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Woody Shoes
06-04-08, 09:39
I found the " You been living in China too long" at some discussion page I believe it was shenzhenstuff
Anyway #102 When you change your 5 rmb dvd copie because if its bad quality #103 When a 9 or 10 for western standards is just so so for you. (and you think the 4-5s are beautiful).
Godfather2
06-04-08, 14:33
You start believing that No. 8 ( 298,398,88) is a Number for money.
When you bring the slippers you took from the Chinese hotel with the crazy Chinese name and you bring them onto the plane for a long haul flight.MABI do take them. I usually throw the unused excess pair that I get in my suitcase. Now I have atleast a draw full of it in my house in the US. They are convenient to use and then throw away. I also throw a few pair in my suitcase when I'm travelling in the US. I have not seen too many hotel (even four and five star hotels. Westin, Starwood, Ritz) give guests slipper. I hate walking barefooted on those carpets. Ahh.
You think a B cup can only be had at Starbucks, for a latte grande.
#105 You stop wearing a wristwatch because you've never been to a meeting in China that started on time (now I know why Chinese men don't wear them).
#106 Your favorite exclamation becomes "Ai Yo" (sorry for the bad pinyin), even when visiting abroad.
#107 When traveling abroad you visit Chinese restaurants just to practice your Mandarin (and scold them for their lack of authenticity or regionality in their dishes).
#108 You start to wonder why the rest of the world doesn't stir fry lettuce.
#109 You start to wear the sandlewood Buddah beads like other Chinese men.
SE Asia Joe
06-05-08, 07:03
#106 Your favorite exclamation becomes "Ai Yo" (sorry for the bad pinyin), even when visiting abroad.
#107 When traveling abroad you visit Chinese restaurants just to practice your Mandarin (and scold them for their lack of authenticity or regionality in their dishes).
#108 You start to wonder why the rest of the world doesn't stir fry lettuce.
#109 You start to wear the sandlewood Buddah beads like other Chinese men.
Naaaaah.... these ain't if you stayed in China Too long - Dem's what happens when you've stayed AWAY from China too long!!
SEAJ
Dan Hawaii
06-06-08, 09:27
#100 - (and this, number 100, is from Toucan Joe) You actually cheer and clap when some stranger walks into your KTV room and downs YOUR liquor without asking.
toucan
Funny,
#101 - when you start a boycott against BBS mommies cause their girls gave you bad service. And it works!!! ;) Mr. BL
#102 - when locals start talking to you, Expats/Europeans (CPE), in chinese. And you understand them!!!
And the ultimate!!!
#103 - when everyone in china does not try to rip you off anymore.
#110 Don’t understand what’s everyone’s problem as you leisurely stroll up a freeway ramp in your sandals, dodging 60mph traffic, jumping over wired fences, safely lands in front of Seibu BBS.
#111 You no longer need to rinse utensils in hot teas at restaurants cos you’ve developed antibodies against Hepatitis A by eating BBS girls.
#112 You can spot if a hotel has FS sauna from a mile away with eerie accuracy.
#113 When you innately stagger your steps around the spit pools in the sidewalk.
#114 When you no longer notice the guy in the restaurant spitting on the floor between your table and his (you DO wonder what's wrong with the non-spitting guy on the other side. Is he angry at something? )
#115 You realize you are about to spit on the floor, of your own house. But after a moments pause, you pull the trigger anyway.
#116 you rush to the chow cart a couple steps ahead of the food police (who are busy tossing confirep001ed two wheel restaurants into their truck), hoping you can pick up a good deal on that duck neck you ogled earlier.
#117 you criticize the taxi driver when he backs off from passing a truck that is currently already passing a car, headlong into a solid wall of traffic on a one and a half lane road. the driver understands what you said, agrees, and then shuts the meter off a block early to apologize.
#118 driving a motorcycle cutting diagonal across a swarming intersection running a red light with sidesaddle-riding babe teetering on back looks like a perfectly reasonable place to light up ciggy in the midst of a phone call.
#119 a large fish being beaten to death on the sidewalk merely makes you think "awright! 10 more minutes till dinner".
#120 your massage xiaojie frets endlessly that the air con is blowing on you... before sneezing on your face.
#121 you can pass buy a pink light bbs without at least considering a stop in. although the dirty window did feel cool against your nose.
Reading reports about blockage to isg and claims that only a vpn works. Dunno, still have a few proxies work. Hesitate to hasten their demise by open posting url's but would be happy to pm a few by request. Then again, if you read this and send the first pm, who am I kidding? You already figured it out.
Be aware. Recalled a built in isg time out feature, logging one off after a a short while. Imagine the surprise 24h after a looksee, log in was still functional. No damage. Wish my other log was as durable. And no, I won't proxy her with yours!
Sukhumvitter
07-05-08, 02:02
I've started using WiTopia (40 USD / year) and it works great. Not only does it let you surf unrestricted in China, but it also protects your data when at a WiFi hotspot.
Cheers
Old Mean Dog
07-07-08, 08:35
This maybe very interesting to watch, but it maybe blocked in China:
http://apnews.excite.com/article/20080706/D91OGEQ00.html
-CPE
Jay Balanty
07-07-08, 19:00
Not sure if I am posting in the right place, plus this is kinda off topic of mongering. That being said. What do you guys do for a living? I having been trying to move out of the US for a while. Im a rather young guy (26) and I think living in the same place for too long may make me a little close minded and I dont want that to happen. I have traveled avidly since I was 18 and have been mongering since I was about 20. I work in information technology and thought it would be easy to find a job, but I was wrong. Any advice or help would be appreciated.
Again I am sorry if this is in the wrong area.
Thnx,
JB
I'm definely moving to China end of year
Will stay at Shenzhen or Ningbo (depend on visa. If I can only renew my visa at HK, then I'll live at Shenzhen)
I do online daytrade
So I'm sure I'll live better life in China compare to canada. (cost of living)
I do want to do some part-time jobs (main purpose is to meet people. Although paying for sex is easy, I do want to have a gf that can cook, and wash my clothes) any recommandation?
My friend hook me up with a part-time job at trading company. But they only need me working when they can't get visa to go to usa trade show. So I don't get to meet any girls. So I turn that down.
Have tried to do search function with a paid proxy server and a free one and neither allow me to do searches. Bummer! Have others had success and with which proxy server? Please PM if you have an answer to keep 'them' out of the loop.
Thanks!
GB56
Old Mean Dog
07-09-08, 09:27
I do want to have a gf that can cook, and wash my clothes) any recommandation?
Hire a maid, it's cheaper in the long run.
-CPE
Old Mean Dog
07-09-08, 09:35
Not sure if I am posting in the right place, plus this is kinda off topic of mongering. That being said. What do you guys do for a living? I having been trying to move out of the US for a while. Im a rather young guy (26) and I think living in the same place for too long may make me a little close minded and I dont want that to happen. I have traveled avidly since I was 18 and have been mongering since I was about 20. I work in information technology and thought it would be easy to find a job, but I was wrong. Any advice or help would be appreciated.
Again I am sorry if this is in the wrong area.
Thnx,
JB
Lots of people I know are in international trade, IT and teaching.
http://english.jobchina.net/
http://classifiedpost.scmp.com/jshome_en.html
http://www.asiaexpat.com/
http://www.shenzhenparty.com/classifieds/index.php?catid=1&set_add_ad_cat=
http://www.learn4good.com
Just do an internet search for jobs in China. Even Hotjobs and Monster list jobs here.
Good luck,
-CPE
Sukhumvitter
07-12-08, 06:52
I'm definely moving to China end of year
Will stay at Shenzhen or Ningbo (depend on visa. If I can only renew my visa at HK, then I'll live at Shenzhen)
I do online daytrade
So I'm sure I'll live better life in China compare to canada. (cost of living)
I do want to do some part-time jobs (main purpose is to meet people. Although paying for sex is easy, I do want to have a gf that can cook, and wash my clothes) any recommandation?
My friend hook me up with a part-time job at trading company. But they only need me working when they can't get visa to go to usa trade show. So I don't get to meet any girls. So I turn that down.
I would recommend S. China for what you want. More expats, more trading, more girls, more international connections, more P4P options, etc, etc.
Guys that I meet living in other parts of china all want to be in the Shenzhen area. Any special reason for Ningbo?
I would recommend S. China for what you want. More expats, more trading, more girls, more international connections, more P4P options, etc, etc.
Guys that I meet living in other parts of china all want to be in the Shenzhen area. Any special reason for Ningbo?I choose ningbo for several reason
1. Street are cleaner, air are nicer
2. People are nicer (less low end worker from poor province)
3. Housing is cheaper then shenzhen.
4. 2hr drive to shanghai, 2hr flight to shenzhen.
By the way, what's the website to look for housing in China?
Do I need to purchase insurance in China, or better purchase travel insurance in Canada? (medical/emergency insurance)
Ace of Spades
07-27-08, 13:37
Korean:
Buy the health insurance in China (for use in China only) -- it will be cheaper than any insurance you buy in Canada I bought RBC insurance before I left Canada it was like $3 or 4 per day -- but the coverage only lasts 6 months. I paid too much for the insurance!
Go to Ping An of China in any major city you can get cheap local insurance. Insurance plans from Canada do not always work in China. For example, I was in the hospital last year in a second tier city, so not Beijing, Shenzhen, etc.. The hospital I went to was not in the insurance company's network, so I had to pay OUT OF POCKET and be reimbursed later after providing receipts. My bill was like $500 dollars very small, but if it was serious I would have been fucked!
You really only need accidental insurance in China -- the cost to go to the doctor or hospital is small.
When i travel in some of the smaller cities in China where restaurant sanitation maybe in questions and there is no other alternative (like no Mickey D's or KFC restaurants nearby) i usually have the waiter bring me a bottle of China's infamous "Maotai" (equivalent to American Kentucky finest moonshine) and i usually chase down some of the foods with a shot of this "white lightning". Whatever did not died during cooking, this "white lightning" will kill it.
This beat filling out all these confusing health insurance form.
BTW. Once I was in a small town and this friend gave me some homemade ones. I put it on a porecelain spoon and lit a match over it. I think it would make good charcoal starter fluid for a nice barbeque.
TIC
Anyone have a supplier for Cialis in Shanghai they can share with me?
ES
Yellow Fever #2
08-03-08, 16:07
Anyone have a supplier for Cialis in Shanghai they can share with me?
ES
Almost every pharmacy in Shanghai (Green Cross Sign) has stock of Cialis, Levitra and Viagra.
Some pharmacies will require a prescription to get your fix.
There is a 24 hour pharmacy near the intersection of YanAn Xi Lu and WuYi Lu that stocks all 3 of these enhancers in single and 4 packs. From my memory Levitra/Viagra are 128RMB/single pack and Cialis is 138RMB/single. 4 packs are roughly 400RMB.
I find if I break the Levitra tablet in 4 or 5small pieces, that any single piece will give me the 'edge'. Perhaps it is a mental thing but I don't need much to get a performance enhancement. Large dose/small dose it doesn't seem to make a difference - having the help is all I need.
Yellow Fever
Anyone have a supplier for Cialis in Shanghai they can share with me?
ESES - Big pharmacy directly across the street from Jin An temple. Go up escalator to second floor and to the back corner (opposite corner from the sex shop). They have western medicine there. I've seen V and C in the case.
Point to what you want, the person behind the counter will write a "prescription" and you have to go pay at the cashier. Then bring the receipt back to the medicine counter and the pharmacist will hand over the meds.
Yellow Fever #2
08-06-08, 05:28
Recently in Shanghai and Shenzhen, I have found that many pharmacies require prescriptions in order to dispense medicines including V, L and C as well as antibiotics etc.
I am sure that for some time you will be able to get meds in many pharmacies but over time it may be necessary to obtain a prescription in the future.
As Matsui has said, enterprising pharmacies will create the prescription for you on the spot. Whether this can continue or not is not certain for now.
Hopefullly after the damn olympics finish China can return to being China and not pretend to be another country.
Thankfully, Shanghai does not seem to have done this./ TODAY, I bought vitamin V and saw Vitamin C OTC!!! in Pudong at a green cross pharmacy. No questions asked! Except do I want to try a chinese herbal to enhance the experience.
Recently in Shanghai and Shenzhen, I have found that many pharmacies require prescriptions in order to dispense medicines including V, L and C as well as antibiotics etc.
I am sure that for some time you will be able to get meds in many pharmacies but over time it may be necessary to obtain a prescription in the future.
As Matsui has said, enterprising pharmacies will create the prescription for you on the spot. Whether this can continue or not is not certain for now.
Hopefullly after the damn olympics finish China can return to being China and not pretend to be another country.
Last time I bought the big V I was asked for a prescription, and I told them I had one but it was in my home country... and they rolled right over and gave it to me without further questions. This was in the big pharmacy next to Huashan hospital in Shanghai.
Loveasiangirls
08-06-08, 22:16
Guys, today (Thursday) is Chinese Valentine's day. A SMS to your freebies or favorite WG may pay dividends as you show your awareness about chinese society. Although it is not a big thing in China, girls are always happy and surprised.
You can e-mail her and electronic card. This site allows you to send up to 10 cards at the same time (He! He!): http://www.dgreetings.com/chinese_valentines_day/cards/chinese_valentines_day31.htm
They have othercards on this site but I think this is the only one that does not included the words "I love you" - let's not overdo it!!!!
Here is another one that I used.
http://www.123greetings.com/events/chinese_valentines_day/chinese5.html
ES
Thanks to all of you for the info.
ES
Below based on Wikipedia excerpts.
Qi Xi (Chinese: 七夕; pinyin: qī xī; literally "The Night of Sevens"), also known as Magpie Festival. Young girls traditionally demonstrate their domestic arts, especially melon carving, on this day and make wishes for a good husband. It is also known by the following names:
1) The Festival to Plead for Skills (乞巧節; qǐ qiǎo jié)
2) The Seventh Sister's Birthday (七姊誕; qī jiě dàn)
3) The Night of Skills (巧夕; qiǎo xī)
The story of Cowherd and Weaver Girl
-----------------------------------------
In late summer, the stars Altair and Vega are high in the night sky, and the Chinese tell the following love story, of which there are many variations:
A young cowherd named Niulang (Chinese: 牛郎; pinyin: niú láng; literally "the cowherd", the star Altair) happens across seven fairy sisters bathing in a lake. Encouraged by his mischievous companion the ox, he steals their clothes and waits to see what will happen. The fairy sisters elect the youngest and most beautiful sister Zhinü (simplified Chinese: 织女; traditional Chinese: 織女; pinyin: zhī nǚ; literally "the weaver girl", the star Vega) to retrieve their clothing. She does so, but since Niulang has seen her naked, she must agree to his request for marriage. She proves to be a wonderful wife, and Niulang a good husband. They lived happily and had two children. But the Goddess of Heaven (in some versions Zhinü's mother) finds out that a mere mortal has married one of the fairy girls and is furious. (In another version, the Goddess forced the weaver fairy back to her former duty of weaving colorful clouds in the sky because she could not do her job while married to the mortal.) Down on Earth, Niulang is very upset learning that his wife is gone. Suddenly, his cow begins to talk telling him that if he kills him and puts on his hide, he will be able to go up to Heaven to find his wife. With tears flowing, he killed the cow, put on the skin and carrying his two children with him and off he went to Heaven to find Zhinü. The Goddess found out he had come and was very angry. Taking out her hairpin, the Goddess scratches a wide river in the sky to separate the two lovers forever (thus forming the Milky Way, which separates Altair and Vega).
Zhinü must sit forever on one side of the river, sadly weaving on her loom, while Niulang watches her from afar and takes care of their two children (his flanking stars β and γ Aquilae or by their Chinese names Hè Gu 1 and Hè Gu 3).
But once a year all the magpies in the world take pity on them and fly up into heaven to form a bridge (鵲橋, "the bridge of magpies", Que Qiao) over the star Deneb in the Cygnus constellation so the lovers may be together for a single night, the seventh night of the seventh moon.
It is said that if it rains on the night of Qi Xi, they are the tears of Niulang and Zhinü crying at the misery of their life.
Traditions
-----------
On Qi Xi, a festoon is placed in the yard and the single or newly married women in the household make an offering to Niulang and Zhinü consisting of fruit, flowers, tea, and facial powder (makeup). After finishing the offering, half of the facial powder is thrown on the roof and the other half divided among the young women. It is believed by doing this the women are bound in beauty with Zhinü.
Another tradition is for young girls to throw a sewing needle into a bowl full of water on the night of Qi Xi as a test of embroidery skills. If the needle floats on top of the water instead of sinking, it is believed to be an indication of the girl's being a skilled embroideress.
THE REAL & TRADITOPNAL CHINESE VALENTINE'S DAY
------------------------------------------
The Lantern Festival (simplified Chinese: 元宵节; traditional Chinese: 元宵節/元宵; pinyin: yuánxiāojié) or (Yuanxiao Festival), also known as the Shang Yuan Festival (simplified Chinese: 上元节; traditional Chinese: 上元節; pinyin: shàngyuánjié) is a Chinese festival celebrated on the fifteenth day of the first month in the lunar year in the Chinese calendar. It is not to be confused with the Mid-Autumn Festival, which is also sometimes known as the "Lantern Festival" in locations such as Singapore, and Malaysia.
The Lantern Festival used to serve as a day for love and matchmaking, on which an ummarried girl was traditionally permitted to appear in public unescorted and thus be seen by eligible bachelors. It was one of the few nights in ancient times without a strict curfew. It is sometimes regarded as another Chinese Valentine's Day. Young people were chaperoned in the streets in hopes of finding love. Matchmakers acted busily in hopes of pairing couples.
While not strictly observed on the Mainland it is still recognised in Taiwan but in a more modern liberal & nostalgic sense.
Here is another one that I used.
http://www.123greetings.com/events/chinese_valentines_day/chinese5.html
ES
Ice Dragon
10-03-08, 03:15
Last time I bought the big V I was asked for a prescription, and I told them I had one but it was in my home country... and they rolled right over and gave it to me without further questions. This was in the big pharmacy next to Huashan hospital in Shanghai.I have no problems in Pudong, but if all else fails, you can go to East Shanghai International clinic in Pudong nan lu, at the dispensary the arrange prescriptions free of charge, (they previously charged 50rmb for this.)
FZ
Ice Dragon
10-11-08, 04:23
It seems we can order Durex condoms, any type, size 52mm, 54mm, or 56mm in China, but we may have a problem meeting the minimum order requirements!
http://www.made-in-china.com/showroom/anjie-hk/product-detailiqKxwtHjCQIW/China-Condom-AJF-035-.html
fz
It seems we can order Durex condoms, any type, size 52mm, 54mm, or 56mm in China, but we may have a problem meeting the minimum order requirements!
http://www.made-in-china.com/showroom/anjie-hk/product-detailiqKxwtHjCQIW/China-Condom-AJF-035-.html
fzIn addition you risk that they are fake. You can oder any quantity US condoms from here:
Durex condoms to China on ebay (http://stores.ebay.com/aravindaHK_Condoms-English-listings_W0QQcolZ4QQdirZ1QQfsubZ18428773QQftidZ2QQtZkm)
Interesting stories. I have lived here for 9 years and never heard them
ES
This may be a little off topic... I did RTF but didn't find anything relevent.
Have been travelling regularly to China for the past few years and it is past time to start to work on some rudimentary understanding of the language.
If you do an internet search, you find a number of places in China that offer intensive (5 days per week, 4 - 6 hrs / day) training. Does anyone have an experience with these programs? Any recommendations?
I'm sure the best way would be to find a bilingual GF and learn with her... but I'm usually in country for 2 weeks at a time so that's not an option. I was figuring on trying one of these intensive courses for 2 - 4 weeks at a time. Not expecting to be a competent speaker after one time, realize this is an on going thing. But before getting started, thought I would ask the advice of this board.
The driver to learn the language is more on the personal level - to gain competency for business is a multi year project, I'm sure.
Appreciate any advice / comments / etc.
Cheers!
This may be a little off topic... I did RTF but didn't find anything relevent.
Have been travelling regularly to China for the past few years and it is past time to start to work on some rudimentary understanding of the language.
If you do an internet search, you find a number of places in China that offer intensive (5 days per week, 4 - 6 hrs / day) training. Does anyone have an experience with these programs? Any recommendations?
I'm sure the best way would be to find a bilingual GF and learn with her... but I'm usually in country for 2 weeks at a time so that's not an option. I was figuring on trying one of these intensive courses for 2 - 4 weeks at a time. Not expecting to be a competent speaker after one time, realize this is an on going thing. But before getting started, thought I would ask the advice of this board.
The driver to learn the language is more on the personal level - to gain competency for business is a multi year project, I'm sure.
Appreciate any advice / comments / etc.
Cheers!Rosetta stones, they are wonderful! It will a good place to start. After that you could move on the a bilingual gf to practice with. But really, finding a bilingual gf to learn from is not easy. If you do, China's english level are not quite there yet.
SE Asia Joe
10-13-08, 05:22
Guys.... you guys MUST go to our esteemed member Oh What Lies' thread where he's blowing water again. Mr. Kung fu fighter scores again!! In whose dreams?? Jeez..!!
SEAJ
This may be a little off topic... I did RTF but didn't find anything relevent.
Have been travelling regularly to China for the past few years and it is past time to start to work on some rudimentary understanding of the language.
If you do an internet search, you find a number of places in China that offer intensive (5 days per week, 4 - 6 hrs / day) training. Does anyone have an experience with these programs? Any recommendations
The driver to learn the language is more on the personal level - to gain competency for business is a multi year project, I'm sure.
Appreciate any advice / comments / etc.
Cheers!
Consider some of the following.
Oxford Dictionary. Beginner's Chinese.
Modern Chinese: A Basic Course ISBN 0-486-22755-3 With audio cassettes.
Tuttle Publishing. Beginner's Chinese dictionary.
Tuttle. Learning Chinese Characters.
Pimsleur and Rosetta Stone recordings can be downloaded on the internet.
Chinesepod.com available by subscription.
Since we are on the topic of Chinese language, I'm looking for a webpage translator. I have tried google's translator and it's not very good. I found several by doing a search on the net but I don't know which one is OK.
Any suggestion for a language tool Chinese/English translator.
Since we are on the topic of Chinese language, I'm looking for a webpage translator. I have tried google's translator and it's not very good. I found several by doing a search on the net but I don't know which one is OK.
Any suggestion for a language tool Chinese/English translator.altavista.com
Jayagopal50
10-13-08, 12:40
I did Part 1 of pimseuler and found it VERY useful and helped me in my 18 day trip this september.If i had more frequent plans to vist i would go on to Part 2.I found mandarin easier to learn than Spanish, but it may be because i am used to a totally different grammer situation as i am from India.
The CD's are great to learn while driving.
One of the first things Mao did when coming to power was to put a ban on prostitution. Anyone who visits the big c can easily see for them self, that this is not enforced, what so ever. Conclusion: China officials knows all about it, does nothing to correct it.
Thailand was the focus country a couple of years ago, and the point was to blame western country’s for sex-tourism. Today we see china, and the situation is extreme. Only one thing is for sure: The west is not to blame. This is an internal china deal.
How can this go on? The answer is simple: officials are gaining from this. There is no way in hell that places like the sauna at Shanghai hotel – an entire floor of a major hotel in central shanghai – can be run without party officials approvement.
Here´s the deal:
I think there is a good reason to be careful when on mongering in china. Ok, no news so far, but why? Ok, its illegal, busts do occur, but that is not the main reason. I think those busts are very bad for everyone. No, the main reason to be careful is the obvious that a thing that seems to be good to be true often is.
Anyone that stayed in china for some time knows that the authorities are quit scruple free. I think that the saunas are places were important people (from a party point of view) can be compromised. The classic east-block Romeo trick has put a lot of people in very difficult possisions. Ok for an average Joe like you and me, this might not be a problem, but if you have something to loose; think twice.
altavista.com
Thanks, I have used altavista.com also called Babel Fish. Babel Fish is also used as a translator in yahoo.com. Google translator is not very good if the sentence is like a subordinate conjunction. Hope it's better than google.com?
Ice Dragon
10-14-08, 01:55
Thanks, I have used altavista.com also called Babel Fish. Babel Fish is also used as a translator in yahoo.com. Google translator is not very good if the sentence is like a subordinate conjunction. Hope it's better than google.com?I have lingoes installed on all machines, freeware, it calls up an instant translation module when copying text. It can be set up for almost any combination of languages using 15 or so online translators including google, babelfisg, yahoo, and some much better. I'm bresently using it to translate from Indonesian to chinese for gf on bali trip! It also provides an unbelievable library of freely downloadable dictionaries.
Found it on this forum!
One tip, with all online translators, after translating, reverse the process to check it makes sense, unfortunately, english can be easily misread, but a little tweak can always bring it in line!
FZ
Thanks, I have used altavista.com also called Babel Fish. Babel Fish is also used as a translator in yahoo.com. Google translator is not very good if the sentence is like a subordinate conjunction. Hope it's better than google.com?I always have problem with google translator, not quiet stable. Much better luck with babel fish but I guess it really depends on where you are.
The Tanuki
10-14-08, 12:22
I always have problem with google translator, not quiet stable. Much better luck with babel fish but I guess it really depends on where you are.
Firefox has a wide variety of plugins that link up to translation systems. I don't use them a lot, but at least for Japanese they work pretty well and you can easily try several to see which does the best for a given page. FWIW...
Tankuki
I think we have all been paying too much for taxis in southern China, me included.
"Flag fall is set at 7 yuan for the first three kilometers, while the illegal operators charge only 2 or 3 yuan. “They (illegal taxis) are dirt cheap, so people use them,” said an unnamed green taxi driver."
Full story at: http://szdaily.sznews.com/html/2008-10/21/content_380188.htm
Digital Jelli
10-21-08, 09:51
Since we are on the topic of Chinese language, I'm looking for a webpage translator. I have tried google's translator and it's not very good. I found several by doing a search on the net but I don't know which one is OK.
Any suggestion for a language tool Chinese/English translator.This is the site I use most often.
http://www.xuezhongwen.net/chindict/chindict.php
Or I sometimes double check with:
http://www.chinglish.com/main/freetrans
[but it only does short paragraphs :( ]
FernandoAlonso
10-21-08, 20:35
I think we have all been paying too much for taxis in southern China, me included.
"Flag fall is set at 7 yuan for the first three kilometers, while the illegal operators charge only 2 or 3 yuan. “They (illegal taxis) are dirt cheap, so people use them,” said an unnamed green taxi driver."
Full story at: http://szdaily.sznews.com/html/2008-10/21/content_380188.htmNo you do not. Because the locals know the prices so you will always pay more for the illegals, try Haikou, a nightmare if you do not have a Chinese with you
FA
No you do not. Because the locals know the prices so you will always pay more for the illegals, try Haikou, a nightmare if you do not have a Chinese with you
FA
It all depends on how local you act and your knowledge of the city. Moody, TickTock and I managed to convince a taxi to go by the meter from ChangPing's train station. These guys usually ask for 20 rmb near the exit, 10 rmb further away.
In ChangAn (Dongguan) I have seen Singaporean guys routinely negotiate fares below the metered price. If there are too many out-of-towners willing to pay inflated taxi fares, then yes, the cabbies will refuse to budge.
SE Asia Joe
10-27-08, 08:46
It all depends on how local you act and your knowledge of the city. Moody, TickTock and I managed to convince a taxi to go by the meter from ChangPing's train station. These guys usually ask for 20 rmb near the exit, 10 rmb further away.
In ChangAn (Dongguan) I have seen Singaporean guys routinely negotiate fares below the metered price. If there are too many out-of-towners willing to pay inflated taxi fares, then yes, the cabbies will refuse to budge.
Ok this may not work for everybody - but anytime I want a car - taxi or pirate - I hold up my index finger - indicating RMB10 - and say "destination xx se kuai" and if from the Chang Ping train station, I just keep on walking until one of the guys break ranks and agrees.
On a side note, you guys DO realize that there IS "Tea Money" being required from the pirates in front of most hotels - RMB1,000/month from the Hui Hua CP, RMB500/month from the JingLong CP etc - and thus its no use for you to try this stunt in front of most hotels. Like what happened when Moody jumped into that Taxi disharging a passenger in front of the Star of Star CA a week or so ago.... and the hotel guard kicked in the door of the taxi.
You can only do what I do when NOT in front of these hotels.
Just IMHO
SEAJ
Ps. Did you know that channel 13 at JingLong hotel cp actually shows 24/7 Japanese pixellated PORN movIes? Amazing... this in China!!
Hehe, looking for a hotel to take a date to in Guangxi? Rooms here come with red rope, adult chair and yoga excercise ball. Anyone knows what the little aluminum chair is for?
Full article at: http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/china/2008-11/07/content_7184564_5.htm
OldAsiaHand
11-08-08, 11:32
Hehe, looking for a hotel to take a date to in Guangxi? Rooms here come with red rope, adult chair and yoga excercise ball. Anyone knows what the little aluminum chair is for?
Full article at: http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/china/2008-11/07/content_7184564_5.htm
Wadman,
The aluminum chair is for rimming.
Just my POV.
OAH
Since we are on the topic of Chinese language, I'm looking for a webpage translator. I have tried google's translator and it's not very good. I found several by doing a search on the net but I don't know which one is OK.
Any suggestion for a language tool Chinese/English translator.
I have used babelfish.yahoo.com for Chinese/English translation. It works great.
Wadman,
The aluminum chair is for rimming.
Just my POV.
OAH
I think it's to put your luggage on top.
-M
I have used babelfish.yahoo.com for Chinese/English translation. It works great.
Thanks, I have used altavista.com also called Babel Fish. Babel Fish is also used as a translator in yahoo.com. Google translator is not very good if the sentence is like a subordinate conjunction. Hope it's better than google.com?
I have lingoes installed on all machines, freeware, it calls up an instant translation module when copying text. It can be set up for almost any combination of languages using 15 or so online translators including google, babelfisg, yahoo, and some much better. I'm bresently using it to translate from Indonesian to chinese for gf on bali trip! It also provides an unbelievable library of freely downloadable dictionaries.
Fla Fun
Actually babelfish.yahoo.com ( altavista.com ) was mentioned by "mmlouie" and is just as bad as google's translator. Short sentences both are fine. If anything is complex or long, both are about 60% corrected in translation. But from what I am hearing, it seems like babelfish is a little better.
I'm looking for something better, at least 80% correct. Might try suggestion by "Fuzimiao2" install freeware on computer.
I have a pocket translator that claimed 80% but I found out it was not true.
Thanks anyway....
OldAsiaHand
11-09-08, 03:48
While we are on the topic of translation, does anybody have a link for a download of a good English/Chinese dictionary for my Apple I-phone?
Thanks.
OAH
While we are on the topic of translation, does anybody have a link for a download of a good English/Chinese dictionary for my Apple I-phone?
Thanks.
OAHThe itune store will give you plenty of choices there.
I'd found the free one actually works best, but that just my opinion.
The itune store will give you plenty of choices there.
I'd found the free one actually works best, but that just my opinion.What's the name of the program you like. I've Diahua, it's ok only. But I must have a internet connection for it to work. Do you know any that just store all the words in the iPhone's HD?
Thanks,
Rex
Eyebrow777
11-11-08, 16:41
While we are on the topic of translation, does anybody have a link for a download of a good English/Chinese dictionary for my Apple I-phone?
Thanks.
OAHOAH,
Maybe not quite what you're looking for, but check out iChinese in the Apple store. It has a decent dictionary. If you enable the simplified Chinese keyboard on your iPhone, you can even input and find the meaning of hanzi.
E
What's the name of the program you like. I've Diahua, it's ok only. But I must have a internet connection for it to work. Do you know any that just store all the words in the iPhone's HD?
Thanks,
RexDianhua is a free program, it is ok for simple translation. For simple phrases, you could try lonely planet mandarin simple phrasebook. At the least, the girls will get a kick listening to that program. If your iphone is not jailbroke, then you are pretty much stuck with itune's stuff. If it is jailbroke, then your option is much more adverse.
Go to starbuck, they usually have wi-fi connection. It works for me!
Btw, anyone interested in a black 3 g 16gb iphone? Pm me if you are, I could ship it out to you if you have paypal.
Old Mean Dog
12-15-08, 17:14
have you ever been on a bus, subway or in a restaurant and made simple eye contact with a gal, that gave you a little pup tent? not just stare at the laowai look, but the sexual, my interest is peeked kind of look?
happened to me on the bus today, decided to get off at the same stop as her and play the "i'm new and lost" trick on her. worked perfectly and she spoke english. got her digits and now intend on giving her a try.
too many hot girls, not enough time.
-cpe
Ps. Did you know that channel 13 at JingLong hotel cp actually shows 24/7 Japanese pixellated PORN movIes? Amazing... this in China!!
More interesting is that the Sauna at Swan Lake they have an internal DVD channel and will play porn on that upon request which is what my two nyphos requested.
have you ever been on a bus, subway or in a restaurant and made simple eye contact with a gal, that gave you a little pup tent? not just stare at the laowai look, but the sexual, my interest is peeked kind of look?
happened to me on the bus today, decided to get off at the same stop as her and play the "i'm new and lost" trick on her. worked perfectly and she spoke english. got her digits and now intend on giving her a try.
too many hot girls, not enough time.
-cpe
hey c, you're killing me and every guy who is more than 500 miles of this fantasy land!
Old Mean Dog
12-16-08, 01:42
Hey C, You're killing me and every guy who is more than 500 miles of this fantasy land!
Sorry M, it's why I posted in the "Living in China" Section, but I should have know it's not limited to just us living here.
I can't even imagine what life back in the USA is like again. When I left there three years ago, I was limited to dating 30ish year old divorced moms of 1,2 or 3 kids who were looking for a daddy rather than a lover and who seemed to only want to talk about their ex's and how they were a piece of shit.
In China, a guy my age (Born in the 60's), can date (and do) smoking hot girls in their 20's, who have never been married and don't have ankle biters.
Sure China (and Asia in general) has a lot of bad things, but the life for a foreigner and certainly the girls make up for a lot of it.
-CPE
BTW: When will you be returning?
--cut-- In China, a guy my age (Born in the 60's), can date (and do) smoking hot girls in their 20's, who have never been married and don't have ankle biters.
Sure China (and Asia in general) has a lot of bad things, but the life for a foreigner and certainly the girls make up for a lot of it.
-CPE
BTW: When will you be returning?
Often quoted negative aspects of Asia/China probably could be said equally about US/Europe (examples of overcrowding, poverty, racism, rudeness, crime, etc.). Different quantities and flavors, but broadly in the same bucket. You've, of course, mentioned the best parts, the girls, and other positives like food, culture, services... Enjoy, and I'll be back to visit in a few months (not scheduled yet). Have a great holiday season!
A very positive but subtle aspect of your story is that married/seriously dating men still can go out and have some carnal fun in Asia, but much more of a risky proposition in other cultures.
SE Asia Joe
12-17-08, 06:42
Often quoted negative aspects of Asia/China probably could be said equally about US/Europe (examples of overcrowding, poverty, racism, rudeness, crime, etc.). Different quantities and flavors, but broadly in the same bucket. You've, of course, mentioned the best parts, the girls, and other positives like food, culture, services... ....A very positive but subtle aspect of your story is that married/seriously dating men still can go out and have some carnal fun in Asia, but much more of a risky proposition in other cultures.
I would think that your above equally applies for any country/destination that is economically under-par.
Go to most parts of the world which is NOT a first world country and you will find a surfeit of gals and opportunities for guys that are errrr...... not in their prime! And as far as food, culture etc - come on guy - anything that ain't familiar to oneself is "exotic" - thus again available at any place except your own home country.
China ain't got nuthin' special and its just a matter of individual taste as far as what is a good destination. And whilst I ain't trying to slag China off, I must point out that as far as it being a mongering destination - it really does leave a lot to be desired. China is NOT geared/does NOT cater to the foreign monger and is a hard place for foreigners to partake of such.
Just IMHO
SEAJ
SE Asia Joe
12-17-08, 06:46
More interesting is that the Sauna at Swan Lake they have an internal DVD channel and will play porn on that upon request which is what my two nyphos requested.
Aw come on - Porn in a sauna is rather "expected" but what I'm talking about is porn in the regular run-of-the-mill guest rooms at the Jing Long.
SEAJ
Old Mean Dog
12-18-08, 04:58
China ain't got nuthin' special and its just a matter of individual taste as far as what is a good destination. And whilst I ain't trying to slag China off, I must point out that as far as it being a mongering destination - it really does leave a lot to be desired. China is NOT geared/does NOT cater to the foreign monger and is a hard place for foreigners to partake of such.
Just IMHO
SEAJ
This is why I LIKE China for mongering. Thailand is a beautiful country, but one only has to look in their photo section to see the kinds of skanks those guys are banging. PI, majority of those gals ain't nothing but cum buckets and run through by every swinging dick there. In China, I find a more pure, unadulterated, innocent kind of girl.
Of course, if you are looking for the downright nasty, anal sex, CIM, get it on with 3 willing rug munchers then obviously, China might not be right for you.
-CPE
SE Asia Joe
12-18-08, 06:43
This is why I LIKE China for mongering. Thailand is a beautiful country, but one only has to look in their photo section to see the kinds of skanks those guys are banging. PI, majority of those gals ain't nothing but cum buckets and run through by every swinging dick there. In China, I find a more pure, unadulterated, innocent kind of girl.
Of course, if you are looking for the downright nasty, anal sex, CIM, get it on with 3 willing rug munchers then obviously, China might not be right for you.
-CPE
I agree with you 100%. China is where the gals are still quite "unadulterated' by the thundering throngs of foreign sex tourists. It still cater 99% towards the local/regional clientelle who expects - and gets - the kind of service, attitude and deference that the Chinese Male expects of their women.
What we don't need in China are Foreigner mongers who are Wankers/BSD/too damn used to the skanks you describe in LOS, PI etc. Or those on the other end of the scale who wants to do Chinese gals on the cheap/freebies. All these type of crettins do nuthin' except spoil it all for those of us who appreciate the situation as it is now AND act accordingly.
And if you notice even from our pages, we've got more and more of these "types" coming over, asking idiotic questions and showing their BSD tendencies - even whilst asking such question.
SEAJ
The girls in China are usually there for a short time, then they go home and never return (I still miss a lot of the great girls). Girls in Thailand are usually there for the long haul. I remember seeing some of the girls that I spent time with 5 years ago (the scary part is they remember me) and they are still there.
I don't think anyone here will see any girl that they have been with 2 years ago much less than 5 years or longer.
This is why I think the girls in China are prettier since they are younger and fresher.
God, I miss China. As Arnold said, "I will be Back".
Pointpanic
12-19-08, 12:44
Hey Freepeaks and SEJoe,
Bing Bing and Xiao Lian took me there the night before you and your two. The porn was laughable, old chinese stuff that was barely watchable. Certainly not at the JPorn level. It was more fun having Bing Bing slap XL on her butt to get her to do me only to have her gag, run to the toilet and try to upchuck by hacking away for 10 minutes. All was good as Bing Bing did her thing until XL came back to share her tight little ass.
Freepeaks, that was a stunner that you brought out for lunch the following day with Mongoose. Thanks Joe for helping us out! I even enjoyed the Swan Lake stage show, especially the dancers. Is the Jing Long, the King Long across from New Century? By the way Joe, the last time I saw Bing Bing was last summer with our old buddy Bill Lee. Mongoose and I toasted him before I left. It was also great to see Vickie who I think will figure things out. Her procedure was successful. Thanks for the great time. Freepeaks, sorry I didn't join you at Jia Yi or Crown Prince as my regular went to her old BBS behind the Yalan Hotel, brought back a couple more and we had our own KTV party in my room till I left the next day.
Just think in the middle of this, I lost and recovered my cell thanks to Joe and Wadman, thanks guys. You guys are the best!
Mahalo,
PP
More interesting is that the Sauna at Swan Lake they have an internal DVD channel and will play porn on that upon request which is what my two nyphos requested.
SE Asia Joe
12-24-08, 08:54
Hmmmm...... not one season greetings anywhere on the China boards.....hmmmmm.
So here goes:
MERRY CHRISTMAS TO YOU ONE AND ALL - HO HO HO!
Yeah - even to you Santa!!
SEAJ
have you ever been on a bus, subway or in a restaurant and made simple eye contact with a gal, that gave you a little pup tent? not just stare at the laowai look, but the sexual, my interest is peeked kind of look?
happened to me on the bus today, decided to get off at the same stop as her and play the "i'm new and lost" trick on her. worked perfectly and she spoke english. got her digits and now intend on giving her a try.
too many hot girls, not enough time.
-cpe
yeah, i have used the same method often in china to get to know girls, just kills me that i can't be in china right now.
BTW, also on the buying side, just saw a website for a brothel in Austria: http://www.babylon1.com/deutsch/prices.htm
Just for one hour of sex in Vienna in this place you pay 150 Euros entrance, 300 Euros "rent" for the room and 200 Euros to the girl, makes 650 Euros or roughly 6000 RMB for one hour of sex with a girl who presumably has a lousy attitude.
In China you get the same for 200 RMB and probably the girl is less bitchy/arrogant. I prefer Asian girls anyway.
For the price of one hour of sex at that dump you could buy a plane ticket to China and back.
Anyway, I'll be back in China sometime in summer.
The girls in China are usually there for a short time, then they go home and never return (I still miss a lot of the great girls). Girls in Thailand are usually there for the long haul. I remember seeing some of the girls that I spent time with 5 years ago (the scary part is they remember me) and they are still there.
I don't think anyone here will see any girl that they have been with 2 years ago much less than 5 years or longer.
This is why I think the girls in China are prettier since they are younger and fresher.
God, I miss China. As Arnold said, "I will be Back".That is so true. I never see the same girl for mroe than 2 years. Very rarely. I think it's also because they are smarter too. They constantly migrate from place to place to work. Thus making them appear fresher, when in reality they are not. For example, how I've seen it is. Girls come to Dongguan factory to work. They get recruited by either their boyfriend who tricks them into being a ***** for them, or some friend tricks them into being a ***** or on some rare occasions they choose to be *****s. Anyhow, they usually start at BBS since the barrier to entry is lower. (no fees to managers and fines like saunas and KTV) then the pretty ones who are popular usually want to progress. So they either go to Saunas or KTV to earn the big bucks in the end. Even when they progress to KTV and Saunas they are hopping from one place to another within Dongguan. Then when they are in their almost mid twenties, many of them start going to Shenzhen for more money. Then Hong Kong later on. Or they do the other route which is Zhu-hai and then Macau. But these girls are basically hopping from one place to the next. So even though they appear new, they usually are not. So how I see the age progression of girls are. 16-20 in Dongguan 23-26 in Shenzhen 29-35 in Hong Kong. It gets older as the city is more expensive to live in. And it gets younger as the city is cheaper to live in. Kind of strange but true.
Because in any new KTV, Sauna or BBS in another town, you can always reposition yourself as the new fresh girl who "just started". I can't tell you how many times I have heard that before.
AsnDragon
EDITOR'S NOTE: I would suggest that the author or another Forum Member consider posting a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please Click Here (http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?) for more information.
The girls in China are usually there for a short time, then they go home and never return (I still miss a lot of the great girls). Girls in Thailand are usually there for the long haul. I remember seeing some of the girls that I spent time with 5 years ago (the scary part is they remember me) and they are still there.
I don't think anyone here will see any girl that they have been with 2 years ago much less than 5 years or longer.
This is why I think the girls in China are prettier since they are younger and fresher.
God, I miss China. As Arnold said, "I will be Back".Csun,
I agreed that the girls in china are much less harden than the one you find in Thailand. Most of the smarter ones realize that their beauty will start fading after they turn 21 and time in this business in limited. They usually try to make enough to start a business back in their hometown. I have also met a few that were abused back home and do not want to return.
Everytime i leave China and return back to the US, I want to return back.
Starchild2012
01-06-09, 21:41
Csun,
Everytime i leave China and return back to the US, I want to return back.
Then Don't go back to US Dude...Be a man....Whats stopping you..Do your thing..For once make a decision that you like for yourself..live for yourself not for your wife or kids back in US.
You can do so much in China than US..Good Luck.
Dont spoil your life been a ladyboy thinking between China and US..select one and be a man..else you will end up with nothing and land in between country called India where im from and think what the hell im writing at 2 AM in ISG china which makes no sense at all. :( i just wanna die now :) please take me to china
SE Asia Joe
01-07-09, 04:41
Then Don't go back to US Dude...Be a man....Whats stopping you..Do your thing..For once make a decision that you like for yourself..live for yourself not for your wife or kids back in US.
You can do so much in China than US..Good Luck.
Dont spoil your life been a ladyboy thinking between China and US..select one and be a man..else you will end up with nothing and land in between country called India where im from and think what the hell im writing at 2 AM in ISG china which makes no sense at all. :( i just wanna die now :) please take me to china
Good God man - what kind of post is this?
Get a hold of yourself!
SEAJ
Hey Freepeaks and SEJoe,
Bing Bing and Xiao Lian took me there the night before you and your two. The porn was laughable, old chinese stuff that was barely watchable. Certainly not at the JPorn level. It was more fun having Bing Bing slap XL on her butt to get her to do me only to have her gag, run to the toilet and try to upchuck by hacking away for 10 minutes. All was good as Bing Bing did her thing until XL came back to share her tight little ass.
Freepeaks, that was a stunner that you brought out for lunch the following day with Mongoose.
Freepeaks, sorry I didn't join you at Jia Yi or Crown Prince as my regular went to her old BBS behind the Yalan Hotel, brought back a couple more and we had our own KTV party in my room till I left the next day.
Just think in the middle of this, I lost and recovered my cell thanks to Joe and Wadman, thanks guys. You guys are the best!
Mahalo,
PP
The porn playing with XL and DD (don't remember name just had huge tits) was blonde california porn non-pixelated, lasted maybe 20 minutes then they switched it to britney spears DVD - lol.
XL did the same after DD encouragement, tried then sprinted to bathroom and gagged. very strange. asked DD waht the issue was and she said she didn't know - messed up in head..
thanks for the complement on the stunner, she is also quite nice to be around in general and tolerates my horrible chinese and understands it and helps me learn too. BanDao was decent this trip, but Jia Yi I passed on. There is a flower street at the Cprince now, starts at 7pm? was very fun for a change of pace (you can stand on 2nd level and look down on the group) but as usual Cprince is more expensive than anywhere in CP. Had a good time though the girl I picked there was again very average performer.
I agree Wadman and SEAJ are the best. Perhaps this year we should have an appreciation party (at Swan Lake of course) for them. Both of them have helped me and others numerous times. Perhaps we bring in BBS girls too.
l8
Good God man - what kind of post is this?
Get a hold of yourself!
SEAJSeaj
Maybe there is a reason why he is in india. BornLoser, my work takes me to China several times a year and sometimes I stay there a bit longer depending on my work schedules and appointment. I'm quite content with my life, that is the reason why I'm not in India.
SE Asia Joe
01-07-09, 06:06
The porn playing with XL and DD (don't remember name just had huge tits) was blonde california porn non-pixelated, lasted maybe 20 minutes then they switched it to britney spears DVD - lol.
XL did the same after DD encouragement, tried then sprinted to bathroom and gagged. very strange. asked DD waht the issue was and she said she didn't know - messed up in head..
thanks for the complement on the stunner, she is also quite nice to be around in general and tolerates my horrible chinese and understands it and helps me learn too. BanDao was decent this trip, but Jia Yi I passed on. There is a flower street at the Cprince now, starts at 7pm? was very fun for a change of pace (you can stand on 2nd level and look down on the group) but as usual Cprince is more expensive than anywhere in CP. Had a good time though the girl I picked there was again very average performer.
I agree Wadman and SEAJ are the best. Perhaps this year we should have an appreciation party (at Swan Lake of course) for them. Both of them have helped me and others numerous times. Perhaps we bring in BBS girls too.
l8
Just a bit of suggestion - that the next time you guys patronize SWL's KTV - that you do NOT pre-pay the momma the 100 she demands for the gal to sit with you.
Insist on only paying after the evening/when you decide to let her go. Too damn many times I've seen these gals just leave as they know that they ain't gonna be taken out ST/LT - especially if you have 2 or 3 of them to sit with you. and if they ain';t gonna be taken ST/LT, then there's no more $$'s coming out from you and thus no incentive to stay and waste any more of their time.
And as far as putting me in the same rarified category as Wadman - no way, no way at all. Wadman is a real monger and monger helper who routinely goes out of his way to help out just about anybody - just like Old Asia Hand and Superforce in Zhuhai. Now, these guys are the one who truly deserve a general vote of thanks and tangible tribute.
SEAJ
Just a bit of suggestion - that the next time you guys patronize SWL's KTV - that you do NOT pre-pay the momma the 100 she demands for the gal to sit with you.
Insist on only paying after the evening/when you decide to let her go. Too damn many times I've seen these gals just leave as they know that they ain't gonna be taken out ST/LT - especially if you have 2 or 3 of them to sit with you. and if they ain';t gonna be taken ST/LT, then there's no more $$'s coming out from you and thus no incentive to stay and waste any more of their time.
Very good point. The standard procedure is: if you take a Swanlake BBS girl for a ST, prepay the mommy 100. If you pick her to sit at the Swanlake KTV, do not prepay mommy 100. Mommy will insist on it of course, and counter with arguments like "but all your friends have prepaid me". Who cares. Just stand your ground, and mommy will relent.
Especially on weekends, a lot of girls at Swanlake do not like to be picked for just the sitting fee. Out of the 100, she probably has to kick some back. So it's very slim earnings for the girl. Understandable from the girl's POV.
And as far as putting me in the same rarified category as Wadman - no way, no way at all. Wadman is a real monger and monger helper who routinely goes out of his way to help out just about anybody - just like Old Asia Hand and Superforce in Zhuhai. Now, these guys are the one who truly deserve a general vote of thanks and tangible tribute.
Careful, Joe. People might think you are being serious.
Just a bit of suggestion - that the next time you guys patronize SWL's KTV - that you do NOT pre-pay the momma the 100 she demands for the gal to sit with you.
SEAJ
At your and Wadman's advisement -
That is exactly what I did last time. And one mommie insisted on the 100, so I told her then tell the girl to sit back down. Her loss as I would have probably taken her ST. I agree pay later, and if they don't like it, tough. Hell sometimes I take 3 ST.
SE Asia Joe
01-07-09, 10:12
Careful, Joe. People might think you are being serious.
Awwww. come on Wadman, false modesty doth NOT befit you and your great help to so many guys on these boards.
You deserve praise and gratitude - so just accept it with grace!!
SEAJ
You deserve praise and gratitude - so just accept it with grace!!
Only if Grace is a girl and good at BJ.
And especially if she does ANAL like a cowgirl in Montana :) Ride her cowboys ....
Only if Grace is a girl and good at BJ.
SE Asia Joe
01-08-09, 06:04
Only if Grace is a girl and good at BJ.
OK - need you guyses help here!!
Gotta/help me find a provider named Grace; I'll tie a little red bow around her ass and present her to Wadman with a packet of condoms and some lube.
Anyone knows any Grace in Southern China?
SEAJ
Anyone knows any Grace in Southern China?
SEAJ
Yes, that's the same Grace that had a pair of big hairy nuts and left them behind at Bumrungrad Hospital. She didn't like 'em because they were too itchy.
SE Asia Joe
01-08-09, 08:24
Yes, that's the same Grace that had a pair of big hairy nuts and left them behind at Bumrungrad Hospital. She didn't like 'em because they were too itchy.
LOL!!! as good as the joke you just sent me//
A man was laying in bed with his new girlfriend. After having great sex, she spent the next hour just scratching his nuts, gently rolling them over, fondling them, something she seemed to love to do.
As he was enjoying it, he turned and asked her, 'Why do you love doing that?'
'Because,' she replied, 'I really miss mine!'//
OTH - perhaps though, we should NOT still take it for granted that one'd be pretty hard done to meet any Katoeys in China. Following in today's South China Morning Post, complete with a Wedding picture of one marrying "her' husband!!:
///////////
Between lives
Despite some advances, transsexuals remain a stigmatised group on the mainland
LIFE
Qiu Lin
Jan 08, 2009
Cai Yiyi had pictured herself enjoying a life of happy domesticity after her sex-change operation: she would meet the right guy, marry and adopt a child with him, and the youngster would run around the apartment while her husband worked at the computer and she cleaned and dusted.
But the 36-year-old Qindao native found the reality very different. "I regret having the surgery, not in the sense that I became a woman but because the social stigma is too severe to handle," says Cai, a willowy figure with flawless skin and meticulously applied makeup.
News reports in recent years suggest attitudes towards transsexuals are becoming more liberal on the mainland. Some have been able to marry and secure IDs under a different gender after having reassignment surgery. Transsexual Chen Lili even became a model in Chongqing and took part in a provincial beauty contest leading up to the Miss Universe Pageant in 2004. But those may be the lucky few.
Cai says she hasn't been able to find a decent job after her surgery five years ago and now relies on her mother for financial support. Most of her transsexual friends are forced to make a living by performing in clubs or prostituting themselves because they aren't accepted in other fields.
"Most of the problems faced by sexual minorities [such as transsexuals] - their desperation and self-denial - are not brought by themselves but by society's negative attitude towards them," says Fang Gang, a psychology professor at Beijing Forestry University.
To foster more open debate, he regularly invites Cai and others with gender identity issues to talk to his students about their concerns.
A former bank teller, Cai says she cut herself off from most people from her past life after the operation, including relatives and former colleagues, realising that she would be stigmatised.
Only her mother and two siblings knew about her transformation. "The pressure as a transsexual is too much," Cai says. "It's hard enough to be accepted by society, but I couldn't find anyone to love and that's even worse."
She contemplated suicide, but the thought of her mother's grief stopped her. "My father died many years ago and my mother raised me, my sister and my brother all by herself." Although born with all the male physical attributes, Cai says she has always felt she was a woman, "or should I say, I never accepted I was a man".
Prompted by media reports about sex change surgery 10 years ago, Cai sought counselling at a hospital in Qingdao but found little help. "The psychologist there had never seen anyone like me. He thought I was a freak," she recalls.
Not surprisingly, her mother opposed the idea of sex reassignment but Cai was determined to have the procedure. She just had to save up the estimated 100,000 yuan required.
It took her some time on her small salary as a teller at the Qingdao branch of a national bank - a job she secured through her father, who used to be the branch chief.
Cai regularly attracted the stares of colleagues and customers despite being seated behind the counter and dressed in sober business suits: she - he at the time - wore makeup to work every day, with plucked eyebrows and carefully applied lipstick. "I didn't care how people looked at me. I felt I was this girl trapped in a suit."
But much as she loathed the job, it enabled her to put a downpayment on a flat that she eventually sold for 80,000 yuan, raising a large portion of the costs for the sex-change operation.
Cai quit her job and headed for Hegang, a city in northeastern Heilongjiang province, to get breast implants before travelling to Hainan island to work as a nightclub performer. "People are curious to see transsexuals perform, like the ladyboys in Thailand," she says.
It was a way to earn good money quickly and Cai soon made enough to have the full procedure. She had her adam's apple removed in Beijing and then went to Shanghai to complete the transformation from a man to a woman.
"I was so excited the day before I was released from hospital," Cai recalls. "I went shopping with tubes still hanging from my bladder, but I couldn't resist the joy of becoming a woman. I wanted to buy lots of beautiful clothes."
But for all the financial stability her mother provides, Cai often feels low because of repeated rejections in job interviews since then.
"Chinese society puts everyone in a frame. Those who don't fit are cut off," she says.
There are no official figures on the number of transsexuals on the mainland, but experts estimate that at least 100,000 people want to have a sex change, about 1,000 of whom have had the surgery. The country's best-known transsexual is probably dancer-choreographer Jin Xing.
The son of an army officer and a translator, Jin was the youngest person to be admitted to the People's Liberation Army Song and Dance Academy and was later awarded a scholarship to study dance in the US. That proved to be both a professional and personal turning point. Jin underwent a sex change in 1995, and now lives with her German husband and three adopted children in Shanghai.
However, it's often difficult for transsexuals to maintain relationships with partners who care for them.
Cai found someone in 2006 - a policeman from Dongguan, Guangdong province - whom she met online. When they fell in love, she went to live with him in Dongguan, going out to look for work during the day and then returning home to cook for her boyfriend. "I was really happy. I was just enjoying being in love," Cai says.
But her boyfriend's family were greatly opposed to their relationship so she left rather than put him in a difficult position.
Now renting a flat in southwest Beijing, Cai spends her time volunteering on a website for transsexuals. Doubling as administrator and informal counsellor, she addresses questions on how surgeries are done, ways to look more feminine after surgery, offering advice she couldn't find before having her sex change.
Her love life may also be looking up. She recently got to know a soldier stationed in Guangzhou through a social website. They hit it off and have been chatting online for more than a month, and she says he doesn't mind that she's a transsexual.
"We call each other every day," Cai says. "We talk for hours and our topic is love."
Cai and her new friend plan to meet in March when he visits Beijing on vacation. Although it's an agonising wait, Cai says she's enjoying life again, at least for now.
China Features
Hi fellows,
I have been a Power-Monger for nearly three years (see my Reports in the German, Lusthausforum" and in the Dubai-Thread of the ISG).
Now I retired from mongering and I visit China every month for one week to see my PRC-girlfriend.
As I am still a novice in learning Chinese language and my girlfriend is not so familiar with technical and practical things I would like to ask you for some help.
On my next visit (Shanghai) I bring an Apple iPhone and need to buy a local SIM-Card. Best with an internet flat rate and with UMTS technique.
Do you fellows have any suggestions?
Second I would like to rent a 1 BR, 1 LR, BR, Ki – Apartment in Shanghai.
I saw many offers in the Craigslist.
Is it worth calling this agents, advertising in the Craigslist, or can you recommend better ways for getting a clean, inexpensive Apartment in a safe quarter of Shanghai.
I don't want to spend more than 3000-4000 RMB/month and a fast Internet-Connection is a must.
I do have another 1000 questions but for now I would highly appreciate some help for these two issues.
Greets from the cold and snowy Bavaria/Germany
Captain B. (next week in SH)
OldAsiaHand
01-24-09, 10:54
Hi fellows,
I have been a Power-Monger for nearly three years (see my Reports in the German, Lusthausforum" and in the Dubai-Thread of the ISG).
Now I retired from mongering and I visit China every month for one week to see my PRC-girlfriend.
As I am still a novice in learning Chinese language and my girlfriend is not so familiar with technical and practical things I would like to ask you for some help.
On my next visit (Shanghai) I bring an Apple iPhone and need to buy a local SIM-Card. Best with an internet flat rate and with UMTS technique.
Do you fellows have any suggestions?
Second I would like to rent a 1 BR, 1 LR, BR, Ki – Apartment in Shanghai.
I saw many offers in the Craigslist.
Is it worth calling this agents, advertising in the Craigslist, or can you recommend better ways for getting a clean, inexpensive Apartment in a safe quarter of Shanghai.
I don't want to spend more than 3000-4000 RMB/month and a fast Internet-Connection is a must.
I do have another 1000 questions but for now I would highly appreciate some help for these two issues.
Greets from the cold and snowy Bavaria/Germany
Captain B. (next week in SH)
Captain B,
First of all, I suggest that you post this on the Shanghai thread if you did not do so already. The guys on that thread are experts.
I use an Apple I-phone with the features you need but I have a monthly plan with China Mobile. If your g/f is Chinese, she can set up an account for you. I am not sure if pre-pay data services are available or not.
3,000-4,000 RMB seems low to me for a nice place, but I am sure you can get something reasonable in that price range. I guess an agent is the easiest way to go but a commission is being paid. Usually, it is split between landlord and renter.
Just my POV.
OAH
Hi fellows,
On my next visit (Shanghai) I bring an Apple iPhone and need to buy a local SIM-Card. Best with an internet flat rate and with UMTS technique.
Do you fellows have any suggestions?
Second I would like to rent a 1 BR, 1 LR, BR, Ki – Apartment in Shanghai.
I saw many offers in the Craigslist.
Is it worth calling this agents, advertising in the Craigslist, or can you recommend better ways for getting a clean, inexpensive Apartment in a safe quarter of Shanghai.
I don't want to spend more than 3000-4000 RMB/month and a fast Internet-Connection is a must.
Captain B. (next week in SH)
Captain, I can't help you with the iPhone but most of the postings on CL are agents. 3,000-4,000 is rather inexpensive but they are available. Short term is the problem but again they are available.
Check this site also http://www.cityweekend.com.cn/shanghai/classifieds/housing/
I would not call them, just have them send you all the details. Donno where you want to stay but the Jinan Temple area is pretty convenient as is Xujiahui. Good subway connections for both.
ES
I'm very happy about your fast response to my questions (I myself am not a friend of those „only asking guys“ in the mongering forums).
I red almost all of you fellows reports in the China part of ISG. Only watching all of Eaglestar's pictures will take me another 3 weeks!?! I envy your fortune with the freebies very much, Eaglestar!
(Tried the same with the “Adult friend finder” but did not have much success).
The iPhone is for my girlfriend (my own has a SIM-lock from my local mobile-provider).
The Apartment is, at least, for one year. My girlfriend will live there when she has to (temporarily) go home to china while she stay in my country on a travel visa (europe-schengen rules / you only can stay for 90 days within 6 months).
If 3000-4000 RMB´s are not enough, I can pay some more. But now I have to maintain 3 homes (one for the family, one for my girlfriend and me, and the third in china) – I’m not a millionaire!!!!
Jinan Temple area is pretty convenient as is XujiahuiThank you Eaglestar for your suggestions. As my SH-customer is located in Luwan, I will focus on these three districts.
First of all, I suggest that you post this on the Shanghai thread if you did not do so alreadyOHA, I not have courage to post in the sh-tread. I think that the thread is for mongering matters and not for the silly questions of an old ex-monger who now is desperately in love.
Cheers and have fun
Captain B.
Hi Guys,
Need some help in accessing to ISG in China.
I have been living in Shanghai for the last four years, about six months back, I no longer could access to this website. Now that I am out of the country for holiday, this is no more a problem.
From the reports that I have reading for the last two days, it appears that you guys who are also living in China do not have this problem.
I also believe this issue has been raised and addressed before, I carried out a search but it leads me to nowhere. Can someone guide me how to get around this problem or post a link to the past report where this issue was addressed.
Thanks.
GlenEagle
Applecrate
01-25-09, 04:55
Hi Guys,
Need some help in accessing to ISG in China.
I have been living in Shanghai for the last four years, about six months back, I no longer could access to this website. Now that I am out of the country for holiday, this is no more a problem.
From the reports that I have reading for the last two days, it appears that you guys who are also living in China do not have this problem.
I also believe this issue has been raised and addressed before, I carried out a search but it leads me to nowhere. Can someone guide me how to get around this problem or post a link to the past report where this issue was addressed.
Thanks,
GlenEagleI have used many proxy servers over the past several years of living in Shanghai. Currently, I find that Invisible Surf has been the most useful.
Here is the link
http://www.invisiblesurf.net/
1. The new unlock software for iphone and yellowsn0w can unlock your carriers lock and allow you to use phone anywhere.
2. You can also by a universal sim (you slide inside with the sim to trick the phone into thinking your sim is from your home zone) - but with free software unlock why bother - and sometimes these don't work.
send email to www.china-mobile-phones.com and talk to Harry. He is honest, based in Shanghai and knows how to get nearly any phone working in China.
He will however send you a SIM card that will work anywhere in China. He charges a few dollars (like 3?) service charge, but is very good, responsive and accepts paypal.
hope that helpz
Applecrate
01-25-09, 06:13
Hi Guys,
Need some help in accessing to ISG in China.
I have been living in Shanghai for the last four years, about six months back, I no longer could access to this website. Now that I am out of the country for holiday, this is no more a problem.
From the reports that I have reading for the last two days, it appears that you guys who are also living in China do not have this problem.
I also believe this issue has been raised and addressed before, I carried out a search but it leads me to nowhere. Can someone guide me how to get around this problem or post a link to the past report where this issue was addressed.
Thanks,
GlenEagleI would recommend Invisible Surf which is located at http://www.invisiblesurf.net/
I've tried several in recent months, but this one is quite useful.
It should also work in other Chinese cities as well.
Hi Guys,
Need some help in accessing to ISG in China.
I have been living in Shanghai for the last four years, about six months back, I no longer could access to this website. Now that I am out of the country for holiday, this is no more a problem.
From the reports that I have reading for the last two days, it appears that you guys who are also living in China do not have this problem.
I also believe this issue has been raised and addressed before, I carried out a search but it leads me to nowhere. Can someone guide me how to get around this problem or post a link to the past report where this issue was addressed.
Thanks.
GlenEagle
ISG access has been blocked for quite a while here in China, maybe a year or more. I think most of us use a proxy server or VPN to access. I don't know of any other way to access here.
ES
ISG access has been blocked for quite a while here in China, maybe a year or more. I think most of us use a proxy server or VPN to access. I don't know of any other way to access here.
ESSearch for proxy servers on the net, I use www,kismyproxy.com there are many other free proxy providers.
Hi Freepeaks,
My own iPhone is SIM-Locked and works fine in China with my German mobile-carrier's SIM. I don't want to change anything.
But now I bring another (non SIM-locked) iPhone for my girlfriend to China and I wonder whether (and if. Where) I can buy a (maybe prepaid) SIM-Card with the ability to access the internet.
In addition, the rate should not be too high, because my girlfriend is very thrifty and even now she is moaning every day about her mobile costs.
Thanks
Captain B.
OldAsiaHand
02-07-09, 10:39
Hi Freepeaks,
My own iPhone is SIM-Locked and works fine in China with my German mobile-carrier's SIM. I don't want to change anything.
But now I bring another (non SIM-locked) iPhone for my girlfriend to China and I wonder whether (and if. Where) I can buy a (maybe prepaid) SIM-Card with the ability to access the internet.
In addition, the rate should not be too high, because my girlfriend is very thrifty and even now she is moaning every day about her mobile costs.
Thanks
Captain B.
CaptainB,
If you have the old model, GSM, most prepaid SIM cards will work. You need to get one with data capability for internet access. Shop around since there are many different packages available depending on what you want.
For the new model, 3G, it may be more difficult since the 3G network is not fully operational in China yet.
OAH
If you have the old model, GSM, most prepaid SIM cards will work. You need to get one with data capability for internet access. Shop around since there are many different packages available depending on what you want.
For the new model, 3G, it may be more difficult since the 3G network is not fully operational in China yet.
I brought the iPhone to shanghai and it worked fine from the beginning with my girlfriends prepaid SIM-Card. I turned off the G3-function.
At first internet didn´t work but after visiting the 3rd china-mobile shop a guy in a china-mobile shop at Nanjing Lu got the phone to work with the internet within 30 seconds.
Girlfriend liked to play with the iPhone very much. Especially the YouTube was great fun for her.
But the credit of the SIM-card melted like ice in the sunshine!?!
Asked china-mobile for a flat rate but nobody could give a satisfactory answer, because the SIM-card was from another branch of china-mobile.
Here I again realized that having no china-language skills is an absolute disadvantage.
I don´t believe that my girlfriend ask the right questions and when I asked the china-mobile guys in English language I only got “big eyes” and misunderstanding.
To learn some mandarin I subscribed now with “chinesepod” in the internet and (believe it or not) it works.
I listen to the podcast-lessons in every free time (in the gym, in the car, while having breakfast etc.) and on my last visit to china I realized that I suddenly begin to understand some words when my girlfriend talks to other Chinese.
Again to the iPhone: Now my girlfriend is back in her hometown and she told me that the iPhone is no more working at all.
She went to the next china-mobile shop and neither one girl nor three guys could help her to get the phone working again. They told her that the phone cannot work because it´s not a Chinese phone (ha, ha, ha!!!).
In two weeks we meet again in shanghai and I try again to get a GPRS-Package for my girlfriend´s iPhone. Let´s see!?!
On my last visit we looked for apartments in shanghai. We went to some local agent shops of “21century” and “dooioo” (thank you ISG-fellow “JustDoIt” for your informative PM) and had a look at five different apartments from RMB 3500 to RMB 4800.
The 3500 RMB Ap. on Nanjing Lu was dirty dark and ugly. The 4800 RMB, 80sm apartment in 21st floor of a very nice housing area was very good and we almost signed the contract immediately after the viewing.
But as we intend to use the Apartment only part time (my girlfriend can only stay in my country for 90 days every half year because of the “schengen-visa-rules”) 4800 RMB seems a little bit too expensive for me.
Next time we will look for same quality apartments in other parts of shanghai (this one was in Jingan district) for maybe some better prize.
Interesting thing was that the agent asked for 4800RMB/month but the female landlord told us (after seeing me) that she “must” have at least 5000RMB/month (the female landlord was a very elegant lady in my ages, dressed in a fur-jacket. I was thinking that she might be a good “target” for ISG fellow “eaglestar”!?!!!).
In two weeks I am back in Shanghai to continue my very difficult but also very exciting “adventure” as a retired monger trying to get together with his nice Chinese girlfriend.
Greets from Bavaria/Germany
Captain B.
Hey ... seems that I am a regular ISG-member now.
My Reports are not delayed any more.
Great!
Just a pity that i retired from mongering and now cannot write much interesting reports.
Have fun
Captain B.
OldAsiaHand
02-08-09, 17:15
I brought the iPhone to shanghai and it worked fine from the beginning with my girlfriends prepaid SIM-Card. I turned off the G3-function.
At first internet didn´t work but after visiting the 3rd china-mobile shop a guy in a china-mobile shop at Nanjing Lu got the phone to work with the internet within 30 seconds.
Girlfriend liked to play with the iPhone very much. Especially the YouTube was great fun for her.
But the credit of the SIM-card melted like ice in the sunshine!?!
Asked china-mobile for a flat rate but nobody could give a satisfactory answer, because the SIM-card was from another branch of china-mobile.
Here I again realized that having no china-language skills is an absolute disadvantage.
I don´t believe that my girlfriend ask the right questions and when I asked the china-mobile guys in English language I only got “big eyes” and misunderstanding.
Again to the iPhone: Now my girlfriend is back in her hometown and she told me that the iPhone is no more working at all.
She went to the next china-mobile shop and neither one girl nor three guys could help her to get the phone working again. They told her that the phone cannot work because it´s not a Chinese phone (ha, ha, ha!!!).
In two weeks we meet again in shanghai and I try again to get a GPRS-Package for my girlfriend´s iPhone. Let´s see!?!
Captain B.
Captain B,
Once you get settled in Shanghai, your girlfriend can apply for a normal account with China Mobile. You just put money in the bank and they deduct as you use the phone. I pay 100 RMB per month for 2MB of data and I never use it all.
OAH
GPRS Rates
Flat Rate-No Plan: $4.00/MB
$15.00 Monthly Plan: 50MB free download, $1.30 per MB if exceed 50MB;
$30.00 Monthly Plan: 800MB free download, $1.30 per MB if exceed 800 MB;
$60.00 Monthly Plan: 2000MB free download, $1.30 per MB if exceed 2000 MB;
Plans available - video will eat MB quickly (you can download free programs that measure usage from itunes store)
OldAsiaHand
02-10-09, 04:07
GPRS Rates
$60.00 Monthly Plan: 2000MB free download, $1.30 per MB if exceed 2000 MB;
Freepeaks,
Is this from China Mobile? I am paying 100RMB/month for this plan.
OAH
Thanks Freepeaks for your PM´s.
Tomorrow I will be back in Shanghai and try to finally get my Girlfriend´s iPhone upgraded to a GPRS-Plan with China-Mobile.
Let´s see whether I succeed or not.
If I don´t, maybe I ask the Shanghai-Fellows for some personal assistance.
Cheers
Captain B.
GPRS Rates
Flat Rate-No Plan: $4.00/MB
$15.00 Monthly Plan: 50MB free download, $1.30 per MB if exceed 50MB;
$30.00 Monthly Plan: 800MB free download, $1.30 per MB if exceed 800 MB;
$60.00 Monthly Plan: 2000MB free download, $1.30 per MB if exceed 2000 MB;
Plans available - video will eat MB quickly (you can download free programs that measure usage from itunes store)What currency are you talking about? Can't be RMB. Does anyone know something about 3G? Is there alrady a price available. It's said they start it in May.
I've just been offered a job in Beijing. My question is; I'm married to a Thai girl - how is she likely to be treated in Beijing?
Neither of us speak any Mandarin, but she is pretty clever with languages so is likely to pick up Mandarin pretty quickly. (I on the other hand am hopeless.)
Your assistance appreciated.
Beijing is a International city. You will find lots of forighners there of all ethnicity. Your wife will be fine there. Knowing Chinese is not an absolute necessity in Beijing for normal life. All signs are in English as well. Get a english map and also subway map.
Beijing is a International city. You will find lots of forighners there of all ethnicity. Your wife will be fine there. Knowing Chinese is not an absolute necessity in Beijing for normal life. All signs are in English as well. Get a english map and also subway map.Not necessary but with some basic putonghua, it could be quite helpful. Try Rosetta Stones, it is not that difficult!
Mmlouie
Thanks for the advice, Sammon and Mmlouie
My Dear Fellows,
Anyone knows if this years Labor day is 1 day or 1 week?
Most locals says just one day, friday, May 1st.
But some says it maybe changed back to a Golden Week in some provinces or something.
Is it 1 day or 1 week in 2009??
Thanks.
HT
Mock A Bee
03-17-09, 10:09
My Dear Fellows,
Anyone knows if this years Labor day is 1 day or 1 week?
Most locals says just one day, friday, May 1st.
But some says it maybe changed back to a Golden Week in some provinces or something.
Is it 1 day or 1 week in 2009??
Thanks.
HT
My understanding is, the May Day Holiday in 2009 is May 1,2,3, which is Friday, Saturday and Sunday.
This is based on the official Chinese Govt document that office managers get, to notify them of all the holidays for the year. It is usually distributed in January.
So yes, in a way you can think of it as only one day because it is Friday through Sunday, inclusive.
MAB
Hi everyone.
Last time I went o Shanghai, one of my friends had a really nice flat in the north of the city at the 23rd floor of a new building, with modern equipement, tv etc.
I will probably be moving to Shanghai this summer.
How much should I expect to pay for a similar flat (let's say about 50 m2)?
Do I have to pay in advance, in cash or whatever lousy conditions?
Is it still cheap to take the cab everyday?
Thanks, I need to budget my travel to issue an expense form.
Hi everyone.
Last time I went o Shanghai, one of my friends had a really nice flat in the north of the city at the 23rd floor of a new building, with modern equipement, tv etc.
I will probably be moving to Shanghai this summer.
How much should I expect to pay for a similar flat (let's say about 50 m2)?
Do I have to pay in advance, in cash or whatever lousy conditions?
Is it still cheap to take the cab everyday?
Thanks, I need to budget my travel to issue an expense form.
Depending on the location you will pay RMB2,500-3,000 for a decent 50/60 square meter flat. This will not include utilities but for that size place your total electric, gas and water should not average (over 12 months) more than RMB350 to 450.
Some flat owners want quarterly rent payment but I have never done that. I just walk if they insist. Also most want 2 or 3 months deposit. My present flat I paid one month deposit and pay my rent monthly. She (landlord) wanted 2 month deposit but I refused. I also included in the contract that after 8 months of the 12 month lease, I can give one month notice and can still get back my deposit.
The market here is softer and landlords are more willing to "bened" today than they were last year so you might get an even better deal.
Subway system is very good and very cheap. It is the best way to get around for longer distant trips. I live about a 5 minute walk from line 4 and can get to line 2 and 6 at Century Blvd which is only one stop away. After a few question you can also negotiate the bus lines but they are rather slow. Taxi meter down is now RMB11.00 (US1.65 approx)
Overseas TV programming is illegal but the law is ignored by most but you better make certain the building owner will allow an external satellite dish. Just look at the exterior of the building, if there are dishes then no probably it is problem. Cost is about RMB1000 to 1200 for the installation with no monthly fees for 50+ channels from The Philippines, including HBO, CineMax, CNN, BBC, Discovery, History channel, Nat Geo ad nauseum. There are literally 100's or maybe 1,000's of guys who do the installation. My mail box gathers their little fliers daily.
More info? PM me
ES
Thanks. I am planning to pay the subscription fee so I can PM later this week BTW.
I will probably not get the Satellite TV since most of the time I Download the shows or watch them on Youtube anyway. I'll just bring my computer.
I may get an internet access, cell phone, water, Elecricity and that's it.
So based on what you say I could probably beo k with 4000 rmb a month excluding food (and BBS ). 60 m2 is bigger than my current flat anyway.
Thanks. I am planning to pay the subscription fee so I can PM later this week BTW.
I will probably not get the Satellite TV since most of the time I Download the shows or watch them on Youtube anyway. I'll just bring my computer.
I may get an internet access, cell phone, water, Elecricity and that's it.
So based on what you say I could probably beo k with 4000 rmb a month excluding food (and BBS ). 60 m2 is bigger than my current flat anyway.
OK...........PM me when you get it paid. I will give you more info that I am not willing to post on this public forum
ES
Does this place still exist?
And anyone know the cost?
ES - Big pharmacy directly across the street from Jin An temple. Go up escalator to second floor and to the back corner (opposite corner from the sex shop). They have western medicine there. I've seen V and C in the case.
Point to what you want, the person behind the counter will write a "prescription" and you have to go pay at the cashier. Then bring the receipt back to the medicine counter and the pharmacist will hand over the meds.
Thanks. I am planning to pay the subscription fee so I can PM later this week BTW.
I will probably not get the Satellite TV since most of the time I Download the shows or watch them on Youtube anyway. I'll just bring my computer.
No Youtubein China. Blocked. Get the dish
No Youtubein China. Blocked. Get the dishWatching the BBC I player ISG and Youtube is easy just ask.
Yellow Fever #2
06-21-09, 02:40
Thanks. I am planning to pay the subscription fee so I can PM later this week BTW.
I will probably not get the Satellite TV since most of the time I Download the shows or watch them on Youtube anyway. I'll just bring my computer.
I may get an internet access, cell phone, water, Elecricity and that's it.
So based on what you say I could probably beo k with 4000 rmb a month excluding food (and BBS ). 60 m2 is bigger than my current flat anyway.
If you even wanted to consider satellite service you will need to expand your flat search. You will need to find a flat with a clear view of the open sky to the EAST and SOUTHEAST for the satellite dish to capture the Philippine service.
If your apartment has this orientation you SHOULD get the service. You never know when things happen in China and your source of news is censored on China TV - it happens all the time.
I have the Dream satellite (Philippine satellite service) at my apartment in Shenzhen. I cannot be censored, censorship sucks.
A BIG BUT - recently Dream satellite has changed their encryption so many free channels are not blocked but I can still get enough for my entertainment and news purposes but not as good as before June 16. I need to call my satellite dish provided and see if there are any ways around this new encryption system.
YF
I need to call my satellite dish provided and see if there are any ways around this new encryption system.
YF
It is my understanding that there is no way around the new encryption system, but you can buy a "legit" box and card that is good for a year for 2400 RMB.
Dream was once the best option, but they have recently lost several channels (HBO and Cinimax among them) because they did not pay their bill. They claim that after the switch over all of the illegal boxes will stop working, making people pay for their subscriptions. This will give Dream the money to pay for the canceled channels again. Still a risk.
There are several other satellite options out there, just google and pick the one that is best for you.
Sammy
Can someone tell me whether you can receive the major U.S. programs in China like NBC, CBS, FOX and ABC? Thanks
Can someone tell me whether you can receive the major U.S. programs in China like NBC, CBS, FOX and ABC? ThanksIn all my trips, no you don't get this on television. CNN World, and BBC were my sources to keep up with the world.
Can someone tell me whether you can receive the major U.S. programs in China like NBC, CBS, FOX and ABC? Thanks
Only 5 star hotels carry CNN and some other english channels. Cannot get NBC,FOX and ANC. Some chinese channels show some english programs part of the time.
China Maverick
06-23-09, 04:52
If you have broadband then try downloading "SOPCAST" P2P tool which can give you access to multiple TV channels from States and other countries too! You can google search the above tool and download the same.
CM
In all my trips, no you don't get this on television. CNN World, and BBC were my sources to keep up with the world.
Blacklisted
06-28-09, 16:38
This is getting ridiculous guys. First ISG, then bloody utube and now GOOGLE! Can they be serious?
The more they try to hide the more obvious it is that they have something to hide. Not really criticising because I do love this country and let's face it, they have been doing a kick ass job, but Google.... For goodness sake.
I am finding the VPN a little slow to be honest. Any word out there on which is better way to go, VPN or this box thing? (tech genius here!)
Cheers
Go there http://wwitv.com at 6am china time, you can watch whatever nbc puts on for its mobile version.
This is getting ridiculous guys. First ISG, then bloody utube and now GOOGLE! Can they be serious?
The more they try to hide the more obvious it is that they have something to hide. Not really criticising because I do love this country and let's face it, they have been doing a kick ass job, but Google.... For goodness sake.
I am finding the VPN a little slow to be honest. Any word out there on which is better way to go, VPN or this box thing? (tech genius here!)
CheersSuppose there is a complete management off good party members well connected in place that has to keep their job(maybe not any more). If we know how to get round it why else would they bother. They suggested finding a team to look for porn suppose the poor people will be given medication to cope wonder what the pay is. I also think they really went too far with Goggle and that was pointed out to them it came back on pretty fast for China look at the Olympic visas just fixed now well almost. Same with the great filter that blocks bananas the dates been extened. I know one sales team already was hit hard by the goggle block when they could not find customers in the US to target.
Talking about sites being blocked, when I'l be in China, is there a way to avoid this problem?
I thought about using linux instead of windows, I don't know if it has any effect. Is there anything I can do as a user, in my computer, in google, in firefox? I just paid for the forum BTW, so now I can receive messages. If you have any advice, please let me know.
Ice Dragon
07-10-09, 13:13
US Chamber of Commerce info on Residence Permit changes
by Ron Cai, Erica Li and Kevin Moore, Davis Wright Tremaine LLP Shanghai Office
As China's larger cities compete to attract fresh foreign investment in the current global economic recession, Shanghai launched a pilot program on July 1 that could ease visa requirements for some foreign nationals. Under the program, qualified foreign executives and professionals whose employers are invested or registered in the city's Pudong District will be able to receive residence and work permits with validity of up to five years, along with their dependants.
Residence applicability and duration depend upon the status of a foreign executive or professional's employer and his or her long-term need to reside in Shanghai. The Shanghai residence permit is valid like a visa for entry and exit purposes and travel in China. In addition, an "F" visa (business visitor visa) of extended length is available for those who do not need to reside in Shanghai long-term.
"Highly qualified foreign talents, special talents and renowned individuals" may apply for residence permits with validity of between three and five years. Shanghai Municipal Government's Foreign Affairs Office is drafting detailed guidelines on who are qualified. Similarly, favorable measures are available for renowned foreign nationals, foreign academic leaders, high-tech foreign professionals, and foreign professionals at multinational regional headquarters, research and development (R&D) centers, and investment companies. Foreign executives and professionals of enterprises with registered capital exceeding US$3 million are also qualified.
Renowned foreign nationals
Foreign nationals who have been recognized as "Honorary Citizens" of Shanghai may apply for five-year residence permits. Likewise, foreigners who have been conferred a "Magnolia Award" from the city government may apply for five-year residence permits. Those who are "highly qualified foreign special talents and renowned individuals" are similarly qualified. This policy exclusively targets foreign nationals who have contributed significantly to Shanghai’s economic and social development.
Foreign academic leaders
Foreign academic leaders employed by national, ministerial or Shanghai city-level research institutes or universities may apply for residence permits with validity of between three and five years. In the past, permits for such individuals were only available with four years' validity.
High tech foreign professionals
Foreign legal representatives, general managers, deputy general managers and finance directors in high tech companies, foreign-invested companies that utilize advanced technology or those that sell export products may apply for residence permits with validity of between three and five years. Previously, such professionals could only apply for permits with one to two years’ validity.
Foreign professionals at multinational regional headquarters, R&D centers and investment companies
Foreign legal representatives, senior managers and scientific research personnel at multinational companies' local headquarters, R&D centers or investment companies may apply for residence permits with validity of between three and five years. In the past, such professionals could only apply for permits with one to three years' validity.
Foreign professionals of enterprises with registered capital exceeding US$3 million
Foreign legal representatives, general managers, deputy general managers, finance directors, senior managers and individual investors in enterprises (foreign or domestic) with registered capital of more than US$3 million may apply for residence permits with validity of between three and five years. Previously, permits were only available to such foreign professionals of enterprises with registered capital requirement of more than US$30 million.
Non-long-term qualified foreign professionals
If a foreign national is qualified under any of the above categories but does not need to work or reside in Shanghai long-term, and he/she is also qualified for an F visa, he/she may apply for the multiple-entry F visa with validity of two to five years. Normally, if a foreign national is qualified for an F visa, he/she may only apply for a one-year, multiple-entry F visa.
Online application for residence permit extension
It is now possible to apply online for extension of a residence permit. After online filing is accepted, the applicant can check his/her approval status. Once the notice of approval is posted on-line, the applicant may, by himself/herself or through the agency of another, visit the Shanghai Exit-Entry Administration on the date as stated on the notice to have the new residence permit affixed to his/her passport.
Possible adoption throughout Shanghai
There is a possibility that the above measures can be extended beyond Pudong to the entire city of Shanghai by 2010.
Expatriates seeking World Expo-related employment in Shanghai
Separately, as World Expo 2010 approaches, Shanghai's authorities have also announced a special policy to facilitate the entry of expatriates who seek Expo-related employment. A new "Employment Registration Form for Foreign Employees in China (for Expo 2010)" will be used. The Form and a regular work visa/permit application will need to be endorsed and stamped by the Bureau of the Shanghai World Expo Coordination (BSWEC). As such, work visa applications can be simplified into two applications: a work permit application and a residence permit application (Regular work visa application involves four applications). That means expatriates who are endorsed and receive a stamp from BSWEC can enter China on a business or tourist visa. While in China, they can then directly apply for a work permit / residence permit in Shanghai without exiting China to convert the visa status. Detailed rules and regulations are expected in the near future.
For more information, please contact Ron Cai, Partner In Charge/Chief Representative of Davis Wright Tremaine LLP Shanghai Office at roncai@dwt.com or at (8621) 6170-9500
Ice dragon
Da Dicknotist
07-22-09, 06:34
I have a ton of proxies but none seem to work for Facebook - does anyone here have any ideas? Thanks!
Yellow Fever #2
07-22-09, 06:48
I have a ton of proxies but none seem to work for Facebook - does anyone here have any ideas? Thanks!
Use a VPN. There are tons of paid for VPN services and even some free ones. I use ALONWEB free VPN service and it works well. I think that VPN service cannot be blocked in China as most foreign companies use it for their communication and it is impossible for them to distinguish. Either block ALL VPN or none.
I think I have a PROXY that also works in Souther China but for obvious reasons I will not post it. I was in Qingdao a few weeks ago and my Southern China proxy did not work but worked when I returned home.
Not all proxies will work in all places in China. Some work in one place some work in other places.
Yellow Fever
Nice Guy 99
07-22-09, 07:21
I have a ton of proxies but none seem to work for Facebook - does anyone here have any ideas? Thanks!
I just returned from China .... np accessing FB with TOR
Da Dicknotist
07-22-09, 08:44
Tor worked like a charm... ALON isn't an option as I'm a mac user. Thanks!!
Hi Guys,
A 2 day trip to Changchun now extended into 5, and now with the weekend coming up, I try to restock on Cialis. However I seem to be unable to find it in any pharmacy? !
Great Jilin Medicine stores (at least here) offer Viagra, however I prefer its jounger brother. Well, speaking no Chinese, but using the handy pillss.jpg image a fellow mongerer provided here in the forum, I was repeatedly offered Xi Li Shi (see attached picture). But the price of 50 Maos per box somehow gave me the feeling this can't be the "real deal". Or is it?
Any advise. As always. Highly appreciated!
Cheers,
Jack
P. S.: Though this is a somewhat changchunish topic, I believe it will be the same story once I head back to Qingdao after the weekend, hence me posting it in the "Living in China" thread. Apologies in advance if that was wrong
First they came for the American news websites, and I did not speak up because I read the Guardian.
Then they came for the blog sites, and I did not speak up because I had no blog.
Then they came for ISG, and I did not speak up because I have a VPN.
Then they came for YouTube, and I did not speak up because I watched cheap DVDs.
Then they came for Google, and by that time there was nobody left to speak up...Nope I use YAHOO
I have a ton of proxies but none seem to work for Facebook - does anyone here have any ideas? Thanks!
I use paid VPN service. I think US$10-15 per month is worthwhile if you want no hassle net surfing in china.
Through my VPN, I can access ISG, of course, and also, youtube, facebool, and some other china-blocked sites. Oh, and no problem using msn.
I tried a few free vpn services, but the quality cannot match that of paid ones.
Talking about sites being blocked, when I'l be in China, is there a way to avoid this problem?
I thought about using linux instead of windows, I don't know if it has any effect. Is there anything I can do as a user, in my computer, in google, in firefox? I just paid for the forum BTW, so now I can receive messages. If you have any advice, please let me know.
I also use Linux, but the OS has nothing to do with blocked sites, neither does the browser.
I recommend using paid VPN services.
this is getting ridiculous guys. first isg, then bloody utube and now google! can they be serious?
the more they try to hide the more obvious it is that they have something to hide. not really criticising because i do love this country and let's face it, they have been doing a kick ass job, but google.... for goodness sake.
i am finding the vpn a little slow to be honest. any word out there on which is better way to go, vpn or this box thing? (tech genius here!)
cheers
i personally use vpn service from www.reliablehostings.com and i find the speed is almost same as without vpn.
Susu Lover
08-02-09, 05:24
Re: This picture is NOT of any ED treatments, its for ZINACEF a cephalosporin antibiotic. Please look at upper left had corner of the the package. Perhaps you got it mixed up? Perhaps you contracted GNC with or without Chlamydia. Please make sure you are getting what you want, because you might receive something. You don't want.
My 2cents.
Rx
Hi Guys,
A 2 day trip to Changchun now extended into 5, and now with the weekend coming up, I try to restock on Cialis. However I seem to be unable to find it in any pharmacy? !
Great Jilin Medicine stores (at least here) offer Viagra, however I prefer its jounger brother. Well, speaking no Chinese, but using the handy pillss.jpg image a fellow mongerer provided here in the forum, I was repeatedly offered Xi Li Shi (see attached picture). But the price of 50 Maos per box somehow gave me the feeling this can't be the "real deal". Or is it?
Any advise. As always. Highly appreciated!
Cheers,
Jack
P. S.: Though this is a somewhat changchunish topic, I believe it will be the same story once I head back to Qingdao after the weekend, hence me posting it in the "Living in China" thread. Apologies in advance if that was wrong
Loveasiangirls
08-03-09, 04:02
Hi Guys,
A 2 day trip to Changchun now extended into 5, and now with the weekend coming up, I try to restock on Cialis. However I seem to be unable to find it in any pharmacy? !
Great Jilin Medicine stores (at least here) offer Viagra, however I prefer its jounger brother. Well, speaking no Chinese, but using the handy pillss.jpg image a fellow mongerer provided here in the forum, I was repeatedly offered Xi Li Shi (see attached picture). But the price of 50 Maos per box somehow gave me the feeling this can't be the "real deal". Or is it?
Any advise. As always. Highly appreciated!
Cheers,
Jack
P. S.: Though this is a somewhat changchunish topic, I believe it will be the same story once I head back to Qingdao after the weekend, hence me posting it in the "Living in China" thread. Apologies in advance if that was wrong
If you have a printer, just print this. Most drug stores carry it - no prescription required. Just show it and ask "you mei you?" (approximately pronounced yo may yo).
If you have a printer, just print this. Most drug stores carry it - no prescription required. Just show it and ask "you mei you?" (approximately pronounced yo may yo).Thanks man, just what the doctor ordered so to say! Will take the guess work out of it.
Doc
@Rxworker: everything fine with little Jack, nothing contracted. I guess it was my poor pronunciation that lead to this offering.
@Loveasiangirls: bingo, thx a lot - that should do.
Cheers,
Jack
SE Asia Joe
08-03-09, 16:51
Re: This picture is NOT of any ED treatments, its for ZINACEF a cephalosporin antibiotic. Please look at upper left had corner of the the package. Perhaps you got it mixed up? Perhaps you contracted GNC with or without Chlamydia. Please make sure you are getting what you want, because you might receive something. You don't want.
My 2cents.
RxThat's hilarious!!!
Came in to get some chemical help and walked out with treatment for Chlamydia!!
I hope that Jackpott managed to still perform when he did hit his jackpot - even though his chemical assist only managed to cure him of his chlamydia!!
Sorry Jackpott.... couldn't help myself!! But you gotta admit, this IS hilarious!!
SEAJ
That's hilarious!!!
Came in to get some chemical help and walked out with treatment for Chlamydia!!
I hope that Jackpott managed to still perform when he did hit his jackpot - even though his chemical assist only managed to cure him of his chlamydia!!
Sorry Jackpott.... couldn't help myself!! But you gotta admit, this IS hilarious!!
SEAJ
Chlamydia? That stuff is a bomb against a serious case of the clap.
SE Asia Joe
08-03-09, 17:57
This report is for those of you who take the direct Hong Kong-Dongguan-Guangzhou East train - as well as those of you bemoaning the fact that things in China many times just ain't all that effishun'!
Which would you prefer - Efficiency or convenience??
Was having a leisurely dinner with BS Dave's fiancee - just chit chatting and not really watching the time..... when I suddenly realized that it was only half an hour before the last train was leaving from Chang Ping.
No problems I thought, knowing that I've managed to get on the train in the past when I reached the train station five minutes before the scheduled departure - as I could just go up to the departure level and buy a ticket "train side" if the ticket window already stopped selling the latest train.
Well, managed to get to the train station a full 10 or 12 minutes before the departure but the ticket counter gal had already stopped selling tickets for this 20:58 departure AND THEN proceeded to tell me NOT TO GO UP to the departure gate as this train is a Hong Kong KTT train (what the hell does KTT mean anyway - Keep Time Train??? Versus a China NON Keeping Time Train??) You say what lady???
Hell no I ain't gonna follow HER instructions (especially since this is the last train leaving CP that night and I had to get back earlier than the approx. 3 hours it would have taken me to go home, by getting on the train to Shenzhen and then switching on to the Hong Kong MTR train) and rushed upstairs.
The regular ticket puncher lady who I must have seen a thousand times before was there (lucky me!!) and I proceeded to sweet talk her - and then just basically gave her the HK$145 fare price of the ticket with a finger held up to my lips signifying that this is gonna be our own little secret. A nice smile and a gesture as if she was punching my ticket and I was merrily on my way...... until I ran into a bit of delay at the immigration counter.... with her watching me and me smiling back at her.
And that's when I saw that she noticed that some guy in some kind of uniform had been watching us all along. I don't know what happened next - all I know was that when I nearly reached the bottom of the elevator towards the train, she breathlessly was running down the staircase and frantically waving at me to stop and rushing to give me a ticket!!
I THINK what happened was that she was originally going to just pocket the $145 - as per our signalled mutual agreement, but gotten freaked out when she realized that she may have been caught - and that was when she sprang into action and decided to get me a genuine ticket.
Now, if this was just a regular China train, they would have just allowed me to get on the train and one of the people at the platform would have just informed the train attendant that I was without ticket - and for them to sell me one on board. Convenient!! (yeah - but it would have delayed the train departure a bit as the platform attendant needs to acompany the passenger without a ticket, get a train attendant and then allow the train to get on its way; But hey - that's not a big deal in China - a couple or so minutes delay!! Everybody here knows THAT!!).
But since this was an efficient Hong Kong run train - no such thing!! It's gotta be clock work, its gotta be efficient - convenience be damned in the face of efficiency!!
So - you guys prefer China to be effishun or convenient??
SEAJ
@Rxworker: everything fine with little Jack, nothing contracted. I guess it was my poor pronunciation that lead to this offering.
Jack, I suspect the last syllable did you in:
西力士 (xī lì shì) is Cialis. Xī means "west" and "Lì shì" means "strong man".
西力欣 (xī lì xīn) is Zinacef, the antibiotic cefuroxime.
希爱力 (xī ài lì) also means Cialis... maybe less chance for a mixup when you don't have the box picture to show.
That's hilarious!!!
Came in to get some chemical help and walked out with treatment for Chlamydia!!
I hope that Jackpott managed to still perform when he did hit his jackpot - even though his chemical assist only managed to cure him of his chlamydia!!
Sorry Jackpott.... couldn't help myself!! But you gotta admit, this IS hilarious!!
SEAJActually I didn't walk out with that crap; even though I don't speak let alone read Chinese, the number "250" on the package was enough indication that this ain't gonna be the *real* deal.
Thus, I
A) took the picture with my crackberry to post it here at ISG and
B) bought LBP instead, though I don't like it. Gives me a *very* sore stomach. But the jackpot for little jack was worth the trouble;. P
Hehe!
Cheers,
Jack
P. S.: Will return to CC for 1-2 days tomorrow. Let's see if we can repeat the rodeo. Any fellow mongers around in MF1 Thursday nite?
OldAsiaHand
08-11-09, 15:15
After becoming totally fed up with proxy servers and their lack of reliability, I finally broke down and invested $39.99 for the Witopia VPN previously mentioned on the board. It is fast and effective.
Just my POV.
OAH
After becoming totally fed up with proxy servers and their lack of reliability, I finally broke down and invested $39.99 for the Witopia VPN previously mentioned on the board. It is fast and effective.
Just my POV.
OAH
I also recently signed up for a VPN account. It costs $10 per month, and is worth every penny. No more problems accessing ISG, or any other site that is blocked by the great firewall of China. If you are not running through a VPN send me a PM and I'll tell you who I am using.
Sammy
Member #3421
08-12-09, 13:48
After becoming totally fed up with proxy servers and their lack of reliability, I finally broke down and invested $39.99 for the Witopia VPN previously mentioned on the board. It is fast and effective.
Just my POV.
OAH
I use alonweb. Works fine in general, but the lag is sometimes annoying. Ok for ST, not so much for LT.
Loveasiangirls
08-12-09, 22:14
After becoming totally fed up with proxy servers and their lack of reliability, I finally broke down and invested $39.99 for the Witopia VPN previously mentioned on the board. It is fast and effective.
Just my POV.
OAH
I use that one too and it works fine without any noticeable delay. Good value for the money.
OldAsiaHand
08-13-09, 03:30
I use that one too and it works fine without any noticeable delay. Good value for the money.
I may have spoke too soon. I noticed a bit of a delay last night. It must be the result of more USA server demand during their working hours. I am curious to know if anybody bought the $59.99 package and if there is any difference being able to access the different server locations.
OAH
SE Asia Joe
08-13-09, 05:51
I may have spoke too soon. I noticed a bit of a delay last night. It must be the result of more USA server demand during their working hours. I am curious to know if anybody bought the $59.99 package and if there is any difference being able to access the different server locations.
OAH
Is this $59.99/39.99 per year or per month?
SammyT's is $10 per month.
I've also clicked on www.reliablehostings.com, but it seems like this is a page which gives you several different VPN servers. so Lebaron, which on that page did you chose and how is it in term of price, reliability, delay etc.
I am trying to figure this all out/ considering which one to subscribe to and would appreciate any and all advise.
Anybody else got any other suggestions for a reliable, low cost and little delayed VPN?
Yellow Fever #2
08-13-09, 10:20
I use alonweb. Works fine in general, but the lag is sometimes annoying. Ok for ST, not so much for LT.
I used to use Witopia but they raised the price more than $20 from $39 to $59 and I decided to look elsewhere.
I found ALONWEB and it works well enough for the times when I need it. Once in while you get an advertisement and you have to wait 30 seconds to see your page. Not too much of a big deal. The price is right too: FREE!
Some business people are using FREEGATE. It is a not a VPN but works differently, not sure if ISG works using FREEGATE but it should.
There is another software like freegate that exists and works similarly.
Sometimes I use a proxy server for quick views, but the proxy server may not work in all locations in China. Each city seems to have their own blocked proxy server list.
Yellow Fever
Loveasiangirls
08-13-09, 11:54
Is this $59.99/39.99 per year or per month?
SammyT's is $10 per month.
I've also clicked on www.reliablehostings.com, but it seems like this is a page which gives you several different VPN servers. so Lebaron, which on that page did you chose and how is it in term of price, reliability, delay etc.
I am trying to figure this all out/ considering which one to subscribe to and would appreciate any and all advise.
Anybody else got any other suggestions for a reliable, low cost and little delayed VPN?
That is per year
Is this $59.99/39.99 per year or per month?
SammyT's is $10 per month.
I've also clicked on www.reliablehostings.com, but it seems like this is a page which gives you several different VPN servers. so Lebaron, which on that page did you chose and how is it in term of price, reliability, delay etc.
I am trying to figure this all out/ considering which one to subscribe to and would appreciate any and all advise.
Anybody else got any other suggestions for a reliable, low cost and little delayed VPN?
I am using the $10 per month plan from Reliable Hosting, and so far have found it to be very good. No need yet to upgrade to a more expensive package, but if I do I'll post why.
Sammy
Ppp Traveler
08-13-09, 15:10
I may have spoke too soon. I noticed a bit of a delay last night. It must be the result of more USA server demand during their working hours. I am curious to know if anybody bought the $59.99 package and if there is any difference being able to access the different server locations.
OAHOAH, I bought the $59.99 package from Witopia, and it is great MOST of the time. However, at about 3 out of 10 or so locations that I've connected to in China, it disconnects on me about once every half hour (maybe the server sucks, and it lagged out?) And maybe it's not location dependent, but time dependent? I'm not sure. But the Witopia icon goes from green to yellow, and my network connection icon gets a yellow exclamation mark on it. Then I have to disconnect Witopia, at which point the yellow exclamation mark disappears. Then I reconnect to Witopia. It's really annoying, and I don't know if others have this same problem with the $59.99 or $39.99 plan.
Actually, I'm gonna send this report to Witopia right now, in case they have an easy fix for this problem.
PPP
OldAsiaHand
08-13-09, 15:14
Is this $59.99/39.99 per year or per month?
SammyT's is $10 per month.
I've also clicked on www.reliablehostings.com, but it seems like this is a page which gives you several different VPN servers. so Lebaron, which on that page did you chose and how is it in term of price, reliability, delay etc.
I am trying to figure this all out/ considering which one to subscribe to and would appreciate any and all advise.
Anybody else got any other suggestions for a reliable, low cost and little delayed VPN?
SEAJ,
The price is per year.
OAH
oah, i bought the $59.99 package from witopia, and it is great most of the time. however, at about 3 out of 10 or so locations that i've connected to in china,
it's really annoying, and i don't know if others have this same problem with the $59.99 or $39.99 plan.
pppi have the same plan and never have any dropout problems sometimes reconnect to get better speed as its disappointing on the uk bbc iplayer video sometimes. it helps when your emails down as well as the godaddy servers get problems from china sometimes so well worth the money. isg is great no problems.
Google maps have updated all of the China street maps with it all in English and covering a lot of the great tourist spots we all enjoy. Shenzhen and Donggang are on there Has Bus stops, numbers of the bus, KFCs and Hotels with links and pictures of the outside and you can easy change to sat view as well, to get bearings on local landmarks. Still no street view of the catacombs though, That should be interesting when it happens.
SEAJ,
The price is per year.
OAHThat is for the year and works great for me. Live in Qingdao and work in the M. East. Never have a problem getting on.
Yellow Fever #2
08-17-09, 04:56
I haven't tried it but I found another free VPN service.
The website is www.ULTRAVPN.fr
Give it a try and see how it works.
It is using the OPENVPN client, same at WITOPIA/ALONWEB etc.
They post instructions for PC, MAC and LINUX use.
Completely free, donations accepted.
If you try it, write a report to the forum. I'm still using ALONWEB, it works fine for me. Witopia is better but for my Alonweb is good enough for my limited usage.
Yellow Fever
I have been using a VPN designed by a fellow ISGr. He does not live in China but visits the Middle Kingdom occasionally. I have used his beta version for almost one year not and never had a problem
He is not yet ready to market it but when he does I will let you all know. It is an excellent system and will be in the range of US$5.00 per month range. Maybe slightly higher, who knows?
I will post it here when it is available. Please DO NOT send PM to me now. Wait until he tells me he is ready,
ES
SE Asia Joe
08-18-09, 06:57
thanks to all of you for providing the information on vpn and proxy services.
here i must digress and also thank all the contributors who posts on the china boards - from china!!
i live in hong kong and its a breeze to post reports from here - but the few times that i've posted from within china, it really has been an exercise in frustration with:
- having to search for a proxy/vpn service just about everytime i try to get on (these services are still quite inconsistent - one day up, another day down etc),
- getting on but then loosing it midway,
- signing on and then being signed off (happens all the time when you've written a post and try to submit it/loosing the post),
- slow speed to post - especially pictures (practically mission impossible!)
- computers getting infected, and being so full of viruses so soon (the great china conumdrum!)-
- etc etc.
and thus my hats off - and special thanks - to you guys who do post from china. i really don't think people outside of china really understand - or appreciate the effort that you guys take to report from there.
seaj
Yellow Fever #2
08-18-09, 15:57
I have been using ultravpn for 2 days now with only minor issues.
I can connect to any site worldwide, including of course ISG. All my chat clients work (MSN/Yahoo/GoogleChat). The only thing I have been unable to get working is my email in Thunderbird, perhaps it is the encrypted connection or UltraVPN blocks the ports used for encrypted emails. (I do not remember this problem with Witopia). This is not really a big problem, it is easy enough to disconnect from the VPN, check/send emails and get back on when you need to surf away from the Chinese Wall.
Actually it is much faster than connecting normally here in China.
All the IP addresses up to now seem to come from France.
Its a good option, give it a try if you do not have any paid VPN service.
Yellow Fever
- having to search for a proxy/vpn service just about everytime i try to get on (these services are still quite inconsistent - one day up, another day down etc),
- getting on but then loosing it midway,
- signing on and then being signed off (happens all the time when you've written a post and try to submit it/loosing the post),
- slow speed to post - especially pictures (practically mission impossible!)
- computers getting infected, and being so full of viruses so soon (the great china conumdrum!)-
- etc etc.
please be very careful when using free (and to some degree even paid) proxies and vpns. here is why.
please keep this in mind at all times:
everything you send through a proxy and vpn is wide open to the party operating the proxy/vpn. everything, meaning your passwords, userids, credit card numbers, any and all data you send via that link (short of encrypted traffic sent through an encrypted vpn or ssl connection…) is freely available to the party at the other end.
when you use a proxy or vpn, you need to know that you entrust your data to another party at the other side. this party has access to your most private secrets. would you trust a perfect stranger?
why do free proxies exist?
setting up a proxy costs time and money. have you ever contemplated why there are free ones? for several reasons:
1.) per chance. many proxy servers are created by mistake when someone sets up a new system. they are found by robots and included in lists. suddenly, the traffic spikes, the administrator finds out, he fixes his mistake, the proxy is gone. this explains the short shelf life of many proxies.
2.) as a trap set up by criminals. the easiest way to collect private data is to set up a free proxy. people who use it have something to hide. people who set it up have a lot of interesting stuff to gain. many free proxies are set up by hackers. while you use their proxy, they steal your information, get access to your computer, place trojans or rootkits on your computer. from now on, your computer will operate as part of their botnet and do whatever else they want. stolen credit cards, and “rental fees” to botnets easily compensate for the cost of the proxy. when or before the illicit nature of this proxy is discovered, it is shut down. this explains the short shelf life of many proxies.
3.) as a trap set up by law enforcement. because proxies attract people who want to hide something, many proxies are set up by le. refer to #2 for the rest. there is no need to shut down these proxies. this explains why some of the longest living and best performing proxies are operated by governments or law enforcement agencies.
4.) as a service to society by do-gooders. but how do you know that #4 isn’t a #2 or #3? you don’t. these proxies tend to stay around for a while also, until the do-gooders are sick of doing good for free. a notable exception is the tor network. it is a distributed, peer-to-peer network of volunteers. it uses encryption. it’s usually slow like molasses. again, the encryption ends at the exit nodes of the network where it can be sniffed, recorded, analyzed. you never know.
why do free vpns exist?
except for the inadvertent creation (vpns need to be managed and administered,) the same applies to free vpns. they are set up by criminals, law enforcement agencies who want to entrap criminals, and by do-gooders who want to provide a public service. as above: you never know. keep in mind: the vpn traffic is encrypted (some traffic, especially via the pptp protocol is easily breakable,) but it’s only encrypted as far as the vpn-provider’s server. once there, the traffic is decrypted and passed on in the clear. on the provider’s server, the traffic can be viewed, stored, analyzed, traced back to the sender et al.
who do you trust?
it is up to you to decide what the intentions are to provide a free proxy or vpn service. the old “if an offer sounds too good to be true” adage applies. i trust a free proxy or vpn service as much as i trust anyone who offers me any free service: i don’t.
paid proxies or vpns
note that in theory (and some praxis) the same as above applies to paid proxies and paid vpns. just because you pay them doesn’t make your information more secure. the fact that they are a commercial enterprise simply raises your trust level. they invest time and money to get you as a customer, and they will lose all customers if they abuse your data. which doesn’t assure you that they won’t cheat you. a paid proxy or vpn simply raises the likelihood that it is legit. if i’d be really insidious, then i would operate a low cost, high performance, paid vpn service. i would have all my customers’ credit cards, and therefore addresses, identities, ssn#s, credit ratings. i would know what they access all day and would even make some money to cover the cost. can’t help you with that conundrum.
proxy or vpn?
if you pay, use someone you deem as reliable, stay away from the too good to be true offers, and pay for a vpn instead of a proxy. a vpn encrypts all traffic from and to your machine without additional fuss. proxies are headache-inducing, they need a lot of fiddling on your part and often they plainly don’t work. if you pay, pay for a vpn.
other uses of a vpn
if you use a hotspot in an airport or starbucks, if you use an internet connection in a hotel or any other public place, and if you value your data, always use a vpn. if you don’t, the data you send is available to anyone on that network. wifi connections to public hotspots are unencrypted and can be sniffed by anyone who knows how. the easiest way to get high value data is to camp out with a laptop in the first class lounge of an airport (keeps out the riffraff …) if you are using a hotel connection, assume that your data is being logged. wifi in public hotspots and hotel networks can be fertile grounds to harvest high value data.
paranoia dept. 1
when you sign up for any encrypted service, the initial sign-up stage is usually in the clear. userids, passwords, keys etc. often get sent via email. renewal notices and transactions are often sent via email. can be easily intercepted. be careful. you might be buying a complicated security system while giving the key to someone you want to lock out.
paranoia dept. 2
the identity and addresses of vpns and proxies are no secret. the ip numbers of the providers and ports to be used can be and are being blocked. more insidiously, they can be spoofed. you think you are connecting to your vpn provider, but instead you go through someone else’s computer. to set this up takes considerable effort and energy. it is unlikely. but not impossible. “someone else’s” identity is left as an exercise to the reader.
most trusted solution
the person you can trust the most is yourself. the safest vpn is the one you have set up yourself. if you know how to, you can set up a small server back home. preferably via tcp port 443, which makes your traffic look like regular https traffic. if you don’t know what i’m talking about, then you probably can’t set up that system anyway. an (expensive) alternative is to rent a private or virtual private server elsewhere and set up the endpoint there. in both cases, the identity of the vpn server can be tracked down, so don’t use it for doing something you should not. you still need to be able to trust the isp, the administrator of the datacenter on the other end, or the person who has the keys to your basement. there is no such thing as perfect security.
firewall it!
often forgotten: if you use a vpn, it bypasses all routers and firewalls on your premises. your home or office router usually provides a level of safety. with a vpn connection to the internet, that level of safety is removed, and you are wide open to attacks. don’t get lulled into a false feeling of safety, just because you use an encrypted connection. the other end isn’t encrypted, and your computer is as vulnerable as if you connect it straight to the internet via a cable modem or adsl connection without an intervening router. if you use a vpn, always use a personal firewall such as zonealarm etc. and set the security level to high.
other uses for a vpn
if you travel a lot, it probably happened to you many times: you ordered something with your credit card. the charge was denied. you call the card company and incur expensive long distance charges on your mobile. turns out your card is good. or sometimes, turns out your card was just blocked because of a possible security breach. what happened? ignorant of the fact that people travel, the webshop on the other side used a geo-location of the ip-address where you at. the ip says you are in timbuktu, whereas your address is in hicksville, usa. the charge is denied. or worse, reported to your credit card company, which blocks your card until you call them and tell them that you are on vacation in timbuktu. with a vpn that has its endpoint in the usa, this hassle is usually avoided. if the vpn server sits in los angeles, they think you are in los angeles. it usually works. the charge goes through. americans are allowed to travel freely in america, but never abroad. very paranoid shopping sites have a list of vpn servers and all alarm bells ring when you use them. then they want you to send a copy of your credit card and your driver’s license and your firstborn’s birth certificate to someone in bangalore. what a mess.
last words
the only halfway reliable security is end-to-end encryption. if your website supports it (this one does not) use the https protocol instead of http. to try, use https://www.yoursite.com instead of http://www.yoursite.com. for email, always use secure (ssl) connections for sending and receiving. some isps, hotels, hotspots etc. block the ports of these protocols. be very wary if they do. use your vpn. if they won’t let you use your vpn, move.
hope that helps.
Yellow Fever #2
08-20-09, 16:00
Please be very careful when using free (and to some degree even paid) proxies and VPNs. Here is why.
Your write up is well done but your level of paranoia is too much.
By far your best advice was to protect yourself with a software based firewall.
I write this using ULTRAVPN, free VPN service from inside of China. Please check out www.ultravpn.fr.
Is UltraVPN secure?
Your network is as secure as its weakest part. Most certainly, UltraVPN will not be this weakest part.
You can check its source code and build it yourself. UltraVPN is fully based on OpenVPN, which is available there. OpenVPN is the de-facto reference for SSL VPN.
UltraVPN servers are run by Lynanda . No connection or traffic logs are kept
You can do what you want while using UltraVPN, all anonymously
If you're not sure whether UltraVPN is secure or not, feel free to ask us.
You can also get tierce-party advice about UltraVPN. Typing UltraVPN in Google is a good starting point.
Should we believe them? Maybe, maybe not. I am certainly more likely to believe them than the active Chinese censors.
The only completely safe thing we can do it to not use the internet, don't use a credit card, or a bank, keep you cash under your mattress.
Whatever we do in China is monitored (almost all countries are the same - not only China), walking the street there are thousands of cameras everywhere. Surfing the internet, we are observed, and eventually blocked or banned from many sites. Our browsers are reset. It is a game of cat and mouse. Perhaps China is worse, maybe it isn't.
In my opinion using any VPN is at least some protection and freedom. It's good to be aware that what we type and the sites we used may be logged - even if they say it isn't. I believe they don't log anything, they, the free VPN can then resist and LE action against them in their own country. They either log and act illegally or they don't log to protect themselves and you.
Our risk of getting caught with a Chinese girl in a BBS/Sauna/hotel room seems to be more significant (jail/deportation/fines etc) than the risk of using the internet. Even LE in China uses vice cops as streetwalkers sometimes. Be worried, very worried.
I've found the free VPNs to be very useful. I post in China on this forum all the time using the free VPNs. Hard to imagine that in China, YouTube videos are a threat to national security.
Yellowfever
Your write up is well done but your level of paranoia is too much.
Foreign companies and corporations create their own VPNs so they could communicate with their headquarters. Our company is not large but is in the US, we uses one and it have work out fine for us. Just my personal opinion.
Mmlouie
Your write up is well done but your level of paranoia is too much.
My write-up is based on an understanding of the business and the technology. Whether one should be paranoid or not is up to the user. As far as UltraVPN is concerned, it is fair to question the motives of its operator. We don’t know who runs UltraVPN. All we are told is that “UltraVPN servers are run by Lynanda .” Doesn’t mean a thing. My servers are run by datacenters in various parts of the world. However, I control them. And who’s Lynanda anyway? The only thing noteworthy about them I found was that they invented a piece of software that blocks Skype. ( http://www.webwire.com/ViewPressRel.asp?aId=19177) Thanks a lot. Not the best reference for someone who supposedly protects your privacy. Or not.
Bandwidth ain’t free, hardware ain’t free. Operating a high performance VPN service for gadzillions of users needs a serious investment into hardware and bandwidth. Why they do it isn’t clear at all.
If you go to https://www.Lynanda.fr and to https://www.ultravpn.fr, your browser will throw a security certificate error, saying that the security certificate is bogus. This is common with amateur sites that don’t want to afford the $100 or so a decent certificate costs, but it is highly questionable for a company you entrust with all your data. And by the way, UltraVPN.fr is registered through an OVH company (http://www.ovh.com/fr/index.xml) which prides itself in providing "Certificats SSL" amongst other products. They could have provided the registrant LYNANDA COMPUTING SERVICES (well, at least the website is registered to Lynanda...) with a decent certificate. I don't know what kind of certificate they use for UltraVPN, but if they can't come up with a real one for their own sites, I fear the worst. As explained here, (http://www.osnews.com/story/5803) non-bogus certificates issued by a trustworthy certificate authority is at the heart of a trustworthy OpenVPN service. (Also see "Paranoia 2" in my previous writeup. Your OpenVPN client can check for a valid certificate or certificate revokation to avoid these man-in-the middle attacks.)
The Swedish Pirate Party, which has an ideological motive to protect privacy, runs a well-known VPN called Relakks, (https://www.relakks.com) (note the working certificate,) but even their VPN isn’t free, it costs EUR 45 a year. At least they have a halfway decent data privacy policy. ( https://www.relakks.com/faq/legal/)
UltraVPN’s data privacy policy is notable by its absence. All they say is “No connection or traffic logs are kept.” With that “policy,” they could keep all data (except for the logs), or give the logs straight to the Deuxieme Bureau, or do whatever they please, except for keeping the logs.
They don’t need any logs. Most traffic in Europe already is logged. As for most in Europe, there is even an EU directive. UltraVPN doesn’t have to log anything, their ISP is REQUIRED to do that as per EU regulation 2006/24/EC (http://eur-lex.europa.eu/LexUriServ/LexUriServ.do?uri=CELEX:32006L0024:EN:HTML). As you correctly write, China is not alone. Just a bit hamfisted. France has an especially bad history of privacy. Until 1999, all encryption in France was against the law. After 1999, only weak encryption was allowed. It needed EU regulations to make encryption legal in France. In Germany, the government now can legally put a Trojan on your computer (and I’m not referring to the rubbers.) Many countries are surrounding themselves with their very own firewalls. Of course, they are there to protect the citizenry from kiddie porn. Yeah, sure.
I write this using ULTRAVPN, free VPN service from inside of China. Please check out www.ultravpn.fr.
Don't type anything big brother shouldn't know. And remember: Even the paranoid have enemies.
Foreign companies and corporations create their own VPNs so they could communicate with their headquarters. Our company is not large but is in the US, we uses one and it have work out fine for us. Just my personal opinion.
Mmlouie
Same here. If your company isn't large, they probably don't have a corporate policy against access of sexy websites, and no nosy sysadmins who report you to HR.
Same here. If your company isn't large, they probably don't have a corporate policy against access of sexy websites, and no nosy sysadmins who report you to HR.
But you and I both know that we still do, yes? Maybe just me anyway, lol.
Mmlouie
Yellow Fever #2
08-21-09, 05:51
My write-up is based on an understanding of the business and the technology. Whether one should be paranoid or not is up to the user. As far as UltraVPN is concerned, it is fair to question the motives of its operator. We don’t know who runs UltraVPN. All we are told is that “UltraVPN servers are run by Lynanda .” Doesn’t mean a thing.
I believe you are very well versed in this technology based on your writing and the very quick responses you made to my initial report.
It is fair to question the motives of their service. After reading about OpenVPN, it does not seem terribly difficult to create a VPN service. Most commercial VPN (and all free ones) services that I have seen use OpenVPN.
My servers are run by datacenters in various parts of the world. However, I control them.
What do you mean by your servers? Are you running a VPN Service?
And who’s Lynanda anyway? The only thing noteworthy about them I found was that they invented a piece of software that blocks Skype. ( http://www.webwire.com/ViewPressRel.asp?aId=19177) Thanks a lot. Not the best reference for someone who supposedly protects your privacy. Or not.
They make their Skype blocking or monitoring software is freely available in the public domain as open source code with a standard public license. Does not seem so sinister to me and is probably useful for many companies internal networks.
Bandwidth ain’t free, hardware ain’t free. Operating a high performance VPN service for gadzillions of users needs a serious investment into hardware and bandwidth. Why they do it isn’t clear at all.
They write that they offered this service for more than 3 years for free because they had extra bandwidth and it was not hard to do. Recently however the service has become more popular and they began to ask for donations to maintain the service.
Bandwidth and hardware are relatively cheap, but they ain't free. They don't say how many users they have, how much bandwidth they use or what hardware they employ. They don't offer a performance guarantee, they certainly don't have a 24 hour support staff but for the price you don't expect that either. If it went offline tomorrow, the world would survive. The only concern is as you say, privacy - what they could do with the data that may be possible for them to get from using their service. All transactions on the internet should be a concern, not just using this VPN or any other free or commercial VPN.
Perhaps as you wrote they are LE, as long as we are using their service to climb the Chinese Wall, and not for illegal or terrorist activities, we should have nothing to fear.
If you go to https://www.Lynanda.fr and to https://www.ultravpn.fr, your browser will throw a security certificate error, saying that the security certificate is bogus. This is common with
amateur sites that don’t want to afford the $100 or so a decent certificate costs, but it is highly questionable for a company you entrust with all your data. And by the way, UltraVPN.fr is registered through an OVH company (http://www.ovh.com/fr/index.xml) which prides itself in providing "Certificats SSL" amongst other products. They could have provided the registrant LYNANDA COMPUTING SERVICES (well, at least the website is registered to Lynanda...) with a decent certificate. I don't know what kind of certificate they use for UltraVPN, but if they can't come up with a real one for their own sites, I fear the worst.
I tried to have my browser through this bogus certificate error but could not get it to happen. I tried IE, FireFox, Safari and Chrome. Perhaps I had inadvertantly accepted the certificate on my computer before, so I tried another computer that had never connected to UltraVPN and did not have any certificate errors.
Also, you write that you checked www.lynanda.fr which does not exist. The lynanda site is www.lynanda.com.
I actually think that ULTRAVPN, Lynanda, OVH and CacaoTV are all owned by the same people. So they may own the registrar, as well as their other sites. CacaoTV seems to be a free online live streaming TV site, although I have not looked at it in detail. I think they have a lot of bandwidth for use of their VPN service and streaming TV.
The Swedish Pirate Party, which has an ideological motive to protect privacy, runs a well-known VPN called Relakks, (https://www.relakks.com) (note the working certificate,) but even their VPN isn’t free, it costs EUR 45 a year. At least they have a halfway decent data privacy policy. ( https://www.relakks.com/faq/legal/)
UltraVPN’s data privacy policy is notable by its absence. All they say is “No connection or traffic logs are kept.” With that “policy,” they could keep all data (except for the logs), or give the logs straight to the Deuxieme Bureau, or do whatever they please, except for keeping the logs.
I looked into Relakks too. They offer a free 30 days trial period.
You are correct, the lack of a privacy policy is notable. I think they should make a clear privacy policy. However the actual implementation of the policy depends on the people behind it, no matter what the words say.
They don’t need any logs. Most traffic in Europe already is logged. As for most in Europe, there is even an EU directive. UltraVPN doesn’t have to log anything, their ISP is REQUIRED to do that as per EU regulation 2006/24/EC (http://eur-lex.europa.eu/LexUriServ/LexUriServ.do?uri=CELEX:32006L0024:EN:HTML). As you correctly write, China is not alone. Just a bit hamfisted. France has an especially bad history of privacy. Until 1999, all encryption in France was against the law. After 1999, only weak encryption was allowed. It needed EU regulations to make encryption legal in France. In Germany, the government now can legally put a Trojan on your computer (and I’m not referring to the rubbers.) Many countries are surrounding themselves with their very own firewalls. Of course, they are there to protect the citizenry from kiddie porn. Yeah, sure.
I started to read the EU directive but got lost in its complexity. Basically; "Persons whose activity is to offer access to online communication service other than private messaging have to keep data permitting the identification of any person having contributed to the creation of any content related to the service", as UltraVPN is not an ISP or hosting service, they do not have to keep traffic logs. It is outside the field of application of this law.
My best guess is that they will continue to offer the service for free until either they cannot afford to offer it any more or they get a critical mass of users and begin to offer it as a paid service. Several years ago, even ISG forum was completely free until a critical mass and expenses of operating it allowed Jackson to begin charging for it too.
Do a quick search on Google for UltraVPN, their are lots of recommendations.
In any case I am not fearful of using the service, it is very well done. My experience with this service is on par with the service from Witopia, although Witopia has the benefit of being located in America so certain sites that I would use more often are better served. Even UltraVPN, recommends another service called HotSpotShield for the times when a US based IP is necessary.
Yellow Fever
I tried to have my browser through this bogus certificate error but could not get it to happen. I tried IE, FireFox, Safari and Chrome. Perhaps I had inadvertantly accepted the certificate on my computer before, so I tried another computer that had never connected to UltraVPN and did not have any certificate errors.
Also, you write that you checked www.lynanda.fr which does not exist. The lynanda site is www.lynanda.com.
Now this is interesting. Yesterday, https://www.ultravpn.fr threw an error because the cert was issued to Plesk (common mistake when amateurs are at work.) Today, they have a valid cert, issued by Godaddy to Ultravpn.fr - coincidence, or someone in France is interested in China. The cert is quite recent, issued 6/3/2009, don't know what they used before.
As for lynanda.com/fr - my bad. https://www.lynanda.com isn't working here, maybe they are busy ordering a valid cert. http://www.lynanda.com works.
If you trust them and don't want to spend the money: go forth and use them. I shall continue using what I trust. And no, I'm not in the VPN resale business.
OldAsiaHand
08-26-09, 06:24
The above subject gets discussed on this forum from time to time. I have been spending quite a bit of time in Thailand this year. IMHO, the girls in China are far better looking than their counterparts in Thailand. That said, I get far better GFE service from Thai girls more often than Chinese girls. The Thai girls seem to be more technically proficient, as well, e.g. much better oral skills (no spitting), etc. This may be due to their greater familiarity with western punters. Any thoughts?
Just my POV.
OAH
SE Asia Joe
08-26-09, 06:58
The above subject gets discussed on this forum from time to time. I have been spending quite a bit of time in Thailand this year. IMHO, the girls in China are far better looking than their counterparts in Thailand. That said, I get far better GFE service from Thai girls more often than Chinese girls. The Thai girls seem to be more technically proficient, as well, e.g. much better oral skills (no spitting), etc. This may be due to their greater familiarity with western punters. Any thoughts?
Just my POV.
OAH
Let me chime in!
For one, most LOS WG's are older and to me a lot more hardened than their Chinese counterparts. Add that to the fact that there ARE 2 kinds of WG's in LOS - ones who cater to the local Johns and ones who cater to the Foreigners - so of course the "experience" for the foreign punter is much more satisfying for the Western punter in Thailand.
Also, I FEEL that there are a whole lot more professional WG's in Thailand versus China where I opine the majority of gals are only doing this until they've saved up enough money to go back to a "normal life," whatever it means!!
Language ability, more exposure to Western culture and mores (including sexual ones), and the Thai propensity to act and appear subservient to foreigners (although their real feelings are probably a helluva lot removed from this projected subjugation), all ACTS to make the mongering experience more satisfying to the Western punter.
But the key to all this is the word "ACT" - which necessarily all WG's must do to excell in their profession. And the Thai WG's acts a helluva lot better than their Chinese counterpart!!
Just IMHO
SEAJ
The Thai girls seem to be more technically proficient, as well, e.g. much better oral skills (no spitting), etc. This may be due to their greater familiarity with western punters. Any thoughts?
Just my POV.
OAH
My thoughts?
You've had more friggin blowjobs from Thai girls than anyone else on this forum, so why the fuck are you asking us? Ho, ho, ho, :D
First off, Santa is right! If there's anyone who can answer this question it's you OAH, you have the most experience with Thai girls than most of us on this board I'm assuming.
But SEAjoe is correct, if you measure the BBS girl's in China with the thai girls in Thailand, there's no comparison, Thai girls are better at servicing guys in terms of BJ. Just because many China WG are just doing this as a temporary outlet to earn extra cash, Whereas Thai WG are long term providers with a whole lot more experience and age to hone in on their skills. However, if you compare sauna girls in China versus the Saunas in Thailand, I would pretty much judge them as on par with each other. In fact, there are some sauna girls in China that are amazing, especially the one I got in Tangxia about 5 years ago. She studied all of the erogenous zones and pressure points in making a man more aroused and cum with more force. She must have studied some ancient Chinese book to maximizing male ejaculation.
But I think when comparing apples with apples, Chinese in general are not as sexually open as Thai girls are. At least from my personal experience between the two groups. But as China becomes more westernized, I believe that it'll catch up with Thailand.
For example, most guys in China don't even DATY at all. No wonder many girls in China are not that interested in Sex, they haven't even been exposed to the true pleasures of sex. There's a lack of openness when sex is involved in China, and I think as time progresses people are more willing to explore, BJs, DATY, Toys and other erotic fetishes.
AsnDragon
My thoughts?
You've had more friggin blowjobs from Thai girls than anyone else on this forum, so why the fuck are you asking us? Ho, ho, ho, :D
The above subject gets discussed on this forum from time to time. I have been spending quite a bit of time in Thailand this year. IMHO, the girls in China are far better looking than their counterparts in Thailand. That said, I get far better GFE service from Thai girls more often than Chinese girls. The Thai girls seem to be more technically proficient, as well, e. G. Much better oral skills (no spitting), etc. This may be due to their greater familiarity with western punters. Any thoughts?
Just my POV.
OAHDon't forget that those Thai gals who server foreigners are "second hand" as they have been abandoned by their thai husbands/boyfriends after giving birth. You can witness birth marks in their abdomens. Chinese gals are almost fresh apples from the farm. As evidence they are too tight and firm bodies.
No insult intended to either side of them. Don't forget the horror stories we read in media about the unfortunate sufferings good men get from Thai gals when they want to help them out of their poverty. Chinese gals will most certainly appreciate you than Thai girls although they have a language barrier to overcome.
OldAsiaHand
10-04-09, 11:30
However, if you compare sauna girls in China versus the Saunas in Thailand, I would pretty much judge them as on par with each other.AsnDragon,
The disadvantage for me with Thai sauna girls nowadays is CBJ, whereas, most China sauna girls do not insist on this. That said, I find the Thai sauna experience a bit more fluid compared to China where I find when that when the girls are following the "menu" of services it gets a bit mechanical. Best to disregard the "menu" and let it flow for a better experience. Also, the quality of girls working in Thai saunas, especially those establishments that accept farangs, is lower than the China saunas.
Just my POV.
OAH
OAH,
The CBJ is a bit troublesome. But that's the standard in thailand it seems from the times i've been there. I think it depends on which sauna you go to. There are some higher end saunas, of course more expensive than usual ones, in thailand that have some hot girls. Of course, in general i would have to agree with you, I find that China sauna girls are on average much prettier. Perhaps I'm just not all that into South East Asian girls. Perhaps it's skin tone or just the overall bone structure. But China and North (and some vietnamese) are the parts i consider pretty Asians to reside at. Unless they are half mixed fillipina girls, with half spanish and fillipina descent, then I think that's an exotic type of hot- and a whole different type of category.
I guess you picked the right place to station at!
AsnDragon
AsnDragon,
The disadvantage for me with Thai sauna girls nowadays is CBJ, whereas, most China sauna girls do not insist on this. That said, I find the Thai sauna experience a bit more fluid compared to China where I find when that when the girls are following the "menu" of services it gets a bit mechanical. Best to disregard the "menu" and let it flow for a better experience. Also, the quality of girls working in Thai saunas, especially those establishments that accept farangs, is lower than the China saunas.
Just my POV.
OAH
Ice Dragon
10-20-09, 15:31
a chinese waitress is at the center of a national controversy after a vindictive ex-lover started an illicit blog in her name, according to police in hebei province. the married man, whose name hasn't been released, posed as the twenty-nine year old waitress, whose name is yan deli, announcing to the world that she was an hiv-infected prostitute, reports china daily.
the blog, which has since been blocked, included three hundred x-rated photos of the woman, photos of her ids, alleged photos of her hiv tests, and a photo of her family. it also included her address and phone number, as well as the phone numbers of 279 alleged former clients. claiming yan wanted "revenge against society, " the blogger gave vivid details about stds and multiple abortions, and also made [CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123) allegations against yan's stepfather. "even if it is rotten, i want to be famous rotten because i am yan deli and i enjoy being the rotten goods like in the pictures i have posted, " the blog claimed.
a local police officer says the jealous man demanded money from yan when they split; the man, meanwhile, claims that yan's brother attacked him. (in an interesting twist, the officer--who declined to be named--was one of the 279 supposed clients listed on the blog.) when the man left the police station in hebei province, he returned to his home in beijing and began sending officers indecent photos of yan from his phone. photos of yan and excerpts from the blog (including phone numbers) have been widely spread around the internet.
yan took an hiv test this week to prove her innocence, reports shanghai daily; she says all the published numbers came from her old cell phone.
SE Asia Joe
10-24-09, 05:10
I posted a similar question on the Zhuhai thread but thought it more appropriate here.
Anyway, what have you guys heard as to what is really going on in Zhuhai and in China as a whole in regards to our favorite hobby?
I mean I read about how severe the crackdown is in Zhuhai, Shenzhen, Shanghai etc - but notice no discernible difference in Macau and Chang Ping/most Dongguan area.
- Is it really just because of the "High Official" visit to Zhuhai/Macau upcoming ?
- Is it that they want mongers now just to go to Macau and turn Zhuhai into a "real tourist" destination - and especially force foreigners (including and especially Hong Kongers, Taiwanese and Macanese themselves) to just stay in Macau if all they want is vice? And for Hong Kongers NOT to make their almost routine travel to Shenzhen just for sex.
- Are the authorities taking a leaf out of Hong Kong and Singapore's book on the way to controlling the sex trade by limiting such activities only to certain areas i.e. Mongkok for locals and Wanchai for Foreigners in Hong Kong, Geylang for Chinese and Desker (?sp) street for Indians in Singapore. And maybe they're just gonna let the Dongguan area be THE place for such activities - at least for now. Hmmmmm..... is this why there are so many new great big hotels - all with KTV's and Saunas - opening up all over Chang Ping and Dongguan these days?
- Is China really serious with a longer term crack down on the sex trade?
All of this just doesn't look good for our favorite hobby I say
SEAJ
I am no expert but I would imagine that the guys who invest in these new huge hotels in CP are serious guys who know what the score is in regards to cracking down on prostitution, etc there and I doubt they would be investing millions of RMB if they did not have some kind of guarantee from someone in charge concerning everyone's favourite activity.
CP would die a quick painful death if the sex industry closed down there, I am not too sure about ZH but I would imagine that ZH, while it would be affected, would still operate as a city.
OldAsiaHand
10-26-09, 05:09
SEAJ,
I have seen no real crackdown in CP in the last 20 years. OK, so you get a few "image" crackdowns once in awhile but it is like places where it may snow but the snow never stays on the ground.
CP has no image to protect. It is a dump in an industrialized area. It will never be anything but a dump. How many public officials or members of the international political community ever make an official visit? The best thing going for it is the strategic location as a stop for the train giving it easy access to mongers.
For the rest of China, I believe the crackdown is targeted at the eyesores on the surface. This is why the LE are patrolling the streets during peak hours running off the SWs. This is why LE are shutting BBS in better residentional areas.
I believe that our hobby will be less accessible and more expensive in the future, especially in big cities where LE are under pressure to contain it in dedicated venues out of sight from the general public.
Just my POV.
OAH
I posted a similar question on the Zhuhai thread but thought it more appropriate here.
Anyway, what have you guys heard as to what is really going on in Zhuhai and in China as a whole in regards to our favorite hobby?
I mean I read about how severe the crackdown is in Zhuhai, Shenzhen, Shanghai etc - but notice no discernible difference in Macau and Chang Ping/most Dongguan area.
- Is it really just because of the "High Official" visit to Zhuhai/Macau upcoming ?
- Is it that they want mongers now just to go to Macau and turn Zhuhai into a "real tourist" destination - and especially force foreigners (including and especially Hong Kongers, Taiwanese and Macanese themselves) to just stay in Macau if all they want is vice? And for Hong Kongers NOT to make their almost routine travel to Shenzhen just for sex.
- Are the authorities taking a leaf out of Hong Kong and Singapore's book on the way to controlling the sex trade by limiting such activities only to certain areas i.e. Mongkok for locals and Wanchai for Foreigners in Hong Kong, Geylang for Chinese and Desker (?sp) street for Indians in Singapore. And maybe they're just gonna let the Dongguan area be THE place for such activities - at least for now. Hmmmmm..... is this why there are so many new great big hotels - all with KTV's and Saunas - opening up all over Chang Ping and Dongguan these days?
- Is China really serious with a longer term crack down on the sex trade?
All of this just doesn't look good for our favorite hobby I say
SEAJ
Crackdown projected in tourist and key political area.
Local demand will exceed supply for cheap sex worker in China. Price increase projected in the near future based on the current rise in the China sex ratio. Importation of North Korean and others girls may have some local price stability in the short run.
Rise in personal earning of Chinese will have direct impact on the sex worker future earning power. Great earning potential for sex worker in the near future as the tourist and the combination of locals seek greater sex service.
Global index indicate China is currently the lowest cost provider in Asia. China's Big Mac global Index is the lowest in the world currently.
Ref: Sex ratio China, red color indicate male to female ratio greater than 1.05. Lots of boys under the age of 15 in China compared to the girls population. Extremely high ratio for Asia.
SEAJ,
I have seen no real crackdown in CP in the last 20 years. OK, so you get a few "image" crackdowns once in awhile but it is like places where it may snow but the snow never stays on the ground.
CP has no image to protect. It is a dump in an industrialized area. It will never be anything but a dump. How many public officials or members of the international political community ever make an official visit? The best thing going for it is the strategic location as a stop for the train giving it easy access to mongers.
For the rest of China, I believe the crackdown is targeted at the eyesores on the surface. This is why the LE are patrolling the streets during peak hours running off the SWs. This is why LE are shutting BBS in better residentional areas.
I believe that our hobby will be less accessible and more expensive in the future, especially in big cities where LE are under pressure to contain it in dedicated venues out of sight from the general public.
Just my POV.
OAH
Re: Thai Wat Po Trained Girl v Chinese TCM Trained Girl
I have not had this situation in a sauna experience to comment. May be someone else can shed more light.
By training both can increase blood flow to the penis for extended period.
AsnDragon,
The disadvantage for me with Thai sauna girls nowadays is CBJ, whereas, most China sauna girls do not insist on this. That said, I find the Thai sauna experience a bit more fluid compared to China where I find when that when the girls are following the "menu" of services it gets a bit mechanical. Best to disregard the "menu" and let it flow for a better experience. Also, the quality of girls working in Thai saunas, especially those establishments that accept farangs, is lower than the China saunas.
Just my POV.
OAH
Sound7,
I don't always trust what I read. Because census are completely wrong and are only as accurate as the information they are able to use in their analysis. China supposedly had 1.3 billion people. This census was taken in 1989. Back in those days, people were having kids left and right already, not registering them with the government. This is widespread in villages all around China.
Firstly, how China villages work is, they will keep on having kids until they have a son. Yes, some do abort them, but many in villages keep having kids until they have a son. Some families have 2-3 daughters before they have a son. What do they do with the daughters? Well, they either throw them into an orphanage, or they just keep them at home and don't register them with the government, which means they are off of the government's radar. Some people put their children under Grandfather's name or even deceased people's name that the government didn't even know died.
Secondly, China usually lies in most of their studies, census or reports. I bet you that back in 1989, 1.3 billion was a lie already to begin with. But even if it were true, if you taken into account 20 years of the population growth, mathematically their population should be around 1.8 billion to 2 billion people.
Yes, they do have a supposed shortage of girls on record. But most of China is still rural. And in rural areas, you can get away with A LOT of things- like having multiple children. I don't know how many girls are born off record in China, but the numbers must be scary.
So don't fret. Unless you are worried that your grandson won't have enough girls to monger.
Just my personal opinion.
AsnDragon
Crackdown projected in tourist and key political area.
Local demand will exceed supply for cheap sex worker in China. Price increase projected in the near future based on the current rise in the China sex ratio. Importation of North Korean and others girls may have some local price stability in the short run.
Rise in personal earning of Chinese will have direct impact on the sex worker future earning power. Great earning potential for sex worker in the near future as the tourist and the combination of locals seek greater sex service.
Global index indicate China is currently the lowest cost provider in Asia. China's Big Mac global Index is the lowest in the world currently.
Ref: Sex ratio China, red color indicate male to female ratio greater than 1.05. Lots of boys under the age of 15 in China compared to the girls population. Extremely high ratio for Asia.
I do not know the exact under estimation or missing girls from the Chinese sex ratio as reported to the UN. I will never know for all the reasons you have indicated so far.
In forecasting one is allowed a great latitude since one has to address variance. It is best to start with a known quatity and address the variances. Do trend review frequently and adjust.
Sex workers in China make more money than certain portions of SA. An indication of shortage supply. Demand being down due to current economic conditions one is not seeing discounts or specials being offered in China market. No surplus of cute girls now.
Now we have shortage of cute Chinese girls in China. Other posting confirm this.
Sound7,
I don't always trust what I read. Because census are completely wrong and are only as accurate as the information they are able to use in their analysis. China supposedly had 1.3 billion people. This census was taken in 1989. Back in those days, people were having kids left and right already, not registering them with the government. This is widespread in villages all around China.
Firstly, how China villages work is, they will keep on having kids until they have a son. Yes, some do abort them, but many in villages keep having kids until they have a son. Some families have 2-3 daughters before they have a son. What do they do with the daughters? Well, they either throw them into an orphanage, or they just keep them at home and don't register them with the government, which means they are off of the government's radar. Some people put their children under Grandfather's name or even deceased people's name that the government didn't even know died.
Secondly, China usually lies in most of their studies, census or reports. I bet you that back in 1989, 1.3 billion was a lie already to begin with. But even if it were true, if you taken into account 20 years of the population growth, mathematically their population should be around 1.8 billion to 2 billion people.
Yes, they do have a supposed shortage of girls on record. But most of China is still rural. And in rural areas, you can get away with A LOT of things- like having multiple children. I don't know how many girls are born off record in China, but the numbers must be scary.
So don't fret. Unless you are worried that your grandson won't have enough girls to monger.
Just my personal opinion.
AsnDragon
SE Asia Joe
10-28-09, 10:55
I do not know the exact under estimation or missing girls from the Chinese sex ratio as reported to the UN. I will never know for all the reasons you have indicated so far.
In forecasting one is allowed a great latitude since one has to address variance. It is best to start with a known quatity and address the variances. Do trend review frequently and adjust.
Sex workers in China make more money than certain portions of SA. An indication of shortage supply. Demand being down due to current economic conditions one is not seeing discounts or specials being offered in China market. No surplus of cute girls now.
Now we have shortage of cute Chinese girls in China. Other posting confirm this.
Apologize if I am wrong - but the way I see it, you're making all sorts of assumptions and making all sorts of statements in regards to the true state of the Chinese WG market from the comfort of your armchair somewhere in the States - with occassional visits to Mexico/Tijuana and parts of S. America to supplement what you supposedly know about China (this all from reading your previous posts).
YOu've probably visited China once, twice, thrice max whilst doing all sorts of studies, surveys and reading up all sorts of research, polls, statistics etc - without hardly ever being actually on the ground. I say that those who do - DO and those who wants to but do NOT, instead makes studies and observations and polls.
I apologize again if I'm being presumptious - but please clarify what is it that you are actually trying to achieve/trying to tell us?
SEAJ
Not where I live.- Shanghai. Walk Hua Hai Road around lunch time. Watch the girls who walk by Shanghai Times Square, any time of day. The saunas I frequent have no shortage of cute girls.- 10 plus in a line up? And no, I repeat, no ugly ones. No fat ones.- all beauties.
I do not know the exact under estimation or missing girls from the Chinese sex ratio as reported to the UN. I will never know for all the reasons you have indicated so far.
In forecasting one is allowed a great latitude since one has to address variance. It is best to start with a known quatity and address the variances. Do trend review frequently and adjust.
Sex workers in China make more money than certain portions of SA. An indication of shortage supply. Demand being down due to current economic conditions one is not seeing discounts or specials being offered in China market. No surplus of cute girls now.
Now we have shortage of cute Chinese girls in China. Other posting confirm this.
Shangai beauty makes a lot of money compared to CP girl but not as much as a UAE Chinese, HK mainland girl or Vancover Chinese. Different markets.
What does Shanghai beauty charge ? A lot ! Why? A shortage of supply of Chinese beauty in Shanghai too.
Not where I live.- Shanghai. Walk Hua Hai Road around lunch time. Watch the girls who walk by Shanghai Times Square, any time of day. The saunas I frequent have no shortage of cute girls.- 10 plus in a line up? And no, I repeat, no ugly ones. No fat ones.- all beauties.
I posted supporting data that reality is changing in China from a global view.
Summary Answer:
1) The view of Chinese sex as a global commodity will be short lived based on over 2 trillion surplus.
2) Enjoy while it last.
3) At 95 doing sex will have little value. Body balance will be the issue of the day.
[QUOTE=SE Asia Joe] SEAJ Original Question: "What is happening in China ?
All of this just doesn't look good for our favorite hobby I say"
SE Asia Joe
10-29-09, 07:38
I posted supporting data that reality is changing in China from a global view.
Summary Answer:
1) The view of Chinese sex as a global commodity will be short lived based on over 2 trillion surplus.
2) Enjoy while it last.
3) At 95 doing sex will have little value. Body balance will be the issue of the day.
[QUOTE=SE Asia Joe] SEAJ Original Question: "What is happening in China ?
All of this just doesn't look good for our favorite hobby I say"
WHAT supporting data?
What reality?
Reality you glean from an armchair?
Hi-fallutin data you ain't got a clue on its actual application, for the reality you imagine?
What has how many trillion surplus got much to do with our hobby? Have you examined your 'DATA" to figure out China's Ginni coefficient? Which will show that there IS a wide spread between the haves and the have nots - and thus still fueling the supply of gals ?
Have you examined the disparity between provinces and areas of China? the number of un and under-employed youth in china - both Guys as well as gals?
Have you examined ALL the relevant data available - or only those which fits your own hypothesis and suppositions.... And.... I still really don't know what it is you are trying to achieve/tell us.
And as far as my original question is concerned - it's to ask what is happening as far as the Powers-that- be in China is intending. Nothing to do with demographics and certainly nothing to do with any sex ratio imbalance etc.
Please do enlighten us - What are you trying to achieve/tell us??!!
SEAJ
PS. No need to use colors in your replies. I believe that we all are quite capable of reading in black and white.
SE Asia Joe
10-29-09, 07:46
Shangai beauty makes a lot of money compared to CP girl but not as much as a UAE Chinese, HK mainland girl or Vancover Chinese. Different markets.
What does Shanghai beauty charge ? A lot ! Why? A shortage of supply of Chinese beauty in Shanghai too.
And based on WHAT???
Are you sure that a Shanghainese beauty makes more than a CP one? Have you gone ahead and done both a CP as well as a shanghai BBS gal?? And if so, please do enlighten us the difference in price! Or a Shanghai Vs. Crown Prince, CP KTV gal.
Have you examined your DATA on the differing cost of living?
And WHAT, pray do tell - is a "UAE chinese" or a "HK mainland girl?"
SEAJ
lots of questions posted but no answers. why ?
no katsulis like study for china.
katsulis study: tijuana
sex work and the city: the social geography of health and safety in tijuana, mexico
inter-america series; 1st ed.
by katsulis, yasmina.
sex work and the city
the social geography of health and safety in tijuana, mexico
by yasmina katsulis a gateway at the usa-mexico border, tijuana is a complex urban center with a sizeable population of sex workers. an in-depth case study of the trade, sex work and the city is the first major ethnographic publication on contemporary prostitution in this locale, providing a detailed analysis of how sex workers' experiences and practices are shaped by policing and regulation.
contextualizing her research within the realm of occupational risk, yasmina katsulis examines the experiences of a diverse range of sex workers in the region and explores the implications of prostitution, particularly regarding the spheres of class hierarchies, public health, and other broad social effects. based on eighteen months of intensive fieldwork and nearly 400 interviews with sex workers, customers, city officials, police, local health providers, and advocates, sex work and the city describes the arenas of power and the potential for disenfranchisement created by municipal laws designed to regulate the trade. providing a detailed analysis of this subculture's significance within tijuana and its implications for debates over legalization of "vice" elsewhere in the world, katsulis draws on powerful narratives as workers describe the risks of their world, ranging from hiv/aids and [CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123) (by police or customers) to depression, work-related stress, drug and alcohol addiction, and social stigma. insightful and compelling, sex work and the city captures the lives (and deaths) of a population whose industry has broad implications for contemporary society at large.
yasmina katsulis is assistant professor of women's and gender studies at arizona state university in tempe. a medical anthropologist with postdoctoral training at yale's center for interdisciplinary research on aids, she has garnered research support from the national institutes of health and the national science foundation.
and based on what?
are you sure that a shanghainese beauty makes more than a cp one? have you gone ahead and done both a cp as well as a shanghai bbs gal? and if so, please do enlighten us the difference in price! or a shanghai vs. crown prince, cp ktv gal. have you examined your data on the differing cost of living?
and what, pray do tell. is a "uae chinese" or a "hk mainland girl? "
seaj
OldAsiaHand
10-29-09, 10:18
And based on WHAT???
Are you sure that a Shanghainese beauty makes more than a CP one? Have you gone ahead and done both a CP as well as a shanghai BBS gal?? And if so, please do enlighten us the difference in price! Or a Shanghai Vs. Crown Prince, CP KTV gal.
Have you examined your DATA on the differing cost of living?
And WHAT, pray do tell - is a "UAE chinese" or a "HK mainland girl?"
SEAJ
SEAJ,
I think what Sound7 is trying to relate is that pricing is different for the same nationality depending on the location. Obviously, a mainland Chinese girl can make more money in Hong Kong or UAE than she can in China.
Overall, I would say that Shanghai is a bit more expensive place to monger than CP. The BBS pricing is nearly the same, however, they always charge me a laowai surcharge in Shanghai. KTV girls, on the other hand, are more expensive on average in Shanghai. Sauna pricing is about the same, but the average sauna price is slightly higher in Shanhai.
At the top, you can find girls in Shanghai that charge ridiculous amounts of money; 5-10k LT, for example. I do not believe this exists in CP.
Just my POV.
OAH
SE Asia Joe
10-29-09, 11:00
SEAJ,
I think what Sound7 is trying to relate is that pricing is different for the same nationality depending on the location. Obviously, a mainland Chinese girl can make more money in Hong Kong or UAE than she can in China.
Overall, I would say that Shanghai is a bit more expensive place to monger than CP. The BBS pricing is nearly the same, however, they always charge me a laowai surcharge in Shanghai. KTV girls, on the other hand, are more expensive on average in Shanghai. Sauna pricing is about the same, but the average sauna price is slightly higher in Shanhai.
At the top, you can find girls in Shanghai that charge ridiculous amounts of money; 5-10k LT, for example. I do not believe this exists in CP.
Just my POV.
OAH
well..... let's just see what he writes back. Let's see!!
His posts are usually so cryptic and disjointed that it's really hard for me to understand what it is that he's trying to put across.
And as far as different pricing etc - of course this is true!! This is not rocket science but it's certainly NOT only because of the lack of or abundance of gals in any location.
Pricing - especially for our favorite hobby - depends on many many factors i.e. General standard of living, Laws - and if enforced or not, control by one faction or another vs competitive pressures, religion and attitudes towards our hobby, physical layout of each place, perception of each nationality/ethnicity of a particular gal in that location etc etc - the list goes on and on and could even include time of day, temperature of day or particular dates (if close to usual pay days etc.)
YOur data on the difference between Shanghai and CP gals reflects most of the list above, especially in regards to the general standard of living and the degree of enforcement of laws. and by the way - please read Joe Banker's report on the price difference Shanghai/CP 943288
A good and balanced reporting on this exact discussion on pricing - and how he thinks that CP really ain't all that great a deal. You get what you pay for!!
What Sound7 is hot to trot about - as per his other posts, mainly about Tijuana and SA American places - is about price parity of WG's.... I think!! Totally uninteresting, totally an armchair exercise based upon false suppositions and questionable data!!
And I'm really wondering what is it that he's trying to put across to us here in China and what he's trying to achieve.
Back to you Sound7 - please do tell us. Thanks
SEAJ
Re: China's WGs Future in the Green Global World.
SEAJ
I am happy to share the indexed data with you.
Do you have any data I should be considering ?
Thanks in advance.
S7
Back to you Sound7 - please do tell us. Thanks
SEAJ
SE Asia Joe
10-30-09, 07:32
Re: China's WGs Future in the Green Global World.
SEAJ
I am happy to share the indexed data with you.
Do you have any data I should be considering ?
Thanks in advance.
S7
Huh???
Again I must tell you that I really don't understand what you mean.
I'm not interested in data and I don't have data; I just go out there and do IT.
Please do clarify what you want to tell us or achieve here.
Thanks and Regards
SEAJ
SE Asia Joe
10-30-09, 07:36
Lots of questions posted but no answers. Why ?
No Katsulis like study for China.
Katsulis Study: Tijuana
Sex Work and the City: the Social Geography of Health and Safety in Tijuana, Mexico
Inter-America Series; 1st Ed.
by Katsulis, Yasmina.
Sex Work and the City
The Social Geography of Health and Safety in Tijuana, Mexico
.............
Yasmina Katsulis is Assistant Professor of Women's and Gender Studies at Arizona State University in Tempe. A medical anthropologist with postdoctoral training at Yale's Center for Interdisciplinary Research on AIDS, she has garnered research support from the National Institutes of Health and the National Science Foundation.
Errrr.... this is the China board.
And does Yasmina Fuck?
That's all I'd care to know since I ain't interested in Data, research and/or any other hi-fallutin' thing on our favorite hobby.
Again thanks and regards, whilst slowly, very slowly.... shaking my head side to side.
SEAJ
Died and Sound 7 appointed himself as the omnipotent knower of all pertinent facts.
Thank you Jesus -- sorry Jackson -- for the ignore feature.
Shangai beauty makes a lot of money compared to CP girl but not as much as a UAE Chinese, HK mainland girl or Vancover Chinese. Different markets.
What does Shanghai beauty charge ? A lot ! Why? A shortage of supply of Chinese beauty in Shanghai too.
OldAsiaHand
10-31-09, 04:26
Re: China's WGs Future in the Green Global World.
SEAJ
I am happy to share the indexed data with you.
Do you have any data I should be considering ?
Thanks in advance.
S7
S7,
I suggest that you explain clearly what you are trying to accomplish with the index. You seem to be confusing the forum members with extraneous jibberish.
Just my POV.
OAH
For a person on his own merit to find the location and pay fair market price in China by reading the Index. The market price variation with location will be noted in the Index.
Thanks for requesting a clarification.
Typical 60 Minutes Global Sex - 2009
Location....Local Money/USD
AR....................150/$42.86
BR...................300/$169.49
CZ....................150/$83.33
CP....................300/$44.12
CO.................60000/$30.00
CR...................1000/$60.00
DO...................2000/$57.14
DE....................135/$198.45
TJ......................500/$41.67
ID.................450000/$50.00
MY....................150/$45.45
PE.....................150/$51.72
PH....................1500/$45.45
TH....................2200/$44.44
RU...................5000/$166.67
UAE...................350/$100.00
China CP Raw Data:
Catacombs and similar: 30-50 RMB ST, No LT
SW: 150-200 RMB ST, 400-500 LT
BBS: 130 - 200 RMB ST, 300-500 LT
KTV: 300-600 RMB ST, 500-1,000 LT
Sauna: 350-700 RMB ST, No LT
S7,
I suggest that you explain clearly what you are trying to accomplish with the index. You seem to be confusing the forum members with extraneous jibberish.
Just my POV.
OAH
For a person on his own merit to find the location and pay fair market price in China by reading the Index. The market price variation with location will be noted in the Index.
Thanks for requesting a clarification.
Typical 60 Minutes Global Sex - 2009
Location....Local Money/USD
AR....................150/$42.86
BR...................300/$169.49
CZ....................150/$83.33
CP....................300/$44.12
CO.................60000/$30.00
CR...................1000/$60.00
DO...................2000/$57.14
DE....................135/$198.45
TJ......................500/$41.67
ID.................450000/$50.00
MY....................150/$45.45
PE.....................150/$51.72
PH....................1500/$45.45
TH....................2200/$44.44
RU...................5000/$166.67
UAE...................350/$100.00
China CP Raw Data:
Catacombs and similar: 30-50 RMB ST, No LT
SW: 150-200 RMB ST, 400-500 LT
BBS: 130 - 200 RMB ST, 300-500 LT
KTV: 300-600 RMB ST, 500-1,000 LT
Sauna: 350-700 RMB ST, No LT
What are those abbreviations? I can't guess some of those places, e.g. what the hell is AR?
Asia
Changping (CP)
Indonesia (ID)
Malaysia (MY)
Philippines (PH)
Thailand (TH)
Mexico
Tijuana (TJ)
The Caribbean
Dominican Republic (DO)
Central America
Costa Rica (CR)
South America
Argentina (AR)
Brazil (BR)
Colombia (CO)
Peru (PE)
Europe
Czech (CZ)
Republic Germany FKK Clubs (DE)
Russia (RU)
The Middle East
United Arab Emirates (UAE)
What are those abbreviations? I can't guess some of those places, e.g. what the hell is AR?
Asia
Changping (CP)
Indonesia (ID)
Malaysia (MY)
Philippines (PH)
Thailand (TH)
Mexico
Tijuana (TJ)
The Caribbean
Dominican Republic (DO)
Central America
Costa Rica (CR)
South America
Argentina (AR)
Brazil (BR)
Colombia (CO)
Peru (PE)
Europe
Czech (CZ)
Republic Germany FKK Clubs (DE)
Russia (RU)
The Middle East
United Arab Emirates (UAE)
Sound, this is fascinating info. However, you left out California=50% of your entire net worth, haha!
California ?
Link the two previous posting and it should read like this.
Typical 60 Minutes Global Sex - 2009
Location....Local Money/USD
AR....................150/$42.86
BR...................300/$169.49
CZ....................150/$83.33
CP....................300/$44.12
CO.................60000/$30.00
CR...................1000/$60.00
DO...................2000/$57.14
DE....................135/$198.45
TJ......................500/$41.67
ID.................450000/$50.00
MY....................150/$45.45
PE.....................150/$51.72
PH....................1500/$45.45
TH....................2200/$44.44
RU...................5000/$166.67
UAE...................350/$100.00
Asia
Changping (CP)
Indonesia (ID)
Malaysia (MY)
Philippines (PH)
Thailand (TH)
Mexico
Tijuana (TJ)
The Caribbean
Dominican Republic (DO)
Central America
Costa Rica (CR)
South America
Argentina (AR)
Brazil (BR)
Colombia (CO)
Peru (PE)
Europe
Czech (CZ)
Republic Germany FKK Clubs (DE)
Russia (RU)
The Middle East
United Arab Emirates (UAE)
Sound, this is fascinating info. However, you left out California=50% of your entire net worth, haha!
SE Asia Joe
11-04-09, 13:42
Typical 60 Minutes Global Sex - 2009
And pray do tell what is "typical 60 Minutes Global Sex?
And since there ain't a "Big Mac" standard as far as sex is concerned - what possible relevance could there be in all your research, to our "hobby?"
SEAJ
On ISG. Lead by Sound 7. What next?
And pray do tell what is "typical 60 Minutes Global Sex?
And since there ain't a "Big Mac" standard as far as sex is concerned - what possible relevance could there be in all your research, to our "hobby?"
SEAJ
SE Asia Joe
11-05-09, 06:24
....some guys behave badly in China.
and I'm talking about all these BSD's coming to town, flashing their $$ or GBP or Euros or whatever - and expecting that one and all are gonna bow down and service them to "their standards." Speak English! Don't spit when blowing me! What - a Laowai surcharge??!!,..... their standards!
Most Westerners come to town not really aware that MOST Chinese ARE xenophobic, thinking instead of how China have opened up and welcomes everybody with a grin on their face and arms outstretched for a hand-out. Second thing about a lot of Westerners coming here is that they come to China for business and their first contact would be their Chinese prospective supplier, business partner etc who WILL of course be more than accommodating - setting the tone for what he perceives China is all about. These suppliers would wine and dine them at places where they have maximum "Face" and again reinforces in the Western guy's mind the servile attitude of the Chinese.
Then he decides to go out on his own - and head towards enclaves popular with Westerners and where the foreign $$ does reign supreme - places like Maggie's in BJ and Zapata's in Shanghai where English is practically DE rigueur and everybody do cater to the needs, wants, and standards of the Western monger.
Worse, a lot of these mongers, prior to coming China, had experienced how things are at "other" sex destinations - not fully realizing that China CANNOT and SHOULD NOT be considered a mongering destination. (The HELL you say - what about all these reports on ISG, how about how cheap gals are here, how about all those SW's all over the place etc etc - of course China IS a mongering destination!). And this guy goes into full mongering mode - the way he would be acting whilst at these true mongering destinations.
And I believe that you all here can imagine how he would be like a bull in a China shop (Omigawd - what an appropriate expression to use!!). Especially when he strikes out on his own at establishments that cater to the Chinese punter AND at localities like Changping or Shenzhen in Guangdong, Xiamen, Chongqing etc - where the "White Boy" is nothing more than a nuisance to the regular business they're geared for.
Just IMHO - and I guess appeal for all of you contemplating coming to China - or are already here - to really think about how you should act here.
Thank you one and all for again putting up with my sermonizing.
...... It's only SEAJ....only SEAJ!!!! (Please chant this a few times and hopefully a grin will start to appear on your face - of course, whilst you're shakin' your head!)
Yup, I is
SEAJ
Ps. You may also want to read my post on what the action of a few "bad Apples" has resulted in at one popular venue in Changping - 949795
Index would help others answer the question - Is China sex good value for the money today ?
The short answer is yes. YMMV
And pray do tell what is "typical 60 Minutes Global Sex?
And since there ain't a "Big Mac" standard as far as sex is concerned - what possible relevance could there be in all your research, to our "hobby?"
SEAJ
I respect your comment that some people act badly, whatever they do and wherever they do it. I can tell some stories too. I do detect some problem in your post. I read "laowai" and "white boy" and this gets my hair up. Don't fret however. I tell each and every Chinese I meet in sunny California that I know he is only here to chase a dollar. Anyone who goes to China and does not get laid for money from the gazillion girls has no desire to do so. They send them to your room in hotels for god's sake. In China everything is for sale, we all know that. I respect China and Chinese, even though I know they get anti-American indoctrination starting in kindergarten. (My Shanghai girlfriend said "kidney garden" I almost died laughing at her Engrish). Going to China just to get laid would be absurd, it's much more than a "Monger destination". Beijing or Shanghai would be much more fun than Lima or other dumps that only have girls as the attraction.
Waldeck2
Members of this thread have provided the CP raw data for the Global Sex Worker Index - October 2009.
PM me or post it if you have current WGs data in China.
Thanks in advance
S7
On ISG. Lead by Sound 7. What next?
Young kidney and operation practice is cheaper in China than the long waiting list in California with a older body part.
Behaviour is hard to modify even if money is involved as an incentive for change. Easy to manufacture large quality good for best price in the world using the current cultural practice than change attitude and learrning.
Sterostyle exist all over the world and WG pick it up fast.
Money is the common link but not for changed attitude.
IMHO
S7
I respect your comment that some people act badly, whatever they do and wherever they do it. I can tell some stories too. I do detect some problem in your post. I read "laowai" and "white boy" and this gets my hair up. Don't fret however. I tell each and every Chinese I meet in sunny California that I know he is only here to chase a dollar. Anyone who goes to China and does not get laid for money from the gazillion girls has no desire to do so. They send them to your room in hotels for god's sake. In China everything is for sale, we all know that. I respect China and Chinese, even though I know they get anti-American indoctrination starting in kindergarten. (My Shanghai girlfriend said "kidney garden" I almost died laughing at her Engrish). Going to China just to get laid would be absurd, it's much more than a "Monger destination". Beijing or Shanghai would be much more fun than Lima or other dumps that only have girls as the attraction.
Currently have limited data to establish "Chinese Hobby.Cost"
Typical 60 Global:
3 WGs for 20 minutes each based on local practice.
or
1 WG for 60 minutes.
I thank in advance for all your support and help in collecting various hobby locations in China and global.
S7
Chinese Hobby Cost:
China CP: Low
Shanghai: Low Plus to Low Medium
Lima: Currently Not Available
Mexicali: Currently Not Available
PH:
TH:
VN:
MY:
SIN:
HK: Medium
TW:Medium Plus
UAE: Medium Plus
Vancuver, CA: High
Is China CP best value ? Yes. YMMV.
And pray do tell what is "typical 60 Minutes Global Sex?
And since there ain't a "Big Mac" standard as far as sex is concerned - what possible relevance could there be in all your research, to our "hobby?"
SEAJ
SEAJ,
I think what Sound7 is trying to relate is that pricing is different for the same nationality depending on the location. Obviously, a mainland Chinese girl can make more money in Hong Kong or UAE than she can in China.
Overall, I would say that Shanghai is a bit more expensive place to monger than CP. The BBS pricing is nearly the same, however, they always charge me a laowai surcharge in Shanghai. KTV girls, on the other hand, are more expensive on average in Shanghai. Sauna pricing is about the same, but the average sauna price is slightly higher in Shanhai.
At the top, you can find girls in Shanghai that charge ridiculous amounts of money; 5-10k LT, for example. I do not believe this exists in CP.
Just my POV.
OAH
Re: CP=Chang Ping. Is this someplace a honky with no Chinese skill could venture? Or is it out of the question except for "pros" who know the lingo and the ropes? Also, are there other redeeming or interesting features to this place? Good sheep tripe like mom used to make? Terra cotta armies? Anything besides girls to see out there?
Re: CP=Chang Ping. Is this someplace a honky with no Chinese skill could venture? Or is it out of the question except for "pros" who know the lingo and the ropes? Also, are there other redeeming or interesting features to this place? Good sheep tripe like mom used to make? Terra cotta armies? Anything besides girls to see out there?
For most guys, yes. But for you, after reading some of your comments and opinions on China, NOPE. You will just ruin it for every other honky.
You will run into all sorts of trouble from both the women, men and authorities.
dash,
in cp, there's this really smelly river, where the town and all neighboring town, i suspect, dump all of their sewage and left over excrement- left over grease from restaurants, [CodeWord109] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord109) and all the leftover nasties from all the residential buildings all run down this one smelly river. however, this river is one of the main rivers throughout the town, so it's a really great sight-seeing spot- a must see when you come to cp. the aroma is in between putrid and leftover punk from drunken man after eating pizza and goat cheese.
if you want terra cotta soliders, go to xian. cp has nothing for you to see.
asndragon
re: cp=chang ping. is this someplace a honky with no chinese skill could venture? or is it out of the question except for "pros" who know the lingo and the ropes? also, are there other redeeming or interesting features to this place? good sheep tripe like mom used to make? terra cotta armies? anything besides girls to see out there?
For most guys, yes. But for you, after reading some of your comments and opinions on China, NOPE. You will just ruin it for every other honky.
You will run into all sorts of trouble from both the women, men and authorities.
The men too? Anyway, what do you perceive my opinion of China to be? Actually, like all good amateur anthropologists, I can adapt my comments and beliefs to my audience. I know about subjects you do no speak of at dinner for example. I was curious because I read "CP" all over and wondered what other delights besides pussy there was to be found. Sorry if you think I dislike China and Chinese, it's the opposite, I thought it was a great place and the people were nice. However, I learned after working in another third world country that is is best to take off my rose tinted glasses before I look around a place.
FernandoAlonso
11-09-09, 14:06
Re: CP=Chang Ping. Is this someplace a honky with no Chinese skill could venture? Or is it out of the question except for "pros" who know the lingo and the ropes? Also, are there other redeeming or interesting features to this place? Good sheep tripe like mom used to make? Terra cotta armies? Anything besides girls to see out there?In all modesty, Chinese people and people all over the world appreciate a minimum of interest in their country and culture, China specifically, when you ask a Chinese whether you can see a TerraCotta soldier in CP you will not get much support if he not kills you right away for the insult, luckiliy nobody understands English there anyhow.
And without any Chinese skills or knowledge better go to Shanghai, CP is a dangerous place for the not knowing..
No offence meant, but my god there is google and there are maps of China and a zillion travel reports, get just a little basic knowledge that helps a lot
FA
PS: Sheep is served mainly in the North and in CP are girls and factories, absolutely nothing else, read Factory Girls
SE Asia Joe
11-10-09, 09:57
I respect your comment that some people act badly, whatever they do and wherever they do it. I can tell some stories too. I do detect some problem in your post. I read "laowai" and "white boy" and this gets my hair up. Don't fret however. I tell each and every Chinese I meet in sunny California that I know he is only here to chase a dollar. Anyone who goes to China and does not get laid for money from the gazillion girls has no desire to do so. They send them to your room in hotels for god's sake. In China everything is for sale, we all know that. I respect China and Chinese, even though I know they get anti-American indoctrination starting in kindergarten. (My Shanghai girlfriend said "kidney garden" I almost died laughing at her Engrish). Going to China just to get laid would be absurd, it's much more than a "Monger destination". Beijing or Shanghai would be much more fun than Lima or other dumps that only have girls as the attraction.
Dash - I can pretty well assure you that the terms "Laowai" and "white boy" are very mild versions of what the Chinese can and do address Westerners. But then again, the next report you yourself use the term hongky??!!! Hmmmm....!
And what's with this laughing your ass off at your girlfriend's "Engrish"? I'd really, REALLY like to be there when you try YOUR MANDARIN! Oh, but of course she's got to measure up to you edict "my way or the highway" as you'd written previously.
And yes.... indeed.... do come back to China knowing "That everything is for sale" - after all, you'd be packin' all 'em good Ole You Assss of Ay Dollars huh!
SEAJ
If I live for 5 years in China, I expect I may speak reasonable Mandarin by then. Certainly I don't speak a word of it. I have studied German (grammar school), French (middle school, high school) Spanish (college) Japanese (post college). I had to converse in Japanese when I was in Dalian since the hooker had some ability in that. I speak only two languages fluently. I make fun of the Chinese girl because she's so funny with her rules and whatnot but then she mixes up "he" and "she" and I still can't believe after this length of time she messes up our language. I just think "kidney garden" is funny, maybe that's the name of some ficticious place where the victims can come but they can never leave. I always have a budget so if I go to China again I won't throw dollars all around, I am a Yankee with frugal sensibilities. Don't be concerned that the price for girls will be going up because of me.
SE Asia Joe
11-10-09, 18:14
If I live for 5 years in China, I expect I may speak reasonable Mandarin by then. Certainly I don't speak a word of it. I have studied German (grammar school), French (middle school, high school) Spanish (college) Japanese (post college). I had to converse in Japanese when I was in Dalian since the hooker had some ability in that. I speak only two languages fluently. I make fun of the Chinese girl because she's so funny with her rules and whatnot but then she mixes up "he" and "she" and I still can't believe after this length of time she messes up our language. I just think "kidney garden" is funny, maybe that's the name of some ficticious place where the victims can come but they can never leave. I always have a budget so if I go to China again I won't throw dollars all around, I am a Yankee with frugal sensibilities. Don't be concerned that the price for girls will be going up because of me.
Versus your previous report - yup, you're reaaally gonna be a hit in CP!!
Not to feed the flames, but my impression of China is hooking is a way of life, and so when in Rome, do as the Romans do. Fuck any girl that you can, let her taste some caucasian, the "other white meat". I'm not an expert, my fleeting experiences were fun, but they employ hookers in the finest hotels in China. The government surely doesn't give a shit about it, or it would stop. I won't learn Mandarin soon, so I'll have to pay the higher prices if I go again. Now, if they could just do something about that long plane flight over there....
Versus your previous report - yup, you're reaaally gonna be a hit in CP!!
I see no contradiction in my posts. I will not overpay for hookers, I will learn the price structure here. I also believe that prostitution is a tradition in China that the government either cannot or will not stamp out. So, when in Rome, do as the Romans do. I guess I'll just have to pick up on the few Chinese girls who emailed me "come back to visit me in China". I will give them some "duck dick" the succulent "white meat" that they all crave so much. Don't worry, I don't go around insulting people because I'm a guest in China. But, I won't "tip" the hooker they send to my hotel room if I am unable to snag some girl somewhere. I've already been set up with a few friends of California Chinese girls, I guess there is an underground "lonely hearts club" or "Chinese girl seeking the other white meat" conspiracy. I will try to nail them, but "I always deny them my essence, Mandrake."
I see no contradiction in my posts. I will not overpay for hookers, I will learn the price structure here. I also believe that prostitution is a tradition in China that the government either cannot or will not stamp out. So, when in Rome, do as the Romans do. I guess I'll just have to pick up on the few Chinese girls who emailed me "come back to visit me in China". I will give them some "duck dick" the succulent "white meat" that they all crave so much. Don't worry, I don't go around insulting people because I'm a guest in China. But, I won't "tip" the hooker they send to my hotel room if I am unable to snag some girl somewhere. I've already been set up with a few friends of California Chinese girls, I guess there is an underground "lonely hearts club" or "Chinese girl seeking the other white meat" conspiracy. I will try to nail them, but "I always deny them my essence, Mandrake."
Side note: I have not yet met a Chinese woman who did not ask numerous questions to try and determine my net worth. The one who is a "matchmaker" was blunt: "Do you have $1 million dollars? Or is it less?" I had to chuckle. It's so nice to be appreciated for who you are, haha.
Bob Builder
11-11-09, 00:42
Side note: I have not yet met a Chinese woman who did not ask numerous questions to try and determine my net worth. The one who is a "matchmaker" was blunt: "Do you have $1 million dollars? Or is it less?" I had to chuckle. It's so nice to be appreciated for who you are, haha.
There a whole lot in Shenzhen who haven't been able to find a Chinese hussband for some reason or another and have passed their sell buy date and found their only option is to marry a foreigner. One I met was in this situation as she decided to go for the easy $$$ and be some Hong Kong guy's mistress for a few years but when she worked out that he was never going to marry her she married a Canadian headmaster who she met on the web as no one else in China wanted her. It works 2 ways as that guy must have been desparate too. This guy sends her money and must be financially stable. She isn't marrying for love and she can be poor staying in China.
There a whole lot in Shenzhen who haven't been able to find a Chinese hussband for some reason or another and have passed their sell buy date and found their only option is to marry a foreigner. One I met was in this situation as she decided to go for the easy $$$ and be some Hong Kong guy's mistress for a few years but when she worked out that he was never going to marry her she married a Canadian headmaster who she met on the web as no one else in China wanted her. It works 2 ways as that guy must have been desparate too. This guy sends her money and must be financially stable. She isn't marrying for love and she can be poor staying in China.
NO SHIT! But, maybe she can make the Canadian guy happy, I hope so for his sake. Ever spend much time in Canada? Except for a couple places, it can be pretty slim pickin's for finding girls. Why he sends her money I can't fathom, but I guess he can afford it. I have a problem marrying a woman who was a mistress, she's suspect in my book. Fine for girlfriend material of course :)
Bob Builder
11-11-09, 02:54
NO SHIT! But, maybe she can make the Canadian guy happy, I hope so for his sake. Ever spend much time in Canada? Except for a couple places, it can be pretty slim pickin's for finding girls. Why he sends her money I can't fathom, but I guess he can afford it. I have a problem marrying a woman who was a mistress, she's suspect in my book. Fine for girlfriend material of course :)
From my understanding from my buddy who is still shagging her after the guy came over here, she wasn't used to the guys big dick and he made the most of the trip since he was getting none in Canada.
Don't you give housekeeping to your wife or does she give you pocketmoney?
Dash, none of these gals are going to tell anyone they were someone's mistress and most guys don't know how to check out if a gal's story anyway.
SE Asia Joe
11-11-09, 06:15
I see no contradiction in my posts. I will not overpay for hookers, I will learn the price structure here. I also believe that prostitution is a tradition in China that the government either cannot or will not stamp out. So, when in Rome, do as the Romans do. I guess I'll just have to pick up on the few Chinese girls who emailed me "come back to visit me in China". I will give them some "duck dick" the succulent "white meat" that they all crave so much. Don't worry, I don't go around insulting people because I'm a guest in China. But, I won't "tip" the hooker they send to my hotel room if I am unable to snag some girl somewhere. I've already been set up with a few friends of California Chinese girls, I guess there is an underground "lonely hearts club" or "Chinese girl seeking the other white meat" conspiracy. I will try to nail them, but "I always deny them my essence, Mandrake."
OK..... then please let me be a bit blunt then.
A Yankee Doodle Rah Rah Rah comes over to China, gets all big headed about being solicited 2 minutes out from his hotel door, meets up with some minor officials/business brokers who kowtow to him, then brings him to places where this minor official has maximum face - which re-inforces this guy's impression of how servile ALL China must be. Then he strikes out on his own and again score a gal - who may nor may not be a WG - but who nonetheless plays this guy and give him the impression as being sincere and totally infatuated with this Big, Strong, Rich American.
Same guy comes back to the Good Ole You Assssss of Aye and meets up with an over the hill and previously discarded Shanghai "lady" who plainly just has $$$ in her sight but who the guy just cannot even fathom at all - that she wouldn't be totally and madly in love with him for his other qualities!
Then he gets on ISG and read all these posts about desperate Chinese gals, them going to to Duck palaces, them being easy freeby targets on QQ, MSN etc and even on English language centers, starbucks and of course the bars.
OK.... this same guy will come back to China with ideas of full and total conquest of all fair maidens.
You see anybody here that perhaps matches your shallow knowledge of how things really are in China and your expectations??
IMHO
SEAJ
OK..... then please let me be a bit blunt then.
A Yankee Doodle Rah Rah Rah comes over to China, gets all big headed about being solicited 2 minutes out from his hotel door, meets up with some minor officials/business brokers who kowtow to him, then brings him to places where this minor official has maximum face - which re-inforces this guy's impression of how servile ALL China must be. Then he strikes out on his own and again score a gal - who may nor may not be a WG - but who nonetheless plays this guy and give him the impression as being sincere and totally infatuated with this Big, Strong, Rich American.
Same guy comes back to the Good Ole You Assssss of Aye and meets up with an over the hill and previously discarded Shanghai "lady" who plainly just has $$$ in her sight but who the guy just cannot even fathom at all - that she wouldn't be totally and madly in love with him for his other qualities!
Then he gets on ISG and read all these posts about desperate Chinese gals, them going to to Duck palaces, them being easy freeby targets on QQ, MSN etc and even on English language centers, starbucks and of course the bars.
OK.... this same guy will come back to China with ideas of full and total conquest of all fair maidens.
You see anybody here that perhaps matches your shallow knowledge of how things really are in China and your expectations??
IMHO
SEAJ
Joe, we must stop posting, the others will be bored. But, you should not insult or be insulting. "you ass of A".Why are you getting personal with me with your posts?
This site is about chasing pussy, not feeding egos. For the record, China was fantastic, there are girls everywhere who are friendly. Do you doubt that some may be interested in someone who looks, talks and dresses differently from everyone else? Want to know the magic words all over the world? "I'm from California" Their eyes get wide. Women are interested in novelty and fantasize about mystical places like Hollywood. I never give anyone the impression I am rich.
I don't know about being taken anywhere by the Chinese officials where they had face, it was always some banquet at a restaurant that the govt. actually owned, the grub was great.
I was not played by any girls in China. I met just a few but the ones I fucked all were paid.
I spent an afternoon with the pretty interpreter supplied by the Party. She asked me "You only like beautiful girls, don't you?" Later, our guide was convinced I had fucked her. I said "No, we just saw the town." I was flattered.
The girl who lives here is only over the hill perhaps by monger in China standards. Here she is considered very desirable. She was not discarded. She was never a Chinese hooker so it's irrelevant anyway, she's a U.S. citizen, owns her own business and lives in the most exclusive zip code on Earth.
I don't think the Chinese kowtow, but they were extremely nice. Do I think they really like me? Of course not, I'm not Chinese. Do I expect them to be servile to me? No. Will the girls sell their ass to me all over the place? I guess so, since that's what I read here and that's what I found with no searching.
For the record, I have limited hooker experience. Why? Because it's a pain in the U.S. Mexico has hookers, but I don't need to use them there, free works great. So, some California hos, some Mexican models, and Chinese and Australian is all I report. Would I need to get Chinese hookers if I go back and visit? Maybe not, but I WANT to anyway.
If you have a problem with some Americans coming over and making you feel bad, take it up with them. Wait till the Russians show up then you'll really be upset.
SE Asia Joe
11-11-09, 08:58
Joe, we must stop posting, the others will be bored. But, you should not insult or be insulting. "you ass of A". Are you crazy? Why are you getting personal with me with your posts? Surely you would not do so in person.
This site is about chasing pussy, not feeding your ego. For the record, China was fantastic, there are girls everywhere who are friendly. Do you doubt that some may be interested in someone who looks, talks and dresses differently from everyone else? Want to know the magic words all over the world? "I'm from California" Their eyes get wide. Women are interested in novelty and fantasize about mystical places like Hollywood.
I don't know about being taken anywhere by the Chinese officials where they had face, it was always some banquet at a restaurant that the govt. actually owned, the grub was great.
I was not played by any girls in China. I met just a few but the ones I fucked all were paid.
The girl who lives here is only over the hill perhaps by monger in China standards. Here she is considered very desirable. She was not discarded. She was never a Chinese hooker so it's irrelevant anyway, she's a U.S. citizen, owns her own business and lives in the most exclusive zip code on Earth.
I don't think the Chinese kowtow, but they were extremely nice. Do I think they really like me? Of course not, I'm not Chinese. Do I expect them to be servile to me? No. Will the girls sell their ass to me all over the place? I guess so, since that's what I read here and that's what I found with no searching.
If you have a problem with some imaginary Americans coming over and making you feel bad, take it up with them. Wait till the Russians show up then you'll really be upset.
No = Not meant to be insulting at all - why would I want to do THAT?? Hell, I've never even met you!
Rather it was meant to be advise to you and your wide eyed wonderment of China and the Chinese ladies.
And also perhaps to point out that your condescending attitude about the Chinese gals and the Chinese in general is not really appreciated..... especially here on the China boards!
OK, you've been to China once, twice, perhaps even thrice, you go to China town pretty regularly (I guess) and YES........! You've got yourself a Shanghainese GF living in Monterey (the most exclusive Zip code on Earth??!! Most exclusive???!!!) - and you go on here to seek opinion and advice and comments on?!
Then you write about making fun of your GF's lousy Engrish, about her eating skin, tendons and funny parts, how you need A subservient Asian woman, "believe that the tradition in China of sex for money is ingrained there," How ALL Chinese salivate at even the thought of California - gimme a break!!
And then ".........I will give them some "duck dick" the succulent "white meat" that they all crave so much. Don't worry, I don't go around insulting people because I'm a guest in China....." So, I guess the Chinese women folk in China is not "people" in your dictionary huh?
No, Dash - what you need is a dash of reality in your views and opinions about China - and a change of attitude.
Just my POV
SEAJ
I have to admit I am turned on by the Chinese red and black silk gown on a woman. More so if it has gold thread pattern on it of a dragon or a tiger.
Any suggestion as to where I should look for this combination of WGs with silk covering in red or black in China?
Thanks in advance
S7
The most exclusive zipcode is indeed near Monterey. Hint: they have a famous golf course, for $9 you can drive around her neighborhood. You may bump into Clint Eastwood. I assumed this forum was about *****mongers "living in China", I therefore didn't soften my comments for the local Chinese sensibilities. So, sorry if you think I go around acting like god, it's very different, I am looking around with amazement. The war of the sexes is real. Girls want to marry a US citizen and even pay for the privilege. Can a guy use this to an advantage? Possibly. Should he? Why the fuck not? Girls around the world do seem to react to "California" for whatever reason. I must use any method at my disposal to get laid. Cash for a strumpet is a last resort, but an acceptable method.
Lighten up, calling myself "white meat" and my cock "duck dick" is for fun, besides it rhymes. "suck my duck dick" just rolls off the tongue. Some of the beliefs in China are indeed quaint and ridiculous, but so what? It's not a problem, it's interesting. I will never inflate the prices paid to hookers in China, won't insult them, and won't make fun of some strange dish if I am served it accidentally. "Oh, my beliefs prevent me from eating primates and pets." Now, detect that was humor?
SE Asia Joe
11-12-09, 05:11
The most exclusive zipcode is indeed near Monterey. Hint: they have a famous golf course, for $9 you can drive around her neighborhood. You may bump into Clint Eastwood. I assumed this forum was about *****mongers "living in China", I therefore didn't soften my comments for the local Chinese sensibilities. So, sorry if you think I go around acting like god, it's very different, I am looking around with amazement. The war of the sexes is real. Girls want to marry a US citizen and even pay for the privilege. Can a guy use this to an advantage? Possibly. Should he? Why the fuck not? Girls around the world do seem to react to "California" for whatever reason. I must use any method at my disposal to get laid. Cash for a strumpet is a last resort, but an acceptable method.
Lighten up, calling myself "white meat" and my cock "duck dick" is for fun, besides it rhymes. "suck my duck dick" just rolls off the tongue. Some of the beliefs in China are indeed quaint and ridiculous, but so what? It's not a problem, it's interesting. I will never inflate the prices paid to hookers in China, won't insult them, and won't make fun of some strange dish if I am served it accidentally. "Oh, my beliefs prevent me from eating primates and pets." Now, detect that was humor?
The Following only my POV, in my humblest opinion, not trying to stir anything up etc etc. so please bear with me. OK? Thanks!
Dash = whilst I appreciate your attempts to ameliorate the situation by using humour etc, you must understand that there is nothing funny in your feeble attempt at such when accompanied by a still condescending and your "I am better, I am an American from California attitude."
Buffoonery, Rah Rah Rah, Hi Y'all, Hee-Haw, Bull in a China shop actions do NOT go down well in China and I would suggest is one of the major reasons why a lot of Chinese - who are NOT used to such crass mannerism - to look unfavorably at a lot of foreigners. THIS.... is what I am trying to point out to you.
I do apologize if I do come on strong on this subject - and NO, I am NOT trying to insult or denigrate you - or otherwise trying to start a flame war or whatever its called. But I do think it important that this subject be thoroughly discussed and brought out into the open for others who may be reading; as I certainly do think that your writings may give the exact wrong guidance to those who are going to visit China.
I've had the misfortune of having to entertain a couple of mommies who let me have it - just because they thought that I was responsible for sending in a couple or so Foreigners into their shop - and causing problems. NOT that they meant to cause problems I am sure, but their brand of humour and accompanying actions went down like a lead balloon.
I know that I've probably written more than enough on the subject - but apparently there are still guys out there who still do not get "IT." And I again apologize - but to me you represent such personae.
PEACE - and again, I'm NOT trying to start a flame war or anything like it - and the above is strictly IMHO
SEAJ
Like I say, when in Rome, do as the Romans do. I only go with the flow, and the girls were all around from my perspective. I feel it's absolutely impossible for me or any American to be as obnoxious or denigrating to the natives as the local corrupt abusive officials. I can't recall cases of Americans grabbing 11 year old Chinese girls and trying to drag them into restaurant bathrooms. I also cannot imagine that the Japanses drunk *****mongers are more welcome than someone like me. Anyway, China is interesting and fun on its own merits, but I have no idea how badly foreigners behave, I didn't see them performing any antics in the Grand Hyatt in Beijing, and I saw no one on the streets doing anything odd either. I did see an old geezer with a gorgeous young Chinese girl, and I can sure see how this would offend the sensibilities of the locals. Whenever I spoke to someone in a big place, somehow a crowd of people formed a circle around us to observe us. I think I am at least as "exotic" and interesting to the girls in China as they are to me, but probably moreso, since I have known Chinese here and they have probably not met many american guys who are not older men in suits. If you are Chinese and hate others fucking your women, I can see why it bothers you. You can have the satisfaction that they relate to you better than to me, and see me as an interesting zoo animal. I am not foolish enough to believe they see me as "civilized." We are barbarians to them probably.
SE Asia Joe
11-12-09, 08:13
Like I say, when in Rome, do as the Romans do. I only go with the flow, and the girls were all around from my perspective. I feel it's absolutely impossible for me or any American to be as obnoxious or denigrating to the natives as the local corrupt abusive officials. I can't recall cases of Americans grabbing 11 year old Chinese girls and trying to drag them into restaurant bathrooms. I also cannot imagine that the Japanses drunk *****mongers are more welcome than someone like me. .................. If you are Chinese and hate others fucking your women, I can see why it bothers you. You can have the satisfaction that they relate to you better than to me, and see me as an interesting zoo animal. I am not foolish enough to believe they see me as "civilized." We are barbarians to them probably.
I give up!!!
Do as the Romans do....and cite how an abusive corrupt local official acts??!!! That is the standards you've set for yourself when doing as the Romans do huh??!!
Yes I am Chinese but I don't particularly care who fucks who - It's the other Majority of Chinese who DOES care and who I am trying to advise you and others to be aware of, to be considerate of their sensibilities, to tone down all this "Yeah!! I is from A.m.e.r.i.c.a., I is from the Gold Mountain, I is exotic, I is civilized" shit.
As I said, advise - and you take it or you don't.
But like I said previously, you're really gonna be a hit in CP - and I suspect in most other parts of China.
SEAJ
Chocha Monger
11-12-09, 08:18
Whenever I spoke to someone in a big place, somehow a crowd of people formed a circle around us to observe us. I think I am at least as "exotic" and interesting to the girls in China as they are to me, but probably moreso, since I have known Chinese here and they have probably not met many american guys who are not older men in suits.
They were no doubt pining to try some of that "duck dick" or "the other white meat" and we're not talking about moo shoo pork. :D
Bob Builder
11-12-09, 09:13
Like I say, when in Rome, do as the Romans do. I only go with the flow, and the girls were all around from my perspective. I feel it's absolutely impossible for me or any American to be as obnoxious or denigrating to the natives as the local corrupt abusive officials. I can't recall cases of Americans grabbing 11 year old Chinese girls and trying to drag them into restaurant bathrooms. I also cannot imagine that the Japanses drunk *****mongers are more welcome than someone like me. Anyway, China is interesting and fun on its own merits, but I have no idea how badly foreigners behave, I didn't see them performing any antics in the Grand Hyatt in Beijing, and I saw no one on the streets doing anything odd either. I did see an old geezer with a gorgeous young Chinese girl, and I can sure see how this would offend the sensibilities of the locals. Whenever I spoke to someone in a big place, somehow a crowd of people formed a circle around us to observe us. I think I am at least as "exotic" and interesting to the girls in China as they are to me, but probably moreso, since I have known Chinese here and they have probably not met many american guys who are not older men in suits. If you are Chinese and hate others fucking your women, I can see why it bothers you. You can have the satisfaction that they relate to you better than to me, and see me as an interesting zoo animal. I am not foolish enough to believe they see me as "civilized." We are barbarians to them probably.
While I think Joe is having a couple of off days and should cool down but that's up to him as this is an open forum, I don't think anyone should go on about corruption in China when they come from the country that gave us Enron and whose president publicly lied about having sex in the white house with Monica. Not that I have anything against Bill as he feck women that I wouldn't touch with my duck dick.
FernandoAlonso
11-12-09, 11:11
While I think Joe is having a couple of off days and should cool down but that's up to him as this is an open forum, I don't think anyone should go on about corruption in China when they come from the country that gave us Enron and whose president publicly lied about having sex in the white house with Monica. Not that I have anything against Bill as he feck women that I wouldn't touch with my duck dick.Bob,
I like this conversation between them, really, do not stop it! I mean how ignorant can one be!
I love my ass off. No need for making this political, we all have our skeletons in the cupboard as countries, do we?
Let us talk about gals, not Monica
Peace
FA
While I think Joe is having a couple of off days and should cool down but that's up to him as this is an open forum, I don't think anyone should go on about corruption in China when they come from the country that gave us Enron and whose president publicly lied about having sex in the white house with Monica. Not that I have anything against Bill as he feck women that I wouldn't touch with my duck dick.
Except that the people you mention from USA are the exception, not the rule. Also, Clinton was impeached and disbarred, the Enron guys are in jail. How's China's record in that area? I don't care who likes me or not, but I am not rude when I travel to foreign lands, I am not an ignoramus who offends his hosts. Do I think my hosts love me? Of course I don't. Are the Chinese girls curious about me? Absolutely. Don't believe me? Look at the numerous dating sites, shit, just look at Craigslist. Those "women seeking men" are not all hookers.
Chocha Monger
11-12-09, 21:09
Except that the people you mention from USA are the exception, not the rule. Also, Clinton was impeached and disbarred, the Enron guys are in jail. How's China's record in that area? I don't care who likes me or not, but I am not rude when I travel to foreign lands, I am not an ignoramus who offends his hosts. Do I think my hosts love me? Of course I don't. Are the Chinese girls curious about me? Absolutely. Don't believe me? Look at the numerous dating sites, shit, just look at Craigslist. Those "women seeking men" are not all hookers.
I think what Dash wants to say is that we cum in peace. We're not there to offend the Chinese people or get involved in China's politics. We just want to give those beautiful Chinese girls some dick! Given the increasingly global nature of our community we hope that our Chinese brothers don't mind sharing with us. After all, we all depend on each other to some extent.
Chochoa Monger,
I think SEAJoe and other brother on this board are not against foreigners coming to China for girls. Just we want all mongers, whether Asian or Foreigners, to be respectful and not draw too much attention to themselves when mongering. Because in China mongering, although accessible is still offered in a discreet fashion.
Although some of the language here may appear harsh, I think most brothers just want everyone know that China is a very complex and to some extent dangerous place if you do not follow certain rules and guidelines.
Therefore as I said, follow these and you'll be alright:
1. Be vigilant about the environment around you
2. Do not draw too much attention to yourself
3. Be respectful to the girls, and do not act haughty, over confident or arrogant
4. Be a gentlemen and low key
These four will help any foreigners in China to stay out of trouble and help the mongering trade sustain a longer period of time without any political or LA scrutiny.
AsnDragon
I think what Dash wants to say is that we cum in peace. We're not there to offend the Chinese people or get involved in China's politics. We just want to give those beautiful Chinese girls some dick! Given the increasingly global nature of our community we hope that our Chinese brothers don't mind sharing with us. After all, we all depend on each other to some extent.
Loveasiangirls
11-13-09, 02:48
..... shit, just look at Craigslist. Those "women seeking men" are not all hookers.
Right not 100% are hookers, the others are Nigerian scammers.
OldAsiaHand
11-13-09, 04:40
Dash,
As a foreigner living in China for many years, I do have a bit of experience.
I don't want to burst your bubble but there are not many Chinese women here waiting for your "white meat" as you so put it. On the contrary, the hottest (9+), young girls actually want nothing to do with laowais. They much prefer guys of Chinese descent that speak their language and are more sensitive and understanding of their culture. Yes, there are some women that are curious but it is a very small minority and usually the ones without other choices; older, less attractive, etc.
Even among WGs, the perception of foreigners is that they have huge dicks and screw them for hours. We are completely rejected by around 30% of WGs; even more in some venues. All WGs would prefer mongers of Asian descent if they had the choice.
SEAJ is talking about the reality. This is not Thailand or The Philippines where foreigners are more accepted and you see many interacial relationships. There is still a stigma about Chinese women with western men. It is best to say that we are tolerated.
Although you deny it, the tone of your posts eludes that you fall into the category of an "Arrogant American". As I travel around the world, I hear many people talk about this perception. "I have money." "Do it my way." "Accept my culture." "Why don't you speak English?" And, the list goes on.
IMHO, this attitude will get you in trouble in China. Frankly, guys like this coming to China leave a bad impression and make it difficult for the rest of us laowais trying to make the best of living here.
Just my POV.
OAH
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