FKK World - Giessen [Archive] - Page 11

Tommylove

12-01-08, 03:08

hey guys, just thought i’d provide a trip report about my current fkk holiday.

i flew into frankfurt, and landed about 9:30 am local time. i was surprised to find that germany no longer requires landing cards for passengers arriving from the united states. as a result, clearing customs and immigration was a breeze, and in a little over 30 minutes, i managed to rent a car from sixt and was happily driving on the autobahn to fkk world. i arrived a bit before before opening time – there were only two cars in the guest lot, and i watched some of the girls showing up for work while fussing with my gps. these girls, who look so hot inside. look so pedestrian in their street clothes, don’t they? it’s pretty stunning, to watch them go from demure college girl in jeans and sneakers, to sexpot clad only in waistchain and six inch stripper heels.

naturally, it was quiet when i finally entered, maybe a dozen girls eating breakfast and still looked pretty sleepy, barely able to invoke the come hither look. since i hadn’t slept on the redeye flight over the atlantic, i needed to catch an hour of sleep before partying. there’s this dark and quiet lounge downstairs, where men usually spend their refractory time between ejaculations. unfortunately, i couldn’t sleep a wink. why? because every few minutes, clack clack clack go the stripper heels, heading toward me. "hi, you wanna fuck me? " "i’m jetlagged.come back later, okay? " "okay baby. " clack clack clack, as she waddles away. and before i could close my eyes, i hear the clack clack clack of a different pair of stripper heels. "hey schätzen, you want a blowjob? " i was shoo’ing them away as fast as i could. it was a hopeless battle, since the gesture of covering my eyes did not deter these women from cheerfully checking to see if i might be willing to serve as their first victory of the day. i sighed as another one, from bulgaria, walks away, threatening to come back in exactly one hour.

just as i close my eyes, a whole flock of hotties walk over with a flurry of clacking. i open my eyes to find three very sexy, young smiling brazlians with really stunning "bunda". (that’s portuguese for "ass"). all three of these gals share a flat in barcelona, and work the fkks together. the pick of the litter was mirali (sp), a smashing brunette with the face of penelope cruz and the body of jessica rabbit. schwing! the other two were pretty sweet, but this one was simply amazing. especially her ass and her gorgeous face, which i kid you not, looks just like ms. cruz in her heydey. not an ounce of fat either, and a perfect tan to boot. plus, she was pretty clever. she’s the first to propose that if i really wanted to recover from jetlag, a nice orgasm would help me sleep. when she started giving me the blowjob of the century, while i was lying on the sofa trying to sleep. what else could i do? her tongue is amazing, so i give in, and decide to go with the flow and enjoy her as the appetizer of the day.

what a tongue. mirali is a great kisser, responsive to daty, and a spectacular blowjob that felt just innocent enough to make her seem like a girlfriend and not a *****. unfortunately, her breasts turned out to be aftermarket additions, dropping her from a 10 to a 9, but everything else was just perfecto. after the blow, we enjoy a menu of multiposition intercourse, with a healthy portion of doggy style. i mean. killer doggy. finally, back in mish because i wanted cum looking at penelope cruz’s face. and then she says, "i know it costs more, but you reeeeeeeeeeally should try it. cum in my mouth. " man, what could i do but give in? my instinct to preserve 50 euros, the cost of cim, overcame my deep male instinct to nod my head whenever a ddg hottie asks, "you wanna cum in my mouth? " anyway, i was glad i did because the orgasm she produced was spectacular. her main trick: her mouth pressure eases off as you approach the final peak, and then provides the optimal light pressure to insure a mindblowing orgasm. nothing as satisfying as feeling her accepting that first burst of my semen in her mouth. and after the primary spasms are complete, she follows with a few seconds of stillness, and then like a diabolical milking machine, more soft stimulation to eek out another spasm. she timed her mouth perfectly to allow for several such milkings. rest, then milk. rest, then milk. and then finally. she swallowed. you have to remember, i started saving up my spunk for the fkks over a week ago. i had a major load to unload in her mouth. and like a champ, she took it all with a smile. [score: face 10, body 9, sex 10, attitude 10].

afterwards, we do a little chitchat, just enough so she shows me she cares, and then i say, "babe, better get back to making money huh? " she smiles. as she walks me to the payment station, where wallets are held in personal mini-lockers. (one key fits both this locker, and the clothes locker in the dressing room downstairs. wow, the miracle of german engineering, and in this case, in the design of a brothel.) after i kiss her goodbye and say obrigada – that’s portuguese for thank you, a new arrival walks in from the dressing room and shouts, "hooza! " at the site of her perfect ass. you have to understand, no guy at an fkk takes the first girl he sees, unless she is pretty fucking incredible. and mirali is that fucking incredible. she winks at me and walks off with the guy.

after this great start to the day, i booked a 30 minute therapeutic massage, and moved over to the swimming pool lounge area, where i thought i might get a bit more quiet. after the massage (30 euros for 30 minutes) and then a shower to remove the oil, i jumped into the jacuzzi. afterwards, armed with the endorphins of orgasm, hot water and massage, i was able to fall asleep on a deck chair by the swimming pool for about an hour, just long enough to reset my brain and feel fresh again. when i woke, i was a bit disoriented, but realized that i wasn’t dreaming. i really was at an fkk. i pop into the sauna, followed by a cold plunge into the swimming pool, then the sauna again, then another cold plunge. then i go upstairs, have a cappuchino to fully recharte, and gird my loins for the night to come.

okay, before getting down to the details of the rest of the day, let’s talk about interior decorating. no, silly, i’m not going gay. they remodeled the main room, and i wanted to describe the changes. first, the bar on the side of the main room, was now a circular bar in the middle. they broke up the big pole dancing stage in the middle, into four smaller pole stations just outside the bar circumference, with mini-stage lights above them. they also created a number of semi-private areas against the walls, using an international motif – a bamboo asian tea house, a morrocan retreat, and new york city complete with an eight foot statue of liberty. the girls tend to sit on the barstools, and shake their butts at the guys lounging on the sofas at the perimeter of the room.

it’s about 5:30 now, and i count maybe a handful of 10s, including two of the brazilians, in the crowd. mirali comes by every so often to give me a kiss. i predict she’s going to be millionaire someday, because she absolutely understands the tenets of great customer service. anyway, all the girls here are all fuckable, basically forming a collections of 8s and 9s. i only see 2-3 women with any cellulite or stomach flab, to offset the aforementioned 10s. no 6s or 7s in the lot. it’s like going to hardbody heaven. anyway, after 30 minutes of window shopping in the main room, i run into eva from serbia. last time i was here, we had a two hour fuckathon, which ended with my throatfucking her and experiencing the production of throat yogurt. she doesn’t recognize me, but she’s still absolutely gorgeous. (in fact, she looks a bit like the new ukranian bond girl, olga kurylenko. see pix below). eva looks like a mix between olga and catherine zeta jones, with perfect natural tits and everything else about her is wonderful. however, something has happened in the year since she got here. the bloom is off the rose.

nevertheless, i hook up with her for old time’s sake and we go into the movie room and lay out our towels. the fkk provides special, long towels that are easier to wrap around. on the bed, they form perfect surfaces for us to cuddle. after kissing a bit, she gives me an exquisite blowjob. but one that feels like she’s been working diligently at improving her blowjob skills. it’s wonderful, but you can feel the subtle shift from actual girlfriend to gfe. the enthusiasm is just ever so slightly artificial. after the bbbj starter, which she calls *blausen* since we’re speaking a mixture of german and english, we fuck for a while, and as we close in on our 30 minutes, i suggest cim because i ain’t cumming anytime soon with a condom on. she smiles, and expertly drains my cock. sheer heaven actually. [score: face 10, body 10, sex 10, attitude 9].

afterward, i do the spa thing again, and refresh myself. even though the energy of the main room has picked up, girls seem to realize that i’m sated now. so watch the czech porno for a while, that they pump to all the flat screens. i notice that there is a lot of erotic art here, including this pair of great cocktail tables that use naked female figures to hold the glass of the table. and i have dinner, which is barely edible, of pork and mashed potatoes. i try a little of the pork, but mainly load up on german salads. everything here is fattening, i can see why the men here are so fat! fat and happy!

after dinner, i’m looking for a blonde, having had a couple of brunettes already. also, fully sated on ejaculating, i’m looking for a tantric hookup, to practice tantra (non-ejaculatory sex). i then notice that there’s a doppelganger for this blonde yoga teacher from palo alto i bang on the side. exact same haircut and body type. i’m here for variety, so i pass on this fuckbuddy clone. she’s nice, but darn, she must be in her early thirties, making her second string talent here. finally, i run into a perfect cheerleader type, alicia from hungary. she’s early 20s, very fit, and athletic. we go to a room and do our thing. great blow, but not as refined as eva or enthusiastic as mirali. but she’s bouncy and cheerful, and we fuck for the entire period allotted. this gives me an opportunity to do tantra. not really caring about ejaculation, and just feeling the flow of energy. i don’t cum with this one, and sex becomes a meditation. after our time is up, i thank her and go back into the main room. and for the first time, i’m feeling the energy of the room. so i settle into a cozy sofa and meditate, absorbing the delicious sexual energy in the room, of which i am now aware. it’s subtle and i’m in a state of bliss. the experience i’m having is one of absolute sexual abundance. a-bunda-dance. i allow this feeling of sexual prosperity to permeate my being, and it begins to deepen.

suddenly, eva comes back up to me. "now, i recognize you! from last year, in the room with the tent. right? " i nod, she remembered me! with that, she plops down beside me and we cuddle. she tells me it was the best sex ever! and that she never forgot me, but the light in the movie room was so dark she couldn’t recognize me. she kisses me like a girlfriend and we just cuddle there. for an hour. i tell her that i’m done for the night, and she says she doesn’t care about the money. i mean, it was just like reconnecting with a real girlfriend. bliss on a stick, man, sheer bliss. that 9 just became a 10. plus, the sense of sexual abundance deepened into a sense of emotional completeness and acceptance as well. just cuddling with this gorgeous angel, surrounded by the energy of sexual abandon, it was simply amazing. but i’m tired and i have to go. on the way out, i ask eva to accompany me, and as i am leaving for the dressing room. i tip her 20 euros, and hand her a business card for my filmmaking business. i tell her that if she ever comes to america, i will not only put her in a movie. i’ll marry her. i give her my best cement mixer grin, a 150 watt burst of love energy. she smiles, promises to stay in contact, and kisses me and then i’m on my way. after dressing, and just outside the door, i notice a hot blonde wearing glasses arriving. i ask her name, and she smiles, "julie". so i watch her for a second as she walks away, registering her into my consciousness, and locking her into my memory for next time. just as she opens the door, she turns around and sends me a killer smile. yeah, registered.

walking toward the car, i look up and see a bright full moon. no wonder i'm so horny, a full moon! awooooo!

with that, i’m done with fkk world. and tomorrow, i’m heading to fkk oase!

editor's note: i would suggest that the author or another forum member consider posting a link to this report in the reports of distinction thread. please click here (http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?) for more information.

Akibono

12-04-08, 02:17

You're a cruel man, Aki. I love it though.

BTW, how is your favorite World girl? Have not seen her since she had her heart broken by a mutual friend of ours.

Cheers,

Dedalus

Went with her the last time I was there. The session was just not that passionate this time. Seems like her mind was preoccupied, or she was trying to avoid an emotional attachment. Then she has an orgasm and reacted rather strangely. I think she said: "why do I always have to come first?" Because I'm a gentleman--that's why. It seemed rather abrupt. Then she asked if I took something. Of course--do you really think I could perform at that level without some enhancement drug. I hope she does not become too cynical. One of her charms is her honest demeanor. Still, it's never a bad session.

Dedalus

12-09-08, 13:55

Went with her the last time I was there. The session was just not that passionate this time. Seems like her mind was preoccupied, or she was trying to avoid an emotional attachment. Then she has an orgasm and reacted rather strangely. I think she said: "why do I always have to come first?" Because I'm a gentleman--that's why. It seemed rather abrupt. Then she asked if I took something. Of course--do you really think I could perform at that level without some enhancement drug. I hope she does not become too cynical. One of her charms is her honest demeanor. Still, it's never a bad session.

Hey Aki,

Word is that she is up at GT these days. I think that she is working under the name Anna there.

Cheers,

Dedalus

Basketcase

12-09-08, 21:21

Word is that she is up at GT these days. I think that she is working under the name Anna there.

Hey Dedalus and Akibono,

Is that Anna (Germany)? Blonde, fairly tall (well the heels help), B cups, quite fun to spend time with in and out of the room? Yes, she is at GT but I have not seen her of late - we keep missing each other. Moreso now as GT is off the weekly trip list until Spring 2009 as I cannot stand the smoke, the gay club like atmosphere when busy in the weekends when I go and the inside is small giving a feeling of claustophobia. I do miss hanging out with the ijsberen and the food and the non alcoholic drinks and the loud techno music.

Cheers,

Londonbasketcase

Dedalus

12-09-08, 23:03

Hey Dedalus and Akibono,

Is that Anna (Germany)? Blonde, fairly tall (well the heels help), B cups, quite fun to spend time with in and out of the room?
Cheers,

Londonbasketcase

Nope. Different girl. Thin, dark haired Romanian with glasses. Used the name Emma at World. Nothing at all wrong with the gal looks-wise, but not what most guys would refer to as a stunner. Very good session! She has a lot of fans and regulars.

Cheers,

Dedalus

Akibono

12-10-08, 02:52

EEEVVAA this is WALL-e.

Vito Corleone

12-12-08, 05:12

Hooked up with 5 of my Capos & headed to World. I was really looking forward to seeing Lilly again. Arrived around 4:30pm & received my Nicolas chocolate gift & a 5e off discount card.

Checked the place out & noticed the lineup was not getting me excited. A really hot looking Romanian was the only thing around for close to 2 hrs, but I only wanted to do her as a last resort. Had dead fish written all over her.

It was clear Lilly was not around & pickings were quite slim. This was my 10th day in a row of FKKing all day & night so I was being a little picky. I was thinking I should have gone to Palace or the party @ Oase.

I was shooting the shit with my Capos when I noticed a hot babe walking towards the womens showers. Bolted after her & asked her name.

Andrea - German, light brown hair, 5'6 B's, hot bod with a very very very pretty face. Looks like porn star Jenna haze. LFK decent BJ & above average session. Not earth shattering, but worth a try.

Looked around again & did not see much. After 10 days of FKK, my legs were really sore so I decided to go to my locker & get my cell to set my alarm so I could recharge my batteries by the pool. A couple of lookers from mine, an out of this world off the hook babe was dressing. One look @ her gorgeous face & I got my mojo working again. I could feel the juices rushing to my balls as I stood there in awe of her beauty.

Zarina - Ukranian, Blonde, petite, 5'1, B's drop dead gorgeous. DFK like there was no tomorrow & we just seemed to click. 8 hours total. That should explain everything. I remember the mistake I made with Lilly back in August when after 3-4 hrs I let her go thinking I would see her again later. Of course she was busy & I knew after 4 off the hook hours with Zarina, she would be unavailable too. I saw the attention she received when she walked through the place & I figure she would be busy until closing so I made an offer she couldn't refuse.

After 4 hours, we were hungry & needed a shower. I said after we shower & eat, I want you until closing. She thought I was crazy, but was more than happy to agree. Paid for the 4 hrs & offered to pay for the next 4 1/2 upfront, but she said after is fine & that I did not have to pay the 30 minute break. I guess I got the bulk rate discount.

Zarina is one of my top 5 favorites & I would have spent more time with her if the place stayed open past 5am. Not sure what the rest of the lineup looked like as I spent all the time in the room. I noticed a bunch of hot women arrived late between 7-9pm.

Dedalus

12-12-08, 12:47

Vito Corleone

12-13-08, 07:29

There is a new Romanian named Simone. Blond, 20, very nice natural C-cups and just about as sweet as can be. A real looker!

She is a little inexperienced (she has only been working 1 week and 3 days, but she did quite well in the room and is worth checking out next time you are there.

Dedalus
Wassup Deda,

I think Simone was the hot Romanian I mentioned in my report. Hot looking babe with C's sounds right. I was going to session with her until I saw Andrea & Zarina. If you see Zarina, tell her her Husband from ***** says hello.

I do not think you even liked Danaya until her boob job. Correct?

Dedalus

12-13-08, 11:11

Wassup Deda,

I think Simone was the hot Romanian I mentioned in my report. Hot looking babe with C's sounds right.

I do not think you even liked Danaya until her boob job. Correct?

Hello Don Vito,

Yeah, you probably saw Simone. Really adorable young lady!

I did do my first session with Danaya post enhancement, but I have always thought she was attractive. However you use to come off a little cold to me.

Cheers,

Dedalus

Fkk Lover

12-13-08, 20:50

However you use to come off a little cold to me.

Deda, you had a session with Don Vito? Who knew?

Not that there's anything wrong with that ;-)

Dedalus

12-14-08, 04:56

Deda, you had a session with Don Vito? Who knew?

Not that there's anything wrong with that ;-)

Note to self:

Self, no more smart phone typing after a long night at Oase doing what FKK Lover wishes he could be doing more often ;-)))

BTW, Sophia says hi.

Cheers,

Dedalus, who knows what Don Vito thinks if "Finocs" and would like to avoid any unfortunate misunderstandings

Basketcase

12-15-08, 22:17

Zarina - Ukranian, Blonde, petite, 5'1, B's drop dead gorgeous. DFK like there was no tomorrow & we just seemed to click. 8 hours total. That should explain everything. I remember the mistake I made with Lilly back in August when after 3-4 hrs I let her go thinking I would see her again later. Of course she was busy & I knew after 4 off the hook hours with Zarina, she would be unavailable too. I saw the attention she received when she walked through the place & I figure she would be busy until closing so I made an offer she couldn't refuse.

After 4 hours, we were hungry & needed a shower. I said after we shower & eat, I want you until closing. She thought I was crazy, but was more than happy to agree. Paid for the 4 hrs & offered to pay for the next 4 1/2 upfront, but she said after is fine & that I did not have to pay the 30 minute break. I guess I got the bulk rate discount.

Zarina is one of my top 5 favorites & I would have spent more time with her if the place stayed open past 5am. Not sure what the rest of the lineup looked like as I spent all the time in the room. I noticed a bunch of hot women arrived late between 7-9pm.

Hey Vito Corleone,

Zarina (Ukraine) was tapped by me on my last trip. Nice session but a little expensive. I think she was getting ideas. She remembers you well.

Good kisser, boy, she can kiss and do it like she means it. A wet and sloppy suck and passive during sex.

Regards

Londonbasketcase

Bratwurst

12-17-08, 12:26

Here is a Trivia question for you experienced World raiders: on my not so memorable November visit in Pohlheim, I was told from the Oscar winning performer Angel (Portorico), that currently the 3 top acts in World were:

Herself (what a surprise!), a brasilian girl and a Romanian girl. Names she wouldn't tell me, but both were not present when she told me.

It was not her opinion she said, but of the customers and most important of the owner. Any clues?

Sweetjohnusa

12-17-08, 20:44

I was in the 13-12-2008 Xmas Party in the FKK World from about 17:00 'till 02:30 next day.

The whole program was awesome including unlimited food and drinking from the bar and buffet.

There were a lot of girls especially from Romania and Bulgaria.

I had four seasons there with : 1) CARINA the porno GGG Star from Romania, 2) REBECCA from Romania, 3) NINA from Brazil and Russia (she was with another awesome chick with short hair in which i couldn't found spare time to laid with her - is here anyone who knows her name??????), and the amazing, captivating 4) MARINA from Romania which I spent the most time with her (what a great talker, fucker and kisser this lass).

Lord Have Mercy on the FKK World.

Vito Corleone

12-18-08, 09:12

Slaveowner

12-20-08, 07:09

Just came back from my first visit to FKK World. Spent approximately 4 hours there but did something that even surprised myself. Engaging in a monogamous relationship with Bulgarian Juliette for those 4 hours. Well, actually, I can't say it was monogamous on her part, because chances are she prolly blew some bloke between my 2 pops.

Has anyone tried her? She has medium length dark hair, petite with A/B cups and pretty pale skin. Tells me she currently goes to university in Bulgaria studying to be a teacher and is only in Germany during breaks to make some extra money. Boy she sure taught me something.

Her BBBJ techniques are impeccable. I didn't expect FKK girls to kiss on the mouth but Juliette was french kissing me with her tongue in my mouth. Not rushed at all. Even during the second pop which I decided to make it into a 1hr session, I think it went way over 1 hr. Decided to make it into a CIM for a 150EURO session. Well worth the money. I think she BBBJ me for at least 50 mins during that session.

Maybe it's just the idea of doing a college girl turns me on. But normally I consider myself a "sampler" and wouldn't go for the same woman twice. But those 2 sessions with Juliette was truly special. Will plan to go back to the World in a few days and pay Juliette a final visit leaving Germany.

On a side note, I've read about people here managing 7+ pops in 1 FFK visit. How is that possible? 2 pops is about as many as I can manage and usually the second pop requires a 1 hr session to accomplish. And that's with more than 1.2 hour of downtime. It's not about getting a hard-on, I manage an erection just find after some BBBJ, but getting off is the hard part. What is your secret?

EDITOR'S NOTE: I would suggest that the author or another Forum Member consider posting a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please Click Here (http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?) for more information.

Carlojj

12-26-08, 16:11

Mike De H

12-26-08, 19:47

Dedalus

12-26-08, 20:36

Hi All,

I have not had much to report recently with the strength of the Euro. However I may well spend New Year Eve in FKK World. Something I have never done.

However, I would like to know what the NY party is like.

I did do a RTFF but last year had no reports.

Any pointers as to price and likely quality of Women? I did check www.fkk-world.de but the info is limited not even an entry fee as far as I could see.

Hey Mikey,

You would be in for a disappointment on New Year's Eve, since World is closed on the 31st. They are open on the 1st starting at 5 PM. Probably will be a slow day but pretty relaxing and a dude could be in for a treat if he makes the right love connection.

In fact, if you want to meet up on the 1st, then I might be game.

Cheers,

Dedalus

Dedalus

12-26-08, 20:45

On a side note, I've read about people here managing 7+ pops in 1 FFK visit. How is that possible? 2 pops is about as many as I can manage and usually the second pop requires a 1 hr session to accomplish. And that's with more than 1.2 hour of downtime. It's not about getting a hard-on, I manage an erection just find after some BBBJ, but getting off is the hard part. What is your secret?

For what it's worth, when a guy brags about seven sessions in one visit, that doesn't necessarily mean seven pops. Maybe if I were just getting released from prison, returning from a month-long Vatican vacation, or a couple of weeks in the deep south, then who knows how much semen back-up one has built up.

For the record, three is the average for me. Occasionally four, and on a few rare occasions I've popped a 5er.

Odd user-name, but to each his own.

Cheers,

Dedalus

Henio

12-27-08, 01:41

...Tells me she currently goes to university in Bulgaria studying to be a teacher and is only in Germany during breaks to make some extra money.... That much be a long distance program since Julia has been working at World every single time I have been there in the last 6-8 months or so :-) Those I know that have gone with her give her good remarks although I have not tested myself.

Dedalus

12-27-08, 17:46

Those I know that have gone with her give her good remarks although I have not tested myself.

What a shocker! ;-)))

I get confused easily. I know the Julia who is the tall, dark haired Bulgarian who looks like she is straight out of the gypsy camp, and can be a decent session. The one described here is vaguely ringing a bell, but I am coming up short.

Cheers,

Dedalus, who gets shagged so dog blind by the Bulgarian duo of Lara and Lucy that it is a wonder he can still see at all

Beffen1

12-27-08, 18:36

That much be a long distance program since Julia has been working at World every single time I have been there in the last 6-8 months or so :-) Those I know that have gone with her give her good remarks although I have not tested myself.

Hi Henio and ddedalus-

Slaveowner speaks of Juliette (pronounced Julietta), the pale skinned curvey "Kindergarten teacher" . I've had the pleasure-she is a voracious and very wet kisser and BBBJ artist- tireless affectionate and ultraenthusiastic in both departments. Total GFE.

Julia, the tall, very thin - tanned tiny titties temptress is a bit more of an operator in the room, with a few restrictions and a rathey toothy BJ, been there and done that too. More of a PSE, not that there's anything wrong with that. She got legs......

Dedalus

12-27-08, 19:44

Hi Henio and ddedalus-

Slaveowner speaks of Juliette (pronounced Julietta), the pale skinned curvey "Kindergarten teacher" . I've had the pleasure-she is a voracious and very wet kisser and BBBJ artist- tireless affectionate and ultraenthusiastic in both departments. Total GFE.

Hey Beff,

Hope you are enjoying the holiday season.

Figures that you would go for the teacher. As the late Rodney Dangerfield said, "I like teachers. If you do something wrong they make you do it over again." Still can't seem to place her in my mind's eye.

Julia, the tall, very thin - tanned tiny titties temptress is a bit more of an operator in the room, with a few restrictions and a rathey toothy BJ, been there and done that too. More of a PSE, not that there's anything wrong with that. She got legs......

She ain't the best filly on the farm, but I have to admit that she has provided me with a few good times in the past. And you are right. She do have some serious legs!!!

Cheers,

Dedalus

Henio

12-28-08, 03:58

What a shocker! ;-)))

I get confused easily. I know the Julia who is the tall, dark haired Bulgarian who looks like she is straight out of the gypsy camp, and can be a decent session. The one described here is vaguely ringing a bell, but I am coming up short.

Cheers,

Dedalus, who gets shagged dog blind by the Bulgarian duo of Lara and Lucy that it is a wonder he can still see at all I was talking about the gypsy looking one, and it was indeed you and Beffen I was refering to when I said she had gotten good remarks. I guess I should have said decent remarks though.

Dedalus

12-28-08, 04:42

I was talking about the gypsy looking one, and it was indeed you and Beffen I was refering to when I said she had gotten good remarks. I guess I should have said decent remarks though.

Hey Man,

Hope that you are enjoying the holiday break!

She's not anywhere near Lara's or Lucy's league, and she can be a little sharky, but she can look pretty hot and although I doubt that you would like her room technique, I do groove on those legs of hers.

Cheers,

Dedalus

Vito Corleone

12-28-08, 06:59

On a side note, I've read about people here managing 7+ pops in 1 FFK visit. How is that possible? 2 pops is about as many as I can manage and usually the second pop requires a 1 hr session to accomplish. And that's with more than 1.2 hour of downtime. It's not about getting a hard-on, I manage an erection just find after some BBBJ, but getting off is the hard part. What is your secret?

I think you are getting 7+ pops mixed up with 7+ sessions. I have had more than 10 sessions a couple of times, but only managed around 4-5 eruptions. I average around 4 eruptions a day, but I usually stay around 14 hours until closing so it is not hard to do. Sometimes I will stay with an ATF for several hrs & she just knows how to work it.

The most I had was 6 pops last year @ Oase. It was my first day & 4-5 of my ATF's were present. I was there from 12 noon - 5am (took a sport nap around midnight). No big secret other than time & a hot babe that knows how to work it.

Mike De H

12-29-08, 16:43

Hey Mikey,

You would be in for a disappointment on New Year's Eve, since World is closed on the 31st. They are open on the 1st starting at 5 PM. Probably will be a slow day but pretty relaxing and a dude could be in for a treat if he makes the right love connection.

In fact, if you want to meet up on the 1st, then I might be game.

Cheers,

Dedalus

I certainly would like to meet up on the 1st, however I would need somewhere on the 1st to be... any suggestions as the Hotel in Linden seems a bit sad for New YEars Eve!

Dedalus

12-29-08, 21:20

I certainly would like to meet up on the 1st, however I would need somewhere on the 1st to be... any suggestions as the Hotel in Linden seems a bit sad for New YEars Eve!

Hey Man,

The 1st, in general is pretty sad. Most folks are in bed, dealing with Silvester hangovers.

I would not bet that World will be all that rockin' on the 1st, but it is likely to be as good as the others. Oase might be a slightly better choice. Hard to know for sure. Quite a few girls at World told me on my last visit that they would take this time off and be back on around the 6th or 7th.

Drop me a mail and we'll work out the logistics. B & B Hotel might be a better choice, although I hear that Etap Linden has been renovated. I know a place that IS open on the 31st. It's not in F'furt and it my not be your cup o' tea, but who knows...

Cheers,

Dedalus

Vito Corleone

12-30-08, 12:26

Drop me a mail and we'll work out the logistics. B & B Hotel might be a better choice, although I hear that Etap Linden has been renovated. I know a place that IS open on the 31st. It's not in F'furt and it my not be your cup o' tea, but who knows...

Cheers,

Dedalus
The Etap in Linden has been renovated, but it is still an Etap. Nothing fancy.

Dedalus

12-30-08, 20:02

The Etap in Linden has been renovated, but it is still an Etap. Nothing fancy.

Hey Don,

Are they still charging and arm and a leg for WiFi?

Cheers,

Dedalus

Jackyo

12-31-08, 11:52

It will be the first for me to visit germany.

I always go to spain.

Need your advises from many good trusted gentlemen.

Which of all FKK has best quality young and fresh. And plus a wide selection.
I would stay on the beaten tourist track and visit the Hessen 3: Palace, World, Oase.

Having said this and as a full disclosure, this is one of those "do as I say, not as I do" things.

Travelerb69

12-31-08, 12:00

Hey Don,

Are they still charging and arm and a leg for WiFi?

Cheers,

Dedalus

Hi Dedalus

All Etap hotels in Germany now have wifi for free. It used to be quite expensive indeed.

Best regards.

Dedalus

12-31-08, 17:20

Hi Dedalus

All Etap hotels in Germany now have wifi for free. It used to be quite expensive indeed.

Best regards.

Hay Man,

God tidings indeed!

Thanks,

Dedalus

Vito Corleone

01-06-09, 23:38

Hey Vito Corleone,

Zarina (Ukraine) was tapped by me on my last trip. Nice session but a little expensive. I think she was getting ideas. She remembers you well.

Good kisser, boy, she can kiss and do it like she means it. A wet and sloppy suck and passive during sex.

Regards

Londonbasketcase
Wassup LBC,

What do you mean expensive? Is she starting to charge extra for kissing & etc. Please give specific details or PM.

She can be passive during sex @ first, but you just need to know where to push her buttons.

Vinicio

01-07-09, 21:08

Hi everyone, here's my first post, first report about my first time in a FKK and, in the end, my first questions.

We decided with some friends to visit FKK World in Frankfurt, none of us had been in a FKK before. I'm not sure how my friends decided for World, after reading the forums now it appears that Oase would have been a better choice maybe.

Anyway, reaching the place by car was easy (with a gps) as was parking near it.

We entered and talked to the woman at the reception. She asked us if it was the first time there and quickly explained how the place works. I was hoping to have a naked women to introduce us to the place but it wasn't the case. We went to the lockers room, undressed, took a shower and went inside the club.

I didn't know what to really expect and I was a bit nervous, I still had my pants under the towel: D After a quick tour to see the place and a quick look to other people inside I felt pretty stupid with my pants on and decided to took them off. At first I didn't see a lot of interesting girls, most of the were a bit over weight; just 2 or 3 cute girls around. I now understand why, it was Sunday afternoon and pretty early, around 14. 30.

Some girls came to talk to me but I didn't like them, so I politly said I wanted to wait and relax for a while to get used to the place and went to the swimming pool area.

At this point I have to say I have a real bad memory for names, so I don't remember any of the girls name, except maybe 2. While I was relaxing in the swimming pool area a saw a pretty brunette with a nice body going to the sofas near the sauna area and I decided to follow her.

I went there and found her on a sofa. I smiled and started to talk. She was bulgarian, with white skin, black hair and blue eyes. She was cute but pretty cold and she wasn't talking much. Having a fairly good experience with escorts and amsterdam rld gilrs I should have known that it wasn't going to be a good session, but I decided to go on. After a couple of kisses she whispered me to go in a room. I agreed and followed her. She didn't provide BBBJ and so I was a bit disappointed and the sex was average. I finished pretty soon anyway because I was thinking to my fkk visit since one week: D It wasn't bad but I wouldn't try her again.

I then decided to relax a bit, got a coke a went to the swimming pool area. While I was going back upstairs after a while, a girl hugged me, kissed me and said "let's go to fuck". I didn't think to any good reason to say no: D, so I followed her to a room. I now incredibly remember her name, Renata. She had nice blue eyes, a big tits and soft body, I liked her attitude. The session was good, with kissing, BBBJ and a very enthusiastic sex. After I finished she hugged me and we talked for a while. I now understand, after reading some reviews here, that should be always like this when you finish before the 30 mins limit.

Now there were more girls and many more good ones.

Again in the swimming pool area I was approched by another bulgarian (I think) blond girl. I was a bit tired and I thought it was too soon for another session, but she started touching me there and the reaction was quick, so I decided to go to a room with her. She gave me a good BBBJ and kept kissing me during sex. I fucked her for good long time and finished in doggy style near the 30 mins limit. Very good session and a very good attitude. At this point I had to eat something and the food didn't taste so bad as I read somewhere, maybe I was really hungry. My last to session where with the same girl, a friend of the last blond one. She was very young, bulgarian, with black long hair and a dark skin. She was really aggressive in trying to bring me to a room, but the chemistry with her was very good and I had my 2 best sessions of the day. Around 19. 30 we decided to go, but to be honest and could have stayed there till late night. At first I didn't know what to expect but it turned out the best place I've been in for sex, like paradise on earth for me.

So here comes the questions, as I enjoyed the place so much that I decided to come back this weekend, but possibli without doing the same mistakes.

I will go to world first because I have a 15 euro discount for next visit and because I like the place but I'd like to spend more time outside the rooms with a girls to understand first how they really are. Any suggestion on how to do this? I tend to just follow them to the rooms.

If I want to spend more time with a girl, let's say a couple of hours, how much money should I offer her? I plan to go to world on Saturday afternoon, leave in the early night and go to palace because my hotel is near it and maybe to Oase on Sunday early afternoon till 5 pm because I have the return flight in the early night, is it a good plan in your opinion? Any suggetion on these places?

And last a logistic question: I booked a Hertz medium car, do they have gps or I need to bring mine? Cheers for the answers and sorry for my sucky english, I wrote way more than I wanted.

EDITOR'S NOTE: I would suggest that the author or another Forum Member consider posting a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please Click Here (http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?) for more information.

Jackyo

01-08-09, 11:24

I will go to world first because I have a 15 euro discount for next visit and because I like the place but I'd like to spend more time outside the rooms with a girls to understand first how they really are. Any suggestion on how to do this? I tend to just follow them to the rooms.
This is what is called the "testing for chemistry" phase. The problem is that you need to find a way to manuever her to a couch so you can first just sit and talk.

World has couches for this purpose but the activities on its couches don't come close to what takes place on the couches of other clubs I am familiar with.

I don't like clubs where the girls don't allow time for non-room time and where the extent of your conversation is "Hallo. Gehen wir ins Zimmer?". These are transactional type girls, not ones interested in building a "relationship" with you.

If you find someone who will just sit with you first, then good for you. If not, move on.

If I want to spend more time with a girl, let's say a couple of hours, how much money should I offer her?
Its quite simple.

The standard rate is 50 Euros per half hour. This is what she expects to be paid. It is a standard rate and you shouldn't have to negotiate for it neither should she tell you its any different.

So if you spend two hours with her, you are expected pay her 200 Euros.

Iseeu

01-08-09, 18:06

I booked a Hertz medium car, do they have gps or I need to bring mine? Nice 1st time report.

Depends on the deal you negotiated and Hertz status, but they usually charge extra for a GPS. If you bring your own, make sure that you have European maps.

Dedalus

01-08-09, 22:41

Nice 1st time report.

Depends on the deal you negotiated and Hertz status, but they usually charge extra for a GPS. If you bring your own, make sure that you have European maps.

Hey,

I use Hertz quite often. I have never gotten a car from them that had a Navi system in it unless it was a paid for add-on. Europcar on the other has given me many rentals with GPS without me reserving one.

If you want to be safe, then bring your own.

Cheers,

Dedalus

Vinicio

01-08-09, 23:08

Thanks for the answers. I will bring my gps.

I hope to have fun in Palace and Oase too. Haha it seems Palace is really near to my hotel, google maps says 45 meters.

Ortos

01-10-09, 04:37

I happened to visit World last night and guess what: the much-loved and long-missed Linda ex Palace (yes, that's right: Czech Linda!!) has resurfaced at Pohlheim of all places!

I had a session with her and she delivered an off-the-scale performance, just as always!

She said she is just trying World for a few days to assess if the business is good there. She may well go back to Palace or some other club if World's traffic does impress her.

Her bbbj is still one of the the best, if not THE best around.

Further afield:

I was very impressed with a great line up at World including many impressive lookers and performers. I hit three top notch session there including Linda, who now goes under the name of Karolina at World. Aside from Linda, I had two other sessions, one with a youngish Serb girl, Kim: fantastic kissing and very good bbbj and wonderful sex. She has great smooth skin and a very cooperative approach...no attitude, this one! Then I ended the night with a suprisingly good intimate gfe from a Romanian 22 y.o. girl Olivia, one more gfe!

Many girls complained about how slow business is these days and it comes to mind that the current depressed economy might in fact produce better overall session standards than during former times, because the market these days no longer tolerates under-performers. At least I found the attitudes of the girls now to be very, very customer friendly...or was I just lucky and wisely selective?

One new change I noticed at World: the small room adjacent to the dining room, immediately to the left as one enters the main room from the red curtains of the pay lockers, where formerly tables existed is now a small video game arcade. I would not call this an improvement myself, more of a distraction really....

Anyway, on balance I found World in very good shape and I look forward to returning.

Ortos

Ortos

Ekliges Lauern

01-10-09, 16:36

I happened to visit World last night and guess what: the much-loved and long-missed Linda ex Palace (yes, that's right: Czech Linda!!) has resurfaced at Pohlheim of all places!

This is good news indeed, Linda being sighted in Hesse.

I just wasn't going to go all the way to Switzerland for a Linda blowjob.

I wonder if this is another sign of the global downturn, Linda abandoning banking dominated Switzerland and testing which Hesse club will maximize her earnings.

Dedalus

01-10-09, 17:50

I happened to visit World last night and guess what: the much-loved and long-missed Linda ex Palace (yes, that's right: Czech Linda!!) has resurfaced at Pohlheim of all places!

Ortos

Hey Man,

Interesting. Let's hope that she is still there next weekend.

I imagine that she will do well in Pohlheim. Of course she usually does well wherever she is.

Any chance that you spotted a gorgeous, blond Romanian named Simone? Use to have a bad rep with a few German guys, but she improved by leaps and bounds when I and a few others went with her in December.

There is a tall, blond Bulgarian that Beffen turned me onto named Ola. Not a bad session and kinda fun when she breaks out the toys.

Leila was there at the start of the year. Gal hasn't lost a step. Might want to hunt that down as well in you are interested.

Cheers,

Dedalus

Beffen1

01-10-09, 19:47

Wassup LBC,

What do you mean expensive? Is she starting to charge extra for kissing & etc. Please give specific details or PM.

She can be passive during sex @ first, but you just need to know where to push her buttons.

By expensive, I think LBC means, as I understand him, that she was charging for wait times before you get a room- charging just to talk and hang out. I think this may have been a function of the Christmas party zimmerkrise and find it hard to believe that she would pull this during the winter doldrums when business is down. Though she is so gorgeous, I can't imagine her having any down time.
Hoping to get there next time, as she had no time for me at Christmas.

Nick The G

01-10-09, 19:50

Linda ex Palace (yes, that's right: Czech Linda!!) has resurfaced at Pohlheim ....... She said she is just trying World for a few days to assess if the business is good there.
...... Many girls complained about how slow business is these days ....... Seems Linda/Karolina has selected a bad time to test business at FKK-World. Looking back on my experience over the last five years, January was/is usually low business in Pohlheim, so this is to large extent independant of global economy.
Btw, in Germany it is lousy cold now, with beautiful and sunny days and lots of ice. A weather phase, cold and long like this, we havn't had for many years. On Wednesday morning 9 o'clock, they had -19 degrees centigrade in Pohlheim, at noon it was still - 12 degrees centigrade!

When I arrived on Wednesday at approx 3:30 pm, the place was more or less empty, only a few women and not so many men around there. It became significantly better after 6 o'clock. Then there were enough women I like. Btw., Simona, Ola and Olivia were not there on this day.

I had a good time in the room with Sophia (Italy) and Katharina (Hungary). And a good chat with Rebecca from Romania at the bar.

I was surprised to see Linda in Pohlheim, she was circulating many many times around the bar in the center, she didn't have much business on that day.

.... and it comes to mind that the current depressed economy might in fact produce better overall session standards than during former times, because the market these days no longer tolerates under-performers.I would say: wishful thinking! The mind of a dreamer! :D
The men who go to clubs/brothels are in need to go there!
If you look at it from a different perspective, they are the real "underperformers" on the sex between genders "market"! ;)

Ekliges Lauern

01-10-09, 20:38

I would say: wishful thinking! The mind of a dreamer! :D
The men who go to clubs/brothels are in need to go there!
If you look at it from a different perspective, they are the real "underperformers" on the sex between genders "market"! ;)

Actually, no. I have noticed a distinct difference in service levels at clubs on days when it was a sellers market and days when it was a buyers market.

As far as the English speaking men I have met at clubs, probably 90% would have no trouble finding a regular girlfriend or two. Most of the men I have met a pretty well off financially (and yes this does count with women). There are only a few that are so ugly that they couldn't find a girlfirend. There are plenty of ugly women out there looking for a man as well.

Difference is the quality in terms of appearance as well as the skill level/ranchyness factor. Even being a fat ass, I have no problem hooking up with a girlfriend if that is what I seek. I've juggled more than one from time to time. Difference is, most of the women that want to be my girlfriend are in their 40s and rather average looking. Plus, about 80% of them are looking to get married. And their skill in bed is no where near that of the club women (practice does indeed make perfect). Finding one that will happily blow you in an adult movie theater is like finding a needle in the haystack. And finally, regular women tend to get offended if you want them to leave you alone after sex.

I look at sex with women at clubs as like eating at a 3 star restaurant as opposed to sex with civilian girlfriends is like eating at McDonalds. Given the choice between eating at McDonalds and not eating, I'll go for McDonalds (but I'd really rather be at a 3 star restaurant).

Akibono

01-10-09, 20:45

Hey Man,

Leila was there at the start of the year. Gal hasn't lost a step. Might want to hunt that down as well in you are interested.

Cheers,

Dedalus

I've been waiting to hunt down that treasure for awhile. Guess I am going to World next week.

Nick The G

01-11-09, 02:22

Finding one that will happily blow you in an adult movie theater is like finding a needle in the haystack. And finally, regular women tend to get offended if you want them to leave you alone after sex.

I look at sex with women at clubs as like eating at a 3 star restaurant as opposed to sex with civilian girlfriends is like eating at McDonalds. Given the choice between eating at McDonalds and not eating, I'll go for McDonalds (but I'd really rather be at a 3 star restaurant).Many men tend to think of women as "objects". Women have to function, they are mainly good for fulfilling the needs of needy men.
Well, lately I heard somebody saying that a relationship has something to do with relating (indeed!) to somebody else, lets say a man to a human female being. Now, when we are relating, something has changed quite a bit, we are not alone anymore. So, how can we relate? I would say: in the way we think, we feel and we act we relate to the important other one in our life.

I've juggled more than one from time to time. Difference is, most of the women that want to be my girlfriend are in their 40s and rather average looking. Plus, about 80% of them are looking to get married. And their skill in bed is no where near that of the club women (practice does indeed make perfect).From what you say, I understand you are a specialist. I am pretty much convinced you are a perfect sex machine! And women of all ages cannot help but queue up in front of your house to get that benefit (as you say: practice does indeed help to improve and leads - sometimes - to perfection). Since you are skilled in the art, you deliver best service to all women, independant of age and how they look.

On the other hand, if you go to a 3 star restaurant, the cook there for sure will be better than you. And if you go to a concert, the musicians there will play the instruments better than you do. And if you visit the exhibition of a professional painter or photographer, you might get the impression, that they do things much better than you.

Due to many facts, the 18-25 years old girls in the german brothels, mostly from south-east Europe, are no adequate partners for men that are beyond their 40s or 50s.

Problem might be: we are too old for the young women and we don't want to recognize that fact! ;-) Why? Because we still look at the women with the eyes of a fifteen to eighteen year old boy. But we cannot see what the others see: the girls look back at us and what do they clearly see: a man way beyond his 40s. They know: he comes to the club, he is in need of sex urgently. And they know for sure: they need money urgently.

To compensate for this twisted ego (freeze-framed feelings of an adolescent boy in a matured body of someone beyond his 40s)), we're forced to travel quite a lot and to invest a lot of money!(of course, to further improve our sex skills until we meet and unite with our ultimate lover, death ;-)

Strato

01-11-09, 03:21

Aha. A Czech Linda sighting. I knew she would return to FKK land.

My guess is Palace will be her next roost.

Keep us posted of her whereabouts!

Seems Linda/Karolina has selected a bad time to test business at FKK-World. Looking back on my experience over the last five years, January was/is usually low business in Pohlheim, so this is to large extent independant of global economy.

Btw, in Germany it is lousy cold now, with beautiful and sunny days and lots of ice. A weather phase, cold and long like this, we havn't had for many years. On Wednesday morning 9 o'clock, they had -19 degrees centigrade in Pohlheim, at noon it was still - 12 degrees centigrade!

When I arrived on Wednesday at approx 3:30 pm, the place was more or less empty, only a few women and not so many men around there. It became significantly better after 6 o'clock. Then there were enough women I like. Btw., Simona, Ola and Olivia were not there on this day.

I had a good time in the room with Sophia (Italy) and Katharina (Hungary). And a good chat with Rebecca from Romania at the bar.

I was surprised to see Linda in Pohlheim, she was circulating many many times around the bar in the center, she didn't have much business on that day.

I would say: wishful thinking! The mind of a dreamer! :D
The men who go to clubs/brothels are in need to go there!
If you look at it from a different perspective, they are the real "underperformers" on the sex between genders "market"! ;)

Ekliges Lauern

01-11-09, 15:56

Many men tend to think of women as "objects". Women have to function, they are mainly good for fulfilling the needs of needy men.
Well, lately I heard somebody saying that a relationship has something to do with relating (indeed!) to somebody else, lets say a man to a human female being.

Difference between relationship and sex. You are confusing the two. I go to FKKs for sex. If you go to FKKs for the emotional benefits derived from relationships, you are deluding yourself. I was merely pointing out that about most of the men going to FKKs can get sex outside of the clubs.

From what you say, I understand you are a specialist. I am pretty much convinced you are a perfect sex machine! And women of all ages cannot help but queue up in front of your house to get that benefit (as you say: practice does indeed help to improve and leads - sometimes - to perfection). Since you are skilled in the art, you deliver best service to all women, independant of age and how they look.

Where the fuck did that come from? The practice makes perfect comment was in relation to the women. The point was a girl in an FKK was probably more skilled at sex than a civilian because she has sex a lot.

I was also pointing out that I can get sex outside the clubs if I so choose (in the context of a relationship or dating. I also believe 90% of the men who visit clubs can as well. Just not with beautiful young women in their 20s.

On the other hand, if you go to a 3 star restaurant, the cook there for sure will be better than you.

If business is bad, you may get better service as the chef and service staff want to incent you to repeat more often. Conversely, if the restaurant has more business than it can handle, you may get indifferent service as they might not care if you come back.

Problem might be: we are too old for the young women and we don't want to recognize that fact! ;-)

True enough, but to me, the young women are a sexual fantasy. As far as companionship I prefer women closer to my own age.

To compensate for this twisted ego (freeze-framed feelings of an adolescent boy in a matured body of someone beyond his 40s)), we're forced to travel quite a lot and to invest a lot of money!(of course, to further improve our sex skills until we meet and unite with our ultimate lover, death ;-)

That may be one of the most cynical things I have heard in a while. I wouldn't say we are forced to travel and spend a lot of money. You can strike up a FWB relationship with a girl in her early twenties using Craigs List in the US. Takes a fair amount of persistence. Down side she is goign to want more that 50E per get together and because of the time invested in finding one, it works best if you find one and stick with her for a while.

I visit FKKs either in conjunction with business trips (fewer given the economy) or a few times a year where the travel is on my own dime. I see it as a luxury, much the same way other take cruises or by boats with the recreation time. And not, it's not to improve our sex skills. When I am at an FKK, its all about me. I'm paying for it after all.

Bratwurst

01-11-09, 17:32

I look at sex with women at clubs as like eating at a 3 star restaurant as opposed to sex with civilian girlfriends is like eating at McDonalds. Given the choice between eating at McDonalds and not eating, I'll go for McDonalds (but I'd really rather be at a 3 star restaurant).I 100% quote this FKK attitude, Radler !

I've also always considered FKK clubs being for the sex what the restaurants are for the food.

There are good restaurants and bad ones, the same for FKKs.

I am married, my wife is one of the best cooks I know on earth, nonetheless I enjoy deeply dining in fine restaurants and sampling new food, new spices, new styles of cooking all over the world.

My wife is also enthusiastic and curious about the sex, I tell you she can be fun in bed if she wants (and I don't have to ask first if I will be getting BBBJ), but can she offer the variety, the skills, the different flavours and spices of all the sx providers that you find in an FKK? No way. I get "regular" sex outside the clubs, now and then, and it also happens with some 20-25 yo girl (I am 34 yo), and even if it is fun while at it I happen to be annoyed by the lack of sexual skills and naughtyness that many of our "common" girlfriends perform.

We go in FKKs for the best sex experience that money can buy. Only difference is that we don't have to mix up our emotions with the cook in a restaurant, while it sometimes happens with a FKK gal. But that is what FKKing so damn addictive, is it?

Dedalus

01-11-09, 23:11

I've been waiting to hunt down that treasure for awhile. Guess I am going to World next week.

Hey Ak,

If she's there and not booked solidly, then you should be in for a treat. I did not get to ask her what her planned schedule is, but weekends should be pretty good. Gal's got some pretty good English chops going also.

No doubt Sophia will be looking for you also. She should be back this week.

Cheers,

Dedalus

Dedalus

01-11-09, 23:18

Btw, in Germany it is lousy cold now, with beautiful and sunny days and lots of ice. A weather phase, cold and long like this, we havn't had for many years. On Wednesday morning 9 o'clock, they had -19 degrees centigrade in Pohlheim, at noon it was still - 12 degrees centigrade!

Hey Nick (ein Frohes Neues!!!),

Man you got that right. Hope that it is better for you than where I'm at.

I gotta get back out to Pohlheim to get my temperature up the old fashioned way.

Cheers,

Dedalus

Vinicio

01-11-09, 23:54

I'm back from my weekend Germany trip and here's my second report. I have to tank this forum for the Fleming's hotel advice, it was perfect. Near enough from the airport (16 km from Frankfurt Airport terminal 1) and in front of Palace. The total cost of the flight ticket (from north Italy), a rented car and 1 night in the hotel was 390 euro, which is pretty low in my opinion. I rented the car because I wanted to go to world first and I think a taxi would have costed me more.

Anyway, I arrived at world Saturday around 14. 15 (55 km from the Fleming's). Renata remembered me from last week and asked me if I wanted to spend so time with here. She is a bit overweight and normally not my type, but I like her attitude and the fact that she speaks a bit of italian, so I said yes. We spent some time on the couch and then off to a room. She asked me if I wanted to stay 1 hour but I declined, basically because I know my first is pretty fast, and told her I wanted a CIM. So in the end a good BBBJ with CIM. Total time spent couch + room about 40 mins. Good session and good talk. She told me there were just few men, also on Friday. In fact the place looked like last Sunday afternoon, on a Saturday.

I went a bit around and so more girls than the previous time and also better looking in average.

I went to the relax area near the sauna to rest for a bit, travelling is tiring even if it's a short journey, at least for me. Every 5 minutes I had to chat with a girl. I said no to 2 or 3 of them and then the first girl I was with last week came on the couch and started to kiss me. Her name is Denaia or somethign like it. She is not very tall, nice body but not too skinny, nice young looking tits, black air nor very long and bue eyes. She is from Bulgaria. I didn't like that much the first time with her, but this time she was way more friendly and I really like her body. She was touch me there and we went to a room. I asked her to blow me without a condom, not like the first time, and she said yes. Good BBBJ even tho a little be fast and good sex. I was pretty fast also this time, it happens when I really like a girl: p.

Off upstairs for some food but this time it wasn't that good, shame because I was pretty hungry.

Again to the relax area and to the continuos chatting with girls. There were indeed just few men.

Eva (this time I tried hard to remember names) came to sit near me on the couch. Blond, average body and nice attitude. Average session, I was able to finish in the 30 mins. Nothing special to remember, not bad anyway.

After some time Denisa (or a similar name) spotted me. She is a 19 years old from Bulgaria, with black air, dark skin and a very nice body. I had 2 sessions with her last week and enjoyed them alot. She is pushy, but in a nice way and she seems to really enjoy what she does. I was trying to rest near the swimming pool when she saw me. She asked me to go with her, but I told her I was tired and I couldn't at the moment. She told me "you can" and started to blow me there. Indeed I could and we went to a room. BBBJ, 69, some positions + CIM. Very good session, I really like this girl. At this point I started to be really tired and I wanted to sleep but it was impossible. Again near the swimming pool a tall and skinny girl I saw before came to sit near me. Dark air, very skinny but with a nice body, beatiful face, dark eyes. Julia, 22 years old from Bulgaria. She started touching and kissimg me and I told her I was tired and I couldn't do anything, she said I could but I said no again. She turned from me and opened her long legs in front of me, with her pussy at 30 cm from my face, and she was looking in my eyes. After that she moved and started blowing me and again I was off to a room. She is the most PSE girl I have ever met. She was trying to upsell but in a incredibly porn way. She asked me if I wanted to to anal while is was fingering her ass, took my hand and made me put a finger in her ass. I said no but I'm not sure why: D Very good BBBJ and very good sex. In the end 50 euro for living a porn movie for 45 mins (swimming ppol area + room), very good.

After a long rest renata found me again and wanted me to do another session with her. To be honest I didn't want to but I went anyway to keep our "relationship" good. Non sense I know. Anyway I was able to finish with a CIM in the 30 mins. She is nice so it's ok.

At this point, around 9. 30 I was finished, again near the swimming pool. Denisa saw me and came near me. I wanted to do another session with her but I was really tired. She started a blow job there for a long time and then we went for a room. There were none free, she laughed and she started to blow me again while I was standing near the swimming pool. I told her she was crazy and she laughed, continuing her job. Finally a room was free and we went there. Best session I had with her and I was able to finish in 30 mins again. I love this girl.

At this point I went back to my hotel.

5 girls. 7 sessions. 3 CIM. 500 euro spent + 50 euro entrance fee (I had a 15 euro next time discount). I enjoyed the place even tho with friends last time was better, alone is a bit boring sometimes. Way better than my next day palace experience that I'm going to write in the palace thread.

EDITOR'S NOTE: I would suggest that the author or another Forum Member consider posting a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please Click Here (http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?) for more information.

Xenon U

01-12-09, 01:23

Difference between relationship and sex. You are confusing the two. I go to FKKs for sex. If you go to FKKs for the emotional benefits derived from relationships, you are deluding yourself. I was merely pointing out that about most of the men going to FKKs can get sex outside of the clubs.

I was also pointing out that I can get sex outside the clubs if I so choose (in the context of a relationship or dating. I also believe 90% of the men who visit clubs can as well. Just not with beautiful young women in their 20s.

True enough, but to me, the young women are a sexual fantasy. As far as companionship I prefer women closer to my own age. Hi, Radler,

I think you are confusing relationship and love. To my mind having sex IS a relationship. The deepest relationship possible to human beings, even if you pay for it. It is a relationship for a relatively short time, but if you do not relate to each other I suspect it is foul relationshipwise and the sex is bound to be lousy, too.

I'm not a very experienced monger ("newbie"), but until now the chemistry (=relationship? ! ) has been OK to great with the half dozen or so ladies I had paid sex with. If not I could have fucked a piece of raw meat, and I'm not going to pay for that a single dime!

Peter Sarstead once wrote and sang about a girl: "You're in between twenty and thirty, a very desirable age. " (Where do you go to my lovely)

Yes, it is the young girls of that age that attract most men because of biological reasons, and having passed the climax of their lives most men painfully become aware that sex with the aforementioned age group of girls is not for free anymore. Of course I have a lot of more or less Platonic "relationships" (apart from my marriage) with girls or women far younger than me, but satisfying and "sordid" sex is out of question.

Bags of money, glory and power is a great aphrodisiac, but, alas, I've got neither of them.

But I've found out that being witty and polite to the girls you pay for and trying to appear intelligent and well-educated helps them remembering you even after a long time. And I'm trying to compensate for the lack of money and glory by apearing not too disgusting outwardly: I keep fit by going to the gym and doing some bit of jogging regularly. Additionally before attending a club I shave (not only my face! ). The naked shaved elves appreciate this.

In other words: I had some of the deepest relationships possible with paid girls, relationships I'll never forget.

But that does NOT mean I LOVE these girls (maybe I'm infatuated with some of them! ) nor, and that is more important, do I expect them to love me, let alone expect them to embark on a daily-life-relationship (=marriage? ) with me. Our sociological backgrounds would simply be too different. Do not get me wrong: I'm not saying "she is a dirty ***** and I am a respected member of society, so we would never fit" but just the contrary: I will never be able to fulfil what she expects from life. And I appreciate their services highly and therefore I think these girls deserve my (our? ) highest respect.

To sum it up: A one-hour-relationship with a girl providing great sex for money is, for an aging man, a fantasy come true. But it nevertheless IS a sort of relationship.

Yours truly, X

EDITOR'S NOTE: I would suggest that the author or another Forum Member consider posting a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please Click Here (http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?) for more information.

Vito Corleone

01-12-09, 12:11

I said no to 2 or 3 of them and then the first girl I was with last week came on the couch and started to kiss me. Her name is Denaia or somethign like it. She is not very tall, nice body but not too skinny, nice young looking tits, black air nor very long and bue eyes. She is from Bulgaria. I didn't like that much the first time with her, but this time she was way more friendly and I really like her body. She was touch me there and we went to a room. I asked her to blow me without a condom, not like the first time, and she said yes. Good BBBJ even tho a little be fast and good sex. I was pretty fast also this time, it happens when I really like a girl: p.

So Danaya is back & ready for action! It has been close to 1 year since I last saw her, but I am sure Mr. Dedalus will be ecstatic to hear she is back.

Vito Corleone

01-12-09, 12:24

I look at sex with women at clubs as like eating at a 3 star restaurant as opposed to sex with civilian girlfriends is like eating at McDonalds. Given the choice between eating at McDonalds and not eating, I'll go for McDonalds (but I'd really rather be at a 3 star restaurant).
I think of my experiences @ the FKK's kinda like wine tasting. Sure, I can find a nice bottle of wine & enjoy it. Being stuck with the same bottle of wine is not my cup of tea & can be a little too much work. Some wines just do not go well with certain food. Some wines do not age well either.

I prefer wine tasting where you can observe, smell, check for quality, pick/choose & sample the choices available. Some places have a very fine selection & some are limited editions & gold star winners. I can ask the host the different tastes, flavors, quality & even ask the different ages.

If I enjoy a glass, I can pay for another glass or buy a bottle. Sometimes I buy a box. If I find a certain sample tastes like crap, I can dump it. The best part is you can leave the empty bottle/glass/box there & move on to another winery. Some "free" bottles of wine can get too difficult to store & need to get recycled. Every glass of wine tastes different & my palate for wine has improved after every trip.

Wine is never free. You always end up paying for it.

Dedalus

01-12-09, 13:34

So Danaya is back & ready for action! It has been close to 1 year since I last saw her, but I am sure Mr. Dedalus will be ecstatic to hear she is back.

Yep, saw her last December. Glorious as ever. Gal ain't nothing but fine.

Cheers,

Dedalus

Vinicio

01-12-09, 13:35

So Danaya is back & ready for action! It has been close to 1 year since I last saw her, but I am sure Mr. Dedalus will be ecstatic to hear she is back.I'm not sure it's the one you think of. the name can be that or similar, I'm very bad at remembering names :p Check if she fits my description.

Basketcase

01-12-09, 22:13

By expensive, I think LBC means, as I understand him, that she was charging for wait times before you get a room- charging just to talk and hang out. I think this may have been a function of the Christmas party zimmerkrise and find it hard to believe that she would pull this during the winter doldrums when business is down. Though she is so gorgeous, I can't imagine her having any down time.
Hoping to get there next time, as she had no time for me at Christmas.

Hi Beffen and Vito Corleone,

Yes, Zarina (Ukraine) was charging for room wait time. We waited for 30 minutes before getting into a room then we were into the second set of 30 minutes so all up €100 for a standard 30 minute session and 30 minutes of room wait time.

I thought she would cut me some slack as a repeat customer but I guess money does not talk with Zarina on that Christmas Party Night at World. I think she wanted to party since she had something special to celebrate and she kissed me sweetly later on when I caught up with her on how it was going.

It seemed after she saw me that she took no more clients. As well as saying she had no time for you Beffen she also said the same - no more clients to two other esteemed members of our party. So that makes three of you at least that evening as well as the other customer I saw ask and were rebuffed.

Zarina is a fantastic kisser though.

Kind regards

Londonbasketcase

Basketcase

01-12-09, 22:23

Then I ended the night with a suprisingly good intimate gfe from a Romanian 22 y.o. girl Olivia, one more gfe!

One new change I noticed at World: the small room adjacent to the dining room, immediately to the left as one enters the main room from the red curtains of the pay lockers, where formerly tables existed is now a small video game arcade. I would not call this an improvement myself, more of a distraction really....

Hi Ortos,

Nice catching up with you recently to trade news.

I understand that your Olivia was Romanian but did you also meet another Olivia at World of about the same age from Poland that is green eyed, long straight black hair - gives her a sort of Ancient Eqyptian Cleopatra look. Petite in size, slim body size, B cups. Maybe its the same girl (?). Kisses really well and intimately and does all the usual sex acts with aplomb.

She certainly provides a girl friend experience (gfe) and I never do less than an hour with Polish Olivia.

The Polish Olivia is a fave of mine (and a few others I understand from the German forums).

Should be interesting that the area adjacent to the dining area has now been turned into a video game arcade area. Is it more girls or the punters that are using these facilities? Also is there a charge or is the use of the games part of the overall entritt fee?

Sorry to ask as I am not expecting to be back at World until middle of January 2009 (this month actually).

Cheers,

Londonbasketcase

Dedalus

01-12-09, 22:36

Hi Beffen and Vito Corleone,

Yes, Zarina (Ukraine) was charging for room wait time. We waited for 30 minutes before getting into a room then we were into the second set of 30 minutes so all up €100 for a standard 30 minute session and 30 minutes of room wait time.

I thought she would cut me some slack as a repeat customer but I guess money does not talk with Zarina on that Christmas Party Night at World. I think she wanted to party since she had something special to celebrate and she kissed me sweetly later on when I caught up with her on how it was going.

It seemed after she saw me that she took no more clients. As well as saying she had no time for you Beffen she also said the same - no more clients to two other esteemed members of our party. So that makes three of you at least that evening as well as the other customer I saw ask and were rebuffed.

Zarina is a fantastic kisser though.

Kind regards

Londonbasketcase

Hey LBC,

I thought that was what I heard that night, but I was sure it had to be a mistake.

Dude, you got rogered but good. I don't care how hot the gal is. No one is required to pay for a wait outside the room, unless you are actually doing part of the session outside of the room, and most gals with not count that either.

Lots and lots of gals and guys had to deal with long room waits that night. Lucky for me I only feel victim to a long room wait once with Lucy. We did quite a bit of pre-room nookie before actually getting there, and she didn't hit me up for extra change.

I got no problem with occasional generosity, but you gotta admit that caving to such an obvious scam sets a bad example.

Still, all in all that was a fun evening as far as parties go. Watching IPM go ape-shit every time someone else won at the drawing was worth the price of admission alone ;-)))

Cheers,

Dedalus, who ended that night (and the year) with Lara. Probably the find of 2008 for me. No room-wait either ;-)))

Dedalus

01-12-09, 22:39

Should be interesting that the area adjacent to the dining area has now been turned into a video game arcade area. Is it more girls or the punters that are using these facilities? Also is there a charge or is the use of the games part of the overall entritt fee?

Sorry to ask as I am not expecting to be back at World until middle of January 2009 (this month actually).

Cheers,

Londonbasketcase

The video slots were used by men and ladies alike on my last visit. They work the way they normally do. Pay your money, push the button and take your chances. Some dude won 300 EUR the night I was there.

Cheers,

Dedalus

Basketcase

01-12-09, 22:54

I got no problem with occasional generosity, but you gotta admit that caving to such an obvious scam sets a bad example.

Still, all in all that was a fun evening as far as parties go. Watching IPM go ape-shit every time someone else won at the drawing was worth the price o admission alone ;-)))

Hi Dedalus,

Yes I know agreeing to pay for waiting time was not right so I was a bit reluctant to explain on the open forum my comment that Zarina was expensive. I guess it is out now especially as I confirmed the explanation given.

Sorry I was not with the rest of the crew to see IPM go ape shit. That would have been funny.

I was laying back on the couches having a rest and a kindly German guy who had like 20 chits and a couple of naked girls was checking all my smaller pile of tombola chits to see if my numbers were coming up as I explained I did not speak Deutsch and the times when English was being said for the tombola numbers I was having trouble understanding with the loudspeaker. I did not win anything.

Being at World that day got me in trouble with some my Oase girls who asked where had I been. Not to worry.

Regards

Londonbasketcase

Vito Corleone

01-13-09, 01:28

Yes I know agreeing to pay for waiting time was not right so I was a bit reluctant to explain on the open forum my comment that Zarina was expensive. I guess it is out now especially as I confirmed the explanation given.

Sorry I was not with the rest of the crew to see IPM go ape shit. That would have been funny.

Wassup LBC,

Didn't mean to put you on the spot. You could have inboxed me. I agree with Deda on refusing to pay for wait time, but I might have shrugged my shoulders & paid too. It is easier to refuse sitting infront of my computer, but I would most likely give in if she was sitting on my lap. I travel a long way to let 50E keep me from a hot babe like Zarina. I dished out 800E last trip so what's another 50E?

As long as you had a good session, who really cares what people think. If you can afford the extra 50E for extras, more power to you. I am in complete indulge mode & have never let money keep me from experiencing pure pleasure.

Vito Corleone

01-13-09, 01:33

I'm not sure it's the one you think of. the name can be that or similar, I'm very bad at remembering names :p Check if she fits my description.
Bulgarian, average height, nice bod & fake rack. It's Danaya.

Vito Corleone

01-13-09, 01:36

Yep, saw her last December. Glorious as ever. Gal ain't nothing but fine.

Cheers,

Dedalus
I remember when you thought she was just OK. I guess her implants raised her average.

Vito Corleone

01-13-09, 01:59

Dude, you got rogered but good. I don't care how hot the gal is. No one is required to pay for a wait outside the room, unless you are actually doing part of the session outside of the room, and most gals with not count that either.

I got no problem with occasional generosity, but you gotta admit that caving to such an obvious scam sets a bad example.

Wassup Deda,

I agree with you, but I think I would have done the same as LBC. I travel from way to far to let 50E keep me from a hot babe. Yes, I know it is principle & etc, but I go to the FKK's to indulge & I think it would be worth it. Even the Godfather has weaknesses. I would only consider it with my ATF's, not some random hot babe laying around.

Some people might think it is more Spafatore than Corleone, but look what Tony Soprano did to Ralph after Pie O My died.

Beffen1

01-13-09, 10:54

hi dedalus,

yes i know agreeing to pay for waiting time was not right so i was a bit reluctant to explain on the open forum my comment that zarina was expensive. i guess it is out now especially as i confirmed the explanation given.

londonbasketcase

hey lbc,

listen, in this game, the girls set the price for what they are willing to do and we decide if we want to pay, ideally all before the fact. at least she was up front about it and didn't hit you up after the session without a warning first. now that's a rip off. but the way it happened for you, no problem for others there. in fact, zarina (are we sure its not spelled czarina lol) is sooo fine, and so much my type, that, given your glowing recomendation of her room skills, i might have acceded to her request had she deigned to accompany me to a room that evening. alas, i too am a sucker for a perfect ten [CodeWord901] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord901). and hopefully i'll get to suck her everywhere next trip.

Akibono

01-14-09, 04:17

Hey Ak,

If she's there and not booked solidly, then you should be in for a treat. I did not get to ask her what her planned schedule is, but weekends should be pretty good. Gal's got some pretty good English chops going also.

No doubt Sophia will be looking for you also. She should be back this week.

Cheers,

Dedalus

Must bring more Euros. Knees are getting weak already.

Ortos

01-14-09, 14:38

Hi Ortos,

Nice catching up with you recently to trade news.

I understand that your Olivia was Romanian but did you also meet another Olivia at World of about the same age from Poland that is green eyed, long straight black hair - gives her a sort of Ancient Eqyptian Cleopatra look. Petite in size, slim body size, B cups. Maybe its the same girl (?). Kisses really well and intimately and does all the usual sex acts with aplomb.

She certainly provides a girl friend experience (gfe) and I never do less than an hour with Polish Olivia.

The Polish Olivia is a fave of mine (and a few others I understand from the German forums).

Should be interesting that the area adjacent to the dining area has now been turned into a video game arcade area. Is it more girls or the punters that are using these facilities? Also is there a charge or is the use of the games part of the overall entritt fee?

Sorry to ask as I am not expecting to be back at World until middle of January 2009 (this month actually).

Cheers,

Londonbasketcase

The Olivia I refer to is NOT Polish, but very, very definitely Romanian. Not the same girl.

Beffen1

01-14-09, 23:38

[Quote:Originally Posted by Dedalus]Still, all in all that was a fun evening as far as parties go. Watching IPM go ape-shit every time someone else won at the drawing was worth the price of admission alone ;-)))

[QUOTE:Originally Posted by Londonbasketcase]Sorry I was not with the rest of the crew to see IPM go ape shit. That would have been funny.

Thanks guys.

It's nice to know who your friends are.

I was getting slighty agitated with the guy calling the numbers only in German, considering there were so many non German speakers there that night.

I really wanted to win a coffee making machine worth 35 euro and pay 50 euro extra baggage charges on it. LOL (P.S. I don't drink coffee)

Hey IPM,
I too was getting agitated-- all the fricking tickets in the bowl were "Rot" and all my tickets were "Blau". Schiesse.
Have a great time this week .

bef

Akibono

01-17-09, 13:42

For fans of Czech Linda, she was spotted yesterday and was constantly busy. The crowd was a little light (both men and women). There is cute bulgarian named CICI that I would suggest you avoid. Only does coverd BJ and has a bad attitude. First bad Bulgarian I have had. On the other hand, there is a blond german girl, A tits, curly, short hair, named Janine that was really passionate. Recommended. Eva, monica, inna, Leila, denaya, and janet were also spotted. Marie, Andrea, Zarina were missing.

Vito Corleone

01-18-09, 10:24

Beffen1

01-18-09, 16:05

Mike De H

01-19-09, 01:34

Hey man, hope you are enjoying a good buzz.
What about Zoya, Olga, Barbie from Poland, little Sandra of Gemrnay?

Go get em.
beff

Olga was there. So was Dedalus and J.....

There was a Bulgarian sex kitten there you would have LOVED, petite, and unbelievably PSE AND GFE called ....er gone and done it again. What was her name Dedalus?

Beffen1

01-19-09, 16:14

Olga was there. So was Dedalus and J.....

There was a Bulgarian sex kitten there you would have LOVED, petite, and unbelievably PSE AND GFE called ....er gone and done it again. What was her name Dedalus?

Hey Mike,
Thanks for the update- glad you've reunited with some of us and are enjoying yourself. I'll look for whats her name next time LOL.
beff

Strato

01-20-09, 00:54

Akibono,

Thank you for update.

What time was Linda at World?

Thanks,

Strato

For fans of Czech Linda, she was spotted yesterday and was constantly busy. The crowd was a little light (both men and women). There is cute bulgarian named CICI that I would suggest you avoid. Only does coverd BJ and has a bad attitude. First bad Bulgarian I have had. On the other hand, there is a blond german girl, A tits, curly, short hair, named Janine that was really passionate. Recommended. Eva, monica, inna, Leila, denaya, and janet were also spotted. Marie, Andrea, Zarina were missing.

Mike De H

01-20-09, 12:22

Hey Mike,
Thanks for the update- glad you've reunited with some of us and are enjoying yourself. I'll look for whats her name next time LOL.
beff

MAYA !!! Thats it..

Mike De H

01-20-09, 12:22

Akibono,

Thank you for update.

What time was Linda at World?

Thanks,

StratoShe was there all day.

Cularo

01-20-09, 13:25

The Olivia I refer to is NOT Polish, but very, very definitely Romanian. Not the same girl.I saw Olivia (the Polish one. (. LBC.) Sunday 18th January. She just came back from poland and was leaving the same day for one wekk break.

She told me she finishes the month at fkk World and then go working fkk Globe near Zurich. Snifff

Sunday, business was very low in the afternoon, and many girls were playing at the new casino machines. (I saw Danaia, Daniela.).

Cularo

Dedalus

01-20-09, 14:36

She was there all day.

Yesterday she arrived at about 5 PM. Works under the name Caroline now.

On what was a pretty slow day, she was pretty much constantly booked.

Cheers,

Dedalus

Dedalus

01-20-09, 14:39

MAYA !!! Thats it..

Hey Mikey,

Did not see her last night. However there were a few others in the Bulgarian click who had the hinder standards that you are usually looking for.

Cheers,

Dedalus

Basketcase

01-20-09, 22:05

I saw Olivia (the Polish one. (. LBC.) Sunday 18th January. She just came back from poland and was leaving the same day for one wekk break.

She told me she finishes the month at fkk World and then go working fkk Globe near Zurich. Snifff

Sunday, business was very low in the afternoon, and many girls were playing at the new casino machines. (I saw Danaia, Daniela.).

Cularo

Hi Cularo,

Thank you for your report and you thinking of me.

Thank you for the update on dark haired Olivia (Polen). So sad that she is leaving on Sunday, 18 January to return to Polen. I will not see her then before she moves to work at FKK Globe. I fear if she is gone now.

FKK Globe prices to the punters are around €90 (CHF130) for a session compared to €50 a session for the same thing in Deutschland. The girls go where the money is.

Little blond Lisa (Polen) has also retired too from working. My Frankfurt based friend gave me solace that I had invested in her future. Also with the cute brunette Karolina (Ukraine) gone too. Now that is going to be three further reasons for not going to World for me. My next trip is turning into a disaster in terms of line ups. I may have to start doing finishing myself off if none of my favourites are around.

Also no sighting of blond Zarina (Ukraine) that kisses so intimately and potentially no tall brunette Eva (Serbia) with the sexy arse and little blond pixie Sandra (Germany).

I am sorry I did not come last weekend even though I had booked and paid for the trip. I had to see a man about a dog.

In my experience, World is very slow on a Sunday so I tend to make Oase my Sunday venue as it generally has a stronger line up or Palace if I have to leave for the airport on a Sunday.

Regards

Londonbasketcase

Breadman

01-21-09, 18:21

Liebe Gäste, Besucher und Freunde unseres Hauses,

ab sofort bieten wir ein Winter-Special: nur 50,- Euro Eintritt ganztägig.
Wir bieten "der Wirtschaftskrise Paroli" !

Und darauf ein dreifach geiles Hellau :
Denn am 7. Februar 2009 steigt unsere Faschingsparty
Mit Porno Star Sharon da Vale, heißen SambaShows, Gogos, live DJ, tollem Buffet
und vielem mehr !

Das FKK-WORLD Team freut sich auf euren Besuch und wünscht unvergessliche
Momente im größten und exklusivsten FKK-CLUB Europas.

P.S.: Mo - Mi entfällt nicht mal unser Dauer Special: Eintritt "3 für 2" -
Alle Gäste,die zu dritt kommen erhalten eine 5,- Euro Rabattkarte für den nächsten Eintritt.

Got this via the fkk world newsletter. Im not sure what the p.s. is saying...wonder if the 3 for 2 special is still being taken with this new admission.

"Dear guests, visitors and friends of our house,

now we offer a Winter Special: only 50, - Euro Admission all day.
We offer "of the economic crisis Paroli"!

And then a triple geiles Hellau:
Indeed, on 7 February 2009 is increasing our Carnival Party
With Pornostar Sharon da Vale, hot samba shows, Gogos, live DJ, great buffet
and much more!

The nudist WORLD team is looking forward to your visit and hopes unforgettable
Moments in the biggest and most exclusive naturist CLUB Europe.

PS: Monday - Wednesday is not even our permanent Special: Admission "3 for 2" --
All guests who come to receive a third 5, - euro discount card for the next entry."

Dedalus

01-21-09, 19:23

Got this via the fkk world newsletter. Im not sure what the p.s. is saying...wonder if the 3 for 2 special is still being taken with this new admission.

"Dear guests, visitors and friends of our house,

now we offer a Winter Special: only 50, - Euro Admission all day.
We offer "of the economic crisis Paroli"!

And then a triple geiles Hellau:
Indeed, on 7 February 2009 is increasing our Carnival Party
With Pornostar Sharon da Vale, hot samba shows, Gogos, live DJ, great buffet
and much more!

The nudist WORLD team is looking forward to your visit and hopes unforgettable
Moments in the biggest and most exclusive naturist CLUB Europe.

PS: Monday - Wednesday is not even our permanent Special: Admission "3 for 2" --
All guests who come to receive a third 5, - euro discount card for the next entry."

Hey Bread,

This does not surprise me. I have been there three times since the 1st of this year and the male guest traffic is way down. Talked to a few people there and there seems to be some concern. This past weekend while visiting the place I was speaking with another ISGer about when (not "if") the winter special was going to happen.

Traffic seems to be down at all the Hessen clubs, but I think World is taking a bigger hit because of its location. Most of the guys from the textile Messe last week hit either Palace or Oase. I was at Oase the Sunday after the Messe and it was also fairly light, even by Oase's normal Sunday standards.

Since none of my favs at Palace were working, I gave the place a pass.

A few weeks ago I dropped by Paradise on a Wednesday. Dead, dead dead. Also had trouble finding a good session there. A number of Palace girls (on their way to Berlin to work at Artemis) were working and pulling some of the same tricks that has made Palace's esteem drop so much in my eyes.

The P.S. just means that if a group of three shows up on a normal 3 for 2 day, then each will get a card for 5 Euros off the next visit.

Cheers,

Dedalus

Marlow

01-21-09, 22:19

Maybe the message will get through to those girls on the scam in these clubs. And to those who work independently and are trying to jack up prices. The pressure is one them to adjust, which to be fair is difficult as the government's 'tart' tax deducted at source by the clubs has gone up. So the first guest of the day is for the taxman and the second the club and the third to pay for their accommodation.
All clubs are taking a hit. In the Rheinland it's carnival time so business is managing to stay afloat.
I was in Hungary recently and the class agencies are still charging over 200 Euros an hour. Unbelievable, the country is one huge rip-off

Breadman

01-22-09, 00:18

The P.S. just means that if a group of three shows up on a normal 3 for 2 day, then each will get a card for 5 Euros off the next visit.

Makes sense seeing that the rate on 3 for 2 days would be 44 euro's and most of the guys that I ran into seemed to be local's who knew the name of the game seeing that I saw them every time I visited. Or they were just hopeless pussyhounds like myself ;-)

Sun Devil

01-22-09, 08:28

Just got back from World on Tueday night. Met a couple of fellow American mongers from New York City. Met a Serbian named Eva who I passed up, I just did not find her face that attractive, instead deciding on conversing with one of the fellow Americans because I had to rest from my sessions with Mercedes and a Belarus chick at Bernd's earlier that day.

Afterwards, could not passed up a session with Carolina from the Czech Republic. I think she went by the name of Linda at Palace. Great set of knockers--she told me they were 75 cm, F-cup. Had one of the best CIM sessions I had on this particular trip.

Afterwards, rested and did the deed with a tall Romanian chick (1.8 meters) named Theodora, who hangs with out with Ariana, another Romanian. She had great oral skills but I could not finish as I was too dry from my earlier sessions. I spent nearly 2 hours in the Egyptian room, which is next to the bar, with her. Enjoyed the house music while she was giving me a BBBJ.

Nick The G

01-22-09, 21:16

Just got back from World on Tueday night. .... Met a Serbian named Eva who I passed up, I just did not find her face that attractive, ....I've been there on the same day and I noticed some american guys around.
Well, I can assure you that you missed a lot, the "Rest of Eva" ist quite spectacular!
To me she looked beautifully "dressed" on that night.
I know Eva/Ewa from Serbia for some time already but always talked to her only.
But on this Tuesday I went with her the first time to the room.
And had a wonderful time with that lovely 23 years old woman!

You were this guy who was hanging round for hours with Theodora and Ariana till 4 o'clock in the morning at the central bar?

Vito Corleone

01-22-09, 23:41

"Dear guests, visitors and friends of our house,

now we offer a Winter Special: only 50, - Euro Admission all day.
We offer "of the economic crisis Paroli"!

The nudist WORLD team is looking forward to your visit and hopes unforgettable
Moments in the biggest and most exclusive naturist CLUB Europe.

PS: Monday - Wednesday is not even our permanent Special: Admission "3 for 2" --
All guests who come to receive a third 5, - euro discount card for the next entry."
Do you know how long this Winter special is going to last. General idea?

Sun Devil

01-22-09, 23:50

Nick the G, yeah dude that was me. Had to catch a flight to get back to the US at FRA early that morning so I figured I would hanged out until closing time with the Romanians. A couple of laidback girls. All in all just drank alcohol with them from 2:45 to 4 am while listening to house music and watching a bunch of people dance. Couldn't do anything else but that because of my earlier sessions that day at Bernd's as well as World.

Travelerb69

01-23-09, 00:34

Hey Sundevil, good to hear from you.

Afterwards, rested and did the deed with a tall Romanian chick (1.8 meters) named Theodora, who hangs with out with Ariana, another Romanian. She had great oral skills but I could not finish as I was too dry from my earlier sessions. I spent nearly 2 hours in the Egyptian room, which is next to the bar, with her. Enjoyed the house music while she was giving me a BBBJ.

I think her name is Diadora, not Theodora, tall, curly blond hair, a bit skinny?

So you drank with her and Ariana? I still remember Ariana and the "incident" with the capuccino- LOL. I can imagine how she is like when drunk.

Best regards, let´s see if we meet again in Germany.

Travelerb69.

Akibono

01-23-09, 03:33

Akibono,

Thank you for update.

What time was Linda at World?

Thanks,

Strato

Linda was there around 8:00 one day and around 5:00 another day and was constantly busy!

Dedalus

01-23-09, 08:13

Hey Sundevil, good to hear from you.

I think her name is Diadora, not Theodora, tall, curly blond hair, a bit skinny?

So you drank with her and Ariana? I still remember Ariana and the "incident" with the capuccino- LOL. I can imagine how she is like when drunk.

Best regards, let´s see if we meet again in Germany.

Travelerb69.

Hey T69,

Sundevil is right. Her name is Theodora. I did a session with her last Saturday. Not bad. Maybe a tad too distant for some tastes.

Cheers,

Dedalus

Hessen Bub

01-25-09, 14:40

Do you know how long this Winter special is going to last. General idea?

Guess it'll end with the party on Feb 7.

HB

Ortos

01-25-09, 15:07

Do you know how long this Winter special is going to last. General idea?

They had this same special going on last year too, right? I remember going into World during March and enjoying this reduced Eintritt...

Ortos

Jackyo

01-25-09, 17:22

What has become of our esteemed colleagues, Shiatsu and Cordelia?

Breadman

01-25-09, 17:29

They had this same special going on last year too, right? I remember going into World during March and enjoying this reduced Eintritt...

Ortos

And if I recall it ended sometime in April...so make use of it while its here. I was actually thinking of buying one of their 10 pass cards for 470 euro's next trip...but with the new reduced entry figure id wait till I visit in the summer/warmer weather.

Beffen1

01-25-09, 17:31

Guess it'll end with the party on Feb 7.

HB

I understand that if you pay full price 65 euro eintritt you can still sleep on the relax zone couches. Is that true?

Breadman

01-25-09, 17:33

Had to catch a flight to get back to the US at FRA early that morning so I figured I would hanged out until closing time with the Romanians. A couple of laidback girls. All in all just drank alcohol with them from 2:45 to 4 am while listening to house music and watching a bunch of people dance. .

If you have an early flight out, this is one of the best ways to spend that 50 euro's for the hotel room. Instead of sleeping in a lonely hotel bed, put that 50 to better use and sleep with a girl at the club for a half hour. Stick around till 5am (weekend departure only) and then head towards the airport. Plenty of time to grab some Zzzz's on the plane back home.

And there's something magical about that late 3am hour at World. Guys shagging girls gets few and far between...so the girls start doing some pole work and showing off to each other.

Breadman

01-25-09, 17:37

Guess it'll end with the party on Feb 7.

HB

they'll have this rate for the next few month's...until the weather starts to turn and more people start showing up. now if Oase matched this discount I wonder what would happen?

I understand that if you pay full price 65 euro eintritt you can still sleep on the relax zone couches. Is that true?

Not sure I understand the question. Are you refering to the couch's downstairs? If so, if you paid only 50 euro's they wouldn't let you sleep on the couch's? And if you slept on the relax zone couch's, how would they know what you paid upon entering?

Dedalus

01-25-09, 18:53

Not sure I understand the question. Are you refering to the couch's downstairs? If so, if you paid only 50 euro's they wouldn't let you sleep on the couch's? And if you slept on the relax zone couch's, how would they know what you paid upon entering?

The Beffster is being ironic. Some of us discovered last weekend that the club has put the kibosh on tired Gents sacking out on the comfy couches around the fireplace. Sleeping is still allowed by the pool and in the Kino.

I like World, but this unfortunate development really gives the place a few minuses in my book. Use to be great to shag oneself silly all day and stretch out on those big couches for a regenerative snooze. Trust me; those poolside chairs ain't made for cutting Z's.

Hopefully the good folks at World will soon realize the error of their ways. It ain't like a lot of boffin' is taking place on those sofas any way.

Cheers,

Dedalus, who left World last Saturday and Monday MUCH more tired than usual

Beffen1

01-25-09, 20:22

The Beffster is being ironic. Some of us discovered last weekend that the club has put the kibosh on tired Gents sacking out on the comfy couches around the fireplace. Sleeping is still allowed by the pool and in the Kino.

I like World, but this unfortunate development really gives the place a few minuses in my book. Use to be great to shag oneself silly all day and stretch out on those big couches for a regenerative snooze. Trust me; those poolside chairs ain't made for cutting Z's.

Hopefully the good folks at World will soon realize the error of their ways. It ain't like a lot of boffin' is taking place on those sofas any way.

Cheers,

Dedalus, who left World last Saturday and Monday MUCH more tired than usual

They have a website, let your displeasure be known, I'm sure they are listening.

Breadman

01-25-09, 20:45

They have a website, let your displeasure be known, I'm sure they are listening.

Have done just that...

Dedalus, who left World last Saturday and Monday MUCH more tired than usual

What exactly happened? Did they wake you from your beauty sleep? And is it all the couch's downstairs that they are focusing on or just those fluffy one's near the fireplace?

Dedalus

01-25-09, 21:01

What exactly happened? Did they wake you from your beauty sleep? And is it all the couch's downstairs that they are focusing on or just those fluffy one's near the fireplace?

Hey,

Yep, just woke everyone up.

According to Ruth (who btw was very polite about the whole thing) it was still OK if we used the chairs by the pool to snooze. I did not ask for details of the new policy, but I was under the impression that it is the couches in the entire Relax Zone.

She only mentioned that it had been getting too extreme (extreme relaxing, now THERE'S a sport!) of late with the sleeping. Given the lack of male guests there of late, I suspect that this is just the party line. More likely, some of the girls have complained that too many male guests are relaxing instead of screwing.

Cheers,

Dedalus, who thinks longingly back to happier days when Ruth would cover him with an extra towel while relaxing in the Relax Zone

Gergiev

01-25-09, 23:20

What has become of our esteemed colleagues, Shiatsu and Cordelia?

They turned up recently in the UK General Info section with some posts about the new legislation regulating prostitution in Britain...

However, no empirical posts of late as far as I can see...

Strato

01-26-09, 01:01

Back in 2005, one of our esteemed members posted about taking the 630 bus, to and from Giessen to World. (see below). Dick advised getting off Bus 630 at Pohlheim-Garbenteich Sportplatz stop as best stop for World.

Can anyone advise as to how far World is from the Pohlheim-Garbenteich Sportplatz stop? Are cabs available at this stop to get World?

Personally I prefer Public Trans if available, as when leaving the clubs after a long day/night. My driving skills most likely are impaired. I. E. Cross-eyed vision, limping, etc. Any thoughts/assistance is appreciated.

Strato

(below was posted in 2005 by Dick Rambone)

Bus 630 -Schedule below is from World to Giessen, reverse for Giessen to World.

Pohlheim-Garbenteich Sportplatz 21:11 - Pohlheim-Garbenteich Dorf-Güller Straße 21:12 - Pohlheim-Garbenteich Apotheke 21:14 - Pohlheim-Garbenteich Schiffenbergstraße 21:15 Gießen Klingelbachweg 21:33 - Gießen Aulweg 21:34 - Gießen Liebigschule 21:35 - Gießen Berliner Platz 21:38 - Gießen Johanneskirche 21:41 - Gießen Bahnhof 21:46

Hessen Bub

01-26-09, 10:03

Some of us discovered last weekend that the club has put the kibosh on tired Gents sacking out on the comfy couches around the fireplace. Sleeping is still allowed by the pool and in the Kino.

Are they going nuts?! I pay my entrance and period, if I wanna sleep on one of the couches, I'll do it. The lower level is empty anyway, especially at daytime.

And no, Oase has never matched any World discounts.

HB

Dedalus

01-26-09, 18:11

Dick advised getting off Bus 630 at Pohlheim-Garbenteich Sportplatz stop as best stop for World.

Can anyone advise as to how far World is from the Pohlheim-Garbenteich Sportplatz stop? Are cabs available at this stop to get World?

Bus 630 -Schedule below is from World to Giessen, reverse for Giessen to World.

Pohlheim-Garbenteich Sportplatz 21:11 - Pohlheim-Garbenteich Dorf-Güller Straße 21:12 - Pohlheim-Garbenteich Apotheke 21:14 - Pohlheim-Garbenteich Schiffenbergstraße 21:15 Gießen Klingelbachweg 21:33 - Gießen Aulweg 21:34 - Gießen Liebigschule 21:35 - Gießen Berliner Platz 21:38 - Gießen Johanneskirche 21:41 - Gießen Bahnhof 21:46

Probably only a 3 minute walk or so. No cab needed. You will probably have to cab it back to Giessen if you leave World pretty late.

Cheers,

Dedalus

Dedalus

01-26-09, 18:18

Are they going nuts?! I pay my entrance and period, if I wanna sleep on one of the couches, I'll do it. The lower level is empty anyway, especially at daytime.

HB

Hey HB,

A guy might can get away with it during the day. When someone is manning the bar (after 6PM?) then that area gets policed a bit more often.

Are they nuts? Well, I certainly don't agree with the policy. Again, I suspect that the girls have somehow pushed this one through. Not a good time for that club to be annoying its regulars, so yeah, maybe they have gone a little loony.

Cheers,

Dedalus

Vito Corleone

01-27-09, 03:33

And if I recall it ended sometime in April...so make use of it while its here. I was actually thinking of buying one of their 10 pass cards for 470 euro's next trip...but with the new reduced entry figure id wait till I visit in the summer/warmer weather.
Thanks for the info fellas. I booked a trip in mid Feb & was hoping the reduced entry would still be offered.

Vito Corleone

01-27-09, 03:40

What has become of our esteemed colleagues, Shiatsu and Cordelia?
They were both there on Sat December 6th. Cordelia still has a great bod for someone her age. Not sure how long they stayed as my infatuation with Zarina locked me up until closing.

Mike De H

01-27-09, 12:53

They have a website, let your displeasure be known, I'm sure they are listening.

I must do that some time when I can feel up to it.

Can I point out Beffs, that at least the Kino is nice and quiet and comfortable. Nobody would ever go in there and find you on the bottom bed in the left corner.

Dedalus

01-27-09, 13:25

Can I point out Beffs, that at least the Kino is nice and quiet and comfortable. Nobody would ever go in there and find you on the bottom bed in the left corner.

Hey Mickey,

Comfy, yes. Quiet? Not really. The music from the main room is seriously loud and my noise cancelling headphones are too bulky to allow comfortable sleeping. Plus, now and then the Kino gets used for sporting activities and that can get loud. A few years ago some dude was doggin' the hell out of Jacqueline less than 2 feet away from where I was snoozing. The skin slapping was loud enough to wake me for a while.

Cheers,

Dedalus

Hunter10

01-27-09, 14:42

I finally get to go back to World after almost 2 years.

I notice some major changes. They renovated the main hall and they remodel the rooms to theme rooms like many high class clubs do.

There's Italy,Asian, Egypt, New York and other fancy decorated rooms. They have a Tv in a select few where you can watch porn while having sex. What more can you ask for sometimes.

The food has also improve greatly over 2 years ago. The selection was just hot dogs and sausages back then. If you want people to stay or comeback reinvest back a little and they did. The new world improved and so has the food.

Service in general is higher here than in Palace. I can't make that statement comparing World to Oase. I like Oase.

I had Three ladies and they all knew how to give good service.

I was surprise with one of selection. There was a hot looking girl with a nice ass. She look Hispanic. She turn out to be from India. I could not initially tell but as you heard her speak I said wow. I always wanted to be with someone from India. Ladies from background like Suriname or Guayana I've seen but from India it was novelty. She was friendly and did CIM.

The service was good overall. I can't remember names after a few days jumping from FKK to FKK.

EDITOR'S NOTE: I would suggest that the author or another Forum Member consider posting a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please Click Here (http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?) for more information.

Basketcase

01-27-09, 21:20

my infatuation with Zarina locked me up until closing.

Hi Vito Corleone,

Zarina (Ukraine) is now back from holidays. She made up in spades for the Christmas party nacht charging for room waiting time thanks.

Trip report to come.

Basketcase

01-27-09, 23:03

FKK World

Arrived: 11:15
Departed: 05:15 next day

Transport: Sixti hire car at €18.75 per tag including airport surcharge at 19%.

Hotel: Etap Giessen Sued Linden at €38 per nacht

Time in club: 18 hours (crazy)

Entritt: €35 being €50 Winter Special preis less €15 discount karten. Gut 15 prozent off.

1.) Maria (Bulgaria)

One of my usual crew took this hustling lady to the zimmer twice on a previous raid on World. She is dark haired, natural C cups, is plump (we compared stomach sizes), not average looking, I could not work out what the attraction was so when it came to me Maria did her sales pitch which went along the lines of “I’ll lick you here, there and everywhere intimately”. After a lot of whining from Maria to take her to the zimmer I just caved. I was tired and she had her hands on my schwanz so I did not have much choice. In the room Maria began the up sell for extras and I declined. Did the basics like BBBJ and covered sex but did not deliver on the “I’ll lick you here, there and everywhere intimately” or DFK advertisement. The session was a €50 compensation charge. I wanted to get out of that room as fast as possible. I will never ever repeat. I get the impression my mate was doing her to induce me to give me the impression to do her as well for the pure laugh factor of seeing me do a girl I would not go with normally. Well your practical joke worked since I did. LOL. YMMV and all the usual riders as I expect many others find her stimulating and an absolute dream. There are better choices for my taste at World. I will not be repeating.

2.) Simone (Romania) also known as Mia (Romania) at FKK Oase

Curly long blond hair, blue eyes, gorgeously formed natural C cups, petite, tanned, pretty & disarming smile, average build. Simone allowed kissing in the room but not in the main contact room. Simone performs nipple licking on me on her way down to BBBJ where her mouth went half way down the shaft. On with the condom for sex first in cowgirl (okay), missionary then doggie then finish with Simone lying flat on her stomach as I finished fucking her from behind with a COB finale. At first I decided that I would not repeat with Simone because her BBBJ was not first rate for my tastes but seeing her more and more each visit I can see her growing on me. She is sweet and we flirt outrageously with each other. She accepted €50 compensation.

3.) Angela (Romania) or Angie for short

Blond, blue eyes, natural D cups, average build, speaks good English. Totally naked with no accentuating accessories or clothing like Ariana. I like the look. Seemed to be unhibited happily sitting on couches or chairs with her legs akimbo showing off her clean shaven muschi. I also like that in a girl. Such a nice looking muschi. Performs kissing but not open mouth kissing, decent BBBJ. Sex in various positions and allowed COB finish. She accepted €50 compensation.

Present during my visit:

Angela (Romania) blond, totally naked, nice natural D cups, average build

Ariana (Romania) slender blond, blue eyes, tall, slim, natual C cup breasts that are perfectly formed, pert nipples that point to the sky, all over tan and went around totally naked except for her heels. I like the naked look on her. Looking at her in side profile as she sits is divine. Has a tattoo on her top right hand shoulder blade. I missed out taking this lovely creature to the zimmer.

Eva (Romania)

Janine (German)

Katya (Bulgaria) long dark hair, slim, does an energetic session and does tricks to your underside (you know where)

Maria (Bulgaria)

Nicole (Ukraine) Zarina’s tall brunette friend with pale skin. Friendly girl and was game for hanging out on a slow night.

Olivia (Poland) working to April

Simone (World) /Mia (Oase) (Romania)

Theodora (Romania)

Zarina (Ukraine) really friendly and happy to sit and chat for quite some time several times. Even shared time in Jacuzzi with some fondling for frei. Made up for her charging me €50 for waiting time.

Zoe (Romania)

? (Turkish German) dark haired, average build, likes to dance and is lively in the bar area

Did not see:

Carolina (World)/Linda (Palace)/Adriana (Oase) (Czech Republic) natural F cup and deep and slow BBBJ

Eva (Serbia) slender, tanned, brown eyed dark haired girl, leggy with a tight arse.

Karolina (Ukraine) gorgeous brunette, big brown eyes, A cups. Moved to another club.

Lisa (Poland) slender blond, bubbly laugh, B cups. Retired. A favourite sadly departed. Tears from this one at this news.

Sandra (Germany) – little pixie blond with tattoos on her very nice unblemished skin. High cheek bones and always had a smile for this one.

Napping arrangements: loungers by the pool were fine

Food: roast chicken, chipped potatoes, salad selection, pea and sausage souppe, with chocolate mousse or custard cream for sweet.

Total outlay: €185 for an 18 hour stay at FKK World.

Dick Travel

01-27-09, 23:38

FKK World
Arrived: 11:15
Departed: 05:15 next day

Hotel: Etap Giessen Sued Linden at €38 per nacht

Blimey, I assume the hotel was for the night before you hit World then ! I've stayed in ETAPs and found corridor/door noise prevented any sleep beyond 7 ish ! Did you head for the airport from World?

Time in club: 18 hours (crazy)

Total outlay: €185 for an 18 hour stay at FKK World.

So, I was just doing the sums and weighing up the now near 1:1 of GBP to Euro and whether it makes much odds to mongerers from UK.

You spent:

€185 at World
+ €18.75 for the car
+ €38 for hotel
+ £100 for flights at max? (although expect you did better budget flight)
= £341.75 (working on approx 1:1 exchange)

UK rates for a 30 min session would be at least £100 to get anywhere near FKK service, even then unlikely.
Add in the 18 hours of luxurious surroundings plus oodles of eye candy and food/drink for free.

Now you're looking at 341.75/18 = ~£19 an hour for hanging out in "mens disneyland" and 3 shags into the bargain.

LBC, you know how to get value for money ! Nice one.

£19 per hour, mmmm, if you took the flights out of the equation and if World allowed laptops and wifi, one could make more than £19 an hour surely working online between sessions? One could adopt World's lounge as a permanant and very cool office to work in eh !?

Basketcase

01-27-09, 23:58

Guten Tag Herr Dick Travel,

Alles Klar? I am glad you enjoyed your trip to Berlin and the almighty Artemis.

Blimey, I assume the hotel was for the night before you hit World then ! I've stayed in ETAPs and found corridor/door noise prevented any sleep beyond 7 ish ! Did you head for the airport from World?

I had been at Oase for 18 hours leaving at 05:00 the previous nacht before my World visit so had about 4 hours sleep at this Etaps before hitting World. I think I was so knackered that I slept okay and even had a tug watching the pay phone in porn on TV before settling down.

From World I went to check into another hotel in the Hessen area for the next raid that I executed.

Now, thats ~€10.27 per hour for luxurious surroundings, plenty of eye candy and 3 sessions and food/drink, thats defintiely getting top value. Nice one LBC.

Yes, good value if you have the staying power to be there that long and not get cabin fever.

I cannot say that I was that enarmored of the eye candy at World. I only have a few faves at World. Sometimes the oase line up be best described as average - what gives the girls the edge is the fact that they are naked. Palace - more and more has been getting good reports on the beauties working there. What Palace has less in its favour as a FKK is that just about all the girls are wearing some sort of clothing covering themselves up e.g. a shoulder wrap, waist wrap, body stocking, etc...

Cheers,

Londonbasketcase

Dick Travel

01-28-09, 00:25

Marlow

01-28-09, 09:02

Marlow

01-28-09, 09:27

Hessen Bub

01-28-09, 09:42

I thought World did allow laptops and had wifi installed for its beach club?

They do allow laptops, I've seen guys using them. But with my devices I've not found any WiFi in the club or somewhere outside. So I would say there's none. With UMTS internet access should be no problem.

HB

Dedalus

01-28-09, 13:29

I thought World did allow laptops and had wifi installed for its beach club? maybe I was dreaming. Perhaps under their current crisis awareness programme they should now have an executive suite with a resident headhunter to discuss your future prospects.

Hey,

Like HB, I have been all over that club looking for a WiFi signal. There just ain't one. With the beach club closed at the moment, technically there is no place in the club or one the grounds that one can use their mobiles. The exception to this rule is in the area around the entrance.

Cheers,

Dedalus

Jimmy Boy 99

01-28-09, 13:30

They do allow laptops, I've seen guys using them. But with my devices I've not found any WiFi in the club or somewhere outside. So I would say there's none. With UMTS internet access should be no problem.

HB

When and where did you see them in World? I was in the upstairs lounge last year with my laptop and was told I had to put it back in the locker. Perhaps they've changed the policy or it's OK in other areas.

Dedalus

01-28-09, 14:08

But and this is a big but, or rather a big why......has it become the norm for girls at an upmarket FKK club to behave no better than girls in a laufhaus? Why is it acceptable, because it seems that way from LBC's report, for girls to up the ante in the room? And since when did mongers start happily handing over 50 Euros for having a 'little chat'?

Hey Marlow,

The short answer is yes. Some of the time:-)))

The scene has changed a lot since I visited Dolce Vita for the first time (back in 96) and I definitely have observed that more girls pull the ole' shuck-and-jive, double-cross with a guy than back in the day.

The factors are many, and I do long for the day when a Gent could take a lady to the room and not have standards dumped on him as extras. This happened to me some weeks ago at Paradise when an ex Palace girl tried to sell me kissing and ball-licking once in the room for an extra 50 each. Tried to tell me that this was standard will all the girls. I had no definite clue before taking her to the room that she would pull this and I have great empathy for guys who complain about "this or that club" where this practice seems for the norm than the exception.

I am all for the clubs standing behind the girls, but I loose patience with the argument that while a girl may be a rip off, a club is innocent or a Gent is a sucker who should have known better. (No offense meant to my buddy, Ortos. We just have a different read on that one.)

I actually do believe that either greed, indifference or both on the part of many club owners and management have played a big roll in the decline of service standards in many of the big clubs. This wasn't always the case.

Also an "Absockerin" was easier to spot and isolate a few years back and they usually did not stay in the biz that long. Word got out and she either changed her wicked ways or spent the days alone and had problems meeting her quota.

I could always forgive a bad session. That could always be chalked up to many factors other than dishonesty. "Up-selling" once in the room or trying to cheat on the time spent in room, I have never had patience for and those girls should be avoided like leprosy.

I have high regard for Lisa at GT and Dana at LR. Neither kiss, but they are upfront about it BEFORE you get them to the room. I also think that it is no coincidence that both are incredible sessions.

I feel for LBC. Did he make an error in judgment? Yeah, probably. Still this Maria gal just made my own personal black-list. Wouldn't be a terrible thing if the folks at World (and a few other clubs) had such a list as well.

Cheers,

Dedalus

Cularo

01-28-09, 14:16

Olivia (Poland) working to Aprilshe changes her plans? . Sunday 18th janaury, she told me she finishes the month a fkk world, then go in February in fkk Globe near Zurich.

I told her the story of a girl I know in Oase, who worked in fkk globe 2 years ago. She was not so "hot" anymore to go to work there. Who knows with that girl, she changes her mind and club as often as panties. LOL

Ortos

01-28-09, 16:36

Hey Marlow,

I am all for the clubs standing behind the girls, but I loose patience with the argument that while a girl may be a rip off, a club is innocent or a Gent is a sucker who should have known better. (No offense meant to my buddy, Ortos. We just have a different read on that one.)

I actually do believe that either greed, indifference or both on the part of many club owners and management have played a big roll in the decline of service standards in many of the big clubs. This wasn't always the case.

Cheers,

Dedalus

No offense taken, old bean... I think it is healthy and fine that some of us have different reads on things, and most of us can exchange these views like the true gentlemen mongers that we are...

In my post on the Palace thread (which is I suppose what you are referring to) I was just trying to make the point that there is a responsibility on the part of the male customer to test the waters somewhat with a girl before he departs immediately to the room. There should be some attempt to form a kind of verbal contract where things like DFK and other "standard" features are spelled out BEFORE entering the room.

As you yourself just noted, times have changed and we live and operate in an altered FKK reality from, say, 2002 or 2003. Today, sadly, one must bring these issues up or in some way test matters before you consumate the deal by going into the room. This is esp. the case nowadays at clubs like: Palace and GT and sometimes at Oase and World. If I guy does not make any effort, then he leaves himself open to having corners cut and being somewhat taken advantage of.

My point and advice for any guy going to a large club like Palace or wherever these days is: As you draw near to the point of deciding to go to a room with a girl, why not lean in and plant a kiss on her lips to see if she'll open up and bring the tounge into play. Kudos to the girls you cited, Dedalus, who are considerate enough to let you know their session limitations BEFORE you go to the room.

Now for a guy to enter a club like Palace and have one bad experience with one girl who he may well have just gone to the room with without anykind of pre-zimmer interview or testing and then turn around and say: The whole club is a rip-off club, well, that is just not cricket! We don't know anything about the specifics here, so we'll wait and see if in fact he was ripped off or just made a bad choice.

Surely you will agree that we guys have some responsibility to select our fruit from the tree and reject rotten apples that might walk up to us or somehow land in our lap, right?

I will not defend the Palace management, but I will say: I seldom run into these kind of problems because I observe, assess and test girls and their behaviour before I commit. And if I do happen to choose a dud, I often blame myself for choosing wrongly.

As for World, I have to commend the management actually: Recently I had great hour session with one of their top girls, who near the end of the first half-hour tried to upsell me on extras. I told her: "Instead of CIM, I prefer to carry on for another half-hour" i.e. I extended the session giving her an extra 50E income. Then near the end of the next half-hour she again tried to upsell the CIM. Again I told her I did not want extra anything but was happy to end at one hour and then probably go for another hour with her later in the night. What did she do: she sucked me strong and hard--wonderfully, really!-- and then at the moment when I was clearly going to explode, she manipulated me and my man organ in such a way that some of the cum landed on her body. I did not request it, she made it happen. Her body was positioned such that she was in total control of where my fluids would land or not land.

Then at the pay locker she tried to collect an extra 50E (on top of the 100E for 1hr) for the extra COB. I cried foul but she held her ground and would not relent. So I demanded that we go to the front desk. The lady on duty was a familiar face to me, I believe her name is Francesca who at one time worked behind the bar. (Dark hair, dark tan, tatoos). She listened to both sides, then told me that it was up to me if I wanted to pay the extra 50E to the girl. I said it was not a matter of the money, but of the principle and that I was absolutely sure this girl did this on purpose to take advantage of me. Therefore, I rejected to pay the extra money. I said to them both that it was rather stupid of the girl, because clearly was very, very happy with this girl and her service and that if she had not pulled this stunt at the pay locker, and just let this matter go, I surely would have seen her again...and probably again and again and again. So I did NOT pay any money, and Francesca said she would talk to the girl privately and deal with it.

I sincerely believe this girl was trying to pull something, which is a damn shame, because she was top-notch looks and performance. Should I mention her name? It starts with "E" and she comes from Serbia...go figure.

Ortos

Marlow

01-28-09, 17:49

Excess

01-28-09, 17:55

I bow to the gentlemen whose posts appear before mine and many other posters, in their near encyclopaedic knowledge and experience in the FKK scene. Interesting and very civil discussion on the sliding standards and tensions that have arisen in the scene over the years between guests and girls in FKK land.

All very understandable from both the customer and server points of view as it rotates very much around human nature.

Simply to say, it is really largely up to the customer to assess, define and try to maintain standards in this and all worlds (no pun intended). If done with a smile, no offense should be taken by the providers and usually one is respected all the more for it which can give rise to expectations being met by both sides. I think that we can all agree that many girls do look for and do respond to a pleasurable experience in their work day as every good work person does. Again, human nature to respond favorably to a customer with a bit of game and who knows what he expects and wants and is not stingy in sharing the same. Saying that, this reporter has slipped and made session decisions in the heat of the, umm, moment and the results are predictable - either all goes according to the estrogen induced dream, or not. In memory, many sessions that were not memorable were partially or fully my own fault for many reasons. A substantial number were due to the other side not fulfilling the promises made prior to. It happens and best simply to move on.

Without utilising verbal and other signals to form a scoping agreement pre-session, we are left with the only alternate where clubs provide small paper pre-session drive/flight check lists for both sides to agree to and if necessary sign-off on. Effective, but that would be very sad and simply reinforce that the verbal side and other signals between humans have gone out of play which is not what many want to experience in FKK's or other ares of life.

The isolation of girls who do a constant upsell or worse change the rules of the road in zimmer is very much warranted and to be encouraged and the offenders identities shared. The resulting Financial discipline and loss is a mighty thing for both girls and clubs.

Enough. Many thanks to to O, D, M and many others for your experienced views and for sharing. Chocks away !!!!

Dedalus

01-28-09, 18:17

Hey Man,

No offense taken, old bean... I think it is healthy and fine that some of us have different reads on things, and most of us can exchange these views like the true gentlemen mongers that we are...

Indeed! Wish that it could be like this with others. Old bean? I’m hurt ;-)))

In my post on the Palace thread (which is I suppose what you are referring to) I was just trying to make the point that there is a responsibility on the part of the male customer to test the waters somewhat with a girl before he departs immediately to the room. There should be some attempt to form a kind of verbal contract where things like DFK and other "standard" features are spelled out BEFORE entering the room.

True enough. I suppose that I am just nostalgic for the good ole' days when chatting up a lass had a little less of the business transaction aura about it. Of course, you are right about this.

As you yourself just noted, times have changed and we live and operate in an altered FKK reality from, say, 2002 or 2003. Today, sadly, one must bring these issues up or in some way test matters before you consumate the deal by going into the room. This is esp. the case nowadays at clubs like: Palace and GT and sometimes at Oase and World. If I guy does not make any effort, then he leaves himself open to having corners cut and being somewhat taken advantage of.

True again. I must say that I hate that part of this game. I have no illusions about this being a business for the girls, but I find negotiating extras and the like a bit of a mood killer. Assessing personalities is another matter. THAT can be fun.

My point and advice for any guy going to a large club like Palace or wherever these days is: As you draw near to the point of deciding to go to a room with a girl, why not lean in and plant a kiss on her lips to see if she'll open up and bring the tounge into play. Kudos to the girls you cited, Dedalus, who are considerate enough to let you know their session limitations BEFORE you go to the room.

Not a bad idea, but a huckster is not above kissing outside the room and trying to charge a Gent extra for it once in the room. I got tagged by one of those at Paradise recently. Getting guys into the room and THEN pulling out the menu is a common ploy these days. Luckily I have only fallen victim to that one a few times in the last few years. Mostly, but not always at Palace.

Now for a guy to enter a club like Palace and have one bad experience with one girl who he may well have just gone to the room with without anykind of pre-zimmer interview or testing and then turn around and say: The whole club is a rip-off club, well, that is just not cricket! We don't know anything about the specifics here, so we'll wait and see if in fact he was ripped off or just made a bad choice.

While I don’t hold truck with those who say that Palace is one big rip-off (Hell, I still go there now and then when I know a fav or two of mine will be present) I can understand the frustration. Customer service ain’t their main concern. Beffen’s experience last year was a prime example.

http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showpost.php?p=739642&postcount=2961

Surely you will agree that we guys have some responsibility to select our fruit from the tree and reject rotten apples that might walk up to us or somehow land in our lap, right?

I will not defend the Palace management, but I will say: I seldom run into these kind of problems because I observe, assess and test girls and their behaviour before I commit. And if I do happen to choose a dud, I often blame myself for choosing wrongly.

Well, yes and no. If you mean that we have a responsibility to not reward gals who ply their trade dishonestly, or even provide half-baked service, then certainly we have that duty. I was never such a fan of the concept in some clubs that girls should never approach or “animate” the guys. However I must admit that those places have/had more clarity in the selection process and I NEVER got fleeced in such a joint. Now like you, I don’t have many problems wherever I go. I’ve been at this a while, speak decent German and tend to spend most of my money on gals that I already know. And if, when choosing a new girl, I happen upon a session that is not to my liking, then I usually shrug and move on without much regret. However the ones that cheat get me a little hot. And the clubs that too often turn a blind eye or worse, ENCOURAGE such behavior work my nerves as well. I hope that we get the chance to discuss this aspect in person sometimes.

As for World, I have to commend the management actually: Recently I had great hour session with one of their top girls, who near the end of the first half-hour tried to upsell me on extras. I told her: "Instead of CIM, I prefer to carry on for another half-hour" i.e. I extended the session giving her an extra 50E income. Then near the end of the next half-hour she again tried to upsell the CIM. Again I told her I did not want extra anything but was happy to end at one hour and then probably go for another hour with her later in the night. What did she do: she sucked me strong and hard--wonderfully, really!-- and then at the moment when I was clearly going to explode, she manipulated me and my man organ in such a way that some of the cum landed on her body. I did not request it, she made it happen. Her body was positioned such that she was in total control of where my fluids would land or not land.

Then at the pay locker she tried to collect an extra 50E (on top of the 100E for 1hr) for the extra COB. I cried foul but she held her ground and would not relent. So I demanded that we go to the front desk. The lady on duty was a familiar face to me, I believe her name is Francesca who at one time worked behind the bar. (Dark hair, dark tan, tatoos). She listened to both sides, then told me that it was up to me if I wanted to pay the extra 50E to the girl. I said it was not a matter of the money, but of the principle and that I was absolutely sure this girl did this on purpose to take advantage of me. Therefore, I rejected to pay the extra money. I said to them both that it was rather stupid of the girl, because clearly was very, very happy with this girl and her service and that if she had not pulled this stunt at the pay locker, and just let this matter go, I surely would have seen her again...and probably again and again and again. So I did NOT pay any money, and Francesca said she would talk to the girl privately and deal with it.

I sincerely believe this girl was trying to pull something, which is a damn shame, because she was top-notch looks and performance. Should I mention her name? It starts with "E" and she comes from Serbia...go figure.

Ortos

Good for you and good for Francesca. World is not a perfect club, but overall I think that they treat their guests quite well.

Although I have had several good sessions with Eva, I am not really surprised. She’s a bit of a processor and you might have caught her on a day when her personal quota might have needed to be a bit higher. No excuse though and I’m glad you stood your ground. I don’t want her getting any weird ideas the next time I take her to the room.

Cheers,

Dedalus

Toscana

01-28-09, 20:08

@Ortos
You've opened my eyes with this story at World. You are a man of immense patience. This girl tried to roll you twice and then when that failed tried getting the extra fifty with a body swerve. And still you would go with her again. I'm baffled.As I read it, Ortos was saying he would have gone again with her if she hadn't behaved this way. So, no. And that is only right conclusion to draw of course.

Ortos

01-28-09, 20:37

@Ortos
You've opened my eyes with this story at World. You are a man of immense patience. This girl tried to roll you twice and then when that failed tried getting the extra fifty with a body swerve. And still you would go with her again. I'm baffled.
And if this is the Francesca I know she is Italian, a body builder hardbody who used to work in the biz herself and charge 200 an hour out of Frankfurt. Glad she stood up for you.
Frankly I would have stopped the second part of the session walked out and told she girl she could have her hundred and I hoped never to see her again. I'd make sure I didn't come either. I would make very sure she knew my opinion of her in the nicest possible way.
A stunning Russian blonde perched on a stool at Finca I approached and talked to, cut me short and said 'I only go to the room'. My reply was 'I'm not stopping you, go now.' Yes, she was shaken and soon left the club for good.
Why are men prepared to travel to Germany and be treated like this? Especially when many of them say they are ripped off at home and Germany is better.
Why put up with this type of humiliation from these girls with a shrug of the shoulders and a hey nonny, nonny let's whistle a happy tune while they fleece us?
Now I don't want to offend you guys, but if you read the German boards this kind of behaviour would soon get them steaming mad and telling the management what they think. And as I have never read such blatant case histories on the German boards I can only assume these girls try it on with visiting Anglo-Saxons and non German speakers.
I would also add you guys have a duty to stop it, because if Dedalus is right it is affecting or rather infecting the whole business

Hi Marlow,

I think you have not interpreted correctly what happened with my session, nor have you understood correctly some of my writing. I take full responsibility for this, because I must not have been clear and lucid.

Toscana understood me correctly: At no point did I say that I would go with her again. What I meant to say was: It's a shame she pulled this crap, because had she not, I surely would have gone with her again and again and probably become one of her steady Stamm-guys. So in her greed to harvest an extra 50E through suspect behaviour, she lost alot more euros from me in potential future business. That was my point.

And by the way our converse throughout was auf Deutsch, so for all she knew I was German; I have no idea if she speaks English or not.

You say she tried to "roll" me not once but twice. This is NOT the case. She mentioned extra services for extra Euros once as the first half-hour drew near to a close. That is not rolling anybody. She did not know me from before, so I don't hold it against a girl to mention to a new guest: "Oh ubrigens, I do a great CIM, if you are interested." Why not? They're entitled to earn their extras if men want that service. Often great bbbj performers, and this was certainly one, let men know. Fair enough. It was her repeating it at the end of the second 30 mins, after I had already declined CIM in favour of extending the session, that was a bit out of order. Then her "body swerve" (Lol, that is good!) and refusing to drop the issue at the pay locker. THAT is revealing. It made her inner shark fins visible...so I would not desire to re-session with her, and I never said so.

While I do commend Francesca for playing the fair independent broker between the two parties, and for giving me the choice to pay or not, I think this is simply a FKK World management policy. They saw me as a Regular Guest. They knew I would be upset if forced to pay when I felt I was being wronged by this girl. So they took a middle ground and let me save face, knowing that they would preserve my custom. Francesca was not in the room, so she could not say who was in reality right or wrong. I had the impression that maybe the club was going to give the girl some money, in lieu of me paying her. OTOH maybe there have been other incidents with the same girl and they held her back for private discussions and told her to knock off the crap. I don't know.

Oh I can visualise in my mind's eye our esteemed colleagues JackyO, Excess, Isee and other NRW afficianados shaking their head in disgust and saying: This kind of bullshit would never happen at proper clubs like Bernd's, etc....And they're absolutely right about this. But...Do you believe in change?

As Dedalus has already suggested: The writing is on the wall. The so-called "old days" of great service at minimal prices are gone. I know this is not change we want to believe in...

We have to be sceptical now about many new girls we might engage to session with, esp in large clubs like the Hessen 3 or GT and perhaps others. But just as it is "fun" to assess the girls' qualities and mentally decide if they go to the "shark" or "gfe" categories (the two extremes), I think it is also beholden on the girls to start assessing some of the men they chat up more carefully and get a feel for whether this guy is a tourist newbie or an experienced ffker who knows the rules and may well see right through her games.

Dedalus makes a very interesting point when he suggests that the problems we are discussing are less prevalent in clubs where girls do not approach the men, mainly clubs in NRW. I can say, that there maybe something to that. I would never even dream that a girl at, say, F39 would try to pull some of this shit. No DFKing? Never! Sure some guys, maybe alot of married men and others, do not engage in DFK with girls at the clubs. But plenty do seek it and it is/should continue to be a standard element of the FKK session, whether that session is 30mins or longer. That is my view of it anyway.

Ortos

Breadman

01-28-09, 21:26

Why are men prepared to travel to Germany and be treated like this?

This is why we travel so far...

http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/years/2009/0128091tampa1.html

out of 19, number 2 and 3 might be doable. for all you AO lovers out there, number 19 has a clean bill of health, those are just cold sore's from all the cold weather tampa's been having lately.

Basketcase

01-28-09, 23:42

I think you posted a response while I was editing my post and we crossed timings ! Your quote of me is now out of date !

18 hrs at Oase, 4 hrs sleep then 18 hours at World, then another raid the next day ! Is that all? Where's your staying power? ;-)

Yes, agree on lineup comments, World wins on facilities with me, if was was to spend 18 hours I'd far rather do so at World than Oase or Palace where I would get cabin fever!
Oase and Palace have best lookers for lineup (when it is good Oase has edge). Yes, Palace girls wear more, but personally I like the stockings/wraps thing, they can be used to disguise bits though so need to do some filtering !

regards DT

Hi Dick Travel,

Yes, our messages have passed each other like ships in the night.

The time spent on each razzia (raids) were in order:

18 hours Oase
18 hours World
14.5 hours
12 hours
15.5 hours

Totalling 78 hours for entritt fees of €295 so that is €3.78 per hour.

I was getting cabin fever towards the end of the spell in sex heaven. It is good to have a banter with the girls as they keep me entertained and they usually drag me into their games or insist that I service them (in more ways than one). Makes the time go faster. Then I also meet up with other crews from all over the world.

Yes, my power was flagging and I was wondering why was I subjecting myself to this pain? I should get a girlfriend, get married to her and settle down, be faithful and have little Londonbasketcases to bring up and nuture to adulthood.

World has the best facilities of the Hessen three and gives Palace a run for its money on food the difference is at World is that the food tends to be always available whereas less so at Palace and do not mention the dearth of food available at Oase.

I agree that Palace does have the lookers but I find many more that I like at Oase. Further I can get the services I like at Oase but less so at World and even lesser at Palace. It is rare for me to find a girl that does not kiss at Oase. Alia (Germany) is one.

Also it feels less inhibited at Oase - anything goes there sort of feeling. I mean Jozsef the ijsbeer held a party there with balloons, glow sticks, light emitting rings, glow rings, glow rings and got up on the dance pole podium to be stripped naked with a horde of Romanian girls clamouring for his party hand outs. Myself and a crew of other ijsberen were in stitches with laughter that night.

Then there was the Deutsch man dressed up like Pappa Christmas with big red yeti boots get a blow job from Alba (Germany/Greece) on the dance pole podium to the merriment to the festive crowd at Oase. Alba wanted to do the same to me!!

I can take stockings on girls but I do like a naked girl as she is ready for action. Girls look much better naked.

Basketcase

01-29-09, 00:04

I admire LBC doing an 18 hour working day (and night) on the World production line.

But and this is a big but, or rather a big why......has it become the norm for girls at an upmarket FKK club to behave no better than girls in a laufhaus? Why is it acceptable, because it seems that way from LBC's report, for girls to up the ante in the room? And since when did mongers start happily handing over 50 Euros for having a 'little chat'?

I don't know any native German speaker who would put up with what passes for normal when dealing with non German speakers.

Salute Marlow,

It was a long day in the life of Londonbasketcase to be in a club for 18 hours. It is just that my hotel room does not have naked women in it. I understand that the going rate is €200 per hour for a girl to come to your hotel.

The €50 for 30 minutes of waiting time for the room was a one off for the Christmas party night and Zarina was not really into working that night for her own reasons. Zarina (Ukraine) and I spent a good 2-3 hours chatting, fooling around and taking a jacuzzi together last trip. Nicole (Ukraine) her friend also was hanging out and was more forward in enjoying my frei services on offer.

I have mixed compensation requirements from the girls at World. For example, Eva (Serbia) wanted to charge Ortos €50 for COB that she engineered by making him come when blowing him to completion. I too have been charged €50 extra for COB by Eva (Serbia). I just have to remember to come in the condom when with her nowadays.

Olivia (Polen) also charges €50 extra for COB, but my lovely Lisa (Polen) let me do all sorts of naughty things to her body including giving me three bouts of BBBJ (in kino for warm up, then BBBJ while waiting for a room and then another episode of BBBJ in the room) and only charges me the €50.

With Eva and Olivia I was not expecting to be charged €50 extra for COB since I am used to Oase where COB in my experience has been an inclusive service. I did not argue the point when it came to compensation time. Are you telling me that I should have?

At Palace I like less as COB appears to be clear to be a €50 extra service. So if I do go to Palace ever again I have to make sure that I come in her mouth and she takes it to earn €50. Yay.

Cheers,

Londonbasketcase

Basketcase

01-29-09, 00:14

she changes her plans? . Sunday 18th janaury, she told me she finishes the month a fkk world, then go in February in fkk Globe near Zurich.

I told her the story of a girl I know in Oase, who worked in fkk globe 2 years ago. She was not so "hot" anymore to go to work there. Who knows with that girl, she changes her mind and club as often as panties. LOL

Salute Cularo,

I agree, Olivia (Polen) told me way in 2008 that she was leaving the business to return to Polen for a normal life so I took that last session to avail myself of all her services including anal. An expensive session.

Then a little while later I find Olivia is still working the clubs and extending that date when she returns to Polen. She does seem to change her story but then again English is not her strongest language and my Polish is non existent.

The clubs in Switzerland get a lot of air time in discussion with the girls as they all think the money is better there. This last trip I had three faves discuss with me the clubs in Zurich and the power of the Swiss Franc (CHF). It is €90 for 30 minutes in some clubs in Switzerland compared to €50 for 30 minutes in Germany. A big difference.

I may end up having to visit Zurich to see my fave girls!! Would you come with me Cularo to see Lake Zurich?

Ciao,

Londonbasketcase

Vito Corleone

01-29-09, 02:54

Hi Vito Corleone,

Zarina (Ukraine) is now back from holidays. She made up in spades for the Christmas party nacht charging for room waiting time thanks.

Trip report to come.
Wassup LBC,

Thanks for the update. I can't wait to re-kindle the fire with her.

Vito Corleone

01-29-09, 03:18

I sincerely believe this girl was trying to pull something, which is a damn shame, because she was top-notch looks and performance. Should I mention her name? It starts with "E" and she comes from Serbia...go figure.

Ortos
Eva from Serbia. I believe I was there when you picked her. I remember Eva trying her best to get me to commit, but something did not feel right. She looks great & was very convincing, but I politely refused. I remember she was talking to me on the couch in the Italian section & you watching the whole time in the Egyptian area.

I remember asking you later how she was & etc. I think you were off to Palace after this bad experience. My memory is a little fuzzy since Zarina walked in shortly after & the rest is history.

Vito Corleone

01-29-09, 03:30

I agree that Palace does have the lookers but I find many more that I like at Oase. Further I can get the services I like at Oase but less so at World and even lesser at Palace. It is rare for me to find a girl that does not kiss at Oase. Alia (Germany) is one.

Alia makes up for the lack of kissing with her out of this world goods looks & tight toned bod.

Marlow

01-29-09, 09:42

Thanks for the explanation.
Whichever way we look at it, it still comes across as Laufhaus scamming. FKK clubs are supposed to be different not more expensive versions of the same. The old days as such were probably due to the fact that most clubs operated a pay as you leave system, none of this paying at the locker where arm twisting is de rigeur.
Another factor is the prices charged in the former Soviet satellites have risen. So an East European girl working in Germany isn’t actually earning much more than she would in her home country, once you’ve deducted taxes and club fees.
And the third factor is in my view the influx of sex tourism to the clubs, particularly around Frankfurt. All tourists are seen as mugs and girls in the sex industry are no different. They see rich pickings from the wide-eyed and eager determined to have their fun in the short space of time they have visiting Germany. It flashes in neon across their foreheads, along with the 'to do list'.
And when they can tell you’ve had a few beers....well, they think it rude not to try it on. Take your money before you give it another girl. Alcohol consumption and boisterousness are sure signs for the girls of money on a pr**k.
I’m not fond of girlfriends who give me grief and when I am paying for the privilege I have no patience at all.
Of the experiences related here I admire those who admit to what the girls try on, a nice counter balance to what I suspect is sometimes hype. Either way I am struck by the truth of the old Jewish saying that a man has two brains and when one is up the other doesn’t function. Steve Martin made a whole film based on this joke, and very funny it was too.
So now, back to fun and games....

Dedalus

01-29-09, 13:30

-The old days as such were probably due to the fact that most clubs operated a pay as you leave system, none of this paying at the locker where arm twisting is de rigeur.

-Another factor is the prices charged in the former Soviet satellites have risen. So an East European girl working in Germany isn’t actually earning much more than she would in her home country, once you’ve deducted taxes and club fees.

-And the third factor is in my view the influx of sex tourism to the clubs, particularly around Frankfurt. All tourists are seen as mugs and girls in the sex industry are no different.

Hey Marlow,

Of the three factors that you mention, the first two strike me a very, VERY salient.

The pay-as-you-leave model has been and still is a great way to deal with the scamming. Probably not a practical model for high traffic clubs like the Big-3 or the Golden Triangle, but would that it could be so.

As far as your second point, this is clear from the dearth of Baltic, Russian/Ukrainian and Czech talent that once set the standard in many clubs.

I’m not fond of girlfriends who give me grief and when I am paying for the privilege I have no patience at all.

I suspect that you and I have much in common on this point.

Cheers,

Dedalus

Nick The G

01-29-09, 19:50

Recently I had great hour session with one of their top girls, .......
What did she do: she sucked me strong and hard--wonderfully, really!-- and then at the moment when I was clearly going to explode, she manipulated me and my man organ in such a way that some of the cum landed on her body. I did not request it, she made it happen. Her body was positioned such that she was in total control of where my fluids would land or not land.She made it happen? Oh happy day!
Another great victim story here! Shark attack!?!? Are you susceptible to manipulation? Especially when a woman does it?
Imagine the headline of Bild-Zeitung: "Woman manipulated man to become almost unconscious and remote-controlled before coming on her body!" :-)

A story like this has never happened to me, never, and I visit this club since it opened more than 5 years ago!

If we go with a woman the first time, we need to be cautious, because we really don't know this woman and we don't know how things will develop in the room!

Even if we and the women in the club are naked, we don't know each other!!!!!!

Maybe we have a lot of expectations and illusions, o.k. Therefore, it is better to first talk with the woman of our choice.
I often wonder why guys cannot say to a woman on the way to the room for the very first time: The deal is for half an hour only, I give you 50 Euro, that's it! No extras intended!
If you go to the room for the first time with a certain woman, you could even take 50 Euros along with you and show the money to her while talking about the first session with her!

This is business, business, business. Let us first settle the business agreement, then enjoy our time in the room. The clearer we know what we want, and the clearer we communicate what we want, the less problems we will have. The other way round is open to all sorts of hassle.

If we don't want to communicate, because we are under the impression that this will disturb our easily evaporable romantic illusions, let's leave it up to fate or good/bad will. O.k.!
But then please let us not complain when things go wrong! Or start to tell others about our principles then! Let's accept that we deserved the gift fate wanted to give us! ;-)
-------------------------------------------
other topics from discussion here:

The other thing is: if a women sees, that we had lots of alcohol already, she might behave in several possible ways:
- reject us, because she doesn't like the smell of alcohol, eg. when kissing. And she knows from her experience she is heading for trouble with drunken men.
- come with us to the room, because she needs money urgently and in her opinion (and experience) we are an easy victim.

I only talk about situations, where we don't know the woman and she doesn't know us, because we have never been to the room together before.

Another opinion of mine: if mongers want to be regarded as a "tourist" visiting Germany, the best way is not to speak any german and to go downstairs and fall asleep for a longer time!
Even though the management of the club advertises it as a place for wellness, it isn't in the first place. It is a brothel, nothing else!
And the women you meet there are *****s, and not good mothers giving favour to good boys.

Ortos

01-29-09, 22:20

She made it happen? Oh happy day!
Another great victim story here! Shark attack!?!? Are you susceptible to manipulation? Especially when a woman does it?
Imagine the headline of Bild-Zeitung: "Woman manipulated man to become almost unconscious and remote-controlled before coming on her body!" :-)

A story like this has never happened to me, never, and I visit this club since it opened more than 5 years ago!

If we go with a woman the first time, we need to be cautious, because we really don't know this woman and we don't know how things will develop in the room!

Even if we and the women in the club are naked, we don't know each other!!!!!!

Maybe we have a lot of expectations and illusions, o.k. Therefore, it is better to first talk with the woman of our choice.
I often wonder why guys cannot say to a woman on the way to the room for the very first time: The deal is for half an hour only, I give you 50 Euro, that's it! No extras intended!
If you go to the room for the first time with a certain woman, you could even take 50 Euros along with you and show the money to her while talking about the first session with her!

This is business, business, business. Let us first settle the business agreement, then enjoy our time in the room. The clearer we know what we want, and the clearer we communicate what we want, the less problems we will have. The other way round is open to all sorts of hassle.

If we don't want to communicate, because we are under the impression that this will disturb our easily evaporable romantic illusions, let's leave it up to fate or good/bad will. O.k.!
But then please let us not complain when things go wrong! Or start to tell others about our principles then! Let's accept that we deserved the gift fate wanted to give us! ;-)

The other thing is: if a women sees, that we had lots of alcohol already, she might behave in several possible ways:
- reject us, because she doesn't like the smell of alcohol, eg. when kissing. And she knows from her experience she is heading for trouble with drunken men.
- come with us to the room, because she needs money urgently and in her opinion (and experience) we are an easy victim.

I only talk about situations, where we don't know the woman and she doesn't know us, because we have never been to the room together before.

Another opinion of mine: if mongers want to be regarded as a "tourist" visiting Germany, the best way is not to speak any german and to go downstairs and fall asleep for a longer time!
Even though the management of the club advertises it as a place for wellness, it isn't in the first place. It is a brothel, nothing else!
And the women you meet there are *****s, and not good mothers giving favour to good boys.

Hey Nick,

Sorry to be a bit blunt here but:

Well, you write English fairly well, so one naturally assumes you can read and understand it with a fair degree of comprehension. However when I read your post above in response to my own, I have to wonder if:

A) Did you really understand anything about the point I was trying to make in the post that took me a little time to compose for the benefit of our board and in the spirit of sharing information?

B) Are you indeed drunk or on drugs?

C) or just an arrogant, sarcasm-addicted klugscheisser?

I sincerely hope it the answer is A, but I remain open to all other options. Nevertheless, to me at least, you sound like a complete jerk when you post that irrelevant quatch below...some of us are trying to have a serious discussion, so it would be nice if you contributed something constrictive instead of taking the [CodeWord140] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord140)... wouldn't you agree?

Just my own warped perceptions, I suppose...

und Tscheuss

Nick The G

01-29-09, 22:33

Just my own warped perceptions, I suppose... Actually, it is my way of looking at things, my opinion.
Since there was no alcohol nor even drugs involved, I agree it is A) plus C) ..... ;-)
and, not to forget:
D) As I said, I have been visiting this club for more than 5 years now, average approx. three times per month, and it never happened to me! Not even with lovely Eva from Serbia!
Sure, a lot of others things did happen to me there. But nothing like this!
How can I make a woman responsible for directing my cum all over the world? Is this sort of a joystick game? :-) But then, who is in command at the joystick?

Ortos

01-29-09, 22:53

Actually, it is my way of looking at things, my opinion.
Since there was no alcohol nor even drugs involved, I agree it is A) plus C) ..... ;-)
and, not to forget:
D) As I said, I have been visiting this club for more than 5 years now, average approx. three times per month, and it never happened to me! Not even with lovely Eva from Serbia!
Sure, a lot of others things did happen to me there. But nothing like this!
How can I make a woman responsible for directing my cum all over the world? Is this sort of a joystick game? :-) But then, who is in command at the joystick?

Nick,

Once again, you seem to miss the whole point of what I wrote so maybe you just can't absorb it...I don't know. But in this case it was deviousness, plain and simple.

But you're correct: it is absolutely your way of seeing things...but how can you see things when you were not even there? LOL! You should just trust that sometimes people who actually experienced the things they describe know just a little bit more than you do about what actually happened. And --not that it is at all relevant-- I've been visiting the club for 5 years too, and this was the first time something like this ever happened to me. I hope you continue to visit the club for another 100 years and I hope this never happens to you. Have fun with Eva and other girls. But I know a shark when I see one. I know when somebody is trying to steal an extra instead of earning one after a bone fide request for such an extra.

Granted, if I was seen in the club every week like you then maybe she wouldn't have tried to pull that stunt. But she was digging for money. And if you insist on taking the [CodeWord140] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord140) out of people who report real negative attributes in a girl, then you do not show respect for the posters or the spirit of the board.

But I keep forgetting that you fail to see the whole point of my original post anyway and insist that you know more about what happned to me then I do...LOL. I guess you are correct: Since it never happened to you, I must be completely idiotic to cry foul...

Makes me wonder why I ever brought it up to begin with...

Dick Travel

01-29-09, 23:06

Evening gentlemen.

I have been reading back a few pages catching up.

Regarding rip offs, service levels, negotiation etc.

It's good to hear of mongerers taking a stand and not rolling over !
(NB whether individually we feel they had a case or not!) However, there must be a reasonable number of silent victims otherwise the perpetrators woud'nt be trying it on?

So, here's my two cents worth...

Yes, we should all try and pre-assess girls before committing, it's common sense and if nothing else lets one assess chemistry and judge whether you're going to have fun or just a session.

However, I do NOT think we should need to attempt to verbally agree an exact list of services before committing, besides unless it was written and signed it would be futile. If I want to negotiate I'll go to Amsterdam window girls or a street corner.

To those esteemed mongerers with longer experience in years than me -
Is it that in past years at a Laufhaus you'd be daft not to negotiate a list, but at an FKK you could expect standard services in the price?

If this is the case then as a previous poster said we all DO have a DUTY to stand up for this level of expected service and not let girls get away with it.
Otherwise yes the FKK experience will decline (or continue to).

It was suggested that the increase in tourists is not helping.This could be true. Partly because the one off visit tourists are easy naive prey and it doesnt matter if they are ripped off as they wont be back anyway. However perhaps the increased numbers of regular multi-visit foreign tourists (like me maybe) also contribute considerably. We all bring our national characteristics with us. Take Brits, we all have a very strong sense of justice and fair play, but alas it's coupled with a reluctance to moan or complain even if we are treated badly as we dont want to upset anybody or draw attention to ourselves! (I know crazy, however sex is a bit taboo in Britain too which makes it less liekly we'll draw attention to ourselves!).

Maybe I'm not typical, I will complain. I'm that guy in the shop in front of you in the queue loudly complaining about something I bought, yes, the one who declines the managers kind offer to offer to go to their office to discuss the complaint because "I'm quite happy to air my complaint here where other customers can hear it thankyou" ! ;-)

You'll note when I was a bad judge at Palace and ended up in a room with a girl who just provided NO service and tried upselling everything bar the right to inhale in the room - I told her straight how I felt, what she'd done wrong and even offerred her advice on improving before I said she wasnt getting a bean and left the room.

Ok, that's just me. I can't honestly suggest this behaviour was motivated by my concern that if I didnt take a stand then FKK service for all us mongerers would decline. But, on reflection of the posts on this forum recently, I think this a serious possibility and is maybe coming to fruition?

So, come on gents, lets not be shafted. It should be the other way around!
I know I'm at serious risk of preaching at the converted here, but I hope there are a good number of "lurkers" who visit FKKs infrequently or are yet to make their debut FKK visit.

I think we should get tougher, it sounds like the Germans are.
-EXPECT all components of standard service at an FKK (ie BBBJ, kissing, covered sex)
-REFUSE extra payment for any components of standard service,
-even REFUSE full payment for a session if standard service has not been given (unless eg a girl has specifically VOLUNTEERED in advance that she doesnt kiss and you accepted it)
I dont believe in suggestions that E50 is payable as soon as you agree to a session, the E50 is for the standard session itself, not for agreeing to have one !

If we take this approach things will improve and perhaps we can get back to the good old days some of you recall?
The poor providers will be hit financially and either shape up or ship out.
(they wont run to management every time if we are all being firm, they'd be there too often for management to believe them and they'd get booted anyway). If they do ship out or get booted then the good providers will have less competition and do even better turn overs than they do now!

If we take this approach then we will all be able to go to FKK's knowing that:
-for our premium entry fee we will find providers present who provide a fair standard service without rip off.
-we can relax and allow our romantic fantasies to run wild if we wish without being spoilt by unneccessary and tiresome business negotiations.
-there will be less arguments on the board about whether a rip off occurred or not ;-)))

Want a cheap service you have to negotiate? - go down market, heck go to Amsterdam canal girls.
Want a quality service? Go to FKKs and stand up for it.

DT

(climbing off soap box which he'd perched on the band wagon for the duration of this post)

Jackyo

01-30-09, 11:02

Might it be that the NRW clubs with the Animierungsverbot are that way because this is how the Einheimische prefer their clubs?

Dedalus makes a very interesting point when he suggests that the problems we are discussing are less prevalent in clubs where girls do not approach the men, mainly clubs in NRW.

How often is it that we see posts here by tourists who have been to the Hessen clubs express surprise when they visit clubs in NRW which don't allow the women to self-market and wonder why that is?

Bottom line is that "Timmy Tourist" as Marlow has referred to him before, has no point of comparison and doesn't know better.

There are subtle differences between club sub-cultures which are opaque to those not in the know. Kein Wunder if these differences extend to service standards too.

A well established German pastime is meckern. Nothing escapes their attention. Nothing.

If a club is substandard, the club management will hear about it. If the chick offers substandard services, she will hear about it.

In short, they set a higher standard than that set by the random tourist.

So yes, let's get back to basics.

This forum's primary intent is to serve as a consumer forum.

When folks start to look the other way when these women make outrageous demands for services which are normally included but for which they want to charge extra fees, it is eroding the general price structure and that is detrimental to of us. Its a slippery slope from acceptance of these practices to starting to think that Laufhaus-style negotiations are normal at an FKK club.

Nick The G

01-30-09, 13:11

I don't want to start a personal fight here. So let's discuss the "event" on a basis that is not related directly to Ortos.

Granted, if I was seen in the club every week like you then maybe she wouldn't have tried to pull that stunt.This is imho a very important point.
E.g., in the case of Eva, I was talking with her many, many times and always refused her offer to go to the room. But what I noticed was, that she continued to talk with me and always was very friendly and charming. We had lots of fun talking together at the bar and eating together in the dining room. Then, I think after more than one year, I went with her the first time to the room. Because on this day, it was on a dessous day not so long ago, I really felt like I wanted to go with her.

But I know a shark when I see one. ......
But she was digging for money. And if you insist on taking the [CodeWord140] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord140) out of people who report real negative attributes in a girl, then you do not show respect for the posters or the spirit of the board.I don't doubt the experience of the writer in the room with her. But the way he was writing about the situation raised my concern. The main point I am making is, that he shifted the responsibility for the whole thing completely over to her, he even stated: "She made it happen". By the way, what is "it"? Where has the writer been when "it" happened? ;-) What did the writer do during the time when "it" happened?

In my way of thinking, I would descibe the same situation like: I went with a woman who in my opinion showed signs that she might be a shark. I chose her and was using her - and no other woman - to come to this sort of situation! And now I am soo unlucky that I indeed got evidence for my assumption that she is a shark. :-)

Isn't it strange, that when things go wrong, in most of the cases it is due to the women working there. We report about "real negative" attributes of the woman. But the attributes and self-understanding of us, the writers here, never is reported.
We have a good excuse. We are the good boys, we are so nice and gentle, respect each other and especially all the women there. We can trust each other but we cannot trust these women there, because: "Sharks are around"!

My position is, after all these years: I am an active and responsible human being. I select the club and I select the woman and I select the time I want to go to the room with a woman.
If something like what has been described is happenening, with my behaviour and thinking I actively take part in creating such a situation. I am a creator, not a victim.
Because otherwise, only "it" has been there, but not me. ;-)

Dedalus

01-30-09, 14:40

Another opinion of mine: if mongers want to be regarded as a "tourist" visiting Germany, the best way is not to speak any german and to go downstairs and fall asleep for a longer time!
Even though the management of the club advertises it as a place for wellness, it isn't in the first place. It is a brothel, nothing else!
And the women you meet there are *****s, and not good mothers giving favour to good boys.

Hey Nick,

As a German speaker who has (back when it was allowed) engaged in much sleep time downstairs, I have to mention that I have lost count of the number of Teutonic club regulars who I have seen enjoying long bouts of shut eye on those Relax Zone couches as well. I could even provide a list of well known Roemers who sleep and snore with the best of them.

Couldn't agree more with you about the advantages of knowing some German though. No guarantee that it will keep a guys from getting shafted, but it does seem to make the girls (even the ones that don't speak German) see a Gent as less gullible than normal.

Cheers,

Dedalus

Ortos

01-30-09, 15:49

I don't want to start a personal fight here. So let's discuss the "event" on a basis that is not related directly to Ortos.

This is imho a very important point.
E.g., in the case of Eva, I was talking with her many, many times and always refused her offer to go to the room. But what I noticed was, that she continued to talk with me and always was very friendly and charming. We had lots of fun talking together at the bar and eating together in the dining room. Then, I think after more than one year, I went with her the first time to the room. Because on this day, it was on a dessous day not so long ago, I really felt like I wanted to go with her.

I don't doubt the experience of the writer in the room with her. But the way he was writing about the situation raised my concern. The main point I am making is, that he shifted the responsibility for the whole thing completely over to her, he even stated: "She made it happen". By the way, what is "it"? Where has the writer been when "it" happened? ;-) What did the writer do during the time when "it" happened?

In my way of thinking, I would descibe the same situation like: I went with a woman who in my opinion showed signs that she might be a shark. I chose her and was using her - and no other woman - to come to this sort of situation! And now I am soo unlucky that I indeed got evidence for my assumption that she is a shark. :-)

Isn't it strange, that when things go wrong, in most of the cases it is due to the women working there. We report about "real negative" attributes of the woman. But the attributes and self-understanding of us, the writers here, never is reported.
We have a good excuse. We are the good boys, we are so nice and gentle, respect each other and especially all the women there. We can trust each other but we cannot trust these women there, because: "Sharks are around"!

My position is, after all these years: I am an active and responsible human being. I select the club and I select the woman and I select the time I want to go to the room with a woman.
If something like what has been described is happenening, with my behaviour and thinking I actively take part in creating such a situation. I am a creator, not a victim.
Because otherwise, only "it" has been there, but not me. ;-)

Nick,

I am overjoyed that you don't want to continue a flame war here, because neither do I. So let's call a truce and, hopefully, in short order, we can move on to other subjects.

I just want to repeat, yet again, that just because something never happened to you, doesn't mean it doesn't happen to others. And, I am a bit confused by your lack of imaginantion here in not being able to figure out that there are indeed myriad ways that a girl can (to use Marlow's wonderfull phrase) "body swerve" her way to an extra 50Es, even if that particular extra was specifically rejected by the man when asked whether he wanted it.

Look, sometimes you just have to accecpt somebody's account as accurate because he was there experiencing it, and you were not. So let me be one final time categorically clear:

After long years of experience I can say WITHOUT A SHADOW OF DOUBT that in this case the girl DID IN FACT "make it happen" and then tried to collect an extra 50E in the most devious and sharklike fashion. She placed her body position in such a way that she, NOT ME, Nick, was in complete control of where the fluids landed and she engineered the thing. Plain and simple. So either accept it or not, but please stop whining about how you cannot imagine this, so therefore it MUST be the man's fault. Remember, you were not there, I was! (I can only guess that perhaps you are a meat and potatoes man when it comes to sexual positions and may not experiment with exotic postions the way some others might? Is this plausible?)

So let us move on and shift the focus slightly shall we?

Here is a point: It is clear from various perspectives that Eva perhaps belongs to a category of FKK girl that does not treat all male guests the same. Fair enough. We've all run into girls at these clubs that will DFK with Guest A and C, but not with Guest B. There are girls that will cut some guests more slack (e.g. give certain guys more time on the couch, or whatever) than she would for other guests. That is just the way of the world and the way it is. We have to accept this.

I think in the case we are discussing, it is clear that Eva --like many other girls no doubt-- will treat a guy she sees at the club regularly, better than she might a guy she has laid eyes on for the 1st time. In my case, I believe for whatever reasons she decided to "try it on" to see if she could get away with asking for an extra 50E for something that other girls at the same club would just consider as collateral damage and part and parcel of any deeply intense sex session: peripheral spritz, whatever you want to call it. I can give you a long list of girls I've been with at World, Oase, Palace, etc. that would never ever think of pulling this type of shit. But she did, and she probably was a bit shocked when I brought the matter up to the front desk, and they gave me the option. If you were there you would remember the expression on her face, when the front desk did not back up her case, but seemed to accept my explanation. She looked like: "Well, it was worth a try anyway!"

Another point that I feel is most important here and I am a bit reluctant to bring it up, but feel I must:

There is an element of trust that a poster like me assumes amongst the isg.forum community when he chooses to expose a personal situation like this for the benefit of the Brotherhood at large. It is a trust that assumes specifically that another board member here reading the incident will not then go back to the girl that is mentioned and say: "Hey, you should see what some guy wrote about you on the Internet! He is accusing you of being a Ripp-off, etc..." and then goes on to explain to the girl all the details reported in the post so that she might remember the incident and thus identify the poster when he next visits the club. Then that poor poster, whose intentions were only to bring a fair an honest warning (e.g. "Hey, such and such happened to me with Girl X, so watch out, guys, and if you go with her be forewarned and prepared...") for the benefit of other guys, goes into the club next time and that girl tells all the other girls: "Don't go with him, he makes up stories and false accusations and spreads them around the Internet of all places..." Many of us agree that the less spoken about Internet to girls in these clubs the better, ja?

Now I am NOT accusing any specific person of actually blowing the cover of any other isg brother here, I am just annunciating a potential concern that might deter other bona fide reports of negative abuses from being posted.

Am I out of line to annunciate this?

Peace to you and all others, Nick. If we ever meet face to face I would be most pleased to illustrate the way things happened that night and trap she used and then you will believe there are some things out of a man's control, despite your "current way of thinking..."

Lastly, I suspect --though I am in no way 100% certain-- that I am not the only one who may have seen/experienced shark-like/processing attributes of the girl in question.

Ortos

Optimist

01-30-09, 16:17

Hi Gergiev and Jackyo

Thank you for your notice. We are well. Cordelia is in fact going to spend some time at the end of Feb at World. Shiatsu still makes some visits and is going to World and NRW clubs in early March

The lack of posts is simply that there are so many informed, enthusiastic and comitted posters already that we have little to add without repeating ourselves or others!!.

The only thing we have noticed at World is that during November abd December the atmosphere was pleasanter than it had ben for some considerable time. many of the girls were spending time chatting to men and not aggressively selling - there was no more of the "ficky ficky" "Why not" etc.

Nick The G

01-30-09, 16:49

.... I have to mention that I have lost count of the number of Teutonic club regulars who I have seen enjoying long bouts of shut eye on those Relax Zone couches as well. I could even provide a list of well known Roemers who sleep and snore with the best of them.@ Dedalus: why not start a survey in the Roemerforum or here: what is the average sleeping time :) of experienced mongers :D during a visit in a german FKK-Club. ;)

Nick The G

01-30-09, 17:00

Peace to you and all others, Nick. If we ever meet face to face I would be most pleased to illustrate the way things happened that night and trap she used and then you will believe there are some things out of a man's control, despite your "current way of thinking..." I will be pleased to meet you there some day, like I happened to come to know some others guys from the isg forum.

Dedalus

01-30-09, 17:23

@ Dedalus: why not start a survey in the Roemerforum or here: what is the average sleeping time :) of experienced mongers :D during a visit in a german FKK-Club. ;)

Hey Nick,

I'll suggest that to Wolfl next I see him. Right friendly dude, but he might *****-slap me as fast as a Gent can type "Löschen" or "Forumverbot" for using his home that way.

Cheers,

Dedalus, on his way to Frankfurt as he types

Dedalus

01-30-09, 19:25

Basketcase

01-30-09, 20:59

How often is it that we see posts here by tourists who have been to the Hessen clubs express surprise when they visit clubs in NRW which don't allow the women to self-market and wonder why that is?

Bottom line is that "Timmy Tourist" as Marlow has referred to him before, has no point of comparison and doesn't know better.

There are subtle differences between club sub-cultures which are opaque to those not in the know. Kein Wunder if these differences extend to service standards too.

A well established German pastime is meckern. Nothing escapes their attention. Nothing.

If a club is substandard, the club management will hear about it. If the chick offers substandard services, she will hear about it.

In short, they set a higher standard than that set by the random tourist.

So yes, let's get back to basics.

This forum's primary intent is to serve as a consumer forum.

When folks start to look the other way when these women make outrageous demands for services which are normally included but for which they want to charge extra fees, it is eroding the general price structure and that is detrimental to of us. Its a slippery slope from acceptance of these practices to starting to think that Laufhaus-style negotiations are normal at an FKK club.

Jackyo,

I think a lot of the answer to your rant at us Timmy Tourists is that we are foreigners. We are guests in Germany. The locals suffer us being allowed into their establishments, hotels, entertainment centres and other attractions. I thank the locals very much for letting me every single FKK and saunaclub that I have attempted to enter.

I dress appropriately and I am always polite to the reception, bar staff, cleaners and security. I mean the security at Oase tend to say hello to me when I visit and even ask when I am back next. The bar staff know what drinks I like and appreciate it when I bring my empty glasses and used plates back to the bar rather than leave then on the tables as is the norm at Oase saving someone going around collecting the empties and table ware. I act as I would at home. Heck I would help wash the dishes if need be.

As a guest I would not normally complain lest I get thrown out or a ban placed on me. This is why I do not normally complain if I get less than the expected service (generally its the kissing or muschi licking that is denied me). Also since I do go to the clubs regularly I do not want a reputation as a complainer or a miserly punter that a girl groans "I have to work with this one". Some girls tell me that some customers they hate going with and sometimes avoid some customers. Of course all customers are tolerated since they are guests and a girl is hard put to refuse regardless if she does not like your hygiene, your halitosis breath, your pot belly such that you cannot see your own penis and she has to go find it, your age, you have an enormous cock that will be painful for her to accept in her muschi and you want to shag her hard and deeply for 25 minutes of your allotted half a hour.

I want a pleasant experience - not one where I have to be on my guard having to tick off - right she kissed me, good, check, now she is licking my nipples, nice - I like that, oh good she is now sucking my cock without a condom and paying due attention to the Eier, this must be for 5 minutes minimum and I am timing it, before its on with the condom for minimum three sex fucking positions before I complete my pleasure in her muschi in the condom for the grand sum of €50.

So all I am saying is please take it from a foreigner that we want to come back and not get told to leave. Some of us just do not want to rock the boat or get beaten up by a pimp or the local security.

Just remember we are guests in this country.

Regards

Londonbasketcase

Breadman

01-30-09, 22:19

Just remember we are guests in this country.

And as guests we should do what the locals do...follow in their example.

Ortos

01-30-09, 22:41

And as guests we should do what the locals do...follow in their example.

You mean we should all eat Schwein Haxe mit senf?

Basketcase

01-30-09, 22:56

You mean we should all eat Schwein Haxe mit senf?

Wenn ich in Deutschland, wie Wurst mit Brot oder Currywurst mit Pommes.

Ich kann auch essen Schwein mit Senf-Sauce.

Really I just like the naked ladies. The Bratwurst is good though.

Londonbasketcase

Dick Travel

01-31-09, 02:05

Good post LBC. I am sure most of us ISGers do behave properly as guests and your description of your behaviour is a good example to us all.

In return we should be treated well as guests in the country and indeed we are and will be by the local mongerers so long as we don't mess things up for them.
That means behaving as they do and reportedly they don't stand for the minority of girls that might attempt to provide less than a decent session.

Re-reading my "back to basics" post now, I think my language and use of occasional capitalisation made it comes across with a near militant edge in places! This may have overblown the topic. I am certainly not advocating picketing the driveway constantly complaining if I recieve less than x minutes of BBBJ.

The poor providers in the average crowd of lovelies at any FKK are in the minority, but maybe that minority is a bit bigger than once. That's the feeling I sensed from some of the long serving posters comments.

@LBC, with respect, you are perhaps viewed by the girls as an FKK equivalent of a casino "high roller" (in terms of frequency of visits etc) and this could mean any girl you session with will do their best to give you a great session, as they know you will be back and will repeat. I wouldnt be surprised if the gilrs themselves wouldnt stand for anyone mucking you about.(Plus your radar must be so highly tuned by now that unless you're 18 hours into the day you can probably sense a shark approaching Burgolzhausen let alone approaching you!)
Other less frequent visitors will be prone to slightly higher chance of service slippage as they are not seen as so valuable. (plus of course less honed radar.)

Personally guys, I won't be pre-agreeing session details up front (unless I seek particular extras), but I will politely and firmly stand my ground if attempts are made to upsell what should be standard or if I'm treated to display of blatant disregard for what is decent "customer service". It's like Jackyo says, we should not let our presence be blamed for any erosion of the status quo.

Thankfully, most of the girls are great and most of the time FKK's are mini heavens on earth.

Finally, so much activity on here recently and some fine reports, it's only weeks since my last trip and I've got itchy feet already darn it !

Regards all

DT

Vito Corleone

01-31-09, 02:09

Another opinion of mine: if mongers want to be regarded as a "tourist" visiting Germany, the best way is not to speak any german and to go downstairs and fall asleep for a longer time!
Even though the management of the club advertises it as a place for wellness, it isn't in the first place. It is a brothel, nothing else!
And the women you meet there are *****s, and not good mothers giving favour to good boys.
I speak very little German, but I have always had a great time @ World the past 3 yrs. Only had 1 girl try to rip me off. 3 of my friends also speak very little English, but they have had only a few problems since they started @ Atlantis. I'm sure speaking German helps, but I think I have done a pretty good job indulging my lust for hot women while speaking zero German.

Vito Corleone

01-31-09, 02:35

Couldn't agree more with you about the advantages of knowing some German though. No guarantee that it will keep a guys from getting shafted, but it does seem to make the girls (even the ones that don't speak German) see a Gent as less gullible than normal.

Cheers,

Dedalus
Wassup Deda,

I might be the only person who thinks speaking German in an FKK in a little overrated. Sure, it does help, but a clueless person is clueless whether they speak German or not. My very first FKK trip I traveled solo (3 of my friends backed out) & could not get enough of the FKKs (I almost canceled my flight to Paris). I experienced no scams or rip-offs & I did not even try speaking German the entire trip.

Basketcase

01-31-09, 04:58

Another point that I feel is most important here and I am a bit reluctant to bring it up, but feel I must:

There is an element of trust that a poster like me assumes amongst the isg.forum community when he chooses to expose a personal situation like this for the benefit of the Brotherhood at large. It is a trust that assumes specifically that another board member here reading the incident will not then go back to the girl that is mentioned and say: "Hey, you should see what some guy wrote about you on the Internet! He is accusing you of being a Ripp-off, etc..." and then goes on to explain to the girl all the details reported in the post so that she might remember the incident and thus identify the poster when he next visits the club. Then that poor poster, whose intentions were only to bring a fair an honest warning (e.g. "Hey, such and such happened to me with Girl X, so watch out, guys, and if you go with her be forewarned and prepared...") for the benefit of other guys, goes into the club next time and that girl tells all the other girls: "Don't go with him, he makes up stories and false accusations and spreads them around the Internet of all places..." Many of us agree that the less spoken about Internet to girls in these clubs the better, ja?

Now I am NOT accusing any specific person of actually blowing the cover of any other isg brother here, I am just annunciating a potential concern that might deter other bona fide reports of negative abuses from being posted.

Am I out of line to annunciate this?

Ortos

@Ortos

This is a fear that I suspect most writers on any internet forum such as this fears. This is the fear of being outed since the detail of one's post provides sufficient clues and touch points for a punter to be pinpointed. This in turn allows that punter to be identified and confronted or back channel feedback given amongst the ladies that you are a writer or a monger or a punter and that a girl should be circumspect with you in the room or may even get you barred by the ladies lest you write about them.

I suspect that many ladies do not like being written about even if the report is glowingly positive. I know some guys say that the girls really like it since it is advertising for them and may generate them more customers but I am not 100% convinced. Sorry, but that is me. I know others have told me their opinion that the girls should be thanking the writers with free sex in return for the positive posts written about them. The fact that I do not hear of writers who have been rewarded as such with free sex for posts written about them provides me with the ammunition that that assertion is correct.

When I write my reports I do dither between providing good detail or omitting the facts or just not even naming the girls as many guys do in their reports or just mentioning the name and saying whether it was good or bad excluding what happened. The good detailed reports are fanatastic as what one guys says is a fantastic session may not sound like a fantastic session for another. For example, a guy getting a BBBJ to completion in the kino whoch takes all of 2 minutes costing a €100 due to the €50 extra for the CIM service may for that person be a fantastic experience fulfilling a fantasy but then there will be many a person saying what a rip off - all you got is 2 minutes and they would never ever pay for CIM has it is a waste of money and the girl did not have to work for her extra really. It is up to you. But without the detail one cannot judge for themselves what is a good deal or not or whether one was ripped off or not or whether as in most cases the gentleman in question has had a most excellent time and commends the lady to the forum members to also go with her and reward her for her good work.

The girls do read the forum as we have seen from the times when girls have written in response. The girls also read the Dutch, French, Swedish and probably more readily the German forums as most of the girls in general have good German language.

I have also heard girls relate back to other customers that the lady has had customer referred the girl to posts written about them on the forums - even this ISG forum. The girls use the internet as well contrary to some discussion I have had with some punters that the girls generally do not have the ability or the opportunity.

I am a believer in using the forum to share information and enhance the experience by connecting other people with a like mind on this hobby of ours. This is why I always hate it when there is a flame war going on - it should be about respecting what another has written regardless that you may disagree. That post may or may not have informational content but the fact that some one has taken the effort to write something is positive since there are so many more people that read the forum (or lurk) than actually write. Even if the post is to ask a question that has been ask many times before and the response is RTFF.

I at times wonder when large crews of ISGers, ijsberen, roemers, etc.... are in the clubs and the girls see individual international regulars of theirs of different nationalities just join up and chat like old friends having some sort of pre-arranged bond between them, that the girls put two and two together and wonder how these men come to know each other? I have at least one girl ask me about a table of men warning me that those men are mongerers that go mongering around all the clubs. The point is that she used the word monger which is to me a term that North Americans use. The equivalent in Britain is punter. The girls do know about the forum and that some of their guests are the writers.

The point is that I also agree that the less said about the internet to the girls in the clubs the better it is.

Regards

Londonbasketcase

Dedalus

01-31-09, 05:30

Wassup Deda,

I might be the only person who thinks speaking German in an FKK in a little overrated. Sure, it does help, but a clueless person is clueless whether they speak German or not. My very first FKK trip I traveled solo (3 of my friends backed out) & could not get enough of the FKKs (I almost canceled my flight to Paris). I experienced no scams or rip-offs & I did not even try speaking German the entire trip.

Hey Don Vito,

No, you're not the only one. And while I think having some German chops can give a guy many advantages, I also am quite convinced that a dude can have a great time in the clubs without it. You and most guys that I hang out with in the clubs have little German skills and are clear examples of this.

I think back to a discussion we once had about p4p in countries and situations where being a foreigner and not speaking the local language would insure either no service or service of poor quality. Germany is clearly different, but he girls do treat the locals differently; both in good ways and bad ways.

FKK girls often fall into two categories: The ones who try to cultivate regulars through good service, and those who play hit and run with guests. The ones who fall into the second category don't waste too much time on locals, whereas the ones in the first group see the value in having many regulars who they can depend on for frequent business.

Cheers,

Dedalus

Basketcase

01-31-09, 06:15

I think back to a discussion we once had about p4p in counties and situations where being a foreigner and not speaking the local language would insure either no service or service of poor quality. Germany is clearly different, but he girls do treat the locals differently; both in good ways and bad ways.

FKK girls often fall into two categories: The ones who try to cultivate regulars through good service, and those who play hit and run with guests. The ones who fall into the second category don't waste too much time on locals, whereas the ones in the first group see the value in having many regulars who they can depend on for frequent business.

Hey Dedalus,

I agree with the observation that you make about how the girls treat international visitors to the clubs compared to the locals.

As you say there are girls that would tend to cultivate the locals looking for repeat business by providing good service and a relationship. For a few girls in Oase and to a lesser extent World I like to think I have been elevated to regular with the status of such since some girls have actually said to me that they tolerate for me what they would not for other customers or that they say they may have only a few customers that they like or form a relationship with and generally the other customers are all Germans. I am the token foreigner on their books.

Sometimes I can see the second category of girl doing the hit and run on customers as you say. These girls do not avoid the locals but I can see that they may tolerate their requests more than say a newbie foreigner in the club. The local can tell his friends what bad service he received - the international visitor may not come often or be a one off and have no one to tell since it is not the thing you tell people that you do. I sometimes see that the local Germans get more couch time or a bit longer BBBJ in the kino or more kissing. YMMV the usual rider to a statement like that. Regardless the girls will have a chat more with a German than a foreigner since the common language is there. This tendency is totally understandable. Sitting with a bunch a girls and with German men the conversation will be in the main in German until they want to say something that they want me to understand or know then the conversation turns to English. It is always good to have a fave or two around at these times to ensure that English is spoken.

The international guests on the other hand unless they are experienced can get a bit of a run around from certain girls. I tend to hear that the international guests are good payers and can be less work.

Also the one off wind fall jobs will come from the international guests - the hotel escort work, the big tips for standard service, etc... I have now heard of all sorts of amounts that can be earned unexpectedly from international customers. The basic for escort work in general seems to be €200 per hour and generally its the international customers that do it. Then there is the jobs in Dubai, Italy, the French riveria, etc... going for thousands a day in fees. I know the same of English girls who do that sort of work and earn thousands for a couple of days work on the European continent or in the Middle East sitting in hotels or in yachts or ski chalets, etc...

I know some girls say that they love certain nationalities since they are quick and can revive quickly and go again. Some girls was telling me of men from one particular European country who go 6-7 times during a visit and tend to opt for CIM. The girls from this nation love the men from this European country as they are good business and that country is not Germany. As a hint a few of the girls, mainly Romanian pretend that they are from that country. The girls say that the guys from that country are fun guys (that is, not hard work to get them into the room regardless of the banter), quick and like to go for the extras.

They say some nationalities are hard work and just pound away for the full 30 minutes and they tend to avoid those nationalities. Some say they do not like some other nationalities. Some nationalities are cultivated more than others because of their ease as a client to satisfy. The overall rider is that the clients have to have the ability pay regardless if the guy comes in 1 minute with 2 sucks of their schwanz or if the guy gets a 30 minutes of non stop sucking and fucking.

I sat up one slow night in the club with a table of girls and they took me through all the nationalities and discussed the stereotypes that they generated of who had the biggest schwanzes, average sized schwanzes, fucked the longest or were quick to come or went for multiple sessions. The interesting point was that German men were said to be dotted across the full sprectrum of customer types. I expect that was because there are more German customers and yes they would span the full spectrum of customer types compared to the smaller experience of each nationalities.

Cheers,

Londonbasketcase

Jackyo

01-31-09, 13:10

Jackyo,

I think a lot of the answer to your rant at us Timmy Tourists is that we are foreigners. We are guests in Germany. The locals suffer us being allowed into their establishments, hotels, entertainment centres and other attractions. I thank the locals very much for letting me every single FKK and saunaclub that I have attempted to enter.

I dress appropriately and I am always polite to the reception, bar staff, cleaners and security. I mean the security at Oase tend to say hello to me when I visit and even ask when I am back next. The bar staff know what drinks I like and appreciate it when I bring my empty glasses and used plates back to the bar rather than leave then on the tables as is the norm at Oase saving someone going around collecting the empties and table ware. I act as I would at home. Heck I would help wash the dishes if need be.

As a guest I would not normally complain lest I get thrown out or a ban placed on me. This is why I do not normally complain if I get less than the expected service (generally its the kissing or muschi licking that is denied me). Also since I do go to the clubs regularly I do not want a reputation as a complainer or a miserly punter that a girl groans "I have to work with this one". Some girls tell me that some customers they hate going with and sometimes avoid some customers. Of course all customers are tolerated since they are guests and a girl is hard put to refuse regardless if she does not like your hygiene, your halitosis breath, your pot belly such that you cannot see your own penis and she has to go find it, your age, you have an enormous cock that will be painful for her to accept in her muschi and you want to shag her hard and deeply for 25 minutes of your allotted half a hour.

I want a pleasant experience - not one where I have to be on my guard having to tick off - right she kissed me, good, check, now she is licking my nipples, nice - I like that, oh good she is now sucking my cock without a condom and paying due attention to the Eier, this must be for 5 minutes minimum and I am timing it, before its on with the condom for minimum three sex fucking positions before I complete my pleasure in her muschi in the condom for the grand sum of €50.

So all I am saying is please take it from a foreigner that we want to come back and not get told to leave. Some of us just do not want to rock the boat or get beaten up by a pimp or the local security.

Just remember we are guests in this country.

Regards

Londonbasketcase
Hi LBC,

I am as foreign at one of these clubs as you are so we are really in the same boat. I've been doing club visits for a very long time though so I am hardly a tourist. I also don't have language issues.

But neither are you a tourist. I read the summary of your 2008 exploits and just marvel at your commitment to this hobby!

When in Germany, I do as the Germans do. And as I've written here before, I tend to lean more towards German speaking women than the average person in this forum. I can't stand not being able to communicate with the object of my lust (I tend to talk too much during sex - this is what the women tell me).

I have a strong preference that the German character of an FKK experience not become Americanized (which is probably more likely than it become Anglicized, don't you think?). It would lose a lot if it ever got that way.

The only thing I ask the average tourist is not to rock the boat. Don't upset the price structure, don't spoil the women, don't give in to the upsell, and yes, be very demanding service-wise.

Bref, do exactly as the locals do.

This is what will keep the clubs and women on their toes. They have to be made aware that it is a global market with buyers who scour the globe looking for the best services at the best prices. There is also a lot of intense competition locally and with the current recession (yes, its official in Deutschland), there is an inevitable shakeout coming.

When will the first big club close its doors? Its only a matter of time before that happens.

Its those "in the middle of nowhere" large clubs which don't get traffic which will and should close first, don't you think? Parkschloss Dali, z. B. I've not been yet. They do advertise on the RF and their ads look more and more desperate featuring more and more extreme activity such as Barbara Devil, the AO queen, doing a gangbang.

You occasionally get these remarks from newbies here which say: "50 Euros for thirty minutes is dirt cheap!". Its dirt cheap in comparison to what you would spend elsewhere but that doesn't mean that one should open ones wallet and ignore the warning signs of women who don't deliver a good Preisleistungsverhaeltniss.

Make them compete for our business.

M P Lurker

01-31-09, 13:57

You occasionally get these remarks from newbies here which say: "50 Euros for thirty minutes is dirt cheap!". Its dirt cheap in comparison to what you would spend elsewhere but that doesn't mean that one should open ones wallet and ignore the warning signs of women who don't deliver a good
It would be better to say that its a good fair price, but not totally cheap. I earn less than that after heavy taxes back home (sob).

There are other countries existing with far cheaper prices of course. So iits really a balance between what quality you are looking for and what you want to pay. For guys with a lot of time to travel available there are significantly cheaper Countries.
In Thailand I can afford to have a girls everyday and overnight or on multi-day bookings where I could not afford that in Germany. 24 hours with a girl could cost far less than 100 Euros.

Cambodia and China should be even cheaper.
Africa must be incredibly cheap.
But in then end we are looking for a certain standard to go with the money so there is a limit to how cheap we should go.

Nick The G

01-31-09, 14:04

This is a fear that I suspect most writers on any internet forum such as this fears. This is the fear of being outed since the detail of one's post provides sufficient clues and touch points for a punter to be pinpointed. This in turn allows that punter to be identified and confronted or back channel feedback given amongst the ladies that you are a writer or a monger or a punter and that a girl should be circumspect with you in the room or may even get you barred by the ladies lest you write about them.All the time the men in the club talk about the women there, and the women talk about the men there, they talk and talk and talk and talk and talk and talk and talk and talk ... :)

At the end of the day, the men go home, sit in front of their beloved computers and write and write and write and write and write and write ....
And the women go home and count and sum up their money, and add and add and add and add....

Since many women in FKK-World know that I write from time to time about what is going on in the club and some even know my nick, I do not have to fear anything! I even experienced in two cases angry comments, and maybe a woman will not talk to me for half a year or maybe even one year anymore. So what! :D
In fact, that anger expressed was never about me writing about something going on in the room! ;)

As long as we forget, that we are co-creators of everything that happens there, we run the risk of writing about something that is a description of a universe where we are not existing. We behave like a radar station that scans the environment with high precision but has absolutely no clue about its own construction.

I suggest many of you reread your postings. Very often you will find:
as long as everything proceeds fine in the room, the male principle (you!) is the driving and directing force, you are in command! You direct the actions. Then you will typically write in style like: I told her this and that, I ordered her to go into this position, I pounded her for 25 minutes from behind .....
When things go wrong, the strong male principle ("I") disappears all of a sudden completely from your reports, you will start to write about "it" or "she". The stage revolves 180 degrees, women are the (mal-)active principle then that takes over command and the situation.
Isn't that really strange? ;)

Ekliges Lauern

01-31-09, 14:49

You mean we should all eat Schwein Haxe mit senf?

Schwein Haxe rocks!

Ortos

01-31-09, 14:52

Schwein Haxe rocks!

I agree...actually they rock!

Ekliges Lauern

01-31-09, 18:06

I agree...actually they rock!

Grin. As previously noted your Deutsch is much better than mine.

Intellectually, I did know it was plural but I have a hard time not thinking of it as singular as it is a single piece. Plus, I'm not sure the subject verb agreement rules are clear when the subject and verbs are of different languages.

Hessen Bub

01-31-09, 19:02

It's actually "Schweinehaxe mit Senf". Not my favourite.

HB

Ortos

01-31-09, 20:10

It's actually "Schweinehaxe mit Senf". Not my favourite.

HB

Yes, I always had you pegged as a Fisch-lover.

Ortos

Beffen1

01-31-09, 20:56

Hey Dedalus,

I sat up one slow night in the club with a table of girls and they took me through all the nationalities and discussed the stereotypes that they generated of who had the biggest schwanzes, average sized schwanzes, fucked the longest or were quick to come or went for multiple sessions. The interesting point was that German men were said to be dotted across the full sprectrum of customer types. I expect that was because there are more German customers and yes they would span the full spectrum of customer types compared to the smaller experience of each nationalities.

Cheers,

Londonbasketcase

Oh man, I would love to hear the sum and substance of that conversation-
Professor Case- it would be wonderful if you could make a spreadsheet or otherwise impart the results of your informal polling of the girls and their work preferences. Or perhaps we can discuss it at a future meeting soon.

Regards,
beffen

Basketcase

01-31-09, 21:33

Oh man, I would love to hear the sum and substance of that conversation-
Professor Case- it would be wonderful if you could make a spreadsheet or otherwise impart the results of your informal polling of the girls and their work preferences. Or perhaps we can discuss it at a future meeting soon.

Regards,
beffen

Hey Beffen,

The overall chat went on for like 2 hours - it was a real slow night and it was with a group of girls with much experience of the FKKs. The girls were good at being methodical starting from one end of the spectrum saying these two European countries's nationalities were the worse customers for banging for the full half hour to the customers in the middle to the customers at the far end of the spectrum that come the quickest and somehow revive the quickest to go again. The customers that come the quickest but seem to revive the quickest like I said is the same country that many Romanian girls pretend that they are from when they are not.

It was interesting to know where American men came compared to Russian men then Japanese, Chinese, Indians, Italians, French, Turkei, Arabs, and ethnic Africans (sorry they were not country specific for Africans).

Remember it was their stereotypes and I do not want to offend but it was very enlightening seeing their perspective and at times shattering some stereotypes that I had of who was good at what. I had a gorgeous naked slender leggy German blond on my lap during this conversation so I was very pleased with myself.

Beffen. just PM when you are around next - I am usually around so we should be able to easily hook up.

Kind regards

Londonbasketcase

Breadman

02-01-09, 00:05

When will the first big club close its doors?

Or small club for that matter. Interesting comment...we as guests don't think about the cost of running a club...price of gas to heat the place, electricity to light and cool the place in summer, food/beverages...all that. Ask yourself how many times you've paid the entry to a club and said to yourself "I couldn't get this much stuff anywhere except an fkk club".

Breadman

02-01-09, 00:33

If your looking to meet up with other posters on every visit, you setting yourself up for some form of betrayal...and its all your own fault so don't go blaming others if it happens. If your a tourist or a semi frequent visitor and some guys you meet are regulars of the club, do you really think they'd risk their sexual activities for someone they don't even know? Do you know their last names, where they work and live?? If not don't reveal too much information that can haunt you later. Keep things private to a point, don't show up to the clubs and announce to the world who you are. People talk, word gets around...and then its not hard to pick that person out of a crowd.

If its recognition your looking for, put a sign around your neck and announce to the club...aka world who you are. The clubs are for fucking, not socializing. You want recognition, go into politics.

Iseeu

02-01-09, 01:17

Oh I can visualise in my mind's eye our esteemed colleagues JackyO, Excess, Isee and other NRW afficianados shaking their head in disgust and saying: This kind of bullshit would never happen at proper clubs like Bernd's, etc....And they're absolutely right about this. But...Do you believe in change?

As Dedalus has already suggested: The writing is on the wall. The so-called "old days" of great service at minimal prices are gone. I know this is not change we want to believe in...

Dedalus makes a very interesting point when he suggests that the problems we are discussing are less prevalent in clubs where girls do not approach the men, mainly clubs in NRW. I can say, that there maybe something to that. I would never even dream that a girl at, say, F39 would try to pull some of this shit. No DFKing? Never! Sure some guys, maybe alot of married men and others, do not engage in DFK with girls at the clubs. But plenty do seek it and it is/should continue to be a standard element of the FKK session, whether that session is 30mins or longer. That is my view of it anyway.

It shouldn't only be the "NRW afficianados" shaking their heads in disgust. All of us, who have been in this hobby for a couple of years, should be shaking our collective heads in disgust at some of the behavior that has been reported on the board and saying that this bullsh*t SHOULD NEVER happen at ANY FKK CLUB.

Charging extra for kissing, for waiting time, for 3 minutes over the half hour. Charging for CIM when only a BBBJ was given, even charging for being nice and civil to the customer! SP refusing to go to a room unless you agree to pay 100 Euro for a half hour session! Expecting a tip for cuddling and not being a cold fish? What is this sh*t? Women wearing clothing in an FKK club when it's not dessous day? Coercing CIM or COB against the wishes of the customer? Only agreeing to DFK or DATY if it's an extended session?

And then some of our fellow posters find reasons to condone these behaviors and why they may be acceptable? Some are even implying that it's our own fault because we speak with other mongers during our down time or have too high a level of expectations from these poor SP.

I'm not just demoaning about the current lack of serious couch action at many of the popular clubs, which was always a standard method of auditioning the talent. Not in the kino- in the public areas. This used to regularly happen in Hessen, not only in select clubs in NRW.

In my waning memory, I seem to remember what standard FKK service used to mean:
* it included a fully naked woman (no shoes either once in the room)
* it included some talking and getting to know each other in the public area
* it included some touching, kissing, and other action in the public area
* it included DFK, DATY, BBBJ, and sex.

I may be naive or perhaps some call me a purist or a dreamer, but this is what we should expect of our SP. And if she is providing any of the above as a professional service, we should not have to guess or wonder if she will actually be good at any of these activities, but expect it.

Nothing less and nothing more should be expected other than what the term "standard FKK service" implicitly inlcudes. Anything else is elective, a matter of negotiation and choice on the part of the SP and the customer, and can't be expected. But standard service provided in a professional manner by a professional should always be expected.

I was once a newbie as well, but it was during a different time in the FKK universe. Today's newbies, coming say for the first time to an FKK after being released from the sex penitentiary that I call home, could be well excused for succumbing to the seductive guiles of a nubile sweetie. Basic econonmic theory will say that if the SP can charge for it and get someone to pay for it she will set her product and price at that level. I don't blame the SP for trying when there's an easy mark in their sight. In their tight shoes, I might do the same, if I knew that I could get away with it.

Yes, the times have changed; due to the internet (and ISG and all of us who post here may be somehwat responsible for this) there are more sex tourists finding their way to the clubs, and changing European economic factors mean that there are fewer desperate E. European SP who were the stalwarts of previous eras. But, those of us who know better, and have seen what good FKK service really provides, should continue to shake our collective heads and try to educate newer mongers how to be a more "educated consumer". And we should continue to be selective in the women that we choose and the clubs that we frequent.

May be it's time that we more experienced mongers start a training camp for would-be mongers, and award them their mongering towels only upon completion of the requisite Basic FKK 1.01 and FKK Economics 1.01?

Ortos

02-01-09, 06:34

Or small club for that matter. Interesting comment...we as guests don't think about the cost of running a club...price of gas to heat the place, electricity to light and cool the place in summer, food/beverages...all that. Ask yourself how many times you've paid the entry to a club and said to yourself "I couldn't get this much stuff anywhere except an fkk club".

...price of gas to heat the place....Oh, thanks! Now I understand why the showers at Palace never have proper hot water...

Ortos

Ortos

02-01-09, 06:47

Basketcase

02-01-09, 13:02

I wonder, however, whether the collective FKK club management would all agree if asked to list on a piece of paper what are the standard elements of a 30min FKK session. Would all your listed points be included and fully agreed on.

I personally don't think we are at the point where we have to have some kind of specific verbal contract about every position and sex activity we want to engage in with a girl before we enter the room. Alot of it can be brought down to a contract agreed in the eye contact or the type of smile/chemistry one might develop with a girl. And that is why certain elements of the FKK pre-zimmer experience, like couch action in public areas, needs to be preserved --as Iseeu says-- or we will be dealing with a heavily diluted FKK product.

Ortos and others,

A girl at Palace had said that the management had told the girls that the €50 session covered suck and fuck. The girls took that this implied that anything else was extra including GFE services like kissing, muschi licking, ball licking and sucking, and also drove the natural further implication that titten fucking and come on body were also extras. It is Palace where I am usually charged for COB. I am not charged for COB at Oase or World except by Eva (Serbia) at World and Olivia (Polen) at World. Zarina (Ukraine) is quite professional saying that a guest pays €50 for half a hour and she would give half a hour and it is up to the man to elect what he does in his half hour apart from the usual extras like CIM at an extra €50.

Moving to Oase the brief explanation by Oase to guests arriving at Reception just says €50 for half hour with the girls. When I talk to the girls about what is included in the half hour the usual in a session is it suck and fuck but it sort of went without saying that muschi licking was involved although kissing was a moot point as not all girls do it but in my experience 95% did. Alia (Germany) is one of the few exceptions that do not kiss for example although she does for me an excellent blasen for a very pretty girl that looks like Paris Hilton.

At Artemis in Berlin there was a more larger number of girls that do not kiss in my experience and I ended up having to ask if they kissed or not and sometimes when they did say they kissed it was just light kissing and/or only for a little while for a few pecks. The basic service once again seemed to be blasen and fucking.

Kind regards

Basketcase

Nick The G

02-01-09, 14:16

@Breadman: to me it appears a bit that your world view is based on deep mistrust.
Maybe our behaviour in the club is pretty much a reflection based on how many lies we have to tell other important ones in our life to get the "freedom" and ressources (time, money) to go there.

I came to know LBC once for a short time, so I don't really know him. But to me he appeared open minded and communicative. I would describe him in the best way as an "obsessed researcher", an expert in the field of muschi-science! :) And, as is good custom in the field of sciences, he studies thoroughly and writes long and detailed reports! :D
@LBC: hope to meet you this year and have time to talk longer with you!

.... If you're a tourist or a semi frequent visitor and some guys you meet are regulars of the club, do you really think they'd risk their sexual activities for someone they don't even know? ...Sorry, even after reading this for several times I don't understand what you mean with "risk their sexual activities.."! Sounds a bit paranoic to me ;)

The clubs are for fucking, not socializing. Different opinions might exist on this matter. I would agree with you completely if you were relating to a "Laufhaus". A Laufhaus-brothel is for fucking, not for socializing. True! Stairs up and down, no room left for socializing.
Atmosphere and life in one of the big clubs (in Hessia) imho is completely different. Many people go there to spend a whole day! I spent so many beautiful summer days in FKK-World. I enjoyed and will enjoy very much the talks with many people there, from Germany and others countries too. And eating and drinking together. And I learned so much about other countries and behaviour of the people there, e.g. Russia, Romania, Hungary, Georgia, Poland from talking with the girls who work in the clubs.

But I do have another example too! I have a friend, he is not interested at all in coming to know anybody in the club or talk more than a little bit with other men. He is completely fixed on women and fucking. Whenever we visit a club together, he is already running around in the club trying to find his prey when I'm still under the shower!
And he feels bored very very easily, if he cannot fuck a woman or a least gets the feeling from a woman, that she flirts with him or finds him very interesting.
After he has fucked several times and run out of money, he wants to go home immediately.

Breadman

02-01-09, 15:05

@breadman: to me it appears a bit that your world view is based on deep mistrust.

hardly. just trying to make a point that just because you post here...and then meet someone else who posts here at a club...does not always a friendship make. yes, you can chat and talk about this and that, this girl and that girl. unlike say a stripclub where your just getting a dance from their favorite girl...in this case your going to be fucking their favorite girl. big difference.

say you do something the girl doesn't like or vice versa...and things get messy...you get the idea. so after you leave and head back home...and that guy you met meets up with his favorite girl...do you really think he's going to stand up for someone he just met or hardly knows? she'll probably here comments like "i don't even know the guy"...or worse.

i do socialize while im in the clubs, i find it very easy to chat up someone sitting next to me ogling a naked hotty...something of interest to talk about. for me though, the clubs are a way to get away from all the bullshit and just relax. im not looking for conversation with other guests to pass the time, i can bullshit with guys at the bar at home any day of the week. i have met up with some posters who i consider friends though. i'll be honest, a group of isg'ers stand out like a sore thumb. i've met groups of guys from several different countries who basically look like friends who decided to make a trip to the clubs. i've also met groups of icebears, they too seem to blend into a club. now a group of isg'ers is the exact opposite...they stand out. standing out in a club isn't always a good thing, i prefer to try to blend in and pick and choose...the group to sum it up might effect the hunt...ie experiences that otherwise wouldn't present themselves. same rule applies for a group of girls as it does for a group of guys...its hard for a guy to approach a table full of girls...and the reverse is true for the girls. its hard to interact with the girl if there are 4 other guys present. i've spent hours with several girls outside the room and i doubt it would have happened had guys i just met kept coming up to me and wanting to chat. lasting memories of a hot naked chick draped over your lap or a conversation you'll soon forget from a poster you'll soon forget...hard to decide on that one.

basically not all your friends can afford this hobby...or want to partake. so people want to meet new people in the hobby that they can call friends...doing so via the internet. just trying to say not everyone you meet is looking out for your best interest....ie use common sense.

Basketcase

02-01-09, 15:31

Hey Nick The G,

Maybe our behaviour in the club is pretty much a reflection based on how many lies we have to tell other important ones in our life to get the "freedom" and ressources (time, money) to go there.

I guess you are right. I have few people that I need to report into so I have the freedom and I have less need to account for my time and money. I also have some home chores to do, the ijsberen go further say I need to get a house with a garden so I am not always in the FKKs and saunaclubs. The main one for my normal life is for me is coming up with excuses as to why I am in Germany all the time and primarily for Frankfurt which everyone keeps telling me: "there is nothing to do there except if you are there for work in insurance or banking". I think I get away with it that its an international city and that I meet people that I know there and we go out to eat and relax which is true.

My friends all know what I do in Germany and have even come over themselves to see what the fuss that their Basketcase is enjoying in Germany. The problem is that they prefer the delights of Thailand as its better value for money as others have discussed before.

I came to know LBC once for a short time, so I don't really know him. But to me he appeared open minded and communicative. I would describe him in the best way as an "obsessed researcher", an expert in the field of muschi-science! :) And, as is good custom in the field of sciences, he studies thoroughly and writes long and detailed reports! :D
@LBC: hope to meet you this year and have time to talk longer with you!

Nick The G, thank you for your kind words. I appreciate them very much.

I suppose I am a definite hobbyist and like to ensure that good research is taken to make sure I do a good job and leaving less to chance. You do get much more enjoyment when you are immersed in a topic. I quite like that term: muschi science.

I was actually looked out for you when I was in FKK World during January but I guess our dates did not coincide. I was very much hoping to bump into you to catch up and chat. I am sure we will have more opportunities this year coming. I have a few pencilled in dates. I will PM you when the dates firm up.

Atmosphere and life in one of the big clubs (in Hessia) imho is completely different. Many people go there to spend a whole day! I spent so many beautiful summer days in FKK-World. I enjoyed and will enjoy very much the talks with many people there, from Germany and others countries too. And eating and drinking together. And I learned so much about other countries and behaviour of the people there, e.g. Russia, Romania, Hungary, Georgia, Poland from talking with the girls who work in the clubs.

But I do have another example too! I have a friend, he is not interested at all in coming to know anybody in the club or talk more than a little bit with other men. He is completely fixed on women and fucking. Whenever we visit a club together, he is already running around in the club trying to find his prey when I'm still under the shower! And he feels bored very very easily, if he cannot fuck a woman or a least gets the feeling from a woman, that she flirts with him or finds him very interesting. After he has fucked several times and run out of money, he wants to go home immediately.

At first when I started this hobby in Germany it was all about the women and doing as many as was humanly possible by my body. I look at my old trip reports and see me doing 6-7 girls per FKK visit. I remember the pain I was putting on my schwanz in knocking out all those come shots. Then after a while I realised that I could get across to Germany relatively easily even with flights involved. With the enlightenment that came with not having to bang every girl on your wish list and knowing you can come back another time to do the others took a burden off me.

I then came to enjoy the full FKK experience. The showering, the nakedness, the Finnish sauna, the Turkish steam room, the massages, watching TV, sitting in the sunshine in the Summer months. It became my weekend retreat after a hard day at work and the girls were also a big part. Chatting to the girls was a lot of fun and brought me more confidence would you believe.

There are girls and customers from many nations and it is so interesting to hear the stories that each person has. I studied a lot of History when I was at school and then bringing to life the people that inhabit the lands that I read about brought back those thoughts I had of those studies.

I also became friendly with many other forum writers and non forum writers to spend downtime together. This enhanced the experience even more since not only did we talk about the girls but also other topics of life outside the FKKs.

So yes at first I was like your friend wanting to bang as many girls as I can and not really knowing anyone but then the motive has changed slightly to relaxation but yes I admit the over arching motive is spending quality time with girls licking a beautifuly formed muschi, getting a good blasen and having wonderful sex and for me usually a CIM or COB finish. I guess I watch too much porn.

The interesting point is that on my first ever trip to Frankfurt FKKs I actually met a crew of ISGers who I still meet up withh today.

Cheers,

Basketcase

Shark16

02-01-09, 15:34

I personally don't think we are at the point where we have to have some kind of specific verbal contract about every position and sex activity we want to engage in with a girl before we enter the room. Alot of it can be brought down to a contract agreed in the eye contact or the type of smile/chemistry one might develop with a girl. And that is why certain elements of the FKK pre-zimmer experience, like couch action in public areas, needs to be preserved --as Iseeu says-- or we will be dealing with a heavily diluted FKK product.

Ortos

I am a strong believer in couch action/sparkle in the eye/DFK and other pre-zimmer experience, but I regret to say some of these scams have become pretty creative. The rip-off girls will do anything to make a good impression outside the room, but once inside everything changes: The kissing stops, extra for this, extra for that, etc. Although a somewhat mood killer, nowadays in Palace I find it necessary to ask a girl upfront what her services are and what she considers as extras and so on.

I know you and others may not agree to this, but I find it easier to trust couch action in Oase and World. In Palace I am sceptical in involving myself with new girls unless having observed her perfomance in Kino, checking the punter's face at the lockers when payment is made, etc., in additon to a standard couch interview/pre-action.

Breadman

02-01-09, 15:36

Then after a while I realised that I could get across to Germany relatively easily even with flights involved.

Not always the case for many of us. Im on a plane for 12 hours just to get to frankfurt.

With trips being long and few and far between...

Ortos

02-01-09, 18:07

I am a strong believer in couch action/sparkle in the eye/DFK and other pre-zimmer experience, but I regret to say some of these scams have become pretty creative. The rip-off girls will do anything to make a good impression outside the room, but once inside everything changes: The kissing stops, extra for this, extra for that, etc. Although a somewhat mood killer, nowadays in Palace I find it necessary to ask a girl upfront what her services are and what she considers as extras and so on.

I know you and others may not agree to this, but I find it easier to trust couch action in Oase and World. In Palace I am sceptical in involving myself with new girls unless having observed her perfomance in Kino, checking the punter's face at the lockers when payment is made, etc., in additon to a standard couch interview/pre-action.

This is an interesting point you raise: Let's say you engage in some pre-zimmer warm-up on the couch or in the kino. A girl DFKs you there and on that and other bases you decide to commit to a session in the room. No bbbj has yet occurred. Once in the room, the girl stops DFKing and asks for extra money, etc...just as you describe below. Question: If you immediately stand up, put your towel on and leave the room, saying to her: "You are a scam artist because you DFK outside the room but once inside you want extra money. Forget the session! Go find some other sucker." Can't you justifiably abort the session and not be made to pay anything?

Now something similar to this once happened to me at Palace and I immediately left the room as soon as these kind of red flags were raised. The girl looked upset, but I told her to [CodeWord140] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord140) off and not bother me again. And if she wanted to press for money there would be a huge argument at the front desk. The girl was Tan from Shanghai and she did not press the matter. From that day onwards we just ignored each other. But let me be clear here: I stood up and left the room immediately, perhaps within 2 minutes or less of being in the room with her. I sensed a shark or a bad session here and I aborted immediately.

But I think one could make a strong case to the management that this girl who DFKs on the couch but not in the room and does not announce prior to the zimmer that she wants extra for kissing is not holding up her side of the implied contract.

Recently at World I was about to take a girl, a Romanian girl called Olivia, to the room. We had not engaged in DFK or any serious couch action. Before I went away towards the room with her, whilst still on the couch, I leaned over and kissed her with the tongue. She responded a little bit. I asked her directly: "Do you kiss deeply?" She said: "Just take me to the room, and I will show you what kind of a lover I am. You will be very happy." I gambled on the chemistry I thought we had developed and it paid off: true to her word, she delivered a top-notch GFE. Yes there was "sparkle in the eyes" pre-zimmer and that is what I often by instinct go with...

Ortos

Ekliges Lauern

02-01-09, 18:34

It shouldn't only be the "NRW afficianados" shaking their heads in disgust. All of us, who have been in this hobby for a couple of years, should be shaking our collective heads in disgust at some of the behavior that has been reported on the board and saying that this bullsh*t SHOULD NEVER happen at ANY FKK CLUB.

Let me respectfully disagree. The implications of your second sentence as well as Daedalus' comments was everything was somehow better in the past. I only have my personal frame of reference to go on so let's get back into the wayback machine to the 2000-2001 period. I know some mongers history go back further.

Price was 100DM back in 2000. Or 51.13Euro at the pegged conversion rate. I looked up German CPI growth and found from 2000-2007, German CPI increased by 12%.

http://www.econstats.com/r/rger__m8.htm

So between the 2000 and 2007, the price of a session has declined about 15% in inflation adjusted DM/Euro.

In 2000, Poland, the Czech Republic, the Baltic states and Hungary were not part of the EU. The economic situation in Russia could have best been described as appalling. The compensation to the women has declined since 2000 while for the most part the economic situation in their home countries have improved.

Since we are in the World thread, I think it is only fair to compare Atlantis/Oase to the Hessen big three. I had a really bad experience in Oase back in that time frame and stopped going for years. As a result, I went to Atlantis pretty exclusively back then.

Since we are in the World thread, I think it is only fair to compare against Atlantis and Oase. My Oase experience in those days was extremely limited, in fact I recall almost nothing of that club. My first club and main club for many years was Atlantis. Back then my standards as far as the appearance of the women was much higher. Now, I'm sure LBC and Vito think I fuck trolls. My expected level of acceptable service was much lower.

Back then, I could not speak German conversationally, and as such I was an English speaker. Information on the internet in English was comparatively limited. There were other forums, but the frequency of posts were a fraction of today's postings. Armed with a little information and only pidgin German skills I visited the clubs for the first time back in 2000. Couch action was common at Atlantis but restricted to BBBJs. I remember the first time a beautiful Thai girl dropped to her knees and started blowing me at the bar. There was of course, no Kino. With the exception of F39 and Bernds, I just don't run into public action anymore. It seems the Kinos have come to serve that function at most clubs. Kinos, to their credit, seem to encourage more public fucking.

I probably had more ripoff attempts in Atlantis than any other club. Ripoff attempts included one woman trying to convince me on my first visit that it was standard for a man to spend a half hour with the woman in the whirlpool then another half hour in the sauna, followed by a shower and then time in the room, all time chargeable of course. In her words, this isn't a Laufhaus, men come here to spend time with women, not just fuck them. If I wanted to fuck a woman for 100DM, go to a Laufhaus, she said. And by the way, she didn't kiss in the room.

Another attempted scam was one Turkish girl tried to get me to go to the room with her, but she me to commit to doing anal with her. Oh, and BTW, the standard price for anal was 500DM, she said.

So why did I keep going back? Well, when Atlantis was good, it was great. I remember being treated like a rock star because I was American in October 2001 in that brief moment when everyone in the civilized world stood in solidarity with America of the outrage that had just occurred. Pity we pissed that goodwill away. I also had some great sessions with some beautiful women. My great session to BS session ratio was about 2-3 to 1.

As time went by, I got better at selecting women and fending off shark attacks and my German got to the level I can converse in the language. The shark attacks dropped to almost 0.

When Atlantis closed, I started going to Palace. Palace had/has a similar vibe to Atlantis. There has always been a "let's shake down the tourist" vibe to some of the ladies at both places, as well as all large clubs in Germany. I can't say I have noticed a decline in service standards in the roughly 9 years I have been doing this in Germany. The bullshit has always there in the big Hessen clubs. Palace probably stands out the most to some because of its location it has the highest tourist quotient of any club.

My other regular club experience from back in those days were with Park Sauna Wildenrath on the boarder with the Netherlands. PSW had more public action upstairs, but it had no Kino. It was a Sauna club, not an FKK, so dress was comparable to GT today. The ladies' attire, service level (and scam frequency) was about the same as GT today. In fact, GT reminds me of PSW, just more women and better facilities. No public action, but the Kino makes up for it. Now if I could just get them to turn down the music in the contact room.

My experience with the Koeln area clubs was a club whose name I have long since forgotten. It may have have been Sankt Augustin, it could have been Babylon, my memory fades. As I remember, the club had a reputation for turning away non-Germans back then, so I memorized enough German to fake my way through the "have you been here before" door interview. I had a grounding in the language from my college days, so I wasn't totally doing it cold, but I was faking it and making educated guesses at what she was asking me. I got in. The club was basically a bar area off to the side and one main room with couches lining the walls with a circular platform in the center of the room. I remember having difficulty finding women I wanted to session with. I also remember a couple fucking in the center of the room in front of everyone. Plenty of public action. While pleasant enough, I liked the larger and better looking selection of women at Atlantis, bullshit and all. Never returned.

And Berlin, well, back then La Folie was the only FKK. Pure bullshit. Covered BJs were standard. Only redeeming feature was I did fuck a Mongolian woman there (my first). Although I've never been, I can't imagine Artemis is not light years better.

I know you and other think we should all vote with our feet and go to the smaller more service oriented clubs, particularly those around Koeln. We get it. Everyone has varying tastes. Right now, those clubs don't work for me based on the quality and quantity of the women. This may change for me in the future as my tastes broaden. If they don't work for me now, it is unlikely they will work for other mongers whose tastes are far more selective than mine. As previously mentioned both LBC and Vito think I fuck trolls. There is no way Bernds will work for them.

There is another senior monger, who tells us over and over again that the real Germans prefer the smaller service oriented clubs. Two problems with this assertion. First, last time I checked, HB was a "real German" and he seems happy enough with Palace. The second problem is, with apologies to HB, I'm not sure the Germans are the final say on sexual matters. I have nothing but respect for the Germans for coming up with the FKK model. However, a stroll through a Frankfurt Bahnhofsviertel adult bookstore should make anyone question the sexual tastes of the Germans. Pay particular attention to the size of selection of Scheisse, NS and GGG porn. Thanks, but I'll stick to my own tastes, thank you very much. No offense HB, I think you guys brew the best beer in the world, your trains rock, but I'm a little leery of looking to the Germans for guidance in sexual matters.

It comes down to this, what works for one monger doesn't for another. And IMHO, it comes down to a trade off in quality and quantity of women vs. level of service. When the newbees come on wanting advice on which club has the best looking women, it's fairly clear they want to go to one of the Hessen big three or GT. I think the best we can do is try to impart experience to help them avoid the newbee pitfalls that makes them targets. Telling them it was somehow better back in the good old days is bullshit and does them a disservice.

Bratwurst

02-01-09, 19:15

Wenn ich in Deutschland, wie Wurst mit Brot oder Currywurst mit Pommes.

Ich kann auch essen Schwein mit Senf-Sauce.

Really I just like the naked ladies. The Bratwurst is good though.

LondonbasketcaseBratwurst is not only good, it's great!

Currywurst, Weisswurst, Thuringer. There's a universe behind a hot-dog!

And Schweinshaxe, you can get the real one only in Bayern (try Kloster Andechs Biergarten, near Muenchen), and should eat it mit Sauerkraut, oder Rotkohl!

But me too I am for the naked ladies. Never heard of an International Sausage Forum (ISG! )

Ciao

Bratwurst, making his way and heading VV, GT and OASE next week.

Ekliges Lauern

02-01-09, 20:24

How often is it that we see posts here by tourists who have been to the Hessen clubs express surprise when they visit clubs in NRW which don't allow the women to self-market and wonder why that is?

Actually pretty close to never would have been my guess. I can't remember having seen a post asking that recently. Maybe I missed a bunch of them.

Nick The G

02-01-09, 21:38

I think the best we can do is try to impart experience to help them avoid the newbee pitfalls that makes them targets. Telling them it was somehow better back in the good old days is bullshit and does them a disservice.First of all, I agree.
Secondly, as far as I can remember way back in the first days I spent in Atlantis club in Altenstadt, nothing was really better then, nothing! But, of course, it was much more impressive! Why? Because then it was a completely new experience for me.

Fucking is a sensual experience. Let's make use of all our senses and stay in the "here and now".
Old, sexually inactive men and women like to look back and dream and talk about those "good old days" :D

btw.: seems that lots of phantasies went into your new nick: "ekliges Lauern"

Basketcase

02-01-09, 22:46

@Ekliges Lauern,

I only have my personal frame of reference to go on so let's get back into the wayback machine to the 2000-2001 period. I know some mongers history go back further.

Price was 100DM back in 2000. Or 51.13Euro at the pegged conversion rate. I looked up German CPI growth and found from 2000-2007, German CPI increased by 12%.

http://www.econstats.com/r/rger__m8.htm

So between the 2000 and 2007, the price of a session has declined about 15% in inflation adjusted DM/Euro.

In 2000, Poland, the Czech Republic, the Baltic states and Hungary were not part of the EU. The economic situation in Russia could have best been described as appalling. The compensation to the women has declined since 2000 while for the most part the economic situation in their home countries have improved.

I see the logic in this argument and it is not the first time that this analysis has been bandied about. I sometimes see the same sentiments amongst the German girls saying that the Eastern European girls are under cutting them on service doing what they say is more for the €50 which they no longer wish to do since it is a lot of work do perform DFK, DATY, BBBJ and covered sex for a full 30 minutes for just €50. Just you try thinking whether you would suck someone's cock for €50?

Some German girls say that some years ago they were quite happy to do all the usual services like DFK, DATY, BBBJ and covered sex for €50 but nowadays these girls give the guys that want the €50 deal the short program of suck and fuck only and get them out the door. Basically in and out in 10 minutes. That is what they see the service level for a €50 note. To do more is to under cut their earning potential.

I can see where the girls are coming from with this argument. It was like the note that at Oase some girls are offering to do sessions for €30. A girl who heard this comment said that the girls who do that should not work in FKKs and can do that on the street. She said she works hard enough for €50 a session and she is from Eastern Europe.

A 15% paycut in real terms for a standard session is a lot of money especially when there is no basic salary involved and its all turnover related to profit. Then there is the point that Marlow made in post 838539 that the girl has to do 3 clients at €50 each before she starts making money for herself or for her pimp for that matter:

838539

No wonder you have many of the girls thinking of working in Switzerland or other Western countries or other clubs to try their luck elsewhere. You even girls saying that they did jobs in Florida USA. It has been discussed before that Linda (Czech) went to work in FKK Globe in Zurich and came back - maybe the voloume and competitiveness made her come back. Olivia (Polen) indicates she work in Switzerland and most of the German girls at Oase have worked in Switzerland at some stage but have come back to Germany and Oase or World as they main bases. The girls also look for the good escort jobs that pay €200 or more a hour or the jobs to the Italian lakes, to the Middle East or to the French Riveria.

Now, I'm sure LBC and Vito think I fuck trolls. My expected level of acceptable service was much lower.

Ekliges Lauern, I do not quite think you fuck trolls. I am just fastidious where I put my schwanz and which muschis I lick. I like a clean shaven and pink muschi for me to dine upon. I like a pretty girl sucking my schwanz and Eier. I like a tight toned body for me to fondle. I am paying for it so I like to get the fantasy if I can and especially when the price of such is the same for the troll as it it for the wet dream cheerleader looking Bimbo.

You have a broad spectrum of tastes which I find commendable and I should aspire to that status so that whichever club that I attend that there is something that I want to go with instead of turning up my nose.

Couch action was common at Atlantis but restricted to BBBJs. I remember the first time a beautiful Thai girl dropped to her knees and started blowing me at the bar. There was of course, no Kino. With the exception of F39 and Bernds, I just don't run into public action anymore. It seems the Kinos have come to serve that function at most clubs. Kinos, to their credit, seem to encourage more public fucking.

I get the odd occassion of what you say in Oase but this is so rare and is not the norm. The kino does get all sorts of action. National Geographic in proportions with all the copulating couples that even David Attenborough would be astounded trying to describe the mating habits of the homo sapiens species.

There are at busy times be a lot of fucking going on in the kino.

As for me - I have rarely fucked in public - one time on the podium in Oase in the morning session when there were only a few girls and punters around to watch me perform in broad view of the bar, the main lounge and beyond.

My great session to BS session ratio was about 2-3 to 1. As time went by, I got better at selecting women and fending off shark attacks and my German got to the level I can converse in the language. The shark attacks dropped to almost 0.

I see the point and it is noted that having better German language skills will enhance the experience, but as yet I am not willing to invest in a German language course. So far I think I have been doing okay with English and have found a few favourites that I really connect with I think that I speak English with a even a few that speak very little English that I get along with well.

When Atlantis closed, I started going to Palace. Palace had/has a similar vibe to Atlantis. There has always been a "let's shake down the tourist" vibe to some of the ladies at both places, as well as all large clubs in Germany. I can't say I have noticed a decline in service standards in the roughly 9 years I have been doing this in Germany. The bullshit has always there in the big Hessen clubs. Palace probably stands out the most to some because of its location it has the highest tourist quotient of any club.

Not having the history I cannot comment but I do see the logic. All I have are Ortos and Beffen's posts from 2001-2003 period giving me an indication of what it was like. It does sound wild back then but it can be wild now and you just have to be around to see what goes on.

My other regular club experience from back in those days were with Park Sauna Wildenrath on the boarder with the Netherlands. PSW had more public action upstairs, but it had no Kino. It was a Sauna club, not an FKK, so dress was comparable to GT today. The ladies' attire, service level (and scam frequency) was about the same as GT today. In fact, GT reminds me of PSW, just more women and better facilities. No public action, but the Kino makes up for it. Now if I could just get them to turn down the music in the contact room.

It is nice to know that I did not miss anything with Park Sauna Wildenrath and that Golden Time is it direct descendant in terms of service levels and quality of the ladies.

And Berlin, well, back then La Folie was the only FKK. Pure bullshit. Covered BJs were standard. Only redeeming feature was I did fuck a Mongolian woman there (my first). Although I've never been, I can't imagine Artemis is not light years better.

I have not been to La Folie but I have been to Artemis and Artemis to me is like Palace - good in the selection of women but bad in that I had to be more selective and interview the girls as to what they did in the room like kissing. I did not come across any girl that insisted in covered BJ thankfully and also COB seemed to be inclusive in the €60 price.

You should make the trip to Berlin for Artemis - if you like Palace then I am sure that you like Artemis. As Dick Travel said in his report 840144 it also reminded him of Palace:

840144

I know you and other think we should all vote with our feet and go to the smaller more service oriented clubs, particularly those around Koeln. We get it. Everyone has varying tastes. Right now, those clubs don't work for me based on the quality and quantity of the women. This may change for me in the future as my tastes broaden. If they don't work for me now, it is unlikely they will work for other mongers whose tastes are far more selective than mine. As previously mentioned both LBC and Vito think I fuck trolls. There is no way Bernds will work for them.

Ekliges Lauern, I think that you are right. I made the trip to PT Osnabruek and had a shocking time with the ladies since the quality was not there but I had not laughed so hard in my life. It was so much fun doing all the antics that we got up to. A real free for all and hardcore. I still have nightmares of the 10-15 guys lining up to fuck one Eastern European blond girl as well as the hordes of customers trying to get their pink schwanzes inside one of the Dutch porn stars (and me too!!!).

Basketcase report 766869
Creature2 report (shorter one)767121
Creature2 report (longer one)781373

However, a stroll through a Frankfurt Bahnhofsviertel adult bookstore should make anyone question the sexual tastes of the Germans. Pay particular attention to the size of selection of Scheisse, NS and GGG porn. Thanks, but I'll stick to my own tastes, thank you very much. No offense HB, I think you guys brew the best beer in the world, your trains rock, but I'm a little leery of looking to the Germans for guidance in sexual matters.

If the German men are into this hardcore style of porn then think how open minded their women folk have to be to put up with their men demanding them to perform some of the sexual acts depicted. This does play on the stereotypes one has of German sexual proclivities. I am not condemning it - I am only deploring that my country is not so open minded about it as well. I may have to get a German wife or girlfriend if they are this open minded. Yay!!! Where can I get a German wife or girlfriend from?

It comes down to this, what works for one monger doesn't for another. And IMHO, it comes down to a trade off in quality and quantity of women vs. level of service. When the newbees come on wanting advice on which club has the best looking women, it's fairly clear they want to go to one of the Hessen big three or GT. I think the best we can do is try to impart experience to help them avoid the newbee pitfalls that makes them targets. Telling them it was somehow better back in the good old days is bullshit and does them a disservice.

Ekliges Lauern,

I wholeheartedly agree with your comment. Please deal with the here and now rather than discuss what it is not now. The previous times may have been the golden age but I am not in that golden age. I still recall some of Ortos' trip reports from 2001 saying XXXXX was a shark or YYYYY was a GFE so even then there were the players skimming the tourists.

Kind regards

Basketcase

Dedalus

02-02-09, 00:55

Let me respectfully disagree. The implications of your second sentence as well as Daedalus' comments was everything was somehow better in the past. I only have my personal frame of reference to go on so let's get back into the wayback machine to the 2000-2001 period. I know some mongers history go back further.

It comes down to this, what works for one monger doesn't for another. And IMHO, it comes down to a trade off in quality and quantity of women vs. level of service. When the newbees come on wanting advice on which club has the best looking women, it's fairly clear they want to go to one of the Hessen big three or GT. I think the best we can do is try to impart experience to help them avoid the newbee pitfalls that makes them targets. Telling them it was somehow better back in the good old days is bullshit and does them a disservice.

Hey,

I know that my cred with you is nil. Still, for what it's worth a comment and clarification or two might be in order.

While I certainly agree that different dudes may have different tastes and needs, I DO stand by my belief that it was a better scene and atmosphere in the FKKs back in the day, and that service standards have in general gone downhill. You and a few others may not agree and that is you right, but those are my observations.

It is too bad that you had some rough times at Atlantis. My experiences there were very different. I never belonged to the group of people who thought that it was the mother of all FKKs, but they did have consistently great line-ups and in all my visits there (and they were quite frequent) I never once had a girl try to cheat me on time or sell me a "standard" as an "extra". Also most nights that I was there a good deal of couch action and public sex took place. Remember the bed on in the main contact area?
On 70% of my visits some it was being put to good use.

A club like Babylon set the standard back in the late 90s. It was tough to beat both the service standards and the quality of women. When I was going there frequently, the line-ups (usually 20 or so in number) were similar looks-wise to the finest Palace and Oase line-ups that I have seen. Combine that with Bernd's quality service and that was a cocktail that was hard to top.

Back when Oase was the only member of the future Big-3, quality was also quite good and the scam factor also was pretty low. Oddly enough, it was when competition from Atlantis, World and eventually Palace entered the picture, that service standards started to slide a little. In general however it has been my experience that Oase, despite occasional ups and downs, continues to provide a pretty good experience with a relatively small percentage of scammers. Again, this is just my experience.

I won't bother to rehash any differences on the Palace issue except to say that for several years it was my favorite club. That unfortunately changed about three years ago.

World is having line up issues right now. I just spent the last three days at World, and Oase and while I have a sentimental bias toward World, there was no comparison between the two places. There are still some gems there. (Leila, Lucy, Annemarie, Martha, etc.) However a talent infusion would not hurt the place.

(BTW, Mike D. If your out there, I could kick you for recommending Monika to me. Cute, but the deadest fish in the lake.)

First of all, I agree.
Secondly, as far as I can remember way back in the first days I spent in Atlantis club in Altenstadt, nothing was really better then, nothing! But, of course, it was much more impressive! Why? Because then it was a completely new experience for me.

Fucking is a sensual experience. Let's make use of all our senses and stay in the "here and now".
Old, sexually inactive men and women like to look back and dream and talk about those "good old days"

Firstly, I think that QUITE a bit was better back then. I wouldn't say that every girl was a winner, but I would say that percentages were much higher. Only real improvement that I have noticed is club facilities.
Also in contrast with you, Atlantis was not a new experience for me.

Secondly, while I may be guilty of over indulging in nostalgia (actually I think we had a conversation about this once) and while I agree that it is important to "stay in the here and now", I also think that comparing the here and now to "way back when" can be a positive and beneficial thing. And those who want dismiss those of us who remember the "good old days" as being-stuck-in-the-past are missing a broader point. I can understand and accept that the scene undergoes some changes. But why do some many of these changes have to involve a compromise in service standards or an acceptance of chicanery from the girls? Maybe if more of us Gents knew how it was in the "good old days" at places like Babylon, Oase ca. 1997-2002 etc., then we might be less inclined to accept anything less.

For those who believe that all is well in the scene these days, then what I say will not reach you. Your choice. However I suspect that most guys here who have been doing this hobby for 10 years or more understand what I am driving at.

Cheers,

Dedalus

Jackyo

02-02-09, 01:12

Secondly, while I may be guilty of over indulging in nostalgia (actually I think we had a conversation about this once) and while I agree that it is important to "stay in the here and now", I also think that comparing the here and now to "way back when" can be a positive and beneficial thing. And those who want dismiss those of us who remember the "good old days" as being-stuck-in-the-past are missing a broader point. I can understand and accept that the scene undergoes some changes. But why do some many of these changes have to involve a compromise in service standards or an acceptance of chicanery from the girls? Maybe if more of us Gents knew how it was in the "good old days" at places like Babylon, Oase ca. 1997-2002 etc., then we might be less inclined to accept anything less.

For those who believe that all is well in the scene these days, then what I say will not reach you. Your choice. However I suspect that most guys here who have been doing this hobby for 10 years or more understand what I am driving at.

Cheers,

Dedalus
For guys who have just started out in this hobby, there is no legitimate point of comparison whether in a cross-sectional sense or in a time-series sense.

So no offense intended but its really not the same to hear someone who is relatively new say: "XYZ Club is the greatest thing ever!"

The question that follows logically is: "In comparison to what?"

Babylon back in the late 90s really rocked. It is still my all time favorite club. The last time I was there was in the Fall of 07 and I am rooting for it to make a come back.

To enter a club where you could throw a dart to pick your next Lebensabschnittgefaehrtin is truly something else. No surprises, just a guaranteed experience.

If I want to do negotiating, I will visit a Laufhaus.

It bothers to me to no end to visit a club and have to wonder whether I'm dealing with someone who will short time me or try to upsell or run some similar scam. And one experience like that during a visit is enough to ruin my mood for the duration of my visit. The logic goes: "If she just tried to pull a fast one on me, she learned it from somewhere so her friends are into the same scam".

Nein, danke.

Beam me back to Elsdorf in 1999, please.

Ekliges Lauern

02-02-09, 12:34

Some German girls say that some years ago they were quite happy to do all the usual services like DFK, DATY, BBBJ and covered sex for €50 but nowadays these girls give the guys that want the €50 deal the short program of suck and fuck only and get them out the door. Basically in and out in 10 minutes. That is what they see the service level for a €50 note. To do more is to under cut their earning potential.

I can see where the girls are coming from with this argument. It was like the note that at Oase some girls are offering to do sessions for €30. A girl who heard this comment said that the girls who do that should not work in FKKs and can do that on the street. She said she works hard enough for €50 a session and she is from Eastern Europe.

Actually, back in the days when I was just starting out in Atlantis, it was quite rare to find a German woman in the club. As I remember, the general consensus on the boards was German women were to be avoided. Funny how things have turned around as some of the best sessions out there are German women.

A 15% paycut in real terms for a standard session is a lot of money especially when there is no basic salary involved and its all turnover related to profit. Then there is the point that Marlow made in post 838539 that the girl has to do 3 clients at €50 each before she starts making money for herself or for her pimp for that matter:

Given the decline in real wages, I'm surprised things are holding up as well as they are. Plus, I suspect within the EE EU girls, London is now the choice destination over Germany.

I see the point and it is noted that having better German language skills will enhance the experience, but as yet I am not willing to invest in a German language course. So far I think I have been doing okay with English and have found a few favourites that I really connect with I think that I speak English with a even a few that speak very little English that I get along with well.

Actually, I think the shark attacks would have dropped to zero irrespective of whether I learned German. It was a matter of experience as well as my becoming less focused on a certain type of woman and getting better at seeing the overall picture. But don't get me wrong, German language skills help.

Marlow

02-02-09, 16:40

..@Dedalus - I am 100% in agreement with you as I am with Iseeu.

Didn't expect to spark of such a debate, but having read through it I am very glad some extremely experienced members of this forum have spoken. Sorry I took a back seat, but others have said exactly what I would have, had I not been enjoying the delights of Janette, Sara, Natalie, Mona at Finca. All four are proof that standards still exist as some of us remember them.

Pimping exists in Germany, though no girl actually needs one. Girls will come to Germany from other EU countries knowing they can work independently, which is unlikely to be the case in their home country. Germany at the current time is overrun with girls from the new EU member states. Pimping is only a serious issue in countries in which the sex industry is illegal or quasi-illegal.

In general scamming is the worst I have heard of it, particularly here, and the pressure to keep prices down because of the financial crisis encourages it - make a buck while you can, anyway you can. On the other hand those East European currencies not in the Euro mean a girl from Hungary for example is making it up on the currency exchange with a rate of 10,000 to 35.

Toscana

02-02-09, 21:41

Things evolve all the time. We've been going through a phase in the past two years when - on account of increasing demand - the pendulum has swung a little towards the girls. They have not managed to raise the direct price (the club managements and stout defence by the German regulars effectively prevented this), but they are trying at some clubs to raise it through "extra extras" and other methods we call scamming etc. These tend to be clubs which are underpinned by a strong flow of tourist punters and this gives the "enterprising" some easy prey. Not all girls of course. There are excellent providers in every club. The experienced punters find the good girls, still. But they too have to fend off the scammers and upsellers.

I agree with Marlow, Iseeu, Dedalus and others that the standards we expect are a bit under pressure. It is indeed harder in my experience to make choices. But there is not a lot we can do about it. Just fight our own corner. We should not, however, be "appeasers", trying to understand the ill-behaved, to find excuses for the shenanigans, by crying over how little they have left over after they've paid their entrance, taxes, etc.. That's wrong-headed. A market's a market, they can leave it they do not like the offered price. And we pay more than EUR 50 if you include our taxes, and our social security contributions, and our our entry fee.

We should report honestly when bad service or other shitty tactics occur, just as we do if we get good service, so that others can be warned, if they wish to pay heed, and may be helped. If someone disagrees, or doesn't want to listen, that's just fine. That's always been my mantra for a number of years.

In fact I don't think the future is all doom and gloom. The recession will bite hard. Fewer punters, more girls joining the chase and appreciating that EUR 50 isn't too bad after all. Especially from Eastern Europe, which is great news for me :-). More girls chasing fewer men sounds good to me. Some clubs will go to the wall, more will come under financial pressure (they are already by all accounts), and the managements will become a little bit more reasonable and sensitive than they have been when it comes to listening to service complaints.

And there will be fewer Messe visitors, so even spoilt managements at big city clubs will notice the turndown. Give it twelve months and I think we'll have a somewhat different picture. This is in my opinion not the time to despair at FKK club standards.

Marlow

02-02-09, 22:17

Agree with Toscana -
As Frankfurt declines and the messe trade falls off......so be it. Reading other sections of this forum I do realise how lucky we are in Germany. and if some male attitudes that I read make me cringe, they are not by any means to be found in the German section.

Breadman

02-02-09, 22:53

As Frankfurt declines and the messe trade falls off.....

How's the trade show business looking with this world economic downturn? I read in another thread someone saying the crowd wasn't what the girls expected from the recent trade fair. Everything seems to be down, you hear and read it everyday...wonder if this carries over to the clubs as well?

Dedalus

02-02-09, 23:25

I agree with Marlow, Iseeu, Dedalus and others that the standards we expect are a bit under pressure. It is indeed harder in my experience to make choices. But there is not a lot we can do about it. Just fight our own corner. We should not, however, be "appeasers", trying to understand the ill-behaved, to find excuses for the shenanigans, by crying over how little they have left over after they've paid their entrance, taxes, etc.. That's wrong-headed. A market's a market, they can leave it they do not like the offered price. And we pay more than EUR 50 if you include our taxes, and our social security contributions, and our our entry fee.

And there will be fewer Messe visitors, so even spoilt managements at big city clubs will notice the turndown. Give it twelve months and I think we'll have a somewhat different picture. This is in my opinion not the time to despair at FKK club standards.

Hey Tosc,

Very sage and reasonable observations.

The recession is already having an effect. I was talking to a girl at World on Friday who told me that many male guests that she was use to seeing 6 to 8 times per month, she now sees only one time per month or less. Many regulars she was use to seeing seem to have disappeared.

Oase seems to be keeping up as far as male traffic goes, but a few girls this weekend told me that guys are making fewer trips to the rooms, and some are just coming to leer or hang out with friends.

The girls with a good regulars list seem to be weathering the storm OK. I finally did a session with Hannah at Oase last Saturday (waited WAY too long to tap that lady, for she is a Major Leaguer!!!) and she is still busy despite the tighter wallets of many guys. However I observed that Lucia is having to hustle much more to make her bones in the “Hit and Run” style that she is accustomed. Hell, she even tried to be friendly to me, which is odd considering we have never said a word to each other since our one and only session. She mentioned to me that I always have new friends when I visit. Too bad that she did not realized this when we did our only session together. Had she been a good provider, I would have been a regular and I would have recommended her to numerous running mates. And I suspect that she may actually have just realized this. Little too late though.

You mention that there is not a lot we can do about the standards except fight our own corner. I agree to a certain extent, however I can’t help but shake my head at stories such a paying a girl for waiting time. (LBC, I am not trying to nag you about that one. Just using it to illustrate a point. Believe me, there are other tales that have me scratching my head as well.) There is a very good chance that this encourages poor performance and other shenanigans. One guy on another forum complained about Linda (Oase, Greek) charging him 100 for a 40 minute session in which she spent about 10 minutes smoking a cigarette. Again, I scratch my head. Linda has a well-known rep for this and if a guy finishes before the 30 minute make, why agree to let her smoke a cigarette on YOUR time? I myself got tagged by a blond Romanian at Paradise named Nicole several weeks ago. She gave me some DFK outside the room but tried to tell me that DFK and ball licking were and extra 50 each once we got inside the room. I took a pass on the extras and finished quickly. I DID make a point of telling her in front of her friend Daniella (normally at Palace) that I would have had a good time with her had she not tried to sell me a regular service as an extra. Danni and I have been together very often and she knows that I know what a proper session should include. She also knows that I am not opposed to extending a session with the right girl and no doubt pointed that out to Nicole.

I think that there is indeed a bit that we can do. YMMV girls are one thing (I realize that one man’s cow-shit may be another man’s carrera marble) but gals who scam ought to be avoided and this and other forums are good ways to keep track of them. Now's the right time.

Cheers,

Dedalus

Nick The G

02-03-09, 01:07

.... Give it twelve months and I think we'll have a somewhat different picture. ....That is an easy experiment! Only 12 month and we know if it will be true or not!
My prophecy for 2010: there will be no significant differences in 12 month! Why?

Because there are already enough sex-junkies, "idiots" :) who like to spent money for fucking. If it is not the germans in the clubs, it will be the dutch or english or americans or italians, or it will be people from Russia, China, Japan or the arabic countries.

For most of these people, their highest value in life is spending money for fucking young girls. Second highest value in life is to spend money for cars/gasoline or flights/hotels to reach the clubs and be where the young *****s are. If possible all day and all of the night and .....
......seven days a week!

Because most of these men are obsessed by sex and addicted to the PaySex scene, they cannot stop and will even save money on food or clothes or cultural activities just to be there!

Ekliges Lauern

02-03-09, 06:04

I know that my cred with you is nil. Still, for what it's worth a comment and clarification or two might be in order.

Well, you did give me inspiration for my new username, so that has to count for something. Seriously,why don't you post some reviews (good and bad) sometime. It is helpful information.

While I certainly agree that different dudes may have different tastes and needs, I DO stand by my belief that it was a better scene and atmosphere in the FKKs back in the day, and that service standards have in general gone downhill. You and a few others may not agree and that is you right, but those are my observations.

As mentioned, I barely remember Oase from those days. Rather than beat a dead horse, how 'bout regailing us with a tale or two from days of yore at Oase. Ortos and I are having fun swapping rememberances of Atlantis. I would be interested in hearing something I didn't know about days of yore at Oase.

It is too bad that you had some rough times at Atlantis. My experiences there were very different. I never belonged to the group of people who thought that it was the mother of all FKKs, but they did have consistently great line-ups and in all my visits there (and they were quite frequent) I never once had a girl try to cheat me on time or sell me a "standard" as an "extra". Also most nights that I was there a good deal of couch action and public sex took place. Remember the bed on in the main contact area?

Standard service as an extra is a relatively new scam. I've never run into it and I frequent Palace, so I have no frame of reference for what you and others complain about. I mentioned some old school scams that were practiced at Atlantis. I've run into time banditry in the last year at Oase and requests for non-standard pricing for extras (100E CIM) at both Oase and Palace. I just say no.

I remember the bed, but quite honestly I can't remember it being used.

A club like Babylon set the standard back in the late 90s. It was tough to beat both the service standards and the quality of women. When I was going there frequently, the line-ups (usually 20 or so in number) were similar looks-wise to the finest Palace and Oase line-ups that I have seen. Combine that with Bernd's quality service and that was a cocktail that was hard to top.

I went back and googled Bablyon, and that was the club I visited so many years ago. I recognized the dark countinuous couchs along the walls in the common room and the circular bed in the center. As mentioned I visited once and never went back. Back then I was more into the visuals of the women. Frankly, I thought the women were slighty less attractive than the women at Atlantis. Kind of like the difference between the Hessen big 3 and F39 today. Nothing wrong with them and definately fuckable, just a notch down.

Where Atlantis beat it hands down was variety of of the women. You had a couple of Thai girls, some latina a few Africans and a middle eastern girl or two at Atlantis. With Babylon, it seemed to me that you had a choice between blonde and brunette EE girls. Now admittedly I only visited once. I do remember going with a dark haired Hungarian woman, but I can't remember the sex, which that tells you something. I also have memory of seeing a Polish looking blonde getting shagged doggie style on the circular bed and thinking to myself, damn I should have hooked up with her before my seed was all spent.

Funny thing is even though I never went back as I had better options for what I was looking for back then, it would probably suit my tastes now as I like a nice balance of attractiveness and service. This is why I like F39 as the women are to my taste and I generally get superior service. Although there are a few do-able women at Bernds, generally I turn up my nose at what is on offer there. Who knows, perhaps in another 10 years it might be to m taste.

Back when Oase was the only member of the future Big-3, quality was also quite good and the scam factor also was pretty low. Oddly enough, it was when competition from Atlantis, World and eventually Palace entered the picture, that service standards started to slide a little. In general however it has been my experience that Oase, despite occasional ups and downs, continues to provide a pretty good experience with a relatively small percentage of scammers. Again, this is just my experience.

Once again, regale us with a tale or two of days of yore at Oase. I'm sure many would be interested.

I won't bother to rehash any differences on the Palace issue except to say that for several years it was my favorite club. That unfortunately changed about three years ago.

That's fine. Don't go there. Or even report on the incidents that led you to this conclusions (once or twice, endlessly rehashing is just plain annoying). Include names for any incidents as this is useful information. Understand, I'm not going to boycott a place based on the experiences of another. Right now, the club works for me and it works well for others as well.

For those who believe that all is well in the scene these days, then what I say will not reach you. Your choice. However I suspect that most guys here who have been doing this hobby for 10 years or more understand what I am driving at.

So some higher degree of FKK wisdom will be revealed on my 10 year anniversary in Sping of 2010? Seriously, the scene works quite well for me right now. I do think the model is under economic pressure. Hence my providing some economic and political data.

One of the things I do for a living is negotiate. Negotiation is not always about getting the lowest price if you are customer or getting the highest price if you are the vendor. The best deals are the ones where both parties feel a fair deal was struck. Word will get around that you deal fairly and others will want to do business with you. This is why I believe in rewarding women that provide good service with extras and/or repeat business. It incents good behaviour. I never do it outside of the standard pricing structure. This is probably why I am not a target of fake extra scams at clubs I visit.

As much as we like to feel that the relationship is based on respect for a service model, for the women it is about economics. Ignore their motivations at your peril.

Ekliges Lauern

02-03-09, 06:33

Ortos

02-03-09, 09:10

I hope I'm not being off-topic here by asking a question related to the current World line-up, but outside of Dedalus, who posted a review of the current (declining) state of the World line-up a day or so ago, there have not been that many specific comments about specific girls at World in the last few pages...Don't get me wrong: I think this is an extremely valuable and long-needed discussion-review-exchange of opinions about the current State-of-the-FKK-Nation and let it continue to run its course on this thread or on the Gerneral one, whereever it is most appropriate, however:

I do have a specific question which I hope somebody can answer just to quench my interest:

Anybody seen Czech Linda ("Karolina) at World in the past week or so?

As reported by several of us, she was definitely a steady fixture there in mid-January, after her long absence from the Hessen clubs. I was pleasantly surprised when I saw her at World on Fri 09.01. She told me that she had just started working again after a long break. "Where were you so long, schatzie? Ich vermiss dich...?" I enquired. "Oh, I've been at home with my parents..." Oh yeah, what did you discuss with mommy?.... I don't know if was true, but when I asked her if she liked World, she said it was her second day there and that she was still assessing the club and its traffic level. "You are the first "Stammgast" I've seen here," she commented to me.

Anyway it was a no-brainer to go to the room with her. After a few minutes of small talk at the bar, we made a B-line for the corner room upstairs immediately to the right as you exit the rear of the Wintergarden. What ensued was a fantastic session of reunion sex. The BBBJ is still the measure to compare other bbbjs (for me, at least) and there was never even a remote question about scam or shark-like tendencies. DFK was steady and intense whenever you wanted it and for as long as you wished. The bbbj was constant, soft, deep and slow. Not a hint of the bullshit tactics one might get from the New Generation of Girls. Just pure Linda-style sex. Who even thought of looking at the clock? When I handed her a green note by the pay lockers, I was so happy and fully satsified with the session, the way it should be.

So anybody see her in the very recent past? Did she pack it in at World for the time being or is she still there? Maybe she just came out of retirement to grab some quick cash for a week or two? Maybe she found World too slow, esp in comparison to the traffic jams at Palace she was used to back in her heyday there?

Just wondering? Now back to your regularly scheduled programming...

Ortos

Dedalus

02-03-09, 10:19

I hope I'm not being off-topic here by asking a question related to the current World line-up, but outside of Dedalus, who posted a review of the current (declining) state of the World line-up a day or so ago, there have not been that many specific comments about specific girls at World in the last few pages...Don't get me wrong: I think this is an extremely valuable and long-needed discussion-review-exchange of opinions about the current State-of-the-FKK-Nation and let it continue to run its course on this thread or on the Gerneral one, whereever it is most appropriate, however:

I do have a specific question which I hope somebody can answer just to quench my interest:

Anybody seen Czech Linda ("Karolina) at World in the past week or so?

So anybody see her in the very recent past? Did she pack it in at World for the time being or is she still there? Maybe she just came out of retirement to grab some quick cash for a week or two? Maybe she found World too slow, esp in comparison to the traffic jams at Palace she was used to back in her heyday there?

Just wondering? Now back to your regularly scheduled programming...

Ortos

Hey Ortos,

Carolina/Linda was working this past Friday. Compared to many other girls, she seemed pretty busy. However I talked with her later in the evening and she was lamenting that business was off a bit and that she only had a handful of guests that day.

A few others I saw on Friday:

-Carina (Ro)
-Jacqueline (Po)
-Martha (Po)
-Leila (Geor)
-Simone (Ro)
-Lucy (Bulg)
-Monika (Bulg) (Mike D, if you’re out there, she was AWFUL!)
-Anamarie (Ro)
-Denisa (Bulg)
-Jessica (Ro)
-Theodora (Ro)
-Angie (Ro)
-Eva (Belgium): First time I’ve seen this girl. Tall, Bolt-Ons, Tattoos, straight dark hair with some blond tints, lots of jewelry. I’m skeptical about her being from Belgium. More likely Romanian.
-Chanel (Ger/Tur) Similar to Eva, and they seemed to be „partners in crime“ that night. Word is that she worked in Living Room earlier. I suspect that both her and Eva were just stopping by. Both girls walked around the entire evening with oil all over their bodies. Certainly noticeable.

There were others who’s names I do not know. The Bulgarian crew has taken over the “America Corner” from the Polish girls and when the German club (Janine, Jeanette, etc) are not there, then the many of the Romanian gals set up shop in the Italian corner.

It’s not a bad line-up, but I’ve certainly seen the place when it is more inspiring.

Cheers,

Dedalus

Marlow

02-03-09, 11:13

Nick the G, not known perhaps for diplomacy, hits the nail on the head. It's the sex junkies who are at fault. Harsh but true, as they say.
I mean what am I to understand of a nickname like 'Wan King' or 'Ekliges Lauern'? The first is a derivative of a robost English insult the second in German is composed of the words lurker and disgusting. Jokes? I've heard better.......

Okay, I'm being pompous old Marlow. But the name gives you a clue as to who I am, which is intentional. So don't get upset, because by thy name shall ye be known.

I think those of us who have been around a while have a right to encourage others not to ruin it for the majority. Particularly for those among us who are neither raunchy optik fickers capable of bagging several brace of perfect tens in day's shooting spree, nor those of us past their crud date humping omas, but the silent - less confident, less bumptious and less boastful - majority who don't post, who enjoy FKK land and who don't deserve to be ripped off.

Iseeu

02-03-09, 13:23

Let me respectfully disagree..
What do you disagree with? That we shouldn't be shaking our heads in disgust at some of these reported behaviors?

The implications of your second sentence as well as Daedalus' comments was everything was somehow better in the past.
Sorry if you misunderstood, but the implication of my post is that we are allowing the meaning of "standard FKK service" to be redefined at a poorer service level, not that everything was better once upon a time.

I probably had more ripoff attempts in Atlantis than any other club. Ripoff attempts included one woman trying to convince me on my first visit that it was standard for a man to spend a half hour with the woman in the whirlpool then another half hour in the sauna, followed by a shower and then time in the room, all time chargeable of course. In her words, this isn't a Laufhaus, men come here to spend time with women, not just fuck them. If I wanted to fuck a woman for 100DM, go to a Laufhaus, she said. And by the way, she didn't kiss in the room..
I had a similar experience with a Ukrainian girl at Atlantis on one of my first Atlantis visits, who used a similar argument, saying that if all I wanted was sex in a room I should go to the RLD. In an FKK, it was expected that I spend time with her in the whirlpool and pay for it as well.

I never meant to imply that there were no scams or sharks in the business in a previous generation or to look nostalgically back at the old days. There was a lot that was bad then including the terrible feeling that many of the women may have been coerced into this line of work. But, I do believe that there was then an accepted industry wide specification for "FKK standard service". An SP that tried to under-provide or over-charge knew just as we did that she wasn't performing to spec. That has slipped and we (the collective monger community) are probably as much as fault as the SP and the clubs for allowing this behavior to incrementally take over.

When Atlantis closed, I started going to Palace. Palace had/has a similar vibe to Atlantis. There has always been a "let's shake down the tourist" vibe to some of the ladies at both places, as well as all large clubs in Germany. I can't say I have noticed a decline in service standards in the roughly 9 years I have been doing this in Germany. The bullshit has always there in the big Hessen clubs. Palace probably stands out the most to some because of its location it has the highest tourist quotient of any club.
By the time Atlantis closed,World opened and then Palace re-opened, I had already pledged most of my business to Oase, and it still remains my preferred FRA club, so I haven't been a regular Palace visitor. But I agree that it's business-like vibe is most reminiscent of Atlantis amongst the Big Hessen 3, although Atlantis had this skanky, illicit feel that Palace just doesn't capture.

My other regular club experience from bac Palace just doesn't capturek in those days were with Park Sauna Wildenrath on the boarder with the Netherlands. PSW had more public action upstairs, but it had no Kino. It was a Sauna club, not an FKK, so dress was comparable to GT today. The ladies' attire, service level (and scam frequency) was about the same as GT today. In fact, GT reminds me of PSW, just more women and better facilities.o public action, but the Kino makes up for it. Now if I could just get them to turn down the music in the contact room.

My experience with the Koeln area clubs was a club whose name I have long since forgotten. It may have have been Sankt Augustin, it could have been Babylon, my memory fades. As I remember, the club had a reputation for turning away non-Germans back then, so I memorized enough German to fake my way through the "have you been here before" door interview. I had a grounding in the language from my college days, so I wasn't totally doing it cold, but I was faking it and making educated guesses at what she was asking me. I got in. The club was basically a bar area off to the side and one main room with couches lining the walls with a circular platform in the center of the room. I remember having difficulty finding women I wanted to session with. I also remember a couple fucking in the center of the room in front of everyone. Plenty of public action. While pleasant enough, I liked the larger and better looking selection of women at Atlantis, bullshit and all. Never returned.
I too did a tour of the NRW clubs. PSW was the favorite of another respected monger and I tried it at his behest a couple of times. Also went to PHG a couple of times. Never, really got into it and since I wasn't visiting NRW as often then, they never became regular visits.
The club that you remember with the circular platform in the middle is Babylon which was a very good club those days and is trying to recapture its glory. Lots of public action, similar to what could be seen at the other popular NRW clubs, Cocoon, Sankt Augustine and Bernd's. Only Bernd's still maintains that same modus vivendi.

I agree, although there are isolated exceptions to this rule, that for pure quantity of selection of lots of hot nubile women, the big Hessen clubs have always had the upper hand. Like you, I prefer a mixture of the 2. I can find great service from pretty women at OASE, and I can find very pretty women (really you've outdone yourself regurgitating the myth of trolls and Omas at Bernd's) who give great service at Bernd's.

I know you and other think we should all vote with our feet and go to the smaller more service oriented clubs, particularly those around Koeln. We get it. Everyone has varying tastes. Right now, those clubs don't work for me based on the quality and quantity of the women. This may change for me in the future as my tastes broaden. If they don't work for me now, it is unlikely they will work for other mongers whose tastes are far more selective than mine. As previously mentioned both LBC and Vito think I fuck trolls. There is no way Bernds will work for them.
Did I say propagating the myth????
Actually, I don't think that "...we should all vote with our feet and go to the smaller more service oriented clubs, particularly those around Koeln." If I thought that I wouldn't spend so much money at Oase, a large FRA area club. But I do prefer quality over quantity. I'm not f*cking 70 women when I visit a club, just 3-5, and if I can find that number with the right combination of looks, attitude, and skill, I don't need to get the visual surge.
It's simply untrue that Bernd's wouldn't work for mongers looking for hot women. I was there this past Thursday, and there were at 10 who are hot by any scale, 3 in the mid range and 2 on the MILF scale. And considering how some of these same mongers look for the CIM or COB ending, Bernd's is definitely the best place for that right now in these tough economic times.

I think the best we can do is try to impart experience to help them avoid the newbee pitfalls that makes them targets. Telling them it was somehow better back in the good old days is bullshit and does them a disservice.
I don't think that saying everything was better in the good old days is helpful to anyone. And as you say, it probably isn't true. Times change. Change is usually a good thing and when properly managed leads to new opportunities.

We should learn from our experiences, share them and and impart the knowledge gained from them to others coming into the hobby, to make sure that the change that we are seeing, which has manifested itself in the deterioration of "standard FKK service" is managed to our collective benefit.
That would bring many new, very appealing opportunities for all of us and would be a change for the positive that we can all believe in.

Akibono

02-03-09, 21:01

Alot has changed since the early FKK club days. First, the clubs were much smaller compared to the WalMart type megaclubs today. Second, there are many, many more clubs today. In smaller clubs, the poor providers are easily weeded out. When there are fewer clubs, the girls don't have the luxury to form shop. That said, Atlantis has both highlights and things to be desired.

I think there were more super attractive girls there, but there were also a collection of uglies. I remember the best girls seemed to arrive around 7, were constantly busy, and then left by 1. The main difference seems to be a certain party atmosphere. Girls would spend time horsing around with other girls and the customers. It was not uncommon to share a meal with a girls. This was encouraged by time spent after the session if a girl thought you might take her to the room again or if she found you attactive. Plus, I frequently heard comments from girls that liked other girls who worked there. They did not view them as competion--just friends. Sure, money was a motivating factor and there were complaints of "slow" business. However, money and a sense of frustration when business was slow was not as prominent as it is today. This was viewed as a place to have fun.

That said, it was not exactly a golden time (no pun intended). There were plenty of complaints too. One of the most common were reports of mechanical service and short sessions. Scams, overcharges, and upselling were rare. I remember posters who talked about how to speak to girls and to develop sympathy to get a good session. With limited language skills, I always found this to be daunting. Still, I was lucky to be initiated into the sport by a Greek girl named Sia who was both passionate and honest.

I have not been able to confirm this, but early reports was that BBBJ was not conventional service and became that way from the influx of Russians who would routinely provide this service. So, the level of service was always in flux. I wonder when kissing became a part of standard service?

Would I trade the present for the past? Not a chance.

Toscana

02-03-09, 21:05

I hope I'm not being off-topic here by asking a question related to the current World line-upOrtos,

you are quite right. We were all off-topic. I'll copy paste to the General Info thread and we can debate on. Don't feel the need to follow us :-)

Akibono

02-03-09, 21:07

A few others I saw on Friday:

-Carina (Ro)
-Jacqueline (Po)
-Martha (Po)
-Leila (Geor)
-Simone (Ro)
-Lucy (Bulg)
-Monika (Bulg) (Mike D, if you’re out there, she was AWFUL!)
-Anamarie (Ro)
-Denisa (Bulg)
-Jessica (Ro)
-Theodora (Ro)
-Angie (Ro)
-Eva (Belgium): First time I’ve seen this girl. Tall, Bolt-Ons, Tattoos, straight dark hair with some blond tints, lots of jewelry. I’m skeptical about her being from Belgium. More likely Romanian.
-Chanel (Ger/Tur) Similar to Eva, and they seemed to be „partners in crime“ that night. Word is that she worked in Living Room earlier.

Dedalus

My sweetie is still AWAL!! Where is the work ethic?

Dedalus

02-03-09, 23:20

My sweetie is still AWAL!! Where is the work ethic?

Hey Aki,

I am afraid that I saw neither hide nor hair from her. Was it you who told me that she was considering a move to GT?

I'm looking for her myself. We were supposed to give it a second go around in the new year. I'm still waiting...

Cheers,

Dedalus

Ekliges Lauern

02-04-09, 02:23

I mean what am I to understand of a nickname like 'Wan King' or 'Ekliges Lauern'? The first is a derivative of a robost English insult the second in German is composed of the words lurker and disgusting. Jokes? I've heard better.......

Okay, I'm being pompous old Marlow. But the name gives you a clue as to who I am, which is intentional. So don't get upset, because by thy name shall ye be known.

Well, unfortunately, Das eklige Lauern was one letter too long (as well as running afoul of the capitalization rules). As to what you think of my handle, don't care.

Wan King I believe long ago left for the Uroma fucking delights of the party treff scene. Do me a favor if and PM me if you actually have any useful info to share or post a review.

I think those of us who have been around a while have a right to encourage others not to ruin it for the majority. Particularly for those among us who are neither raunchy optik fickers capable of bagging several brace of perfect tens in day's shooting spree, nor those of us past their crud date humping omas, but the silent - less confident, less bumptious and less boastful - majority who don't post, who enjoy FKK land and who don't deserve to be ripped off.

I'm still trying to parse that to figure out what it means. I take it you think something I do is ruining it for the great silent majority. Not sure what that is other than to disagree with others who think somehow in the good old days, the women didn't shake down the tourists.

Akibono

02-04-09, 04:00

Hey Aki,

I am afraid that I saw neither hide nor hair from her. Was it you who told me that she was considering a move to GT?

I'm looking for her myself. We were supposed to give it a second go around in the new year. I'm still waiting...

Cheers,

Dedalus

She mentioned Oase. There are some girls you miss, but are glad that they left the profession. I hope the slowdown does not leave us with all the ugly ones or the ones with bad attitudes.

Ekliges Lauern

02-04-09, 04:10

I had a similar experience with a Ukrainian girl at Atlantis on one of my first Atlantis visits, who used a similar argument, saying that if all I wanted was sex in a room I should go to the RLD. In an FKK, it was expected that I spend time with her in the whirlpool and pay for it as well.

Thanks for collaborating the old school scam. At least it wasn't just me this line was attempted on. Curiously, like today's endless discussions on Palace, peoples opinions on Atlantis are all over the spectrum.

There was a lot that was bad then including the terrible feeling that many of the women may have been coerced into this line of work.

Interesting you mention that. I never percieved that at Atlantis, but if memory serves, it was one of the reasons, along with tax problems, why Atlantis got shut down.

But, I do believe that there was then an accepted industry wide specification for "FKK standard service". An SP that tried to under-provide or over-charge knew just as we did that she wasn't performing to spec. That has slipped and we (the collective monger community) are probably as much as fault as the SP and the clubs for allowing this behavior to incrementally take over.

And this is where we part ways, at least as far as the big clubs are concerned. I remember women at Atlantis who did not kiss. At La Folie in Berlin and an FKK in Stuttgart that I have long since forgetten I remeber receiving covered BJs as standard service.

I too did a tour of the NRW clubs. PSW was the favorite of another respected monger and I tried it at his behest a couple of times. Also went to PHG a couple of times. Never, really got into it and since I wasn't visiting NRW as often then, they never became regular visits.

I really liked PSW. For some reason I had a string of memorable sessions. I remember talking to another American in PSW who at the time was receiving a BJ from a blonde Polish lass who we on her knees in front of him. As we were talking, the guy said to me in English something to the effect, "She's a nice girl, but not very bright. .... Ow!!!" She bit him, not hard enough to cause him any damage, hard enough to let him know his comment wasn't appreciated. I almost died of laughter on the spot.

I can find great service from pretty women at OASE, and I can find very pretty women (really you've outdone yourself regurgitating the myth of trolls and Omas at Bernd's) who give great service at Bernd's.

Actually you have taken my troll comment out of context. My comments regarding trolls were:

Now, I'm sure LBC and Vito think I fuck trolls.

As previously mentioned both LBC and Vito think I fuck trolls. There is no way Bernds will work for them.

The troll comments were intended to illustrate that their are other mongers that are far more selective than I. Hell, I'll fuck pretty much anything in a pinch. Doesn't mean I'll like it or will seek it out in the future.

Well as far referring to the Bernds fan club as the Oma fuckers, I plead guilty. Unlike some of the folks who bash Hessen clubs that they have never visited, I have actually been to Bernds (last visit Spring 2008).

You will notice I never bash clubs that I have not visited. You'll never see me bash Samya or Artemis. I have no first hand experience so it would be inappropriate and I would be doing a disservice to the readers.

Different men have different standards as far as appearance and age in women. Bernds doesn't work for me on that basis. It is better than wanking. Probably a toss up with a Laufhaus for me.

I'll offer you a challenge. Let's take a monger with higher standards than mine as far as appearances to Bernds. Someone who is quite happy with what is on offer at the big Hessen clubs. I nominate LBC or Vito. We'll take one of them to Bernds for a day and then when they want to leave, ask them a simple question, will you return? If no, you pay their entance and session tab and admit you are an Oma fucker on ISG. If yes, I will pay the tab and state on ISG I am not worthy of the godesses of Bernds and never will I use the word Oma in conjunction with Bernds ever again.

Fkk Lover

02-04-09, 04:18

She mentioned Oase. There are some girls you miss, but are glad that they left the profession. I hope the slowdown does not leave us with all the ugly ones or the ones with bad attitudes.

She ain't at GT either. Emma told me as much.

Hessen Bub

02-04-09, 08:33

She ain't at GT either. Emma told me as much.

Who are you looking for? Maybe I can help.

HB

Marlow

02-04-09, 10:23

DJ FourMoney

02-04-09, 12:01

Dedalus

02-04-09, 13:03

Who are you looking for? Maybe I can help.

HB

Hey HB,

I've been looking for Sophia (It.) but she has not been at World on any of my visits thus far this year. Been keeping a close eye on the German and dutch forums and have not found any reference to her.

Cheers,

Dedalus

Ortos

02-04-09, 13:32

Hey HB,

I've been looking for Sophia (It.) but she has not been at World on any of my visits thus far this year. Been keeping a close eye on the German and dutch forums and have not found any reference to her.

Cheers,

Dedalus

Ahh, Sophia is the mystery girl you referring to...should have said so at the start.

I observed Sophia working at World on both my two visits there in mid-January. She was there on the evenings of Friday 09.01 and on Tues 13.01.
She looked good, quite slim from the way she was, say, 6-8 months ago.

Ortos

Dedalus

02-04-09, 14:24

Ahh, Sophia is the mystery girl you referring to...should have said so at the start.

I observed Sophia working at World on both my two visits there in mid-January. She was there on the evenings of Friday 09.01 and on Tues 13.01.
She looked good, quite slim from the way she was, say, 6-8 months ago.

Ortos

Hey Man,

Yeah she had dropped some pounds when I saw her in December. Looked really good!!!

So she HAS been active since the start of the year, eh. Wonder where she is now?

Cheers,

Dedalus

John Moore

02-04-09, 16:30

Marlow

02-04-09, 17:07

@ John Moore
You are looking at a taxi journey of around 60 kilometers, or 40 miles. You'd do best to try hiring a car

Henio

02-04-09, 18:09

On a visit to World last weekend with Dedalus, decided I wanted to have a session with a chubby girl. Selected a new girl called Oana. She was at Villa Vertigo for few months before. As said before, chubby, but with a nice looking natural girl next door face. Session was forgetable, distant in the kissing and kind of restricted the penetration and gave a toothy BBBJ. She made a point of telling me that she did not CIM (I was not going to anyway since no way was the toothy BJ gonna get me off). Not a repeat material, but then again, not terrible either but below club standard.

Also went with German Andrea for the first time. She's been at World for long time. Genuinly sweet girl and I had a very good time with her. I find her facial features stunning and she has a nice body to go with it.

World has seen better days, but the selection was still quite ok and I could have done another visit the day after and found my 2-4 girls to session with easily, but opted for Oase instead where the lineup was pretty good.

John Moore

02-04-09, 18:19

@ John Moore,

You are looking at a taxi journey of around 60 kilometers, or 40 miles. You'd do best to try hiring a carYes I would.

If I had a drivers license.

Nearest city reachable with train and a taxi from there is maybe a better idea?

Shark16

02-04-09, 19:12

Strato

02-04-09, 19:14

John:

Public trans to World is easy..- Two ways to go, Train from Frankfurt HBF to Giessen and then Cab to World

OR

Train from Frankfurt HBF to Giessen and then Bus to near World and then a 5-10 minute walk.

Below I am cutting and pasting various posts. Which explain public trans to World. Hope this helps.

Strato

While accessible by public transportation, World is more difficult than the other two clubs. After reading the reports, I thought I could look for RE30 train. It took me a while to figure out that it didn't leave from the U or S platforms, (From Frankfurt HBF) but the upstairs big station with the intercity/country trains. There wasn't an RE30 train running that day, so I had to look through the schedules for a train going to Giessen. I found it, bought the ticket and got on board. It was a Saturday around 5PM and the train was packed. No seats at all. I was tired from the previous days activities, and standing 40 minutes on the train wasn't too fun. Little kids were running up and down the aisles. The one good thing was a kid was saying the alphabet in German, so I learned instead of 'eff kay kay', you say 'eff kah kah'.

Got off in Giessen and caught a cab, telling the driver 'eff kah kah Vorld'. All I had to say was 'vorld'. All the cabdrivers I met spoke excellent English. Pretty long cabride through the countryside. Although a lot of mongers drive to these places with GPS, I must say that if your car ever broke down, you would be hard pressed to find some roadside assistance.

NOTE: CAN TAKE BUS! From Giessen to near WORLD (instead of CAB)

Bus 630. Route directly below is from World to Giessen.- reverse from Giessen to World (see note below Schedule

Pohlheim-Garbenteich Sportplatz 21:11. Pohlheim-Garbenteich Dorf-Güller Straße 21:12. Pohlheim-Garbenteich Apotheke 21:14. Pohlheim-Garbenteich Schiffenbergstraße 21:15 Gießen Klingelbachweg 21:33. Gießen Aulweg 21:34. Gießen Liebigschule 21:35. Gießen Berliner Platz 21:38. Gießen Johanneskirche 21:41. Gießen Bahnhof 21:46

What you posted seems like the bus route from FKKW to Giessen train station, no?

Can we still take bus 630 from Giessen and it takes us to FKKW? Is Pohlheim-Garbenteich Sportplatz where we should get off the bus?

Yes Garbenteich Sportplatz is the place to get off. There are other bus routes from Giessen which take a few minutes less but they all involve a change. Sample timings of the 630 from Giessen station are, on a weekday, 12. 14, 13. 40, 14. 40, 15. 40, 16. 45. All taking 34 minutes.

The last two return journeys are 21. 11 and 22. 25 (there is however one at 04. 53 which might suit anyone staying at FKKW to closing or therabouts.

Weekend times will be different 2. O Frankfurt hbf (main train station). , and then by train to Gissen abot 30 km north, depending on the time of day there are trains to Garbenteich, you will then have a walk from there, otherwise there are buses from Gissen hbf to Pohlheim-Garbenteich, or a taxi from Gissen will cost about 30 euros, I have walked there a few times both summer and winter, and believe me the hill at the end of the walk up to FKK world is a killer, so maybe a taxi,

Bus 630.Schedule below is from World to Giessen, reverse for Giessen to World.

Pohlheim-Garbenteich Sportplatz 21:11. Pohlheim-Garbenteich Dorf-Güller Straße 21:12. Pohlheim-Garbenteich Apotheke 21:14. Pohlheim-Garbenteich Schiffenbergstraße 21:15 Gießen Klingelbachweg 21:33. Gießen Aulweg 21:34. Gießen Liebigschule 21:35. Gießen Berliner Platz 21:38. Gießen Johanneskirche 21:41. Gießen Bahnhof 21:46

Hello everyone,

I hope you can take another newbie question? I'm staying in Frankfurt between 23-29 April and would very much like to visit World but I don't have a car so I have to go by public transportation or taxi or both. Does anyone have an idea how to go from Hauptbahnhof to World in such a way? Anyone knows how much a taxi is all the way or if I can go to somewhere a little closer to Giessen and take a cab from there?

Any help would be very appreciated.

John Moore

02-04-09, 20:03

@ John Moore,
Marlow is right, a rental car is recommended (combination of efficiency, flexibility and costs). Try Sixti for the best deals (order at least 2 weeks in advance).

For alternatives (public transport with/without taxi combinations) I suggest this little report from LBC: http://internationalsexguide.info/forum/showpost.php?p=727810&postcount=2225

Enjoy & Report! :-)@Shark16,

No license, no car. That report by LBC was just what I needed. Perfect. Thanks you so much and thanks LBC for providing it. Will surely visit World. Couldn't find the info about the taxi from Frankfurt though.

Vito Corleone

02-05-09, 01:47

.......has a point, and that is the one made by Iseeu. Namely the monger community foreign division is responsible for the decline in standards as much as the girls are themselves.

Mongers come to Germany because there is no other country in the world that can boast a similar standard or style. Yet they have succeeded in bringing with them the same low standards from which they are trying to escape. That to me is the downside of tourism the world over, whether you are at World's beach club or sitting on a beach in Spain or Cancun.

Girls have always worked the angles, but never to quite the extent as now. I'll tell you this for free, I was at World last summer and on one visit the noisy antics and drinking from a group of English speakers reminded me of behaviour you read about in the press of Brits on their hols. I've seen similar at Bernds. To me there is a difference between enjoying yourself and making and exhibition of yourself.
All the outsiders I hang with in the FKK's are escaping the low/no standards of our home countries, but to say we bring the same low/no standards with us is going too far. Some do, but do not catergorize us all.

1 trip to World last Summer & a group of English speakers were loud. So what! I have also seen a group of Germans getting a little drunk @ World & making some noise, but who cares. This is an FKK, not a library. You have a problem with outsiders, deal with it. Complain to the management & tell them to keep us out. Some of us spend quite a bit of money & management might tell you to kiss off.

Some foreign newbies are willing to lower their standards, but not everyone. Are you jealous that some of us have the means to travel from great distances & spend money on your precious ATF's? Yes, I know standards are lower or whatever. Sounds like a case of some local Salieri's to some of us foreign Mozart's.

Vito Corleone

02-05-09, 02:02

Hello everyone,

I hope you can take another newbie question? I'm staying in Frankfurt between 23-29 April and would very much like to visit World but I don't have a car so I have to go by public transportation or taxi or both. Does anyone have an idea how to go from Hauptbahnhof to World in such a way? Anyone knows how much a taxi is all the way or if I can go to somewhere a little closer to Giessen and take a cab from there?

Any help would be very appreciated.
I am a foreign newbie, so please ask Marlow or any other local to validate this info.

www.bahn.de

Take the train to Giessen (40-50 minutes). Take a taxi from the Giessen station (15-20 Euro) to World. You can also take a bus that drops you off within a 5-10 minute walk to World.

It is very important to tip all the girls after a session. 25-50 Euro. If a girl tries to rip you off, don't make a scene. Just pay her. English speakers have to be very quiet! I do this all the time & the women just love me.

Vito Corleone

02-05-09, 02:09

Also went with German Andrea for the first time. She's been at World for long time. Genuinly sweet girl and I had a very good time with her. I find her facial features stunning and she has a nice body to go with it.

I'll second that! Standard service, but I felt like I was with a model.

Akibono

02-05-09, 05:59

World is the easiest club to avoid a scam since there are plenty of locals. Just observe who they talk to and the girl's reaction and you will seldom go wrong. One suggestion I have with dealing with the scam artist is the not so subtle threat. Say you are a regular (know the prices and rules) and inform the girl that you know you are being overcharged. Unless it is really egregious, you will probably have to pay, but threaten to tell all your "german" friends about the poor service and how the girl will just sit around for the rest of the night without another session. That should be sufficient for her to back down. Nice attitude adjustment. The good girls do not like the scam artists because they reduce the number of men which cuts into their business by destroying a clubs reputation.

Akibono

02-05-09, 06:03

Ortos

02-05-09, 10:25

All the outsiders I hang with in the FKK's are escaping the low/no standards of our home countries, but to say we bring the same low/no standards with us is going too far. Some do, but do not catergorize us all.

1 trip to World last Summer & a group of English speakers were loud. So what! I have also seen a group of Germans getting a little drunk @ World & making some noise, but who cares. This is an FKK, not a library. You have a problem with outsiders, deal with it. Complain to the management & tell them to keep us out. Some of us spend quite a bit of money & management might tell you to kiss off.

Some foreign newbies are willing to lower their standards, but not everyone. Are you jealous that some of us have the means to travel from great distances & spend money on your precious ATF's? Yes, I know standards are lower or whatever. Sounds like a case of some local Salieri's to some of us foreign Mozart's.

Hey Vito,

Next time one of these Auslander-bashing Germans are in the club when you are, know this: I've planted it behind the water cistern in the Men's downstairs toilet. Just excuse yourself from the verbal attacks they are directing at you for a minute or two ---No, better yet: Ask permission to go take a [CodeWord140] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord140)-- then go take care of the guy. I've hidden it well and planted it tight against the wall, 'cause I don't want my fellow Auslander-monger division member coming out with nothing but his schwanz in his hand!

And I think the expression is: "[CodeWord140] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord140) off," but if you want to kiss him, well that is your perogative...

But seriously, there may be points on both sides of this debate, but it is a bit too simplistic (and paranoid?) to blame the sliding standards and increase of scams on the "monger community foreign division." Lol! What an appellation! Anyway, one of the fastest ways to see some of these clubs close their doors is to ban the Auslander guests or have them take their business elsewhere. It's like foreign military bases in another country: The locals always moan when they are there, but when they leave they want them back, or more accurately, they want the money the base personnel used to contribute to the local economy...

Ortos

Nick The G

02-05-09, 11:25

It is very important to tip all the girls after a session. 25-50 Euro. ......
I do this all the time & the women just love me.Imho you are confusing quite a bit !

First of all, you said: "it is very important to tip the girls". But for whom? And why? Who needs to do that in this way and why? And why is "it" so "very important" to that person? ;)

Secondly, the women work there to earn money. They need and like primarily our money :). So it is our money - and not primarily us - they want. The more money we give, the better! The higher the tips, the better for the women. They love "it".

Thirdly, please be aware that the way you describe it, you pay for and buy the feeling, that they like you. You don't give feelings, you expect feelings, obviously you are in need to pay to receive "feelings"!
Without money, none of the women there - at least as long as they don't know you already - would care for you more than 5 minutes! For them it would be a waste of time for their business.

Maybe it is because you identify completely with the power of your money, you think they like you! In the eyes of the girls, "you" is just a guy who is willing to spend money and to pay high tips, that's it!
The more money you give, the more they will like "you". Let's say, you go for one hour session, bring extra gifts from Amerika for them, and give 200 Euro Tip on top of that, they will "like you forever", at least on this day! And of course the next time you will enter the club, they will rush to you, with (de)light in their eyes, because they see the big Euro-Signs on your forehead.

If you are curious, do a couple of experiments to find out:

Level 1 (beginner :)): the next 5 times you go to an FKK-Club in Germany, don't give any tip and find out if these women still "love" you.
If they do, you know that it is not "very important" to tip them.
That's an easy and money saving way to find out, isn't it? ;)

Level 2 (advanced :D)): for such a charming boy like you an easy task: just pay for the entrance and without spending any further money inside find out, how much "love" you will get. lol!
Hint: some "experts" have found out, that they can get along quite well by giving little psychotherapy or massages to women aching from the hard work in the room. And those experts argue: they invest their precious lifetime and mental energies in doing so, that is much more than giving money.

Level 3 (master): You found a woman there who really needs you and loves you! Only you get all her "real" feelings. Consequence: No more money needed. The women pays for your entrance and all your drinks. Sex without condom. All the time she is dreaming of you and waiting for you to come to the club again. Disadvantage: no more fucking with other women tolerated there. But the real master knows such a type of woman in every club!

After all, let's not forget about the frame, we are entering, when we go to these places: by entering, we fully and consciously agree (I do hope!) to pay money to meet women and have sex with them! The more money we are willing to spend, the longer the service time and - in most cases - the better and friendlier the women.