View Full Version : American Women
Australia is now becoming too much like the US thanks to globalization, Oprah is now showed here on TV. I plan on packing my bags for Eastern Europe in about 5 years, hopefully I plan to wind up in Poland, Hungary, the Czech Republic or somewhere else with some fine Eastern Euro females. I do like America and what my forefathers did to bring democracy around the world, but it seems as if our great country has been snatched by the feminazis who are looking to spread their ideology around the planet.
fuckin' oprah's on the tube in bucharest (basic cable). ee will fulfill the worse american stereotypes within the the next decade. and dont tell a pole they live in ee...they will politely correct you and say that they are "european unionites" or central europeans..
DJ FourMoney
04-08-06, 10:58
I fully understand your glass half empty stance and its been taken note of.
I really do like this Hungrian girl however, no stopping that. As for the others, well, find them, fuck them and flee might be the right thing to do...
DJ,
Don't get bogged down with any particular woman. If you want the best value for your dollars, fuck and flee! Getting too emotionally connected with these women before you really know them is bad business. A lot of European women are players and fucking you is no big deal to them, especially the Swedes. Be careful or you just might end up being someone's chocolate fix and end up pulling up the sheets the next morning with some money on the night stand like Eddie Murphy in Boomerang.
3F those skanks and yell out, "Next!"
Okay, I'm off to finish packing for my trip.
There's been a lot of talk about globalization and how US style feminism is spreading around the world.
But, has anyone considered Latin America? They seem to have a very strong culture. In fact, the recent trend down there seems to be actually rejecting the "Americanization" process. If anything, Mexico would appear to be encroaching on the U.S. along the borderlands.
I remember when I was in Miami last year. There was this shopping mall we went to..... almost the entire crowd was hispanic of one kind or another. What's more, half the people working in the stores could barely speak english.
This globalization thing cuts both ways. In addition, the feminazi movement is based largely on American economic success at home. It's also partly dependent on that economic strength for it to be able to continue spreading abroad. With the U.S. heading towards an uncertain future (colossal expenditures on war, titanic trade and budget deficits, unimaginable national debt), I think that this Feminazi B.S. will lose out eventually. All of the unfair laws will still be in the books for generations to come, but women's attitudes will change.
The only question is, how long will it take and how many of us will be young enough to care?
Rock
Gee Rock, cheering for everything to turn to shit just to knock the pins out from feministaism isn't very productive. I think it's called cutting off your nose to spite your face.
Besides, the female sense of entitlement is like rust - it never sleeps, it just spreads.
Hardbag,
You misunderstand me...... I'm not hoping for things to go that way. It's just my prediction based on how things are going right NOW.
To be honest, I couldn't give you any exact figures on budget deficits, trade imbalances or national debts. But when those numbers are measured in the TRILLIONS, and going up every day, you know it's going to get bad someday.
Part of this spread of feminism is based on the strength and popularity of American culture. However, if the US declines as an economic (and by extension, military) power, this cultural influence will probably weaken as well. Not something I'd hope for, but it is what I think is coming.
Remember the British Empire? Nope? Me neither..... but up until 60 years ago, they were still a major power in the world. A hundred years ago, they were the superpower economically and militarily. They were also a strong cultural influence as well. In fact, many of todays sexual mores and attitudes were strongly influenced by Victorian age Britain (sexual tightasses).
Where did they go? Well, the economic drain of fighting 2 world wars in a 25 year period pretty much did them in. While they were on the decline, the US was on the rise. Now today you have the US fighting "The War on Terror" spending countless billions on Homeland Security and economically China and India are on their way up. See any similarities?
Rock.
But, has anyone considered Latin America? They seem to have a very strong culture. In fact, the recent trend down there seems to be actually rejecting the "Americanization" process. If anything, Mexico would appear to be encroaching on the U.S. along the borderlands.
I remember when I was in Miami last year. There was this shopping mall we went to..... almost the entire crowd was hispanic of one kind or another. What's more, half the people working in the stores could barely speak english.
And here is the problem with this:
-From www.us-english.org
In 1999, the average employed immigrant who spoke English very well earned $40,741, more than double the $16,345 earned by immigrants who did not speak English at all.
The number of Americans who do speak English "not at all" jumped from 1.22 million in 1980 to 3.37 million in 2000, a 176 percent increase over 20 years (Source: U.S. Census)
Since 1980, the number of U.S. residents who are limited English proficient has more than doubled, from 10.2 million to 21.3 million. In 1980, fewer than 1-in-20 Americans struggled with English. Now, nearly 1-in-12 do. (Source: U.S. Census)
__________
I personally get a big kick out of the alien workers who come into my workplace to send money back home who don't speak any English at all. I get to say "go fuck yourself" with a big smile. Kind of like how they do me when I got to Mexico or the DR, and I play no comprende with them. I speak enough Spanish to know what they're really saying to me.
But, has anyone considered Latin America? They seem to have a very strong culture. In fact, the recent trend down there seems to be actually rejecting the "Americanization" process.
Rock
I have considered Latin America. I have been traveling there for action for 10 years. I met and dated a Colombiana for a year.
If you are serious about a relationship, as opposed to what Chocha Monger advocates, a Latina can bring you LOTS of pleasure and happiness. The key is to find a good woman. Many Latinas see how AW live here through TV, mvies, etc., and the greedy materialistic ones will use a man to get the same US lifestyle. Non-materialistic Latinas prefer to earn just enough to be comfortable, abnd then spend the rest of their time with their families.
If you are a "homebody man" and don't need to "keep up with the Jones' ", then a Latina is for you.
CBGBConnisur
04-09-06, 01:24
Hardbag,
You misunderstand me...... I'm not hoping for things to go that way. It's just my prediction based on how things are going right NOW.
To be honest, I couldn't give you any exact figures on budget deficits, trade imbalances or national debts. But when those numbers are measured in the TRILLIONS, and going up every day, you know it's going to get bad someday.
Part of this spread of feminism is based on the strength and popularity of American culture. However, if the US declines as an economic (and by extension, military) power, this cultural influence will probably weaken as well. Not something I'd hope for, but it is what I think is coming.
Remember the British Empire? Nope? Me neither..... but up until 60 years ago, they were still a major power in the world. A hundred years ago, they were the superpower economically and militarily. They were also a strong cultural influence as well. In fact, many of todays sexual mores and attitudes were strongly influenced by Victorian age Britain (sexual tightasses).
Where did they go? Well, the economic drain of fighting 2 world wars in a 25 year period pretty much did them in. While they were on the decline, the US was on the rise. Now today you have the US fighting "The War on Terror" spending countless billions on Homeland Security and economically China and India are on their way up. See any similarities?
Rock.
I definitely see the similarity, the US is bogged down in the Middle East(US will be in Iraq even after 2008 when Bush leaves and whoever takes his place, I hope its not Hilary Clinton), while China and India are focusing on economic growth. A lot of US and European technology is being sent to both these countries, which will allow both to modernize within 10 to 15 years.
In the latest GQ there is a story about an American who tired of the AW BS and went to Colombia to pick out a wife. Seems he was like a kid in a candy store and picked a hot little Colombiana and took her back to Brooklyn with him where he got her pregnant. She turned too posessive for him and he packed her off to Colombia. Sounds kind of effed up from what I read while in CVS killing time waiting for my pasta dinner. The end of the article the guy says he wants his freedom back to hang out with models and AW's in Manhattan clubs and be single again.
In the latest GQ there is a story about an American who tired of the AW BS and went to Colombia to pick out a wife. Seems he was like a kid in a candy store and picked a hot little Colombiana and took her back to Brooklyn with him where he got her pregnant. She turned too posessive for him and he packed her off to Colombia. Sounds kind of effed up from what I read while in CVS killing time waiting for my pasta dinner. The end of the article the guy says he wants his freedom back to hang out with models and AW's in Manhattan clubs and be single again.
.....even men's magazines (particularly the more "upscale" ones) can be written with a wussy pro feminine bias. I've seen articles in Esquire and GQ that are tantamount to "Fresh new ways to kiss your girlfriend's ass", and little comments to the effect of "Understand that your woman is the perfect creature, and is always right."....so take anything you read with the appropriate grain of salt.
fuckin' oprah's on the tube in bucharest (basic cable). ee will fulfill the worse american stereotypes within the the next decade. and dont tell a pole they live in ee...they will politely correct you and say that they are "european unionites" or central europeans..Eh, there is no conspiracy. Oprah and Oprah alike TV shows are transmitted not of political reasons. There is no hidden feminist agenda. Channels transmitting these shows are doing it because the mass produced American talk shows are cheap. Simple as that.
You won't see Oprah on quality networks, but on commercial bloated cheaper "entertainment" channels. Different strokes for different folks. And don't blame Romanians for their desire to belong to Europe.
Mike12,
So who wrote that story anyways? The author may very well be a woman, or even a woman writing under a man's name. If that is the case, you have some obvious built-in bias coming from the author.
If it's a man writing the story things might be a little bit different. Did the writer actually tag along while these things were happening? Did he know the guy personally or was it all based on third party word of mouth? If the writer IS a guy, he may have some AW stuck-up **** of a girlfriend that he's trying to impress by writing a story about how bad things turn out when you go for a foreign girl.
Even if every single word is true, it just proves that there's no guarantees in life.
Rock
That story was discussed on other forums. It seems the story was not totally on the up-and-up. The author is a photographer for GQ. Some believe a similar story line was pitched to GQ a few years ago and this guy went to Colombia as the photog for a story on mail-order-brides. He got hitched to one and used his experience to write a story for his employer.
If the circumstances of meeting her were even partly contrived, then the whole relationship, and therefore the published story, is a sham. I haven't read the entire article, and cannot confirm other posters' allegations. Take my post, and the GQ story, with many grain of salt.
Hardbag,
You misunderstand me...... I'm not hoping for things to go that way. It's just my prediction based on how things are going right NOW.
To be honest, I couldn't give you any exact figures on budget deficits, trade imbalances or national debts. But when those numbers are measured in the TRILLIONS, and going up every day, you know it's going to get bad someday.
Part of this spread of feminism is based on the strength and popularity of American culture. However, if the US declines as an economic (and by extension, military) power, this cultural influence will probably weaken as well. Not something I'd hope for, but it is what I think is coming.
Remember the British Empire? Nope? Me neither..... but up until 60 years ago, they were still a major power in the world. A hundred years ago, they were the superpower economically and militarily. They were also a strong cultural influence as well. In fact, many of todays sexual mores and attitudes were strongly influenced by Victorian age Britain (sexual tightasses).
Where did they go? Well, the economic drain of fighting 2 world wars in a 25 year period pretty much did them in. While they were on the decline, the US was on the rise. Now today you have the US fighting "The War on Terror" spending countless billions on Homeland Security and economically China and India are on their way up. See any similarities?
Rock.
I actually enjoy discussing geopolitics and history, but find this a strange place to be doing so. I'll try to be brief.
Yes, empires come and go. If they happen to be democracies, maybe even quicker. Democracies have a hard time being ruthless enough to run things very long. For instance, our best policy would be to foment and facilitate a worldwide Sunni/Shia civil war throughout all Islam for the next couple of generations. They're trying real hard to get started in Iraq, and we're trying to stop it. Just not ruthless enough.
The Brits had a long run. Their fall coincided with a worldwide end to colonialism. Not entirely their fault. WWI was the death knell for an already faltering way of life. They never recovered from their "victory". Casualties were in the millions. More like 90 years ago. By the time of WWII they were already a second class power.
Yes, the US will eventually fade, but to compare the costs of Iraq to those of WWI and/or WWII is quite a stretch. To predict it will produce that kind of world change is irresponsible.
As to feminism, social movements have a life of their own. F-ism's time has come, or it has not. It's relationship to US political and economic influence is transitory. In my opinion, f-ism is an attribute of the Industrial Revolution and the realignment of our species by the IR. That transcends any political structure. Only time will tell.
You don't seem to see how much modern f-ism reflects British Victorianism. I'd say "sexual tightass" is a great description of your standard American f-ist. The woman's suffrage movement, precursor to our feministas, was an invention of Victorian England. Many of the most revered heroines in the f-ist pantheon were proper Victorian ladies. Just as Victorianism has morphed with the political fading of the Victorians, post American f-ism will morph and continue - if it is viable.
I gave it a quick read over-kindly correct me if I picked up anything wrong.
1. This guy was not a "normal guy". His days are spent pouring water, honey and whipped cream on photo models.
2. Mostly, we only got one side of the story.
3. He went down to Columbia, picked out a girl that he didn't have any common language with, and brought her back to New York City (hello culture shock) IMMEDIATELY.
4. He had a weirdo (in my opinion) pseudo stepfather thing with the eight year old daughter of an ex-girlfriend (he is not the biological father). This caused Roxie the Columbiian girl to become very jealous, insecure, and behave abberantly. This may seem a little strange, and be "points against" Roxie, but on the other hand, I have actually seen an American girl get jealous of A KITTEN-yes, I mean the purring kind with fur, four legs and a tail.
Think of Roxie's position....she is totally dependent on this guy who has constant exposure to smoking hot women, is dropped suddenly from abject poverty in Columbia to NYC where she doesn't speak the language and is unexpectedly caused to have to play stepmother to a female child that this guy is inexplicably playing daddy for. Oh, and she became pregnant (Guy knew there was no birth control being practiced)....I'm not sure if the guy was going to support her financially or not.
I strongly suspect that most women would go a little wacko in that situation.
B9k
Adding on: If I understood correctly the guy's first pick down in Columbia was "taken" by another man (age 42, an Argentinian living in Miami). He (as a wealthy pretty boy) attempted to lure her away from him, but she was faithful and refused to "better deal" the guy she was committed to.
Eh, there is no conspiracy. Oprah and Oprah alike TV shows are transmitted not of political reasons. There is no hidden feminist agenda. Channels transmitting these shows are doing it because the mass produced American talk shows are cheap. Simple as that.
You won't see Oprah on quality networks, but on commercial bloated cheaper "entertainment" channels. Different strokes for different folks. And don't blame Romanians for their desire to belong to Europe.
are you german? many of my best mates are bavarians; a combination of logic, efficiency, and moral decadence that I can identify with.
your post brings two quotes to mind: 1. “any club that would accept me as a member I wouldn’t want to belong to.” & 2.“the utmost desires of the oppressed is to exchange places with the oppressor.” Woody Allen uttered the former and an Algerian political theorist (whose name presently escapes me) writing about french colonialism said the latter.
Oprah: one can’t help but marvel at the success and longevity of oprah and her media conglomerate. I don’t think nelsien has ever seen such a show that cuts across the various (female) demographics the way her show does. she’s the closest thing to a female berlusconi the world has seen—she singlehandedly manuipualted the new york time’s best seller list when she catapulted a (largely embellished) tacky memoir from obscurity to numero uno. although anyone with any mentionable amount of testosterone would be hard-pressed to stomach a full hour of her show on a normal day, one would find equal difficulty in expressing any articulable qualms with the show….just too pink for me.
I once saw oprah say that she disagreed with the western institution of marriage and that it “stifled the expression of love.” I couldn’t help but chuckle at the baron of feminism’s role reversal: here she is with her trophy boyfriend (Steadman) saying that the reason why she doesn’t want to get married is because she doesn’t want to give her partner ½ a billion when things go south.
Every time my ee girls watch oprah they give me a look that says, “are you Americans that lucky where you have to create problems for yourselves?” My reply is always, “in general, yes, we are that lucky.”
I don’t “blame” Romania for wanting to be part of the EU. But I think the journey to accession is worth more to these countries than membership in an organization that issues unenforceable bureaucratic decrees from Brussels will ever be. Romanians now get to learn such indispensable things like a bribing a judge does not equate to justice and if your write something down and sign it it’s best for all parties if they intend to adhere to said document. But really man, reform and prosperity take more than simply sowing another star on a flag and humming ode to joy.
Doctor_Skank
04-11-06, 09:30
DD:
The quote is from Groucho Marx (not Woody Allen)... and one of my favorites too.
Here are a couple more GM quotes:
"I've had a perfectly wonderful evening. But this wasnt it."
"Women should be obscene and not heard."
"Go, and never darken my towels again."
DD:
The quote is from Groucho Marx (not Woody Allen)... and one of my favorites too.
i've yet to attend law school (a few months away).. but i wrote "uttered"; thus, i did not incorrectly attribute the quote.
Dirk,
I think Leeuwen sounds like a dutch name, of course that's pretty close to German anyways. We might not agree with everything he says, but it's nice to have differing points of view here.
It's funny what you said about Oprah.... she sure does like to put a spin on things with regards to her own actions. That's the way women are these days. If a woman works a low paying job with long hours, it's exploitation. If a man has the same job, he's told he should be looking for something better.
Rock
CBGBConnisur
04-14-06, 02:33
I was reading about a US expat living in the Canary Islands and how globalization is spreading a more affluent lifestyle to places few would suspect, with this expect women around the world to become more "Americanized", talking to a friend who travels to some very quickly emerging economies, he noticed that the women in these places are becoming very American in their mentality(spend money they don't have, expect men to bend over for them, eat fatty and sugary food, dress badly, etc.). I think Americans living abroad still have a few advantages but they will eventually wither, I was sitting in a lounge near where I live and a couple of ladies heard my American accent, suddenly they were paying attention to me. Then again I could go near a college campus, and that same accent could get me some unfriendly comments. Then again you got the conartists trying to empty your wallet or get a green card. I swear every Thai, Korean, other Asian chic has hit on me during my six years in Australia probably because I am a gateway to the USA.
CBGB,
If I was you, I'd show them the gateway to my bedroom. Then, send them home with some cab fare and a sore coochie.
If they want to play it that way, they can take it that way.
Rock
By Hiba Moussa
Wed Apr 12, 9:47 AM ET
DOMINOS NIGHTS
If a shisha smoke is a heaven for some, playing dominos is sacrosanct for others.
Omar, 25, who asked to be identified only by his first name, said his mother has bought him extra blankets, pillows and mattresses so that friends, even those who live next door, could sleep at his house when they meet for a dominos game at night.
"One night two of my friends were robbed by thieves as soon as they left my house," said Omar at the end of a game, where he shared tea and cigarettes with friends.
Before U.S.-led forces invaded Iraq in 2003, Omar and his family, like most Iraqis, used to go out at weekends for picnics or strolls, staying out until late. As security worsened, the only place they feel safe now is the living room.
"We have to adjust ourselves with these new circumstances," he said. "Life must go on, you know."
"OPRAH"
Sahar Moussa, a 40-year-old teacher, said that watching television has become a daily "passion" in her life, especially during the evenings after she gets back home from school.
"I love watching satellite TV channels," she said. "I can't think of doing anything else rather than to sit and watch TV."
With endless television programs available through satellite channels, the only show that Moussa thinks is worth watching is "The Oprah Winfrey Show."
"I love 'The Oprah Winfrey Show'," she said. "I liked her when she gave away cars to her audience for free!"
Before violence escalated in Baghdad's streets, Moussa said she enjoyed visiting friends or shopping late at night.
Although she said she enjoyed watching TV, she said it also had its drawbacks. "I gained a few pounds in one week," she said. "From now on, I have to stop eating chips."
http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20060412/wl_nm/iraq_leisure_dc
Potted Beef
04-14-06, 23:03
This week on Thursday (yesterday) there was an interesting report in "Outlook" (bbcworldservice) in which an AW lesbian journalist tells about her 1.5 year during which she posed as a man while dating women. Towards the end of the interview on Outlook she confesses :"I have now a tremendous amount of sympathy for men..." , "we women make men who they are as much as men make men who they are and we should take a certain amount of responsiblility for this" , "there is a certain arrogance we do have about the fact that we are probably more emotionally skilled" , "both as a woman and a lesbian I tended to have the prejudices of overesteeming my own sex..."
To hear the interview, go to the bottom left of the bbcworldservice homepage (RADIO PROGRAMMES), go to "Outlook" in the A-Z list, click on "Go" and scroll down to "Thursday""Listen to Thursday's Edition" . The interview starts at 41'58" :
Is it a man's world?
A few years ago US journalist Norah Vincent set out on an unusual experiment: for the following 18 months, she pretended to be a man. She called herself Ned, learnt to walk and talk like a man and applied make-up to fake day-old stubble. Amazingly no-one found her out, though she did eventually confess all to some of the people she had become friends with.
CBGBConnisur
04-15-06, 02:44
By Hiba Moussa
Wed Apr 12, 9:47 AM ET
DOMINOS NIGHTS
If a shisha smoke is a heaven for some, playing dominos is sacrosanct for others.
Omar, 25, who asked to be identified only by his first name, said his mother has bought him extra blankets, pillows and mattresses so that friends, even those who live next door, could sleep at his house when they meet for a dominos game at night.
"One night two of my friends were robbed by thieves as soon as they left my house," said Omar at the end of a game, where he shared tea and cigarettes with friends.
Before U.S.-led forces invaded Iraq in 2003, Omar and his family, like most Iraqis, used to go out at weekends for picnics or strolls, staying out until late. As security worsened, the only place they feel safe now is the living room.
"We have to adjust ourselves with these new circumstances," he said. "Life must go on, you know."
"OPRAH"
Sahar Moussa, a 40-year-old teacher, said that watching television has become a daily "passion" in her life, especially during the evenings after she gets back home from school.
"I love watching satellite TV channels," she said. "I can't think of doing anything else rather than to sit and watch TV."
With endless television programs available through satellite channels, the only show that Moussa thinks is worth watching is "The Oprah Winfrey Show."
"I love 'The Oprah Winfrey Show'," she said. "I liked her when she gave away cars to her audience for free!"
Before violence escalated in Baghdad's streets, Moussa said she enjoyed visiting friends or shopping late at night.
Although she said she enjoyed watching TV, she said it also had its drawbacks. "I gained a few pounds in one week," she said. "From now on, I have to stop eating chips."
http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20060412/wl_nm/iraq_leisure_dc
I thought the purpose of invading Iraq was to make it safe. Oops. In other news Australia is about to sell its uranium mines to... China!!! China claims it will use the uranium for "peaceful purposes". I remember the US sold Japan a shitload of steel during the World's Fair. Does anyone remember this scenario?
Greetings everyone,
In recognition of his many great contributions to the Forum, I have given DirkDingy his own thread titled "DirkDingy's Opinions".
http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showthread.php?t=2429
Those of you who wish to join him in the discussions in his new thread are welcome to do so.
Thanks,
Jackson
DD:
The quote is from Groucho Marx
"I've had a perfectly wonderful evening. But this wasnt it."
"Women should be obscene and not heard."
"Go, and never darken my towels again."Stuck-up hi-society woman: "Well! I've never been so insulted!"
Groucho (looking at his watch): "It's still early yet."
Groucho to a hefty rich woman he's romancing: "I imagine our being married. You're in the kitchen cooking dinner. You're bending over the stove. I can't see the stove."
Groucho in real life when asked why he continues to hang out so much in public with his ex-wife: "I like to stay close to my money."
GM reflecting to the camera on two women he's pretending to pursue (he's actually mocking and toying with them): "How happy I'd be with either of these two, if they'd both just go away."
There's something that I've noticed recently. A lot of girls like to walk along with their arms folded together in front of them. You don't see kids walking like that. You don't see old women walking like that. You NEVER see men walking like that. I haven't seen girls in other countries walking that way. Mostly it seems like girls from their early teens up to their thirties.
What's up with this walk anyways? Body language is supposed to indicate one's state of mind so it must mean something. Are they hugging themselves? Are they trying to protect themselves from the entire outside world? I can tell you one thing, when I see a girl walking like that.... it makes her look so insecure and so fucked up.
Has anybody else noticed this too? If anyone has an explanation of what this is, I'd like to hear it.
Rock
Sinanju Master
04-16-06, 21:27
#1] The New Year's Eve hog had one too many shots of Jack Daniels. I mean C'MON! What broad in her right fucking MIND is gonna think ANY modeling agency that caters to the mainstream public is gonna want to plaster a photo of the equivalent of Rosie O' Donnell on their pages with the intent to sell product through her?
#2] The rude coffehouse blob was probably compensating for lack of meaningful male company or trying to do what her more attractive counterparts do: act rude and see how much they can get away with it in an effort to see if you were going to fall all over yourself to try to win her favor.
Myself, I don't sweat AW these days. In fact, whenever I'm making delieveries or whenever I go out for a bite to eat, even the ones who are trying to get my attention are baffled by my professional demeanor, my short straight-to-the-point answers and the fact that I don't take the bait.
The beefette at the coffee shop was just following standard procedures.It seems like fugly women who hang out with cute friends are even worse because they always lurk in the shadows of their friends success.
Another thing I've noticed about the "less qualified" is they are twice as hard to get along with because guys think they get no play so all the weirdos go for her.It's all heady oriented BS.Also remember if your a girl with even just an attractive toe you have horny guys all over you.I'm so disappointed with all of it.
SINJU: Intresting experiment....Since I've found cheap pussy abroad I too brush off the flirts and handle myself like a dignified ISG member and it makes women really pissed off..they are so needy for attention.The way I deal these days is ask myself what I would pay someplace else for a slab of the same meat then respect it accordingly....putting all sex aside you get to really see what's left.Remember many amercians cant or dont travel so women dont really understand whats available to men in other countries.
I have two single women on my floor of my apartment building who give me the look of death everytime they see me just because I'm single.I've made the effort many times to say hello and be polite but it doesn't work.Women get too much credit for nothing.
Sinanju Master
04-16-06, 23:12
For me, the last straw was when I fell for a woman I thought was THE ONE. I made the (STUPID) mistake of coming on too strong, BUT I noticed that after I broke off my pursuit, NEVER ONCE during my courting attempts did she come out and tell me never to see her again. I thought about this a lot and came to the conclusion that, like many of her counterparts, she likes male attention, no matter WHERE it comes from. Although she never directly directly yanked my chain, she played it cool and was perfectly willing to let me direct my attention toward her, making a fool out of myself, affirming her attractiveness as a woman. It was THIS revelation that made me understand just how fucked up a lot of AW's are. To give an example of how she kept me on a chain of my own making, I came out one night and showed my cards, telling her how I felt about her. She said: "I'll ALWAYS be your friend". Looking back on it, she was a master of manipulating the situation. I don't harbor any illl feeling toward her though. I made a fool of MYSELF, and the blame lies with the image I see in the mirror everyday.
Doctor_Skank
04-16-06, 23:41
SM:
"I made the (STUPID) mistake of coming on too strong"
"I thought about this a lot and came to the conclusion that, like many of her counterparts, she likes male attention, no matter WHERE it comes from."
Thats a mistake we have all made and it hurts. I honestly believe that I screwed up some relationships that had good potential simply because I was so sure early on that it could be something good, that I drowned her in attention and affection. This will scare away or disinterest a lot of women.
Its hard to hold back when you want to tell her all those sweet things and dote on her with attention, but it can backfire.
And yeah, many girls love male attention, but they often respect or want the guys more that AREN'T throwing all the compliments, presents etc. at them.
As if subconsciously she is thinking "if he wants ME so much, then he cant be that great..."
Sinanju Master
04-16-06, 23:57
I hope you don't think I'm a one-man Doc Skank admiration society, but you've hit the nail on the head again! In fact, to emphasize one of your comments, I remember a female caller on the Tom Leykis show (B9K, I can't believe you've JUST RECENTLY discovered him! LOL) who said that she'd be more apt to go after a guy who DIDN'T have time for her or at least ACTED that way. When I heard that, I said: "HUH"????? I felt like I was in the Bizarro Universe where everything is BACKWARD!
are you german? many of my best mates are bavarians; a combination of logic, efficiency, and moral decadence that I can identify with.Dutch, but due to nature of the Dutch-German border through last decades, Germany has never been foreign to me. Besides thanks for letting us know that the myth about German efficiency is so well cultivated across the pond.
Rock Dog, given you are American, your guess was clever.
No idea who actually was first with Oprah-like talkshows but nowdays there is plently of them. Personally, I find Oprah's intense passion for goodness somewhat annoying, but it might also be the moments when cameras zoom faces in the audience. Not sure if those people get paid or are pre-programmed to sit there with face expressions looking either like melting maple syrup or totally shocked, grasping for air. To me this is absolutely ridiculous and undermines Oprah's credibility. On the other hand, this silly pseudo dramatic acting is rather standard in every American preacher styled talkshow, let it be Ricky Lake, Jerry Springer or Dr.Phil. It's perfectly fine helping people out but skip the sweet talk and hypocrisy.
Women emancipation is a result of increased equality between sexes, not a result of TV talkshows or the so called "Americanization". I think most will agree that women have lived in sort of captivity before, and during last decades single mothers have become accepted by society, so have unmarried women who decided not to have children. This has worried certain category of men for last decades, so what? When it suits us (you?) we brag about democratic values in the West and simultaneously condemn cultures where women are oppressed, like for example in Mideast or south Asia. Suddently when we don't find anyone to lecture about superiority of western values, we are bitching about AW.
Speaking to Muslims, they paradoxically claim Muslim women enjoy more freedom than western women. How come?
"Our women don't have to work, as we provide for them?", they say. Try this at home, or this (http://www.womenrussia.com/austwives.htm).
Don't interpret my little input as defence of AW, but rather as reaction on logical inconsistency from your side.
DirkDingy, no stars are added to the EU flag anymore. Google says:
"The flag of the European Union depicts 12 golden stars arranged in a circle on an azure blue sky. The five-pointed stars represent the union of the people of Europe; the number 12 represents perfection and unity. The height of the flag is two-thirds the width. This flag was officially adopted as a symbol of the European Union on May 26, 1986."
There's something that I've noticed recently. A lot of girls like to walk along with their arms folded together in front of them. You don't see kids walking like that. You don't see old women walking like that. You NEVER see men walking like that. I haven't seen girls in other countries walking that way. Mostly it seems like girls from their early teens up to their thirties.
What's up with this walk anyways? Body language is supposed to indicate one's state of mind so it must mean something. Are they hugging themselves? Are they trying to protect themselves from the entire outside world? I can tell you one thing, when I see a girl walking like that.... it makes her look so insecure and so fucked up.
Has anybody else noticed this too? If anyone has an explanation of what this is, I'd like to hear it.
Rock
Rock,
This is a very astute observation. I've also seen this behavior, although I cannot place it...maybe when I was working downtown Chicago, or on a college campus. Where I live, there isn't much A to B that can be obtained by walking. It seems that girls only do this when they are by themselves, I don't recall ever seeing one in a pair or a group doing so.
I read Don Steel's body language book. While this behavior is not expressly mentioned, I would be inclined to say (given Steel's analysis of other behavior) that the girl is either subliminally protecting herself from the world, or holding something in.....possilbly a combination of both-notice that the arms are generally held more or less across the breasts.
Sin-Leykis has only been on in my market for a couple months...I happened across him by accident on my local talk radio station....It just happened that I tuned into him as he was on "ditch the bit*h", and "only marry foreign women".
By the way, I think that my last straw was getting burned by a desperation induced "fix up project" a couple years ago. I was going to clean up some (young, not bad looking) trailer trash, and see if I could make a respectable human being out of her...she soaked me for a little cash (2-3 fast food meals, and a little grocery shopping trip), before I inadvertanly dropped by her apartment where she proceeded to almost bone a scumbag right in front of me. I wasn't a happy camper. I hope to run into that little bim someday so I can laugh at her....she was starting to get fat at 20, and I'm sure that white trash behavior patterns have resulted in her life going even further into deep shit.....conversely these days, I have girls in in Prague that are more than she was, or will ever be.
B9K
PS Marak, these days the divorce rate is 60%.
Sinanju Master
04-17-06, 03:03
your radio market WAS unenlightened, but has seen the light. CONVERSELY, MY market seems to have undertaken the philosophy of IGNORANCE by no longer carrying Lord Tom. Your trailer trash project seems to be on the path to implosion. I think if you simply let her do what she does, yer gonna see her resemble a Jerry Springer candidate VERY SOON.
http://www.edge1550.com/stream.html
yea, that chick was far enough down the food chain that her peer group was having a hard time reaching their early mid twenties (od's, accidents, probably violent crime also-she had been to more funerals at 20 than i at 32....and mine are all elderly relatives). just a tiny bit of intelligent pussy usage and she could have been living in my big townhouse, probably starting college....but that type isn't known for making good decisions.....you know, something funny just occurred to me...i (seriously) can't remember her name anymore......i think it started with "j"....my memory banks must be full remembering marketta, natasha, anna, martina......,
b9k
Women emancipation is a result of increased equality between sexes, not a result of TV talkshows or the so called "Americanization". I think most will agree that women have lived in sort of captivity before, and during last decades single mothers have become accepted by society, so have unmarried women who decided not to have children. This has worried certain category of men for last decades, so what? When it suits us (you?) we brag about democratic values in the West and simultaneously condemn cultures where women are oppressed, like for example in Mideast or south Asia. Suddently when we don't find anyone to lecture about superiority of western values, we are bitching about AW.
Don't interpret my little input as defence of AW, but rather as reaction on logical inconsistency from your side.
[/i]
Leeuwen.
"The previous arrangement" (men ruled and bore the brunt of harsh reality, women deferred and were provided for) may have been somewhat stifling to women, but at least it was BALANCED (as the women of russia article alludes to). Yes, many women were "relegated" to being homemakers....on the other hand, how many men do you think worked 40 years at a shitty job that they hate to provide for their wife and children? Do you think that they felt a little stifled also? Possibly they gave up on a dream or two, just like the women did?
I absolutely believe that a woman should be able to do anything that she chooses to do....however, the ability to make decisions is POWER. One of the "laws of the universe" is that power is correlated to responsibility. Now, US women have power......but an unbalance exists because our society is absolutely, completely geared towards protecting them from the consequences of bad decisions. This is not TRUE equality.
An interesting side note: Someone, a few posts back, mentioned (possibly not by name) the book "Self Made Man" by Norah Vincent, a lesbian who posed as a man to discover what life is like on the other side of the fence. She SHOCKINGLY discovered how disempowered she became by (temporarily) giving up her status as an "opressed double minority" (female and gay). If I were feeling more motivated, I would go get her exact quote on the subject.
B9k
PS The media absolutely is a corruptive influence. There is a constant message of "men are stupid", and encouragement for women to take ADVANTAGE of their societal privleges. Oprah is a particularly nasty offender, having made over a billiion dollars convincing the most privledged creatures on the planet (US women as a whole, having generally some of he most comfortable lifestyles on the PLANET while generally doing he least to earn it) that they are poor, opressed, and entitled to MORE.
The book "Self Made Man" is actually a real interesting read. In the book a lesbian dresses up like a man and undergoes life as "Ned." Alot of experiences she has are exactly the same as what we have been posting about or pertain to them. She observes that; when guys first meet they treat each other as good guys until proven otherwise, whereas women have you judged as a cad right off the bat until proven otherwise, Men face alot of rejection everyday at the hands of women, women are extremely judgemental and look for any reason to prove to themselves that the man is not worthy, females play games and word semantics, females blame men for all their problems, and college taught her to be overly feminist and very suspicious of males.
Maybe she can do a sequel and go to different countries where she can experience the differences between AW's and foreign woman. Am quite sure it will be not the same as the first book. When they made American woman they definitely threw away the mold.
Overall the book is very good and I just might buy "Self Made Man" instead of reading it in Borders bookstore for free.
DJ FourMoney
04-17-06, 12:17
Very interesting....
It doesn't suprise me one bit and that is just what we have been dealing with. Your right they threw away the mold of American women, thank gawd we don't any more of them than there already are.
The book "Self Made Man" is actually a real interesting read. In the book a lesbian dresses up like a man and undergoes life as "Ned." Alot of experiences she has are exactly the same as what we have been posting about or pertain to them. She observes that; when guys first meet they treat each other as good guys until proven otherwise, whereas women have you judged as a cad right off the bat until proven otherwise, Men face alot of rejection everyday at the hands of women, women are extremely judgemental and look for any reason to prove to themselves that the man is not worthy, females play games and word semantics, females blame men for all their problems, and college taught her to be overly feminist and very suspicious of males.
Maybe she can do a sequel and go to different countries where she can experience the differences between AW's and foreign woman. Am quite sure it will be not the same as the first book. When they made American woman they definitely threw away the mold.
Overall the book is very good and I just might buy "Self Made Man" instead of reading it in Borders bookstore for free.
i was reading about a us expat living in the canary islands and how globalization is spreading a more affluent lifestyle to places few would suspect, with this expect women around the world to become more "americanized", .forgive me isg gods for i have sinned. i promise not to to write bad things about france, frenchmen, and arabs any more when totally pissed.
gbgb: how confident are you that wealth and americanization are positively correlated? i think that mtv and opera do more americanizing than bill gates will ever do. yes, wealth expands the menu, but there are some things that many of us would simply choose not to order. many women find feminism silly.
i recently had an epiphany: foreign women will often try to act american when dating an american. this phonomenom is especially atrocious because these women develop their opinions about america from television and third hand embellished scuttlebutt from pals abroad who want to appear more affluent than they actually are to impress their friends. however, these women's impressions are preferable to the maestros of american culture who achieved their infinite knowledge about the “states” from a two week trip to new york city 10 years ago when they were 11.
two things happened two me recently which has caused me to believe this. a few days ago i brought home a girl from the 'club (disco) and she decided that she just wanted to cuddle. when i expressed my desires for a little head she refused. when i asked her why she came home with me if she didn’t want to give me some action she replied, "because in america the girl doesn’t have to have sex with the man until she wants to." i piped, "so if i was moldovan?" she replied, “oh no, i would never go home with a strange moldovan man at nite because he would expect [read take] sex." (in the vast majority of the world when a woman goes to a man's home alone--especially from a disco--he has the right to fuck her. [CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123) in ee means grabbing a gal off the street and beating her into submission...the guy can still get off is she was walking alone past 2400 dressed kinda skanky.) what was i to do with the 18 yo child? i rolled over and went to sleep.
two, my girlfriend has violated some unwritten rules in eastern europe: as long as the man takes care of her needs and is not too overt he can get side action & the woman takes care of all of the domestic responsibilities. most girls here don't care or don't really object to "one-nite relationships" with other women. i was hanging out with some strippers a few nights ago and gf called and figured out where i was and told me that if she "were an american girl i wouldn't treat her this way." later, when i noticed that my dishes were not washed i asked her if something was wrong? she replied," in america the relationship is like a partnership, not the man the chief and the woman just cook and clean all day."
other shit has happened as well.
i am convinced that foreign women, especially young ones, will often try and co-opt american behaviors when they are with an american.
in the vast majority of the world when a woman goes to a man's home alone--especially from a disco--he has the right to fuck her. [CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123) in ee means grabbing a gal off the street and beating her into submission...the guy can still get off is she was walking alone past 2400 dressed kinda skanky.with this attitude, no wonder you have to travel thousands of kilometers to find women willing to spend time in your companionship. if i quoted you to women i know, they would probably guess you were taliban. no, actually you no right to fuck her unless she doesn't mind.
very often when women get raped their dress code is questioned, which i find extremely bizarre. like as if we men are in posession of a license to [CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123) whenever we see a hottie wearing mini-skirt after 24:00. what if you join some blokes you meet in a bar and join them for poker game and beer. imagine a jury questioning your dress code after these dudes had gang raped you. would you blame four homosexuals for expecting you to play along? i doubt any sensible person would like to live in such world.
i am convinced that foreign women, especially young ones, will often try and co-opt american behaviors when they are with an american.when i catch taxi to schiphol (amsterdam airport) i expect it to be of decent brand. when i land in kiev, ukraine, i don't expect latest model from mercedes or audi to bring me to the hotel. the moldovian girls you refer to use the same analogy. you should be flattered they have high expectations about you, haha.
That is some scary shit. Interesting too. It seems that just as Western men have BS preconceptions about Eastern European women, the reverse is also the case. I read somewhere that the marriage agencies were perpetuating the perception that western men were all big pussies, easily controlled. I have to say though that even with 24 hour Oprah, MTV etc, it will never be half as bad as in the US for a couple of reasons:
1. Legal prostitution makes the sexual favor of a woman easily and inexpensively obtainable. This puts a very distinct limit on how much shit men will endure from women to get sex. On a bullshit scale of 1-10,, in my estimation, EE's may go from a 0 to a 3 or 3.5, whereas in the US, women are at an 11.
2. Puritanism-US has it...Europe, not so much. European's it seems view sex as a GOOD thing, whereas AW, in many cases view it as a chore that is necessary to get and keep a man. This isn't to say that they won't ever learn to use sex as a weapon, but again, see number 1.
B9K
Doctor_Skank
04-17-06, 22:52
SM:
"who said that she'd be more apt to go after a guy who DIDN'T have time for her or at least ACTED that way. When I heard that, I said: "HUH"????? I felt like I was in the Bizarro Universe where everything is BACKWARD!"
A lot of things are backwards in male-female relationships. Ultimately I prefer my own happy naivety to being callous or overly cynical, but over the years I have figured out that many (maybe even most) women are quite shallow in what they look for in men and that "being a nice guy" is a personality feature that one should apply with due caution, as for many women nice guys do finish last.
I think it is very important that when being nice (some of us just cant help it) you remain strong. It is equally important in my opinion that when being strong you avoid being brutish and flat-headed... application of affection, romance or sensibility can work wonders, but are to be applied with care and in doses just large enough to keep her interested or as the Pussycat Dolls say, "keep it frilly".
leewuan…please differentiate between description and advocation; i simply, albeit crudely, described the prosecutorial standards which are used in many parts of the world regarding sexual assault. i.e., slapping a woman on the buttocks—even playfully—can be, and has been, prosecuted as fourth degree sexual assault in the u.s. and can result in a two year prison sentence—as well as the destruction of one’s future career prospects. i have not partaken in and do not advocate taking a woman against her will. my sexuality was actually questioned while studying in poland for not closing the deal on a few women i brought home after a night of carousing. in america, especially in the hypersensitive feminist environs that have engulfed college campuses “no” means no, “maybe” means no, and silence means no. mike tyson, kobe, and the lads at duke would have never been charged with sexual assault in the vast majority of the world’s nations.
frankly, in america, the prospect of an unsubstantiated accusation combined with the opproious legal system makes me very weary of fucking women that i do not know. the 9th circuit has ruled that a woman can give consent, then retract said consent during the act—even non-verbally—and the man can still be charged with [CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123). so: you can be fucking a chick, she suddenly changes her mind but forgets to tell you about it, or the booze starts to kick in, and you be doing 20 to life in folsom a few months later.
most people can’t see how guys like mike tyson are convicted when the woman went to his hotel room at 2 am. what the fuck is any woman going to discuss with mike alone in his room in the wee hours of the night after sipping on a little liquor? what the fuck would anyone discuss with mike period? i’ll reiterate what i said earlier: when a woman goes home with a strange man in the wee hours of the am after drinking some form of intimacy is expected. i would tell my daughter to not go home with men from clubs or discos.
bart: actually, as you well know, ee women are prettier on average (when younger), are sexier, have better attitudes, lack puritanical hang-ups about sex, are more domestic, and are more easier satisfied than their yankee counterpart...most stereotypes about ee women are kinda true. i don’t mind cooking or even cleaning but when the women here forbid you to do it—it is unmanly in their eyes—you start expecting certain things.
yes, the ability to readily get sex in ee (even if illegal) weakens the women’s position; however, it also decreases compromise and interpersonal skills—essential skills for any relationship. honestly, after spending some time abroad i don’t think that one can normally function in america or date an aw again.
but over the years I have figured out that many (maybe even most) women are quite shallow in what they look for in men and that "being a nice guy" is a personality feature that one should apply with due caution, as for many women nice guys do finish last.
Dr. S.,
Your statement is true only in the US and other Western countries such as Canada or England. It is definitely NOT true in Colombia, Brazil, Dominican Republic, Costa Rica, etc. Most Latin women get their fill of super macho Latin men as they grow up. When they hit adulthood and are looking for a serious mate, they mostly want nice guys. Some still want the womanizing macho man, but most want nice, stable, reliable guys they can start and raise a family with.
Nick Danger
04-18-06, 19:59
leewuan…please differentiate between description and advocation; i simply, albeit crudely, described the prosecutorial standards which are used in many parts of the world regarding sexual assault. i.e., slapping a woman on the buttocks—even playfully—can be, and has been, prosecuted as fourth degree sexual assault in the u.s. and can result in a two year prison sentence—as well as the destruction of one’s future career prospects. i have not partaken in and do not advocate taking a woman against her will. my sexuality was actually questioned while studying in poland for not closing the deal on a few women i brought home after a night of carousing. in america, especially in the hypersensitive feminist environs that have engulfed college campuses “no” means no, “maybe” means no, and silence means no. mike tyson, kobe, and the lads at duke would have never been charged with sexual assault in the vast majority of the world’s nations.
frankly, in america, the prospect of an unsubstantiated accusation combined with the opproious legal system makes me very weary of fucking women that i do not know. the 9th circuit has ruled that a woman can give consent, then retract said consent during the act—even non-verbally—and the man can still be charged with [CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123). so: you can be fucking a chick, she suddenly changes her mind but forgets to tell you about it, or the booze starts to kick in, and you be doing 20 to life in folsom a few months later.
most people can’t see how guys like mike tyson are convicted when the woman went to his hotel room at 2 am. what the fuck is any woman going to discuss with mike alone in his room in the wee hours of the night after sipping on a little liquor? what the fuck would anyone discuss with mike period? i’ll reiterate what i said earlier: when a woman goes home with a strange man in the wee hours of the am after drinking some form of intimacy is expected. i would tell my daughter to not go home with men from clubs or discos.
bart: actually, as you well know, ee women are prettier on average (when younger), are sexier, have better attitudes, lack puritanical hang-ups about sex, are more domestic, and are more easier satisfied than their yankee counterpart...most stereotypes about ee women are kinda true. i don’t mind cooking or even cleaning but when the women here forbid you to do it—it is unmanly in their eyes—you start expecting certain things.
yes, the ability to readily get sex in ee (even if illegal) weakens the women’s position; however, it also decreases compromise and interpersonal skills—essential skills for any relationship. honestly, after spending some time abroad i don’t think that one can normally function in america or date an aw again.
i agree with most of what you're saying but guys like kobe and mike tyson should know better.these women who follow them are interested in their lifestyles ,money and whatever else they have learned about them.additionally, as black men they know with the air of sexual stereotypes a blame the victim defense will mean disaster.who has more credibility mike tyson or a 19yr sunday school teacher? he got what he deserved;kobe too.
in the nba , the high profile stars michael jordan etc. pay for their sex with "upscale"escorts this affords them greater protection since it's a business proposition. of course, there are exceptions it's a known fact that shaquille o'neal fucked cindy crawford.
lastly, i believe the 9th circuits' reasoning was that one could consent to letting someone into their home so why couldn't they withdraw that consent? and, saying no to more sex isn't unreasonable.
most people can’t see how guys like mike tyson are convicted when the woman went to his hotel room at 2 am. what the fuck is any woman going to discuss with mike alone in his room in the wee hours of the night after sipping on a little liquor?short addition to your description of the u.s legal system. characters like mike tyson aren't relevant in this case as neither of us is a celebrity with deep pockets, and average joe isn't given special treatment in court of law. women who visit famous sportsmen in their hotel rooms in the wee hours, as you described, are generally gold diggers. i was talking about average women whose dress code is qestioned in the court, despite focus should stay on the raper. then the defence lawyer will always attempt to discredit the complainant due to her less than prudent sexual behaviour. what the heck - so it's ok to gang [CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123) sex workers but not women with victorian values? given aw realize this, i'm not surprised they are superficially restrictive with sex. nonetheless, vast majority of aw in the range 18-35 year are sluts, ready to fuck any guy with good future prospects and willing to spend money on his darling. perhaps i will write about my obseravations some other time.
My post on a movie and TV board:
"Well.....appearently, I have wandered into a HERD of 400 pound lesbians as chick logic (the great oxymoron) and man bashing are the rules of the day.
That being the case, I will step aside and gladly defer to your stunning, enlightened all knowing brilliance.
By the way, as I well know that your type cannot handle the harsh shock of reality , I am fairly confident that someone will cry to the moderator and this post will be removed."
Smut Villain
04-19-06, 03:36
Dr. S.,
Your statement is true only in the US and other Western countries such as Canada or England. It is definitely NOT true in Colombia, Brazil, Dominican Republic, Costa Rica, etc. Most Latin women get their fill of super macho Latin men as they grow up. When they hit adulthood and are looking for a serious mate, they mostly want nice guys. Some still want the womanizing macho man, but most want nice, stable, reliable guys they can start and raise a family with.
According to conventional wisdom it's probably not wise to make sweeping generalizations like this,
HOWEVER...
Your statement does pretty much describe my experience with Latinas thus far (I lived in Mexico for nearly 5 years). They certainly do have a markedly different (and refreshing) attitude when comared with AW's, so I can't dismiss your statement, either.
Brian Moloney
04-19-06, 04:17
short addition to your description of the u.s legal system. characters like mike tyson aren't relevant in this case as neither of us is a celebrity with deep pockets, and average joe isn't given special treatment in court of law. women who visit famous sportsmen in their hotel rooms in the wee hours, as you described, are generally gold diggers. i was talking about average women whose dress code is qestioned in the court, despite focus should stay on the raper. then the defence lawyer will always attempt to discredit the complainant due to her less than prudent sexual behaviour. what the heck - so it's ok to gang [CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123) sex workers but not women with victorian values? given aw realize this, i'm not surprised they are superficially restrictive with sex. nonetheless, vast majority of aw in the range 18-35 year are sluts, ready to fuck any guy with good future prospects and willing to spend money on his darling. perhaps i will write about my obseravations some other time.the only pepole that can get away with [CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123) are the kennedys.
Doctor_Skank
04-19-06, 14:03
George90:
Thanks for your comments. Admittedly (and sadly) my experience with Latina women is limited to a few girls I banged back in college and some pros in German FKKs or the RLD in Amsterdam, so I certainly can't relate to what you are saying. It does sound encouraging though.... :)
Of course when we post here we are generalizing, out of necessity. Nobody wants to read the sordid details of everybody else's fucked up relationships. There are self-help groups for that or other self-help methods, like Jack Daniel's or sectarian religion. :)
I'm basing my observations on generalized experiences with Anglo women, Euro women and EE (Slavic) women.
I am also generally refering to young women in the 18-25 dating age and probably in the age before they are seriously (or desperately) seeking a husband. As women get older, their tastes do change and they generally look for security ($$$) and in optimal cases, emotional and societal compatibility.
Nonetheless, I stand by my theory based on my experience that over-doting or drowning a girl with attention in the early stages of a relationship will scare away or turn off many girls, and this is not necessarily limited to only American or Anglo women.
Nor am I saying that flat-headed super-machismo is the ticket to success, I doubt that works really that well anywhere.
I am just saying that being a nice guy and doing all the right things might be the wrong thing with many women. At least in my experience, I've often done best when behaving like a womanizing jerk. A jerk with a heart of gold, but a jerk nonetheless. It somehow intrigues many women, including oddly enough, some truly top girls.
I agree that latin women do really appreciate a "nice guy" ofcourse not too nice but someone that would give her respect or courtesy where a latin male wouldn't.Although I'm beginning to think latin men treating women as less than can only benefit guys like me.Without the macho jive...what would they really want.
I'm glad the topic of being a nice guy came up and as sombody stated earlier it's totally ass backwards.I've never figured that one out. Either I'm too nice (which happens most of the time) or I'm an asshole.I have no idea how to be a nice asshole. I've never admired that character in any man nor did I want to turn into one of those just to get laid.Can anyone shed some light or is this nonsensical babble drama from the world of "her" ?
Do a google search on "Nice Guy", or "Nice Guy Syndrome".
I kind of hold a double standard with AW about this.
I get that EE's NEED their men to be harsh, rough, tough, and kind of mean-kind of an overbearing jerk-philandering probably just comes with the package.. They live in a harsh, rough, tough part of the world, where it may actually become necessary to physically defend her and her children.
I don't know too much about Latinas and Latin American, so I won't comment there.
Conversely, I am disgusted with this need in AW. Our culture (female driven) pushes men into being feminized pussies ("Sit nicely and comply little Johhny or I will flunk you out of school"........and all of our mother's tried to make us into "gentlemen" who would bend over backwards to give a woman anything she wants), but then our women reject us for being what they want us to be.
I realize that this is a highly mysoginistic statement, but given this sort of thing, I'm inclined to believe that in most cases (there are exceptions), a mis-wired female brain shouldn't be put in charge of any decision more important than "Bounce or Downy".
B9K
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060419/ap_on_re_us/sexual_satisfaction
Well, this article is half right. There is more equality in Europe and in Austria than any other continent for men and women. Japan and Latin America is male dominated and controlled so Japanese women grudgingly have sex with their local men but then have more satisfying sex with us American men that TREAT them like equals. What I don't agree with is the US having satisfying sex according to this article.
I think it is like Japan or Latin America only the OPPOSITE!!! Women are dominant and it is the MEN that grudgingly have sex with these behemoths!! One thing this article got right is that inequality DOES cause less satisfying sex lives in the couples and that is very true in the US or Canada which are female dominated. Also inequality causes less healthy dominant partners because the dominant sex thinks he in Latin America or Japan or she in the US doesn't have to work out to get any. The equal countries such as Europe do work out to attract each other and therefore leads more sexually satisfying lives.
darkseid,
that was a good observation on your part regarding the dominant partner feeling like they don't have to work out in order to get laid.
i see it all the time.... young girls with fat little dough-bellies that see no need to go to the gym. women of all ages with big fat out-of-shape asses that try to lose some weight, not to attract a guy, but so that they can try out some new fashion.
i also see guys who are (as far as i can tell) in fairly good shape, and they're walking along with these chubby little fem-blobs. i guess if you've got the p*ssy supply under 100% control, the guys haven't got any other choice.
there are a few girls out there who do have nice hard bodies. but, if you eliminate the ones who are ****, crazy, lesbian or man-haters, you're left with a fraction of a percent of the female population. these chosen few have a 200 to one ratio of interested guys vs. attractive girls. they can take their pick of whatever guy they like.
the really sad thing is, it's getting so that the smaller, less homely fem-blobs have better choices available than an average guy.
rock
CBGBConnisur
04-20-06, 10:30
frankly, in america, the prospect of an unsubstantiated accusation combined with the opproious legal system makes me very weary of fucking women that i do not know. the 9th circuit has ruled that a woman can give consent, then retract said consent during the act—even non-verbally—and the man can still be charged with [CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123). so: you can be fucking a chick, she suddenly changes her mind but forgets to tell you about it, or the booze starts to kick in, and you be doing 20 to life in folsom a few months later.
most people can’t see how guys like mike tyson are convicted when the woman went to his hotel room at 2 am. what the fuck is any woman going to discuss with mike alone in his room in the wee hours of the night after sipping on a little liquor? what the fuck would anyone discuss with mike period? i’ll reiterate what i said earlier: when a woman goes home with a strange man in the wee hours of the am after drinking some form of intimacy is expected. i would tell my daughter to not go home with men from clubs or discos.
very true, the legal system with regards to male suspect, female accuser is usually male is guilty until proven innocent. in other news, i would strongly advise the men on this board to avoid anglophone countries for play. a lot of the oprah shit has made its way down under, go to southeast asia, south america, eastern europe, hell i even heard some middle eastern places are better places to meet women. anyhow i am headed to penang and bangkok.
[QUOTE=CBGBConnisur]....hell I even heard some Middle Eastern places are better places to meet women.QUOTE]
Actually, the best place I've ever been to to meet upscale, beautiful, and quality women is... Qatar... of all places. There are 3,000 international flight attendants based there and a dearth of availiable suitors. It's an ideal location to meet well-bred women from 2nd world nations. Most of them don't date arabs and the 40,000 soliders there are confined to base; the defense contractors that can leave the base don't dont know how to date such women so if you're good looking, appear refined, and fun, you can easily clean up once "you're in." it was there that I realized that the most beautiful women in the world are arab. I dated this Iraqi woman there that was nothing less than a 9.5 before I got drunk and said something stupid and she abrubtly dumped me.:(
Appearently when you bring in a foreign national as a wife or whatever, you have to sign a paper with the feds promisng to pay for any social assistance benefits that the foreign national receives, up to $16,000 a year. Ouch! Like things weren't bad enough with Americanization, etc.
Maybe the "sailor marriage" (keep her at home, your vacations there, and hers in US) proposed a few times here on the board might not be such a bad idea....
B9K
That law’s on the books but not enforced too much. I’ve actually seen it used more when the woman claims abuse and wants to get out of the marriage before she has permanent status.
“Sailor marriages” can work well with older women or unambitious and stupid young girls. Older women will be not enthused at the prospect of starting over and leaving their ever so important existent social structure behind. They will also enjoy their new found wealth in their native land. I know a few Israeli guys that have Moldovan wives ½ their age that they keep in Moldova. The girls are dumb as shit—no education past the 7th grade—or former sex workers, but everyone seems to be happy. You should bear in mind that when you leave she will be fucking someone else.
Nonetheless, I stand by my theory based on my experience that over-doting or drowning a girl with attention in the early stages of a relationship will scare away or turn off many girls, and this is not necessarily limited to only American or Anglo women.
Guys,
Do not confuse being a "nice guy" with being a door mat or a puppy dog! That is NOT at all what I mean by a "nice guy". By "nice guy" I mean a man who reciprocates the good things his woman gives him. Who is respectful towards her and treats her with dignity.
None of that implies that nice guy gives his woman anything she wants whenever she wants. It doesn't mean she makes all, or even some, of the decisions in the relationship. A nice guy listens to his woman so she has input into things, BUT he has the final say. He provides the guidance and direction for the relationship. Providing that guidance doesn't need to be harsh or brutal, it only needs to be firm.
I have found AW's to be completely schizo on this point. On the one hand, they create an environment where a man can barely wipe his own ass without some investigative committee getting in on the act to make sure he is not being sexual, sexist, or something. On the other hand, they complain that men are no longer "men". We don't make the first move anymore. We aren't chivalrous anymore. We don't as much ambition and drive anymore. Etc. etc. etc.
Sinanju Master
04-22-06, 01:42
I have found AW's to be completely schizo on this point. On the one hand, they create an environment where a man can barely wipe his own ass without some investigative committee getting in on the act to make sure he is not being sexual, sexist, or something. On the other hand, they complain that men are no longer "men". We don't make the first move anymore. We aren't chivalrous anymore. We don't as much ambition and drive anymore. Etc. etc. etc.
Is it any wonder that many times you can hear AW's lamenting that they don't know what they want? "THE ONE" told me that she didn't know what she wanted after I laid out my cards. That's a big reason why I hate indecisive women. I'm not gonna waste my precious time hanging around waiting for them to make up their minds while I can be enjoying Life with one who CAN.
It is good to hear that they don't bother with it too often. Just out of curiosity, what is your information source if you can reveal it without difficulty?
I didn't REALLY want to do the "sailor marriage", but found it preferable to potentially again putting a woman in a position to ruin your life (on the other hand, you are definitely buying the cow, without getting the milk......setup is basically useless unless you want to have some kids). Most certainly the most pious and faithful of women would be prone to cheat seeing you only 6-8 weeks a year.
An interesting thought.....I personally would like to be living in Europe right now (I'm aiming for age 40, 5 years off), and the biggest potential impediment is the EU work visa. Several parts of the former Eastern Bloc are EU member states, including the Czech Republic, Romania, Bulgaria, and probably eventually Ukraine....one could marry a girl from one of those places, and have a "ticket" to work anywhere in the EU, such as Amsterdam, Berlin, Barcelona etc....
Just a thought,
B9K
That law’s on the books but not enforced too much. I’ve actually seen it used more when the woman claims abuse and wants to get out of the marriage before she has permanent status.
“Sailor marriages” can work well with older women or unambitious and stupid young girls. Older women will be not enthused at the prospect of starting over and leaving their ever so important existent social structure behind. They will also enjoy their new found wealth in their native land. I know a few Israeli guys that have Moldovan wives ½ their age that they keep in Moldova. The girls are dumb as shit—no education past the 7th grade—or former sex workers, but everyone seems to be happy. You should bear in mind that when you leave she will be fucking someone else.
Also my friend just tipped me off to this new england journal of medicine article, and it said like 33% of american women have no sexual desire, and another 17% don't even enjoy sex. The divorce rate here is 50%.
So you have to ask yourself, what are you even working for? Once you do finally hold the attention of an aw, there's a 50% chance that you look forward to a sexless marriage, if your marriage even lasts at all
All these aw's act like their pussies are gold mines, but they don't deliver. Once you get past the facade, there's nothing there.
In my opinion aw's are in a constant state of the cat chasing the string. They want the bigger, better deal at all times, but in the end nothing really makes them happy.
The guys who still have a choice if they marry: Don't forget, the world goes global. Discount airlines grow taking you everywhere you want for a reasonable fare. Let the AW's how they want to be - untouched - and follow your desires using global opportunity.
Believe me you can find well educated women in that globe (you should be well educated as well) - not from the pro scene - who also enjoy thier pussy treated well and also enjoy to give you return for that. And the maintanance cost are not higher (rather lower) then with AW's and doubtable return.
I strongly believe, if the aw's behave is consequently ignored and foreign are women preferred, the attitute will change over time (but it certainly will take some time).
regards
Brain666
i find it all amusing:
the result should be binary. either a bimbo (or maybe two with her friend-not that familiar with the details), is going to get very publicly outed for crying wolf about [CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123) or.....
a bunch of spoiled overprivleged college athletes get skullfucked out on a rail.
i'm pretty much ok with either scenario.
there was something else......it will come to me later.
b9k
What a bunch of bullshit.
Everyone is so worked up over this case while at the same time ignoring the really serious issues. So a stripper got fucked (maybe) by some guys that she didn't (maybe) want to do it with.
My dad always said watch out, because a woman can run faster with her skirt up than a guy can with his pants down.
Rock
[CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123) bullshit.
yes, [CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123) is an actual violent crime, and is a horrible societal offence. quite frankly, if i had a daughter and a man did that to her, i would probably kill him, bare handed.
however, it has been turned by feminists into one of the biggest anti man weapons out there, along with sexual harassment.
i remember starting at a small public midwestern university 17 years ago.
the absolute first thing broadcast by "the powers that be" (i don't recall the exact transmission methods-probably dorm orientations, and definitely the school paper) was [CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123) this, [CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123) that, [CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123) sensitivity, date [CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123)......about 6 weeks into the term, there was an "attempted [CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123)" which caused the campus to be on virtual "lockdown" with campus maps being circulated with indications of "high danger areas", and the rotc offering a "walk home" service (mostly a way to meet girls). it turned out later to be a hoax, perpetrated by someone with an agenda (big surprise right guys)....i remember clearly that it was actually kind of funny because the artists drawing of the "suspect" strongly resembled a nationally famous comedian....who was the entertainment for homecoming in a few weeks.
now me personally, as a somewhat naive, impressionable young guy (having not received any instruction in countervailing points of view) took this bullshit to heart...and turned into a "sensitive" guy, barely willing (while sober anyways) to make an aggressive (necessary) move toward a girl-----exactly the state that these cunts want men to be in. needless to say, i didn't get any ass that first term!!!!
coming back to the duke thing, although as previously mentioned i will be more than amused to see a couple of spoiled overprivledged college athletes take a big nasty hit, i will absolutely, definitely, blow a load if it turns out that this chick faked it or whatever....unfortunately, in actuality, it will probably end ambiguously ("not enough evidence to convict") and people will end up with their own conclusions.
b9k
Happy Chappy
04-22-06, 09:19
Very true, the legal system with regards to male suspect, female accuser is usually male is guilty until proven innocent. In other news, I would strongly advise the men on this board to avoid Anglophone countries for play. A lot of the Oprah shit has made its way down under, go to Southeast Asia, South America, Eastern Europe, hell I even heard some Middle Eastern places are better places to meet women. Anyhow I am headed to Penang and Bangkok.I read plenty of posts on the American thread and this forum in general and finally am getting off my backside to be more of a poster/contributor rather than a lurker. Anyway I find your posts quite interesting in general and you make many good points. One aspect of your posts has intrigued me, is that I seem to get the impression that you find the women in Australia a lot better than American women. Being an ozzie, its funny because all the posts on American women I read here, I personally think that they nearly all apply equally to Australian women. So when sometimes you seem to imply ozzie women are better, I would hate to be on the dating scene in the U.S. then!
My only U.S. expereince was for a month so I probably don't have much insight. I was thinking that maybe your experience with Australian women is better because I think Australian women might have a bit of a thing for foreign men in general? But overall when I read the American women thread I believe that Australian women have been "americanised" and share the same traits as are often mentioned here.
So I am interested what your current feelings are towards Australian women as opposed to American women, are they any better, or do you think they share many of the same traits as American women?
Cheers
here's what pisses me off about this whole situation.
a woman comes on strong with a guy who is not interested. that's ok, a: because 99% of all heterosexual guys don't mind that sort of thing and b: she can portray herself as being sexually empowered/liberated. even if she's absolutely homely fat and disgusting, the guy would just shrug it off, go home have a beer and forget about it.
now when a guy comes on strong with a woman who isn't interested. that's bad because a: the woman automatically gets portrayed as a victim and b: the man is automatically labelled as some kind of aggressive sexual deviant. instead of just shrugging it off, the woman claims to be traumatized and requires counseling so that she can "get closure" and "enable the healing process".
this line of reasoning applies to what i call "gray area" intercourse, which is to say, intercourse where consent may or may not have been given. this is opposed to straight up [CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123)..... where there is no consent and the man gets his enjoyment from violently subjugating the woman.
there have been many cases like this. in fact, some women will get themselves into socially embarrassing situations like these. afterwards, they will claim to have been sexually assaulted in order to protect their "reputation".
it's like someone said, these days no means no, maybe means no, silence means no ....... and even yes can mean no if the woman decides to change her mind later.
rock
Jelly Donut
04-22-06, 14:32
Also my friend just tipped me off to this new england journal of medicine article, and it said like 33% of american women have no sexual desire, and another 17% don't even enjoy sex. The divorce rate here is 50%.See New England Journal of Medicine "Sexual Desire and Arousal Disorders in Women" by Rosemary Basson, M.D. Volume 354:1497-1506 April 6, 2006 Number 14
I personally would like to be living in Europe right now (I'm aiming for age 40, 5 years off), and the biggest potential impediment is the EU work visa.Since the invention of the internet and e-commerce has made it fairly easy to make money from anywhere in the world, why on earth would a work visa be a problem?
With 5 years to do it you can build an online business that makes as much money as you need to support you anywhere you want to live.
And don't forget, there are backdoors available to EU citizenship. I won't give you details but I will give you hints.
Hint 1: Honduras
Hint 2: Spain
Hint 3: EU
Now get to work.
I'll PM you.....I think I get the gist here...I also know that Italy is an easy one.....you can go there, get like a residence permit, and then use that to get their equivilent of a social security number....which you can use to work legally.
Thanks,
B9K
Several parts of the former Eastern Bloc are EU member states, including the Czech Republic, Romania, Bulgaria, and probably eventually Ukraine....one could marry a girl from one of those places, and have a "ticket" to work anywhere in the EU, such as Amsterdam, Berlin, Barcelona etc....Neither Romania nor Bulgaria are members of EU, though they will be in one or two years if they play good. The Ukraine won't be for many many years. The referendums in the Netherlands and France, sobered EU politicians a bit, so lobbying for new member states would be a bad idea and they know it.
You can apply for a working visa, and there are good chances you get one given that you are well educated and there is a company asking for your services. You should also speak at least one more language besides English, unless you opt for Ireland or the UK. Good luck.
And don't forget, there are backdoors available to EU citizenship. I won't give you details but I will give you hints.
Hint 1: Honduras
Hint 2: Spain
Hint 3: EUWhy not giving us details? Spain=EU, but explain the Honduras to Spain step. You mean spaniards let people from former colonies in just like that? I don't think so.
Leeuwen,
I was appearently mistaken about Romania and Bulgaria-although a year or two is of course nothing. From what I have read, Ukraine is shooting for 2015-9 years which on the other hand isn't easily dismissed. Isn't it correct however, that some privleges, such as "mobility of labor" are, or can be granted prior to full ascension.
My understanding is that things can be a bit more complicated than simply applying for a job, being hired, and granted a work visa. I understand that there are some bureaucratic hassles to the employer involved such as advertising the position locally for six weeks in an attempt to find a suitable local candidate. Quite frankly, although I have a high degree of education, I don't (to the extent of my knowledge) have any particular skill that would warrant the hassle. I do know that the multi national corporations have the manpower(for dealing with hassles) and political influence to move people pretty much wherever they want to go, but to this point in time, I haven't had any success with say GE Europe-Possibly, this is a defeatist attitude, but I'm inclined to think that what I am able to do isn't "special and unique" enough to warrant bringing me to another continent for a job interview. I'm certainly aware that I can come and teach english as a second language, but due to my heavy student loan debt, I need to earn a decent western style salary-that kind of work pays about $500 monthly in Prague, and 750 Euro monthly in Nice France....presumably salaries are similar in Spain, Italy, Germany....
I am working on developing some semi-unique skills that will eventually make me marketable to an overseas employer, and do have a little online business I'm working with. But in the meantime.....
At any rate, thank you for the encouragement at least
B9k
PS I did PM Elberto for some exact details...he is yet to respond to me.
Elberto contacted me.
Appearently you need only be a resident of a Spanish colony for two years to be able to apply for Spanish citizenship, which of course entitles you to work anywhere in the EU.
Anyone who wants the info link, PM me.
B9K
Doctor_Skank
04-25-06, 22:59
B9K:
Even though the EU is governed by a self-serving government that nobody elected but was rather appointed (so much for democracy) and the citizens of Europe never even were allowed to vote to have the EU created or have a common currency created (again, so much for democracy) and many in the appointed EU government would like to allow any and every nation into the less than exclusive union, the current political climate is not one that encourages immigration. As Leeuwen correctly stated, recent referendums on the subject of EU expansion were shot down in Denmark and France among others, which surprised fat-headed EU politicians who believed they could shove anything down the peoples throat. I have great respect for the French for making a stand on this issue.
Of course there are always ways to get in, but I would double and triple check any reports of it being so easy to become an EU citizen or get a work permit, especially through Spain which is struggling with a rising immigration problem, particularly from North Africa. I might be wrong and have never tried myself to become an EU citizen myself, but like I said the current political climate is more protectionist than liberal.
As for Ukraine, I think Yushenko might have overplayed his card by burning all bridges to Russia in his effort to westernize Ukraine and make a bid for EU membership. I think even 2015 is a long shot, but who knows. So far most Euro governments see no reason at all to let in further members and most already regret so readily accepting nations such as Bulgaria or Romania. They will be nothing but tax burdens and places to outsource production and services, further slowing the economies of the EUs primary motors, such as Germany, France or Italy. Of course some in big business will profit from this outsourcing, but ultimately the burden will fall on the already overladen taxpayer, stifling his earnings and slowing the consumption fueled economy.
Or maybe not. What the hell do I know.
All this talk of getting into the EU.
The question is, why? To gain access to low-cost eastern european poontang? There must be a better way. For one thing, I believe you're aiming at the wrong target. The EU, in general, is a high cost/lower standard of living place to live. Don't believe me? Try staying in France, Germany or the UK for a few weeks and then we'll see what you think.
The idea of first living in Honduras or any other former Spanish colony is an excellent one. You might find that you've attained your goal in one step. These countries (eg. Honduras, Colombia, Argentina etc.) are not too expensive to live in and are populated with some of the most excellent women in the world. Plus, they are a lot closer to "home" for us North Americans. Also, cheaper to get there and you don't have to contend with way out differences in time zones. Language is another bonus. Spanish or English.... that's it. If you know these 2 languages you can go ANYwhere in Latin America.
If you guys STILL have a burning desire for europe, go ahead..... but there a much stronger case to be made for South America. Just ask Jackson about Argentina sometime and see what he says.
Rock
ps. If I WAS going to head for Europe, I'd look into buying some property somewhere in EE. Possibly along the Adriatic coastline of Croatia. That's right across from Italy.... not too expensive, and makes for a nice mongering "base of operations".
Rock,
All great suggestions, but unfortunately, I have a constraint-I have a US dollar obligation of about $300 a month (student loan-balance 52K)....much as I would like to say "fuck it all", and move to a tropical paradise, I unfortunately have to contend with that payment, which means that I can't work for a poor countries salary.
I know that Western Europe also has it's downsides, my thought is that I could earn a westernized salary there, plus, if I settle down, I'm of the impression that the wife wouldn't get "westernized", at least to the same degree.
Now should my little business take off, and I can work from anywhere, I might be inclined to split my time between Prague (cool Euro flavor, inexpensive, cosmopolitan), and someplace warm during the winter....coastal Croatia, Bulgaria, and Odessa also caught my eye...or as you have mentioned, Argentina, Honduras.....
By the way, Dr S, regarding:
"Or maybe not. What the hell do I know."
In my humble opinion, only the truly learned and insightful man realizes the extent to which his own perceptions can be incorrect.
.
When I meet new people overseas, and tell them I'm from the U.S., some find it hard to believe, they tell me I don't "act like an American." I'm not sure what it is they mean exactly, but it seems to be something they like, as if they are complimenting me. I've gotten this response from both women and men, and both Asian and European. Some of them went so far as to insist that I call them up (in their hometown or wherever). And, as you might guess, some were women with whom I became intimate.
Now I'm stuck in the U.S. again with little or no social life, just as it was for me here as a teenager and a couple decades or so of adult life. It's almost like being a monk. I'm wondering if this same "unamerican" quality that I have, that works in my favor overseas, actually works against me here.
I'm not suggesting that any one culture or personality type is "better" or "worse" than any other. I'm just wondering if some personality types are a better match for certain cultures, while not working so well in other cultures.
I would like to hear from others, especially those who have lived in the U.S. as well as other countries, and let me know your thoughts and observations on this.
Thanks,
Night Cat
Bart9000 - Think about it. If only two years of residency in a former Spanish colony is all it takes to be able to apply for Spanish citizenship, don't you think half of the South and Central America would already have moved to Spain? Personally I have never heard of this law, but should have, given the consequences related to it. Looking forward to see some proofs. http://www.euimmigration.org/
Doctor Skank - Do you mind, but GW Bush is an appointed president by the Supreme Court, not elected one (so much for democracy). He and geezers with similar view on democracy, lied to American tax payers about the war in Iraq, as they lied about pretty much everthing else. Look who's talking now.
Even though the EU is governed by a self-serving government that nobody elected but was rather appointed (so much for democracy) and the citizens of Europe never even were allowed to vote to have the EU created or have a common currency created (again, so much for democracy) and many in the appointed EU government would like to allow any and every nation into the less than exclusive union, the current political climate is not one that encourages immigration.Whatever the source is, it's wrong and reflects ignorant opnions, which you may have come in contact with while in Europe. There have been referendums on whether to join EU or not to. There have also been referendums regarding euro currency. Latest referendum covered the constitution.
Few examples:
1994 - Norway votes 'no' to EU membership (today majority of Norwegians is in favour)
1995 - Sweden votes 'yes' to EU membership
2000 - Denmark votes 'no' to euro currency
2005 - Spain votes 'yes' to EU constitution
What some citizens failed to understand, was that by signing the Maastricht Treaty member countries were obliged to join the Economic and Monetary Union. Denmark and the UK had a clause excluding EMU, hence euro referendum was held in Denmark but not elsewhere. The newest EU members held national referendums on regarding membership, joining single currency (in few years), and ratification of the constitution.
All this talk of getting into the EU.
The question is, why? To gain access to low-cost eastern european poontang? There must be a better way. For one thing, I believe you're aiming at the wrong target. The EU, in general, is a high cost/lower standard of living place to live. Don't believe me? Try staying in France, Germany or the UK for a few weeks and then we'll see what you think.Nobody here has slightest doubts you are better off with 100€ in Honduras compared to France or Germany, but there are few blondes in Central and South America. Diffrent strokes for different folkes. If EE blondes are your cup of tea, then best way to stay in Europe must be to work for an European division of a U.S company. Germany would be optimal from points of view such as many flights to EE destinations, and amount of EE women in the country. You can also bring them to Germany and for a trial period, haha. Even if there are incredible beautiful women in Venezuela and Colombia, you can't stay in those countires without giving up your employment, right? And bringing them back to the U.S is complicated. So either getting laid every night, 365 days a year, or making a two week excursion to Colombia once a year (for average Joe from Texas).
Bart9000,
That's a whole different story.... if you have a business over there and it's making you some $$$. Check with our mutual friend Brian regarding Russia though. He has some eye opening info..... you might want to avoid going there. Prague or Odessa both get two thumbs up from me. Only thing is Ukraine's long term future with regards to it's political stability. However those women are hot and, according to Brian, a bargain.
Marak,
The women I've seen from Honduras look like they have a lot of indian in them. Many latina looking women to be sure, but there seems to be a common type there...... kind of short, a little bit thick, and big tits. I don't think the average Honduran girl is as pretty as a Colombian one, but there's always a few nice ones wherever you go.
Rock
Bart9000,
That's a whole different story.... if you have a business over there and it's making you some $$$. Check with our mutual friend Brian regarding Russia though. He has some eye opening info..... you might want to avoid going there. Prague or Odessa both get two thumbs up from me. Only thing is Ukraine's long term future with regards to it's political stability. However those women are hot and, according to Brian, a bargain.
Marak,
The women I've seen from Honduras look like they have a lot of indian in them. Many latina looking women to be sure, but there seems to be a common type there...... kind of short, a little bit thick, and big tits. I don't think the average Honduran girl is as pretty as a Colombian one, but there's always a few nice ones wherever you go.
Rock
Actually, Odessa is a little bit pricey believe it or not (seems like I saw pretty much "ordinary" houses selling for 2-300,000...as I recall, there was a "pimp daddy" condo there selling for about 250K)...I'm sure that going 5 miles inland would fix that, but I REALLY like the concept of living on the coast. Also, yes believe me, I'm aware of political instability. I believe that, would I choose to live there, I would have a definite "escape plan" available....not to mention be ready to wave my blue passport around if necessary....I don't approve of many things in the US, but it can be a good thing to be a citizen of the country that is the last military superpower.
I really like the Czech Republic, and they are head and shoulders up in this regard...unfortunately the country is landlocked....I could maybe cope if I spent 6 months out of the year in Nassau, Costa Rica, whatever
Night Cat-Do the words "I feel like a stranger in my own homeland" mean anything to you? I've been told that my attitudes are more European than American, am bored to death by sports (so I can barely communicate with most other men), and you don't want to know what I think of a good portion of organized religion (this used to not be that big a factor until they started putting guys with PE teacher IQ's, and their greedy self serving friends in charge of the free world because otherwise gay men might have wedding ceremonies and share insurance benefits) I have always generally gotten along better with people from anyplace OTHER than the US, including even people from the middle east (I had Turkish and Pakistani roomates in college-those guys were awesome), and "non-americanized" Mexicans.
B9K
Any guys of European descent should get birth documents from your grandparents right away. I met a guy in Cali, Colombia, who was born in the US but whose grandmother was born in Ireland. He told me he took advantage of an Irish law that conveyed citizenship on the descendants of Irish nationals, even if they were born outside of Ireland. When he became an Irish citizen, he automatically became a citizen of the EU and now has the right to live and work anywhere is Europe!
I understand that Italy is also very liberal in that regard, with a similar policy
Sinanju Master
04-27-06, 21:35
If I didn't see it with my own eyes, I wouldn't have believed it! I was watching Oprah to see who she was gonna vilify today and BAM!!! She featured sex predators... (waiting to deliver the punch line) all of whom were WOMEN!! AND she tore into her very first sex predator guest! IT GETS BETTER!!! She told the broad that 1] there is a DOUBLE STANDARD in this country regarding punishment of sex predators by gender and 2] she told the broad that if she were a MAN, the country would want to throw her UNDER the jail and toss away the key!!
My bretheren, I'm almost afraid to go outside right now for fear that I'll find I'm no longer in my own universe. I may find Pat Robertson holding prayer meetings with leaders of the Gay Community and openly embracing them, Dubya telling the world that he's wrong for dismissing the intelligence community (and later BLAMING THEM) that got us into the Iraq quagmire, Al-Zarqui holding a cookout (inviting non-Muslims) featuring barbecued ham, and alcohol galore... LOL
nope,
here's how i see this one. this is oprah's insidious way of telling us that women have gotten so equal, and now have so much power that they feel it is now "safe" for them to go after (ie. criticize or attack) each other. this is really just the absolute height of political correctness.
the actual fact of the matter is, there is a difference when a 23 yr old woman has sex with a 13/14 yr old boy vs. a 23 yr old man doing it with a 13 yr old girl. the boy can't get pregnant.... and have his life messed up. the boy can't engage in the act unless he is sexually aroused (and by implication, willing). finally, the boy may actually get a fair amount of positive peer reactions from..... well, from his peers. back when i was 13, i would have been the hero of the year if i could have scored with one of my teachers.... or any full-grown woman for that matter.
a 13 year old girl could feel pressured into the act by vritue of the adult's authority and do it without being aroused at all, but rather scared out of her wits.... this would be quite traumatic. also, there's not going to be any postive reactions from her peers. she's more likely to be stigmatized as "the girl that had sex with that man".
so, relax sinanju..... oprah is still full of shit, and the world still makes sense.
rock
Billy Jeans
04-28-06, 02:14
Well put Rock Dog.
Any guys of European descent should get birth documents from your grandparents right away. I met a guy in Cali, Colombia, who was born in the US but whose grandmother was born in Ireland. He told me he took advantage of an Irish law that conveyed citizenship on the descendants of Irish nationals, even if they were born outside of Ireland. When he became an Irish citizen, he automatically became a citizen of the EU and now has the right to live and work anywhere is Europe!
That is correct George, Irish citizenship is granted to anyone who has one grandparent who was born in the island of Ireland (including Northern Ireland) it is actually a huge loophole given that the actual population of Ireland is about 5 million whereas there must be ten times that number of people living in the US, the UK, Australia, Canada, New Zealand and South Africa who can legally claim citizenship through their oul' Irish granny.
With an Irish passport you can automatically live and work anywhere in the EU, including all those nice new entrants from central and eastern Europe, Czech Rep, Latvia, Poland, Hungary etc. You do not even have to show your passport if travelling between the UK and Ireland but will have to present it when travelling to the continent.
Enjoy this loophole while it lasts folks.
CBGBConnisur
04-30-06, 01:23
That would be one way of getting into the European Union, which has some of the most difficult laws and attitudes towards migrants. Americans regardless of origin are very welcome in most countries. Still, from what I know from people who live in the more affluent Euro countries is that the women and the divorce issues are just as bad if not worse than the USA. Most people who want to leave the USA think about Europe because it has modern living standards. With the modern living standards comes the similar attitudes you see in North America. This is a link to divorce rates around the world: http://www.divorcemag.com/statistics/statsWorld.shtml
Poland is the only new EU state that doesn't seem to have a high divorce rate. Italy, Spain, and Portugal are also lower.
nope,
here's how i see this one. this is oprah's insidious way of telling us that women have gotten so equal, and now have so much power that they feel it is now "safe" for them to go after (ie. criticize or attack) each other. this is really just the absolute height of political correctness.
the actual fact of the matter is, there is a difference when a 23 yr old woman has sex with a 13/14 yr old boy vs. a 23 yr old man doing it with a 13 yr old girl. the boy can't get pregnant.... and have his life messed up. the boy can't engage in the act unless he is sexually aroused (and by implication, willing). finally, the boy may actually get a fair amount of positive peer reactions from..... well, from his peers. back when i was 13, i would have been the hero of the year if i could have scored with one of my teachers.... or any full-grown woman for that matter.
a 13 year old girl could feel pressured into the act by vritue of the adult's authority and do it without being aroused at all, but rather scared out of her wits.... this would be quite traumatic. also, there's not going to be any postive reactions from her peers. she's more likely to be stigmatized as "the girl that had sex with that man".
so, relax sinanju..... oprah is still full of shit, and the world still makes sense.
rock
so a 13 year old boy can give consent, but a 13 year old girl could never. and girls are always forced to have sex.
i never thought women could enjoy sex either.
Tyhigs,
You're reading something that I didn't write. The fact is, I never wrote that 13 yr olds of either gender could give consent. Legally speaking, neither can give consent. That being said, males have to be physically aroused in order to have intercourse (as long as we aren't talking about oral sex). Girls DON'T have to be aroused.
It's true that such a young girl might be a willing participant. A young boy might do it with an adult woman, and then later feel disturbed by the experience. However, the double standard exists for a reason. It didn't just arise spontaneously for no good reason. That's what I was trying to get at with my post.
It's a hard issue to get into..... if you go too far, you start coming across as an advocate for sexual relations between adults and kids in their early teens.
Oprah is trying to imply that there should be no double standard because there is no difference between men and women. She used this issue to skillfully and subtly push her own agenda of total feminist equality . All I'm saying is, there ARE differences between males and females.... both physical and psychological. In my opinion, double standards don't just pop up on their own.... they arise for a reason.
This was definitely one of those times.
Rock
ps. Hopefully, this clarifies my position
One Wing Low
04-30-06, 18:33
Took a ride with a Nigeria-born shuttle van driver. It turned out that he's an educated man, graduated an Electrical Engineer from California Polytechnics University-Pomona.
He was working as an engineer, living a happy single’s life. He felt awkward at family gatherings that all his siblings were married with kids. It seems that they all wanted him to get hooked into the same trap as they. At 40, he finally married a registered nurse from Nigeria and brought her to America. She refused to go to work, at the same time demanded him to work extra jobs to bring more money into the household. He deeply resented the fact that she could be making $45-$60 an hour but refused to go to work.
Despite hating each other, somehow they had 6 children in the past 20 years. The oldest son was a star football player in high school and was offered full football scholarship to UCLA. He‘s very fond, loving and proud of his children. He was smiling broadly when complaining that the 6 children are all big size and they ate him broke.
But he just hates the wife. Apparently they had lots of fights. Each time they had arguments, she would call 911 to summon the police. He ended up going to jail 3 times. He lost his engineer job in one of the incarcerations and lost his home. He could not get back into the job market for professionals. He therefore bought a van, paid $30K for the franchise fee and drive people to and from airports etc…The franchiser also takes 25% of his revenue. It’s a hard life but he’s paying for 2 kids in college and 4 younger ones who eat big time everyday.
Apparently there were also a lot of fights among the children but she never called 911 on them. So she was just abusing the police to punish her husband. It seems they both love the children passionately but just hate each other. It’s strange how they hate each other that much and still managed to have 6 children together.
This story is very common among foreign-born wives. They would call 911 every time they are pissed off, abusing the police to punish their mates. They are also more inclined to abuse other public services like social assistance, health care etc… It seems that they feel inferior and do not like to mingle socially, or to compete in the work place. They are more likely to stay home and depend on their husbands entirely for their living, while manipulating and abusing them in the worst ways.
It seems that their lives are entirely focused at …HOME, and that where their main battles are.
Life is so much simpler and more beautiful if one just goes to TJ and pay the young, sweet, pretty chicas for hot sessions.
the fact that there is an obvious overt difference in arousal between the young boy and girl does not mean that there should be a difference in how the crime is classified.the boy also does not have to get pregnant to have his life "messed up" he could be screwed up later in life just by the experience, not everyone is the same.
you seem to be saying because the boy gets overtly aroused and the girl does not have to there is or should be a difference in the equality of it. a female teacher that performs oral sex on a young boy will arouse him, its natural for him to be aroused, but the arousal in no way equates to consent, the arousal is natural.
also at 13, the boy could still get teased or harrassed by his peers. its cute for people to say when i was 13 i would have love to have had sex with my teacher, but they are saying it now (when they are older) not when they were 13. these type of interactions can negatively affect some boys and in some cases they may not.
there are some natural overt differences as you pointed out, but they are just male and female differences. if society adopted the macho image that the boy may have been a willing participant or enjoyed the act, there's no telling where this issue would end up.
we could start excusing female teachers who have sex with minor boys and not classify it as a crime,or make them lesser crimes than if it was with a girl, but what if the boy was our own 13 yr old son?
just my opinion.
nope,
nope,
here's how i see this one. this is oprah's insidious way of telling us that women have gotten so equal, and now have so much power that they feel it is now "safe" for them to go after (ie. criticize or attack) each other. this is really just the absolute height of political correctness.
the actual fact of the matter is, there is a difference when a 23 yr old woman has sex with a 13/14 yr old boy vs. a 23 yr old man doing it with a 13 yr old girl. the boy can't get pregnant.... and have his life messed up. the boy can't engage in the act unless he is sexually aroused (and by implication, willing). finally, the boy may actually get a fair amount of positive peer reactions from..... well, from his peers. back when i was 13, i would have been the hero of the year if i could have scored with one of my teachers.... or any full-grown woman for that matter.
a 13 year old girl could feel pressured into the act by vritue of the adult's authority and do it without being aroused at all, but rather scared out of her wits.... this would be quite traumatic. also, there's not going to be any postive reactions from her peers. she's more likely to be stigmatized as "the girl that had sex with that man".
so, relax sinanju..... oprah is still full of shit, and the world still makes sense.
rock
rock
Sinanju Master
04-30-06, 21:30
Interesting discussion here, my bretheren. At the end of the day, sex with a minor by EITHER sex is a crime. PERIOD. I was channel surfing and came upon one of the female teachers (from Florida, I believe) in the middle of a media circus and this fucking B*TCH had the BALLS to say that there was no double standard where this type of crime is concerned. ON TOP OF THAT, she felt she did NO WRONG!! One couldn't get more POSITIVE evidence of a double standard than if you went to the top of Mount Sinai and got it inscribed in STONE!
Doctor_Skank
04-30-06, 21:50
What puzzles me about this whole thing, is what motivation does a woman like Debra Lafave have in seducing a 14 year old?
Power trip?
Some sort of vengeance?
Self-hate?
Simply lust?
It really doesnt make much sense to me, as a 14 year old boy is not usually what a woman would consider a sex object. The fact that she is above-average looking makes it even more puzzling for most men. She obviously would have a decent selection of grown men to choose from. I am sure the P.E. teacher would have loved to have seen Ms.Lafave on an extra-curricular basis.
I also wonder if what happened is a society-induced largely American phenomenon, just like disgruntled employees shooting their co-workers (which happens almost exclusively in the US) or acute obesity, an American phenomenon being effectively globalized. I am not nearly as America-paranoid as many posters (have lived in several countries and took a little satisfaction in realizing how fucked up they can be too), but do admit that some pretty whack things do happen in the good ol' US of A.
So why does she do it? Seems to me that sexual pleasure cannot have been the central motivation.
CBGBConnisur
05-01-06, 00:06
Took a ride with a Nigeria-born shuttle van driver. It turned out that he's an educated man, graduated an Electrical Engineer from California Polytechnics University-Pomona.
He was working as an engineer, living a happy single’s life. He felt awkward at family gatherings that all his siblings were married with kids. It seems that they all wanted him to get hooked into the same trap as they. At 40, he finally married a registered nurse from Nigeria and brought her to America. She refused to go to work, at the same time demanded him to work extra jobs to bring more money into the household. He deeply resented the fact that she could be making $45-$60 an hour but refused to go to work.
Despite hating each other, somehow they had 6 children in the past 20 years. The oldest son was a star football player in high school and was offered full football scholarship to UCLA. He‘s very fond, loving and proud of his children. He was smiling broadly when complaining that the 6 children are all big size and they ate him broke.
But he just hates the wife. Apparently they had lots of fights. Each time they had arguments, she would call 911 to summon the police. He ended up going to jail 3 times. He lost his engineer job in one of the incarcerations and lost his home. He could not get back into the job market for professionals. He therefore bought a van, paid $30K for the franchise fee and drive people to and from airports etc…The franchiser also takes 25% of his revenue. It’s a hard life but he’s paying for 2 kids in college and 4 younger ones who eat big time everyday.
Apparently there were also a lot of fights among the children but she never called 911 on them. So she was just abusing the police to punish her husband. It seems they both love the children passionately but just hate each other. It’s strange how they hate each other that much and still managed to have 6 children together.
This story is very common among foreign-born wives. They would call 911 every time they are pissed off, abusing the police to punish their mates. They are also more inclined to abuse other public services like social assistance, health care etc… It seems that they feel inferior and do not like to mingle socially, or to compete in the work place. They are more likely to stay home and depend on their husbands entirely for their living, while manipulating and abusing them in the worst ways.
It seems that their lives are entirely focused at …HOME, and that where their main battles are.
When you bring a woman from a developing country into a modern one, they will in most cases integrate quite well. Therefore they won't have much in common with women from their home country and will be "Westernized".
[QUOTE=One Wing Low]
He was working as an engineer, living a happy single’s life. He felt awkward at family gatherings that all his siblings were married with kids. It seems that they all wanted him to get hooked into the same trap as they. At 40, he finally married a registered nurse from Nigeria and brought her to America. She refused to go to work, at the same time demanded him to work extra jobs to bring more money into the household. He deeply resented the fact that she could be making $45-$60 an hour but refused to go to work./QUOTE]
OWL,
I just HAVE to respond to your post. Because I prefer foreign women to US women and expect to marry a foreign woman when I am ready.
Have you ever been to Nigeria? Have you ever seen how women there atreated by society? Did you know that Nigerian men can legally marry up to 4 wives, due to the strong influence of Sharia (Islamic) Law? Do you realize that you cannot generalize about all women from every other country in the world based on your experience with 1 Nigerian couple?
Nigeria is a very messed up country on all aspects! Economic, social, political, moral, you name it! It is in a class by itself. Well, maybe Haiti is also in its class. Nigeria and Haiti are major mess-up countries that have nothing in common with any other countries. When a Nigerian woman comes to the US, she cannot be compared with any other woman coming from some oter country.
How do I know? I have been friends with Nigerians. I have been to Nigeria and seen the attitudes with my own eyes. Nigerian women are oppressed there and are full of hostility towards men and male power. When they come here and are free to do as they please, they get revenge on ANY AND ALL men who cross their paths. That man's wife was likely forced to marry him, as he was also likely "coerced" to marry her. Parents and family elders, especially well-to-do ones, still choose the spouses of their children. They fight each other because they each represent, for the other, the lack of autonomy and personal power in the choice of one's mate.
That example is not representative of the experience one may have with a woman from Colombia, Brazil, the Dominican Republic, Philipines, etc.
One Wing Low
05-01-06, 01:12
... to avoid women from oppressed countries, just like avoiding women from abusive families.
It's wise to narrow the selection for one's mate among those obviously from loving, fun, healthy, principled ... families, preferably from roughly the same socio-economic and religious backgrounds. It helps reducing the gap of common understandings and the potentials for conflicts and friction in the relationship.
It's wise to accept the person one marries as is. If one ever aspires to make any changes in a person after marriage, even minor ones, one is asking for lots of problems that could eventually destroy the relationship.
One should make a realistic list of changes the potential mate must make for smooth integration into his lifestyle, then estimate how much risks there will be in the relationship.
How do I know? I have been friends with Nigerians. I have been to Nigeria and seen the attitudes with my own eyes. Nigerian women are oppressed there and are full of hostility towards men and male power. When they come here and are free to do as they please, they get revenge on ANY AND ALL men who cross their paths.
Dr. Skank,
I have spent some hours wondering the exact same thing......with no apparent answer except that in our permissive society, that boy may represent the only forbidden fruit that is left.
Sinanju Master,
I agree 100%.
Run Mann,
I'd rather it was my 13 yr old son than my 13 yr old daughter......wouldn't you?
Rock
Rock Dog,
My immediate response is yes, but I don't know how much damage this event could do to my son (if I had one). Let’s say the teacher looked like Willem Dafoe or even Rosie O'Donnell, he could be scarred for life from such a traumatic event.
This is really a collateral point though. I took issue with your post because you were making the point that there was difference in how child predators should be viewed if they violated a 13 yr old male versus a 13 yrs old female and that the males were (implied) willing participants because they got aroused. There is no difference in how society should punish the predator that violated a 13 yr old male or the one that violated the 13 yr old female.
Peace.
Run Mann,
I'd rather it was my 13 yr old son than my 13 yr old daughter......wouldn't you?
Rock
Organicgrowth
05-01-06, 19:05
Doctor_Skank, Rock Dog, Run Mann
Gentlemen, as yourselves, I have given this issue some considerable thought. Debra Lafave is a paedophile. As such, my conclusion is that she should burn for that fact. Plain and simple. We owe it to all children, wherever they might be, in whichever country rich or poor, boy or girl...
Regards, Havanaman
Wanderer1000
05-02-06, 00:20
One Wing Low -
I don't claim to know what the secret is to a "successful" relationship - common class and cultural background, etc. - maybe.
It is wise to accept the person you marry as they are, with any compromises worked out beforehand, and not try to make changes after the fact. The problem is bound up in the old saying, "A woman marries a man hoping he'll change, and a man marries a woman hoping she won't change."
So much of the disappointment that men have expressed here with foreign or native AW they have married, is the changes they pull in so many ways. It's more like - is she a closet chameleon or isn't she?
Havanaman,
If you were a 14 yrs old again, and Debra Lafave gave you the chance to have sex with her, what would you do?
I remember, at age 14, all I could think about was tits ass and p*ssy all day long. I would have been in heaven if I was nailing that piece.
Having said that, when asked why she wanted to have sex with a 14 yr old boy, Debra Lafave told him that the idea excited her because "it wasn't allowed".
Comments anyone?
Rock
first, it's important to make a distinction between someone who is ****d, and a child. a child is someone who is not sexually mature - biologically unable to conceive. there is never any justification for an adult to engage in sexual activity with a child. "****d" is a legal concept that reflects many things other than human biology. it is not unusual for people to become sexually mature by age 12, or even younger. the later the status of ****d is extended, the more it reflects the puritanical attitudes of society. that is, sex is evil and shameful. the longer we can restrict it, delay it, keep people ignorant of it, the better. use any excuse.
we all must abide by the law. that doesn't mean we have to suspend our common sense. insisting on treating all sexual encounters between biological adults exactly the same is simply political correctness at its most cynical.
demanding we treat teenaged boys as traumatized by sex with an older woman is necessary so that we can continue to treat all teenaged girls as traumatized by sex with older men, while maintaining the feminist fiction that females don't need or demand special protection.
vilifying the adults equally, both male and female, is an expression of our puritanism.
i think it's pretty interesting that on a board dedicated to the pursuit of sex, that some feel it necessary to assert moral superiority by labeling people "****s" and then looking for a rope. as others have observed, most teenaged boys feel like they've died and gone to heaven if they have a chance to boink their teacher. i don't pretend to understand what any girl or woman really wants. demanding draconian punishment for what is essentially a victimless "crime" (teenaged boy - older woman) is a very strange position for anyone on this board to take. it's not a very reasonable position for anyone to take.
Organicgrowth
05-02-06, 23:46
gentlemen,
i’m not going to be drawn into someone’s flame fantasy. where, from a medical view point, i would suggest getting help. suffice it to say that:
1. a paedophile is defined in the o.e.d as an adult who is sexually attracted to children.
2. the law clearly states when a young human is a child and when he / she is not. this differs from country to country and indeed there are degrees of “adulthood actions” permissible, under law, at given ages. it is also commonly accepted in many countries that the age of 16 be kept, in law, as an acceptable age at which a young adult can legally participate in sexual intercourse.
3. as an adult, debra lafave broke the law.
4. debra lafave’s own testimony leaves “her hanging” as a paedophile. she molested a minor.
5. the law protects us all. it is neither here nor there that people mature at different ages. we are all equally required to follow the law. this applies as much to issues on this site as to anywhere else. apart from paedophiles, there are not many adults on this planet that would support the idea of offering anything but appropriate punishment for a person self confessed to “sleeping with…”/ “making out with…” / “making love with…” or just plain molesting an ****d person.
6. it’s self evident that a 14-year-old male child will have raging hormones and would possibly enjoy the experience. to claim that there has been no victim is not only absurd, it’s pathetic, discounting as it so frivolously does the possibility of psychological damage and indeed mental trauma. american jurisprudence is so full of such cases it’s trite for me to “even go there…”. any non-paedophilic adult would have not only not been “attracted” to the child, they would have not allowed anything to happen…
7. i think it's pretty interesting that on a board dedicated to the pursuit of sex between consenting adults, that some feel it necessary to assert moral superiority by offering some form of weak defence to self confessed child molesters. it’s not my place as a surgeon but i would urge a consultation with one of my psychiatric colleagues…
8. debra lafave broke the law. she should burn for that fact, so rope is not needed. plain and simple. we owe it to all children, wherever they might be, in whichever country rich or poor, boy or girl... i hope mr. glitter is listening…
9. enough already…
regards, havanaman
Organicgrowth
05-02-06, 23:55
Havanaman,
Having said that, when asked why she wanted to have sex with a 14 yr old boy, Debra Lafave told him that the idea excited her because "it wasn't allowed".
Comments anyone?
Rock
Rock,
Based on previously presented arguments by others, I guess it might have excited her even more the less mature the child as from those arguments, the child would have been younger and so according to societal constructs “even more not allowed…”.
In the final analysis, when its wrong, its wrong. You know it. I know it. We all know it…
One good thing about American women: they are not all looking at 14 year olds. I have seen some real diamonds, but then again I’ve been with some real paste. When I see Debra Lafave’s face, yes I can see the beauty, but I find it difficult to get past the child abuse. Thats just me and I in now way exhort that to you or anyone else.
Regards, Havanaman
ok, this is it..... my final comments on this matter.
hardbag, read your post. your comments were well written and well put.
havanaman, same goes for your post as well. i will make some brief responses to the points that you made.
1. to define what is a ****, you have to define what is a child. i had sex with a fair number of 13 and 14 yr old girls..... when i myself was still a teenager. does that make me a ****? no, i don't think so. so, where does one draw the line....how young is too young, how much of an age gap is too much? all i can say is, we have a one-size-fits-all law when each case is different.
2. again, a one-size-fits-all law. however the law is the law......... and if someone does't like it, they can do what they like. they're the ones who will pay if and when they get caught.
3. definitely did that. now she's paying for it.
4. yep!
5. this is a tough one. in general isg members are probably all law-breakers... at least the ones living in the us. so, while we are supposed to follow the law(regarding prostitution), many of us don't.
6. no argument here. for the first statement anyways.
7. i never intended to offer any kind of defence for debra l. what i did say, was that there is a difference and that the so-called double standard exists for a reason.
8. she did break the law..... but there's no way she's going to "burn for it". the fact that she is exceptionally attractive, plus it was an older woman/teenage boy will likely limit her punishment to probation or some other slap on the wrist. that being said, people who have jobs where they work with young people (teens or children) should be held to a higher standard. schools should be places of education, not pick-up joints.
9. enough already..... exactly.
i just want to state one last time, for the record, i'm not trying to make any excuse or defence for any of these people. most impressive that we managed to discuss such a sensitive, politically charged topic in an intellectual fashion. not so much as one insult or accusation. well done!
rock
9. Enough already…
Regards, Havanaman
That certainly does limit any response.
"We are all equally required to follow the law. This applies as much to issues on this site as to anywhere else."
Funny thing, just last Monday I saw literally millions of self-confessed law breakers mugging for the cameras. No arrests. A few years back I was one of millions of lawbreakers almost every day when I drove 56 mph. I'm afraid I just don't feel guilty about it. Laws are often arbitrary. They're certainly enforced arbitrarily. Some people see this as a reason to revisit the assumptions that led to the law.
"It’s self evident that a 14-year-old male child will have raging hormones and would possibly enjoy the experience. ... it’s pathetic, discounting ... the possibility of psychological damage and indeed mental trauma."
Well, once you've bought into the premise that sex is evil, vile, sinful, shameful and the work of the devil, we sure wouldn't want anyone enjoying the experience. If, for just a moment, you could rise above your puritanical baggage, you just might be able to identify how much of your fire and brimstone predictions are based on those assumptions. Isn't this where, if he were masturbating, you tell us about "the possibility" of going blind, hairy palms, or indeed mental trauma?
It always fascinates me when someone argues that lawyers and politicians can improve on biology.
I won't comment on the personal attacks.
Organicgrowth
05-03-06, 19:16
that certainly does limit any response.
"we are all equally required to follow the law. this applies as much to issues on this site as to anywhere else."
funny thing, just last monday i saw literally millions of self-confessed law breakers mugging for the cameras. no arrests. a few years back i was one of millions of lawbreakers almost every day when i drove 56 mph. i'm afraid i just don't feel guilty about it. laws are often arbitrary. they're certainly enforced arbitrarily. some people see this as a reason to revisit the assumptions that led to the law.
"it’s self evident that a 14-year-old male child will have raging hormones and would possibly enjoy the experience. ... it’s pathetic, discounting ... the possibility of psychological damage and indeed mental trauma."
well, once you've bought into the premise that sex is evil, vile, sinful, shameful and the work of the devil, we sure wouldn't want anyone enjoying the experience. if, for just a moment, you could rise above your puritanical baggage, you just might be able to identify how much of your fire and brimstone morality is based on those assumptions.
it always fascinates me when someone argues that lawyers and politicians can improve on biology.
i won't comment on the personal attacks.
it is blatantly clear that in any democracy to campaign for law change is a given. many millions will break laws together when there is a common agreement, of the resident majority, that a particular law is either too stringent or not needed. who can forget the marches against vietnam; who can forget the marches for the c.r.m and the like. has anyone heard about a march or protest to decrease the age of heterosexual sexual consent below the age of the agreed “minor/ child”? never. certainly “not in my name…”. to even compare a driving speed limit protest to this issue is ……... to even approach such an absurd and distasteful comparator is abhorrent, speaking volumes about such “would bees…”
apart from yourself “hardbarg” who introduced the “premise that sex is evil, vile, sinful, shameful and the work of the devil”? no one….. certainly not me, and i certainly have not now or at any time “bought into that premis”. what’s your hang-up? just let it go. i am just about the biggest unbeliever breathing. i see so much suffering on the table and no redemption when a patient is discharged, shit man, i can prove there is no god and certainly no devil…. for me big daddy, the kid and spooky are just thumbscrews to control the masses, same as with the non-johnson bearded gentleman who parted the waters and the same goes for the turban wearing desert camel trader. “puritanical baggage” along with “your fire and brimstone morality” would seem to be your “cross” lol
by the way hardbarg, if your going to quote me, have the decency to quote me fully: once you hit the quote button, there is no real need to edit my comments to suit…
are we reading of the same “hymn sheet” here: who “argued that lawyers and politicians can improve on biology” for christsake? lol
regards,
havanaman
where to start.
> “if your going to quote me, have the decency to quote me fully”
you’re pretty verbose, and hard to keep on point. cutting through the emotionalism to introduce some logic requires editing.
> "we are all equally required to follow the law. this applies as much to issues on this site as to anywhere else."
i’ll try again. you seem to like making dictatorial statements, and expect absolute agreement. unfortunately, as in this case, your statements aren’t exactly true. i just gave some examples. your lecture on democracy (once again off point) shows how you do go on when your pronouncements are not accepted unquestioningly.
> “apart from yourself “hardbarg” who introduced the ‘premise that sex is evil, vile, sinful, shameful and the work of the devil’? ... i can prove there is no god and certainly no devil"
well you got me there, sorta. i could say that “work of the devil” is a figure of speech, but, since it seems to bother you so much, i’ll admit there is no direct evidence of your religious beliefs.
that just leaves evil, vile, sinful, and shameful. everything you say reeks of your demonization of sex. otherwise, how do you get from the young man in question enjoying the experience of having sex with a beautiful young woman (you admitted to that) to mental trauma. i shudder to think of the irreparable damage that would have been done to him if they had shared a pizza.
> “puritanical baggage” along with “your fire and brimstone morality” would seem to be your “cross”
once again, figures of speech, but in this case i would say they correctly convey the sense of your attitudes.
btw, if you’re going to quote me, have the decency to quote me correctly. it's “fire and brimstone predictions.”
> “who ‘argued that lawyers and politicians can improve on biology’ for christsake?”
uh, you did. there’s that problem with logic again. let me take you through this step by step.
in my original post i discussed the unequivocal demarcation between a child and a sexually mature human being as determined by physical changes in our species. in fact, it was the very first thing i said. that’s the biology part.
in your reply, your long, condescending, lecture on the definition of a child uses the terms “law”, “legal” and similar, more than a dozen times (i stopped counting). for example: “the law clearly states when a young human is a child and when he / she is not.” that’s the lawyer and politician part.
maybe there was, in fact, no point to your post, but i was giving you the benefit of the doubt.
xoxoxox,
hb
I usually don't quote my own posts but,
I just want to state one last time, for the record, I'm not trying to make any excuse or defence for any of these people. MOST impressive that we managed to discuss such a sensitive, politically charged topic in an intellectual fashion. Not so much as one insult or accusation. Well done!
Rock
I guess I spoke too soon.....ouch! Guys, please!
Rock
CBGBConnisur
05-05-06, 09:56
The main reason American women are they way they are is because of our extreme prosperity, by far no country on Earth could match America's wealth, I have noticed a lower standard of living even in the richer Euro countries compared to the USA. I am person who has traveled to every corner of the Earth, there is no better country in the world for someone to earn a living than the USA. That being said, since guys who make a 100K a year a dime a dozen in the US, most women will take many things for granted, and the bar is raised to a very high level in the USA. If you have your shit together, a good job(Doctor, Lawyer, Banker, etc.), decent looking, etc. you can definitely score in the USA without a lot of trouble, the real issue is keeping a an LTR. Women in a lot of other countries will also demand something better than the average schmo, Europe, SA, Asia, Africa, etc. When I go to Europe, simply being a Yank increased my social standing considerably, and therefore I get more pussy because I become an alpha male. So the best thing is to take advantage of the US economic engine, and stake something abroad.Women want a mate that will increase their chances of survival, so they are going to look for the best mate they can find.
The main reason American women are they way they are is because of our extreme prosperity, by far no country on Earth could match America's wealth, I have noticed a lower standard of living even in the richer Euro countries compared to the USA. I am person who has traveled to every corner of the Earth, there is no better country in the world for someone to earn a living than the USA. That being said, since guys who make a 100K a year a dime a dozen in the US, most women will take many things for granted, and the bar is raised to a very high level in the USA. If you have your shit together, a good job(Doctor, Lawyer, Banker, etc.), decent looking, etc. you can definitely score in the USA without a lot of trouble, the real issue is keeping a an LTR. Women in a lot of other countries will also demand something better than the average schmo, Europe, SA, Asia, Africa, etc. When I go to Europe, simply being a Yank increased my social standing considerably, and therefore I get more pussy because I become an alpha male. So the best thing is to take advantage of the US economic engine, and stake something abroad.Women want a mate that will increase their chances of survival, so they are going to look for the best mate they can find.
Myth: The U.S. has the world's highest standard of living.
Fact: By a great many important measures, it doesn't.
The U.S. has the highest productivity per worker in the world. But how Americans spend that productivity is another matter entirely. Working with slightly less, the other rich nations of the world have built clearly better societies: better health and vital statistics, universal health coverage, smaller health costs, less violent crime, less pollution, higher home ownership, more democratic participation, greater social programs, less government corruption, less teenage sex, fewer teenage pregnancies, fewer abortions, larger middle classes, less poverty, less child poverty, greater savings, greater investment, less debt? the list goes on and on.
Here's a comparison between the U.S. and other Rich Nations http://home.att.net/~Resurgence/8Comparison.htm
That being said, since guys who make a 100K a year a dime a dozen in the US Possibly in New York, or biggest cities in the U.S. On the other hand, cost of living it much higher too, so 100K is nothing to write home about. Been there, seen that. $100K a year is rare anywhere else in the U.S. For instance, my car insurance in California was about 10 times more than in the Netherlands. Why the heck do I see so much poverty in the U.S if guys making 100K a year are "a dime a dozen"?
When I go to Europe, simply being a Yank increased my social standing considerably, and therefore I get more pussy because I become an alpha male. Increased, compared to what? Don't flatter yourself. Just because you apparently get totally ignored by AW, but get some attention in Europe doesn't mean you stand out. EW are perhaps friendlier than AW. Don't jump to conclusions.
Organicgrowth
05-05-06, 15:14
Rock Dog, hardbarg et al.,
From my side, it ends here. I’m bored with the whole thing.
I know what I said. I know what others have said: anyone interested can see the record and judge for themselves.
We all know that Debra Lafave is an adult: fact.
Debra Lafave broke the law: fact.
Debra Lafave sexually abused a minor: fact.
Debra Lafave’s name has been added to the (USA) National Sexual Offenders Register: fact.
For her multiple sexual abuse crimes she will have a punishment: fact.
I’m not a Lawyer, I’m a Doctor. As such I am not qualified to pass legal judgment on her. My hope would be that she be treated like any other paedophile.
My lack of religious beliefs, expressed in my previous post, should indemnify me from morality based judgements, specifically as I am defending against the actions of a self confessed child abuser who did it because "it wasn't allowed"….
In all honesty it baffles me that anyone can offer a defence towards someone who sexually abused a child.
I stand by my beliefs that a child is a child when the law says it is so, and not based on the value judgments around the degree of physical maturity.
Regards, Havanaman
Also.....
What's so great about having "the highest standard of living"? What's so great about it if it means you have to make a six figure income just to live decently? What's so great about it if it turns 90% of the women into spoiled b*tches? What's so great about it if it causes two thirds of the population to be fat or obese?
I, for one, submit that there are many benefits from living in a country where the standard of living is LOWER. Your money goes a lot farther, the women are better looking and easier to get. People generally are more grateful for what they DO have, instead of being obsessed with buying more stupid shit that they don't need so they can look like they've got more money than they really do.
If the US is so great, how come so many guys expatriate? CBGB, you yourself are a prime example..... you went to Australia and have made numerous positive comments about that country. Last time I checked, the US was ahead of AUS. by a fair bit.
The truth is, different things are important to different people. A lot of the things that make the US (and Canada) great to a lot of people, make them fairly annoying to me.... as in fat, demanding women, rat race etc.
Rock
Organicgrowth
05-06-06, 11:13
Rock,
Over the last 25 years, I have lived in and mongered in, a large number of countries from the USA (NY & FL); Europe (Paris, Germany before and after the wall, Austria, England, Spain); S. America (Argentina, BA: where I spent some time and mongered with Saint & Jackson himself! Paraguay, Uruguay, Chile). Cuba in the Caribbean and also in Ukraine (Kiev and Donetsk before & after the fall of communism and the great divide). I site all this in the conclusion that I agree with your comments from personal experience.
Wherever the so called standard of living has been lower, the mongering / chicas for me have been of a higher standard. This may be due to the $$ factor of course as far as mongering is concerned, but when one has lived in such places and developed GF relationships the same holds true. In such places I have also not experienced any negative / criminal offences whilst mongering. As a comparator, I have only ever been swindled twice: both times in the USA and both times by “working girls”.
I must add that of the 3 American GFs I have had, all were worth it. I enjoyed the experiences and with the exception of the most recent one (we parted badly) I’m still in contact with them on a friendly and professional (work) basis.
Something is happening to the physical-makeup of American women! You are so right about the FAT. I was in NY again recently and saw that regardless of the sliming message, the availability of everything form surgery to pills has made no impact on the average AW’s girth. My heart goes out to my American friends having to mount such “porkers”: I’m wondering if male “taste” will change to keep pace with the increasing size. An average snapshot in Europe, indeed even in S. America shows slim chicas who look after themselves.
Has the average American women just given up?
Regards, Havanaman
Havanaman,
We've got our fair share of porkers this side of the border as well. But it's more than that. I've been to Cuba, Zambia, Vietnam and Mexico. I've also been to England and have travelled all over the States. It seems like things, life in general, somehow make more sense in these other countries.
I've talked about this with friends and people that I know, but it's only the ones who've gone travelling themselves that seem to understand what I'm getting at. Sure, we've got lots of STUFF. There's no better place to get educated and you have the opportunity to make money. But we've traded away something for all this stuff.
People here are so uptight! Rules and regulations roping me in and tying me down. It's like nobody can take a joke anymore and everyone is so busy trying to get ahead...... everything is one big competition. I remember something I saw during my trip to Cienfuegos in Cuba. There was this guy on a little motorcycle..... not much more than a scooter. He had a busted headlight, not one, but TWO passengers.... and the girl sitting behind him was carrying a bottle of rum. It was GREAT! Nobody gave a hoot, it was no big deal and no harm done. Back here, he would have been busted so many times over.
I think that's the point I'm trying to make. After the so-called "standard of living" gets to a certain point, people seem to lose touch with reality. We get all uptight about every little detail. Nothing is ever good enough, or safe enough. We gain materially, but we lose out socially, personally.... maybe even spiritually whatever it means.
That's why so many women are b*tches. They get caught up in this ratrace competition and it's fucked them up big time. Not all of them, but a lot of them. From their viewpoint, most men probably aren't much of a prize either.
Rock
Doctor_Skank
05-06-06, 17:57
Havanaman:
You wrote: "Has the average American women just given up?"
Thats been my theory for years... I really wonder if these women are so full of self-hate or perhaps just indifference that they have just given up. They blame much of their unhappiness on a societal perception of beauty characterized by slim women... yet are incapable of eating normally or getting a mild bit of exercise themselves.
I really feel sorry for them sometimes... unless they have attitude, in which case I just think "what comes around goes around".
RD:
"There was this guy on a little motorcycle..... not much more than a scooter. He had a busted headlight, not one, but TWO passengers.... and the girl sitting behind him was carrying a bottle of rum. "
Now that's the good life... and he didnt need a 401K or an SUV to find it.
I agree with you totally that quality of life is equally or more important than standard of living. Its something that we as Americans should observe more closely, as I feel we are slowly but surely surrendering our quality of life in pursuit of faux security i.e. $$$.
I've been to high class bars with $15 beer, restaurants where the appetizers run $100 and nightclubs where I stuffed $200 into various g-strings in the course of an hour... those were all great memories... but equally great are memories drinking (not even)$1 Singha beer in a Bangkok back alley with a Nana Plaza bargirl and her friends, dancing the night away with cute Russian girls in a grimy student bar eating dried salty fish and drinking cheap local cognac, or cuddling up with a local cutie on a Bulgarian beach watching the sun come up after a night dancing in a local disco that will never make a Lonely Planet guide or anybody's "What's Hot" list. .... and I havent even been to South America and its low-key high-reward lifestyle, imagine what I could find there.... happiness is where you find it and where you make it. I am always impressed by the ability of people in second and third world nations to really enjoy life despite the fact they'll never own a plasma tv...
... come to think of it, we the international monger, should be damn happy we can have the best of both worlds.
Organicgrowth
05-07-06, 13:57
Doctor_Skank
My own conclusion is the same.
On my recent NY trip (work related) I saw a number of AW who were so gross that I actually avoided looking at them. Please don’t get me wrong: I’m referring to their physical shapes rather than them as people. Actually in all such cases I would have to say that these women were actually OK looking when one looked at the face, but “porkers” in the rest of the body ~ lets say average looking MILF-type women who never walked more than 50m a day! In one case I actually felt nauseous when I saw the uterine-apron waddle. The best case for abdominoplasty I have seen this year! Combining this “giving up” with a bad attitude makes for a lonely spinster. I guess the USA population dynamic will be affected by this in the long run.
I don’t live in the states and so would ask you: is this “giving-up” something that is learned by migrants also? I mean to say does this argument apply equally to new residence after a few years? Does the classic pair shape Hispanic chica arse turn into a sac of doughnuts? Give me rice & beans any day of the week!
Rock:
I really enjoyed your bike-rider analogy. I have seen it and similar so many times now that it bought a smile to my face. The simplicity of life has been “rat-raced” somewhere along the line. I think that we have been manipulated into having bought into the idea of “better than next door…” as a general rule of life. So (in the immortal words of Chuck Palahnuik of Fight Club fame): “an entire generation pumping gas and waiting tables; or they're slaves with white collars. Advertisements have them chasing cars and clothes, working jobs they hate so they can buy shit they don't need. We are the middle children of history, with no purpose or place. We have no great war, or great depression. The great war is a spiritual war. The great depression is our lives. We were raised by television to believe that we'd be millionaires and movie gods and rock stars -- but we won't”. Is the race to beat “next door” responsible for the AW attitude? Certainly not the AW average shape these days…
Is the answer to find some hide away island and teach English to the locals as a job, working for $1 per hour and being happy? Actually this thought really attracts me, and one day I may sell up and do just that….maybe as part of an early retirement plan. I agree that we need money / credit of some kind to survive, but it’s the “race” which not only belittles the quality of life, it actually reduces its longevity!
Regards, Havanaman
On my recent NY trip (work related) I saw a number of AW who were so gross that I actually avoided looking at them. Please don’t get me wrong: I’m referring to their physical shapes rather than them as people. Actually in all such cases I would have to say that these women were actually OK looking when one looked at the face, but “porkers” in the rest of the body.Obesity is very much a socio-economic problem in the USA, and elsewhere I guess. Spending most time in San Francisco and San Jose, I have to admit there are quite few abnormally overweighted women. Have you guys noticed regional differences thoughout the USA?
Havanaman:
If you'd just walked away without the parting cheap shot I would have been happy to drop this. Now you've got some explaining to do.
I didn't pursue this before, because Rock Dog brought it up. You've had a chance to respond, but of course you chose to ignore it.
By your own admission, you've engaged prostitutes in circumstances where it was illegal. So, does "the law is the law" apply to everyone except you, or is it that sex is illicit only when you say it is. Time to turn yourself in.
Organicgrowth
05-08-06, 08:30
Leeuwen,
The socio-economic problems in the USA and elsewhere being responsible for obesity is a good argument and I think represents the majority of the case. However I would question why a person, a woman no less, and of course for this thread an AW, would allow obesity to take hold. Walking a few extra paces a day would be enough to stave off fat build up. I recall reading a few years ago in a journal that some obese people walk less than a couple of hundred steps a day!
The quality of life argument comes into play again. We park our cars as close to the destination as possible, we delight in using the drive through, we eat re-cooked (or should I say re-fried…) fast foods. We have trained our taste buds from childhood to like the least healthiest fats (trans…) and to expect a lot of salt. However, I think that in the case of the classic “AW” as being discussed throughout this section, there is more than just the dietary issue explaining the obesity. Doctor_Skank brought up the “attitude” issue and a number of others have pointed to the money issue. I wish I had done more psychology!
I really like your question about obesity regional differences throughout the USA. A straw poll would be quite enlightening. From my own observations in Europe I can tell you that Germany and the U.K. are the fat capitals.
Regards, Havanaman
Doctor_Skank
05-08-06, 09:01
Leeuwan,
Traditionally the midwest and the south are the fat capitals of the USA, however I think this phenomenon applies to most every region by now. Also, city people tend to be less fat than country people, probably because city people have more active lifestyles by necessity. More walking, less time to eat.
The midwest, essentially rural, agricultural areas, always had a traditionally calorie-rich environment. Farmer would eat a huge breakfast, a light lunch and a large dinner. He of course managed to work all the calories off in the course of his 14-16 hour work day. The menu hasnt changed much, except for perhaps now including a larger lunch and even unhealthier foods, however the work day has. Average work day is now 8 hours, the majority of which is spent on sitting on one's ass. Much of the midwest lives fairly isolated and travel by car is a necessity rather than merely a convenience. And life is boring in the midwest. Many many people eat simply because they are bored and there isnt much to do except watch TV and eat.
The south is the capital of fried foods and people love to eat in the south. Its too hot outside to do much physical work, so people tend to stay indoors and in air-conditioned cars.
The obesity phenomenon has spread to much of Europe and Asia already, and eastern Europe will likely soon follow suit. With prosperity, comes obesity.
Thankfully, health awareness is higher in Europe than in the US, but especially the younger European generations are adopting some terrible eating and lifestyle habits. Young Germans for example are not obese, but they certainly are getting fatter.
I personally dont care if someone is fat as long as they are happy and understand why they are fat. What I dont like are fat girls who complain that society made them fat or that society only celebrates the thin and fit.
My issue with the subject is one of self-respect. If you cant control your eating habits to the extent that you are at a weight that is comfortable for you emotionally and physically, then you need to have more self-respect. I particularly feel sorry for fat kids who really didnt know any better and whose parents didnt exercise their parental duty and teach their child to live and eat in a healthy fashion.
Havanaman:
My favorite Fight Club line is the one about self-improvement (in the form of getting fit) being masturbation... :)
CBGBConnisur
05-08-06, 10:32
Leuween is a very funny, a few years ago, I actually turned down a job offer in his home country of the Netherlands because it paid one third of my US salary. Obesity is a big problem in the US but the problem is just as severe in many Western European nations, Australia and NZ, and Canada as well. Having met people from many third world countries I would not make the assertion that people from these countries are happy, it is true that people from these places are more easily pleased than those from first world countries, but this pattern seems to occur when you go from the US to a less wealthy place, its a lot easier for me to please Euro women than Americans and I am sure this has something to do with money. Look at the Middle East.
Organicgrowth
05-08-06, 11:14
Doctor_Skank
I prefer to be masturbated than to masturbate…. The soft hands of a Latino chica, than the sausage fingers of an AW! I’m getting fitter, but I’m not “carved out of wood” yet….
The argument for self-respect you presented goes a long way to help explain obesity IMHO. However, “people eating simply because they are bored” is a new one on me. The USA health bill is going to go into the stratosphere in the next few years as the increasing numbers of obese start to present their visceral-fat associated symptoms… T2 diabetes, CV problems, sexual health problems… etc. I guess this is going to be a (negative)-positive feedback loop: obesity causing the aforementioned dysfunctions, resulting in suffering and depression, resulting in more eating as compensatory / comfort behaviour (even boredom?)…. That’s so very sad.
Do you think that there is a realisation by AW that being an “oversize” AW is putting males off?
CBGBConnisur:
I agree with your assertions. Its so much easier to please and indeed pleasure European women (and also Latino women) than American Women.
Regards, Havanaman
The argument for self-respect you presented goes a long way to help explain obesity IMHO. However, “people eating simply because they are bored” is a new one on me. I guess this is going to be a (negative)-positive feedback loop: obesity causing the aforementioned dysfunctions, resulting in suffering and depression, resulting in more eating as compensatory / comfort behaviour (even boredom?)…. That’s so very sad.
Regards, Havanaman
Sad, but very true. I had former colleagues who worked in the health field. Some investigated obesity, its causes, and cures. One of the causes was the need for emotional comforting. We, (humans), love fat and sugar because they were very hard to come by as we evolved. When we eat them we feel very good. We we are upset or feel depressed or sad, eating foods with fat and sugar raise our spirits.
I remember Louie Anderson, an obese comic, discussing his autobiography. Everyone in his family is obese. Why? Because, according to him, his father was abusive and he, his mother, and siblings, used food as a reward for putting up with that abuse. Many food companies market their products as "fun" foods, or foods to eat when one is upset. I remember seeing an ice cream brand commercial a years back featuring an attractive woman eating ice cream after breaking up with a man.
So how does my previous post relate to AW's? This is my theory.
Women eat "comfort foods" to change their mood. The issue is why do so many women in the US need to have their moods changed by so much. After having mongered in LA for the past several years, I believe that the sexual repression of AW here in the US leads many of them to feel low, blue, bad, or otherwise less than content and happy. They, as all of us humans, need regular sexual/intimate contact and fulfillment, but don't get enough of it due to societal or personal restrictions. Either without understanding it or refusing to understand it, these women prefer to make themselves feel better by eating "comfort foods" rather than by doing what is necessary to get a more fulfilling sex life.
What do AWs need to do to develop better sex lives? I believe one main thing is to change attitudes about men. So long as we men are viewed as enemies, adversaries, or competitors, women will never feel enough positive things towards us for them to succeed to attracting good men or in lowering their defenses enough to allow a man to love them. It is a vicious circle since the more a woman feels antagonism towards men, the less quality sex/intimacy she gets, then the worse she feels and the more she eats. That leads to geater difficulty in attracting good men and the cycle continues.
This is no conspiracy theory, but a general question - Is there something wrong with the food in the USA? We can safely skip McDonalds and its alikes, as I'm not talking about junk food. Friends of mine in California, both Europeans and Americans, are very much into the so called organic food. At first, I assumed it was yet one of those marketing buzzwords like all natural. Then a German guy told me he gained 10kg after 12 moths in California. He assured he worked out as much as in Europe, and didn't change his diet. Few days later, I referred to the German guy's experience at an international dinner. To my big surprise, this did little impression on the gathered dinner guests, like as if it was completely natural to gain weight when in America. So I decided to investigate, and found out that many of attenders rather than buying food in ordinary grocery stores like Safeway, went to places like Slow Food or Planet Organics. Due to media hype? Lastest cool diet to catch up with (low carb, Atkins, etc)? I would like to emphasize they were not fat, just gained few kilos extra.
Personally, I'm sushi lover (no pun intended), and consume relatively small amounts of red meat, but like the others gained weight. By today, plenty of Europeans and some Japanese confirmed their weight increased upon arrival to California.
Recently, sitting and flipping through a magazine, I read about the powerful sugar lobby. Apparently there are reps from sugar producers lobbying in Washington DC for adding excessive amounts of sugar, and sort of get consumers addicted to sweet taste. I recall rumors, later proven facts, from tobacco industry, which added an addictive substance to cigaretts. The question is whether some artificial food preservatives affect people's weight. We concluded obesity being a socio-economic issue, but how does one explain general weight gain among social groups with strong understanding of physical activity and calorie intake?
Leuween is a very funny, a few years ago, I actually turned down a job offer in his home country of the Netherlands because it paid one third of my US salary. Obesity is a big problem in the US but the problem is just as severe in many Western European nations, Australia and NZ, and Canada as well.Apparently Dutch employers don't value your professional skills as high as American employers ;)
Obesity is as severe in W.Europe as in the USA? I strongly disagree. Study 'average weight' statistics and you will see.
[quote=george90]what do aws need to do to develop better sex lives? i believe one main thing is to change attitudes about men. so long as we men are viewed as enemies, adversaries, or competitors, women will never feel enough positive things towards us for them to succeed to attracting good men or in lowering their defenses enough to allow a man to love them.quote]as i have been reading this thread i have been thinking along these lines.
a few months ago i spent some time in a new city and to make for a better time i put an ad on match.com and tried to go out with some of the local women. i was surprised at how rude and antagonistic these women were, but more than that i couldn't believe how arrogant and stuck up they were for being fat, unintelligent, and below my standards. i ended up telling one girl to her face to go fuck herself.
women in america have convinced themselves they are the prize, but it's only a function of the illegality of prostitution and the collusion of media and academia constantly preaching how men are stupid and evil. they know that the average american man has no choice but put up with her b.s. if he wants some pussy. that might seem good for women, but it's not.
i think modern pornography reflects a backlash against american women. after college it becomes difficult to meet women, and since women are so full of themselves men choose porn and masturbation over wasting time and money on trying to meet a nice woman. the billions of dollars spent on porn in america every year isn't being spent by men getting laid on a regular basis.
more evidence of backlash is the violence toward women in modern porn. today much porn is nothing more than sexual abuse, with women being choked, gagged, beaten, gang-raped, urinated on, and more. this isn't really sex, is it? why would a man want to see a woman treated this way? porn wasn't like this 10 or 20 years ago. is it possible it's a reaction to the way women treat men now? is this really what women want? lets hear oprah have a show about this.
i've gotten to the point where i don't even entertain the fantasy now of meeting a good woman for a relationship. i'll pick up drunk chicks for one night stands, but my ability to tolerate the attitude of modern american women has been extinguished.
Sinanju Master
05-10-06, 00:18
I remember reading a few years ago about Japanese men emigrating to the US. There were two groups studied. One group had emigrated to California and the other to Hawaii. The Cali-bound men gained more fat-bound weight than the Hawaiian ones. If I remember correctly, the author theorised that since the Hawaiian-bound males maintained a lifestyle CLOSER to what they had experienced in Japan than the Cali-bound males, they gained less weight and were generally healthier. A change of lifestyle, locale and the types and amounts of foods may well be the culprit.
Also, Doc, you nailed it when you said that many women (and men too) eat 'cos they're bored. When you don't have time to be bored, the weight will fall off. Case in point is when I went to basic training. I had EVERY MINUTE of the day accounted for FOR ME, and they ran my ass RAGGED. By the time I got out of basic, my clothes were almost FALLING off me.
CBGBConnisur
05-10-06, 01:24
There is nothing different about the food. The way of life in California compared to Germany is quite different. I travel to Germany frequently and I often use public transportation heavily. Food portions in Germany tend to be smaller than in the USA, there are also a lot of alternative foods, usually Turkish, in Germany compared to the USA. I know many people in the USA including myself who keep reasonably fit, in fact whenever I go to Europe people usually think I am 25 even though I am really 35.
It's more than just physical attraction.
I've found that most girls/women overrate themselves in every conceivable way. They invariably think of themselves as being more cheerful, intelligent, funny, hard-working, creative and (ironically)modest than average. Obviously, everyone can't be above average, but there you have it.
It's a kind of split from reality. Most women, and guys too, like to think of themselves the way they WISH they could be. Then they try and come across like that's how they really are, hoping it will somehow alter the way others perceive them. This could explain why women over-rate their appearance, why they spend so much on makeup and clothes. It's why people in general blow cash on useless crap if they think it will make them look young or "cool".
Just my theory,
Rock
I remember reading a few years ago about Japanese men emigrating to the US. There were two groups studied. One group had emigrated to California and the other to Hawaii.Indeed, I remember that study. The goal was to examine whether the humans were genetically prone to develope cardiovascular diseases, or if food and enviroment played greater role. Since Japan was among nations with least rates of cardiovascular diseases, the study focused on Japanese living in Japan, and Japanese living in the USA. Needless to say there was no difference from that perspective between average Americans and Japanese living in America.
What the study did not take into account, was the fact that majority of foreigners, other than Japanese, did gain weight while not changing diet nor daily routines.
There is nothing different about the food.
I strongly disagree. US food is VERY different from food in other partsof the world, especially meat. We monger abroad don't we? We eat abroad, don't we? Haven't we noticed the difference in the food in Colombia, Dominican Republic, Philipines, etc. compared to here in the US?
I like to monger in Brazil. The food there is orders of magnitude of higher quality than here, AND way less expensive. Meat is lean AND tender. Fresh fruit and vegetables are plentiful and inexpensive, (sometimes dirt cheap). The main difference is that food in those places (developing countries) is not grown with who knows what kind of fertilizers, and cattle, pigs, chickens, etc, is raised without who knows what kinds of hormones to make them grow faster and fatter.
Nutritionists have documented that the hormones given to animals makes its way into our bodies and affects us. The age of menarch for girls (first menstrual period) has fallen steadily for several decades. Some of this fall is attributed to the effect of growth hormones in our food. Some psychologists believe that the epidemic of ADHD in boys is partly due to the hormones and chemical additives in our food.
I've gotten to the point where I don't even entertain the fantasy now of meeting a good woman for a relationship. I'll pick up drunk chicks for one night stands, but my ability to tolerate the attitude of modern American women has been extinguished.
Welcome to the club, Alberto! Many of us are looking abroad for wives, in addition to short-term pussy. There are many agencies and dating sites that cater to international tastes. We can discuss some of them here or in the other thread for that.
Sinanju Master
05-10-06, 01:51
In Japan, traditionally at least, the food doesn't have the ultra-gargantuan fat content that the US of A has. Except for Sumo, people don't eat like they are at a trough, either.
To digress... today I was at lunch and I saw 4 AW's who were probably 10-15 years older than me and they pulled off something that FEW women if any were able to do: they were able to make me ASHAMED I'm American IN MY OWN COUNTRY. This particular hotel always has a buffet at lunch time. The first broad EMPHATICALLY declared that she wanted a hamburger (medium done, no pink in the middle, with AMERICAN cheese, she stated firmly) and fries. My thought is: "Damn you sow, the LAST thing you need is to eat such food!" The NEXT broad joins her at the table and says to the waiter: "Please give me a menu, because you have NOTHING anybody would want in the buffet", even though there were at least TWENTY people or more around her eating the very same food she turned up her nose at. I thought to myself: "Why are these COWS complaining when all they have to do is LEAVE and find a place where the food is to their liking"? The scene reminded me of all the times I've witnessed the "Ugly American" when overseas. If it came down to the choice of being a monk for the rest of my days or fucking any one of them, I'd be wearing a robe and in deep meditation.
There is nothing different about the food.The bare fact that GMO has become mainstream in the U.S while still being highly controversial in EU is proof that the food is not the same. If the food industry can shove GMO down your throat, why wouldn't it be extra generous with fishy preservatives? You don't see the organic food hype in Europe, but again, it has become way of life among health conscious consumers in America. You think they pay premium for pure joy of spending more money than necessary? I don't.
The way of life in California compared to Germany is quite different. I travel to Germany frequently and I often use public transportation heavily.I explicitly excluded the obvious differences in lifestyle, and emphasized the fact that foreigners gain weight despite keeping the old daily routines, like diet and working out.
Don't see what public transportation has to do with what we discuss. Sitting on a bus is not going to make you slim.
I know many people in the USA including myself who keep reasonably fit, in fact whenever I go to Europe people usually think I am 25 even though I am really 35.Congratulations, even if I recall someone on this forum reporting from the Czech Republic. His story was exactly the opposite as he claimed he could fool women in the U.S about his age, but not in Europe. Use the search button combined with approperiate terms and you will find the report.
I can assure you that this chick is an idiot. By definition, a piece of red meat is WELL DONE if it is cooked all the way through with no pink.
I've spent a lot of time in the restaurant industry, paying my way through two degrees, and in patches of professional unemployment. The result of this is as a general rule, I have a passionate dislike for people (at least Americans) as a whole....obnoxious, idiotic behavior like Sin is describing is the rule, not the exception.....and it is most often bitches, or married couples (contolled by the *****) acting like that.
By the way, I will only drink organic milk these days. I highly recommend watching "The Corporation" for an explanation...it's so gross, I can't bring myself to explain.
Regarding exaggerated female self perception, I always maintained that it was the result of having their asses pathetically kissed by men desperate for pussy. I've seen a nothing special (thin, but not especially pretty, and definitely weird) in her mid thirties seriously think that she rates a young stud in his mid twenties......she had been a bartender for 15 years, and has had drunk guys trying to fuck her all that time. Here we go with one of my favorite refrains:
American women have a monopoly on pussy...one of the very few in the world....even some fundamentalist Moslem countries have legal brothels.
If the legal penalties, social stigma, and prohibitive expense (this would be the effect of legalization) were removed from prostitution, and men could get sex on demand, gender relations would be a WHOLE new ballgame.
Adding on: This affects the whole of American society. The media kisses women's asses because they make or at least exert substantive influence major buying decisions. Why is this? Because women are better decision makers (aka analytical and logical)? FUCK no! It's because (except in the cases where the decision is beneath the breadwinner's attention-household products etc), women exercise contol over the pussy that men have a biological need for....if you want proof of this, how many guys REALLY want to spend 10K on a new living room set? Or 50K for that big fucking SUV so she can run back and forth to Starbucks, the beauty parlor, and the grocey store ?
If prostitution were legalized, and pussy became reasonably available (overhauling divorce laws would be extremely helpful also), this bullshit would turn on it's head overnight. Of course on the other hand, our materialistic consumer society would probably collapse too but....
While I'm on a tear, I heard my buddy Tom Leykis say something I had entertained as a pet theory for some time. Roughly 25 years ago was when the divorce laws changed right? Many children became fatherless because of this including of course girls. Now, unprescedented scores of girls are fucked up in their sexuality (one manifestation is the current bisexuality craze), due to MOLESTATION from sexual predators. Hmmm could it possibly be that that those ever so competent and capable single mommy's aren't quite so able to handle scaring off sexual predators as their former husbands would have been. Would mommy's friend "Uncle Phil" be quite so brazen in diddling his 12 year old "niece" if he knew her father was around and would beat him to death for that sort of transgression?
B9K
CBGBConnisur
05-11-06, 12:59
Europeans may think that they are better than Americans yet the American model of life is being quickly adopted by most under 30's in Europe. Waistlines are increasing around the continent, and a study confirmed that countries like France will be just as fat as the USA within 2 decades. Countries like Britain and Ireland are just as fat, actually fatter, than the United States. I recall seeing a Pizza Hut all you can eat buffet the last time I visited Manchester, and waistlines in certain parts of Australia are just as bad, go to Queensland, the most rednecked place on the Earth, NSW where I currently reside isn't too bad but avoid Queensland, WA, South Aus, and NT. In other words all the fun is in Melbourne and Sydney. There are other more serious problems around the planet, the USA is still far and away the most prosperous nation in the world.
Country John
05-11-06, 18:14
HAZARDOUS MATERIALS DATASHEET For AMERICAN WOMEN
ANALYSIS
Element: Woman
Discoverer: Adam
Atomic Mass: Accepted as 55kg, but known to vary from 45kg to 225kg
Occurrence: Found in large quantities in urban areas with trace elements in outlying regions
Physical Properties
1. Surface normally covered with film of powder and paint.
2. Boils at absolutely nothing, freezes for no apparent reason.
3. Melts if given special treatment.
4. Bitter if used incorrectly.
5. Found in various grades ranging from virgin material to common ore.
6. Yields to pressure if expertly applied.
Chemical Properties
1. Affinity to gold, silver, platinum and all precious stones.
2. Absorbs great quantities of expensive substances.
3. Explodes spontaneously without reason or warning.
4. Greatly increased activity when saturated with alcohol.
5. The most powerful money reducing agent known to man.
Common Use
1. Highly ornamental, especially in sports cars.
2. Can be a great aid to relaxation.
3. Can be a very effective cleaning agent.
Tests
1. Pure specimens turn bright pink when found in their natural state.
2. Turns green when placed alongside a superior specimen.
Hazards:
1. Highly dangerous except in experienced hands.
2. Illegal to possess more than one, although several can be maintained at different locations as long as specimens do not come in direct contact with each other.
Country John
Sinanju Master
05-11-06, 18:18
That's a Good one, CJ! The description sounds almost like good old U-235! I damn sure wouldn't wanna handle it!
Europeans may think that they are better than Americans yet the American model of life is being quickly adopted by most under 30's in Europe.Dear CBGBConnisur, how about facts for a change instead of personal opinions grabbed out of the air? What's so typical American that Europeans under 30's have adopted? Please, don't say they wear t-shirts or drive cars.
There are other more serious problems around the planet, the USA is still far and away the most prosperous nation in the world. Well, don't know about prosperity taking into account U.S national debt (http://www.publicdebt.treas.gov/opd/opdpenny.htm) of $8,360,179,820,754.65. And this small diagram (http://www.brillig.com/debt_clock/history.gif) shows the exponential curve resulting from debt. Add the all-time-high trade deficit, and support buyers of the dollar (Japan and China) losing patience (http://www.paulvaneeden.com/displayArticle.php?articleId=87) and you get the picture. I hope you enjoy living in Australia, which isn't that "prosperous" as the good old US of A.
Leeuwen,
I can't quite put my finger on it, but something about your recent posts is starting to seem awfully familiar. The English is improved but still not quite right. The old confrontational, argumentative tone is starting to re-assert itself.
I also noticed that you've only started posting in this forum on a regular basis since March. It started with 2 or 3 posts spaced a month apart and now you're crankin' them out on a daily basis. I'm really hoping it's not what I think it is..... and that you aren't who I (and Marak5) think you are.
Rock
Sinanju Master
05-12-06, 09:59
Rock, Richard Pryor said the ONLY way you can kill ROACHES is 12D
rock dog, the answer is no. i have never posted under other nick than leeuwen and never bothered to investigate marak5's insinuation. you are damn right my posts are argumentative, but always backed up by facts. posting statements filled with superlatives based on personal perception, with no proof or backup is by definition bullshit. so which way do you want it? bullshit or facts?
my opinion is that inaccuracy must be corrected, or else a chain reaction of obfurep001ion, falsification and myths will lead to a world with no place for the truth. ok, this's pretty deep, but nonetheless true.
Organicgrowth
05-12-06, 19:34
leeuwen, rock dog,
i like facts, but i would add that personal perception also plays a role in formulating a final conclusion. thanks for adding a new word to my collection (obfurep001ion…).
ohhhhhh, by the way, i think that the usa (under arbusto, than any real president) is an example… of “chain reaction of obfurep001ion, falsification and myths (leading) to a world with no place for the truth….” however i must add that i have met a number of aw’s who fit that bill very well!
regards, havanaman
i just saw an aclu commercial promoting women's rights because, as they said "women and girls still arent seen as equal to men and boys." indeed. men and boys always force/coerce women into performing sexual acts upon them. screw the anglocized world. in the uk, a 15 yr old boy had sex with an 11 yr old girl - both minors. the government authorities are trying to figure out how to apply the law in a way to punish this 15 yr old boy. gotta love westernized manginas.
begin article:
boy, 15, faces [CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123) charge
press association
friday may 12, 2006 2:33 pm
a teenage boy has been charged with [CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123) after it emerged a 11-year-old girl had become pregnant, police have said.
the 15-year-old is scheduled to appear again on july 10 at edinburgh sheriff court having already made a previous appearance, police said.
it emerged that a west lothian girl, now aged 12, is set to break the record for being the uk's youngest mother.
she told a national newspaper she is "really excited" about having a child after losing her virginity at 11 to a boy aged 15 in edinburgh.
the girl, who has not been named, is due to give birth in a few weeks, breaking the record set by jenny teague, of dorset, who was had a baby aged 12 years and nine months in 1997.
a spokesman for west lothian council said: "we are aware of the situation. we are providing support through our social policy and education teams.
"we are working with the family to support the young person to ensure that the child gets the best possible start."
the mother-to-be told the scottish sun newspaper that she hoped the baby would be a boy.
the girl's 34-year-old mother also said she was proud of her daughter.
Roughly 25 years ago was when the divorce laws changed right? Many children became fatherless because of this including of course girls. Now, unprescedented scores of girls are fucked up in their sexuality (one manifestation is the current bisexuality craze), due to MOLESTATION from sexual predators. Hmmm could it possibly be that that those ever so competent and capable single mommy's aren't quite so able to handle scaring off sexual predators as their former husbands would have been. Would mommy's friend "Uncle Phil" be quite so brazen in diddling his 12 year old "niece" if he knew her father was around and would beat him to death for that sort of transgression?
B9K
Bart, child molestation is more likely to be linked to women's penchant for bad boys. Bad boys have no respect for the law. So whether or not a child is of legal age or even consenting is not something they regard as important. If you check out the news, there are women who live with bad boys who molest their daughters, yet deny the fact the entire time. Or look at the number of letters Scott Peterson, Richard Ramirez and the late Ted Bundy got proposing marriage. In fact, I believe that one of the Menendez brothers got married in prison. I believe this is because society has villified masculinity. And women are attracted to masculine men. Overtly women want to quash masculinity by invading every masculine strong hold and feminizing it. For example, invading all male clubs, sports teams and even locker rooms. Once in these environments, women demand that men act more feminine as to not offend the women. So we have an entire society of men who act like women so as not to offend women, but on a purely biological and instinctual level, women want to mate with masculine men. With the lack of real masculine men, women resort to the only alternative they have - Bad boys who are good at emulating masculine traits due to their sociopathic disregard for social norms and laws.
Bart, child molestation is more likely to be linked to women's penchant for bad boys. Bad boys have no respect for the law. So whether or not a child is of legal age or even consenting is not something they regard as important. If you check out the news, there are women who live with bad boys who molest their daughters, yet deny the fact the entire time. Or look at the number of letters Scott Peterson, Richard Ramirez and the late Ted Bundy got proposing marriage. In fact, I believe that one of the Menendez brothers got married in prison. I believe this is because society has villified masculinity. And women are attracted to masculine men. Overtly women want to quash masculinity by invading every masculine strong hold and feminizing it. For example, invading all male clubs, sports teams and even locker rooms. Once in these environments, women demand that men act more feminine as to not offend the women. So we have an entire society of men who act like women so as not to offend women, but on a purely biological and instinctual level, women want to mate with masculine men. With the lack of real masculine men, women resort to the only alternative they have - Bad boys who are good at emulating masculine traits due to their sociopathic disregard for social norms and laws.
Well......you aren't going to get an argument from me
Used to know this girl.....at 21 she was highly promiscuous (not a bad thing by itself-course she managed to get an std from a local DJ), self destructive, Waaaayyyy into alcoholic abuisive guys who treated her like shit......also, she had a great propensity towards the affectations of childhood (big thing for stuffed animals-this is a sign of sexual abuse)......I was willing, after seeing all this behavior together to believe that she had been molested........never got definitive confirmation, but I found out that she was born when her mother was 18-19.....Mom was a bimbo party girl, and a bartender, and I'm sure that there were all kinds of loser guys through that home throughout the years......finding that scenario, I would have bet good money that little "S"''s cherry got popped around 13 by a 30 year old guy Mom let "sleep it off" at the house while she went to work.....I could be wrong but...
B9K
Well......you aren't going to get an argument from me
Used to know this girl.....at 21 she was highly promiscuous (not a bad thing by itself-course she managed to get an std from a local DJ), self destructive, Waaaayyyy into alcoholic abuisive guys who treated her like shit......also, she had a great propensity towards the affectations of childhood (big thing for stuffed animals-this is a sign of sexual abuse)......I was willing, after seeing all this behavior together to believe that she had been molested........never got definitive confirmation, but I found out that she was born when her mother was 18-19.....Mom was a bimbo party girl, and a bartender, and I'm sure that there were all kinds of loser guys through that home throughout the years......finding that scenario, I would have bet good money that little "S"''s cherry got popped around 13 by a 30 year old guy Mom let "sleep it off" at the house while she went to work.....I could be wrong but...
B9K
I do not think you are wrong. But I do think the problem is more than just women being attracted to bad boys. I read a magazine article on a similar theme that compared the behavior of step-fathers to biological fathers regarding children. The article quoted research stating that step-fathers were something like **15** times more likely to kill their step-children than biological fathers were to kill their biological children. The article went on to question the wisdom of the new "blended family" that is all the rage now. Women have a child with one bad boy. Divorce him and then hook up with another bad boy, who abuses her child, and then hooks up with a third bad boy who kills her child. (In the Miami area there has been a rash of recent killings of children by their parents/care takers.)
The article didn't address molestation. But if step-fathers are so much more likely to kill step-children, then I am sure they are also much more likely to molest step-children.
I am not particularly conservative, but I do strongly believe that where goes the family so follows society. We all know what has been happening to the family in the past 20 years. I pray for our society.
Stinky Pete
05-13-06, 22:04
The bare fact that GMO has become mainstream in the U.S while still being highly controversial in EU is proof that the food is not the same. If the food industry can shove GMO down your throat, why wouldn't it be extra generous with fishy preservatives? You don't see the organic food hype in Europe, but again, it has become way of life among health conscious consumers in America. You think they pay premium for pure joy of spending more money than necessary? I don't.
I explicitly excluded the obvious differences in lifestyle, and emphasized the fact that foreigners gain weight despite keeping the old daily routines, like diet and working out.
Don't see what public transportation has to do with what we discuss. Sitting on a bus is not going to make you slim.
Congratulations, even if I recall someone on this forum reporting from the Czech Republic. His story was exactly the opposite as he claimed he could fool women in the U.S about his age, but not in Europe. Use the search button combined with approperiate terms and you will find the report.Food production differs from country to country. A simple example can be found on the ingredients label on a simple bottle of ketchup. The principle sweetener in the USA is high-fructose corn syrup, found in many foods.
When I was in England two summers ago, the label on the bottle of ketchup (at the pub I was eating a burger at) said glucose.
High fructose corn syrup has been in use in the USA since, I think sometime in the last 70's or early 80's, when the food industry here switched from beet sugar and cane sugar. So we've had a whole generation raised on this sweetner. Many in the USA who are now young adults, bathed in it in their mother's womb. Some author's implicate high fructose corn syrup in the rising incidence and earlier onset of diabetes (See for example, the book Lights Out, reviewed on Amazon).
There are many differences in practices between countries. Another example: the use of mercury in dental amalgams, in vaccines, even in contact lens solution. When you buy contact lens solution in Germany, is mercury listed as an ingredient? I'll have to see if I can even find the stuff next time I am in Germany.
I'll comment on the stepfather thing later.
Although I am highly progressive, both socially, and economically (I wish someone would explain the "Marginal Propensity to Consume" to the prick in the Whitehouse....very slowly of course), it amuses me at times to look back at the way that things were done in "the old days", and see what fucked up result has been obtained by discarding it.
Back, I don't know, 60-70 years ago, there used to be a social control on women making a decision to give themselves to the kind of guy (high chaos, womanizing, undependable, shiftless, substance abuser, abusive......), that generally makes their little pussies drip wet......suitors were subject to male aproval in the form of the girl's father....if little Johnny was a dirtbag drunk with problems holding down a job, and a hair temper, Mr. Roarick didn't let him within 50 paces of his little Rebecca.
This is a highly mysoginistic statement, but I think there is a high degree of truth to it..women have been historically denied decision making power, presumably because men ruled due to physical superiority. I'm inclined to contend that they were denied the ability to make decisions because they aren't generally very good at it.....making them on the basis of FEELINGS instead of logic and reason.
B9K
Clandestine782
05-13-06, 22:40
These are some (edited) thoughts that I wrote on another discussion board.
I can see that women's brains are fundamentally different from those of men. Women in China seem to be weird in the exact same ways that women in all other countries are. These thoughts came up in a moment of clarity AFTER some of my female students could not believe a statement that I made to the effect of: "If there is some man that is not doing it for you, JUST FIND SOMEONE ELSE. They are fundamentally all the same."
It seems like women want to be wanted after they are MUCH past their prime. So, if you are a man who wants to get his freak on, you'll get it on a lot faster with an older married woman than you will a young girl (say, 22 or 23). What is it that changes in women's minds such that they seem to want to be sought after MORE at a much later age? (I have talked to many women who will actually go to a gay bar to dance so that they will not be hit on. Or a woman give her number to some guy just to have the experience of being sought after-- but who would never really consider the guy.) To me it seems like if you wanted to have all the sex you could get, you would do it while you were younger and able to get the most men. But it doesn't work that way.
Why do women so consistently choose bad men? How many times have I seen some woman pass over dozens of other men to find someone who will only half go to work or will beat her ass on a regular basis? Or has lots of other women or is neglectful? (I remember a conversation with a birdbrain about a girl who had a boyfriend that she said didn't love her-- but who she wanted to try to sway, because she wanted a "challenge." Huh? Huh? Huh?) This seems to be the same way/ equally common in China as in the USA-- and it makes even less sense here since women actually pass over MORE men to choose someone that is bad.
Why is it that women don't say: "Ok, subject to some minimal constraints regarding race/ height/ appearance, they are all the same. One will do pretty much the same as another"? Relationships ALL seem to take the same direction over the longer term-- so it follows to me that you could choose any person and it would be the same result if you chose any one person over another. Most girls don't seem to see it this way. I don't get it.
Sinanju Master
05-13-06, 23:07
Good Day, Young Padawans! Clandestine gave the answer probably without realising it. Women want a CHALLENGE. I've heard similar scenarios from many men in conversation and online. I was reading maerial from Doc Love and he stated this EMPHATICALLY.
The following male traits are what makes a woman choose one man over another and STAY with him.
Self-Confidence, Self-Esteem, Discipline, Patience, Self-Control, and CHALLENGE.
A few years ago I read his material cover to cover and it made so much sense then and still does NOW. Back to the trait of "Challenge", think about it: you treasure something you've fought for and EARNED more so than you do something that was given to you FREE OF CHARGE without effort. PLUS women are of the mindset that if it's easy to get, then it's not worth having. I know it sounds fucked up to any upstanding guy who'd make a great husband and father, but how else are you gonna survive in the game?
Consider these words, Young Padawans....
CBGBConnisur
05-14-06, 05:29
The reason why I feel Europe tends to have a lower standard of living than the US mostly has to do with my interactions with European women on the continent, rarely have I had my wallet emptied quickly with a European woman as what happens when in the company of your average American lady. She doesn't seem to expect as much and often it takes a much smaller amount of effort to impress her. That's part of the problem with a lot of American women, they are used to a very plush standard of living and used to getting what they want. This is not the case with many European women.
....to celebrate the prick in the White House achieving a 29% approval rating. Unless he catches Osama bin laden, or gets gas back down to $1.40, he stands a fighting chance of having the lowest rating of all time.....and that people take it out on his party come the November elections. I console myself while pumping $3.00 a gallon gas that this is just paying a fee to kick the sanctimonious bible thumping, binary brained right wing pricks out of congress and the senate
Being a stepfather is, as I believe Sin put it, the most thankless job on earth, and I absolutely believe the stat's George is citing about them being 15 times more likely to kill a step child. Family life is at times, a pressure cooker, even when you share a bed (with wife), or genetics and biological ties (kids).....In many cases, men are sacrificing their own financial well being to provide a home environment for children who will not be passing his genetics into the future, and often disrespect, hate, barely tolerate....him. It's a bad deal also regarding the molestation thing....with a stepfather, it is almost a cliche. You marry a mother, with an adorable little 9 year old moppet...6 short years later, you have a little big titted sexpot (with again, no biological ties to you) living under the same roof....it happens,
Changing gears, I came to realize something...had heard this previously, but only recently came to REALLY understand it. It is well known that girls from masculine-centric cultures will marry men who are much older, and less physically attractive than they are. It has been generally presumed that this is entirely a money thing. Here is something else however. In Russia, for example, it is a woman's worst nightmare for that sweet boy of 22 she married 20 years ago to drop her cold and throw her to the wolves, so he can take up with a 25 year old. Girls in this type of culture are very aware of this behavior, and in hopes of getting a lifetime committment from her husband, go ahead and marry a guy that she will still be a little dish to in 20 years....a hot MILF of 40 to his 58
B9K
CBGBConnisur
05-14-06, 10:00
....
Changing gears, I came to realize something...had heard this previously, but only recently came to REALLY understand it. It is well known that girls from masculine-centric cultures will marry men who are much older, and less physically attractive than they are. It has been generally presumed that this is entirely a money thing. Here is something else however. In Russia, for example, it is a woman's worst nightmare for that sweet boy of 22 she married 20 years ago to drop her cold and throw her to the wolves, so he can take up with a 25 year old. Girls in this type of culture are very aware of this behavior, and in hopes of getting a lifetime committment from her husband, go ahead and marry a guy that she will still be a little dish to in 20 years....a hot MILF of 40 to his 58
B9K
Virtuallly all Anglo societies are man hating castrating societies. Look for a place in Asia, Latin America or Eastern/Southern Europe if you want a real woman. Hell, I would even wager the Middle East would be a good place to find a nice wife. Compare French Canada to Anglo Canada. Bush's 29 percent approval rating speaks volumes, anyway Chinese and Indian universities graduate a million new scientists and engineers each year, this is pretty much going to signal a shift of technology and economic supremacy East.
Organicgrowth
05-14-06, 11:25
Gentlemen,
Off topic I know but please forgive me.
We are due to have a party this evening, until now it did not have a theme: I’ve just emailed the guests and the theme will be Arbusto’s 29%…. We all need to celebrate this (at last) beginning of the end for Arbusto, the unelected, ex-alcoholic, husband to a wife who killed an innocent human being before she was 18 years old, tyrant, megalomaniac and abuser of freedom "president "… To say nothing of his contribution to making the AW what she is today!
I wonder when my North American brothers (and sisters) will wake up to the harm this Arbusto has done and is doing and will continue to do to them…..
Regards, Havanaman
Starchild2012
05-14-06, 14:22
Sinanju Master,
You THE man of ISG :)...Couldn't agree more...To all american women haters....just read again...what SM has to say about "Challenge" and you will get rid of the american women sickness.
My life has changed since I being reading doc love articles at www.askmen.com and now just show me any women on this planet earth from american to african to asian and I would make them my slave for ever :)
Instead of you being dragged by american women...I bet with my all heart, that doc love has got the mantra to get rid of our men sickness of women....If I was in america right now, I could have constructed a statue of the man Doc love for saving mine and 100's of lifes...
Really guys...Its time again and again to shift focus and get the solutiuon instead of crying on the problems...
There was a comment a few posts back..... something to do with how women want to be wanted more as they get older. That's an easy one to explain. When do women develop their perceptions of how attractive they are? During their teenage years when boys start going crazy. This also happens to be at the young woman's peak years of physical attractiveness.
As they get older, they get less attractive. I think they start to notice that they just aren't getting as much attention as they used to. So, they start putting out the vibe to see if they've still got it.
CBGB made a comment about anglo societies being man hating and castrating. I think he must have been talking about women's attitudes in those societies. It's true to some degree, but is it because of the society itself, or is it a "spoiling effect" due to the high standard of living found in ALL anglo societies?
One good thing about Bush being re-elected..... he's finally had enough time to show the public his true quality. The 29% approval rating should be enough to keep him from doing any more damage.
Hey, here's a thought. Instant green card for any illegal woman who marries
a US citizen. Think of the hordes of pretty young mexican girls prowling around looking for a guy they could hook up with.
One last thing, BornLoser5, I totally agree with that last line in your post....
Its time again and again to shift focus and get the solutiuon instead of crying on the problems.
Rock
Sinanju Master
05-14-06, 18:45
Women (girls) mature faster than young males and are more intuitive about the opposite sex wanting them in (in droves) their formative years. As a result of this headstart on boys, they wield power that few young men can resist. As they mature into young (and VERY HOT) women, they wield that power without restraint. Paraphrasing what Charles Xavier once said: "What good is Power without restraint?". What they fail to realise is that they must FOCUS that power to pair with a mate that will ensure the best circumstances (marriage, family, etc). However, many of them fail to heed "The CLOCK" and when the clock strikes midnight (or very near to it), they realise that they have wasted the best years of their lives to achieve their goal. Now they are attracting less attention from males than in their peak years and they lament the fact that it has come to this, when they had the power to avoid their present situation. For the prowling tiger (my bretheren on this board and many like us) this is like when the great cat spies the herd from a grassy blind and seeks out the less swift prey (the recently turned MILF). The younger and more swift of the herd will alight in an instant and head to "safety' while the now-abandoned MILF makes for a meal.
Another thing I have realised is that straight out physical beauty and sexual experience are inversely related in most cases. I was reading a post by Hanavaman that solidified my understanding on this. The post itself is unimportant, so I won't lead my bretheren on a chase to seek it out, but the idea behind it IS.
GOOD, Young Padawans! Embrace the Force, and Wisdom will seek you out...
Shadow Lance
05-14-06, 21:12
The other day I way having a solo lunch at an italian restaraunt. Seating next to me were a couple of attractive ladies in their early 20's. The conversation I overheard only confirmed my wise choice of avoiding marriage when I was in their age range.
The girls were highly titilated because the boyfriend of one of the girls had just proposed marriage. Evidently the proposal had swelled the girl's ego to emmense proportions. She was obviously quite happy to have received the proposal, but it seemed they both deemed to consider the poor guy a fool for asking; and of course he just wasn't good enouph for her. They discussed the matter with such relish and glee, one would have thought they had just pulled off a real whopper of a practical joke on someone. Maybe they had.
It was notable that these paragons of the "gentler" sex had not one jot of compassion or concern, let alone respect, for the soon to be discarded gentleman. He may not understand this for some time, but he is much better off with her rejection. If she had accepted his proposal, then he probably would have been in for what I overheard from another gaggle of twenty something females where one of their number had just accepted a proposal:
This hottie is showing off her engagement ring to 4 or 5 other "ladies." Are these girls talking about LOVE? No. Are they talking about kids? No. Are they talking about the romantic nature of the proposal? No. Are the talking about the man's many fine qualities? No. Are they talking about what the girls family thinks about the marriage? No.
I had not been aware of it, but there is a magic formula that a young American Woman MUST consider when recieving a proposal: The rock on their engagement ring must have a monetary value equal to MINIMUMLY 3 months of the gentleman's income.
Was this what this gaggle of 20 something female hotties gaggling about? YES. Amoung themselves they had estimated the young man's income at about $120K (evidently he was a successfull young salesman) so if this girl was not to get ripped off or taken advantage of by this guy, she needed to have the rock appraised to make sure it was worth $30K.
Yes, nothing better than American Woman. Love them, but for god sakes don't go off and do something foolish like empregnating or marrying one of them.
This is a highly mysoginistic statement, but I think there is a high degree of truth to it..women have been historically denied decision making power, presumably because men ruled due to physical superiority. I'm inclined to contend that they were denied the ability to make decisions because they aren't generally very good at it.....making them on the basis of FEELINGS instead of logic and reason.
B9K
You are correct again. Though again I feel that the history is more complicated. I don't believe that women have been denied decision-making power in all society's throughout history. I believe what happened is that societies experiented with various social and power structures and societal evolution lead to male-dominated societies being more successful.
When the leaders of a society make decision based on feelings insteed of logic, that society will fail in the long run. Female dominated societies, which I am sure existed, went the way of the dinosaurs when faced with bnetter run societies. The died out or were assimilated into male dominated scieties.
This theory doesn't apply only to female societies, but to any society. Look what happens to societies or sub-cultures within a society, when they embark on self-destructive or unsustainable paths. The PLO and Arafat embarked on a path in the 70's that was unsustainable due to the corruption in its leadership. Decisons were made based on connections and payoffs rather than on logic and reason. Look at the state Palestine is in now. The same goes for other countries like Nigeria, or for corporation like Enron, and its auditor, Arthur Anderson.
The problem is that bad decison-making usually doesn't show all its consequences for many many years. The decision-making style of most young women will not show negative consequences until they are well into middle age.
A few years ago I read his material cover to cover and it made so much sense then and still does NOW. Back to the trait of "Challenge", think about it: you treasure something you've fought for and EARNED more so than you do something that was given to you FREE OF CHARGE without effort. PLUS women are of the mindset that if it's easy to get, then it's not worth having. I know it sounds fucked up to any upstanding guy who'd make a great husband and father, but how else are you gonna survive in the game?
Consider these words, Young Padawans....
Those are very wise words! I have heard many time from women who say they want a challenge in a man, AND to be a challenge for a man. They want their man to "conquer" them.
I don't get it at all, because if a woman is making herself a "challenge" for me, I interpret it as she is not interested in me. I don't see the oint in battling a woman for er love. Love is freely given WITHOUT a battle! So to me these women are looking for something that is certainly not love to me!
I am sure I can speak for all of us who have dated foreign women. When you have been with a woman is interested in you and shows in very POSITIVE ways that she is interested in you, you can never again seriously respond to any AW.
Why Farang girls hate Thailand - priceless!!!
http://www.mangosauce.com/farang_life/why_farang_girls_hate_thailand.php
Jackson: I apologize in advance if url contravenes posting rules. Please delete this post if inappropriate.
Chocha Monger
05-15-06, 21:48
Yes, American women are a challenge. Guys like a little token resistance now and then; but seriously who would want to conquer this?
Organicgrowth
05-15-06, 22:14
Chocha Monger,
LOL. Last man, last women and all that: I’d rather that as a species we went into extinction rather than mount that…
Regards, Havanaman
Sinanju Master
05-16-06, 00:09
Yes, American women are a challenge. Guys like a little token resistance now and then; but seriously who would want to conquer this?
CM, I believe Captain Ahab would want to conquer that...
Someone tell her not to go near the ocean, especially if there's any whaling ships nearby.
Rock
Smut Villain
05-17-06, 01:44
Yes, American women are a challenge. Guys like a little token resistance now and then; but seriously who would want to conquer this?
I'd hit it...
with a crowbar!!!
Rubber Nursey
05-17-06, 06:02
yes, women have been historically denied decision making power, although i don't believe it has anything to to with men's 'physical superiority' or because women 'generally aren't any good at it' ...the suppression and oppression of women is, and always has been, a very deliberate action by the church (for many reasons, but this is probably neither the time nor the place for religious discussion!)
anyway, what i'm really here to comment on is the recent posts regarding single mothers. those comments were based on what can only be described as cruel generalisations and blatant stereotyping. aside from the fact that you are describing only a tiny minority of single mums and tarring us all with the same brush in the process, there are three things that really made me furious about those posts.
1) yes, there are single parents who enter into relationships thinking only of themselves - be it for sex, financial security, emotional support or just blinded by love - with little regard for how that relationship will affect their children. but i would be willing to wager that for most single mums, their children's welfare is their absolute top priority. do we somehow care less about our children than our married counterparts do? are we really all that selfish/desperate/victimised/stupid that we would choose the affections of a man or the stability of a marriage over the safety and happiness of our own flesh and blood??? a parent's primary responsibility in life is to protect their children and it is not a job that any of us take lightly, married or not. but even after taking all due care and being very selective about partners, some of us will still find ourselves in relationships that end in disaster, for us and for our children. that's nothing to do with single parents choosing 'bad boys' - it's just the nature of relationships in general. one day you wake up and the man you love, that you chose to be the father of your children, has suddenly become unfaithful or a child abuser or a drunken, violent piece of shit - and i know, because that's how i became a single mum in the first place!
2) there is a very big difference between a 'bad boy' and a paedophile. sure, mum's new boyfriend may be a bit of a party animal or a womaniser or knock her around a bit. but does that automatically mean that he would consider jumping into bed with her 9 year old daughter??? or, if she is a mother of a teenage girl, then she is likely to be in her mid thirties or older and he is likely to be in a similar age bracket. why on earth would it then stand to reason that this man who is approaching forty would necessarily fantasise about fucking his 15 year old step daughter, just because she lives in the same house and is not biologically related to him? a paedophile might see the teen as a horny young girl, but a real step-father just sees her as his daughter.
3) basically, the entire argument is a cop-out that absolves men of any wrong-doing when it comes to the ridiculous rate of child sexual abuse and [CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123) of women. on one hand you are saying that women are not able to make intelligent decisions on their own behalf and on the other, you are saying that single mothers should have known better than to bring 'that sort of man' into their homes and let them get their hands on their daughters. well, guess what...it's men who [CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123) those single mothers' daughters. whether the mother should have seen it coming or not, is beside the point. whether it happens more in single parent families than in marital homes, is beside the point. it is men who are [CodeWord125] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord125) their daughters and step-daughters. stop blaming women for letting it happen and start blaming the men for doing it!!!
end of rant. let the flaming begin.
Hi Nursey,
At the moment, I'm cramming for a job interview....I'll weigh in later.
B9K
Rubber Nursey
05-17-06, 06:55
B9K,
Just for the record, my post is an attack on the concept that was being discussed, not a personal attack on any of the posters involved. :)
Best of luck with your interview!
Rubber Nursey
05-17-06, 07:31
LOL. If you want pics of hot babes, go to the field reports - where I don't post. This is the Opinions sections and, like it or not, I've got opinions about the relationship between men and women, just like you have. And if you have a little look at the number of posts beneath my handle, you'll see that I've shared a hell of a lot of my opinions over the years and I'm probably not gonna stop any time soon, no matter how...ummm...'nicely', you ask. :)
Sinanju Master
05-17-06, 10:16
Long time no hear, Red! Your suggestion about the church historically oppressing women is an interesting one, and upon further thought, makes a lotta sense. However, I wouldn't say JUST the (Catholic) Church, but ALL major religions. In a nutshell, it lets men get away with murder (sometimes literally) while women are expected to blindly adhere to laws written by MEN. To pause for a moment, don't EVEN think I'm promoting feminism by my aforementioned words. Those doing so will receive a custard pie to the face! I also agree wholeheartedly that a single mum's priority is her little one(s) and mostly try to make decisions that positively affect their lives. However, it seems that many single mums (apparently not you) get taken in by said bad boy who in the end, isn't good for mum OR the little one, but is still charmed by him, and gradually allows him to get away with more and more unacceptable behavior that has been discussed in previous posts. Myself, I couldn't date a single mother because A] I would INSTANTLY have a living, breathing hurdle to overcome that would be always attempting to foil my efforts to forge a relationship with the single mother; B] Somewhere in the back of her mind, there would ALWAYS be the little one, who would take priority over me, and therefore divide her attention (which at best, would be directed to me only 50% of the time); and C] being an instant father would be like walking in the Outback at high noon one moment and being tossed into the Antarctic Ocean the next: a SHOCK that I would have to contend with if my relationship with the single mother would survive.
No flame, just my two cents, however worthless it may be.
Rubber Nursey
05-17-06, 11:49
Hey, as I've said before, I have absolutely no problem with people choosing not to date single parents; female OR male. As a single Mum, I know that dating - which is already an emotional minefield at the best of times - is made all the more difficult with the addition of children. And as I mentioned last time, I am currently (yes, STILL, would you believe!! LOL) involved with a man who is also a single parent. It puts a lot of pressure on both of us and makes everything so much more complicated than it really should be.
My issue is the with apparent belief that there is something inherently wrong with single parents in general. That we are bad judges of men, that we put our children at risk with our so-called 'lifestyle choices' (are we really suggesting that every single Mum does drugs, parties constantly and brings a different man into her home every night???). Single parents cannot be held responsible for all of society's ills. And single Mums should not have to bear the guilt and shame and BLAME all by themselves, anyway. Women can't have children all by themselves. For every single mother, there is at least one FATHER out there who, for whatever reason, is no longer a part of the family. And why is it that if the man she has children to is a 'bad boy' and abuses the kids or leaves her, it's always HER fault??? You're saying that women actively go out and find 'bad boy' assholes who will treat them like crap and then leave them, so it must be her fault for choosing him in the first place. But doesn't HE deserve some contempt for being an asshole in the first place?
I'm sorry - I just don't get how men always manage to make this OUR fault. The single mother issue is, in my eyes, just another example of male/female double standards ie: a client who pays for sex is a perfectly normal human being, but a prostitute who charges for it is somehow degrading herself; a man who sleeps with a hundred women is a stud, but a woman who sleeps with fifty is a sl*t; a single mother is an unfit parent, but the asshole who got her pregnant and took off is somehow not even taken into consideration.
Ok, I'm rambling again - and this isn't even remotely on topic. My apologies. Sometimes when I get my knickers in a knot, I just can't stop myself. :)
I'm sorry - I just don't get how men always manage to make this OUR fault. The single mother issue is, in my eyes, just another example of male/female double standards ie: a client who pays for sex is a perfectly normal human being, but a prostitute who charges for it is somehow degrading herself; a man who sleeps with a hundred women is a stud, but a woman who sleeps with fifty is a sl*t; a single mother is an unfit parent, but the asshole who got her pregnant and took off is somehow not even taken into consideration.
I'm sure this is very true in the USA......but I'm not sure your comments apply in other countries.
Rubber Nursey
05-17-06, 13:06
i'm australian - and even in what i consider to be a broadminded country, these stereotypes are still alive and well. take, for example, when a sex worker is raped. do the courts judge these cases in the same way as they would the [CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123) of a 'normal' woman? (if it makes it to court at all!) and is the [CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123) of a 'promiscuous' woman judged in the same way as that of a 'chaste' woman?
i could meet a man who has slept with 500 women (and he would probably give me that information with absolutely no sense of shame - maybe even with some pride) but do you think he would consider continuing our relationship if i told him that i have slept with more than 8 times that number of men???
and you only have to look at some of the comments men on this forum have made to me over the years to see the hooker/client double standard. all the men on this forum consider themselves educated, intelligent, respectable men who simply indulge in a hobby that is on slightly the wrong side of 'moral' in society's eyes. they don't feel that the fact that they're 'mongers' has any bearing on their characters at all. and rightly so. but when *i* open my mouth with some comment that people don't agree with, i am automatically called out as a wh*re - uneducated, degraded, immoral and untrustworthy. there is something inherently wrong with me because i accepted money for sex, and yet there is no such assumption made about the men who gave me that money.
this double standard is always alive and well in the american women section. you guys say that women are too fussy, too full of themselves - and yet every second post complains that the women that hit on you are not beautiful/young/slim/busty/perfect enough for you to lower yourself to sleep with. you complain that women are manipulative and cruel when it comes to marriage and then you discuss ways to screw women out of every penny when a relationship breaks down (or ways to avoid any commitment at all). you say all american women are fat and ugly and let themselves go as soon as they get into a relationship - and yet you fail to look at your own bald spots and beer bellies and consider that maybe we are thinking the same thing about you guys! (i don't know about your country, but in mine, there are more obese men than women!)
i'll repeat something i've said before (and a certain poster who shall remain nameless may recognise this :) ) - don't expect women to make compromises that you, yourself, are not willing to make. don't expect women to go to the gym and stay slim and beautiful, while you age disgracefully on the couch with a beer in your hand. don't expect a woman to go out of her way to treat you like a king, unless you are prepared to treat her like a princess. have a look at the women you like, work out what it is that you actually like about them and try emulating those qualities yourself. remember, we are just as scared and insecure and disillusioned as you are!!!
I just came back from buenos aires so I'm in a very healthy state of mind.
I agree with you that both women and men can be sluts and *****s there are no exceptions.I think what you failed to address is that people do have a desire for a long term relationship with one person but the cards are different in this day and age and one must explore other avenues.It's getting harder and harder in western culture to find a compatible partner due to too many reasons to be listed or they have already been addressed on this board.
I disagree with you about women wanting an in- shape guy. The only way it would work is if you both worked out and enjoyed a healthy lifestyle. There is no way a women is going to feel comfortable with an in shape guy who looks better than her and has more visual appeal.The guy is going to get hit on by women and men alike.Just the same if a women is in shape and the guy isn't guys should know they have to pay for it otherwise it wouldn't fit.
I resent the fact that you scourn men and the activities that go on on this board.That would be like me interfering in a conversation on girls night out.I find it appealing that your intrested in the topic of mongering and are willing to listen but your comments about men are typical and dont relate to anything positive.
It would be more intresting to have a female address topics in an unbiased manner.I think the insight would be very welcomed.I think your last post displayed just the kind of energy we (at least me) are trying to avoid.
**** Artisttyp
a parent's primary responsibility in life is to protect their children and it is not a job that any of us take lightly, married or not. but even after taking all due care and being very selective about partners, some of us will still find ourselves in relationships that end in disaster, for us and for our children. that's nothing to do with single parents choosing 'bad boys' - it's just the nature of relationships in general. one day you wake up and the man you love, that you chose to be the father of your children, has suddenly become unfaithful or a child abuser or a drunken, violent piece of shit - and i know, because that's how i became a single mum in the first place!
end of rant. let the flaming begin.
ok. here is my flame!
read you own words, rn!!!!!!!!
despite all that you, and other women, have done to be careful and selective in choosing a mate, you still find yourselves in relationships that are disastrous. rather than realize that you are selection out decent men and selecting in assholes, and then respond to that by changing your selection method, you blame it on "the nature of relationships in general" and on us men who magically overnight become assholes, after months/years of behavior that you found attractive and endearing. what a crock!!!!
this is exactly why we men are finding women from non-western countries more appealing than american (or australian) women. we men are blamed for your (women's) mistakes!!!
unless these assholes are [CodeWord125] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord125) you, it is your responsibility, and your responsibility alone, for the type (and number) of men who enter your intimate life. start taking responsibility for your decisions!
if you do the same thing repeatedly (apply a flawed selection method), but expect a different outcome (a decent man) from the one you have been repeatedly getting (an asshole), then you are very stupid!!
your selection method is flawed because you women like those assholes! if you were serious about not having a drunkard in your life, you would not date any man who drank. if you were serious about not having any abuse in your relationship, you would stay away from men who demean, humiliate, or threaten others, even if they have not done so to you (yet). it in fact has everythuing to do with women choosing "bad boys"!
this rant is not sexist because the same criticisms apply to men. there are many men who repeatedly choose badly and repeatedly end up with lousy partners, but blame everyone else and everything else before themselves.
"yes, women have been historically denied decision making power, although i don't believe it has anything to to with men's 'physical superiority' or because women 'generally aren't any good at it' ...the suppression and oppression of women is, and always has been, a very deliberate action by the church (for many reasons, but this is probably neither the time nor the place for religious discussion!)"
i'm an admittedly weak student of history as a whole, and certainly haven't put any special study into the histor of gender relations. i was actually thinking back to prehistoric times where the female homo sapien had no choice but to submit to the will of the male homo sapien....and things probably continued forth from there, where that position was further legitamized in rule by the church and government.
"anyway, what i'm really here to comment on is the recent posts regarding single mothers. those comments were based on what can only be described as cruel generalisations and blatant stereotyping. aside from the fact that you are describing only a tiny minority of single mums and tarring us all with the same brush in the process, there are three things that really made me furious about those posts.
1) yes, there are single parents who enter into relationships thinking only of themselves - be it for sex, financial security, emotional support or just blinded by love - with little regard for how that relationship will affect their children. but i would be willing to wager that for most single mums, their children's welfare is their absolute top priority. do we somehow care less about our children than our married counterparts do? are we really all that selfish/desperate/victimised/stupid that we would choose the affections of a man or the stability of a marriage over the safety and happiness of our own flesh and blood??? a parent's primary responsibility in life is to protect their children and it is not a job that any of us take lightly, married or not. but even after taking all due care and being very selective about partners, some of us will still find ourselves in relationships that end in disaster, for us and for our children. that's nothing to do with single parents choosing 'bad boys' - it's just the nature of relationships in general. one day you wake up and the man you love, that you chose to be the father of your children, has suddenly become unfaithful or a child abuser or a drunken, violent piece of shit - and i know, because that's how i became a single mum in the first place!"
i believe that ty higgs asserted that girls bounce from bad boy to bad boy. although i didn't take issue with it enough to voice a disagreement (i've seen it happen), i generally maintain that women run around until the get their lives into a bad place, and then go pick up a love and sex starved "nice guy" to pick up the pieces of her life (saddling him with parental responsibilities and obligations-which western culture glorifies, and paints with a pretty picture but still it remains)-i have seen this happen dozens of times over the years....we had this discusion last time......
i don't believe that people change overnight....or actually that much at all, except for becoming generally more mature, calmer, and sometimes wiser. my best and oldest friend, at 21 was kind, intelligent, respectful, polite, loving, hardworking, faithful, moderately ambitious......fifteen years later, at age 36, guess what he is......kind, intelligent, respectful, polite, loving, hardworking, faithful, moderately ambitious. yes, things can be hidden for a time, but i have a hard time believing that you can go through an entire courtship without getting some indication what a man is actually like...aren't women supposed to be the perceptive emotionally intuitive gender? perhaps you saw the problems, but were "blinded by love"......this sounds a lot like the emotion based bad decision making that i was criticizing.....and as i postulated, can't believe that 60-70 years ago, needing patriarchal aproval for courtship didn't cut down on that sort of thing.
"2) there is a very big difference between a 'bad boy' and a paedophile. sure, mum's new boyfriend may be a bit of a party animal or a womaniser or knock her around a bit. but does that automatically mean that he would consider jumping into bed with her 9 year old daughter???"
i personally agree.....being a bad boy doesn't necessarily make someone a ****. someone can be 10 times as bad as the guy you describe above, and still (rightly) not have the slightest sexual interest in a pre pubescent child. being attracted to a child is an incurable sicknes, and acting on that impulse should be met with the harshest legal penalties.
"or, if she is a mother of a teenage girl, then she is likely to be in her mid thirties or older and he is likely to be in a similar age bracket. why on earth would it then stand to reason that this man who is approaching forty would necessarily fantasise about fucking his 15 year old step daughter, just because she lives in the same house and is not biologically related to him? a paedophile might see the teen as a horny young girl, but a real step-father just sees her as his daughter."
i'm going to have to strongly disagree, and don't mean to be unkind, but have to tell you that you are seeing that situation with rose colored glasses.
basically there are two kinds of men:
those who are sexually attracted to physically sexually mature attractive girls including those **** 18, or even 16.
and others who say that they aren't, but are lying. watch the eyes(we are usually sneaky about this) of the greatest father,kind, upstanding, moral, husband etc, as a 15 year old with big tits walks by...i guarantee that they will follow the girl. he may curse himself for having "impure thoughts" or whatever, but the thouhts are still there.
now, i am by no means saying that this is right, or that every man acts on the attraction, but simply that it is there. i haven't experienced this personally, but have even heard from biological fathers, that they have a hard time coping with their daughters becoming sexually mature...they become disgusted with themselves for being at least "aware" that the little moppet who is still climbing into daddy's lap is suddenly brushing brand new breasts up against him in the process.
3) basically, the entire argument is a cop-out that absolves men of any wrong-doing when it comes to the ridiculous rate of child sexual abuse and [CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123) of women. on one hand you are saying that women are not able to make intelligent decisions on their own behalf and on the other, you are saying that single mothers should have known better than to bring 'that sort of man' into their homes and let them get their hands on their daughters. well, guess
what...it's men who [CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123) those single mothers' daughters. whether the mother should have seen it coming or not, is beside the point. whether it happens more in single parent families than in marital homes, is beside the point. it is men who are [CodeWord125] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord125) their daughters and step-daughters. stop blaming women for letting it happen and start blaming the men for doing it!!!
my assertion was simply that women, as single mothers are less capable of keeping sexual predators away(not necessarily those that they are married to, or bringing into the house as boyfriends or whatever, although that is also certainly a problem-see above)....what originally brought this topic to mind was a syndicated radio host that espouses sentiments similar to that which is expressed on this board. he happened to take a call from a very screwed up young woman (i don't remember her exact dysfunction) who was seduced by and lost her virginity at age 11 to a 19 year old man as she was left unsupervised while her single mother was off at work. my point was twofold. one, although i am highly progressive in most areas, i do not believe as our pro feminist society has deigned that one woman is in most cases well equipped to raise children without the presence of a partner-parenthood is a two person job, with one entity primarily providing financial support, and the other being the primary caregiver. noticed that i did switch to gender neutral language....i do not have a problem with both parents being a man and woman, two gay men, or two gay women (although i cringe at the thought of some of the fucked in the head dykes i know raising children). in the case of this 11 year old girl, if there had been someone anyone supervising her, she would not have ever been in a situation where she could be coerced into sex with a 19 year old scumbag. my second point is that although our society has deigned that men are superfulous (i hope i spelled that correctly).....quite frankly, the chance of the incident happening would have been radically diminished if the girl's 30-40 year old father would have been around, as the 19 year old skeevy punk would have been very likely intimidated by the father who around that age would be coming into the peak of masculine power.
by the way, it is not hypocritical for the lesser financial contributor in a relationship to be expected to stay physically attractive....in many cases that is what allowed them to be in the relationship, and giving that up is pretty much "false advertising". again, note that i switched to gender neutral language. these days, many successful women are taking "boy toys" as partners....it would also be wrong of the "boy toy" to become phyically, or otherwise undesireable after laying claim to a successful woman's financial assets through a marriage. i couldn't imagine how much for example a 33 year old pharmaceutical representative who makes 140k a year and has a net worth of $850,000 would complain if the 25 year old surf bum with a 32 inch waist decided shortly after they got married chose to gain 50 pounds, deny her sex, and become moody and unpleasant to deal with. yet a woman does it, and it's "just natural".
b9k
Rubber Nursey
05-18-06, 05:53
For the record, I definitely do NOT 'scorn men'. I love men. In fact, I only have one female friend (and I am HER only female friend!) and all my other mates are, and always have been, men. I've been on this board for many years now, because I love to hear how you guys feel and what you think about different matters. Sometimes I play Devils Advocate and sometimes I genuinely disagree with you, but most of the time I recognise your fears and insecurities in myself and agree with you wholeheartedly. I can't give you 'unbiased opinion' as such - I'm a woman and my views will always be from a woman's perspective. But that's good, because your views come from a male perspective and maybe, every now and then, we can find common ground and get some insight into where our respective genders are going wrong. :)
"...people do have a desire for a long term relationship with one person but the cards are different in this day and age...It's getting harder and harder in western culture to find a compatible partner...".
Absolutely! My theory? Men and women no longer have clearly defined gender roles. Neither of us know where the hell we stand any more. Men are supposed to be kind and sensitive while at the same time being dominant and macho. They are supposed to be the breadwinner and yet spend more time with the kids and help with the housework. They are supposed to get jealous and defend their lady's honour and yet not be violent or controlling or possessive. Women are in exactly the same boat. We are still supposed to be popping out babies and cooking and cleaning and being 'good wives' and at the same time have a successful career and be financially independent. We are supposed to embrace our sexuality and indulge in casual sex and yet when we do it too openly, we are still branded sl*ts. In the business world and the political arena we are encouraged to be tough, ball-breaking b*tches, and yet still retain our femininity and be 'submissive' and nurturing.
When we get into relationships, we don't know what part we're supposed to play any more. Men fear their masculinity is being threatened. Women fear their independence is being undermined. Both sides are suspicious of each other - largely, I think, because we all spend so much time trying to be someone we're not, that we come across as 'fake'. And with divorce rates so high these days, I fear we are ALL going into relationships expecting the worst and it eventually becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy.
Right now, we have a Mexican Stand-off between men and women. Neither wants to be the one who backs down and compromises their position. We really need to stop treating relationships like a competition that can be won or lost - we're ALL losing because of it.
Rubber Nursey
05-18-06, 06:32
I, personally, do not believe for a minute that 'all women love bad boys'. Take a look at your own mates who are married or in relationships - are they all bad boys? Are they all treating their wives and girlfriends like crap? There are plenty of good men out there with partners and plenty of women who found exactly what they were looking for in those good men.
Most of us in this 'room' are over thirty. We have all been there and done that and are now looking at things from an experienced, mature, 'I know exactly what I'm looking for in a partner' position. But we were all young once and when we were, our priorities were very different to what they are now. In years past it was (for many of us) largely about sex, image, fun and excitement. We made decisions based on those priorities and - surprise, surprise - it blew up in our faces. Now we are looking for companionship, love, romance and stability and can't seem to find it. Why? Probably because a) many of us are looking for younger partners who are still in that sex and excitement phase of their life (and as such, won't give us a second glance) and/or b) because we've all been burned so badly by our past experiences that we are going into new relationships with bitterness and mistrust and destroying it before it starts. And that's both men AND women.
"This rant is not sexist because the same criticisms apply to men. There are many men who repeatedly choose badly and repeatedly end up with lousy partners, but blame everyone else and everything else before themselves".
That's all I was getting at in the first place. It takes TWO to fuck up a relationship. :)
Rubber Nursey
05-18-06, 08:12
Firstly, can I say thank you for the polite and respectful tone of your post. I was up on my high-horse yesterday when I wrote mine and certainly wasn't as balanced as I usually try to be, so I probably deserved some serious flaming from you, which I didn't get. Your original posts hit a raw nerve with me, not just because I was upset with the stereotyping, but because of some political stuff that's going on down here at the moment regarding single parents (namely, forcing single parents to work more hours - thus being around less for their children and increasing their risk of coming to harm). My frustration with these Government policies, combined with your - absolutely correct - observation that kids are at more risk when their only parent is forced to choose work over parenting, caused me to snap back more violently than I should have. My apologies and thank you again for the respectful way in which you responded to my rant.:)
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Deleted by poster
Hey there RN,
This is a bit off the current topic but anyways.... a couple of days ago, one of the guys here posted a link to a website for guys who enjoy the Thailand scene.
There were lots of comments regarding so-called backpacker girls. These are farang type girls who go travelling to Thailand as tourists. Some of these girls had actually made some rather nasty comments regarding the guys activities while they were mongering in Thailand..... which kind of brings me to the point I want to make.
What is it with women and competition? Apparently a lot of these girls like to get laid, which is normal. However, it seems that the competition (by local Thai girls) for the farang guys is having a profound effect on their behaviour. There are guys reporting come-ons made by women that they'd NEVER get if they were back home. One guy went so far as to say "It's like shooting blonde pussy in a barrel".
I was wondering if you might have some insights into this whole competition thing.
Rock
I, personally, do not believe for a minute that 'all women love bad boys'. Take a look at your own mates who are married or in relationships - are they all bad boys? Are they all treating their wives and girlfriends like crap? There are plenty of good men out there with partners and plenty of women who found exactly what they were looking for in those good men.
I do not associate with 'bad boys' so my own friends are not 'bad boys'. However, many, if not most, are divorced or on second or third marriages BECAUSE they were not 'bad' enough for their first wives. They did not treat their women crapping enough! As a result, their women did not feel 'loved', hence the request for divorce.
Many women here in North America believe that strong emotional displays reflect love and caring. One women said to me that she believed that fights in a marriage were necessary for a healthy marriage. (She felt it cleared the air.) Many women do things to inspire jealousy, or other strong emotions, to test whether the man really loves them.
From our point of view, we work hard to create a secure home for our wives and childre. We work hard to give opportunities to our children that we didn't have in order that they see more success in life than we. From many women's points of view, our hard work takes us away from her and out of the home. This makes her feel neglected and unloved. To test whether she is still loved and to feel lobved, a woman provokes fights, jealousies, and anger in her husband. After a few years of this nonsense, the woman comes to believe that she is not loved and the man loses the love he once had for her. And they divorce.
If this sounds like immature behavior, I agree completely; it is immature behavior. To many of us men, many women seem to be emotionally immature. They are very smart, accomplished, and professional in their jobs, but revert to children when it comes to romance. It is as if women's emotional development is arrested at their late teens or early twenties, despite them beng 10 or 20 years older than that.
Organicgrowth
05-21-06, 11:31
Rock Dog, RN, Wet Nose
After reading Wet Nose's post I was thinking about that very same question. Well asked RD.
Regards, Havanaman
I travel by myself alot and it seems just when I have a few days left I meet
a western girl that sucks me dry of my time with no intention of it adding up to anything.I feel its for the lack of attention/intrest that they get and they want a male companion to accompany them.I usually hang out for awhile then I say I have things to do.It's always a game.I also believe they just dont add up to the sex appeal of foreign women so their sense of control is lost.
Fuck the farang women who dont like what we do if they gave it up without so much bullshit maybe they would have guys falling at their feet.I get that in the DR alot.Remember in most countries if a guy wants pussy he gets it no matter what.
Someone mentioned older women and how they lose maturity with age so true.Usually it's in accordance with their looks when they suddenly realize its takes personality too.You can really judge a womens character as she gets older the less neurotic the more compassionate the better the catch for those who stay attractive they regress as well but back into the intellect of a 20 year old.Lets see would I like a ok looking women in her 40's that acts like a 20 year old or a 20 year without any wear and tear that acts her age.
I really think things will only get better for me now that I'm 36 and never been married.I'm prime meat for the right person and the control is more in my favor.I will use it with respect but I will also not let my emotions or compassion ruin my opportunity that I have rightfully been waiting for.
I resent nothing I do just that it didn't happen any sooner.
Also when women get older they get manly features even the attractive ones.I have a date today and shes around 37 with an estrogen defecit but still somewhat attractive and her personality is kind of like half man too.I'm debating whether it's worth it.I dont know maybe I should just stick to mongering and forget about the rest completely.
Rubber Nursey
05-21-06, 18:33
What is it with women and competition? ...I was wondering if you might have some insights into this whole competition thing.
Insight? No.
Opinion? Hell yeah!
I know you guys think women treat MEN like crap, but that's NOTHING compared to how women treat each other!! (Why do you think all my mates are men???) Everything's a bloody competition.
Women are their own worst enemies. We are very insecure creatures - ask any woman what parts of her body she doesn't like and her list will take her half an hour to rattle off. We spend a WHOLE lot of time thinking "I wish I had boobs like hers - I wish I had long legs like hers - I wish I was thin/curvy/blonde/brunette/tall/petite like her". So much time, in fact, that when we actually meet a woman that has all the attributes that we wish we had - we can't help thinking "YOU F#@&#G B*TCH"!!!!
As far as the situation with Western backpackers in Thailand goes, I think its probably just a case of them overcompensating for the fact that they're not Asian. The physical differences between Thai girls and your average Western woman are obvious - as is the fact that if the Western guys are visiting Thailand and hanging out in the girlie bars, they are probably specifically looking to pick up Thai chicks. But those Western girls are ALSO on holiday looking for a good shagging!! How else can they compete with some exotic looking Asian woman? Their only real option is to be totally brazen.
Mind you - they could have just thrown off their inhibitions and decided to play sex kitten while they're away from home, like a lot of people do when they go on holiday. An American tourist (for example) could very well behave in exactly the same way if she travelled to Australia or England, where physically she would be very similar to the locals. Its amazing what a few glasses of wine and ten thousand miles between her and her husband can do for a woman's libido. :)
Rubber Nursey
05-21-06, 21:21
George90:
You got me there, mate - I can't argue with a word you said!! :)
I've seen plenty of women behave in exactly the manner you described and I guess I've probably done it a bit myself over the years. Not cause fights on purpose, but I've been guilty of a little bit of harmless flirting over the years - just enough get my partners attention and check out his reaction. To see if he still gives a damn, I suppose. However, I have had boyfriends do exactly the same thing to me, but the motive is usually to make me feel uncertain about my attractiveness (compared to the woman he is flirting with) and not-so-subtly remind me that I could be easily replaced OR to reaffirm his own attractiveness in his own mind. Men have a few cruel games of their own up their sleeves!
I'd be willing to relate it to the 'gender role crisis' theory I was talking about before. (And again, that's just my own theory and I'm no expert on the human behaviour). I think somewhere deep down, perhaps subconsciously, women still want to feel possessed or dominated by their man and they want him to defend her honour and fight for her affection like males do in the wild. In the same way, I think men still want their women to be submissive and obedient to a certain extent and he wants to be the 'leader' of the household and rule with an iron fist. Most of these concepts are considered outdated - if not offensive - in modern relationships. When our instinct is telling us one thing and our social environment is telling us another, its sure to cause unrest, both in our minds and in our marriages.
Sinanju Master
05-21-06, 21:33
Does that mean I can't take a club and bash my competition over the head and victoriously drag my (newfound prize) woman BY HER HAIR back to my cave?
Rubber Nursey
05-21-06, 21:44
You could try - but you'd best make sure that club isn't within her reach when you let go of her hair. Especially if she's just been to the hairdressers!!
RN's assertion about women having all kinds of negative views about their appearance is correct.
Three years ago I was with a drop dead gorgeous working girl by the name of Alexandra in Manchester, England. I asked her out for dinner afterward and, to my surprise, she accepted. Over dinner and several bottles of wine, she began to speak spontaneously about her myriad of physical imperfections and shortcomings. Huh??? I mean, this girl was drop-dead gorgeous. She looked much like Catherine Zeta-Jones but even better - if that's possible. As I'm looking at her through my wine-induced haze, I could hardly believe what she was telling me. It occured to me that if this woman thinks that she is lacking in terms of physical attributes and beauty, I could only wonder what the other women on this planet must be thinking. I tried to re-assure her but she would have none of it. The whole encounter was rather amazing and I've never really forgotten her.
Paddy
This whole low-self-esteem thing might be at least a partial explanation for the whole bad-boy phenomenon.
These guys may have a better ability to spot attractive women who have low self esteem..... even though,outwardly, they might be stuck-up. The crappy treatment from the badboy is subconciously reassuring to the woman because it matches up with what she thinks she deserves.
This is offered only as a theory and partial explanation. Most times, the only way to know what's going on in a woman's head is to ask another woman.
Rock
Doctor_Skank
05-22-06, 14:23
I personally dont see as many women falling for the true bad boys as is reported here... i.e. guys with drug and alcohol problems, unemployed or criminally employed etc. I think a lot of this might be merely superficial. Then again, maybe I am just liviing in denial... :)
Still, beyond whats been written here, it is true that many very attractive girls cannot find men with enough confidence to hit on them.... men are intimidated by their beauty.
Macho men, in the US at least often what one might call "bad boys", are fearless in terms of hitting on women. In fact, I think their strategy is to hit on 30 women a night in the hope that they might get 2 or 3 that take the bait. No wonder they end up thinking that "all women are slutz"... they conveniently forget the 27 out of 30 that told them to take a hike.
In any case, its often no wonder that attractive women often end up with guys that look and behave like they've just been released from the state pen.
For me personally the bad boy syndrome doesnt have to work against us. Although I hardly qualify as a bad boy in the sense of the word used here, I have found that being adventurous or somewhat aggressive are qualities that many women, even if they don't admit it outright, like in a man. I find that women like to be reminded that they are women... and demonstrating the differences, whether physical or cultural, can tweak their interest.
I also find that, at least when dating young girls (18-24, in the age before they actually start looking for real long-term partners that can give them financial stability) do tend to go for rougher or at least superficially alpha male type guys. I also found that in the days when I behaved the "worst"... having multiple girlfriends simultaneously etc... it was the easiest for me to get girls. My "bad reputation" actually served as great advertising. And although some girls wouldnt touch me with a ten foot pole, many girls came around out of curiousity just to see what all the fuss was about.
I think the key is of course in the individual chemistry, but being "soft" in any way really wont get you far.
I used to know this kid who got a lot of play from being "bad", "crazy", and "wild". His claims to fame:
He had a lot of tatoo's.
He had a pierced tongue (In my estimation, that is one for the "you know how I know you're gay...." list, right next to "you used macrame to knit yourself a pair of jean shorts)
He was a "wild dancer".
He would yell and scream a lot.
I looked at this punk, and thought to myself. "Wild eh? Tell you what son, you can call me when you have:"
Had a Rugby team try to haze you with alcohol and you laugh at them/been told to STOP drinking all the beer while playing "three man" before they run out.
Telling same rugby team that you will submit to hazing stunts, when and if they (collectively) find someone big and bad enough to MAKE YOU.
Fool around with a pretty freshman girl on the roof of a frat house (This was WAY before flashing tits became part of the typical Friday night out) with numerous witnesses.
Gotten kicked out of a FRATERNITY for being a drunken psychopath
Gone Urban Surfing (I was only the driver on this one)
Mastered solo operation of a beer bong.
Drunkenly doing "stealth mode" on a dark highway at 110 MPH (Admittedly, this wasn't my idea, and not too bright but....I thought it was funny at the time).
You guys get the idea.....
(disdainful tone) "Wild dancing"
B9k
Sinanju Master
05-22-06, 21:37
was being kicked out of a town in a foreign country by the mayor himself with police backup
I have to take an honorable mention for while fucking my roomates girlfriend, making an attempt to get her upstairs so we could fuck in my bed (we were in her car), four feet away from her sleeping boyfriend. She wouldn't go along with it.
B9K
Adding on: I'll throw a bit into the current conversation...At the moment I'm franticly re-educating myself in the finer points of MS Office, prior to some pre-employment testing.
Women are generally creatures of emotion....they are most attracted to the guys that give them the biggest emotional rush....making them feel that they are "most alive", "walking on the wildside" whatever.......unfortunately, these feelings are most often generated by the guys who have the most drama and excitement in their lives......getting shot at while running from a house you just broke into-pretty exciting.......working all day and then studying all night for your MBA-kinda boring. By the way, as I have repeated ad nauseum, girl's don't usually MARRY the "drama guys" (or guys they perceive to be that-see below)....they (generally speaking-there are exceptions) give their hot little asses to him until it's time to settle down, and then they reel in some poor "nice guy" schlub to foot the bills so he can pop out some munchkins-hopefully biologically his, but that is far from a given.
B9k
By the way, as I have repeated ad nauseum, girl's don't usually MARRY the "drama guys" (or guys they perceive to be that-see below)....they (generally speaking-there are exceptions) give their hot little asses to him until it's time to settle down, and then they reel in some poor "nice guy" schlub to foot the bills so he can pop out some munchkins.
B9k
What you left out is that the munchkins that get popped out were sired by the "drama guys". The need to settke down with a "nice guy" hits hard when she gets pregnant and the father, a "drama guy", can provide absolutely ZERO stability.
What you left out is that the munchkins that get popped out were sired by the "drama guys". The need to settke down with a "nice guy" hits hard when she gets pregnant and the father, a "drama guy", can provide absolutely ZERO stability.
Well, that certainly happens too, both in the "instant family just add Daddy" category, as well as the "it's your baby" category.
Been meaning to mention...I don't begrudge anyone their youthful stupidity, as obviously I had at 18-22, a severe lack of regard for public safety. However, I paid the price for mine......girls expect you to pay their price for them.
B9k
PS The exciting loser/boring "winner" thing kind of feeds back into Nursey's "modern dichotomy" thing.....generally, toeing the line, working hard, being boring are prerequisites for success, which is required.....but then we are punished by a lack of attention (until it's time for them to use our financial resources) when we don't do them.
DJ FourMoney
05-23-06, 08:50
Not that you have all missed me, but I have spent the last month PLUS with this local Hungrian girl.
To cut a LONG story short, we finally met, I hit it, tagged it good in fact. But then the morning came, I left and 2nd doubts crept in...
From that moment I was DONE. She claims no chemical reaction in her to me. Okay, but she didn't mind the fact I "dinned at the Y" for at least 30 mins straight. Lack of regular sex shorten my master "stroke" to about 10 mins, which I thought might have screwed up her thinking. She asures me it had no effect, I don't buy it, but whatever.
Spent the next evening together, fondling and such. Got kicked out around Midnight. We both had to work early.
Well she pretty much said to me "in not so many words" that there is no spark and might not ever will be one. Wants to remain friends and that is fine with me, I suppose.
So what did I loose in that amount of time?
I won't get into all the details, I'll feel even more foolish than I already do.
I COULD have visted a certain German woman this month as was planned. Of course that might have limited my mongering to nill, but I would be in Europe and fuckin and that's what was important.
Now I have pushed that back to Sept/Oct when prices go back down, and frankly after spending some time in the New England area with about 5' of snow and visiting Canada during that same time, its actually not that bad, though I can't see myself LIVING in it. I would consider going even later in the year if it ment saving some dead presidents.
This has nothing to do with American women I guess, and this was about as far from the typical American woman as a European woman gets, which was very refreshing.
Though I failed this mission, I am on the right track. My destiny lies with a European woman. From where I don't know, but I can't see myself in any kind of a long term deal with an American woman. Expections are way too rare bothering with searching.
Its increasingly hard to find a childless woman here or in Europe.
But not impossible...
What kills is that she was local (10 mins away) and now I'm back to searching around the free world again. That is likely the most disapointing fact that it didn't work out.
Moral to this story -
Do not wait 5 weeks to meet a girl in person for the first time, especially if she lives in your AREA!
I wasted 5 weeks when it could have been maybe 1 week under normal conditions. Why did we wait so long? She wanted an answer on her legal status here. She is NOT an American citizen, even though she married one for papers. She sent out papers for her final Green Card before she can try for citizenship. She got an answer this past Saturday and I got the greenlight.
So there you have it, the only thing I can take from this is that a proper boy scout is always prepared... I had another waiting in the wings, though not an "import" but a "domestic" model, but she lives in UTAH!
Ive prolly traveled for pussy for more miles and hours than I care to mention.
The saga of being a nice guy continues...
I wasted 5 weeks when it could have been maybe 1 week under normal conditions. Why did we wait so long? She wanted an answer on her legal status here. She is NOT an American citizen, even though she married one for papers. She sent out papers for her final Green Card before she can try for citizenship. She got an answer this past Saturday and I got the greenlight.
I don't mean to kick a man when he is down, but you should have known better. I am quoting the part of your post where she clearly explains HER priorities to you. You are clearly nowhere near the top of her list of priorities. First is her papers. Second is her husband. You were way down that list in the recreation slot.
There is nothing wrong with being her recreation or her being your recreation. But there is LOTS wrong if you don't realize that is only what it is! You should have had your own priorites straight. Your German lady friend should have been a higher priority than your Hungarian fuck partner. It would have been better to put the Hungarian on hold until her papers panned out, while you put the Fraulein on the front burner.
At least, now you do know better. Thanks for sharing because now many other men know better as well.
I personally dont see as many women falling for the true bad boys as is reported here... i.e. guys with drug and alcohol problems, unemployed or criminally employed etc. I think a lot of this might be merely superficial. Then again, maybe I am just liviing in denial... :)
It's usually not THIS pronounced. Although guys like Soprano's character Chris Moltasanti (an abusive full blown criminal with a serious substance abuse problem) get more ass than the can shake a stick at, it is frequently more the "loser" part of "bad boy loser". One that I have seen a lot over the years is a pretty young girl from a nice family, who has some things going on (college, or a decent job, sometimes both) will have a boyfriend who is taking up air that other people could be breathing........pretty typical is being about 22-23, living with his divorced mother (Dad would have kicked his ass for being a bum), playing SEGA about 7 hours a day, maybe off and on holding down some little nothing part time job (zero ambition towards anything better)-paying just enough to keep him in cigs, weed and beer......plenty of time and energy to "party" and have social drama.......generally he treats the girl like shit, ambivalent as to whether or not she is around unless he gets horny.
The girl is usually madly in love with this guy....I saw a deal once where a 21 year old guy (not going to school) getting his FIRST job (20 hours a week at a department store) caused much jubilation and celebration with his 21 year old goddess of a girlfriend.....she was starting to plan her wedding and children with him..
Saw another deal where a guy actually planned it out where he and girlfriend (young and pretty, holding a decent job and going to school) could live in a one bedroom trailer with no phone and they could live on her income, so he could continue playing video games all day. I'm proud of her to say that this stunt got the guy dumped....after he got hot young ass off of her for 2-3 years (fortunately, she managed not to get pregnant). I can't help but think that there was some hardworkinig ambitious deserving young man who would have enjoyed her company during this time
While I am on a roll here, I once saw a guy who at 27 could be most accurately be described as a "drifter" (he came out to "crash with a buddy" for a while)come to work as a bartender at a restaurant where I was cooking in the early nineties. Within a month, he had "fucked and chucked" EVERY girl there who was young, single and attractive (total of 7 or 8).....yea, some of these girls were mattressbacked bimbo's, but others weren't......but they were all drawn to him like a moth to flame. This story at least has a happy ending.....the guy ended up a couple years later impregnating the biggest nasty, bitchy, ugly trailer park skank that you could possibly imagine....I believe he ended up married to her, and I'm sure she did a number on him.
B9k
Saw this post by a provider on another board and thought I'd post here for discussion purposes. This American guy is in some DEEP, DEEP dodo and it serves him right for being careless with his email password. His American wife wants to know from the provider what she might have done wrong in the relationship. It sure makes for some good reading.
...............an email from a wife? Not an angry one, but a like a pitiful, but determined one? Never in my 6 years of working have I had one of these, and I am usually ok at handling these sorts of things rationally-- but I am utterly and entirely stumped, without a clue on the horizon of what to say. I was so touched, and so confused and lost at the same time-- it was overwhelming... I got it latenight/early morning and she repeated herself often throughout, as though maybe she had been drinking a bit. But it was truly a cry for help that I had never come across. I am sure that she isn't onto ***, and even if she is, I had to risk it, I need help, I don't know what to say...
The email (minus a bit of fluff that was cut to shorten it) was sent as follows:
Danielle,
I hope this doesnt catch you as off gaurd as you caught me, and I hope you read my letter because it would mean alot to me if you do. I have seen your website and you are a very pretty girl. I am a woman, I am mother, and I am a wife, Though I am not mad, I know who and what you are and how you have affected me and my family anfd my childrem. I wont keep you, but I wanted to talk to you if you dont mind, about this and my husband. See its been a while now, that I have noticed signs of his misbehaving, but I dont ever say anything to him about it. and though you are not the only one I have emailed, you seem to be the one he is firends with. And from your correspondances I can tell what sort of person you are, and I think you will respect where i am coming from, so I have some questions for you (".....edited.......").
Im going to confront him, but before I do I want to knw one thing, what is it I have done wrong? What amy I not doing for him and to him, that has made him seek sexual attention outside of our home. I love my husband and I have stood behind him, but I am at my rock bottom wits end and i dont want to call it quits but I feel like i have no other choice at this point. This is my last resort. Please, I am asking you if you know anything, or can tell me anything that he has told you, it would be a great help. Tell me things he like to do, and things he has said to you that he wants to do or try. I always felt like I was open with him, but there is obvoisly some things that he feels he cant and shouldnt do with me and its tearing me and our family apart. Its also put a dent into our finances to the point where I have noticed it badly. Like I told you Im not mad with you, you were simply doing your job and I understand that. But I hope you understand that I cannot allow him to come see you or anyone else anymore. You can always find anothe client but he is my only husband. And Im in tears as I am writing this, you cant understand how it pains me to have to have to approach a lady my husband has given our money to for his pleasure, so I can find out about more about him. We have been married now for 17 years, and he apparently thinks he can't come to me for his desires or fetishes or whatever. I and can't take it, and we can't afford it. And it has to stop.
Im sorry if i have incovieninced you in any way. I dont mean to carry on, I would just relaly appreciate it if you can help me to please my husbband better. We cant afford this emotionally or financially any longer, but I dont want to loose him completely either. I need the keey to keeping us together. Please help. Can you call me, or can we meet for coffee or something?
******** ***********"
I know she isn't bull$hitting me, because she forwarded the emails he and I had sent back and forth... Im so shocked, and saddened, and embarrassed all at once, and I haven't sent something back to her yet. I feel very bad for the guy too-- because he and I had developed a friendship over the years he had seen me, and he does tell me plenty about his wife, nothing too bad ever, just that she is a great woman, but not pleasing him anymore-- exactly what she thinks of herself. I am at a total loss for thought, and anything that anyone can say to help would be great. I would like to be tasteful, and pleasant as possible, and I short and sweet as well.
I would like to help her, but how? I don't really want to get involved, but I feel so bad for her...
what to do?
I'd say that she basically anwered her own question in that letter. Of course women seem to understand men about as well as men understand women so I'll spell it out for everybody.
Married for 17 years with kids. 17 years of banging the same hole. 17 years of looking at the same naked body, the same old routine. There's no kinky sex acts, no techniques and no fetishes that could possibly freshen things up enough to get out of that rut. Of COURSE the guy went out for some side action. Guys need variety. Women want security and familiarity..... but men need variety. It's the eternal conflict between the sexes.
He's gonna have to deal with the consequences now. The wife may feel like it's her fault, but that won't last for long once the divorce lawyer's done coaching her.
Rock
Sinanju Master
05-25-06, 02:26
The letter is expressed from ONE SIDE of the relationship. It says that the husband left her side to seek sexual gratification elsewhere. It does not say WHY. No details of the relationship are made known other than opinion. While I am NOT defending the husband, here's a POSSIBLE scenario...
wifey may have paid SO MUCH attention to the kids during the span of the relationship that she may have neglected hubby and not thought of it for a second because she was being "Mommy" and dumped her role as "wife". It DOES happen (I've seen it on Oprah! LOL). NATURALLY hubby is gonna be resentful and seek attention elsewhere. He has no legal recourse if wifey does this. What is he supposed to do? Tough it out, jerk off and be HAPPY at this farce of a family life? Sure, you should raise your kids with the proper amount of attention and love, but to do so at the detriment of your spouse (with whom your PRIMARY RELATIONSHIP should be) is a recipe for disaster. If she thinks that he's gonna wait around for the kids to turn 18 and be sexless for the entire time simply because she wants to dote on her kids, then she's OBVIOUSLY on crack. Does she think that he's gonna stand for this? No man with a backbone WILL. I think that this scenario is entirely plausible and is one she will not admit to.
Think about this, young padawans....
Chocha Monger
05-25-06, 06:16
I also met a Hungrian girl that has been in the US 6 years and TOTALLY uneffected by the typical thinking of American women, which she finds stupid and almost funny. Totally refreshing. What's even better she lives less than 5 mins from where I'm posting this...
I'm not going to put my eggs in one basket and she has some "green card" issues she needs to take care before anything serious happens between us. So currently the phyical part of the relationship is on hold, but you should see the SMS she sends me 4-5 times a day. She's gunna crack and when she does, I'll be there to catch her, but I will still go to Europe and enjoy myself, just to confirm she is worth and honestly I know its been only a few days, I can say she is 100% worth it....
DJFourMoney:
Do you think that we preach about the pitfalls of becoming involved with American and Americanized women because we have nothing better to do? It seems that all of the warnings and admonishments are futile; guys keep repeating the same behavior that gets them burned.
Let us see, this Hungarian woman lived in the United States for 6 years but you thought that she was “totally unaffected by the typical thinking of American women”. DJ, if you really believed that, I have a nice lobster farm in Central Georgia that I would like to sell you. Don’t worry, I’ll give you a good price and all of the lobsters have been de-clawed to spare you those nasty pinches.
So here you go, smitten with this totally Un-Americanized immigrant who has been residing in the US for 6 years; you cancel your mongering trip to Europe while this self professed visa hunter puts you on hold to finish securing a permanent green card from her sponsor; you dine on her [CodeWord140] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord140) flaps for a half hour and then she tells your efforts didn’t have the slightest effect upon her. Then she tells you that you can be friends. Well, DJ pardon my honesty, but that sounds terribly American to me. You got played in a really bad way.
I remember that my last words to you regarding this woman were to “fuck and flee”. Instead, you chose to be Mr. Nice Guy and you finished last. Is that any surprise? How were you going to excite her when you did what every other sucker does by trying very hard to please her? You were too nice and sensitive making excuses for your performance; wasting your time licking her [CodeWord140] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord140) hole. What you should have done was cut your 10 minute master stroke to a vicious 5 minute beast fuck, preferably anal, then after blowing your load suddenly remember a prior engagement; pull up your pants and rush out the door. I guarantee that you would have had quite an effect on her and left her with more of an impression than submissively licking her **** for a half hour.
Perhaps, you think that the regulars in this thread are a little too radical for your liking. Maybe, deep down inside you believe that we’re just a bunch of bitter bastards; that is perfectly okay but do yourself a favor and visit the Medellin section on the Colombia thread. You will find that guys who don’t post here also have some very revealing views and experiences with foreign women who end up in the United States.
Not related to american women, but feminism in general. Sure food for thought...perhaps the feminists are starting to wake up?
http://www.stickmanbangkok.com/Reader2006/reader2572.htm
DJ,
Don't get bogged down with any particular woman. If you want the best value for your dollars, fuck and flee! Getting too emotionally connected with these women before you really know them is bad business. A lot of European women are players and fucking you is no big deal to them, especially the Swedes. Be careful or you just might end up being someone's chocolate fix and end up pulling up the sheets the next morning with some money on the night stand like Eddie Murphy in Boomerang.
3F those skanks and yell out, "Next!"
Okay, I'm off to finish packing for my trip.
"fuck and flee" I like that...........I've committed these comments to memory.
That is so true!
Not related to american women, but feminism in general. Sure food for thought...perhaps the feminists are starting to wake up?
http://www.stickmanbangkok.com/Reader2006/reader2572.htm
Sinanju Master
05-26-06, 00:22
That story that Wet Nose posted from the British author is SO on the money! The guy's self-acceptance is eye-opening, refreshing and maybe a bit Herculean, after being metaphorically beaten up by western females. I gotta admit the guy gave me a NEW view on the entire subject and I'm LESS apt to be defensive defensive about it if an AW ever found out and interrogated me on the subject.
Happy Chappy
05-26-06, 10:32
I have made 2 trips to Thailand for vacation within the last 12 months. People within my workplace know I am single and whenever I say I have come back from Thailand they will either come out directly and pry into my sex life over there, or do so in an indirect manner, basically I feel its clear that they are viewing me as a "sex tourist". I even heard that a single women in the office (who is typically fussy and expects to meet a Brad Pitt even though her clock is ticking - she is 36 y.o. and very average looking) commented to another about me being a sex tourist and I have to travel half way around the world to get some sex.
Now I know for sure within myself I have no problems or issues about myself paying for sex. Yet for some strange reason people talking behind my back like in the above example annoys me a little, even though I know it should not. I was wondering if others on this board experience similar snide remarks or reactions from American women when telling them you have been to Thailand or another country renowned for sex tourists. Does it bother you? I sometimes consider maybe I should say I am going somewhere else on holiday, I just get sick of people obsessed with my sex life just because I am single and frequent such locations. I never would for instance ask a married person in the office how many times a week are you having sex, so I sort of expect not to have to share any intimate relationship details I maybe having on my trips.
My longer term goal is that when I am around 42 y.o. I believe I shall have enough to retire an spend around 4 months of the year across Asia and the rest in Australia, I do not have ambitions to have kids or get married or be in a relationship during my time in Australia. Effectively I have given up dating westernised women for the whole host of reasons that are often discussed here. Yet in the meantime it is driving me mad with friends, family, work colleagues who do not seem to want to accept the fact I want to spend my life different to them, i.e. they are continually trying to set me up on dates despite me saying I am not interested, they are gobsmacked when I say I have no interest in having kids, and think I am a lunatic for not buying a home yet ( I don't want to live in one place all the time and prefer to trade the stockmarket).
Does anyone experience similar fustrations from American women who look down on men such as me who have chosen to give up on them? I think they are shocked that I can lead a very happy life without them.
Happy Chappy
05-26-06, 11:30
That story that Wet Nose posted from the British author is SO on the money! The guy's self-acceptance is eye-opening, refreshing and maybe a bit Herculean, after being metaphorically beaten up by western females. I gotta admit the guy gave me a NEW view on the entire subject and I'm LESS apt to be defensive defensive about it if an AW ever found out and interrogated me on the subject.I agree Sinanju Master, a fantastic read, the guy is a great writer. I can relate to so much of what he said, reading particular parts of it I felt it was myself who was talking.
Organicgrowth
05-26-06, 13:19
Without doubt one of the best articles I have read in the past couple of years.
Sinanju Master I think that you are very right: it does leave one with a new view on the entire subject.
Regards, Havanaman
Great read for sure.I think he speaks for alot of people on this board.I'm him just 15 years younger.
I have made 2 trips to Thailand for vacation within the last 12 months. People within my workplace know I am single and whenever I say I have come back from Thailand they will either come out directly and pry into my sex life over there, or do so in an indirect manner, basically I feel its clear that they are viewing me as a "sex tourist".
The cat is out of the bag and, since one cannot unring a bell, you need to change jobs! You well know the low level of respect women give men in our society. It should not surprise you then that you are not accorded privacy regarding your sex life.
I do not blame women for your problem. I blame you! You should have known better than disclose your trip destinations to your coworkers. You should have lied to them, say you are going to Europe, or politely told them to mnd their own business, say that your vacation is escape from work and you do not want to discuss your vacation time at work with coworkers.
I know better. Most other posters know better. So, no! We have not experienced what you are experiencing regarding your travel. I have heard comments baout being middle-aged and single. But I am not considered a catch for AWs so they are not dissappointed that I do not show interest in them.
...for explaining my frequent trips to a snowy Eastern European capital..
"I have friends there" (true)
"I'm meeting my buddy from (third country) there" (true)
"I have a couple of girlfriends there" (true-also keeps people from pinning you down for exact details about your "girlfriend".
"I enjoy the surreal ambiance" (true-I was in the city center for about 5 minutes when about 70 hare krishna's danced and chanted by me....walked by a McDonalds in a quiet part of the city at night to see that a bunch of kids have co-opted it into a dance club....)
"I would live there if I could/It's home away from home" (also true)
"It's incredible-you should go" (probably not true)
Regarding being single, our culture is dominated by female thinking, and religious fucks, neither of whom have any tolerance for lifestyles that do not underwrite their agenda's.
B9k
PS Changing jobs probably isn't a bad idea. Bitches are a hell of a lot more sneaky and manipulative than we are, and if they have figured out that you aren't playing by their rules, it might behoove you to get out of there, and into a masculine dominated environment. I've seen a man fall into disaproval for holding alternative religious beliefs, and the next thing you know, he is being fired on trumped up sexual harassment charges.
Organicgrowth
05-26-06, 19:12
I have made 2 trips to Thailand for vacation within the last 12 months. People within my workplace know I am single and whenever I say I have come back from Thailand they will either come out directly and pry into my sex life over there, or do so in an indirect manner, basically I feel its clear that they are viewing me as a "sex tourist". I even heard that a single women in the office (who is typically fussy and expects to meet a Brad Pitt even though her clock is ticking - she is 36 y.o. and very average looking) commented to another about me being a sex tourist and I have to travel half way around the world to get some sex…...
I am in full agreement with George90. Enough said: its your own fault.
HOWEVER, I think that you should tell this co-worker that you know what she has been saying, you have witnesses and that she should either apologise and stop this nastiness, maliciousness, lies / gossip and hate-mongering or you will escalate this issue to your human resources managers and seek a legal solution…. The idea is to cause her maximum fear of job loss….
As to your other point: its in the nature of a lot of people to “match make”. I should go on a few of these dates and on the very first date get the conversation to “partnerships in place of marriage”, “enjoying life without kids”, “prenuptial agreements in a relationship” etc… you get the point: issue which will make the most ardent cringe… Feedback about these will soon tell your so called friends that you are not playing the “matchmaker game”.
Regards, Havanaman
PS. Who gives a shit what people think: you be yourself but keep your business to yourself...
ABSOLUTELY under no circumstances ever let anyone "fix you up". In western culture, the odds are radically stacked in women's favor, and any chick who can't find dates on her own has SEVERE defects.
Fix ups are usually the opportunity for someone to appease their morbidly obese friend (at your expense) who cries constantly that she can't find a good man (I wonder why)
I wouldn't bother with a confrontation with this woman, or an escalation to HR. Confrontation merely adds fuel to the fire, and as a hetrosexual single male, you effectively have no rights. The HR heirarchy is pretty much there to protect the rest of your working world FROM you. As I said before, you may want to change jobs ASAP. If the field that you work in is female dominated, try to get a (best case scenario divorced) male boss who has been there for a while (and consequently has probably hired most of the people on staff)....bosses tend to replicate themselves in their hiring decisions, and if she is an self righteous unstable judgemental *****, then you will find yourself working in a highly male hostile environment.
B9K
I happen to be an avid photographer with photos to back up my talk for every trip I go on which is a great alibi.The more obscure the location the better(more intresting) the photos.My problem is when I go back to visit places I've already photographed.I was asked what I did in buenos aires for 2 weeks without leaving the city...if they only knew.
Screw people who bad talk you your one of the very few people who can travel with that you become more intelligent and harder to manipulate.Everyone should be so lucky.
I agree with what was said about harassment it's no different than what women go through.
Sinanju Master
05-26-06, 21:39
don't worry, dude. I was in a slightly similar situation last year when I returned from the Philippines. A female salesperson and our female receptionist found out about my trip and the salesperson queried me DIRECTLY while the recptionist did it subtly. I detected a bit of indignation in the salesperson (that I would actually go halfway around the world and fuck hot young honeys even having payed for it). She said (and I quote): "I hear that they treat their men like kings". I thought to myself: "You are SO FUCKING RIGHT, Shamu"! The fact that I was able to choose my sexual partner (age, looks, and body type) must have INCENSED her. She was incensed that I was no longer in the US, no longer subject to the whims of women who attempt to control me through sexual means. She was incensed that I removed the ONE element through which all AW's attempt to control men. ON TOP OF THAT, she was incensed that I was so relaxed and easy going when I returned. These two broads tried to convince me that I should get married, have kids, blah blah blah. After they found out my sexual foray to the other side of the world changed my outlook for the better, they tossed in the towel and accepted defeat. So, Ozzie T, continue to do what you're doing and DON'T hide the fact that your forays recharge your batteries and make Life seem wonderful. THAT is what makes your female nemesis green with envy and that's what makes her conjure excuses for why you are a loser in her eyes. Take heart, Young Padawan! The Force will be with you... always
Chocha Monger
05-26-06, 22:37
Ozzie T,
You should avoid any discussions about your private life on the job. The subject of sex is to be especially avoided in the work place! As a male you open yourself up to all kinds of allegations when you permit women to discuss your personal life.
You should draw your boundaries with female co-workers. In the future keep your mouth shut about your vacations. If someone inquires about your vacation just say that it was fine and leave it at that; should they insist on details, tell them that after returning from your last vacation some very nasty and inappropriate things were said about you. Therefore you have decided to keep your affairs private in order to prevent further slandering of your character.
If you were the one making remarks about this woman's sex life you'd have already been fired!
Happy Chappy
05-27-06, 01:46
The cat is out of the bag and, since one cannot unring a bell, you need to change jobs! You well know the low level of respect women give men in our society. It should not surprise you then that you are not accorded privacy regarding your sex life.
I do not blame women for your problem. I blame you! You should have known better than disclose your trip destinations to your coworkers. You should have lied to them, say you are going to Europe, or politely told them to mnd their own business, say that your vacation is escape from work and you do not want to discuss your vacation time at work with coworkers.
I know better. Most other posters know better. So, no! We have not experienced what you are experiencing regarding your travel. I have heard comments baout being middle-aged and single. But I am not considered a catch for AWs so they are not dissappointed that I do not show interest in them.Well that is an interesting response George. I must admit I was expecting people to say why on earth am I worried about what others think , and that lying about where you go on vacation is rediculous.
Anyway I am certainly not changing jobs! But the idea of lying about where I go on vaction is appealing and I nearly did this last time. When you say the cat is out of the bag, well that may be true to a large extent, but to put this into perspective, I have worked at this place for nearly 7 years. In that time I have done plenty of vactions across Australia, also the U.S. and Europe aswell as these recent couple of asia trips, so maybe the cat is not quite out of the bag yet if you know where I am coming from.
Anyway thanks for the tip George. I will say thought that I did know this would occur, I guess I just thought I wouldn't care what anyone else thinks, to me that is a great way to live. However I just misread how I would feel not how woman would think, and it turns out it bothers me a little.
PS Changing jobs probably isn't a bad idea. Bitches are a hell of a lot more sneaky and manipulative than we are, and if they have figured out that you aren't playing by their rules, it might behoove you to get out of there, and into a masculine dominated environment. I've seen a man fall into disaproval for holding alternative religious beliefs, and the next thing you know, he is being fired on trumped up sexual harassment charges.
That is the reason for my suggestion to change jobs; to avoid a sexual harassment accusation or worse. From stories I have heard, and frm the attitude of many women, I would not put it past a woman to report OT to the police, or other law enforcement (FBI) accusing him of having sex with minors or travelling for the purpose of illegal sex.
I hope EVERYONE knows and fully understands that it is against US law for a US citizen or US permanent resident to travel abroad for the purpose of engaging in prostitution. The law is rarely enforced, so far only for sex with minors. But it is INSANE to have one's coworkers gossiping about your having sex with prostitiutes in Thailand. It WILL get to someone in LE, via a feminist, and you will have to explain a HIGHLY exaggerated story to a detective threatening you with arrest.
With all due respect, **I don't want to start a flame war**, but you guys who are advising OT to flaunt his mongering to women in their faces at his job, are just plain dumb.
Happy Chappy
05-27-06, 01:58
I am in full agreement with George90. Enough said: its your own fault.
HOWEVER, I think that you should tell this co-worker that you know what she has been saying, you have witnesses and that she should either apologise and stop this nastiness, maliciousness, lies / gossip and hate-mongering or you will escalate this issue to your human resources managers and seek a legal solution. The idea is to cause her maximum fear of job loss.
As to your other point: its in the nature of a lot of people to “match make”. I should go on a few of these dates and on the very first date get the conversation to “partnerships in place of marriage”, “enjoying life without kids”, “prenuptial agreements in a relationship” etc… you get the point: issue which will make the most ardent cringe… Feedback about these will soon tell your so called friends that you are not playing the “matchmaker game”.
Regards, Havanaman
PS. Who gives a shit what people think: you be yourself but keep your business to yourself...Thanks Havanaman and anyone replying about this topic. I just wanted to say that confronting this woman or turning this into a HR issue is way out of the question. This annoyed me a little, enough to post here about it, but no where near enough to make a big issue about it, I am not slashing my wrists over the event.
Your last quote was interesting, as it is hard to be myself yet keep such a significant part about myself private. And when I say this I am not talking or referring about mongering. Whilst a massive part of my Thailand trips are the women, also a big part is travelling in general, hence my many holidays through America and Europe destinations that are not known as sex tourist locations. So it is a bit unusual for me to jetset across the world and not come back and talk about my travels as a lot of people are interested, so it will not be that easy to lie, I guess I will have to get used to it.
Happy Chappy
05-27-06, 02:03
That is the reason for my suggestion to change jobs; to avoid a sexual harassment accusation or worse. From stories I have heard, and frm the attitude of many women, I would not put it past a woman to report OT to the police, or other law enforcement (FBI) accusing him of having sex with minors or travelling for the purpose of illegal sex.
I hope EVERYONE knows and fully understands that it is against US law for a US citizen or US permanent resident to travel abroad for the purpose of engaging in prostitution. The law is rarely enforced, so far only for sex with minors. But it is INSANE to have one's coworkers gossiping about your having sex with prostitiutes in Thailand. It WILL get to someone in LE, via a feminist, and you will have to explain a HIGHLY exaggerated story to a detective threatening you with arrest.
With all due respect, **I don't want to start a flame war**, but you guys who are advising OT to flaunt his mongering to women in their faces at his job, are just plain dumb.I also want to clarify I have never talked about my sexual exploits over there. It is just often assumed. If a conversation starts to head that way from someone else I always say I had no luck with the women or whatever. Maybe that is why the whole thing bothers me, I have never said I had any sort of relationship with women over there.
Happy Chappy
05-27-06, 02:06
That is the reason for my suggestion to change jobs; to avoid a sexual harassment accusation or worse. From stories I have heard, and frm the attitude of many women, I would not put it past a woman to report OT to the police, or other law enforcement (FBI) accusing him of having sex with minors or travelling for the purpose of illegal sex.
I hope EVERYONE knows and fully understands that it is against US law for a US citizen or US permanent resident to travel abroad for the purpose of engaging in prostitution. The law is rarely enforced, so far only for sex with minors. But it is INSANE to have one's coworkers gossiping about your having sex with prostitiutes in Thailand. It WILL get to someone in LE, via a feminist, and you will have to explain a HIGHLY exaggerated story to a detective threatening you with arrest.
With all due respect, **I don't want to start a flame war**, but you guys who are advising OT to flaunt his mongering to women in their faces at his job, are just plain dumb.So it is common for women to report single men in the 30's for holidaying in Thailand to the police because it is speculated they are visiting for illegal sex? Come on lets not get too carried away.
Happy Chappy
05-27-06, 02:43
I happen to be an avid photographer with photos to back up my talk for every trip I go on which is a great alibi.The more obscure the location the better(more intresting) the photos.My problem is when I go back to visit places I've already photographed.I was asked what I did in buenos aires for 2 weeks without leaving the city...if they only knew.
Screw people who bad talk you your one of the very few people who can travel with that you become more intelligent and harder to manipulate.Everyone should be so lucky.
I agree with what was said about harassment it's no different than what women go through.You could say the same for me too. As I have said I have worked at this place for nearly 7 years, done trips to America and many European destinations and came back with many photos ( the tourist type not the mongering type!) before the latest trips to Thailand. With Thailand when I went the second time I said I went to check out different places to the first trip after hearing good reports and I came back with different photos of different places. And years before I have done second trips to the same country for the same reason. But as far as Thailand goes, it seems if you are a single male, no matter what excuses you are have for going there, it is guaranteed women will assume you are a sex tourist, no doubt about it.
Sinanju Master
05-27-06, 04:22
I'm DUMB for knowing my boss is an Alpha male type who gets off on the types of exploits I went through in the Philippines. I'd be TRULY dumb if I actually spoke IN DETAIL about what happened on my trip to these broads. The fact is that I only told said broads that I WENT to the Philippines and their imaginations supplied the REST. I didn't dissuade them from what they thought. If they wanted to bring me up on sexual harassment charges as someone who is willing to point an accusing finger SUGGESTS, they would have only their accusations (NOT supported by the rest of my company AT ALL). That being said, if I'd be accused by the Thought Police, then I'd have no defense at all and I'd be GUILTY simply because their agents SAID SO.
So, Ozz, be subtle about it. I NEVER said to be graphic about your exploits as someone ASSUMED. If these harpies wanna charge you for sexual harassment simply because they INFERRED that you had sex with younger women, the burden of proof is upon THEM. If it's found out that they cried wolf (as I'm sure it will be) more people in your company will be enlightened to that fact.
I was going to bring up earlier after Sin's first post, that it depends on your work environment how big a deal this is...Sin pointed out that there really isn't too much to be done if there is a manly man in charge of your work environment, the bitches aren't in a power position (like married to the owner)and there (appearently) isn't an HR department for them to go crying to. Conversely, if your immediate supervisor is a chick, and you work for a big lawsuit adverse corporation,, you could have a problem. Remember by the way that women generally do not have any sense of fair play, and don't see a problem with ruining your career because they judgementally don't approve of your vacation activities.
I also have to point out that OT is from Oz. We have possibly mistakenly assumed that Oz's sexual harassment laws are as wacko as those in the US (almost any behavior can labled SH at the whim of any woman-----I once had a complaint which was in part due to me being "too nice"). I do not definitively know this, but it may be that it (the wacky laws) are not the case.
One more thing about the match making deal-I have a very nice, very friendly female cousin that doesn't really talk to me anymore when I declined to continue seeing her best friend (a 300 pounder-she was nice at least but..) after a blind date. I was kind and respectful to the girl but it was a no win situation, that I recommend staying out of by categorically rejecting "fix ups"
B9k
I'm DUMB for knowing my boss is an Alpha male type who gets off on the types of exploits I went through in the Philippines.
Your individual work environment is larger than you think it is. Even if you think you are keeping it only between you and your sympathetic boss, the walls have ears.
Your firm interacts with other firms. You have clients. If any of those clients here about "The guys at Someco went to Thailand and banged a bunch of *****s for almost no money.", you may be lucky to only lose that client's business. Women in your client's firm can complain about sexual harassment by employees of other firms. Then you have a problem.
You have employees of other firms come into your firm to do work. Lawyers who review contracts, auditors, etc. Let them hear about your Thai exploits and again you can have serious problems. Those workers, the employees of other firms working on your firm's premises, can complain about sexual harassment by your firm's employees.
After you have gotten into the habit of discussing your Thai exploits with sympathetic coworkers, you may find it difficult to turn off the bragging at appropriate times. You may be careless and let "sensitive" people overhear you.
Sex monger talk is NOT appropriate in the workplace. Don't do it at all, and you will have few problems. You will not have ANY problems, if you never discuss things that or even tangentally related to mongering, such as taking a vacation to Thailand.
I just remembered an example of what I described below. I used to work as an auditor. The senior of the audit team LOVED to talk and be the center of everyone's attention. He would tell jokes to us and the client's workers, make remarks, compliments, insults, anything that involved running his mouth.
In one of his off-the-cuff smart alec remarks, he said something that one or more of the client's staff felt disparaged their position. At least one woman then went around complaining to EVERYONE about what he said and how offended and slighted she was. She complained to her boss, the controller, in front of me and several other mid-to-high level executives. I don't know if the audit partner was told and what happened afterward. I only know that he kept his job.
My main point is, you do not need the grief, SO DON'T RISK IT!!!
Sinanju Master
05-27-06, 06:21
I work for a plumbing supply warehouse. 95% of the customers that walk thorugh the doors are MEN (plumbers) who speak as I do. On the rare occasion that a WOMAN walks through the door, I fill their order with the courtesy required and treat them as valued customers. We now have ONE woman working for us (a totally DIFFERENT one), and I have not nor do I need to tell her about my views or forays. I've never been fired or THREATENED to be fired for sexual harassment, HOWEVER, I've been on the RECEIVING end of it.
Yes, my work environment IS larger than I think. ALL the males in KEY positions think as I do. IN FACT, these key males are bigger *****s than I am. It's pretty much a good ol' boys club, and my stories of my vacation exploits are welcomed. I learned from a different environment a few years ago of the dangers of doing what I do NOW.
My sex monger talk is kept among men who wish to do as I do.
Organicgrowth
05-27-06, 08:54
My sex monger talk is kept among men who wish to do as I do.
Very well said: I totally agree. Whilst I see the issues involved and eloquently discussed here, I must add that it is purely a personal thing dependent on ones job, environment, like-minded co-workers etc.
I work in a supposedly high level professional job. I monger. No one knows about it with the exception of two other guys who also monger; we swap stories, skills, locations information and the like, indeed we have mongered together and have photographs of each-other mongering (some nude with chicas!). These friendships have been going for the past 22 years since pre-med and we are all happy with ourselves. We remain true to the faith and each other knowing that any breakdown would damage all concerned, especially since one of the gang is married with kids.
In advocating that we be ourselves I’m not suggesting that we walk about with a “sandwich-board” announcing that we are mongers. I’m talking about general behaviour and conduct which includes discretion, confidentiality and trust amongst “men who wish to do as I do”.
In the final analysis its no ones business where anyone goes, what anyone gets up to and indeed if it's paid for or not. I do not believe that we will ever be in a global majority society that is accepting of mongering especially since there is always confusion about prostitution and sex slavery: very well discussed by Sinanju Master:
http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showthread.php?t=1076
This being the case we owe it to ourselves and other mongers to keep the faith.
OT, clearly this issue does not need to be escalated. One of the best “lies” I have told to cover my solo-mongering is just to say that I want to cover as much of the planet as possible before I die. In the same breath I pull out my well thumbed and marked copy of the lonely planets guide to wherever I’m going to be mongering. The coloured marker-tabs and underlining of interesting parts validates the adventurer tourist…. The co-worker soon gets pissed off (or indeed jealous) of me pointing to this or that place and I soon get labelled as the local crazy person who likes to travel… This is a truth simply because when you monger I would guess you also visit at the very least a couple of touristy places on rest periods!….
Regards, Havanaman
Happy Chappy
05-27-06, 09:23
Very well said: I totally agree. Whilst I see the issues involved and eloquently discussed here, I must add that it is purely a personal thing dependent on ones job, environment, like-minded co-workers etc.
I work in a supposedly high level professional job. I monger. No one knows about it with the exception of two other guys who also monger; we swap stories, skills, locations information and the like, indeed we have mongered together and have photographs of each-other mongering (some nude with chicas!). These friendships have been going for the past 22 years since pre-med and we are all happy with ourselves. We remain true to the faith and each other knowing that any breakdown would damage all concerned, especially since one of the gang is married with kids.
In advocating that we be ourselves I’m not suggesting that we walk about with a “sandwich-board” announcing that we are mongers. I’m talking about general behaviour and conduct which includes discretion, confidentiality and trust amongst “men who wish to do as I do”.
In the final analysis its no ones business where anyone goes, what anyone gets up to and indeed if it's paid for or not. I do not believe that we will ever be in a global majority society that is accepting of mongering especially since there is always confusion about prostitution and sex slavery: very well discussed by Sinanju Master:
http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showthread.php?t=1076
This being the case we owe it to ourselves and other mongers to keep the faith.
OT, clearly this issue does not need to be escalated. One of the best “lies” I have told to cover my solo-mongering is just to say that I want to cover as much of the planet as possible before I die. In the same breath I pull out my well thumbed and marked copy of the lonely planets guide to wherever I’m going to be mongering. The coloured marker-tabs and underlining of interesting parts validates the adventurer tourist…. The co-worker soon gets pissed off (or indeed jealous) of me pointing to this or that place and I soon get labelled as the local crazy person who likes to travel… This is a truth simply because when you monger I would guess you also visit at the very least a couple of touristy places on rest periods!….
Regards, HavanamanThat last paragraph is a good point Havanaman. I have used that one too, and it is quite plausible since my overseas travel does not appear to be related to mongering when you look at it over a longer time frame and all the variety of places I visited. Just that 2 consecutive Thailand trips seemed to at least raise the eyebrows of some. However my next trip will be somewhere different altogether again, so I will at the very least go with the "cover as many places on the planet before I die" comment.
One thing that concerns me with lying about where I am going, even though it would be highly unlikely, is someone somehow finding out where I really went. For example imagine if my last trip I told people I am going on a holiday within Australia, then someone , maybe an industry colleague or client or whoever, spots me in Thailand. How bad does that look, i.e. if I lie about where I am going and will not tell people I am going to Thailand, obviously I am doing something involving prostitution or god knows what. That would be the assumption and be even worse I think..
limiting monger talk to only those who also partake is the prudent thing to do.
those who have jobs that are male dominated are at less risk from discussing the hobby than those who have jobs like mine. i am in education now, which is female dominated. i have a colleague who talks of his mongering exploits with "the guys". i think he is foolish to do so. i limit my monger talk to anonymous forums.
still, there remains risk when discussing non-anonymous mongering even only with other mongerers. when looking for ****hopiles, le does exactly that. they become friends with a suspected **** and then encourage him to talk about his exploits.
clearly we all live in different circumstances. we need to evaluate the risk inherent in our particular circumstance and then decide on the appropriate level of disclosure.
mine is none! your mileage may vary!
Speaking of Phillippines, I met a filipina in a local disco in Chicago recently. Nice good looking girl with a killer body. She has been in the USA for 9 years and is aapparently a successful real estate agent. As it turned out, she lived about 45 miles from my area. Next day we talked on the phone and were discussing where to meet. She only wanted to meet around her area. She told me that she has dated couple guys from my area and they would drive to her house, pick her up, drive back to Chicago for dinner, drop her back to her house and then drive back home ! Needless to say that I refused. I told her that I was in Manilla and literally thousands of pretty girls were game. She did not say a word. But I was amazed that there are so many "pussy starved" guys in this country who would go virtually any length to get women from opening car door to licking her feet to get a kick in the ass. USA for women must be what Thailand, Phillippines, China, EE, Brazil etc for us mongers. USA is a pussy hell.
Chocha Monger
05-28-06, 23:02
USA for women must be what Thailand, Phillippines, China, EE, Brazil etc for us mongers. USA is a pussy hell.
Badboy,
You summed up the situation very accurately and concisely. It's good to see that there are a few guys left who are not desparate to the point of being a door mat. I bet the look on her face was priceless when she realized that you knew the way things are in her homeland!
I've seen this many times, foreign women arrive in the US and soon adapt the ways of AW. I guess that they realize the market value of bearded tuna is much higher here and hence try to get as much out of it as they can. Some of these women get so drunk with their new pussy powers that they become even worst than the natives.
Sinanju Master
05-29-06, 01:03
One thing that concerns me with lying about where I am going, even though it would be highly unlikely, is someone somehow finding out where I really went. For example imagine if my last trip I told people I am going on a holiday within Australia, then someone , maybe an industry colleague or client or whoever, spots me in Thailand. How bad does that look, i.e. if I lie about where I am going and will not tell people I am going to Thailand, obviously I am doing something involving prostitution or god knows what. That would be the assumption and be even worse I think..
Dude, where you go on vacation and what you do (within legal means) is none of your colleagues' god-damn business. IF someone circulates bad karma about you, it's because it's either a GUY thinking: "Man, I wish I was doing what that rat bastard is doing" (jealousy), or a WOMAN thinking: "I HATE that bastard because I don't have the power to reject him and quash his ego since he knows what time it is" (spite). Besides, a while back, I went to ANOTHER country in ADDITION to the country where I went on vacation to. The other country I went to (for a week) is where I hooked up with a honey. In that week on my side trip, the ONLY time we left the bed was to get something to eat.
DJ FourMoney
05-31-06, 09:12
DJFourMoney:
Do you think that we preach about the pitfalls of becoming involved with American and Americanized women because we have nothing better to do? It seems that all of the warnings and admonishments are futile; guys keep repeating the same behavior that gets them burned.
Let us see, this Hungarian woman lived in the United States for 6 years but you thought that she was “totally unaffected by the typical thinking of American women”. DJ, if you really believed that, I have a nice lobster farm in Central Georgia that I would like to sell you. Don’t worry, I’ll give you a good price and all of the lobsters have been de-clawed to spare you those nasty pinches.
So here you go, smitten with this totally Un-Americanized immigrant who has been residing in the US for 6 years; you cancel your mongering trip to Europe while this self professed visa hunter puts you on hold to finish securing a permanent green card from her sponsor; you dine on her [CodeWord140] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord140) flaps for a half hour and then she tells your efforts didn’t have the slightest effect upon her. Then she tells you that you can be friends. Well, DJ pardon my honesty, but that sounds terribly American to me. You got played in a really bad way.
I remember that my last words to you regarding this woman were to “fuck and flee”. Instead, you chose to be Mr. Nice Guy and you finished last. Is that any surprise? How were you going to excite her when you did what every other sucker does by trying very hard to please her? You were too nice and sensitive making excuses for your performance; wasting your time licking her [CodeWord140] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord140) hole. What you should have done was cut your 10 minute master stroke to a vicious 5 minute beast fuck, preferably anal, then after blowing your load suddenly remember a prior engagement; pull up your pants and rush out the door. I guarantee that you would have had quite an effect on her and left her with more of an impression than submissively licking her **** for a half hour.
Perhaps, you think that the regulars in this thread are a little too radical for your liking. Maybe, deep down inside you believe that we’re just a bunch of bitter bastards; that is perfectly okay but do yourself a favor and visit the Medellin section on the Colombia thread. You will find that guys who don’t post here also have some very revealing views and experiences with foreign women who end up in the United States.
Bitter? Never....
I take heed, I learn the hard way...
I have read some of the rants about Columbian women that have ended up in the US and dispatched their husbands.
Without getting into the what seems like (in many cases) a case of May-Dec relationships gone arye, I'd still say its a pretty small number of women that get tainted like that.
Said German lady also has 3 kids from the same relationship and always had to tell me how bad her kids were on a regular basis, especially when she's on the phone.
All is not lost however, Europe still beckons and I will make my appearance in late Sept or Oct or if I don't mind the cold weather, maybe later than that.
I will not make the same mistake twice.
Sorry DJ but never ever change your plans for some hoe.I've learned once you do that you show weakness and the ability to be manipulated.You had this whole trip to europe planned and you threw it away because some skank gave you a wink.It would have shown more intrest on her part if she attempted to fit into your schedule thats when you know you have something meaningful.
I guess you really want to go to europe but have you researched other options? You could go this month to buenos aires spend less and get more.The mix of women in BA is very similar to europe.
Artisttyp
Chocha Monger
05-31-06, 18:26
Tom Philpott | May 26, 2006
Senators Vote to End Ex-Spouse Law's '10-Year Rule'
The Senate Armed Services Committee has voted to end the "10-year rule" used by the government for more than two decades to screen court orders seeking automatic payment of retired pay to former military spouses.
The change is one of three adjustments to the Uniformed Services Former Spouses Protection Act (USFSPA) in the Senate’s version of the 2007 defense authorization bill (S 2766). All three are intended to streamline administration of the controversial 1982 law, said Senate staff.
If approved by the full Congress, the changes would be the first made to the military ex-spouse law in 14 years. They would ease how future court orders are handled for former spouses rather than past court orders.
The 10-year rule has required the Defense Finance and Accounting Service (DFAS) to turn away requests for automatic payment of retired pay to ex-spouses unless the couple had been married at least 10 years during which the service member completed 10 years of creditable service.
The rule’s elimination "would solve a lot of problems," said Marsha Warthen, board president of Ex-POSE, a military former spouse support group. "We are contacted regularly by spouses who just missed the 10-year requirement."
The 10-year rule would end 120 days after the bill is signed. Retroactive sharing of benefits based on the change would be prohibited.
Change two in the Senate Bill would direct DFAS to comply with all court requests for making cost-of-living adjustments to ex-spouse shares of retirement. DFAS now applies COLAs only to ex-spouse shares set as a percentage of a retiree’s annuity. COLAs are not applied to ex-spouse shares that courts state in dollar amounts. This change would apply to court orders that take affect 90 days after the bill is enacted.
The third change would end a requirement that DFAS notify retirees and provide them copy when DFAS receives a court order directing division of retired pay. The Senate would shave that paperwork burden by forwarding court orders only to retirees who had told DFAS they want to be notified.
Warthen said future ex-spouses will be most pleased to see the 10-year rule end. When DFAS is barred from assisting with automatic payments, courts order retirees to make payments directly to ex-spouses. But many former spouses can’t "track down" retirees, she said.
"It causes great expense for spouses who have minimal income and minimal leverage to recoup [missed payments] or to go back to court for enforcement. Some of them just give up," said Warthen.
The 10-year rule also has been an irritant to retirees. If DFAS can’t accommodate a court order, it continues to withhold taxes on full annuities, including whatever portion the retiree pays directly to an ex-spouse. This can complicate retiree plans to have ex-spouses share the tax burden.
The 10-year rule also can confuse lawyers, judges, retirees and spouses. The term suggests that retired pay can’t be divided unless a marriage lasts a decade. In fact, the 10-year rule impacts only automatic payments DFAS. As many retirees will attest, divorce court judges can, and do, divide retirement as property for marriages of any length.
Frank W. Ault, executive director of the American Retirees Association, an advocacy group for divorced military retirees, said ARA supports the Senate changes. Indeed, "abolition of the 10-year rule was one of our recommendations," said Ault, referring to a package of legislative changes ARA drafted for Congress to consider last year. No lawmaker could be found to introduce it as legislation, however.
Ault said one ARA concern with the 10-year rule has been that without DFAS handling all court orders to divide retired pay, "we never really have known what the [USFSPA] population is out there. It’s an advantage for us to know that" in pushing Congress to make more substantive changes.
DFAS says it now divides with ex-spouses the retired pay of 82,887 military retirees. That number includes 4,046 court orders received in 2005 that satisfied the 10-year rule.
The House and Senate continue to approach the USFSPA with caution, avoiding changes perceived as tipping the law in favor of either retirees or of ex-spouses. The rationale for the Senate bill changes are taken from a comprehensive review of USFSPA that Defense officials completed in 2001.
The committee’s own report mimics the DoD study in finding "overwhelming justification" for abolishing the 10-year rule. It notes that no other known retirement system or plan carries such a restriction. It says repeal would prevent courts, lawyers, retirees and spouses "from mistakenly interpreting this rule as a prerequisite to allocation of retired pay."
Still not addressed by Congress, said Ault, "are the major problems that military people have" with the USFSPA. "They still resent having their pay called 'property.' They still resent giving it to a spouse for life for a marriage of minutes. They still would like to get rid of the windfall benefit," a reference to courts dividing retired pay without taking into account the affect of promotions and pay raises earned after the marriage dissolved.
And a growing number of service members, said Ault, resent court orders that force them to share retired pay before they actually retire. Both the House and Senate again this year have ignored a Defense Department request to ban court orders that involve such “imputation of retired pay."
"The [Senate] changes are constructive," Ault said, "but far below what’s needed to get this law on track."
Doctor_Skank
05-31-06, 18:37
Heard on the radio today that their is a motion in British parliament to create laws regarding the financial aspects of common law marriages, which would essentially create the same kind of alimony payment rules associated with divorce in those cases were common law marriages fail.
This essentially would mean that if you lived with a women for more than a few years, but were not married, and then split up, you would have to pay her a part of your earnings as compensation for your time together.
I have no details as I only heard it on the radio, and am not sure if it has any chance of passing parliament into law, but it is yet another sign that men are being enslaved. Soon women will wonder why no one wants to marry any more or enter into any commiting relationship.
Doctor_Skank
05-31-06, 20:24
And here more proof that the world has gone insane.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060531/ap_on_fe_st/matchmaker_lawsuit
DJ FourMoney
06-01-06, 07:54
Sorry DJ but never ever change your plans for some hoe.I've learned once you do that you show weakness and the ability to be manipulated.You had this whole trip to europe planned and you threw it away because some skank gave you a wink.It would have shown more intrest on her part if she attempted to fit into your schedule thats when you know you have something meaningful.
I guess you really want to go to europe but have you researched other options? You could go this month to buenos aires spend less and get more.The mix of women in BA is very similar to europe.
Artisttyp
I have -
I was looking at doing BsA and Sau Paulo at first. Problem with that is the language barrier, especially in SP where seems only some business owners people that have spent time in the US and college students know any english.
I have talked to Sama Guide many times, but felt even though he personally thought I wouldn't have a problem pulling non-pro talent, I just wasn't up to learning any Portuguese when I considering where I live would get more out of learning Spanish and I wasn't down for that either.
I also wasn't really diggin the idea of it being a pure mongering trip...
I contacted a few "brothas" that have been to BsA, all reported excellent times from the mongering point of view but hardly any information on the non-pro side of things.
I'll be going there, maybe early next year. Its fairly cheap any time of year, but I still need a visa to visit Brasil.
Europe offers a few more options and I do have a friend or two over there, which allows me to save some money and spent it elsewhere.
My mission purely depends on how much availalble income I have to take with me (to monger). So I'm mainly focusing on non-pro talent because we can communicate online or by Skype. I have changed my approach a bit in this area as I want to be flexible to do what I want. I'll get some mongering in because I do want to see some of the clubs talked about in the Germany forums and maybe even hit Prague, tho I understand that can cause some communication issues as well.
I just wanted to have a good time and I just feel I'll have a better first time abroad in Europe.
> I am fresh back today from 10 days in Argentina. Today I am very sad and almost in tears.
I can totally relate. Chicago is a hell inside another hell when it comes to women. Everytime I am flying back to O'hare, I wonder why in the world am I going back there. Atleast 50% of the women in this city must be overweight to put it mildly and can be outright ignored. And those 10-15% of the good looking available women need everything you have got and THEN she may reward you with tuna some day.
First these women are more interested in their career, their friends and dogs than men. Period. You can see a gorgeous girl picking after her dog in broad day light but don't ever expect her to do anything for you. If she did give you a card on your birthday, she is expecting nothing less than diamond-n-pearls on her birthday. Secondly, they are totally accustomed to men doing every single thing for them. They take it for granted and they easily get it in Chicago. I recently went out with a pretty Ukrainian girl who is a mortgage broker. Same story - she married a rich guy and then ofcourse divorced once she was here. She was exclaiming how easy it was to make money for her in the mortgage industry and how men love fat women here and have kids with them. She dates with as many men as the time permits and makes a lot of money in the mortgage industry (you don't need a degree for that).
Luckily, I get the opportunities to go to Asia and Europe several times a year and I know the difference. Most men are born in Illinois, live in Illnois and die in Illinois so they would never know. If you tell this to AWs (and their husbands too) they will paint you as a loser who couldn't get hold of an AW and has to resort to foreign women. Some may even tell you that you need God. Funny.
Marak & Badboy,
I'm a Chicago guy too and have had identical observations. I monger in Eastern Europe and landing at O'Hare is about as bad as it gets. Just walking through the airport and looking at all of those fat, ugly women with attitudes is a major downer. I have also found Milwaukee to be much worse than Chicago - if such a thing is possible.
I wish that we had a forum on the ISG dealing with immigration to foreign countries for punters. There is a website called escapeartistcom that I have looked at. It's a good website and has a lot of information on specific countries dealing with visas, real estate, getting a drivers license there, etc.
You know, once you go abroad to meet women, you spend much of your time here in the states wishing you were someplace else. It's a strange way to proceed through life it seems.
Paddy
I'm sure you guys know that I'm from that area also....gotta say from experience that there is nothing like growing up as a hot girl in a little nothing shit midwestern community (small, homogenous and highly hierarchal) to cause a belief that the world revolves around their pussies (then they move to Chicago taking the attitude with them). Say what you will about New York haughty,, but at least living there you have to be aware that there is a world outside the cornfields that surround you.
Regarding "needing God", I was last week, during a bus ride, subjected to a conversion attempt by a fundamentalist pastor.....I just kept smiling and nodding, and laughing inside as this guy thought he was just speaking to a "lost" young man, unmarried and childless at 35 (this drew some derisive looks-talk about the tip of the iceberg)......in reality, I am probably the closest thing to a full blown HIERATIC that he has ever encountered in real life.
B9k
Also notice how every dating site has a banner displaying a stunning chick (not guy) looking for her soulmate. This clearly says that the marketing department has done their DD. They know who the target audience is. There are a lot of men roaming this country with their pp in the hand. Talking to polish, russian, asian immigrant women is an eye opener. They feel like a kid in the toy store when they come to the USA. You can find them on any personals site. Just search on languages (polish, Japanese, russian etc). There are a lot of EE girls working as mortgage-reale-state brokers in Chicago. Much easier and rewarding but dont expect anything even close to Asia Europe or latin America. They know what they are worth here. With the coming crash of the real-estate market, hopefully the tuna market will improve. Currently, almost all EE women I dated drive brand new cars, live in their own house-condos and have plenty of money to spend.
Chocha Monger
06-04-06, 19:36
This is what an AW expects when dating: http://msn.match.com/msn/article.aspx?articleid=6056&TrackingID=516311&BannerID=544657&menuid=6>1=8233
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