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Thanks for all the input and some of your personal views on morals.
She has a 2 year green card that will expire soon, she can apply for a 10 year green card in August. I just feel responsible for her, to help her have a decent future and want to help her get the 10 year green card. There are many reasons why I want to divorce. I've told her how I feel, how I can't stay in a relationship for too long, and that it is all my fault for marrying her. I'm sure if she were living in the US and we were able to date and see each other more often then I would have gotten bored and broken up. You all know the feeling of when you first start a realtionship and you are madly in love, I just felt I had to do anything just to be with her, so I took the dive and married her. What I couldn't see from over the Pacific and the couple trips I made there is that she is extremely lazy (quit her easy job within only 5 months, says she'll never work again), wants to bring her parents over here to live, hot tempered, and unwilling to really learn English well enough. That is only a sampling.
Its not really about mongering, it is about freedom! I would much rather have strong lifelong friendships and be able to date girls (without comittment) and screw some working girls when I am not getting any.
I just don't think I can stay with one woman forever. I think I will have to meet a real incredible girl for me to change my mind. What I've learned is that I should have first gotten to know the girl in person and lived wither her rather than just a few trips over there and online when we both have our best faces on.
I support the relationship through Air Force stipends (about $2, 000 a moth) while I am in school. After school I will serve 4 years as an air force dentist.
Phil1980, I don't know if I should be giving advice, but I'll give you my opinion. Marrying someone just so you can have free sex whenver you want will get boring. Having a long-term girlfriend will accomplish the same goal.
The weird thing: why Chengdude posted here in the first place!?! Is he looking for a husband to a chinese girl to get her green-card?
So many questions? here are few:
Why did you really marry her in first place?
Why did she really marry you?
What kind of visa she is on?
How did you support the relation? so far and now with the current economy?EDITOR'S NOTE: I would suggest that the author or another Forum Member consider posting a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please Click Here (http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?) for more information.
It is the law which states 2 year co-habitation is required to get a permanent green card. This is to prevent sham marriages in order to obtain green card. If you have seen the movie "green card" it explains everything.
In the seventies and early eighties many americans will get a sham marriage in exchange for money sometimes amounting to $5000-$10,000 for the purpose of green card. I know couple of girls who did that.No longer my friend, I've been doing this for quite some time now. There are ways and they are all legal!
Phil1980, I don't know if I should be giving advice, but I'll give you my opinion. Marrying someone just so you can have free sex whenver you want will get boring. Having a long-term girlfriend will accomplish the same goal.
The problem is that you can only get Chinese girls EU visas by marrying them, so if you want a girl that lives together with you and that you can have sex with, marriage is the best solution I know.
The problem is that you can only get Chinese girls EU visas by marrying them, so if you want a girl that lives together with you and that you can have sex with, marriage is the best solution I know.
Phil: It's a little easier to get a Chinese girl to the EU than to the US. The easiest way is an inter-company exchange or intern program. That's probably more in the reach of us "older" guys. If you marry her, just make sure that you marry her in China. The jurisdiction and law of where you marry comes into play when you divorce. Definitely cheaper to divorce according to Chinese law that according to German law - assuming you are German. Under German law, she will initially get a residency permit of up to three years. If you are still married, she will get permanent residency. She can even apply for German citizenship. If you divorce during the 3 year period, she can either stay out her three year permit, or, if shorter, apply for another year. Then she has to go home. Officially. There is a "hardship" clause that allows her to stay nevertheless. If you get divorced after three years, she can stay. If she has acquired German citizenship, she can marry a rich Chinese and bring him in the country ....
Tip for Yellow Fever sufferers: Try Japan. JP girls are more cultured, more into sex, and you don't have to bring the whole family to Germany or wherever you live ....
Having said that, and that goes for Chengdude also: Marriage is taking responsibility. You are taking on extra responsibility if you take a girl out of her culture and drag her to another. Doing it just to get "free sex" is one of the most irresponsible (and stupid) things I can imagine.
Thanks for all the input and some of your personal views on morals.
She has a 2 year green card that will expire soon, she can apply for a 10 year green card in August. I just feel responsible for her, to help her have a decent future and want to help her get the 10 year green card. There are many reasons why I want to divorce. I've told her how I feel, how I can't stay in a relationship for too long, and that it is all my fault for marrying her. I'm sure if she were living in the US and we were able to date and see each other more often then I would have gotten bored and broken up. You all know the feeling of when you first start a realtionship and you are madly in love, I just felt I had to do anything just to be with her, so I took the dive and married her. What I couldn't see from over the Pacific and the couple trips I made there is that she is extremely lazy (quit her easy job within only 5 months, says she'll never work again), wants to bring her parents over here to live, hot tempered, and unwilling to really learn English well enough. That is only a sampling.
Its not really about mongering, it is about freedom! I would much rather have strong lifelong friendships and be able to date girls (without comittment) and screw some working girls when I am not getting any.
I just don't think I can stay with one woman forever. I think I will have to meet a real incredible girl for me to change my mind. What I've learned is that I should have first gotten to know the girl in person and lived wither her rather than just a few trips over there and online when we both have our best faces on.
I support the relationship through Air Force stipends (about $2, 000 a moth) while I am in school. After school I will serve 4 years as an air force dentist.
Phil1980, I don't know if I should be giving advice, but I'll give you my opinion. Marrying someone just so you can have free sex whenver you want will get boring. Having a long-term girlfriend will accomplish the same goal.
Yeah well man if she is an adult, she is responsible for herself. Do what makes you happy.
Do not feel so responsible for her. As it was said she is adult and responsible for her own actions. Try to test if she is staying with you for the green-card and money. This might help you understand if she is opportunist. At the end enjoy man.
Thanks for all the input and some of your personal views on morals.
She has a 2 year green card that will expire soon, she can apply for a 10 year green card in August. I just feel responsible for her, to help her have a decent future and want to help her get the 10 year green card. There are many reasons why I want to divorce. I've told her how I feel, how I can't stay in a relationship for too long, and that it is all my fault for marrying her. I'm sure if she were living in the US and we were able to date and see each other more often then I would have gotten bored and broken up. You all know the feeling of when you first start a realtionship and you are madly in love, I just felt I had to do anything just to be with her, so I took the dive and married her. What I couldn't see from over the Pacific and the couple trips I made there is that she is extremely lazy (quit her easy job within only 5 months, says she'll never work again), wants to bring her parents over here to live, hot tempered, and unwilling to really learn English well enough. That is only a sampling.
Its not really about mongering, it is about freedom! I would much rather have strong lifelong friendships and be able to date girls (without comittment) and screw some working girls when I am not getting any.
I just don't think I can stay with one woman forever. I think I will have to meet a real incredible girl for me to change my mind. What I've learned is that I should have first gotten to know the girl in person and lived wither her rather than just a few trips over there and online when we both have our best faces on.
I support the relationship through Air Force stipends (about $2, 000 a moth) while I am in school. After school I will serve 4 years as an air force dentist.
Phil1980, I don't know if I should be giving advice, but I'll give you my opinion. Marrying someone just so you can have free sex whenver you want will get boring. Having a long-term girlfriend will accomplish the same goal.
Do not feel so responsible for her. As it was said she is adult and responsible for her own actions. Try to test if she is staying with you for the green-card and money. This might help you understand if she is opportunist. At the end enjoy man.
I don't know why people think a green card is a gift from heaven and that a Chinese girl has to be eternally grateful if you get her one ( and nothing else.) I happen to have a European passport and (the old style, permanent) green card. Given the choice, I would give up the card without thinking. For one, it would stop the silly expatriate tax return I have to file. For two, with a European passport, I can live anywhere between Finland and Spain, between Ireland and Italy. If you want to blow a Chinese girl's mind away, take her on a tour of Venice, Rome, Cannes, Paris. Then put her back on tzhe plane to Beijing so that she can show her friends the pictures. If you want to make her unhappy for life, marry her to live in Fayetteville, or Lincoln, Nebraska. Be really cruel to her and kick her out to live on welfare. Trust me, she's better off in Changsha.
SE Asia Joe
03-26-09, 10:05
I don't know why people think a green card is a gift from heaven and that a Chinese girl has to be eternally grateful if you get her one ( and nothing else.) I happen to have a European passport and (the old style, permanent) green card. Given the choice, I would give up the card without thinking. For one, it would stop the silly expatriate tax return I have to file. For two, with a European passport, I can live anywhere between Finland and Spain, between Ireland and Italy. If you want to blow a Chinese girl's mind away, take her on a tour of Venice, Rome, Cannes, Paris. Then put her back on tzhe plane to Beijing so that she can show her friends the pictures. If you want to make her unhappy for life, marry her to live in Fayetteville, or Lincoln, Nebraska. Be really cruel to her and kick her out to live on welfare. Trust me, she's better off in Changsha.
Hate to point this out Zhuren - but you must know that you ARE a breed apart as far as your economic status is concerned - whilst the VERY large majority of gals in China is way way down such economic ladder. You cannot use your perspective to try to understand why most Chinese still prefer the U.s. as an immigration destination.
Most Chinese gals still look to the U.S. as being the "Gold Mountain" in that even a regular American Joe Blow goes to China and seem to have so much $$$ to splash around. I mean, lets face it, even guys on +-US$2,000 Social security will have RMB 13,600 per month to live in a relatively luxurious RMB 3,000/4,000 apartment, have a RMB 700 part time Ay-I and wander out to some watering hole at least once a week. etc. Plus you also know that Europeans generally (and please don't take me to task for over-generalization/typecasting whatever) are not as "open" in flaunting their higher status as a lot of Americans are.
OK, the reality of actual life in the U.S. is perhaps not as pretty - but you gotta also understand that most of Europe does have a much higher cost of living index vs. the U.S. plus a generally higher rate of taxation.... which makes it harder for a newly arrived immigrant to do well. Add to this the fact that historically, people coming back from Gold mountain do bring back more than those from Europe.
And one last thing - The U.S. is known as a melting pot and have gone a long way towards conquering bigotry and eliminating discrimination - and loudly proclaims so. Europeans - well Europeans are Europeans - and even for myself I do feel "something" when I see a bunch of spiky haired teens in Europe, or walk outside an English Pub when they've got a bunch of soccer louts celebrating a win - or a loss, or when I get in to Fauchons (?sp) from the litter strewn Champs Elysee - and that little French waiter (and oh - never refer to them as "garcons") gives me the once over before seating me. The S.O.B. gotta figure if I'm Vietnamese, Japanese, Chinese or - and if I'm able to pay the bill or some poor dishwasher from China town. etc etc
Just my humble opinion as to why the U.S. is still perceived as a better destination for the Chinese.
SEAJ
I could not have said better. Well said. Do you know that Eastern European girls want the chance of landing to US?
Hate to point this out Zhuren - but you must know that you ARE a breed apart as far as your economic status is concerned - whilst the VERY large majority of gals in China is way way down such economic ladder. You cannot use your perspective to try to understand why most Chinese still prefer the U.s. as an immigration destination.
Most Chinese gals still look to the U.S. as being the "Gold Mountain" in that even a regular American Joe Blow goes to China and seem to have so much $$$ to splash around. I mean, lets face it, even guys on +-US$2,000 Social security will have RMB 13,600 per month to live in a relatively luxurious RMB 3,000/4,000 apartment, have a RMB 700 part time Ay-I and wander out to some watering hole at least once a week. etc. Plus you also know that Europeans generally (and please don't take me to task for over-generalization/typecasting whatever) are not as "open" in flaunting their higher status as a lot of Americans are.
OK, the reality of actual life in the U.S. is perhaps not as pretty - but you gotta also understand that most of Europe does have a much higher cost of living index vs. the U.S. plus a generally higher rate of taxation.... which makes it harder for a newly arrived immigrant to do well. Add to this the fact that historically, people coming back from Gold mountain do bring back more than those from Europe.
And one last thing - The U.S. is known as a melting pot and have gone a long way towards conquering bigotry and eliminating discrimination - and loudly proclaims so. Europeans - well Europeans are Europeans - and even for myself I do feel "something" when I see a bunch of spiky haired teens in Europe, or walk outside an English Pub when they've got a bunch of soccer louts celebrating a win - or a loss, or when I get in to Fauchons (?sp) from the litter strewn Champs Elysee - and that little French waiter (and oh - never refer to them as "garcons") gives me the once over before seating me. The S.O.B. gotta figure if I'm Vietnamese, Japanese, Chinese or - and if I'm able to pay the bill or some poor dishwasher from China town. etc etc
Just my humble opinion as to why the U.S. is still perceived as a better destination for the Chinese.
SEAJ
Clean Gene
03-26-09, 16:28
Hate to point this out
OK, the reality of actual life in the U.S. is perhaps not as pretty - but you gotta also understand that most of Europe does have a much higher cost of living index vs. the U.S. plus a generally higher rate of taxation.... which makes it harder for a newly arrived immigrant to do well. Add to this the fact that historically, people coming back from Gold mountain do bring back more than those from Europe.
And one last thing - The U.S. is known as a melting pot and have gone a long way towards conquering bigotry and eliminating discrimination - and loudly proclaims so. Europeans - well Europeans are Europeans - and even for myself I do feel "something" when I see a bunch of spiky haired teens in Europe, or walk outside an English Pub when they've got a bunch of soccer louts celebrating a win - or a loss, or when I get in to Fauchons (?sp) from the litter strewn Champs Elysee - and that little French waiter (and oh - never refer to them as "garcons") gives me the once over before seating me. The S.O.B. gotta figure if I'm Vietnamese, Japanese, Chinese or - and if I'm able to pay the bill or some poor dishwasher from China town. etc etc
Just my humble opinion as to why the U.S. is still perceived as a better destination for the Chinese.
SEAJ
Chinese living in the US are allowed to "feel" very much "American". And they often do. Their children going back to China (often to the sorrow of their parents who suffered to establich them in USA) feel they are 100% American.
One person on my mind right now is a "WeiWei". That dear little lady made a fortune in Beijing real estate, and is now living in the "mud flats of Berkeley" so she can "earn" a green card for her married daughter. I've tried to get her address from her mother, for old times sake, but the mother professes ignorance. My point is that "WeiWei" and daughter are anxious to give up a rich and enviable life style in Beijing for a grubby chance at the "American Dream".
CG
Cunning Stunt
03-26-09, 16:42
... I mean to give up a decent woman only to chase after the filth we brag about on these boards is ridiculous ... You might regard them as 'filth' but even the most misogynistic members of ISG do tends to have a little more respect for these girls.
If I'm wrong please feel free to flame me!
Nutty Trotter
03-26-09, 19:36
Today I met some of the German fellows around the bar and had a chat during chat. And on the topic of mongering, they said it's easy for laowai to bait. Even though I am a laowai too, since I am an Asian laowai, they say Chinese women won't be preferring me. Is it true?
Today I met some of the German fellows around the bar and had a chat during chat. And on the topic of mongering, they said it's easy for laowai to bait. Even though I am a laowai too, since I am an Asian laowai, they say Chinese women won't be preferring me. Is it true?
Just curious, what is Asian laowai?
Mmlouie
LittleGoomba
03-27-09, 08:14
Today I met some of the German fellows around the bar and had a chat during chat. And on the topic of mongering, they said it's easy for laowai to bait. Even though I am a laowai too, since I am an Asian laowai, they say Chinese women won't be preferring me. Is it true?In some circumstances, yes, in general, not true.
Just curious, what is Asian laowai?
MmlouieThey meant Asian living in western country. Not really considered Laowai in the sense that Chinese people think " laowai" as caucasian race.
Asians are considered as asians irrespective of which country they live or hold the passport.
They meant Asian living in western country. Not really considered Laowai in the sense that Chinese people think " laowai" as caucasian race.
Asians are considered as asians irrespective of which country they live or hold the passport.I'm a third generation ABC, and I would never. Ever consider myself as an asian Laowai.
Today I met some of the German fellows around the bar and had a chat during chat. And on the topic of mongering, they said it's easy for laowai to bait. Even though I am a laowai too, since I am an Asian laowai, they say Chinese women won't be preferring me. Is it true?Nutty T.
You got some serious identity problem issues.
You sound like a "banana" to me.
They meant Asian living in western country. Not really considered Laowai
in the sense that Chinese people think " laowai" as caucasian race.
Asians are considered as asians irrespective of which country they live or hold the passport.
Thank you for the explanation, Sammon. This would be the first time I heard of that terminology being used, Chinese usually just considered us as "华侨" or an overseas Chinese. But what the heck do I know?
Mmlouie
Sound Stream #2
03-27-09, 21:15
Today I met some of the German fellows around the bar and had a chat during chat. And on the topic of mongering, they said it's easy for laowai to bait. Even though I am a laowai too, since I am an Asian laowai, they say Chinese women won't be preferring me. Is it true?They don't prefer you because you have low self confidence.
The fact that you have to ask this question told me that.
All women in general like "strong" men who are sure of themselves.
I'm a overseas Chinese, and when I go to China, the women absolutely love me! They think I'm funny, good looking, and exciting to be with.
And with the advantage of me blending in, and being able to speak some Chinese, I have a huge advantage over those Germans you met at the bar.
I find that getting women to like you and go out with you in China is so rediculously easy.
Basically if you like yourself, and am happy with who you are, you will be attractive to woman.
SE Asia Joe
03-28-09, 05:01
They meant Asian living in western country. Not really considered Laowai in the sense that Chinese people think " laowai" as caucasian race.
Asians are considered as asians irrespective of which country they live or hold the passport.
YOu guys are forgetin' that there IS a large variety of "Asians" - Chinese/Taiwanese, Japanese, Korean - considered to be "whiter skinned = more desireable, to the dark skinned = less disireable Indian, Pakistani, Native Malaysian Indonesian - and the middlin' Thai, Filipino etc.
And yes - the fact of the matter is that darker skinned "Asian Laowai" do have a harder time than the whiter skinned ones! It's also a matter of features of the different Asian nationalities - with the Northern Asians considered to be of more refined/fine features.
On the other hand, I just met up with a great guy from the States who just happens to be of Indian (northern part!) extraction and we were discussing just this topic. Whilst his features are not distinctly Indian, he goes ahead and ramp-up his "attractiveness quotient" by calling himself Daniel White! Yup - "WHITE" is his last name when he introduces himself - from the States - and "BAM" the gal immediately thinks he's a white Laowai!!
I immediately knew Daniel was of Indian extraction when I first met him - but for these Chinese gals, their exposure to the different nationalities are still quite limited - and most of the prejudice that they have just mirrors other's opinions - and they readily think that Daniel is of European extraction!!
SEAJ
On the other hand, I just met up with a great guy from the States who just happens to be of Indian (northern part!) extraction and we were discussing just this topic. Whilst his features are not distinctly Indian, he goes ahead and ramp-up his "attractiveness quotient" by calling himself Daniel White! Yup - "WHITE" is his last name when he introduces himself - from the States - and "BAM" the gal immediately thinks he's a white Laowai!!
I immediately knew Daniel was of Indian extraction when I first met him - but for these Chinese gals, their exposure to the different nationalities are still quite limited - and most of the prejudice that they have just mirrors other's opinions - and they readily think that Daniel is of European extraction!!
SEAJ
MARK White, he introduces himself as "Mark White". Not Daniel. Sheesh, get your story straight, Joe.
SE Asia Joe
03-28-09, 06:20
MARK White, he introduces himself as "Mark White". Not Daniel. Sheesh, get your story straight, Joe.
Good God Wadman - of course I remember - and I on purpose went ahead and changed it to protect MARK.. NIce one that you've now gone ahead and announced it here.
The important part of the story is his last name - not his first name!
So - Mark - sorry - but you've now gotta change your name.... thanks to good ole Wadman!!
I guess now I'm gonna introduce myself as Joe Brown!!
SEAJ
Clean Gene
03-28-09, 09:48
I'm a third generation ABC, and I would never. Ever consider myself as an asian Laowai.
The "lao" is usually an honorific. Think 'Sir Wai', or 'Lord Wai' or even 'Don Wai'. Like 'Sir John', 'Lord John' or 'Don Juan'. For Asians you got to be 'laotou' or 'laoban' which is 'boss' or 'chief'. Japanese used to be honorary 'laowai' before WWII. Just like Japanese used to be 'white' in South Africa while Chinese were 'colored'. (This was still true when I lived there. Buses had to stop for 'whites' but not for 'coloreds', creating some confusion when it came to Japanese and Chinese. Most drivers could easily tell however. Dress and posture as well as color and facial hair.)
Trackster42
03-28-09, 17:47
As most of you know, "lao" literally means old. People have nicknames like "Lao Zhou, " "Loa Chen" which mean Old Zhou, or Old Chen. Usually this is reserved for older men who have kids already. As opposed to young men who would be called, "Xiao Zhou, " "Xiao Chen. " (Xiao = little). Both of these are used only in a familiar way and in no way honorific. I would never address an older men I just met "Old Zhou" or even a younger man "Xiao Zhou, " even he goes by that among his friends. "Lao Wai" falls into this category. Therefore I would not call someone a "Lao Wai" in his face unless I am friends with him.
Lao Tao (Old man, but literally means "Old head") is somewhat derogatory. I would never call someone "Lao Tao" unless I intend to insult him.
Indeed, there are some cases that Lao can be interpreted as honorific: "Lao Ban, " which you cited, or "Lao Shi" (teacher). However, it use is not as common as the familiar one I described earlier.
The "lao" is usually an honorific. Think 'Sir Wai', or 'Lord Wai' or even 'Don Wai'. Like 'Sir John', 'Lord John' or 'Don Juan'. For Asians you got to be 'laotou' or 'laoban' which is 'boss' or 'chief'. Japanese used to be honorary 'laowai' before WWII. Just like Japanese used to be 'white' in South Africa while Chinese were 'colored'. (This was still true when I lived there. Buses had to stop for 'whites' but not for 'coloreds', creating some confusion when it came to Japanese and Chinese. Most drivers could easily tell however. Dress and posture as well as color and facial hair.)
OldAsiaHand
03-29-09, 16:13
Chengdude,
Yes, you made a mistake and now you have to pay for it. You should have discussed everything before you jumped into it. It is not uncommon for a Chinese girl to miss her parents and want to bring them over. Especially since you are not giving her the psychological support she needs to be in a foreign country. Almost all Chinese want to sponsor their family when they get to the USA anyway.
All of the negatives you mention about her could be to spite you for wanting to dump her. I just hope that you do set her up with a permanent green card the way you say you will.
Fortunately for her, if she is hot and sexy as you say, she will most likely find a better partner than you very easily in the USA.
It seems that you do not want to make a comittment to anybody. You still want to screw girls for a lifetime without giving then anything to show for it.
I suggest that you just monger to your heart's content until you figure out what you want out of a relationship. You are still young and may find a desire for companionship later. It is a shame that your naivity has hurt such a young innocent girl from China.
Just my POV.
OAH
Thanks for all the input and some of your personal views on morals.
She has a 2 year green card that will expire soon, she can apply for a 10 year green card in August. I just feel responsible for her, to help her have a decent future and want to help her get the 10 year green card. There are many reasons why I want to divorce. I've told her how I feel, how I can't stay in a relationship for too long, and that it is all my fault for marrying her. I'm sure if she were living in the US and we were able to date and see each other more often then I would have gotten bored and broken up. You all know the feeling of when you first start a realtionship and you are madly in love, I just felt I had to do anything just to be with her, so I took the dive and married her. What I couldn't see from over the Pacific and the couple trips I made there is that she is extremely lazy (quit her easy job within only 5 months, says she'll never work again), wants to bring her parents over here to live, hot tempered, and unwilling to really learn English well enough. That is only a sampling.
Its not really about mongering, it is about freedom! I would much rather have strong lifelong friendships and be able to date girls (without comittment) and screw some working girls when I am not getting any.
I just don't think I can stay with one woman forever. I think I will have to meet a real incredible girl for me to change my mind. What I've learned is that I should have first gotten to know the girl in person and lived wither her rather than just a few trips over there and online when we both have our best faces on.
I support the relationship through Air Force stipends (about $2, 000 a moth) while I am in school. After school I will serve 4 years as an air force dentist.
Phil1980, I don't know if I should be giving advice, but I'll give you my opinion. Marrying someone just so you can have free sex whenver you want will get boring. Having a long-term girlfriend will accomplish the same goal.
EDITOR'S NOTE: I would suggest that the author or another Forum Member consider posting a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please Click Here (http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?) for more information.
Cloud Palms
03-29-09, 20:15
Chengdude,
Fortunately for her, if she is hot and sexy as you say, she will most likely find a better partner than you very easily in the USA.
Chengdude,
Theres a lot of truth to that statement by OAH. Asian women in the States are much more highly valued than they are in Asia. If shes attractive let me repeat, much more. They can always use this fact as leverage when they are in a relationship with an Asian man. After she gets her permanent green card she could very well easily find a rich man, have kids with him and rub it in your face later on. Which is basically using you to get to the States so she can get to that point. So please take that into account before you give her the green card. She could very well have more than a decent future at your expense. This is just a scenario so take it for what its worth but I've seen it happen enough so just want to make sure you're aware of it.
You did bring her here, but its not like she is old and unattractive with your kids so she isnt really losing a lot even if she does go back to China. I disagree with those that say youre causing great harm to an innocent. I mean where would she be anyway if she didnt marry you? At Harvard, planning to marry Warren Buffett? I've seen situations like yours where the Chinese woman demands that the husband pays her $1 million USD if they divorce. Seriously, as if she could have made that money if she didnt marry him.
Shes an adult and she made a choice just like you did. You happened to both make the wrong choices. So learn from it and move on. You seemed like you did learn from it and want to monger more. Go for it if thats your goal.
The "lao" is usually an honorific. Think 'Sir Wai', or 'Lord Wai' or even 'Don Wai'. Like 'Sir John', 'Lord John' or 'Don Juan'. For Asians you got to be 'laotou' or 'laoban' which is 'boss' or 'chief'. Japanese used to be honorary 'laowai' before WWII. Just like Japanese used to be 'white' in South Africa while Chinese were 'colored'. (This was still true when I lived there. Buses had to stop for 'whites' but not for 'coloreds', creating some confusion when it came to Japanese and Chinese. Most drivers could easily tell however. Dress and posture as well as color and facial hair.)Clean Gene;
Putting those two terms together does not make an asian honorable. In that context others see you as a "bananna". It is just when laowai is used toward another asian. It is in a different context for laoban, laotze and others terms. As for the situation of separating the japanese and Chinese in S. Africa, you are really generalizing and not accurate. I really do not want to go into that, I do not want you to think that I am flaming you. I will leave it at that.
I do believe that nutty trotter has a problem with self confidence. As an ABC I have never had any problem with the ladies in China. I have more problem getting rid of freebies than finding them. As an ABC, I know that I am on the top or damn near the top of the pecking order for Chinese girls looking for a BF or even a casual relationship. Nutty Trotter's drinking buddies is just giving him a bunch of bull with this "white superiority" stuff. Each ethnicity have certain advantages over other depending on what part of the world that are in. In Europe and part of the US those drinking buddies may have a slight advantage over me but in China I will definitely give them a run for their $$$'s.
I will just end in here. Just my two rmb on this.
Ciao
As I understand it, once you have been approved for lawful permanent residence status, you have the right to live in the US permanently unless that status is explicitly revoked. The green card is simply a document proofing your status. If it expired, it does not really change your status. It is just that the card is no longer valid as a mean to proof your status (get a job, border transit etc). You can always re-apply for a new green card at any time after it had expired or lost.
This is similar to the passport. That is a document to show you are a US citizen. If you are a US citizen (say by birth) and you have an expired passport, or, even no passport, you are still a US citizen and have all the responsibilities (tax) and rights (vote). However, in situation requiring a passport to proof your citizenship (border transit), an expired or null passport will not be acceptable. Again, you can have an expired passport for years before you renew or get a new one.
So, I am not sure what is the big deal between a 2 years or 10 years Green Card once one has been granted permanent residence status.
Just my 2 cents. But given I am not an immigration lawyer ....
What's the chances of Chengdude posting a dozen or so naked
bedroom images of his future ex-wife?
That way,
five years from now,
when he's a bible thumping,
born-again Air Force dentist
facing punitive action for violating Article 82 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solicitation) of the UCMJ,
the rest of us Real Men of Genius (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Real_Men_of_Genius)will still have something worthwhile to
remember this discussion by...ROTFLMAS!
But seriously, I've already downloaded all of Eaglestar's lovely MILFs.
What this writer needs is some new Cheap Sex in China
pictures to help stimulate his creative juices.
They don't prefer you because you have low self confidence.
The fact that you have to ask this question told me that.
All women in general like "strong" men who are sure of themselves.
I'm a overseas Chinese, and when I go to China, the women absolutely love me! They think I'm funny, good looking, and exciting to be with.
And with the advantage of me blending in, and being able to speak some Chinese, I have a huge advantage over those Germans you met at the bar.
I find that getting women to like you and go out with you in China is so rediculously easy.
Basically if you like yourself, and am happy with who you are, you will be attractive to woman.
Dude, you need to work on your diplomacy skills. I mean, the guy posts a legitimate question, and you come down on his character? WTF???
Then, instead of answering his question, you just pat yourself on the back for your success with women. Thanks for sharing! However, you only mentioned going out with them. If you're not laying them, or not many of them, what kind of success is that?
What's funny is that a lot of guys like to attribute their success to how they are "happy," "strong," "confident," when in reality their success comes from: indicators of wealth (money, clothes, position, connections, and in China, just being overseas Chinese), looks (GQ face, or big muscular physique), or "playing" or "gaming" them (prospect of marriage, playing her insecurities -- not that I do it). Then you get girls, and naturally get a happier feeling, and then delude yourself into believing that it was caused purely by your "confidence" or whatever. Sorry, but it's the other way around. Take away that other stuff I mentioned, and you're nowhere.
Forget the self-help books. The truth is, nearly everyone likes themselves (at least I do, and everyone I know). You probably do too. It's just natural. I'm happy with myself, and when there are good results, I'm happy with the results. It's simple enough. Now, if we want to give advice, let's keep it real, ok?
Today I met some of the German fellows around the bar and had a chat during chat. And on the topic of mongering, they said it's easy for laowai to bait. Even though I am a laowai too, since I am an Asian laowai, they say Chinese women won't be preferring me. Is it true?Nutty Trotter
Your friend is telling you a bunch of bull. If you play your cards right and get some serious self confidence, ABC/CBC or BBC are damn near the top of the pecking order as the preferred choice of mates. I'm an ABC (I am not an asian laowai) and proud of it, I have more than my fair share of freebies. I seldom goes hunting but rather get hunted. I just love being captured)
Today I met some of the German fellows around the bar and had a chat during chat. And on the topic of mongering, they said it's easy for laowai to bait. Even though I am a laowai too, since I am an Asian laowai, they say Chinese women won't be preferring me. Is it true?
It's true that there is some racial bias in China. SEAJ's comment about dark skin was accurate. If your skin is very dark (like south Indian), it may make a noticeable difference, not always, but sometimes. You didn't tell us your ethnicity or nationality.
You can ignore the comments from the overseas Chinese guys about your "confidence" or "identity problem." That's just BSD talk. You sound OK to me. I guess they think that since they're at the top of the food chain (which they are, being overseas Chinese in China), they can go around and attack people's character. They are full of shit, and someone needs to call them on it.
Tianjin sounds like a hole. If you make lots of money, e.g., Western salary (you didn't say what job you do), and don't mind spending it, Beijing might be better (both for mongering, and normal girls). If you want to get out of the "expat bubble," get a job in a second-tier city, and you can enjoy a lower cost of living and more mongering options. But you need to learn to speak Mandarin.
Downunder96
03-30-09, 14:27
As most of you know, "lao" literally means old. People have nicknames like "Lao Zhou, " "Loa Chen" which mean Old Zhou, or Old Chen. Usually this is reserved for older men who have kids already. As opposed to young men who would be called, "Xiao Zhou, " "Xiao Chen. " (Xiao = little). Both of these are used only in a familiar way and in no way honorific. I would never address an older men I just met "Old Zhou" or even a younger man "Xiao Zhou, " even he goes by that among his friends. "Lao Wai" falls into this category. Therefore I would not call someone a "Lao Wai" in his face unless I am friends with him.
Lao Tao (Old man, but literally means "Old head") is somewhat derogatory. I would never call someone "Lao Tao" unless I intend to insult him.
Indeed, there are some cases that Lao can be interpreted as honorific: "Lao Ban, " which you cited, or "Lao Shi" (teacher). However, it use is not as common as the familiar one I described earlier.
"Lao" can be used for buddy term eg Lao Li (Mr Li), Lao XX (Mr XX). I Went to chinese school a while back! DU96
I can see it coming Night Cat. Duck
ES
Sound Stream #2
03-30-09, 17:40
Cloud Palms,
I would have to disagree with this one point. If she finds a nice rich guy to take care of her, he should be very happy for her. He will never find peace with yourself or grow as a person until you learn to genuinely wish other people well. Also, from what it sounds like, it doesn't sound like this girl plotted things to begin with. From Chengdude's statements, it's really does sound like that he is growing sick of her. Not the other way around. She did intend to stick around.
OAH has some a good point regarding the lack of pyschological support. I see it all the time. It's really tough to go to a foreign country where you don't speak the language. In the US, some people are ignorant enough to make fun of you when you can't speak proper English, yet these same people wouldn't survive for very long in another country without access to their financial lifeline. The inability to speak the language totally frustrates them. When women are emotionally stressed, they just don't think clearly. And that's where you get all these outbursts.
Chengdude is the only person she can turn to in this country for mental and emotional support. And while he may think that he does, he most likely does not. She feels like she is alone in this country, and everyone including her own her own husband does not seem to care. He neglects her, and runs to other women. That is why she lashes out. Because she is frustrated, and does not know any other way.
Chengdude, ask yourself if you believe that she truely loves you. If the answer comes back as yes, then it means that it is simply that your feelings have changed. You can't neglect your wife, hang out with other women all the time, and expect them to be happy with that. But at the same time, you have to find out what you really want in life.
My friend told me, "a man looks for many women to satisfy one need, but a women looks for one man to satisfy all her needs."
If you can understand that last statement, you'll understand how women see things alot easier.
Chengdude,
After she gets her permanent green card she could very well easily find a rich man, have kids with him and rub it in your face later on. Which is basically using you to get to the States so she can get to that point. So please take that into account before you give her the green card. She could very well have more than a decent future at your expense. This is just a scenario so take it for what its worth but I've seen it happen enough so just want to make sure you're aware of it.
Sound Stream #2
03-30-09, 18:23
That was "tough love" in action. Diplomacy is not neccessary for this case. It may be an unorthodox method, but sometimes it is more efficient to just slap them hard on the face to get them to wake up. Nothing wakes you up, more than getting a real shock of truth. Years from now, he'll end up a better person from it.
Also, if you look very carefully, there is a very important lesson I gave him that is invaluable. Women will tend to size you up, by looking at what you say, how you act, and how you carry yourself. All these clue them in on your social position and outlook. I was able to look at what he says, and figure out with 100% certaintly that his problem was that he has low self-esteem.
That kind of insecurity litterally scares women away.
What clues you give off lets women know what your position in society is. Women have a natural instinct to want to mate with the guy on top, and will look on contempt to the guy on the bottom eventhough they don't tell you. Basically, like in the gorilla heirachys, the top gorilla mates with all the females, while the other gorilla watch and drool.
In my playboy days, whenever I can get a girl to go out with me, chances are I have them under my spell after the first day. I'm just an easy person to like and fall for. I usually find that the exit and emotional drama afterwards is harder than getting them to sleep with you. Everything still takes time nontheless. If I really wanted a women to fall extremely hard for me, I know exactly just how to do that. They all work the same way.
I have never ever used the prospects of marriage as a lure. That is just way too low for me to do. I have always focused it around the themes of comfort, fun, excitement, and pleasure, and slipping it in there that I'm the guy that can satisfy that.
As to self-help books, most of them are worthless. Some even go as far as giving harmful advice. Talking about keeping a guy down!
Dude, you need to work on your diplomacy skills. I mean, the guy posts a legitimate question, and you come down on his character? WTF?
Then, instead of answering his question, you just pat yourself on the back for your success with women. Thanks for sharing! However, you only mentioned going out with them. If you're not laying them, or not many of them, what kind of success is that?
What's funny is that a lot of guys like to attribute their success to how they are "happy, " "strong, " "confident, " when in reality their success comes from: indicators of wealth (money, clothes, position, connections, and in China, just being overseas Chinese), looks (GQ face, or big muscular physique), or "playing" or "gaming" them (prospect of marriage, playing her insecurities.- not that I do it). Then you get girls, and naturally get a happier feeling, and then delude yourself into believing that it was caused purely by your "confidence" or whatever. Sorry, but it's the other way around. Take away that other stuff I mentioned, and you're nowhere.
Forget the self-help books. The truth is, nearly everyone likes themselves (at least I do, and everyone I know). You probably do too. It's just natural. I'm happy with myself, and when there are good results, I'm happy with the results. It's simple enough. Now, if we want to give advice, let's keep it real, ok? EDITOR'S NOTE: I would suggest that the author or another Forum Member consider posting a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please Click Here (http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?) for more information.
Traveler1234
03-30-09, 18:51
Nutty Trotter
I'm an ABC (I am not an asian laowai) and proud of it, I have more than my fair share of freebies. I seldom goes hunting but rather get hunted. I just love being captured)
We are known as the 'perfect passport' to heaven ;)
Personally I prefer to just pay rather than do freebies, costs less long term. And if a laowai is semi-fluent in Chinese, he's also on top rung of the food chain and will score like crazy.
Sound Stream #2
03-30-09, 20:47
Wow! Forget what I wrote with my previous response. I obviously did not read this yet...
Sounds to me now that you are the cause of your wife's explosive attitude that you mentioned in another post, but just don't realize it. I really feel bad for your wife. Poor girl.
If this is truely how you feel, then leave her. You're not doing her any favors by having her stick to you for life, and you're not doing yourself any good if you're not happy. But you do owe it to her to make sure she has a decent life after going through all this. She wasn't the one that abandoned you. You abandoned her.
I just discovered this website and this is my first post. I've been to China 3 times over the past 3 years. My first time there I went with a group from my university to study the language and culture for a summer semester. It was a lot of fun, and while riding around Kunming on some piece of shit bike I bought for 50 yuan I found, what I think you guys call BBS shops. Little shops in the wall with pink lights or whatever. Before I went to China I didn't know these existed here, but wow! I had a great time with a few girls there, first time with hookers.
After all my fun I met a girl, a student not a working girl, but we kept in touch for over a year. I don't know what the hell I did, but we decided to get married. I am still young (25) and in school and after almost 2 years of marriage I told her I want a divorce. I've realized I'm highly unlikely to change from who I am in relationships. Every serious girlfriend I've had I have become bored after a year or two. Especially in the bedroom but also my love, for example my wife is beautiful and I still think she is sexy and I still have some love for her, but very very rarely do I actually want to have sex with her, I'd rathr jerk off honestly.
I've come to the decision that I never want to get married again or get into some very serious relationship, and I don't care about having kids either. I'm hoping to become a China monger like some of you guys here! It's the life I want! Of course I need to save up money and I'm sure it will be a least 10 years before I could come there on a more permanent basis. I'm taking the big first step towards this dream by divorcing my wife which is actually hard because I want her to be happy and end up with a good guy, a guy that wants a family and settle down with one girl. I told her I wanted a divorce 5 days ago and she has been trying like hell to change my mind and crying like crazy and I had to stop her from swalling a bottle of sleeping pills. She doesn't really have any good friends here for her to talk to. She doesn't want to go back to China, I told her she can live in the apartment until she finds someone else and I'll help her get the 10 year green card, its just so fucking hard hearing her crying and begging me to stay every day. Thank god I don't have a nickel to my name as a student, can't wait for this to be over.
Then, instead of answering his question, you just pat yourself on the back for your success with women. Thanks for sharing! However, you only mentioned going out with them. If you're not laying them, or not many of them, what kind of success is that?
What's funny is that a lot of guys like to attribute their success to how they are "happy," "strong," "confident," when in reality their success comes from: indicators of wealth (money, clothes, position, connections, and in China, just being overseas Chinese), looks (GQ face, or big muscular physique), or "playing" or "gaming" them (prospect of marriage, playing her insecurities -- not that I do it). Then you get girls, and naturally get a happier feeling, and then delude yourself into believing that it was caused purely by your "confidence" or whatever. Sorry, but it's the other way around. Take away that other stuff I mentioned, and you're nowhere.Night Cat
I feel that you have been watching too much Oprah and Dr. Phil. As for success rate, you do not need to have the GQ look, definitely I am no Brad Pitt. I am taller than most 6'2" and built like a line backer that have aged a bit (sorry no muscles here nor beer gut). I do not tell the girls that I am single. Usually I tell them honestly that I'm married for over 25years and two college age kids. I do not lead them on that I'm seeking an "er tai" or that I'm single. I dress casually, usually in a dark blazer with slacks, just a normal mature business guy. As for the wealth, I usually have a driver taking me from point A to point B in a local Chinese made vehicle. I do have access to a mercedes but prefer to keep it low. I do not wear high end jewelry, usually a simple watch. I also do not buy gifts or taking out shopping. I just keep it simple and real. I do not flash pictures of my life in the states nor brag about all the fictictious highend shit that I normally hear them BS the KTV girls. I do look like a typical ABC/CBC businessman.
I due try to carry myself with a bit of confidence. Bottom line, I do get hit on by quite a few very classy MILF, office/store girls and just women in general. I really disagree that without money, looks and needing to play the game we cannot get laid. I do believe that confidence carries a lot of weight in getting into the pants of most these beautiful ladies.
I do feel that if you did have looks, money and play the liars game with these beautiful ladies will only get you two things, bad karma in the future and major headaches in the future.
btw, im no BSD. just a simple joe
Cloud Palms
03-31-09, 04:58
Bnlee,
I usually respect your posts. But in this case to me, it really sounds like you're reinforcing Night Cats point for him. You just claimed you dont need to look good nor have money or game to get freebies. But then you say youre tall - and for an Asian very tall, built like a linebacker, with money, already an established family so not needy and without a care in the world, in the United States as a 3rd generation ABC in a time where western money and power is what Chinese people desire. Hey if all that doesnt give confidence to a guy, then I dont know what will. Did it occur to you thats what gives you confidence, those attributes Night Cat mentioned?
'Fraid to say, not all people are like you. If you were short, fat, making minimum wage, and with no friends or family lets see you try to carry yourself with the same confidence.
Its all a game, we just play the best we can with the cards we're dealt.
Night Cat
I feel that you have been watching too much Oprah and Dr. Phil. As for success rate, you do not need to have the GQ look, definitely I am no Brad Pitt. I am taller than most 6'2" and built like a line backer that have aged a bit (sorry no muscles here nor beer gut). I do not tell the girls that I am single. Usually I tell them honestly that I'm married for over 25years and two college age kids. I do not lead them on that I'm seeking an "er tai" or that I'm single. I dress casually, usually in a dark blazer with slacks, just a normal mature business guy. As for the wealth, I usually have a driver taking me from point A to point B in a local Chinese made vehicle. I do have access to a mercedes but prefer to keep it low. I do not wear high end jewelry, usually a simple Vacheron watch. I do not flash pictures of my life in the states nor brag about all the fictictious highend shit that I normally hear them BS the KTV girls. I do look like a typical ABC/CBC businessman.
I due try to carry myself with a bit of confidence. Bottom line, I do get hit on by quite a few very classy MILF, office/store girls and just women in general. I really disagree that without money, looks and needing to play the game we cannot get laid. I do believe that confidence carries a lot of weight in getting into the pants of most these beautiful ladies.
I do feel that if you did have looks, money and play the liars game with these beautiful ladies will only get you two things, bad karma and major headaches in the future.
Bnlee,
I usually respect your posts. But in this case to me, it really sounds like you're reinforcing Night Cats point for him. You just claimed you dont need to look good nor have money or game to get freebies. But then you say youre tall - and for an Asian very tall, built like a linebacker, with money, already an established family so not needy and without a care in the world, in the United States as a 3rd generation ABC in a time where western money and power is what Chinese people desire. Hey if all that doesnt give confidence to a guy, then I dont know what will. Did it occur to you thats what gives you confidence, those attributes Night Cat mentioned?
'Fraid to say, not all people are like you. If you were short, fat, making minimum wage, and with no friends or family lets see you try to carry yourself with the same confidence.
Its all a game, we just play the best we can with the cards we're dealt.Cloud Palms
Most northern Chinese are also tall. I do not own the company that I work for. I really never get into discussion with them on my professional status. I usually just elude a guy working for the company. I never like to discuss my professional work in detail. They can tell that I'm an ABC, they do not know if I have am wealthy or not. I usually wear a simple blazer, dress shirt and slack in China.
I do not openly display wealth. I usually spend a few minutes looking over a meal check to make sure that it is correct. I do not take them shopping. I do exude confidence. What I totally disagree is that you do not need looks, wealth or talk a good game to get into the pants of the girl, what you need to do is just be confident.
You do not need to have the best hairdresser, wear the best in designer clothes, throw cash out like there is no tomorrow and BS the girls to get laid. Be yourself and be confident about yourself. Girls can sense insecurity and will bolt when they feel that in a guy.
Cloud Palms
03-31-09, 05:45
First of all I dont think Chengdude came on this forum of all places for marriage and relationship advice. I mean most guys on here even though they may be playboys, casanovas and Gods gift to women, for whatever reason would rather pay for it explicilty. So if he came here looking for Sally Jesse Raphael or Don Juan then I believe he should look elsewhere.
Second, I am not going to try and read between the lines or do some type of psycho-analysis on an online post. He made up his mind that he wants to divorce and do more mongering. I say good for him for doing what he wants to do in life. I understand the irresponsibility factor but it could be a lot worse and she doesnt have it that bad from what I gathered. Shes still young, good looking, sexy, in the United States and a good woman so its not all doom and gloom for her. I think she will be ok in this country and him I agree that divorcing could turn out to be a blessing is disguise for her.
I would have to disagree with this one point. If she finds a nice rich guy to take care of her, he should be very happy for her. He will never find peace with yourself or grow as a person until you learn to genuinely wish other people well.
Well in an ideal world where nothing bad happens and no selfishness that would be great for everyone if we all wished everyone well. Please let me know what you're smoking and we can meet up at a ktv for some fun times! Seriously, who are you to say what he SHOULD feel? Are you going to tell us the meaning of life next? Maybe he wants her to have a great life after him, maybe he doesnt, its up to him. I dont go around on my high horse trying to tell people what they should or should not feel. I stated some possible scenarios that could happen, if hes cool with all that then great. There is no high moral ground here and its not as cut and dry as "being happy for others will make you happy in life". Jesus, shouldnt that stuff belong in a philosophy forum, you should suggest Jackson to create one!
Cloud Palms
03-31-09, 06:10
Cloud Palms
Most northern Chinese are also tall. I do not own the company that I work for. I really never get into discussion with them on my professional status. I usually just elude a guy working for the company. I never like to discuss my professional work in detail. They can tell that I'm an ABC, they do not know if I have am wealthy or not. I usually wear a simple blazer, dress shirt and slack in China.
I do not openly display wealth. I usually spend a few minutes looking over a meal check to make sure that it is correct. I do not take them shopping. I do exude confidence. What I totally disagree is that you do not need looks, wealth or talk a good game to get into the pants of the girl, what you need to do is just be confident.
You do not need to have the best hairdresser, wear the best in designer clothes, throw cash out like there is no tomorrow and BS the girls to get laid. Be yourself and be confident about yourself. Girls can sense insecurity and will bolt when they feel that in a guy.
Bnlee,
I am not going to argue your point about confidence because I do agree with it to an extent. However I feel like I am not doing a good enough job trying to make mine - that your confidence stems from the fact that you have wealth and status, and compared to most Chinese you do.
Thanks anyway for the freebie advice.
Edit: BTW, I am a short, fat, poor chinese guy without much so I will try your advice and report back!
I feel that you have been watching too much Oprah and Dr. Phil.
Really? Well, you're the guy who responsed to the original post (from a typical China newbie just asking for an opinion) by giving him your diagnosis of his "low self confidence" and "identity problem" (your words). Thank you Dr. Bnlee! But it was totally off-base. There was nothing in his post that deserved that kind of response. Maybe you didn't read his post.
Look, this whole argument is stupid. The only reason I jumped in is because I object to using the forum to make unwarranted personal attacks on people's character, as you and Sound Stream did with Nutty Trotter. You guys still haven't owned up to that. I just hope that the next time I need some opinion or advice, I'm not going to get slammed with irrelevant attacks and criticisms like that. It's just not cool.
Nutty Trotter has probably tuned out by now, but I'd like to add to my response. Note that the original question was about mongering, not freebies. I stand by my earlier suggestion that there is some racial bias (but not a lot), and having very dark skin may make a noticeable difference (but only sometimes). If the question is "yellow vs. white" (specifically, non-Chinese yellow, which seems to be the original question), my guess is that it won't make any difference in the aggregate, but it will with some girls in some situations. For example, suppose you're in a town where the Germans are all factory managers and the Koreans are all students. In a venue such as a bar, where the WGs have the freedom to pick their clients and negotiate the price, they may prefer the Germans over the Koreans. In that situation, what the German guys told you in the bar may be true (maybe this is the case in Tianjin?). But in a town where it's the other way around, they may prefer the Koreans. Sometimes. It's not 100%.
In a venue where the girls have a fixed price (e.g., sauna), it won't make any difference. In fact, being white may be a negative in that case. In sauna situations, I've had girls refuse to serve me, maybe 5 or 10 percent of the time, just because I'm white (afraid of dick size or forcefulness, afraid of difficulty communicating, or just afraid of the unknown).
Generally, if you've got the cash, and you can communicate with them, you can find service. Happy exploring.
As for how the original question has any relevance to overseas Chinese, I don't see it. The guy didn't say anything about being from overseas, being Chinese, or having anything in common with overseas Chinese. Nor did he ask anything about freebies. So I don't know why you guys changed the subject like that. What is it, you get laid a few times, and suddenly everything's about you? Like you just need to talk about yourself, and how "confident" you are? That's OK, but maybe we need to start a Dr. Phil thread, if that's what you're looking for.
First of all I dont think Chengdude came on this forum of all places for marriage and relationship advice.
Actually, he did. This thread often has topics not only on mongering, but relationships as well.
I agree with what most people have said, Chengdude needs to do the honorable thing and do his best to help the girl. It seems to be his intention, he just needs to follow through.
Chengdude, I'm not sure you understand that the Chinese, and especially a Chinese girl, have a different view and feeling about marriage, and I'm not sure I can explain it. It's easy to say she'll get over it and move on, but it's not that simple. Basically, she's getting kicked in the teeth (figuratively), and kicked out of her own family (literally -- you are her new family). That fact will remain with her for life, and so will the stigma and emotions that come with it (to some degree). You can take the blame, but in Chinese culture, a wife is not disposable, and if she's disposed of, then she's been put in the trash (figuratively, please, no flames). There is the sense that she's failed in the most important thing in her life. No wonder she doesn't want to go back to China. She can stay in the U.S., but being alone in the U.S. is rough. In any case, it could take years before she can really move on.
As cynical as I am about Chinese girls, my sense is that she's getting the shaft big time. As you seem certain about wanting a divorce, I'd say just do your best to be her friend and support her (including financially) through what will be a very difficult time. There's no way you will ever be able to make this up to her, but you can try to help her where possible. I just hope this works out for her somehow. As for you, well, I'm sure you will find your way.
Sorry if I seem overly-dramatic, or like I'm having a "Dr. Phil moment." I just wanted to give my take on this topic. It may not be true for all Chinese, but the general sense is true for some. So, no flames, please (but if you have experience being married, and maybe divorced, with a Chinese gal, it would be interesting to hear your take).
Really? Well, you're the guy who responsed to the original post (from a typical China newbie just asking for an opinion) by giving him your diagnosis of his "low self confidence" and "identity problem" (your words). Thank you Dr. Bnlee! But it was totally off-base. There was nothing in his post that deserved that kind of response. Maybe you didn't read his post. There are many ABC/CBC and other minority that have an identity issue, this is due to low self confidence in their own race/ethnicity. It is you that tried to analyze the situation. I am just telling you my opinion on it. This is the China opinion thread. Did you not read the title of the thread.
Look, this whole argument is stupid. The only reason I jumped in is because I object to using the forum to make unwarranted personal attacks on people's character, as you and Sound Stream did with Nutty Trotter. You guys still haven't owned up to that. I just hope that the next time I need some opinion or advice, I'm not going to get slammed with irrelevant attacks and criticisms like that. It's just not cool.
Nutty Trotter has probably tuned out by now, but I'd like to add to my response. Note that the original question was about mongering, not freebies. I stand by my earlier suggestion that there is some racial bias (but not a lot), and having very dark skin may make a noticeable difference (but only sometimes). If the question is "yellow vs. White" (specifically, non-Chinese yellow, which seems to be the original question), my guess is that it won't make any difference in the aggregate, but it will with some girls in some situations. For example, suppose you're in a town where the Germans are all factory managers and the Koreans are all students. In a venue such as a bar, where the WGs have the freedom to pick their clients and negotiate the price, they may prefer the Germans over the Koreans. In that situation, what the German guys told you in the bar may be true (maybe this is the case in Tianjin? ). But in a town where it's the other way around, they may prefer the Koreans. Sometimes. It's not 100%.
In a venue where the girls have a fixed price (e. G. , sauna), it won't make any difference. In fact, being white may be a negative in that case. In sauna situations, I've had girls refuse to serve me, maybe 5 or 10 percent of the time, just because I'm white (afraid of dick size or forcefulness, afraid of difficulty communicating, or just afraid of the unknown). Wow, are you bringing out the racial issue. Look at what you are writing before making accusation.
Generally, if you've got the cash, and you can communicate with them, you can find service. Happy exploring.
As for how the original question has any relevance to overseas Chinese, I don't see it. The guy didn't say anything about being from overseas, being Chinese, or having anything in common with overseas Chinese. Nor did he ask anything about freebies. So I don't know why you guys changed the subject like that. What is it, you get laid a few times, and suddenly everything's about you? Like you just need to talk about yourself, and how "confident" you are? That's OK, but maybe we need to start a Dr. Phil thread, if that's what you're looking for. It was Nutty Trotter saying that he was an Asian Laowai. From this I gather he is asian. If he said that he was an African Laowai, I would assume that he may be an African American.
Night Cat, I think that it is you that is trying to create an argument here. Just remember that this is the China Opinion thread. I am just hereby addressing an opinion to a thread.
I just stating that it is really not about money, looks, or being a BSD (which you brought up). It is all about being friendly, natural and yourself. There is a guy that works in the office in Shenzhen. He is just a managment trainee earning just a bit more than the office gals. He gets more than his fair share of pus$y than some of the senior manager and without even spending a dime. He is natural and easy to talk with.
You sound a bit sour. Lighten up and don't think that others have an advantage over you. You sound like the whole world is against you. Be confident. If not, go see a shrink.
Ciao
Edit: BTW, I am a short, fat, poor Chinese guy without much so I will try your advice and report back! Cloud Palm
I know of this guy this is a mid manager in a company in GZ. He is exactly what you describe yourself as. He gets hit on by quite a few of the mid twenties gals that think their age and beauty is waning. I even found some younger one hitting on him. Sometimes having the money, looks and status can work against you. Many gals are afraid of the "player" type. The girls mentality is that they think this guy will be a good provider knowing that that got a good looking women at home and treat the girl nice. This guy has a very good personality.
That was "tough love" in action. Diplomacy is not neccessary for this case. It may be an unorthodox method, but sometimes it is more efficient to just slap them hard on the face to get them to wake up. Nothing wakes you up, more than getting a real shock of truth. Years from now, he'll end up a better person from it.
Also, if you look very carefully, there is a very important lesson I gave him that is invaluable. Women will tend to size you up, by looking at what you say, how you act, and how you carry yourself. All these clue them in on your social position and outlook. I was able to look at what he says, and figure out with 100% certaintly that his problem was that he has low self-esteem.
Did you actually read his post?
Did you notice the context of his question was mongering?
Is it possible that WGs in a bar might relate race or nationality to how much money is in a guy's pocket?
Is the Tianjin/German/Korean scenario in my previous post realistic?
Could it be that what the German guys said in the bar is true, at least in that town (Tianjin) or that bar (the above-mentioned scenario being one possibility)?
Did you notice that he did not report being rejected at all (by WGs, or anyone)?
Is it reasonable for a guy with no mongering experience (seems to have just arrived in China), who probably doesn't even speak Mandarin, and lives in a mongering desert (Tianjin), with no apparent interest in freebies or relationships (maybe just wants to get some mongering under his belt), and hears some factoid about WG racial/nationality bias (which may actually be true, in their locality), to pose that factoid as a question on this forum to get a second opinion from seasoned mongers, so he can happily embark on his mongering adventure armed with accurate info, and without needing to be psychoanalyzed or "tough loved"?
If you respond, as you did, by giving him reasons why women don't prefer him (when he never complained of any rejections), don't answer his question about WG biases (which, in fact, exist), and instead talk about overseas Chinese finding freebies, is that off-topic?
If the answer to any of the above questions is "no," please explain why.
There are many ABC/CBC and other minority that have an identity issue, this is due to low self confidence in their own race/ethnicity. It is you that tried to analyze the situation. I am just telling you my opinion on it. This is the China opinion thread. Did you not read the title of the thread.
Wow, are you bringing out the racial issue. Look at what you are writing before making accusation.
It was Nutty Trotter saying that he was an Asian Laowai.
Yes, he said that. But that, by itself, is no reason to accuse him of having "low self confidence" or an "identity problem" (your words).
You have given your opinion, now I have given mine.
As for the questions I just asked Sound Stream, I would have addressed them to you as well, but you don't seem interested in a sincere effort to clear up what is probably just a misunderstanding. So, if it's not too much trouble, please take a look at that. Otherwise, just drop the issue.
And don't worry, I'm not sour, just making observations and pleasant conversation. Cheers!
Yes, he said that. But that, by itself, is no reason to accuse him of having "low self confidence" or an "identity problem" (your words).
You have given your opinion, now I have given mine.
As for the questions I just asked Sound Stream, I would have addressed them to you as well, but you don't seem interested in a sincere effort to clear up what is probably just a misunderstanding. So, if it's not too much trouble, please take a look at that. Otherwise, just drop the issue.
And don't worry, I'm not sour, just making observations and pleasant conversation. Cheers!Many individuals are afraid of themselves and how other percieve them. I have people working above and below me with this issue. I am not afraid to speak up and go after something that interest me. Many people in life to not reach their goals is because they are afraid to reach for it. It you fail then try harder the next time.
I believe that you misunderstood the thread. I read it perfectly. If I make a mistake, I will correct it. I am not afraid.
I told Nutty Trotter that the German guys told him something that may not be true. I pointed out to him that he should have more confidence and then he may not have the issue with the girls in the bar.
I'm not brad pitt, bill gates or tom cruise or rather Choy Yun Fat (even though he is a tall fella) to get all of the girls swarming over you. You just need to be yourself and confident about yourself and you will be able to do well with all kind of women. You threw looks, cash and status in and you do not need that in an equation.
Like I told the other respondent, you could be a short, fat balding guy with confidence and you will do fine.
Get it. Btw, the whole world is not against guys like you. You just need to assert yourself in a positive manner.
As of initially saying that nutty trotter was a "bannana", I meant it in a friendly manner to show him that being asian in China is okay. Girls will like you, but just be proud and confident.
I have a worker in the office in Shenzhen, he was always afraid of saying the wrong thing and very subservient. He could not close a transaction or come close to completing a sales transaction. I spent months working with him and help him to be more confident about himself. Today he is one of the company's best producer. I love it when we get into a dialog over business.
Sound Stream #2
03-31-09, 23:57
Night Cat, The main point is that Nutty Trotter does have an issue with an inferiority complex. He's been brainwashed by Western media (TV / Movies) into believing false propaganda that stereotyping asians men as undersirable mates. Any asian that believes that they are less desirable than any other race definitely has an identity crisis. That is why I said, "They don't prefer you because you have a confidence problem." It's not because you're overseas asian. That is a totally true statement, and Nutty Trotter is not going to refute this because he knows deep inside that this is TRUE. It may be harsh, but someone has got to tell you, so you can become a person that you are happy with. It's not about race as much as how you carry yourself around women.
As for the Germans, a confident (not arrogant / there is a difference) overseas Chinese who is happy with himself is definitely going to be prefered over a German in China, and will be met with way less resistance. The girl doesn't have to worry about how people see them when they are together, nor what their family thinks. In this case, it may be about race, because you're in your home country where people that look like you are the majority. And home court, always hold the advantage. It's like that in any country. If those Germans told me that, I would call them on their BS.
Night Cat, , as to your question regarding the issue of rejection from women. I didn't have to go very far to figure that out. His lack of self confidence is going to guarantee it! Doesn't take a genius to put two and two together.
And why am I going through his character? I'm trying to help him out. In the end, he'll be better off that I opened my mouth than if I didn't. Because you can't fix a problem that you don't know about.
Today I met some of the German fellows around the bar and had a chat during chat. And on the topic of mongering, they said it's easy for laowai to bait. Even though I am a laowai too, since I am an Asian laowai, they say Chinese women won't be preferring me. Is it true?
FrequentTravel
04-01-09, 01:36
Hi all,
Strange, after a long time of thinking I finally decided to ask for opinions on this board, but now after reading the last discussions I am no longer sure if it is a really good idea.
Maybe I will find out that I have no self confidence, treat girls/women like shit, that Germans are bad from birth or whatever.
Nevertheless, I am in desperate need of some opinions: As you can see from my previous posts I stumbled upon ISG quite late, so to say I have some experience in mongering. Roughly the time I found this great source of knowledge things changed and became kind of complicated.
Point A: Hard to start, so in Germany I have been together with this woman for almost 16 years (and mongering around for approx. 10 years). Not really in love, but kind of (more like a sister or something). Never thought anything can get between us. Never intended to get married, but she was asking to do for almost 16 years (kidding, actually it was only 14 years). So I finally gave in and got married after being (and living) together with her for 14 years, hoping for a happy life going on like before.
Shortly after getting married (and finding ISG, coincidence? ), I met a woman in China. Actually I don’t want to go too much in details, but she was working in a bar for short time, not allowed to go out for P4P, did it anyways and we fell in love.
Seriously, in the beginning I thought: "This is not love, it is just her service, her body, her whatever". Shortly after I realized being in love, but still kind of in control. And damn it, she seemed to feel the same. What is the probability of a seasoned monger and a bar girl falling in love?
Up to this point a story which happens every day, but now things start to really complicated: My wife got behind the stuff which was going on, confronted me, and after short thinking I asked for divorce. Never happened though. She wanted to stay with me (actually she lost weight, looks great (if I would not know her I think I might even choose her in a line-up), sexual behaviour changed completely.
On the other side there is the woman in China. I tried 2 times to separate from her (as well as she did). Every time I chased her/she chased me until we came together again. God, I am around 40, not easy to fall in love at that age (with my experience).
You think I am done? Nope, the topping of the cake is still missing. I finally decided to suppress my feelings and break up with the woman I really love. (Just for the blindfolded, you remember from the forum and generalization, bar girls/Chinese woman only want your money). So based on the world economic situation I told her, that if things will not change drastically I will be completely broke within the next 4 month, hoping she will leave me. Guess what. Her summarized answer was: "It doesn’t matter if we are rich or poor, I want to be together with you, we can build up something new. I have my family supporting us, as long as we love each other things will work out fine. "
That is really great isn’t it? I am in love (different kinds of being in love, but definitely loving both of them) with two women. As far as I can tell they both seem to be in love with me. So I am sitting here, actually preventing the Chinese woman from finding someone to marry and at the same time I prevent my wife from finding someone new. And for me this is the toughest decision (there were some in my life) I ever had to make. If you ask me what I want, I say I want both of them. I could take care of two woman but there are some "buts": While the Chinese woman would be fine with another woman, my wife totally refuses the idea. The second "but" is the German law, I can not marry a second woman. So I am at point where I have to make a decisions. But which one, which way? Most important for me are the women I love, that leaves:
Talk my wife into the idea living together as three people?
Leave me wife (which will hurt her to the bones, and me not to the bones, but deep in the flesh)?
Leave my Love (yeahh, I sound like a school boy, but so I feel. Which actually also will hurt her to the bone and me, well, much deeper in the flesh)?
Leave them both, stay on my own and continue just mongering? So given the numbers of people on this board, there must some experience. Anyone of you older guys must have been in a similar situation. What decision did you make? Do you regret it?
Thanks for any opinion (and I missed to tell, this situation is going on for almost 2 years now, so no "falling in love because of the fuck of my life")
FT
Regarding the actual discussion: Seriously, stop this talk about ethnic/racial issues: A mouse pretending to be lion will fail, while a mouse, being happy and totally fine with being a mouse, will succeed. A lion pretending to be a mouse will fail/succeed the same way. = Just be what you are! (And I seriously wish I would have these kind of problems instead of the ones I have / no offence)
OldAsiaHand
04-01-09, 03:46
Mongering: All things being equal, WGs in China prefer smaller dicks and quick pops; "less pain" more gain". Although not always the case, Asians are perceived to fall into this category, laowais are perceived to be the opposite. I find myself being rejected up to 30% of the time depending on the establishment and previous exposure to laowais. Less so in the places I frequent often and more so when I seek out new venues. More so in BBS and less so in KTV and saunas. Acceptance has increased substantially over the years. I can remember KTV years ago where you were lucky to find 1-2 girls in the whole place that would do a laowai and they were usually fat and ugly and had no choice.
Freebies: Again, all things being equal, IMHO, young, single, hot Chinese girls prefer rich, successful local businessmen over any foreigner, ABC or otherwise. Life is comfortable in China for them if they have money to spend. Most have no desire to live abroad if they can satisfy their needs locally. Most of the freebies Bnlee2 does are not in this category, rather in their 30's, possibly married and not getting any at home, etc. There are a lot of neglected, "older" women in China since they are not attractive to the local guys. Many of these women are curious about laowais and want to try, but language is definitely a major disadvantage when compared to an ABC that can speakMandarin. There is no shortage of opportunity for laowais if you can speak some Mandarin and are willing to accept the "over 30" age bracket.
Just my POV.
OAH
...
Freebies: Again, all things being equal, IMHO, young, single, hot Chinese girls prefer rich, successful local businessmen over any foreigner, ABC or otherwise. Life is comfortable in China for them if they have money to spend. Most have no desire to live abroad if they can satisfy their needs locally. Most of the freebies Bnlee2 does are not in this category, rather in their 30's, possibly married and not getting any at home, etc. There are a lot of neglected, "older" women in China since they are not attractive to the local guys. Many of these women are curious about laowais and want to try, but language is definitely a major disadvantage when compared to an ABC that can speak Mandarin. There is no shortage of opportunity for laowais if you can speak some Mandarin and are willing to accept the "over 30" age bracket.
Just my POV.
OAH
As usual, OAH hits the nail on the head （搔到痒处）。White skin and a foreign pedigree stimulate the curiosity of many "older" women. It does not matter whether fat, old, and bald, like me. And the attitudes toward sex are continuing to evolve. For example, a woman I met in southwestern China eleven years ago would not even remove her overcoat in my hotel room then. By happenstance having lately become reacquainted with her online, she now tells me she "needs and welcomes passion". Well, a trip to that city may soon appear on my schedule. Just my pov.
Sound Stream and Bnlee2: OK guys, I get it. I get it!
In your opinion, if a China newbie, with apparently no mongering experience, comes to the Forum and dares to question what he heard about WGs having some racial/nationality biases (as some, in fact, do), and refers to himself as an Asian laowai (as he, in fact, is), that's enough to accuse the man of having "low self confidence" and an "identity problem" (as you, in fact, did).
I get it! Thanks for sharing your opinion and subsequent explanations.
Now, let us all conclude our friendly discussion, relax, and be happy. Good night, and good mongering!
Mongering: All things being equal, WGs in China prefer smaller dicks and quick pops; "less pain" more gain". Although not always the case, Asians are perceived to fall into this category, laowais are perceived to be the opposite. I find myself being rejected up to 30% of the time depending on the establishment and previous exposure to laowais. Less so in the places I frequent often and more so when I seek out new venues. More so in BBS and less so in KTV and saunas. Acceptance has increased substantially over the years. I can remember KTV years ago where you were lucky to find 1-2 girls in the whole place that would do a laowai and they were usually fat and ugly and had no choice.
Freebies: Again, all things being equal, IMHO, young, single, hot Chinese girls prefer rich, successful local businessmen over any foreigner, ABC or otherwise. Life is comfortable in China for them if they have money to spend. Most have no desire to live abroad if they can satisfy their needs locally. Most of the freebies Bnlee2 does are not in this category, rather in their 30's, possibly married and not getting any at home, etc. There are a lot of neglected, "older" women in China since they are not attractive to the local guys. Many of these women are curious about laowais and want to try, but language is definitely a major disadvantage when compared to an ABC that can speakMandarin. There is no shortage of opportunity for laowais if you can speak some Mandarin and are willing to accept the "over 30" age bracket.
Just my POV.
OAHI feel that in major cities there is less of a rejection rate for laowais. In smaller town you rate of rejection for laowais are much higher than 30% due to their limited exposure to foreigner.
As for older, most local guys put gals over 25 in that category. Most of my freebies ranges from the late twenties to the mid thirties. Asian gals does not age as quickly as american or european gals. Most older gals in their thirties looks ten years younger, maybe it is that asian aging gene that makes most of us look younger. As for the freebies in the over 25 group, there are a lot of lonely housewives, er tais or just plain mistress. Asian businessman tends to like to have trophy gals in this category but tend to work 24/7 365. I just loves it when I get hit on by that category. I find usually money is not an object, they probably have more in their purse than you. They are just horny and want a confident dominating man to satisfy their current desire. They are less sticky than other and tend to want to be discreet. I just love them. I just do not understand why a man wants to have a trophy just to look at and not use it.
For single gals, ABC/CBC/BBC are a great choice. It is a guy that they can bring back to their home without people whispering behind their back. As you all know "face" is very important in Chinese society. I have also found that most women wants a mate that is confident and strong especially in China.
Sound Stream #2
04-01-09, 18:06
the most common penis size is 5.5 to 6 inches according to the statistical graph from:
http://www.average-penis-size-chart.com/
i will admit to having a 6 inch penis, but very good girth. i guess that makes me normal.
when it comes to comparing penis sizes, i don't know how anyone can validate any of that, unless the person gets into the habit of peeking over his stall. most of the generalizations comes from watching "porn", and believing stereotypes with no scientific evidence. but most people don't realize that the western porn industry naturally selects the biggest 9 inch+ they can find, which is not common in real life, but extremely rare. it's like choosing white women with dd+ natural for every western porno, and then get people to believe that white women have bigger natural tits than asian women? why doesn't someone put this to rest and get random guys of different ethnicity of similar heights to agree to this, and record the average dick sizes based on height. until this can be done, and there is scientific evidence, not speculation through "hear say", i can't believe any of that.
as to quicker pops. i don't believe that either. i tire the girls out like crazy because i can go on for hours with the right attractive women, and without viagra, but yet also keep it hard, when i was in good physical shape. to get back in good shape, i just have to workout and run regularly everyday for 2-3 months straight. i have girls told me that i burned them out quite often, and that my wife or girl friend must be a very lucky girl. they were telling me something that i didn't already know. one girl friend in the past joked that there must be something wrong with my penis because it stays hard for a very long time, and i get so many boners all the time throughout the day. she thinks i took viagra.
with regards to establishments, i have never ever been rejected so far. that is an advantage being chinese.
hot chinese girls will prefer anyone that turns them on physically, mentally, emotionally, and sexually. i may not agree with the local business man having an advantage over an overseas chinese businessman. the main reason is that in the states we are used to working with overcoming rejection in a society where women have quite a bit of power, and play way too many games. we are forced to honed in, and develop our skills to face that as a natural event over time. that makes us strong. but when we go to china we find that most of these girls, and even the really hot ones, don't put up the same type of resistance. it's feels way too easy. in china, it is a male dominated society, and women have less power. as a result, the locals get lazy when it comes to homing in on their skill sets. locals also don't excercise regularly, and shape up their bodies to make them attractive to ladies because it isn't neccessary in china. but an overseas chinese like me will work out regularly. thus, i become a sought after rarity.
as to really hot looking normal girls, once i get them into bed, they are basically putty in my hands. why? because i go the extra mile to make them orgasm like they've never felt before. and i focus on making sure i do it better and longer than anyone else because i think that is important. even when i am burnt out, or losing interest, i keep going. that takes training, but that is my secret to getting girls to obsess over me.
mongering: all things being equal, wgs in china prefer smaller dicks and quick pops; "less pain" more gain". although not always the case, asians are perceived to fall into this category, laowais are perceived to be the opposite. i find myself being rejected up to 30% of the time depending on the establishment and previous exposure to laowais. less so in the places i frequent often and more so when i seek out new venues. more so in bbs and less so in ktv and saunas. acceptance has increased substantially over the years. i can remember ktv years ago where you were lucky to find 1-2 girls in the whole place that would do a laowai and they were usually fat and ugly and had no choice.
freebies: again, all things being equal, imho, young, single, hot chinese girls prefer rich, successful local businessmen over any foreigner, abc or otherwise. life is comfortable in china for them if they have money to spend. most have no desire to live abroad if they can satisfy their needs locally. most of the freebies bnlee2 does are not in this category, rather in their 30's, possibly married and not getting any at home, etc. there are a lot of neglected, "older" women in china since they are not attractive to the local guys. many of these women are curious about laowais and want to try, but language is definitely a major disadvantage when compared to an abc that can speakmandarin. there is no shortage of opportunity for laowais if you can speak some mandarin and are willing to accept the "over 30" age bracket.
just my pov.
oah
Sound Stream #2
04-03-09, 18:21
Hi all,
Point A: Hard to start, so in Germany I have been together with this woman for almost 16 years (and mongering around for approx. 10 years). Not really in love, but kind of (more like a sister or something). Never thought anything can get between us. Never intended to get married, but she was asking to do for almost 16 years (kidding, actually it was only 14 years). So I finally gave in and got married after being (and living) together with her for 14 years, hoping for a happy life going on like before.
Marriage is more of a benefit to women than it is to a man. But after you marry them, they do seem to change, simply because they usually show you the best side of themselves early on. But your case might be different because you've known your wife for 14 years. It's not that easy for them to hide her true nature for 14 long years.
On the otherhand, you've only known the other women for 2 years, and since you have a wife, I'll have to assume that you couldn't have spent much time with this 2nd lady to really know the true her. Because you don't see each other everyday and live together for an extended period of time, you will rarely see the 2nd lady in your face like your wife and making complaints, simply because there isn't enough time to deal with that kind stuff early on in a relationship where she has to show you the best side of her. Everything looks good and smells like roses, and the bad is shuffled and hidden from your view. You think this is really great.
Shortly after getting married (and finding ISG, coincidence? ), I met a woman in China. Actually I don’t want to go too much in details, but she was working in a bar for short time, not allowed to go out for P4P, did it anyways and we fell in love.
Seriously, in the beginning I thought: "This is not love, it is just her service, her body, her whatever". Shortly after I realized being in love, but still kind of in control. And damn it, she seemed to feel the same. What is the probability of a seasoned monger and a bar girl falling in love?
You think everything is rosy (there is not nagging, bitching, complaining, and you have your space, and is leanient ) early on with this 2nd women, but once you marry them, that can change because all that is HIDDEN during the honey moon stage. If you don't rush into marriage, and spend more time with them, more will become apparent (even though not all of it). They do have a goal: to get you to marry them, and they aren't going to risk showing you the worst stuff blowing their chances. After you are married, that is a whole different story.
Up to this point a story which happens every day, but now things start to really complicated: My wife got behind the stuff which was going on, confronted me, and after short thinking I asked for divorce. Never happened though. She wanted to stay with me (actually she lost weight, looks great (if I would not know her I think I might even choose her in a line-up), sexual behaviour changed completely.
Your wife didn't leave then. What makes you think she will leave even if you keep the 2nd lady on the side to buy yourself time to decide? Relax, the ball is in your favor.
So I am at point where I have to make a decisions. But which one, which way? Most important for me are the women I love, that leaves:
Talk my wife into the idea living together as three people?
Not a bad idea if there isn't going to be any cat fights and sabatage going on. With 2 women in the household, you're going to end up with lots of fighting. I see headache like never before with this one. Even the emperoror of China gave his mistresses their own quarters away from each other, so they can avoid each other when necessary.
Leave me wife (which will hurt her to the bones, and me not to the bones, but deep in the flesh)?
You just got to ask yourself if you love your wife enough to see her grow old and gray. If the answer is "no", leaving was what you wanted to do, but am just afraid of hurting her and feeling guilty after all those years she gave up for you. If you decided to stay with your wife, there is your answer. Stop here. If not, read the next option.
Leave my Love (yeahh, I sound like a school boy, but so I feel. Which actually also will hurt her to the bone and me, well, much deeper in the flesh)?
You call this 2nd lady, "my love", which tells me that you feel more in love with this 2nd lady than with your wife. But just keep in mind what I said above about women always putting their best foot foward early on the relationship. What you see now might not be what you actually get after you are married. If you choose this option, you may want to live together for an extended period of time to help you decide.
Leave them both, stay on my own and continue just mongering? So given the numbers of people on this board, there must some experience. Anyone of you older guys must have been in a similar situation. What decision did you make? Do you regret it?
I guess this is your only last option after none of the above work out.
But either way, hope everything works out for you, and you figure out what will make you happy in life.
Old Mean Dog
04-04-09, 05:12
As to really hot looking normal girls, once I get them into bed, they are basically putty in my hands. Why? Because I go the extra mile to make them orgasm like they've never felt before. And I focus on making sure I do it better and longer than anyone else because I think that is important. Even when I am burnt out, or losing interest, I keep going. That takes training, but that is my secret to getting girls to obsess over me.
You sir, are god's gift to women, congratulations!
Reminds me of the old Mac Davis song that went "Oh lord it's hard to be humble, when your perfect in every way.....I can't stand to look in the mirror, cuz I get better looking each day......to know me is to love me, I must be one helluva man.....Oh lord it's hard to be humble, but I'm doin' the best that I can"
Rock the Casbah
04-05-09, 22:26
Frequent traveller: you could try the I ching, I found it useful in dilemmas.
Getting both of them in the same house will most likely not work.
My instinct: your wife has got her act together and not left you- I'd stay with her . Culturally, the differerence and expectations 9especailly towards ;ookng after her family) will emerge if you go with the chinese girl. and she is a bar girl - can you forget she's screwed other guys (were you really the first she did P4p) . I nearly fell for a girl in a bar in Brazil and another in Colombia - I came to my senses, thank God.
SE Asia Joe
04-06-09, 06:39
You sir, are god's gift to women, congratulations!
Reminds me of the old Mac Davis song that went "Oh lord it's hard to be humble, when your perfect in every way.....I can't stand to look in the mirror, cuz I get better looking each day......to know me is to love me, I must be one helluva man.....Oh lord it's hard to be humble, but I'm doin' the best that I can"
Awww come on CPE - give SS#2 a break. Yes, to us old geezers, he's probably a bit too much into himself - but don't YOU remember how you were when you were young yourself?
Look at some of his previous posts - especially this one going back to 2004 (All you'd have to do is just to search "more posts") and you'll have a better perspective on SS#2
.......
What I wrote might be a bit on the tough side, but its as truthful
as I can put it. I figured that telling you what you want to hear
just to make you feel better would just be a temporary solution.
You'll only keep making the same mistakes over and over again
with women until you finally figure out what you're doing wrong.
Before I was 23, you wouldn't know how many times I messed up with girls. Went out with them for a couple of months and then getting dumped, or getting the "friend" bull shit. I think I was really pathetic. But looking back at the way I acted back then, I would have to say that the final outcome was expected. It wasn't until I was 24 that all my answers just came to me in sudden flood, and I figured out how to get girls go to crazy over me and to turn them on. I even ended up with a habit of making them beg me for sex, or they don't get any. No more "friend" bull shit for me. Maybe it was a new awareness of the world, that I didn't understand before that changed my attitude.
A lot of it has to do with understanding your own self-worth......
IMHO - and very humble ones at that - I think that SS#2 - being ABC, "discovered" himself when he came back to China.
OF COURSE he did - after all, a young man (he should be 28 or so now, an American Born CHINESE and probably doing quite well here) that had his confidence restored cannot help but be "succesful" in wooing these simple Chinese gals (errr..... exceptin' that he'd better watch out - some (Most??!!) ain't as simple as all that!!).
Now, if SS#2 was a scrawny old geezer like OWL and making these "Statements" I'd say FIRE AWAY!!! But I do believe that SS#2 does have some pretty damn good info and stories, and I myself would ignore things like him having to actually measure the size of his own dick etc (Hmmmmm..... still some lingering doubts huh SS#2??) or that he's God's gift to womenfolk (at least the PRC womenfolk - Jeez - he's gonna have his work cut out for him back in the States!!) - and just enjoy the diversity of posts in our boards.
Peace and Salutations to one and all.
SEAJ
SE Asia Joe
04-06-09, 06:49
Discussion moved from the Photo Gallery
You Seniors Should KNOW BETTER!!!
Since I believe I started this diatribe about shaved vs non-shaved (unintentionally I may add, as I just expressed me bein' partial to True White Tigers), I guess I should also put in my 2 cents worth about all these "No pictures postings" on this the Photo Gallery.
Come on guys, take this discussion elsewhere - say the Chinese Women Opinion and advise pages?? - OK?
Up to now, we've been fairly succesful in keeping the China Photo Gallery relatively free of these type of "clutter/no pictures postings" thats a bane on some other countries' forums - so let's keep it that way OK? Especially hateful are those idiots who writes and makes stupid or worse, derogatory - remarks about a particular picture posted up or another (of course without posting up his own picture!). Just venting here - sorry.
Anyway - herewith a pix of the gal Xuer mommie (from the SWL alley 2/F) keeps claiming is her "sister." She's got a very pretty face but a body that's not anything to write home about. Still, quite a nice one - and WITH HER PUBES INTACT!!! At least it was intact couple days ago and hope to God that Bnlee didn't get to her. Fuckin' Mutilator!!! Down with Mutilators!! Oh shit - now I'se gonna get all these shavin' fanatics on my case - OH WELL, what the hell!!
And I say here again - I LOVE pusssies, I love hairy pussies, I love not so hariy pussies, and I especially love True White Tigers - but - I HATE SHAVED PUSSIES!!!! (and stinky ones too!!)
SEAJ
SE Asia Joe
04-06-09, 09:32
Moved from the Dongguan thread - with apologies to Jackson for wasting bandwidth.
SEAJ
Hey SEAJ
Just another one going over to the "smooth side". No more choking on furr balls.come on SEAJ. You got to admit that it looks very sexxyyyy. If we get a few converts a day. And them showing the other gals how nice it looks. In a few months we will have a few thousand converts, by year end tens of thousand of convert.
Come over to the smooth side SEAJ
BnLee - you ain't never heard of washing them all up first?? And getting rid of any and all loose hair in the process?? And you would actually go down on any and all WG?? You're a much braver man than I for sure!!
And NO - it does NOT look sexy at all - it look like a nasty plucked chicken - same texture, same feel and same look! YUCK!!! And after a few days or week - its actually downright nasty - all scratchy to the touch, sandpapers my groin (and your face I guess!!) and looks like mouldy peace of shit!
And then them nicks and scratches and cuts!! OHMIGAWD - harboring all 'em germs and nastiness - and cracking open when mounted! Fresh Blood on your skin now!!
OK guys who hates these mutliators - go out and do your part to tell each and every gal you do NEVER to shave themselves. That if they do, they're definitely gonna be branded as no longer worthy of doing Chinese customers (and Japanese and Korean and Taiwanese and Hong Kongers and.......) and only reserved for ....... you know who you are!!!
And give mommies shit if they ever give you a gal who's been shaved..... and throw out gals who's shaved.....and mark and shame all gals who allows themselves to be mutilitated in our litle playground. This is WAR guys! We gotta defeat these guys who come over and mutilates our lovely fair maidens!!
Hell, I used to love going to Philippines and Thailand - but have stopped going there to monger and only go when I ain't got no choice but to go; All crap plucked chickens there - Mucho Gracias to these Western Mongers who've been spreading these insidious and false information about the attractiveness of the shaved beaver. BTW - I usually restrict myself to going to the Saunas in Thailand - as these places are the "Locals" choice to go to - and thus a great majority of the gals there remains unshaven. Its these Darker skinned Thai gals favored by the Westerners who hangs around the bars that are usually shaved.
SEAJ
Ps. Moving this post to the China Women Opinion and advise thread.
Moved from the Dongguan thread. With apologies to Jackson for wasting bandwidth.
SEAJHey SEAJ
I just going to stop off at Watson and buy up all of the female pussy razors and a lot of cream and maybe an added incentive of paying premium for smooth pus$y. No I do not go down on WG but I do go down on my freebies aka rich and young MILF that are lonely and horny.
As for the comment on stubbles and new hair growth, I have introduce two of my freebies to brazilian waxing that can keep it smoother for a bit longer. They just loves pleasing me.
SEAJ, drinks are on me when I get back to DG sometime in May/June.
Sound Stream #2
04-06-09, 20:50
Delete to save space.
Sound Stream #2
04-06-09, 21:00
IMHO - and very humble ones at that - I think that SS#2 - being ABC, "discovered" himself when he came back to China.
OF COURSE he did - after all, a young man (he should be 28 or so now, an American Born CHINESE and probably doing quite well here) that had his confidence restored cannot help but be "succesful" in wooing these simple Chinese gals (errr..... exceptin' that he'd better watch out - some (Most??!!) ain't as simple as all that!!).Yes, you are somewhat close. I'm a couple years older than 28. I started attracting women in the states about 3-4 years before I made my first trip to China. I used the same strategy over and over again in the states because it works:
1. Make the women comfortable and trust you.
(This is easy if you're a nice guy, but you'll have to take it to the next
level if you want to get anywhere.)
2. Build their feelings of respect and admiration for you with stories.
(if a women can not respect or admire you, she wouldn't fuck you)
3. Get them used to being in close proximity to you, and get
them used to being touchy feely with you.
4. Build up feelings of excitement and arousal, and link them all to YOU.
During the time with them, I usually throw in a few hints without sounding as if it means much to me, so that they can come to the same conclusion themselves that: ( I'm desireable to women. I'm in good physical shape. I'm exciting sexually, etc... ). Women get turned off very fast when they think you're bragging, so I do it in a way where it does not look like that at all, and it is only by subtle implication because they filled in the blanks themselves to come to that conclusion based on how I act and carry myself when I'm with them.
My first trip to China was a big eye opener. I've been so fined tuned with getting around the defences of women in the states, that I found it was just way too easy in ShenZhen, China to score with beautiful women. I didn't have to try very hard, because women in China didn't seem to have the problems that women in the states had: suspicion that every guy is just trying to get into their pants, and that they had to cock block to avoid looking easy. So here I am, fine tuned to deal with cock-blocking women, and I'm not getting any resistance at all. I totally loved this difference, because it was very little work, with lots of play.
Now, if SS#2 was a scrawny old geezer like OWL and making these "Statements" I'd say FIRE AWAY!!! But I do believe that SS#2 does have some pretty damn good info and stories, and I myself would ignore things like him having to actually measure the size of his own dick etc (Hmmmmm..... still some lingering doubts huh SS#2??) or that he's God's gift to womenfolk (at least the PRC womenfolk - Jeez - he's gonna have his work cut out for him back in the States!!) - and just enjoy the diversity of posts in our boards.The mention of my penis was really my way of saying that I am not afraid to tell you my dick size in order to dispell the myth that asian's have tiny dicks. It's not a big dick, but I'm happy with my penis either way, and don't feel a need to change it. I'm not sure how open or comfortable anyone else would be to throw out their penis size.
The truth is, you don't need a huge cock to be very good in bed. You just need to know how to use it the right way.
Discussion moved from the Photo Gallery
And I say here again. I LOVE pusssies, I love hairy pussies, I love not so hariy pussies, and I especially love True White Tigers. But. I HATE SHAVED PUSSIES! (and stinky ones too! )
SEAJSEAJ
If you love white tiger then you should love the pussy that have gone through a nice brazilian waxing job. Hairy pussy also stinks especially in the humid south China weather. In a relax mood, I love shaving my freebies or using that waxing hair removing procedure on them.
I love true white tiger. That is usually what I ask for.
Clandestine782
04-07-09, 06:51
SEAJ
If you love white tiger then you should love the pussy that have gone through a nice brazilian waxing job. Hairy pussy also stinks especially in the humid south China weather. In a relax mood, I love shaving my freebies or using that waxing hair removing procedure on them.
I love true white tiger. That is usually what I ask for.Are you sure about women being stinky in the humid south China weather? It seems to me like smell is more a function of what women eat. So I know that women in Sichuan/ Hunan/ Chongqing eat a lot of spicy food and they seem to be a bit more fragrant below than women from other provinces (independent of the time of the year). If you notice, there has been a lot of observation on Chengdu as the city with the most stinky pussy. (To be honest, the smell of Chinese women compared to a lot of Western women is VERY MILD.) Also, in Indonesia (which has humid/ hot weather), most of the women are shaved. But after a few unhappy incidents (after which I learned to say in Bahasa "I want a girl with pubic hair"), I didn't notice any difference between the shaved vs. shaved. As we've discussed before, I think that the deciding factor between stinky and fragrant is apocrine sweat glands vs. exocrine sweat glands. (Blacks and whites have the former. Asians don't. But everyone has the latter.)
But to put in a bit on the issue of shaved vagina (disgusting) vs. non-shaved (good!), I don't know why it is that all of a sudden shaved vagina is *so hot!* If you think about it, human beings have been getting by just fine for the last 250,000 years without shaving or waxing. Why is that so hot now? Isn't hair a sign of puberty? Shouldn't human beings have been conditioned to find *that* attractive (instead of the alternative)?
SE Asia Joe
04-07-09, 08:25
BnLee - is this what brazilian waxed pussy looks like?
SEAJ
Ps. A white Tiger is NOT a waxed pussy!!
White tigers just do not have any pubic hair - period.
A waxed pussy is not a white tiger - it's more like "plucked chicken!!"
Now repeat after me -
a White Tiger is NOT a waxed pussy, A White tiger is NOT a waxed pussy........ repeat 100 times at least!!
BnLee - is this what brazilian waxed pussy looks like?
SEAJ
Ps. A white Tiger is NOT a waxed pussy!
White tigers just do not have any pubic hair - period.
A waxed pussy is not a white tiger - it's more like "plucked chicken!!"
Now repeat after me -
a White Tiger is NOT a waxed pussy, A White tiger is NOT a waxed pussy........ repeat 100 times at least!!Seaj
You must have surf the web all night long to find that pic or did you spend all night plucking a girl just for me. Shaving with a nice razor takes less time than plucking.
If you did spend all night plucking that girl, you did a wonderful job. You need to show us your wonderful technique.
Red Rock II
04-08-09, 20:45
Dear ISG brothers,
Can we just drop the discussion about pussy hair or move it to some place else such as "Pussy Hair Forum" ? Whether you like white tiger or shaved pussy, that is just your own business, and rest of us don't really need to knwo unless we don't have anything else to talk about here in China Women-Opinions and Advice thread.
I like this Thread very much. I learn quite bit about Chinese women through the posts. I enjoy reading and sharing genuine experience in women no mater it is bad or good. Honesely, most of my friends like to brag about how good they are at women, they don't tell a story unless it has a happy ending. This is the only place that I can get stories from both sides. Please do not ruin the thread by talking too much about women's hair!
I normally do not criticize the post posted by fellow mongers no matter how senseless they are because I am not a big contributor to the forum. But I am a good reader. I am big fan of China Women - Opinions and Advice thread because I love women and enjoy mongering, not I want to know more about the difference between white tiger and shaved pussy nor how they make you feel differently.
Thanks anyway!
RR2
Red Rock II
04-08-09, 21:38
I used the same strategy over and over again in the states because it works:
1. Make the women comfortable and trust you.
(This is easy if you're a nice guy, but you'll have to take it to the next
level if you want to get anywhere.)
2. Build their feelings of respect and admiration for you with stories.
(if a women can not respect or admire you, she wouldn't fuck you)
3. Get them used to being in close proximity to you, and get
them used to being touchy feely with you.
4. Build up feelings of excitement and arousal, and link them all to YOU.
During the time with them, I usually throw in a few hints without sounding as if it means much to me, so that they can come to the same conclusion themselves that: ( I'm desireable to women. I'm in good physical shape. I'm exciting sexually, etc... ). Women get turned off very fast when they think you're bragging, so I do it in a way where it does not look like that at all, and it is only by subtle implication because they filled in the blanks themselves to come to that conclusion based on how I act and carry myself when I'm with them.
My first trip to China was a big eye opener. I've been so fined tuned with getting around the defences of women in the states, that I found it was just way too easy in ShenZhen, China to score with beautiful women. I didn't have to try very hard, because women in China didn't seem to have the problems that women in the states had: suspicion that every guy is just trying to get into their pants, and that they had to cock block to avoid looking easy. So here I am, fine tuned to deal with cock-blocking women, and I'm not getting any resistance at all. I totally loved this difference, because it was very little work, with lots of play.
Above post is making a lot of sense than a discussion about hairly/hairless pussy. I actually learn a few things from a new and relative young guy (by ignoring his mentioning of penis size, I am going to use mine to find the pleasure, who cares about others?)
I especially think your stragedy #2. is very much true: "if a women can not respect or admire you, she wouldn't fuck you" . I can't agree with you more!
A woman can respect and admire you because you are
1. successful in your profession, or
2. weathy and generous, or
3. having a good sense of humor, or
4. good looking, or
5. strong either physically or mentally, or
6. ......
But, as you said, not by bragging or giving fake promises. But people are so different. Someone may enjoy getting into a women's pants by cheating on them. I remember someone post a stroy in Bankok Forum on how he called a
WG to a hotel room. After the session, before paying the girl, he offered to take the girl to have a drink at some place nearby. Then he made a restroom excuse, went back to the hotel, check out, and dispeared. He post the story with a tone that sounds he is so smart. That was a shop lifting!
Above post is making a lot of sense than a discussion about hairly/hairless pussy. I actually learn a few things from a new and relative young guy (by ignoring his mentioning of penis size, I am going to use mine to find the pleasure, who cares about others? )
But, as you said, not by bragging or giving fake promises. But people are so different. Someone may enjoy getting into a women's pants by cheating on them. I remember someone post a stroy in Bankok Forum on how he called a WG to a hotel room. After the session, before paying the girl, he offered to take the girl to have a drink at some place nearby. Then he made a restroom excuse, went back to the hotel, check out, and dispeared. He post the story with a tone that sounds he is so smart. That was a shop lifting! I find the easiest way with non WG is to gain their confidence by just being truthful and confidence. I'm usually very upfront and telling them that I'm married and no chance of changing into another relationship, eg. Divorce. If they want to pursue then they are aware of the complex situation. Cheating them and giving them false hopes will just create future problems.
If I'm with a WG for the evening, they are there for the money. Ditching them afterward just to save a few hundred or maybe a thousand RMB is just wrong. They are there to provide you with service. Ripping them off is just like walking into a store and stealing merchandise. I think that the guy that posted and bragged about ripping off WG was "Cheap Meat". I usually ignore his posting. I really do not like associating with "asshole" like him. I hope that the pimps find him one of these day and do a number on him for stealing.
SE Asia Joe
04-09-09, 05:54
Seaj
You must have surf the web all night long to find that pic or did you spend all night plucking a girl just for me. Shaving with a nice razor takes less time than plucking.
If you did spend all night plucking that girl, you did a wonderful job. You need to show us your wonderful technique.
Hey Bnlee - the picture is the "aftermath" of -
////////The Polish bat record of being fornicator with 646 men in just seven hours. Klaudia Figure is the new world champion of fornication. The Polish porn actress has achieved new world mark in just seven hours at the Festival erotic Warsaw. The meeting was crucial stiff competition from the Brazilian Mayara Rodrigues and the British Claire Brown. The previous record holder was the American actress Houston, in 1999, lay with 620 men at the same period time. The competition began at ten o'clock and rigorous regulation required that each intercourse run between 30 and 60 seconds. The record was achieved at 16:54, while brava Klaudia continued until 17:46, raising the bar to 646 powders. Mayara Rodrigues left his mark at 633, while Claire Brown left his mark on 466.////
Muahahahaha!!!
SEAJ
ps. Red Rock - cool it will ya. The last time I checked I see that ISG is STILL an open forum and that most of the information that are on these pages are the result of the back and forth banter between all of us.
1. Shaved and not shaved pussy on CHINESE gals definitely belongs on the China Women and opinion pages
2. Hmmmm..... we can only write what YOU want to read??!! Hmmmm....
3. Wasn't it you that wrote this a couple or so months ago??
Please stop fighting. The more you write, the more it shows your character. Yes, you may live in the States for more than 43 yrs, you may earn multiple degrees and be a multi-language speaker... but, it does not make those mis-spelled words right.
On this board, people earn their respect by posting genuine good/bad experience, by providing useful information, by making sincere comments and advices...
Peace!
RR how rapidly you've changed your stripes and flaming away!!
Red Rock II
04-09-09, 10:07
I find the easiest way with non WG is to gain their confidence by just being truthful and confidence.
Bnlee2,
I truthfully belive that the confidence is the key. Unfortunately, that was something that I didn't have a lot, especially when I was little. I felt particularly less confident when I met a pretty girl that I like. No one taught me nor discussed it with me until I was almost 20. Finally, I did not know how and when, I realized a girl who has a pretty face or a hot body does not necessaryly to be smarter or enven popular. Even most of them are spoiled by the boys that are chasing them, they still need friends that they feel comfortable with. After I gained my self confidence, I started to talk to girls naturally, and offered helps when they needed sincerely. Then I found they were interested in me just as much as I was interested in them.
When I first came to china, I didn't have a lot of problems with confidence, however I was having another problem: when I met a pretty woman and would like to make move, I alwasy felt that she had seen through my innocent face and discovered my secret motivation. Finally, one of my friends realized the problem that I had, and said to me: you don't have to pretend to be innocent. Nothing wrong with your motivation, those ladies may need you as much as you need them. If one does not, there will be another one.
Later I find out a lot of women in china actually prefer to have a relationship with a foreign resident because they think most of western men are open-minded, and less likely to think them as bad women if they are a little bit more sexually aggressive.
It is all about a learning curve. I now fully understand what you mean when you talk about confidence. It is a key of success both in a personal life and in a social life.
RR2
Chocha Monger
04-09-09, 16:35
are you sure about women being stinky in the humid south china weather? it seems to me like smell is more a function of what women eat. so i know that women in sichuan/ hunan/ chongqing eat a lot of spicy food and they seem to be a bit more fragrant below than women from other provinces (independent of the time of the year). if you notice, there has been a lot of observation on chengdu as the city with the most stinky pussy. (to be honest, the smell of chinese women compared to a lot of western women is very mild.) also, in indonesia (which has humid/ hot weather), most of the women are shaved. but after a few unhappy incidents (after which i learned to say in bahasa "i want a girl with pubic hair"), i didn't notice any difference between the shaved vs. shaved. as we've discussed before, i think that the deciding factor between stinky and fragrant is apocrine sweat glands vs. exocrine sweat glands. (blacks and whites have the former. asians don't. but everyone has the latter.)
but to put in a bit on the issue of shaved vagina (disgusting) vs. non-shaved (good!), i don't know why it is that all of a sudden shaved vagina is *so hot!* if you think about it, human beings have been getting by just fine for the last 250,000 years without shaving or waxing. why is that so hot now? isn't hair a sign of puberty? shouldn't human beings have been conditioned to find *that* attractive (instead of the alternative)?
the sweat glands may be a factor but you can't ignore hygiene. the asian girls that i've encountered who had no vaginal odor invariably washed themselves each time they used the restroom. some had pubic hair but no scent because the frequent washings removed any traces of [CodeWord109] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord109), sweat and dead epithelial cells, leaving nothing to be broken down by odor producing bacteria.
Hey Bnlee - the picture is the "aftermath" of -
////////The Polish bat record of being fornicator with 646 men in just seven hours. Klaudia Figure is the new world champion of fornication. The Polish porn actress has achieved new world mark in just seven hours at the Festival erotic Warsaw. The meeting was crucial stiff competition from the Brazilian Mayara Rodrigues and the British Claire Brown. The previous record holder was the American actress Houston, in 1999, lay with 620 men at the same period time. The competition began at ten o'clock and rigorous regulation required that each intercourse run between 30 and 60 seconds. The record was achieved at 16:54, while brava Klaudia continued until 17:46, raising the bar to 646 powders. Mayara Rodrigues left his mark at 633, while Claire Brown left his mark on 466.////
Muahahahaha!!!!!Hey SEAJ with the average time of each intercourse at 30-60 second, I guess that they could not consider me to join into the fun. I would take atleast 30 to 60 times longer if I were to participate.
SEAJ, did you partake in the event? Since you got such a nice shot of her. Just wondering.
OldAsiaHand
04-10-09, 05:20
Interesting dialogue on the needs of Chinese women.
IMHO, the major difference between western women and Chinese women is that the Chinese women are looking for men that "take care of everything" and make the decisions for them. Unlike their western counterparts, they do not want to voice an opinion and make a joint decision. For example, you may ask a western woman where she would like to go for dinner. You should tell a Chinese women where you are taking her.
Just my POV.
OAH
SE Asia Joe
04-10-09, 08:08
Interesting dialogue on the needs of Chinese women.
IMHO, the major difference between western women and Chinese women is that the Chinese women are looking for men that "take care of everything" and make the decisions for them. Unlike their western counterparts, they do not want to voice an opinion and make a joint decision. For example, you may ask a western woman where she would like to go for dinner. You should tell a Chinese women where you are taking her.
Just my POV.
OAH
And this is where quite a few "Western and Westernized" guy falls flat on their face!!
They're either just so used to be "Gentlemanly" (read that - pussy whipped/balls cut off by these feminists) that they think they also need to act such with PRC gals.
Take our good friend who's practically a resident of CP as an example; the guy - when he's with us guys - knows what he wants and insists on getting what he wants!! I want 2 veggy dishes, I want a fish, meet me at Mito's nowhere else, Beer garden at 12:30, I'll come - or not come - to the KTV etc etc and is practically a pain the ass - but when he's with his sweetheart - one who he JUST MET at the BBS, he's as pliable as a lamb!! Gotta romance her, put on nice music, dance with her, cajole her, acting practically like Santa Claus!!! ..... Yes, Yes OK to everything the gal wants - and he ends up NOT getting blown, Not allowed to take his time, pestered for more Xiao Fei and ends up all upset and depressed!! Hell, he PAYS the gal - and he allows them to pussy whip him!!
OR
On the other end of the spectrum are these guys who've read some and think they now know how to handle PRC gals - and hell in fact, how to handle all Chinese here!! All Macho and bossy and "I give you $$$' and .....true pain in the asses. These masters of the Universe come gang busters and expect one and sundry to KNOW that his shit don't stink!
Moderation Gents, Moderation is the key to handling Chinese women - and I guess ALL women - and I guess ALL situations!! So PLEASE let this discussion NOT go off on the deep end of either extremes.
Just IMHO - and worth 3 fen???!
SEAJ
Red Rock II
04-10-09, 08:15
Interesting dialogue on the needs of Chinese women.
IMHO, the major difference between western women and Chinese women is that the Chinese women are looking for men that "take care of everything" and make the decisions for them. Unlike their western counterparts, they do not want to voice an opinion and make a joint decision. For example, you may ask a western woman where she would like to go for dinner. You should tell a Chinese women where you are taking her.
Just my POV.
OAH
Here are my two cents:
A Chinese wonan does not like to be complimented as being a capable or career oriented person even she is or she wants to be. She does not want to be considered as a person who has a strong opinion, especiallly in front of a man that she likes. She always wants to be or pretends to be a “little woman” in her lover’s eyes. If you look at the profiles in those chinese dating sites, you hardly find a woman that discribes herself as a successful professional even she is. It is a tradition and a culture issue. A marriage is less stable if a wife has a better social status than her husband. In such case, woman will feel uncomfortable and man will feel stressful.
SE Asia Joe
04-10-09, 08:17
Hey SEAJ with the average time of each intercourse at 30-60 second, I guess that they could not consider me to join into the fun. I would take atleast 30 to 60 times longer if I were to participate.
SEAJ, did you partake in the event? Since you got such a nice shot of her. Just wondering.
Weak come back - weak come back BnLee!!
So your 30 to 60 times longer - out of the ... what half hour/hour ...how much time you gonna spend giving her a Brazilian Wax??!!
All fun and games.... nuthin' better than to pimp each other out IN FUN here....let's see how you're gonna come back now...hey mebbe Red Rrock can join in..... just remember guys ..... all in fun .... OK???!!
Muahahahahaha!
SEAJ
I agree with most of the advice given here about non-WG Chinese ladies. But just to clarify one point, there seems to be different ideas out there of what is meant by "confidence" (maybe due to cultural differences? I don't know). One meaning would be something purely internal (how you feel about yourself, having a positive regard for yourself, being comfortable with who you are, etc.). Another meaning is something about one's outward behavior (friendliness, assertiveness, showmanship, salesmanship, etc.). I think it'd be more clear to be specific.
If we take the first meaning (an inner thing) then of course confidence is important, if only for one's own peace of mind. Some guys are fond of saying, "all you need is confidence," which is true in some sense, especially if you're not attached to any particular outcome. But if what you want is maximum quantity of freebies, then confidence by itself is not enough. You need to add something else, for example, certain outward behaviors that you guys have shared about. A good example is Sound Stream's 4-step strategy. I'm sure that will boost your numbers. But what if you don't do any of that, or any of the other stuff people recommend, and instead, just be confident about yourself (as an inner thing)? You probably won't rack up the same numbers. You may still get some results, and if you're satisfied with those lesser results, then, yeah, we can say that all you needed was confidence. This is fine.
Now, to avoid putting you guys to sleep, here's a juicy (but true) story. I was walking back to my hotel in Beijing (one of those budget hotels) around 2AM and saw a lady, late-20s, walking out of the hotel by herself. While she was kind of attractive (more "cute" than "sexy"), she didn't strike me as being a WG. I made some smalltalk with her ("ni hao," gee, it's so late to be out and about, are you staying in this hotel, oh you're a local person, and so on). Then, just like that, she went ahead and confided her situation to me.
She was a married lady, and she had just had a first date with a guy she had been chatting with online for 6 months, and the date ended early because the guy had equipment failure, and now she was disappointed and ticked off about "that terrible man." As if on cue, I said, "gee, it's a bit cold out here, why don't we continue our conversation inside." We went inside and, being the good samaritan that I am, I immediately picked up where the other guy left off. This was probably my fastest-ever freebie.
I've also had several that were almost as fast (e.g., ask some silly question, walk with the girl, oh here's my hotel, let's go inside, ...). These "point blank" encounters are my favorites. Not that I'm bragging (actually, this method fails far more often than it works, e.g., the girl doesn't walk with me, or she doesn't go to my room, or once in the room she doesn't do anything, etc.). I just want to make the point that (a) it's actually possible to get results, once in a while, without the behaviors people have recommended (behaviors designed to impress the girl, excite the girl, conform to the Chinese girl's idea of a "man," etc.; so in that case, confidence is for yourself, to regard yourself positively even if the results are negative), and (b) if you want to improve your numbers, rather than saying "all you need is confidence," I'd say certain outward behaviors (as you guys have shared) are also important.
I should also add that there are some guys I've known who exhibit the "right" outward behaviors and get results with girls, but if you get to know them, you find that some of them (not most, but some) are actually quite messed up inside -- especially the alcoholics (and maybe models, but I don't know any). The point is that, for some people, outward behaviors and appearance may get results (esp. in racking up numbers) even without confidence. But of course I'd agree that you're better off with confidence than without.
Professor 1
04-10-09, 18:54
Ripping them off is just like walking into a store and stealing merchandise.
The other problem with stealing is that it makes it that much harder for the next guy who, while not paying in advance, will honor his word to so do. I had such an adventure in Mexico. My compromise was to leave the money on the dresser under the ashtray. As I was sneaking out in the morning, the girl jumped up, and ran to check the money. After she saw that it was all there, she relaxed, gave a kiss, and offered to give a quickie. Stealing from these girls is like an inner-city store charging the poor an extra US$1.00 on each item.
South Gate
04-14-09, 09:30
This is the kind of story that makes me ponder the philosophical question of freebie vs p for p. Which road should I take? The freebie is free (sort of). The p for p will cost me maybe 200 RMB or more. On my last plane trip to GZ, I sat next to a 28 year local unmarried female lawyer, very cute. We were getting off talking to each other for an hour before the plane landed and I took her phone number and told her I would call the next day. After my business on the next day, I pulled out her number from my wallet and started reading the forum. Which should I go for? The cute lawyer was only a maybe. Maybe she would. Maybe she would not. Maybe she would be a lousy lay even if she did. The forum told about sure things. BBS girls that did BBBJ sometimes CIM, sometimes only hand jobs, sometime full service with rimming to boot but for sure I would get my rocks off that way. With the lawyer I might not even get a kiss. I had only one evening so I had to decide.
I decided for the p for p and found a cute SW who spent the whole nite with me for 700 RMB. I am not sorry about my decision since it turned out ok but I will always wonder, like Robert Frost, if I should have taken the other road.
I agree with most of the advice given here about non-WG Chinese ladies. But just to clarify one point, there seems to be different ideas out there of what is meant by "confidence" (maybe due to cultural differences? I don't know). One meaning would be something purely internal (how you feel about yourself, having a positive regard for yourself, being comfortable with who you are, etc.). Another meaning is something about one's outward behavior (friendliness, assertiveness, showmanship, salesmanship, etc.). I think it'd be more clear to be specific.
If we take the first meaning (an inner thing) then of course confidence is important, if only for one's own peace of mind. Some guys are fond of saying, "all you need is confidence," which is true in some sense, especially if you're not attached to any particular outcome. But if what you want is maximum quantity of freebies, then confidence by itself is not enough. You need to add something else, for example, certain outward behaviors that you guys have shared about. A good example is Sound Stream's 4-step strategy. I'm sure that will boost your numbers. But what if you don't do any of that, or any of the other stuff people recommend, and instead, just be confident about yourself (as an inner thing)? You probably won't rack up the same numbers. You may still get some results, and if you're satisfied with those lesser results, then, yeah, we can say that all you needed was confidence. This is fine.
Now, to avoid putting you guys to sleep, here's a juicy (but true) story. I was walking back to my hotel in Beijing (one of those budget hotels) around 2AM and saw a lady, late-20s, walking out of the hotel by herself. While she was kind of attractive (more "cute" than "sexy"), she didn't strike me as being a WG. I made some smalltalk with her ("ni hao," gee, it's so late to be out and about, are you staying in this hotel, oh you're a local person, and so on). Then, just like that, she went ahead and confided her situation to me.
She was a married lady, and she had just had a first date with a guy she had been chatting with online for 6 months, and the date ended early because the guy had equipment failure, and now she was disappointed and ticked off about "that terrible man." As if on cue, I said, "gee, it's a bit cold out here, why don't we continue our conversation inside." We went inside and, being the good samaritan that I am, I immediately picked up where the other guy left off. This was probably my fastest-ever freebie.
I've also had several that were almost as fast (e.g., ask some silly question, walk with the girl, oh here's my hotel, let's go inside, ...). These "point blank" encounters are my favorites. Not that I'm bragging (actually, this method fails far more often than it works, e.g., the girl doesn't walk with me, or she doesn't go to my room, or once in the room she doesn't do anything, etc.). I just want to make the point that (a) it's actually possible to get results, once in a while, without the behaviors people have recommended (behaviors designed to impress the girl, excite the girl, conform to the Chinese girl's idea of a "man," etc.; so in that case, confidence is for yourself, to regard yourself positively even if the results are negative), and (b) if you want to improve your numbers, rather than saying "all you need is confidence," I'd say certain outward behaviors (as you guys have shared) are also important.
I should also add that there are some guys I've known who exhibit the "right" outward behaviors and get results with girls, but if you get to know them, you find that some of them (not most, but some) are actually quite messed up inside -- especially the alcoholics (and maybe models, but I don't know any). The point is that, for some people, outward behaviors and appearance may get results (esp. in racking up numbers) even without confidence. But of course I'd agree that you're better off with confidence than without.
SE Asia Joe
04-14-09, 09:58
I decided for the p for p and found a cute SW who spent the whole nite with me for 700 RMB. I am not sorry about my decision since it turned out ok but I will always wonder, like Robert Frost, if I should have taken the other road.
The monger in me would have opined that you should have tried to bed the Lawyer FIRST and if not succesful, and only then go for the P4P as WG - especially in china - is ALWAYS available any time!
The human being in me though makes me opine that it's NOT nice to toy with a Chinese gal's emotions just to get into her pants for the night. One night stands in the Western world is de-rigeur and not anything to stress about - but as "down-trodden" as most Chinese gals are, its' just too unequal.
Jeez, I don't mean to make myself sound so moralistic - and I certainly ain't even gonna try to proselytize - but please do let me try to explain a bit.
OK - Chinese gals also have their own agenda and yes they are not as simple minded or innocent as some Westerners think they are - but as a general rule, these gals are NOT as exposed to (and have the necessary defenses against) some of the mores of conduct that's old hat in the West; things like "the Game" or "pick-up" techniques" or even the role that "Confidence" plays in ensnaring young maidens as being discussed here.
Add to this mix the $$ inequality between the sexes in China - and how general behaviour between sexes in so predicated on this monetary inequality/how predictable Chinese gals usually are.
Now, I'll be the first one to admit that I've pulled out from this 'bag of tricks' up our sleeves to bed maidens down - but when I snare a real innocent one, I many times actually end up feeling a bit guilty about it all. Akin to a melodrama about the dirty old man compromising the modesty of a sweet young innocent thing! Yes yes yes, quite an oxymoron for a dedicated mongerer - but hell, I cain't help what I cain't help feeling can I?
NOt a real good explanation - NON? But hope you guys get my meaning and perhaps can discuss this a bit more. Hopefully this topic would satisfy Red Rock and thus allowing BnLee and I to continue pimping each other about the relative merits of the shaved/unshaved nookie.
Peace Peace Peace!!! OK????
SEAJ
Loveasiangirls
04-14-09, 17:48
The monger in me would have opined that you should have tried to bed the Lawyer FIRST and if not succesful, and only then go for the P4P as WG - especially in china - is ALWAYS available any time!
The human being in me though makes me opine that it's NOT nice to toy with a Chinese gal's emotions just to get into her pants for the night. One night stands in the Western world is de-rigeur and not anything to stress about - but as "down-trodden" as most Chinese gals are, its' just too unequal.......
SEAJ
I agree with your concept. I am more a freebie kind of guy and use P4P as backup.
I used to travel often in China and always had more girls lined up than days available. However they all knew what they were getting, I was only in town for 2-3 days then I would leave. We both understood this.
I now live in Beijing and feel I cannot do this any more. Honestly I don't ant to break their heart. They know I live here and they generally have more expectations. Until I settle with one single GF for now I never promise something that I cannot deliver. P4P is always there as my backup if needed.
I agree with your concept. I am more a freebie kind of guy and use P4P as backup.
I used to travel often in China and always had more girls lined up than days available. However they all knew what they were getting, I was only in town for 2-3 days then I would leave. We both understood this.
I now live in Beijing and feel I cannot do this any more. Honestly I don't ant to break their heart. They know I live here and they generally have more expectations. Until I settle with one single GF for now I never promise something that I cannot deliver. P4P is always there as my backup if needed.Experience has taught that free sex is always more expensive. I think of paying as like buying a license: This permits the holder: never having to say I love you, never having hear " why don't you ever take me out to a movie or dinner". Paying is not for the sex, I think of the sex as fee and what I pay for is permission leave when I am finished. This is a very cynical way look at it.
There is some reality, though.
SE Asia Joe
04-15-09, 08:58
Freebies AND paybies - I've found out that they "USUALLY" don't care if you're married or not.
To the paybies - it makes sense that they prefer married punters as less chance of problems/can always threaten to rat to the wife if the guy's giving her shit/usually more generous, gentle and pliable as they invariably compare favorably versus the missus/have less other opportunities etc etc. They even don't mind it if the guy ends up in the shit and gets divorced because of her - then she's REALLY got him by the balls!!
But the surprising thing I found out is that in China, even freebies really couldn't care less if you're married or not (or is it because I've messed with all the wrong crowd???!!!). I actually feel that they think "So what if he's married - no big deal. As far as I'm concerned, he's fair game STILL!!"
"A good divorcee is much better than a loser single" seems to be the mantra for some of these gals.
SEAJ
South Gate
04-15-09, 16:50
I agree with SEA on this one. Most, not all, of the Chinese women I have known could care less about my being married. Chinese women dont display the same kind of possessiveness that western women display about marriage. In the west, only rarely will a woman sleep with me if she knows I am married. I am someone else's property. In China, they don't care. Regarding the p for p girls, I also agree with SEA. They do sometimes try to make trouble. I was seeing a sauna girl regularly last November and having really nice GFE with her. In December, I went to the US for a few months. I told the sauna girl I would return in March. In early March, my girlfriend (not wife) moved into my apartment in Kunming a week before I arrived. My GF started getting phone calls from this sauna girl saying that the sauna girl was my fiancee and she would soon marry me. Sauna girl even had some guy call and say he was her father and wanted to talk to me about the upcoming marriage. My girl friend was cool and told him that he must have the wrong number because I was already married. It would have been bad if my wife had been in my apartment instead of my girlfriend. Life is complicated
Freebies AND paybies - I've found out that they "USUALLY" don't care if you're married or not.
To the paybies - it makes sense that they prefer married punters as less chance of problems/can always threaten to rat to the wife if the guy's giving her shit/usually more generous, gentle and pliable as they invariably compare favorably versus the missus/have less other opportunities etc etc. They even don't mind it if the guy ends up in the shit and gets divorced because of her - then she's REALLY got him by the balls!!
But the surprising thing I found out is that in China, even freebies really couldn't care less if you're married or not (or is it because I've messed with all the wrong crowd???!!!). I actually feel that they think "So what if he's married - no big deal. As far as I'm concerned, he's fair game STILL!!"
"A good divorcee is much better than a loser single" seems to be the mantra for some of these gals.
SEAJ
Freebies AND paybies. I've found out that they "USUALLY" don't care if you're married or not.
SEAJI just had a freebie tell me that I am the boss and should tell my wife that because I'm rich? I can have 2. 3. Or 4 wife's. Wife number one will just have to compete because the best one will get the best and me for the night. Wonder if I should tell the freebie she is number 4 at the moment and has a bit of work to do yet. I've been in China too long an B cup is huge.
SE Asia Joe
04-16-09, 05:57
First - apropo apologies to Red Rock - and request for him to just skip this post.
But I do want to take a parting shot at the discussion on preference for shaved vs unshaved pussy - which actually is all a matter of personal taste.... so, quite pointless to argue about.
On the other hand, have you mutilators thought about how you've affected the lives of these gals you've convinced/are going to convince to shave?
I believe you agree that MOST Chinese (and other Asians?) actually abhor White Tigers - even the natural ones which the Chinese consider extremely UNlucky to do, never mind the ones who are shaved.
The shaved ones, most Chinese would definitely avoid as they would consider these gals to be just too slutty/probably do a helluva lot of Whites/ Blacks/ Indians etc - not good enough to be able to get Chinese clients. Hate to say this - but even I do think this. NO I wouldn't throw them out as soon as I find out she's shaved, but I'd just get it on and then throw her out and I'd definitely never repeat a shaved gal.
Given the above - are you mutilators perhaps being a bit too callous by convincing them to shave? I mean, it takes at least a few weeks/month before pussy hair grow back to its natural state. What happens to her in those few weeks? I mean - you've only paid her for 1 session - and now you're gonna screw her money making ability. And if a freebie, her chances of landing a good BF/husband!!
Just IMHO
SEAJ
Seaj
That is why I prefer very horny unused wealthy trophy wives of well to do businessmen that have a tendency to work 24/7/365 and forgot what they have at home. They loves to get together with me discreetly and usually book a very nice five star hotel room for an afternoon of romp. They usually are not interested asking you to take them shopping and wanting expensive gifts. Call me cheap, but all I am interested in is getting my rocks off and so those she. These desparate rich house/trophy wives are not interested in rocking their boats at home. Hey, they should do a show on Desparate Housewives of the PRC. They are more careful that you.
I just had one of them give me a nice birthday gift, a real vacheron watch (sorry not one of the fake ones that they sell at the lowu train station- I had a jeweler friend check it out for me).
Guys, there are many lonely rich young trophy wives out there for the taking. Just make sure that the hubby does not have a mean streak or is a senior PLA member, that could get a bit dicey. Reverse the table.
Freebies AND paybies. I've found out that they "USUALLY" don't care if you're married or not.
To the paybies. It makes sense that they prefer married punters as less chance of problems/can always threaten to rat to the wife if the guy's giving her shit/usually more generous, gentle and pliable as they invariably compare favorably versus the missus/have less other opportunities etc etc. They even don't mind it if the guy ends up in the shit and gets divorced because of her. Then she's REALLY got him by the balls!
But the surprising thing I found out is that in China, even freebies really couldn't care less if you're married or not (or is it because I've messed with all the wrong crowd? ! ). I actually feel that they think "So what if he's married. No big deal. As far as I'm concerned, he's fair game STILL! "
"A good divorcee is much better than a loser single" seems to be the mantra for some of these gals.
SEAJ
You do have a point, old wise one.
I will think about changing my ways.
First - apropo apologies to Red Rock - and request for him to just skip this post.
But I do want to take a parting shot at the discussion on preference for shaved vs unshaved pussy - which actually is all a matter of personal taste.... so, quite pointless to argue about.
On the other hand, have you mutilators thought about how you've affected the lives of these gals you've convinced/are going to convince to shave?
I believe you agree that MOST Chinese (and other Asians?) actually abhor White Tigers - even the natural ones which the Chinese consider extremely UNlucky to do, never mind the ones who are shaved.
The shaved ones, most Chinese would definitely avoid as they would consider these gals to be just too slutty/probably do a helluva lot of Whites/ Blacks/ Indians etc - not good enough to be able to get Chinese clients. Hate to say this - but even I do think this. NO I wouldn't throw them out as soon as I find out she's shaved, but I'd just get it on and then throw her out and I'd definitely never repeat a shaved gal.
Given the above - are you mutilators perhaps being a bit too callous by convincing them to shave? I mean, it takes at least a few weeks/month before pussy hair grow back to its natural state. What happens to her in those few weeks? I mean - you've only paid her for 1 session - and now you're gonna screw her money making ability. And if a freebie, her chances of landing a good BF/husband!!
Just IMHO
SEAJ
I assume you were pressed for time or you would have done BOTH. For my part I would have tried my luck with the freebie. Call it a fetish if you like but screwing for me is much better when the other party is a more willing participant. We will never know if you would have scored but I think the risk was worth it. As it stands you presumably got a good session with a pro, but I would rather take the chance of etching another swastica onto my headboard.
Maybe she would not. Maybe she would be a lousy lay even if she did. The forum told about sure things. BBS girls that did BBBJ sometimes CIM, sometimes only hand jobs, sometime full service with rimming to boot but for sure I would get my rocks off that way. With the lawyer I might not even get a kiss. I had only one evening so I had to decide.
I decided for the p for p and found a cute SW who spent the whole nite with me for 700 RMB. I am not sorry about my decision since it turned out ok but I will always wonder, like Robert Frost, if I should have taken the other road.
Ok i just love asian girls. It's not my fault, i just started to feel strongly towards asian cultures since i was only 5 years old after all.
Few of my girlfriends were not asian.
I first started dating a chinese girl when i was in freshman year 8 years ago. She was 22 y/o virgin, with the maturity of a 15 Y/O caucasian by the way, but i assume most of you know about this difference. Some chinese people have a way of thining that remind me of the 50's, and it's probably where they are in terms of civilisation, economy aside.
Anyway i went out with her for 2 years and it was really cool. Educated type, not into money or aything ike that. Not planning to live abroad at any cost, oved china as well like most of the educated city girls nowadays.
But i never really loved her. She was just TOO nice, TOO sweet and TOO submissive, it got on my nerves. Dumped her. She took it pretty well, never complained to me and i am still in touch with her.
Went to Shanghai on holidays. Met 2 girls i absoluely hate :
1st one got me into a pregnancy thing, wanted me to believe she was pregnant (or maybe she was, so far i don't know). She wasn't trying to get some money actually, she kind of wanted to artificially create the family she always dreamed about. She thought being pregnant would make me become serious or propose her in some way. Anyway she was insane, I Just told her to fuck off and find a random needy 70 Y/o chinese guy which i think she did.
2nd girl is THE love story of my life. Never loved then hated someone that much. Advice to all of you : if you have something good, end it and do NEVER try to get it back.
I went t HenShan lu. Was a bit lost and tired, and at the same time ipressed by all thi shanghai experience, kind of a tornado i was taken into and little bit much of experiences for a 21 Y/O student. Met a 35 years old american girl. Strated talking, she took me outside to another bar with other American and Europpean friends. Nice people. On the dancefloor i saw a girl who suddenly appeared to me as a kind of godess, like "she's the one i've been looking for". Turned out the girl was a friend of these people. 3 days later, first date, everything in common, she had an american boyfriend before and he left because he coudln't stand china. We loved the same movies, same compter games, even occidental music etc.
Spent the most amazing week of my life, looked like a dream.
Left China in tears and sweared i'll go back there (which i'm actually going to do very soon BYW).
Saw the girl one year later in Milan. Had become a totally different person. Had a job as an air attendant, meeting al these married international buyers who took her to restaurants and bought her presents. MAde me feel really bad .
Anyway one day i was in Milan and she suddenly dumped me without notice. I Was really devastated andstarting talking bullshit, to which she responded i was immature and blabl bla, which i probably was. Anyway, Chinese girls are not all after money or a visa, expecially when they are educated because China has good perspectives right now. But sometimes they think all that glitters is gold.
Now i live with a Girl fro Dalian since 2005. No babies, no parents unhappy she wasn't a virgin anyway, no money problem (at least not when she shops @ Chanel). We have a dog, we're happy, she's good looking. Stop thinking all chinese girls are after your money or green card, try meeting girls outside passage parlors and bars for a while. Chinese girls in general are pretty much like your mum when she was 25 : thinking about marriage and children.
Anyway my current girlfriend dirves me mad for washing up and house-cleaning purposes, so i'll starting to think about leaving i'm too young for that...
South Gate
04-18-09, 09:09
There should be many more who can love like you do.
Ok i just love asian girls. It's not my fault, i just started to feel strongly towards asian cultures since i was only 5 years old after all.
Few of my girlfriends were not asian.
I first started dating a chinese girl when i was in freshman year 8 years ago. She was 22 y/o virgin, with the maturity of a 15 Y/O caucasian by the way, but i assume most of you know about this difference. Some chinese people have a way of thining that remind me of the 50's, and it's probably where they are in terms of civilisation, economy aside.
Anyway i went out with her for 2 years and it was really cool. Educated type, not into money or aything ike that. Not planning to live abroad at any cost, oved china as well like most of the educated city girls nowadays.
But i never really loved her. She was just TOO nice, TOO sweet and TOO submissive, it got on my nerves. Dumped her. She took it pretty well, never complained to me and i am still in touch with her.
Went to Shanghai on holidays. Met 2 girls i absoluely hate :
1st one got me into a pregnancy thing, wanted me to believe she was pregnant (or maybe she was, so far i don't know). She wasn't trying to get some money actually, she kind of wanted to artificially create the family she always dreamed about. She thought being pregnant would make me become serious or propose her in some way. Anyway she was insane, I Just told her to fuck off and find a random needy 70 Y/o chinese guy which i think she did.
2nd girl is THE love story of my life. Never loved then hated someone that much. Advice to all of you : if you have something good, end it and do NEVER try to get it back.
I went t HenShan lu. Was a bit lost and tired, and at the same time ipressed by all thi shanghai experience, kind of a tornado i was taken into and little bit much of experiences for a 21 Y/O student. Met a 35 years old american girl. Strated talking, she took me outside to another bar with other American and Europpean friends. Nice people. On the dancefloor i saw a girl who suddenly appeared to me as a kind of godess, like "she's the one i've been looking for". Turned out the girl was a friend of these people. 3 days later, first date, everything in common, she had an american boyfriend before and he left because he coudln't stand china. We loved the same movies, same compter games, even occidental music etc.
Spent the most amazing week of my life, looked like a dream.
Left China in tears and sweared i'll go back there (which i'm actually going to do very soon BYW).
Saw the girl one year later in Milan. Had become a totally different person. Had a job as an air attendant, meeting al these married international buyers who took her to restaurants and bought her presents. MAde me feel really bad .
Anyway one day i was in Milan and she suddenly dumped me without notice. I Was really devastated andstarting talking bullshit, to which she responded i was immature and blabl bla, which i probably was. Anyway, Chinese girls are not all after money or a visa, expecially when they are educated because China has good perspectives right now. But sometimes they think all that glitters is gold.
Now i live with a Girl fro Dalian since 2005. No babies, no parents unhappy she wasn't a virgin anyway, no money problem (at least not when she shops @ Chanel). We have a dog, we're happy, she's good looking. Stop thinking all chinese girls are after your money or green card, try meeting girls outside passage parlors and bars for a while. Chinese girls in general are pretty much like your mum when she was 25 : thinking about marriage and children.
Anyway my current girlfriend dirves me mad for washing up and house-cleaning purposes, so i'll starting to think about leaving i'm too young for that...
Sound Stream #2
04-19-09, 10:06
This is the kind of story that makes me ponder the philosophical question of freebie vs p for p. Which road should I take? The freebie is free (sort of). The p for p will cost me maybe 200 RMB or more. On my last plane trip to GZ, I sat next to a 28 year local unmarried female lawyer, very cute. We were getting off talking to each other for an hour before the plane landed and I took her phone number and told her I would call the next day. After my business on the next day, I pulled out her number from my wallet and started reading the forum. Which should I go for? The cute lawyer was only a maybe. Maybe she would. Maybe she would not. Maybe she would be a lousy lay even if she did. The forum told about sure things. BBS girls that did BBBJ sometimes CIM, sometimes only hand jobs, sometime full service with rimming to boot but for sure I would get my rocks off that way. With the lawyer I might not even get a kiss. I had only one evening so I had to decide.
You might be in for a fun treat. I dated a lawyer in the states before, and she was kinky, and very open for insane hot and rough sex. I made her beg me for sex and tell me that she's my dirty little **** and she'll do anything I want. She really liked getting tied up, slapped in the ass, and dominated.
FernandoAlonso
04-23-09, 05:16
Anyone interested in a friend in Jiujiang to contact with let me know, she wants to learn English, but I am sure also other things))
If interested PM me
FA
SE Asia Joe
04-30-09, 05:02
OK - I've heard time and time again that it never is a good thing to get too personally involved with WG's lives and problems etc. Hell - I've even said it mucho times myself!!
But I've examined my past AND PRESENT experiences - and I've gone and done "IT" myself countless times!! Scenario is - I pick a gal, do her and if I like her, I DO chat with her about anything and everything! I do enjoy "personalising" the experience - and with that comes tales of their lives, ambitions, experiences.... and problems.
The way I figure it - in China when a gal's "huge" problems can be solved so easily - either by spending a few hundred RMB's or by just making a phone call - it's not a big deal for me to help them out. But being able to deal with it by being rather standoff-ish is very important. I figure its nutso if I get all enamored about her as a GF or husband - but quite pleasant if I take the stance of an uncle or even father figure.
Gals I've treated such are so pliant and accomodating..... and most importantly - NOT demanding or expecting you to be their one and only saviour! They'll still try their own best to go out and earn their own way, and get together with you with their joys, experiences and of course problems (@#$ Ouch!) - and of course do you properly and at your own pace/time!! Nice I say.
What you guys say??
SEAJ
OK - I've heard time and time again that it never is a good thing to get too personally involved with WG's lives and problems etc. Hell - I've even said it mucho times myself!!
But I've examined my past AND PRESENT experiences - and I've gone and done "IT" myself countless times!! Scenario is - I pick a gal, do her and if I like her, I DO chat with her about anything and everything! I do enjoy "personalising" the experience - and with that comes tales of their lives, ambitions, experiences.... and problems.
The way I figure it - in China when a gal's "huge" problems can be solved so easily - either by spending a few hundred RMB's or by just making a phone call - it's not a big deal for me to help them out. But being able to deal with it by being rather standoff-ish is very important. I figure its nutso if I get all enamored about her as a GF or husband - but quite pleasant if I take the stance of an uncle or even father figure.
Gals I've treated such are so pliant and accomodating..... and most importantly - NOT demanding or expecting you to be their one and only saviour! They'll still try their own best to go out and earn their own way, and get together with you with their joys, experiences and of course problems (@#$ Ouch!) - and of course do you properly and at your own pace/time!! Nice I say.
What you guys say??
SEAJ
I have a confession to make. A few times I have fallen in love with thai working girls and the consequences were tragic on both sides. Consequently, I am now reluctant to allow myself to become emotionally involved with a working girl. Therefore, I think it is better to try to keep my mongering activities strictly in the "customer/client" mode.
Not being able to hold a proper conversation in chinese helps in this regard. I have many times met chinese working girls that i very much liked but my poor chinese language skills have probably prevented bonding.
Is it good to bond?
I met a young HK guy on the train going to HK who was sobbing about his tragic situation. He was very much in love with a pretty Shenzhen hooker who had now become his mistress and who had moved into an apartment which he really could not afford. The problem was he had a nice wife and three kids in Hk and he was neglecting them because of her.
Maybe if someone is wise with years, as is Joe, you can enjoy a close relationship without becoming "enamored."
If I am fucking a gal, talking to her romanticly and "personlising" the experience, I do not think (I) would later be capable of taking a "stance of being an uncle or even fatherly figure."
OK - I've heard time and time again that it never is a good thing to get too personally involved with WG's lives and problems etc. Hell - I've even said it mucho times myself!!
SEAJIncisive commentary. Rings a bell with me. I agree entirely.
ET
OK - I've heard time and time again that it never is a good thing to get too personally involved with WG's lives and problems etc. Hell - I've even said it mucho times myself!!
But I've examined my past AND PRESENT experiences - and I've gone and done "IT" myself countless times!!
I can give you countless cases where it worked beautifully, and countless cases where it ended in disaster. Just like in real life, where (as in America) more than 50% of the marriages end in court and in one of the most harrowing traumas in one's life, with careers and fortunes ruined and lawyers enriched.
In America and Europe, a WG officially never gets involved with a customer - which is a myth. I have a friend who operates the best and most successful - all legal - escort services in Germany, and she says that her girls falling in love and marrying customers is the greatest cause of personnel attrition.
In China, most girls have a "Pretty Woman" fantasy and dream of a (preferably rich) guy who takes her in and - preferably - marries her.
From that point on, you are taking your odds just like in real life -there are good people and bad people, there are people you can trust, and people who will cheat you. A wife from the social register of Washington, DC, can perform bigger damage to your life than a girl from a KTV in Shenzen. Been there, done that.
Asides from the cultural gap, which I don't want to address here, because it has been done at nauseam, the relationship demands a lot from the guy: He must forget - or at least don't give a damn - about the former profession of his bride. Too many guys have moral hangups, have fantasies of "rescuing" a girl, think the poor girl has to treat him as her savior for the rest of their lives. If you can't respect the girl as your equal partner, don't do it. Also, don't do it if you are worried to be found out how you met.
"How did you guys meet" is one of the most common questions. A happy couple I know, he a successful real estate developer, she a former stripper, happily answer "In a strip club." If you can do that, go for it. If you are ashamed, let it be.
I DO chat with her about anything and everything! I do enjoy "personalising" the experience
But being able to deal with it by being rather standoff-ish is very important. I figure its nutso if I get all enamored about her as a GF or husband - but quite pleasant if I take the stance of an uncle or even father figure.
Nice I say.
What you guys say??
SEAJ
I think what Joe is saying here is that he can "personalise" the experience without getting too involved, without getting "all enamored." That he can have sexual and romantic relationships, and yet play the role of uncle instead of boyfriend or husband.
And, that the girl in return will understand this, give him better service and not become too demanding.
Am I understanding him correctly?
I think what Joe is saying here is that he can "personalise" the experience without getting too involved, without getting "all enamored." That he can have sexual and romantic relationships, and yet play the role of uncle instead of boyfriend or husband.
And, that the girl in return will understand this, give him better service and not become too demanding.
Am I understanding him correctly?
Easy. We have a "personalized" relationship with a group of girls, who are actually part of the extended family. We go out to dinners. Birthday parties. A Sunday brunch. Escort them to Maggie's if needed. Works out just fine. However, they are Mongolians, who usually are more educated, more professional, and more drama-free than their Chinese sisters.
You might be in for a fun treat. I dated a lawyer in the states before, and she was kinky, and very open for insane hot and rough sex. I made her beg me for sex and tell me that she's my dirty little **** and she'll do anything I want. She really liked getting tied up, slapped in the ass, and dominated.
Just because a lawyer in the U.S. was into BDSM doesn't mean that a lawyer in GZ is into same. All they have in common is that they are lawyers. BDSM is extremely rare in China. Next door in depraved Japan is a different story.
SE Asia Joe
05-05-09, 11:15
Easy. We have a "personalized" relationship with a group of girls, who are actually part of the extended family. We go out to dinners. Birthday parties. A Sunday brunch. Escort them to Maggie's if needed. Works out just fine. However, they are Mongolians, who usually are more educated, more professional, and more drama-free than their Chinese sisters.
What you've described with your Mongolians is probably closer to what I'm talking about rather than a true "Love story" between a WG and her John.
NO - I'm not espousing true love and marriage between A WG and anybody - because love and marriage etc is already so fraught with all sorts of problems - one does NOT need to add to the equation. What I AM doing (and I guess also espousing.... a bit...!!) is to actually have a personal relationship with these gals - but one that IS NOT romantic or BF/GF, Husband/wife type etc.
I mean, just coz you're screwing a gal, don't mean you gotta fall in love with her. And just coz you like her as a person don't mean that you gotta love her like a GF or wife!! You can like her, be concerned about her, show tenderness and caring - but no necessarily romantically - right??!
Treading on thin ice I know - but if one can gingerly tread on such, methinks one can have much more fulfilling experiences than the "Wham Bam Thank You Mam" experince I (and I believe a lot of other mongers too!!) get sometimes/so many times sick and tired of.
SEAJ
Easy. We have a "personalized" relationship with a group of girls, who are actually part of the extended family. We go out to dinners. Birthday parties. A Sunday brunch. Escort them to Maggie's if needed. Works out just fine. However, they are Mongolians, who usually are more educated, more professional, and more drama-free than their Chinese sisters.
I have had the pleasure of going to Maggie's a few times and you do indeed have a bevy of fine ladies.
I was in a girly bar in ChangMai, Thailand. A young man ran into the bar and violently dragged an experienced bargirl out of the bar and forced her into a waiting tuktuk. She was screaming and he was yelling at her something about "I told you to stay out of this fucking bar!" This is the sort of situation i'm talking about. This inexperienced young fella, driven by his gonads, had become emotionally attached to this young "working" lady. Now he was in a jealous rage and no longer able to think rationally. Love clouds our thinking and arouses the passions.
As they say, "you can take the girl out of the bar, but you cannot take the bar out of the girl."
I agree with Joe that he is walking on thin ice. Maybe the ice is thinner than he thinks and he has already fallen in.
And that begs the question, how does one know when one has fallen in love? Anybody on this forum brave enough to try answering that question?
Do you guys know that song that Marlene Dietrich sung, Fallin' in Love Again, Can't Help it!
Meiguoguizi
05-07-09, 13:05
I think what Joe is saying here is that he can "personalise" the experience without getting too involved, without getting "all enamored." That he can have sexual and romantic relationships, and yet play the role of uncle instead of boyfriend or husband.
And, that the girl in return will understand this, give him better service and not become too demanding.
Am I understanding him correctly?
I can't recall which movie or novel (or bartender) once said -
As a man ages he is finally able to appreciate beautiful women without the compulsion to acquire them for his own exclusive use. They have become works of art, best left in a museum for all to enjoy.
ISG is truly an on-line course on Art Appreciation. And Carnal Knowledge is no less valid than any other academic pursuit.
Professor Joe is certainly entitled to his academic passion.
As a man ages he is finally able to appreciate beautiful women without the compulsion to acquire them for his own exclusive use.
Thank you and i agree with your sentiment.
However, despite their age and advantage of acquired knowledge, older and more mature guys can also fall in love, become enamoured, and potentially become victims of their passions. Falling in love or "becoming enamoured" is NOT something we choose to do or not to do, it is something that happens to us.
The older guy can also fall in love, become possessive, and be aroused to fits of jealousy and anger.
Fallin' in love again, can't help it!
Red Rock II
05-08-09, 06:01
Love clouds our thinking and arouses the passions.
It is so true! Sometimes I just have to talk to someone that I can trust to help me to clear my thinking. If it happens to me again, I may come here Women-Opinions and Advise seeking for help.
"The older guy can also fall in love, become possessive, and be aroused to fits of jealousy and anger." It is also true. It remind me of a movie called "Damage".
However, as a man ages, it is harder for his passion to get aroused. He still can fall in love as madly as a young guy. But it is just not as easy or as quick as a young guy.
I got into a nice scenario but did not make the most out of it. Now I report to all hopefully to ask for advice of what to do right, since I regret now I was on line 9 subway shanghai from songjiang university town back to downtown. I got on the last train, 9pm or so. After this train, virtually no more train to go back downtown. Sitting at the last car, near very last seat. I came by a lone girl sitting there. Around, there were a few passengers. I notice the girl is pretty, looks serious, and in good lavish clothes in black color. She is about 22 to my eyes, a 8-9 stunner to my book.
I guess she is a student, since this line goes to university town.
For a while, I manage to break the ice and started talking to her. She caught on real well and responded warmly. Unlike what I assumed, she is not a student any more but a hotel managerment clerk or supervisor of a hotel in songjiang town area, and she catches the train to go to her home in qibao, about 1 hour from my hotel in downtown. It means she will have to get off the train before me.
She gave me her phone number and went to sit next to me, since at first we sat opposite from each other. We talked nicely, but I soon get into thinking of what is next, so my talk was intermittent. Anyway, instinct told me to act conservatively, and next station, I happened to glance at the station name. This caused her to do likewise, and she got off the next station, qibao.
I wonder if that was my correct move, or I should have chatted her into missing the station, which she seems to do just that. Then action can be done quickly after missing her station in a hotel nearby?
Hmm I puzzled myself and consider now I miss a chance. Of course I can go back shanghai and call her in a few weeks. Hope to hear your valuable comments. Btw, I am asian american, and look like a Chinese guy.
OldAsiaHand
05-09-09, 06:23
I got into a nice scenario but did not make the most out of it. Now I report to all hopefully to ask for advice of what to do right, since I regret now I was on line 9 subway shanghai from songjiang university town back to downtown. I got on the last train, 9pm or so. After this train, virtually no more train to go back downtown. Sitting at the last car, near very last seat. I came by a lone girl sitting there. Around, there were a few passengers. I notice the girl is pretty, looks serious, and in good lavish clothes in black color. She is about 22 to my eyes, a 8-9 stunner to my book.
I guess she is a student, since this line goes to university town.
For a while, I manage to break the ice and started talking to her. She caught on real well and responded warmly. Unlike what I assumed, she is not a student any more but a hotel managerment clerk or supervisor of a hotel in songjiang town area, and she catches the train to go to her home in qibao, about 1 hour from my hotel in downtown. It means she will have to get off the train before me.
She gave me her phone number and went to sit next to me, since at first we sat opposite from each other. We talked nicely, but I soon get into thinking of what is next, so my talk was intermittent. Anyway, instinct told me to act conservatively, and next station, I happened to glance at the station name. This caused her to do likewise, and she got off the next station, qibao.
I wonder if that was my correct move, or I should have chatted her into missing the station, which she seems to do just that. Then action can be done quickly after missing her station in a hotel nearby?
Hmm I puzzled myself and consider now I miss a chance. Of course I can go back shanghai and call her in a few weeks. Hope to hear your valuable comments. Btw, I am asian american, and look like a Chinese guy.
Dumamay,
I was not there but it sounds like she was just being friendly. I reckon the chance of picking up a normal girl on the train in Shanghai is very slim. I would start to make contact now, exchange some SMS and/or emails and increase your chances of scoring when next in Shanghai.
Good Luck!
Just my POV.
OAH
Red Rock II
05-09-09, 23:11
Dumamay,
To me, it souds more than just a friendly act. In the States, people can carry a lengthy conversation with a stranger and then forget about it completely afterward. In china, people are more conservative. They don't like to talk to strangers they meet in the public place, let alone give out their cell phone numbers, especially for girls. No doubt that she likes you in some way, but to get her on your bed or a hotel bed may be more than just letting her to miss the station. So, nothing to regret about.
Chinese women become more open to casual sex for the last 20 year, but not every girl you chat up with will lead to a hot sex. Actually, the ratio is fairly low. You may see some posts here in ISG that tell the stories about how someone met a hot woman in a airplane and later in the day, they ended up in bed. To me, they are no less than lottery winners.
You may continue to communicate with her vis sms. As long as she still responses your message, there is a chance for you to get her. Next time when you are in Shanghai, if you can manage to get out for a drink or a dinner/lunch.... (good thing is you have her number!)
My point is the rules of picking up a girl is not going to be very much different whether it is in China or someplace else in the world.
It is just my 2 cents.
RR
Oah and Red Rock II
I did just that, sms her from USA. She answered nicely, and when she asked me ni bu hui da zhongwen shima, since I use pinyin to sms her, my laptop ran out of battery. I hurry to find a jack, and 15 minutes later, when I resent new smses, she stopped replying. Damn it.
Next time, I will surely go for it, missing the station into the night. Anyway, I will give her a call when I am in shanghai to test the luck out.
Thanks bros.
DMM
Dumamay,
To me, it souds more than just a friendly act. In the States, people can carry a lengthy conversation with a stranger and then forget about it completely afterward. In china, people are more conservative. They don't like to talk to strangers they meet in the public place, let alone give out their cell phone numbers, especially for girls. No doubt that she likes you in some way, but to get her on your bed or a hotel bed may be more than just letting her to miss the station. So, nothing to regret about.
Chinese women become more open to casual sex for the last 20 year, but not every girl you chat up with will lead to a hot sex. Actually, the ratio is fairly low. You may see some posts here in ISG that tell the stories about how someone met a hot woman in a airplane and later in the day, they ended up in bed. To me, they are no less than lottery winners.
You may continue to communicate with her vis sms. As long as she still responses your message, there is a chance for you to get her. Next time when you are in Shanghai, if you can manage to get out for a drink or a dinner/lunch.... (good thing is you have her number!)
My point is the rules of picking up a girl is not going to be very much different whether it is in China or someplace else in the world.
It is just my 2 cents.
RR
Yellow Fever #2
05-24-09, 14:45
I am located in Shenzhen and have been married nearly 5 years to a Chinese woman.
Any recommendations for a good lawyer to solve this problem???? I am a foreigner (of course) and I cannot speak or read Chinese...
Fortunately divorce is quick in China as long as parties agree. I just don't trust her to pay me what we agree to. Need a lawyer for advice.
Please PM me or write a message to the forum, I am sure this will be useful information for others too.
Yellow Fever #2
Clandestine782
06-05-09, 07:33
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB124415971813687173.html
By MEI FONG
XIN'AN VILLAGE, HANZHONG, China -- With no eligible women in his village, Zhou Pin, 27 years old, thought he was lucky to find a pretty bride whom he met and married within a week, following the custom in rural China.
Ten days later, Cai Niucuo vanished, leaving behind her clothes and identity papers. She did not, however, leave behind her bride price: 38,000 yuan, or about $5,500, which Mr. Zhou and his family had scrimped and borrowed to put together.
When Mr. Zhou reported his missing spouse to authorities, he found his situation wasn't unique. In the first two months of this year, Hanzhong town saw a record number of scams designed to extract high bride prices in a region with an oversupply of bachelors.
[Zhou Pin with his now-missing bride] Mei Fong/The Wall Street Journal
Zhou Pin with his now-missing bride
The fleeing Mrs. Zhou was one of 11 runaway brides -- hardly the isolated case or two that the town had seen in years past. The local phenomenon has fueled broader speculation among officials that the fast-footed wives may be part of a larger criminal ring.
"She called me soon after she left," says Mr. Zhou, a slight man with a tentative smile. He says she asked how he was doing, and apologized for the hardship she had caused. "I told her, 'I will see you again one day.' "
Thanks to its 30-year-old population-planning policy and customary preference for boys, China has one of the largest male-to-female ratios in the world. Using data from the 2005 China census -- the most recent -- a study published in last month's British Journal of Medicine estimates there was a surplus of 32 million males under the age of 20 at the time the census was taken. That's roughly the size of Canada's population.
Now some of these men have reached marriageable age, resulting in intense competition for spouses, especially in rural areas. It also appears to have caused a sharp spike in bride prices and betrothal gifts. The higher prices are even found in big cities such as Tianjin.
A study by Columbia University economist Shang-Jin Wei found that some areas in China with a high proportion of males have an above-average savings rate, even after accounting for factors such as education levels, income and life-expectancy rates. Areas with more men than women, the study notes, also have low spending rates -- suggesting that many rural Chinese may be saving up for bride prices.
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China's cultural preference for boys has resulted in a dearth of marriageable brides. Some Chinese young women are scamming rural bridegrooms by accepting proposals and betrothal payments, then absconding with the dowry. Mei Fong reports from China.
Curbing consumption in hopes of connubial pleasure is increasingly the norm in Xin'an Village, or New Peace Village, a lushly verdant spot with 14,000 people, located in central China's Shaanxi province. The village has over 30 men of marriageable age, but no single women.
As in other parts of the country, village customs dictate the groom's family pay the bride's family a set amount -- known as cai li -- while the bride furnishes a dowry of mostly simple household items.
In the 1980s, before the start of China's economic reforms, cai li sums were small.
"When I married, my husband just bought me several sets of clothes," recalls Zhang Shufen, Mr. Zhou's mother.
In the 1990s, cai li prices rose to several thousand yuan (about $200 to $400 at today's conversion rates), mirroring the country's growing prosperity. But it was only starting in 2002-03 that villagers noticed a sharp spike in cai li prices, which shot up to between 6,000 to 10,000 yuan -- several years' worth of farming income.
Not coincidentally, this was also the period when the first generation of children since the family-planning policy was launched in 1979 started reaching marriageable age.
So the normally frugal Xin'an villagers began saving even more in anticipation of rising wedding costs. While the Zhous are fairly well-off by village standards, they had been scrimping for years, growing their own vegetables and eating mainly rice and noodles, with little meat. The family had curbed spending in anticipation of wedding costs for their son who was working in southern Chinese factories. The hope was that he would return with a prospective mate in tow.
But when the younger Mr. Zhou returned home a year ago, he was still single. "In our village, when a boy is older than 24, 25, it is a shame on him for not marrying," says his mother.
Last December a family friend told his mother that her nephew recently married a girl from neighboring Sichuan province. The bride had three female friends visiting her, who might be interested in marrying local men, said this friend.
Encouraged, Mr. Zhou and his mother met the three girls the next day. After an hour's chat with the trio, who claimed to be ages 23, 25 and 27, Mr. Zhou found himself drawn to the prettiest and youngest, Ms. Cai, who had angular features and an ivory complexion.
He proposed marriage. She agreed, with one proviso: cai li of 38,000 yuan, or roughly five years' worth of farm income. The Zhous agreed, but took the precaution of running a quick background check. Tang Yunshou, Xin'an's Communist Party secretary, said Ms. Cai's identity and residential papers checked.
Three days later the couple registered their union at the local registrar's office. They posed for studio shots, with the bride in a creamy satin gown, the groom in a tuxedo. In one shot, they wear traditional garb, the bride pretending to light a string of firecrackers. Mr. Zhou mugs a grimace, hands to his ears.
They held the wedding banquet a week later, on Jan. 4, where Mr Zhou's mother formally handed over the dowry -- half of it loans from family members -- to a woman she believed to be Ms. Cai's cousin.
The new bride took up residence with her in-laws, and quickly found favor with her diligent and respectful ways, said Mrs. Zhou. "I treated her better than my own daughter," she said. A red electric scooter, with ribbons on the handles, sits in the living room, a wedding present for Ms. Cai.
Matrimony was catching. Two neighbors sought Ms. Cai out, and asked her to act as matchmaker for their sons. Ms. Cai recommended two girls within a few days. The neighbors each paid 40,000 yuan in cai li.
On Jan. 28, all these brides vanished, leaving the villagers reeling.
While there are no nationwide statistics, wedding scams have occurred before, but usually isolated cases. Mr. Tang, Xin'an's Communist Party secretary, says he has never before seen such clusters of cases. Most of the 11 families involved lost an average of 40,000 yuan. Officials consider these to be fraud cases. So if caught, the women could serve jail time, according to police.
Meanwhile, Mr. Zhou is still lovelorn. "I feel I can't hate her," says the deserted husband, who is now so depressed his parents have forbidden him to leave the village, as he longs to. "She must have her own troubles."
—Gao Sen contributed to this article.
Write to Mei Fong at mei.fong@wsj.com
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB124415971813687173.html
By MEI FONG
XIN'AN VILLAGE, HANZHONG, China -- With no eligible women in his village, Zhou Pin, 27 years old, thought he was lucky to find a pretty bride whom he met and married within a week, following the custom in rural China.
Ten days later, Cai Niucuo vanished, leaving behind her clothes and identity papers. She did not, however, leave behind her bride price: 38,000 yuan,
"I feel I can't hate her," says the deserted husband, who is now so depressed his parents have forbidden him to leave the village, as he longs to. "She must have her own troubles."
—Gao Sen contributed to this article.
Write to Mei Fong at mei.fong@wsj.comThis is sad. These folks are so naive and so desperate to find a wife ASAP, and they t rush into something stupid. Stealing money from the pooor? This country is seriousely starting to change its way of life, but some still think the old way and are easy targets.
Fast Eddie 48
06-16-09, 04:28
I am located in Shenzhen and have been married nearly 5 years to a Chinese woman.
Any recommendations for a good lawyer to solve this problem???? I am a foreigner (of course) and I cannot speak or read Chinese...
Fortunately divorce is quick in China as long as parties agree. I just don't trust her to pay me what we agree to. Need a lawyer for advice.
Please PM me or write a message to the forum, I am sure this will be useful information for others too.
Yellow Fever #2Yellow,
I not sure what kind of divorce settlement your wife want or there are kid invole, if you want a good lawyer go to HK for advice most law firm have office in China also, it is good to be single again happy for you.
Fast Eddie 48
I never been to china but they say that there is a sex imbalance.
By 2020 anywhere from 20-40 million Chinese men will stay single because not enough girls.
I am curious because it is 2009 and there is sex imbalance even now in China from what some of my friends tell me.
I also here that white guys do very well in CHina and have no trouble getting the girls. If white guys in China are getting girls left and right won't local Chinese guys get [CodeWord140] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord140) and start cock blocking or something.
Sorry if this is a stupid question but I am curious.
Clandestine782
06-23-09, 07:47
I never been to china but they say that there is a sex imbalance.
By 2020 anywhere from 20-40 million Chinese men will stay single because not enough girls.
I am curious because it is 2009 and there is sex imbalance even now in China from what some of my friends tell me.
I also here that white guys do very well in CHina and have no trouble getting the girls. If white guys in China are getting girls left and right won't local Chinese guys get [CodeWord140] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord140) and start cock blocking or something.
Sorry if this is a stupid question but I am curious.There IS a sex imbalance even now. And a really rough one. The one child policy was instituted in 1979, and so the overall sex ratio of the country includes people born before that time (in which the sex ratio was less unbalanced than it is now). Based on working in high schools, I would say that the ratio for people that are born after the 1 child policy (which includes people who are teenagers today) is something like 130-135:100.
There is a great book by Valerie Hudson called "Bare Branches." She demonstrates that no country over 120:100 has ever been stable (and this includes China in the past). It also gives you an idea of what happens. Too many men who can't find women in a country is a reason for it to collapse/ have excessively high crime rates.
There IS a sex imbalance even now. And a really rough one. The one child policy was instituted in 1979, and so the overall sex ratio of the country includes people born before that time (in which the sex ratio was less unbalanced than it is now). Based on working in high schools, I would say that the ratio for people that are born after the 1 child policy (which includes people who are teenagers today) is something like 130-135:100.
Absolute, utter, unadulterated bunk, as a look at http://www.nationmaster.com/country/ch/Age_distribution (2010 data) will prove in 5 seconds.
If you are "working" i.e. teaching at High Schools, you should seek other employment right now before you cause more damage.
The male/female ratio in the 15year and younger age group in China is 1.13 to 1. It's a little high, but not alarmingly so. Switzerland has 1.08 to 1, and nobody doubts its stability. The world average is at around 1.05 to 1. Nature simply produces more males than females. OTOH, male life expectancy is shorter than females. Nature makes up for that.
Two years ago, the male/female ratio at birth peaked a bit in China, only to decline thereafter. This should not interest you, unless you want to have sex with babies.
The slight imbalance in China is caused by two factors:
1.) Selective abortions in the big cities (you need to have money to be able to afford the ultrasound and medical costs.) Now against the law.
2.) The rampant underreporting of female babies in the villages. Farmers often continue to have babies until a male offspring is produced, who will then be registered in the hukou. Females live off the books.
These alarmist reports are not based on science. But they just won't die. As all correspondents on this forum can attest, there is no shortage of females. (Actually, a lot of them are those "off the books" girls.)
I think the truth is that if you are well educated, have a good job or wealth, you will not have a problem finding a wife.
If you are a dirty farmer, poor and with no real future, you will have a problem finding a wife regardless of how many women there are per man.
This fact is true in any where in the world.
I think the truth is that if you are well educated, have a good job or wealth, you will not have a problem finding a wife.
If you are a dirty farmer, poor and with no real future, you will have a problem finding a wife regardless of how many women there are per man.
This fact is true in any where in the world.
Csun: This is true, especially in China. Girls are leaving the villages and head for the cities. There are small villages empty of girls of marriageable age. Not because they don't exist. Because they have left.
Csun: This is true, especially in China. Girls are leaving the villages and head for the cities. There are small villages empty of girls of marriageable age. Not because they don't exist. Because they have left.
I don't know if it is true, but I heard in Russia, Thailand and the Philippines, it's the other way around. women out number the men. There are many old maids in Thailand, Russian and the Philippines. There are many dating services in these countries with pictures of females looking for husbands. In these countries there's not a real problem like China for men finding females.
There was a documentary by National Geographic called, "China lost Girls". It was made by Lisa Ling. She now doing time in Korean. It talked about the effects of the gov't's one child policy. It is estimated there are about 40-50 million more males than females.
There was also something on linktv on the huge disparity of males to females in China. The program was called, "Looking for China Girl".
http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showpost.php?p=489536&postcount=1604
Looking for China Girl
Twenty-five years ago, to stop the country's spiraling birth rate, China's communist government decreed that couples should have just one child. And influenced by Chinese tradition, couples usually want a son and not a daughter.
According to official figures, about 117 boys are born for every 100 girls. Many reasons have been given for the fact that more boys are born than girls, including selective abortion or infanticide, under-reporting of female births and adoption.
This World follows 24-year-old Xinhau Lu, who still lives with his parents on a small farm in rural China, on his search for a wife. "In my current situation, no girl would be interested in marrying me," he says. So in an anxious mission to find work and attract a bride, Xinhau travels 860 miles to Beijing.
Others, however, are not as scrupulous as Xinhau. Some young women across China are being kidnapped and sold as brides. We speak to Qing, only 16 years old when she was snatched and forced to live with a desperate bachelor. And in China's cities there is also a new breed of girl like Shao Ying, who have made successful careers and are enjoying the single life. These are the personal stories of a modern demographic crisis. Can China stop itself from becoming a bachelor society?
http://www.linktv.org/programs/looking
EDIT: by Blee2, Laura Ling is doing time NOT Lisa Ling. thks for the correction
There was a documentary called, "China lost Girls". It was made by Lisa Ling. She now doing time in Korean. It talked about the effects of the gov't's one child policy. It is estimated there are about 40-50 million more males than females.
There was also something on linktv on the huge disparity of males to females in China. The program was called, "Looking for China Girl".
http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showpost.php?p=489536&postcount=1604Weelock,
You got the wrong "Ling". It is Laura Ling that is doing hard times in North Korea. Lisa remains frees as long as you stay away from North Korea's borders.
There was also something on linktv on the huge disparity of males to females in China. The program was called, "Looking for China Girl".
Instead of going to linktv, I would recommend more reliable sources. Nationmaster is based on the CIA factbook. They are not necessarily sympathetic to China's cause, but usually reliable.
For a completely unbiased look, go to the United Nations: http://unstats.un.org/unsd/demographic/products/indwm/tab1a.htm
By perusing the data, you'll see that there is nothing unusual about China. There are countries with many more men, and countries with many more women. One may understand that the Vatican only has 51 women to 100 men. But the UAE - holy cow, only 48 women per 100 guys. Didn't we think they keep them by the score in harems? Whole Saudi appears to be devoid of females. Seen a TV program about that? Small countries, you say? Look at India. Fewer women per men than China. Does India have a one child policy?
According to the United Nations, there are 23 countries that have fewer women per men than China. Nobody makes an issue out of it. Ever seen a video on linktv about Greenland falling apart, due to the fact that it has only 81 women to 100 men?
There are 136 countries on the planet that have more women than men. Anybody making movies about the plight of lonely women?
Hard data to the contrary, the story of the big Chinese gender gap returns with regularity, intermixed with lurid stories about infanticide, forced abortions, and stories about sex starved males who could riot in the streets. Don't you think someone has an agenda? There seems to be an odd obsession about Chinese guys not getting a girl. Ever heard stories about sex starved Arabs taking to the streets? At a rate of one female for two guys, they sure would have reason to.
This discussion - we've had them before - was started by one post wonder Chanta, who, by his own admission, has never been in China, but who spouts drivel with racist undertones. Me thinks, he's been here before, under different names.
Also, by his own admission, he thinks his might be a stupid question. He's right on that.
Zhuren,
No need to get heated. Just a curious question. From seeing what the media is showing that there will be sex imbalance in china just wanted to see guys who been in China (you are right I never been there that is why I am asking .) just how bad it is.
No need to flame and you are wrong this is my first post.
Zhuren,
No need to get heated. Just a curious question. From seeing what the media is showing that there will be sex imbalance in china just wanted to see guys who been in China (you are right I never been there that is why I am asking .) just how bad it is.
.
We are sensitive to these "curious" questions. If they are honest, then they can be easily answered by a little googling and by going to solid sources.
"If white guys in China are getting girls left and right won't local Chinese guys get [CodeWord140] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord140) and start cock blocking or something," has racist undertones and is trolling for dissent.
If you are so interested in gender balance, why don't you do some studies of your own. This is not a good place. Unless it's hands-on studies.
Anyway my current girlfriend dirves me mad for washing up and house-cleaning purposes, so i'll starting to think about leaving i'm too young for that...Before anything else, try to explain these thoughts to her? Give her a chance to decide on what she is willing to "accept" for the sake of the relation/friendship. Hiring a maid probably isn't a big problem. If money is, getting an eager english student to do the work for free/cheap should be easy, if s/he gets some free english conversation practice.
Not claiming thats THE way to do it, neither knowing you wouldn't have done something similiar anyway.
Have and give good life
(usable sentence/wish?)
Before anything else, try to explain these thoughts to her? Give her a chance to decide on what she is willing to "accept" for the sake of the relation/friendship. Hiring a maid probably isn't a big problem. If money is, getting an eager english student to do the work for free/cheap should be easy, if s/he gets some free english conversation practice.
Not claiming thats THE way to do it, neither knowing you wouldn't have done something similiar anyway.
Have and give good life
(usable sentence/wish?)Well I tried to talk about it. But the feedback I got was I have to change change. In short, I have to change, but she is not willing to chaneg anything since I am wrong. I did try to help with housework, but whatever I do I will not do it the good way because I'm not really into it. I thought about hiring someone, but she said it's a waste of money and we can do it ourselves. When I use the washing machine or leave a light on, she starts to talk about saving the planet.
She's really extreme. I can live with it, but I don't think I can build a family with someone that rigid. And if I want to spend some of the money I earn to have someone help me, and by doing so helping this person earn money, I don't really see where the problem is.
SO we look like Homer Simpson and an army general who joined grenpeace live together. Frankly, does that look possible to you?
an important cause of bad breath in chinese women (and, presumably, men, though i have never been in bed with any ... ... ) is their eating of members of the allium (onion) family. this includes, of course, garlic, leeks, yang cong (foreign! cong), chives, spring onions, shallots ... ...
from time to time members of the china forum understandably complain about bad breath on their female companions.
the solution is fairly simple - ask her (insist, if necessary) that she clean her teeth with toothpaste and toothbrush, and scrape her tongue with the brush. an additional backup solution is to give her mints (or similar)!
often, prevention is better! at the ktv when the uncooked cloves of garlic come around, just send them back! (just joking!)
all this happened to me last year: rather than gag on the sulphurous emissions, i took the lead, cleaned my teeth, ripped open a 2nd hotel toothbrush, and politely offered it. worked a treat!!
just my experience.
p13
AsianLover
07-09-09, 15:46
I have a Chinese friend. We just started dating, but she is already saying "Wo ai ni" to me after only a few dates. I know that this translates to: I love you.
But my question is, in China does this phrase have the "exact" same meaning as in English, with the same devotion, exclusivity and burdens. Or does it mean something less dramatic and less deep?
I would love the opinion from any expatriates living in China. Thanks.
AL
It depends on the situation realy. Some WG's use it to give you a more appreciated, "special" feeling, and use it to get you to become a regular. Sometimes they will start to call you "Lao Gong" (Husband) on the 2nd time you have her, for the same reason. Just be sure to call her "Xiao Lao Po" (2nd wife) and not "Lao Po" (wife) as a reply.
If this is just a regular Chinese girl. Then expect this to be geniune. As a matter off fact most of the time it has even a stronger feeling then the way we use it in the West.
Some good read-up on Chinese women and the difference between the Chinese and western culture can be found at: http://middlekingdomlife.com/guide/dating-sex-relationships-China.htm
I have a Chinese friend. We just started dating, but she is already saying "Wo ai ni" to me after only a few dates. I know that this translates to: I love you.
But my question is, in China does this phrase have the "exact" same meaning as in English, with the same devotion, exclusivity and burdens. Or does it mean something less dramatic and less deep?
I would love the opinion from any expatriates living in China. Thanks.
AL
Loveasiangirls
07-09-09, 20:12
I have a Chinese friend. We just started dating, but she is already saying "Wo ai ni" to me after only a few dates. I know that this translates to: I love you.
But my question is, in China does this phrase have the "exact" same meaning as in English, with the same devotion, exclusivity and burdens. Or does it mean something less dramatic and less deep?
I would love the opinion from any expatriates living in China. Thanks.
AL
Yes it does. I like you is not the same words. Actually it can also mean "I love your money"; "I love your passport" or "I love your big c**k"
Well I tried to talk about it. But the feedback I got was I have to change change. In short, I have to change, but she is not willing to chaneg anything since I am wrong. I did try to help with housework, but whatever I do I will not do it the good way because I'm not really into it. I thought about hiring someone, but she said it's a waste of money and we can do it ourselves. When I use the washing machine or leave a light on, she starts to talk about saving the planet.
She's really extreme. I can live with it, but I don't think I can build a family with someone that rigid. And if I want to spend some of the money I earn to have someone help me, and by doing so helping this person earn money, I don't really see where the problem is.
SO we look like Homer Simpson and an army general who joined grenpeace live together. Frankly, does that look possible to you?
My opinion is that if you are not having fun living with her then just move on. Life is too short, you should enjoy it with the person you are with. Plus the longer you wait, the harder it will be to break up (without causing a big mess).
China Maverick
07-10-09, 03:32
i have another way to address this challenge: i carry a backup of mouth freshners: mints, chewing gums etc and generously offer to them - this works beautifully for the short time that they would be with me!
cm
an important cause of bad breath in chinese women (and, presumably, men, though i have never been in bed with any ... ... ) is their eating of members of the allium (onion) family. this includes, of course, garlic, leeks, yang cong (foreign! cong), chives, spring onions, shallots ... ...
from time to time members of the china forum understandably complain about bad breath on their female companions.
the solution is fairly simple - ask her (insist, if necessary) that she clean her teeth with toothpaste and toothbrush, and scrape her tongue with the brush. an additional backup solution is to give her mints (or similar)!
often, prevention is better! at the ktv when the uncooked cloves of garlic come around, just send them back! (just joking!)
all this happened to me last year: rather than gag on the sulphurous emissions, i took the lead, cleaned my teeth, ripped open a 2nd hotel toothbrush, and politely offered it. worked a treat!!
just my experience.
p13
It depends on the situation really. Some WG's use it to give you a more appreciated, "special" feeling, and use it to get you to become a regular. Sometimes they will start to call you "Lao Gong" (Husband) on the 2nd time you have her, for the same reason. Just be sure to call her "Xiao Lao Po" (2nd wife) and not "Lao Po" (wife) as a reply.
True. That's lesson #1 to be learned for the newcomer. A western WG might do unspeakable acts (for the right amount of money) except
- Kiss you on the mouth
- Mention "love."
(Exceptions to both rules apply, as always.)
By contrast, my first words I learned in Chinese were "Wo Ai Ni" - taught by a pro. She also kissed. While "Xiao Lao Po" is definitely more advisable than the vanilla Lao Po, XLP still carries connotations of a paid apartment and a monthly stipend - discretion advised.
If this is just a regular Chinese girl. Then expect this to be genuine. As a matter of fact most of the time it has even a stronger feeling then the way we use it in the West.
Also sage advice. Amongst civilians, especially in the US, "I love you" has become a commodity item. It's used between casual friends, family members, even between strictly heterosexual buddies. With a regular girl in China, it means you love her, and you have sincere intentions to make her your Lao Po. Not the Xiao variety. Warning signs: Trips to the photo-shop. Meetings with the family. Red alert: Meeting with the grandmother.
If you want it really complicated, go to Japan. There are a myriad of finely nuanced ways to put your affection into words, and according to lore, you usually don't. The most daring expression is "ai shiteru." It is - or at least was - rarely used. This is changing a bit amongst the younger generation. If a Japanese woman whispers "ai shiteru" (in private, she would never in public,) then better head to Tiffany's.
China Expat
07-10-09, 08:38
Some good read-up on Chinese women and the difference between the Chinese and western culture can be found at: http://middlekingdomlife.com/guide/dating-sex-relationships-China.htmThank you for that link. This has to be the best and most useful information I have read about Chinese women.
Starchild2012
07-10-09, 17:46
Instead of going to linktv, I would recommend more reliable sources. Nationmaster is based on the CIA factbook. They are not necessarily sympathetic to China's cause, but usually reliable.
For a completely unbiased look, go to the United Nations: http://unstats.un.org/unsd/demographic/products/indwm/tab1a.htm
By perusing the data, you'll see that there is nothing unusual about China. There are countries with many more men, and countries with many more women. One may understand that the Vatican only has 51 women to 100 men. But the UAE - holy cow, only 48 women per 100 guys. Didn't we think they keep them by the score in harems? Whole Saudi appears to be devoid of females. Seen a TV program about that? Small countries, you say? Look at India. Fewer women per men than China. Does India have a one child policy?
According to the United Nations, there are 23 countries that have fewer women per men than China. Nobody makes an issue out of it. Ever seen a video on linktv about Greenland falling apart, due to the fact that it has only 81 women to 100 men?
There are 136 countries on the planet that have more women than men. Anybody making movies about the plight of lonely women?
Hard data to the contrary, the story of the big Chinese gender gap returns with regularity, intermixed with lurid stories about infanticide, forced abortions, and stories about sex starved males who could riot in the streets. Don't you think someone has an agenda? There seems to be an odd obsession about Chinese guys not getting a girl. Ever heard stories about sex starved Arabs taking to the streets? At a rate of one female for two guys, they sure would have reason to.
This discussion - we've had them before - was started by one post wonder Chanta, who, by his own admission, has never been in China, but who spouts drivel with racist undertones. Me thinks, he's been here before, under different names.
Also, by his own admission, he thinks his might be a stupid question. He's right on that.
Excellant post Zhuran...We need more analytical and indepth post with facts like yours.
Add to that...No body will ever debate on why their are more prisoners in America than in China.
Not to speak of countless single moms, teen pregnancies, addiction...generally the whole insanity called American values and culture...its been a long time since, anything productive have come out of the west.
YET, they have plenty of time to figure and riducle the asian way of life.
90% of what we read on the internet is ministry of propaganda.
oops..sorry, I'm wroung...blame it on the North koreans for all the problems of the world. :)
Its useless telling Americans and westeners the value of Chinese or Asian women.
They will use them and then throw them away..look how low they speak of Thai women now a days, those were the same guys who 10 years ago went mad over Thai women..Now it seems they have figured everything about Asia and they got bored with it.
Chinese women seems to be the new flovour of the decade it seems for western men now a days.
ohh no ...Dont raise the price for rest of us.......when you start hearing these words often know that the end has come for Chinese women too.
Thanks for the assist. I'm rather alone here on that topic. Myth busting is always harder than repeating the same trite cliches. I lived in a lot of places in this world. I like it here, and I like to see people treated with respect.
Excellant post Zhuran...We need more analytical and indepth post with facts like yours.
Add to that...No body will ever debate on why their are more prisoners in America than in China.
Not to speak of countless single moms, teen pregnancies, addiction...generally the whole insanity called American values and culture...its been a long time since, anything productive have come out of the west.
YET, they have plenty of time to figure and riducle the asian way of life.
90% of what we read on the internet is ministry of propaganda.
oops..sorry, I'm wroung...blame it on the North koreans for all the problems of the world. :)
Its useless telling Americans and westeners the value of Chinese or Asian women.
They will use them and then throw them away..look how low they speak of Thai women now a days, those were the same guys who 10 years ago went mad over Thai women..Now it seems they have figured everything about Asia and they got bored with it.
Chinese women seems to be the new flovour of the decade it seems for western men now a days.
ohh no ...Dont raise the price for rest of us.......when you start hearing these words often know that the end has come for Chinese women too.
SO we look like Homer Simpson and an army general who joined greenpeace live together. Frankly, does that look possible to you?
Time to move on. It never gets better.
You are lucky if it's great in the beginning and stays great.
If it starts bad, it always gets worse.
Time to move on. It never gets better.
You are lucky if it's great in the beginning and stays great.
If it starts bad, it always gets worse.Yeah that's the feeling i get. Gets worse.
Thank you for that link. This has to be the best and most useful information I have read about Chinese women.
Don't take everything you read there at face value. While the information is well researched, documented, and updated, some material there can be quite dated. China is changing more rapidly than any website can keep up with.
Eyebrow777
07-11-09, 14:14
Absolute, utter, unadulterated bunk, as a look at http://www.nationmaster.com/country/ch/Age_distribution (2010 data) will prove in 5 seconds.
<snip>
These alarmist reports are not based on science. But they just won't die. As all correspondents on this forum can attest, there is no shortage of females. (Actually, a lot of them are those "off the books" girls.)Zhuren,
Thanks for your informative posts.
E
China Expat
07-11-09, 20:06
China is changing more rapidly than any website can keep up with.As a general rule I would agree with you but I'd say that the information across those eight sections is valid and, as you pointed out, very well researched and documented. At least it jives with my personal observations and experiences with Chinese women over the past eight years in China.
In particular, the two sections on the psychology of Chinese women and narcissism are extremely valuable for anyone thinking about having a real relationship with a Chinese girl.
Thanks for your informative posts.
Buyongxie!
Tightway,
I second the motion. You are always welcome to post your POV on this forum provided you do so according to the set guidelines.
I have a question for you. How any regular girls do you think you would score if you were completely straight up with them? I mean to tell them from the start that you only want to do them and move on rather than feeding them bull and giving them false hopes of looking for a g/f, getting married, foreign passport, taking them out of their misery, etc. I guess some guys will do whatever it takes to get laid for free, but I cannot con them the way you do.
I remember the day we met and went to KTV. Did you pay that KTV girl you left with or feed her the same bull to get her to do you for free? How would you like it if someone came to China and asked you to do some work for them here only to find out later that they left the country, did not pay you and never contacted you again after the work was done? Is this not the same scenario as doing a P4P girl and not paying her?
I get my share of regular girls, albeit not the numbers that you do, but I am always upfront with them from the start about my situation and intentions. I sleep better that way.
Just my POV.
OAH
I have not been on the forum for a long time. I just saw this post.
The girl you saw me with at the KTV went back with me to shanghai. And i did not feed her any "bull". Nor do I any of the other girls.
She wanted to go back to the hotel with me that night, and she said she is not going with me for the money. If you can not believe it, because it is out of your realm of experience than I can not change your opinion. And I dont really care what anybody believes. I know what is true.
I am always HONEST and dont push any girl to do anything. If I like a girl I dont see her as cattle, and I dont treat her that way. So thats why some girls appreciate my company.
I have lots of more freebie-stories to tell. The XiaoJie-Freebies are an exeption, because I almost never go to XiaoJies anyway. I dont need to, and I prefer Freebies with true feeling, and real eye to eye, person to person contact. But I got the feeling that my wealth of experience deserves an other audience, than in a XiaoJie Forum, which i almost never come to anyway.
Peace.
No to all that - but yes I've talked to a few of the gals he managed to bag - and they invariably were all starry eyed and ever so pliant in his hands. Nothing surprising in all this you say? Well, howzabout this - one of the gals who fits the above description, he had met her at the Peninsula KTV - and that evening, she was the ultimate hardened Pro - to the point that I told Tightway that he's really got his hands full that evening. His answer? No, but I really really like her and I will do anything to get to know her better.
I mean - the guy was - and I guess still is - totally striaghtforward with me and with them. I guess that's part of his "Charm" AND NO - I do NOT condone his actions at all! I keep on reminding him that for him to try to fall in love - or get the gal to fall for him, WHEN SHE IS A WG (whether KTV, BBS, or Sauna) is just NOT fair and is like shooting fish in a barrel. But the thing about it all is that Tightway truly believes that he is going to be able to find his true love - whether she is presently a WG or not. Amazing! and I KNOW you guys think that I must be an idiot for believing Tightway. But hell, as you would say OAH, this is only my POV!
And by the way, that calling the police - actually it was Tightway who called the police. He had "courted" the gal whilst emphasising several times that he is only after true love and NOT going to pay (according to him, yes true, but methinks this is not a lie), and when it was time to part, she then asked him for $$. Typical Tightway, he refusesdto pay - telling her over and over again - hey, I already told you that we are going to make love becasue we both want to make love - and there's no question about $$. She then threatened him, begged him... and then started to tear up his clothing and threatening to tear it all up unless he paid her. Which was when tightway called the Police. YES - can you believe this guy - he actually called the police and complained..... and the police actually removed the gal. Amazing!!
SEAJ
On the other hand, I did also hear about some of the "shit" he got into in the Zhuhai Saunas - nasty there I heard.
Interesting, what goes on when I am not watching the forum!
I think it is a strange waste of time to spent time in this forum and reply to wrong accusations. This is not my normal world and life, and it is not really important.
But,....well, I guess I will react to this, because it bugs me nonetheless:
First of all, I think there is a lot of jealousy going around, since I posted a report that I had sex with 10 freebies in 2 weeks in Zhuhai. Since than some people cant forget this and also can not stop pounding on me because of this little thing. Always trying to question my methods of how I get to know girls, because they cant figure out why they cant do this themselves. They suspect that there must be some kind of weird thing going on, if someone can get so many girls. I dont think this is anything special, and I am not really paying attention to this either. I dont get my selfconfidence from my relationship or success with girls. But there are still about 5 people in this mongering forum that cant let go. I guess I should have considered the personalities and lifes of the people that frequent this kind of a forum, before I report about daily successful freebie sex experiences so openly.
The guys who are critizising are those who can not get freebies in a normal way. Even their "freebies" want to be paid in some way, like giving them money after they are being fu....ed. Like OHA said, that he is giving some money to his freebies. Well, let me tell you a secret, this is not a freebie! If a "normal" girl is taking some money from you than they are meeting you for the money. Or which normal girl will not feel offended, if a guy gives her money for sex???
If you think its normal to give a normal girl money for giving you sex, and if you think that an average girl would not feel offended by it, than you are living for too long in the mongering prositution world, my friends....
People who are daily in this forum are guys who must pay sex. This is very clear.
They would probably not pay for sex if they could get it for free more often and with more girls. So I can understand their jealousy. Still, I got a lot of positive PMs after my report. Guys who told me that they agree with me. They were all secretly PMed me for fear that they themselfes might be critisized and witch hunted in the forum for being pro freebie, and for talking about how they are getting lots of freebies.
If you can get freebies, than you are lucky. If not than you can pay. As long it is mutual and agreed upon before, it is ok.
I think that a girl can pay me as much as I can pay her for sex, if it is mutual. I give her as much pleasure, or even more, as or than she gives me.
So, freebies are not there to be paid. Or they are just hobby hookers.
Of course people can always help each other if it is honest. I always try to make every experience as beautiful for the girl as I want it to be for me.
Now here some answers to the heated accusations of certain longtime forum mongers.
1.)
QUOTE:
"[QUOTE=SE Asia Joe]No to all that - but yes I've talked to a few of the gals he managed to bag - and they invariably were all starry eyed and ever so pliant in his hands. Nothing surprising in all this you say? Well, howzabout this - one of the gals who fits the above description, he had met her at the Peninsula KTV - and that evening, she was the ultimate hardened Pro - to the point that I told Tightway that he's really got his hands full that evening. His answer? No, but I really really like her and I will do anything to get to know her better.
I mean - the guy was - and I guess still is - totally striaghtforward with me and with them. I guess that's part of his "Charm" AND NO - I do NOT condone his actions at all! I keep on reminding him that for him to try to fall in love - or get the gal to fall for him, WHEN SHE IS A WG (whether KTV, BBS, or Sauna) is just NOT fair and is like shooting fish in a barrel. But the thing about it all is that Tightway truly believes that he is going to be able to find his true love - whether she is presently a WG or not. Amazing! and I KNOW you guys think that I must be an idiot for believing Tightway. But hell, as you would say OAH, this is only my POV!"
ANSWER:
I really dont think you know any of my girls. Except the one that you met at the KTV. You never met any other ones, and I did not tell anyone about them.
You only talked and tried to fumble the beautiful girl from the KTV with the huge tits. You tried to "steal her away" from me, but could not, because she'd rather be with me.
I also never said on the first evening that I liked her. You liked her, and tried to get her! I, on the other hand, said that she is a pro and that I am kind of afraid of her on first sight. I dont like those experienced hardened pros. But later, when i got to know her, than I said that I really liked her. She is one of the 2 most intelligent girls I have ever met. You, EAJ, tried to get her for yourself, and even asked me if you could do her after me, because you still kept thinking about her even after a few days had past.
So, for the record, after the KTV she went back with me together to the room, and than with me together to shanghai. And, except the before agreed Ktv sitting fee and my extra tip to her, of course there was never any other money involved. She enjoyed her time as much with me as i did with her. She did not want money from me from the beginning. She even refused to take the sitting fee. The first week after that evening we did not have sex for 5 days, because she had her period. But we still met all the time. When I went to an other Ktv I called her to come, and did not choose an other girl. She and me had a good time together. And she even paid some stuff for me as I also paid some stuff for her. It was very equal. She is very very intelligent and selfconfident, and nobody will cheat her out of anything. (Just in cast some of you nonbelievers want to accuse me again of taking advantage of a "poor soul".) As you told me after 1 week after the KTV night (and not on the same first KTV night), she is also a hardened pro. But she never tried to cheat money from me. But I know she cheated lots of other guys (rich chinese BFs) before, big time!
QUOTE:
"And by the way, that calling the police - actually it was Tightway who called the police. He had "courted" the gal whilst emphasising several times that he is only after true love and NOT going to pay (according to him, yes true, but methinks this is not a lie), and when it was time to part, she then asked him for $$. Typical Tightway, he refusesdto pay - telling her over and over again - hey, I already told you that we are going to make love becasue we both want to make love - and there's no question about $$. She then threatened him, begged him... and then started to tear up his clothing and threatening to tear it all up unless he paid her. Which was when tightway called the Police. YES - can you believe this guy - he actually called the police and complained..... and the police actually removed the gal. Amazing!!"
ANSWER:
I dont know where you got that from. The girl was not taken away by the police! She went home after the talk! The police, the girl and me had a normal conversation. Why should I not call the police, if someone is threatening me. The police is there to help. I did nothing wrong, and if I did than i would certainly not call the police. She is the one who tried to rip me off!
I offered to give her 700 RMB, although it was very clear before that there would be no money involved. But she wanted to have more money (1500 to be exact), and 700 was not enough for her for just one pop and the rest sleeping until 12AM and than go out to eat. I told her, that she wants to rip me off because I am a foreigner. We did not even spent half a night starting from 4AM, when we met, popping once, and than soundly sleeping until 12AM."
What do you mean: "Typical Tightway, he refuses to pay!" When did I ever refuse to pay?!!? I refused only this one cheater-girl to give her more money. When she did not want to let me go for 2 and a half hours on the street, threatening me of calling some bad guy, than I told her for about 1 hour that I will call the police for help, if she does not let me go. And thats what finally had to do.
She, on the other hand, was not afraid of the police, because she did not even know that prostitution is illegal. She told me she is not a hooker.
I had gotten to know her the night before near a Restaurant where i was eating at night. I asked her what her job is, and she said she is working at the reception in a hotel. I asked her if she is a KTV girl, and she said no. I asked her that 5 times to make sure! But as it turned out later, when i told her I had something to do, she all of a sudden demanded money from me. Than she changed her story and she told me that she is a KTV girl.
Although I did not have to, i agreed to give her 700 RMB anyway, because of all the discussion. This should be more than enough for one pop at 4 AM in the morning. Especially because she does not even have to give any money to her mami. But she demanded much more.
QUOTE:
"On the other hand, I did also hear about some of the "shit" he got into in the Zhuhai Saunas - nasty there I heard."
ANSWER:
What??? What kind of trouble did I get into in the Zhuhai Saunas?
Maybe you can enlighten me? I went to 4 saunas in Zhuhai:
1. Sauna: The old DMY, where Superforce99 (Nickname: Mr. ENVY) recommended a girl to me. We first connected, and than for a certain reason, that I will explain later, not. She still liked me that much that she even gave me her number, and wanted to meet me later, which offer I did not take because I did not enjoy her service that much. She even told me that i should not tell Superforce99 (Mr. ENVY) that she gave me her number, because he tried getting her number all the time, but she always refused and told him that she has no phone. I already told him about this a long time ago, because he said maybe she did not give me good service because she did not like me. Haha! Of course not. What really happend was that the chemistry between me and her went downhill, after I told her that I know Superforce99 aka ENVY, and than let her talk to him on the phone, because ENVY wanted me to call him, so he could talk to her. By that time I did not know yet that she was trying to avoid him.
What Superforce99 (still Mr. EVNY :-) ) did after I told him that the experience was not as phantastic for me as he said it was for him, was that he told her that I did not like her service at all, that it was crappy and he said to her that I complained about her. This was completely not true! I never complained about her. I told Mr. ENVY that she did a good job, but it did just not do anything for me because all of the sudden the chemistry was gone, after I let the girl talk to Mr. ENVY on the phone. Mr. ENVY-Superforce99 said to me that I should let her talk to him on the phone, so she would give me better service. Little did I know what was going on in between them.
2. Sauna: Jing Yu, the beautiful girl refused to give a blowjob and I complained to the manager. Before she started her crappy service she got my phone number though...
Although I complained to the manager about her crappy attitude, she strangely still called me lots of times afterwards and wanted to meet me! Of course I was not interested, because of the bad service and attitude. Sometimes the girls think they can play with me and give me lazy service, because I am too nice to them.
3.) 5 Star Hotel Sauna: In one 5 Star Hotel near JUSCO (i forgot the name of the place). The girl was gorgeous and gave me great service, I even extended one hour and I had a great time. We exchanged phone numbers. She lives in Macao now and has a rich BF.
4.) Old Chang An: I also went to the old Chang An. I asked a little 20 year old manager boy to give me more than one lineup. He refused and said he has no other girls. One of the girls in the lineup told me that her friend is nice and new and she would tell her to come. When that girl came to my room the manager told her not to service me, and said to me that they dont have any girls. Obviously they did. So i told him that he is an asshole and i left. I came back the next day and an other about 38 year old manager gave me 3 lineups, and I got a cute but very experienced girl, which was too professional for my taste. But the girl was nice. Also asked me for my phone number and also kept calling and sending me messages for the next 4 month.
Besides that, I had a few freebies too. But this I wont talk about anymore in this kind of forum, as you can understand.
My question: So, what kind of nasty shit did I get into? The only one who knows about those little Sauna stories in the Zhuhai Saunas is Superforce99, who I also nickname "Mr. ENVY" for a reason. And I wonder what is bringing Mr. ENVY to tell lies about me or talk at all behind my back??? What kind of "nasty shit" is he talking about behind my back?!?
If he is talking "nasty shit" about me, than i have a lot of true nasty stuff to tell about him ...
I dont like two faced, two tongued people. I am always straight forward! AS YOU CAN SEE!
This whole thing on the forum is so childish, i cant believe that I am even bothering with it and replying. But I guess it bugs me to read "nasty shit" about me, which grows on jealousy.
OldAsiaHand
07-12-09, 16:28
Like OHA said, that he is giving some money to his freebies.
Tightway,
When did I say that I was giving any money to my freebies?
OAH
Guys,
Here is my take on it. Ten freebies in 2 weeks. It is possible if all the chicks are lined up in advance. Just finding ten freebies in two weeks, I would say that it maybe questionable.
I'm not saying that it is not possible but a bit questionable and the degree of freebies that they are. If I were Bill Gates or the word got out that I have huge piles of cash, I'm sure that I will have atleast twenty pussies crossing my path everytime I go out, but for the average joe, you either have to possess a lot of charms and a lot of money. Most of these freebies may have ulterior motives.
Loveasiangirls
07-13-09, 03:48
Guys,
Here is my take on it. Ten freebies in 2 weeks. It is possible if all the chicks are lined up in advance. Just finding ten freebies in two weeks, I would say that it maybe questionable.
I'm not saying that it is not possible but a bit questionable and the degree of freebies that they are. If I were Bill Gates or the word got out that I have huge piles of cash, I'm sure that I will have atleast twenty pussies crossing my path everytime I go out, but for the average joe, you either have to possess a lot of charms and a lot of money. Most of these freebies may have ulterior motives.
It is very doable. Either you line them up ahead of time which requires a lot of work on MSN (which is how I do it), or you are very charming or not shy and know which bar to go to.
As for their motivation, most just about getting some sex with a white guy. Most of my freebies have a good job, some drive their own car and don't care for the passport.
It is very doable. As for their motivation, most just about getting some sex with a white guy.You must be non asian to make a statement like that. You are living in a fantasy world. Most of my freebies. The last thing they want is "sex with a white guy"
Ahhh. Imperialistic attitudes.
SE Asia Joe
07-13-09, 05:26
Interesting, what goes on when I am not watching the forum!
I think it is a strange waste of time to spent time in this forum and reply to wrong accusations. This is not my normal world and life, and it is not really important.
But,....well, I guess I will react to this, because it bugs me nonetheless:
First of all, I think there is a lot of jealousy going around, since I posted a report that .............
Damn.................!!!
Tightway!!! You serious??
Here I am just about the only guy here defending you and your methods etc and you get on my case?!
You gotta be kidding!!
SEAJ
10 freebies in weeks is possible in China. When i went to shanghai, i was meeting girls nearly everyday and never actually got to pay for sex. I guess most of them liked me because i am a foreigner = they think i have cash etc, or had this idea of a romance with a foreigner, some just wanted to practice their english but i jumped on the occasion to seduce them.
Yes, you are somewhat close. I'm a couple years older than 28. I started attracting women in the states about 3-4 years before I made my first trip to China. I used the same strategy over and over again in the states because it works:
1. Make the women comfortable and trust you.
(This is easy if you're a nice guy, but you'll have to take it to the next
level if you want to get anywhere.)
2. Build their feelings of respect and admiration for you with stories.
(if a women can not respect or admire you, she wouldn't fuck you)
3. Get them used to being in close proximity to you, and get
them used to being touchy feely with you.
4. Build up feelings of excitement and arousal, and link them all to YOU.
During the time with them, I usually throw in a few hints without sounding as if it means much to me, so that they can come to the same conclusion themselves that: ( I'm desireable to women. I'm in good physical shape. I'm exciting sexually, etc... ). Women get turned off very fast when they think you're bragging, so I do it in a way where it does not look like that at all, and it is only by subtle implication because they filled in the blanks themselves to come to that conclusion based on how I act and carry myself when I'm with them.
My first trip to China was a big eye opener. I've been so fined tuned with getting around the defences of women in the states, that I found it was just way too easy in ShenZhen, China to score with beautiful women. I didn't have to try very hard, because women in China didn't seem to have the problems that women in the states had: suspicion that every guy is just trying to get into their pants, and that they had to cock block to avoid looking easy. So here I am, fine tuned to deal with cock-blocking women, and I'm not getting any resistance at all. I totally loved this difference, because it was very little work, with lots of play.
The mention of my penis was really my way of saying that I am not afraid to tell you my dick size in order to dispell the myth that asian's have tiny dicks. It's not a big dick, but I'm happy with my penis either way, and don't feel a need to change it. I'm not sure how open or comfortable anyone else would be to throw out their penis size.
The truth is, you don't need a huge cock to be very good in bed. You just need to know how to use it the right way.
Has anybody ever met "Sound Stream #2"? He sounds like Superforce99!
I could almost bet that they are the same person, who is using two (or more?) different handles.
If anybody that I know has ever met SS#2, than please let me know If they are the same person or not. I am curious to know if I am right.
OldAsiaHand
07-16-09, 03:18
Has anybody ever met "Sound Stream #2"? He sounds like Superforce99!
I could almost bet that they are the same person, who is using two (or more?) different handles.
If anybody that I know has ever met SS#2, than please let me know If they are the same person or not. I am curious to know if I am right.Tightway,
How much do you want to bet?
I have met both and they are not the same person.
OAH
Has anybody ever met "Sound Stream #2"? He sounds like Superforce99!
I could almost bet that they are the same person, who is using two (or more?) different handles.
If anybody that I know has ever met SS#2, than please let me know If they are the same person or not. I am curious to know if I am right.What is this, a "How to get the chicks" fastseduction site where breathless PUAs file their pathetic after action reports? If they are not discussing heavy topics such as "An Approach to Approach Anxiety" or "Hand Holding Routine." There is enough of that crap, spare us. Please let's get back to the subject matter.
Superforce99
07-16-09, 07:31
Interestingly enough, two people pushed me to check out Tightway's recent posts about me, and I must say, it's all so. Ridiculous. I wasn't going to post a response, but it is really just too strange, so here goes:
Tightway, I consider you a friend in the sense that you chat with me via email, I'm, and phone occasionally and we have laughs about our experiences in China. That's why I found it so strange that you literally "blew up" after SE Joe's comment of "nasty shit" in ZH. Honestly, I don't remember telling Joe anything that would be construed as "nasty shit" but then one man's meat is another man's poison, or perhaps one man's amusing anecdotes are another man's "nasty shit"? Did Joe ever clarify to you what he meant by his comments? How often do you chat with Joe? Do his views carry so much weight with you?
Basically, I think we both enjoy laughing at the funny/ridiculous shit that we foreign guys can get into with girls, both p4p and non-p4p, and it was these type of stories I must have shared with Joe, but I have forgotten, so maybe SE Joe can share with us? It's kind of amazing that you would blow up at one vague comment posted by someone you probably never interact with. If you really have any problems with me, call me anytime, you have my number.
Anyway, I think the other people on ISG who have met me or have interacted with me in some manner can attest to the kind of person I am.
SF99
Sorry for the clutter/useless posts, it will be the first and last from me.
SE Asia Joe
07-22-09, 09:38
I usually counsel young WG's I like, never to have a boy friend during all the time whilst they are still "working". For obvious reasons.
But then yesterday, I was with a gal that gave me a totally mind blowing, incredible blow job. I mean she was one of the best I'd had lately! I of course asked her how she learned her craft and she told me that her boy friend taught her everything! I mean, the guy taught her just about every trick in the book that I know of. Plus some more!
Hmmmm. Mebbe I should stop preaching to W. G.'s about not having a boyfriends!
SEAJ
Transporter
07-22-09, 10:18
I usually counsel young WG's I like, never to have a boy friend during all the time whilst they are still "working" - for obvious reasons.
But then yesterday, I was with a gal that gave me a totally mind blowing, incredible blow job - I mean she was one of the best I'd had lately! I of course asked her how she learned her craft and she told me that her boy friend taught her everything!! I mean, the guy taught her just about every trick in the book that I know of - plus some more!!
Hmmmm.... mebbe I should stop preaching to W.G.'s about not having a boyfriends!
SEAJOne of the best kept secrets is: the best girls are the kept girls.
Porter
I usually counsel young WG's I like, never to have a boy friend during all the time whilst they are still "working". For obvious reasons.
But then yesterday, I was with a gal that gave me a totally mind blowing, incredible blow job. I mean she was one of the best I'd had lately! I of course asked her how she learned her craft and she told me that her boy friend taught her everything! I mean, the guy taught her just about every trick in the book that I know of. Plus some more!
Hmmmm. Mebbe I should stop preaching to W. G.'s about not having a boyfriends!
SEAJSince you are so wonderful to counsel the WGs, could you please also teach them to use the razor properly for hair maintenance. I know you you could add that to the list of advice that you give to them.; )
No need to thank me if you did overlooked this advice.
SE Asia Joe
07-23-09, 13:13
Since you are so wonderful to counsel the WGs, could you please also teach them to use the razor properly for hair maintenance. I know you you could add that to the list of advice that you give to them.; )
No need to thank me if you did overlooked this advice.
GOOD IDEA - really good!!
I'll advise 'em NEVER to give in to entreaties by anybody to shave themselves down there as then they will definitely not have any more local and other Chinese origin clients...... except perhaps some cheap charlies who would do any gal.
Thanks for reminding me
SEAJ
Clandestine782
07-27-09, 23:35
http://www.arabnews.com/services/print/print.asp?artid=49378&d=4&m=8&y=2004&hl=Wife%20Beating,%20Suicide%20Cases%20Increase%20in%20China
This is from an Arab website (strangely enough). I was looking at articles about this and couldn't seem to access the articles on the China Daily about said topic. Some other articles I have read say that the government is "making tough laws against battering women," but this Arab site (and my own experience) seem to say otherwise. Reality is a matter of perception, it seems....
This comes up because I was talking to a girl and trying to make The Case to her (you guys have all been there) and selling her benefits that she could get from allowing me to pursue her for a relationship (with exploring each other's moist regions as a benefit for both parties). One of the things that I talk about with these girls is that a lot of women get their ass beaten on a regular basis-- and I suspect that this is because a lot of women here are intent on marrying/ settling down with the first man they ever have sex with (BAD IDEA). Hitting a woman is something that I have never done and WILL NEVER do, no matter what.
It happens that we were walking in the street after talking about this earlier, and what did we come upon? A woman getting her ass beaten IN THE MIDDLE OF THE STREET. I made it very clear that "I Told You So," and then left the topic alone. From what I could figure out, this woman had a child with this man and there were actually 5 people involved in this. 1. The man; 2. His wife; 3. Some friend of the wife who was holding her in a bear hug and trying to stop this man from getting at her; 4. Another man who was holding the baby and not being of any use; 5. The baby, who was too young to know what was going on.
I did nothing, as I have learned the hard way that it is not a good idea to try to help a woman in this situation since: 1) They will never admit to being beaten--and if you try to help, it may in fact become YOUR problem; 2) Some women like getting their ass beaten (it's the only conclusion that I can come to given the fact that they could easily find someone else); 3) That they had all the chances that they wanted to find a man and passed over every other choice to find someone that beats their ass. (Including the gender imbalance: For the math to work out, something like 11 out of 10 Chinese men would have to hit women for there to be any single woman who could not find a non abusive man.)
What experience have you guys had with this phenomenon? The article below
Wife Beating, Suicide Cases Increase in China
Juliana Liu, Reuters —
BEIJING, 4 August 2004 — Xiao Li, a 32-year-old nurse, still weeps when she recalls the first time her tour guide fiance beat her up. The couple was bickering over how to renovate a newly purchased flat in Beijing when the argument dissolved into shoves and punches in full view of neighbors and security guards.
“Every time I got up, he pushed me down again. My mobile phone clanked on the ground. He kept cursing me and demanding I admit I was wrong,” she said, tears trickling from swollen eyelids.
“No one had ever talked to me or treated me like that before,” said Li, whose fine features and porcelain skin seem to have been copied from a Tang dynasty brush painting. “In that moment, I could understand why patient wives, abused for years, end up killing their husbands. If I had a knife, I think I would have used it.”
Li is one of tens of millions, perhaps hundreds of millions, of Chinese women regularly abused by their husbands or partners, experts say.
Wife beating and alarming female suicide rates have been well documented in China’s remote, dirt-poor villages.
But experts say young, cosmopolitan women like Li are increasingly falling victim to domestic violence as they bear the brunt of unprecedented social upheaval sweeping the country, spurred by an economy galloping at more than nine percent a year.
In a bizarre twist, many women even say their status in society has been eroded as economic reforms unleashed 20 years ago cast aside the last vestiges of Maoism, under which women were famously told they “hold up half the sky”.
Wife beating hit the headlines in 1999 when news broke that three women in northwestern China had been murdered by their husbands, sparking much soul-searching. One woman was stabbed, another beaten and the third was set on fire.
An official at the All China Women’s Federation, Wang Simei, said the level of violence in domestic assault cases has increased.
According to a recent survey by the Chinese Academy of Social Sciences, as many as one third of women in 270 million households across the country have been victims of domestic violence.
Researchers say surveys often understate the problem because many women are unwilling to “lose face” by admitting, even anonymously, that they have been beaten. In traditional Chinese society, family strife is considered best kept from the public.
Whatever the true number, experts agree domestic violence has become more common as China moves toward a market economy, throwing millions of people out of jobs and ushering in a return to the more traditional values that preceded Communist rule.
“Domestic violence has gotten worse,” said Ren Yuan, a professor at Shanghai’s Fudan University who studies women’s issues. “People are more stressed. We all feel this. China is changing very quickly, too fast for social support services and the law.”
That doesn’t surprise Mrs. Wang, a 42-year-old engineer, who has been a human punching bag for her surgeon husband for 10 years. “He’s under heavy pressure at work and transfers his anger to me,” the Beijing resident said by telephone. “At the beginning, he slapped my face. Step by step, he progressed to kicking me and throwing everything in the house he could grab.”
Wang said her parents and relatives have pushed her to tolerate the beating, saying it would be difficult for a woman at her age to be alone.
“I don’t want to divorce, not only because the apartment I am staying in belongs to him and his salary is two or three times higher than mine. I want to keep a complete and normal family for my child,” she said, echoing the fears of many abused women.
“(But) each time, my son and I feel so scared. I have even thought of killing him, killing myself and asking my parents to bring up my child.”
Wang says her future would be bleak if she left her husband. There are virtually no state-sponsored women’s shelters in China because officials are afraid women would bring their children and stay for good.
Experts say the problem is compounded by a regression in rights and career opportunities, even for talented women. Social attitudes also seemed to be reverting to the old Confucian ways.
Those who seek jobs are becoming commodities, they say, with some young women going as far as getting nose jobs and eye-lid surgery to catch the attention of prospective employers.
“Women’s employment rate has fallen and the income gap between men and women has risen,” said Wang Simei of the Women’s Federation. “More and more people believe women should play a more important role in the family rather than in society.”
Marriage is a social pressure many modern Chinese women like Nurse Li can’t simply shake off, even to an abusive husband. “If I don’t marry him, I might be an old maid!” she lamented, crying into her Diet Coke.
Chocha Monger
07-28-09, 00:36
Just wondering, if there are way more men than women in China wouldn't that mean that women could have their pick of men, and men would have to treat their wives/girlfriends better in order to keep them around. Instead, it seems that the value of women has fallen. That seems to suggest that it's easy for Chinese men to find women. And why would a pretty 32 yr old Chinese nurse be worried about ending up an old maid when she should have her pick of suitors?
Crazy Jim Wood
07-28-09, 01:36
Sure there are billions of men in China.
However not all are marriage material -- no car no job no house smell bad stutter have a club foot 9 out of 10 have a problem.
Sure there are billions of women in China.
However not all are marriage material -- too old, pussy stretched out by foriegn dicks, mole on their nose, pigeon toed, etc. 9 out of 10 have a problem.
So the actual number of marriageable persons of either gender is much less than the number of people of either gender who are alive.
However, since women reach their expiration date sooner than men, they are under great competition to get a decent guy while they are still young.
A 32-year-old woman is considered too old to be a great pick.
Men have longer expiration dates. As they get older they also get more money and become more desirable. They will just wait until the perfect woman comes along. They are under no pressure to choose.
Just wondering, if there are way more men than women in China wouldn't that mean that women could have their pick of men, and men would have to treat their wives/girlfriends better in order to keep them around. Instead, it seems that the value of women has fallen. That seems to suggest that it's easy for Chinese men to find women. And why would a pretty 32 yr old Chinese nurse be worried about ending up an old maid when she should have her pick of suitors?
I once dated a real beauty in China. She was 30 years old but looks about 24. She would turn heads whenever we walked into a restaurant. She owned her small dress shop, easy going and funny.
I asked her why she was still single and she must have a lot of men chasing after her all the time. She told me that there are always men hitting on her but her standards are very high. So I wanted to know her high standards because I thought I would probably not be able to measure up.
She wants to find a man who can meet the following conditions:
1. Have a good education
2. Does not drink (excessive)
3. Does not smoke.
4. Does not gamble.
5. Have a job.
6. The most important part, will not hit her.
I thought I know a ton of guys here in the U.S. that can meet these conditions however I checked around my Taiwan friends and did not find one that can meet all 6 conditions.
It is funny how the culture are so different between Western vs Asian.
I talked to a group of Chinese friends and their wives about hitting women. All the Chinese men says there are times when it is OK to hit their wives, like when the wife cause the man to lose face in front of their friends or family, when the wife dis-respect the man's father or mother and other examples like that. The strange part was that the wives all agreed that under these conditions, it was justified for the husband to hit the wife and the wife deserved it.
I was trying to explain that in the U.S., there is never an acceptable reason where a man can hit a woman but they just can't seem to accept that.
SE Asia Joe
07-28-09, 06:35
I was trying to explain that in the U.S., there is never an acceptable reason where a man can hit a woman but they just can't seem to accept that.
.
ACCEPTABLE??? To whom may I ask?? Is it not acceptable to all 'em bra burning dykes who've basically rallied all the good women of the good Ole U.S. of A towards their Women Liberation type of thinkin?
That to me is what had happened in most Western and wealthier countries - that these women has "risen" and asserted themselves to the point that most of the society - including the males - accepts matter of factly all the crap that these gals feeds them.
It's OK for gals to hit, scratch, bite etc AT WILL but not for guys to put them back in their place?? At least to defend himself?? OK for her to totally disrespect ANYTHING and EVERYTHING that a guy stands for and totally believes in and then for her to throw a wild cat tantrum and even flying fists - and the guy is just supposed to take all that shit??
Sorry - but my Asian eyes just see too much inequality here. NO I've never hit a gal in my life either - but the gals in Asia KNOWS where their limits are (as they know that there is always the threat of physical violence if they ever step beyond these boundaries) and have thus never needed to do so. In the States?? No boundaries, no respect and nothing for the guys to assert themselves.
Just IMHO and totally my own opinion/not trying to flame anybody/anything/ any country/and people - and my prior and due apologies to anybody who may be offended at what I just wrote.
SEAJ
Trackster42
07-29-09, 06:09
6. The most important part, will not hit her.
I thought I know a ton of guys here in the U.S. that can meet these conditions however I checked around my Taiwan friends and did not find one that can meet all 6 conditions.
It is funny how the culture are so different between Western vs Asian.
I talked to a group of Chinese friends and their wives about hitting women. All the Chinese men says there are times when it is OK to hit their wives, like when the wife cause the man to lose face in front of their friends or family, when the wife dis-respect the man's father or mother and other examples like that. The strange part was that the wives all agreed that under these conditions, it was justified for the husband to hit the wife and the wife deserved it.
I was trying to explain that in the U.S., there is never an acceptable reason where a man can hit a woman but they just can't seem to accept that.CSUN: You should not draw your conclusion just because of your small sample size of 6 people, who probably share a similar background. I know plenty of Chinese who would never hit their wives, and there are plenty of American guys who beat up their wives and girlfriends (heard of Chris Brown?).
I was trying to explain that in the U.S., there is never an acceptable reason where a man can hit a woman but they just can't seem to accept that.Its not publicly acceptable but there are still many people who do so in the privacy of their own homes. It's still about face. The western world see's it as a loss of face to actually hit a woman, and we've been conditioned to believe its wrong to do so. Whereas in Asia there are acceptable reasons for hitting a woman, just as there are areas/reasons not acceptable to hit a woman.
Personally, I've never hit a woman, and no desire to ever do so. My shoulders tense up at the idea of it. And I've had to force myself and my friends not to interfere when I've seen it happen in other countries. In Ireland, I'd step in. But, saying that, I'm very much into equality, and figure a man has the right to defend himself. If a woman hits me, and won't stop. I'll give her a open handed slap back to force her to get a grip on her emotions. Hasn't happened yet, but the time might come in the future.
Different rules for different cultures. I'm not going to say that western culture is more right than eastern cultures.
Clandestine782
07-29-09, 18:56
CSUN: You should not draw your conclusion just because of your small sample size of 6 people, who probably share a similar background. I know plenty of Chinese who would never hit their wives, and there are plenty of American guys who beat up their wives and girlfriends (heard of Chris Brown?).I don't think he said that there were only 6 examples. There were some unspecified number of examples that failed to meet 6 constraints.
Chocha Monger
07-29-09, 20:17
I was trying to explain that in the U.S., there is never an acceptable reason where a man can hit a woman but they just can't seem to accept that.
Yes, in the U.S. the family dog holds more rights than the man and less obligations. There are many female batterers in the U.S. and they count on the assumption of the man's guilt on the part of the police to get away with their one sided violence. American women believe that it's okay to throw drinks or slap men in the face. Both are acts of assault under the law but women think they are exempt from the law. I've seen women strike men very forcefully and then claim that the man didn't feel it because he is a man and a woman's blows were incapable of causing him injury even when objects were used to inflict blunt force trauma.
Studies have also show that a significant percentage of domestic violence incidents are in fact initiated by the woman. When the fight turns against the woman she calls the police. I've witnessed this personally when a fat neighbor followed her husband out to the parking lot in an attempt to stop him from leaving. At first he ignored her blows but when he got into the car she leaned into the drivers window punching him repeatedly in the face and bloodying his nose. He finally retaliated by jumping out the car and raining some blows down on her. As she stumbled back her massive frame inflicted damage on my new luxury car parked out front. Of course, now that the tide of the battle had turned she squealed frantically for help.
Unfortunately, in the U.S. there seems to be acceptance for a woman hitting a man but not vice versa. Violence is violence regardless of which sex is on the receiving end. Don't buy into feminist propaganda that violence is acceptable against men but not women.
SE Asia Joe
07-30-09, 07:02
Yes, in the U.S. the family dog holds more rights than the man and less obligations. .....
Unfortunately, in the U.S. there seems to be acceptance for a woman hitting a man but not vice versa. Violence is violence regardless of which sex is on the receiving end. Don't buy into feminist propaganda that violence is acceptable against men but not women.
I've had the distinct and special privilege of being able to spend a few years in Mid-West USA during the mid to late 60's. I was witness not only to the start of the Peace movement, Flower Power, make Love not War, psychedelic and other drugs etc but ALSO to Gloria Steinem, bra burning and the rise of the feminist power.
Traditionally conservative Mid westerners for the most part pooh-poohed what all was happening at both East and West Coasts. Salt of the earth types, they stoically went about their daily lives - working, going to church, organizing bazaars, attending Rotary Clubs and raising their family. Wives stayed at home and catered to the husbands (Yup - bare feet, pregnant and in the kitchen here - but guys....tongue firmly in cheek here too!!). Women then knew their place and Men - real men then, knew how to control their wives - and yes... Hallelujah and Bejeezus.... they once a while need to get out the ole belt buckle to straighten out these rampaging female hormones. Lives were stable and fulfilling.
Fast forward to present day America - Yup - guys with less rights than the family dog.... at least that is what's happenin' in the East and West coasts. But let me ask you guys here..... Is this the case in the Mid-West??? Where the TRUE U.S.A. is?? NO metro males, cappucinos or Quiche here - just the salt of the earth types working away and keeping America Strong. But then again, I ain't been back to the Midwest for eons.
SEAJ
Ps. apologies - I shud've written this in the American Women section. You guys figure I shud move it?
Yellow Fever #2
07-30-09, 16:53
Original link: http://www.reuters.com/article/newsOne/idUSTRE56T0S020090730
13 million abortions in China each year: report
Thu Jul 30, 2009 4:52am EDT
BEIJING (Reuters) - Some 13 million abortions are carried out in China each year, in part because there is little education about contraception or disease for the rising numbers of young people who are having sex, state media said on Thursday.
Fewer than one in three callers to a Shanghai hotline knew how to avoid pregnancy, and only one in five were informed about venereal disease, the official China Daily quoted a survey by the city's 411 Army Hospital saying.
"Sex is no longer considered taboo among young people today, and they believe they can learn everything they need from the Internet. But it doesn't mean they have developed a proper understanding or attitude toward it," the paper quoted hospital gynecologist Yu Dongyan saying.
Until the 1990s, doctors asked for women's marital status at abortion clinics, which were part of the family planning system that limited urban couples to one child.
Now, government data shows that nearly two thirds of women who have abortions are between 20 and 29, and most are single, the paper said.
Birth control information is mainly given to young couples.
Some single women may also be driven to seek abortions because under current laws unmarried mothers cannot get a "hukou" or household registration card for their child.
Without one it is extremely hard for Chinese citizens to get access to education, healthcare and other public services. China also sells about 10 million abortion pills a year, and there are many other abortions performed in unregistered clinics, the paper quoted Wu Shangchun, a division director at the National Population and Family Planning Commission, as saying.
In the United States, by contrast, which has a population less than one-quarter that of China, official figures from the Center for Disease Control show there were 820,000 abortions performed in 2005, excluding California, Louisiana and New Hampshire for which no figures were provided.
Sun Xiaohong from the education department of Shanghai's family planning authority said it was difficult to promote sex education in schools because some teachers and parents thought it would encourage teenagers to become sexually active.
Ordinary web users in China will be banned from surfing sex-related medical and research websites from July, amid an Internet crackdown on pornographic online content, that threatens to make information about sexual health even harder to access.
Original link: http://www.reuters.com/article/newsOne/idUSTRE56T0S020090730
13 million abortions in China each year: report
Thu Jul 30, 2009 4:52am EDT
BEIJING (Reuters) - Some 13 million abortions are carried out in China each year, in part because there is little education about contraception or disease for the rising numbers of young people who are having sex, state media said on Thursday.
Fewer than one in three callers to a Shanghai hotline knew how to avoid pregnancy, and only one in five were informed about venereal disease, the official China Daily quoted a survey by the city's 411 Army Hospital saying.
"Sex is no longer considered taboo among young people today, and they believe they can learn everything they need from the Internet. But it doesn't mean they have developed a proper understanding or attitude toward it," the paper quoted hospital gynecologist Yu Dongyan saying.
Until the 1990s, doctors asked for women's marital status at abortion clinics, which were part of the family planning system that limited urban couples to one child.
Now, government data shows that nearly two thirds of women who have abortions are between 20 and 29, and most are single, the paper said.
Birth control information is mainly given to young couples.
Some single women may also be driven to seek abortions because under current laws unmarried mothers cannot get a "hukou" or household registration card for their child.
Without one it is extremely hard for Chinese citizens to get access to education, healthcare and other public services. China also sells about 10 million abortion pills a year, and there are many other abortions performed in unregistered clinics, the paper quoted Wu Shangchun, a division director at the National Population and Family Planning Commission, as saying.
In the United States, by contrast, which has a population less than one-quarter that of China, official figures from the Center for Disease Control show there were 820,000 abortions performed in 2005, excluding California, Louisiana and New Hampshire for which no figures were provided.
Sun Xiaohong from the education department of Shanghai's family planning authority said it was difficult to promote sex education in schools because some teachers and parents thought it would encourage teenagers to become sexually active.
Ordinary web users in China will be banned from surfing sex-related medical and research websites from July, amid an Internet crackdown on pornographic online content, that threatens to make information about sexual health even harder to access.This is a good reminder for us to wear a hat whenever we monger in China. This reflects the large number of girls/guys having sex without protection. One don't want to bring extra baggage back home to the little woman.
Meiguoguizi
08-23-09, 04:00
During 10 years of extensive annual mongering in China, I have grown to understand that my very young companions will be ill at ease walking or eating or drinking in public places in my company.
I observe the constant scrutiny and approbation that they are subject to while being seen in public with a westerner who is some 30 odd years older than them.
So it is the exception to the rule that surprises me; during these years I have met 4 or 5 working girls that seem impervious to the public 'loss of face'. They are happy to hold hands, walk the beach, order the restaurant waitresses around... acting the role of a genuine 'xiao lao po', which they are not.
I've always wondered why these few were 'immune' to the stares and comments. I've noticed that they are routinely from small towns, rather than the city. They are, in fact, less 'westernized' than many of their coworkers. I don't believe they are any more comfortable with me than the normal working girl who appreciates a considerate client. And they come from different areas of China, one from Dongbei, one from Jiangxi, one from Henan, two from Hainan.
They each are from 20 to 25 years old, so they haven't yet reached the age of desperation for Chinese women.
Any thoughts, gentlemen?
OldAsiaHand
08-24-09, 05:18
During 10 years of extensive annual mongering in China, I have grown to understand that my very young companions will be ill at ease walking or eating or drinking in public places in my company.
I observe the constant scrutiny and approbation that they are subject to while being seen in public with a westerner who is some 30 odd years older than them.
So it is the exception to the rule that surprises me; during these years I have met 4 or 5 working girls that seem impervious to the public 'loss of face'. They are happy to hold hands, walk the beach, order the restaurant waitresses around... acting the role of a genuine 'xiao lao po', which they are not.
I've always wondered why these few were 'immune' to the stares and comments. I've noticed that they are routinely from small towns, rather than the city. They are, in fact, less 'westernized' than many of their coworkers. I don't believe they are any more comfortable with me than the normal working girl who appreciates a considerate client. And they come from different areas of China, one from Dongbei, one from Jiangxi, one from Henan, two from Hainan.
They each are from 20 to 25 years old, so they haven't yet reached the age of desperation for Chinese women.
Any thoughts, gentlemen?
Meiguoguizi,
My guess is that you just got lucky. It could depend on the town you were in? Where was it? Were you extra generous with them? Did you spend a long time with them? The stigma most fear is that they become less desirable to the Chinese punters when seen with a foreigner. However, some couldn't give a shit about this. Some may be attracted to a foreigner out of curiousity. Some may want to learn English. Some may be looking at your passport. I think it needs to be analyzed on a case by case basis.
Just my POV.
OAH
During 10 years of extensive annual mongering in China, I have grown to understand that my very young companions will be ill at ease walking or eating or drinking in public places in my company.
I observe the constant scrutiny and approbation that they are subject to while being seen in public with a westerner who is some 30 odd years older than them.
So it is the exception to the rule that surprises me; during these years I have met 4 or 5 working girls that seem impervious to the public 'loss of face'. They are happy to hold hands, walk the beach, order the restaurant waitresses around... acting the role of a genuine 'xiao lao po', which they are not.
I've always wondered why these few were 'immune' to the stares and comments. I've noticed that they are routinely from small towns, rather than the city. They are, in fact, less 'westernized' than many of their coworkers. I don't believe they are any more comfortable with me than the normal working girl who appreciates a considerate client. And they come from different areas of China, one from Dongbei, one from Jiangxi, one from Henan, two from Hainan.
They each are from 20 to 25 years old, so they haven't yet reached the age of desperation for Chinese women.
Any thoughts, gentlemen?Fortunately for me being an ABC, I have not had that issue with the gals. Face is very important in Chinese culture.
During 10 years of extensive annual mongering in China, I have grown to understand that my very young companions will be ill at ease walking or eating or drinking in public places in my company.
I observe the constant scrutiny and approbation that they are subject to while being seen in public with a westerner who is some 30 odd years older than them.
So it is the exception to the rule that surprises me; during these years I have met 4 or 5 working girls that seem impervious to the public 'loss of face'. They are happy to hold hands, walk the beach, order the restaurant waitresses around... acting the role of a genuine 'xiao lao po', which they are not.
I've always wondered why these few were 'immune' to the stares and comments. I've noticed that they are routinely from small towns, rather than the city. They are, in fact, less 'westernized' than many of their coworkers. I don't believe they are any more comfortable with me than the normal working girl who appreciates a considerate client. And they come from different areas of China, one from Dongbei, one from Jiangxi, one from Henan, two from Hainan.
They each are from 20 to 25 years old, so they haven't yet reached the age of desperation for Chinese women.
Any thoughts, gentlemen?A small number of girls will not mind being your xiao lao po in public provided it is not in their hometowns. Still most girls will mind. I just think you got lucky.
Have you ever try taking your xiao lao po back to her hometown and being girlfriend/boyfriend there in public? I think you will be enlighten.
Sarg2009
SE Asia Joe
08-26-09, 06:40
I've never really understood the actual dynamics of Chinese WG's and their Boyfriends. NOw I'm all the more confused.
One of my "regulars" is a BBS gal that I've gotten to know pretty well and she - of course - has a boyfriend. But this guy actually is in jail for drug possession and have ben incarcerated since last year. He is the one who got her out of working in a factory, taught her all the tricks of the trade and let her loose at a BBS in Shenzhen. She had of course financed both their living doing so, including his regular RMB 200/pop drug addiction.
Well, the guy got caught and got a 6 year sentence - which according to her, could be "lessened" to the end of this year if she raised RMB 10,000; and of course she is working her tail off, literally, to do so. Fact is, last month she paid RMB 3,000 just to be able to see her BF for 10 minutes (which she later found out should have been only RMB 1,000 if she had paid off the right guy!).
I see her and shake my head for I really don't know whether to pity her for actually doing one of the hardest and most dignity-robbing jobs I know of, all in the name of "love", be disgusted by her for her ignorant devotion to a guy who's a total loser, or to admire her for her total selflessness and one-minded strength. All in the name of love.
I've never known love this strong - and thus I most likely also envy her BF.
SEAJ
I've never really understood the actual dynamics of Chinese WG's and their Boyfriends. NOw I'm all the more confused.
One of my "regulars" is a BBS gal that I've gotten to know pretty well and she - of course - has a boyfriend. But this guy actually is in jail for drug possession and have ben incarcerated since last year. He is the one who got her out of working in a factory, taught her all the tricks of the trade and let her loose at a BBS in Shenzhen. She had of course financed both their living doing so, including his regular RMB 200/pop drug addiction.
Well, the guy got caught and got a 6 year sentence - which according to her, could be "lessend" to the end of this year if she raised RMB 10,000; and of course she is working her tail off, literally, to do so. Fact is, last month she paid RMB 3,000 just to be able to see her BF for 10 minutes (which she later found out should have been only RMB 1,000 if she had paid off the right guy!).
I see her and shake my head for I really don't know whether to pity her for actually doing one of the hardest and most dignity-robbing jobs I know of, all in the name of "love", be disgusted by her for her ignorant devotion to a guy who's a total loser, or to admire her for her total selflessness and one-minded strength. All in the name of love.
I've never known love this strong - and thus I most likely also envy her BF.
SEAJ
I would say it's all about her personal history. She has been previously rewarded for obedience and loyalty, and punished for previous disobedience. She has been conditioned to obey. Learned behaviour! Just like Pavlov's dogs and Skinner's pigeons, she is doing what she has been conditioned to do!
As OAH would say, "just my point of view."
I would say it's all about her personal history. She has been previously rewarded for obedience and loyalty, and punished for previous disobedience. She has been conditioned to obey. Learned behaviour! Just like Pavlov's dogs and Skinner's pigeons, she is doing what she has been conditioned to do!
As OAH would say, "just my point of view."
And it's not a Chinese thing. The WG/pimp relation is very hard to understand for an outsider. I knew a tall, blonde, statuesque dominatrix in Europe. I hired her for clients who were into tall, blonde, statuesque dominatrixes. I never had sex with her, tall, blonde, statuesque dominatrixes don't work for me. Because of that (and because I brought her good business) a non-sexual friendship developed. Turned out, the tall, blonde, statuesque dominatrix had a pimp who lived thousands of miles away with two girlfriends. Every other month, the tall blonde flew down to his place and brought him his 50% share. She could never explain to me why he could have that power over her from thousands of miles away. She definitely wasn't the submissive type, no Siree. I finally talked her into setting 20% aside before she would split the take. That put her back into some kind of control and broke the spell the distant pimp obviously had on her. But it did not completely. She had to give him 50,000 Euro before he let her go ... amazing.
Chocha Monger
08-26-09, 14:38
And it's not a Chinese thing. The WG/pimp relation is very hard to understand for an outsider. I knew a tall, blonde, statuesque dominatrix in Europe. I hired her for clients who were into tall, blonde, statuesque dominatrixes. I never had sex with her, tall, blonde, statuesque dominatrixes don't work for me. Because of that (and because I brought her good business) a non-sexual friendship developed. Turned out, the tall, blonde, statuesque dominatrix had a pimp who lived thousands of miles away with two girlfriends. Every other month, the tall blonde flew down to his place and brought him his 50% share. She could never explain to me why he could have that power over her from thousands of miles away. She definitely wasn't the submissive type, no Siree. I finally talked her into setting 20% aside before she would split the take. That put her back into some kind of control and broke the spell the distant pimp obviously had on her. But it did not completely. She had to give him 50,000 Euro before he let her go ... amazing.
In the dominant/submissive scene sometimes there are rituals and codes. In some cases one must be a submissive or "slave" under a dominant or "master" for a number of years. It is sort of an apprenticeship. At the end of it the sub graduates as a dominatrix but she can never be more dominant than her master/mistress. The whole prolonged extreme submission process leaves behind a feeling of extreme loyalty and obedience to the former master/mistress that often transcends time and distance.
The pimp might have been the one who trained and initiated her into becoming dominant.
Chocha Monger
08-26-09, 23:11
I found this article and thought I'd post it here because what this guy is saying sounds completely different from the reports on the China thread.
http://middlekingdomlife.com/guide/dating-etiquette-sex-relationships-china.htm
Meiguoguizi
08-26-09, 23:24
I found this article and thought I'd post it here because what this guy is saying sounds completely different from the reports on the China thread.
http://middlekingdomlife.com/guide/dating-etiquette-sex-relationships-china.htm
I know the writer personally.
His Sichuan girl friend left him when her parents were horrified by her relationship with him.
His current wife is a Filipino that he met in a bar in Hong Kong..
Nice guy. But knows as much about Chinese women as he does about nuclear physics.
SE Asia Joe
08-27-09, 05:12
I've pretty well got "Western values" in my relationships and experiences with the fairer sex, tempered with seeing situations through oriental eyes.
When I was younger and had "regular" girl friends, I found out that the worse I treat my lady friends, the more they'd come back for more. Treat em good and they have a bad habit of then trying to walk all over you.
Fast forward to my relationships with WG's - I found out the reverse and that the more I treat these WG's as a human being, the more I get from my experiences. Treat 'em bad and they treat you like the customer that you are.
In the process of treating WG's as a human being, I've had the pleasure of many many times having gals swear up and down that they've truly enjoyed their romp with me - some even swearing that they've never had any better experience even with their BF's; And this "regular" with the BF in jail is one who has stated this.
Which always leads to me questioning her why is it that she would still stick to him and to actually plan her whole life around this guy? The answer - I love him, he makes me feel so happy and I cannot live without him. And she's talking about a guy who she KNOWS is no good, who she knows she cannot depend on and who she knows will eventually bring her all sorts of unhappiness.
Ahhh - perhaps "youth" and inexperience is what it's all about. All of us have had to pay "the price" for learning life's education. Pavlovian reflex? S/M? Dominatrix/Submissive training? Maybe, but I seriously doubt it. Just youthful naivete, optimism from not having experienced enough of life's up and down yet - and the all encompassing exuberance of young love.
At least I suspect so - for that is what I felt when I was younger.
IMHO
SEAJ
From talking to a few WGs, lots of WG's greatest fear is not having someone to hold to when they are not working, to them the "Bad" boyfriend is better than nothing. They consider themselves "Spoiled" goods and fear not able to get another one, a new boyfriend might be worse! In fact not much different from a lot of people – sticking to what one is familiar with and being afraid of change.
Hungryguy
I
When I was younger and had "regular" girl friends, I found out that the worse I treat my lady friends, the more they'd come back for more. Treat em good and they have a bad habit of then trying to walk all over you.
Fast forward to my relationships with WG's - I found out the reverse and that the more I treat these WG's as a human being, the more I get from my experiences. Treat 'em bad and they treat you like the customer that you are.
SEAJ
"Treat a 'ho like a lady and a lady like a 'ho."
-- Wilson Mizner (1876-1933)
China Expat
08-31-09, 05:45
Nice guy. But knows as much about Chinese women as he does about nuclear physics.Fortunately he isn't writing about nuclear physics.
I've lived in China for 10 yrs, am married to a Chinese national and have known many more. I'd say those eight chapters are spot-on as a general rule of thumb.
Meiguoguizi
08-31-09, 13:04
"I'm a chinese man married to a white American woman. I know many more white American women.
I've lived in the United States for 10 years..
I've written 8 full chapters to give guidance to other Chinese men who want to be with American women.
I tell you how American women think and how to be successful if you want to marry one."
China Expat
08-31-09, 14:46
"I'm a chinese man married to a white American woman. I know many more white American women.
I've lived in the United States for 10 years.
I've written 8 full chapters to give guidance to other Chinese men who want to be with American women.
I tell you how American women think and how to be successful if you want to marry one."Good start. Now if you add to that you are also a western trained psychologist who has been conducting research on cross-cultural relationships and treating American women married to Chinese men for 10 years, you would have very credible credentials with which to draw some conclusions about those relationships I think.
Not that this will matter to you, but every Chinese woman I've shared those chapters with, including my wife, finds them to be generally true and has commented on how insightful they are.
Chocha Monger
08-31-09, 15:55
I know the writer personally.
His Sichuan girl friend left him when her parents were horrified by her relationship with him.
His current wife is a Filipino that he met in a bar in Hong Kong..
Nice guy. But knows as much about Chinese women as he does about nuclear physics.
So much for a "poor foreigner always being better than a rich Chinese."
"I'm a chinese man married to a white American woman. I know many more white American women.
I've lived in the United States for 10 years..
I've written 8 full chapters to give guidance to other Chinese men who want to be with American women.
I tell you how American women think and how to be successful if you want to marry one."
This is a joke I hope come on own up who are you really.
I think most guys here would want to know how to get rid of them any American woman will take any man with cash or a good credit rating Until bled dry and then spit him out quicker than a BBS girl after a head job. Give me Chinese woman any day at least you can also gain a father and mother and inlaws that look after you when you get old. and you can call him son. hehe.
Starchild2012
09-01-09, 15:28
http://www.chinahush.com/2009/08/31/top-ten-cities-in-china-with-the-most-beautiful-women/
Check this out...top ten cities in China with the most beautiful women :)
Wish i could check the places one by one and comment on the authenticity of the post, not so lucky
anyone ?
http://www.chinahush.com/2009/08/31/top-ten-cities-in-china-with-the-most-beautiful-women/
Check this out...top ten cities in China with the most beautiful women :)
Wish i could check the places one by one and comment on the authenticity of the post, not so lucky
anyone ?If you had a good day, most girls are beautiful, if you had a bad day most girls are probably not.
It does not matter how many more beautiful girls a city has after you made your choice. And if there is only one and you can score, then the one is enough. I am not into statistics.
http://www.chinahush.com/2009/08/31/top-ten-cities-in-china-with-the-most-beautiful-women/
Check this out...top ten cities in China with the most beautiful women :)
Wish i could check the places one by one and comment on the authenticity of the post, not so lucky
anyone ?I would have to agreed about the gals of Dalian.
They are absolutely beautiful.
My top three choice is Dalian, follow by Chongqing(nice long legs but very hot temper) and tie for third place is Suzhou and Changsha.
Sound Stream #2
09-07-09, 13:12
I know the writer personally.
His Sichuan girl friend left him when her parents were horrified by her relationship with him.
His current wife is a Filipino that he met in a bar in Hong Kong..
Nice guy. But knows as much about Chinese women as he does about nuclear physics.
His writing. He is indeed very funny...
because he makes it sound like an instruction manual as if he got his PHD in this...
If you know women, they don't follow the normal expected behavior of guy logic, so don't even try to make sense of what they do as they can be rather irrational at times.
Sound Stream #2
09-07-09, 13:37
Has anybody ever met "Sound Stream #2"? He sounds like Superforce99!
I could almost bet that they are the same person, who is using two (or more?) different handles.
If anybody that I know has ever met SS#2, than please let me know If they are the same person or not. I am curious to know if I am right.
You're wrong. I'm pretty sure of it...
I only have 1 handle.
Sound Stream #2
09-14-09, 15:55
Did the recession just kill off all the mongering?
Why's the board so quiet...
SE Asia Joe
09-14-09, 16:24
Did the recession just kill off all the mongering?
Why's the board so quiet...
So..... why dontcha start with a topic or a report or a comment etc.
Young, good looking guy who knows the moves like you should have tons of exploits to share with us.... so howzabout it. Write sumthin', anythin'!!
SEAJ
Ps. Just a suggestion, but perhaps you should NOT report anything about shaved or unshaved pussy etc - you'll raise Red Rock II's ire again!! Muahahah!!!
SE Asia Joe
09-14-09, 16:32
As a topic of discussion?? I replied on the Shanghai thread this post - but think that it probably is better suited here. Apologies for C+P'ing this - but..... Anyway:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bionicman
.....But they maybe want to address their action where most of hte foreigners go so "to give a lesson", to reduce the bad impression these locations give around the world (and foreigners heavily talking about them do represent a problem for the government)
Of course it is all a bit silly as these establishments are clearly known and visible for locals. But that does not represent a problem for the authorities.
The problem is the "outside world" that knows about and gives a bad impression on their own home ground.
BINGO!! Of course "services" are available - right now, in the past and also in the future BUT - and this is the big BUT - the Chinese government does NOT want China to be known Internationally as a Sex destination as places like PI, LOS etc are. This is, after all, a matter of face and China's face to the rest of the world.
These places are NOT in the same league as China nowadays and IMHO, the Chinese government is Not going to allow their international image to be sullied any further by all these Laowais coming over and boasting about their "Chinese Conquests" etc on ISG as well as other media. Worse of course are these newbies and BSD's who come to China thinking that it is only another sex destination AND acting obnoxiously.
Quite hard to judge what to do on such a forum, though!
Enough is enough I think - and what I would like for guys here to hopefully subscribe to is the idea that we in the ISG community can and should do our part to preserve whatever there is left. Forget about being nice guys and helping out these idiots asking things like - where's the big tits, where are the easiest place to score freebies, give me the contact for that hottie, is CG a good source? Where can I get a reliable service etc etc. All idiotic requests and ones that us old timers have no need to ask for.
Let these new guys go and find it all out themselves and get burned if need be. Oh I know that this is probably NOT in the usual spirit of ISG - but like I said, we need to preserve whatever is left of the action for us foreigners that there is in China - without making any lee ways for newbies to spoil it any more for us who needs to stay and monger locally.
Apologies if I offend anybody - but please note that this is purely IMHO and one that has been formed from having witnessed some of the excesses of these BSD's who once a while wash up on "our shores" so to call (yeah yeah, some one's gonna tell me that I really am full of it thinking and stating that these are OUR shores!! but.......).
Look-it, just about all of us have been warning that the "coast is not really clear" these days - and what kind of questions do we instead get?? Are you sure?? Did you actually experience it yourself or is it just hearsay? Come on, it cain't really be all that bad??!! What are the chances....?" IDIOTIC!! totally idiotic.
Peace
SEAJ
Sound Stream #2
09-15-09, 03:50
So..... why dontcha start with a topic or a report or a comment etc.
Young, good looking guy who knows the moves like you should have tons of exploits to share with us.... so howzabout it. Write sumthin', anythin'!!
SEAJ
Ps. Just a suggestion, but perhaps you should NOT report anything about shaved or unshaved pussy etc - you'll raise Red Rock II's ire again!! Muahahah!!!
SEAJ, I'm haven't been back to China for a long while. Those were great times, but the reality is that I'm just going to have fun here secretly in the States instead. I've been having a blast lately. Some of my sessions here were so amazing, I can't say the skill level and intensity in China can ever compete. A lot of times, I think the girls in China are just inexperienced compared to women in the states.
Being young and good looking doesn't make a woman want to bang you. Most girls aren't going to bang you just for being good looking. The guy needs to know how to demonstate perceived value in order to separate himself as a winner among all the other lame guys who want to get in her pants. If you learn to fall into the habit of doing all the things most guys are used to doing, she can't help but to categorize you with all the other guys whose tried. That's a receipe for disaster. You've got to be different in all your approaches and behavior than every other guy who has tried.
As I mature, I came to realize that there is no real free lunch with women. Most women (if they are single) will only sleep with you because they secretly want something from you, like something that will lead to a relationship, or other self gain for her in some form or another. With these women, once they know that they're not going to get what they were secretly after from you, they'll leave. That's why I believe mongers are smart people. They pay for it to avoid commitment, drama, and headache.
Once in a while you'll get crazy women who are only looking for some revenge bonking to get even with their boy friend for pissing them off. And then there are aging ladies who haven't gotten any in a long time, and are neglected. They some how are starting to doubt their own beauty and desirability, and need to go out looking to bang a guy to validate themselves and make them feel special. As for me, I am totally not into MILFs. I like them young, model like, and hot.
What I learned in life is that it's can be tough and tiring to go chasing after women. But that's the reality most guys face.
That was when I figured out that even the way I was doing things was not even the best way. It's tiring, fun, but extremely time consuming. I found that the best way was to have beautiful women come to you, and not you to them. Look at Huge Heifner, rock stars, and celebrities. They have it easy. Until I find a way to master that like them, I am simply wasting time...
SE Asia Joe
09-15-09, 04:49
SEAJ, I'm haven't been back to China for a long while. Those were great times, but the reality is that I'm just going to have fun here secretly in the States instead. I've been having a blast lately. Some of my sessions here were so amazing, I can't say the skill level and intensity in China can ever compete. A lot of times, I think the girls in China are just inexperienced compared to women in the states.
Being young and good looking doesn't make a woman want to bang you. Most time...
Gotcha collared huh?!
We oughta have a sub-thread about what guys get up to back home AFTER they've been in China!! We got lots "walking woundeds" just drudging around their lives and waiting... just waiting till they can get back on that Silver Bird to the Middle Kingdom!
And then we've got you who seems to have settled back in with both feet planted on the ground and his middle leg still active. Got the "game" down pat huh?
So come on in - bring in the idle chatter - you cain't be out on the hunt all the time back home can you? Hell, I betcha whatever there is to hunt back there takes too much $$, too much travelling and too much time and effort compared to here - so spend some time here and honor us with your input.
Ciao
SEAJ
As I mature, I came to realize that there is no real free lunch with women. .
What I learned in life is that it's can be tough and tiring to go chasing after women. But that's the reality most guys face.
...
When you're young and getting established your career, you go chasing after women.
When you're mature and established in your life, women go chasing after you.
Course there's no free lunch when you're mature. They (the young, hot, and usually unaccomplished girls) want your hard earned money! If guys are smart, they'd date/go after the established and successful women, but those require a lot of maintenance and compromise on the guy's part (which is very reasonable, but difficult for the guys to do). Practical vs. Unrealistic.
But money aside, in my opinion, being able to successfully chase women depends on finding one's own niche. Something that, in a competitive environment, makes you stand out. Whether it's being charming, humorous, worldly, etc. I remember reading an article in a magazine that says if you can't get a date, stay home and "learn" something...like juggling. That's why many would agree that foreigners or ABCs do very well with da ladies if he knows a bit of Chinese. A couple of ISGers are taking up the language just so they can come back. Little things matter when you're in a competition.
Right now, I'm enjoying the dating scene. I enjoy going to China for pleasure, but dating when I'm back is much more "real" and satisfying. I mean, dating to see if I can get the girl based on conversation and enjoying each other's company makes my daily life interesting. Vacationing in China, I enjoy to my heart's content. It's like the best of both worlds.
Chocha Monger
09-15-09, 16:39
When you're young and getting established your career, you go chasing after women.
When you're mature and established in your life, women go chasing after you.
Course there's no free lunch when you're mature. They (the young, hot, and usually unaccomplished girls) want your hard earned money! If guys are smart, they'd date/go after the established and successful women, but those require a lot of maintenance and compromise on the guy's part (which is very reasonable, but difficult for the guys to do). Practical vs. Unrealistic.
I had a professor who pointed out this irony. It's true a young man's energy would be better spent creating wealth and career success instead of chasing pussy. Once successful a man can wait like a grizzly for the salmon to swim upstream and leap into his waiting jaws without expending much energy.
I've never really understood the actual dynamics of Chinese WG's and their Boyfriends. NOw I'm all the more confused.
I see her and shake my head for I really don't know whether to pity her for actually doing one of the hardest and most dignity-robbing jobs I know of, all in the name of "love", be disgusted by her for her ignorant devotion to a guy who's a total loser, or to admire her for her total selflessness and one-minded strength. All in the name of love.
I've never known love this strong - and thus I most likely also envy her BF.
Have you asked about her family? The parents could have treated her horribly for years...until she met her BF who treated her slightly better (but still better than her parents). Is it any wonder she'd follow him since the alternative's a dead end?
And truth be told 90% of the mongers make outrageous promises or dreams which never materialize. the crappy BF is the only reality she has. And yes, poor girls, it's really a pity since many of them have a good heart and an innocence lost at such an early age.
...
But money aside, in my opinion, being able to successfully chase women depends on finding one's own niche. Something that, in a competitive environment, makes you stand out. Whether it's being charming, humorous, worldly, etc. I remember reading an article in a magazine that says if you can't get a date, stay home and "learn" something...like juggling. That's why many would agree that foreigners or ABCs do very well with da ladies if he knows a bit of Chinese. A couple of ISGers are taking up the language just so they can come back. Little things matter when you're in a competition.
...
I concur with the learned comments above.
Message to all da brothers out there having fun: your fun (and safety) will be improved the more Mandarin (or Cantonese) language you can use.
I speak from experience. For the first year, Mandarin was incomprehensible. But ... hey ... Mandarin (and its close allies) is the mother tongue of maybe 1 billion people and not all of them are geniuses.
The second year, Mandarin started to make sense, especially when I could master the tones and understood the significance of the radicals.
Now, each week and often each day, another little breakthrough ... with fewer breakdowns.
Knowing Mandarin gives you a comparative advantage and the gals will love you all the more for it.
Just my experience.
Enjoy.
P13
SE Asia Joe
09-16-09, 06:24
Have you asked about her family? The parents could have treated her horribly for years...until she met her BF who treated her slightly better (but still better than her parents). Is it any wonder she'd follow him since the alternative's a dead end?
And truth be told 90% of the mongers make outrageous promises or dreams which never materialize. the crappy BF is the only reality she has. And yes, poor girls, it's really a pity since many of them have a good heart and an innocence lost at such an early age.
My goodness BT - when did the transformation occur??
From eager to try anything/everything, wide eyed doe in the headlights, Happy Go Lucky Young man to this pensive and thinking mature gentleman?!! Hell Pushkin even writes that your comments are learned!!
Must be that S.B. - he's totally corrupted you!!
AND
When you're young and getting established your career, you go chasing after women.
When you're mature and established in your life, women go chasing after you.
Course there's no free lunch when you're mature. WOT???!!!
Jeez, you sound like an old codger.... like me!!
OK enuff fooling around!
Whilst all you say is probably true - I like best your comment ".....I remember reading an article in a magazine that says if you can't get a date, stay home and "learn" something...like juggling......" Coz you musta been practising your juggling or whatever it is that you been learning - coz me do think your naturalness is what lots of gals.... and guys too I guess... like about you!!
so quit your pretending to be all old and wise - don't behove you - not at all!!
Just IMHO!!!!!
SEAJ
Clean Gene
09-16-09, 07:25
When you're young and getting established your career, you go chasing after women.
When you're mature and established in your life, women go chasing after you.
Right now, I'm enjoying the dating scene. I enjoy going to China for pleasure, but dating when I'm back is much more "real" and satisfying. I mean, dating to see if I can get the girl based on conversation and enjoying each other's company makes my daily life interesting. Vacationing in China, I enjoy to my heart's content. It's like the best of both worlds.
Or you can bump into someone with whom you really click. Usually this only happens when you are young. My first wife was the best. I should have appreciated her more.
After the 1st, keep both eyes wide open. The smart ones chase you for your talent, your money and your parent's money. Better also to keep an extra pair of eyes to help (your ex's, who still cares about you; your mother's etc.)
My Ex, my mother and my aunt were so much wiser than I in judging good fillies that there is no comparison.
CG
SE Asia Joe
09-16-09, 08:42
Or you can bump into someone with whom you really click. Usually this only happens when you are young. My first wife was the best. I should have appreciated her more.
After the 1st, keep both eyes wide open. The smart ones chase you for your talent, your money and your parent's money. Better also to keep an extra pair of eyes to help (your ex's, who still cares about you; your mother's etc.)
My Ex, my mother and my aunt were so much wiser than I in judging good fillies that there is no comparison.
CG
Nostalgia? Regrets? Warm and fuzzy feeling from the memory??
So how come you're not back with your ex? Probably none of my business - but from the tone in your post, I do detect that you really like/miss/want your ex back. So why not go for it guy??
Tell me to MYOB if you feel so inclined. I won't mind as I know I probably deserve it!!
Peace!!
SEAJ
SE Asia Joe
09-16-09, 08:50
Have you asked about her family? The parents could have treated her horribly for years...until she met her BF who treated her slightly better (but still better than her parents). Is it any wonder she'd follow him since the alternative's a dead end?
And truth be told 90% of the mongers make outrageous promises or dreams which never materialize. the crappy BF is the only reality she has. And yes, poor girls, it's really a pity since many of them have a good heart and an innocence lost at such an early age.
Oh I guess I'd better reply to your questions huh!
Her Dad died and her mom went nuts after he died; I mean really nuts and not able to communicate etc anymore nuts. So she's actually all alone and the ony close person she has is her boyfriend.... and me I guess!!
Actually she's such a lonely person and yes - I do see that she does have a good heart and thaqt she had truly lost her innocence way too early.
The stories we run across in China. Truly incredible tales of tragedies, bravery, selfless sacrifice, blind love/devotion, etc AND also tales from the other spectrum - That of greed, cheating, lust, heartlessness etc. The whole gamut of tales!! Oh well!!
SEAJ
I have some Taiwan friends who went to China to find the pretty girls. Since they have a good job, education and some money, they had their pick of the girls. My 3 Taiwan friends really took their time to find the love of their life. All the girls they met were regular girls introduced family friends, relatives, etc. After a few years of looking and dating, they all found their soul mate. I have met the ladies that they married, they were between 26-29 years old, slim and very pretty, and the guys were 36-41 years old so the age were pretty well matched.
Fast forward a few years and now all 3 guys are unhappy. They have a wonderful wives and a couple of them have a child. The problem was that the guys miss the fun lives that they had before they got married. They miss going to KTV, the BBS and having fun with all the single guys who are doing what most of the guys in this forum are doing.
They now just staying home with their family and missing the good life.
So guys, be careful of what you wish. The grass is not always greener on the other side.
Just letting you guys that travel all over the world and having fun, know how lucky you are.
Clean Gene
09-17-09, 05:51
Nostalgia? Regrets? Warm and fuzzy feeling from the memory??
So how come you're not back with your ex? Probably none of my business - but from the tone in your post, I do detect that you really like/miss/want your ex back. So why not go for it guy??
Tell me to MYOB if you feel so inclined. I won't mind as I know I probably deserve it!!
Peace!!
SEAJ
SEAJ,
Good question. I visit the old ex at least one week every 4 months. I like my old side of the house (which is a roomy 3,000 sq ft next to a private garden and forest. The footage includes a deck from which I can see the LA skyline as well as the Vincent Thomas Bridge and ships coming to port). The Ex also schedules theater, concerts, museum viewings as well as dinner with a few old friends. These are friends she would lose without me; and I would perhaps lose without her. (Several of my old friends, for instance, still maintain contact with me, but their wives won't have me at their home. They are too fond of my Ex.)
We also go to a 'foot massage' place together where she gets an acupressure massage from a graduate of a Chinese Traditional Medicine College, and I get a massage from a young bra-less Changchun girl.
My Chinese "country girl" wife allows this grudgingly. She says she still loves me, but no longer 'likes' me. And my Ex tolerates "country girl" because she can 'trust' her to care for me.
CG
After a few years of looking and dating, they all found their soul mate. I have met the ladies that they married, they were between 26-29 years old, slim and very pretty, and the guys were 36-41 years old so the age were pretty well matched.
I've always thought it'd be easy to bag a Chinese gal who's in the marital age range. Get her to sign a prenup agreement, get her knocked up, and have everything in the guy's name would pretty much make her a guy's property. Bring her to another country to further isolate her and have her re-taught to the guy's cultural values.
It almost sounds too easy as this is done with Vietnamese/Philippine/Thai brides.
SE Asia Joe
09-18-09, 16:47
SEAJ,
Good question. I visit the old ex at least one week every 4 months. I like my old side of the house (which is a roomy 3,000 sq ft next to a private garden and forest. The footage includes a deck from which I can see the LA skyline as well as the Vincent Thomas Bridge and ships coming to port). The Ex also schedules theater, concerts, museum viewings as well as dinner with a few old friends. These are friends she would lose without me; and I would perhaps lose without her. (Several of my old friends, for instance, still maintain contact with me, but their wives won't have me at their home. They are too fond of my Ex.)
We also go to a 'foot massage' place together where she gets an acupressure massage from a graduate of a Chinese Traditional Medicine College, and I get a massage from a young bra-less Changchun girl.
My Chinese "country girl" wife allows this grudgingly. She says she still loves me, but no longer 'likes' me. And my Ex tolerates "country girl" because she can 'trust' her to care for me.
CG
Sounds like you're in a good groove! The only thing that seems to be a fly in all that cream is of course that your "country Gal" wife don't like you too much!! What's with that?? She still spitting out the chicken bones on the table?
You know what's the best cure for wives that "Love you but don't like you" bullshit?? A dose of hard reality. And what I suggest is that you just get your ass to LAX and get on that silver bird to China - and just tell her that you need to take care of some business or whatever in China.
Let her wonder, let her worry, let her know that you ain't gonna take her shit and that you DO have alternatives. NO - do NOT spell it all out for her i.e. that you're gonna screw around over here, but just let it be known that you ARE your own man. If I know Chinese gals, I'd predict that she'd soon toe the line.
Just a suggestion and hell, don't get on my case if it all blows up in your face though!!
IMHO
SEAJ
Ps. how the hell did ISG get turned into a marriage counseling forum???!!
Chocha Monger
09-18-09, 17:55
SEAJ:
Why would Chinese girls give any trouble? Last I heard Chinese girls were willing to pay 10K U.S. dollars for an American husband.
I've always thought it'd be easy to bag a Chinese gal who's in the marital age range. Get her to sign a prenup agreement, get her knocked up, and have everything in the guy's name would pretty much make her a guy's property. Bring her to another country to further isolate her and have her re-taught to the guy's cultural values.
It almost sounds too easy as this is done with Vietnamese/Philippine/Thai brides.
My Taiwan friends had no problem finding girls. It took them a while because they were very picky. I think one guy went through 500 girls before he found the right one. Just about everyone in China knows someone with a daughter that wants to get married.
My Taiwan friends were in demand because they are from Taiwan therefore have basically the same culture, language, college educated, have great paying jobs, etc. The other plus is that the girl can visit her family any time she wants since Taiwan is only about 45 minutes from China by plane.
The problem was that they don't like given up their freedom. They used to come to China just about every weekend. They would leave work early on Friday and be in Shenzhen by 5PM and Leave late Sunday night. While meeting all the good girls, they would have fun with the P4P girls.
Now that they are married, their life is just work, wife and baby.
SEAJ:
Why would Chinese girls give any trouble? Last I heard Chinese girls were willing to pay 10K U.S. dollars for an American husband.
Actually here in California, the prices is over $40K U.S. dollars.
Chocha Monger
09-18-09, 20:08
Actually here in California, the prices is over $40K U.S. dollars.
Sounds like a bargain considering that marrying an American woman would probably set you back by that amount just going into the marriage. Not to mention the years of pain and suffering to follow.
SE Asia Joe
09-19-09, 02:13
SEAJ:
Why would Chinese girls give any trouble? Last I heard Chinese girls were willing to pay 10K U.S. dollars for an American husband.
If you think American women can give you "troubles" - you'd be in for a helluva surprise if you ever marry a Chinese gal and YOU DID NOT TRAIN HER WELL!!
Train a Chinese gal properly.......wellllll...!!
SEAJ
SEAJ:
Why would Chinese girls give any trouble? Last I heard Chinese girls were willing to pay 10K U.S. dollars for an American husband.Chocha M.
I believe you need to add a multiplier into that number, unless the guy is fugly. If you are interested in selling yourself for $10K, your friend selling your ass is making a few more $10Ks than you are.
Check around
Chocha Monger
09-19-09, 03:12
If you think American women can give you "troubles" - you'd be in for a helluva surprise if you ever marry a Chinese gal and YOU DID NOT TRAIN HER WELL!!
Train a Chinese gal properly.......wellllll...!!
SEAJ
Does that mean?
1. Keep her gainfully employed.
2. At least 2 to 3 pops each day.
3. Oily massage at least once a week.
4. Business trips to China whenever she behaves bad.
If you think American women can give you "troubles" - you'd be in for a helluva surprise if you ever marry a Chinese gal and YOU DID NOT TRAIN HER WELL!!
Train a Chinese gal properly.......wellllll...!!
SEAJI agree 100% Joe. As you know, I am going thru my own troubles with my own Chinese wife
SE Asia Joe
09-19-09, 03:40
Does that mean?
1. Keep her gainfully employed.
2. At least 2 to 3 pops each day.
3. Oily massage at least once a week.
4. Business trips to China whenever she behaves bad.
That's only a tiny bit of the training. A tiny bit.
More important is ATTITUDE - that's what gotta be beat into a China woman for her to be any good.
SEAJ
Does that mean?
1. Keep her gainfully employed.
2. At least 2 to 3 pops each day.
3. Oily massage at least once a week.
4. Business trips to China whenever she behaves bad.The right attitude is not to marry her but to keep her as a mistress and leave her in China. If she behaves badly, throw the bitach out and find a replacement. Clear and simple. The cost of maintaining in China is helluva cheaper than marrying the biatch.
Just my two rmb on this.
Chocha Monger
09-19-09, 08:10
The right attitude is not to marry her but to keep her as a mistress and leave her in China. If she behaves badly, throw the bitach out and find a replacement. Clear and simple. The cost of maintaining in China is helluva cheaper than marrying the biatch.
Just my two rmb on this.
Bnlee, I also have the option of keeping her in a third country friendly to China where I can guarantee her entry on a visa without marital preconditions like the USA. Is that the right attitude?
- you'd be in for a helluva surprise if you ever marry a Chinese gal and YOU DID NOT TRAIN HER WELL!!
Train a Chinese gal properly.......wellllll...!!
Taming of the Shrew (or Kiss Me Kate if you'd prefer the modern musical version). Shakespeare himself left his wife in Stratford to go to London and came back when he was close to dying. In his will, he left his wife "the second best" bed and a few nick-nacks. The house and all went to the kids.
Chinese women should be used to the "re-education" program since that's what their gov't does to "troublemakers." I guess it's even expected! Heck, their parents treat them like crap (favoritism to males) yet they are still loyal and bring home the bacon.
Petruchio tamed his wife the way she should be trained and got an obedient and model wife (along with her money, but that's neither here or there...), while the pretty Bianca started pushing around her hubby right after they were married.
Woo during courtship. Become firm n decisive as a fiancee. After the "I do's", assert your authority!
Chocha Monger
09-19-09, 08:47
Taming of the Shrew (or Kiss Me Kate if you'd prefer the modern musical version). Shakespeare himself left his wife in Stratford to go to London and came back when he was close to dying. In his will, he left his wife "the second best" bed and a few nick-nacks. The house and all went to the kids.
Chinese women should be used to the "re-education" program since that's what their gov't does to "troublemakers." I guess it's even expected! Heck, their parents treat them like crap (favoritism to males) yet they are still loyal and bring home the bacon.
Petruchio tamed his wife the way she should be trained and got an obedient and model wife (along with her money, but that's neither here or there...), while the pretty Bianca started pushing around her hubby right after they were married.
Woo during courtship. Become firm n decisive as a fiancee. After the "I do's", assert your authority!
Jeez, this sounds almost as bad as international diplomacy. Gradual escalation, tough negotiations, brinkmanship and then unilateralism. I can't wait!
SE Asia Joe
09-19-09, 10:13
Taming of the Shrew (or Kiss Me Kate if you'd prefer the modern musical version). Shakespeare himself left his wife in Stratford to go to London and came back when he was close to dying. In his will, he left his wife "the second best" bed and a few nick-nacks. The house and all went to the kids.
Chinese women should be used to the "re-education" program since that's what their gov't does to "troublemakers." I guess it's even expected! Heck, their parents treat them like crap (favoritism to males) yet they are still loyal and bring home the bacon.
Petruchio tamed his wife the way she should be trained and got an obedient and model wife (along with her money, but that's neither here or there...), while the pretty Bianca started pushing around her hubby right after they were married.
Woo during courtship. Become firm n decisive as a fiancee. After the "I do's", assert your authority!
WTF???!!!
Shakespeare??!!
Marital Advise??!!
From BeeTee??!!
Jeez... now I KNOW that S.B. has done and truly and thoroughly corrupted you.
SEAJ
From BeeTee??!!
Jeez... now I KNOW that S.B. has done and truly and thoroughly corrupted you.
That's it! Now Sir, You've made me angry (and you wouldn't like me when I'm angry). Time for a taste of your own medicine!
Checking the times from some of your recent grumpy posts, I've noticed that you've posted quite a bit on Sept. 19 morning, afternoon, and now around 5pm. On a SATURDAY!! What is SEAJ doing in front of a computer on a SATURDAY and on an AFTERNOON for that matter?! Hmmm...
I'm betting SEAJ is somewhere far from sweet young pussy!
A-ha!
Almost every Fri, Sat, and Sun, afternoons are prime times for his romps. One romp, then he's all normal and as testimonials from many ISGers, he's a great guy to hang with. At KTV in the evening, he's all attentive to his girl and drinking casually. Two romps in the afternoon, then he's all mello jello and giving out sage advice while in the evening he's gleefully groping everyone's girl. Three romps in the afternoon, then he's all guru and in the evening, singing and acting all crazy at the KTV.
A-ha!!
Now, he usually post fun posts on Sun, Mon, and Tues. But on Thurs and occasionally Fri, his posts turn grumpy and impatient!
A-Ha!!!
Now since this is a China Woman (Opinion and Advice) thread, How does having a Chinese woman have an affect on our SEAJ? Well, the proof is in the pudding! He's GRUMPY without 'em!! And so, for the love of having a happy ISG site, here's something for SEAJ....
Please return to your normal routine you do every Fri, Sat, and Sun afternoons.
Bwhahahaha
BT
SE Asia Joe
09-19-09, 14:28
That's it! Now Sir, You've made me angry (and you wouldn't like me when I'm angry). Time for a taste of your own medicine!
Checking the times from some of your recent grumpy posts, I've noticed that you've posted quite a bit on Sept. 19 morning, afternoon, and now around 5pm. On a SATURDAY!! What is SEAJ doing in front of a computer on a SATURDAY and on an AFTERNOON for that matter?! Hmmm...
I'm betting SEAJ is somewhere far from sweet young pussy!
A-ha!
Almost every Fri, Sat, and Sun, afternoons are prime times for his romps. One romp, then he's all normal and as testimonials from many ISGers, he's a great guy to hang with. At KTV in the evening, he's all attentive to his girl and drinking casually. Two romps in the afternoon, then he's all mello jello and giving out sage advice while in the evening he's gleefully groping everyone's girl. Three romps in the afternoon, then he's all guru and in the evening, singing and acting all crazy at the KTV.
A-ha!!
Now, he usually post fun posts on Sun, Mon, and Tues. But on Thurs and occasionally Fri, his posts turn grumpy and impatient!
A-Ha!!!
Now since this is a China Woman (Opinion and Advice) thread, How does having a Chinese woman have an affect on our SEAJ? Well, the proof is in the pudding! He's GRUMPY without 'em!! And so, for the love of having a happy ISG site, here's something for SEAJ....
Please return to your normal routine you do every Fri, Sat, and Sun afternoons.
Bwhahahaha
BT
Oooooops!! Caught!! really caught!!
Yup, you're 100% CORRECT! I am away from my drug of choice - Chinese gals and I am being all goody goody back home these past few days. And you're right - it's not only making me grumpy, it's making me down right nasty and ornery!!
Hell, I'm even taking on Meat Loaf in Nicaragua - now how crazy is THAT?!
Gotta get back.... soon!!
Come to think of it - how do YOU GUYS do it?? I mean, go to CP, Zhuhai, Shenzhen or wherever, party night and day and screw screw screw - and then having to come back home and get back to "normal" for how ever many months it takes before you can get back?? Hell, its been just over a week for me now and I'm going totally bonkers already - as evidenced by my recent writings here.
And let me take this opportunity to apologize to one and all here who I've been blasting these past few days. Yes, even those newbie BSDicks who invariably washes up around South China when the Canton trade fair rolls along.
Cap in hand, eyes downcast, saying solly solly solly!!
SEAJ
OldAsiaHand
09-19-09, 14:49
SEAJ:
Why would Chinese girls give any trouble? Last I heard Chinese girls were willing to pay 10K U.S. dollars for an American husband.
Last I heard, the price was 65k USD.
Just my POV.
OAH
Can be good. If you are in a city that has Korean Spas, Saunas or health centers. A little more $$ but they are good.
Oooooops!! Caught!! really caught!!
Yup, you're 100% CORRECT! I am away from my drug of choice - Chinese gals and I am being all goody goody back home these past few days. And you're right - it's not only making me grumpy, it's making me down right nasty and ornery!!
Hell, I'm even taking on Meat Loaf in Nicaragua - now how crazy is THAT?!
Gotta get bqck.... soon!!
Come to think of it - how do YOU GUYS do it?? I mean, go to CP, Zhuhai, Shenzhen or wherever, party night and day and screw screw screw - and then having to come back home and get back to "normal" for how ever many months it takes before you can get back?? Hell, its been just over a week for me now and I'm going totally bonkers already - as evidenced by my recent writings here.
And let me take this opportunity to apologize to one and all here who I've been blasting these past few days. Yes, even those newbie BSDicks who invariably washes up around South China when the Canton trade fair rolls along.
Cap in hand, eyes downcast, saying solly solly solly!!
SEAJ
I feel so cheap. About 5 years ago I was offered only US$20K to marry a Chinese girl for the purpose of an Australian residence permit. Maybe thats the going rate for Australia?
Chocha Monger
09-19-09, 17:57
Last I heard, the price was 65k USD.
Just my POV.
OAH
Now that is a dowry that can help ease the pain of marriage. No American man should marry without one. It sure beats the alternative of paying out anywhere north of 10k for a diamond ring before marrying an American woman then paying several times as much to escape from her after a few years of intense suffering.
SE Asia Joe
09-20-09, 08:44
Now that is a dowry that can help ease the pain of marriage. No American man should marry without one. It sure beats the alternative of paying out anywhere north of 10k for a diamond ring before marrying an American woman then paying several times as much to escape from her after a few years of intense suffering.
Don't hold your breath!! $60 - 65K IS the going price for the GAL to pay to get "married" to a U.S. citizen in order for her to get a Green card. But it is NOT what the broker will offer you to get married to her.
The "fee" she has to pay will need to be re-paid back when she's settled in the U.S. - working either at a sweat shop, a hoor house or if she's lucky, at a Chinese restaurant. Meanwhile, she is under the total control of the "snake-head" who retains her green card, passport (if she still has it) and close watch over her family back home - with threats of (and sometimes actual) physical and other harm to them if she steps out of line. And even after she pays off the first agreed upon fee, many times these snake-heads continue to prey upon these gals and bleed them dry.
so you'll only get a fraction of that $65K -= and don't even think that you'd be getting "access" - sex or otherwise - to her meanwhile
BTW guys, our friend Chocha is now known as "SIR Chocha Monger, Earl of Rooting Them" on the Meat Loaf in Nicaragua thread, where I've staged a coup D'Etat and ousted Meat Loaf (at least for now!!) and we're having (errr... at least I am!!) a blast just pimping around. You may want to join our conquest of Nicaragua - and I, the supreme exalted excellency WILL allow you to join any post in my cabinet and allow you to take on ANY title!!
SEAJ
Chocha Monger
09-20-09, 09:11
Don't hold your breath!! $60 - 65K IS the going price for the GAL to pay to get "married" to a U.S. citizen in order for her to get a Green card. But it is NOT what the broker will offer you to get married to her.
The "fee" she has to pay will need to be re-paid back when she's settled in the U.S. - working either at a sweat shop, a hoor house or if she's lucky, at a Chinese restaurant. Meanwhile, she is under the total control of the "snake-head" who retains her green card, passport (if she still has it) and close watch over her family back home - with threats of (and sometimes actual) physical and other harm to them if she steps out of line. And even after she pays off the first agreed upon fee, many times these snake-heads continue to prey upon these gals and bleed them dry.
so you'll only get a fraction of that $65K -= and don't even think that you'd be getting "access" - sex or otherwise - to her meanwhile
BTW guys, our friend Chocha is now known as "SIR Chocha Monger, Earl of Rooting Them" on the Meat Loaf in Nicaragua thread, where we're having (errr... at least I am!!) a blast just pimping around. You may want to join our conquest of Nicaragua - and I, the supreme exalted excellency WILL allow you to join any post in my cabinet and allow you to take on ANY title!!
SEAJ
I never did like paying retail or using brokers. Seems that I'll have to go straight to the source. SEAJ, I'm sure that you must know many China dolls who would like to have a shot at slaving away under the US debt system. Full access rooting and otherwise is a must for it to meet the conditions of a bonafide marriage. Feel free to PM details. You'd be surprised to know how many guys pay off these girls debts to save them from the Chinese restaurants. It doesn't make much sense though. It's like paying to take on really bad risk and we've seen how that one worked out for the US economy.
OldAsiaHand
09-20-09, 10:27
I feel so cheap. About 5 years ago I was offered only US$20K to marry a Chinese girl for the purpose of an Australian residence permit. Maybe thats the going rate for Australia?
Pig Fat,
I was offered US$30k in 1994 for USA green card. The 65k number came from reliable sources around a few years ago. It may be more now.
OAH
OAH
I was offered US $10k for USA green card in college. Very cute girl would not date.
Trend - 10K, 30K and now 65K plus.
S7
Pig Fat,
I was offered US$30k in 1994 for USA green card. The 65k number came from reliable sources around a few years ago. It may be more now.
OAH
Chocha Monger
09-20-09, 19:44
OAH
I was offered US $10k for USA green card in college. Very cute girl would not date.
Trend - 10K, 30K and now 65K plus.
S7
Did those prices include marital privileges? For 10K I would imagine they did.
Clean Gene
09-20-09, 20:31
Sounds like you're in a good groove! The only thing that seems to be a fly in all that cream is of course that your "country Gal" wife don't like you too much!! What's with that?? She still spitting out the chicken bones on the table?
You know what's the best cure for wives that "Love you but don't like you" bullshit?? A dose of hard reality. And what I suggest is that you just get your ass to LAX and get on that silver bird to China - and just tell her that you need to take care of some business or whatever in China.
Let her wonder, let her worry, let her know that you ain't gonna take her shit and that you DO have alternatives. NO - do NOT spell it all out for her i.e. that you're gonna screw around over here, but just let it be known that you ARE your own man. If I know Chinese gals, I'd predict that she'd soon toe the line.
Just a suggestion and hell, don't get on my case if it all blows up in your face though!!
IMHO
SEAJ
Ps. how the hell did ISG get turned into a marriage counseling forum???!!
SEAJ,
Thanks for suggestions. I try to follow without making gratuitous enemies.
Tomorrow have to fly to Europe for an appointment-crowded week and a half. Then back to Bay Area a couple of weeks. Then LA for one week.
And finally back to my place in China. Where I can do paperwork in the evening or even enjoy dinner at my favorite restaurant while having a few hours of BBBJ. Followed by some delicious young fuc*-tube lubricated by her own cum juice.
CG
OldAsiaHand
09-21-09, 10:12
Did those prices include marital privileges? For 10K I would imagine they did.
My offer was strictly a business proposition. No priveleges whatsoever.
OAH
SE Asia Joe
09-21-09, 16:00
SEAJ,
Thanks for suggestions. I try to follow without making gratuitous enemies.
Tomorrow have to fly to Europe for an appointment-crowded week and a half. Then back to Bay Area a couple of weeks. Then LA for one week.
And finally back to my place in China. Where I can do paperwork in the evening or even enjoy dinner at my favorite restaurant while having a few hours of BBBJ. Followed by some delicious young fuc*-tube lubricated by her own cum juice.
CGSounds like a plan!! Hope you pull it off.
IF you're interested, you MAY want to check my posting on the Meat Loaf in Nicaragua thread on my further thoughts on "training" Chinese gals.
(don't ask me why I posted it on that thread - long long story!!)
SEAJ
Co-live for two years or till the issuance of Green card.
Did those prices include marital privileges? For 10K I would imagine they did.
Chocha Monger
09-22-09, 20:07
I am still on my quest to find my Chinese girl with the porcelain complexion of a Hong Kong beauty and the alluring structure of a Chongqing doll. I've met a few potential candidates all petite cute and flirtatious. Unfortunately, none have the combination of attributes required above. Not many girls have been able to amuse me beyond six months. Those who have succeeded in doing so usually have some special qualities. If she can sing that will probably close the deal. I'm a real sucker for a girl who can sing.
I have a strange feeling that SE Asia Joe has some KTV doll fitting the aforementioned description but he is selfishly keeping her hidden away for himself. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ttAKEwXKD5s
Some more grist for the mill.
While flying to Australia from Europe, I met a some Chinese cousins in my Hong Kong hotel lobby. One exchanged email with me and by odd coincidence, her cousin lived in California 40 minutes from my location. So, I struck up a friendship with a nice girl. The woman was unhappily married and she told me she had to confess this. She married a rich American but he was basically keeping her locked up in the house and didn't like her learning English or studying, etc. She also found out after the fact he was old and sick, he soon had triple by-pass surgery, and has diabetes. She took care of him and he bought a car but she never owned it, he loaned it to her. So, she had a better lifestyle in California, but had quit her good job in Shanghai and was now unable to work or see friends, etc. She had a university degree in China while her rich American husband was a semi-literate but wealthy businessman. Anyway, we became an item and she eventually separated. She was the most sexually giving woman I have been with. She would do everything and anything I suggested, with a giggle and a smile. She would take any suggestion I would make and would comply. If time was a factor, at first we met at a motel and would go for four pops and lunch. She was very busy working and going to school, without enough money to do so. She was incredibly hardworking and was also very bright. I was truly impressed with her and she was incredibly kind and attentive when I had a visit from my father. She was loyal and kind, an ideal partner for most guys.
BUT. She went crazy with jealousy when some idiot woman friend called me. I let her doubt me by my own casual talk about other girls. I learned that you can NOT JOKE about fucking other girls with a girl like Shanghai Lil. She forever believed I was fooling around with other girls. I can see why she believed that.
I had a family emergency and she was coming to my house so I had my friend let her in and she could wait for me. She was overcome by curiosity and went through my desk. She found pictures of girls I posted here, babes I fucked in various adventures. She was totally freaked out and said I was a crazy sex addict and had often consorted with prostitutes. Well, I guess I'm guilty.
We were apart for months as I dealt with this family health emergency in another state. To help ease my stress, Shanghai Lil would do strip shows on skype for me, touching her pussy and rubbing it, and really turning me on. Wow, nice effort!
Today, just as I am finally coming back home, she has informed me that I am probably not the guy for her. Ironically, being away from her made me more certain I liked spending my time with her, as much as possible for as long as possible. Well, she probably figured I was not the one to give her what she really wants: children.
Now, when we began dating, she made a point that she did NOT want to change my lifestyle. But, now that she is finally divorced, and is doing her own little business, I guess her life is serious. I also guess her age as close to 40.
Anyway, she was as good as any girl I have dated. She did not try to spend my money, actually she was generous. She was also sexually very generous, and was excellent in that area.She had a fantastic figure and kept it in shape. She had a good disposition and was very well educated. Overall, a very nice girl.
A woman from Beijing warned me about her because she is from Shanghai. But, I really don't think she was a gold-digger. She is just like all women, they want a house with a picket fence and a couple of kids. We guys want a girlfriend usually and can skip the rest of the package and the stresses it gives.
I will say that she had some Mr. Spock qualities when explaining my pros and cons to her needs.
The one thing about her was she was overly attentive and in return demanded complete loyalty. She had a tiny bit of a control issue. I am nice to people but am mature enough to not expect reciprocation. Many people are selfish jerks, but they are not doing that to bother me, that's just their nature. "Never take it personally" is my rule.
I may see her when I am get back, and she may decide she wants to continue. Or, maybe not. In any case, to relieve my angst, I believe I must quickly go down to Mexico. I lived there and speak Spanish. I can get my pipes cleaned and forget my California problems! Later, I want to go to China but if I do she would definitely want to cut my balls off. She knows too much now.
I have a strange feeling that SE Asia Joe has some KTV doll fitting the aforementioned description but he is selfishly keeping her hidden away for himself. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ttAKEwXKD5s
After viewing (and listening) to the above mentioned youtube I am reminded of some advice given to me many years ago when I first moved to China..... "When you begin to enjoy traditional Chinese music, you have been in China too long"
ES
Chocha Monger
09-23-09, 00:21
I had a family emergency and she was coming to my house so I had my friend let her in and she could wait for me. She was overcome by curiosity and went through my desk. She found pictures of girls I posted here, babes I fucked in various adventures. She was totally freaked out and said I was a crazy sex addict and had often consorted with prostitutes. Well, I guess I'm guilty.
Dash,
Don't worry you're not alone. You're in good company. I think you'd be better off without Shanghai Lil and her curiosity. I learned at great expense and with much suffering that women who exhibit the intense curiosity of a monkey coupled with insane jealousy often have a third trait. That trait is extreme vindictiveness. It's best to let this one go her own way but I doubt she will.
Dash,
Don't worry you're not alone. You're in good company. I think you'd be better off without Shanghai Lil and her curiosity. I learned at great expense and with much suffering that women who exhibit the intense curiosity of a monkey coupled with insane jealousy often have a third trait. That trait is extreme vindictiveness. It's best to let this one go her own way but I doubt she will.
Looks like I better be careful. Thanks and I too saw a vindictive streak when she video skyped me and listed off my crimes.
Looks like I better be careful. Thanks and I too saw a vindictive streak when she video skyped me and listed off my crimes.
A - former - US friend of mine tried a career back in Shanghai in the 90's, failed, but met a Shanghainese girl there, married her and took her back to the States.
The guy - actually very gifted, well educated and fluent in Mandarin - never really made anything out of all his talents, went back to university and basically kept on studying ... until today. Nothing against live-long scholars, but ... guess who paid for all this?
The girl had a very good position here in Shanghai, when he married her and took her to the States. There, she had to start from the scratch, no time to get accustomed, but find a new job quickly in order to make her and her useless brick to survive.
She did well, and today, she has an executive position in a Fortune-500 company. Her useless husband is still in university, and with approaching 50 soon, has not even achieved a PhD until today.
On top, he denied her children, also because he had a child from a former marriage and decided that would be enough of a burden for him.
Still, the woman stays by her man, she is still writing the checks, and she probably will do so for the rest of her life. She occasionally thought about going back to China, because she even would have greater career opportunities there, but also because of her husband unwilling to move she decided to stay in the US and go on with her life.
This might come a bit to the retrieval of Shanghai women's honor, also because I am a big fan of Shanghainese girls and women. They are tough, but they would rip their hearts out in order to make a living for their families. And, as usual, you certainly also will find some black sheep among them.
Levitian
A - former - US friend of mine tried a career back in Shanghai in the 90's, failed, but met a Shanghainese girl there, married her and took her back to the States.
The guy - actually very gifted, well educated and fluent in Mandarin - never really made anything out of all his talents, went back to university and basically kept on studying ... until today. Nothing against live-long scholars, but ... guess who paid for all this?
The girl had a very good position here in Shanghai, when he married her and took her to the States. There, she had to start from the scratch, no time to get accustomed, but find a new job quickly in order to make her and her useless brick to survive.
She did well, and today, she has an executive position in a Fortune-500 company. Her useless husband is still in university, and with approaching 50 soon, has not even achieved a PhD until today.
On top, he denied her children, also because he had a child from a former marriage and decided that would be enough of a burden for him.
Still, the woman stays by her man, she is still writing the checks, and she probably will do so for the rest of her life. She occasionally thought about going back to China, because she even would have greater career opportunities there, but also because of her husband unwilling to move she decided to stay in the US and go on with her life.
This might come a bit to the retrieval of Shanghai women's honor, also because I am a big fan of Shanghainese girls and women. They are tough, but they would rip their hearts out in order to make a living for their families. And, as usual, you certainly also will find some black sheep among them.
Levitian
I believe this completely. The woman I know would probably have supported me too if she were making a lot of money. She was generous. My only question is: can your lazy friend disobey the Shanghai woman? I believe you have their loyalty, but they require complete obedience. Results vary of course.
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