View Full Version : Racism against foreigners in Thailand
Terry Terrier
11-30-07, 21:47
Ice Raj
Of course many Thais don't like Farang - no surprise there. But, to say that Indians are loved in the south means nothing because Southern Thailand isn't even really Thai. If it was, they wouldn't be blowing up Thais and trying to separate from the rest of the country.
Just because Indians are accepted in places like Pattaya doesn't alter the facts, simply because they are accepted by girls who will do whatever to make money; even shag an Indian.
As I said before, I have taught plenty of Indian students who are 2nd 3rd or even 4th generation Thai born - as Thai as any other Thai, Thai-Chinese or whatever. Yet, they don't integrate into the society, are not accepted and pretty much stick to their own. If even Thai-born Indians are subject to racism, how do you think the main Thai population feels about Indians who come here on holiday or even work here?
Have your fun, if you can. But, don't labour under any illusions about your acceptance simply because you dress well, smell good or whatever. You are Indian, have dark skin and that's all it takes for Thais not to like you. Conversely, if Thais like Farang at all it's generally because we're white and perceived to all be rich - a pretty common belief and not new information at all.
The whole "Indian" topic has been talked to death on here many. many times - now quite boring, really. As there seems to be more and more Indians coming here now, perhaps you'll all be able to reverse centuries of an anti-Indian mindset with your 'Bollywood' charm and good looks.:D
Hey! I was just YouTubing and found some stuff by OTH's fave trad folk band:D :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-uSGtRoEQYA
It's hard to think of a good reason why any tourists should give a monkey's about racism in Thailand. The locals smile a lot, but don't actually seem to like each other most of the time, let alone outsiders.
can someone spell the word correctly, in the heading please?
Terry Terrier
12-01-07, 01:54
can someone spell the word correctly, in the heading please?
Nope. It's completely perfect if our galactic-class dyslexic prof takes his rightful place in the thread.
can someone spell the word correctly, in the heading please?
I just assumed that was just the Americans making up a new spelling for a word that was spelt fine already? :)
i have yet to rtff in full please excuse me. however i need to get a feeling for a few things before i dig.
ive read that some girls will not service specific people and that there are clubs for specific races. i fall somewhere in between.
im turkish greek russian from new york city. i can look arab spanish or italian. it depends on who is looking at me. i also deal with a little speech impediment that doesnt always go over well with asian people. ive gotten into nasty arguments here in nyc. usually everbody ends up "losing face".
ive heard thailand is different than other asian countries (more friendly) is this true?
does anyone think i wouldnt get serviced to *my expectations(bbbj,daty) due to any of these issues ?
If you have the baht, they have the time and the orifice.
It's all about BAHT - pay for service.
no money, not much chance of honey.
Same as at home, actually.
M P Lurker
12-10-07, 22:35
im turkish greek russian from new york city.
<cut>
does anyone think i wouldnt get serviced to *my expectations(bbbj,daty) due to any of these issues ?
turkey, greece, and russia all have some very good looking dudes, even to thais. so your origins aren't necessarily a problem.
the main issue is to be very well washed and groomed in general so that you don't look low class and don't smell bad. i.e. greasy hair doesn't look good. stinky under arms is a turn off to thais.
its hard to comment on how people react to a speech impediment, as i don't have one and therefore lack the experience and i am not thai.
when guys find some girl who doesn't speak english, then they won't be able to have a conversation anyway.
if in a blow job bar, not much conversation is necessary and the girl has her mouth full anyway.
daty depends on whether the particular girl likes it or not.
SirHumpsaLott
12-11-07, 20:16
Well I'm a black american and have NEVER had a problem being serviced in Thailand or any other Asian country I've ever been. I find it curious that these girls all supposedly prefer white guys SO much over any other yet whenever I go to Japan (ESPECIALLY JAPAN), P. I. , Hong Kong, and Thailand, they all seem to go out of their way to get my attention. You'll see a lot said on sites like these about how Thais, or practically any girls-particularly non white- who make a living selling their a$$et$ supposedly prefer white farangs over all others but when it comes down to it, I'll still end up with one or two of the little brown honeys sharing my bed at the end of the night and so will you if you're cool about it.
I really think it's-to paraphrase another post from this thread-all about the money, end of story. Granted, a little' common sense, a good attitude and basic hygiene go a long way with these ladies but when you go there and see these old men in their shorts, socks and sandals ensemble, and I'm talking Wilfred Brimley/Parkinson old, walking around like lovesick teenagers with these beautiful girls young enough to be their grand-daughters on their arm, then I don't really think the girls are too picky about the men they choose or those who choose them let alone about what race he is. IMO, a lot of these guys here really don't like the idea of non white farang playing in what had been their own little sandbox for so long that they'll try and say anything to prevent brown and black people from coming to also enjoy the LOS. Despite the fact that a lot of each have been. *ahem*. "cumming" there since the Vietnam conflict.
I'm sure you'll find some racist thais but you'll find that anywhere you go from anyone, not just Thais, but for every one racist thai, white, black, yellow or brown racist idiot out there, there are hundreds that aren't so ignore the throwback racist idiots and go for the many open minded folks that have evolved into true twentieth first century human beings.
And anyway, if you do encounter any racism from any of the ladies just forget her, get another, and revel in the fact that at least you don't have to suck old ass balls for a living.
Well I'm a black american and have NEVER had a problem being serviced in Thailand or any other Asian country I've ever been. I find it curious that these girls all supposedly prefer white guys SO much over any other yet whenever I go to Japan (ESPECIALLY JAPAN), P. I. , Hong Kong, and Thailand, they all seem to go out of their way to get my attention. You'll see a lot said on sites like these about how Thais, or practically any girls-particularly non white- who make a living selling their a$$et$ supposedly prefer white farangs over all others but when it comes down to it, I'll still end up with one or two of the little brown honeys sharing my bed at the end of the night and so will you if you're cool about it.
I really think it's-to paraphrase another post from this thread-all about the money, end of story. Granted, a little' common sense, a good attitude and basic hygiene go a long way with these ladies but when you go there and see these old men in their shorts, socks and sandals ensemble, and I'm talking Wilfred Brimley/Parkinson old, walking around like lovesick teenagers with these beautiful girls young enough to be their grand-daughters on their arm, then I don't really think the girls are too picky about the men they choose or those who choose them let alone about what race he is. IMO, a lot of these guys here really don't like the idea of non white farang playing in what had been their own little sandbox for so long that they'll try and say anything to prevent brown and black people from coming to also enjoy the LOS. Despite the fact that a lot of each have been. *ahem*. "cumming" there since the Vietnam conflict.
I'm sure you'll find some racist thais but you'll find that anywhere you go from anyone, not just Thais, but for every one racist thai, white, black, yellow or brown racist idiot out there, there are hundreds that aren't so ignore the throwback racist idiots and go for the many open minded folks that have evolved into true twentieth first century human beings.
And anyway, if you do encounter any racism from any of the ladies just forget her, get another, and revel in the fact that at least you don't have to suck old ass balls for a living.
I wasn't so lucky but, it wasn't THAT bad though. I will FOREVER love Thailand.
http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showthread.php?p=669722#post669722
Racism is huge in Thailand and Thai girls do prefer johns with lighter skin. Been here long time and can say that this is fact. They also prefer guys that are handsome and rich. Do they always get this combo? Of course not. Will they go with a guy that is dark? Yes, but if it's a choice between a colored man and a white skinned man of equal looks and status, they will choose the white skinned guy 9 times out of ten. This is fact. Is it racism? Who cares. I see plenty of dark skinned guys getting tail especially in pattaya where the girls fuck anything that walks. A previous poster mentioned that hygenie and dress are important and this is certainly true. However, in a land that is obsessed with whitening their skin and idolizing white skin people from thai pop culture, it would be foolish to say that they are not concerned about skin color. Seen black guys clean house in Japan, but never in Thailand. That doesn't mean you cant' get action here. If you got a pulse you can get laid in thailand. You may not have the whole market open to you, but you'll still have plenty to chose from. Play hard and bang hard.
SirHumpsaLott
12-23-07, 20:24
Racism is huge in Thailand and Thai girls do prefer johns with lighter skin. Been here long time and can say that this is fact. They also prefer guys that are handsome and rich. Do they always get this combo? Of course not. Will they go with a guy that is dark? Yes, but if it's a choice between a colored man and a white skinned man of equal looks and status, they will choose the white skinned guy 9 times out of ten. This is fact. Is it racism? Who cares. I see plenty of dark skinned guys getting tail especially in pattaya where the girls fuck anything that walks. A previous poster mentioned that hygenie and dress are important and this is certainly true. However, in a land that is obsessed with whitening their skin and idolizing white skin people from thai pop culture, it would be foolish to say that they are not concerned about skin color. Seen black guys clean house in Japan, but never in Thailand. That doesn't mean you cant' get action here. If you got a pulse you can get laid in thailand. You may not have the whole market open to you, but you'll still have plenty to chose from. Play hard and bang hard.And yet for everyone of you guys on sites like this that claim this supposed fact of Thai life, it’s never been proven true from any of my first hand personal experiences in Thailand or anywhere else although granted there may be some sort of bias amongst thai community regarding darker/lighter skin thais. Personally, I think a lot of you guys are just projecting your personal racial bias(and wishful thinking).
I’m not talking as just a sex tourist about bar girls, I own a company and I just moved my manufacturing operations from China to Thailand and actually do business with regular Thais on an almost daily basis as well as now have to make frequent trips to Bangkok and other areas in Thailand several times a year. I first met my business contact there about 15 years ago while I was a U.S. Marine and he a member of the Royal Thai Marines and we have had long discussions about this very topic. Anyway, I’ve had more than enough time to mingle with the regular average thai man and woman in Thailand and when the topic of race inevitably comes up, the impression I always leave with is that it’s a bias amongst thais against other thais moreso than any issue they may have with other dark skinned ethnicities.
What you’re not understanding is that Thais, like anyone else, cannot be generalized as all thinking the same and each capable of making their own minds up about what they like based on their own individual experiences. Though you may have met some, and I'm sure there are, with negative feelings toward dark skin, I’ve actually met many Thai, Japanese, Korean, Vietnamese, etc as well as some white women that PREFER and also actively seek out dark skinned Farang. I’ve noticed this also amongst women in the U.S., parts of Europe and Australia in particular.
Anyway, back to the Thai girls,
What you are also not taking into consideration is the “type” and background of the average black man that would even be over there in the first place that the thais would have a chance to encounter. I mean, other than African college students and military service members, any other type is bound to be either American or British civilians on vacation/holiday and judging by some of the other black members of this site, of above average income level. There is no “bad” history between thais and blacks that would cause there to be bad juju between either for there to be a basis for racist feelings. What about the average black guy does an average Thai have to complain about in the first place?
Incidentally, I am often in bars and clubs in Thailand, Japan, etc, and have been in the situation you mentioned above in which I had to vie for the attention of a thai woman I wanted in a bar (regular club, not a go-go) full of white guys who were mostly all younger than me and I'm guessing at least as good looking and by your rationale, I should have went home empty handed but she chose me over them, granted the guys didn’t really try that hard and there were many other girls for them to choose from but by your rationale, they shouldn’t have had to at all; my girl should have just went with them over me based solely on their “whiteness” and my lack thereof.
Another story; While out for drinks in Bankok one night, one of the factory office managers got a little tipsy and told me in no uncertain terms, despite her tenuous grasp of english, that should I ever decide to live in Thailand that I could make extra money as a gigolo since according to her, African men and Black men from both England and America are fetching top bhat from wealthy Thai women but hey, don’t believe me, amazingly enough there was a research done a few years ago on this very topic:
http://www.msuspokesman.com/media/paper270/news/2002/11/08/WorldNews/Thai-Female.Elite.Demand.Black.Gigolos-318113.shtml
Amazing huh?
Soooo… if wealthy Thai women are apparently willing to pay for sex with black men, (especially when I wouldn’t think they would have to) what then does that say about your theory regarding what they “prefer”?
I’m not saying Thais are perfect when it comes to racial tolerance, (I've seen how they divide themselves by class and territory amongst the workers in the factory) only that they aren’t anymore racist than anyone else and I have yet to encounter the same amount and veracity of racism in Thailand than I have here in the U.S. or anywhere else.
Then again, I can only speak for me, not the thread starter who is apparently East Indian, although, I have seen those dudes with Thai women as well.
NicFrenchy
12-24-07, 04:26
They also prefer guys that are handsome and rich. Please leave me out of this LOL.
On a more serious note, I am young, not so ugly and I have a job that pays me quite well. Yes, I have a lot of opportunities, everywhere I go to get dates with Thai women (I actually took the chance a few times, which I will write reports on some) but it is my experience (however very short: 3 years) that Thai women tend to prefer Younger Thai men.
Yes, a lot of girls go with us foreigners (sometimes just to "try") and a lot of them actually likes Foreigners because we treat them with respect (in most cases) BUT, I can speak for a few girls in my office, who are married to Older Farangs and tell whoever wants to hear about their 3 or 4 younger Thai Boyfriends on the side. The Farang Husband is their Bank. One girls actually admitted she was waiting for her Husband to pass away so she could inherit.
Thailand is complicated and it will take me another 10 years to even begin to understand Thais, if ever.
Always nice to get some different points of view.
I'm white, so, I suppose it is inevitable that my opinions are going to be tainted by that - not necessarily from any pre-conceptions of my own (although that's possible as well), but, because I am shown what people expect me to want to see. The implication in your message is that (being white) I might be predisposed to the idea of Thai's being more attracted to whites than blacks (actually, a more accurate statement might be less repulsed by whites than blacks, but I'll get there shortly).
Now, as I mentioned, the Thais that I meet may want me to think they like me (and my 'kind') more than blacks, so, they present that point of view to me, and, I come away thinking that that is their point of view. I say it is possible, but I don't think it is likely, and here is why:
1) I've formed a few deep and abiding friendships with some Thai's over the years. They've been to visit me in various parts of the world etc etc. Almost to the last man, they've viewed blacks as inferior. This attitude is diluted heavily with education - it also seems to fade away for expat Thais. My point here is, amongst my Thai friends, it is pretty much taken as a given that the Thai's are an incredibly racist bunch (and this may or may not be a bad thing - whether it is or not is a subject of great debate), and, that Thai's generally don't like blacks. They don't like whites much either, but blacks are definitely a couple of rungs down the ladder.
2) Anthropologically it makes sense that they'd put whitey a cut above. The people from the poorest part of Thailand (Isaan) are also the darkest. Dark skin is associated with working in the fields (and therefore poverty). For these reasons dark skin is considered undesirable and millions upon millions are spent on skin whitening products. It is the same deal as here in the west, if you have money, you have time to lie around in the sun, so a tan is desirable - we spend millions on tanning products.
Now, all that being said, there's always a segment of the population that varies from the most commonly held view. You've mentioned them in your post - I've certainly heard of middle aged Japanese women hiring big studly black men (although I've never seen it). I think the higher standards of education in Japan and Korea probably have a lot to do with that, not to mention black heroes in action movies and the like that are seen everywhere. While I happily acknowledge that cross section of the Thai population exists that would prefer blacks to whites, I would maintain (pretty strongly in fact) that that segment isn't a huge one.
As a final point, it is worth noting that the Thais consider the Indian's to be the absolute bottom of the barrel. My guess is it is because they've seen plenty of poor Indians around the place (there's a heap in Phuket trying to flog stuff in the markets). Rarely have they seen any poor blacks (the only blacks I've ever seen in Thailand have been wealthy enough to go there on holiday), so, they're considered in a kinder light than the Indians.
I spent many years there also.
Thai women are all about money.
If you give good wallet, they like you.
Its not the color of your skin, its the color of your money.
You would have to pay me to go back to Thailand and deal with Thai women. They kind of disgust me now with their aggresive money obsession.
I spent many years there also.
Thai women are all about money.
If you give good wallet, they like you.
Its not the color of your skin, its the color of your money.
You would have to pay me to go back to Thailand and deal with Thai women. They kind of disgust me now with their aggresive money obsession.
Then I bet you haven't seen the Filipinas yet.
Old Thai Hand
12-24-07, 07:42
Rarely have they seen any poor blacks (the only blacks I've ever seen in Thailand have been wealthy enough to go there on holiday), so, they're considered in a kinder light than the Indians.
I agree with everything you say, except that you forget the very real presence of Africans (Nigerians, especially) in Thailand, particularly in BKK, who are feared by Thais and with good reason. There have been a number a well publicized stories over the years, all involving Nigerian scams, drug-dealing and various other shadowy activities. The Thais are able to differentiate between these and well-healed Western blacks. But, then the other bias that exists, contrary to SirHump's assertion is a fear of the reputation of black men having big dicks and being studs. While there might be a very small segment of Thai women who might find this fascinating, most Thai women would be terrified.
I agree with NicFrenchy that most Thai women generally still prefer Thai men. I also agree that many poorer Thai women (shopgirls, secretaries etc.) go after Farang, while maintaining a couple of young Thai gigs on the side. However, in my 11 years here, I've seen the bias change a lot with more and more Thai women opting for Non-Thai men. Thailand has become more international and more young middle and upper-class Thai women are exposed to Farang every day in the workplace and at schools. Since I teach in international programs at Thai universities, I see this first hand every day. As my students are all well-off if not filthy rich, money certainly isn't the attraction. Yet, every semester I see more of my female students dating foreign students, and even teachers.
I think that racism is not quite the proper term. Xenophobia is much more accurate. Thais are xenophobic, and combine childlike curiosity with a healthy dose of suspicion and fear of any foreigners with whom they aren't familiar. So it goes throughout Asia. Thais see themselves as superior (why, is beyond me) to anyone else in the world. Most are quite content in their own little Thai world and have no interest in being anywhere else.
While people can continually debate this, I think it is pretty well established that Thais are not all that accepting of anyone outside of their own milieu.
To put it simply the pecking order is probably as follows:
1/ Thais versus....
2/ Everyone else
a/ Japanese and Koreans
b/ Chinese
c/ Vietnamese
b/ Lao
c/ Cambodians and Burmese (both are hated by the Thais)
d/ Farang
e/ Western Blacks
f/ Africans
g/ Kaek
i/ Arabs
ii/Indians
It should be pointed out that true racism does exist within the country with Thailand being culturally and ethnically an extremely segmented country. If you want to hear Thais truly bad-mouth someone, get them talking about Thais from other parts of the country.
I think that racism is not quite the proper term. Xenophobia is much more accurate. Thais are xenophobic. I agree, and think this applies everywhere in Asia, and to humanity in general. I see racism as a doctrinaire, ideological subset of xenophobia, and frankly I don't think most Thais give all that much thought to it- mostly it's a case of "We don't like them people what's different from us, " and the more different, the worse. I could imagine such doctrinaire racism developing here someday- Phibun took a crack at it, I think, against the Chinese, and it would go along well with the fascist/authoritarian streak that appears pretty regularly in Thais; it's hard to miss, being about a mile wide. ("Shoot all the drug dealers! " "Yeah, kill 'them all, let Buddha sort 'them out. " Another very popular Thaksin program.) As it is, though, I don't see the apparent racism as being all that well thought out, so to speak, or systematic.
I do think there is a de facto social apartheid in play here right now, mainly brought about by the dominance of ethnic Chinese of the urban professional class- in general, dark skin means labor or service, white skin means office worker/doctor/professional. It's kind of hard to miss. Still, I don't see it so much as racism as simply a convenient, if contemptible, way of identifying class (skin color not necessarily being a differentiating factor in race, which in a biological sense is none too easy to define as it is).
The deeply hierarchical social outlook of the Thais is also a factor; this is a society in which one has few social equals (in terms of social order, and accordingly in the eyes of the law or any other sense). The failures of the west, and the resulting loss of respect for western culture, business, and values in comparison first with Japan and now with China, has resulted in the Thais thinking not that we might be equals, but rather that we might be inferior (and not just karmically)- or at least that we have fallen. Naturally, this is a perception that could under the right circumstances be reversed.
I often hear farangs lament that "the Thais used to like us so much, but not anymore". It makes me want to remark that they were just pretending to like us- but by the same token, they could be just pretending not to like us now (I refer here to your average Pornchai on the street). By which I mean, I don't think they are for the most part thinking about it all that deeply, but are more than likely just reacting without much reflection to the most recent stimuli dished out by the government propaganda machine and the mass media.
Joe Nailer
12-24-07, 13:39
I spent many years there also.
Thai women are all about money.
If you give good wallet, they like you.
Its not the color of your skin, its the color of your money.
You would have to pay me to go back to Thailand and deal with Thai women. They kind of disgust me now with their aggresive money obsession.Then I bet you haven't seen the Vietnamese women yet.
Old Thai Hand
12-24-07, 16:59
Sanook D
Very well thought out and written. I couldn't agree more.
SirHumpsaLott
12-24-07, 20:43
Always nice to get some different points of view.
I'm white, so, I suppose it is inevitable that my opinions are going to be tainted by that. Not necessarily from any pre-conceptions of my own (although that's possible as well), but, because I am shown what people expect me to want to see. The implication in your message is that (being white) I might be predisposed to the idea of Thai's being more attracted to whites than blacks (actually, a more accurate statement might be less repulsed by whites than blacks, but I'll get there shortly).
Now, as I mentioned, the Thais that I meet may want me to think they like me (and my 'kind') more than blacks, so, they present that point of view to me, and, I come away thinking that that is their point of view. I say it is possible, but I don't think it is likely, and here is why:
1) I've formed a few deep and abiding friendships with some Thai's over the years. They've been to visit me in various parts of the world etc etc. Almost to the last man, they've viewed blacks as inferior. This attitude is diluted heavily with education. It also seems to fade away for expat Thais. My point here is, amongst my Thai friends, it is pretty much taken as a given that the Thai's are an incredibly racist bunch (and this may or may not be a bad thing. Whether it is or not is a subject of great debate), and, that Thai's generally don't like blacks. They don't like whites much either, but blacks are definitely a couple of rungs down the ladder.
2) Anthropologically it makes sense that they'd put whitey a cut above. The people from the poorest part of Thailand (Isaan) are also the darkest. Dark skin is associated with working in the fields (and therefore poverty). For these reasons dark skin is considered undesirable and millions upon millions are spent on skin whitening products. It is the same deal as here in the west, if you have money, you have time to lie around in the sun, so a tan is desirable. We spend millions on tanning products.
Now, all that being said, there's always a segment of the population that varies from the most commonly held view. You've mentioned them in your post. I've certainly heard of middle aged Japanese women hiring big studly black men (although I've never seen it). I think the higher standards of education in Japan and Korea probably have a lot to do with that, not to mention black heroes in action movies and the like that are seen everywhere. While I happily acknowledge that cross section of the Thai population exists that would prefer blacks to whites, I would maintain (pretty strongly in fact) that that segment isn't a huge one.
As a final point, it is worth noting that the Thais consider the Indian's to be the absolute bottom of the barrel. My guess is it is because they've seen plenty of poor Indians around the place (there's a heap in Phuket trying to flog stuff in the markets). Rarely have they seen any poor blacks (the only blacks I've ever seen in Thailand have been wealthy enough to go there on holiday), so, they're considered in a kinder light than the Indians.
The impression you and some others here are presenting (or strongly trying too)is pretty obvious. I’ve never before encountered so many that wanted so badly to be the porridge that Goldilocks chose.
That the Thais may be telling you what they think you might want to here kind of fits with what has been said before here about Thais being so outwardly "friendly" and seemingly amicable to a persons face despite whatever they feel otherwise. Some have said similar things to me about whites when none are around.
The majority of the posts regarding this subject just seems like more generalizing and projecting. I have Thai friends too, not to mention several business acquaintances, and not to burst any of your bubbles; but lets just say that when you get a group of non white people of different ethnicities together (black, asian, Hispanic, middle eastern, etc) the conversation is a bit more "free" than it normally would be than when whites are present. Trust me, there are some things that non white men and women of any ethnicity have in common. Some things talked about that you all just really don’t want to know that sometimes lead to bonding, ie- from my personal experience, many thais know that many whites don’t consider them as equal (I can kind of see why; some of you talk about them as if they are a race of children who need your care and guidance) but can usually only speak amongst themselves about it but I’ve found that it doesn’t take much for them to express this sentiment to other people of color.
Now, I mentioned before that I noticed that Thais have a bias against each other regarding skin tone but to suggest and rationalize that they would project that bias onto other ethnicities for the same reasons is somewhat a short-sighted theory. A light skinned Thai is not judging a dark skinned American as working in the fields or poor especially in this day and age when they are all too well aware that the average black American or brit who bothers to travel there more than likely makes in a year more money than what the average Thai will make in their lives.
That being said I submit that the same rationale you all apply to Thais’ view of other dark skinned ethnicities also applies to Thais view of whites; that the Thai who date and marry them are varying from what I surmise is the most commonly held view of Thais marrying only Thais and that the Thai women who are attracted to whites is mainly because of the white "heroes in action movies and the like that are seen everywhere" (not *gasp* because they actually like the guy). While I acknowledge that cross section of the Thai population exists that would prefer only whites to anything else, I would maintain (pretty strongly in fact) that segment isn't a huge one.
What strikes me as odd is that for some strange reason, you and some others here seem very intent on stating what races Thais do and don’t like despite the fact that none of you are Thai. That last paragraph is especially telling in that you are simply projecting your own bias’ against Indian people. For whatever reasons, I can only guess but I do have a theory or two in mind and I would wager that I’m not too far off the racist mark.
Does the idea that Thais might not really care about what type of Farang they would care to be with, or that many would prefer to not be with whites at all really bother you all and if so, why?
Anyway, I have another business trip planned for Jan and I plan on providing a thorough "education" to many of the Thai women I am already set up to meet. Who knows, since they are apparently paying to sleep with black men, maybe I can make a little cash on this trip. http://www.msuspokesman.com/media/paper270/news/2002/11/08/WorldNews/Thai-Female. Elite. Demand. Black. Gigolos-318113.shtml
Satrai2000
12-25-07, 15:48
I experieced racism in Thailand from (drunk) Britons, calling me "fucking Indian" and "Paki" and "curry-eater".
Sad to say but I think there are quite a lot European racist tourists visiting Thailand. Many of them are not interested in Thailand and its culture itself, only in getting their dick sucked in a cheap way by the local girls, which they call "brown bitches", "asian fuckers" and things like that.
Note: I do NOT state that all European tourists are like that, but unfortunately there are some.
I never experienced racism from the local people. Why should they. Of course there are South-Asian assholes visiting Thailand but that does not mean that all people from there have bad manners, bad odour, don't shower, are ugly, etc.
Some facts :
1. Indians, in particular the Sikhs, belong the the richest communities in Bangkok;
2. Thai religion and culture is very much Indian;
3. Thai language has many Sanskrit words in it;
4. Thai script is derived from a South-Indian script;
5. Thai genes have input from Indian genes.
So a Thai must be very dumb to consider India or Indians as the bottom of the barrel.
And to be honest: I never experienced racism or things like that from Thai.
Satrai2000
12-26-07, 01:18
The impression you and some others here are presenting (or strongly trying too)is pretty obvious. I’ve never before encountered so many that wanted so badly to be the porridge that Goldilocks chose.
That the Thais may be telling you what they think you might want to here kind of fits with what has been said before here about Thais being so outwardly "friendly" and seemingly amicable to a persons face despite whatever they feel otherwise. Some have said similar things to me about whites when none are around.
The majority of the posts regarding this subject just seems like more generalizing and projecting. I have Thai friends too, not to mention several business acquaintances, and not to burst any of your bubbles; but lets just say that when you get a group of non white people of different ethnicities together (black, asian, Hispanic, middle eastern, etc) the conversation is a bit more "free" than it normally would be than when whites are present. Trust me, there are some things that non white men and women of any ethnicity have in common. Some things talked about that you all just really don’t want to know that sometimes lead to bonding, ie- from my personal experience, many thais know that many whites don’t consider them as equal (I can kind of see why; some of you talk about them as if they are a race of children who need your care and guidance) but can usually only speak amongst themselves about it but I’ve found that it doesn’t take much for them to express this sentiment to other people of color.
Now, I mentioned before that I noticed that Thais have a bias against each other regarding skin tone but to suggest and rationalize that they would project that bias onto other ethnicities for the same reasons is somewhat a short-sighted theory. A light skinned Thai is not judging a dark skinned American as working in the fields or poor especially in this day and age when they are all too well aware that the average black American or brit who bothers to travel there more than likely makes in a year more money than what the average Thai will make in their lives.
That being said I submit that the same rationale you all apply to Thais’ view of other dark skinned ethnicities also applies to Thais view of whites; that the Thai who date and marry them are varying from what I surmise is the most commonly held view of Thais marrying only Thais and that the Thai women who are attracted to whites is mainly because of the white "heroes in action movies and the like that are seen everywhere" (not *gasp* because they actually like the guy). While I acknowledge that cross section of the Thai population exists that would prefer only whites to anything else, I would maintain (pretty strongly in fact) that segment isn't a huge one.
What strikes me as odd is that for some strange reason, you and some others here seem very intent on stating what races Thais do and don’t like despite the fact that none of you are Thai. That last paragraph is especially telling in that you are simply projecting your own bias’ against Indian people. For whatever reasons, I can only guess but I do have a theory or two in mind and I would wager that I’m not too far off the racist mark.
Does the idea that Thais might not really care about what type of Farang they would care to be with, or that many would prefer to not be with whites at all really bother you all and if so, why?
Anyway, I have another business trip planned for Jan and I plan on providing a thorough "education" to many of the Thai women I am already set up to meet. Who knows, since they are apparently paying to sleep with black men, maybe I can make a little cash on this trip. http://www.msuspokesman.com/media/paper270/news/2002/11/08/WorldNews/Thai-Female. Elite. Demand. Black. Gigolos-318113.shtmlYou are absolutely right. Especially your statement about Asian-Indians. I (as a South-Asian) have only experienced racism from white Europeans and never from any Asian person at all.
Old Thai Hand
12-26-07, 16:19
Satrai
All your points about Indians and Indian influence on the culture in Thailand are perfectly correct.
But, the fact is that Indian-Thais while among some of the wealthiest are also among the most ghettoized people here. There is very little actual mixing between Indian-Thais and other Thais, beyond perhaps the necessities of business dealings. They rarely if ever inter-marry, they rarely if ever socialize. The Indian community sticks to its own. I have had large numbers of indian students over the years and they never mix with the Thai students. I have also heard Thais say quite bluntly, more times than I can think, "I hate kaek". I actually heard it today, while standing in line behind some Indians at MBK waiting for a taxi . I'm sorry, but this is just a fact. I have never heard a Thai say they like kaek. I have never seen any of my Thai students ever mix with, let alone date an Indian student. I would hazard a guess that my very numerous observations of Thai attitudes toward Indians over the last 11 years, because they are so overt and unambiguous are pretty inidicative of a general attitude towards Indians within the Thai population.
But, the Thais, not being confrontational would never let on that they don't like you and would even be superficially pleasant to you. But, that doesn't change the fact of how they actually feel.
This topic is so boring because it is the one thing that is absolutely irrefutable, in my opinion. I assert that SirHumps has a strong case for some Thais actually liking blacks. As well, there is lots of basis for the pro vs. con -Farang argument.
But, as far as Indians go, there is virtually no room for debate. The Thais hate you. Case closed. I'm sorry to be so blunt. But, as awful as it is, it's also true.
I was in Bangkok a coupel of months ago, with an East Indian friend (from USA).
He arrived a day before me and went alone to several go-go bars, both in Nana Plaza and Patpong.
Several times, he was refused entry, with the doorman saying that it was members only, when it clearly was not, as others (whites) walked straight in.
On a couple of occassions, flashing some cash and insisting saying that he was from US and not India seemed to work, but most times, it did not.
Once inside, there was no problem or attitude from the girls or the waitresses.
The next day, with me alongside him, there was no problem.
I don't know if it's just Indians from India who maybe don;t spend nay money and just want to look, or actual racism, but clearly there is something inherently discriminatory about the stereotyping of Indians by the doormen.
Even showing cash, failed to change the minds of some of them, so I presume that it is actual racism.
Cowa Banga
12-26-07, 20:48
Need More Gas,
LOL about Vietnamese women. In my view, Thai hookers are better at hiding their intent.
Sunset Strip
12-26-07, 22:37
And anyway, if you do encounter any racism from any of the ladies just forget her, get another, and revel in the fact that at least you don't have to suck old ass balls for a living.
Quote of the year!
TJ
I experieced racism in Thailand from (drunk) Britons, calling me "fucking Indian" and "Paki" and "curry-eater".
Sad to say but I think there are quite a lot European racist tourists visiting Thailand. Many of them are not interested in Thailand and its culture itself, only in getting their dick sucked in a cheap way by the local girls, which they call "brown bitches", "asian fuckers" and things like that.
Note: I do NOT state that all European tourists are like that, but unfortunately there are some.
I never experienced racism from the local people. Why should they. Of course there are South-Asian assholes visiting Thailand but that does not mean that all people from there have bad manners, bad odour, don't shower, are ugly, etc.
Some facts :
1. Indians, in particular the Sikhs, belong the the richest communities in Bangkok;
2. Thai religion and culture is very much Indian;
3. Thai language has many Sanskrit words in it;
4. Thai script is derived from a South-Indian script;
5. Thai genes have input from Indian genes.
So a Thai must be very dumb to consider India or Indians as the bottom of the barrel.
And to be honest: I never experienced racism or things like that from Thai.
Very well said. I agree that many Brits (NOT all) act like they are in the colonies when they visit other colonies. I have seen the same in Thailand as well as Dubai and other countries. Thai culture is VERY much influenced by India (and China).
As for OTH, you are ignoring the fact that many Thais may be jealous of the economic success of the Indian expat community. This is obvious in many countries (for example in Africa - the reason Idi Amin kicked out the Indians and ruined the Ugandan economy - now Uganda is begging Indians to come back!). So what if they don't mix with Thais? Indians and other expats (yes, white people too) are in Thailand for economic reasons. The non-mixing is prevalent in India too and not restricted to Thailand or other places where Indians live. In India, people marry within their own caste or religion as do many people of other religions. Much of human mating system is based on assortative mating - meaning people mate with people who are like themselves. But ultimately, I don't expect a bar girl to understand the nuances of social and economic aspects. They think what they do and who cares? I don't find "regular" educated Thais to be as discriminatory as bar girls - bar girls have different worries. But all groups tend to easily stereotype other groups and think bad behavior by people in their own group to be an exception to the rule. OTH is making the same mistake - despite his professed sophistication.
Skeeter Pratt
12-27-07, 02:51
I have got to say having read several of these post. It bothers me a bit that we think we know what a whole country thinks about any thing. Just because some of our friends think something, I know some blacks that hate whites that does not mean that all blacks hate whites and I know some Japanese that hate whites my father in law being one of them, that does not mean any thing. Just that some of the people I know feel that way. Like every where in the world you have racism sexism classism and what other ism's you can come up with. That shit is just a fact of life. But I will say I just finished my first trip to LOS and it was great. I had a discussion with several expat buddies Britons most of them about if I had delt with any racism and I did, but so what. Par for the course mostly what I found was a good time and some great pussy and for ever girl that passed me up there were 10 more that took my money and fucked me well, so what ever. Truth is most of us are just work for these girls white or black or Indian.
Old Thai Hand
12-27-07, 02:52
I don't find "regular" educated Thais to be as discriminatory as bar girls - bar girls have different worries. But all groups tend to easily stereotype other groups and think bad behavior by people in their own group to be an exception to the rule. OTH is making the same mistake - despite his professed sophistication.
I'm not making any mistake. I'm just reporting what I know to be true. As for "regular" educated Thais - You seem to forget that I work with the most educated Thais in this country and I can say with total confidence that they are among the most Xenophobic Thais around and specifically don't like Indians. There is, in fact an unwritten rule at many Thai universities to not hire Indian academics because Thai students don't like having Indian teachers. The only exception to this is ABAC and that's only because ABAC pays so badly that nobody but Indians and Burmese will work for its International School. Add to this what I've already written about my Thai students who clearly don't like Indians and have said as much over the years. I've taught thousands of Thais and it is one of those things you constantly hear in class. As I also stated once in an earlier post, this dislike does not extend to Nepalis. So, one can conclude that it has nothing to do with skin color. While I know one of the obvious reasons, because I've heard it enough times is to do with how badly Thais think Indians smell, I'm not sure exactly what the other reasons might be. I've asked students why they don't like Indians and they always say the same thing, "Bad smell". But, there has to be other factors because Indian-Thais, who are also not liked that much are usually similar to Thais in their hygeine. So, smell can't be a factor there.
In any event, I'm not trying to stir things up here, nor make claims that are not true. I'm merely reporting what I have observed continually over a long period of time. Don't shoot the messenger.
the most educated Thais in this country. . .are among the most Xenophobic Thais around and specifically don't like Indians. . . this dislike does not extend to Nepalis. Ironically, or so it may seem to those of us who pretend to think logically, the "Thais" also seem to think the Bhutanis (Bhutanese? ) shit Dixie Cups.
I've often suspected that the wealthy locals don't like the Indians much for the same reason nobody really likes the competition. Are the Chinese in Malaysia sticking up for their non-Bhumiputra Indian brethren in their time of need? Didn't think so.
"ABAC pays so badly that nobody but Indians and Burmese will work for its International School" What, can't find enough Filipinos? They'll speak, even sing, in English for next to nothin'! (Sorry, couldn't resist.) I wonder what the locals think of the Pinoy.
The impression you and some others here are presenting (or strongly trying too)is pretty obvious. I’ve never before encountered so many that wanted so badly to be the porridge that Goldilocks chose.
I am not sure what you are implying here. I am simply reporting my own observations, horrifying or otherwise. This is a place for the dissemination of information, not for being picked by the teacher as having the best answer.
That the Thais may be telling you what they think you might want to here kind of fits with what has been said before here about Thais being so outwardly "friendly" and seemingly amicable to a persons face despite whatever they feel otherwise. Some have said similar things to me about whites when none are around.
Of that I have no doubt, yet I would maintain my position for a huge number of reasons, a vast range of behaviors I've seen ranging from overtly offensive to politely offensive.
The majority of the posts regarding this subject just seems like more generalizing and projecting. I have Thai friends too, not to mention several business acquaintances, and not to burst any of your bubbles; but lets just say that when you get a group of non white people of different ethnicities together (black, asian, Hispanic, middle eastern, etc) the conversation is a bit more "free" than it normally would be than when whites are present. Trust me, there are some things that non white men and women of any ethnicity have in common.
Well, duh!
First off... there are 2 ways to tackle a topic such as this: Generalize, or, quote specific examples. Neither offer anything definite, so we all offer our points of view, along with some indication as to how much weight we would put behind them, as well as citing why we would put such weight behind them, and, we read the answers of others hoping to come away a little wiser.
Some things talked about that you all just really don’t want to know that sometimes lead to bonding, ie- from my personal experience, many thais know that many whites don’t consider them as equal (I can kind of see why; some of you talk about them as if they are a race of children who need your care and guidance) but can usually only speak amongst themselves about it but I’ve found that it doesn’t take much for them to express this sentiment to other people of color.
Now this interests me. Frankly I find the whole concept of rasicm pretty fascinating to be honest. I'd be curious to hear more about these 'opening up sessions'.
With respect to the 'treating like children' comment. I'd say that is a fair criticism, but when it comes to indoctrinated racism, I am afraid I lack the courage to go any further than that. In my own country, I would openly criticize someone who was being as overtly racist as I've commonly seen in Thailand. Living in Thailand, unless one wishes to be excluded from much of polite society one needs be a little more diplomatic - I content myself with making my own feeling clear, but, allow for the fact that others with a different cultural perspective (and cultural indoctrination) may have different views to mine. It is these views that I tend to view as childlike, and, frankly I make no apology for it.
Now, I mentioned before that I noticed that Thais have a bias against each other regarding skin tone but to suggest and rationalize that they would project that bias onto other ethnicities for the same reasons is somewhat a short-sighted theory. A light skinned Thai is not judging a dark skinned American as working in the fields or poor especially in this day and age when they are all too well aware that the average black American....
Yep - valid point... and if you read again, I mention am only guessing as to why that is so. I am not quite arrogant enough to state my opinion as fact...
What strikes me as odd is that for some strange reason, you and some others here seem very intent on stating what races Thais do and don’t like
Well, the topic is "Racism in Thailand"
despite the fact that none of you are Thai. That last paragraph is especially telling in that you are simply projecting your own bias’ against Indian people. For whatever reasons, I can only guess but I do have a theory or two in mind and I would wager that I’m not too far off the racist mark.
I'm not Thai, but I have no idea if anyone else is. Why should a Thai be any more aware of how racist his own people are than a foreigner would be? I would expect to find the opposite to be true. As a case in point, I grew up in a country where I thought racism hardly existed. Returning after several years absence, I was staggered to see how wrong I was. I would point out examples to my friends, and they would scratch their heads and say 'yeah, I've never really noticed that before'.
Your comment about projecting was one that I found to be outright offensive. Observing another's norms is something utterly distinct from subscribing to that same viewpoint. I haven't called you a racist, please refrain from doing the same to me. If I make a racist comment then you can attack me. If I attribute racism to others unfairly, the crowd will shout me down. Racism is a touchy enough subject without risking animosity becoming part of the discussion :)
Does the idea that Thais might not really care about what type of Farang they would care to be with, or that many would prefer to not be with whites at all really bother you all and if so, why?
I'd like to think it wouldn't bother me one iota (and I don't honestly think it would), but I can't be sure. Everybody wants to feel attractive - but that admission shouldn't detract from my opinion above.
Anyway, I have another business trip planned for Jan and I plan on providing a thorough "education" to many of the Thai women I am already set up to meet. Who knows, since they are apparently paying to sleep with black men, maybe I can make a little cash on this trip. http://www.msuspokesman.com/media/paper270/news/2002/11/08/WorldNews/Thai-Female. Elite. Demand. Black. Gigolos-318113.shtml
Best of luck with it!
I'm not making any mistake. I'm just reporting what I know to be true. As for "regular" educated Thais - You seem to forget that I work with the most educated Thais in this country and I can say with total confidence that they are among the most Xenophobic Thais around and specifically don't like Indians. There is, in fact an unwritten rule at many Thai universities to not hire Indian academics because Thai students don't like having Indian teachers.
I would concur with what you say about the Thai's/Indians.
I would disagree with the rest - but I suspect you have a very different perspective to me. You obviously move in tertiary education type circles and have contact with a lot of students. When I refer to educated Thais, I tend to mean people I know through business, ie, those that have traveled and lived (sometimes even educated) in other countries. This group, as a rule, has tended to be the least racist group of Thai's I've known.
Sunset Strip
12-27-07, 22:25
On racism in Thailand. I think there is a disconnect here in the discussion. Some people are talking about cultural/institutional racism while others are talking about what type of guys the TGs want to be with. The two cannot be the same.
Hookers everywhere have standard not necessarily in line with the mainstream culture. If most of the guys visiting Thailand are white, then the girls probably get used to associating with white guys. This can be a positive.
If the white guys had a reputation for violence or something (this is a hypo) then the girls would shy away from them; a negative.
But all of this has little to say about the treatment of any group in the culture at large becuase most people are not planning on screwing you!
So can you guys, especially Sir hump a lot, provide some kind of opinions about TGs and African American men, then tell us about the treatment of African American men in the larger culture.
Thanks,
I want to compare these thoughts of yours (the experts) with mine on Brazil where you have many, many black guys visiting.
TJ
Racism?
Girls in Hat Yai fear whites for their Big White Dicks that would tear their pussies open never to close again.
These poor girls are used to Malaysian clientele who can not fill a good sized gap.
All this BS makes it rather difficult to get decent pussy in Hat Yai for Farangs.
If the white guys had a reputation for violence or something (this is a hypo) then the girls would shy away from them;
Quick observation- one gets the impression from some of the girls that it is the violent tendencies of the local fellas that makes them figure they can't go too far wrong servicing the farang. Farangs seem to get brownie points simply by not being violent.
Sunset Strip
12-28-07, 19:12
Information taken from outdated links and sources found on the Thailand FAQ. I guess I will not be using the FAQ from this site ever again. Kind if ironic that the moderator will "try" to embarrass you for using information provided on his site.
But this proves I was correct in posting it. If the information was wrong then how in HELL was I to know without asking?
What a jerk!
...
Doll House (Clinton Plaza)
...
[OK,
This discussion somehow gets ridiculous.
Clinton Plaza does not exist any more since years now.
Giotto
M P Lurker
12-28-07, 20:50
I found this list on another site. Apparently these bars claim to be members only when a nonwhite tries to enter. They then become open to all when the nonwhite leaves!
<cut>
Long Gun (Soi Cowboy)
Well this is crap. I was sitting next to a black guy at Long Gun just the previous night who looked similar to that american actor in "The Practice" TV Lawyers series. He barfined a girl quick and lively.
Sunset Strip
12-28-07, 21:00
OK,
This discussion somehow gets ridiculous.
Clinton Plaza does not exist any more since years now.
Giotto
Well I erased the links but I actually got it off the Thailand FAQ links from this site. So you are right and need to tell Jackson, or whoever, to update that info. too!
TJ
Sunset Strip
12-28-07, 21:03
OK,
This discussion somehow gets ridiculous.
Clinton Plaza does not exist any more since years now.
Giotto
Since you seem to be a moderator, would you please update the FAQ for Thailand so I will not make the mistake of using outdated information.
Your fault,
TJ
Since you seem to be a moderator, would you please update the FAQ for Thailand so I will not make the mistake of using outdated information.
Your fault,
TJTJ Fannatic,
The FAQ of the Thailand board is years old, written by some well respected Senior Members.
Fault: Please write about your own knowledge and experiences, and not about 'hearsay' from others.
Thank you.
Giotto
Country Counter
12-28-07, 22:18
I am going to add my 2 cents to this thread. I spent 7 nights in Bangkok and 3 nights in Phuket a year ago. I got laid each day, both in the massage parlors and I pulled some girls from Soi Cowboy. I can only speak about my experience.
I did not notice any racism while out and about in Bangkok. I was in Cupidity once (mistake I know now) and the papa-san started at 10k baht "because some of the girls are scared of black dick. " I laughed and turned to leave, it was quickly down to 2. 5k. That's the only upselling I found, this board helped immensely.
Some girls claimed to be curious about sleeping with black guys, but hey all hookers claim that you're perfect. Every time I walked into a bar on Soi Cowboy I had an enthusiastic girl or two at my side instantly, there is jungle fever everywhere. I hired a car and driver for each day, and he claimed that many girls love black american men, but not so much for africans.
I didn't experience p4p in Phuket because I was bust banging a cute waitress from a resort restaurant. I found that the Thais in Phuket greeted me enthusiastically because I am "dark like them. "
Anyway, I had a great time, got laid, had no problems. Good luck fellas.
Sunset Strip
12-28-07, 22:40
Shut up, jerk!
I expressly said that I found that info. in another place and was asking what the deal was.
You can just shut up now because you already proved to be a jerk when you started saying that was ridiculous.
So basically what the jerk Giotti is saying is that you should not read anything on this site but you SHOULD post your own experiences on this site. That is dumb because then who is to read what is on the site. Everything on this site and all like is HEARSAY, you jerk.
Again, shut up giotto.
And last, nothing Giotto said proved that there is or is not race discrimination along the lines initially quoted because all he said was that one of the places closed down already. AND.....that means nothing. Your post Giotto was ridiculous, not mine.
And what you say is just hearsay, too. So shut up!
TJ
LittleBigMan
12-29-07, 00:33
Just a kinder outlook and clarification for you! T.J. Fanatic!
I have been on this site for a long time but I don't contribute much like so many old and new members. I just remember long time ago a few original Senior members like Joe Zap, The Traveler, etc.. consolidated some information and links and Jackson the creator of this site placed that information link FAQ, I have gone to this link many times and yes! some of the links might be old and many I believe still exist. I don't believe Jackson monitors this link nor do I know how to update that! Your best bet is to contact the Adminitrator Jackson. Please excuse me if I gave the wrong names but these are the ones I most remember!
As with Racism, From what I have read in this thread when it comes to Blacks most of the reference seem to be with Blacks from Africa that some Thai's seem to dislike due to their attitudes towards women. I'm from the U.S. and have many good friends that are blacks. Way back when I was free as a bird to monger I made trips to BKK with co-workers and I never noticed that they being black was ever having a problem with the Thai women. Maybe it's the way they speak and dress or even that they're from the U.S. but never did I see or hear from them that there was racism towards them. Every place we went they had girls hanging all over them!
I can't speak for Giotto, but I think he meant that if you want to know a specific thing about Thailand and the old FAQ link can't help you just ask your question and someone will try to answer it for you. Clinton Plaza listed on the FAQ Thread was torn down a few year back and no longer exist.
Good luck in your search, LBM
Clandestine782
12-29-07, 03:13
I wouldn't be surprised if Thais didn't like black people because they associated them with that failed continent called "Africa."
Chinese people are much the same story. If they think that you are from Africa, they want no part of you. If they find out that you are American/ English/ Canadian/ some other Western country, then they are a bit more open for discussion. Witness the large number of Africans with stereotypical accents trying to pass themselves off as Americans/ English. I've had this experience MANY times with them.
The African men are rather rough with women-- both black and non-black and they do seem to not have discovered underarm deodorant. Plus, there seems to be a higher percentage of them that are just generally stupid and obnoxious in *that* particular way. Can you imagine what a Thai (or other Asian person thinks) when some odoriferous African comes up wanting to try to get some play? (Especially when Asian people don't have underarm or vaginal odor-- a result of not having apocrine sweat glands.)
Being black in general in Asia does carry some disadvantages. But they can be overcome.
Rubber Nursey
12-29-07, 04:37
Hi guys. Sorry to butt in, but I got a message from a poster about this discussion and came to read it out of curiosity. Just wanted to give my two cents. I agree with TJ Fanatic's comment that hookers have their own special selection criteria, based on sexual stereotypes rather than actual racism - as well as LBM's comments about men's cultural attitudes to women. That's what this is usually about.
A man from a country where women are considered second class citizens is (generally) more likely to treat a sex worker like crap, than a man from a country where women are treated as equals. Cultures who look down on women in general are going to have even more disgust for wh*res and all working girls have experienced that disgust from time to time. Unfortunately there's not much you can do if you're a man from that particular race/culture who ISN'T like that, because a working girl's instinct for self preservation will be much stronger than her sense of 'fair go'. You may not ever get the chance to prove yourself different from the rest.
With regard to black men...any working girl will tell you that the 'black men are bigger' myth, is NO MYTH. Black men generally ARE bigger. (That's one of the reasons why I love them so much ;) ) Hookers all over the world avoid large penises at work, quite simply for loss of income. A really big man in the morning could incapacitate some women for the rest of the day. Obviously I've never put my own penis into a Thai girl, but they are such tiny little things that I assume a huge penis would be pretty hard work for them. I don't blame them for knocking black men back.
All I can suggest to the black guys on the forum is...come to Australia! We LOVE black men down here! lol
LittleBigMan
12-29-07, 22:19
Rubber Nursey,
Black men generally ARE Bigger. ( That's one of the reasons why I love them so much )
R.N, you go both ways I guess? So does many others in Australia? You might be on the wrong website?
In general a big dick would can incapacitate a girl for the day but a average dick that strokes for a good 1/2 hour can give the same effect. You can carry a big stick but if you don't know how to use it, then it just in the way!
C,782, You are wrong in regards to " Asian's don't have underarm or viginal odor " I have experience many in my life time that even in the U.S. Asians do have underarm or viginal odor. When I use to go to Korea to monger in the late 70"s and into the early 80"s I experience underarm and viginal odor. Many Korean women didn't even shave their underarms and when in the bush you couldn't even find the forest from the tree's. Have you ever stood waiting for the MTR in Hong Kong or been in a train trapped with a guy underarm in your face? If Indian's are Asian then in general the point you made is totally invalid! Prevention is whether you can afford it or believe in it and that is DEODORANT!
LBM
Starchild2012
12-29-07, 22:28
We are all hypocrites to the highest degree
Men all over the world are same..Racism is just an issue that tickles our ego and gets in between our desiers
I'm from India and after reading so many post on Thai hating Indians..I too had a strong point of you..
However, while watching videos & places of girly bars in Thailand on youtube as i was preparing myself to come down over there...
There is one thing which is common to folks from all races..
Hatred Towards LadyBoys..the way the monger looks and avoids the ladyboys is like they are some kind of animals with diseases..i saw some of the folks literally running away from them...there seems to be NO RESPECT at all for those folks it seems from the tourist..
After doing some research...i found ladyboys are actually well integrated & tolerated in Thai society and are given a chance to make a living .unlike in India where they are treated like dirts
It was refreashing to read how the Thai's view the ladyboys and integrate them to their society.
Now If we put ourselfs in their shoes for even one day, the kind of b**ll sh**t these folks take from 99% of the tourist is overwhelming.
offcourse, some tourist like them and some of them are nice and take them too for pleasure...are the words we hear far too common..but that would be for a day or two..but there life is far more worse than a bar girl and they could not even DREAM... let alone go with a farang to a western coountry..
No body wants them...Ladyboys will be happy to take most of us or an alien BUT no..we men don't want them cos our desires are in women..not the third kind created by nature..cos we are not wired that way and if we are even ticked one bit by the opposite kind...WE CRY like babies and ask the admin to create a seperate thread and disect the subject to extreme.
Agreed, ladyboys or no ladyboys..racism is different..but putting things in perspective....the nature has created far more miserable things than color of a man skin..nature does not care if a bar girl likes you or not...
MOVE ON....Look Around...Think of a ladyboy what she will be going through when 100's of us moral and high ground mongers reject them everyday..forget about sex..we don't even respect or care about those kinds
All i have read in forums over the years is ..HOW TO SPOT A LADYBOY AND AVOID THEM"..Google ladyboy and the most lines we get are .... 10 to 20 points to avoid a ladyboy by some of the veteren and seasoned mongers everywhere..I enjoyed that reading and also there are lots of videos on youtube on how mongers try to spot a ladyboy.
AND this LADYBOY hating things is across ALL MEN of all skin color....this thing is actually far worse than what we have to go thourgh in terms of racism by bar girls..Cos they don't have a voice, a say in how they feel when they are just rejected, no forum to talk about, they are helpless, miserable, egoless creatures, who have to take whatever we throw at them.
I have never taken a ladyboy out just for a good time, have dinner and drop her back home and pay her for the time..AND i have taken 10's of bar girls, had dinner and dropped them home without having sex and paid them for their time..AND ALSO..BARKED 100 of times in forums..how good a deed i have done to the girls.
Two words would better sum up mongers like us
SELFISH< selfish<selfish<selfish>hyprocrite>hypocrite>hyprocrite>HYPOCRITE
LittleBigMan
12-29-07, 23:19
I speak for myself only!
Born Loser 5,
I was born and raised in a City in the United States that has the greatest population of gays maybe the world. I have members in my own family that are gay! Male and Female. As you noted we are all hypocrites that is part of our nature as being humans but being shelfish isn't part of the equation, it is IGNORANCY!
I currently live most of the year in Pattaya and my background gives me greater tolerance of Ladyboys but where I'm from Ladyboys are referred to being a "IT". Across from my house are a group of Ladyboys but this didn't prevent me or my family from buying the home. There are some that look like ladies and then there are some that I just can't understand why they even bother but I know it's not their fault because it's genetics. In the end they are just like everyone else, they are people , some are good and honest and their are some that are bad!
In my years visiting and now living in Pattaya, the majority of Ladyboys holiday visitors see are along Beach Rd. Walking Street, and 2rd Rd, in Boystown. They are dressed in the extreme and acting agressively and to many tourist that don't have a lot of interaction with Ladyboys are afraid and setback when in contact. In many ways Ladyboys in Pattaya deserves the badrap in Pattaya. All you got to do is watch the tube each night and the read the local paper to see some of the crime that they commit.
Whether it is in Pattaya or anywhere in the world that I might visit I personally treat everyone the same way. Believe what you want and do want you want but don't impose your views or yourself on me! In the past, years ago I like to walk at night and cruise whenever I came upon a individual or group of Ladyboys and they start to approach me I politely tell them " Thank you but no Thanks in Thai. I have never had a problem. You see the worse of the worse in Pattaya but their are many that are gay that have normal lives just like the rest of us.
My moto is be whatever you want to be at least be the best at it! If you are going to be a Ladyboy, at least dress like a lady and shave you underarm and legs. I have seen many and though, if I got dressed and made myself up I would get picked up before them!
Treat everyone the way you want to be treated! Enjoy LBM
Hatred Towards LadyBoys..the way the monger looks and avoids the ladyboys is like they are some kind of animals with diseases..i saw some of the folks literally running away from them...there seems to be NO RESPECT at all for those folks it seems from the tourist..
I find that criticism a bit unfair. I avoid packs of boisterous ladyboys in Bangkok for the same reason I avoid packs of boisterous young men in other cities - experience has taught me that avoiding eye contact and shuffling past is the most likely way of avoiding trouble or robbery.
Further, there seems to be a substantial number of ladyboys whose stock in trade is deceit. While I am happy to sit and chat with one (and have done so on many occasions), I've no desire to go to bed with one, no matter how feminine the appearance. I've had them trying to convince me they are women before, and, I've met several mongers who haven't worked out they are men until after they'd reached various stages of intimacy. Those guys have been duped, and I've no doubt some of them are scarred for life. Admittedly I don't know how common this is, but as you point out - it is common enough that there was a well populated thread created primarily for the purpose of avoiding such fraud.
Whilst I agree, it is unfair to tar all ladyboys with the same brush, if I want to be sure of the original gender of the creature to which I am giving my intimate attentions, I will damned well claim that right. If I want to avoid a group of individuals on the street on the suspicion that they might be trouble, that to is my right; while you could rightly claim this is a form of discrimination, said discriminatory behavior needs to be balanced against my own sense of self-preservation.
Clandestine782
12-30-07, 03:45
Rubber Nursey,
Black men generally ARE Bigger. ( That's one of the reasons why I love them so much )
R.N, you go both ways I guess? So does many others in Australia? You might be on the wrong website?
In general a big dick would can incapacitate a girl for the day but a average dick that strokes for a good 1/2 hour can give the same effect. You can carry a big stick but if you don't know how to use it, then it just in the way!
C,782, You are wrong in regards to " Asian's don't have underarm or viginal odor " I have experience many in my life time that even in the U.S. Asians do have underarm or viginal odor. When I use to go to Korea to monger in the late 70"s and into the early 80"s I experience underarm and viginal odor. Many Korean women didn't even shave their underarms and when in the bush you couldn't even find the forest from the tree's. Have you ever stood waiting for the MTR in Hong Kong or been in a train trapped with a guy underarm in your face? If Indian's are Asian then in general the point you made is totally invalid! Prevention is whether you can afford it or believe in it and that is DEODORANT!
LBM
LBM: You should go over your notes. 1. Rubber Nursey is a FEMALE ex-prostitute, so if SHE says something about dicks, I'm likely to believe HER. They are something that she worked with every day for a period of years. 2. My comment on Asian people not having underarm or vaginal odor was accurate, and this is because they don't have apocrine sweat glands. (Look it up.) Exocrine sweat glands are something that we all have, but the apocrine sweat glands make you stink. If you notice in Asia, most of the deodorant is sold without aluminum complexes (such as Aluminum Zirconiumtetraclorohydrex) because people don't notice its absence. Instead, you'll notice that it has EDTA/ propylene glycol and perfume. But if a black or white person used it (= a deodorant with EDTA/ propylene glycol instead of Aluminum Zirconiumtetrachlorohydrex), they would say something like "Oh, that deodorant does not hold me/ does not work."
And that's said even after noting that most stores in China/ HK/ Korea don't even carry deodorant.
Without turning this into a Chemistry class, I'll also note that if you do have any Chinese girls with smells around their box at all, they are likely to be from Sichuan and Hunan (where a lot of spicy food is eaten). And even then, the smell is not that strong. But most of the girls have NO odor whatsoever around their boxes-- and I've had my face in DOZENS of them. Any monger here that is really into Asian girls will note that one of their best advantages is lack of feminine odor.
Interesting discussions, so shall we get real?
Thai and other Asian P4P workers in general do not like big cocks as it stretches their pussies. Every girl likes to be able to be tight, and make the man "feel" as much as possible. Now whilst some large stretched wide girls might rant and rave about "big cock", they have to as simply they no longer can be with normal men. What man really wants to put his dick into a bucket with no feeling at all? Why do you think Asian men like "girls without babies"? No stretch marks and tight pussy.
You are paying for a feeling, and that feeling should be a nice tight pussy, not some sloppy bucket.
This is why you will see some girls are "Asian" man only, some girls are "Japanese" man only. Some girls will do white guys along with Asian's. Some girls will do any guys.
So whilst a very few percent of Asian girls will like men with big cocks, the majority do not on a P4P scale of events.
As ever, its not what you've got, its what you do with it.
Nearly every women dreams of having big breasts in Asia, they desire them, they want them, they think all men love them, they think all men want them. Well, I for one don't give a shit about them, give me a pretty face and a nice tight wet pussy anytime. But this is women's talk. And so "big cock" is mens talk, they all dream about having one, they think all women want one. But really, the truth is as always very different from the opinions.
Racism in Asia, well, in general there is lots of racism, but unlike the dumb ass Western countries where a big fuss is made over it, in Asia you just take it on the chin. Walk around China and many people will be calling you all sorts of nasty things in Mandarin, but if you cannot understand you'll never know. They detest other Asians in China, detest blacks. Whites are "tolerated" but not liked.
Who cares. I think its good to have some national identity, some differences. Unlike in the west where they try to force people to melt into a single non-identity.
Thailand belongs to Thai's, and if they do not like blacks, indians, whites or whatever, then so be it, thats their choice, you either live with it, or get the f*** out, as its not your country.
I have travelled and lived all over the world, and I respect that in countries that are not my own country, I will get some racial abuse from time to time, and so be it, I ignore it, and acknowledge I am in another country. Would it not be nice if everyone did that, rather than want to change somewhere else to be like their home.
I am white, and have suffered racial abuse in many different parts of the world, for being white, for being a foreigner. But I don't care, and I ignore it and I respect that people have a right to formulate their own opinions in their own country, when I am "travelling" in a country that is not my own.
Also, on the earlier part, I am not big, and not small either. But its amazing how many girls will tell you "you very big", I generally laugh and tell them they can cut the bullshit and be real. You may ask why they tell every man that they are very big. Well its for "damage limitation" factors, if they tell you you are big, you will be more gentle with their delicate pussy, they can also half way through make an excuse about being painful if they are not enjoying it and say its because "you too big". It also rules out you asking for "anal" fun as you "so big". So there is a valid reason why they tell every guy he is "very big".
Well, thats a couple of cents worth for now.
M P Lurker
12-30-07, 05:52
<cut>
My comment on Asian people not having underarm or vaginal odor was accurate, and this is because they don't have apocrine sweat glands. (Look it up.) Exocrine sweat glands are something that we all have, but the apocrine sweat glands make you stink. If you notice in Asia, most of the deodorant is sold without aluminum complexes (such as Aluminum Zirconiumtetraclorohydrex) because people don't notice its absence. Instead, you'll notice that it has EDTA/ propylene glycol and perfume. But if a black or white person used it (= a deodorant with EDTA/ propylene glycol instead of Aluminum Zirconiumtetrachlorohydrex), they would say something like "Oh, that deodorant does not hold me/ does not work."
I agree that non-Aluminium deordorants just don't cut it, in general. I buy "Top Country" in the 7Eleven store and it has Aluminium Chlorhydrate as normal plus a very nice scent. I highly recommend it to mongers, together with lots of shower gel washes under the arms. You don't want the the Thai girls to be turned off.
Most Thais don't stink. Several sweaty contruction workers got into my lift a a Hotel who had been doing heavy stuff. No odours what so ever. If I had worked that hard I know my under arms would start to smell but not as much as some people, and I can smell it myself as my sniffer works too well.
Then a Hotel guest on another floor got in the lift. I nearly feinted from the underarm stench. Fortunately the guest got out on another floor. The Thais were too polite to say anything, but laughed in agreement when I said I had nearly passed out.
Rubber Nursey
12-30-07, 06:36
Thanks, Clandestine. Sorry for the confusion, LBM. Yes, I am a woman (but you were right...I do swing both ways! ;) )
What you and Born Loser said about the ladyboys was beautiful and I totally agree. Blunderer's response was basically what I was trying to say yesterday about racism in the sex industry - but he said it much better than I did.
I think there's a difference between outright racism - that is, thinking you are somehow superior to another person, based solely on their race or colour - and making informed judgements based on personal or collective experiences, in order to protect your person. That's what hookers do and although racial profiling is certainly a form of racism, I think in this context their motives are generally pure.
Obviously, there ARE racist sex workers, just like there are racist people in every other section of society, but I think on the whole it's usually about self-preservation.
Rubber Nursey
12-30-07, 07:23
LOL! Toughen up, Princess, or get out of their country ...excellent advice, Easy2007. :)
I know this isn't racism related, but I have to take issue with the two other points you made.
Women's pussies don't 'stretch'. They are elastic and can accommodate most (if not all) sized penises and bounce right back to exactly how they were. Sloppy vaginas are not caused by big dicks or childbirth, but by poor muscle tone. There are many, many young women out there who have never had children, but could still fit a Mack truck up their clacker. Vaginal muscles have to be exercised, just like any other muscle.
At 33 years old and after giving birth to two children, my personal 'claim to fame' is being able to sit perfectly still on a man's dick and 'milk' him to orgasm with my muscles alone. I've been told many times that it feels just like a blow job - and that I'm tighter than most 16 year olds. (Unfortunately, the rest of me looks every bit my real age! lol)
My personal preference for big dicks is mostly psychological. I do love the feeling of being 'filled up' as they say, but it goes deeper than that. A big dick hurts and I can feel my body straining against it, battling to accommodate it. It makes you feel young and inexperienced again, like the very first time, when sex is uncomfortable and you feel dominated and controlled by your man. I love that feeling.
And regarding WGs telling clients that their dick is 'so big'...while the reasons that you gave sound perfectly feasible and I don't doubt for a second that they're used in exactly that way, there IS another one. Many men WANT you to say it! Seriously, if you don't say a word about his penis at the start of the booking, at least every second client will eventually ask you for your opinion. You would not believe how many men ask whether we think their dick is big.
Telling a guy that he's big right from the start is usually a calculated move to prevent uncomfortable questions later on. Soooo may men ask in the heat of the moment whether their dick is big compared to other clients. In answering, WGs need to avoid a) faltering for a second and making smaller guys doubt their manhood and b) discussing other men we've been with (it puts a real dampener on the mood!) Better to start out saying that they're big or hard, whatever the size, and be done with it.
Thai and other Asian P4P workers in general do not like big cocks as it stretches their pussies. Every girl likes to be able to be tight, and make the man "feel" as much as possible. Now whilst some large stretched wide girls might rant and rave about "big cock", they have to as simply they no longer can be with normal men. What man really wants to put his dick into a bucket with no feeling at all? Why do you think Asian men like "girls without babies"? No stretch marks and tight pussy.
<snip>
Thailand belongs to Thai's, and if they do not like blacks, indians, whites or whatever, then so be it, thats their choice, you either live with it, or get the f*** out, as its not your country.
<snip>
But its amazing how many girls will tell you "you very big", I generally laugh and tell them they can cut the bullshit and be real. You may ask why they tell every man that they are very big. Well its for "damage limitation" factors, if they tell you you are big, you will be more gentle with their delicate pussy, they can also half way through make an excuse about being painful if they are not enjoying it and say its because "you too big". It also rules out you asking for "anal" fun as you "so big". So there is a valid reason why they tell every guy he is "very big".
M P Lurker
12-30-07, 08:06
<cut>
Thai and other Asian P4P workers in general do not like big cocks as it stretches their pussies. Every girl likes to be able to be tight, and make the man "feel" as much as possible. Now whilst some large stretched wide girls might rant and rave about "big cock", they have to as simply they no longer can be with normal men. What man really wants to put his dick into a bucket with no feeling at all? Why do you think Asian men like "girls without babies"? No stretch marks and tight pussy.
You are paying for a feeling, and that feeling should be a nice tight pussy, not some sloppy bucket.
This is why you will see some girls are "Asian" man only, some girls are "Japanese" man only. Some girls will do white guys along with Asian's. Some girls will do any guys.
So whilst a very few percent of Asian girls will like men with big cocks, the majority do not on a P4P scale of events.
While I doubt that a big cock can stretch a pussy much it is true that childbirth does make pussies "looser". I'm sorry Rubber Nursey, but this is well execepted even if the childbrith just stretched some muscles that don't work properly now.
I don't like overly tight pussy and so usually have a wonderful time with girls taht have babies as their pussies can have a soft touch. The best girls of course still know how to use the muscles to squeeze you. This describes my gig from last night. She has a baby, but was a fabulous sex machine with great muscle control.
Agreeing with Easy2007,
Guys with incredibly large cocks can get a lot of curious western women for free (not talking about myself by the way). But big dicks are not really an asset with Asian women. It scares them and can they can get bruised/inflamed uterus quite easily. Great care is needed.
As ever, its not what you've got, its what you do with it.
This partly a myth. Its both what you have and using it well.
Nearly every women dreams of having big breasts in Asia, they desire them, they want them, they think all men love them, they think all men want them. Well, I for one don't give a shit about them, give me a pretty face and a nice tight wet pussy anytime. But this is women's talk. And so "big cock" is mens talk, they all dream about having one, they think all women want one. But really, the truth is as always very different from the opinions.
Many Thai girls with adequate breats and noses are wrecking themselves by getting nose jobs and implants. They usually looked better before the procedures.
Racism in Asia, well, in general there is lots of racism, but unlike the dumb ass Western countries where a big fuss is made over it, in Asia you just take it on the chin. <cut>
"Racism" is alive and well everywhere but its really aversion to other cultures and ways that we are not used to or do not accept. Some countries admit it and others do not.
I have aversion to religions where women are given apparrently lower status than the animals, where they are not permitted to work or have an education.
I can't stand to be close to people with strong body odours, as the stench can be quite unpleasant, whether they are Aussies like me or wherever they come from.
Thais may have aversions to people form many other cultures including some other asian countries because they feel these people are lacking in basic good manners and politeness. I always have to think about the way I am acting when something irritates me and if I will appear bad mannered to the Thais.
Rubber Nursey
12-30-07, 08:19
Sorry, Mick. You're absolutely right. On re-reading my post, what I should have said was that childbirth doesn't 'automatically' make your pussy looser - that is, not every woman who has had children is permanently stretched. But some women do get damaged by childbirth.
That said, women's bodies are designed to withstand the birthing process and the majority of women can get back to pre-childbirth muscle tone - or at least, very close to it - so long as they're prepared to do the work.
M P Lurker
12-30-07, 08:44
Sorry, Mick. You're absolutely right. On re-reading my post, what I should have said was that childbirth doesn't 'automatically' make your pussy looser - that is, not every woman who has had children is permanently stretched. But some women do get damaged by childbirth.
That said, women's bodies are designed to withstand the birthing process and the majority of women can get back to pre-childbirth muscle tone - or at least, very close to it - so long as they're prepared to do the work.
Thats right. The majority CAN get muscle control back, but actually we meet only a few with really talented muscle control that is so woooonderful!
I have only ever had 1 Thai girl that was totally too loose for me. She had a baby already. Her pussy was cavenous and no muscle action at all. So although she was good looking, well educated and a great conversationalist fluent in several languages, she was just useless for normal sex. Perhaps she could specialise in oral. She definitely needed someone to teach her the muscle control and may have even needed a tightening operation.
Whoops. I have just realised that I should apologise and shut up for being off on a tangent. This is the "Racism in Thailand" thread.
Rubber Nursey
12-30-07, 09:03
Hmmmm, Mick...I do like a man who understands a woman's body. Maybe you and I should have a drink one night and you can help me hone my talents? ;) lol Just kidding.
The racism topic is fascinating, though. It would be interesting to see a thread like this for all the different countries of the world.
Are there any Thai or other Asian men on this thread? Can I ask - do you ever experience racism as locals? I get the impression from this site that there are brothels/parlours/bars in Asian countries (Thailand, China, Japan, Korea) that cater either solely to locals or solely to foreigners. Is that true? And if so, are Asian men treated badly by sex workers who would rather service foreigners than locals?
Just out of interest...
M P Lurker
12-30-07, 09:37
Hmmmm, Mick...I do like a man who understands a woman's body.
<cut>
Its a woman's mind I don't understand well. Sometimes we meet a woman who seems to think like a man (and she usually lusts for girls too). Then its real easy to understand them.
Rubber Nursey
12-30-07, 09:43
Sometimes we meet a woman who seems to think like a man (and she usually lusts for girls too).
And therein lies the secret to my success - a shared love of boobs, beer and pizza. :)
I don't understand most women, either...
Retired Army
12-30-07, 14:07
Its a woman's mind I don't understand well. Sometimes we meet a woman who seems to think like a man (and she usually lusts for girls too). Then its real easy to understand them.
Be careful, she may have been a man a few years ago...
M P Lurker
12-30-07, 19:42
Be careful, she may have been a man a few years ago...
Yeh, I once heard a story about a guy who had a sex change so that he could become a lesbian. :confused:
I met one through a friend recently in BKK who'd started out a man, switched over to become a streetwalker, then got offered a decent job somewhere through a family member and switched back.
I can't bring myself to think about how any of those operations might work. To look at him you'd know there's something wrong, but, you'd be unable to put your finger on what it was... like someone who'd been badly burned and had a lot of plastic surgery to clean up the scarring.
Yeh, I once heard a story about a guy who had a sex change so that he could become a lesbian. :confused:
Reminds me of the old line "I'm a lesbian trapped in a man's body". Cheesy AND sleazy!
LittleBigMan
12-30-07, 21:11
C782,
When Rubber Nursey made her report on 12/28, there are no clear indication that she was a women. Near the end of her comments she made this statement " obviously I've never put my own penis into a Thai girl ". Although she has amazed over 1000 post, I don't believe those post were made in the Thailand Thread which might have given me a better indication that she was a women. Her recent post after your's has now cleared up the matter!
I'm Asian, and I don't know if you are one C782, and I'm not a scientist so I'm not going to contest your medical findings about the human glands. The only gland that I concern myself with is my #1 LBM. I Being Asian C782, based on your medical explaination why Asian don't smell how do you explain some of my own life experiences.
A close relative of mines stunk of B.O. on hot days everytime she raised her arm you could see the sweat marks on her clothes. This person was so close to me that I didn't and couldn't say anything to hurt her. Why did this Asian female smell?
Once I let mine cousin borrow a very expensive backpack jacket for a month because he was making a trip to Montana. When he came back and return the Jacket it smelled of extreme B.O. the garment underarm area had a white ring of sweat and the garment had a extreme odor of B.O., I tried several times washing it and even took it to the dry cleaners. Even the dry cleaner said it was B.O. and it's not coming out. In the end my cousin had to buy the garment from me. What happen here?
My whole life I'm a sweater especially when I exercise and I sweat when I use to work as a laborer. If I forget to use my deodorant you don't want to be near me. I myself can smell that I stink! How do you explain this? Is this all in my mind? Have I been wasting my money on deodorant? Why didn't I know this earlier! I could be rich by now! How do you explain this?
When I use to work I was assigned with a guy from India on a regular basis and on hot days inside the belly of a aircraft loading luggage this guy smelled of B.O. it was so bad no one wanted to work with him. I did because he was such a great worker but I put Vicks vapor rub in my nose a technique I learn visiting China country bathrooms. How do you explain this?
I once dated a Korea flight attendant. I got her on the rebound after her divorce from her Korea Husband who smacked her around. She was based in L.A., when we finally hit the sack she had more underarm and pussy hair than I had on my head. She bath regularly but smell alittle on hot and sweaty days but didn't stink. After a few months she dumped me ( hamberger ) for a Pilot ( Steak ). How do you explain her smell?
Finally, Rubber Nursery, the answer to your question. Yes as a Asian I have experience racism my whole life in the U.S. but my visit in Asia particularly in China I have never face racism as it is being discussed in this thread. I dress and speak like a American has always been a plus with the ladies
pro and non-pros. Until recently I have never experience racism in Thailand, the closes I have come is trying to sign up for some Thai speaking classes with this Thai lady that hangs around with farangs. When we first spoke it was over the phone but when we finally met her expression indicated somewhat shock to see someone who look like a Thai, speak to her in English maybe better than the one's she was hanging around with. I like to dress in beach shorts and T-shirts and after several conversations about classes she seem to be putting me off. Finally I told her to go F--K herself! When I told my wife what happen she explain to me that she most likely gave me the " Head/Toe" treatment. Otherwise LBM, gets all he can handle.
When it comes to talking about penis, we as men love to boost about how long we can go, how many times we can go, and how big a gun we are packing and this remark will be no exception to the rule. As noted I am Asian but through my life mongering in the U.S. and Asia with white, black, asian woman I have been told a number of times that I'm not small for a Asian. LBM got his nickname in jail. Being somewhat of a pretty good basketball player I had a couple of real good buddies that are black. Once in the shower I turn around and saw one of my buddies staring at me. I joked and said what the F--k are you looking at? I told you before that I'm black below the waist!
Rubber Nursery, nice to have a womens perpective on this thread. But from your comments you give me a impression that you might be a Transvest. Doesn't bother me if you are or not! But if not, if you are ever in my area you have a open invitation to give some of that muscle action to LBM.
Happy New Year / LBM
Rubber Nursey
12-31-07, 02:28
Rubber Nursery, nice to have a womens perpective on this thread. But from your comments you give me a impression that you might be a Transvest.
I can assure you, LBM, I'm ALL woman. If you go back a couple of posts, I also said I'd given birth to two children - gender reassignment surgery is pretty good these days, but not that good! :)
Thanks for describing your experiences (or lack thereof) of racism as an Asian-American in Asia. Very interesting. Do you think the fact that you dress and speak like a foreigner counts for something? I mean, have you ever seen Asian locals treated differently to you?
It's always funny when the American sailors come into my city. Brothels pay off cab drivers to bring in lost Americans and hordes of sex workers and brothel owners go down to the wharf and hand out flyers. Australian men - or anyone without an American accent, actually - 'can't get laid in a brothel' as the saying goes. Working girls brush them off on purpose, saying they're too busy or rushing them into bookings and straight out again, keeping themselves free for the big-spending Americans. The Australian guys get really annoyed.
Obviously that's not about race, but perceived wealth (or at least, a willingness to spend), which I would assume is also a pretty big factor for working girls in every country. The sex industry is a business, after all.
M P Lurker
12-31-07, 02:46
<cut>
A close relative of mines stunk of B.O. on hot days everytime she raised her arm you could see the sweat marks on her clothes. This person was so close to me that I didn't and couldn't say anything to hurt her. Why did this Asian female smell?
Once I let mine cousin borrow a very expensive backpack jacket for a month because he was making a trip to Montana. When he came back and return the Jacket it smelled of extreme B.O. the garment underarm area had a white ring of sweat and the garment had a extreme odor of B.O., I tried several times washing it and even took it to the dry cleaners. Even the dry cleaner said it was B.O. and it's not coming out. In the end my cousin had to buy the garment from me. What happen here?
My whole life I'm a sweater especially when I exercise and I sweat when I use to work as a laborer. If I forget to use my deodorant you don't want to be near me. I myself can smell that I stink! How do you explain this? Is this all in my mind? Have I been wasting my money on deodorant? Why didn't I know this earlier! I could be rich by now! How do you explain this?
Its hard to getgood info on the web on this topic since many articles are pay per view. However it appears that East-Asians have less Apocrine sweat glands while only some MAY have none at all. There are hereditary influences.
East-Asians can still smell excessively under arms which may be associated with some medical condition.
East-asians apparently go for treatment of underarm body odours more so than in other cultures probably because they are seen as more abnormal.
Other cultures accept the body odour more.
Body odours associated with food such as garlic come out of the eccrine sweat glands prevalent throughout the body. East-Asians have these also but may sweat a bit less than some other races.
P.S. Yes I was confused by Rubber-Nursey's first report too.
Terry Terrier
12-31-07, 03:09
Mick, what is your strategy for the World Class halitosis that you and the rest of us farang are subjected to in LOS?
M P Lurker
12-31-07, 03:18
Mick, what is your strategy for the World Class halitosis that you and the rest of us farang are subjected to in LOS?
Terry,
Is that a sarcastic remark? Or is it a totally straight question? I'm at a lost to understand what is behind this question and why you direct the question to me specifically?
But taking it straight:
My experience is that Thai girls brush their teeth often, and their tongues and are mostly great to kiss. Only occasionally hit bad breath.
LittleBigMan
12-31-07, 03:22
Rubber Nursey,
I apologize, I miss that you were a mother of two. Yes I do think that being Asian and dressing and speaking like a white American is a benefit to me now that I live in Thailand. I have come in contact with so many women pro and non-pro in Pattaya that when they first meet me think I'm Japanese and when they learn I'm from America they sometimes do not believe me! I have run into so many non-pro's since living here that I flirt with but I'm not able to act further because of my situation. I can't even ask their names since I talk in my sleep. I don't want to wake up with a shorter dick.
Mick Linker, my point I was trying to make to C782 was if I being Asian don't have a apocrine glands and only have exocrine gland, why the smell. And I can tell you it's not from my diet. If it was diet when I sweat it would be coming from all parts of my body and not directly from the underarm. The distinction of the odor can't be mistaken that it is B.O. It's not a matter of what gland is causing the smell the end result is that it comes from the underarm. If the root cause of smell for Asian was due to diet from Hunan food, spices, etc... I rather smell like food than B.O.!
Got to be a doctor in the house to clear this up! LBM
M P Lurker
12-31-07, 03:53
Mick Linker, my point I was trying to make to C782 was if I being Asian don't have a apocrine glands and only have exocrine gland, why the smell. And I can tell you it's not from my diet. If it was diet when I sweat it would be coming from all parts of my body and not directly from the underarm. The distinction of the odor can't be mistaken that it is B.O. It's not a matter of what gland is causing the smell the end result is that it comes from the underarm. If the root cause of smell for Asian was due to diet from Hunan food, spices, etc... I rather smell like food than B.O.!
Got to be a doctor in the house to clear this up! LBM
I was not trying to imply that your B.O. would come form food at all. I was just providing info found on web searches.
I am happy to agree that you no doubt do have aprocrine sweat glands just like me, but probably blessed with less than some other races. So for us, we smell mostly after stenuous exercise, and the problem is easily rectified.
The important thing is that when we stink, we know it. Some odouriferous people don't realise that they stink. I recently told a co-worker that he had a problem and he as shown an incredible improvement since. So it was worthwhile.
The web indicates various treatments for B.O. such as Clindamycin to kill the bacteria usually responsible for the odours, liposuction of sweat glands, up to the drastic sweat gland removal operations.
LittleBigMan
12-31-07, 04:03
Mick Licker, My response was not really directed at you but to C782, concerning the reference to food being the cause of smell in Asian. No problem.
LBM
Rubber Nursey
12-31-07, 06:37
Sorry about that Mick and LBM. I've been hanging around this site waaaay too long and I guess I just assumed that you guys 'knew' me.
Note to self: You are not a freakin' celebrity! :)
I rarely had Asian clients (I'm not their type of gal) but of the ones I did have, I certainly don't remember any of them smelling of BO. On the contrary, I always found Asian men to be extremely clean and fresh smelling. From what I understand, Asian women are the same. Asian men also have very little body hair, including under their arms - that probably helps a bit with underarm odour, too?
Are Indians considered Asian, Clandestine, when it comes to this missing gland? This will sound rude, but they always smelled very strongly of curry and spices - not an altogether pleasant experience in a closed room on a hot summer's day - but they never smelled of BO, that I can recall. Lucky buggers. Visiting a hot place like West Oz, it must be handy not having whatever gland it is that makes you stink!
Rubber Nursey
12-31-07, 07:14
Coincidentally, there's a fantastic discussion about sex industry 'racism' going on in the Japan>General Info section. The comments by Azure Knight and Homer69 are an awesome read.
M P Lurker
12-31-07, 13:30
Sorry about that Mick and LBM. I've been hanging around this site waaaay too long and I guess I just assumed that you guys 'knew' me.
Note to self: You are not a freakin' celebrity! :)
RN,
Many of us hang around the Thailand Threads only, or perhaps just limited threads, but you are a celebrity here now. It certainly didn't take long.
I am an Aussie but I haven't been to any Aussie threads lately. I don't play up in Australian bothels any more because most of the girls are so professional and you get so little time. Girls that fake enjoyment are a super turn off to me. But the Asian girls in Aus are on average superior and more fun than the anglo-saxons, and cleaner. This is my reverse Racism, sort of.
I did have fun with European women though when I was in Germany.
Satrai2000
12-31-07, 17:40
...Asian men also have very little body hair, including under their arms - that probably helps a bit with underarm odour, too?
Are Indians considered Asian, Clandestine, when it comes to this missing gland? This will sound rude, but they always smelled very strongly of curry and spices - not an altogether pleasant experience in a closed room on a hot summer's day - but they never smelled of BO, that I can recall. Lucky buggers. Visiting a hot place like West Oz, it must be handy not having whatever gland it is that makes you stink!
Hi,
Indians are Asian, period!
However genetically people from (North-)India are much more closely related to Europeans than they are to East-Asians. You can find plenty of stuff on this subject on the Internet. And of course North-Indian men have more facial and body-hair than the (South)East-Asians...and I must say that in general a hairy chest is considered as sexy.
Clandestine782
12-31-07, 22:28
Sorry about that Mick and LBM. I've been hanging around this site waaaay too long and I guess I just assumed that you guys 'knew' me.
Note to self: You are not a freakin' celebrity! :)
I rarely had Asian clients (I'm not their type of gal) but of the ones I did have, I certainly don't remember any of them smelling of BO. On the contrary, I always found Asian men to be extremely clean and fresh smelling. From what I understand, Asian women are the same. Asian men also have very little body hair, including under their arms - that probably helps a bit with underarm odour, too?
Are Indians considered Asian, Clandestine, when it comes to this missing gland? This will sound rude, but they always smelled very strongly of curry and spices - not an altogether pleasant experience in a closed room on a hot summer's day - but they never smelled of BO, that I can recall. Lucky buggers. Visiting a hot place like West Oz, it must be handy not having whatever gland it is that makes you stink!Someone said it earlier, but Indians are closer to black/ white people. There are actually at least 2 different types of Indian (that I know of). If you see people from way down south (Tamil Nadu/ Kerala), those people are very dark and are likely quite a different population to the Northern Indians and Pakistanis. You'll never see a Pakistani as dark as someone from the Indo-Dravidian areas of India. Some of the Pashto speakers are are even lighter. Yes, Indians DO have body odor and LOTS of body hair. (A doctor that I once had in the States had so much body hair coming out of his shirt, that he should thank whatever god that he prayed to that he wasn't killed for his pelt on the way to work any given day.)
Clandestine782
12-31-07, 22:36
Mick Licker, My response was not really directed at you but to C782, concerning the reference to food being the cause of smell in Asian. No problem.
LBMI can't come up with a mechanism for why Asian girls have a *little bit* of smell around their box when they come from Sichuan or Hunan. But if you look at some of the posts about people who have gone mongering in those places, a few of them have noted the smell. (Just type in the words "stinky pussy" in the search function in the Chengdu/ Changsha child forums of the China section.) I've noticed the same thing. One girl that I met (not in a client-working girl context) had underarm odor and she was from Sichuan (we were both in Chengdu at the time). But she was the ONLY Asian girl that I've EVER met that had any underarm smell.
It is not that EVERY SINGLE Asian person has not a one apocrine sweat gland, but that the vast majority don't have them. Maybe it's the same way that SOME black people have green eyes, but the vast majority don't have them.
Even if an Asian girl has any type of smell around her box or under her arms, it does not bother me. It is good enough for her to be Asian (since Asian girls are the finest women on the PLANET) and the shower would have to take care of the rest.
Old Thai Hand
01-01-08, 04:21
First of all, what do any of the posts in the last few days have to do with racism in Thailand?
Secondly, I don't really get the point of this thread. For one thing, racism is not the proper term, as it is meant to refer to how a given people think about each other within the context of their country and culture. I doubt anyone on here is interested, that much in how Thais are racist towards other Thais. When talking about how Thais feel about outsiders, which I presume is the reason for this thread, the proper term is Xenophobia. That Thais are xenophobic is a foregone conclusion. So what's the point of all this discussion? A good deal of what has transpired in the last few days might better be posted in other threads; not here.
But, on the topic of the thread, for example; just because such-and-such an Indian says that he doesn't think there's racism (really, xenophobia) because he has no trouble getting laid proves nothing. He's shagging hookers and they'll shag anyone. It's business. If he said he had no trouble scoring with shopgirls, secretaries, nurses in hospitals or your average TG on the BTS, then he'd have an argument. But, those kind of girls wouldn't go near him with a barge pole, even if he smelled like a garden and looked like a Bollywood actor.
Despite the fact that I annoy scores of people because of my apparent absolutist knowledge of Thailand, the point is that I probably do encounter more Thais on a day-to-day basis that just about anyone on this board and therefore can make declarative statements about Thai attitudes towards others with a certain degree of confidence. True, my evidence is anecdotal, as I haven't done any empirical study on the subject. But, given that at the moment, for example, I have over 200 students, not to mentions dozens of Thai colleagues, I feel I can make an pretty informed opinion on Thai attitudes about other Thais as well as non-Thais.
Other than people's personal experiences with Thai attitudes, which are mostly skewed because the majority of posters only encounter girls in P4P and people in the service industry (hotels, restaurants etc.), there seems little point to having a thread like this.
One could take issue with your views.
You could in fact be one of those, errrr... school teacher types. You may only associate with Thai colleagues in the academic circle, and your students may only be students from more prosperous families. Therefore, your actual experience and view of Thailand could be completely and utterly distorted given the population of the country is quite a number of million people.
How often do you travel outside of Bangkok ? Or even outside of your "local area" in Bangkok ?
Do you spend a few months here and there, in the central regions, in the south, in the east, the west, the north ?
You appear to indulge in conversations with the Thai acedemic circle, you should be fully aware that these people love to interfere in politics, they really have no clue as to how it all works, but they think they do and so, as they imagine for some strange reason they do understand, they are vocal in their opinions - very strange opinions. They should follow the fine examples in the West, and keep quiet and get on with their job, teaching.
You also seem to think that you alone have contacts with Thai society.
Well chap, I am not in that 'orrible profession of teaching. I am doing business here and elsewhere in Asia, have high levels of contact within the necessary corridors of power. I have been here and around for well over 25 years now.
The one thing that does [CodeWord140] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord140) me off, is the amount of screwed up teachers in Thailand, who know jack about most things, but go around pouting their opinions all over the place, cause they are a teacher and they have a couple of friends and they are not here for P4P and they know more than just bar girls.
You really need to get out more, and stop trying to belittle everyone as you are an "OldThaiHand"..........some people have been here longer than you, done more than you, experienced more than you, have interactions with a larger cross section of society than you and so on and so forth.
I do not claim to be an expert, but I do take exception to those that try to represent themselves as such, either directly or indirectly :)
This rant is for the comment "Despite the fact that I annoy scores of people because of my apparent absolutist knowledge of Thailand, the point is that I probably do encounter more Thais on a day-to-day basis that just about anyone on this board and therefore can make declarative statements about Thai attitudes towards others with a certain degree of confidence".
That comment says more about you as a person and your emotional needs and requirements, and nothing about your knowledge or experience of things Thai.
Anyway, rant over, Happy New Year OTH :)
First of all, what do any of the posts in the last few days have to do with racism in Thailand?
Secondly, I don't really get the point of this thread. For one thing, racism is not the proper term, as it is meant to refer to how a people think about each other. I doubt anyone on here is interested, that much in how Thais are racist towards other Thais. When talking about how Thais feel about outsiders, which I presume is the reason for this thread, the proper term is Xenophobia. That Thais are xenophobic is a foregone conclusion. So what's the point of all this discussion? A good deal of what has transpired in the last few days might better be posted in other threads; not here.
But, on the topic of the thread, for example; just because such-and-such an Indian says that he doesn't think there's racism (really, xenophobia) because he has no trouble getting laid proves nothing. He's shagging hookers and they'll shag anyone. It's business. If he said he had no trouble scoring with shopgirls, secretaries, nurses in hospitals or your average TG on the BTS, then he'd have an argument. But, those kind of girls wouldn't go near him with a barge pole, even if he smelled like a garden and looked like a Bollywood actor.
Despite the fact that I annoy scores of people because of my apparent absolutist knowledge of Thailand, the point is that I probably do encounter more Thais on a day-to-day basis that just about anyone on this board and therefore can make declarative statements about Thai attitudes towards others with a certain degree of confidence. True, my evidence is anecdotal, as I haven't done any empirical study on the subject. But, given that at the moment, for example, I have over 200 students, not to mentions dozens of Thai colleagues, I feel I can make an pretty informed opinion on Thai attitudes about other Thais as well as non-Thais.
Other than people's personal experiences with Thai attitudes, which are mostly skewed because the majority of posters only encounter girls in P4P and people in the service industry (hotels, restaurants etc.), there seems little point to having a thread like this.
M P Lurker
01-01-08, 07:06
First of all, what do any of the posts in the last few days have to do with racism in Thailand?
Secondly, I don't really get the point of this thread. For one thing, racism is not the proper term, as it is meant to refer to how a given people think about each other within the context of their country and culture. I doubt anyone on here is interested, that much in how Thais are racist towards other Thais. When talking about how Thais feel about outsiders, which I presume is the reason for this thread, the proper term is Xenophobia. That Thais are xenophobic is a foregone conclusion. So what's the point of all this discussion? A good deal of what has transpired in the last few days might better be posted in other threads; not here.
But, on the topic of the thread, for example; just because such-and-such an Indian says that he doesn't think there's racism (really, xenophobia) because he has no trouble getting laid proves nothing. He's shagging hookers and they'll shag anyone. It's business. If he said he had no trouble scoring with shopgirls, secretaries, nurses in hospitals or your average TG on the BTS, then he'd have an argument. But, those kind of girls wouldn't go near him with a barge pole, even if he smelled like a garden and looked like a Bollywood actor.
Despite the fact that I annoy scores of people because of my apparent absolutist knowledge of Thailand, the point is that I probably do encounter more Thais on a day-to-day basis that just about anyone on this board and therefore can make declarative statements about Thai attitudes towards others with a certain degree of confidence. True, my evidence is anecdotal, as I haven't done any empirical study on the subject. But, given that at the moment, for example, I have over 200 students, not to mentions dozens of Thai colleagues, I feel I can make an pretty informed opinion on Thai attitudes about other Thais as well as non-Thais.
Other than people's personal experiences with Thai attitudes, which are mostly skewed because the majority of posters only encounter girls in P4P and people in the service industry (hotels, restaurants etc.), there seems little point to having a thread like this.
You could just ignore the Thread if its totally pointless to you. ;)
However I can undertsand that plenty of forum members who would be interested in this thread even if not every post is totally on topic.
I think the "AVOID" thread is a pretty useless one.
Old Thai Hand
01-01-08, 08:46
The one thing that does [CodeWord140] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord140) me off, is the amount of screwed up teachers in Thailand, who know jack about most things, but go around pouting their opinions all over the place, cause they are a teacher and they have a couple of friends and they are not here for P4P and they know more than just bar girls.
You really need to get out more, and stop trying to belittle everyone as you are an "OldThaiHand"..........some people have been here longer than you, done more than you, experienced more than you, have interactions with a larger cross section of society than you and so on and so forth.
I appologize if I've made assumptions about you, because other than a few posts that have shown you to be a supporter of the TRT/PPP and sympathetic to the impoverished people of Isaan, as well as working as a businessman here, I don't know much about you. But, now you are making many assumptions about me. Yet, you don't know anything about me or what I've done in this country.
FYI, I actually do get out quite a bit and have done so since I came here because my research and work require it. I have stayed in everything from Isaan hovels to mansions and have interacted with all levels of Thai society in my time here. I've picked rice with poor Isaan farmers, gone out on the ocean with Thai fishermen, been a manager at one of the largest media companies in the country, taught university and worked for the royal family.
Your comments about teachers are belittling, although I don't totally disagree with your opinion about many teachers here. But, I am not just some teacher here puttering around for a couple of years teaching English with "a couple of friends", as you put it.
I am not a teacher, (Khru) but a professor (Ajarn) - there is a distinction - with a broad spectrum of subjects that I have taught at a variety of Thai universities - from low-end Ramkhamhaeng up to high-end Chulalongkorn. I teach among other things ,Cross-cultural studies that deals with interaction between Thais and foreigners and cultural influences in this country. Thus, I have done an incredible amount of research into Thai culture which has required me to travel throughout the country. So, while I recognize that you've been here longer than I have, that doesn't mean you know more than I do, if for no other reason than in-depth knowledge of the people and their culture is not the purpose of your being here. But, it is a large part of my purpose here. I'm sure you know more about doing business with Thais than I do, because that's your milieu. Even within the culture, I don't know everything and am still learning. But, since knowledge of all aspects of the country and culture is a large part of the focus of my work, particularly in recent years, I tend to know more than even many Thais - my GF is often stunned at how much obscure (and one may argue irrelevant) minutiae I know about Thailand and Thai people. I've met foreigners like you doing business since even the 70s, who by osmosis have acquired a considerable amount of general knowledge of Thailand. But, it still remains general knowledge only.
I also know other foreigners, like Joe Cummings of Lonely Planet, a long time resident who, as a leading expert on the Lanna Culture is acknowledged even by Thais as being one of the pre-eminent authorities. Sorry to sound so arrogant. But, some people actually are experts on subjects because that's their job. Such is the case with me. So, if I spout off about Thailand, it is, I assure you from a position of knowing explicitly and implicitly about the subject matter.
My questioning of this thread is in the fact that, other than endless tales of positive and negative experiences of Thai xenophobia on the part of posters, I still don't see the point or what people are trying to prove or discover. I'd actually really like to know.
If you have something to add that can counter my contention that Thais are for the most part xenophobic, and even practice very strong inter-cultural racism, please enlighten us.
BTW, Happy New Year.
Satrai2000
01-01-08, 15:39
Someone said it earlier, but Indians are closer to black/ white people. There are actually at least 2 different types of Indian (that I know of). If you see people from way down south (Tamil Nadu/ Kerala), those people are very dark and are likely quite a different population to the Northern Indians and Pakistanis. You'll never see a Pakistani as dark as someone from the Indo-Dravidian areas of India. Some of the Pashto speakers are are even lighter. Yes, Indians DO have body odor and LOTS of body hair. (A doctor that I once had in the States had so much body hair coming out of his shirt, that he should thank whatever god that he prayed to that he wasn't killed for his pelt on the way to work any given day.)Hi,
First of all: a blessed 2008 to all you guys.
What do you mean by "but Indians are closer to black/ white people.". Is it closer to black or closer to white people? Genetically (North-)Indian people are very much related to Europeans. Many Europeans as well as Indians do not like this when they hear this, but it is a fact (now this is what is called racism...). This also has something to do with the controversial Indo-Aryan hypothesis. Won't discuss this here; lots of books have been written on this subject.
You are right about your statement that there are at least two different types of Indians. That is: at least. There are more. When you have visited the eastern states like Assam and Nagaland you know what I am talking about. The people here resemble south-east Asians.
Satrai2000
01-01-08, 16:13
...But, on the topic of the thread, for example; just because such-and-such an Indian says that he doesn't think there's racism (really, xenophobia) because he has no trouble getting laid proves nothing. He's shagging hookers and they'll shag anyone. It's business...I suppose you mean me by referring to "such-and-such an Indian".
Indeed, I didn't experience racism in Thailand from the locals (only from British tourists) but I do believe that there is at least some truth in your postings.
However, I do not call it racism nor xenophobia but I call it "jealousy". Let's be straight about this: the attitude some Thai have towards ethnic Indians has everything to do with the relative success of the Indian community; it has to with money, money and money.
This same hatred-thing also happened in some African countries from which Indians were kicked out last century. And not to mention in some cities in the USA from which I heared horror-stories. They were hated by whites, blacks and latino's because of their salary.
Note: I do NOT say that Indians are always the victims and are not racist. Many, in particular the rich, will only marry within their own community (you also see this in the Sikh-community in Bangkok).
...If he said he had no trouble scoring with shopgirls, secretaries, nurses in hospitals or your average TG on the BTS, then he'd have an argument. But, those kind of girls wouldn't go near him with a barge pole, even if he smelled like a garden and looked like a Bollywood actor...Sad to tell you this but I did have "fun" with two girls from a reputable mall in Bangkok (b.t.w.: not only in Bangkok but also in Bali and Singapore). It seems you know some truth but not the whole truth, in spite your many years of thorough research.
I still don't get it what it is that you are tying to prove. Maybe I am wrong (and I apologize if I am) but it seems to me that you are telling me something like "don't go to Thailand, they hate you very much; keep your hands off my Thai-chicks".
Old Thai Hand
01-02-08, 02:50
Satrai
I wasn't referring to anyone with my "such-and-such and Indian" remark.
I suspect that you are overly sensitive and may even have a chip on your shoulder - appologies if I'm wrong.
I'm not telling you to not go to Thailand or to "keep your hands off my Thai chicks". I could care less about your luck with Thai girls. Perhaps your luck with a couple of "shopgirls at a reputable Mall" (are there disreputable Malls?:D) is because you're devilishly handsome and charming or the shopgirls in question are players or both. I don't know. It doesn't prove much. It's been a long-standing fact that it's fairly easy to score with girls at several department stores, such as Robinson's on Silom as well as any number of girls working at MBK. If you shagged a HiSo student from a top university, then I'd be interested because THAT would be unusual. So, there's a challenge for you. Try that next time you visit and post pics to prove it. Then, I'll be impressed.
I would say the reverse to you to what you are saying to me. That there is some truth in what you are saying. But, that what I am saying is the more general truth about Thai attitudes to all outsiders, especially Indians. I'm not trying to prove anything because honestly, I don't care one way or another, except when the xenophobia affects me: and trust me, I've been the victim of plenty of anti-Farang attitudes on the job. But, since this thread was started by an Indian about racism (still, not the proper term) in Thailand, I wanted to express my opinion, based on a lot more experience than you've had about what I've observed and heard outright from Thais about their attitudes.
However, there may be some truth in your supposition that some Thais are jealous of the money that Indian-Thais have. But, I would say that's only true among certain middle and lower-class Thais. The rich Thais are still richer than the richest Indian-Thais - so, no jealousy there. Although, I don't know how wide-spread it may be, I know of jealousy among the Indian-Thai community for the Thai-Chinese because the Indians feel that they've been shut out of the power structure of this country even though they contribute significantly to the economy.
I'm still waiting for someone to explain the purpose of this thread other than endless back and forth discussions as to whether the Thais are racist/xenophobic or not. Such discussions could go on forever without anyone being convinced one way or the other beyond their own experience.
Satrai2000
01-02-08, 21:47
Old Thai Hand,
It's all OK to me.
By the way: this discussion about who hates who is getting boring and in fact I don't really care who hates who in Thailand for I am not a Thai citizen.
Anyway, thanks for the info about Thai attitude. For as I said before I do believe that there must at least some truth in your words.
Old Thai Hand
01-03-08, 02:24
By the way: this discussion about who hates who is getting boring and in fact I don't really care who hates who in Thailand for I am not a Thai citizen.
Agreed. It is getting boring because it is largely irrelevant to anyone who is merely visiting here, which describes 99% of the posters on this board.
Monger approaches girl....
Girl refuses..or shuns him..
Monger walks less than a block or to another bar..
finds an even prettier girl
fucks her silly all night long..
so much for racism in thailand...
Old Thai Hand
01-03-08, 02:58
Monger approaches girl....
Girl refuses..or shuns him..
Monger walks less than a block or to another bar..
finds an even prettier girl
fucks her silly all night long..
so much for racism in thailand...
Stupid post
Stupid post
LOL...I've read most of these posts where first time visitors/mongers..are asking:
Are thai girls racist...do they like black/brown/yellow guys?
OF course there is racism in thailand...from a visiting mongering perspective it does not matter..who the fuck cares?...for every bar or freelance girl who refuses to sleep with you, u will find 10-20 of equal or higher value that will gladly fuck you silly...
that my friend--was my point in an overly simplified manner...we are not here trying to enter the upper echelons of thai society..
Old Thai Hand
01-03-08, 10:14
LOL...I've read most of these posts where first time visitors/mongers..are asking:
Are thai girls racist...do they like black/brown/yellow guys?
OF course there is racism in thailand...from a visiting mongering perspective it does not matter..who the fuck cares?...for every bar or freelance girl who refuses to sleep with you, u will find 10-20 of equal or higher value that will gladly fuck you silly...
that my friend--was my point in an overly simplified manner...we are not here trying to enter the upper echelons of thai society..
Well, ok then. Point taken and I agree with you.
SirHumpsaLott
01-03-08, 18:49
LOL...I've read most of these posts where first time visitors/mongers..are asking:
Are thai girls racist...do they like black/brown/yellow guys?
OF course there is racism in thailand...from a visiting mongering perspective it does not matter..who the fuck cares?...for every bar or freelance girl who refuses to sleep with you, u will find 10-20 of equal or higher value that will gladly fuck you silly...
that my friend--was my point in an overly simplified manner...we are not here trying to enter the upper echelons of thai society..Well in that perspective, I guess Thailand is really no different than anywhere else.
Anyway,
I don't know how far back you've read of this thread but old thai and a few others were trying to impress upon everyone else here that ALL thais were somewhat ESPECIALLY racist towards dark skinned people of any ethnicity, that no other girls other than bar girls would ever entertain the thought of fucking a black/indian whatever, and that those that did were somehow a flawed segment of Thai society.
He doesn't like the thread now because too many have come forward to share their experiences to the contrary but reading his responses, it seems the only experiences regarding this matter he considers valid....are his own.
SirHumpsaLott
01-03-08, 19:10
I still don't get it what it is that you are tying to prove. Maybe I am wrong (and I apologize if I am) but it seems to me that you are telling me something like "don't go to Thailand, they hate you very much; keep your hands off my Thai-chicks".Perfect and well put.
LittleBigMan
01-03-08, 23:44
SirHumpsalott,
Your last statement " He doesn't like the thread now because too many have come forward to share their experiences to the contrary but reading his responses it seem the only experience regarding this matter he consider valid... are his own "
OTH, doesn't need me to defend him he can do that himself. But this thread and all others threads are responses and experiences we have encounter. Some will agree and some don't that is what this is all about!
He has mentioned in the past and will in the future what his opinions are based on his experience having been in Thailand for so many years. There is nothing wrong with that! we all agree to disagree! Some will post their disagreements and some won't but that doesn't mean that the few that do have a advantage that they are right.
I don't see anything OTH has expressed or Carrib or Satrai2000 or yourself as being in the right or wrong. It's just a opinion take it or leave it and I think OTH has earned the right to express his opinions and experiences whether we agree or not!
LBM
Evil Penivel
01-04-08, 00:27
On racism in Thailand. I think there is a disconnect here in the discussion. Some people are talking about cultural/institutional racism while others are talking about what type of guys the TGs want to be with. The two cannot be the same.
TJ, you hit on a point that often missed in these discussions. A bar owner's (or bar girl's) preferences about customers are seldom based on any sort of "ideological" racism. It has to do with simply rules-of-thumb that enable them to survive under less than ideal circumstances.
Threads about discrimination at LOS nightspots pop up regularly on the punter boards. Too much emphasis is placed on racist ideology as the motivation for the refusal of some gogo bars to admit men of color. Instead, it is almost entirely a commercial decision, Bar owners are simply trying to cultivate the core customer group they need to survive. It's a sharp edge that cuts in all directions. I'm about as mainstream white, Anglo-Saxon and Protestant as you can get, but there are a half-dozen bars within walking distance of my apartment in New York City that would refuse me service if I tried to visit them.
Is it because those bar owners hate WASP men? That may be a tiny part of it, but mostly it's because I don't fit in with the customers on which the bar owner is dependent for his livelihood. To the degree that I remind customers of a law enforcement agent, process server, bail bondsman, private investigator, insurance claims adjuster, social worker, building inspector, district attorney or any of a number of other professions that spell trouble for certain people, I tend to scare away his target customers. In other cases, it's simply because I'm too old or dressed the wrong way for the crowd in the bar.
Do I care? Not one bit. In fact, I'm thankful when doormen warn me up front that a certain bar "not for you." That way I don't waste time or money in a place where I'm not going to have a good time anyway.
Same-same in LOS. There are Japanese, Chinese, Korean, Thai, Arabic, Indian, and African bars and clubs that don't want me or any farang as a customer. In Pattaya and BKK, there are of course many places where the tables are turned – I belong to the group from which the bar draws its desired customer base while some non-farangs are refused at the door.
It's nothing to get upset about, just look for another bar.
I have noticed, though, that there's a lot of confusion in these threads and some background might help. First, when Thais speak about Indians or Indian people, they are using a homemade translation for theThai term "kaek." It refers to people from a swathe of countries from Turkey to Nepal, not just citizens of the Republic of India. In fact, it's more likely that when a Thai speaks of "Indian people," it's Arabs who are meant.
There's also another reason. In the 1970's and 1980's, oilfield and construction workers working in the Gulf states became an important part of the LOS P4P scheme. Those guys had a lot of money and spent it freely while in LOS. Because these workers were so badly treated on the job, they refused to sit in the same bar as Arabs. If an Arab walked in, the construction/oil workers would leave en masse. Alternately, the drunkest among them would beat the crap out of the Arabs. In either case, it was easier for the bar owner to avoid all hassles by banning Arabs.
Another "historical" factor to explain the prejudice many BGs feel against "Indian men" has been their inability to understand the bar-fine system. There have been cases where men of various backgrounds have refused to compensate BGs after a night of sex because they thought the B/F was an all-in fee. In other cases, these same men were less than generous in their compensation of the girls.
Add to this some widespread conceptions among TGs about different races or ethnic groups that are based on a combination of bad experiences and handed-down stories. I'll never forget the bar girl who told me, "Ten farang men - one bad customer. Ten Indian men (she meant Arabs), all bad customers." Harsh, but from her point of view, probably true.
Evil
LittleBigMan
01-04-08, 01:04
E.P.
Your post bring back memories for me about Arabs. Around 10 years ago, I went to Pattaya with some friends and one of my buddies booked us in south of Pattaya near walking street in a Hotel called Marina Hotel for around 400 baht. This place and area is dominated my Arabs but it didn't bother me as long as they didn't bother me. I remember they had a jamming disco that open at 1-2 in the morning and didn't close until 07:00. There were freelancers by the dozens in the disco and if LBM, got horny the middle of the night we just went down and got a ST, for 500 baht. It was so convienent. There were also girls in the lobby, but their was one that always got my attention during my stay. She was cute as a button but thick, she was in the lobby like 24/7, one day I was sitting in the lobby just taking in the sights. She was sitting on the sofa on the other end, in the middle was a Arab around 55 or so, they were talking and the Arab offered her 250 baht, her respond had me rolling " What the F--K, for that I might as well drive a taxi " she got up and sat next to me. I offered her 500 baht and off we went for a great GFE, for the next week before I left she came each night and knock on my door to see if LBM was horny.
Regardless of the race, when you get too cheap and stupid it leaves a bad impression on them.
LBM
Old Thai Hand
01-04-08, 04:01
LBM
Thanks for your defence.
SirHumps may have a chip on his shoulder, for I never said that Thais who like Blacks/Indians were somehow "flawed". These are not my attitudes, but only what I have experienced. I merely have been pointing out my observations for over 11 years of indepth exposure to Thai attitudes about others (including other Thais). I've heard some incredibly ignorant remarks come out of Thai mouths about all sorts of people: remarks about Indians and their "bad smell" are as common as rain water. But, they aren't the only target of Thai vitriole. The Thais hate the Burmese for no other reason than history - the Burmese invaded Siam 19 times and destroyed a good deal of it including the ancient capital of Ayutthya. The only reason the Bangkok exists is because it was the last defensive position the Thais were able to take to stop the Burmese. They hate the Cambodians and Lao for similar reasons because both were historical enemies of the Thais and that notion is still drilled into Thai school children. The truth, of course is a good deal of Thai traditional culture was stolen from Cambodia and Lao. But, Thais would be outraged if you ever said that becasue they see themselves as the superior people of SE Asia. Of course, the Cambodians don't like the Thais that much either - a few years ago they burned down the Thai embassy in Phnom Phen when some ignorant Thai actress claimed that Anghor Wat was actually Thai. Regional hatreds run deep and wide. Internally, the Thais hate themselves, with Isaan being the #1 target of contempt by Thais in the rest of the country, especially in central Thailand and the far north. Thais use the Isaan word, "Bugsider" (which just means naiive) in a condescending way, corrupted to mean something akin to "Village Idiot". Of course, the fact that Bangkok would grind to a halt if you removed all those despised Isaan people somehow escapes those who are so hateful about them.
Of course, there are exceptions to Thai xenophobia, and I never said there weren't. For example, I was having lunch at The Bangkok Club, a bastion of entrenched, Thai High Society, if ever there was one, when in walked a very well-dressed black man and Thai woman. She was obviously HiSo and as this is a private club, he could only have been there by invitation. Admittedly, people did stare quite a bit. But, the point is that she was with him and didn't care who saw it. Times may be slowly changing. That's a good thing, IMO.
The issue of xenophobia and inter-cultural racism is really only of concern to expats. Here, I want to stress that white Farang, as well are often subject to exclusion or downright hostility. We are for instance barred from Japanese and Korean clubs. But, Japanese and Koreans aren't barred from anywhere (look at the state of bars like Rainbow 2 and 4 at Nana or Baccara at Soi Cowboy). Personally I encounter hostility and suspicion on a daily basis where I work. I was told as recently as Monday this week that many Thai faculty resent having Farang faculty at the university and that some think our presence is a bad influence on the students and is generally dangerous to Thai culture and tradition.
Most of the Farang faculty have taken to eating lunch away from the university because of the discomfort of going into the faculty lounge - we are segregated to our own table and often stared at. If we enter the room, the conversation turns to whispers. You could cut the air with a knife.
I used to live in a Thai neighbourhood near Ramkhamhaeng University. I ate at the same restaurants every day, shopped at the same 7/11, and walked down the same sois for 2 1/2 years. Yet, on the last day as on the first my presence their was a source of curious suspicion - adults, who I saw every day would still stare at me, as if I was an alien and children would follow me down the street chanting "Farang, Farang, Farang".
SirHumps. A large segment of the Thai population don't like you. But, they don't like me either. I have to live with it. You, for the most part as a visitor don't because, if nothing else the Thais are masters of covering up their true feelings with false smiles and pretending to be lovely, friendly people, especially when money is involved.
Everything in this country revolves around status. So, even in P4P, which I suppose is the main concern even in this thread, a BG, still concerned about status would prefer the lesser of two evils: to be seen with a white Farang is far preferrable to being seen with a black man or a kaek because it is lot less embarassing for her.
Evil Penivel
01-04-08, 22:42
Regardless of the race, when you get too cheap and stupid it leaves a bad impression on them.
LBM
That's a very valid point. There is very little room in these girls' lives for abstract predujice. For many, not accepting a customer's offer could mean that she - or her family - won't eat that night. If a girl does refuse, it's for a damn strong reason - usually because of bad experiences in the past with certain groups of customers.
Evil
Old Thai Hand
01-05-08, 04:00
that's a very valid point. there is very little room in these girls' lives for abstract predujice. for many, not accepting a customer's offer could mean that she - or her family - won't eat that night. if a girl does refuse, it's for a damn strong reason - usually because of bad experiences in the past with certain groups of customers.
evil
i think that you and lbm have hit the nail on the head as far as p4p girls' attitudes are concerned. they are almost solely based on good and bad experiences.
for example, the dislike of kaek isn't about bad smell, but stems from bad experiences of being stiffed by cheap charlies or worse. one celebrated case last year involved an indian who paid the barfine and took a girl back to his hotel where a group of his friends were waiting. the group gang-raped her all night and sent her packing in the morning bruised and battered and with no money. that kind of experience, well publicized in the press, as it was impressed not only upon the unfortunate girl, but every other girl in p4p to avoid kaek, at all costs. the unfortunate thing is that there have been a number of bad experiences like that, almost always with the same general group of people which has solidified negative attitudes.
greetings everyone,
admittedly, this is a delicate subject.
the purpose of this thread is to provide a place for forum members to discuss actual or perceived racial prejudice that they feel may have been exhibited against them by thais, which is a legitimate concern of travelers to thailand.
this thread is not here to provide a place to foster "hate speech" against or denigrate the physical attributes of other races.
actually, i wish that i didn't need to provide this thread in the first place, but experience has taught me that if i don't provide a place for some members to discuss this subject, then the subject will regularly permeate the other threads.
thanks,
jackson
"I could care less about your luck with Thai girls." You are a fucking professor and you use this kind of grammar? Shameful. Where did you go to school, the University of Phoenix?
Fellow professor
The entire province of Siem Reap, in which Angkor Wat is located (note there are many alternative spellings for that), most certainly was part of Thailand for quite a long time. So, you aren't an English professor and you are not a history professor, and you are not as smart as you think you are.
The entire province of Siem Reap, in which Angkor Wat is located (note there are many alternative spellings for that), most certainly was part of Thailand for quite a long time. So, you aren't an English professor and you are not a history professor, and you are not as smart as you think you are.Mr. Dickhead,
I think this statement about Angk[h]or W[h]at was a very clear from Mr. OTH in this thread, as well as all the discussion in this thread was - ... not that bad, compared to other threads, wasn't it?
Are you as smart as you think [if you write something like this?] ? Now, I know, that I am not as smart at all [otherwise I would not write this report}.
Anyway - Mr. Dickhead - you are invited to come here, write here and show ME that you are smarter than OTH. You chance is - close to zero.
Giiotto
PS: Something to read: http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showpost.php?p=689875&postcount=1622
Traveler1234
01-05-08, 22:37
1 Monger approaches girl....
2 Girl refuses..or shuns him.
3 Monger walks less than a block or to another bar..
4 finds an even prettier girl
5 fucks her silly all night long..
6 so much for racism in thailand...
LOL...I've read most of these posts where first time visitors/mongers..are asking:
Are thai girls racist...do they like black/brown/yellow guys?
OF course there is racism in thailand...from a visiting mongering perspective it does not matter..who the fuck cares?...for every bar or freelance girl who refuses to sleep with you, u will find 10-20 of equal or higher value that will gladly fuck you silly...
that my friend--was my point in an overly simplified manner...we are not here trying to enter the upper echelons of thai society..
Luv your first post - in 6 short sentences, summed up this entire fucking thread.
OTH - guess you haven't finished your dissertation. Using this forum as a backboard for your class lessons? :D
Mr. Dickhead,
I think this statement about Angk[h]or W[h]at was a very clear from Mr. OTH in this thread,
And just how did you get that from what he wrote?: "a few years ago they burned down the Thai embassy in Phnom Phen when some ignorant Thai actress claimed that Anghor Wat was actually Thai."
I do have a reservation at your place but will probably cancel it now.
Traveler1234
01-05-08, 22:46
I do have a reservation at your place but will probably cancel it now.
Suggest you keep it...it's a great place. G's stable of girls are colorblind, except for green.... ;)
And just how did you get that from what he wrote?: "a few years ago they burned down the Thai embassy in Phnom Phen when some ignorant Thai actress claimed that Anghor Wat was actually Thai."
I do have a reservation at your place but will probably cancel it now.Mr. Dickhead,
This statement is completely true. That incident really happened, whether you know it or not. But - I remember it.
So - if that is a reason for not coming to the Lodge - stay away! But - the truth is the truth, my smart friend.
Giotto
LittleBigMan
01-05-08, 23:05
Dickhead,
What the heck cause you to go off the deep end? The last time we heard from you was about whether you wanted to catch the bus to Pattaya or stay at the airport for hour's. Was the wrong choice of staying at the airport the reason for the outburst.
Not staying at Giotto place because someone said something you didn't agree with isn't very smart. Your both professor and as professor can't we all get along?
LBM
OK, I believe that English is not Giotto's 1st language so there may be a barrier here. I tell you I KNOW that the Thai actress made that statement. My point is her statement was not necessarily inaccurate as Angkor Wat DID once belong to Thailand. And, Old Thai Handjob did not seem to know that, based on his post. OTH is not a monger, and looks down on them, so I don't know why he posts here. Thus if OTH and Giotto are tight, I might be better off staying somewhere else. I am not in Thailand yet.
What I will do, to be fair and reasonable like the quantitative analyst that I am, is I will stay at Giotto's place for at least one night, hopefully meet the guy, and go from there. I am just not sure based on my reading of his posts that we are on the same page. And, rumor has it that there are several other hotels in Bangkok.
Clearly you can't read English well enough to understand what I am trying to say, but then again I can't read Italian. But I will make other arrangements. I can meet arrogant Italian pricks in abundance in Buenos Aires.
OK, I believe that English is not Giotto's 1st language so there may be a barrier here.
Looks to me like he understood perfectly....
And, Old Thai Handjob did not seem to know that, based on his post. OTH is not a monger, and looks down on them, so I don't know why he posts here. Thus if OTH and Giotto are tight, I might be better off staying somewhere else. I am not in Thailand yet.
I'd ease up a bit there Captain Serenity, you run the risk of violating the policy with regard to personal attacks on other members, and regardless of how annoyed you might be, this forum is a treasure trove of knowledge and it would be a pity if a worthy contributor such as yourself was to lose access.
Besides, if you are going to come up with an insulting variant of OTH, I think you could be a bit more imaginative*
Opinionated Tiresome Harp
Obsessively Telling Half-truths
Obviously Totally Hopeless
* Yes, I apologize, I find him insightful and enjoy reading his posts. I am not aware of any half truths. If anybody argues with the opinionated thing, they are beyond the realms of conventional psychiatric techniques.
I tell you I KNOW that the Thai actress made that statement. My point is her statement was not necessarily inaccurate as Angkor Wat DID once belong to Thailand.
There I think you've missed the relevance. From an external perspective, it doesn't matter two shakes of a shitty chicken whether it was true or not. The point is, the the comment served to create further division between the Thai and Cambodian people.
Have you ever met one of those people who have to be fucking right all the time no matter what... I don't mean as in opinionated, I mean as in factual detail.. correcting their friend's harmless embellishments when a story is being told to a 3rd party, getting reduced to the point of screaming rage over a disagreement about whether it was on Johns Birthday last year that June squeezed Jane's tits or whether it was that other party that John threw a couple of months before. I fucking hate those people. My point is, going to some pains to insist about something of marginal relevance is fucking annoying. Going to pains to insist about something steeped with tension already (as she did) is fucking idiotic. Being right is of not the slightest relevance to how people react to it.
Reminds me of racism. Different skin colours should have fuck all relevance to how people are treated. Unfortunately, 'should' oftentimes has fuck all connection to what actually happens - which, frankly is why I think this thread is useful. We each bring our views on what is to the table so that one and all are forewarned and forearmed. This last is why I find this thread to have great merit.
Further to all that, I find racism an absolutely fascinating subject. It pisses me off that aggression has become part of this thread. It is a very sensitive topic for some, and I do not mean to belittle that sensitivity, but, because of that sensitivity, on this thread, more than others, cooler heads must prevail. Those of you who are sensitive about race should be mindful that anyone from reigning Grand High Demigod Supreme Commander KKK boss type guy through to the black virgin Mary herself can and will participate here. You know there are arseholes out there who believe all sorts of things - hearing them speak isn't exactly going to be a surprise now, is it? Do note that I haven't seen any overtly racist commentary on this thread (but I haven't read it all) - I have seen lots of comments about and descriptions of overtly racist behavior, but that would seem to be the point of the thread.
I reiterate, due to the sensitive nature of the subject, tempers need to be kept in check even more so than normal.
Oh I am not angry in any way over any of this. Racism is indeed fascinating as is classism and so forth. I consider my mongering trips to be studies in racism and classism. The intellectual benefits of mongering are vast: graduate field work in sociology, economics, history, geography, and foreign languages, at a minimum. Oh yeah and gastronomy. However I would disagree that due to its sensitive nature the topic should be treated more gingerly. I think tiptoeing around the issue is part of the problem and not part of the solution. In one of the sociology courses I took, Social Stratification, I wrote a research paper that argued for compulsory interracial marriage. In three generations everyone is fairly brown and a lot of this goes away. I was like 27% dead serious although who the fuck wants the government messing in who you marry? Prof was a hard core feminist and freaked out completely.
Granted it is a harsh solution but it would work and might even have other genetic benefits.
Prof was a hard core feminist and freaked out completely.
My 200th post is to say that I had a good chuckle at that! Hardcore feminists are a bunch of people that don't bother me too much ideologically, induce the mental equivalent of hives on a practical level - suffice to say, there are none on my Xmas list.
Outside the obvious practical failings of your premise, I'd say it was doomed to fail anyway. We are instinctively tribal and we will continue to define members of our own tribes based on arbitrary criteria. Race is one which has been around for a long time - but there are more recent ones that are just as ridiculous, members of rival football clubs in England brawling for example.
I think of all this (including racism) as probably a form of community Darwinism - those tribes which could oust their neighbors would be able to claim the resources the neighbors held and thrive. In the modern world, the divisions are more complex, so we unconsciously make them up.
If we were all brown with slanty eyes, we'd still find ways to hate each other - humankind's ingenuity knows few limits. The only upside is we might be able to finally get rid of all those left handed arseholes in some sort of righty vs lefty war - no more mouse being left on the wrong side of the computer - woohoo!
Traveler1234
01-06-08, 01:56
What I will do, to be fair and reasonable like the quantitative analyst that I am, is I will stay at Giotto's place for at least one night, hopefully meet the guy, and go from there. I am just not sure based on my reading of his posts that we are on the same page. And, rumor has it that there are several other hotels in Bangkok.
Many people have enjoyed Livingstone's Lodge without ever meeting the owner. Your 'analysis' of and decision to stay at this hotel based on a this thread is pretty short-sighted, IMHO.
It would be your loss - not his. And yes there are many other hotels in Bangkok - luckily none are racists - they all accept green, etc. ;)
Funny you should mention that and totally off topic but when I used to hire cooks, I would tell them to fill out the entire application and then sign it in my presence. I then used this to cull out all left-handed cooks who, while undoubtedly worthy individuals, would turn all the ladles, spoons, and pot handles the other way, which slowed me down considerably. Anyway my friend I am meeting in Thailand is left-handed and if you are reading this, buddy, I realized a long time ago that this was a way wrong thing to do.
SidTheSexist
01-06-08, 02:13
Have you ever met one of those people who have to be fucking right all the time no matter what... I don't mean as in opinionated, I mean as in factual detail.. correcting their friend's harmless embellishments when a story is being told to a 3rd partyExample....
but there are more recent ones that are just as ridiculous, members of rival football clubs in England brawling for exampleI believe it is a well established fact that this is a thing of the past amongst rival English fans. At least it is to a stage of minor irrelevance. Take the Italians however, or one of many other European countries, who continually get away with (although on the odd occasion mildly disciplined) blatant racist chanting from masses in the crowd when faced against Black players in various competitions. Or you could go on to talk about the pathetic behaviour of those in scicily(sp?) whose antics quite recently lead to the killing of a few policemen. Or the even more recent nationwide RIOTS in Italy which lead to the cancellation of several games in the same day all over the country. Sorry to be a ****, but please be aware that we have moved on somewhat since the '80's.
Sid :D
Example....I believe it is a well established fact that this is a thing of the past amongst rival English fans. At least it is to a stage of minor irrelevance. Take the Italians however, or one of many other European countries, who continually get away with (although on the odd occasion mildly disciplined) blatant racist chanting from masses in the crowd when faced against Black players in various competitions. Or you could go on to talk about the pathetic behaviour of those in scicily(sp?) whose antics quite recently lead to the killing of a few policemen. Or the even more recent nationwide RIOTS in Italy which lead to the cancellation of several games in the same day all over the country. Sorry to be a ****, but please be aware that we have moved on somewhat since the '80's.
Sid :D
Yeah, ok - slightly outdated example.. but still something ridiculous to fight over.
Other examples:
Turf wars in the US/UK - kid was killed in the UK on NYE ostensibly because he was outside his postcode
Bankokers snubbing Isaaners
Malaysians and the appalling way a lot of them treat the Indonesians
Hell.. a world famous and very busy technical forum needed to shutdown recently because of fighting over the new high def format (Blue-Ray vs HDDVD) an I believe there was some offline fighting about it as well where someone went to someone else's house kicked off some fisticuffs
Chinese vs Tibetans or Mongolias
The current 'War on Terror' which seems to just be wacko arsehole fundamentalist Muslims against wacko arsehole fundamentalist Christians.. prior to that, there was the great campaign against pinko commie scum.... there's always a reason to be fighting people different.
Whilst you can point to the English or the Italians or any other nation or race, my belief is it is endemic to the human condition. The English are no better and no worse than anyone else - they were randomly picked as an example.
Years and years ago I watched a Babylon 5 episode that summed it up nicely.. the premise was something like this.
There's an alien race. Some of them wear a red piece of clothing, others wear a blue piece of clothing - the colour they wear is selected at random. Blue tries to kill red and vice versa. As a species our behavior is not dissimilar.
Old Thai Hand
01-06-08, 03:37
the entire province of siem reap, in which angkor wat is located (note there are many alternative spellings for that), most certainly was part of thailand for quite a long time. so, you aren't an english professor and you are not a history professor, and you are not as smart as you think you are.
well, here we have a declarative statement, i.e. hypothesis without a shred of empirical evidence to back it up.
but, here, i'll help you, professor dickhead.
technically, you are correct, if one considers angkor wat belonging to the thais (actually siamese) after the siamese raped and pillaged and then sacked it, making off with the khmer's art, music, culture and complete troupe of royal khmer court dancers - from which the siamese copied what became classical siamese (now thai) art, music, culture and siamese royal court dancing. using your logic, angkor wat also belonged to the vietnamese, too as the chams from vietnam sacked angkor wat in the 12th century and at various times from the 16th to the 19th century, cambodia was a vassle state of the vietnamese.
at the time of the khmer empire, the siamese were an ignorant rabble living in a villages, with little culture. they were vassles of the khmers and in fact large parts of siam were part of the khmer empire - siem riep means "siam conquered" and there are several khmer temples in isaan (phimai, for example). for about 400 years, from the 11th until the 15th century, the siamese were therefore actually allies, or more likely mercenaries used by the khmer in their many wars with the chams. because the khmers viewed the siamese as completely wild savages who were totally undisciplined, they used them as shock troops and essentially canon fodder, saving the khmer troups for the final coup de grace.
when the khmer empire weakened and began to decline in the 15th century, the siamese took the advantage to sneak in and attack angkor wat and strike the death blow. the surviving khmers tried to maintain a semblance of their kingdom, but eventually alternated between siamese and vietnamese control until the french took over cambodia, at the request of the cambodian king, in the mid-19th century.
so, i suppose you're right in one sense. but, angkor wat has never belonged to thailand in the modern era, which is what i was talking about.
the incident in which the cambodians rioted after the alleged remark from the thai actress occurred in january 2003 (i took the trouble of looking it up).
if you are indeed a professor, then you should know better than to challenge someone's position unless you're prepared to back it up with more than declarative statements. or, did you buy your degree on khaosan road?
you sound incredibly childish to me, especially in your threat to cancel your reservation at livingstone's. i bet you were one of those kids who didn't play nice in the sandbox, bullied the other kids and then said, you were taking all your toy trucks and going home.
oh, and btw, i'm not a history professor or an english teacher. so, excuse my grammatical and any other errors. i sometimes type quickly and make mistakes. i suppose though, that you never make mistakes, do you?
Any definition of the "modern era" is arbitrary. None of what you say makes me see why the Thai actress was incorrect in what she said, as long as she used the past tense. Typing quickly doesn't explain "I could care less." That is just so fucking uneducated and ignorant that you could stay at Livingstone's Lodge for the next 2568 Chinese New Years and never make up for such a gaffe.
Now back to Racism in Thailand. I have a farang friend whom I met in Buenos Aires who has been living in Thailand for about two years now and has decided he will probably move on. I asked him why. He had a couple of reasons but one was that "living here is somewhat akin to being a monkey in a zoo. We (white faces) are put on display and for the amusement of the masses."
I am not planning on living in Thailand so I don't care but it is food for thought. This guy is a very thoughtful, moderate, middle-of-the-road type of person.
Me, I am just going to fuck a bunch of the women there, form no meaningful attachments, and then leave. I am certainly not going to stay there and work under the circumstances you describe where you are too gosh darn a-scared of your local co-workers to even eat lunch with them.
Old Thai Hand
01-06-08, 07:37
Typing quickly doesn't explain "I could care less." That is just so fucking uneducated and ignorant that you could stay at Livingstone's Lodge for the next 2568 Chinese New Years and never make up for such a gaffe.
Well, gee, aren't we an angry young man? Are we having a bad start to the year?
Ok, then. I COULDN'T care less about your opinion. I may be "fucking uneducated and ignorant". But, you haven't exactly shown yourself to be either educated or enlightened. The tone of your posts is rather like gutter-speak, not something I would expect from a professor.
Member #3443
01-06-08, 10:11
One of the reasons the Thais were also able to captilize with invading the area around Siem Reap and Angkor Wat was the decision to move the Royal Court and Capital from Angkor Wat to Oudong to break up the Brahmas (at the time the Hindu religion was still dominant with the noble families) influece and control of the Royal Court as the Empire converting to Theravada Buddhaism ascended in society. You will note of interest that actually Mahayana (Tibetan) Buddhaism variant was the first dominant Buddhist variant in the Khmer Empire.
Another conflict we have seen in history decided by a UN Court in the 1960's was giving Preah Vehar back to Cambodia from Thailand. Thais had claimed that as their own when in fact it was built by a Khmer King.
Old Thai Hand
01-06-08, 11:02
One of the reasons the Thais were also able to captilize with invading the area around Siem Reap and Angkor Wat was the decision to move the Royal Court and Capital from Angkor Wat to Oudong to break up the Brahmas (at the time the Hindu religion was still dominant with the noble families) influece and control of the Royal Court as the Empire converting to Theravada Buddhaism ascended in society. You will note of interest that actually Mahayana (Tibetan) Buddhaism variant was the first dominant Buddhist variant in the Khmer Empire.
Another conflict we have seen in history decided by a UN Court in the 1960's was giving Preah Vehar back to Cambodia from Thailand. Thais had claimed that as their own when in fact it was built by a Khmer King.
Thanks for the interesting additional information. There has in fact been a lot of cultural tension between the Thais and Cambodia almost all to do with historical issues such as you mention vis a vis Preah Vehar. There are also similar types of tension with Laos stemming back to the Laos invasion of Isaan in 1829. The Thais were going to make a movie about this war a couple of years ago, until strong protests from the Lao government forced the film to be shelved.
LittleBigMan
01-06-08, 23:31
Is there a cancellation at the always full L. Lodge? What day was he supposed to check-in Giotto?
Blunderer, I know this is the thread for racism, but did you really need to take Dickheads word to the task and be so unsensitive? I'm hurt that you use the phase "Brown with slanty eyes ". I'm going to my room now!
LBM
Funny you should mention that and totally off topic but when I used to hire cooks, I would tell them to fill out the entire application and then sign it in my presence. I then used this to cull out all left-handed cooks who, while undoubtedly worthy individuals, would turn all the ladles, spoons, and pot handles the other way, which slowed me down considerably. Anyway my friend I am meeting in Thailand is left-handed and if you are reading this, buddy, I realized a long time ago that this was a way wrong thing to do.At the Mc Donalds University and become a " Human Resources Specialist " ?
Is there a cancellation at the always full L. Lodge? What day was he supposed to check-in Giotto?
...
LittleBigMan,
LOL, Livingstone's Lodge is not always full...and I don't know whether there was a cancellation related to this discussion.
Let us stop this nonsense, my report was quite offensive, too. It was definitely not necessary to get involved into this discussion.
Giotto
Traveler1234
01-07-08, 03:41
I like the rhythm of "Dick and Pete"....
Mr. Chairman, LBM, OTH and others - maybe you can all arrange for the two to meet at Giotto's for a drink.....the buenos aires gringo and the aussie have a lot in common. Split my BF, piper1's three beers, the free dinner on the house?
Just a thought ;)
if one considers angkor wat belonging to the thais (actually siamese) after the siamese raped and pillaged and then sacked it, making off with the khmer's art, music, culture and complete troupe of royal khmer court dancers. . .at the time of the khmer empire, the siamese were an ignorant rabble living in a villages
whereas nowadays the siamese live in villages and small, medium, and large cities.
you've made a great effort to educate a dick, let's see if you get a "thank you."
SirHumpsaLott
01-13-08, 14:15
LOL...I've read most of these posts where first time visitors/mongers..are asking:
Are thai girls racist...do they like black/brown/yellow guys?
OF course there is racism in thailand...from a visiting mongering perspective it does not matter..who the fuck cares?...for every bar or freelance girl who refuses to sleep with you, u will find 10-20 of equal or higher value that will gladly fuck you silly...
that my friend--was my point in an overly simplified manner...we are not here trying to enter the upper echelons of thai society..I am in Bankok now, been here about a week now and while I have noticed some of the girls have given me the brushoff or otherwise made it pretty clear that they're not interested in me either because I'm black or whatever, I am constantly finding many others that are STRONGLY interested in what I have to offer.
I've gotten the same results from other types of women in other countries as well as my hometown in the U.S. It's the same story ANYWHERE you go; some women are just into different types of men, some only like men of their own race/ethnicity, while most don't give a shit either way and of the last group, their numbers are steadily rising.
There is nothing I've seen or experienced here so far that would indicate Thais have an especially negative attitude about this as anyone else. I'm sure there are just as many Thai racist idiots as there are white, black, or brown ones IMO and to make Thais out as particularly racist is both wrong and unfair not only to Thais, but also to those few out there that would read something like that and take it for absolute truth.
Like I said before; regarding the racism that OTH is so strongly trying to implicate as so especially strong in Thais against men of color, their behavior is really no different than anyone else's.
SirHumpsaLott
01-13-08, 14:45
Ok,
Well I'm in Thailand right now and was going to post this in the General Reports section but decided since I'm a black man and was sort of on the "lookout" for anything that might be especially racist during my visit here (after all, I am doing business with these people), thought I'd share my firsthand experiences and thoughts regarding this matter. First a little background about me; I own a small manufacturing company in los angeles and just signed a deal with a prominent factory in Bangkok to bulk produce a certain part needed in order to increase production. I have been to thailand before, my first time as a U.S. Marine who came here to co train with the Royal Thai Marine Corps (Cobra Gold). My business contact here is a close friend from college I've known for 15 years and is Thai/American and the guy who brokered the deal that I'm now here completing.
Day one:
Flew in to Suv airport and after getting through customs and immigration, hit Concourse B where my driver is supposed to be waiting. I get a few looks from fellow travellers, mostly white, and from the multitude of Thais both working and waiting there to pick up people. I see my driver holding the sign with my name and approach him wondering if he will be surprised that I'm black but then figure that he's probably been told already. This random stupid thought serves to remind me to keep an open mind and not focus too much on possible negativity.
SirHumpsaLott
01-14-08, 15:58
Sorry folks, accidentally hit the send key before I actually wanted to, here is the real and complete report regarding my first day:
[QUOTE=SirHumpsaLott]Ok,
Well I'm in Thailand right now and was going to post this in the General Reports section but decided since I'm a black man and was sort of on the "lookout" for anything that might be especially racist during my visit here (after all, I am doing business with these people), thought I'd share my firsthand experiences and thoughts regarding this matter. First a little background about me; I own a small manufacturing company in los angeles and just signed a deal with a prominent factory in Bangkok to bulk produce a certain part needed in order to increase production. I have been to thailand before, my first time as a U.S. Marine who came here to co train with the Royal Thai Marine Corps (Cobra Gold). My business contact here is a close friend from college I've known for 15 years and is Thai/American and the guy who brokered the deal that I'm now here completing.
Day one:
Flew in to Suv airport and after some mundane and boring business matters, finally was able to get away to find out what exactly is what regarding the matter discussed. Stayed at the Grand President, EXCELLENT hotel! Top Notch service and staff and the apartment I had was superb! They even upgraded me, at no extra charge or request from me, to a larger and more extensive apartment suite when they couldn't give me the one I had originally reserved. As will be explained later, this place is TOTALLY girl friendly and only asks for an I.D. at the door with no requests for any type of extra charge.
Grabbed a shower and hit the streets and was met by one of the many cab drivers hanging out in front of the hotel who offered a ride to a soapy massage. Been there and done that before so wasn’t interested and headed on to Soi 7 (?) where I heard Eden was located and found it but wasn’t ready for it yet and instead, walked around the street checking out all the other bars, restaurants, and massage parlors. I noticed that some of the ladies hawking their business’ would obviously ignore me while immediately hitting up a white or Asian guy walking nearby but on the other hand, some of the ladies would come right up to me with no hesitation whatsoever. I also notice that many of the ladies sitting outside would point, giggle, and stare at me but it didn’t seem in any rude type of way, more like some sort of joking around with each other about me. Racist? Maybe a bit but nothing different than I’ve encountered back home.
Lots of older white guys hanging around and it’s from them that I got the most derisive looks, granted, a few were fellow Americans who gave me the fellow monger “thumbs up” but for the most part, I could tell that a lot of the European gents there weren’t very pleased at my presence amongst “their” ladies. It’s universal that particular look, whether given here in a seedy backstreet bar by some of the old Europeans or by rednecks in the deep American south, all the same in what it says. Oh well, stare all you want fellas, I ain’t going nowhere.
While pondering that thought, a young lady called to me from the porch of the bar she was working, not only was she hot but she was also wearing a short red skirt, fishnets, and heels, three of my favorite things other than me that I like to see on pretty women. I sat with her and we got to talking, well as much as we could given her lack of English. We were quickly joined by another girl, the first one’s friend. (sorry guys but the names escape me right now) I proceed to buy them drinks while at the same time checking around to see if anyone is staring at us. Some of the girls from Eden looked over but nobody else other than the white guys walking up and down the street that would look up, do sort of a weird double take upon seeing me, then go on their way. The girl I was chatting up asked if I wanted a massage and not being able to hold out any longer, agreed so up we went. Massage was ok but the combination hand job with BBBJCIM was waaayyyyyy better and served to totally relax me. I actually wasn’t expecting her to just take it all in her mouth like that and I had to laugh at the “cum mustache” she now had. I wasn’t yet ready for actual sex so just left it at that and headed back out.
Walked up the street and was hit up by a cab driver trying to get me to go to a soapy, said not interested but jokingly asked if he knew where there was a sex show. He said no problem and took me to this small bar near Nana Entertainment complex that featured banana shows and various other girls that pull various objects from their twats or shoot various objects from said twats. Not a bad show, the ladies are all somewhat up there in years but the lighting is low and it’s a sure shot that they didn’t get hired for their looks.
What intrigues me the most about this place is the clientele; mostly older farang married couples with a few younger ones thrown in. I just thought it was weird seeing what I suppose is regular suburban housewives intently watching a woman shoot at balloons using her twat as a blowgun. Bet that doesn’t come up at the PTA meeting back home! There were also a couple of younger farang women there together who I thought about chatting up but decided not to. Anyway, the show concluded with an obvious middle aged Thai man and woman performing actual sex on stage which would have been great had they looked even the least bit into it, otherwise, not a bad show. Oh yea, its 1000 baht to get in but the drink prices were pretty reasonable.
I was feeling a bit randy and it was getting late so I decided to take the cabbie up on his original offer to take me to a soapy, he said that most would be closing soon but that I could probably get to one in time to take a girl back with me to my room. Hit up his soapy, only a few girls left but picked up a cute one named Pun that was waving enthusiastically at me. I fine her and take her back to my hotel. She cannot speak a lick of English so I don’t even try small talk, just straight into room, we both shower, and once we get on the bed, she proceeds to BBBJ to the point that I almost blow it right there but she must have sensed it and stopped, put a condom on me, then climbed on board and rode me cowgirl style. She pounded away until I felt her cumming squeezing her pussy tightly around my cock. I rolled her over into mish, then doggy. It’s hard for me to finish with a condom on so I pulled out, took the condom off and finished off on her tits.
After the deed was done, weellll let’s just say that I follow the old prostitute’s adage about them not being “paid to stay but rather, to leave”. I don’t need a girl staying all night so let her get her stuff together, paid her, and bid her goodbye figuring she didn’t need me to walk her back to the front desk to get her i.d. as I’d already seen a few girls there earlier with their farang dates doing the “walk of shame”. I don’t know if the guys notice it but I looked at those girl’s faces and they look pretty shamed. Bad enough it’s obvious what they were doing but I don’t think they need insult added to injury by seeing who with.
Not much to report on racism in Thailand that day, at least not from the Thais, but I will say that from my observations;
The only color the Thais care about is the color of baht. You might think that because you are white that you might have some sort of edge over the competition but if it comes down to choosing to be seen with a broke white person or a rich colored person, the man with the money will win 99 out of 100 times.
There is also the fact that the majority of the farang men these women deal with over here are older white men so if a guy who is any way a little bit different in an attractive way comes along they will be curious. I lost count of how many older guys I've seen walking around with little girls and hey, it's all good, love is love however you define it but some of you out there are quite frankly with girls who look young enough that were we anywhere else, you know you would be under investigation by the authorities.
That being said, a young handsome farang, whether black white or other, closer to these ladies age range, will do comparatively well here. I'm not knocking you older guys out here living your second or third lives, I'm just glad that I'm fortunate enough to be able to do this at a relatively young age.
Speaking as an American, I would say that the Thai bar girls have a definite predilection for Americans, whether white, black, or other. I know many must come over here and it seems that once they heard my accent, I was pretty much good to go as far as they were concerned. Maybe it’s because the majority of farang here are European and we are a comparative rarity? Could be because of all the movies or whatever but they keep thinking I’m some sort of Celebrity. I didn’t mention it before but that is what they keep asking me. Funny, but also strange in the fact that they seem to think I would have to be one in order to be over here in the first place as opposed to just another guy on vacation.
Next report: I see more black people! Ménage a tres ala Soi Cowboy. I get lost in what seems in Thailand to be like a cross between the Middle East and Africa. I speak to some Africans about what they do here aaaaaaaaannnd get propositioned by an old German couple.
==============================================
Greetings,
It appears that you inadvertently forgot to correctly place the quote tags in this report. Usually I can fix this sort of thing before it's displayed, but I don't have a clue as to how you intended this report to appear.
The quote tags are simple to use, all you have to do is look for them in the text. Anything that you want to appear in quotes must start with "[quote]" and end with "[/quote ]". Please note the "/" forward slash in the last tag. It's that simple.
In addition, you can preview your report before it's posted, so it's easy to check if you got it right before it's displayed in The Forum.
Thanks,
Jackson
Old Thai Hand
01-14-08, 16:54
Like I said before; regarding the racism that OTH is so strongly trying to implicate as so especially strong in Thais against men of color, their behavior is really no different than anyone else's.
Outside of your business dealings and P4P, how much experience have you had with the regular Thai population? - because you seem to be making a lot of blanket statements, but seem to only have dealt with hookers.
Just curious.
Satrai2000
01-14-08, 21:43
Outside of your business dealings and P4P, how much experience have you had with the regular Thai population? - because you seem to be making a lot of blanket statements, but seem to only have dealt with hookers.
Just curious.Humpsalot is an Afro-American and luckily not an Indian. That is the reason why he didn't experience any hatred.
Personally, I think a lot of you guys are just projecting your personal racial bias(and wishful thinking).
You're welcome to your opinions and that's what makes this board great, but when it comes to fact, the majority of thai women prefer lighter skin. Sometimes the truth hurts! I live in Thailand, and I know this as fact. Just trying to shed some light on the issue for those who come to visit wanting to get laid. Anyone can get laid in Thailand!
Like I said before; regarding the racism that OTH is so strongly trying to implicate as so especially strong in Thais against men of color, their behavior is really no different than anyone else's.
I believe thais dislike all foreigners: white, black, brown, etc. Outside of the p4p scene racism runs deeper and the color of skin is a much bigger factor. In the p4p scene, money still rules but color of skin does play a factor, as well as youth, attitude, and looks.
LittleBigMan
01-15-08, 01:19
Amjeck,
I'm glad you didn't use the word "fact" with your statement " I believe all thai's dislike foreigners " because that is a verrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrry general statement.
In general in Thailand in the P4P scene, Money is 1st, the % of youth being a major factor is slim and none! In Thailand how many old guys do you see walking around with younger P4P. If you see P4P, a young guy too then she just hit the lottery!
LBM
Old Thai Hand
01-15-08, 03:15
but when it comes to fact, the majority of thai women prefer lighter skin.
This is 100% true if you are talking about non-P4P Thai women. While it's common to see regular Thai women with Farang and certainly non-Thai Asian men, only once in a blue moon, will you EVER see a regular Thai woman with a non-Caucasian Westerner. It is EXTREMELY rare.
In P4P, anyone with the right amount can get laid. Even if the girl doesn't like you, she'll shag you for cash. That's her job. So, guys like SirHumpsaLot going on about how easy it is, as a black man to get laid have no validity in the bigger argument.
Simply put, virtually no Thai woman outside of P4P would go near him, no matter if he's devastatingly handsome, looks like Will Smith and is hung like a horse. The negative stigma it would place on her within the culture would be far too great.
Simply put, virtually no Thai woman outside of P4P would go near him, no matter if he's devastatingly handsome, looks like Will Smith and is hung like a horse. The negative stigma it would place on her within the culture would be far too great.
I guess I should go bury my head in the sand...when I was in Thailand I met three regular girls and I exchanged numbers with two. One was an engineer who spoke fluent english and worked in Ohio, the other worked at the Hard Rock Cafe in Pattaya, and the last one was with a group of young middle class/upper middle class thais hanging out.
Only one was very hot..Hard rock cafe girl, we were supposed to meet...but got caught up with easier prey...we've emailed each other, though...Part time free lancer?...perhaps--do I care?. NO..she is HOT..LOL
Out of all three ---the only girl that I felt I had virtually no chance with was Ms upper middle class ...she seemed more interested in finding who/where I came from and why I chose thailand..very good polite convo though...didnt really care much for her, she had a mouthful of braces and looked ok..bleachy white skin, if that mattered.
While I do agree that a high society thai girl or one who is trying to climb the social ladder will have some issues being seen with a non-white farang, but in a country of 64 mil folks..odds are that u will find more than a few who will..I surely did...Perhaps I was lucky and hit the jackpot? LOL...please :)
Conclusion...I was politely shot down by a few hotties..was it racism/classism/Xenophobia? Perhaps/perhaps not.didnt care and I simply moved on, 64 million more!!..my personal assessment is that regular thai girls can be had.
Jaimito Cartero
01-15-08, 04:19
Dickhead in Thailand. That will be a big hoot! I'll be looking forward to his reports, if there are any.
This is 100% true if you are talking about non-P4P Thai women.
In P4P, anyone with the right amount can get laid.
Remember that there are different levels of the p4p scene also. At the higher levels, the preference of skin color will probably play a bigger part in the girls decision process, but that's not to say it doesnt' exist in all levels.
Thais view individuals with white skin, especially other thais, as more beautiful, smarter, and more fortunate than those with dark skin. It is embedded in their culture! This view is spread from the high class all the way down to the street *****.
If you're a monger and just sticking to nana, cowboy, pattaya, phuket, you should have no problems getting laid (doesn't really matter who you are). These areas are bottom of the barrel chicks are low priced and want cash fast. Remember, just b/c these girls value the lighter skin more doesn't mean they get what they want. They are *****s and will take what they can get.
Amjeck,
In general in Thailand in the P4P scene, Money is 1st, the % of youth being a major factor is slim and none! In Thailand how many old guys do you see walking around with younger P4P. If you see P4P, a young guy too then she just hit the lottery!
LBM
youth and looks do play a factor (human nature) just not as much as money does. The old guy may be an expat, thus she sticks with him. Or maybe the old guy was first guy to make a quick deal. Could be a number of things. I've met several girls who will not go with older men. Why? b/c they don't have to. The really good meat will choose all day long who they wish to go with, and sometimes the good meat will choose a dark skinned man.
NicFrenchy
01-15-08, 09:33
I've met several girls who will not go with older men. Why? b/c they don't have to. The really good meat will choose all day long who they wish to go with, and sometimes the good meat will choose a dark skinned man.I have been turned down by a girl in a gogo because of my age (30). Another girl told me that the girl that turned me down prefers older men because the sex is less painful and shorter.
The day she will meet an older guy that will pop a blue pill and fuck her silly all night, she might change her mind LOL
Member #2041
01-15-08, 18:11
The day she will meet an older guy that will pop a blue pill and fuck her silly all night, she might change her mind LOL
Don't half the farangs in LOS fit this description?
SirHumpsaLott
01-15-08, 20:58
Outside of your business dealings and P4P, how much experience have you had with the regular Thai population? - because you seem to be making a lot of blanket statements, but seem to only have dealt with hookers.
Just curious.Well, I AM also going to post about some experiences I've had here this past week with regular girls but I thought this was a site of which the purpose was to write mainly about p4p experiences?
And, OTH, just what exactly have YOU been doing here other than just making blanket statements regarding how you feel Thais view and feel about blacks and other ethnicities of dark skin?
I'm only offering a first hand experience from an american black man's point of view here whohappens to be dealing with thai men and women of various social status. I think it important that people get an objective first hand "man on the street" viewpoint as opposed to your apparent entrenched and negative biased opinions regarding black/thai relations.
That being said; on with it then! : Now because of my schedule and the fact that for the most part, I'm being driven around and escorted by my hosts, I simply don't have as much time to deal with p4p as I would have were I here on a normal vacation and aside from that particular first day, the majority of my first week here has been with those who would be described (by me at least seeing as how most speak perfect english and make great money) as "regular" or upper class Thai people.
They took me to club Hollywood the other night. Nice place, seemed to be a popular joint featuring local talented singers and comedians. It's funny the similarities that cultures sometimes share as I couldn't help but be reminded by this place of the Apollo club in New York (minus the ladyboys who I will have to admit, are great singer/entertainers).
As far as overt racism from the thais, I got a few initial glares and stares from some of the people there but otherwise, they all seemed too concerned with having a good time than worrying about me. Also, I get the same looks back in the U. S. If I go into certain clubs in certain states so did not think it anything different, special, or otherwise particular to just Thais.
My hosts are a mixture of young professional college educated thai men and women in their late 20's early 30's, some older but I really cannot tell. Some have had education from the States. A couple of the women have given me furtive hints that they would be interested but I don't combine work with pleasure and besides, I want to get the "regular" thai's reaction to me, my female factory reps (there's only a few) have all been abroad at some point, mostly in the U. S. So my impression so far regarding them is that hanging out with or possibly fucking a black guy is no big deal to them.
I seemed to catch the eyes of more than a couple of the gals at the club and indeed, a couple of them came over to chat and ended up joining us. One was a young lady of 32, a little curvy, but in all the right places. The other was 35, a little plain but with a nicer figure. They both spoke a little english but with the help of my hosts, the translations ran smoothly. They both were workers in the same office and though had to both be at work at 7 am, out late IMO. But then. So were we.
So normal conversation ensued with business cards even being exchanged between the new girls and my hosts. The thicker of the two girls and I were really hitting it off since we both seemed to share a mutual appreciation of Napa wines and she had just recently returned from a trip to San Francisco which included a trip to Napa Valley. I once lived in San Francisco and having been a member of a wine club, knew exactly to what vinyard she was referring. Long story short, she got my hotel and phone number and an agreement to meet the next night for dinner.
Looking around, I pretty much noticed a lot of other girls there checking me out and not all in an unpleasant way but my hosts decided that they wanted to check out Club Boss, a late night hip hop club over in Patpong so on we went.
Now, I'm not a hip hopper, contrary to popular belief, not all american blacks are, but this club was AWESOME! I wasn't in that joint two minutes when I was immediatley hit upon by a number of gorgeous thai female hip hop yo mtv raps wannabees. Danced, Drank, and got more phone numbers than I could possibly call in the time that I'm here.
And speak of the devil, one of them is at the door now so I will have to continue this later.
Ok, she's cool but I have to close this up now so to summarize this night: No negative racist experiences from thais other than the glares from a few people at Hollywood.
Menh, Big deal.
Like I said; No different from the same looks I got from the same relative number of people back in the states and europe when I went out to clubs with white chicks. I spent pretty much that whole day with "regular" Thai people and have come to understand that many of them don't get to see a lot of black people so am getting used to the stares.
Anyway, I got more time here and this is just the tip of the iceberg of what I've experienced in the week and a half I've been here and will continue tommorrow.
Satrai2000
01-15-08, 22:09
I, being Asian, can tell you bros one thing: fair (light, white) skin is considered more attractive than dark skin in MANY Asian countries, not only in Thailand.
Let's take Bollywood as an example: women who made it to the top all have fair skin; dark skin is a complete no-no. There is no Bollywood-heroine who has dark skin.
This same thing of "discrimination" also happens in for example Indonesia.
But now it comes: although westerners are fair and white, we Asians consider westerners as being ugly. So Asian women who are attracted to a western man are not attracted because of his (fysical) handsomeness and appearance. There are other things that come into play here: social status, economic stability, treatment of women and so on. Not to mention bad experiences she could have had with her "own" men.
One of my sisters for example is happily married to a German guy. She doesn't want anything to do with Asian men (whether they are Indian, Malaysian, Chinese or whatever).
B.t.w.: I can tell you that men with Mediterranean or Middle-East looks are considered the most handsome by many Asian people (in general).
LittleBigMan
01-15-08, 22:37
Amjeck,
I didn't say the youth and looks isn't a factor! In Pattaya, in the P4P scene your going to see lot more of the old guys than the young go looking guys in the end the % is lot lower. Although your going to find P4P girls not willing to go with older guys the % is low low! For a stunner she is somewhat of a commodity so she is going to demand a higher price and be more selective who she goes with! But money is going to still be the main factor! If you are a cheap young good looking guy with no personality and here a 56 year old guys, clean with personality and willing to meet her demands you do the math.
It isn't as simple as $, looks and age! There are so many factors when it comes to P4P. Don't confuse your comments and opinions with a Non-pro, you seem to contradict yourself somewhat we pretty much agree on the same thing it's just being said in a manner that doesn't agree with you.
LBM
M P Lurker
01-16-08, 08:11
I have been turned down by a girl in a gogo because of my age (30). Another girl told me that the girl that turned me down prefers older men because the sex is less painful and shorter.
The day she will meet an older guy that will pop a blue pill and fuck her silly all night, she might change her mind LOL
Many Thai girls say that they prefer older customers. Its probably nothing to do with sexual staying power. The girls say that in general, the younger guys are more arrogant, more disrespectful, self centred, and more hassle.
They may be more stingy as well but I don't that one for a fact.
Of course this dosn't mean you Nic.
Just the way the girls Generalise.
But stands to reason. When I happen to get a pretty hot 20 year old, its like I have got a princess, and she can probably take being admired like a princess. I do my best to please her and service her well. :).
If she liked the service, she might well want me to barfine her every night.
Sometimes its hard to get rid of the girl, to get some variety, if you treat her too well though. Need to find the happy medium.
On the other hand I am continually frustrated by 2 pretty and hot girls who have turned me down many times and are yet to have sex with me ever, because we are long term friends now, even if they don't have alternative gigs. I still enoy seeing them get their gear off despite the frustration. I have always believed that good friends should be able to fuck too.
They must feel that I will lose interest once I have bedded them.
I have been turned down by a girl in a gogo because of my age (30). Another girl told me that the girl that turned me down prefers older men because the sex is less painful and shorter.
The day she will meet an older guy that will pop a blue pill and fuck her silly all night, she might change her mind LOL
I've hear this also. Some would rather go with an older man b/c they aren't as "rough" as younger guys.
You guys have just solved a moral dilema. I am a mere 43 but have been grey since about 13, in various shades, now totally grey. I used to die my hair because people think I'm really old, despite my wrinkle free skin. I am going to Pattaya next week, and I was considering dying my hair to be an even more hansum man, but it seems as if grey=more chance of a top shag, so grey it stays.
Thanks guys
Petemcc
Amjeck,
you seem to contradict yourself somewhat
LBM
Please explain.
LittleBigMan
01-17-08, 01:13
Amjeck,
I think looking back, we both agree that in the P4P, Money is going to be a main if not the top reason. Your post on 1/14 clearly states that " Money still rules "
Your post Yesterday 00:31, " you should have no problem getting laid " and this would suggest to me and I agree that the top reason would be Money!
Your post yesterday 00:44, " good meat will choose a dark skin " and this would sugguest to me and I agree that the top reason would most likely me Money!
Your post " they are ***** and will take what they can get " and this would suggest to me once again and I agree that the top reason would be Money!
This is me but I get the impression when you write that you start with P4P, but border on Non-pro's as you go along. In the P4P, from my experience I see much more older mongers than I see with younger ones, so as I stated I believe that in the P4P scene the looks and age has less of a bearing than Money!
Amjeck, It looks like we agree to disagree on certain aspect of P4P, but we do agree that Money speaks and gets! Feel free to response and get your last comment in but I think we should move on.
LBM
I've hear this also. Some would rather go with an older man b/c they aren't as "rough" as younger guys.
They like old man because "old farang die quick, no power" Blue pill or not Older men dont and cant sustain the constant slamming of a young man on these usually small framed girls in Bkk. This is something told to me by a friend who works Nana everynight FL. Whenever I mention it to WG they allways say "know too much" Older men also have the "mellow" thai ladies prefer for short encounters, Not to mention the Money!
After my last trip in December. I have decided never to allow a thai lady to make me feel like I'm a bad person because she "loves me" and doesnt want me to take another lady. Bullshit! Its the money she did'nt make or the thought she might lose the chance if she does'nt act like it matters to her!
It took me 10 days to realize. Its my vacation! Not the damn WG's
NicFrenchy
01-17-08, 06:55
After my last trip in December. I have decided never to allow a thai lady to make me feel like I'm a bad person because she "loves me" and doesnt want me to take another lady. Bullshit! Its the money she did'nt make or the thought she might lose the chance if she does'nt act like it matters to her!
It took me 10 days to realize. Its my vacation! Not the damn WG's100% on the money! you hit the nail right on the head.
However, as you are dealing with Thais, Tact is always necessary. Turning a lady down is ok, is't all in how you do it.
You can choose to tell her to go fuck herself, brush her off, be rude & nasty, but I would not advise this kind of Attitude as you are dealing with human beings, especially if you plan on returning to that same bar again.
Best is to ignore them completely and they will get the hint.
Amjeck,
but I think we should move on.
LBM
Agree!
I will say this, however. When I was 25 and I was able to get p4p for free. I could walk into a bar in Nana or cowboy and pick a girl and get her in the sack with no cash for the sex act itself. Now this wasn't a regular occurance but it probably happened about 10% of the time. At that age I simply didn't have a lot of money and tried to get the girl anyway i could. I was handsome (according to many TG's) and young. Sometimes we'd agree that I only pay the bar fine or maybe we'd meet after the bar closed or even exchange numbers to meet another day. I never handed them cash for their services.
I believe lots of these girls were trying to become my girlfriend , but i never let that happen. I was young and wanted to bang everything (and conserve my money). I even had one girl pay her own bar fine so she could go out with me to a disco. I'm not trying to brag here but this has been my experience.
Now, I am older and have more money, but I can't get p4p girls for free anymore. Why? I don't know. Could be b/c I'm older.
Old Thai Hand
01-17-08, 09:56
SirHumps
You seem to be going to great pains to prove me wrong.
The point is though, that the experiences you describe are fairly anomolous, with, by your own admission, an educated crowd of Thais with international experience. Enlightened Thais such as you've had the fortune to meet are few and far between.
In 11 years of day in, day out interaction with Thais, I've encountered a very few who would contemplate mixing with anyone other than other Thais, other Asians and perhaps Farang.
There are a few African-American students where I teach. They have all bitterly complained about not being able to get TGs to go out with them. By any standards these guys are good-looking and nice guys. But, the female students won't give them a second look.
There is a real shortage of qualified faculty in my discipline and I've been asked to find foreign lecturers for the international program. I had a highly-qualified African-American with a PhD from a top university in the US apply. But, I was told, politely, but firmly that I couldn't hire him because, "he wouldn't 'fit in' or be accepted because of his color". The people who said this are also highly educated, with extensive international, and especially American experience.
BTW, I just saw a new Thai movie last weekend in which the Thais were talking about "Negroes". I was quite taken aback by the use of this word. But, it just goes to show how Thais think: that such an unacceptable word would be used in this day and age in movie subtitles says a lot about Thai sensibility. It will be interesting to see what happens if this movie is ever distributed internationally.
In the end, there are always going to be exceptions and things are probably becoming more open with the younger generation. But, generally I'm sticking to my belief that the population at large don't like anyone who is dark skinned, particularly foreigners.
But, good luck with the girls who are willing to be more open-minded. More power to you.
Believe it or not, I'd like to see Thais change their attitudes towards every foreigner, regardless of race. They are a decidely ignorant and stupid people sometimes and constantly try my patience. The xenophobic/racist crap that comes out of the mouths of my Thai colleagues, not to mention my students, who are supposed to be the cream of the crop of Thai society beggers belief.
There is a real shortage of qualified faculty in my discipline and I've been asked to find foreign lecturers for the international program. I had a highly-qualified African-American with a PhD from a top university in the US apply. But, I was told, politely, but firmly that I couldn't hire him because, "he wouldn't 'fit in' or be accepted because of his color". The people who said this are also highly educated, with extensive international, and especially American experience.
I used to teach english in bkk and my school would not hire anyone who had dark skin even if their credentials were solid.
Years ago i met an australian english teacher in a nearby province making about 150 baht a day(same as a thai teacher). I recall him telling me that he was an aboriginee mix or something like that and his skin was dark, but not black. I asked him why he worked for such little money and why he didn't work in bkk. He told me that the only place he could find work was at this little school because they needed someone desperately. He also said that because of his skin color , finding work was extremely difficult.
But, generally I'm sticking to my belief that the population at large don't like anyone who is dark skinned, particularly foreigners.
I agree.
I also think the attitude is slowly changing for the better, but at a snails pace.
Agree!
Now, I am older and have more money, but I can't get p4p girls for free anymore. Why? I don't know. Could be b/c I'm older.
That is the good thing about Thailand. No matter how old, fat and ugly you are, you can get at least decent, sometimes outstanding P4P. But the sobering fact is that the older, fatter and uglier you get, the more expensive it will become.
We should rename this fucking thread "OTH Knows Everything" and get it over with. I personally think this thread has outlived its purpose (whatever THAT was). There is racism everywhere in the world.. against someone or another. Thailand is not unique. The other problem of course is that people are jumping to conclusions about Thai people based on interactions with hookers. It may tell you something about Thai society but not enough to make generalizations. As someone said.. no matter who you are or what you look like.. you can still get laid in LOS. Does anything else really matter? Let's move on folks.
Old Thai Hand
01-18-08, 10:49
We should rename this fucking thread "OTH Knows Everything" and get it over with. I personally think this thread has outlived its purpose (whatever THAT was).
A bit harsh. With everybody and his uncle posting declarative statements based on what is largely limited experience with P4P, I think I'm well within my right to post my own extensive information of the general population based on a lot more experience than that of most posters on here.
But, I agree with you on one point. I said a few weeks ago that this thread has no point whatsoever, as it was started by some disgruntled Indian posting some futile argument against the obvious.
Ya. let's dump this thread and move on.
Satrai2000
01-18-08, 23:05
A bit harsh. With everybody and his uncle posting declarative statements based on what is largely limited experience with P4P, I think I'm well within my right to post my own extensive information of the general population based on a lot more experience than that of most posters on here.
But, I agree with you on one point. I said a few weeks ago that this thread has no point whatsoever, as it was started by some disgruntled Indian posting some futile argument against the obvious.
Ya. let's dump this thread and move on.A bit harsh?
Why don't you just mention the name of this "disgruntled Indian"? Calling a member of this board "some disgruntled Indian" sounds a bit disrespectful, don't ye think?
What if another member on this board calls you "some self-conceited farang", would you like that?
You made quite a few posts on this thread and now you say that "this thread has no point whatsoever". Funny!
Terry Terrier
01-19-08, 01:13
Yeah, this thread is starting to head up a blind alley. How about some new threads? Here are my suggestions:
R.O.D. chit chat.
Mick Licker in Thailand (subtitle: Duracell Man).
The Gaming Room (Latest betting: How many more weeks will it take NicFrenchy to go from Kid In A Sweetshop to JB lite).
The Fun Spot: See if you can guess Domino's latest alias.
Prices For Pro's. (would eliminate a lot of the noob posts).
Noobs Please Post Your Stoopid Questions Here. (a splendid hunting ground for the forum's wannabee bullies).
Ya. let's dump this thread and move on.
Yes, let's. . .Doh! I've posted to it again!
Old Thai Hand
01-19-08, 13:35
What if another member on this board calls you "some self-conceited farang", would you like that?
Oh, I've been called a lot worse here, and managed most of the time to laugh it off. :)
BTW, one cannot be "self-conceited". That's somewhat redundant.
Someone else had used the phrase "disgruntled Indian" when discussing the origin of this thread. I merely repeated it. A bit touchy, aren't we?
I have said several times before and at the risk of boring anyone, say it again that this thread is pointless as it states the obvious and nothing can be added that will somehow softsell the state of racism or xenophobia or whatever one wants to call it, that exists here, like it exists in a lot of other places in the world.
So, it really, really, really, really needs to be put to rest as a meaningless thread.
Or, perhaps we could start a "Racism in Thailand is a pointless thread" Thread, and put forth various arguments as to why this thread is pointless and should be put to rest.
Old Thai Hand
01-19-08, 13:42
Yeah, this thread is starting to head up a blind alley. How about some new threads?
How about a...
Let's Put OTH firmly in his place, once and for all - Thread.
It would be quite interesting to see how many different ways people can call me a "self-conceited", know-it-all, arrogant, condescending, P4P-hating, elitist, classist, snob, S.O.B.....
Hey! wait a minute. I just found a few ways, right there. :D
Oh, I've been called a lot worse here, and managed most of the time to laugh it off. :)
BTW, one cannot be "self-conceited". That's somewhat redundant.
Someone else had used the phrase "disgruntled Indian" when discussing the origin of this thread. I merely repeated it. A bit touchy, aren't we?
I have said several times before and at the risk of boring anyone, say it again that this thread is pointless as it states the obvious and nothing can be added that will somehow softsell the state of racism or xenophobia or whatever one wants to call it, that exists here, like it exists in a lot of other places in the world.
So, it really, really, really, really needs to be put to rest as a meaningless thread.
Or, perhaps we could start a "Racism in Thailand is a pointless thread" Thread, and put forth various arguments as to why this thread is pointless and should be put to rest.
It's as pointless as the fight club and only serving the posters to get off some steam.
Satrai2000
01-19-08, 19:22
Oh, I've been called a lot worse here, and managed most of the time to laugh it off. :)
BTW, one cannot be "self-conceited". That's somewhat redundant.
Someone else had used the phrase "disgruntled Indian" when discussing the origin of this thread. I merely repeated it. A bit touchy, aren't we?
I have said several times before and at the risk of boring anyone, say it again that this thread is pointless as it states the obvious and nothing can be added that will somehow softsell the state of racism or xenophobia or whatever one wants to call it, that exists here, like it exists in a lot of other places in the world.
So, it really, really, really, really needs to be put to rest as a meaningless thread.
Or, perhaps we could start a "Racism in Thailand is a pointless thread" Thread, and put forth various arguments as to why this thread is pointless and should be put to rest.Right, so let's now start talking about who has the biggest dick, has fucked the most girls and so on. Much more interesting than this boring subject!
B.t.w.: thanks for teaching me proper English. English is not my native language as you will have understood.
LittleBigMan
01-19-08, 20:13
Fellas,
The reason in the first place for having this thread is because someone recommended that there be such a Thread. So it was created just like so many of the other DEAD THREADS! After a while someone get tired of reading the same topic and they mouth off that someone knows too much and starts to call people names.
If you don't like a particular thread that has been created then what the F--k are you guys clicking and reading for? Just move on!
THE PROBLEM ISN'T THE THREAD! DON'T YOU GUYS UNDERSTAND WE CREATED THESE THREADS NOT JACKSON. YOU WANT! YOU GET! LOOK AT ALL THE DEAD THREADS WE CREATED! WE ARE THE PROBLEM HERE!
LBM
Carpediemyes
01-20-08, 04:50
I spent many years there also.
Thai women are all about money.
If you give good wallet, they like you.
Its not the color of your skin, its the color of your money.
You would have to pay me to go back to Thailand and deal with Thai women. They kind of disgust me now with their aggresive money obsession.If you had no food, you would be all about food.
If you had no job, you would be all about finding work.
If you had the threat of jail over your head, you'ld be all about freedom.
Thai families in Issarn have no money.
That's why Thai girls are all about money.
It is really not that complicated.
That said, do not marry a TG as you will be supporting her whole family one way or another. Much better to rent. JMHO
Thai families in Issarn have no money.
That's why Thai girls are all about money.
That said, do not marry a TG as you will be supporting her whole family one way or another. Much better to rent. JMHO
Old isaan (issarn) proverb:
Hen farahng hen sa-dtahng
Willo
If you had no food, you would be all about food.
If you had no job, you would be all about finding work.
If you had the threat of jail over your head, you'ld be all about freedom.
JMHO
Good use of Maslow’s Hierarchy of Needs theme to make your point but the second bullet is not always true.
Old Thai Hand
01-20-08, 12:49
Old isaan (issarn) proverb:
Hen farahng hen sa-dtahng
Willo
Perhaps then, people should use the abbreviation IG, meaning Isaan Girl, instead of TG because there's a world of difference between Isaan girls and Thai girls.
Old isaan (issarn) proverb:
Hen farahng hen sa-dtahng
Willo
What does 'hen' mean?
I'd like to note that I have an Isaan gf and I've never paid for anything. Of course they're upper-middle class. Rules: 1) poor girls are for P4P, 2) Upper-middle class girls if you must have a gf, and 3) don't marry ANYONE.
M P Lurker
01-20-08, 22:49
What does 'hen' mean?
I'd like to note that I have an Isaan gf and I've never paid for anything. Of course they're upper-middle class. Rules: 1) poor girls are for P4P, 2) Upper-middle class girls if you must have a gf, and 3) don't marry ANYONE.
You can look it up.
In site http://www.thai-language.com/dict/
enter "hen" in the "phonemic" box.
Up comes meaning: "See, visualise"
Meepmeep99
01-20-08, 23:57
You can look it up.
In site http://www.thai-language.com/dict/
enter "hen" in the "phonemic" box.
Up comes meaning: "See, visualise"I think a better translation would be 'to Behold' , enter stage left OTH or as i think of him, obi wan kenobi ,'' use the force luke, use the force ''
SirHumpsaLott
01-22-08, 10:38
A bit harsh. With everybody and his uncle posting declarative statements based on what is largely limited experience with P4P, I think I'm well within my right to post my own extensive information of the general population based on a lot more experience than that of most posters on here.
But, I agree with you on one point. I said a few weeks ago that this thread has no point whatsoever, as it was started by some disgruntled Indian posting some futile argument against the obvious.
Ya. let's dump this thread and move on.How about YOU just move on and let the rest of us decide for ourselves whether or not we find it pointless. Funny, for someone who supposedly thinks this is a dead end topic you sure seem to have a lot to say about it.
Either move on or accept the fact that not everyone is so willing to accept your viewpoints and opinions as the absolute facts regarding Thai people or anyone else for that matter.
SirHumpsaLott
01-22-08, 10:52
I have said several times before and at the risk of boring anyone, say it again that this thread is pointless as it states the obvious and nothing can be added that will somehow softsell the state of racism or xenophobia or whatever one wants to call it, that exists here, like it exists in a lot of other places in the world.
So, it really, really, really, really needs to be put to rest as a meaningless thread.
Or, perhaps we could start a "Racism in Thailand is a pointless thread" Thread, and put forth various arguments as to why this thread is pointless and should be put to rest.Like I said to you before, just because you find this thread meaningless is only of concern to you, not anyone else. Simply do not read the thread if you do not like it. End of story.
The thread was obviously important enough that you and others continue to weigh in with your rather one sided generalizations regarding Thais so you really, really, really need to put your complaints to rest or move on.
And I will tell you again that in the three weeks that I have been here, the racism I have experienced from Thais has been nothing compared to that I sense from the older white guys here and elsewhere. The Thais have no particular penchant for it than anyone else. Some are fine with me, some are not.
The thread is important to those people, non white in particular I think, who are interested or have questions regarding how they will be percieved here and I think it important to come forth with actual experiences as opposed to your own one sided racism tinged generalizations of an entire people and country.
SirHumpsaLott
01-22-08, 15:54
In Thailand"
Because that's most, if not all of the racism that I've encountered while here. Mostly in the form of dirty looks and comments from some of you dirty old white guys. You "Europeans" are the worst of the lot.
Just to let you know; Americans, including those american blacks that you think don't know what you are saying when you speak in your native gibberish about them when you think none are around, mostly understand other languages other than English and you all really need to think about that the next time you think you're "safe" to talk about said black people or any americans when you think some are around.
For those non white members that should know; The bars along beach road are all populated by old white Europeans who simply cannot STAND when a black person decides to drink at the bars they have obviously been frequenting for so long.
It's an affront to their supposed superiority that the bargirl that they thought worshipped them above all else would deign to drop to what I suspect they think, surprisingly enough, in this day and age, the lower "level" of a black person.
With the racism that those here are so readily ascribing to Thais, If one didn't know any better, one would think that they were breeding the Thais to be the next footsoldiers in the fifth reight or whatever nazi regime these racists here hope they are achieving.
I will return with my actual reports as a black person here at a later date but for now, OTH and others, we are hip to your game and as of now. It's over.
In Thailand"
Because that's most, if not all of the racism that I've encountered while here. Mostly in the form of dirty looks and comments from some of you dirty old white guys. You "Europeans" are the worst of the lot.
Just to let you know; Americans, including those american blacks that you think don't know what you are saying when you speak in your native gibberish about them when you think none are around, mostly understand other languages other than English and you all really need to think about that the next time you think you're "safe" to talk about said black people or any americans when you think some are around.
For those non white members that should know; The bars along beach road are all populated by old white Europeans who simply cannot STAND when a black person decides to drink at the bars they have obviously been frequenting for so long.
It's an affront to their supposed superiority that the bargirl that they thought worshipped them above all else would deign to drop to what I suspect they think, surprisingly enough, in this day and age, the lower "level" of a black person.
With the racism that those here are so readily ascribing to Thais, If one didn't know any better, one would think that they were breeding the Thais to be the next footsoldiers in the fifth reight or whatever nazi regime these racists here hope they are achieving.
I will return with my actual reports as a black person here at a later date but for now, OTH and others, we are hip to your game and as of now. It's over.Hey mate, you got to be exact when you mentioned "Europeans". As much as I know there are serveral countries in Europe and by saying Europeans thats abit too much.
It's an affront to their supposed superiority that the bargirl that they thought worshipped them above all else would deign to drop to what I suspect they think, surprisingly enough, in this day and age, the lower "level" of a black person.
What are you thinking? Like a black man is dirtier than all the thai guys who've banged them without a condom before others? I'd rather have an educated black american bang a thai girl with protection before me than a uneducated thai guy using no protection. You go around thinking everybody on the forum is racist and that the thai people are not racist toward you. You are delusional and absolutely crazy. People on this forum are speaking the truth. Thais don't like dark skin and they prefer white skin. Get over it! Truth may hurt you, but you've got to face it and deal with it, not blame all on the board for "hiding their racial bias". What a bunch of crap!
OTH and others, we are hip to your game and as of now. It's over.
What game is that? Please explain.
In Thailand"
Because that's most, if not all of the racism that I've encountered while here. Mostly in the form of dirty looks and comments from some of you dirty old white guys. You "Europeans" are the worst of the lot.
Just to let you know; Americans, including those american blacks that you think don't know what you are saying when you speak in your native gibberish about them when you think none are around, mostly understand other languages other than English and you all really need to think about that the next time you think you're "safe" to talk about said black people or any americans when you think some are around.
For those non white members that should know; The bars along beach road are all populated by old white Europeans who simply cannot STAND when a black person decides to drink at the bars they have obviously been frequenting for so long.
It's an affront to their supposed superiority that the bargirl that they thought worshipped them above all else would deign to drop to what I suspect they think, surprisingly enough, in this day and age, the lower "level" of a black person.
With the racism that those here are so readily ascribing to Thais, If one didn't know any better, one would think that they were breeding the Thais to be the next footsoldiers in the fifth reight or whatever nazi regime these racists here hope they are achieving.
I will return with my actual reports as a black person here at a later date but for now, OTH and others, we are hip to your game and as of now. It's over. You are obviously a very well balanced person.You have a chip on each shoulder .
Old Thai Hand
01-23-08, 01:29
SirHumps
You seem to have a lot of self-worth issues and are going out of your way to attack others, who have done nothing to you. If you are implying, for example that I am an old white European, you are wrong (I'm Canadian). But, in any event, as Amjeck says, Europe's a big place full of lots of nationalities who all have different, but quite liberal views overall. You are the one guilty of making sweeping generalizations here.
But, perhaps you are right about one thing. Maybe we should all leave this board to you poor disgruntled "non-white" guys to pat each other on the back in reassurance that the Thais actually like you.
reassurance that the Thais actually like you.
You obviously mastered it!! Perhaps you can give lessons to "disgruntled Indians"? LOL
In Thailand"
Just to let you know; Americans, including those american blacks that you think don't know what you are saying when you speak in your native gibberish about them when you think none are around, mostly understand other languages other than English .Now I know your just joking in that whole post Who on earth could ever believe that statement. The whole worlds speak American does it not? LOL
Just as Chinese comes from China, Polish from Poland, French from France, German from Germany, and English from England. OH, sorry, its English from Amercia isn't it.
Sorry chaps, could not resist that one.
SirHumps
You seem to have a lot of self-worth issues and are going out of your way to attack others, who have done nothing to you. If you are implying, for example that I am an old white European, you are wrong (I'm Canadian). But, in any event, as Amjeck says, Europe's a big place full of lots of nationalities who all have different, but quite liberal views overall. You are the one guilty of making sweeping generalizations here.
But, perhaps you are right about one thing. Maybe we should all leave this board to you poor disgruntled "non-white" guys to pat each other on the back in reassurance that the Thais actually like you.I second that, I'm from Aus.
Old Thai Hand
01-23-08, 06:50
You obviously mastered it!! Perhaps you can give lessons to "disgruntled Indians"? LOL
If you mean, that I "mastered" the illusion that Thais like me, you're wrong. The truth is one should only discuss the degrees of dislike. Thais dislike white Farang the least, but still don't like us. They merely tolerate us because they need us for a variety of reasons.
NicFrenchy
01-23-08, 07:41
They merely tolerate us because they need us for a variety of reasons.At the top of these reasons are probably our ability to drop Shitloads of cash in P4P & Entertainment venues.
You seem to have a lot of self-worth issues and are going out of your way to attack others, who have done nothing to you.
Seems like Sir Mix Alot is just another lost soul roaming thailand in search of himself. Must be painful. I feel for you man.
In Thailand"
Because that's most, if not all of the racism that I've encountered while here. Mostly in the form of dirty looks and comments from some of you dirty old white guys. You "Europeans" are the worst of the lot.
Just to let you know; Americans, including those american blacks that you think don't know what you are saying when you speak in your native gibberish about them when you think none are around, mostly understand other languages other than English and you all really need to think about that the next time you think you're "safe" to talk about said black people or any americans when you think some are around.
For those non white members that should know; The bars along beach road are all populated by old white Europeans who simply cannot STAND when a black person decides to drink at the bars they have obviously been frequenting for so long.
It's an affront to their supposed superiority that the bargirl that they thought worshipped them above all else would deign to drop to what I suspect they think, surprisingly enough, in this day and age, the lower "level" of a black person.
With the racism that those here are so readily ascribing to Thais, If one didn't know any better, one would think that they were breeding the Thais to be the next footsoldiers in the fifth reight or whatever nazi regime these racists here hope they are achieving.
I will return with my actual reports as a black person here at a later date but for now, OTH and others, we are hip to your game and as of now. It's over.
I've always felt quite welcome in the Land of Smiles and didn't notice any racism per se, save one time when one club refused me entrance in Nana when I was 22. I was dressed kinda bummy and didn't understand what happened, but the club next to it opened me with open arms.
I've normally found Asians to view all Americans as Americans first and one's ethnicity takes a back seat to one's nationality. I must profess that I have never immersed myself into an Asian land; I have always just been a short-term tourist. Maybe shit changes if I lived there fulltime.
The W. Europeans I have met in SEA have all been very cool and I never felt unwelcomed in a bar where they hang out. Quite the contrary actually, I sometimes feel that they are extra nice to me and show me the ropes. I have always gotten along well with Germans, Scandanavians, and Australians.
I will be in the LOS this Thursday. If I notice anything I will let you know.
I kind of agree Dirk - but I've noticed that the ones who get "the look" are AFRICAN (generally, very dark skin coloration) - usually if someone of color opens his mouth and there's an AMERICAN accent, the entire situation changes. (I'm not black, BTW, and my mantra about women is "in the dark all cats are black")
One interesting thing is that a lot of racial prejudice seems to come from the "soccer louts" crowd (Brits with tattoos and for some reason tattooed Russians as well - I wonder if the tattoo marks of "prejudice"?) For some reason, it seems to seep over into the Thai as well depending on the group.
Old Thai Hand
02-16-08, 08:48
For some reason, it seems to seep over into the Thai as well depending on the group.
Oh, now I get it! So, that's why my Thai colleagues and my boss are anti-Farang - because they've been hanging out with tattoed football hooligans and Russian mafia. That explains everything. Thanks.
it was a comment about race. Not about Thai disliking farang "in general".
I've heard more negative comments from white europeans (with either Brit or east european accents) about blacks than from THAI, but I don't hang out with the hi-so like you do.
Old Thai Hand
02-16-08, 15:03
it was a comment about race. Not about Thai disliking farang "in general"..
I know it was. I was just joking.
I've heard more negative comments from white europeans (with either Brit or east european accents) about blacks than from THAI, but I don't hang out with the hi-so like you do.
Well, if you're in holiday locales, especially in Patts where there are certainly more than enough low-life Brits and Euro-trash, I'm sure that you'll 'here' (sp-see above) 'hear' more than your fair share of racist remarks from them against everyone, including against Thais.
Re: HiSo Xenophobia and racism. HiSo Thais, particularly the old-money lot are truly anti-everyone - certainly outsiders, but even other Thais, not of equal status.
I'm sure that you'll here more than your fair share of racist remarks from them against everyone, including against Thais.
Professor OTH, replace the word here with hear before TT shows up to correct you again. :D
Old Thai Hand
02-17-08, 00:05
Professor OTH, replace the word here with hear before TT shows up to correct you again. :D
OMG..."hear". It was late and I was tired. thanks for the English lesson, Mr. Mann.
OMG..."hear". It was late and I was tired. thanks for the English lesson, Mr. Mann.
You're welcome Professor! You're welcome Professor! Continuing with the English lesson, remember to start your sentences with a capital letter.:D
Oh, now I get it! So, that's why my Thai colleagues and my boss are anti-Farang - because they've been hanging out with tattoed football hooligans and Russian mafia. That explains everything. Thanks.After all these years it's good to see you finally cuming to this realization!
But it's much simpler. Like most of the world, they are assholes.
Power corrupts. If you were in their position, would you be any better.
Would replacing Samak or Bush with OTH would be an improvement.
Terry Terrier
02-17-08, 19:18
Professor OTH, replace the word here with hear before TT shows up to correct you again. :D
Run, that wind-up was becoming so old it was starting to auto-translate into Latin :D.
Old Thai Hand
02-18-08, 01:06
After all these years it's good to see you finally cuming to this realization!
But it's much simpler. Like most of the world, they are assholes.
Power corrupts. If you were in their position, would you be any better.
Would replacing Samak or Bush with OTH would be an improvement.
Another failed attempt at wit and cleverness. Give it up man, before you hurt yourself.
Old Thai Hand
02-18-08, 01:07
Run, that wind-up was becoming so old it was starting to auto-translate into Latin :D.
here, hear! :D
Perhaps then, people should use the abbreviation IG, meaning Isaan Girl, instead of TG because there's a world of difference between Isaan girls and Thai girls.OK -- I'll bite. What's the world of difference?
Old Thai Hand
02-19-08, 03:41
OK -- I'll bite. What's the world of difference?
Language
Culture
Education
Appearance
Personality
Behaviour
Manners
OK -- I'll bite. What's the world of difference?Its the same with farangs in Thailand.
We should use say FT (for failed teacher, like OTH, who can work nowhere else now and belongs to the failed farang as a teacher in Thailand club).
We could use RE (for retired expat).
We could use WE (for working expat).
We could use DT (for dumb tourist)
We could use EM (for experienced monger)
Its rather funny really, as in fact most mongers are perhaps not even meeting Isaan girls. Being an experienced person myself, unlike OTH, I can speak Thai, and I can also speak some Chiang Mai dialect (North Thai) and some Isaan (North Eastern).
What you tend to find a lot in Bangkok and Pattaya is you have girls from the central and southern regions who say they are Isaan girls (like we mongers give out false details about ourselves to girls to avoid them getting to know too much about ourselves). They do this to deflect away from where they really are from. I know they telling porky pies as they are unable to communicate in Isaan dialect - and so therefore, are not from Isaan.
This is not of course trying to deny there are many Isaan girls in P4P, there are many, as Isaan has been neglected for a very long time with no money invested in it. Kind of like a blaming a skinny child for being thin, when you have given them no food to eat for a month. However, as mongers will note, the amount of "pretty girls" in Bangkok is diminishing since TRT came to power, and will continue to do so, as Isaan is getting some money thrown at it, and people are becoming more self sufficient, and less sufficient on sending their children to Bangkok to earn money.
Back to OTH and IG and TG, its rather like an "Essex Girl" in the UK, its all about sterotypes, and OTH is a racist pig, and therefore feels it fine to "tar all with the same brush".
I would love OTH to be before His Majesty the King and say to him that someone from Isaan is not Thai. In fact, I would love OTH to say it to the face of someone from Isaan that they are not Thai.
Isaan people have genuine love for His Majesty, and are very very proud of being Thai. Do not forget, the majority of Thai's are in fact in Isaan.
OTH is a self confirmed "Isaan" basher, and it appears has been "done over" by a couple of Isaan girls in the past, hence his hate of all things Isaan.
Old Thai Hand
02-19-08, 13:00
I have attempted to make a truce with you. Obviously you have gone off the deep end.
So, I'll respond to some of you silly assumptions about me.
We should use say FT (for failed teacher, like OTH, who can work nowhere else now and belongs to the failed farang as a teacher in Thailand club).
Where do you get this nonsense from? Do you even know where I work?
Being an experienced person myself, unlike OTH, I can speak Thai, and I can also speak some Chiang Mai dialect (North Thai) and some Isaan (North Eastern).
Again, where did you get the idea that I can't speak Thai? If you in fact have read my posts going back any appreciable time, you'd know that not only do I speak Thai, but Isaan-Lao and some Passa Nua.
OTH is a self confirmed "Isaan" basher, and it appears has been "done over" by a couple of Isaan girls in the past, hence his hate of all things Isaan.
I've never been "done over" by any girl in this country. If you had paid attention, you'd know that I currently have a wonderful GF from Isaan and had a previous long-term and excellent relationship with a girl from Roi-et. My "Isaan bashing" as you call it was largely to get a rise out of you and nothing more.
My deliniation between Isaan girls and Thai girls was not to say one was better than the other, but that they are simply different, IMO. But, I will now say that Isaan girls are more traditional, conservative, and truer to their culture, which is different from Thai culture just as (Lanna and Southern culture is different from Thai culture) and they are also often nicer and more polite than ethnically Thai girls from the central regions.
Anyway, continue to bash me if it turns your crank. However, I do wonder why you put such an effort into your vitriole.
Old Thai Hand
02-20-08, 03:34
OK -- I'll bite. What's the world of difference?
Further to your question...
If one looks ethnographically at Thailand, you quickly become aware of large differences among the many groups that make up the population.
The homogenous and very false notion of "Thainess" which is drilled, quite successfully into the people from an early age is merely a device used by the power elite to maintain control through a false sense of national identity. This has only really been in place since King Rama VII was deposed in the 30s. Prior to that, especially before Rama V, Thailand was a loose confederation of culturally different regions and principalities nominally controlled from Bangkok by the Chakri dynasty. In fact the north was not even part of Thailand until 1913 and only became so, at least in name after Rama V sent death squads in a failed attempt to wipe out the Lanna dynasty in Chiang Mai. Fortunately they managed to escape to Luang Prabang in Laos where their decendents still live in exile.
The truth is that Thailand is made up of many cultures, albeit closely linked but still in many cases quite distinct and not always very favorable towards each other. The central plains Thais, who are the only true ethnic Thais control along with the Thai-Chinese (who aren't really Thai at all) much of the country's cultural identity through the mass media, even if they don't in reality truly represent it. Therefore, the representations of Thai culture one sees on TV, which is largely propagandized, become the de facto "truth" about Thai culture, while actually only representing a small portion of what constitutes the many cultures of the country.
Further to your question...
If one looks ethnographically at Thailand, you quickly become aware of large differences among the many groups that make up the population.
The homogenous and very false notion of "Thainess" which is drilled, quite successfully into the people from an early age is merely a device used by the power elite to maintain control through a false sense of national identity. This has only really been in place since King Rama VII was deposed in the 30s. Prior to that, especially before Rama V, Thailand was a loose confederation of culturally different regions and principalities nominally controlled from Bangkok by the Chakri dynasty. In fact the north was not even part of Thailand until 1913 and only became so, at least in name after Rama V sent death squads in a failed attempt to wipe out the Lanna dynasty in Chiang Mai. Fortunately they managed to escape to Luang Prabang in Laos where their decendents still live in exile.
The truth is that Thailand is made up of many cultures, albeit closely linked but still in many cases quite distinct and not always very favorable towards each other. The central plains Thais, who are the only true ethnic Thais control along with the Thai-Chinese (who aren't really Thai at all) much of the country's cultural identity through the mass media, even if they don't in reality truly represent it. Therefore, the representations of Thai culture one sees on TV, which is largely propagandized, become the de facto "truth" about Thai culture, while actually only representing a small portion of what constitutes the many cultures of the country.I look at a girl ethnographically, then I fuck her. :D
OTH - are you writing a PhD, or are you writing on ISG? ;)
Old Thai Hand
02-20-08, 04:26
I look at a girl ethnographically, then I fuck her. :D
OTH - are you writing a PhD, or are you writing on ISG? ;)
According to Easy, I don't know anything about Thailand. So, how could I possibly write a PhD?
Are you sure that you don't in fact look at an ethnic girl, 'graphically', and then fuck her? :D Or, am I just splitting hairs?
NicFrenchy
02-20-08, 04:38
Are you sure that you don't in fact look at an ethnic girl, 'graphically', and then fuck her? :D Or, am I just splitting hairs?Nice one OTH!
SE Asia Joe
02-20-08, 05:36
Language
Culture
Education
Appearance
Personality
Behaviour
Manners
MOST IMPORTANT HERE on ISG - howzabout:
Price
Service Quality
Boy, you guys in the Thailand thread DO go off on the deep end of discussions dontcha?
Peace, Peace, Peace NOT bashing nobody. All is peaceful!!
SE Asia Joe
Old Thai Hand
02-20-08, 09:39
MOST IMPORTANT HERE on ISG - howzabout:
Price
Service Quality
Boy, you guys in the Thailand thread DO go off on the deep end of discussions dontcha?
Peace, Peace, Peace NOT bashing nobody. All is peaceful!!
SE Asia Joe
Perhaps because we have brains and are interested in other things about the country besides "Price, Service Quality", which really only applies to a rather limited and specific segment of the total female population (i.e. P4P) and doesn't belong on this thread.
I suggest you post elsewhere, in the less cerebral parts of the board.
...
I suggest you post elsewhere, in the less cerebral parts of the board.Old Thai Hand,
LOL, in "Giotto's Lodge in Bangkok" :) ?
Giotto
SE Asia Joe
02-20-08, 10:09
Perhaps because we have brains and are interested in other things about the country besides "Price, Service Quality", which really only applies to a rather limited and specific segment of the total female population (i.e. P4P) and doesn't belong on this thread.
I suggest you post elsewhere, in the less cerebral parts of the board.
Oooooooh.... touchy ain't we??
But STILL - PEACE, PEACE, PAIX!
and PS. I still maintain you got/post the best looking gals on ISG! Yeah!!
Old Thai Hand,
LOL, in "Giotto's Lodge in Bangkok" :) ?
Giotto
You gotta be kidding - right Giotto - after your recent travails?
Hahahahahaha!!!
SE Asia Joe
...
You gotta be kidding - right Giotto - after your recent travails?
Hahahahahaha!!!
SE Asia JoeSE Asia Joe,
After that nonsense I need to have a bit fun :) .
Giotto
Old Thai Hand
02-20-08, 13:13
Oooooooh.... touchy ain't we??
But STILL - PEACE, PEACE, PAIX!
and PS. I still maintain you got/post the best looking gals on ISG! Yeah!!
Not touchy, reallu. Thanks for the compliment. Although I haven't posted any pics for awhile because the last time I posted a sizeable amount, I was under attack for posting, "faceless, headless torsos". So, I decided never to post many photos again.
Old Thai Hand
02-20-08, 13:14
Old Thai Hand,
LOL, in "Giotto's Lodge in Bangkok" :) ?
Giotto
You said it, not me. :D
This is my one and only contribution to this thread.
I'm German by birth and upbringing. 15 or so years ago, I went to Thailand. I was embarrassed and disgusted to see how my fellow Fatherlanders (mis-)behaved in this beautiful country, and how they trashed it to a large degree. I vowed to never come back.
Vows last only so long. I live in China now. Heck it's cold in China. Thailand is a 4 hour flight. So we went to Thailand for a week. Now it's Russians everywhere. Buzz-cut. Tatoos all over their bodies. Polite and graceful as wild boars. Ne culturny. I vowed to never come back.
Too bad. Such a nice place, such nice people.
I was embarrassed a...... and how they trashed it to a large degree.
Thais trashed their own country. They "sold out". Nobody is to blame except the thais themselves!
Cyberspace
02-20-08, 22:43
... I haven't posted any pics for awhile because the last time I posted a sizeable amount, I was under attack for posting, "faceless, headless torsos". So, I decided never to post many photos again.
That's VERY funny OTH. You make it sound as if you'd been an innocent bystander sharing pictures of your erotic adventures when out of nowhere someone had the tenacity to hurl unkind criticism at you. Fact is OTH: you and your buddies had already been on a long binge of negative attacks on posters that had the audacity to post full frontal nudes in the Thailand Photo Gallery when the so-called "attacks" occurred.
The few "faceless, headless torsos" you shared were not all that impressive, but even now I see plaintive requests for more "unmasked" nudes for the Photo Gallery. Face it Old Tied Hands, you may have good reason not to want your identity uncovered in Thailand, and that would be a good reason why you cannot post better nudes, but that's not a good reason to discourage others who can offer more.
BTW OTH - since this is a thread discussion of racism, do you still discriminate Thailand's darker skinned beauties? Just asking
Old Thai Hand
02-21-08, 01:48
That's VERY funny OTH. You make it sound as if you'd been an innocent bystander sharing pictures of your erotic adventures when out of nowhere someone had the tenacity to hurl unkind criticism at you. Fact is OTH: you and your buddies had already been on a long binge of negative attacks on posters that had the audacity to post full frontal nudes in the Thailand Photo Gallery when the so-called "attacks" occurred.
The few "faceless, headless torsos" you shared were not all that impressive, but even now I see plaintive requests for more "unmasked" nudes for the Photo Gallery. Face it Old Tied Hands, you may have good reason not to want your identity uncovered in Thailand, and that would be a good reason why you cannot post better nudes, but that's not a good reason to discourage others who can offer more.
BTW OTH - since this is a thread discussion of racism, do you still discriminate Thailand's darker skinned beauties? Just asking
It's been a very long time. I see your meandering, confusing and convoluted posting style hasn't changed. Welcome back. Are you now going to start again with posting your endless stream of single (and butt ugly) pics one after the other?. Next thing you know, Baby Dragon will resurface.
Naked Gunz
02-21-08, 04:40
I joined and like this site because of one reason. I like to bang women. After a couple of years I am constantly amazed at how often race creeps up in these posts! Now here is an entire thread devoted to Thai racism? Sorry but I don't get it.
Tell me cost, price, when and where..and a name if you have it. I don't have time to give energy to negative $hit, esp in Thailand of all places. Too many women and too much fun to be had.
As an Afro-Am man, I've experianced no rejection in these countries cuz my money is in place and in big denominations! The only "racism" I get is from some white punters that arent used to being near articulate, non-poor Blacks. But those barriers are broken down with a beer usually. If someone is talking $hit about me in their language, so what! I dont understand or care.
When I walk down the Soi alone it's no big deal. When I did with two other Black guys it was a very big deal. I felt like a rock star. I never heard women scream like that for me! That Thai racism I love...OK enuff. YOU made the thread, so as a bro, I've contributed. OUT
In that case, bro, get your black ass over to Japan. JP girls go gaga over blacks, especially of the 'merican hip-hop kind. Tons of freebies, ready for the pickin'. Japanese guys usually are VERY opinionated regarding a race other than theirs - without any compunction whatsoever. JP girls think different. They find their own men boring, cold as stones, and ill equipped.
I joined and like this site because of one reason. I like to bang women. After a couple of years I am constantly amazed at how often race creeps up in these posts! Now here is an entire thread devoted to Thai racism? Sorry but I don't get it.
Tell me cost, price, when and where..and a name if you have it. I don't have time to give energy to negative $hit, esp in Thailand of all places. Too many women and too much fun to be had.
As an Afro-Am man, I've experianced no rejection in these countries cuz my money is in place and in big denominations! The only "racism" I get is from some white punters that arent used to being near articulate, non-poor Blacks. But those barriers are broken down with a beer usually. If someone is talking $hit about me in their language, so what! I dont understand or care.
When I walk down the Soi alone it's no big deal. When I did with two other Black guys it was a very big deal. I felt like a rock star. I never heard women scream like that for me! That Thai racism I love...OK enuff. YOU made the thread, so as a bro, I've contributed. OUT
Naked Gunz
02-22-08, 01:17
In that case, bro, get your black ass over to Japan. JP girls go gaga over blacks, especially of the 'merican hip-hop kind. Tons of freebies, ready for the pickin'. Japanese guys usually are VERY opinionated regarding a race other than theirs - without any compunction whatsoever. JP girls think different. They find their own men boring, cold as stones, and ill equipped.
Yeah I know, but I'm never there long enough to get anything off the ground, and I'm always freakin working. I'm struggling with Spanish to make Latin America work for me. Adios..
Back in august picked up a bar girl from Nana Plaza who was also a college student at one of Bangkok universities. The next morning she didn’t want to leave even though her mouth and arrogance was real turn off. She asked about going to the movies and mall. Since I had never done these mundane activities in Bangkok I said what the hell. Grabbed about 200 dollars from my hotel room safe and proceeded out the door. I am a hip hopper baggy clothes and chains and diamonds is my style but this time I went Tiger Woods style Lacoste from head to toe. This was an experiment for me to see how the Thais would react seeing this well dressed black guy walking around with this college student because I will tell you she didn’t look like hooker. Every time she even fooled hotel security at the four star I usually stay and they grab every girl that hits the elevator.
After a short ride on the infamous sky train we made it. A mall known as paragon or something like that.... Anyway right away I noticed the stares and even she said wow I never been stared at so much in Bangkok in my life. I am not 500 pounds or tall as hell. Just an in shape in average height black guy so the only thing merited the stare was my skin tone. It was all good though I got what I wanted out the deal and little miss college student got an outfit that she couldn’t wait to put on. The next day had a threesome with her and a friend got to love Thailand. Announcement to all black guys. Just because a few bar girls show you some love don’t mean it is heart felt by the mainstream of Thai society. I had one Thai friend from high society and she vanished or should I stay purposely lost contact with me. I hate to associate the WGs with Thai society just as I hate people to associate MTV with the average Black American man.
Take It Sleazy
Vinny_Viagra
03-26-08, 15:19
Back in august picked up a bar girl from Nana Plaza who was also a college student at one of Bangkok universities. The next morning she didn’t want to leave even though her mouth and arrogance was real turn off. She asked about going to the movies and mall. Since I had never done these mundane activities in Bangkok I said what the hell. Grabbed about 200 dollars from my hotel room safe and proceeded out the door. I am a hip hopper baggy clothes and chains and diamonds is my style but this time I went Tiger Woods style Lacoste from head to toe. This was an experiment for me to see how the Thais would react seeing this well dressed black guy walking around with this college student because I will tell you she didn’t look like hooker. Every time she even fooled hotel security at the four star I usually stay and they grab every girl that hits the elevator.
After a short ride on the infamous sky train we made it. A mall known as paragon or something like that.... Anyway right away I noticed the stares and even she said wow I never been stared at so much in Bangkok in my life. I am not 500 pounds or tall as hell. Just an in shape in average height black guy so the only thing merited the stare was my skin tone. It was all good though I got what I wanted out the deal and little miss college student got an outfit that she couldn’t wait to put on. The next day had a threesome with her and a friend got to love Thailand. Announcement to all black guys. Just because a few bar girls show you some love don’t mean it is heart felt by the mainstream of Thai society. I had one Thai friend from high society and she vanished or should I stay purposely lost contact with me. I hate to associate the WGs with Thai society just as I hate people to associate MTV with the average Black American man.
Take It Sleazy
I think you got all the looks cause they thought you were Tiger Woods.
Old Thai Hand
03-26-08, 16:50
After a short ride on the infamous sky train we made it.
Infamous??? What heinous deeds were committed there? Was it the sight of mass murders a la "The Death Railway"? :)
Just an in shape in average height black guy so the only thing merited the stare was my skin tone.
Exactly. There aren't that many black people in Thailand and the vast majority of those that are here are mainly Nigerian drug dealers. Even I stare when I see a black person because it's generally quite unusual. There was a black woman shopping at Carrefour on Rama 4, last weekend and she was stared at a lot because she was the only black person in the whole mall. She simply stood out like a sore thumb.
Oh, and BTW, I get stared at constantly and I'm white.
Thais are so insular that they stare at anyone who's the least bit different.
M P Lurker
03-26-08, 18:41
<cut>
There was a black woman shopping at Carrefour on Rama 4, last weekend and she was stared at a lot because she was the only black person in the whole mall. She simply stood out like a sore thumb.<cut>
Who cares if she was the only black woman in the Mall. If she was sizzling hot like the one I saw on the plane the other day, then I would stare at her. If she was ordinary looking or ugly, then she would not hold my attention for very long.
But i know what you mean. Once in a Thai village everyone stared at me, particularly children. Apparently no Farang had ever been seen there and some children had never seen a Farang other than on TV.
Satrai2000
03-26-08, 22:23
Thais are so insular that they stare at anyone who's the least bit different...Thais stare?
In my home-country you'll find the absolute stare-champions.
Old Thai Hand
03-27-08, 01:06
Thais stare?
In my home-country you'll find the absolute stare-champions.
If you mean, India, I would certainly agree with you there. I sat on a train for 33 hours straight once, and had about 200 pairs of eyes trained on me and the two girls I was with the whole time - incredibly uncomfortable, to say the least.
Old Thai Hand
03-27-08, 01:12
But i know what you mean. Once in a Thai village everyone stared at me, particularly children. Apparently no Farang had ever been seen there and some children had never seen a Farang other than on TV.
Even if they've seen a Farang a million times, they stare. As I reported, once I lived in a very Thai neighbourhood in BKK for 2 1/2 years and was stared at from the first day until the day I finally moved out. I get stared at every day at work. I've never totally figured out the ongoing fascination - perhaps it's my stunning, saphire blue eyes ...:D
Old Thai Hand
03-27-08, 01:14
I find this thread funny. Why? when I was in LOS a few years back I caught some stares. I just got back from Vn, and it was worse than LOS.
I'm caucasian, 6'1 about 225 and the dudes looked me up and down. mumbled some bs .Especially when holding my GF's hand in the market, shes 5' 3 100. I was the only American there too. The ladies smiled at me but the guys were looking for snares, and tripwires to halt my escapades with a doll from their country lol, Fuck em all.
Well, Asian men definitely don't like seeing Farang with Asian women. But, because Asians generally think that Farang only like dark, ugly girls, they may actually have been wondering why you have such bad taste. ;)
But, then again, if this happened in VN, it was most likely general hostility against any foreign dude with an Asian girl, regardless of her looks. I took my Thai ex-GF to Hanoi once and I got grief and she particularly had all kinds of hassles because she could easily pass for North Vietnamese. Some VN dude grabbed her once and she hit him and told him to "fuck off". He understood and just froze in his tracks, stunned. I guess no Asian girl had ever spoken to him like that before.
I am not Indian, but I'll share a story. When recently in Pattaya, I was at a beer bar talking to a few of the women there. Next thing I notice 4-5 Indian guys walk past the women and give them the once over. The interesting thing was that I was sitting right behind the 3 WG's, and when the Indians walked past them, one WG looked up in the air, the next one looked down at the ground, and the 3rd looked over her left shoulder away from the men. They basically gave them nothing.
10 mins later, another group of Indian guys walk past. I'm still sitting behind the 3 women, and the same thing happened again. I mentioned this to the girl I was with and she told the 3 women I was sitting behind. They all laughed. The girl I was with ended up telling me no one at the bar liked Indians, as they are cheap, nasty to the girls, and their personal hygiene is sub par. Nor did they like Indians in general. Which reminds me of a female Thai friend I had years ago, who told me she couldn't stand Indians.
There maybe something there against the ol' Indians.
Well, Asian men definitely don't like seeing Farang with Asian women. But, because Asians generally think that Farang only like dark, ugly girls, they may actually have been wondering why you have such bad taste. ;)...
Well, I for one love seeing "Farang with Asian women" (I'm Asian but not Thai nor East Indian), if anything out of sheer bewilderment from the latter point OTH made... :D
But seriously, a browse through the photo section proves this point. No offence guys, just my 2-baht opinion. I could say the same about local men in my country and their tastes in women (myself included)!
Old Thai Hand
03-27-08, 16:19
I am not Indian, but I'll share a story. When recently in Pattaya, I was at a beer bar talking to a few of the women there. Next thing I notice 4-5 Indian guys walk past the women and give them the once over. The interesting thing was that I was sitting right behind the 3 WG's, and when the Indians walked past them, one WG looked up in the air, the next one looked down at the ground, and the 3rd looked over her left shoulder away from the men. They basically gave them nothing.
10 mins later, another group of Indian guys walk past. I'm still sitting behind the 3 women, and the same thing happened again. I mentioned this to the girl I was with and she told the 3 women I was sitting behind. They all laughed. The girl I was with ended up telling me no one at the bar liked Indians, as they are cheap, nasty to the girls, and their personal hygiene is sub par. Nor did they like Indians in general. Which reminds me of a female Thai friend I had years ago, who told me she couldn't stand Indians.
There maybe something there against the ol' Indians.
This is old news, Dan and has been talked to death on here.
Satrai2000
03-27-08, 22:12
I am not Indian, but I'll share a story. When recently in Pattaya, I was at a beer bar talking to a few of the women there. Next thing I notice 4-5 Indian guys walk past the women and give them the once over. The interesting thing was that I was sitting right behind the 3 WG's, and when the Indians walked past them, one WG looked up in the air, the next one looked down at the ground, and the 3rd looked over her left shoulder away from the men. They basically gave them nothing.
10 mins later, another group of Indian guys walk past. I'm still sitting behind the 3 women, and the same thing happened again. I mentioned this to the girl I was with and she told the 3 women I was sitting behind. They all laughed. The girl I was with ended up telling me no one at the bar liked Indians, as they are cheap, nasty to the girls, and their personal hygiene is sub par. Nor did they like Indians in general. Which reminds me of a female Thai friend I had years ago, who told me she couldn't stand Indians.
There maybe something there against the ol' Indians.I heard this blabla story about WG's that don't like Indians because this and this and that at least a million times and it is getting boring.
I think you should be very grateful to us Indians during your mongering activities. We are ugly, cheap, nasty, don't shower, smell like curry and do other things that God forbid mankind to do. So because we nasty Indians are in fact eliminated, handsome and good mannered guys like you make a higher chance!
B.t.w.: Happy mongering!!
Naked Gunz
03-28-08, 03:46
i heard this blabla story about wg's that don't like indians because this and this and that at least a million times and it is getting boring.
i think you should be very grateful to us indians during your mongering activities. we are ugly, cheap, nasty, don't shower, smell like curry and do other things that god forbid mankind to do. so because we nasty indians are in fact eliminated, handsome and good mannered guys like you make a higher chance!
b.t.w.: happy mongering!!
i get offended on here often, then i remember it's all about tna, not phd. try being black in america. "lady, i'm not trying to [CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123) you!"
everything is on the table. i'm just glad not that many freaks put those nasty toilet rep002 and doo-doo pics up. then i would really be offended!
i'm always happy mongering! i really don't look for respect from wh_res. who needs who(m) more!
M P Lurker
03-28-08, 05:47
I heard this blabla story about WG's that don't like Indians because this and this and that at least a million times and it is getting boring.
I think you should be very grateful to us Indians during your mongering activities. We are ugly, cheap, nasty, don't shower, smell like curry and do other things that God forbid mankind to do. So because we nasty Indians are in fact eliminated, handsome and good mannered guys like you make a higher chance!
B.t.w.: Happy mongering!!
I dated a pretty girl from CP2 soapy afew years back. She said one of her favourite customers was an Indian who was hansome, clean, dressed well, stylish, not stingy, and had lived in Thailand for quite a while and spoke Thai. The colour of the skin was quite unimportant as was his dining preferences.
The point is that generalising puts individuals unfairly in a category box that doesn't necessarily suit them. Most people can portray a better image if they try, by how they act.
NicFrenchy
03-28-08, 09:06
I heard this blabla story about WG's that don't like Indians because this and this and that at least a million times and it is getting boring.
I think you should be very grateful to us Indians during your mongering activities. We are ugly, cheap, nasty, don't shower, smell like curry and do other things that God forbid mankind to do. So because we nasty Indians are in fact eliminated, handsome and good mannered guys like you make a higher chance!
B.t.w.: Happy mongering!!Satrai2000,
Not sure why you would blame OTH in this Story as he is just expressing here what 99.9% of the Thai Population thinks. I have brushed the subject with my Thai Staff and they all had disgusted looks on their faces.
The thing is, most of them have never encountered or had to deal with Indians, they just dislike them because of their color.
I think it is Pathetic but as you have been in this country already you should know that Thai people are far from being the brightest asians (pretty much the opposite if you ask me) and most often base their opinions on whatever the majority thinks, so they blend in the mass and can't be singled out for thinking different.
Having said that, I can also tell you that at the Gym I go to, there is a young indian Guy and, he has one of the prettiest Thai girl as his girlfriend (and she is very white skinned), I am jealous everytime I see them because I would really like to approach her.
Satrai2000, let it go mate ;)
Exactly. There aren't that many black people in Thailand and the vast majority of those that are here are mainly Nigerian drug dealers. Even I stare when I see a black person because it's generally quite unusual. There was a black woman shopping at Carrefour on Rama 4, last weekend and she was stared at a lot because she was the only black person in the whole mall. She simply stood out like a sore thumb.
Oh, and BTW, I get stared at constantly and I'm white.
Thais are so insular that they stare at anyone who's the least bit different.
The vast majority are Nigerian Drug Dealers? Do you have some type of chart or graph to substantiate your claim? I love pie graphs. Or you felt it was alright to throw some negative shit towards a whole nationality and nobody would notice? I guess the “vast majority” of foreign male school teachers who work in the LOS are child-sex tourist and the Russians are arms dealers.
The vast majority are Nigerian Drug Dealers? Do you have some type of chart or graph to substantiate your claim? I love pie graphs. Or you felt it was alright to throw some negative shit towards a whole nationality and nobody would notice? I guess the “vast majority” of foreign male school teachers who work LOS are child-sex tourist and the Russians are arms dealers.
Well, the Nigerians are definitely not famous for their honesty. There are exceptions, but Nigeria is Africas Scam country number one.
Ghanians enjoyed a relatively easy travel, for exaple to HK, until the Nigerians started faking Ghanian passports. Now Ghanians can't even transit in HK anymore for that reason without a visa they normally wouldn't get. They gotta love the Nigerians for that.
Of course there are exceptions and I do apologize to those who stand out.
Old Thai Hand
03-28-08, 14:08
The vast majority are Nigerian Drug Dealers? Do you have some type of chart or graph to substantiate your claim? I love pie graphs. Or you felt it was alright to throw some negative shit towards a whole nationality and nobody would notice? I guess the “vast majority” of foreign male school teachers who work LOS are child-sex tourist and the Russians are arms dealers.
Well, having lived here 11 years and having seen a huge number of stories in the media over the years about Nigerians involved in crime, having travelled on a plane to Nepal with a group of Nigerians, who quite openly admitted to going there to buy dope to sell in Bangkok, not to mention numerous attempts by Nigerians to involve me and many people I know (through email, even Nigerian women on online dating sites etc.) in some money scam or other ("I have an uncle in Paris with a numbered Swiss account..."), as well as all the stories that Bernard Trink used to write about in the Bangkok Post about all the problems with Nigerian money and jewelry scams and general crime in Thailand, I can confidently generalize about a whole nationality, at least as far as it pertains to those from that nationality who live in LOS.
It's simply common knowledge that everyone who lives here knows. Also, BTW, my GF's brother is in the Thai equivalent of the FBI, and has also told me about the vast number of Nigerians involved in shadey stuff. So get off your high horse unless you can prove me wrong.
Russian arms dealers??? Possibly. Most of the Russians here are mafia and involved in some crime or other.
Starchild2012
03-28-08, 18:51
Boy..but one should credit the Nigerian scamsters for what they do :)..some criminals and gansters are only good at one thing like extortion, robbery, drugs, sex trade, internet fraud etc...
But Nigerians scamsters are all over the planet earth..from 401 net scams to selling fake puppies on craigslist, lottery scams, ATM scams..i think selling drugs is like a past time for them..so smoooth.. and they are quite good at it and they don't care if they are caught or not...their mind is jammed or immune to karma and consequences for their actions :D
I think they did not had a history of scamming like the thugs in India or italian mafia or russian mafia..they blossomed in 10 years or so..and are now in every news papers column and fraud website list around the world.
They have not done more damage than italian mafia or russian arms lords...but the image of italy or siccilly and russia is still normal..but Nigeria's image had taken a bad name ..i think its the media projecting everyone in bad light...
Majority of Nigerians are good people....else it would not be the second most happiest country in the world... :)
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/lif_hap_lev_ver_hap-lifestyle-happiness-level-very-happy
Boy..but one should credit the Nigerian scamsters for what they do :)..some criminals and gansters are only good at one thing like extortion, robbery, drugs, sex trade, internet fraud etc...
But Nigerians scamsters are all over the planet earth..from 401 net scams to selling fake puppies on craigslist, lottery scams, ATM scams..i think selling drugs is like a past time for them..so smoooth.. and they are quite good at it and they don't care if they are caught or not...their mind is jammed or immune to karma and consequences for their actions :D
I think they did not had a history of scamming like the thugs in India or italian mafia or russian mafia..they blossomed in 10 years or so..and are now in every news papers column and fraud website list around the world.
They have not done more damage than italian mafia or russian arms lords...but the image of italy or siccilly and russia is still normal..but Nigeria's image had taken a bad name ..i think its the media projecting everyone in bad light...
Majority of Nigerians are good people....else it would not be the second most happiest country in the world... :)
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/lif_hap_lev_ver_hap-lifestyle-happiness-level-very-happyThe Russian, Italian or Chinese Mafia are not trying to scam people like you and me directly. They organize in the background. And as far as protection money goes in HK, they charge reasonably and do protect. I remember a scene when some british cops in HK made trouble in a bar, and they came and kicked them out. The brits said "we are HK police", the guys said: "not tonight".
The new manager of the bar refused to pay. They don't mess around with westerners and went empty handed. But of course no more protection.
Another encounter with the mafia in HK: I got letters because the previous tenant had debts. The letters were serious threats. I called them, told them I am not him. They came to check and left me alone without further trouble.
Whereas I get emails from Nigerian scammers every now and then and know first hand what happens when you answer them. (That was 20 years ago, and thge guy kept calling me any time in the night for months).
I answered because a German friend of mine forwarded the mail to me not knowing it was a scam and since the mail came from him, I answered, being too naive at that time. Of course I came to know what was going on when they asked for money. I didn't pay and they kept calling. Very annoying.
Well, Asian men definitely don't like seeing Farang with Asian women. ....I took my Thai ex-GF to Hanoi once and I got grief and she particularly had all kinds of hassles because she could easily pass for North Vietnamese.
I wonder if Thai men really do care? They seem to be too into each other, or what they're drinking or smoking most of the time!
I like to travel around SE Asia with my sweet Thai GF (I'm almost 50, tall, big and bald; she is 31, small, a little dark and very cute). Traveling together is good for her as it broadens her horizons and it's good for me as she is excellent company. We have a lot of fun.
We recently returned from a short trip to Kuala Lumpur and Singapore. I noticed lots of looks from people in both places. The looks in KL were mainly from south Asian men, and the local Muslim and Chinese women. If she was more than 5 meters away from me the south Asian guys would try to chat her up! In Singapore it was primarily from older Western travelers and south Asian men. I like to stay in nice hotels so this is where we generally cross paths with "white" traveling couples. On a trip to Hanoi last year, we definitely received a lot of long looks from the locals as she can easily pass for a local VN girl.
Funny thing, too, on each of our trips I've noticed a few smiles from happy "mixed" couples. Especially ones that looked like they'd been together for awhile.
For me this experience is a little disturbing because I'd like to take her to visit the US (my home) someday, and I know that our age, size, color and ethnic difference will definitely attract looks in some places. People in America sometimes are not as reserved as Asians when they notice something different.
Funny thing, though, my GF doesn't seem to really notice the attention, nor would she care if she did. She's too busy having a good time and making sure that I am well taken care of.
that Bernard Trink used to write about in the Bangkok Post about all the problems with Nigerian money and jewelry scams and general crime in Thailand, I can confidently generalize about a whole nationality, at least as far as it pertains to those from that nationality who live in LOS....
Because an imprudent media pundit wrote about it must be true. Also I guess Thailand is not famous for gem scams perpetuated by THAIS….The Thai taxi drivers are some of the worst swindlers I have came across in Thailand and most of the countries I have been to. Whenever I meet a guy going to Thailand for the first time on my list of things to watch out for… are the THAI taxi drivers not Nigerian swindlers.
Look not trying to get in a philosophical debate with you guys it just gets under my skin when people make sweeping generalizations about people due to race nationality or creed.
Old Thai Hand
03-29-08, 03:21
it just gets under my skin when people make sweeping generalizations about people due to race nationality or creed.
But you just did.
In any event, I agree with you that Thais can be exceedingly dishonest, especially with tourist.
What does one expect in a society where people equate wealth with moral integrity (if you're rich, you must be an excellent human being) and where corruption is engrained in the populace from top to bottom.
The vast majority are Nigerian Drug Dealers? Do you have some type of chart or graph to substantiate your claim? I love pie graphs. Or you felt it was alright to throw some negative shit towards a whole nationality and nobody would notice? I guess the “vast majority” of foreign male school teachers who work in the LOS are child-sex tourist and the Russians are arms dealers.
Link to statistics from the Department of Corrections, Thailand:
http://www.correct.go.th/statis.htm
Nigerians are #4 for majority of foreigners in Thai jails with 306, behind Cambodians, Laotians and Myanmese (more than half the foreigners are Myanmese!) Now, if I can only get the statistics for total # Nigerians entering the country maybe I could throw some positive shit towards a 'whole nationality'... :D
Link to statistics from the Department of Corrections, Thailand:
http://www.correct.go.th/statis.htmWOW mate! I am proud to be an Australian and I certainly hope I won't get caught in Thailand to break the zero stats.
Raverboy,
This is an old stat from the SARS days, but it should give you an idea:
http://www.thailandoutlook.com/thailandoutlook1/top+menu/special+topic/Thailand+Tourism+Outlook+The+SARS+Impact.htm
Nigeria isn't listed, hence the arrivals are under 1% of total arrivals.
Looking at the prison population, Nigerian departures are somewhat less:D
NicFrenchy
04-12-08, 04:46
you're never going to know really how they truly feel. Thais can be extremely obsequious and put on that cloying, false smile and sugary sweet demeanor, all the while hating you.
Please allow me to continue this here.
OTH nails it, you have no idea how stupid the mindset of Thais is towards people of Indian descent. I rent my condo from an Indian guy who once came to my office for some paperwork, I introduced him to my team and they all complimented him on his dresscode and were very nice and smily towards him.
The minute he left, one girl asked me why I was renting the appartment from Indian people? and why I could not find someone better?
Can you explain this nonsense? I certainly can't, rationally anyway.
Old Thai Hand
04-12-08, 05:08
you have no idea how stupid the mindset of Thais is.
You should just leave your statement above like this, in more general terms.
BTW, thanks for moving this to the appropriate forum.
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