PDA

View Full Version : Anti-Sex Pervert MathewCob's Disinformation Campaign



Pages : [1] 2

MathewCob
07-13-13, 16:54
Right. You won't get very far if you complain about bad service, although a smart mama will try to make it up to you by recommending a different girl that she knows will rock you. She will want to keep your business. But you can complain to the bar and expect a positive response if a girl steals from you or there is a non-performance issue. The bar girls from the quality bars know this and it helps enforce a certain accepted minimum standard of performance. Freelancers are independent and answer to no one, but themselves and their immediate customers. Many freelancers are really nice girls and I have had my share of great times at Cafe Havana, MBC, and Thermae, but there are rotten apples out there. In AC, where there are so many bar girls to choose from and EWR is the norm, I think it is better and more reliable to go with the bar girls. Why fight it? But whatever works for you is fine with me.I think you will find that there is a 100% no barfine policy in all of the Angeles city bars, basically no bargirl will go on a barfine with any customers any more, I'm not sure why I keep reading posters on this forum saying that the bars of Angeles City still have a barfine option, they do not, I was in Angeles just few days ago, many bars have been raided, bargirls / managers / mamasuns arrested for [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) violations, the powers that be have decided that they will either close every single bar in Angeles City or the bars will operate by the new rules, absolutely no barfines what so ever, the good times of Angeles City are unfortunately over gentlemen.

Wicked Roger
07-13-13, 17:55
I think you will find that there is a 100% no barfine policy in all of the Angeles city bars, basically no bargirl will go on a barfine with any customers any more,

The powers that be have decided that they will either close every single bar in angeles city or the bars will operate by the new rules, absolutely no barfines what so ever, the good times of Angeles city are unfortunately over gentlemen.Seems Harry the Horse agrees. Always a good read for his views on the bar scene and he seems despondent by the raids now, read his earlier posts on the same subject.

http://www.harrythehorse.asia/?p=7862

Just means more (monger) visitors to Thailand and less to the Philippines. Some gain some lose, as always the losers will be those over 18who work in the bars trting to support a family

Member #4698
07-13-13, 18:49
I was in angeles just few days ago, many bars have been raided, bargirls / managers / mamasuns arrested for [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) violations, the powers that be have decided that they will either close every single bar in angeles city or the bars will operate by the new rules, absolutely no barfines what so ever, the good times of Angeles city are unfortunately over gentlemen.Thank you Mathew, for your on the scene report. We need more of them here.

Yeah it is pretty f cked up. Viking Bar is the latest bar to get raided. No customers were arrested and other bars remained open. So it still looks like a shakedown / extortion maneuver to me. I want to see how things play out over the next few weeks before I conclude the good times are over in AC for good. You don't need an EWR system to date a bar girl. The BKK bar system always worked fine for me. There are plenty of workarounds. In addition, the battle is not over. There is a lot of money at risk and a great deal of political influence is still on our side; the side of the bar owners, restaurant owners, and hotel owners. Out of control politicians can be replaced or made to heel. We will see what happens. Right now I don't think anyone knows for sure how it is going to turn out, but you are entitled to your point of view. One thing for sure; things definitely are looking more ominous today than they did 10 days ago.

I happen to have a flight booked to Clark and a reservation at the Lewis slated for around 6 months from now. I am not going to change anything until I see where this BS finally ends up. In the worse case scenario, I will spend more time in Subic and Makati. In the nuclear meltdown tsunami worse case scenario, I will bypass the PI entirely and spend more time in BKK and Jakarta. If it turns out that the self righteous powers that be don't want my money, I am not going to force them to take it. Mongering is good for the PI because it pumps a huge amount of foreign capital directly into the local economy. To hell with the crooked politicians if they don't appreciate that fact. Let them pay for all those fatherless babies. There are too many great Asian alternatives with beautiful sexy women and better food for me to give it a second thought. I will feel sorry for the girls though and miss them. They are great. To bad nobody seems to be looking out for them in this current mess.

Jack4765
07-13-13, 21:54
I think you will find that there is a 100% no barfine policy in all of the Angeles city bars, basically no bargirl will go on a barfine with any customers any moreNot what my wingmen, who are there right now, are telling me. They say "business as usuall". Pussy everywhere.

MathewCob
07-14-13, 05:45
Not sure that Subic is the answer to no barfines and no bar raids as a very large Subic (Barrio Barretto) bar was raided and closed down just a couple of days ago,

As for guys claiming barfines are possible in Angeles City then all I can say is these guys must have vested interests in saying these things.

The truth is that there are 100% no barfines in the bars of Angeles, check out any of the major Angeles forums and you will see hundreds of posts stating the same.

MathewCob
07-14-13, 08:41
just to add a few words of why there are no more barfines in angeles and why bars are being raided and closed down almost daily,

let's start at the beginning, a couple of years back the philippine government asked for a payment of humanitarian aid from the usa to the tune of some 250 million dollars, yes was the answer from hillary clinton who was dealing with the request, but only under certain conditions and in stage payments.

one of the main conditions was that the usa would send a [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) task force to opperate with the manilla police, the aim, to stamp out prostitution and **** girls working in the bars of angeles city, hence over the last two years we have had countless bars raided, hundreds of **** girls rescued and bar owners / mamasuns / managers locked up and charged with [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) (some are still locked up and awaiting their day in court even two years later).

roll on to febuary 2013, the mayor of angeles city summoned all of the bar owners of angeles city to a meeting, in this meeting the mayor made it perfectly clear, bar fines and prostitution end today, any bar found to be offering barfines will be raided / closed down and the owners / managers charged with [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) which as stated by a previous board member is an unbailable offence and carries 20 years in prison plus a 2 million peso fine.

all of the fields avenue bars have gone along with the mayors wishes, some of the smaller perimeter bars thought they would basically ignore the mayor and still offer barfines, these bars have been raided over the last 10 days using foreigners with marked money to enter bars, barfine girls, call in the raiding team with automatic weapons to make the arrests of the bar owner / mamasun and girls, some bars remain permanently shut,.

now on to the guys that swear blind that barfines are still available in angeles, let's put ourselves in the shoes of the angeles bargirl / bar owner / mamasun, would anyone in their right mind take the risk of selling a barfine for a half share of £30 barfine and run the risk of being arrested on an unbailable charge, run the risk of having their bar closed permanently, being locked up in a philippine jail on a charge that carries 20 years jail plus 2 million peso fine?

i'll leave the dicision to you fine gentlemen to make up your minds if barfines are being offered in angeles or not.

BrainDrain
07-14-13, 21:44
i applaud the local authorities for stamping out any venue or activity that involves **** girls. **** activity is quite abhorrent.

anywhere where there is an abundance of pussy, the money will find it's way to the pouch. just look at how many different revenue models there are around the world all which come to the same money shot. i for one have never had a drop of party animal pass my lips but i own a few bottles.

i'm confused about the earlier posts. long term forum member westcoast says things are working under a revised system. new member matthewcob (2 posts) says nothing is happening.

i love the report about how the city is going to collect a tax from the trike drivers. that must be so practical!

what is the actual population of the angeles area? could that even support a tram service? i actually find the jeepney services surprisingly cheap and efficient.

anyway, i'm certainly still looking to my time in ac later this month. if not a bar fine, i guess i'll meet the same ladies via internet, or margarita bar, or starbucks, or sm mall, or jollibee, or street walking, or at the gym, or at the cinema.

cheers.

bd

Slippery
07-14-13, 21:58
Welcome to the forum but ummmmmm, as of last night barfines were still available.

Pip Jaeger
07-14-13, 22:51
roll on to febuary 2013, the mayor of angeles city summoned all of the bar owners of angeles city to a meeting, in this meeting the mayor made it perfectly clear, bar fines and prostitution end today,

all of the fields avenue bars have gone along with the mayors wishes, ill leave the dicision to you fine gentlemen to make up your minds if barfines are being offered in angeles or not.i was in ac in early feb and again for a couple of weeks in march. business was as usual and there wasn't even a hint about what you mentioned with regards to a meeting of bar owners and city officials. otherwise i'm sure that during one of my chats with the owners of several bars (on fields mind you) that they would have mentioned something.

furthermore, two girls i keep in touch with (both work in fields ave bars) have not mentioned anything about the elimination of ewr's. one did say that many of the bars are being closely watched for **** girls (a white guy claiming to be from england recently asked her if any worked at her bar; she said no and the man soon left; alone) and she believed that the ewr paid at camelot was for the reportedly **** girl that was working there. that sounds likely if the nbi wanted to firm up its case against the bar by having them acknowledge that she did in fact work there and was not "visiting a friend".

i guess we'll just have to wait and see how it all plays out. sooner or later we'll know if this is a broad attempt at stopping ewr's or just a bit of summer time house cleaning to keep the zealots happy.

WestCoast1
07-15-13, 03:30
Welcome to the forum but ummmmmm, as of last night barfines were still available.I don't think Mathew is saying you can't take a girl. I think he's saying there is pressure from the government to eliminate the barfine as a way of taking the girl. Correct Mathew?

There are now numerous ways to take the girl. And as I experienced recently the Santos / Raymond bars still collecting the cash before taking the girl, and they have very specific terminology (both the girls and mamas) regarding Short Time (two hours) and Barfine (12 hours). Obviously these bars are ignoring the warning from the mayor, or they are exempt. One of the Santos mamas, who I've been friendly with for years now, shared that the Mayor's office pressured her bar over a different item, but she never mentioned pressure to not barfine. Its odd that she would bring up the other item regarding the Mayor and go into detail about it, but not mention barfine pressure. Hence I would believe the Santos bars are not feeling any heat over the barfine.

Western787
07-15-13, 04:34
just to add a few words of why there are no more barfines in angeles and why bars are being raided and closed down almost daily,

let's start at the beginning, a couple of years back the philippine government asked for a payment of humanitarian aid from the usa to the tune of some 250 million dollars, yes was the answer from hillary clinton who was dealing with the request, but only under certain conditions and in stage payments.

one of the main conditions was that the usa would send a [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) task force to opperate with the manilla police, the aim, to stamp out prostitution and **** girls working in the bars of angeles city, hence over the last two years we have had countless bars raided, hundreds of **** girls rescued and bar owners / mamasuns / managers locked up and charged with [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) (some are still locked up and awaiting their day in court even two years later).

roll on to febuary 2013, the mayor of angeles city summoned all of the bar owners of angeles city to a meeting, in this meeting the mayor made it perfectly clear, bar fines and prostitution end today, any bar found to be offering barfines will be raided / closed down and the owners / managers charged with [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) which as stated by a previous board member is an unbailable offence and carries 20 years in prison plus a 2 million peso fine.

all of the fields avenue bars have gone along with the mayors wishes, some of the smaller perimeter bars thought they would basically ignore the mayor and still offer barfines, these bars have been raided over the last 10 days using foreigners with marked money to enter bars, barfine girls, call in the raiding team with automatic weapons to make the arrests of the bar owner / mamasun and girls, some bars remain permanently shut.

now on to the guys that swear blind that barfines are still available in angeles, let's put ourselves in the shoes of the angeles bargirl / bar owner / mamasun, would anyone in their right mind take the risk of selling a barfine for a half share of £30 barfine and run the risk of being arrested on an unbailable charge, run the risk of having their bar closed permanently, being locked up in a philippine jail on a charge that carries 20 years jail plus 2 million peso fine?

ill leave the dicision to you fine gentlemen to make up your minds if barfines are being offered in angeles or not.ac will never be the same from this point forward or until the hysteria runs it course which with past hysterias have lasted 15 to 30 years, and they're doing it under the world wide witch hunt known as "[CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908)" a campaign now effectively controlled by western based ngo's allied with usa state which is allied with ultra radical feminists, and under the increasingly expansive definitions of [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) 100% of age 18 and over bar girls simply by working as bar girls are automatically deemed to be "trafficked", and can even be deemed "self trafficked" on a subconscious basis meaning even though they think they are consenting. their consent is not valid and therefore must be doing it against their will due to the bad acts of third parties. and therefore the owners of bars along with clients are deemed to be engaged in "[CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908)". this issue has been discussed on the burma forum over the past year or so, as that is now a ngo laboratory test case to prevent it from turning into another thailand.

this is my post from march 18th in this forum in regard to this issue:

the country is now operating under a powerful new law. this is the just the beginning, and is a direct result of united states (now ex) secretary of state hillary clinton's campaign not just to shut down actual

true "[CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908)" which every responsible person agrees is a serious crime and a scourge where and when it occurs, but in effect (among other things) to shut down (18 and over fully consentual) mongering in developing countries worldwide, with her efforts now already having a major impact on what is happening in burma currently. the "expanded anti trafficking act in persons act of 2013" was just signed into law last month and is extremely expansive, and pretty much defines [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) as anything they decide it to be. by the way, none of these laws will ever impact (18 and over) mistress arrangements, so the very wealthy will never be impacted.

from the phillipine star on feb 15, 2013.

manila: president benigno aquino has signed republic act 10364, strengthening the country's fight against [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) by plugging loopholes in the existing law.

the government is hoping that the expanded law will improve the philippines' status in the us state department's trafficking in persons report. earlier, justice secretary leila de lima, chair of the inter-agency council against trafficking, said the philippines had been upgraded to tier 2 category in 2011 from the tier 2 watchlist.

de lima said a tier 2 status 'is an important recognition of the country's sustained and aggressive initiatives and programmes to eliminate [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908). '

the tier 2 status officially recognizes a country's significant efforts to adhere to the benchmarks prescribed by the us state department and meet the minimum standards.

'the signing of the new law will give the government a stronger weapon against [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) syndicates, ' de lima said.

in signing the law expanding ra 9208 or 'an act to institute policies to eliminate trafficking in persons especially women and children, ' presidential spokesman edwin lacierda said the president recognized the need to make the government's fight against [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) more effective. 'this is a concern and a priority of the president and this measure will be enforced by the different agencies, especially the department of justice as well as our police agencies, ' lacierda said.

lawmakers called on the president to immediately sign the expanded anti-trafficking in persons act to address [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) in the country, particularly in disaster areas where women and children often fall victim. the expanded law is a strengthened version of the anti-trafficking law, covering attempted trafficking. it has accessory or accomplice liability, covering more related acts and individuals. recruitment in the guise of domestic or overseas employment for sexual exploitation, forced labour or involuntary debt bondage, can now be considered [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908).

also included in the expanded anti-trafficking in persons act are recruitment of any filipino woman to marry a foreigner, engagement in sex tourism, recruitment for organ removal and recruitment of a child to engage in armed activities abroad.

the penalties and sanctions under the new law are now stiffer. those guilty of trafficking can be sentenced to six to 40 years in prison and fines ranging from p50, 000 ($1, 200) to p5m ($120, 000).

http://thepeninsulaqatar.com/philippines/225728-aquino-signs-expanded-law-against-[CodeWord909] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord909).html

Western787
07-15-13, 04:55
The NGO's (sometimes remaining annonymous) can make up ANY fact or statistic or claim they want. And the media will believe it. For example did you know that "In the last twenty years in Angeles City, Philippines more than 300, 000 women and children have died in the prostitution death camps of Angeles."?

Such claim made in 2012 in an online petition: http://www.petitiononline.com/44441212/petition.html

MathewCob
07-15-13, 08:58
For the guys that are claiming there are many ways of barfining girls from Angeles bars, I would like to make it clear that there are not any ways of barfining girls from Angeles bars, the party is well and truly over, no girls will leave from their bar with a customer under any circumstances.

As explained myself before, some of the bars on perimeter road thought they could get around the mayors rules of absolutely no barfines by offering to sell the customer a bottle of party animal (cheap fizzy wine) or a tray of cheap shots as a subtitute for taking cash for the barfine, basically the bar owner thought he could claim that he had not sold a barfine but only a bottle of party animal or shots, these are the stupid bar owners that have been recently raided, got themselves and their bargirls arrested on human traffic charges and their bars closed down, the mayor and the new laws of the Philippines is very clear nobody can offer barfines or accept barfines regardless of how they have been paid for or arranged, even meeting a bargirl in the bar, exchanging numbers and her coming to your hotel room later is classed as [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) and the customer / girl can be arrested and charged if caught,

Just as a side precaution, under Philippines law any foreigner in the company of a pinay which is more than 10 years his junior and not directly related to him found in a hotel room together could also be prosecuted under Philippine law and carries up to 10 years jail, now I'm not saying that this law is used often but just to say its there and if the NGOs, police or mayors office want to get someone then they can very easily,

Hillary Clinton, the NGO task force, the Angeles mayor and the Philippines police are hell bent on getting rid of [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) and in the last few days they have 100% succeeded, forget Angeles City, its over, but the good news is that there are hundreds of other destinations all over the world to enjoy ourselves.

Western787
07-15-13, 10:07
I am always late to the party. Was just about to purchase my ticket for late November. But will wait and see. Just returned from my first BKK / Pattaya trip. May just go back instead. I always seem to read posts on destination I seek to travel that it is not as good as it used to be. I go and it is the best ever. For me. However these crack downs sound different. Serious. Any recommendation on go or no go?I should emphasize one thing, while this crackdown does appear different, the local authorities no doubt are fully aware that the NGO claims are 99% BS. Yes, there is certainly some borderline not yet 18 dancers and other even far more serious but more isolated issues just as there are in Burma, Laos, Cambodia and elsewhere, and there is always gay pervs flying in to any of these countries looking to molest young boys (something the media absolutely refuses to cover) and that 1% is a "scourge" that any decent person wants to eliminate. So that means that there is a "going through the motions" factor her for local authorities to reach whatever milestone State and the NGOs have setup. And then at that point, until the next hurdle happens, you might see a reversion to the status quo, with hopefully getting rid of any under 18 types in these bars. The true test is whether customers get arrested for aiding and abetting "[CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908)" simply by engaging with an 18 or over bar girl. And in fact in United Kingdom, they not only have claimed long-reach jurisdiction to make acts in the Phillipines a crime in the UK, but they also seem to define "trafficking" very loosely. So while things may go back to the mean, there is going to be this ongoing overriding overhang factor at work, and that's not going to go away, because war against "[CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908)" no matter how many stats are made up, is the IN thing at the moment.

Gajith
07-15-13, 16:47
a bottle of party animal (cheap fizzy wine) or a tray of cheap shots as a subtitute for taking cash for the barfine, basically the bar owner thought he could claim that he had not sold a barfine but only a bottle of party animal or shotWhen I was there at AC (Kokomos) ; they followed the above mentioned way.

Key Master
07-15-13, 19:33
Why are you people responding to this MatthewCob person with 3 posts at this time? Read the way the person writes and what he or she is writing.

OralFanatic
07-15-13, 20:08
For the guys that are claiming there are many ways of barfining girls from Angeles bars, I would like to make it clear that there are not any ways of barfining girls from angeles bars, the party is well and truly over, no girls will leave from their bar with a customer under any circumstances.Mathew, were you part of the film crew that was in AC recently?

JesseJames
07-15-13, 20:36
Why are you people responding to this MatthewCob person with 3 posts at this time? Read the way the person writes and what he or she is writing."Hillary clinton." is a dead give away. She's been retired for several months.

BrainDrain
07-15-13, 21:44
I am always late to the party. Was just about to purchase my ticket for late November. But will wait and see. Just returned from my first BKK / Pattaya trip. May just go back instead. I always seem to read posts on destination I seek to travel that it is not as good as it used to be. I go and it is the best ever. For me. However these crack downs sound different. Serious. Any recommendation on go or no go?Get yourself on that flight and see the world for what it is. I doubt that sex will be illegal by then. How you 'pay' might change but there are still 10, 000, 000 pinay here happy to see you and your money. Even if the AC Mayors Social Media Advisor (a. K. A. Matthew Cob) thinks your shouldn't come.

I already have a paid booking for March next year.


BTW, I thought Party Animal was a spirit drink not a fizzy drink. Those fizzy drinks are too expensive.

Wicked Roger
07-15-13, 23:58
Why are you people responding to this MatthewCob person with 3 posts at this time? Read the way the person writes and what he or she is writing.I agree KM,

MC has not even shown clearly he ha visited AC and his FRs are based more on what he reads or he wants to happen. Ie could be LE or someone in IJM etc just "spreading the word" to leave C and go elsewhere as seems he has no clue to how to pay barfines in different ways.

MC. The Philippines is nothing but creative in ways to helps mongers and will continue to be so visit the country and find out. Yes AC is changing various blogs are saying this and possibly the way mongers pay will also change but it won't stop the pussy etc.

So KM I think MC should post his FRs on AC and his experience not the somewhat 'political' message that I read in his / her FRs.

MathewCob
07-16-13, 03:50
HaaaaHaaaaa, I wondered when the bar owners of Angeles would come flooding on here to try and cast doubt on what I'm saying and to at all costs try to keep the true happenings in Angeles secret, yes gentlemen not good for buisness.

Now on to a little about myself, although I am a new member here that does not mean I'm new to Angeles, I have been a member of most Angeles based forums for years, have visited Angeles regularly over some 20 years, some times for months at a time, I'm the last person to want Angeles to close down but I like to tell it as it is to my fellow mongere just like they have helped me decide on new destinations in the past through information on great sites like this one.

Now in my book its up to each individual board member to read through the posts and make up ones own mind on what to believe and what not to.

MathewCob
07-16-13, 04:03
"Hillary clinton." is a dead give away. She's been retired for several months.Yes your correct Hilary Clinton retired some months ago but that's not to say she is not using her massive influece behind the scenes to see her project of elliminating [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) in Angeles City through to completion.

Pute Nut
07-16-13, 05:10
Just as a side precaution, under Philippines law any foreigner in the company of a pinay which is more than 10 years his junior and not directly related to him found in a hotel room together could also be prosecuted under philippine law and carries up to 10 years jail, now I'm not saying that this law is used often but just to say its there and if the ngo, s, police or mayors office want to get someone then they can.blah blaMC, the gentlemen of ISG have recently (that might have been a bit before your arrival, but I don't really care to check) discussed this very topic and I hope most know better than to believe your BS. If you are going to give us lectures on Philippine Law it would help if you read (and understand) it, preferably before typing away.

NomadicMong
07-16-13, 05:57
Spoke with few bar managers today. BF continues in most bars and few bars (mind few bars) stopped that. But the glory goes on. If you like to visit AC, and you make it there, you will enjoy it.

Don't get bogged down by BS from few. Visitors like us make that place great in addition to what AC offers naturally.

Red Kilt
07-16-13, 06:09
Just as a side precaution, under Philippines law any foreigner in the company of a pinay which is more than 10 years his junior and not directly related to him found in a hotel room together could also be prosecuted under philippine law and carries up to 10 years jail, now I'm not saying that this law is used often but just to say its there and if the ngo, s, police or mayors office want to get someone then they can very easily,You conveniently left out the word MINOR, that is, under 18 years of age, in your quote.

Viz. ."foreigner in the company of a pinay which (sic) is more than 10 years his junior (AND A MINOR) and not directly related to him found in a hotel room together.

Wicked Roger
07-16-13, 07:29
You conveniently left out the word MINOR, that is, under 18 years of age, in your quote.

Viz."foreigner in the company of a pinay which (sic) is more than 10 years his junior (AND A MINOR) and not directly related to him found in a hotel room together.Well done RK, you had the sense, unlike me and maybe others, to research the actual wording. Seems MC is either a tad dyslexic or trying to stir up a hornets nest or one of the Christian brigade who really should not be a paid up member of ISG.

Others had alluded to your comments but none has posted the actual words, thanks for clarification.

MathewCob
07-16-13, 07:45
you conveniently left out the word minor, that is, under 18 years of age, in your quote.

viz."foreigner in the company of a pinay which (sic) is more than 10 years his junior (and a minor) and not directly related to him found in a hotel room together.not so, if the 10 year age gap law only related to **** pinays then a 23 year old foreign man in a hotel room with a 14 year old would be ok by what your saying.

read the law again and i think you will find that the law relates to any age group that has more than a 10 year age gap, now i know that this law is crazy but nevertheless it is there and could possibly be used against a foreigner if needed by the relevent law inforcement groups.

BionicMan
07-16-13, 07:52
You conveniently left out the word MINOR, that is, under 18 years of age, in your quote.

Viz."foreigner in the company of a pinay which (sic) is more than 10 years his junior (AND A MINOR) and not directly related to him found in a hotel room together.Does that mean then, for the sake of the talks, that a 25 yo foreigner found with a 17yo girl is ok? (According to Philippine law, not necessary the law of thecoutnrynofnthe foreigner, an aspect many tend to forget) and a 28yo foreigner guy with a 17yo girl is not ok. I might be dumb but a 17yo girl with a 25yo foreigner guy is a no-no. And a 19yo girl with a 59 yo foreigner is ok too? That law has a clear target and purpose. My first example seems not to be the target of the law, and I find this strange. Of course I gave examples nearly to the limits, purposely, as I think a 30 yo girl with a 65yo guy should be a no brainer for The law even of The age difference is massive, and still could carry an element of "trafficking". Clearly The main purposely is protect minors from trafficking, but law should protect also trafficking of much aged people, be it for prostituition or else. Minors can be tricked, and The assumption is that they are not in a position to decide voluntarily, due to age / maturity, even if they say "I am happy to do that" and meaning that. But also people above Legal age can be tricked and brought into trafficking.

Just my two cents, ie the matter is very complicated and not easy to be defined in here. Still I think that a ratio between a 25 or 30 age girl to 50 or above age foreigner should and could be morally acceptable, somehow. Unless we want to say all prostitution is unacceptable. Then age doesn't count.

Western787
07-16-13, 14:54
Yes your correct Hilary Clinton retired some months ago but that's not to say she is not using her massive influece behind the scenes to see her project of elliminating [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) in Angeles city through to completion.Its beyond just influence, as Hillary is obviously already running for President, so she will do whatever it takes to win, and "[CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908)" is on track to become one of THE major issues of the next campaign, (a great diversion in fact from the continued decline of the USA economy and ever increasing morass known as Obamacare.) Hillary and her husband also know the masses in the United States are mostly gullible on this issue, and will swallow anything the NGO's and State spoon feed them, and they know even politicians in the opposing party will go along with the charade given the success the media has already had in generating near mass hysteria over this issue.

The campaign against "[CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908)" the way its being run is very similar to what happened in the United States during the McCarthy era in the early 1950's.

Just to refresh those unfamliar with the era: (from the net)" McCarthyism is the practice of making accusations of disloyalty, subversion, or treason without proper regard for evidence. It also means "the practice of making unfair allegations or using unfair investigative techniques, especially in order to restrict dissent or political criticism." The term has its origins in the period in the United States known as the Second Red Scare, lasting roughly from 1950 to 1956 and characterized by heightened fears of communist influence on American institutions and espionage by Soviet agents. Originally coined to criticize the anti-communist pursuits of Republican USA Senator Joseph McCarthy of Wisconsin,"McCarthyism" soon took on a broader meaning, describing the excesses of similar efforts. The term is also now used more generally to describe reckless, unsubstantiated accusations, as well as demagogic attacks on the character or patriotism of political adversaries."

[CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) at one point meant one "trafficked" against one's will. So for example if a woman were 18 or over and actually consented using her own free will to work in a bar, without being coerced or threatened, such person with not be deemed to be a "victim" of [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908). THAT definition is no longer valid, the term "[CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908)" can now mean whatever the claimant says its means, and nobody is going to question otherwise, so its a perfect opportunity for Hillary to lead the hysteria right into the White House.

Western787
07-16-13, 15:08
Clearly The main purposely is protect minors from trafficking, but law should protect also trafficking of much aged people, be it for prostituition or else. Minors can be tricked, and The assumption is that they are not in a position to decide voluntarily, due to age / maturity, even if they say "I am happy to do that" and meaning that. But also people above Legal age can be tricked and brought into trafficking.

Just my two cents, ie the matter is very complicated and not easy to be defined in here.Everyone GETS the under 18 minor issue, as they cannot give valid "consent" per se, however you've otherwise just proven my point, the term "[CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908)" can now mean whatever the proponent says it means, even if it results in people being locked up in prison for years, some without even the benefit of a trial. That is how a witch hunt works.

MathewCob
07-16-13, 15:32
For the guys that are saying the human traffic law can be used in so many different ways, twisted and turned till it fits the crime I 100% agree.

What we are also forgetting is that for many years now the boys down at station 4, especially when Loui Tan was head man, have their own very unique way of making any charge that they want stick.

As I'm new to this forum I won't push my luck too far and explain.

Pute Nut
07-16-13, 16:06
You conveniently left out the word MINOR, that is, under 18 years of age, in your quote.

Viz."foreigner in the company of a pinay which (sic) is more than 10 years his junior (AND A MINOR) and not directly related to him found in a hotel room together.RK,

The Cob is obviously trying to stir up some some s*it here, but for the sake of clarity this is how RA 7610 is worded:

"a minor, 12 years or younger or who is 10 years or more his junior"

Cob gives me Pink Pearl vibes. Philippines can be a tricky place to navigate and google will not always tell you the full story. LOL

Wicked Roger
07-16-13, 16:11
RK,

The Cob is obviously trying to stir up some some s*it here, but for the sake of clarity this is how RA 7610 is worded:

"a minor. 12 years or younger or who is 10 years or more his junior"

Cob gives me Pink Pearl vibes. Philippines can be a tricky place to navigate and google will not always tell you the full story. LOLMC gives me IJM evangelist type vibes as this subject was discussed in detail earlier this year. RTFF General Information. And a monger who says he is also a lawyer clearly outlined what you and RK said. MC maybe can't read legal text properly. As if this applied to all then everyone I saw at the coffee shop today was breaking the law when they sat with their girl, and then lets get really silly. You can't marry them either as you broke the law by being with them.

MC just posted a China FR in the AC thread so maybe he has lost his way but this debate has run and run and if MC view is correct let all move to Bangkok LOL.

MathewCob
07-16-13, 16:26
RK,

The Cob is obviously trying to stir up some some s*it here, but for the sake of clarity this is how RA 7610 is worded:

"a minor. 12 years or younger or who is 10 years or more his junior"

Cob gives me Pink Pearl vibes. Philippines can be a tricky place to navigate and google will not always tell you the full story. LOLSorry your wrong again in the RA7610 group of laws a minor (child) is classed as anyone under the age of 18, here is the full mandate if anyone cares to read,

http://www.lawphil.net/statutes/repacts/ra1992/ra_7610_1992.html

It also states that anyone indulging in the use of prostitutes or any kind of paid sex with anyone regardless of her / his age is liable to prosecution.

So basically any girl that is barfined even if over 18 comes under the [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) law that is a non bailable offence with a sentence of 20 year in prison.

Sorry Pute Nut if your going to take me on at least get the facts right.

Ibn Buttita
07-16-13, 16:43
I'm a novice in China, so I wan't some feedback on where I went wrong. I am posting in the Beijing forum because that was my last stop.The full version of the above was also posted on the North China-Beijung forum recently under the Title "Outcall?" by Feebles (a first post). I'm not sure what that signifies.


I'm a novice in China, so I wan't some feedback on where I went wrong. I am posting in the Beijing forum because that was my last stop.I don't believe in sticking your head in the sand like an ostrich in the face of bad mongering developments (believe me, I've faced them in my country of residence) , and it seems like there's something (a lot?) to what MathewCob writes. But reading his posts you would think that they basically locked down everything from Fields to Perimeter, which seems to be contradicted by other real time reports. So to anyone currently in AC: please keep the reports coming in so we have enough evidence to judge. I have a ticket for mid August and would like to have some idea of the situation on the ground.

Thanks!

MathewCob
07-16-13, 18:25
rk,

the cob is obviously trying to stir up some some s*it here, but for the sake of clarity this is how ra 7610 is worded:

"a minor. 12 years or younger or who is 10 years or more his junior"

cob gives me pink pearl vibes. philippines can be a tricky place to navigate and google will not always tell you the full story. lolthis must be an important law as its being discussed at the moment on another board.

i think everyone except pute nut is in agreement that the age a person is classed as a child in philippines law is under 18 and most of ra 7610 refers to the laws regarding crimes against a girl under 18.

it does however go on to crimes that were commited to children under the age of 12 and this is where the rules change, as apposed to the rules for an under 18 girl the rules for the even younger age of girls under 12 will be dealt separately by a charge of [CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123) (which carries the harsher penalty of life inprisonment)

the under 12 special section is not to be confused with the age of which a person is a minor, which has always been under 18 years old.

now lets get on to the wording, a minor 12 years or younger or who is 10 years or more his junior"

i'm not sure if english is your first language pute nut but the key word here is the word " or "

the word "or" seperates the two parts of the sentence so that the seperate sentence becomes only, (or 10 years his junior).

yes. 10 years his junior of what number, this is the key, 10 years the junior 0f 30/40/50/60/70?

the only outcome would be that it refers to an age gap of 10 years regardless of age.

pute nut how much are you paying me for the law lessons lol.

Pete Benetar
07-16-13, 18:44
a recent fishing expedition.Looks like a lot of fun to reel in this quarry though perhaps tasting those meaty filets even funner. Well done and thanks for posting.

FreebieFan
07-17-13, 01:47
for the guys that are saying the human traffic law can be used in so many different ways, twisted and turned till it fits the crime i 100% agree.

what we are also forgetting is that for many years now the boys down at station 4, especially when loui tan was head man, have their own very unique way of making any charge that they want stick.

as i'm new to this forum i won't push my luck too far and explain, where's your trip reports dude. you pop up like a sunflower with a sole discussion point about barfines and **** stuff?

not intersted in pussy but only in the law. think pretty soon you will be on everyones ignore list.

yeah wr, defo a pp in disguise type.

you; ve been around angeles a long time you say yet have accumlated 9 posts in a short time.

if it looks like shit and stinks like shit then it probably is what?

Western787
07-17-13, 03:50
Note the "victim" is 18 years old and an adult, nor is there is any mention she was being held against her will, was coerced, forced, or threatened by some third party to perform such (prospective) act with the undercover operative. Its only a matter of time before the NGO's and State demand reverse stings to target actual tourists. The bottom line now is: simply by being a bar girl. One is deemed a victim of [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908), even if the "victims" insist they were not "trafficked" and insist at all times they were acting upon their own free will.

http://www.journal.com.ph/index.php/news/provincial/54337-three-indicted-for-[CodeWord909] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord909)

Three indicted for [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908)

Published : Tuesday, July 16, 2013 00:00 Article Views : 114 Written by : Bernard Galang

Angeles City. Members of the Pampanga Criminal Investigation and Detection Team arrested two women employees of a bar on Fields Avenue in Bgy. Balibago here over the weekend during an entrapment operation against [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908).

Chief Insp. Bienvenido Reydado, CIDT chief, said the suspects received Php1, 000 marked money from a poseur-customer in exchange for a sex with an 18-year-old bar worker at around 11:40 pm.

Senior Insp. Romel dela Vega said Ronalyn Reyes. 23, and Mary Grace Santiago. 28, waitress and cashier, respectively of Angels Viking Night Bar, yielded the marked bills.

The bar owner, identified through the business registration permit as Elma Pila Yun, was not around during the raid.

Reyes, Santiago and Yun were charged with violation of the Anti-Trafficking In Person Act of 2003.

Member #4214
07-17-13, 04:38
This is so fucked up. My first thought is that many people who make a living in the bars must be hurting now and this must really crimp business. Mongers in Angeles should be doing what they can to both patronize and protect those in the industry. Methods and protocols appear to be different even from bar to bar. Hoping mongers go into each and just be receptive to however the mamasan directs regarding take-out protocols.


Note the "victim" is 18 years old and an adult, nor is there is any mention she was being held against her will .

Wicked Roger
07-17-13, 05:47
where's your trip reports dude. you pop up like a sunflower with a sole discussion point about barfines and **** stuff?

not intersted in pussy but only in the law. think pretty soon you will be on everyones ignore list.good observation ff and he seems a back room lawyer. definition of child is 18 or under so he now says any man marrying anyone with more than a 10 years age gap is breaking the law. that mean many pinoys will join the westerners in jail as well lol add the church who recently married my 50 year old mate to his 24 year old pinay bride . he must be a child abuser of his wife but then it is the church so it would turn a blind eye lol.

and what about my mate in cebu living with their ladies for many years with a 42 year age gap, there are so many that if mc is correct we may as well report to jail on arrival at immigration lol.

mc is just an evangelist with no idea of the country etc. the crack down in ac is likely a shake down nothing more form those i know who live there and life continues as is.

one last thought, the us military will be back / are back and the ones i saw in burgos and ac did not seem to care at all, they had lots of fun with girls all over them.

while this is giving me some amusement i really think this should be placed in a separate thread as it is clogging the ac thread.

mc is probably having a chuckle in amish home stroking his beard or something else.

Pute Nut
07-17-13, 06:57
- irrelevant stuff snipped.

Now lets get on to the wording, a minor 12 years or younger or who is 10 years or more his junior"

I'm not sure if English is your first language Pute Nut but the key word here is the word " or "

The word "or" seperates the two parts of the sentence so that the seperate sentence becomes only, (or 10 years his junior).

Yes. 10 years his junior of what number, this is the key. 10 years the junior 0f 30/40/50/60/70?

The only outcome would be that it refers to an age gap of 10 years regardless of age.MathewCob,

Will all due respect for your great language, legal and boardreading skills, I hope you don't mind me trying to explain this section of RA 7610 once again, in as simple terms as possible.

Section 10 b refers to minors (ie 17 years of age or younger). If that "kept" minor is 12 or younger it's applicable in all cases. If that minor is aged 13-17, it is only applicable if the age gap between keeper and kept minor is 10 years or more. The law is not applicable to men "keeping" non-minors.


Pute Nut how much are you paying me for the law lessons LOL.As much (or rather little) as I would pay you for your English lessons, Mr Seperate.

Nvslim
07-17-13, 09:15
Not intersted in pussy but only in the law. Think pretty soon you will be on everyones ignore list.He's on mine.

Slim

Ekspat
07-17-13, 09:29
The only outcome would be that it refers to an age gap of 10 years regardless of age.So it would be against the law if I (51) sit with a 39 years old lady in a Starbucks and have a coffee?

FreebieFan
07-17-13, 09:47
So it would be against the law if I (51) sit with a 39 years old lady in a Starbucks and have a coffee?Ask Matty " IJMmouthpiece " Cobbie. LOL. The lawyer for all seasons.

X Man
07-17-13, 13:38
Calm and reason in the face of rudeness and ignorance. Great post. One of my favorites. LOL.


MathewCob,

Will all due respect for your great language, legal and boardreading skills, I hope you don't mind me trying to explain this section of RA 7610 once again, in as simple terms as possible.

Section 10 be refers to minors (ie 17 years of age or younger). If that "kept" minor is 12 or younger it's applicable in all cases. If that minor is aged 13-17, it is only applicable if the age gap between keeper and kept minor is 10 years or more. The law is not applicable to men "keeping" non-minors.

As much (or rather little) as I would pay you for your English lessons, Mr Seperate.

BrainDrain
07-17-13, 21:38
Here is the link for adding Matthew Cob to your ignore list.

http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/profile.php?do=addlist&userlist=ignore&u=415371

ExpatCat
07-18-13, 03:26
Just to add a few words of why there are no more barfines in Angeles and why bars are being raided and closed down almost daily,

Let's start at the beginning, a couple of years back the Philippine government asked for a payment of humanitarian aid from the USA to the tune of some 250 million dollars, yes was the answer from Hillary Clinton who was dealing with the request, but only under certain conditions and in stage payments.

I'll leave the decision to you fine gentlemen to make up your minds if barfines are being offered in Angeles or not.

Unless I'm very much mistaken, most of the post is a direct cut and paste from Stickman's weekly column on Bangkok from stickmanbangkok. Com. Now, where he got his information from is up to speculation about its accuracy. I, for one, would like to see corroborative proof, or at least a second opinion before I started changing plans.

As mentioned from other mongers, this is probably a phase and will pass. I look forward to visiting the Phillipines sometime soon.

Just my 2c.

Expatcat

Wicked Roger
07-18-13, 04:47
Unless I'm very much mistaken, most of the post is a direct cut and paste from Stickman's weekly column on Bangkok from stickmanbangkok. Com. Now, where he got his information from is up to speculation about its accuracy. I, for one, would like to see corroborative proof, or at least a second opinion before I started changing plans.

ExpatcatYou mean this one EC.

http://www.stickmanbangkok.com/ReadersSubmissions2013/reader8219.htm

See MC is getting around Asia but has he visited any countries in Asia?

Good spotting EC. Least we now know what you read in your spare time, see you soon hopefully.

MathewCob
07-18-13, 05:12
Unless I'm very much mistaken, most of the post is a direct cut and paste from Stickman's weekly column on Bangkok from stickmanbangkok. Com. Now, where he got his information from is up to speculation about its accuracy. I, for one, would like to see corroborative proof, or at least a second opinion before I started changing plans.

As mentioned from other mongers, this is probably a phase and will pass. I look forward to visiting the Phillipines sometime soon.

Just my 2c.

ExpatcatIf you look at the name on the Stickman post you are refering to you will see that it is written by Mathew, does that tell you something, yes I wrote it, duhhhhh.

MathewCob
07-18-13, 05:20
Good observation FF and he seems a back room lawyer. Definition of child is 18 or under so he now says any man marrying anyone with more than a 10 years age gap is breaking the law. That mean many pinoys will join the westerners in jail as well LOL Add the church who recently married my 50 year old mate to his 24 year old pinay bride. He must be a child abuser of his wife but then it is the church so it would turn a blind eye LOL.

And what about my mate in Cebu living with their ladies for many years with a 42 year age gap, there are so many that if MC is correct we may as well report to jail on arrival at immigration LOL.

MC is just an evangelist with no idea of the country etc. The crack down in AC is likely a shake down nothing more form those I know who live there and life continues as is...I think that if you read my post carefully before just trying to rubbish what I say by any means, you will find what I said and what law RA7610 states is that the age gap of 10 years applies to those that are not related, if you were to marry a girl over 10 years your junior you would be related to her by marriage so the law would not apply, simple really, but some clowns just want to cast doubt where no doubt exists.

RoadGlide
07-18-13, 07:45
Its beyond just influence, as Hillary is obviously already running for President, so she will do whatever it takes to win, and "[CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908)" is on track to become one of THE major issues of the next campaign, (a great diversion in fact from the continued decline of the USA economy and ever increasing morass known as Obamacare.) Hillary and her husband also know the masses in the United States are mostly gullible on this issue, and will swallow anything the NGO's and State spoon feed them, and they know even politicians in the opposing party will go along with the charade given the success the media has already had in generating near mass hysteria over this issue.

The campaign against "[CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908)" the way its being run is very similar to what happened in the United States during the McCarthy era in the early 1950's.

Just to refresh those unfamliar with the era: (from the net)" McCarthyism is the practice of making accusations of disloyalty, subversion, or treason without proper regard for evidence. It also means "the practice of making unfair allegations or using unfair investigative techniques, especially in order to restrict dissent or political criticism." The term has its origins in the period in the United States known as the Second Red Scare, lasting roughly from 1950 to 1956 and characterized by heightened fears of communist influence on American institutions and espionage by Soviet agents. Originally coined to criticize the anti-communist pursuits of Republican USA Senator Joseph McCarthy of Wisconsin,"McCarthyism" soon took on a broader meaning, describing the excesses of similar efforts. The term is also now used more generally to describe reckless, unsubstantiated accusations, as well as demagogic attacks on the character or patriotism of political adversaries."

[CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) at one point meant one "trafficked" against one's will. So for example if a woman were 18 or over and actually consented using her own free will to work in a bar, without being coerced or threatened, such person with not be deemed to be a "victim" of [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908). THAT definition is no longer valid, the term "[CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908)" can now mean whatever the claimant says its means, and nobody is going to question otherwise, so its a perfect opportunity for Hillary to lead the hysteria right into the White House.It's not the Clintons that are pushing this. It's the REPUBLICANS and their push to make the world obey Americas morals. Look at what happened during Bush II, You had the changes to the UCMJ making it criminal for service members to have paid sex, look at what John Ashcroft did as his Attorney General.

Slippery
07-18-13, 08:18
I think that if you read my post carefully before just trying to rubbish what I say by any means, you will find what I said and what law RA7610 states is that the age gap of 10 years applies to those that are not related, if you were to marry a girl over 10 years your junior you would be related to her by marriage so the law would not apply, simple really, but some clowns just want to cast doubt where no doubt exists.So why have we not seen any prosecutions in the context that you argue? I don't think if falls in the realm of prosecutorial discretion. You are correct though that any clown can cast doubt where no doubt exists. You sound like a first year law student.

BrainDrain
07-18-13, 08:27
I think there is some social engineering going on with the various posts appearing on this board and on that stickman board. I think a moderately funded and planned mis-information campaign is underway. Although for what it is worth, it would be far more credible if they created a few more false accounts to 'backup' the main "Matthew" account. I guess that will come in a few weeks when they have increased their post count on whichever other accounts they are using to manipulate 'opinion'.

It's an interesting development in the campaign.

I'm so looking forward to landing at CRK on Monday!

Python75
07-18-13, 08:39
I think that if you read my post carefully before just trying to rubbish what I say by any means, you will find what I said and what law RA7610 states is that the age gap of 10 years applies to those that are not related, if you were to marry a girl over 10 years your junior you would be related to her by marriage so the law would not apply, simple really, but some clowns just want to cast doubt where no doubt exists.Your posts in relation to statutory interpretation are so wide of the mark you are obviously trolling.

MathewCob
07-18-13, 08:44
So why have we not seen any prosecutions in the context that you argue? I don't think if falls in the realm of prosecutorial discretion. You are correct though that any clown can cast doubt where no doubt exists. You sound like a first year law student.When I first mentioned this law some posts back I clearly state that although this law exists it is a crazy law, and went on to warn that it might not be often used but its there should the mayor, police or human traffic task team want to use it,

In truth we really don't know if its been used regularly or not, it might not be used directly in many out and out court prosecutions, but whos to say it is not used to coerce large bribe payment from guilty people for the case not to reach court,

Now for the last time, the law is there, it is 100% clear, I have explained it many times, guys are free to accept that its there and take precautions in case it is used against them or they can bury their head in the sand, no skin off my nose either way, case closed LOL

Pip Jaeger
07-18-13, 08:45
I think a moderately funded and planned mis-information campaign is underway. It's an interesting development in the campaign.An interesting thought, was starting to wonder the same thing myself as I've noticed some other boards are starting to see the same influx of confusing posts and misinformation (or perhaps I should say "disinformation").


I'm so looking forward to landing at CRK on Monday!And we'll be looking forward to getting some reliable updates from you as to the current situation there!

FreebieFan
07-18-13, 08:45
Your posts in relation to statutory interpretation are so wide of the mark you are obviously trolling.Stick the prat on IGNORE. The less oxygen of publicity the PRAT gets the less we have to be concerned with his pretty little law lectures. Yes, looks like those fine ijm (they don't deserve to be capitalised) heroes are playing with a new campaign methodology.

"Rescue me rescue me the girls cry" Except its not to be rescued by ijm.

Its to be rescued FROM their sad playing god clutches, as those wonderful ijm boys behaving like men, have successfully taken away the girls job and means of livelihood in the sweet saintly efforts to change the world.

On on. Wait. Thats right. They now have seamstress jobs. LOL

Nvslim
07-18-13, 09:28
If this is such a crack down why haven't we heard of bar raids in Manila? Seems they would try to clean up the capital first. Would they be stepping on powerful toes?

Are the cops also busting the local Pinay bars in A. C. Or just the tourists area bars? What about the Korean owned bars?

Too many questions about the targeting.

Slim

OralFanatic
07-18-13, 10:52
Take all this legal information with a grain of salt; we are talking about the Philippines after all.

This Philippine legislation was passed in 1992. The comments being discussed here about the '10 year age difference' are contained in Article VI.

http://www.lawphil.net/statutes/repacts/ra1992/ra_7610_1992.html

However, the legislation specifically refers to a 'minor' (and someone more than 10 years older) and for the legal age of majority in the PI you can read here.

http://www.wipo.int/wipolex/en/text.jsp?file_id=225741#LinkTarget_5988

Chapter 2 specifically lists the age of majority as 21. I'm not an attorney, but I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night and my interpretation of the law is that technically, if the girl is under 21 and you are more than 10 years older than her, the law would apply. If she is above 21 she is NOT a minor; period. Again, this IS the Philippines. That addresses the 'minor' issue but not the [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) aspect which appears to be the motive behind the raids.

Harry the Horse has some comments in his website about meetings between some of the bar owners and the AC Mayors representative. Some key comments from the meeting; 'Stop the barfines or be raided', '[CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) must stop', 'Plans to reduce number of bars to 40 only'.

There is definitely something underway in the form of a crackdown but it really is hard to decipher all the conflicting information. I've done quite a bit of research (I'm planning a September or October trip) and have read numerous articles tying the crackdown to different aspects of US financial assistance, most of which I could not confirm. The one thing I could confirm is that the Philippines was in danger of being downgrade to a 'Tier 2 Watchlist' under the US Trafficking in Persons report. They were able to retain their Tier 2 status which assures the PI that they will continue to receive the $1.2 million in yearly funding to combat [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908). The Tier 2 watchlist would have eliminated the $1.2 million in funding and a Tier 3 status would have involved sanctions against the PI.

I've found some tourism numbers that indicate the PI may see about $7.6 billion USD yearly in sex tourism. It makes perfect sense to me that the PI would be willing to forego $7.6 billion in revenue to continue to receive the $1.2 million in US aid. If you happen to be in a bar during one of these armed raids, exercise caution and keep your feet away from those of the Filipinos; they might miss their own foot and hit yours.

I'll be in AC in late September or early October regardless.

Pute Nut
07-19-13, 00:58
Chapter 2 specifically lists the age of majority as 21. I'm not an attorney, but I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night and my interpretation of the law is that technically, if the girl is under 21 and you are more than 10 years older than her, the law would apply. If she is above 21 she is NOT a minor; period. Again, this IS the Philippines. That addresses the 'minor' issue but not the [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) aspect which appears to be the motive behind the raids.O. F.

It is correct that the age of majority WAS twenty-one years of age. It was, however, lowered to eighteen (the current age of majority) in 1989 (please see RA 6809, Sec. 1).

Python75
07-19-13, 01:23
chapter 2 specifically lists the age of majority as 21. i'm not an attorney, but i did stay at a holiday inn express last night and my interpretation of the law is that technically, if the girl is under 21 and you are more than 10 years older than her, the law would apply. if she is above 21 she is not a minor; period. again, this is the philippines. that addresses the 'minor' issue but not the [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) aspect which appears to be the motive behind the raids.the age of majority should not be confused with the age of sexual consent. typically the age of majority refers to a legal concept whereby the individual is considered a fully fledged adult and as such is recognized by law to be an adult, capable of managing his or her own affairs and responsible for any legal obligations created by his or her actions and it may vary depending upon the nature of the activity in which the person is engaged. in the usa for example, in the same state the age of majority for driving may be 16 while that for drinking alcoholic beverages is 21. again, in the uk, for example, you cannot inherit under the terms of a trust until you reach the age of 21, you cannot buy alcohol for consumption until you reach the age of 18, and the age of sexual consent for hetrosexual relations is 16.

the age of sexual consent in the philippines is 18 but can be quite complex. sex with any child under the age of 12 is classified as statutory [CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123). sex with someone over the age of 12 but less than 18 is permissible as long as the age difference between the two is less than 10 years. thus a 20 year old can have sex with a 15 year old but a 26 year old cannot have sex with a 15 year old. as long as the girl is aged 18 and above then it does not matter what age the male is.

under international and community concern, the philippines government made 18 changes to the age of consent laws in the philippines between 2007 to 2009. one of the major changes was the updated anti-[CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) act which now states there is no age of consent for anyone trafficked into prostitution. although under filipino law a child is someone under the age of 18, everyone is classified as a child that is trafficked and that means that all prostitutes are now defined as children under the law regardless of that prostitute's age.

MathewCob
07-19-13, 03:12
the age of sexual consent in the philippines is 18 but can be quite complex. sex with any child under the age of 12 is classified as statutory [CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123). sex with someone over the age of 12 but less than 18 is permissible as long as the age difference between the two is less than 10 years. thus a 20 year old can have sex with a 15 year old but a 26 year old cannot have sex with a 15 year old. as long as the girl is aged 18 and above then it does not matter what age the male is.

under international and community concern, the philippines government made 18 changes to the age of consent laws in the philippines between 2007 to 2009. one of the major changes was the updated anti-[CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) act which now states there is no age of consent for anyone trafficked into prostitution. although under filipino law a child is someone under the age of 18, everyone is classified as a child that is trafficked and that means that all prostitutes are now defined as children under the law regardless of that prostitute's age..you claim the age of sexual consent is 18, then with the same breath you claim someone who is 20 is legal to have sex with a 15 year old. the 15 year old is **** regardless of how old the guy might be so totally illegal.

your claim of any person accepting money for sexual services is classed as a minor regardless of age is correct, and this is the law we should all fear when mongering in the philippines,

as someone previously said, this is the philippines, if the authorities want a conviction they get it regardless of guilty or not.

MathewCob
07-19-13, 03:31
Harry the Horse has some comments in his website about meetings between some of the bar owners and the AC Mayors representative. Some key comments from the meeting; 'Stop the barfines or be raided', '[CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) must stop', 'Plans to reduce number of bars to 40 only'.

There is definitely something underway in the form of a crackdown but it really is hard to decipher all the conflicting information. I've done quite a bit of research (I'm planning a September or October trip) and have read numerous articles tying the crackdown to different aspects of US financial assistance, most of which I could not confirm. The one thing I could confirm is that the Philippines was in danger of being downgrade to a 'Tier 2 Watchlist' under the US Trafficking in Persons report.

Yes Harry the horse who is a very respected 20+ year resident of Angeles City, a hotels and bar owner who has a montly newsletter on all things angeles, here is the link to the harry the horse comments in which he states that all bars in angeles have been ordered some time ago to ban barfines or face their bar being raided and closed, hence the many bar raids recently of those who though they were above the law.

http://www.harrythehorse.asia/?p=7862

MathewCob
07-19-13, 04:21
3 more Angeles City bars were raided last night,

Angel Witch Bar, Voodoo Bar, and Devil Witch Bar have all been raided and closed down.

Ekspat
07-19-13, 09:28
So why have we not seen any prosecutions in the context that you argue?Was my thinking as well. I doubt that the cops would have missed this golden opportunity to make some extra cash.

Western787
07-19-13, 10:18
that means that all prostitutes are now defined as children under the law regardless of that prostitute's age.Meaning all sex tourists are now child molesters, which is what the do-gooders have been claiming all along.

E Z Rhino
07-19-13, 12:50
Meaning all sex tourists are now child molesters, which is what the do-gooders have been claiming all along

Maybe all terrorists too. Maybe they're all armed with weapons of mass destruction. Maybe they should all be rendered to Guantanamo and tortured by waterboarding.

Or maybe consenting adults should be allowed to behave as they please. That's my vote. I'll take my chances in my afterlife, and my karma. You lot mind you own f*cking business.

"Puritanism. The haunting fear that someone, somewhere, may be happy."

How exactly to you get to, all prostitutes = trafficked? I see they're skipping over something logically there.

So what am I flying into this weekend folks? Rain, empty streets, empty bars? Can't I at least get some ST service in the back room?

Can I make some off color jokes at the do-gooders' expense? Here's one I saw on a bathroom wall...
"Jesus is coming!" and then underneath some wag had added "... get a towel!"

Here's another. A man is on his deathbed. The priest asks him "Do you renounce Satan?" The man says "Padre, I don't think this is a good time for me to make any new enemies!"

OK last one. Family seated at the dinner table. Father begins reciting grace. Son interrupts him "Daddy, can't you just say the short prayer?" Father says "what do you mean the short prayer". And the son says "Well I was walking past your bedroom door last night, and you shouted 'God! I'm coming!' and then momma shouted 'Jesus Christ! Wait for me!'"

To summarize: bugger all. I'll report back from the field shortly.

Wicked Roger
07-19-13, 14:30
3 more Angeles City bars were raided last night,

Angel Witch Bar, Voodoo Bar, and Devil Witch Bar have all been raided and closed down.For fire violations MCobb. And based on the copy and paste in the Stickman board you were in AC for 20 days so we are waiting for the FRs of your exploits, the bar fines your paid, the girls you shagged and the photos.

http://www.harrythehorse.asia/?p=7878

Read the article as HTH has his views and has contacts.

Maybe MC is working not for IJM gents but for the Thai Tourist Board LOL

MathewCob
07-19-13, 16:09
Three more bars on Fields Avenue Angeles City ordered to be closed down last night.

Angel Witch Bar, Voodoo Bar, Devil Witch bar.

Mongerman69
07-19-13, 16:51
3 more Angeles City bars were raided last night,

Angel Witch Bar, Voodoo Bar, and Devil Witch Bar have all been raided and closed down.Can anyone confirm this?

Python75
07-19-13, 17:31
you claim the age of sexual consent is 18, then with the same breath you claim someone who is 20 is legal to have sex with a 15 year old. the 15 year old is **** regardless of how old the guy might be so totally illegal.

your claim of any person accepting money for sexual services is classed as a minor regardless of age is correct, and this is the law we should all fear when mongering in the philippines,

as someone previously said, this is the philippines, if the authorities want a conviction they get it regardless of guilty or not.read my post again. the age of sexual consent in the philippines is complex. on the filipino statute book the age of sexual consent is 12. the youngest in asia. statutory [CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123) is the crime that someone can be charged with if they have sex with a person who has not reached the age of consent, but who agrees to have sex. that is why sex with under 12s is statutory [CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123).

http://www.sexlaws.org/changing_age_of_consent_consent_from_12_to_16_in_philipines_meets_with_some_resistance

http://www.atimes.com/atimes/south_asia/je31df03.html

however, interpol regard the age of consent in the philippines as 18. you will also be aware that many western countries (usa, australia, uk) in an attempt to stamp out the sexual exploitation of minors make it a criminal offence for their nationals to have sex abroad with minors. that is why interpol regard the age of consent in the philippines as 18. and that is why i would argue, in the spirit of this forum, that the age of consent in the philippines is 18. my original post stands.

Liggi1
07-19-13, 18:20
Can anyone confirm this?Yes, thats right.

MathewCob
07-19-13, 19:00
For fire violations MCobb. And based on the copy and paste in the Stickman board you were in AC for 20 days so we are waiting for the FRs of your exploits, the bar fines your paid, the girls you shagged and the photos.

http://www.harrythehorse.asia/?p=7878

Read the article as HTH has his views and has contacts.

Maybe MC is working not for IJM gents but for the Thai Tourist Board LOLWr,

Put down the whisky bottle and read what I say sober, as stated before the stickman report was written by me so I do not get your copy and paste rubbish.

Only two days spent in Angeles out of 20 days in the Philippines and they were two days too many honestly, but hit the bars heavily with my many friends, contacts on both days, I am a 20+ year monger, most of the others were either long time Angeles residents or ex Bangkok resident, some ex bar owners, so between us many years of mongering experiance, most of us speak passable to good Tagalog, Atlantis / dollhouse / club Asia, the-club, Carousel, Voodoo, Pony Tails were all visited for a few drinks by our group,

What we found was out of the many bars we visited not one single bar offered a barfine option, not through the bar, the mamasun, the bargirls even when spoken to in their own language so they would feel more comfortable in our company, basically zero barfines available for the whole group.

Lucky I have many ex girlfriends (non bargirls) on my phones memory that live near to Angeles that were willing to keep my bed warm for the nights I was there, so not so bad after all.

Now that you got my trip report you can make a start on trying to rubbish that too mr shill LOL

Key Master
07-19-13, 19:44
if you look at the name on the stickman post you are refering to you will see that it is written by mathew, does that tell you something, yes i wrote it, duhhhhh.i stopped reading your website a long time ago with quite a few other people for a reason. what are you doing in the philippines?

and in regards to harry the horse, the man writing the stuff is a very nice older man. i've actually met him. he's nice, but he also has a little problem with alcohol i thought so it's kind of hard to tell what he really thinks and what's what. i am not saying that things don't look down a little bit in ac, but i do think most of it is because there is a new sheriff in town looking to [CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123) the foreigners for some cash to play. nothing new in a red light district, what do you expect? i think in a way that it's great that he is scaring all these people away in a way and now we got the negative stickman here! holy shit!

MathewCob
07-20-13, 04:01
i stopped reading your website a long time ago with quite a few other people for a reason. what are you doing in the philippines?

and in regards to harry the horse, the man writing the stuff is a very nice older man. i've actually met him. he's nice, but he also has a little problem with alcohol i thought so it's kind of hard to tell what he really thinks and what's what. i am not saying that things don't look down a little bit in ac, but i do think most of it is because there is a new sheriff in town looking to [CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123) the foreigners for some cash to play. nothing new in a red light district, what do you expect? i think in a way that it's great that he is scaring all these people away in a way and now we got the negative stickman here! holy shit!i think your totally confused and need to read the post slowly and carefully before jumping to comment,

please tell me how you have confused me (mathew) writing a trip report for the stickman site and posting my trip report in the stickmans readers column, with stickman writing the trip report, the piece clearly states written by mathew.

stickman is stickman and mathew is mathew, two different people, duhhhh.

now stickman has stated many times that he has never visited the philippines and has no desire to visit.

thanks.

Member #4566
07-20-13, 05:10
As I walk along Fields and inquire of the greeters on the outside of the bars the cost of a barfine, I am told that there are no more barfines. What in the world? Apparently the police are no longer allowing barfines. I am told however that you can negotiate a price with the girl. Apparently barfines are going underground for a while.

Garry Smith
07-20-13, 06:59
Three more bars on fields avenue Angeles city ordered to be closed down last night.

Angel witch bar, Voodoo bar, Devil witch bar.Same owner. Whats the reason of close down bro?

MathewCob
07-20-13, 07:45
Same owner. Whats the reason of close down bro?Yes your correct, all three bars belong to the same group, the official reason was they did not have the correct fire certificates.

In my view a load of bullshit because the relevent bars would not have been issued their yearly trading licenses without having the correct fire certificates in place.

At a guess, I would say that the powers that be want to shut this group down permanently and are finding different ways to hassle the owners, if this does not work then they will send the big boys in (human traffic team / Manilla special unit)

As I have said in the past, the mayor / police / special unit want to rid angeles of barfines / prostitution and possibly in the end close down all the bars of angeles, but thats just my view.

Pip Jaeger
07-20-13, 11:51
three more bars on fields avenue angeles city ordered to be closed down last night.

angel witch bar, voodoo bar, devil witch bar.
same owner. whats the reason of close down bro?one of my girls just told me that they were closed for fire code violations; a faulty exit sign in one case. considering the tragic hotel fire in subic earlier this year, it makes me wonder if someone in the city government was cunning enough to use this sardonic approach on a few of the dryden groups' bars. in any event, same result as any raid; bars are closed and time for dave to pay up (again).

on another note, my girl also said that insomnia was also raided the night before last (can anyone confirm?) , but she left the area with a few of her gf's to go watch a movie and didn't know the reason or the outcome. she also said that several of the girls she knows are considering going to subic to work and others are contemplating taking some time off and going home for a few weeks; at least until things settle down. many of the girls are afraid of being taken into custody; some have had friends who were arrested and had to "perform" for their captors as part of the deal for getting released. one (20 years old; who is very small, thin and exceptionally pretty) claims to have been approached by an officer with regards to setting up an old scam; the knock on the door, you're under arrest for having an "****" girl in your room, but we'll let you go if you donate xx, xxx pesos to our benevolence fund. she was at least smart enough to tell him she'd think about it and get back to him in a few days; after her release she hightailed it back to her province.

Western787
07-20-13, 14:45
How exactly to you get to, all prostitutes = trafficked? I see they're skipping over something logically there.My comment was is response to what Python stated. However as for the larger issue, the worldwide war against "[CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908)" at this point is in the nature of a witch hunt, and typical of such hysterias, the proponents can just make things up as they go along. Who's going to stop them from doing this? The press? The press in fact continues to all but ignore the biggest issue related to sexual "[CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908)" which is western gay men traveling to Asian countries to find and molest young boys, a true disgusting "scourge" if there ever was one. Instead the campaign is now about expanding the definition of [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) to among other things (18 or over adult) bar girls who now by definition purportedly HAVE to be "victims" of trafficking regardless of whether they think they are or not and regardless of consent. Its total BS of course, but it allows the NGOs to keep getting funding and politicians like Hillary Clinton to work this issue, and now huge amounts of dollars are now being provided by people such as Australian billionaire Gina Rinehart and many other wealthy elites. The NGO's and State can't get away with this BS in Thailand, but apparently they see the Philippines now as a ripe target.

X Man
07-20-13, 15:34
You've lost me in the first four words dude. I know WR, and he is the "nurse that bottle of beer" type. I'd bet he's refined enough to know a good whiskey, but you try to undermine his message by suggesting he drinks too much. If you spew defamation in the first four words, do you really think anyone is willing to believe anything else you write? X.


Wr,

Put down the whisky bottle and read what I say sober, as stated before the stickman report was written by me so I do not get your copy and paste rubbish.

Only two days spent in Angeles out of 20 days in the Philippines and they were two days too many honestly, but hit the bars heavily with my many friends, contacts on both days, I am a 20+ year monger, most of the others were either long time Angeles residents or ex Bangkok resident, some ex bar owners, so between us many years of mongering experiance, most of us speak passable to good Tagalog, Atlantis / dollhouse / club Asia, the-club, Carousel, Voodoo, Pony Tails were all visited for a few drinks by our group,

What we found was out of the many bars we visited not one single bar offered a barfine option, not through the bar, the mamasun, the bargirls even when spoken to in their own language so they would feel more comfortable in our company, basically zero barfines available for the whole group.

Lucky I have many ex girlfriends (non bargirls) on my phones memory that live near to Angeles that were willing to keep my bed warm for the nights I was there, so not so bad after all.

Now that you got my trip report you can make a start on trying to rubbish that too mr shill LOL

Pip Jaeger
07-20-13, 18:55
My comment was is response to what Python stated. However as for the larger issue, the worldwide war against "[CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908)" at this point is in the nature of a witch hunt, and typical of such hysterias, the proponents can just make things up as they go along. Who's going to stop them from doing this? The press? The press in fact continues to all but ignore the biggest issue related to sexual "[CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908)" which is western gay men traveling to Asian countries to find and molest young boys, a true disgusting "scourge" if there ever was one. Instead the campaign is now about expanding the definition of [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) to among other things (18 or over adult) bar girls who now by definition purportedly HAVE to be "victims" of trafficking regardless of whether they think they are or not and regardless of consent. Its total BS of course, but it allows the NGOs to keep getting funding and politicians like Hillary Clinton to work this issue, and now huge amounts of dollars are now being provided by people such as Australian billionaire Gina Rinehart and many other wealthy elites. The NGO's and State can't get away with this BS in Thailand, but apparently they see the Philippines now as a ripe target.A bit off topic, but the "trafficking" issue is a side effect; the main cause is poverty and in many areas, extreme poverty. If the politicians / public officials would worry less about lining their pockets and more about their constituents then perhaps something can be truly done to reduce the trafficking of their citizens.

http://globalnation.inquirer.net/58823/philippines-remains-one-of-most-corrupt-countries-survey

IMHO several NGO's are probably responsible (at least in part) for the current situation in AC. It's also probably safe to speculate that they are the recipient of illicit funds given to them to cover some politician's tracks; or least moneys that were granted to make themselves look good.

http://www.philstar.com/headlines/2013/07/20/991081/coa-pork-barrel-anomaly-bigger-p10-b

And that 10 billion is just a small drop in large lake. Plenty of other forms of graft and corruption; a UN report (albeit from 1998; pg 504) estimated it at 1.4 trillion nationwide (I'm sure the number has come down some since then, but even if it's half it's still "serious money"); and those pesos could've bought a substantial amount of food and gone a long way in improving the educational system.

http://unpan1.un.org/intradoc/groups/public/documents/apcity/unpan019122.pdf

E Z Rhino
07-20-13, 19:31
Dear Father Cob,

I'm sorry to disappoint you, but. People are still having sex.

I'm here in AC. Business as usual here mate. I bar fined a young hottie just hours ago. And f-cked the red out of her hair. Try a woman for a change, instead of an altar boy.

People, this Father Matthew Cob is a troll. Filter him off, and move on.

MathewCob
07-21-13, 03:07
I'll be staying 2 weeks in Manila and want to head out to AC for one night just to check it out.

I don't do barfines or anything. Manly just pick up girls in regular clubs or try and shore some girls from FL spots.

Anyways, what is the disco / club scene like in AC? I assume there to be only like 1 or 2 in AC as most places are girly bars.

A nice club where regular girls go along with all the bar girls once they got off work would be great. Is there any such place?

A military guy I met that goes to AC told me about one place but I forgot the name.Sky Trax bar is the only freelancer bar, its on perimeter road, near to the main gate jeepney stop, gets going well after midnight, busy by 1-3 am.

E Z Rhino
07-21-13, 11:52
There have been a lot of rumors here lately about all the raids, and I am here to unveil the evil doers behind this plot. I have unearthed abundant evidence of an international syndicate, based in Italy, working constantly, in the Philippines (and many other countries) to control women in sexual slavery. They lure girls in at a very young age, even suborning their very parents into the recruitment, with glib false promises of rewards that the girls never see, while alive. Their scheme is breathtaking in its audacity and its reach, and even in its success to date.

I'm sure readers can guess the perpetrators of this plot. The Mafia? The Koreans? Hong Kong Triads? The Yakuza? Nope! I'm talking about the Catholic church. They are seeking to monopolize the supply of pussy. In their scheme, they lure vulnerable young women with false, or at least unproven, promises of a better life. In the next world. Once they take over a city or a country, they effectively control all the pussy. Pussy then becomes only available by marrying one of their women. In one of their churches. Where you are required to swear out an oath to sell your very children into the ponzi scheme. By controlling the women, they control the pussy. By controlling the pussy, they control the men. By controlling the men and women they control the children.

You may laugh, but already they have made inroads into AC, and into this very forum. Be warned, and be vigilant.

John Traveller
07-21-13, 13:24
Has the closure something to do with their names? Seems that city hall doesn't like devilish names.

Of course these are not koreaned owned.

Anyway, with the new regime it seems to me that the main problem will be for the bars to get any profit, and also to give the potentially customers any reason to go there. So not only the 40-limit will be a problem.


Three more bars on Fields Avenue Angeles City ordered to be closed down last night.

Angel Witch Bar, Voodoo Bar, Devil Witch bar.

Evil Penivel
07-21-13, 15:03
I was at the Cherry Bar in Pattaya last night and one of the other customers there had been in an AC bar when it was raided. He told the Cherry Bar's owner the customers hadn't been allowed to leave the bar for a long time. Not a pleasant way to spend your holiday time, especially since the customers didn't know whether they would be hauled away to a police station in Manila.

And there's a rather pessimistic undertone in a recent piece by Harry the Horse, a well-known AC blogger. He describes how the owners / licensees of 40 big AC bars were summoned to a meeting at the Mayor's office where an official impressed upon them the Mayor's determination to clamp down on prostitution.

Harry notes that there's been some opposition to the Mayor's plans from landlords / land owners of the Fields Avenue bars. That's a crucial factor. Unless there are concrete plans for "something else" (a casino?) to replace the bars, the landlords / land owners would suffer huge losses. All the businesses that supply and service the bars as well as hotels, restaurants, etc would also go down the drain. Depending on their combined political clout, the primary and secondary business owners might be able to stymie the Mayor's anti-bar crusade.

But there's no doubt that if the authorities want to shut down the scene in AC, they can do it overnight. The day they start hauling away customers is the day the music dies. Raids on bars and arrests of bar owners / managers have been a fact of life for years in AC. It seems things have heated up considerably in recent months, but so far, the customer has largely been left in peace. Should there be mass arrests of customers, even if those customers are released after a few hours, then the scene will dry up and wither away in a very short time. That would be the signal that policy has indeed changed and the raids are no longer motivated by demands for more tea money.

Of course, if the PI authorities wanted to frighten away mongers once and for all, they could simply bust a couple of them and then sentence them to long stretches in prison. That's not very likely, but it is certainly possible under the new anti-trafficking laws.

It's a bit of Pascal's wager when it comes to AC. What's the best thing that can happen if you choose AC over Pattaya? You save a few bucks when paying a girl for sex. What's the worst? You could end up doing a 20-year stint in prison for paying a girl for sex.

Evil Penivel
07-21-13, 15:29
You can read the full law here (http://www.gov.ph/2013/02/06/republic-act-no-10364/) on the Philippine government's Web site. SEC. 4. Acts of Trafficking in Persons, specifies that: "It shall be unlawful for any person, natural or juridical, to commit any of the following acts:"

With paragraph (e) the one that could be relevant for customers:

' (e) To maintain or hire a person to engage in prostitution or pornography;"

On its surface, the Philippine law does indeed give police and prosecutors the legal basis for pursuing customers of prostitutes. It doesn't matter whether it's an EWR or a girl you meet through Date In Asia. As long as money changes hands for sexual services, it's against Philippine law.

The amended law further states:

'SEC. 10. Penalties and Sanctions.

' (a) Any person found guilty of committing any of the acts enumerated in Section 4 shall suffer the penalty of imprisonment of twenty (20) years and a fine of not less than One million pesos (P1, 000, 000. 00) but not more than Two million pesos (P2, 000, 000. 00);"

But again, a law on paper never put anyone in jail. It will depend on the will of the police to enforce it as well as the interpretation which prevails in the courts. A friend who's just been in AC told me they had cracked down sharply on the euphemistically named free-lance scene, but that's only a positive thing and long overdue.

And it's pretty scary how badly things can end up for foreigners convicted under the trafficking law. Check out this story:

Swedes sentenced to life in prison for Filipino cyber-brothel (http://scandasia.com/swedes-convicted-to-life-in-prison-for-filipino-cyber-brothel/)

Evil

Wicked Roger
07-21-13, 21:28
Perhaps pepole are aware of it, Emirates have started flights from London to Clark now, especially there are good deals from Gatwick, I am assuming that this is in response to competion to Cebu Pacific which flies from DubaiThere is also a large number of OFWs in the Middle East who live north of Manila. Both Emirates and Etihad have realized this. Cebu Pac is offering really good deals as is PAL to Dubai but the A320 seats are tight. OK for a short trip to HK, KL etc but IMHO very uncomfortable for larger men like myself.

ManonsanBoy
07-21-13, 22:16
It's a bit of Pascal's wager when it comes to AC. What's the best thing that can happen if you choose AC over Pattaya? You save a few bucks when paying a girl for sex. What's the worst? You could end up doing a 20-year stint in prison for paying a girl for sex.No need to go to AC; just stay away and let the place slow down. The Philippines can also legislate to make individual acts of money for sex is legal (like Hong Kong) but that would cut out the blood suckers and middle men.

Hatguy
07-22-13, 01:15
Even girls I've gone with before from Perimeter road bars are reluctant to go out. And the good bars are down to low numbers. I'm not going to say on open board where but the more popular bars is what I'm talking about. Not even going to go to fields this trip. No point.

Amazing changes in the month I've been away.

E Z Rhino
07-22-13, 05:45
I don't understand all these nervous nattering nellies about a couple raids. Is this the first raid ever? Didn't it come during the slack season? Will there never be another raid?

Nor do I understand conflating all this with a law that seems years old. There have been laws against prostitution here for far longer.

Mainly, does the law actually matter all that much? If they want to settle a turf war or someone is behind on their protection money, the police have long had or can invent plenty of reasons to mess with them.

What people seem to be forgetting here is the Golden Rule. That is the only rule that matters. And by this I mean 'The people with the gold make the rules'. Money talks, and bullshit walks. Last time I checked, this country was desperately poor. Are they really going to shut down a major tourist industry and source of billions of dollars in trade, just because some pederast priests promised them a reward in heaven? There's a reason prostitution is the world's oldest industry. Though maybe religion (as a commercial industry) comes second.

E Z Rhino
07-22-13, 05:51
Even girls I've gone with before from Perimeter road bars are reluctant to go out. And the good bars are down to low numbers. I'm not going to say on open board where but the more popular bars is what I'm talking about. Not even going to go to fields this trip. No point.

Amazing changes in the month I've been away.So look. I've only been here 3 days. Its my first visit. You have a lot more posts than me. I know its the slack season. But as far as I can see this town is still operating plenty fine. Laying on its back (or taking it doggy style). People are still having sex. I just busted a nut in a short time bar next to a church an hour ago. Yesterday I brought a girl back from Perimeter and gave her a nice knobbing. What am I missing here. Were people getting blowjobs behind every corner and fornicating in the middle of the walking street?

The only explanation I can think of is that all this rumor mongering is intended to scare away customers so the guys who spread all the fear can monopolize all the pussy.

E Z Rhino
07-22-13, 05:57
Thanks Ez Rhino for your trip report, as you are aiming to give noobies advice then at least get the correct advice,

The word for no in tagalog is not indi it is Hindi with a strong h sound at the beginning, I'm sure the beggars who you wanted to discourage did not understand a word of what you were saying with Indi, better words to use altogether is "wala salamat" rather than Hindi salamat,

For the benefit of noobies, paying 100 pesos to a trike driver in Angeles is being ripped off, the correct fare is 60 pesos for short journeys with 70 pesos for the longer ones say perimeter to fields, locals pay 50 pesos, no tip,

I look forward to the rest of your trip report.MathewCob, I know I've been a little hard on you and I apologize, if you will accept that. I appreciate your even handed response to my provocations. And hey, you just saved me 30 pesos on my last trike ride. I had been getting taken for a ride.

If you or anyone else notice any mistakes I am making, I invite a correction. I still feel this sub-forum is a bit sparse on hard information, but I suppose it can co-exist in between all the gossiping and quarreling.

FreebieFan
07-22-13, 07:33
I.

Last time I checked, this country was desperately poor. Are they really going to shut down a major tourist industry and source of billions of dollars in trade, just because some pederast priests promised them a reward in heaven? There's a reason prostitution is the world's oldest industry. Though maybe religion (as a commercial industry) comes second.Pederast priests. Surely there can't be such a thing. The catholic church is the moral compass of the nation. Telling all those poor Filipinas how to live and who to vote for. Surely the church can be trusted. If not then who can we trust.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/jul/21/gay-scandal-pope-francis-judgment

The church. Moral compass. ? A decaying mess leftover from Spanish days morelike.

FreebieFan
07-22-13, 07:49
, just because some pederast priests promised them a reward in heaven? There's a reason prostitution is the world's oldest industry. Though maybe religion (as a commercial industry) comes second.100, 000 victims. Now thats what the ijm do gooders should be focussing on. Let the priests worry about being raided.

http://ncronline.org/blogs/ncr-today/vatican-abuse-summit-22-billion-and-100000-victims-us-alone

Western787
07-22-13, 08:26
The problem is the NGO's. United Nations, USA State Dept and other entities have come up with model definitions or "protocols" of "[CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908)" that define the term so broadly that the enforcing country (following these protocols) can make it apply to almost anything the want. We are now entering the 5tth year of a USA State Dept controlled by hard core radical ball busting feminists and their male sympathizers, so what is happening is not surprising, with the ultimate (never completely achievable of course) goal to shutdown fully consentual adult to adult P4P worldwide, leaving only the wealthy elites with their high priced mistress arrangements largely unaffected by these new laws. Eventually you will see a backlash to the hysteria, but it could be years into the witch hunt, with by then many people already locked away in prison for years. Below are some typical definitions (emphasis added by me to problematic areas)

1. [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) is: the recruitment, transportation, transfer, harboring or receipt of persons:

By the threat or use of kidnapping, force, fraud, DECEPTION OR COERCION, or by the giving or receiving of unlawful payments or benefits to achieve the consent of a person having control over another person, and for the purpose of sexual exploitation or forced labor.

•The recruitment, transportation, transfer, harboring or receipt of persons:

Trafficking does not require transnational movement of persons; anyone can be a victim of [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908): documented and undocumented immigrants, migrant workers, US citizens and residents.

•By the threat or use of kidnapping, force, fraud, deception or coercion:

Trafficking can result from a real or perceived threat; the victim only has to believe that he / she or loved ones are in danger, they do not actually have to be in danger. The victim believes that if s / he does not do what the trafficker demands, regardless of the traffickers actual ability to follow through with said threat (s) , there will be dire (physical, financial, or other) consequences. Traffickers use a variety of techniques to control their victims. A hallmark of the criminal industry is the sophisticated use of psychological and financial control mechanisms, often minimizing or precluding the need for physical violence or confinement.

Or the trafficker actually does a harmful thing, causing the victim to reasonably believe s / he has no other choice but to do as the trafficker tells her / him.

•Or by the giving or receiving of unlawful payments or benefits to achieve the consent of a person having control over another person:

This means that the trafficker has given another person payment, of some kind, for the use of the victim. For example, a trafficker may pay an impoverished parent for their child or a smuggler may sell a person to a trafficker.

•For the purpose of sexual exploitation or forced labor:

This simply means that the trafficker uses the trafficked person for his / her personal monetary, or other gain.

http://www.humantraffickinged.com/#definitionhum




The Trafficking Protocol defines [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) as.

(a) [. ] the recruitment, transportation, transfer, harbouring or receipt of persons, by means of threat or use of force or other forms of coercion, of abduction, of fraud, of deception, of the abuse of power or a position of vulnerability or of the giving or receiving of payments or benefits to achieve the consent of a person having control over another person, for the purpose of exploitation. Exploitation shall include, at a minimum, the exploitation of the prostitution of others or other forms of sexual exploitation, forced labour or services, slavery or practices similar to slavery, servitude or the removal of organs;

("b") The consent of the victim of trafficking in persons to the intended exploitation set forth in subparagraph (a) of this article shall be irrelevant where any of the means set forth in subparagraph (a) have been used;

("c" The recruitment, transportation, transfer, harbouring or receipt of a child for the purpose of exploitation shall be considered 'trafficking in persons' even if this does not involve any of the means set forth in subparagraph (a) of this article;

("d") 'Child' shall mean any person under eighteen years of age.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_trafficking#Definition_and_usage

Western787
07-22-13, 08:33
100, 000 victims. Now thats what the ijm do gooders should be focussing on. Let the priests worry about being raided.

http://ncronline.org/blogs/ncr-today/vatican-abuse-summit-22-billion-and-100000-victims-us-aloneI like the part that says " 'Neither homosexual nor heterosexual orientation is a risk factor, ' they said, 'but rather, disordered or confused sexual orientation is a risk factor. '

Once again the Catholic Church not admitting gay priests being around young boys is a legitimate concern. Same with the [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) issue- they won't face up to where the major problem is.

E Z Rhino
07-22-13, 08:56
The problem is the NGO's. United Nations, USA State Dept and other entities have come up with model definitions or "protocols" of "[CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908)" that define the term so broadly that the enforcing country (following these protocols) can make it apply to almost anything the want.They do the same thing with the definition of terrorist. The state, the church, they just make it up as they go along. Total hypocrisy.

Western787
07-22-13, 09:10
Cobb is definitely onto something, but its still an open question how far they go with this charade. If they start busting sex tourists and put them into prison for hard time under "[CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908)" laws (aiding and abetting [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908)) for having sex with fully consenting adult bar girls, its game over in this locale. There has to be some other promised large payoff here (the USA military returning in force?) or something else that overrides the current interests. Even if they pull back on this campaign, it seems that damage has already been done. ABC Hotel or other businesses with big investments might as well pack it up as who will take the risk? There are too many other options.

Evil Penivel
07-22-13, 09:13
I don't understand all these nervous nattering nellies about a couple raids. Is this the first raid ever? Didn't it come during the slack season? Will there never be another raid?

Nor do I understand conflating all this with a law that seems years old. There have been laws against prostitution here for far longer.

Mainly, does the law actually matter all that much? If they want to settle a turf war or someone is behind on their protection money, the police have long had or can invent plenty of reasons to mess with them.

What people seem to be forgetting here is the Golden Rule. That is the only rule that matters. And by this I mean 'The people with the gold make the rules'. Money talks, and bullshit walks. Last time I checked, this country was desperately poor. Are they really going to shut down a major tourist industry and source of billions of dollars in trade, just because some pederast priests promised them a reward in heaven? There's a reason prostitution is the world's oldest industry. Though maybe religion (as a commercial industry) comes second.

You are mistaken on several points. The expanded Anti-Trafficking in Persons Act, or Republic Act 10364, was signed into law in February of this year and the most recent wave of raids in AC began in March. It gives the Philippines one of the toughest anti-trafficking laws and provides the legal basis for closing the AC commercial sex scene IF THE AUTHORITIES WANT IT SHUT DOWN. That's the key point. Should the authorities have the will and determination, the now have the means to clean up AC.

One big factor is the Philippines' status in the USA State Department's annual Trafficking in Persons Report. In June, the USA removed the Philippines from its trafficking watch list and gave the country a Tier 2 rating, which means it does not fully meet US stipulated standards on [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) but is making efforts to do so. It would be a source of national pride if the Philippines was upgraded to Tier 1, or full compliance, in the next report.

Closing down the bar scene in AC would be a high-profile and relatively easy way for the PI government to demonstrate its determination to put an end to the commercial sex scene. While AC bars generate a lot of money for their owners as well as other local businesses, it's a very, very small amount in terms of the overall Philippine economy. In 2012, total foreign tourism to the PI amounted to 4. 2 million and only a tiny fraction of them went to AC. Should the AC bars close down, it would be a disaster for the businesses which depend on bar-inspired tourism, but wouldn't have any impact on the national economy.

If the Mayor of AC has the backing of Malacañang (the presidential palace) and the police side wholeheartedly with the anti-bar crusade, then the bars are doomed. It won't happen overnight and it remains to be seen just how far the raids will go. As said, when customers start getting busted, then it's game over.

Thing is, which one of you wants to be the "sex tourist" the Philippine government uses to set an example by arresting and jailing him for paying a girl for sex?

Evil

E Z Rhino
07-22-13, 10:02
Maybe all of us here on this forum can be rolled up for um, conspiracy to aid and abet [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908). And for being terrorists. And for thoughtcrime. For even thinking about talking about cyber-sex services with the call centers in the Philippines... Let alone how I waxed that girl this morning...

Anyway we have a front row seat for how this turns out. I think some of the arguments are a bit strained. Crackdowns would hurt their entire tourist industry, not just the AC portion. Its just bad publicity for the country at the end of the day, and scares off tourists nationwide. I do like the AC scene, but there are hundreds of other places I'd be happy to take my tourist dollars if the Philippines shoot themselves in the foot here. I question if "demonstrating determination" (rah rah rah) is that important compared to national tourist industry. I reiterate that they could always have invented some means to shut down their sex industry. Furthermore the fact that they did so little in the past makes me skeptical that they've suddenly got a woodie for national pride, whatever that means (when compared to say, putting food on the table).

Last time I checked, politicians, in any country, at local through national level, sell out to the moneyed interests. You stopped short when you said the AC bars generate money for their owners. They also generate money for the police and the politicians. Probably this is nothing new, and boils down to whether the AC local authorities can pay enough lip service and token busts, to keep their federal government overlords happy, who in turn are pandering to international organizations.

Only other thought is the police might get excited about an opportunity to create a 'prison industrial complex' like the USA (highest incarceration rate in the world). But they'll run out of foreigners to bust pretty quick, and after that, they can't squeeze much money out of their locals. Especially after ruining their tourist industry.

Its all to easy to cobble together some kind of doomsday scenario for the AC scene, or the Philippines scene, or the global economy. People seem strident and not taking a balanced overview or considering counterarguments. Are they really going to win the 'war on prostitution'. I'll lay odds... Should work out just as successful as prohibition in the USA, or the 'war on drugs' or the 'war on poverty'.

E Z Rhino
07-22-13, 10:05
Thanks Ez Rhino for your trip report, as you are aiming to give noobies advice then at least get the correct advice,

The word for no in tagalog is not indi it is Hindi with a strong h sound at the beginning, I'm sure the beggars who you wanted to discourage did not understand a word of what you were saying with Indi, better words to use altogether is "wala salamat" rather than Hindi salamat, Not to put too fine a point on things, but I'm not sure I said beggars. In fact, I gave money to nearly every beggar I saw. (Which some would consider a mistake as well). As far as merchants, they seemed to understand Indi, but I'll go with Wala next time. Cheers.

MathewCob
07-22-13, 10:11
evil penivel, i agree with almost all that you say and your facts are spot on,

unfortunately under huge pressure from the usa the philippine government have passed down clear instructions to the angeles mayor and the manilla task force to clean up angeles city of prostitution ([CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908)) once and for good, they have been given the tools and are almost complete in their task,

for the guys who say that they will never clean up angeles or that its only a little blip and will pass then look at what the same task force has acheived in a very small amount of time in cambodia,

a few short years ago very near to phnom penh, the capitol of cambodia existed an area called "sway pak" where everything was on offer, from ****philia to you name what (this is where the british singer was arrested for having sex with 12 year olds) this area was raided and bulldozed down in just one day, the many other girly bars of phnom penh (legal age girls) were shut down en mass in just a few weeks, all thats left is a few very small bars that allow a handful of freelancers to hang out,

manila a few short years ago was a hive of bars offering prostitution all over manila, again there was the will to clean the area up and now all that is left is mainly 1 freelance bar,

now some are saying prostitution in angeles will never end because the girls are poor and need the mongers money is wishful thinking, cambodia is much poorer and the prostitution has been totally cleaned up, the prostitutes of a few years ago working in the manila bars were also dirt poor but along came the new mayor and closed the lot down,

as i say angeles just a few short years ago was a great place to visit, going back even further it rivalled even pattaya as a destination to have fun, roll on today and i cannot see any reason to visit what so ever, the main bars with the cutie girls on fields all refuse to allow barfine and as of the few little bars dotted around perimeter that have the older, not so in demand girls are being raided and closed down almost daily,

the philippines government, the police, the mayor and the us led task force have all but completed their mission in angeles, who in their right mind would fly half way around the world at great expense to hear "no i no go on barfine" and if by a miracle a punter does find a girl that out of desperation is willing to take the risk and barfine not only is she taking a risk with her freedom over the next 20 odd years but so is the punter who pays her.

thanks.

Western787
07-22-13, 10:27
apparently before the radicals took over complete control of the usa dept of justice, according to a 2009 usa department of justice report, there were 1, 229 suspected [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) incidents in the united states from january 2007- september 2008. of these. 83 percent were sex trafficking cases, though only 9% of all cases could be confirmed as examples of [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908). so that's 1020 cases suspected with only 111 cases supposedly confirmed



then you go to the ngo where as usual the hysteria is prevalent:



[CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) worldwide:

•[CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) is a $32,000,000,000 per year industry and is tied with drugs for the most profitable criminal endeavor, having past illegal weapons. .

•27,000,000 people in modern-day slavery around the world.

•800,000 people trafficked across international borders every year. 3 50% are children4, 80% are women and girls.

•1,000,000 children exploited by the international sex trade.

•70% of female victims are trafficked into the sex trade. 30% into forced labor.

•161 countries have been identified as being affected by [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908), including 127 countries of origin. 98 transit countries. 137 destination countries.

domestic minor sex trafficking in the united states:

•there are 100,000 to 300,000 **** girls being sold for sex in america.

•the average age of entry into prostitution is 12-14 years old.

•50,000 women and children are trafficked into the united states each year.

•1 out of every 3 teens on the street will be lured toward prostitution within 48 hours of running away from home.

•minor victims were sold an average of 10-15 times a day. 6 days a week.

•1 out of 5 pornographic images is of a child.

•the sale of child pornography has become a $3 billion dollar industry.

•over 100,000 websites offer child pornography.

•55 percent of internet child pornography comes from the united states.

http://trafficking.org/learn/statistics.aspx

E Z Rhino
07-22-13, 10:41
Then you go to the NGO where as usual the hysteria is prevalent:

[CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) Worldwide:

•[CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) is a $32, 000, 000, 000 per year industry and is tied with drugs for the most profitable criminal endeavor, having past illegal weapons. .

•27, 000, 000 people in modern-day slavery around the world.

http://trafficking.org/learn/statistics.aspxClearly I'm missing out on my share.

Sex is a misdemeanor. The more I miss, the meaner I get!

E Z Rhino
07-22-13, 18:15
The clean up is nearly completeSure... and I'm holding my breath, its time for the second coming.

This sounds a bit optimistic. I was just there. Got my wick nice and wet.

Well, in a way I had my second coming.


The Philippines government, the police, the mayor and the us led task force have all but completed their mission in angeles, who in their right mind would fly half way around the world at great expense to hear "no I no go on barfine" and if by a miracle a punter does find a girl that out of desperation is willing to take the risk and barfine not only is she taking a risk with her freedom over the next 20 odd years but so is the punter who pays her.This was not my experience at all, as of 12 hours ago. I have to question your recent arrival, your small number of posts, and whether you are there now, as I was.


For the guys who say that they will never clean up angeles or that its only a little blip and will pass then look at what the same task force has acheived (sic) in a very small amount of time in Cambodia...You sound happy about it. Well, all thats left is to mop up the following places and your work will be done...

Western Africa. Algeria Benin Burkina Faso Cape Verde Gambia. Ghana. Guinea. Guinea-Bissau. Ivory Coast. Liberia. Mali. Mauritania. Morocco. Niger Nigeria. Sao Tome & Principe. Senegal. Sierra Leone. Togo. Tunisia. Western Sahara Northeastern Africa Chad Djibouti Egypt Eritrea Ethiopia Libya Sudan Central Africa Burundi Angola Cameroon Central African Republic Democratic Republic of the Congo Equatorial Guinea Gabon Kenya Malawi Republic of the Congo Rwanda Somalia Tanzania Uganda Zambia Southern Africa Botswana Comoros Lesotho Madagascar Mauritius Mayotte Mozambique Namibia Seychelles South Africa Swaziland Zimbabwe Kenya Belize Costa Rica El Salvador Guatemala Honduras Nicaragua Panama Cuba Dominican Republic Haiti Jamaica Lesser Antilles Puerto Rico West Indies Canada Mexico Albania Armenia Austria Azerbaijan Belarus Belgium Bosnia and Herzegovina Bulgaria Croatia Cyprus Czech Republic Denmark Estonia Finland France Georgia Germany FKK Clubs Greece Hungary Iceland Ireland Italy Latvia Lithuania Luxembourg Macedonia Malta Moldova Monaco Montenegro Netherlands Norway Poland Portugal Romania Russia Scotland Serbia Slovakia Slovenia Spain Sweden Switzerland Turkey Ukraine United Kingdom Bahrain Iran Iraq Israel Jordan Kuwait Lebanon Oman Qatar Saudi Arabia Syria United Arab Emirates Yemen Afghanistan Bangladesh Bhutan Brunei Burma Cambodia China Hong Kong India Indonesia Japan Kazakhstan Kyrgyzstan Laos Macau Malaysia Mongolia Nepal North Korea Pakistan The Philippines Singapore South Korea Sri Lanka Taiwan Tajikistan Thailand Turkmenistan Uzbekistan Vietnam Australia Fiji Guam New Zealand Polynesia Vanuatu Other Pacific Islands

Member #4698
07-22-13, 18:24
Cambodia is much poorer and the prostitution has been totally cleaned upAre you fucking real! Cambodia is still going strong. Prices are up, but that is mostly due to the influx of more tourists willing to pay top dollar. The current ST rate for quality 104 St bar girls is $30. 5 years ago the average rate was 20$ for LT. The girls have just gotten spoiled, that's all. Congrats Mat. You are now on my ignore list.

MathewCob
07-22-13, 18:47
Are you fucking serious! Cambodia is still going strong. Prices are up, but that is mostly due to the influx of more tourists willing to pay top dollar. The current ST rate for quality 104 St bar girls is now $30. Congrats Mat. You are now on my ignore list.Correct me if I'm wrong, the bars on street 51 and street 136 (main bar roads of Phnom Penh) are all freelance bars now, the girls come and go as they please, no girls work for the bar so there is no barfines.

The chicken farms down at the docks and blue mountain which were the two areas of sihanoukville have been closed down long ago, the very few bars that are on the hill have very few freelancers available.

How can you say that you disagree with what is clearly there for all to see and witness with their own eyes,.

Anyways we are straying well off topic, so back to Angeles and no barfines.

Mackin
07-22-13, 20:40
normally i would not get involved but with this converstaion about sex and slavery but i have a few thoughts?

1. 27, 000, 000 in slavery every day. i wonder how many of these are in the muslum countries where woman are second class. just read about norweigan who was thrown in jail after being raped and reporting it. seems she had sex without being married. duh? released now to go home after her embassy got involved. anyway, why are we not complaining about muslun countriues. i guess oil is more important!

2. its all hillary. really, her position on womans right and sex slaves are the same. ? i didn't know that. remember it is the religous right, republican party in u. s that are the pushers here. in my opinion they are the american version of the talaban. obama has very little to do with the religous right evangelical group. after all, they are the conservatives.

is there trafficing out there? sure there is and using minors is the lowers form of life. but for some reason i believe after many vacation in the pi's, the raids seems to be more about the payoffs to the powers that be and the catholic churchs influence. just my opinion

just some food for thought. no responce necessary as it will be ignored.

Pip Jaeger
07-22-13, 21:41
sky trax bar is the only freelancer barwrong, there's also high society on fields ave and a couple others nearby that are on and right off of macarthur hwy (can't recall the names).


.

you sound happy about it. well, all thats left is to mop up the following places and your work will be done.

western africa algeria benin burkina faso """"""""" vanuatu other pacific islands.you left out the good ol' usa, but wait, the usa doesn't have any problems with [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908), prostitution or ****philia, lol. we only like to point our fingers elsewhere and throw money at the problem; then get on a soapbox and tell others how to behave in accordance with our own "high standards", hahaha

WazWallaby
07-22-13, 23:23
Guys, is that it? The game is up and we all, at the stroke of a pen, are sex trafficking crimes?

Hard to believe, but my reading of the forum forces me to pull out an atlas and wonder, where, oh where does a fun loving mongerer go now? Pattaya? Oh my good gawd!

Really, I am finding it very very difficult to conceive of life without a delicious LBFM to help start another day in the tropics, and a different one tomorrow, and another the day after that! Boo Hoo.

I hope someone will tell me ain't so.

Wicked Roger
07-23-13, 01:41
This sounds a bit optimistic. I was just there. Got my wick nice and wet.

Well, in a way I had my second coming.

This was not my experience at all, as of 12 hours ago. I have to question your recent arrival, your small number of posts, and whether you are there now, as I was.EZ,

We all forget that despite protestations by MCobb that he spent 20 days in the Philippines (see earlier FR) some of which were in AC, he has never been anywhere near Asia. He is sitting typing with one finger wishing he could. As has been commented by me and others, he writes on a mongers board his evangelical stuff without posting any FRs on his monger experience so as one posted said he is likely a PPearl again.

As of other experience in AC also, they can also bar fine and enjoy a lady's company but MC does not know that as he has never been to AC as if he had he would have FRs and photos.

He maybe a poster boy for the Thai Tourist Board. One wonders why the USA does not get stuck into Thailand (no need to answer that!) what with the nude bars etc. AC s tame by comparison, in fact boring. And when the US military arrive in full force life will be back to normal as someone said recently.

Only a second coming? LOL

FreebieFan
07-23-13, 01:51
you left out the good ol' usa, but wait, the usa doesn't have any problems with [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908), prostitution or ****philia, lol. we only like to point our fingers elsewhere and throw money at the problem; then get on a soapbox and tell others how to behave in accordance with our own "high standards", hahahayou said it and said it well. yeah the us has no problems at all. everything there is truly perfect and with that comes the right to indeed tell everyone else how to behave. not not not.

FreebieFan
07-23-13, 01:54
apparently before the radicals took over complete control of the usa dept of justice, according to a 2009 usa department of justice report, there were 1, 229 suspected [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) incidents in the united states from january 2007- september 2008. of these. 83 percent were sex trafficking cases, though only 9% of all cases could be confirmed as examples of [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908). so that's 1020 cases suspected with only 111 cases supposedly confirmed

then you go to the ngo where as usual the hysteria is prevalent:

[CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) worldwide:

•[CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) is a $32, 000, 000, 000 per year industry and is tied with drugs for the most profitable criminal endeavor, having past illegal weapons. .

•27, 000, 000 people in modern-day slavery around the world.

•800, 000 people trafficked across international borders every year. 3 50% are children4, 80% are women and girls.

•1, 000, 000 children exploited by the international sex trade.

•70% of female victims are trafficked into the sex trade. 30% into forced labor.

•161 countries have been identified as being affected by [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908), including 127 countries of origin. 98 transit countries. 137 destination countries.

domestic minor sex trafficking in the united states:

•there are 100, 000 to 300, 000 **** girls being sold for sex in america.

•the average age of entry into prostitution is 12-14 years old.

•50, 000 women and children are trafficked into the united states each year.

•1 out of every 3 teens on the street will be lured toward prostitution within 48 hours of running away from home.

•minor victims were sold an average of 10-15 times a day. 6 days a week.

•1 out of 5 pornographic images is of a child.

•the sale of child pornography has become a $3 billion dollar industry.

•over 100, 000 websites offer child pornography.

•55 percent of internet child pornography comes from the united states.

http://trafficking.org/learn/statistics.aspxare you listening mathew. are you listening ijm. or is this what is called an inconvenient truth?

MathewCob
07-23-13, 02:50
wrong, there's also high society on fields ave and a couple others nearby that are on and right off of macarthur hwy (can't recall the names).

you left out the good ol' usa, but wait, the usa doesn't have any problems with [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908), prostitution or ****philia, lol. we only like to point our fingers elsewhere and throw money at the problem; then get on a soapbox and tell others how to behave in accordance with our own "high standards", hahahai purposely left out mentioning high society night club because although it has a few freelancers working there it is also populated by a high number of non prostitutes and normal girls out with their friends and boyfriends / husbands for a night out.

the last thing a monger need is to mistakenly talk to a good girl and end up with a pinoys gun in his face, pinoys do not take kindly to foreigners talking to their wives / girlfriends / sisters / cousins.

best to stick to sky trax club where the numbers are mostly working girls, this is not to say that one should just assume that every girl there is a prostitute, approach with some care.

your comment about the good old usa not addressing its own back yard problems before trying to preach right from wrong to the rest of the world is 100% correct.

Psychman
07-23-13, 04:49
I purposely left out mentioning High society night club because although it has a few freelancers working there it is also populated by a high number of non prostitutes and normal girls out with their friends and boyfriends / husbands for a night out.

The last thing a monger need is to mistakenly talk to a good girl and end up with a pinoys gun in his face, pinoys do not take kindly to foreigners talking to their wives / girlfriends / sisters / cousins.

Best to stick to Sky Trax club where the numbers are mostly working girls, this is not to say that one should just assume that every girl there is a prostitute, approach with some care.

Your comment about the good old USA not addressing its own back yard problems before trying to preach right from wrong to the rest of the world is 100% correct.Wrong wrong wrong. I would say 90percent or more of the women in High Society are freelancers; it is on Fields after all. Respectable women are not going there, for the most part.

MathewCob
07-23-13, 05:05
EZ,

We all forget that despite protestations by MCobb that he spent 20 days in the Philippines (see earlier FR) some of which were in AC, he has never been anywhere near Asia. He is sitting typing with one finger wishing he could. As has been commented by me and others, he writes on a mongers board his evangelical stuff without posting any FRs on his monger experience so as one posted said he is likely a PPearl again.

As of other experience in AC also, they can also bar fine and enjoy a lady's company but MC does not know that as he has never been to AC as if he had he would have FRs and photos.

He maybe a poster boy for the Thai Tourist Board. One wonders why the USA does not get stuck into Thailand (no need to answer that!) what with the nude bars etc. AC s tame by comparison, in fact boring. And when the US military arrive in full force life will be back to normal as someone said recently.

Only a second coming? LOLI thought you had put me on ignore (and advised ever one else to) so how are you still able to see my post and reply (try to rubbish) seems like you been telling porkies again RR,

Now as you obviously like my posts so much and I am not on ignore I'll adress your rants,

I think that you will find that I have posted a trip report of my recent trip to Angeles is it post number 12936, or did you just conveniently over look my post in your haste to rubbish my posts,

Now according to you, members of this board who have not posted their trip reports and included photos (probably your hoping for nude ones mr perv) could not have possibly visited Angeles or anywhere else for that matter, I guess then that 90% of this board have not visited Angeles, mate looks like you need to put 90% of this board on your ignore list too,

Now please make up your mind which I am, a member of the Angeles ngo, s, a member of the angeles task force, an Angeles preast, an Angeles do gooder, or a part of the recent Angeles raiding team, well if I am any one of these then how can you claim that I also have never visited Angeles,

Never mind, pour yourself another large one and please, please add me to your ignore list LOL.

MathewCob
07-23-13, 07:42
Wrong wrong wrong. I would say 90percent or more of the women in High Society are freelancers; it is on Fields after all. Respectable women are not going there, for the most part.Psychman are you saying that respectable girls do not enjoy a night out on fields, I cannot count the amount of non working girls I have taken to Atlantis bar on fields to watch the show, have a couple of beers, I can honestly say that all commented on how much they had enjoyed Atlantis bar,

Now I'm no expert on high society club, only having been there a handful of times, but the last time there I was accompanied by most of the female lewis grand hotel staff and it was their choice as to what venue we went to,

Now while there I can honestly say that hardly any girls looked like the bargirl type and I sure did not get any clear come ons from any girls, I further add that there was a very high percentage of Pinoy males there, some with girls, some alone, as I stated before, I would advise fellow mongers to be quite sure the.

Girl they approach in high society (or any other Philipine disco bar) with an offer of short time is in fact a prostitute, she could well be that big fucker doormans girlfriend or his little sister.

Thanks

MathewCob
07-23-13, 07:59
[Personal Name deleted by Admin], an American who was the sole owner of Big Apple Tours and whose sole aim was to organise sex trips for foreigners to the bar area of Angeles City has been found guilty of organising prostitution, he is awaiting sentence which could carry a sentence of 7 years.

EDITOR's NOTE: This report was edited or deleted to remove the Real Personal Name of a private individual. Posting anyone's real personal name is a grave violation of their privacy and an event that justifies an immediate banning of the perpetrator.

Please do not post anyone's actual personal name in the Forum. Please read the Forum's Posting Guidelines for further information. Thanks!

Ekspat
07-23-13, 08:43
You sound happy about it.That is so far the only action from NGO's I appreciate as well. Sway pak or K11 was indeed a totally disgusting place worth to be shut down. Only for the perverts and the cheapest of the cheap charlies.

Wicked Roger
07-23-13, 11:48
Seems MCobb only likes to tell the 'bad' news not the good news ie when bars re open but despite his protestations it does seem there are are possible sinister reasons for bar closures if you read HTH.

So barfines for all LOL (except you Mathew as you don't like them and likely never been to AC.)

http://www.harrythehorse.asia/?p=7893

http://www.harrythehorse.asia/?p=7889

Evil Penivel
07-23-13, 11:54
The statistics thrown around by NGOs about [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) are absurd and have no basis in reality. Certainly there's a problem, but it's nowhere near the magnitude of the numbers often given. It can be justifiably argued that even one trafficked child is one too many and traffickers of children, as well as their customers, should be hunted relentlessly until they're all stamped out. However, in terms of absolute numbers, it's a small problem.

But that's neither here nor there. The emotional appeal of saving children from slavery gives anti-trafficking efforts a huge amount of popular support. It gives governments a strong base from which to clamp down on all commercial sex services. From the perspective of guys who to go to AC to enjoy consensual sex with adult women, the goal has to be to avoid getting caught up in something that wouldn't be much fun at best and a life-destroying disaster at worst.

From what I gather from reading the PI boards, the atmosphere is very tense. The ex-pats and frequent visitors are saying they call the girls directly to come to their apartments / hotel rooms so they don't have to visit the bars. That's fine for guys with a cell phone full of numbers, but impossible for infrequent visitors to AC. The guys who nevertheless visit the AC bars say its not a comfortable feeling to keep constantly looking over your shoulder and wondering whether the cops are going to bust in. The stress shows on the girls as well. Some are reluctant to deal with customers they don't already know because they are worried about a set up. Many have gone home and some bars are noticeably short of girls, according to some reports.

I agree that getting busted for visiting a bar is a remote possibility. But just being held in a bar for a hour or more while the cops do their thing is not an experience I want to have while on vacation. Until things do get back to usual, or at least the situation clarifies a bit, I don't see much reason for visiting AC for some bar hopping. It's almost certain that for one reason or another, I'll have a less pleasant time than I did on my previous trip there. It's a classic example of risk vs reward.

Evil

Western787
07-23-13, 18:25
Let me see if I got this straight. They're going to bring the military back to Clark. But as part of the same plan, leave the servicemen without brothels. Okaaay.

They just going to tell them to rub one out in the shower? Or is this some kind of don't-ask-don't-tell 2. 0 where they train soldiers to give each other the reach-around?

That said, get ready for 8 years of president Hillary.The time frame to significantly expand the USA military presence is at least 2 to 4 years, and meanwhile local authorities will continue to make high profile busts, eventually going after sex tourists with big prison sentence, then around by lets say 2017 after the Presidential election is done (with Hillary losing anyways) , the AC bars start to go back to business as usual. At some point, but it could be years away, somebody will have the guts to actually question these phony ginned up NGO numbers, in fact 3 or 4 years ago I recall a Washington Post reporter that dared to speak out, but of course he was viciously attacked and told to shut up. The bottom line is Mr Cobb is correct, the risk benefit equation in AC is not good right now.

Western787
07-23-13, 18:52
"[CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908)" like supposed "man made global warming" which emerged 20 to 30 years back and seems to be on the downside of the hysteria, long ago ceased to be about facts, it became a religion dependent upon belief, with heretics marked for destruction. One might say [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) is the new religion of the Left, however it seems to now cross the entire political spectrum, making it far more dangerous. Nor do I recall man made global warming resulting in hard prison time.

Look at the Superbowl hysteria in past years, even the hard left is noticing it: http://www.villagevoice.com/2012-02-01/news/super-bowl-prostitution-hoax/full/

Mbsl65
07-23-13, 19:22
I just asked a friend of mine regarding High Society Club. Her Answer "Its a disco bar. Noisy. A lot of foreign men".

OK. It is a good place to go than.

Wolvenvacht
07-23-13, 19:25
Then you go to the NGO where as usual the hysteria is prevalent:

[CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) Worldwide:

•[CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) is a $32, 000, 000, 000 per year industry and is tied with drugs for the most profitable criminal endeavor, having past illegal weapons. .

(blah blah blah blah)

http://trafficking.org/learn/statistics.aspx62.7% of all statistics are pulled out of thin air.

WestCoast1
07-23-13, 21:03
62.7% of all statistics are pulled out of thin air.And 1. 02% of statistics pulled out of thin air are true.

Oh, and 5 out of 4 people have trouble with statistics.

Pip Jaeger
07-23-13, 21:36
It Ain't So,

The rules and environment might evolve (slowly) , but P4P is governed by the law of supply and demand. The two will always find a way to meet. The supply is quite high in certain parts of Asia, which has caused price to be quite low by global standards. To a westerner used to the opposite (low supply, high price) , quality can be had in abundance, at a price that makes it well worth the travel cost and worth the time and uncertainty of a trip, for those of a certain adventurous mindset. We on this board are a bit rigorous, of a sort.

Government intervention can only change the rules slightly and add to the uncertainty slightly. It will not change the market within which supply and demand find ways to meet, at least not overnight.

Feel better?Very well said CJ; and very true. Even if half of the 80 or so bars on Fields close that still leaves 40 or so open. IMHO that means the cup is still half full and not half empty. In addition, you'd probably see the remaining bars increasing their staff of GRO's, another disco or 3 opening up for the FL market and an increase in the number of girls living in the AC area on the various dating sites.

MathewCob
07-24-13, 02:28
I'm with Rhino here. I was there a few weeks ago, for about one week. I pulled easily over a dozen girls. Fields bars, ST bars, FL, and a chatmate. Regarding tenseness and barfining, the only ones who were tense about it were some of the fields bars in discussing it in the bars. They simply changed their tactics to get the girls out of the bars. Lets not get hung up on semantics: I barfined in all of those bars. I gave up money to have a girl. Whether the bar used the term 'barfine', or whether I purchased a large number of drinks, or whether I just paid the girl the barfine amount the next day, its all a 'barfine'. And I did all of those. The bars were most interested in getting the girls out of the bars.

To drive the point home, on 3 occasions I went into Fields bars with the following Modus Operandi. Walk in, don't sit down, walk around and look at the girls, see if there's a cutie I liked. Ignore the waitress following asking to seat me and get me a drink. Then, turn to her and ask the current barfine procedure. Once she explained it to me, I approached the cutie and said into her ear: "Do you want to go with me? I need X, Y, and Z tonight. Interested?" No chat. No lady's drink. No nothing. Not a single girl winced and looked at me funny. Twice the girl said yes and went to change clothes. On the other occasion she said no, but she pointed to another girl, her 'fwend', and went to get the friend. I re-asked the friend the same thing. Off we went. See it? No sit, no drink, no LD, just a barfine (of several different methods mentioned above). The only ones nervous are the bar owners. Even though Camelot got raided, the bars next door went right on barfining.Your own post says it all Westcoast 1, you claim, (I was there a few weeks ago)

I think you will find that the major clampdown by the Angeles police, mayor, ngo brigade of no barfines whatsoever has hit Angeles big time in the last 14 days or so.

Only in the last 10 days we have had a large number of bars raided and closed down, the angeles mayor has held meetings this week again with all bar owners and has told them point blank, no more barfines, or your bars will be raided and closed down,.

So by your own admission your trip report and your findings are old news and are 100% not what going on now, thanks.

MathewCob
07-24-13, 03:13
Very well said CJ; and very true. Even if half of the 80 or so bars on Fields close that still leaves 40 or so open. IMHO that means the cup is still half full and not half empty. In addition, you'd probably see the remaining bars increasing their staff of GRO's, another disco or 3 opening up for the FL market and an increase in the number of girls living in the AC area on the various dating sites.What part of "no bars in Angeles City are allowed to offer barfines or they will be raided and closed down" do you not understand.

It does not matter how many bars close or remain open. 10/20/40/60 bars, none of them can offer barfines.

Your claim of bars will increase their staff does not hold true, I think you will find that a very large percentage of bargirls have already left working in the bars because they are scared shitless of being arrested, abused by the police and possibly end up in jail.

Mongering as we know it in Angeles City is over, especially now with the new rules of any age girl comes under the human traffick offences and a punter caught paying a girl for sex could face 20 years in a pinoy jail.

Lets be honest who in their right mind will choose to visit Angeles City when just a short hop over the pond exists the world biggest working girl house known to man, with no restrictions to barfines, has cheaper hotels, great food and far prettier girls.

WestCoast1
07-24-13, 04:45
So by your own admission your trip report and your findings are old news and are 100% not what going on now, thanks.By my own admission, correct, its old news.

You're claiming girls aren't going out of Fields bars to hotels with guys for money at this point? Or taking guys in the back room for a romp for pesos?

Psychman
07-24-13, 06:06
Psychman are you saying that respectable girls do not enjoy a night out on fields, I cannot count the amount of non working girls I have taken to Atlantis bar on fields to watch the show, have a couple of beers, I can honestly say that all commented on how much they had enjoyed Atlantis bar,

Now I'm no expert on high society club, only having been there a handful of times, but the last time there I was accompanied by most of the female lewis grand hotel staff and it was their choice as to what venue we went to,

Now while there I can honestly say that hardly any girls looked like the bargirl type and I sure did not get any clear come ons from any girls, I further add that there was a very high percentage of Pinoy males there, some with girls, some alone, as I stated before, I would advise fellow mongers to be quite sure the.

Girl they approach in high society (or any other Philipine disco bar) with an offer of short time is in fact a prostitute, she could well be that big fucker doormans girlfriend or his little sister.

ThanksI am sorry but the vast majority who go to Fields are working girls or part timers. Girls not interested in the scene mostly would not be caught dead there, unless they are going with a sister. Trust me, they are not going to be offended if you think they are working in HS- everybody knows what happens there!

Also, only a tool goes right up to a FL and asks her to go short time, especially if she is with someone. You actaully say "hi" and check out the vibe; it is not hard to figure out who is taken and who is not. If someone is taken, regardless of by whom, you stay away. Too many women.

Also, there is a HUGE different between a freelancer bar and, as you put it, any other bar.

Psychman
07-24-13, 06:09
Mongering as we know it in angeles city is over,.This is pure conjecture. Nobody, nobody knows if this is a passing phase or if this is long term change. Anyone who suggests they know only is demonstrating how little they know. We will know in a few months if the changes have traction, and what the implications for the scene are.

Psychman
07-24-13, 06:15
Lets be honest who in their right mind will choose to visit Angeles city when just a short hop over the pond exists the world biggest working girl house known to man, with no restrictions to barfines, has cheaper hotels, great food and far prettier girls.Sorry to pick on your threads today Mattew, but.

To answer your question, many of us, who are and who are not in our right minds. I have been to both Ac and Patts on multiple occasions, and I must prefer Ac. Why? Pinay! They are far more playful, sillier, warm, GFE, and easier to hang with then TGs, IMHO. I love Pattaya and TGs, but much prefer AC.

MathewCob
07-24-13, 06:36
Sorry to pick on your threads today Mattew, but.

To answer your question, many of us, who are and who are not in our right minds. I have been to both Ac and Patts on multiple occasions, and I must prefer Ac. Why? Pinay! They are far more playful, sillier, warm, GFE, and easier to hang with then TGs, IMHO. I love Pattaya and TGs, but much prefer AC.More a great place to visit due to the clamp downs of recent days / weeks. Thanks.

Psychman, no sorry needed, you are not picking on my posts just giving your views as you see them.

As far as pinays being more playful and fun to be with, with an almost child like innocence about them which I love then I agree with you 100, hense why I married 2 pinays.

What I am saying though is that the once great place to visit called Angeles is no longer a great place to visit due to the recent clampdowns.

Thanks

MathewCob
07-24-13, 06:41
By my own admission, correct, its old news.

You're claiming girls aren't going out of Fields bars to hotels with guys for money at this point? Or taking guys in the back room for a romp for pesos?Unfortunately, going by my very recent visit I am saying exactly that.

Wicked Roger
07-24-13, 06:55
By my own admission, correct, its old news.

You're claiming girls aren't going out of Fields bars to hotels with guys for money at this point? Or taking guys in the back room for a romp for pesos?But at least it is news WC1 unlike MCobb who has likely never been there and despite requests from some of the seniors has never posted any FRs except the monotonous stuff he writes about AC without any facts. One week old news is recent in my view especially when you read some of the local press reporting facts 2 days in the world.

Barfines will continue in whatever form they take and life will continue.

I have been to both and much prefer AC to Pattaya (even though I don't like AC when compared with other places in the Philippines). Same reason as Psychman.

I still wonder if MCobb works for the Thai tourist board given his statement that Thai is better. Odd that IJM don't visit BKK and close all those bars as recently I saw naked girls dancing (shock!) and barfines were being paid (even greater shock MCobb!). So why would MCobb want Thailand when he is so intent on seeing AC closed down. Odd behavior but until we see some real FRs from him about bars, girls, photos (as you commented earlier WC1) we may never know.

Must go see AC again despite my reservations about the lack of soul so I can do a FR and see if barfines are available.

E Z Rhino
07-24-13, 08:28
Sorry to pick on your threads today Mattew, but.

To answer your question, many of us, who are and who are not in our right minds. I have been to both Ac and Patts on multiple occasions, and I must prefer Ac. Why? Pinay! They are far more playful, sillier, warm, GFE, and easier to hang with then TGs, IMHO. I love Pattaya and TGs, but much prefer AC.This reminds me of the old joke. Its Christmas, and the snow is falling on the street corner and Salvation Army band. A fallen woman testifies to the crowd about her redemption in Jesus, proclaiming...

"I used to lay with white men!
I used to lay with black men!
I used to lay with chinamen!
But now,
I lay with Jesus!

A drunk in the back row shouts out...

"That's right sister! F*ck em all!"

Yes, Pattaya, Angeles City. Let's get out there and f*ck 'them all. Hey the bible says be fruitful and multiply right?

Python75
07-24-13, 08:29
Mongering as we know it in angeles city is over, especially now with the new rules of any age girl comes under the human traffick offences and a punter caught paying a girl for sex could face 20 years in a pinoy jail.I would not call a law which has been around for 6 years as new. And prostitution has always been illegal in Phils.

E Z Rhino
07-24-13, 08:33
Continuing to deride the religion trolls infesting our forum.

Did you hear about the time Michael Jackson was summoned before the Pope?
Yes, the Pope called him in and took him to task.
"Michael, my son, if you keep this up, you leave me no choice...
We're just going to have to give you your own diocese!

When is bedtime at Michael Jackson's neverland ranch?
When the big hand touches the little hand!

Michael Jackson's not all bad is he?
For example, he drives real slow in school zones.

See also attached photo of Halloween costume...

MathewCob
07-24-13, 09:37
Here is a link for the guys who claim all is as normal and barfines are plentiful in Angeles city.

The clear message from the Angeles mayor to the bar owners I have been posting about (and been shouted down by fellow board members) hits the local news papers.

The mayor clearly states that any bar not going along with his orders will be chained and padlocked.

http://www.centralluzondaily.net/fields-avenue-clubs-warned-of-closure/

Wicked Roger
07-24-13, 09:51
Mongering as we know it in angeles city is over, especially now with the new rules of any age girl comes under the human traffick offences and a punter caught paying a girl for sex could face 20 years in a pinoy jail.A question you seem not to want to answer is did you pay for sex when in the Philippines for 20 days of which 2 days were AC.

Please tell us as many of us think you have never been to the country, as no FRs nothing just a constant bark on legal issues which you generally read incorrectly and / or deliberately misinterpret for your own evangelical / Thai Tourist Board reasons LOL.

So how about you tell all of us about your 20 days in the Philippines. You claim to have visited the bars so did you take some girls back but paid nothing? Which would be bad form if you did or did you pay the girl which means you broke the law according to MC's rules as you interpret them.

A lot of us would like to know as you seem to know a lot about the Philippines so please enlighten us as other FRs here seriously contradict your 'message' and these are from respected posters with hands on / real time experience.

Run Mann
07-24-13, 12:20
Continuing to deride the religion trolls infesting our forum.

Did you hear about the time Michael Jackson was summoned before the Pope?

Yes, the Pope called him in and took him to task.

"Michael, my son, if you keep this up, you leave me no choice.

We're just going to have to give you your own diocese!

When is bedtime at Michael Jackson's neverland ranch?

When the big hand touches the little hand!

Michael Jackson's not all bad is he?

For example, he drives real slow in school zones.

See also attached photo of Halloween costume.Don't quit your day job.

Konaman
07-24-13, 16:02
This is pure conjecture. Nobody, nobody knows if this is a passing phase or if this is long term change. Anyone who suggests they know only is demonstrating how little they know. We will know in a few months if the changes have traction, and what the implications for the scene are.Dammit! Was planning on visiting AC this September after my last visit 5 years ago. Looks like I got to re-evaluate my options.

Is this a passing phase? Perhaps, but remember Ermita and Mayor Lim, anyone?

WestCoast1
07-24-13, 17:20
Unfortunately, going by my very recent visit I am saying exactly that.SOMEBODY prove this gent right or wrong. Is ANYONE in AC who has taken a girl from any bar in the last 10 days? Or the opposite: is ANYONE currently in AC who has been refused a girl from a bar in AC?

Member #4698
07-24-13, 18:50
I have been reading all the recent posts on various internet sites from reliable guys who are actually at ground zero on Fields and Perimeter and they all confirm they are having great times right now in AC despite a few bar closings. Let's not get hung up on semantics: EWR, barfine. 15 drink minimum, whatever you want to call it, however it is done. The critical point is guys are still taking super friendly Filipinas out of the bars and having a good time even as we debate it on the ISG.

I am ignoring the fear mongers and the trolls. I don't think they are contributing much useful information to the forum. Of course the situation bears watching and could change for the worse any time in the next few weeks. The sky might actually fall, but my main point here is that the sky has not fallen, yet. Furthermore, I am not that interested in speculations about whether the sky will fall or not. Only time will tell. So don't worry guys, if this were really the end of AC as we know it, we would not be debating it. The end would be obvious. Golden Nile, Atlantis, Body Shop, La Bamba, Pony Tails, Tao, Crystal Palace, Det, LIA would all be closed and not reopening. Punters would be reporting that they can't shag a bar girl anymore.

So if I was planning to go to AC sometime in the next 30 days, I would still go. I trust the field reports I am currently reading. Things are still good. But I would stay up to date on the latest news from reliable board members and I would be prepared to call an audible and head to Makati, Ermita, or Subic should the need arise or I was just not having that good a time.

Pagal Chacha
07-24-13, 21:31
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6whhw4il048

Mr Enternational
07-24-13, 22:28
I have been reading all the recent posts on various internet sites from reliable guys who are actually at ground zero on Fields and Perimeter and they all confirm they are having great times right now in AC despite a few bar closings. Let's not get hung up on semantics: EWR, barfine. 15 drink minimum, whatever you want to call it, however it is done. The critical point is guys are still taking super friendly Filipinas out of the bars and having a good time even as we debate it on the ISG.I'm planning on taking my dad and brother to AC in 2 weeks and after reading MC's crap I had to email a buddy of mine who lives there to double check:

Tue, Jul 23, 2013 7:10 pm: What is the situation in AC now? I read that the law is closing many bars and that barfines are pretty much non-existent now.

Tue, Jul 23, 2013 10:31 pm: U CAN STILL BF BUT THEY USE DIFFERENT CODES THEY DO NOT SAY BARFINE [BF] SOME BARS WERE CLOSED FOR NOT PAYING POLICE BUT ARE REOPENING NOW

Tman525
07-24-13, 22:31
SOMEBODY prove this gent right or wrong. Is ANYONE in AC who has taken a girl from any bar in the last 10 days? Or the opposite: is ANYONE currently in AC who has been refused a girl from a bar in AC?I have already posted on how it is largely business as usual in AC. Although the word 'barfine' may not be welcome in some bars, no one is shy to explain how things work under the new regime. Last night I took a girl back to my hotel from a Perimeter Road bar & paid her this morning, usual price of 1500 and more than worth it the little sweetie! Tonight I was in both La Bamba & Dollhouse. Both places the girls talked openly about how it works now. Girls go with guys and the girl gets paid later. Hey, if it makes a 'runner' less likely then in some ways the new regime is helping the punter!

Vikings may have been raided and closed down but it was open again tonight when I walked past at 10pm.

Wicked Roger
07-25-13, 00:21
Here is a link for the guys who claim all is as normal and barfines are plentiful in Angeles city.

The clear message from the Angeles mayor to the bar owners I have been posting about (and been shouted down by fellow board members) hits the local news papers.

The mayor clearly states that any bar not going along with his orders will be chained and padlocked.

http://www.centralluzondaily.net/fields-avenue-clubs-warned-of-closure/MC,

You still have yet to answer the question I asked in the earlier FR. When you were (allegedly) in the Philippines and C did you take any girl, did you pay them and did you bar fine them? Please let us know as all evidence you claim is contradicted by other more senior members.

Yo seem to let everyone know how bad AC and even the Philippines is but you still supposedly visited but won't tell anyone on a mongers board what you did.

As for your link that news source is always a day out of date as HTH said they opened on 23 July.

http://www.harrythehorse.asia/?p=7893

Yes times are changing but no times are not changing so everyone packs up shop and goes elsewhere

Western787
07-25-13, 01:28
Girls go with guys and the girl gets paid later. Hey, if it makes a 'runner' less likely then in some ways the new regime is helping the punter!If they decide to make an example out a sex tourist, mere change of form won't change the substance, as the bar girl (per the NGO / USA State definition) is still "trafficked"

FreebieFan
07-25-13, 01:37
continuing to deride the religion trolls infesting our forum.

did you hear about the time michael jackson was summoned before the pope?

yes, the pope called him in and took him to task.

"michael, my son, if you keep this up, you leave me no choice.

we're just going to have to give you your own diocese!poope i mean pope maybe should warn good catholic boys that being with your local priest might also be dangerous.

http://newsinfo.inquirer.net/452387/pope-warns-catholics-against-money-success-power-pleasure-idols

Western787
07-25-13, 01:42
Unless the normal percentage never flows back to the club, its still going to be considered a barfine, I mean unless you just assume the Mayor is not serious. I believe Cobb's theory is the Mayor is serious and go arounds will be irrelevant.

MathewCob
07-25-13, 03:45
Unless the normal percentage never flows back to the club, its still going to be considered a barfine, I mean unless you just assume the Mayor is not serious. I believe Cobb's theory is the Mayor is serious and go arounds will be irrelevant.You are 100% correct in saying go arounds are irrelevant, and your correct in saying that the mayor is adamant he will close down all the bars if they do not go along with the new human traffick laws.

I have posted the Angeles newspaper reports stating the mayor promising to clean up [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) in Angeles (barfines) for those that still doubt what the mayor has promised.

Now through my own recent experience none of the bars on fields avenue are offering barfines or are allowing their girls to leave with any customers whatsoever, this has also been reported by Harry The Horse and in almost every single Angeles based forum, post after post of guys not being able to barfine on fields avenue

Yes a very small percentage of Angeles bar owners out on perimeter road who do not give a shit about their girls or punters safety are frantically trying to find new ways of ignoring the new laws set by the mayor, these bars at first tried selling an amount of shots equal to barfine which only saw their bars raided and closed down.

This very small amount of perimeter bar owners have now decided to give up on offering multiple drinks as barfine and now if the punter is very well known to the bar then they are allowing the punter to leave with the bargirl and just pay the bargirl the bar share and the girls share after they have fucked.

So here is a summary of where we are as of now, no bars on fields offer any type of barfine, they have 100% gone along with the mayors wishes.

The small amount of desperate bars on perimeter who are trying their best to find ways around the law will be raided and closed down as promised by the mayor in the coming days / weeks IMHO.

Now guys, regardless of what the perimeter bars say or do, lets not for one moment forget that it is illegal to pay any bargirl in angeles regardless of how you paid her or regardless of her age, carrying a 20 year jail sentence, how long will it be till we see a punter made an example of by the new laws, If the mayor does not get his way then not very long I fear. Thanks.

WestCoast1
07-25-13, 06:07
I had to email a buddy of mine who lives there to double check:

Tue, Jul 23, 2013 7:10 pm: What is the situation in AC now? I read that the law is closing many bars and that barfines are pretty much non-existent now.

Tue, Jul 23, 2013 10:31 pm:U CAN STILL BF BUT THEY USE DIFFERENT CODES THEY DO NOT SAY BARFINE [BF] SOME BARS WERE CLOSED FOR NOT PAYING POLICE BUT ARE REOPENING NOWThanks!


I have already posted on how it is largely business as usual in AC. Although the word 'barfine' may not be welcome in some bars, no one is shy to explain how things work under the new regime. Last night I took a girl back to my hotel from a Perimeter Road bar & paid her this morning, usual price of 1500 and more than worth it the little sweetie! Tonight I was in both La Bamba & Dollhouse. Both places the girls talked openly about how it works now. Girls go with guys and the girl gets paid later. Hey, if it makes a 'runner' less likely then in some ways the new regime is helping the punter!Thanks again!

Mathew, comment?

Wicked Roger
07-25-13, 06:44
Thanks!

Thanks again!

Mathew, comment?And MC tell us about your time in the country and AC. Did you barfine a girl. Find a way to do it differently. Did you pay for sex for a bar girl? Which bars did you visit and what hotels as WC1 has asked this type of information as well and many are awaiting yur real FR as we don't think you have ever been to Asia.

E Z Rhino
07-25-13, 07:49
SOMEBODY prove this gent right or wrong. Is ANYONE in AC who has taken a girl from any bar in the last 10 days? Or the opposite: is ANYONE currently in AC who has been refused a girl from a bar in AC?Yes. Me. Lots of others. My dick is still wet. My wallet is still (slightly) lighter. Okay? People are still having sex. Fornicating, adultering, and wh*remongering. In AC. While we speak. Any questions?

Don't trust trolls who recently joined and who have very very posts, all of which are disinformation. Take full advantage of the site's ignore list feature.

MathewCob
07-25-13, 09:25
Yes. Me. Lots of others. My dick is still wet. My wallet is still (slightly) lighter. Okay? People are still having sex. Fornicating, adultering, and wh*remongering. In AC. While we speak. Any questions?

Don't trust trolls who recently joined and who have very very posts, all of which are disinformation. Take full advantage of the site's ignore list feature.Let me get this straight, are you saying that all newly joined board members with relatively little amounts of posts are trolls and not to be trusted / believed, and should be put on ignore.

Then sir, going by your mindset I put it to you that as you yourself were once a new member with very few posts, I take it then that you too must have been a troll and not to be believed and should by your own advice have been put firmly on ignore by the more senior members at that time.

With all due respect EZ, I have read some posts in my many years on mongering boards but your last 4-5 posts have bewildered me the most, totally fucking amazing some peoples mindset.

Wicked Roger
07-25-13, 16:30
Let me get this straight, are you saying that all newly joined board members with relatively little amounts of posts are trolls and not to be trusted / believed, and should be put on ignore.What bewilders many is that you still after 35FRs and repeated request have yet to state any facts about your 20 day visit to the Philippines and if you paid barfines, paid for sex, which bars, which hotels, which girls and any photos.

What EZ is saying is you spread your disinformation using information selectively and try to promote (likely) Thailand 0 but you still don't anyone what you did in the Philippines.

And despite very recent reports contradicting your FRs you seem to think you are correct. So EX is entitled to his views and comments.

And we still wait your real information on your AC and Philippines visit. Or have you never been here MCobb LOL.

New members tend to give informative FRs of mongering not the stuff you write (though a change from the "hey dude can I have digit" brigade but equally as annoying). For example, WC1 (definitely not a newbie) has written some great FRs on hotels and other stuff recently. You on the other hand have not and seem incredibly reluctant to say anything about your 20 day visit

So we are waiting with eager anticipation MCobb.

E Z Rhino
07-25-13, 17:58
Let me get this straight, are you saying that all newly joined board members with relatively little amounts of posts are trolls and not to be trusted / believed, and should be put on ignore.

Then sir, going by your mindset I put it to you that as you yourself were once a new member with very few posts, I take it then that you too must have been a troll and not to be believed and should by your own advice have been put firmly on ignore by the more senior members at that time.

With all due respect EZ, I have read some posts in my many years on mongering boards but your last 4-5 posts have bewildered me the most, totally fucking amazing some peoples mindset.When I was new, I didn't post a bunch of bullshit about a city I'd never visited, which I and others accuse you of. Sorry but on this board you've only been posting for 2 weeks. Go spread your disinformation on your other boards.

Yes, newbies should be seen and not heard. They could post questions but really they should RTFF. And they should post some actual trip reports. Not fearmongering about how the whole street has been bulldozed.

With all due respect, I have read some posts in my many years on mongering boards but your posts have bewildered me the most, totally fucking amazing some peoples mindset.

Don't trust trolls who recently joined and who have very few posts, all of which are disinformation. Take full advantage of the site's ignore list feature.

YG365
07-25-13, 19:31
When I was new, I didn't post a bunch of bullshit about a city I'd never visited, which I and others accuse you of. Sorry but on this board you've only been posting for 2 weeks. Go spread your disinformation on your other boards.

Yes, newbies should be seen and not heard. They could post questions but really they should RTFF. And they should post some actual trip reports. Not fearmongering about how the whole street has been bulldozed.

With all due respect, I have read some posts in my many years on mongering boards but your posts have bewildered me the most, totally fucking amazing some peoples mindset.

Don't trust trolls who recently joined and who have very few posts, all of which are disinformation. Take full advantage of the site's ignore list feature.Amen brotha! BTW, how do you RTFF? LOL JK.

WestCoast1
07-25-13, 19:46
With all due respect EZ, I have read some posts in my many years on mongering boards but your last 4-5 posts have bewildered me the most, totally fucking amazing some peoples mindset.Mathew: This is just argumentative. EZ and others are clearly barfining in the last few days.

1. What say ye now regarding this?

2. Post a solid FR please regarding your recent experience with a bar, with a girl, or hotel.

Wicked Roger
07-26-13, 00:13
Mathew: This is just argumentative. EZ and others are clearly barfining in the last few days.

1. What say ye now regarding this?

2. Post a solid FR please regarding your recent experience with a bar, with a girl, or hotel.
And MC tell us about your time in the country and AC. Did you barfine a girl. Find a way to do it differently. Did you pay for sex for a bar girl? Which bars did you visit and what hotels as WC1 has asked this type of information as well and many are awaiting your real FR as we don't think you have ever been to Asia.WC1,

I just don't think he can as either he has not been to Asia or if he did he would have to say things contrary to what he writes on this forum (ie he had sex with a girl who he paid (ie some form of barfine which according to MCobb is illegal / not happening in the Philippines or shagged one he did not pay and that means he is a cheap Charlie).

Like you I just don't think MCobb can FR on his experiences but I am encouraging him to do so and share which hotels he stayed at and do some reviews.

Kitie Carson
07-26-13, 00:41
Let me get this straight, are you saying that all newly joined board members with relatively little amounts of posts are trolls and not to be trusted / believed, and should be put on ignore.

Then sir, going by your mindset I put it to you that as you yourself were once a new member with very few posts, I take it then that you too must have been a troll and not to be believed and should by your own advice have been put firmly on ignore by the more senior members at that time.

With all due respect EZ, I have read some posts in my many years on mongering boards but your last 4-5 posts have bewildered me the most, totally fucking amazing some peoples mindset.Please refrain from posting what to do's what not to do's from a a place you have never been only read about.

Asking questions is ok but RTFF is mandatory before asking repetitive answered questions.

MathewCob
07-26-13, 04:30
By popular demand here is my trip report of my very recent visit to the Philippines and Angeles city

Lets start with my trip to Cebu city to visit my daughter.

I arrived at the ex wifes house as arranged to pick up my 10 year old daughter, to my surprise the ex was unusually happy, she had prepared some food and had our daughter ready and waiting with her case.

We were off to Boracay that evening, me and the daughter. 12 days of sun, sea and beach and a well deserved catch up, now obviously with a 10 year old in toe I obviously did not have any time for meeting up with any pinays or any late night drinking, so sorry guys no great news there.

I write this because so many want to be moderators on this forum have questioned where I was for my 20 days this trip as I had only spent 2 days in Angeles.

On to Angeles city, I had originally planned on 5 days in Angeles, staying at the wonderful Lewis grand hotel on perimeter road, for those who have not stayed at the Lewis grand then it is highly recommended, paid $100 a night and got upgraded by the lovely Anne on reception to a suite room due to being a regular customer and the hotel being so quiet, Anne by the way is a super cutie, has a year old child but is single for any guys who want to marry a beautiful good girl pop on down to the Lewis and say hi to Anne, as I say a real cutie.

On to what you all been waiting for, the Angeles bar hop, now I have previously posted about this, it's post number 12936 so I can only basically repeat that post with a few additions.

Hit the bars heavily with my many friends, contacts on both days, I am a 20+ year monger, Philippines / Thailand / Cambodia / Vietnam are all places I have visited and lived, most of the others on the barhops were either long time Angeles residents or ex Bangkok resident, some of the gang were ex bar owners, one in Bangkok and one in Manila, so between us many years of mongering experience, most of us speak passable to good Tagalog.

Now I am basically a fields man due to the sheer number of cuties and good shows to pass the time.

I had heard for some time now from my friends who live in Angeles city that the bars had changed for the worst, that the mayor had recently ordered that none of the bars could offer barfines or that no girls could leave the bars with customers at all, so off to test the waters of what exactly was happening in the bars of Angeles.

Atlantis / Dollhouse / club Asia, The-Club, Carousel, Voodoo, Pony Tails (and many more) were all visited for a few drinks by our group, yes probably the top 15 most popular bars in Angeles.

What we found was out of the many bars we visited not one single bar offered a barfine option, not through the bar, the mamasun, the bargirls, our group asked many girls to join us, we bought many lady drinks for the girls, we had fun with the girls, playing drinking games with the girls, having them sit on our laps, yes fun all round,

Now on to the important part, even when spoken to in their own language so they would feel more comfortable in our company, basically zero barfines available for the whole group, the girls just would not discuss anything to do with barfine or leaving with a customer, in fact I had one girl ask me point blank 'are you police' what the fuck, as I say from what our group experienced the girls were very nervous around the idea of leaving with customers and flatly refused saying, daddy say no more barfine, only dance and drink with customer, the best we got was a few offers to meet at 2am in Sky traks disco when the girl got off work, far too late a time for old boys like us LOL.

Now as I stated in my previous report (12936) I had not gone out with the intention to barfine a girl and take her to my hotel as I already knew from my Angeles resident friends that girls were not going on barfines, but had a great few days, catching up with old buddies and sinking a few cold ones.

I had already arranged for my ex girlfriend, a very nice little 20 year old student (non bar girl) who lives in a town about an hour from Angeles to make her way down to spend time with me and keep me and my bed warm at the Lewis grand hotel.

Now as I said my trip to Angeles was originally planned for 5 days but cut short to just 2 and a bit days with the remainder spent back in Cebu with my daughter.

So for the guys (and you know who you are) who have hounded me for a trip report (although I had already posted one) there is my trip report, please feel free to read it, take it to pieces, twist it to suit yourselves and your baseless accusations, then come back and still claim I have never visited Angeles, as I know you all will, it really does make me laugh how petty some are, probably down to the fact that they are losing money by any one daring to tell the truth of what is happening in Angeles city, thanks.

Ekspat
07-26-13, 09:01
but I am encouraging him to do so and share which hotels he stayed at and do some reviews.That's "Waiting for Godot" I guess.

FreebieFan
07-26-13, 10:21
WC1,

I just don't think he can as either he has not been to Asia or if he did he would have to say things contrary to what he writes on this forum (ie he had sex with a girl who he paid (ie some form of barfine which according to MCobb is illegal / not happening in the Philippines or shagged one he did not pay and that means he is a cheap Charlie).

Like you I just don't think MCobb can FR on his experiences but I am encouraging him to do so and share which hotels he stayed at and do some reviews.Would be good if there was a facility here to see where someones IP address orignates from. We could all have lots of fun with that type of info!

Unless of course people are using a VPN. The other day a Pinay on Mamboo asked me if I wanted to meet in Oakland. I told her I was in Asia so that wasnt really possible. She said" oh but you are showing you are in San Francisco ".

MathewCob
07-26-13, 10:26
Would be good if there was a facility here to see where someones IP address orignates from. We could all have lots of fun with that type of info!

Unless of course people are using a VPN. The other day a Pinay on Mamboo asked me if I wanted to meet in Oakland. I told her I was in Asia so that wasnt really possible. She said" oh but you are showing you are in San Francisco ".Most moderators on forum boards can check a posters ip address, in fact I wished they would check mine, post their findings on here and put to bed all the flamers and doubters LOL.

X Man
07-26-13, 15:01
Guys, can we please stop this.

Mr. MCob, something about you rings false and I don't know why. Others see this too. Nevertheless, thanks you for this trip report. I hope you had a good time with your daughter and your Luzon honey.

A few people have noted about the pile on bullying that sometimes occurs here. Since this has been noted by several people. Maybe we should pay attention. I like the way the Photo section is self-moderated, but maybe we should relax a bit with newcomers?

Another thing. When I was in the military, we had a saying,"loose lips sink ships". You guys keep blabbing away about barfine this and fkn that. There is a crackdown in AC. It's a fact. I suggest you say a prayer for Mr. Snowden and shut up. I say "shut up" with all due respect. I think you know what I mean!

I will be in Philippines next month and hope to meet some of the ladies I have befriended online. I'd be happy to meet the MCob if he will be around.

X.


By popular demand here is my trip report of my very recent visit to the Philippines and Angeles city

Lets start with my trip to Cebu city to visit my daughter.

I arrived at the ex wifes house as arranged to pick up my 10 year old daughter, to my surprise the ex was unusually happy, she had prepared some food and had our daughter ready and waiting with her case.

We were off to Boracay that evening, me and the daughter. 12 days of sun, sea and beach and a well deserved catch up, now obviously with a 10 year old in toe I obviously did not have any time for meeting up with any pinays or any late night drinking, so sorry guys no great news there.

I write this because so many want to be moderators on this forum have questioned where I was for my 20 days this trip as I had only spent 2 days in Angeles.

On to Angeles city, I had originally planned on 5 days in Angeles, staying at the wonderful Lewis grand hotel on perimeter road, for those who have not stayed at the Lewis grand then it is highly recommended, paid $100 a night and got upgraded by the lovely Anne on reception to a suite room due to being a regular customer and the hotel being so quiet, Anne by the way is a super cutie, has a year old child but is single for any guys who want to marry a beautiful good girl pop on down to the Lewis and say hi to Anne, as I say a real cutie.

On to what you all been waiting for, the Angeles bar hop, now I have previously posted about this, it's post number 12936 so I can only basically repeat that post with a few additions.

Hit the bars heavily with my many friends, contacts on both days, I am a 20+ year monger, Philippines / Thailand / Cambodia / Vietnam are all places I have visited and lived, most of the others on the barhops were either long time Angeles residents or ex Bangkok resident, some of the gang were ex bar owners, one in Bangkok and one in Manila, so between us many years of mongering experience, most of us speak passable to good Tagalog.

Now I am basically a fields man due to the sheer number of cuties and good shows to pass the time.

I had heard for some time now from my friends who live in Angeles city that the bars had changed for the worst, that the mayor had recently ordered that none of the bars could offer barfines or that no girls could leave the bars with customers at all, so off to test the waters of what exactly was happening in the bars of Angeles.

Atlantis / Dollhouse / club Asia, The-Club, Carousel, Voodoo, Pony Tails (and many more) were all visited for a few drinks by our group, yes probably the top 15 most popular bars in Angeles.

What we found was out of the many bars we visited not one single bar offered a barfine option, not through the bar, the mamasun, the bargirls, our group asked many girls to join us, we bought many lady drinks for the girls, we had fun with the girls, playing drinking games with the girls, having them sit on our laps, yes fun all round,

Now on to the important part, even when spoken to in their own language so they would feel more comfortable in our company, basically zero barfines available for the whole group, the girls just would not discuss anything to do with barfine or leaving with a customer, in fact I had one girl ask me point blank 'are you police' what the fuck, as I say from what our group experienced the girls were very nervous around the idea of leaving with customers and flatly refused saying, daddy say no more barfine, only dance and drink with customer, the best we got was a few offers to meet at 2am in Sky traks disco when the girl got off work, far too late a time for old boys like us LOL.

Now as I stated in my previous report (12936) I had not gone out with the intention to barfine a girl and take her to my hotel as I already knew from my Angeles resident friends that girls were not going on barfines, but had a great few days, catching up with old buddies and sinking a few cold ones.

I had already arranged for my ex girlfriend, a very nice little 20 year old student (non bar girl) who lives in a town about an hour from Angeles to make her way down to spend time with me and keep me and my bed warm at the Lewis grand hotel.

Now as I said my trip to Angeles was originally planned for 5 days but cut short to just 2 and a bit days with the remainder spent back in Cebu with my daughter.

So for the guys (and you know who you are) who have hounded me for a trip report (although I had already posted one) there is my trip report, please feel free to read it, take it to pieces, twist it to suit yourselves and your baseless accusations, then come back and still claim I have never visited Angeles, as I know you all will, it really does make me laugh how petty some are, probably down to the fact that they are losing money by any one daring to tell the truth of what is happening in Angeles city, thanks.

MathewCob
07-26-13, 16:44
Guys, can we please stop this.

Mr. MCob, something about you rings false and I don't know why. Others see this too. Nevertheless, thanks you for this trip report. I hope you had a good time with your daughter and your Luzon honey.

A few people have noted about the pile on bullying that sometimes occurs here. Since this has been noted by several people. Maybe we should pay attention. I like the way the Photo section is self-moderated, but maybe we should relax a bit with newcomers?

Another thing. When I was in the military, we had a saying,"loose lips sink ships". You guys keep blabbing away about barfine this and fkn that. There is a crackdown in AC. It's a fact. I suggest you say a prayer for Mr. Snowden and shut up. I say "shut up" with all due respect. I think you know what I mean!

I will be in Philippines next month and hope to meet some of the ladies I have befriended online. I'd be happy to meet the MCob if he will be around.

X.Thanks for the kind words X Man, yes it can be a bit of a bummer when taking flack from all directions,

Now as I said I been around many Angeles popular board and also Thai boards for many years, have amassed many posts / reports on some so the guys here will never get to me although they are trying their hardest LOL.

Now on most boards the senior members will tread real careful with the newbies, we answer their questions, tell them where to stay, where's good to eat and where best to get laid (if its available) so your advice of taking it a bit easy with newbies till they find their feet is good advice, I say, if you scare newbies off at the start then they will just stop posting and never be able to grow into more senior members and then be able to pass on their knowledge to others and even to us, shame so many senior members on ISG seem to like to hunt in packs in order to normally silence any one who is going against their views,

Your offer of meeting for a few beers is a good one, I will be in Angeles for a very good pals wedding beginning of August but just for the day and then will be in cebu for 5/6 days visiting my daughter again so let me know of your dates and ill happily meet up, maybe I can even convince you that I'm not false at all LOL, thanks.

WestCoast1
07-26-13, 17:27
Guys, can we please stop this.

Mr. MCob, something about you rings false and I don't know why. Others see this too. Nevertheless, thanks you for this trip report. I hope you had a good time with your daughter and your Luzon honey.Agreed.

MCob: thanks for the great FR. I think the mistake MCob made was to post all that other stuff before posting an FR. As children should be seen in public, and not heard, newbs should be posting FR's first, commentary later (sorry newbs, the phils board is different). MCob is just presenting his perspective of things here. I was getting similar guff 2 weeks ago in the bars from waitresses and girls and mama's who were downplaying the word barfine, they even asked me if I was police. The difference was, it was semantics. All the bars had gone past MCob's description of LD's only (no bar exit). They were all pushing exits (in multiple formats).

MCob, don't let us old farts run you off. You didn't get to take ANY girls?

Ekspat
07-27-13, 09:14
By popular demand here is my trip report of my very recent visit to the Philippines and Angeles cityThanks, man. Will be there next month for 4 days and check it out.

XMan, are you in AC then? Free for a drink?

Cheers!

ThatGuy865
07-27-13, 14:50
All bars are pretty much back to normal. I recently returned. There was a scare for a few days. But as usual. After a few days everything was back to normal.

Bars are doing party animals, having the girl meet you outside in 10 mins, some same old bar fine. Just said discreetly.

Between my friends and I. We hit most bars and never had any issues getting the girl, one payment method or another.

Some bars the girls will say "No BF, we don't do that here". Then whisper I can leave if you buy 10 LDs my quota to leave.

There maybe 2 or 3 bars that are hesitant if you are a newbie or suspicious looking to them. But all the rest, it's party time as usual.

MathewCob
07-27-13, 16:54
Ez rhino, below is a paragraph from your trip report (post 913013) you posted of your 1st 3 day first trip to Angeles last week, in it you clearly state that the girl you bar fined was from a perimeter road bar and you paid 1400 pesos,

Now as per your report yesterday (post 13119) you now claim that your 1400 peso barfine was from a fields avenue bar at 3pm,

Now I know fields avenue fairly well and as far as I know there are only two bars that would be open at 3pm and both do not have a barfine priced at 1400 pesos, are you sure it was fields and not as you say in your trip report a bar on perimeter road,

Please let us know exactly what you are saying, fields or perimeter, as I find it very hard to understand how you managed to barfine a girl on fields from bars that have a no bar fine policy and that you managed to even get a large discount thrown in too, it would also help your fellow mongers to name the bar on fields that is offering bar fines to first time visitors at heavily discounted rates, thanks.


E Z Rhino wrote,

The perimiter bar I went to had about 2 dozen girls. About half on stage at any time, the rest watching and waiting or working the small crowd. On my scale, most of these girls are a 6 out of 10. There were some 4's and 5's, a few 7's. Some had bewitching eyes but bodies just a tad thick for me. Yah, everyone has different taste. There was one 8 (in my book) and I waited a bit until she freed up. The mamasan had been sending me ladies and urging me to buy. Finally the girl of my choice sat down with me, and I gave the mamasan 1400.

Chris Long
07-27-13, 19:13
All bars are pretty much back to normal. I recently returned. There was a scare for a few days. But as usual. After a few days everything was back to normal.

Bars are doing party animals, having the girl meet you outside in 10 mins, some same old bar fine. Just said discreetly.

Between my friends and I. We hit most bars and never had any issues getting the girl, one payment method or another.

Some bars the girls will say "No BF, we don't do that here". Then whisper I can leave if you buy 10 LDs my quota to leave.

There maybe 2 or 3 bars that are hesitant if you are a newbie or suspicious looking to them. But all the rest, it's party time as usual.Thanks for the information on the current protocal. This is much appreciated.

Chirs

Gajith
07-27-13, 19:29
Me: Hey.

Jina: Hello,

Jina: I mean last month when you here?

Me: why?

Me: did you meet me? :P.

Me: or did you see me lolz.

Jina: maybe. You go vikings in mango?

Jina: because when I see you pictures I recognized you already but I'm not sure.

Me: hmm.

Me: you work for which bar?

Jina: vikings.

Me: yes I been there

Me: you may remember me.

Jina: I think so but maybe its yoou we together that time.

Me: jina is your real name?

Jina: you ask my number I give it to you that time because you say you call at me but my phone when I'm go home is gone.

Jina: yes jina and my name in bar is *

Me: oh ok.

Me: hmm.

Me: you didn't go bar today?

Jina: no I'm not feeling wel.

Me: ok.

Me: BTW. Any raid in Cebu Bars?

Jina: other bars.

Me: which other bars?

Me: in mango street?

Me: Somebody told me continuous raid in Angeles City.

Jina: yes near in gasoline station

Western787
07-27-13, 22:43
all bars are pretty much back to normal sometimes there is a lull before the storm. i think mr cobb is on the right track, as this looks like a perfect storm setting up, and what's most troubling now they don't seem to be distinguishing between pervs going after **** girls like the bar owner (in the abc nightline report below) at subic versus just tourists who would never go near any **** girls. note the united states under the protect act has long been claiming extra territorial jurisdiction for alleged criminal acts committed outside their borders, ones not even necessarily crimes in the countries where carried out. but of course while powerful democratic senator robert menedez (d-nj) and what may have occurred in costa rica is ignored and swept under the rug by the usa dept of justice (in his case actual credible evidence of involvement with **** providers) , the take down and examples here will be directed at small guys unable to defend themselves, blokes likely doing absolutely nothing wrong. if this is about only **** providers, that is one thing, but i am not sure anyone can proclaim that yet.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bqklpku-way

ThatGuy865
07-27-13, 23:16
[quote=thatguy865; 1451235]all bars are pretty much back to normal / quote]

sometimes there is a lull before the storm. i think mr cobb is on the right track, as this looks like a perfect storm setting up, and what's most troubling now they don't seem to be distinguishing between pervs going after **** girls like the bar owner (in the abc nightline report below) at subic versus just tourists who would never go near any **** girls. note the united states under the protect act has long been claiming extra territorial jurisdiction for alleged criminal acts committed outside their borders, ones not even necessarily crimes in the countries where carried out. but of course while powerful democratic senator robert menedez (d-nj) and what may have occurred in costa rica is ignored and swept under the rug by the usa dept of justice (in his case actual credible evidence of involvement with **** providers) , the take down and examples here will be directed at small guys unable to defend themselves, blokes likely doing absolutely nothing wrong. if this is about only **** providers, that is one thing, but i am not sure anyone can proclaim that yet.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bqklpku-wayno customers have ever been taken away. at worst they make you sit in the bar until it has been cleared. as long as you have identification they let you leave. always carry your drivers license or a copy of passport.

they cannot hold or charge a person for sitting in a bar having a drink. they would have to have undercover posing as bar girls waiting to sting customers. that would be damn near impossible because the bar would have to be in on it and it has never happened.

customers do not have to worry. the only ones that have any worry are the bar employees and the girls. besides they wouldn't want to scare off tourist and that would. even businessmen do p4p with business. and they would be scared off too. conventions would be moved to less hostile countries. they will only go after bar employees, who they consider the ones who are the major exploiters of the girls. fl's. are a different story and should be avoided in ac for that reason and others.

this is a re-occurring "money" making ploy they use every year or so. there were more raids in 2011. than this year.

ac may change. but it a slow gradual change. with plenty of fun to be had. what may happen 5 yrs down the road is a different story. but for now. its still disney land for men.

John Traveller
07-28-13, 06:07
You are fishing for information here, and I don't like it. To all: pleae don't give info on this open board that can lead to problems for individuals in bars in AC!


Ez rhino, below is a paragraph from your trip report (post 913013) you posted of your 1st 3 day first trip to Angeles last week, in it you clearly state that the girl you bar fined was from a perimeter road bar and you paid 1400 pesos,

Now as per your report yesterday (post 13119) you now claim that your 1400 peso barfine was from a fields avenue bar at 3pm,

Now I know fields avenue fairly well and as far as I know there are only two bars that would be open at 3pm and both do not have a barfine priced at 1400 pesos, are you sure it was fields and not as you say in your trip report a bar on perimeter road,

Please let us know exactly what you are saying, fields or perimeter, as I find it very hard to understand how you managed to barfine a girl on fields from bars that have a no bar fine policy and that you managed to even get a large discount thrown in too, it would also help your fellow mongers to name the bar on fields that is offering bar fines to first time visitors at heavily discounted rates, thanks.

John Traveller
07-28-13, 06:11
you are somewhat alarmist here. imho. the stuff you describe has not happened yet. sure, use caution and read the news, but at the moment there's no reason to stay away from ac.




sometimes there is a lull before the storm. i think mr cobb is on the right track, as this looks like a perfect storm setting up, and what's most troubling now they don't seem to be distinguishing between pervs going after **** girls like the bar owner (in the abc nightline report below) at subic versus just tourists who would never go near any **** girls. note the united states under the protect act has long been claiming extra territorial jurisdiction for alleged criminal acts committed outside their borders, ones not even necessarily crimes in the countries where carried out.

WestCoast1
07-28-13, 06:46
please let us know exactly what you are saying, fields or perimeter, as i find it very hard to understand how you managed to barfine a girl on fields from bars that have a no bar fine policy and that you managed to even get a large discount thrown in too, it would also help your fellow mongers to name the bar on fields that is offering bar fines to first time visitors at heavily discounted rates, thanks.the point might be moot. i am in touch (ym) with two bargirls who i had recently. one is a blow-row girl, the other is from a regular bar on fields (near angelwitch).

the blow-row girl went on a 2-hour st with a guy 3 days ago in the usual way to his hotel. he was drunk and beligerant. after the lovin' he would not let her leave the room or use her cell phone. she said she was very afraid of him. when he went to the can she grabbed her stuff and bolted back to the bar. i specifically asked if the p700 paid to the bar before departure was still in effect and she said yes.

the regular bar girl i took several weeks ago. in her bar, you just take the girl and give her the barfine amount the next morning, which she splits later with the bar (you leave the bar first while she changes, and she meets you just up the street a few minutes after you leave). she said in chat her date two nights previous was a nice guy but he pulled out a knife and peeled an apple in the room. i asked her if he was rude or did anything wrong, and she said no, but his having the knife scared her. he paid up in the morning the same amount that i paid and he gave her a tip on top of that (more than i did).

matt, you're going way out on a limb here.


you are fishing for information here, and i don't like it. to all: pleae don't give info on this open board that can lead to problems for individuals in bars in ac!good point. i was going to mention the two bars above (and show a picture of the front of each bar) , so mathew would 'get it'. but that might get a particular bar in trouble with the local authorities, so the approximate street location will have to do.

matt, can we be done with which bar is handling their former 'barfine' in which manner? we have gents reporting they are paying to take girls. and now the bargirls are confirming they are going to the hotels (for money).

Ekspat
07-28-13, 08:33
Now I know fields avenue fairly well and as far as I know there are only two bars that would be open at 3pm.Thinking just for a few seconds I know at least 6 bars open at 3pm between McArthur Highway and Phillies Sports Bar. If you consider Pony Tails still Fields, then easily 10 bars.

MathewCob
07-28-13, 08:45
Westcoast 1, yes there are a few reports on this forum of a select few who have managed to barfine in Angeles but lets be honest how are we to know who these individuals are in real life away from their made up forum names and personalities, some might never have visited, some might have an agenda (normally monetary) to post the glowing reports of how easy it is to get laid in angeles, some might be drunks, some might be Angeles bar owners, some might have severe mental problems and I might be a 60 year old lady boy with two dicks and three pussys LOL.

We have also heard from a few board members who claim like yourself that they have bargirl friends in Angeles who claim they still barfine, here's a bit of advice Westcoast 1,

When a bargirl is moving her lips she is 99. 9% of the time lying, especially if she is a pinay bargirl, we have had posts stating, don't worry lads I text a friend of a friend who is in Angeles and he says that all is rosy, the party is even better than ever,

With due respect, I would rather believe what I saw with my own eyes, heard with my own ears, and experienced on my own very recent barhops in angeles, now as I said in my trip report I was with Angeles residents, ex bar owners, between us over 200 years of mongering experience, now if we could not get girls to barfine or to leave with us regardless of the way we paid then I doubt many people are able to,

Harry the horse, the local Angeles newspapers, the news online, the tv news, the nbi, the police, the mayor, are all claiming that [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) and barfines have stopped or the bars who don't listen will be raided and forced to stop, now I have previously posted all the relevant links to this so won't post again,

3 of the main and biggest online Angeles based forums are full to the brim of guys not being able to barfine on fields, even with girls who had previous to the recent clampdown were eager to barfine, even guys on my barhop tried to barfine girls they had previously been with, with no takers, many bar owners of angeles are posting about the mayors meetings where he has clearly said no more barfines, no more [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) and no more prostitution, the bars who do not listen will be raided and closed with prosecutions bought against those responsible for breaking the rules,

We have seen evidence of this over the past two weeks with many bars raided, people arrested and awaiting their day in court, some bars have reopened under stricter policy rules and some bars have remained padlocked, over the last 18 months some 40 bars in angeles have been raided and closed, (some have reopened but go along with the rules, some changed owners / names, some remain closed) that's approx 50% of all angeles bars have been raided,

Am I dreaming all this? Or is this what is happening, yes I'm sure that some small blow job bars on blow row and some bars in far out perimeter road are trying to find ways around the mayors wishes but I say the mayor is adamant, the police are adamant, the special task force are adamant and most important the us government and Hillary Clinton are hell bent on closing down the bars of Angeles if they don't fully understand and stick to the new rules.

Now Westcoast 1, you might choose not to believe me, the news the mayor or harry the horse, you might choose to believe some of the guys that swear blind Angeles is still rocking and nothing has changed, you might choose to believe the few Angeles bargirls, or the friend of a friends claims as they say up to you, as for me I'll choose to believe what I have recently experienced and not what others might claim, thanks.

Uzinuzin
07-28-13, 09:01
You are fishing for information here, and I don't like it. To all: pleae don't give info on this open board that can lead to problems for individuals in bars in AC!Very good point, I don't know anything about AC or Phili board, just read a few pages for info, but sure enough noticed this poster MC sounds like having an ulterior motive and agenda, watch out guys, he might even be from the other side (authorities) , gathering info and scaremongering. Too focused in his posts, don't feed him!

MathewCob
07-28-13, 09:23
Thinking just for a few seconds I know at least 6 bars open at 3pm between McArthur Highway and Phillies Sports Bar. If you consider Pony Tails still Fields, then easily 10 bars.I think you will find that Fields is whats now called walking st, the pedestrianised part, basically between Atlantis and Mc Donalds near to McArthur highway, and the Club / Phillies etc is upper perimeter road, Pony Tails is mid perimeter road (checkpoint) with petron through to lost in Asia as lower perimeter road,

Now when I said two bars in Fields I meant Fields itself (now walking st) I won't name the two as people are getting paranoid but regardless of the number that are open at 3pm on Fields I think you will agree that none ever offered a 1400 peso barfine as of late.

Tman525
07-28-13, 17:26
now westcoast 1, you might choose not to believe me, the news the mayor or harry the horse, you might choose to believe some of the guys that swear blind angeles is still rocking and nothing has changed, you might choose to believe the few angeles bargirls, or the friend of a friends claims as they say up to you, as for me i'll choose to believe what i have recently experienced and not what others might claim, thanks.i have just left ac after a week. my posts on how i found things are at odds with the opinion that things have irretrievably changed in angeles regarding men procuring women. so folks will have to be informed by what they read from mongers visiting angeles and their posts.

just before i left i was talking with one bargirl who thought that any crackdown would be inconsistent and short lived if for only because the local authorities derived such significant income from the bars and any long term reduction of historic revenues equates to self-harming. what particularly struck me was that, whatever might be going on in the bars, there was no change to the street begging by young children. if abuse of the most vulnerable is to be stopped, surely the street children (a well documented target of western ****s in asia) deserve as much if not more protection and help? but they still line the perimeter road.

on a lighter note, i was in high society on friday night with a bargirl (facebook acquaintance) and her older sister & other bargirl friends. some came back to my room for a drink, the sister went off with another guy to his hotel. whilst with me later on, my girl got a call from her sister who was now back with her american boyfriend & he wanted to say his goodbyes to my friend as he was leaving the next day. so to summarise: the american guy's loyal bargirl gf celebrates his last night by picking up a guy in hs for a quick fuck (very quick and unsatisfying apparently) before nipping back to his side to say "come back soon, hun, miss you already"! my girl said her sister was feeling very horny. well that's all right then!

Western787
07-28-13, 17:43
. This poster MC sounds like having an ulterior motive and agenda, watch out guys, he might even be from the other side (authorities) , gathering info and scaremongering.Like authorities don't already have sufficient "evidence" on the scene to carry out the crackdown? LOL. The problem is: this isn't even about Angeles City or the Philippines per se, as there are much large forces outside of the country hell bent on carrying out a political agenda regardless of the reality, and if innocent tourists get put away for long prison sentences, it doesn't concern them. Meanwhile the public at large in the wealthier elite western countries is still asleep and continues to be easily manipulated by the hysterical NGO claims, constantly being reinforced by a mainstream media which long abrogated their role as independent journalists. So who is going to stop the witch hunt?

MathewCob
07-28-13, 17:55
No customers have ever been taken away. At worst they make you sit in the bar until it has been cleared. As long as you have identification they let you leave. Always carry your Drivers license or a copy of passport.

They cannot hold or charge a person for sitting in a bar having a drink. They would have to have undercover posing as bar girls waiting to sting customers. That would be damn near impossible because the bar would have to be in on it and it has never happened.

Customers do not have to worry. The only ones that have any worry are the Bar employees and the girls. Besides they wouldn't want to scare off tourist and that would. Even Businessmen do P4P with business. And they would be scared off too. Conventions would be moved to less hostile countries. They will only go after bar employees, who they consider the ones who are the MAJOR exploiters of the girls. FL's. Are a different story and should be avoided in AC for that reason and others...I think you will find that during the Pony Tail raid it was widely reported in the press and on all the boards that a German national tourist had been arrested along with the bar girls / mummys / managers.

He was held for 48 hours at camp crane (Manila nbi jail) and released without charge, nobody knows if large sums of money changed hands for his early release or not.

Now I agree that apart from the German tourist up till now all that the raiding teams are doing is holding all the customers back until they see their passports, but, and the big but is 'up till now' in truth nobody knows what might happen in the near future.

The terms and laws governing [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) is very complex, it can be twisted and turned to mean all sorts of things, technically if you are a paying customer who is contributing funds (buying drinks) to an establishment where trafficked bar girls are clearly working then technically things could go bad for you should the authorities try to make an example.

The main thing is to remember where we are, we are in angeles in the Philippines, a fourth world country that is heavily corrupt, which means we are at the mercy of whatever charges the authorities want to try and pin on us, legal or not.

Don't forget human traffick offences are un bailable offences, should the authorities wish to they can technically lock up anyone under the human traffick laws and leave him in a jail for 2-5 years till his case comes to court.

Now as you rightly say, up till now the authorities have not gone after the foreign customers, but that's not to say they won't in the future, thanks.

MathewCob
07-28-13, 18:03
. This poster MC sounds like having an ulterior motive and agenda, watch out guys, he might even be from the other side (authorities) , gathering info and scaremongering.

Like authorities don't already have sufficient "evidence" on the scene to carry out the crackdown? LOL. The problem is: this isn't even about Angeles City or the Philippines per se, as there are much large forces outside of the country hell bent on carrying out a political agenda regardless of the reality, and if innocent tourists get put away for long prison sentences, it doesn't concern them. Meanwhile the public at large in the wealthier elite western countries is still asleep and continues to be easily manipulated by the hysterical NGO claims, constantly being reinforced by a mainstream media which long abrogated their role as independent journalists. So who is going to stop the witch hunt?Your earlier abc documentary link is powerful proof that huge resourses are being poured into the crackdowns, as was clearly demonstrated the human traffick team are in most bars in Angeles city already and know exactly who's doing what, thanks.

Western787
07-28-13, 18:09
if abuse of the most vulnerable is to be stopped, surely the street children (a well documented target of western ****s in asia) deserve as much if not more protection and help?while enforcement has been accelerating in various places like cambodia in regard to this issue, the press and usa state is never going to concede that perhaps 90% to 95% or more of the problem and true scourge of "[CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908)" problem is really about gay men from wealthier countries going to impoverished areas of the world looking to molest (ideally) pre adolescence young boys. the reason: its not politically correct to admit this, nor do they ask why for example why do so many gay men (not the majority of course) seem to have this rather odd predisposition? even with the catholic church priest scandal in the usa which technically was not really ****phelia (as altar boys are typically too old) , the msm continues to pretend this was not primarily a gay priest problem, and in fact the altar boys they molested were typically 3 or 4 years over their ideal targets, but they took what was available. same with the boy scouts in the usa, the press won't report the truth. the fbi at one point had stats showing a 50 to 1 more higher incidence rate on gay men molesting young boys vs heterosexual men molesting young (pre adolescent) young girls. the msm will continue to cherry pick situations where heterosexual men get involved with 16 or 17 year old females, which of course is criminal and should be prosecuted with the perpetrators punished, but they do it with the idea of sweeping the larger problem under the rug. the vast majority of adult heterosexual males do not want the risk or hassle of contact with under 18 females, most seeing it as just plain wrong on its face, nor do most see a difference between the avg 18 year old female and 17 yearold female, but the msm in the western countries will continue to have you believe otherwise. the ballbusting feminists in the usa now running usa state don't believe 18 year females, or 19 years old or older females for that matter, can consent to anything if it involves p4p, so its obvious now they've got their vehicle now to carry out their agenda against the men they despise.

WestCoast1
07-28-13, 18:23
Matt, thanks for your honest reporting.


Westcoast 1, yes there are a few reports on this forum of a select few who have managed to barfine in Angeles but lets be honest how are we to know who these individuals are in real life away from their made up forum names and personalities, some might never have visited, some might have an agenda (normally monetary) to post the glowing reports of how easy it is to get laid in angeles, some might be drunks, some might be Angeles bar owners, some might have severe mental problems and I might be a 60 year old lady boy with two dicks and three pussys LOL.But this is till a stretch. Rhino and ThatGuy have 500 credible posts between them. To suggest they are drunks or bar owners is a stretch.


We have also heard from a few board members who claim like yourself that they have bargirl friends in Angeles who claim they still barfine, here's a bit of advice Westcoast 1,

When a bargirl is moving her lips she is 99. 9% of the time lying, especially if she is a pinay bargirl, That's not good advice. I'm sorry you feel this way. To assume that you are being lied to by every bargirl you (or I) meet, and that multiple regular gents here are lying / drunkards, suggests an interesting level of paranoia. There's little reason to believe when chatting YM to a bargirl (who is not asking for money) that she's lying when she tells me about her son's schooling or a customer she had. Why you would make that assumption is reasonably 'out there'.


With due respect, I would rather believe what I saw with my own eyes, heard with my own ears, and experienced on my own very recent barhops in angeles, now as I said in my trip report I was with Angeles residents, ex bar owners, between us over 200 years of mongering experience, now if we could not get girls to barfine or to leave with us regardless of the way we paid then I doubt many people are able to,I'm not doubting it. Probably due to whatever current fears at the time, you guys had trouble barfining. That appears to have lightened. If I, like you, were to only trust my own eyes and experiences, it would be difficult to believe what you are saying. But I like to keep an open mind.


Harry the horse, the local Angeles newspapers, the news online, the tv news, the nbi, the police, the mayor, are all claiming that [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) and barfines have stopped or the bars who don't listen will be raided and forced to stop, now I have previously posted all the relevant links to this so won't post again,I've got some reading to do!


Am I dreaming all this?No. But if you don't currently have boots on the ground, go back and get us a fuller report from multiple bars. And stop concerning yourself with only a certain group (walking street). If the blowrow bars, or bars near AngelWitch are still barfining (in any format) , then that counts, too.


Now Westcoast 1, you might choose not to believe me, the news the mayor or harry the horse, you might choose to believe some of the guys that swear blind Angeles is still rocking and nothing has changed, you might choose to believe the few Angeles bargirls, or the friend of a friends claims as they say up to you, as for me I'll choose to believe what I have recently experienced and not what others might claim, thanks.Me too! One man's roof is another man's floor. People can have differing experiences, and reasonable minds can disagree.

WestCoast1
07-28-13, 21:35
Harry the horse, the local Angeles newspapers, the news online, the tv news, the nbi, the police, the mayor, are all claiming that [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) and barfines have stopped or the bars who don't listen will be raided and forced to stop, now I have previously posted all the relevant links to this so won't post again,You cited Harry the Horse site. I visited there and went right to the most current July 2013 Newsletters. The most current posting from Harry is June 30 (not exactly up-to-date, as you yourself mentioned my own reporting was several weeks old). From Harry's most recent rant:

"All I can say for sure Bob is we can only wait and see where the chips fall. For now, enjoy what we have and quit complaining about the small shit. Not all hotels and bars are the same. Right now most customers are happy and having a good time. It is business owners that have to worry not the customers."

Harry thinks the koreans would like to get in on more of the action:

"No City official will go after the Koreans. The Mayor, Alex C, City Councilors, they all love them. Why you ask? The same reason they USED to love the Americans, Australians, etc, MONEY. The Koreans are not behind all the raids, if any at all. I do believe that the Koreans would like to be able to take over the action on Fields Ave and I believe that Alex C. Would love to see that as well. That is not factual, just my gut feeling. The entertainment area is under attack by the IJM, CIDG, NBI, BIR and City Hall and quite possibly higher ups in Manila who could be pressuring our Mayor. Right now I cannot predict the outcome of this latest campaign against the Clubs on Fields and along Perimeter Road; I can say it has a lot of people nervous"

OTOH, he wrote this:

"Also, it appears that City Hall here is ready to throw the bars to the wolves. Recently two bars were raided and employees detained, the last being just a few days ago. The Mayor's comment, when I contacted him was: 'We were never remiss in telling and warning them'. I cannot disagree with this. At a meeting in May with bar owners he did lay down the law about bar fines, etc, and warned the owners that he would not allow such activities. Obviously the Mayor will not support any bar owner, manager or Mamasan that does not comply with his warning. The IJM and law enforcement wolves are knocking at the doors folks, some want publicity, some just want money, whatever, Clubs must change their rules or remain vulnerable."

=======================

So, Harry sees things as changing, but as of June 30 he also sees the customers as having the same good time.

ThatGuy865
07-29-13, 01:29
As I see it Matt C has little to no credibility.

Just to logically think about what MC states as the situation. No bars on fields doing Bar Fines. Do you really think. That every forum including this one would be flooded with mongers stating this as fact. Saying how they wasted all that money flying to AC to find out no bars on fields were doing BF's. There would be an uproar of post. MC would not be the only one raising this issue. It would be many posts.

Could you imagine the flood of post if Thailand stopped BF's on Walking street. Do you think there would only be one guy spouting its demise.

No different for Fields.

Second. In the same meeting the Mayor to whom MC references also stated that the bar which were raided and closed would not re-open under any circumstances. Well most have re-opened. Candy bar, Viking, Camelot, and in all girls are going home with guys. So there goes so much for the Mayor keeping a hard stance on his edict.

There is no need to fact check. The mere fact the internet (this forum included) isn't flooded with this news speaks volumes.

I am not sure I even believe MC has been there as his report is pretty vague and general with no specifics. things which could easily been repeated from reading the forum. Especially stating his friends could speak fluent Tagalog And still could not get a girl to leave from any bar on Fields. The girls usually go ape shit over guys that speak Tagalog.

I really think his post have more to do with an agenda than giving out accurate information.

Wicked Roger
07-29-13, 02:35
You cited Harry the Horse site. I visited there and went right to the most current July 2013 Newsletters. The most current posting from Harry is June 30 (not exactly up-to-date, as you yourself mentioned my own reporting was several weeks old). From Harry's most recent rant:

So, Harry sees things as changing, but as of June 30 he also sees the customers as having the same good time.I posted the same thing Westie and read his web site at times. I also know of a good mate (ISG member) who had no issues bar fining recently. He left 2 days ago from AC. From a number of bars in AC. He won't post anything (details) as he thinks MCobb is really someone out trolling for information (another poster said the same thing) but he confirmed that nothing has changed and he is a regular visitor there.

Yes things evolve but generally the status quo is preserved in some way albeit in a slightly different form.

What is for sure is that things will change but biting the hand the feeds you is a somewhat risky strategy especially if the bar owners go elsewhere and pay some other group of people. As for Korean, have heard similar from a number of people who live there or are regular visitors (and know some bar owners). Seems the girls do not like the Koreans especially and are more concerned about events moving in that direction rather than the lack of bar fines etc.

Western787
07-29-13, 02:57
60 year old lady boy with two dicks and three pussysOutside Nana Hotel every single night, I seen that dude, botched surgeries I heard.

Western787
07-29-13, 03:09
"All I can say for sure Bob is we can only wait and see where the chips fall. For now, enjoy what we have and quit complaining about the small shit. Not all hotels and bars are the same. Right now most customers are happy and having a good time. It is business owners that have to worry not the customers."

[/I] "The entertainment area is under attack by the IJM, CIDG, NBI, BIR and City Hall and quite possibly higher ups in Manila who could be pressuring our Mayor. Right now I cannot predict the outcome of this latest campaign against the Clubs on Fields and along Perimeter Road; I can say it has a lot of people nervous"[/I]I believed they had a "good time" on the Titanic too for a time after it hit the iceberg. That's not exactly a ringing endorsement by Harry the Horse.

Wicked Roger
07-29-13, 06:42
Husband? I guess it worked!

I was with a petite and cute little thing at the mall once. I see an old git nearby with an equally petite and cute little thing. At some point the other girl comes up and talks to my girl. Later I ask what was up. Apparently, old git sent his girl over to see if my girl would like to join HIM. I was tempted to have words with the old git, but thought better of it. No reason to fight over sand while at the beach. X.

Thanks for the interesting post BD. X.I do that sometimes but am not an old git XMan (no need to clarify either). See you in August.

BD. Nice report shows bar fines are still operating but as others have said it will operate under a different system.

MCobb. You claimed recently that someone's FR of a week ago was too old, yours are even older so what we read is up to date and even you could be a different person under your handle so don't tar some with a brush when you don't include yourself.

I know many of the posters and they are genuine and what they say about AC now should be taken as fact and fair.

Ekspat
07-29-13, 09:10
I think you will find that Fields is whats now called walking st, the pedestrianised part, basically between Atlantis and Mc Donalds near to McArthur highway, and the Club / Phillies etc is upper perimeter road, Pony Tails is mid perimeter roadYou should have a look in any map of Balibago, and you'll find that Fields ends at the check-point and Perimeter Road (Don Juico) starts there. Even Google maps shows that and the address of Margerita Station is still Fields.


I meant Fields itself (now walking st) I won't name the twoI got that. But again, at least 6 bars are open at 3pm in this stretch, maybe even 7 or 8. Barfine prices I'm not sure.

Anyway, EOD, will be there soon and check it out.

Western787
07-31-13, 08:54
mr cobb's concerns appear to be well founded. however, currently unknown is 1. whether the mayor accepts "go arounds." 2. whether typical (provider 18 and over) p4p tourists will soon be arrested under so-called "[CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908)" laws.

this the actual (tip) report issued by usa sec of state john kerry in june 2013. i capitalized certain words that make it clear they are going after the entire p4p industry under the pretense of "[CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908)" and irregardless of whether the provider is of lawful (18 and over) age and gives full consent. angeles (and subic's) relative small size in regard to tourism does not matter, as the leverage here is about the air and naval bases, as it relates to the current situation with china.

trafficking in persons report 2013

philippines tier 2

the philippines is a source country and, to a much lesser extent, a destination and transit country for men, women, and children subjected to sex trafficking and forced labor. a significant number of filipino men and women who migrate abroad for work are subsequently subjected to conditions of involuntary servitude. men, women, and children are subjected to conditions of forced labor in factories, at construction sites, on fishing vessels, on agricultural plantations, and in the shipping industry, as well as in domestic service and other service sector jobs in asia and increasingly throughout the middle east. a significant number of filipina women working in domestic service in foreign countries also face [CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123), physical violence, and sexual abuse. skilled filipino migrant workers such as engineers and nurses are also subjected to conditions of forced labor abroad. filipina women were subjected to sex trafficking in malaysia, singapore, hong kong, republic of korea, china, japan, saudi arabia, united arab emirates, qatar, kuwait, and syria.

trafficking of men, women, and children within the country also remains a significant problem. people are trafficked from rural areas to urban centers including manila, cebu, the city of angeles, and increasingly cities in mindanao, as well as within other urban areas and tourist destinations such as boracay, olongapo, puerta galera, and surigao. men are subjected to forced labor and debt bondage in agriculture, including on sugar cane plantations, and in the fishing industry. women and children were trafficked within the country the country for forced labor as domestic workers and small-scale factory workers, for forced begging, and for exploitation in the commercial sex trade. hundreds of victims are subjected to sex trafficking each day in well-known and highly visible business establishments that cater to filipinos' and foreign tourists demand for commercial sex acts. filipino migrant workers, both domestically and abroad, who became trafficking victims are often subjected to violence, threats, inhumane living conditions, nonpayment of salaries, confinement, and withholding of travel and identity documents.

traffickers, at times in partnership with organized crime syndicates and corrupt government officials, recruit family and friends from villages and urban neighborhoods, sometimes masquerading as representatives of government-registered employment agencies. during the year, traffickers increasingly used email and social networking sites to fraudulently recruit filipinos for overseas work. fraudulent recruitment practices and the institutionalized practice of paying recruitment fees leave workers vulnerable to forced labor, debt bondage, and commercial sexual exploitation. reports that illicit recruiters used student, intern, and exchange program visas to circumvent the philippine government and receiving countries' regulatory frameworks for foreign workers are not uncommon. recruiters continued to employ various methods to avoid government-run victim detection units at airports and seaports. traffickers utilized budget airlines, inter-island ferries and barges, buses, small private boats, and even chartered flights to transport their victims domestically and internationally. organized crime syndicates transported sex trafficking victims from china through the philippines en route to third-country destinations.

child sex tourism remained a serious problem in the philippines, with sex tourists coming from northeast asia, australia, new zealand, europe, and north america to engage in the commercial sexual exploitation of children. increasingly, filipino children are coerced to perform sex acts for internet broadcast to paying foreign viewers. an ngo reported an increasing risk of boys becoming victims of commercial sexual exploitation.

children in conflict-afflicted areas were particularly vulnerable to trafficking. the moro islamic liberation front, a separatist group, and the new people's army were identified by the un as among the world's persistent perpetrators of violations against children in armed conflict, including unlawfully recruiting and using children. during the year, the un reported on the abu sayyaf group's continued targeting of children for conscription as both combatants and noncombatants. there were reports that, in one incident, the armed forces of the philippines (afp) forced two children aged 12 and 13 to serve as guides; the children were reportedly released the same day. there were also reports that one child was inadvertently recruited into a paramilitary entity operational under the afp during the year.

the government of the philippines does not fully comply with the minimum standards for the elimination of trafficking; however, it is making significant efforts to do so. the government sustained its levels of funding for the inter-agency council against trafficking (iacat) at the equivalent of approximately $1. 2 million in 2012 and continued efforts to implement anti-trafficking laws and policies at the national, regional, and provincial levels. it undertook notable efforts to prevent the trafficking of overseas workers and to protect filipino victims exploited abroad, and increased many of its financial and human resource allocations to combat trafficking. it did not, however, make significant progress in addressing the underlying weaknesses in its judicial system, which stymied efforts to hold trafficking offenders accountable, and the overall number of prosecutions and convictions remained disproportionately low for the size of the problem. it enacted amendments to its anti-trafficking legislation that could facilitate prosecution of a wider range of cases, but the excessive length of trials and lack of public prosecutors dedicated to trafficking cases continue to limit progress. the government identified and provided protections to trafficking victims but did not make significant efforts to increase the availability of specialized services. rampant corruption at all levels enabled traffickers and undermined efforts to combat trafficking.

recommendations for the philippines: increase efforts to investigate, prosecute, and convict an increased number of both labor and sex trafficking offenders implicated in the trafficking of filipinos within the country and abroad; address the significant backlog of trafficking cases by developing mechanisms to track and monitor the status of cases filed with the department of justice (doj) and those under trial in the courts; conduct immediate and rigorous investigations of complaints of trafficking complicity by government officials, and ensure accountability for leaders that fail to address trafficking-related corruption within their areas of jurisdiction; ensure the government's armed forces or paramilitary groups supported by the government do not recruit or use children; continue to strengthen anti-trafficking training for police recruits, front-line officers, and police investigators; increase the number of government officials whose duties are dedicated solely to anti-trafficking activities; continue and improve collaboration between victim service organizations and law enforcement authorities with regard to law enforcement operations; make efforts to expand the use of victim processing centers to additional localities to improve identification of adult victims and allow for victims to be processed and assisted in a safe environment after a rescue operation; examine 'off-loading' policies to ensure this practice does not interfere with individuals' freedom of movement; increase victim shelter resources and expand the government shelter system to assist a greater number of trafficking victims, including male victims of sex and labor trafficking; increase funding for the doj's witness protection program and facilitate the entry of trafficking victims into the program; increase efforts to identify trafficking victims in destination countries and to pursue criminal investigation and prosecution of their traffickers; and develop and implement programs aimed at reducing the demand for commercial sex acts, including child sex tourism.

prosecution.

the government continued to prosecute sex and labor trafficking offenders and to impose stringent sentences on convicted offenders, but it convicted fewer offenders than it did during the previous year. the philippines criminally prohibits sex and labor trafficking through its 2003 anti-trafficking in persons act, which prescribes penalties that are sufficiently stringent and commensurate with those prescribed for other serious crimes, such as [CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123). in february 2013, the government enacted an amendment to its 2003 law that defined additional acts as constituting trafficking in persons and included provisions for the prosecution of attempted trafficking; the new law also provides for extraterritorial jurisdiction of trafficking crimes committed by filipino citizens or legal residents or against filipino citizens abroad. during the reporting period. 227 cases were filed with the doj for potential prosecution, but it is unknown how many cases were prosecuted. the government convicted 24 trafficking offenders, a decrease from the 29 traffickers convicted during the previous year; three convictions were for labor trafficking, a slight increase from the two labor trafficking convictions obtained during the previous year. an international ngo assisted the government with seven of the 19 cases that resulted in convictions. sentences for those convicted ranged from 17 years to life imprisonment, with the majority of offenders sentenced to life imprisonment. in one successful case, a sex trafficking conviction was obtained in the philippines for a local filipina recruiter, and iacat support was given to the court in malaysia that reportedly convicted her singaporean counterpart for [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) violations in malaysia. the government's anti-money laundering law could be used to file a civil action requesting courts freeze and seize assets of suspected traffickers, but there were no reports that victims received this form of redress during the year. nonetheless, hundreds of victims continue to be trafficked each day in well-known, highly visible establishments, many of which have never been the target of anti-trafficking law enforcement action.

although the doj encouraged courts' expedited processing of trafficking cases based on a 2010 supreme court circular setting a six-month limit, inefficiencies in the judicial system posed serious challenges to the successful prosecution of some cases; government and ngo observers estimated the average length of trafficking cases to be between three-and-a-half and five years. the doj, which houses the iacat secretariat, is responsible for the prosecution of suspected offenders and protection of witnesses in trafficking cases and assigned 93 prosecutors to work on trafficking in persons cases, a significant increase from 58 in the previous year. nineteen of these prosecutors were with the iacat secretariat, while 74 were assigned to airport and regional taskforces. most of these prosecutors, however, were given this responsibility in addition to their regular workloads. the government continued to employ a taskforce model, in which prosecutors were assigned to assist law enforcement in building cases against suspected trafficking offenders; eight new taskforces were established during the year, bringing the total to 14. observers reported that constant collaboration between law enforcement officers and prosecutors led to more organized investigations during the reporting period.

the government continued strong efforts to provide anti-trafficking training to government officials: iacat independently conducted 90 training sessions for government and ngo stakeholders and 14 in cooperation with other partners, police trained 1, 616 officers working on women and children's desks, and ngos and foreign donors provided additional training to law enforcement officers. nonetheless, ngos continue to report a lack of understanding of trafficking and the country's anti-trafficking legal framework among many judges, prosecutors, social service workers, and law enforcement officials; low awareness and high rates of turnover among officials continue to pose a significant impediment to successful prosecutions. philippine officials cooperated with counterparts in other countries to rescue victims and pursue law enforcement action against suspected traffickers; two such cases led to convictions of recruiters in china and malaysia for labor and immigration infractions.

law enforcement officials' complicity in [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) remained a problem in the philippines, and corruption at all levels of government enables traffickers to prosper. officials in government units and agencies assigned to enforce laws against [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) reportedly permitted trafficking offenders to conduct illegal activities, allowed traffickers to escape during raids, extorted bribes, facilitated illegal departures for overseas workers, and accepted payments or sexual services from establishments known to traffic women and children. during the year, a judge was reported to have criminally mishandled trafficking cases, and a city prosecutor allegedly accepted a bribe to downgrade a [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) charge to child abuse. there were ongoing allegations that police officers at times conducted indiscriminate or fake raids on commercial sex establishments to extort bribes from managers, clients, and female victims in the sex industry, sometimes threatening the victims with imprisonment.

during the year, the government took some steps to identify and prosecute officials complicit in [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908), and it dismissed officials who may have facilitated trafficking, though no public officials were criminally convicted for trafficking or trafficking-related corruption. two officials were charged under the anti-trafficking law for facilitating illegal departures of overseas workers, but these cases had not been concluded by the close of the reporting period. a philippine ambassador abroad, accused of sexual exploitation of a domestic worker, was investigated for possible trafficking; the ambassador was recalled and currently faces charges in the philippines for sexual harassment.

protection.

the government sustained its efforts to identify and protect trafficking victims during the year, but overall there were inadequate resources available to serve the large number of victims in the country. in 2012, the government allocated equivalent of approximately $615, 000 to the department of social welfare and development (dswd) to fund the recovery and reintegration program for trafficked persons. the government reported the majority of the 2, 569 victims assisted by dswd received skills training, shelter, medical services, and legal assistance under this program; an unknown number of these also received financial assistance to seek employment or start their own businesses. the dswd operated 42 temporary shelters for victims of all types of abuse, and iacat referred 135 trafficking victims to dswd for support through its residential and community-based services. facilities were generally inadequate to address the specific needs of trafficking victims, and at times, shelters lacked the space necessary to accommodate the influx of victims following large-scale law enforcement operations. specialized services for male victims were inadequate; this led to male victims, including children, being released from protective care prematurely and negatively affected their rehabilitation and reintegration. the government established a center for male victims, but at the close of the reporting year it was not yet fully operational. the lack of services was particularly detrimental to male victims of sex trafficking, a growing population in the philippines. the iacat operations center established a temporary shelter for witnesses and trafficking victims that was subsequently transferred to a local government agency; the shelter offered some social services and vocational opportunities to 15 victims during the year.

the government followed formal procedures to identify and assist victims and refer them to government or ngo facilities for short- and long-term care. numerous government agencies employed proactive identification measures; victims were identified through rescue operations, screening at departure points, embassies abroad, and calls to the national anti-trafficking help line. many police units had specialized facilities for processing women and child victims. due to overlapping and incomplete data collection systems across various agencies, reliable statistics for the total number of victims identified and assisted during the year were not available. government shelters did not detain adult victims against their will, though victims who chose to reside in shelters were not permitted to leave the premises unattended. the department of labor and employment (dole) led four operations rescuing 223 children and removed additional children from the worst forms of child labor, including forced labor and sex trafficking; as a result of these operations, four businesses alleged to be engaged in sex trafficking of minors were permanently closed. two children captured during fighting against armed groups were allegedly detained and charged with crimes. one child inadvertently recruited into a paramilitary entity under afp operational control was removed and referred to dswd. during the year, the government finalized the development of a monitoring and response system for grave child rights violations, including child soldiering. no foreign trafficking victims were identified during the year. iacat operated an anti-trafficking help line; during the year, the line received over 7, 000 calls leading to the identification of 133 trafficking victims. the government encouraged victims to assist in the investigation and prosecution of their traffickers, but the serious lack of victim and witness protection programs, exacerbated by a lengthy trial process and fear of retaliation by traffickers, caused many victims to decline or withdraw cooperation. during the year, the iacat launched its operations center witness location program, which located 25 witnesses and victims willing to testify in cases, and assisted 88 witnesses attending hearings; doj increased the number of victims assisted by its witness protection program from 18 to 60, but the majority of victims did not have access to this form of protection. the dswd continued to hold trainings on victim identification and protection throughout the year. most local social welfare officers, however, remain inadequately trained on how to assist rescued trafficking victims, particularly children and victims of labor trafficking.

the dswd and the department of foreign affairs (dfa) coordinated with ngos in other countries to provide temporary shelter, counseling, and medical assistance to 1, 029 victims of trafficking and illegal recruitment identified abroad, and established 15 new multi-agency filipino workers' resource centers overseas to assist workers in 36 countries with 20, 000 or more filipino workers. dswd social workers were deployed to philippine diplomatic missions in malaysia and saudi arabia, where they assisted 2, 604 filipinos overseas. services to victims identified overseas included plane tickets, shipment of personal items, temporary shelter, counseling, and medical assistance.

prevention.

the government continued its robust efforts to prevent [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) during the reporting period; numerous government agencies conducted seminars and training sessions for government officials and community members, and the government provided funding to two ngos to implement additional awareness campaigns. the iacat and other government taskforces involved in anti-trafficking activities continued to meet regularly to share information and coordinate policies, and the iacat partnered with the presidential taskforce against illegal recruitment to establish a joint operations center to respond to reported cases. the philippine overseas employment agency (poea) conducted 862 pre-employment orientation seminars for over 150, 000 prospective and outbound filipino overseas workers, and the commission on filipinos overseas (cfo) held targeted counseling programs for groups considered at-risk, including filipinos seeking overseas marriages or those migrating to europe to work as au pairs. the iacat conducted a two-day anti-trafficking awareness seminar for media professionals in a region known to be a center of trafficking, and the cfo partnered with a private radio and television broadcasting association to develop a short public service announcement that aired on numerous stations between april and june 2012. during the reporting year, poea investigated 9, 029 allegations of unlawful practices by recruitment agencies and filed two cases of trafficking. the government continued to operate its two overseas passenger assistance centers to distribute awareness materials and screen passengers for signs of trafficking in regions where seaports are known to be a departure point for victims. the immigration department continued its intensified efforts to screen for potential trafficking victims at airports and seaports; this aggressive effort to 'off-load' suspected victims for interviews—in essence blocking their travel from the philippines—raised concerns that filipinos' right to travel out of the country might be unduly restricted. there was a significant increase over the previous year in the number of potential victims identified through this method.

in january 2013, the government enacted the domestic workers act, which provides specific protections to domestic workers including mandatory daily and weekly rest periods and the prohibition of recruitment fees charged to workers by a private agency or third party. the government's amended law on migrant workers continued the ban on deployment of filipinos or 'de-certifications' to 14 countries or territories deemed to lack adequate legal protections for workers. afghanistan, chad, cuba, haiti, libya, mali, mauritania, nepal, niger, the democratic people's republic of korea, the palestinian territories, somalia, uzbekistan, and zimbabwe are designated as noncompliant by the dfa. during the year, the government issued resolutions certifying iraq, yemen, and eritrea, thereby allowing the flow of workers to these countries to resume. to decrease the vulnerability to trafficking of thousands of undocumented filipino workers in the malaysian state of sabah, the dfa sent a philippine consul from its embassy in kuala lumpur four times during the year to provide services to this population, including the provision of passports and other documents. the dfa provided anti-trafficking training to new overseas diplomats hired during the year, and the dole maintained 42 labor attaches in 36 diplomatic missions to assist overseas workers. the cfo, in cooperation with the iacat, launched a series of international toll-free help lines in 16 countries that forward calls to the philippines' national help line. in february 2013, the help line in the philippines implemented free text messaging capabilities, though this is not yet available for all mobile phone users. despite significant local demand in the country's thriving commercial sex trade, the government's efforts to reduce the demand for commercial sex acts in the philippines were negligible. during the year, the government charged two child sex tourists under the anti-trafficking law and deported 15 foreign nationals for child sex crimes. the government provided training, including a module on [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908), to philippine troops prior to their deployment abroad on international peacekeeping missions.

===========================================

editor's note: this report was originally written in all capital lettering and thus was edited to normal case text. writing in all capital lettering in the internet equivalent of shouting and is thus is prohibited on this forum.

in the future, please do not write reports in all capital lettering. thanks!

Wicked Roger
07-31-13, 09:13
Mr Cobb's concerns appear to be well founded. In any case we will soon know whether the Mayor accepts "go arounds".

This the actual (TIP) report issued by USA Sec of State John Kerry in June 2013.Always amazes me how the USA is so much into telling the world how to behave when in its own backyard there are many illegal and exploited immigrants who are equally trafficked etc. I have family in the USA and go there many times but still amazes me that people forget this fact all the same.

As to AC, as I said a while ago "why bite the hand that feeds" unless some people want more.

And when the US military regain Subic etc (see reports in the press saying this is inevitable) then all bets are off or will the US declare Subic a "traffick free zone " where people can't be arrested and still do naughty things like talk to girls?

Major dilemas are coming up for politicians so be careful what you wish for everyone.

MathewCob
07-31-13, 11:00
Western 787, thanks for your latest post, some very interesting comments in the report you posted.

I think its clear to say that the powers that be have made up their minds that they are going to clean up [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) in the Philippines and especially in the Angeles bar area.

It's funny that some can see clearly the direction Angeles is being forced into and also accept that Angeles has changed beyond all recognition to just a few short years ago.

But hang on, some on here swear blind that the party is still in full swing, the bargirls are falling over each other to barfine, their recent trip was the best so far, there are no raids, the mayor, police, the US led special units do not exist, they are only a fiction in some posters imagination.

They claim customers have never been arrested, bar owners have never been arrested, bar girls / managers / mamasans have never been arrested, the bars of Angeles are full to the rafters of stunning girls, all will bar fine no probs, no girls have left and returned home due to fear of arrest, all is just dandy, come on down to Angeles, the chance of getting arrested or charged with any crime is non existent, the human traffick laws just do not exist and if they do so what, stop worrying so much.

Believe me when I say, the mayor is serious, he is not allowing go arounds, party animals, trays of drinks to be used in payment for [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) (prostitution).

As we have discussed before many agents, under cover police, informants are actively working in large numbers in the bars, they are gathering info, watching who's hiring young dancers, watching who's trying to get around the laws and acting on info given.

In the end the mayor knows full well that the arrest and international news reports of foreign customers being charged under human traffick violations will be the final death blow to angeles, will they use it, I believe so, lets wait and see.

For the guys that say Angeles is too big to fail, then think again, as many have previously pointed out angeles is tiny and contributes very small amounts of revenue when you look at the bigger picture, no one is going to break a sweat over losing that revenue,

Now for the usual suspects that after reading this will flood on here to rubbish / silence those giving their honest views, I'll be wearing my flame proof suit, thanks.

WestCoast1
07-31-13, 19:03
I think its clear to say that the powers that be have made up their minds that they are going to clean up [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) in the Philippines and especially in the Angeles bar area.He might be right. Its a wait-and-see situtation.


It's funny that some can see clearly the direction Angeles is being forced into and also accept that Angeles has changed beyond all recognition to just a few short years ago.You're guessing (as I am) , nothing more.


But hang on, some on here swear blind that the party is still in full swing, the bargirls are falling over each other to barfine, their recent trip was the best so far, there are no raids, the mayor, police, the US led special units do not exist, they are only a fiction in some posters imagination.

They claim customers have never been arrested, bar owners have never been arrested, bar girls / managers / mamasans have never been arrested, the bars of Angeles are full to the rafters of stunning girls, all will bar fine no probs, no girls have left and returned home due to fear of arrest, all is just dandy, come on down to Angeles, the chance of getting arrested or charged with any crime is non existent, the human traffick laws just do not exist and if they do so what, stop worrying so much.Much of the above, Matt, is wrong. I didn't see anyone on this board say that bars weren't being raided or closed (temporarily). Show us the guy(s) who say that. I myself have posted such closings (as have others).

Nobody said mamasans were never arrested. Show us the guy(s) who say that.

The chance of getting arrested is non existant. Show us the guy(s) who say that.

Human traffic laws do not exist. Show us the guy(s) who say that. in fact Western has been posting them.

The bars of Angeles are full to the rafters with stunning girls. Just the opposite, many posters mention the number of '6' and '7's in the bars.

All will barfine no problem. They are not saying that. They are saying: the barfine format has shifted (yet again, like the last few times in 10 years).


Believe me when I say, the mayor is serious, he is not allowing go arounds, party animals, trays of drinks to be used in payment for [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) (prostitution).Apparently, from the recent posts, one of two things is happening:

1. Matt is right, and the posters of recent barfines are all hallucinating; or.

2. Matt is wrong (no offense, I was wrong once myself, in 1981, when I got married haha).


As we have discussed before many agents, under cover police, informants are actively working in large numbers in the bars, they are gathering info, watching who's hiring young dancers, watching who's trying to get around the laws and acting on info given.Of course. How is this different than the last several crackdowns over the years?


In the end the mayor knows full well that the arrest and international news reports of foreign customers being charged under human traffick violations will be the final death blow to angeles, will they use it, I believe so, lets wait and see.So, they are waiting on something to start the arrests? What would that be. The current crackdown was in effect when I was there last month. How many customer arrests were there for barfining? I didn't see any. Nobody has reported any here (that would be big news). If its going to start in the future, lets not worry about it until it does?


For the guys that say Angeles is too big to fail, then think again,Concur. See the much larger American bank situation of 2009. Too large to fail. Haha.


as many have previously pointed out angeles is tiny and contributes very small amounts of revenue when you look at the bigger picture,True.


no one is going to break a sweat over losing that revenue,Not true. An entire industry will break a sweat.


Now for the usual suspects that after reading this will flood on here to rubbish / silence those giving their honest views, I'll be wearing my flame proof suit, thanks.That would be my job, thanks!

All that having been said, I wonder the following: Assume Matt is right, and AC bars go away like the wind. This is not a death-nail for the sport. The girls will just be available in different forms elsewhere, and there will be one less reason for many of us to make the bus trip north from Manila. More girls will be available in those places wherever they come from, or wherever the work takes them. There's simply no way to reduce the oldest profession.

Matt, I'm not making a judgement call here. Either you are right, or you are wrong. I'm not trying so silence your voice, just disagreeing with it. Post away.

Member #4698
07-31-13, 20:50
I think that Reverend Mcob should be given his own thread so he can preach his special brand of proselytizing to his heart's content and his posts can be completely ignored except by those that seek his spiritual guidance. This guy has an agenda. Reminds me of the old John Lee Hooker song, "Burning Hell." Reverend Mcob, you ain't no Deacon Jones.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5wTESIPAtMo

Everybody talk about it
Burning Hell
Ain't no heaven, I know
Ain't no Burning Hell
Where I die I go
Can't nobody tell

I am going, Deacon Jones
I went down to the church house
I got down on my bended knee
I prayed, I prayed all night, I prayed
Deacon Jones, pray for me

I went down to the church house
I got down on my knee
I begged, Deacon Jones to pray for me
He said, son, here my hand

Ain't no heaven
Ain't no Burning Hell

Ain't no heaven, Ain't no heaven, no Burning Hell
When I die, where I go, nobody know

No Burning Hell
Ain't no burning, no Burning Hell
When I die, in my grave, nobody know where I'm going
Ain't no heaven, ain't no hell

WestCoast1
07-31-13, 22:31
If the Philippines would merely clarify what the actual law is, and how it would be enforced, then Fields could perhaps return to some level of semi normal, but that does not seem likely now.

Its not impossible for a situation where Tourist A goes to Club X and takes out 19 year old Bar Girl B (using a bar fine, or whatever going around method is in use). B in fact actually is 19 years old, an adult, and gave full consent. However assume the next day she is claiming that she was "forced" to work at Club X. A is then arrested for having sex with a "trafficked victim", held w / o bail, and if he is older could effectively be facing life in prison.I'm with Natty.

What difference does it make what the law says for filipinos? Prostitution is illegal in phils (and in most places) , but its mostly ignored (everywhere). So few people go to jail for it that the rest of us don't worry about the incidence rate.

W787, you must admit, that last paragraph describing A and B is alway possible, but way out of the norm. When it starts happening on a regular basis its news, but not before. One could have raised the same scenario one year ago, or 5 years ago. We will have to wait and see how the US pressure effects the scene on the ground. Whole lotta fear going on here?

BrainDrain
08-01-13, 00:08
Despite significant local demand in the country's thriving commercial sex trade, the government's efforts to reduce the demand for commercial sex acts in the Philippines were negligible. During the year, the government charged two child sex tourists under the anti-trafficking law and deported 15 foreign nationals for child sex crimes.Can't wait to get back to AC.

Western787
08-01-13, 00:10
. It is all about shaking the money tree.Using the old rule "always follow the money", the problem now is the big money seems now to be on the other side of the equation, and that's the point I am making.

If this is just about "spreading paranoia" based on little if any evidence, why would that stop YOU from making trips reports with your usual details and so forth? I mean after all, you could just discount whatever Mr Cob or myself are saying.

Look, everything could on a nominal (surface) basis go back to normal, but the overriding larger issue doesn't seem like its going to go away anytime soon, and if a monger gets targeted with this, the downside here is horrific.

Wicked Roger
08-01-13, 00:51
Can't wait to get back to AC.Well said from someone who likes AC (as BD knows, it is not my favourite place on the Philippines). Now onto the misinformation / disinformation being spread IMHO which WC1 and NB have provided thoughtful replies.


I think that Reverend Mcob should be given his own thread so he can preach his special brand of proselytizing to his heart's content and his posts can be completely ignored except by those that seek his spiritual guidance. This guy has an agenda. Reminds me of the old John Lee Hooker song,"Burning Hell." Reverend Mcob, you ain't no Deacon Jones.Agreed I have asked Jackson if this is possible as this does clog up the AC thread.


Much of the above, Matt, is wrong. I didn't see anyone on this board say that bars weren't being raided or closed (temporarily). Show us the guy (s) who say that. I myself have posted such closings (as have others).

So, they are waiting on something to start the arrests? What would that be. The current crackdown was in effect when I was there last month. How many customer arrests were there for barfining? I didn't see any. Nobody has reported any here (that would be big news). If its going to start in the future, lets not worry about it until it does?

Not true. An entire industry will break a sweat.

All that having been said, I wonder the following: Assume Matt is right, and AC bars go away like the wind. This is not a death-nail for the sport. The girls will just be available in different forms elsewhere, and there will be one less reason for many of us to make the bus trip north from Manila. More girls will be available in those places wherever they come from, or wherever the work takes them. There's simply no way to reduce the oldest profession.Ageed WC1. MCobb and Western (who maybe the same or an alter ego) have agendas (to quote others) and if AC goes the way of the banks so Subic will rise again when the US military arrive so just a change of venue. And what will those in AC do for their pocket money (ie cash they don't earn but can screw from the bars), their wives and mistresses still need pasalubongs so who will pay for them?

Lots of misinformation and speculation so hopefully a separate thread can be created and MCobb and Western can write to their hearts content about their views.

AC is fine but maybe changing in some areas but will still exist. Clark maybe trying to become a clean middle class hub but that is years away. Go around or whatever you call them will exist.

I was there the other night (just a day to see an old friend who still insists on living there (not sure why he does live there as AC not my favourite place) and he knows many bar owners). Nothing seems to have changed dramatically he told me, some issues with those who want more money and trying to screw more from the owners but basically you take whatever you like etc – same as you and others have stated (not as MCobb has repeatedly said)

Western you preach here but then post videos / links of Thai massage parlours (undercover you say in your FR)

http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showthread.php?1421-Bangkok-Massage-Parlors-Except-TULIP-and-ANNIES! P=1442875&viewfull=1#post1442875.

And you also seem to know the NGOs well in Thailand based on your FRs there (but some FRs I can't open but are visible from the search only) and you talk about how hard it is to edit out LBs in a Geylang video – me thinks you may have an agenda also (unless you are the alter ego of another poster LOL).

MathewCob
08-01-13, 04:28
blah, blah, blah. all the bars that were closed are back up and running. (oew which was voluntarily closed will be back up soon.) it has been 10 days or longer since the last raid. girls are being barfined. guys in ac are all, i repeat, all reporting that they are having good times. only a handful of bars were raided. no farang customer was ever arrested during this crackdown. and still you drone on and on with all this end of the world paranoia crap. (hillary clinton is coming to get us and lock us up forever. omg! what can i do?) what the fuck is your problem, dude? these crackdown / bar raids have become regularly recurring events every rainy season for at least the last 3 years. it is all about shaking the money tree. i am sure they will occur again next year.

but thanks, w for your input. you have been a great help spreading your paranoia. but, you and mcob have succeeded in one thing. you have had a chilling effect on the flow of information relating to our favorite hobby on this thread. your presence here has thoroughly discouraged bm's like myself from posting trip reports mentioning favorite bars along with favorite bar girls.natty, check your info before posting,

no not all the bars that have been raided and closed are back up and running, candy bar for one, and many more but i won't bore all with a complete list,

these raids are not just a rainy season usual thing, they happen throughout the year in large numbers, in fact some 40 bars just along fields and perimeter have been raided, yes a massive amount, the main reason being human traffic offences or **** girls,

to claim no customers have ever been arrested is just not true, i know of one and harry the horse in his august 2013 newsletter says the number is actually 2 people, yes i agree its not many but is does happen and whos to say the numbers might not increase dramatically in the future,

your comment of i'm sure bar raids will happen again next year is correct, if they do not manage to stamp out human traffic offences before then the raids will continue till it is all stamped out

now to claim that me and other members are stopping you from posting trip reports is just childish, please post away, although i think if you were to be honest in your future trip reports you will struggle to say much good about the bars and girls of ac at the moment, perhaps thats the real reason you are not posting trip reports.

MathewCob
08-01-13, 05:02
there are a ton of reason why they would not do this. once word got out that "the customers" are being busted. it would scare off the casual players too. hurting tourism pi wide big time.

1st they would have to prove you bar fined the girl for sex. and it wasn't of her own free will. after all there is no 'bar fine". the bar owner are going to incriminate themselves to say you did. they will say no. so there is no proof against the customer. they would need a undercover cop poising as a bar girl. so she could testify you specifically ask / paid for sex.

secondly. legitimate business men have meetings / conferences in manila. where women company (wink wink) is apart. the guys who come to dive. but also do.

these are not mongers, but they do come to the pi in part becos they can partake of girls along with their main interest...your claim of no foreigners have been arrested in bar raids is just not true, even harry the horse in his august 2013 newsletter states foreigners have been arrested in bar raids,

your argument of the authorities would have to prove this or that holds no ground imho,.

this is the philippines we are talking about just in case you forgot, yes probably one of the most corrupt countries in the world. 1st world laws and justice mean nothing here, the only justice we would get it what the prosecutor decided we are guilt of.

as far as obtaining witnesses or bargirls to testify, let me give you a little help, a few thousand pesos put into a bargirls hand will have her swear blind that her own mother is a whoring thief and her father is a **** who raped her and her 11 brothers and sisters from birth, or that nasty foreigner raped her and she's only 14 (regardless of her real age) never forget it's all about the peso, everything has a price, even our freedom.

your claim of no barfines will reduce monger / business men seeking sex numbers is exactly what the authorities are after, never forget mayor lim and what he did in manila, thanks.

SteveMonger
08-01-13, 10:00
natty – look out for the diamanda galas version of burning hell if you get chance – it's amazing.

anyway, here is a list of sporadic raids over the years, which may put the debate into context. i think most of the venues listed below are still around (or at least reopened after the raids). one of the bars (voodoo) which was subject to the recent 'fire safety violation' was also raided back in 2008. it is still around.

i put it to you all that that 2013 events are just a continuation of the 'normal' situation, i. e. the mayor and other stakeholders being seen to do something. whilst the tourism value to the nation as a whole is small, the value to the city is significant, and if the raids remove any **** activity, that's good news in my book.

yes; this will change the way things operate a little, but i'm not intending to cancel my planned trip in early 2014 just yet.

summer 2007 – big raids on blue nile, nero's et al. many taken to manila (employees, not customers)

winter 2007 – raids on alaska, angels, emotions.

summer 2008 – raids on roadhouse, alaska, king of diamonds, voodoo (not closed). agasya and las vegas (employees taken away)

spring 2009 – valhalla, edelweiss, icarus.

summer 2010 – dirty duck, forbidden city, pony tails, camelot.

summer 2011 – golden nile, blue nile, cambodia, honey pot,

autumn 2011 – dollhouse, gobbles, dirty duck.

spring 2012 – coyote ugly.

winter 2012 – tight jeans, stampede.

spring 2013 – camelot.

summer 2013 – anglewitch, devilwitch, voodoo, camelot, baby dolls, candy bar

Pip Jaeger
08-01-13, 12:19
Lots of misinformation and speculation so hopefully a separate thread can be created and MCobb and Western can write to their hearts content about their views.

Agreed I have asked Jackson if this is possible as this does clog up the AC thread.Already have the "Philippine politics and economics" thread, maybe they should take their discussion there as that tread has little action and this topic has ventured in that direction.


so Subic will rise again when the US military arrive so just a change of venue.Unless the Philippine Constitution is changed (and that's highly unlikely) then no new foreign military bases, but I'm positive there will be an increased presence of US forces.

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/07/13/world/asia/us-negotiates-expanded-military-role-in-philippines.html

And Japanese forces as well:

http://www.janes.com/article/24493/us-philippines-in-talks-over-troop-rotations


Ageed WC1. MCobb and Western (who maybe the same or an alter ego) have agendas (to quote others).Maybe they work for the Thai tourist board; at least McCornholer hinted at his "agenda":


Lets be honest who in their right mind will choose to visit Angeles City when just a short hop over the pond exists the world biggest working girl house known to man, with no restrictions to barfines, has cheaper hotels, great food and far prettier girls.I presume he is also talking about Thailand, but I could be wrong. Care to clarify Mr. McCobbler? In any event I wonder what he has against the Phils in general and their lovely predominantly English speaking very GFE friendly ladies? IMHO to compare the general appearance between any two cultures is a matter of personal taste; and in each culture you'll of course find examples of exquisite beauty and two baggers.

In another post he refers to visiting his daughter in Cebu. No mention about the mother (married to her or knocked her up) , but I do applaud him for being a part of his daughter's life and it sounds like he supports her as well; again kudos for that. However, and this pure speculation on my part, I wonder if he was scorned by the mother (or another lady there) and if that's part of the cause of his resentment towards Pinays. Or is there another reason(s) for your hard on against the Phils Mr. Cob?

Slippery
08-01-13, 17:17
Was told by one of the girls working at the d club that she went to work today and the place was shut down by the mayor's office before she got there. Apparently not raided but just shut down.

WestCoast1
08-01-13, 17:24
natty, check your info before posting,

no not all the bars that have been raided and closed are back up and running, candy bar for one, and many more but i won't bore all with a complete list, bore us, give us the complete list of bars closed in the last 6 months that stayed closed.


these raids are not just a rainy season usual thing, they happen throughout the year in large numbers, in fact some 40 bars just along fields and perimeter have been raided, yes a massive amount, the main reason being human traffic offences or **** girls,the list please.


to claim no customers have ever been arrested is just not true, i know of one and harry the horse in his august 2013 newsletter says the number is actually 2 people,finally some facts. but that's it? in what timespan? what were the circumstances for the arrests (anything other than barfining)? from harry the horse's most recent posting:

in all the raids over the past few years i only know of two times that a customer has been detained, one a couple of years back and yes, one very recently though there have been denials on that. regardless, it is not common to hassle customers and i pray that it does not become common.


yes i agree its not many but is does happen and whos to say the numbers might not increase dramatically in the future,possible. just like fairies flying out of my ass.


now to claim that me and other members are stopping you from posting trip reports is just childish, please post away, although i think if you were to be honest in your future trip reports you will struggle to say much good about the bars and girls of ac at the moment, perhaps thats the real reason you are not posting trip reports.post away, but you're just spreading fear. many of foreigners took bargirls last night, and many will do it again tonight. you are the only one on this board posting that the bars have stopped barfining (in differing forms). even your citation of harry won't agree with you. regarding a comment by one of his followers saying the barfine forms has changed recently:

(i would rather not discuss this subject. suffice to say that things have changed to protect the innocent.)

also from harry's most recent. listen, matt, if you can't count on your own source for backup, your argument is in trouble:

the bars are in the process of adjusting their policies to comply with the guidelines being put out by the mayor. the policies are not uniform so talk to the bar managers or the mamasans or just talk to the ladies to get a feel for the place.

if the barfine forms had been eliminated completely (as you suggest) , he would have said so.


this is the philippines we are talking about just in case you forgot, yes probably one of the most corrupt countries in the world. 1st world laws and justice mean nothing here, the only justice we would get it what the prosecutor decided we are guilt of.there is nothing prophetic there matt. we all knew this already. you are not giving us the 'inside scoop' here.

================================

so let me ask matt: can you find a single senior or experienced member of this board, with recent boots on the ground, who will tell us he went into some fields bars recently and was refused female takeout in all of them? alternately, can you yourself go into some fields bars and get the take-out scoop from some mamas where they say no way fella it ain't happening no mo, and tell us what bars those are?

MathewCob
08-01-13, 18:13
natty – look out for the diamanda galas version of burning hell if you get chance – it's amazing.

anyway, here is a list of sporadic raids over the years, which may put the debate into context. i think most of the venues listed below are still around (or at least reopened after the raids). one of the bars (voodoo) which was subject to the recent 'fire safety violation' was also raided back in 2008. it is still around.

i put it to you all that that 2013 events are just a continuation of the 'normal' situation, i. e. the mayor and other stakeholders being seen to do something. whilst the tourism value to the nation as a whole is small, the value to the city is significant, and if the raids remove any **** activity, that's good news in my book..thanks for your list of raided bars, here's a few just off the top of my head that you have left out.

now i'm sure if i think for a while more will come to mind, but i think we got enough to be going on with for now,

2013, vikings bar, club prada, eager beaver bar,

2012, bare assets bar,

2011, honky tonk bar, sunshine bar, golden nile executive bar (twice) , boogles bar, bunny ranch bar.

the honey kos bar was also raided but not sure if 2011 or 2010,

although we are naming raided bars, the reasons for the raids and the amount of arrests and the people who have been charged will take more thought but here's a few,

sunshine bar, complaint by dancers mother that her daughter was working as a minor (15 if i remember correctly) sunshine bar remains closed.

between these three bars, dollhouse bar. 48 girls detained, honky tonk 17 girls detained, dirty duck 12 girls detained in total 77 girls were detained out of those 77 girls 12 girls were rescued under the human traffic laws as being minors.

coyote ugly bar 2012, a foreigner and five others were arrested, with 37 female bargirls rescued under the human traffic laws, going by memory coyote ugly remains closed?

camelot bar. 100 odd girls taken away, manager still in jail as of today charged with human traffic violations, going by memory i think camelot still remains closed?

eager beaver bar, customers kept locked in bar for few hours by raiding team but released, no charges, arrests made of staff.

club prada, owner and few staff arrested and formally charged with human traffic offences.

baby doll bar, manager and cashier formally charged with human traffic offences.

so as all can see, many have been arrested, many have been rescued (****) , some have been charged with human traffic offences and remain in jail, so clear signs from the angeles mayor and the higher authorities that they mean business imho.

Psychman
08-01-13, 18:37
Mathew Cob,

I have a couple of questions, and I ask all sincerity. Why are you posting on this topic here? What do you wish to really say? What do you hope to achieve?

Member #4698
08-01-13, 18:43
No not all the bars that have been raided and closed are back up and running, Candy Bar for one, and many more but I won't bore all with a complete list,

Now to claim that me and other members are stopping you from posting trip reports is just childish, please post away, although I think if you were to be honest in your future trip reports you will struggle to say much good about the bars and girls of ac at the moment, perhaps thats the real reason you are not posting trip reports.1. Candy bar is up and running. Sorry to inform you of that, but this is good news for all of us earnest members of the forum.

2. True, nobody is stopping me from posting. But your presence here on the forum is getting kind of creepy and it is definitely discouraging me from posting exact information about my last trip. Yes.

I was in AC and Subic for the two weeks leading up to and including Easter Sunday 2013. I had a great time, maybe the best time I ever had punting in the PI. Notable highlights of the AC leg of my trip was meeting two adorable cousins at XXXX Bar ages 19 and 21 and a EWR'ing a stunning "cultural dancer" from XXXX bar on my last night in town Easter Sunday. I EWR'd the cousins 5 nights in a row and took them out to dinner, barhopping, and for midnight swims at my hotel, the XXX Hotel. The girls came by on several afternoons for more fun by the pool. The sex was amazing although it was always one on one. One girl would go out to the balcony and play games on her cell phone while I boom boomed the other and then while I was cleaning up in the shower they would switch places. I slept in between the two girls wrapped up in their loving embrace. I would love to post more details and some great pictures of the girls, but frankly I currently worry about my pictures falling into the wrong hands, maybe yours.

There are a lot of great guys on this forum. But it is an open forum. Possibly you are ok too and just a little too cautious, pedantic, and risk averse than most of us or maybe you are not one of us. Yeah, maybe you are not one of us! It's a chilling thought and I don't like making that charge, but I don't know what else to make of your continuing posts. They just don't make much sense. Therefore, I think I will just hold off on my trip reports until all this paranoia subsides and or you go away.

By the way, I haven't changed my travel plans one iota and I still plan to return to AC, Subic and Manila early next year. I am in contact with my cousins and they tell me they miss me so. But if the end of the world comes, I think it will be obvious to everybody and I will just call an audible and stay longer somewhere else. Your arguments and stubborn position though are becoming more ridiculous and tedious every day because there are trustworthy, reliable people in AC right now and ALL OF THEM are saying that everything is good. So the question really is: who are you Reverend MCob and what is your agenda. You are making vociferous paranoid predictions based on false reports and spreading a lot of baseless rumors. I repeat, what is your agenda? Are you getting off on all this attention? You seem to be motivated for some reason, religious or ideological, to discourage mongering not only in the PI but Asia at large. We are a bunch of heathens. We are not much interested in your sermons or fear mongering. "Aint no heaven. Ain't no burnin' hell."

MathewCob
08-01-13, 19:00
Was told by one of the girls working at the d club that she went to work today and the place was shut down by the mayor's office before she got there. Apparently not raided but just shut down.Yes Slippery, I have heard this too, trying to confirm it as we speak, will post further news as I hear it.

Wicked Roger
08-02-13, 00:07
So let me ask Matt: Can you find a single senior or experienced member of this board, with recent boots on the ground, who will tell us he went into some Fields bars recently and was refused female takeout in all of them? Alternately, can you yourself go into some Fields bars and get the take-out scoop from some mamas where they say NO WAY FELLA IT AIN'T HAPPENING NO MO, and tell us what bars those are?Good FR WC1,

Lots of misinformation and others have referred to sources to show things are not closed down for good. I was there and nothing seemed to have changed either.

Remember in his 'FR' he visited Cebu and did family things (so not going bars etc, no FRs no photos) and when in AC he was really on a drinking trip with buddies so again no FRs no photos no nothing of substance apart from comments that he heard (heresay. Which time and again has proven to be incorrect by thers FRs and other blogs t some degree)

So he has not been to any Fields bar recently and done any of what you suggest unlike others.

The thing that puts me off some bars is not the issue or do they or do they not bar fine it is some of the patrons I there unwashed vests drinking alone with the solitary beer half the night and trying to engage me in conversation. Maybe that was someone we know Westie LO.

NB. 2 cute girls and one on one? Let me have their details as I maybe there soon and we can do 2 on 1 instead LOL.

Five10
08-02-13, 00:35
RE M Cob,

Your arguments and stubborn position are becoming more ridiculous and tedious every day because there are trustworthy, reliable people in AC right now and all of them are saying that everything is good. So the question really is: who are you Reverend MCob and what is your agenda. You are making vociferous paranoid predictions based on false reports and spreading a lot of baseless rumors. I repeat, what is your agenda? Are you getting off on all this attention? You seem to be motivated for some reason, religious or ideological, to discourage mongering not only in the PI but Asia at large.

Socker
08-02-13, 03:16
RE M Cob,

Your arguments and stubborn position are becoming more ridiculous and tedious every day because there are trustworthy, reliable people in AC right now and all of them are saying that everything is good. So the question really is: who are you Reverend MCob and what is your agenda. You are making vociferous paranoid predictions based on false reports and spreading a lot of baseless rumors. I repeat, what is your agenda? Are you getting off on all this attention? You seem to be motivated for some reason, religious or ideological, to discourage mongering not only in the PI but Asia at large.Reacting to and asking this guy questions only fuels his fire. No one here is going to shut him up w / more questions. It's just that simple.

Wicked Roger
08-02-13, 05:26
(This extra 20 million is just a drop in the bucket as to what's going to follow.)

MANILA CONFIRMS WASHINGTON HIKED MILITARY AIDNo surprises as who else is going to pay for the new infrastructure etc that the country needs what with the alleged pork barrel scam where lots of senators have supposedly dipped their wicks into the barrel and enjoyed themselves (see the Inquirer and other papers if you are unaware) , there is not much left to develop the country. So welcome back the USA and the Philippines will never bite the hand that feeds them (I read some Subic businesses are very happy unsurprisingly).

So people can complain as a democratic right but I don't think those in power will listen much.

And as to MCobb and your assertions about bar closures etc more aid means some more troops and exercises which means more horny marines in the Philippines which means what guys?

Five10 interesting FR and one that neither MCobb or Western seem able to reply to.

OralFanatic
08-02-13, 21:46
Your claim of no foreigners have been arrested in bar raids is just not true, even harry the horse in his August 2013 newsletter states foreigners have been arrested in bar raids.

Your claim of no barfines will reduce monger / business men seeking sex numbers is exactly what the authorities are after, never forget mayor Lim and what he did in Manila, thanks.M. Cob, I know Jackson has a policy against personal attacks but I hope he lets this one slide as there is just no other way to say it.

Your comment that Harry the Horse stated that foreigners have been arrested is patently FALSE. Here is the quote from HH's website;

'Fred, in all the raids over the past few years I only know of two times that a customer has been detained, one a couple of years back and yes, one very recently though there have been denials on that. Regardless, it is not common to hassle customers and I pray that it does not become common. '

So even the 1 arrest reported recently can't be confirmed. You are completely exaggerating what is happening in AC for a reason, and you have absolutely nothing to do with this hobby. There is something quite wrong with you and your false comments on here. I still think you belong to the camera crew that was in AC recently.

And as far as what Mayor Lim did to the scene in Manila, he simply pushed most of it to AC. Trying to eradicate this scene is like trying to pick up water in a sieve.

MathewCob
08-03-13, 03:11
Two more Fields avenue bars were closed down yesterday by city hall officials, D-Club and Insomnia club.

Reports say that city hall have given the clubs 48 hours to correct their infringements or face being permanently closed down.

I'll post more news as I hear it.

Wicked Roger
08-03-13, 15:26
Two more Fields avenue bars were closed down yesterday by city hall officials, D-Club and Insomnia club.

Reports say that city hall have given the clubs 48 hours to correct their infringements or face being permanently closed down.

I'll post more news as I hear it.MCobb,

Either you truly don't read the blogs and deliberately cherry pick information to spread disinformation or you know in advance what is happening. Either way as Oral Fanatic said please get all the facts straight and post a link to a reliable blog as I am doing so the readers can see exactly what is happening.

http://www.margaritastation.com/readfull.php?m=1277

Of made a good point in his FR about MCobb and to date you still won't answer earlier questions posted by me and others about your agenda as you keep making what I and others believe to be misleading information.

Read the link gents and you will see the 48 hours is statutory for all establishments and the blog suggests it is very minor. Not the scare mongering of MCobb.

But MCobb. How did you know the bars were closed as you did not post a link etc to corroborate the information, so who told you? You will post more news when you get it? Form who as we all read HTH and the above web page also so what insights can you give from your 'sources' please.

Another question (s) that won't be answered, maybe I should listen to Socker's advice earlier in his FR

ThatGuy865
08-03-13, 15:31
Two more Fields avenue bars were closed down yesterday by city hall officials, D-Club and Insomnia club.

Reports say that city hall have given the clubs 48 hours to correct their infringements or face being permanently closed down.

I'll post more news as I hear it.I must admit. MC does have valid points as to the direction it is going. I disagree that there are no Bar Fines currently being done.

But I do think. AC as we all know it. Will not survive. I give it another 4 yrs tops.

Clark development IS making a huge impact economically, along with bring a new tourist type to AC and the international pressure everywhere concerning "Sex Tourism" is real. There are no places around the world that haven't been affected.

I think the bars will be limited to "Walking street". Doing mainly bad impressions of Vegas style dance shows, where you can sit and be entertained by women as many Asians are accustom to the "Hostess" bar concept. Especially since the PI target market are neighboring Asians. If Bar fines are done at all they will be discreet, and high priced.

Most of the girls will go home as they are from the province and lack any real skills for surviving on their own without "Stay Inn" living quarters provided by most bars.

I say go. Enjoy it now. Because the AC you know today. Won't be there in the near future. IMHO. Of course.

MathewCob
08-03-13, 17:39
I must admit. MC does have valid points as to the direction it is going. I disagree that there are no Bar Fines currently being done.

But I do think. AC as we all know it. Will not survive. I give it another 4 yrs tops.

Clark development IS making a huge impact economically, along with bring a new tourist type to AC and the international pressure everywhere concerning "Sex Tourism" is real. There are no places around the world that haven't been affected.

I think the bars will be limited to "Walking street". Doing mainly bad impressions of Vegas style dance shows, where you can sit and be entertained by women as many Asians are accustom to the "Hostess" bar concept. Especially since the PI target market are neighboring Asians. If Bar fines are done at all they will be discreet, and high priced.

Most of the girls will go home as they are from the province and lack any real skills for surviving on their own without "Stay Inn" living quarters provided by most bars.

I say go. Enjoy it now. Because the AC you know today. Won't be there in the near future. IMHO. Of course.ThatGuy865,

You are getting very warm with your predictions,

But it will happen within the next 12 months IMHO.

Ekspat
08-05-13, 08:59
But it will happen within the next 12 months IMHO.Then let it happen, I don't mind.

Been to AC the first time around 2003, I loved the place and I've been there from 2004 till 2009 almost every month. Mostly extended weekends, but also stays up to two weeks and of the time in the Phils I spent almost all the time in AC, lets say 90% in AC and 10% elsewhere. Roughly 2009 I felt that AC didn't give me the kick anymore and I turned more and more to Burgos / Makati. Nowadays I spend around 70-80% of my time in Makati and just a couple of days in AC to catch my flight out of DMIA.

If EmCee's scenario comes true, okay, so what, too bad but I can live without AC. Been there, done that.

Cheers!

E Z Rhino
08-06-13, 07:06
Why are we still feeding the trolls? Anyway, turns out that MC is NOT a priest. He is in fact a Lutheran minister, Pastor Bob Snowdon, of Holy Christ Almighty Lutheran Church in Nashua NH and this article reveals more about him. http://www.theonion.com/articles/local-lutheran-minister-loves-to-fuck-his-wife.854/

Wicked Roger
08-06-13, 08:36
Why are we still feeding the trolls? Anyway, turns out that MC is NOT a priest. He is in fact a Lutheran minister, Pastor Bob Snowdon, of Holy Christ Almighty Lutheran Church in Nashua NH and this article reveals more about him.

http://www.theonion.com/articles/local-lutheran-minister-loves-to-fuck-his-wife

854/The link was not working EZ so here it is again, funny read made me laugh a lot.

http://www.theonion.com/articles/local-lutheran-minister-loves-to-fuck-his-wife.854/

Pip Jaeger
08-06-13, 09:56
Why are we still feeding the trolls? Anyway, turns out that MC is NOT a priest. He is in fact a Lutheran minister, Pastor Bob Snowdon, of Holy Christ Almighty Lutheran Church in Nashua NH and this article reveals more about him.

http://www.theonion.com/articles/local-lutheran-minister-loves-to-fuck-his-wife

854/Funny article EZ, but are you sure he's not this guy:

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2013/08/06/high-ranking-priest-in-boston-archdiocese-facing-prostitution-charges/?test=latestnews

Western787
08-06-13, 10:25
Funny article EZ, but are you sure he's not this guy:

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2013/08/06/high-ranking-priest-in-boston-archdiocese-facing-prostitution-charges/?test=latestnewsThese days any Catholic priest actually caught with a woman is given some some kind of prize

E Z Rhino
08-06-13, 11:10
Here is the article again about MC.

http://www.theonion.com/articles/local-lutheran-minister-loves-to-fuck-his-wife,854/

Denom
08-08-13, 10:34
I have been struggling to try and catch up with the news in Angeles, reading backwards quite a lot. It seems that the authorities are squeezed between their desire to please Uncle Sam and their desire to maintain the revenue generated by the bar businesses. All the problems seem to come from the new anti-trafficking law, which is so vague that, IMHO, it actually is unconstitutional, and leaves everybody (authorities, bar owners, customers, the girls, etc) confused as to where to stand and what to do.

I do have to nit-pick, however, on something that MathewCob wrote on July 16, because I have seen nobody correc it:

http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showthread.php?1972-Angeles-City&p=1446932&viewfull=1#post1446932

:


'Now lets get on to the wording, a minor 12 years or younger or who is 10 years or more his junior"

I'm not sure if English is your first language Pute Nut but the key word here is the word " or "

The word "or" seperates the two parts of the sentence so that the seperate sentence becomes only, (or 10 years his junior).

Yes. 10 years his junior of what number, this is the key. 10 years the junior 0f 30/40/50/60/70?

The only outcome would be that it refers to an age gap of 10 years regardless of age. 'That is not correct, since the word 'his' refers to the word 'minor' in the same sentence.

So we have two cases:

1) the minor is below 12, then the 10 years gap rule does not apply and the perpetrator is automatically guilty.

2) the MINOR is above 12 (and by definition below 18) , then the 10 years gap rule does apply.

Furthermore, as others already hinted, if the simple fact that 10 years difference regardless of age would be enough to stick a conviction, then cops would have already used that reason a plenty, and I don't think anybody can point to even a single instance where this happened.

Denom
08-08-13, 12:03
Add to that the fact that there is a comma after the word "minor". It's:

"a minor, twelve (12) years or under or who in ten (10) years or more his junior"

And not, as MatthewCob quoted:

"a minor 12 years or younger or who is 10 years or more his junior".

It does change the meaning.

Furthermore, check the next paragraph:

"Any person who shall induce, deliver or offer a minor to any one prohibited by this Act to keep or have in his company A MINOR AS PROVIDED IN THE PRECEDING PARAGRAPH" (capitals mine)

And there should be no more doubt that the reference is to a minor only, and not regardless of age.

The obvious reason the 10 years gap was added to the text was because the age of consent in the Philippines IS 12, and not 18, and they needed a way to protect minors without changing the age of consent.

The actual RA 7610 is at.

http://www.lawphil.net/statutes/repacts/ra1992/ra_7610_1992.html

MathewCob
08-08-13, 17:40
denom, with all due respect, your wrong and i and many others have explained why

in reality it really makes very little difference where the commas might be, what the wording actually says, what it all actually means.

as stated before this is the philippines, pray you never get caught up in a human traffic offence / sting or even worse a claim of [CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123) against you whether true or false.

you might quickly learn that foreigners have no rights in the philippines, after all the philippines is not known as one of the most corrupt countries for nothing.

any claim against a foreigner to do with [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) or **** claims is an un bailable offence which means if you get charged with it even if you are 100% innocent you will be in a manila jail for the next few years till your case comes to court.

good luck with trying to prove where the comma is or what your interpretation of the law is once your in jail, thanks.

MathewCob
08-08-13, 17:49
Trip report and Angeles city barhop on 5/8/2013

I was again over in Angeles for a few days to primarily attend a very good friend and long time Angeles resident wedding and the stag night out in the bars of fields avenue (walking st).

Stayed at the usual very nice Lewis Grand hotel, has great rooms, massive swimming pool, rain showers, a great restaurant, very friendly staff / manager and probably most important a free limo service at customers disposal 24 hours a day, wherever you want to go or wherever you want picking up from within angeles the limo driver is just a phone call away, I paid roughly $100 dollars us per night, the price has stayed the same for the last 3-4 years so good value all around I feel, highly recommended,

First thing that is noticeable on arrival at the airport is that the new 30 day visa is in full swing, yes out goes the old 21 day visa to be replaced by the new 30 day visa, that's what I got at the airport with no fee needed.

Second thing noticed is how absolutely dead the streets of Angeles are, of the few people out most were locals, the normal mix of trike drivers, fake Viagra sellers, cigarette sellers and the gangs of kid beggars / scammers, the thought that immediately goes through my mind is shit I have not seen it this quiet for monger / tourist numbers in 20 odd years of regular visits to Angeles, could the countless bad reports all over the internet have put mongers / tourists off visiting, not sure what the reason is but quiet as hell.

Shaved / showered and ready to meet friends by 9.00pm for our stag night out, again as my last trip 20 odd days ago we hit all the most popular bars on fields avenue (walking street)

First off Atlantis bar, probably the largest / nicest bar on fields that always employs the best looking girls the town has to offer, very nice surroundings. 3 floors of seating, a very large stage, European D. J, great air conditioning, nice dance routines and yes very clean rest rooms (rare in Angeles) popcorn offered with each drink ordered which is a very nice touch, has an in house Japanese style restaurant, has for some years now been the busiest place in Angeles by far.

As always a very warm welcome from the owners / managers of Atlantis bar, was asked immediately if we wanted to take our party up to the VIP area but we kindly declined as there was barely a soul in the place downstairs, we sat, ordered beers all round (think 125 pesos for sml bottle beer by memory)

What I noticed immediately, Atlantis bar would normally have 250+ girls working on any one night, in reality I counted only about 60 girls working (we stayed long enough to see all the dance routines, so all girls) we all tabled a few girls for drinks (lady drinks 300 pesos) but due to small numbers of girls working the girls would finish their drinks in record time and have to go back on stage for their dance routines, we stayed a couple of hours, and by the time we left I counted probably 10 other customers had been in the bar at some time while we were there, all were asians, mostly Koreans, don't think I saw any westerners all night in atlantis bar, Very worrying customer numbers for the owners when you consider this bar is massive and probably could seats a few hundred customers in one sitting and up to recently would have been standing room only.

On to Dollhouse bar, probably the second most popular bar on Fields avenue, again very few girls working the floor, small number of girls doing vegas style shows on stage, probably 45 odd girls working in total as apposed to the normal amount of 150+ girls working, no western customers, a handful of Korean customers, stayed for a couple of drinks with the girls, moved on to the next bars.

Now in total we hit probably 15 bars on fields (walking st) all had very low numbers of girls working, even lower numbers of customers, some bars had no customers except our group.

3 am, and I have had enough beer to last me a life time, bought enough lady drinks to keep even the most hungry bar girl very happy in drinks commissions.

Time to call the Lewis grand limo and get myself into bed, ex girlfriend (non bargirl) had travelled down to stay with me at the Lewis again and to be honest I was dying to get back to her, without sounding big headed she is by far more pretty than any bargirls I saw out on our barhop by a long long way.

Sad to say that most girls on Fields were a generous 5 in looks / body with a very few 6s thrown in, the 6s were normally the bars cultural dancers bought in from Manila and these girls paid little or no attention to the customers, preferring to admire themselves dancing in the mirrors and when not on stage huddled together on a corner sofa busy playing with their mobile phones until it was time to dance again.

All in all an ok night out, but a good send off into married life for our good pal.

As far as bar fining girls in the many bars we visited, nothing has changed from my last field report of some 20 odd days ago, as I reported then and again report now.

No girls in the Fields avenue bars we visited were available for barfine, regardless of the way one tries to get around the rules, no party animals available, no trays of shots, no meeting the girls outside or at the hotel routine, Absolutely zero barfines available at the 15 odd bars we visited, many girls were asked by our group, all girls declined barfines of any type.

At the wedding reception dinner the next afternoon I had a chance to have an in depth talk with many pals who have lived in and around Angeles for many years.

My first question, where can one barfine now? Clearly it is not available in any of the Fields avenue bars, is it still available in some of the small bars on perimeter?

Generally the feeling was that a very large number of perimeter road bars were going along with the mayors demands of no bar fines (prostitution) at all, a very small amount of bars on perimeter were not going along with the mayors rules and allowing some girls to leave early and meet the customer back at his hotel but only if the customer was very well known to the bar owner because of the possibility of marked money and the customer would also have to be trusted to pay the bars share plus the girls share after they had fucked directly to the bargirl at the hotel.

Now, I am the first to admit I have not been down to perimeter road bars for a while now, simply because of the desperate selection of the girls in most perimeter bars on my previous visits, but each to their own as they say LOL.

In summing up, can anyone go bar hopping on Fields avenue, choose a girl he likes the look of and get her to leave the bar to fuck, absolutely no way is what we found both on this trip and my recent trip before.

Can anyone hit the perimeter road bars, see a girl he likes and get the girl to leave her bar and fuck, highly unlikely in most perimeter road bars according to the Angeles long time residents opinions expressed to me.

Pute Nut
08-08-13, 18:14
Denom, however poorly worded this crappy piece of legislation may be, this is how you should interepret it.

http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showthread.php?1972-Angeles-City&p=1447109&viewfull=1#post1447109

http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showthread.php?1972-Angeles-City&p=1447795&viewfull=1#post1447795

I will not write any more on this subject, since the echo from Mount Stupid will undoubtedly drown it (again). Consult a good Philippine attorney, if you want to confirm it.

It's not so expensive and they all speak better English than Matthew Cob of IJM / TAT.

Pete Benetar
08-09-13, 18:43
Welcome to the Cob twilight zone.Cob is a shill for NGO feminazis, Fr Shea or whomever. A different if marginally more sophisticated means to save the downtrodden and exploited. Blend with the players and disseminate fear, uncertainty and doubt, aka fud. Persuade the players to turn away voluntarily, with misdirection steeped on fact. Girls overwhelmingly there I think voluntarily to make any living IAW the oldest profession in humanity. The notion a "ten year difference" in age is a violation of statute irrespective of age is laughable. Here in my homeland, the world's epicenter of Femi-fascism, my wife is not even half my age. The man with money worth a thousand goofs spreading Gospel.

But keep up the good fight cob; I'm sure your efforts are not going unnoticed and one day you too will have your place in the seminary perhaps even replete with a few young boys.

Western787
08-09-13, 20:46
Cob is a shill for NGO feminazis, Fr Shea or whomever. A different if marginally more sophisticated means to save the downtrodden and exploited. Blend with the players and disseminate fear, uncertainty and doubt, aka fud. Persuade the players to turn away voluntarily, with misdirection steeped on fact. Girls overwhelmingly there I think voluntarily to make any living IAW the oldest profession in humanity. The notion a "ten year difference" in age is a violation of statute irrespective of age is laughable. Here in my homeland, the world's epicenter of Femi-fascism, my wife is not even half my age. The man with money worth a thousand goofs spreading Gospel.

But keep up the good fight cob; I'm sure your efforts are not going unnoticed and one day you too will have your place in the seminary perhaps even replete with a few young boys.Using common sense, I would even agree Mr Cob is probably reading the 10 year rule wrong. However, that's an irrelevant side issue at the moment. I think his more valid point was in terms of cost versus benefit, reliance on a somewhat ambiguous rule is extremely risky given the current situation.

On the big issue however, what's happening to AC, it appears that Mr Cob is on the right track, so I am not sure why people continue to attack the messenger instead of the message.

Mr Cob may not only have it right but he might even be ahead of Harry the Horse's latest analysis. Quoting Harry the Horse " How can bars comply with an inspection when the inspector makes up his own mickey mouse violations on the spot? Is there a standard price, oops, I mean criteria for reopening?" If this really were only just a matter of paying the right persons, then there really wouldn't be a problem, but the issue appears much larger. Its obvious now US State and the NGO's are interferring in the internal affairs of the Philippines and the prospects in regard to Clark and Subic give them that leverage. The Philippino govt no doubt understands the "[CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908)" witch hunt is 95% ginned up hysteria operating behind in most cases literally made up stats. Yes, its an issue and can and should be fixed where its actually happening, but the claims being made are mostly fraudulent and the governments alll over Southeast Asia understand this by now. The Philippino government could perhaps play the game for a few years, and takedown AC for now to placate the wealthy elite radical feminists running State, but once Hillary and her Presidential aspirations are reduced to irrelevance in a few years, AC could likely return.

Python75
08-10-13, 01:13
as stated before this is the philippines, pray you never get caught up in a human traffic offence / sting or even worse a claim of [CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123) against you whether true or false.

you might quickly learn that foreigners have no rights in the philippines, after all the philippines is not known as one of the most corrupt countries for nothing.

any claim against a foreigner to do with [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) or **** claims is an un bailable offence which means if you get charged with it even if you are 100% innocent you will be in a manila jail for the next few years till your case comes to court.this is perhaps one of the more sensible things that you have posted mr mccob. much has been said on this forum relating to the law regarding sex in the philippines, and it can be quite complex but i wish now to put this topic to bed by explaining it.

anyone under the age of 18 is a minor (child)

the age of consent is 12. having sex with someone under the age of 12 whether consensual or not is statutory [CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123). having sex with a minor aged between 12 and 17 is permissible as long as there is an age difference of less than 10 years. however this should be left to filipinos. as long as the girl is aged 18 and above then it does not matter what age the male is for sexual relations.

there is no age of consent for anyone trafficked into prostitution thus everyone is classified as a child that is trafficked and that means that all prostitutes are now defined as children under the law regardless of that prostitute's age.

many western countries (usa, australia, uk) in an attempt to stamp out the sexual exploitation of minors make it a criminal offence for their nationals to have sex abroad with minors. that is why interpol regard the age of consent in the philippines as 18.

summary for mongers in the philippines:

don't fuck anyone under the age of 18.

be aware that prostitution is illegal.

Western787
08-10-13, 03:35
There is no age of consent for anyone trafficked into prostitution thus everyone is classified as a child that is trafficked and that means that all prostitutes are now defined as children under the law regardless of that prostitute's age.The part about "there is no age of consent for anyone trafficked into prostitution thus everyone is classified as a child that is trafficked" is OK and makes perfect sense. As for

"all prostitutes are defined as children", that's actually a leap of logic.

Would a 25 year old prostitute who works in a bar in Angeles City, with an IQ of 140, who graduated from Harvard, and who signed 19 consent forms to work in that bar under the barfine system, therefore be defined as a child and thus unable to give consent, and thereby deemed as a "victim" of [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908)?

That is the radical NGO interpretation of the law and could well be the law in the Philippines, but in truth no one has actually figured how to interpret this law yet.

The critical question (currently unknown in the Philippines) is how one defines "[CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908)". The old definition until the radical feminists took over US State, and still applicable in most western democracies is if the alleged "victim" is 18 or over, of sound mind, and consented to the circumstances they are now in, they cannot be deemed to be 'trafficked"

MathewCob
08-10-13, 03:44
Western 787, you sir are about the only member that can see through the mist.

You are 100% correct in thinking that the recent closures of Angeles bars for minor infringements (loose hinges / fire certificates / water pipes loose) has nothing to do with paying the piper (monetary) and every thing to do with sending out a stern warning to the bar owners that are not going along with the mayors / ngo, s wishes.

If it was about tea money (bribes) then the violation would be found, the owner escorted to the atm, the tea money paid and all are happy with no closures needed, as has always been the case for years.

As far as most shooting the messenger (me) instead of the message, well, flames never bothered me in the slightest, most who flame have vested interests to protect.

If I had vested interests to protect and everything around me was crumbling I would be hitting the bottle hard and crying foul too.

Robbaf
08-10-13, 05:33
This is getting silly if this is to be believed and there is no reason not to.

http://www.harrythehorse.asia/?p=8055

http://www.margaritastation.com/readfull.php?m=1284

Am surprised some have not triumphed this as another nail in the coffin. Maybe some people are short of funds but the elections are over LOLWR, as sad as this is, this is only one of five bars that have been closed for stupid reasons. Now they don't have UA as a reason anymore, they are looking for another reason. I just got back from weeks in AC and I seen it first hand.

Robb

RoadGlide
08-10-13, 06:20
If this is indeed true, everyone there from the managers to the girls should realize that there is no more money to be made in AC. Eye candy is available back in our home countries without the airfare.I think you NEED to look at the source "Mathewcob" is simply NOT to be trusted!

John Traveller
08-10-13, 07:53
Trip report and Angeles city barhop on 5/8/2013
Stayed at the usual very nice Lewis Grand hotel, has great rooms, massive swimming pool, rain showers, a great restaurant, very friendly staff / manager and probably most important a free limo service at customers disposal 24 hours a day, wherever you want to go or wherever you want picking up from within angeles the limo driver is just a phone call away, I paid roughly $100 dollars us per night, the price has stayed the same for the last 3-4 years so good value all around I feel, highly recommended, I am sure your organization pays you a good salary.


No girls in the Fields avenue bars we visited were available for barfine, regardless of the way one tries to get around the rules, no party animals available, no trays of shots, no meeting the girls outside or at the hotel routine, Absolutely zero barfines available at the 15 odd bars we visited, many girls were asked by our group, all girls declined barfines of any type. Of course you couldn't make that work, they know you are an NGO. I'm glad you didn't succeed in your sting operation.

Pete Benetar
08-10-13, 19:03
I am not sure why people continue to attack the messenger instead of the message.See Traveller comments below.

Take in all the FUD you wish, but keep it balanced. How many garden variety guys have had their liberties revoked to date? Barkeeps getting fines or porn mill operators landing in prison does not equate with what the overwhelming majority of punters here on ISG are going to AC or the PI for. We're not all "frenzied" if you'll pardon my pun. IMO some here are being cleverly skewered by more and more facts unilaterally slighted to curry a myopic sense of reason as well as uncertainty and doubt. Mist indeed.

Western787
08-10-13, 21:35
See Traveller comments below.

Take in all the FUD you wish, but keep it balanced. How many garden variety guys have had their liberties revoked to date? Barkeeps getting fines or porn mill operators landing in prison does not equate with what the overwhelming majority of punters here on ISG are going to AC or the PI for. We're not all "frenzied" if you'll pardon my pun. IMO some here are being cleverly skewered by more and more facts unilaterally slighted to curry a myopic sense of reason as well as uncertainty and doubt. Mist indeed.Applying a common sense standard, if I had some kind of ulterior motive or some kind of alignment with NGO's I wouldn't be saying things as I did in my earlier post like:

"The Philippino govt no doubt understands the "[CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908)" witch hunt is 95% ginned up hysteria operating behind in most cases literally made up stats. Yes, its an issue and can and should be fixed where its actually happening, but the claims being made are mostly fraudulent and the governments alll over Southeast Asia understand this by now. The Philippino government could perhaps play the game for a few years, and takedown AC for now to placate the wealthy elite radical feminists running State, but once Hillary and her Presidential aspirations are reduced to irrelevance in a few years, AC could likely return."

I am not sure what Mr Cobb's motivation is or isn't, but my guess is he's pulling the fire alarm because he sees a fire.

As for whether regular tourists could get caught up in a situation (effectively now looking like life in prison under vague and confusing new laws) like those 2 porn mill operators? We don't know that yet because we don't know how far authorities are willing to go to send their message. While the probabilities are low, the worst case downside is so severe, the cost benefit equation does not look good.

Psychman
08-10-13, 21:51
Mathew Cob,

I have a couple of questions, and I ask all sincerity. Why are you posting on this topic here? What do you wish to really say? What do you hope to achieve?Still waiting for an honest and sincere response.