View Full Version : Kyiv
Ronaldinjo
03-10-12, 00:56
What articles did you read claiming Solid Gold best in Kiev? Can you cite them or provide a link?
I've never been to Solid Gold because I usually come in to Kiev for only a few days and since Rio has great looking girls at $300, I didn't think it paid to go to other clubs where price was $400. The only reason might be if the beauty level was significantly better than at Rio. In these matters, I think you can consider reports by TheKnight as reliable. The next best thing is to check it out personally and compare Solid Gold to Rio based on your own experience and what you see.
FUTURE TRIPS: My upcoming trips in April include a long weekend in Kiev which will be a 5 day visit from March 30 to April 4.
(I also am planning an FKK trip later in the month (April 18. 22) and hope to hit the following clubs: April 18. Daytime Goldentime Vienna, overnite Artemis Berlin. April 19. Madrid. Factory Air. April 20. 22. Frankfurt area clubs including Oase and Palace. April 22. London.)
So maybe during my 5 day visit to Kiev in the beginning of April, I will have a chance to check out some other strip clubs besides Rio and satisfy myself whether there is any appreciable difference in the beauty level of the top girls at other clubs versus Rio that might warant an extra $100 in take out costs.
If you or anyone else does check out the other strip clubs as well as Rio, don't forget to post your impressions. Each post that is on topic is valuable, as, even allowing for differences of opinion on the beauty meter, or differences in the line up on different nights, they help provide a picture of what's going on.
LJI never been there, just asked help from a friend of mine who is Russian speaker and can read Russian (he is bellorussian) , so he found in internet that solid gold isconsidered as one of the best if not the best strip club in Kiev. A little bit more expensive. Once more, its just what he read, I have never been there. It will be usefull to read full version of theknights expirience there, if he could compare the level of girls in both places. According to my friend, the post of visitors to solid gold is mostly positive, even better than Rio.
Liljoey, when you are in Kiev in the end of the month it would be wise to at least visit the place, check the girls and post your opinion. Anyway if I visit Kiev in near future solid gold will be one of my visitation targets. Friends, what is the weather like in Kiev in the begginig and middle of April, is it freezing ass as in moscow or there is hope to feel some sun?
Appreciate your comments. I have been in IST couple of times and I have been to high end and low end bars there. The presence of Russian / Ukrainian Mafia is pretty obvious there as well. Long story but I had a close encounter with the EE mafia in Istanbul. I thought I was going to be killed but luckily I made it out alive.I am really curious about that story.
First of all, a picture, just one because unfortunately girls don't want to be photographed: that is for who likes details. In the past it was easier.
About crazy prices and criminal organizations, from my experience. Criminal organizations exist because the social system (politicians, policecops, judges, priests, teachers, etc.) allows those ones. The prostitution is a problem because 50% earning of prostitution is invested in narcotics, the earning of narcotics is invested in regular business and real estate. All banks and governments know that!
People can choose a mafia system or a non-mafia system. For example, about this thread, men can be "happy" to pay crazy prices (and get "the rubber doll" service) , or men can choose individualki who provide a good service at a honest price. In the first case, men allow the mafia system goes on. In the second case, men pay women who actually deserve.
It is years I am repeating the same story. You are right when you are talking about a bad system (not necessarily a "mafia"). But aren't you detecting too many pimps in this forum, I mean, don't you think this forum is becoming a great showcase of reports by pimps? You are talking of a bad system just to who are authors in that bad system.
Men shouldn't be resigned to pay crazy prices. They should understand that dirty business, before to approach any P4P in all over the world. For example, I am in Kiev for a week, I have worked with my method, I have paid honest prices (far from those I read here) , I have met good providers (not top-models) , my penis is burning now, and I am going to Rio this evening just for curiosity. I am not a master, but I am not a silly child (durachok) who believe to be an adult. There is no dignity to pay crazy prices!First of all my friend especially if you are in Kiev; USE CONDOM! (I see from the picture)
Please check from google how AIDS rapidly increased in UKRAINE in the last decade.
Secondly you are a lucky man who has enough money and time so you can be in Kiev and enjoy that enthusiastic city.
If I were you I would spend a night in the stripclub near President Hotel. (I was one of two guys who has been surrounded by 10 girls in the club)
I have no idea about the pimps in the forum.
Escort sites isn't my style of mongering because of some very personal reasons (Look at http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showthread.php?811-Istanbul&p=1236625&viewfull=1#post1236625)
Hope to be there in the future with a more sophisticated view.
Ciao.
AColonizer
03-10-12, 14:52
Since we got the same tragic Italian background, I can understrand you.
Sex is, for its nature, bez preservativa. Something with condom is not sex at all. People can decide to have a shower with a naked body or with a full raincoat, but of course a shower with a full raincoat is not a shower.
It is important not to lie to ourselves, about sex, life, culture, school, economical crisis, politic parties, family, love, money, religion. It seems people prefer to believe in fairy tales instead to be alive in a real world. My worst fault is I always say what is the real world.
Do you know also the official science is "politically correct"? What I see in sex, sex market, sex performances and female world contradicts the official science indeed. Being prudent is a common sense, but believing everything with no critical sense is stupid. And Italian background teaches to be stupid.
I put my reports because I haven't a lot of money to waste, instead of a lot of pseudo-puttanieri here. Therefore I don't like places for Westerners such as strip-clubs, and I avoid dangerous places such as brothels (always go with a friend!).
If you haven't recognize any businessmen in sex market here, then you have to experience some years more.
First of all my friend especially if you are in Kiev; USE CONDOM! (I see from the picture)
Please check from google how AIDS rapidly increased in UKRAINE in the last decade.
Secondly you are a lucky man who has enough money and time so you can be in Kiev and enjoy that enthusiastic city.
If I were you I would spend a night in the stripclub near President Hotel. (I was one of two guys who has been surrounded by 10 girls in the club)
I have no idea about the pimps in the forum.
Escort sites isn't my style of mongering because of some very personal reasons (Look at.
http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showthread.php?811-Istanbul&p=1236625&viewfull=1#post1236625
Hope to be there in the future with a more sophisticated view.
Ciao.
Ronaldinjo
03-10-12, 23:30
Since we got the same tragic Italian background, I can understrand you.
Sex is, for its nature, bez preservativa. Something with condom is not sex at all. People can decide to have a shower with a naked body or with a full raincoat, but of course a shower with a full raincoat is not a shower.
It is important not to lie to ourselves, about sex, life, culture, school, economical crisis, politic parties, family, love, money, religion. It seems people prefer to believe in fairy tales instead to be alive in a real world. My worst fault is I always say what is the real world.
Do you know also the official science is "politically correct"? What I see in sex, sex market, sex performances and female world contradicts the official science indeed. Being prudent is a common sense, but believing everything with no critical sense is stupid. And Italian background teaches to be stupid.
I put my reports because I haven't a lot of money to waste, instead of a lot of pseudo-puttanieri here. Therefore I don't like places for Westerners such as strip-clubs, and I avoid dangerous places such as brothels (always go with a friend!).
If you haven't recognize any businessmen in sex market here, then you have to experience some years more.Sex without condome is no sex you say. I must say that I enjoy condomed sex very much and feel much safer with condom on me. Surely with pros and semi pros, and also with usual freebies. Surely better to make intercourse without the condom, at least the first number, but it can go only with girl that you can trust a lot and know her, only with her, and even it doesn't guarantee safeness. For gods sake, I can't understand men who are so much eager fo uncovered blowjows and DATY with pros, not to speak about sex without condoms. Imagine how many men pros change per week, god knows what such pros can transmit, beggining from aids till hepatitis and gonorhea which are easily transmitted. If I find pros that agree unprotected sex I immediately delete her. Be carefull in ukrain espesially with unprotected sex, there is real big zoo there and once you can get surprised, very unplesantly surprised. Take it in mind boys, especially you acolonizer. Believe me, sex can be very pleasant, even with condom, and its in no way the same as to take bath with closes. At the end you can cume on her face or breasts.
Liljoey, most of us simply don't have the hours to wage throught many pages of information. Someone who can sunmmarize the lot in a longish page is a real boon.I recognize that the reading of the forum is tedious. When I was doing the reading and making my notes, I did find it tedious and time consuming. But I did it because I wanted the knowledge it contained so I could put it to good use in my trips to Kiev. I'm not recommending for others to do anything that I haven't done myself
And I have summarised. Many of my reports are of a summary nature. But obviously I can't keep writing the same things over and over. There is a search function on the board. There is a way to click on a member's name on a report and get to a listing of all his posts. There are all the posts waiting for you to harvest their info for your next trip. Those are the tools we have to work with on this forum. Each guy will make the most of them to the extent he can. If someone is short on time, it is beyond their control. But if they do have the time, but just don't care to use it for reading through this resource, it's ok. They just won't have the info available and will have to figure things out on the ground, so to speak.
Had another walkaround. At Buddha bar saw a lot of very beautiful girls (9+) but seemed to enter in two and head straight to the back of the lounge to hang out with one or two guys who would be with four or six girls. Spent all their time back there.
Cluster of girls at the bar again. These were 6-7. 5. Mostly same girls as were present a few days back. All know each other and I think they are trying to establish this $500/2 hour thing. Starting to feel like they are Phuket taxi drivers, making their own little mafia. The attitude is really poor as well, just say Hi and within 20 seconds they slam right down to this want to go home, $500/2 hour thing without you even having a chance to know if you would enjoy spending more than a minute in their company.
Shook my head and said it's too expensive, girl just waved her hand in my face and I hung out at the bar. Spoke to one of the other members of the 500/2 mafia and she talked my ear off about a guy wanting to buy her all Louis Vuitton stuff to get in her pants and how she tried to explain it was just cheaper to give her the money. She was rattling off the brands of all of her other things. I kind of didn't get it, not that attractive and don't know who is throwing all this money around as there didn't seem to be many interested guys in this place.
These girls at least need to learn some marketing because they are just not beautiful enough to throw that number out thre and get a positive response. It's like going to a strip club and getting the Hi-where-are-you-from-want-a-dance which I always answer with "no." Come here, smile, make me laugh, establish some chemistry without an immediate grab at my wallet and I am much more likely to say yes. The 500/2 being thrown in your face, at least if you talk to her a bit and decide you like her then maybe you're more inclined to counter or accept. The only impression I'm getting is zero personality bitchy girl trying to fish as quickly as possible for a sucker, so I have no interest in continuing from there. She thinks she is filtering out the rich guys from the losers who will "waste her valuable time" which she spends 4-6 hours of a night standing in front of a bar with a head on a swivel.
This is certainly not the vibe or feeling I got in Kiev last time. Wondering where the good times went where girls were a bit more fun and at least curious to talk to you.
Was spoken to by a pleasant girl from Russia who said she didn't like Ukranians much. I asked why and she said,"They're not very much like Russians."
She at least was nice and conducting conversation, I didn't let it lead anywhere and saw there was a guy beside her checking her out so kind of encouraged her to pay attention to him and she picked up on that. So I don't know if she is part of the 500/2 mafia.
Unfortunately bartender kept giving me vodka doubles and I had been hoping to see someone good looking there, and left late as my plan was to visit D'Lux. Had never been and was more curious than anything.
Dressed well, I got blocked at the door at D'Lux and asked if I had been drinking. Why yes I have! Was told that this was breaking the rules and asked to leave, so I left. I didn't feel particularly out of it, but in hindsight if someone's first reaction to you is "have you been drinking" then you're probably too much in the tank. Don't know though if that was just an excuse to face check me, I've been turned back from a club only once in my life so hasn't been a problem. I'm 39 if that means anything in this context.
Went from there to Vodka bar as I had read about it here. Guys in front of me were getting the security hassle and one had been rejected, the other was pleading. I thought here we go again. Security looked at me, I said "Vodka bar" and he nodded and said come in.
Wall to wall 20-somethings having fun (equal male:female ratio). Hot, packed, lights oddly bright. No real opportunity to meet anyone or talk as it was just too crammed and noisy and difficult to tell who was with whom. Saw one other guy out of his 20s, did a circuit and left. As I was leaving saw a group of Turkish looking guys in their late 40s / 50s, half bald, most fat, and sniggered to myself at how out of place they were about to become. Or maybe not, dunno how it works in there.
So, walked home.
Previously on the trip had made plans with a girl from mamba for dinner. She confirmed 3 times, of course didn't show up.
So. I'll give D'Lux a pass because the previous bartender had been pouring me doubles of vodka, bleh, and if someone is showing up half in the tank it's just solving them a problem possibly from their point of view to keep them out. But unattractive girls in the bars asking twice that a 10/10 did 8 months ago. I don't get it. The quick to the point is no good either. Wading through fakes on mamba is a pain we all know, but you find a legit one and she doesn't show. Just leaves everything feeling sour. I'd just like to meet an attractive girl who can laugh and I'll treat her great, do nice things for her, help her financially and just expect a nice time in return. This no longer seems the place for it.
And I'm just thinking if it is like this now. There will be no sense in visiting Ukraine for a year after Euro 2012. Everyone is talking about Euro 2012. Non working girls are talking about "our beautiful girls and these European men it is going to be crazy." Doom. Doom. Doom.
Anybody visited club Velvet?
http://striptease.ua/eng/clubs/velvet
How is the club? Take out options?
Site above shows private dances for 400 gr.
Some clubs on the site have VIP-rooms available.
What you can do there?
Member #3451
03-11-12, 23:36
DAY THREE:
Did more sightseeing in the city center during daytime. Saw plenty of nice girls in their late teens early 20s in McDonalds but thought they looked too young for me. Possibly a good day-time pick-up spot for the adventurous one. Went back to the apartment and arranged a Mamba-meeting in the afternoon. Again the girl who showed up did not match the profile pictures. She was more a 5/6 in real than the 8 on the photos on the website (profile got deleted after we agreed the meeting on the phone). Paid 800 Grivnas for one hour of basic sex. Multiple positions. Came inside the condom in the doggy position. Not much to write home about.
Went to RIO at approx. 10pm in order to pick up Jasmine from the day before. The place was much busier than the previous day. Was again seated in the rather uncomfortable bar-area and was not proposed to sit elsewhere. Took it slowly checking the rather dis-interested strippers performing their shows and had a few beers. Asked the manager for the whereabouts of Jasmine and he left for 5 minutes only to come back telling to my disappointment that she was absent. Don't know if someone had made an early take-out or if she had decided to stay at home that day. Anyway this was a blow to my plans and I had to re-think my options. Should I opt for some other Rio-girl or head elsewhere? Got a lap dance with a really tall and beautiful blonde named INNITSIA (or something similar). She was definitely worth to have some fun with but I decided to pass as the chemistry between us weren't the best.
Decided to give DLUX another shot and got a taxi there. This club was also more crowded than the day before but again I felt this was not a 100% pussy-guaranteed place so I left around 1:30AM with the aim to try Buddha Bar which is in walking distance from DLUX. On my way I passed by the Hotel Dnipro and spotted the MILLENIUM strip club who sounded familiar from this forum. I struggled however to remember anything about it (maybe for a good reason) but ventured in and paid the 100 Hryvnas entrance fee. The place was dead with only 3-4 other punters partly interested in the ongoing strip-show. The strippers tended to be a little older than the strippers in RIO. Same quality though. Didn't take long before I got a visitor to my table. Didn't recall her name but she was in her early twenties and an 8 according to my scale. After the usual "What's your name, where do you come from?" she asked me for a drink. I said sure why not. She then waived to a female waitress and asked for a glass of wine whereas the waitress told me it would cost me 600 Hryvnas! I declined and after a little argument the girl left. Couple of minutes later another girl came to my table, VIKA (Viktoria) claimed to be 23 years old but in real she seemed closer to 30. Her approach was more seasoned as she asked for a coffee for 60 Hryvnas in which I agreed to. I liked that I was advised in beforehand of the price of the girls' drinks by the waitress. Me and Vika came along ok and since options were not plentiful at 2am I asked her how much she wanted for a take-out. Straight away she wanted $400. I made a mistake by saying I only wanted to spend $300 (compared it to standard price of Rio take-out). When she immediately accepted my offer I knew I had overpaid. Before heading to my apartment we stopped by Buddha Bar and had some drinks and smoked some Hookah. Her younger sister also came to the club, from where I don't know, but she was a stunner! A good 9 on my scale. Younger and looking much more innocent. Later I found out from Viktoria that her younger sister was available for P4P as well but sadly I didn't follow up on the offer the next day.
Viktoria turned out to be bad in bed and wanted to finish off things quickly. Not only did she claim to not have any condoms with her (!) luckily I had bought some at the local store the same day. WTF! This wasn't someone I had casually picked up from the street or something! No kissing with tongue, DATY, or fingers in pussy allowed. All this pissed me off and I decided to make her work for it. I pounded her in multiple positions for an hour until the point she said her pussy was tired and she couldn't do it anymore and wanted to stop. Wanted her to leave in a good mood as I was into meeting her sister the next day so I let her go.
DAY FOUR AND FIVE:
Spent my last full day and night with Elena, the girl I met on my first night. We went to a shopping mall called "Dream Town" which was a 50 Hryvnas (negotiated by the Ukrainian girl) and approx. 25 minutes taxi ride from the city center. The mall was very big with an ice-skating rank, cinema and 6-7 restaurants in addition to the usual boutiques. Don't think many non-Ukrainians visit this one as it's on the outskirts of Kiev. Saw quite a few nice girls in their late teens and early 20s. I kind of liked the attention we got as we both stuck well out from the typical Kiev suburban shopping-crowd. Again my girl was dressed very sexy in big high heels. We had some food and drinks, bought her lingerie for 1400 Hryvnas and afterwards we stayed in my apartment the whole evening and night chatting and having sex. Paid her $180 the following day and she was happy. She had stayed with me for approx. 24 hours. We shared the same taxi to the airport the following day and I let her off to the worn down typical soviet-type of building she lived in. Looked like really bad living-conditions and made me think twice about how inflated Kiev P4P prices really are.
The Kiev P4P-scene is IMHO very professional and aimed at foreigners who have the money to pay as no locals are able to afford paying the prices being asked. Rio seems to be 'la valeur sûre" if everything else fails. Freebies seem like a good economic option but demands time, effort and you must have some game. Combine it with a sponsor-girl who will be with you for tourism, clubbing, restaurants and sex when you want and you can have a blast.
Santa75
Member #3451
03-11-12, 23:40
Hi guys,
Just returned from 4 days in Kiev. Sorry for this long report. I was with 4 different girls and had two good experiences and two not so good.
Preparations:
Been a long time lurker on this forum and I want to say a big thank you to everyone for the info posted here. In addition to reading the forum I've had a profile on Mamba for the last 2 years or so and had prepared several contacts from this site before travelling. I even took a 24-hour Russian language course a couple of months before my trip which proved handy. At least it was enough to know the alphabet and some basics in order to break the ice or open up a conversation.
Followed the advice from you guys and rented an apartment and it was perfect for my mission. Compared to 'normal' Kiev-standards I would say it was in the VIP-category with Jacuzzi, plasma screen and all you needed to impress the girls you bring home.
Still, you can do all the preparations in the world but once you're alone (as I were) in Kiev it's a totally different story and it's easy to lose focus on doing the right things when it comes to girls. I found that you could easily be short on options if plan A or B fails. Being a first-time visitor and relatively short on time (only 4 full days) didn't help. I regret not being more active hunting girls during day-time.
DAY ONE:
Landed at Boryspil airport and took the Sky Bus from the airport to the Central Station. Cost 25 Hryvnas, a real bargain in my opinion. The buses are easy to spot since they have lilla colour. They leave the airport for Kiev Central Station every 10-15 minutes from the parking lot between terminal C and F.
Found my apartment and started calling some pre-planned Mamba-girls and managed to set up a date the same night with a pretty 25 year-old named Elena. She's 178cm, skinny and a brunette. She had a really sexy dress and huge stilettos and looked like a perfect girl for a date. She had quite small boobs so I would probably rate her 7+. We went to a restaurant named Mafia on Kreshatik which was good and not too expensive (in the TGI Fridays-category). Main course + dessert x2 and a bottle of wine + some drinks were approx. 700 Hryvnas. I liked the booths in the restaurant as they gave privacy.
Her English was very good and she told me that she actually quit her 3 000 Hryvnas-a-month job in hotel management and now lived purely off sponsors going frequently abroad to
Turkey, Domenican Republic etc. She claimed to be "high-profile" and not doing 1-hour meetings. Took her to the apartment after dinner and soon we were snogging. Asked her how much she wanted to stay until the next morning and was quoted €450! To cut a long story short we settled for €300 including BBBJ (she had rent to pay the next day) and she stayed for 12 hours. Good GFE session with multiple pops, BBBJ and CIM (only girl I met in Kiev who had this on the menu).
DAY TWO:
Did some sightseeing during the day and started working on other Mamba contacts around 6pm in the afternoon. Real disappointment. Some did not speak English, some were busy and some did not answer at all. Went for plan B, Top-modals. Com which ended in disaster. Girl who came was not only 1, 5 hours late but a real skank and NO-WHERE near the girl on the website. Decided to scrap Mamba and Top-Modals and headed for DLUX nightclub. Paid the 200 Hryvnas entrance and found the first bar-level almost empty (it was Thursday at approx. 1am). Took a short tour around the premises and headed upstairs were the real action was. Club was probably half full. Way too many guys compared to girls. Most women were in groups of 2 or 3. Would say the male: female ratio was 3:1. Thought the music was too loud as well and that it was difficult to find P4P since it was not obvious what girls were in the trade or not. Decided to leave after one hour and head toward the well-known RIO strip-club.
Won't go into details since the club has been much talked about on this forum. However it's worth noticing that re-entry is possible, so you can leave the club for any reason and come back without paying a second entrance fee of 100 Hryvnas the same night. I was seated in the bar-area for maybe 45 minutes before the manager gave me a table in the upstairs room. Note: this is the place you want to be seated as you can watch 3 strippers at the same time plus having the comfort of a couch and table for interviewing the girls instead of the bar-chairs in the other area. The club was rather slow with max. 10-15 other punters present. Wide variety of girls mostly in their early 20s and ranging from 6 and 7s (majority) with a few 8s and maybe a rare 9 or two. The manager is the key to negotiating a lap-dance with the girl of your choice or have a girl to sit with you. I had two lap dances and was allowed to touch everywhere except pussy. First one did not take off her panties but second one (Jasmine) showed all. Jasmine was a real gem of 21 years. Not a top-model but a very cute girl-next-door kind of type with a great personality and nice body.
We connected very well and I took her to my apartment for $300. Sex was great (everything covered) with multiple positions and a good GFE. Jasmine claimed she lived outside of Kiev and went home by bus to her parents at 7 o'clock every morning and that they were unaware of what their daughter did in the evenings. How she managed this lifestyle with studies during daytime and stripping in the evenings I don't know. She left my apartment around 5 o'clock having stayed around 2, 5 hours. I liked her so much that I promised her to be back the following night for a longer take-out in which she said she wanted too.
Hello, Theknight,
How do you find Odessa compared to Kiev? Where the quality of girls is better? Where do you have a higher chance to shag a hot chicks?Much better chance in Kyiv than Odessa. A lot of visitors with boyfriends in Odessa.
More students in Kyiv, and more in need of cash or presents (potential freebies).
Personally I think quality is slightly higher in Kyiv too, but that may be due to sheer volume of numbers.
I am thinking about buying tickets and traveling to Kiev for 2 weeks on April 4th, next month.
Do you think the first 2 weeks of April is a good time to be there as far as Rio is concerned?
I don't want to go there and see there are not many girls at Rio
I want to go there before the euro 2012, cheaper prices for aptsBe careful, it may not be the best time, as Orthodox Easter Monday is 16 April this year.
So many of the girls will be going home and probably missing your second week.
However as all exams and university courses have been forced to finish earlier this year because of Euro2012, exams will be earlier and uni holidays may be shorter, though I am not sure of this. If I was only visiting once before Euro I would wait until after 23 April, and before 3rd week of May.
Quoted $400 for 2 hours at the Buddha bar from a fairly attractive blonde, but not knockout. Declined. Not interested in negotiating.
Quoted $500 for 2 hours at Millennium. Declined.
Both extremely inflated from last visit to Kiev. (Previously $300/3hrs in both 8 months back).
Thought I'd let you all know.
Was the only possibility floating around with a female to male ratio of about 5:1.
Doom is in the air.That's the girl trying her luck in Millennium. Standard prices I have written about before RTTF.
Buddha Bar is freelancers only. No set price obviously. They may try to set a cartel, but ignore them and tell them openly you're heading to Rio. It often affects their financial outlook as it proves you are not a totally vulnerable newbie, or on company expenses and not giving a toss.
What articles did you read claiming Solid Gold best in Kiev? Can you cite them or provide a link?
I've never been to Solid Gold because I usually come in to Kiev for only a few days and since Rio has great looking girls at $300, I didn't think it paid to go to other clubs where price was $400. The only reason might be if the beauty level was significantly better than at Rio. In these matters, I think you can consider reports by TheKnight as reliable. The next best thing is to check it out personally and compare Solid Gold to Rio based on your own experience and what you see.
LJNo way is Solid Gold the best looking line-up. I think Rhino in Arena complex is probably just about the best, but chances of arranging a very discreet hook up for the next day are pretty slim. Solid Gold's mean (average) is about on a par with Rio. But sheer fact there are many more girls at Rio means there are more stunners. Couple of real cuties at SG usually, but turnover seems quite high, probably because few clients. But at least the girls aren't worn out and maybe much better chance of genuine GFE, similar to Rio about 2 or 3 years ago IMO. However beware there is much more pressure to buy girls' drinks at very high prices in SG compared to Rio. It borders on a clip joint! If you go pay the entry, sup a beer or a coffee / tea, and resist temptation to buy girls a drink, just chat for 2-3 mins and when the barmaid comes ask for another minute, and then decide whether to ask the girl to go with you, or pass on the next one.
Anybody visited club Velvet?
http://striptease.ua/eng/clubs/velvet
How is the club? Take out options?
Site above shows private dances for 400 gr.
Some clubs on the site have VIP-rooms available.
What you can do there?Please RTFF. It is total garbage. Waste of money. No take out, very expensive private dance. And more than anything awful line-up. They are only interested in hotel guests with more money than sense.
As a general rule of thumb ignore ALL the places inside or attached to hotels. Millennium best of a very bad bunch.
Hi guys,
DAY TWO:
Jasmine.
We connected very well and I took her to my apartment for $300. Sex was great (everything covered) with multiple positions and a good GFE. Jasmine claimed she lived outside of Kiev and went home by bus to her parents at 7 o'clock every morning and that they were unaware of what their daughter did in the evenings. How she managed this lifestyle with studies during daytime and stripping in the evenings I don't know. She left my apartment around 5 o'clock having stayed around 2, 5 hours. I liked her so much that I promised her to be back the following night for a longer take-out in which she said she wanted too.How she manages this lifestyle? She lives with her parents, so the $300 you gave her should be enough to cover all her costs for a mont. That is how.
Actually all you need is experience and a little game.
I've been coming to Kiev for a while, the most I will pay a girl is $100. Prices with the semi pros will also depend on how attracted they are to you, which is also a good test of how good the sex will be.
If you can't tell if a girl is a pro or not then she isn't.
You took a semipro out, bought her gifts and then gave her money the next morning. You so crazy. .
You are indeed Santa for Kiev girls.
(stuff deleted)
The Kiev P4P-scene is IMHO very professional and aimed at foreigners who have the money to pay as no locals are able to afford paying the prices being asked. Rio seems to be 'la valeur sûre" if everything else fails. Freebies seem like a good economic option but demands time, effort and you must have some game. Combine it with a sponsor-girl who will be with you for tourism, clubbing, restaurants and sex when you want and you can have a blast.
Santa75
Stop going to the top sex tourist spots. You'll have better luck.
You sound like a Shooters type of guy, try there and work your way up.
Quoted $400 for 2 hours at the Buddha bar from a fairly attractive blonde, but not knockout. Declined. Not interested in negotiating.
Quoted $500 for 2 hours at Millennium. Declined.
Both extremely inflated from last visit to Kiev. (Previously $300/3hrs in both 8 months back).
Thought I'd let you all know.
Was the only possibility floating around with a female to male ratio of about 5:1.
Doom is in the air.
Generally if you paid for dinner in the 90's it was enough for the girl to spend the night.
One of my bud's who came in 1994 said being American was generally enough to do it.
Right up to 2005 you could be top talent out of River Palace for $100-$150.
They specify the prices and we pay. Nothing to do with it. I am sad for those who skipped the early years of Prestroyka and Glastnos. (People told me that 100 USD was enough for whole night with a Russian)
If you are relaying on RIO for your P4P and you have been to Kiev more than once, you have no mongering abilities.
I am happy that you had a good time and my posts were helpful to you. But I want to clarify that my viewpoint is not just "go to Rio" and that's it. The other options in Kiev have their time and place also.
Or he doesn't feel confident in his mongering abilities to be able to select a good GFE girl from Rio, or doesn't feel comfortable betting on only one girl for the good outcome of a three hour session, and would rather only bet on a girl for one hour so that if she's not good he minimized his losses to a 1 hour fee, or he likes pursuing freebies instead of p4p, or other reasons, then it's perfectly reasonable to pursue all the other options for lower cost pussy mentioned above that don't cost as much as Rio. However, in pursuing the other options he will need to be prepared to invest much more effort and time in finding a hot girl and getting her into his bed. Think of the extra cost at Rio as a "convenience" cost or an "efficiency" cost, which one can forgo and try to get good results the cheaper way using the websites etc with the understanding that the results of the search for cheaper p4p are not guaranteed and it might end up on a given night being a choice of no sex, or sex with a more average looking girl.
3) But if one has a good amount of time in Kiev of more than just a few days, there is no reason one shouldn't mix it up and go to Rio some nights and also pursue the other avenues to keep it interesting and spread out the costs, including websites, nightclubs and shopping malls. This is what I've tried to do for myself. I felt that as long as I had achieved some spectacular results with Rio girls on a few of the nights I was in Kiev, it was worthwhile going to nightclubs on other nights and doing the website thing during the daytimes. I had experimented with vodkaescort. Com (now out of business) with good results. I had gotten some good girls out of top-modals. Com. And I still had some contacts from the River Palace days that ended in 2010. My forays to the nightclubs did not produce any lower cost pussy, however. But it was all interesting.
So although on a short visit, I would agree to Rio and Rio, on a longer visit, or in the event of a smaller p4p budget, I would recommend mixing it up a bit, if only for the sake of variety and interest.
LJ
Ronaldinjo
03-12-12, 14:59
I have heard from several reports that its a fair club with huge amount of pros and semi pros. Is it true? Can somebody explain whats going on there? In there gallery there is a quit big amount of hot looking girls.
I was there for Eurovision too. I believe if you go back to May 2005 you'll find a report or two from me.
Paid same price for the apartment I stayed in. Paid same price at RP $100-$150. At RP I got one of the best bargins of my early career in Kiev. A 9 and her 7 friend for $200.
When I was in Kiev last time I was going to rent an apartment long term in Kiev. Found this great place for $1500 / month, you could throw a football and hit Olympic staduim.
YMMV and expereince is the key to it all.
I'll be in Kiev in a few days but have no plans to be there for Euro2012, should be quite an interesting experience with a lot of girls from the smaller cities and towns spending time in Kiev.
When there was a less important event in Kiev like the Eurovision song contest in 2005 it was an earth quake : prices rised up and it took months and months to go back to normal situation. So I guess this time it might be just worse, as Euro 2012 will last for 1 month and not only for a few days and many more people are expected to visit Ukraine.
They aren't that tall when they take off their 6-7" (15-17cm) high heel shoes. .
(stuff deleted)
As for women. WOW. I am here in. 20 and it is still not hard to see the potential here even with the girls all wrapped up in furs. I went to a few clubs and bars with the girl I came to see and was astounded by the women. Tall, and smoking hot. 9's a plenty. With a few splattering's of 10's.
Anyway I am in the airport and need to go so I will continue with this later.
GT, you still going to Kiev?
Any of the 'old guard' still reading or posting?
I would just like to add that you don't necessarily have to find dozens of quality girls for your bachelor party.
First you have to find 2 or 3 really good girls (in terms of price and quality) whether they be pros or semi-pros. Then they can find other girls for you. Like any business, referrals are invaluable. All girls are plugged into vast networks of friends and colleagues, and if you find one that suits your needs then chances are she has friends who will meet your friends' needs. A hot 8. 0 blonde who is doing everything you want for $300 is not going to set you up with frigid faker who wants $500. So work the dyev network to expand your network.
Member #3451
03-12-12, 19:28
How she manages this lifestyle? She lives with her parents, so the $300 you gave her should be enough to cover all her costs for a mont. That is how.Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't believe that RIO is willing to "lose" a girl for the rest of the night without getting a cut of the $300. But you're right, she could get by for some time even with $150.
I enjoyed being able to feel her up and interview her at RIO, BEFORE I decided to take her home, something which I sadly couldn't do with the fake Mamba- and Top-Modals-girls.
Member #3451
03-12-12, 21:05
Actually all you need is experience and a little game.
I've been coming to Kiev for a while, the most I will pay a girl is $100. Prices with the semi pros will also depend on how attracted they are to you, which is also a good test of how good the sex will be.
If you can't tell if a girl is a pro or not then she isn't.
You took a semipro out, bought her gifts and then gave her money the next morning. You so crazy. .
You are indeed Santa for Kiev girls.I appreciate your view and acknowledgde that I still have a hell of lot to learn about the Kiev P4P-scene. The key word is, you wrote it yourself: expericene, and there's a first time for everything.
The freebie-scene is tempting and I hope to explore it next time around. But most guys on this forum does NOT have unlimited time to hunt for devuschkas whilst in Kiev. As the scene is less straightforward than for instance Germany (no FKK's, no red-light district) one could easily be left with weighing up more expensive options in nightclubs or strip-joints.
The sponsor-girl that you suggest I overpaid for, (attached pic from the photo session she did with with me) stayed 24 hours and gave me a great GFE with BBBJ and CIM (which I believe is rather uncommon amongst working girls in Kiev). What services and length of time are you talking about when you say that you only pay $100?
Please RTFF. It is total garbage. Waste of money. No take out, very expensive private dance. And more than anything awful line-up. They are only interested in hotel guests with more money than sense.
As a general rule of thumb ignore ALL the places inside or attached to hotels. Millennium best of a very bad bunch.Thank you TheKnight. I will cross it from my list. I guess in term of strip clubs there is no competion to Rio.
AColonizer
03-13-12, 13:06
With my reports, also I show readers here, men can pay smaller amounts with a young woman and good provider and no-comdom sex too! I am not a master but I have realized how the fiercest business works.
Men haven't to pay condomed sex much more than unprotected sex: that's no mongering, that's just dickheadness! In fact, what it has happened in the Western world is the result of that dickheadness. And men are transforming Ukraine just as the Western world.
Therefore men say two types of reason to justify their behaviours:
- oh, I have found a "stunning" and "professional" woman in Rio, or Buddha, or Shooters, or somewhere else (and I am menthal masturbating just seeing her and I am happy to pay much more than the same prostitute in my own country) ;
- oh, I have found a "stunning" and "professional" woman in Rio, or Buddha, or Shooters, or somewhere else (and I try to convince men to pay crazy prices because my friend and I get half earning by those places and by those girls).
Moreover, I went to Rio on 8 March, maybe I was unlucky, but I saw just two good girls among twenty, and I tried to contact one of them, and she hasn't any good attitude in approaching customers. In my opinion, men have definitely put their brain in the WC and they have flushed that!
Sex without condome is no sex you say. I must say that I enjoy condomed sex very much and feel much safer with condom on me. Surely with pros and semi pros, and also with usual freebies. Surely better to make intercourse without the condom, at least the first number, but it can go only with girl that you can trust a lot and know her, only with her, and even it doesn't guarantee safeness. For gods sake, I can't understand men who are so much eager fo uncovered blowjows and DATY with pros, not to speak about sex without condoms. Imagine how many men pros change per week, god knows what such pros can transmit, beggining from aids till hepatitis and gonorhea which are easily transmitted. If I find pros that agree unprotected sex I immediately delete her. Be carefull in ukrain espesially with unprotected sex, there is real big zoo there and once you can get surprised, very unplesantly surprised. Take it in mind boys, especially you acolonizer. Believe me, sex can be very pleasant, even with condom, and its in no way the same as to take bath with closes. At the end you can cume on her face or breasts.
Any of the 'old guard' still reading or posting?.
Acolonizer, is still reading&posting, and Yeah everything Without Condom.
Can the experts please help me compare these two destinations for a weekend trip? Price is not an issue.
I would like to know how the two compare in terms of.
- availability of beautiful to stunning pros / semipros.
- discos / clubs with semi pros or students
Ronaldinjo
03-13-12, 23:46
With my reports, also I show readers here, men can pay smaller amounts with a young woman and good provider and no-comdom sex too! I am not a master but I have realized how the fiercest business works.
Men haven't to pay condomed sex much more than unprotected sex: that's no mongering, that's just dickheadness! In fact, what it has happened in the Western world is the result of that dickheadness. And men are transforming Ukraine just as the Western world.
Therefore men say two types of reason to justify their behaviours:
- oh, I have found a "stunning" and "professional" woman in Rio, or Buddha, or Shooters, or somewhere else (and I am menthal masturbating just seeing her and I am happy to pay much more than the same prostitute in my own country) ;
- oh, I have found a "stunning" and "professional" woman in Rio, or Buddha, or Shooters, or somewhere else (and I try to convince men to pay crazy prices because my friend and I get half earning by those places and by those girls).
Moreover, I went to Rio on 8 March, maybe I was unlucky, but I saw just two good girls among twenty, and I tried to contact one of them, and she hasn't any good attitude in approaching customers. In my opinion, men have definitely put their brain in the WC and they have flushed that!Dear acolonizer, if you enjoy sex without condom with ukrainian pros, you are welcome. Don't be surprised if you get STD. About Rio, yes, it depends on the day, most girls are just avarage, bet you can find a few hotties there 8/10 on my scale (I'm very picky, for some tthose girls might be 9 or more, but almost none I saw was more than 8-8, 5/10 maximum). If you are looking for really hot pros go to Rio (real Rio in brazil).
have to say this, premier palace did send up a very nice plate of cheese. the hotel itself feels like a buffed up soviet building. still has that bit of communist strangeness to it, but they've done a decent job of bringing it up to speed. certainly not a hyatt or intercontinental but it's ok.
that said, stopped into their paradise cabaret.
the environment is very nice, but mostly empty of patrons and the girls were all 6-7. 5. nice looking face carries a wide load down low, and great body has a difficult face. one or two pleasant looking girls, and then the remainder were over the hill types that i was surprised were even working in kiev having been to millenium and rio.
very surprised at the number of very large rear ends and cellulite legs, which is so uncommon in this city amongst any females that i was surprised to even know they existed here.
sat down to a drink and pretty much immediately had the tag teams coming out. maybe one of you experienced guys can tell me why they do this because i don't understand it. given two girls maybe you will like one and want to interact with her and then the third wheel will sit there. given the cost of beverages (400-600 for a drink to more for a bottle of champagne) there is not much advantage to paying out drinks for the company of two girls. i think it works to their disadvantage as almost always there is one aggressive and less attractive girl accompanied by a nicer more attractive girl and my reaction is to deep six the both by saying not interested in company rather than pointing at one and saying "go" and at the other and saying "stay".
anyway, nothing really doing here. i've been to some russian clubs and seen great dancing which i appreciate, but this is just the standard walking around the pole stuff by mostly uninteresting girls, and then being hit up by pairs of girls who generate no interest and do the hard sell on expensive drinks.
the notes about millenium below, the place is indeed a bit of a clip joint, but i will say that i've only ever seen girls with great bodies and some 9-10s dancing there. the hard sell happens from time to time but i've also had girls insist that they only wanted a juice because they know the club is going to give the 600 drinks to the customer as the option. and as another poster said, the waitress always clears the price with the customer, at this cabaret the hard sell came with a lot of vagueness about the price,"people here usually buy a bottle of champage / i don't know what it costs" kind of thing.
got to give a thumbs down here, what i read about it, it seems well appreciated, but even as a strip club i rate it in the bottom tenth of places i've been in the world. no fun, hard sell, unattractive women, high costs. why come? no idea.
nice environment though.
AZN Monger
03-14-12, 00:34
I appreciate your view and acknowledgde that I still have a hell of lot to learn about the Kiev P4P-scene. The key word is, you wrote it yourself: expericene, and there's a first time for everything.
The freebie-scene is tempting and I hope to explore it next time around. But most guys on this forum does NOT have unlimited time to hunt for devuschkas whilst in Kiev. As the scene is less straightforward than for instance Germany (no FKK's, no red-light district) one could easily be left with weighing up more expensive options in nightclubs or strip-joints.
The sponsor-girl that you suggest I overpaid for, (attached pic from the photo session she did with with me) stayed 24 hours and gave me a great GFE with BBBJ and CIM (which I believe is rather uncommon amongst working girls in Kiev). What services and length of time are you talking about when you say that you only pay $100?That girl you mentioned (Alisa P) spent the entire night with me for free. I gave her taxi money to go home. It's how you play the game. I also got a BBBJCIM. It was good, I wouldn't say a great one. She uses a little too much teeth.
AZN Monger
03-14-12, 00:40
That girl you mentioned (Alisa P) spent the entire night with me for free. I gave her taxi money to go home. It's how you play the game. I also got a BBBJCIM. It was good, I wouldn't say a great one. She uses a little too much teeth.I actually stay in touch with her too. I assume this was also taken at your apartment?
RomanyStar
03-14-12, 03:49
after months of prep i am waiting for the shuttle to the airport. i have gained from the wisdom of the board, and will give my best effort at payback over the next few days.
i am on the west coast of the us. i had many choices for this long anticipated excursion, all involving long flights. i have an ancient history of good times in asia, and years of experience in latin america. think montreal is as close to monger heaven as i've ever been. since this is a retirement present i decided to make it something new. the decision between fkk land and kiev came down to the fact that i prefer a more gfe encounter, and am hoping for overnights. all the fkk research made it sound a little mechanical for my taste.
i read the board, and at lj's behest, reread the board. then i read the board some more. i'm still picking up pointers in posts i have found in searches from years back. i have a document full of notes i have copied from the board.
i set up a mamba account, and focused on the young ladies that are hopefully non-pro's. i have filtered out the "offers sex for money" entries. i will reserve those that are that blatant for last minute contacts if i get into a situation with a few hours to fill. my intent is to spend two or three of my nights with the ladies i filtered down to. i was offered time for compensation from all but a few. some wanted as much as $600 for the night, one wants a new iphone 4s! the other end is one that wants a pair of shoes, bet they're not cheap. i have three "solid" dates scheduled, and a nice collection of backups.
i spent some time working on the russian alphabet, and invested in a couple lessons from pimsleur. i can at least introduce myself, but won't be much of a conversationalist.
my intent is to approach this with an open budget. i do not believe in throwing money away, and know the highest priced girl in the room is far from the best companion. the other side of that equation is that since this is probably a once in a lifetime trip i plan to go for the hottest looking and most passionate company i can sniff out. i had hoped to have more time, so now i will use the extra budget to stay as busy as my body can manage.
it looks as though there is going to be some sun over the weekend, so i will explore what street scene i can find. didn't we all start there once? there is still a thrill to cruising along and shopping, though the last time it worked out well is lost in my foggy memory. i am planning a couple nights in the clubs. i also spent hours with tineye vetting the photo's of girls on escort sites. most are stolen photos, but more than one site was clean on the searches. escorts will be my backup plan, i'm not going to be sitting around solo in my room on this trip.
i will report on the results of all this work as the days speed by.
The problem with RIO club is that it seems none of the girls don't do DFK or uncovered blowjob
The problem with RIO club is that it seems none of the girls don't do DFK or uncovered blowjobOn what basis are you stating that? Your opinion is not based on experience or personal knowledge. you can't say "none" of the girls do. perhaps you can say "some" of the girls don't do it. only if you have dated most of the girls, which you have not done, and have been unsuccessful in getting dfk and uncovered bj, could you be in a position to say that "most" of the girls do not do dfk and uncovered bj WITH YOU. but since you have not dated most of the girls, you could not say that with accuracy. There are reports on the thread which directly contradict your statement. there are also reports that state a particular girl didn't do an uncovered bj. I have gotten uncovered BJ's sometimes and sometimes not. I have always been able to kiss the girl I took out, although I am not into sticking my tongue so far down her throat that it comes out her vagina. I'm a little more gentle than that. So I don't know what level of dfk you are desiring. But it is clear that what you wrote exaggerates the issue.
In the interest of preserving accuracy perhaps it would be better stated that not every girl at Rio provides dfk and uncovered BJ to every customer, it will depend on each girl's personal outlook as well as on the chemistry between her and a particular client, YMMV, and there is no guarantee that every girl will do it with you.
You need to use your mongering skills during conversation and during private dances to detect as best you can which girl is more likely to do those things with you, or find a way to discuss it without killing the mood or good vibe you might have going.
It is not a guaranteed service on a menu like at an FKK. It is individual and depends on chemistry you may be able to develop with a particular girl with your own personal mongering charms. Impeccable grooming and personal hygiene are of course prerequisite to any girl wanting to do these intimate things with you. So don't expect to get very far if you have bad breath, body odor, or look decrepit. Look and be your best, and turn on the charm, and it will go a long way towards getting you where you want, but keep your eyes open and brain working, and watch for signs of a girl's inclinations, and choose well.
LJ
Ronaldinjo
03-14-12, 09:28
Maanth,
Where is Millenium?
Are girls available for picup?
How much does it cost?
Generally if you paid for dinner in the 90's it was enough for the girl to spend the night.
One of my bud's who came in 1994 said being American was generally enough to do it.
Right up to 2005 you could be top talent out of River Palace for $100-$150..
In 1996 the Hryvnia was introduced, and it was 1. 83UAH to the US$.
In April 2005 it was pegged at 5. 05 UAH to the US$. .
I did Prague, Warsaw, Budapest, Sofia, Zagreb, Belgrade in the late 1980s, before the Berlin Wall came down. It was as cheap as Chips, didn't need to pay a Dime in Prague, Warsaw or Budapest. But then again I was in my 20s, I had youth on my side and with a Western Regesiterd car, I was a bit of Novelty then in those places.
But even then I used to see German mongers who were in their 40s being approached only by WGS in Tourist Clubs in Prague, civvy girls were just not interested in them.
Kiev became a viable cheap mongering destination for me in late 2008, 2009 (8+Uah to the US$) , with the depreciation of the UAH and the Cheap flights on Wizzair from London.
Without those 2 Factors, I wouldn't have considered Kiev as a Mongering Place, because it wasn't cost effective for me. And honsetly with what I got In Kiev & Minsk later on, I don't think I missed out on earlier years.
The only time a girl cost me more than US$ 100 in Kiev, was a girl that I exchanged more 40 messages with her, before she agreed to come from Donetsk to see me In Kiev. And she wasn't a Pro.
The problem with RIO club is that it seems none of the girls don't do DFK or uncovered blowjobThis is actually a fair assumption. For the record, the club is mostly 7's and 8's with some rare 9's. I did not take out and have no real knowledge of how the club works with the girls. However, I will assume the girls pay the club one third. I doubt this club would exist from the money it generates strictly within the establishment. In my eyes it is an extension of the prostitute bars found in Moscow. If this was a strip club without any "outside the club action" the talent would have to be all 9's and 10's. If your in Kiev for a short period, its an option but do not place all your focus on the place. I have a few weeks here and prefer to hunt for amateurs with some leg work.
Happy mongering.
The problem with RIO club is that it seems none of the girls don't do DFK or uncovered blowjobIf the girls here blew without a cover, they would all go work for Gia. If they are going to do all the work of dancing on a stage, there has to be some kind of a payback for them. I believe it lies within the fact that they do not have to perform dfk or BBBJ. I am sure exceptions can be found but it will not be this clubs established norm.
Please keep in mind I only made one visit there and probably do not know what I am talking about.
Thank you to all your posts I think I have now an idea about Kiev and what to do there.
My question I a little bit private but hope I will find your understanding.
I'm thinking about action in Kiev but not sure if I can handle it phisically and be ready for multiple runs.
So decided to try for the first time vitamins (how they called here).)
I read LJ comments regarding it and prices in Kiev I believe$17 for Cialis without prescription.
Since I never used this staff before can you guys give me some lectures about reaction to expect and.
Everything else associated with use based on your experiences?
Thank you in advance
I'm thinking about action in Kiev but not sure if I can handle it phisically and be ready for multiple runs.
So decided to try for the first time vitamins (how they called here).)
I read LJ comments regarding it and prices in Kiev I believe$17 for Cialis without prescription.
Since I never used this staff before can you guys give me some lectures about reaction to expect and.
Everything else associated with use based on your experiences?
Thank you in advanceOk.
I take Cialis, I get 20mg pills, I have a pill cutter(buy from drugstore), I cut it in half, if I want to see a girl at 9pm or later, I take half a pill around 3pm and half a pill around 6pm. It works best for me this way, I would rather not take the whole pill at one time
Ok.
I take Cialis, I get 20mg pills, I have a pill cutter (buy from drugstore) , I cut it in half, if I want to see a girl at 9pm or later, I take half a pill around 3pm and half a pill around 6pm. It works best for me this way, I would rather not take the whole pill at one timeSo you take half of pill about 6 or more hours before and other part about 3 or more hours before? Interesting.
Seems like there was a lot of experiments before to get so precise.)
Why not buy them BEFORE you get there? Various online pharmacies sell them for $1-2 / pill.
How much to take? It depends on whether you are taking them as a necessity or as insurance. Age, alcohol, sleep, and the girl's hotness are all factors. For me a quarter is more than enough for up to 3 days. I once made the mistake of taking a full Viagra and I almost killed the girl, and myself. Only you know yourself. Do some dry tests.
Ok.
I take Cialis, I get 20mg pills, I have a pill cutter (buy from drugstore) , I cut it in half, if I want to see a girl at 9pm or later, I take half a pill around 3pm and half a pill around 6pm. It works best for me this way, I would rather not take the whole pill at one time
Global Surfer
03-15-12, 02:43
Thank you to all your posts I think I have now an idea about Kiev and what to do there.
My question I a little bit private but hope I will find your understanding.
I'm thinking about action in Kiev but not sure if I can handle it phisically and be ready for multiple runs.
So decided to try for the first time vitamins (how they called here).)
I read LJ comments regarding it and prices in Kiev I believe$17 for Cialis without prescription.
Since I never used this staff before can you guys give me some lectures about reaction to expect and.
Everything else associated with use based on your experiences?
Thank you in advanceThere are two types of Cialis available.
Cialis for daily use 2. 5mg and 5. 0 mg. You should start with 2. 5 mg. It should be taken every day once at about the same time.
Cialis 36 hours (Standard Cialis) 5, 10 and 20mg. This is supposed to be taken as needed. Start with a low starting dose of 5mg and only increase if necessary. It has a very long half life and it is not recommended to repeat the table before 24 hours.
If you have a existing heart disease I would strongly recommend to consult your doctor before taking this tablet. It is not recommend combining this table with nitrates (used to treat angina) or alpha blockers (used in prostatic hypertrophy) as it may cause dangerous fall in your blood pressure.
You may experience some drop in blood pressure, headache palpitation and nasal congestion,
Do not take if you have esxisting heart disease, liver or kidney problem, stomach ulcer, vision loss.
So you take half of pill about 6 or more hours before and other part about 3 or more hours before? Interesting.
Seems like there was a lot of experiments before to get so precise.) Yes, that works for me.
Any time I took the whole 20mg pill I got a little headache and sometimes got a little sick
AColonizer
03-15-12, 13:03
before buying viagra, cialis and levitra, it is necessary to meet some good and honest girls. first, it is necessary to find good sex providers about swallow blowjobs, anal sex, anuslingus, [CodeWord103] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord103) etc, and only after men should talk about sexual inhancers. and well (!) , we pay girls to have sex with us, and therefore girls should work to fuck us, and we haven't got tired to fuck her!
that's silly to pay an airfare, plus an accommodation, plus a restaurant meal, plus a medicine, plus a taxi, plus a club ticket, plus a private dance, plus an expensive sex hour to get the same result to fuck any other girl in our own country. with that method, the average cost of a sex hour in kiev is about 300$.
and about rio, i have been once and i saw no 10, no 9, a 8, and a 6. all the rest were standard-appearance girls (and maybe less). i hope the average member here doesn't like anybody who breathes.
Why not buy them BEFORE you get there? Various online pharmacies sell them for $1-2 / pill.
How much to take? It depends on whether you are taking them as a necessity or as insurance. Age, alcohol, sleep, and the girl's hotness are all factors. For me a quarter is more than enough for up to 3 days. I once made the mistake of taking a full Viagra and I almost killed the girl, and myself. Only you know yourself. Do some dry tests.I thought about it but not sure if this products from online distributors always real. Kind of scary to play with unknown pills. Great that I ask this question here and avoided taking whole pill.) Thank you Stivie69
There are two types of Cialis available.
Cialis for daily use 2. 5mg and 5. 0 mg. You should start with 2. 5 mg. It should be taken every day once at about the same time.
Cialis 36 hours (Standard Cialis) 5, 10 and 20mg. This is supposed to be taken as needed. Start with a low starting dose of 5mg and only increase if necessary. It has a very long half life and it is not recommended to repeat the table before 24 hours.
If you have a existing heart disease I would strongly recommend to consult your doctor before taking this tablet. It is not recommend combining this table with nitrates (used to treat angina) or alpha blockers (used in prostatic hypertrophy) as it may cause dangerous fall in your blood pressure.
You may experience some drop in blood pressure, headache palpitation and nasal congestion,
Do not take if you have esxisting heart disease, liver or kidney problem, stomach ulcer, vision loss.Global Surfer it is a real good explanation. I have feeling that this help not just me but other guys as well who never used before. It is always a little scary to hear last part because you never can be sure what you have inside of you, but o well, you can try to see what is going to happen. I am not going to take it evryday and probably will start with 5 or 10 for a day and see how it going to work.
My question going to be if it is available in Kiev in Farmacy (aptekah) in all sizes? I would asume as anywhere in former USSR without prescription.
Yes, that works for me.
Any time I took the whole 20mg pill I got a little headache and sometimes got a little sickThank you Muddy7 for sharing with me. This is very important information and I read you post a couple of times.)
Checked website and this place offer different massages including erotic. Interesting how far they go. And how good quality those gils you pick?
http://www.rakuena.kiev.ua/
Nachalo video erotic seccion.
http://www.rakuena.kiev.ua/services/service_ero/
Felix Nordic
03-15-12, 20:22
Thank you to all your posts I think I have now an idea about Kiev and what to do there.
My question I a little bit private but hope I will find your understanding.
I'm thinking about action in Kiev but not sure if I can handle it phisically and be ready for multiple runs.
So decided to try for the first time vitamins (how they called here).)
I read LJ comments regarding it and prices in Kiev I believe$17 for Cialis without prescription.
Since I never used this staff before can you guys give me some lectures about reaction to expect and.
Everything else associated with use based on your experiences?
Thank you in advanceI think here is what you need to read about "mans best friend" sex pills.
http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/forumdisplay.php?272-Viagra-amp-other-Performance-Enhancers
Apart from that use google.
I sometimes use Kamagra myself which is generic Viagra, but much cheaper. It works well, and I especially need it late at night after some drinking. Kicks in after 30 mins and lasts up to 4 hours after. I take half a 100 mg to 2/3s of a pill at a time. I also use Kamagra when I make amateur porn videos because it is so tricky to handle both shooting with video camera and shag, think about light and angles, setting, poses and giving instructions to girls etc, that it is good to have a sure hard on. Will try cialis because it has a longer lasting effect.
Cheers and happy hunting.
/Felix
I think here is what you need to read about "mans best friend" sex pills.
http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/forumdisplay.php?272-Viagra-amp-other-Performance-Enhancers
Apart from that use google.
I sometimes use Kamagra myself which is generic Viagra, but much cheaper. It works well, and I especially need it late at night after some drinking. Kicks in after 30 mins and lasts up to 4 hours after. I take half a 100 mg to 2/3s of a pill at a time. I also use Kamagra when I make amateur porn videos because it is so tricky to handle both shooting with video camera and shag, think about light and angles, setting, poses and giving instructions to girls etc, that it is good to have a sure hard on. Will try cialis because it has a longer lasting effect.
Cheers and happy hunting.
/FelixThank you. A lot of info, I tend to try Levitra. Seems like people mention less side effects. I hope it is available in Ukraine.
Checked website and this place offer different massages including erotic. Interesting how far they go. And how good quality those gils you pick?
http://www.rakuena.kiev.ua/
Nachalo video erotic seccion.
http://www.rakuena.kiev.ua/services/service_ero/I visit this place last year and had nice gilrs but I guess no chance to pick up to my flat. They made good happy end but no sex
I visit this place last year and had nice gilrs but I guess no chance to pick up to my flat. They made good happy end but no sexSo it is nice relaxing place with cute girls and some action but no sex. Thank you Sponsor74. I may consider for relaxation and experience because their prices look reasonable.
SwedishFlyGuy
03-15-12, 22:18
I visit this place last year and had nice gilrs but I guess no chance to pick up to my flat. They made good happy end but no sexAre the girls naked and are you aloud to touch them?
Felix Nordic
03-15-12, 23:18
before buying viagra, cialis and levitra, it is necessary to meet some good and honest girls. first, it is necessary to find good sex providers about swallow blowjobs, anal sex, anuslingus, rep002 etc, and only after men should talk about sexual inhancers. and well (!) , we pay girls to have sex with us, and therefore girls should work to fuck us, and we haven't got tired to fuck her!
that's silly to pay an airfare, plus an accommodation, plus a restaurant meal, plus a medicine, plus a taxi, plus a club ticket, plus a private dance, plus an expensive sex hour to get the same result to fuck any other girl in our own country. with that method, the average cost of a sex hour in kiev is about 300$.
and about rio, i have been once and i saw no 10, no 9, a 8, and a 6. all the rest were standard-appearance girls (and maybe less). i hope the average member here doesn't like anybody who breathes.
the geological definitition of impotence is when the gravity of earth is stronger than the attraction by a hot girl.
however under certain circumstances "sex pills" can help fight the laws of nature. god bless we live in modern times.
the combination of a hot girl and natural "no condom" sex might rescue a man from the medical solution, but for those who want to play it safe, the pills will be a salvation. i do them when the battle situation calls for it, with or without condom. nothing at all to be ashamed of imo as a man + 40, and anyway age does not matter.
if you play it right, and get the hot girl and the chemical brother, the result is a blast! it helps me performing good during protected sex with condom. though nature style is the best, the situation has to be evalutated in every situation. it is about risk analysis verusus outcome. pleasure versus safety. do the maths and proceed my friends. i know that i make priority for the pleasure and that is natural style, if the risk is to my favour. the best sex is without condom, as driving high speed on a run way. however on a dangerous race way, wear a helmet! same as with girls.
i agree that without a doubt kiev is very over priced! heck, if you do not even get bbbj in a place like rio as standard it should be dumped instantly! without a doubt! a bj with condom is imho nothing! dump those places and tell the girls to tell their bosses to close down their places as the service is shiite! just ditch them and let the market rule and hopefully in the future it will get better. if we horny hunters make the same demands it will get better.
cheers and happy hunting.
/felix
I thought about it but not sure if this products from online distributors always real. Kind of scary to play with unknown pills. Great that I ask this question here and avoided taking whole pill.) Thank you Stivie69Before I head to Kiev& when in London, I buy my stock from the following.
www.kamagrafast.com. Or www.kamagrafast.co.uk
Very reliable, been using them for few years. Genuine and no side effects.
They deliver anywhere, plain envelope.
I use now the generic Levitra from them. Made me pop 3 times in 2 hours, and I am in the wrong half of my 40s.
And about Rio, I have been once and I saw no 10, no 9, a 8, and a 6. All the rest were standard-appearance girls (and maybe less). I hope the average member here doesn't like anybody who breathes.Most probably the 10&9 you didn't see, were with Liljoey.
Global Surfer
03-16-12, 02:07
the geological definitition of impotence is when the gravity of earth is stronger than the attraction by a hot girl.
however under certain circumstances "sex pills" can help fight the laws of nature. god bless we live in modern times.
the combination of a hot girl and natural "no condom" sex might rescue a man from the medical solution, but for those who want to play it safe, the pills will be a salvation. i do them when the battle situation calls for it, with or without condom. nothing at all to be ashamed of imo as a man + 40, and anyway age does not matter.
if you play it right, and get the hot girl and the chemical brother, the result is a blast! it helps me performing good during protected sex with condom. though nature style is the best, the situation has to be evalutated in every situation. it is about risk analysis verusus outcome. pleasure versus safety. do the maths and proceed my friends. i know that i make priority for the pleasure and that is natural style, if the risk is to my favour. the best sex is without condom, as driving high speed on a run way. however on a dangerous race way, wear a helmet! same as with girls.
i agree that without a doubt kiev is very over priced! heck, if you do not even get bbbj in a place like rio as standard it should be dumped instantly! without a doubt! a bj with condom is imho nothing! dump those places and tell the girls to tell their bosses to close down their places as the service is shiite! just ditch them and let the market rule and hopefully in the future it will get better. if we horny hunters make the same demands it will get better.
cheers and happy hunting.
/felixprobably these drugs are used more than they are actially required. as a rule we shoud avoid unnecassary medication and use the smallest possible dose. if you are not suffering from heart disease, kidney or liver disease and not taking nitrates you may try them to enhance your pleasure. please do not underestimate the importance of following.
exercise – aerobic exercise for at least 20 minutes at least 3 days a week. i tmay take 6-12 weeks before you notice significant improvement.
avoid alchol – improvement is instantaneous.
i agree with you that kiev is ovre priced. probably whole of cis is over priced for non russian speakers. i 'friend' in dubai (friend mean multiple calls) from kazan told me that she used to go for usd20 for full night in kazan with locals.
i think we need to work hard a little bit as well. in my experience in kiev mamba is much better and cheaper option. arguably it may be a hit or miss and require lot of planning and work before comming to kiev.
i would also recommend trying local clubs particularly like bacardi which have a mixture of pros and non pros. you may be lucky or may get away with usd 100 for 7/8.
RomanyStar
03-16-12, 02:29
Since my time for the trip was shortened I decided to pay a guide / interpreter to meet me at the airport, and help me run through those first day chores. I used Google to find someone I thought appropriate, and attractive, just in case I could turn this into a freebie. No such luck with the freebie, but the rest of the plan was a home run.
This beautiful graduate student was waiting at the airport with a sign so we could recognize each other. She showed me the ropes of using the bus and metro system to get into town, which saved me enough on taxi's both ways to nearly pay her bill. She brought a SIM card with, so my phone was set up with no fuss at all. We walked the neighborhood around my apartment where she pointed out ATM's, money change kiosks, cafe's and cheap local eats.
We then went on a grocery run, and since I had emailed her that I enjoy good wine, she suggested we go to the Mega Market. What a welcome surprise! They had an international section where I was able to point out a couple California, Argentinian, and Chilean wines I like to the obviously knowledgeable salesman. With what I pointed out, he suggested a couple Georgian bottles, at least the first of which is a fine bottle for well under $10.
The last thing I asked for on my excursion was an introduction to what she considers a couple quality romantic restaurants. I consider this crucial information on my quest for freebies in the next couple days. I was pushing for higher end, but I think she was watching my kopecks, and not wanting to feel obligated. We had hors devours at Pervak, a Ukrainian place previously praised on the board. The savory dumplings were great. Next stop was Oliva which is evidently a chain based on the card I picked up. We shared a Salmon Ravioli that was up to some of the best San Francisco Italian restaurant standards. A little short on the atmosphere though. Our desert stop had the atmosphere, and awesome home made ice cream. The dinner plates I saw coming out sure passed the presentation test. Sadly I can not report the name, this is where I tried to move toward making this a different sort of relationship, and got the low down on her age appropriate Swiss Engineer BF. I was crestfallen, and missed grabbing a card on the way out. I'll walk by tomorrow to get the name since it looks like the place for my (next) freebie attempt. All three of these go on the map.
OK so getting back on topic, I was running a little short on sleep after the 22 hour travel time from home (2 layovers just sucks). I'd been thinking I would start out with a trip down the block to Rio (I'm in Kievappts #318 which seems fair value for the money). Not feeling up to the task of spending a couple hours making a wise choice in a club, and feeling slightly blue balled, I made the call to Gia. It was nearly closing time so the menu was restricted, but Mila had the tight body and services on the menu I was looking for. Her pictures are real, maybe a couple years old, but absolutely the same girl. Services were exactly as advertised. She goes into the top ten all time DT category. A fine save, if a bit expensive, to the end of the day.
AColonizer
03-16-12, 02:46
Yes, you have understood the matter!
Probably these drugs are used more than they are actially required. As a rule we shoud avoid unnecassary medication and use the smallest possible dose. If you are not suffering from heart disease, kidney or liver disease and not taking nitrates you may try them to enhance your pleasure. Please do not underestimate the importance of following.
Exercise – Aerobic exercise for at least 20 minutes at least 3 days a week. I tmay take 6-12 weeks before you notice significant improvement.
Avoid alchol – Improvement is instantaneous.
I agree with you that Kiev is ovre priced. Probably whole of CIS is over priced for non Russian speakers. I 'friend' in Dubai (friend mean multiple calls) from Kazan told me that she used to go for USD20 for full night in Kazan with locals.
I think we need to work hard a little bit as well. In my experience in Kiev Mamba is much better and cheaper option. Arguably it may be a hit or miss and require lot of planning and work before comming to Kiev.
I would also recommend trying local clubs particularly like Bacardi which have a mixture of pros and non pros. You may be lucky or may get away with USD 100 for 7/8.
Global Surfer it is a real good explanation. I have feeling that this help not just me but other guys as well who never used before. It is always a little scary to hear last part because you never can be sure what you have inside of you, but o well, you can try to see what is going to happen. I am not going to take it evryday and probably will start with 5 or 10 for a day and see how it going to work.
My question going to be if it is available in Kiev in Farmacy (aptekah) in all sizes? I would asume as anywhere in former USSR without prescription.Cialis for daily use is new formulation and unlikely to be available in small doses in most countries outside US and western europe. Most common Cialis dose is 20 mg. Even 10 is hard to find. You can easily break it and use 10 MG every 36 hours or every other day.
before buying viagra, cial it is necessary to find some good and honest girls. first, it is necessary to find good sex providers about swallow blowjobs, anal sex, anuslingus, [CodeWord103] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord103) etc, and only after men should talk about sexual inhancers. and well (!) , we pay girls to have sex with us, and therefore girls should work to fuck us, and we haven't got tired to fuck her!with all of the above things that you want to do to the nice girls in kiev, has any of them, turned round and told you, 'you are a pain in the ass?
I think they usually reply.
'Give me $500'
'Give me a phone'
'Fuck off'
With all of the above things that you want to do to the Nice girls in Kiev, has any of them, turned round and told you, 'You are a Pain in the Ass?
I'm talking about the quality guys, like Dr Skank who I know is no longer with us.
I was at one of 109's old rental apartments today, circa 2006, a little blast from the past.
.
Acolonizer, is still reading&posting, and Yeah everything Without Condom.
As long as you are having a good time that's all that matters.
$100 for BBBJ and generally whatever else I want (I don't do anything BB). They usually stay until I boot them to make room for the next one. Or I just outright tell them another girl is coming over and they are welcome to stay and join.
Working girls in Kiev used to do BBBJ as part of the standard service up until 2005. I can only assume too many of them started getting STD's. So the whole WG mafia throttled back on that. It's still rather common with semi pros, of course YMMV.
The clubs in Kiev are loaded up with working girls. Of course there aren't anymore 99% environments like River Palace but you shouldn't have a problem finding them. The highest concentration is probably at D'Lux.
I appreciate your view and acknowledgde that I still have a hell of lot to learn about the Kiev P4P-scene. The key word is, you wrote it yourself: expericene, and there's a first time for everything.
The freebie-scene is tempting and I hope to explore it next time around. But most guys on this forum does NOT have unlimited time to hunt for devuschkas whilst in Kiev. As the scene is less straightforward than for instance Germany (no FKK's, no red-light district) one could easily be left with weighing up more expensive options in nightclubs or strip-joints.
The sponsor-girl that you suggest I overpaid for, (attached pic from the photo session she did with with me) stayed 24 hours and gave me a great GFE with BBBJ and CIM (which I believe is rather uncommon amongst working girls in Kiev). What services and length of time are you talking about when you say that you only pay $100?
The 'business managers' are generally taking 50% if not more.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't believe that RIO is willing to "lose" a girl for the rest of the night without getting a cut of the $300. But you're right, she could get by for some time even with $150.
I enjoyed being able to feel her up and interview her at RIO, BEFORE I decided to take her home, something which I sadly couldn't do with the fake Mamba- and Top-Modals-girls.
Theoretically there are no working girls at Shooters, managements bans them.
But I'm bumping into 5-10 semi pros I know every time I go there.
They do get tossed and banned if caught plying their trade.
I have heard from several reports that its a fair club with huge amount of pros and semi pros. Is it true? Can somebody explain whats going on there? In there gallery there is a quit big amount of hot looking girls.
Cialis for daily use is new formulation and unlikely to be available in small doses in most countries outside US and western europe. Most common Cialis dose is 20 mg. Even 10 is hard to find. You can easily break it and use 10 MG every 36 hours or every other day.Thank you Vitrea. So I just will but in Kiev 10-20 and break it.
I tried to use mamba before and it did not work too good for me, so I was about to ignore it but decided to give it one more try.
Just want to inform you guys on my experiment.
Sent messages only to girls who show up on my screen after I pick sex as my intention for meeting on mamba in Kiev.
Sent messages to about 30 girls today. Very simple and straight forward. That I will be in Kiev in near future and want to know how much and how we can meet?
Received several responses. No phones provided immediately. Prices was quoted 4 times. 3 times 600gr. And once 1000.
Several times received response to contact them when I am ready for it.
Will keep you posted. Still not sure because there is so many escort sites with similar prices.
Thought to contact possible amature girls just for dating and fun and possible action but I don't think it worth it at all. Better to do it while in Kiev and meet face to face.
Still not sure because there is so many escort sites with similar prices.
I'm talking about the quality guys, like Dr Skank who I know is no longer with us.
I was at one of 109's old rental apartments today, circa 2006, a little blast from the past.Any ideas where is Old Bez Bezarra?
He did put some life into the Kiev thread.
Might look him up on Collins Ave, Miami, when I head to Fort Lauderdale.
How would I recognize him.
Have Fun In Kiev& learn new tricks.
Most probably the 10&9 you didn't see, were with Liljoey.Do I detect a note of skepticism, Jojosun? The line up at Rio speaks for itself. I am satisfied as to the quality there for my purposes. I have stated clearly in my reports how the options there compare favorably with the other available options. I regard these as objective facts. I have no agenda other than to inform others on how to enjoy the same things I have found pleasing to myself. But to each their own. I am quite picky. But if you feel that the viewpoint of a fellow monger like Acolonizer is more in tune with your own, then feel free to stay away from the Rio club and boink women whose backside looks like the one in the photo Acolonizer just posted recently on this thread.
And rest assured I would never cock block a guy like Acolonizer from getting a beauty at Rio, and quite the opposite I would pay good money to a manager to be seated at the adjoining booth so I could overhear his interview with a typical lovely 19 year old university student recently hired to dance at Rio, as he asked her if she would [CodeWord140] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord140) on him or could he possibly shove his fist way up her ass_LOL. The reaction of the poor young thing would have to be one of those priceless moments. I have been reading his posts complaining about the too high prices, waiting in vain for him to report about an actual negotiation he has conducted and describe the details in "he said, she said" fashion, so maybe I could learn something.
I will be in Kiev soon enough though from March 30 to April 4. I have already set up dates with former and current Rio, Mamba and Top-modals girls and 1 RP girl that I know from prior trips, so my calendar is getting full even before I scope out the line up there.
Theoretically there are no working girls at Shooters, managements bans them.
But I'm bumping into 5-10 semi pros I know every time I go there.
They do get tossed and banned if caught plying their trade.19March should be a good night at Arena Club. Hosting the After party for Eurofashion2012.
Some hot girls heading there.
Ronaldinjo
03-17-12, 00:12
Do I detect a note of skepticism, Jojosun? The line up at Rio speaks for itself. I am satisfied as to the quality there for my purposes. I have stated clearly in my reports how the options there compare favorably with the other available options. I regard these as objective facts. I have no agenda other than to inform others on how to enjoy the same things I have found pleasing to myself. But to each their own. I am quite picky. But if you feel that the viewpoint of a fellow monger like Acolonizer is more in tune with your own, then feel free to stay away from the Rio club and boink women whose backside looks like the one in the photo Acolonizer just posted recently on this thread.
And rest assured I would never cock block a guy like Acolonizer from getting a beauty at Rio, and quite the opposite I would pay good money to a manager to be seated at the adjoining booth so I could overhear his interview with a typical lovely 19 year old university student recently hired to dance at Rio, as he asked her if she would [CodeWord140] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord140) on him or could he possibly shove his fist way up her ass_LOL. The reaction of the poor young thing would have to be one of those priceless moments. I have been reading his posts complaining about the too high prices, waiting in vain for him to report about an actual negotiation he has conducted and describe the details in "he said, she said" fashion, so maybe I could learn something.
I will be in Kiev soon enough though from March 30 to April 4. I have already set up dates with former and current Rio, Mamba and Top-modals girls and 1 RP girl that I know from prior trips, so my calendar is getting full even before I scope out the line up there.Liljoey, how you set up dates with Rio girls? Did you phone them or by the computer (for example skype)? How was the weather in your 2011 April visit in Kiev? Was it hot enough too see mini skirts in the streets or still cold?
Ronaldinjo
03-17-12, 00:17
Theoretically there are no working girls at Shooters, managements bans them.
But I'm bumping into 5-10 semi pros I know every time I go there.
They do get tossed and banned if caught plying their trade.How do I recognise high quality pro in delux or scooters? If you was travelling to Kiev now to bang the best looking girl (real 9-10) and you have only 2-3 days, where are the highest chances in Kiev to find her? Rio, delux, schooters or somewhere else? I know soft rhino have best line up, but sex is not aloud unfortunately. Maybe you know the answer where best girl can be found.
Do I detect a note of skepticism, Jojosun? The line up at Rio speaks for itself. I am satisfied as to the quality there for my purposes. I have stated clearly in my reports how the options there compare favorably with the other available options. I regard these as objective facts. I have no agenda other than to inform others on how to enjoy the same things I have found pleasing to myself. But to each their own. I am quite picky. But if you feel that the viewpoint of a fellow monger like Acolonizer is more in tune with your own, then feel free to stay away from the Rio club and boink women whose backside looks like the one in the photo Acolonizer just posted recently on this thread.
And rest assured I would never cock block a guy like Acolonizer from getting a beauty at Rio, and quite the opposite I would pay good money to a manager to be seated at the adjoining booth so I could overhear his interview with a typical lovely 19 year old university student recently hired to dance at Rio, as he asked her if she would [CodeWord140] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord140) on him or could he possibly shove his fist way up her ass_LOL. The reaction of the poor young thing would have to be one of those priceless moments. I have been reading his posts complaining about the too high prices, waiting in vain for him to report about an actual negotiation he has conducted and describe the details in "he said, she said" fashion, so maybe I could learn something.
I will be in Kiev soon enough though from March 30 to April 4. I have already set up dates with former and current Rio, Mamba and Top-modals girls and 1 RP girl that I know from prior trips, so my calendar is getting full even before I scope out the line up there.Liljoey, what makes you detect a bit of skepticism in my reply to Acolonizer, re (the Reason) for the lack of 10&9 girls on the night of his so called visit to Rio. .
I am a fan of Rio Club, and I usually go there every night when I am in town.
I agree with you about the line up & the convenience of take out, now River Palace is gone.
I tried to talk some of the girls to meet me 4 happy hour during the day, but no joy so far.
Unlike some of the girls at River Palace in the old days.
Its just US$ 300 in one GO, is above my budget for Kiev or anywhere for that matter. I have to budget for a lot of temptations in London during the week as well.
One of them was a 30 stone 220kg Young Black Girl in London, by the name of Zen Fierce, which cost me 120 an hour or nearly US$175 for one hour. Call me a wierdo
Its your money& its your choice. No need to explain why you think its a good deal 4 U at Rio.
Just make sure that you don't pay for sex more than. TEN Times the Price Of a Hair Cut at the Top Hair Dressing Salon in Kiev. See my earlier posts in reply to Asian Chaos re his question How Much to pay for Sex In Kiev.
Now I am toying with the idea of catching a plane to Kiev, if for anything to catch Marcia at Arena Club on Monday night party, in aid of World Water Day. Would love 2 get her wet on the night.
I doubt they are going to have wet tea shirt competitions on the night. Kiev is not Fort Lauderdale of the old days during Spring Break.
http://es-es.facebook.com/pages/MARCIA/7769760772?sk=wall&filter=12
Marcia on her facebook, Eurofashion2012 in Kiev.
RomanyStar
03-17-12, 04:42
After 14 hours of deep sleep I woke anxious for today's action. I had a 60+ message contact from Mamba due at 2PM. No call. No Mamba response. Why did she bother with all those messages?
By 2:30 I decided to roll the dice. Went back to Mamba and searched for currently online talent. Sent a half dozen messages and got a couple quick responses. Mostly stating $100 / hr. Called one and smelled a pimp. Then got a response that said $150/2-3 hours from a 27yo MILF that swore her pics were real. She showed up in 30 minutes and I bet the pics were shot last month. Talked for awhile, and moved off to the bedroom. Very nice round one, all covered, but DFK and real decent skills. We showered talked awhile and I thought she would move on. Wrong there. After a glass of fruit juice and some more conversation she led me back to the bedroom. I tried to explain that my recovery time was a little more than the 45 minutes that we had talked, but she wasn't having any of that. After a LONG session, and a thoroughly explosive finish it was back to the shower. She still wasn't making any moves to get dressed! We talked some more. We grazed on the goodies in the fridge. Listened to music and acted like teen lovers. Total GFE except for the condoms. She finally left at 9:30. With the hefty tip I ended up paying $200 for nearly six hours with this great lady. Can't get rates like that on the streets in Tijuana. If it weren't for my absolute NEVER repeat policy I know what the next three days would be spent doing. Total jackpot experience.
Since my body is 10 time zones off from Kiev, I'm real wide awake at 10PM, so I figured despite being thoroughly wrung out it was time to explore the club scene. First stop Rio. Now it may have been an off night, or maybe I was on the wrong floor, but I sat there through the entire lineup, a couple times. Two and a half hours and I had two on my list as dooable. I like slender, and most of these girls have tummies. I counted a couple real 3's, plenty of four-sixes, a couple sevens, and one eight. Maybe my standards are high, maybe an off night. My regular stomping ground is Hong Kong Club in Tijuana and I have to say this place is lame by comparison. What's with a strip club without nudity? Might as well have been in California. I sat with one of the real cuties through a couple drinks, we'd had nice eye contact while she danced through the couple sets I watched. We had great conversation, she wants to be a model. Took her off for a private dance, which was hot. Finally the bottoms came off, but in a pretty dark booth. Thought I might as well see if I could set something up for tomorrow. Not happening. She "never" leaves the club. Now I'm not bad looking, well dressed, well spoken, and I don't stink, so I was a bit miffed but figured I had picked the wrong girl. Sat back down, and my number two candidate was just getting on stage. Didn't invest in the drinks this time, but went for two REAL hot dances. Popped the question, and got the same damn line. OK a long time ago I learned that strippers get a kick out of teasing, and a good WG likes to see her customer satisfied. This is not the place for me.
I moved on to Shooters. Some times a situation just makes me feel like an old pervert, and this was one of them. If there was anyone in that room within 15 years of my age I sure didn't see them. Did a quick exit and moved on to Buddha. I felt more at home, my slacks and sports jacket weren't glaringly out of place. There were some amazing looking women, so I decided to suck up another sparkling water and see what would turn up. Didn't take long and I was asked if I would like to buy a drink. She was a solid 8. 5, natural blond, blue eyed EU classic. Conversation quickly came to the $500 / hr point. Best laugh I've had in weeks. Sure glad I was still feeling far from needy though, damn she was hot looking.
I'd go to the prime tourist spots. D'Lux and Buddha Bar. I think you are likely to find jaded pro's at Buddha Bar working the clueless foreingers and more likely to find some semi pros at D'Lux having a fun night out.
Haven't been to Rio in 4 years so I can't advise on the talent there.
There are also super hotties on mamba but you have to know what you are looking for and of course YMMV. Any time a girl replies to your 'privet! Kak dela' with services and rates you just came upon an agency. It's not a bad thing but your chances of having the girl in the photo sent to your door are about 20% at best.
How do I recognise high quality pro in delux or scooters? If you was travelling to Kiev now to bang the best looking girl (real 9-10) and you have only 2-3 days, where are the highest chances in Kiev to find her? Rio, delux, schooters or somewhere else? I know soft rhino have best line up, but sex is not aloud unfortunately. Maybe you know the answer where best girl can be found.
Romany, I got your PM. I'm generally not interested in meeting people from ISG but if you run into problems let me know, maybe I can help.
Having girls on mamba flake out on you is to be expected. Chat up and get phone numbers from 10 and expect to meet one, maybe two. If you really really really want to meet a girl from mamba and she gives you her phone number, call her. That is the 100% way of letting her know you are really interested in her. The hot girls are used to getting a bazillion messages and a lot of sms's everyday.
The girls have a lot of options. Meeting a 50 year old sexpat might seem more interesting at 0200 when you are chatting with her on mamba and you are in the US than it is in the reality of 14:00 when you are message / sms / calling her when you are actually in Kiev. Luckily there are a bazillion hot girls in Kiev, some actually wanting to meet a 50 year old American sexpat. Keep trying.
After 14 hours of deep sleep I woke anxious for today's action. I had a 60+ message contact from Mamba due at 2PM. No call. No Mamba response. Why did she bother with all those messages?
Great to have you back. Where have you been the past year or two?
Likewise, whatever happened to Dr Skank or Bez Bezarra and some of the other old school?
Colon still turns up once in a while though with the same old same old LOL
The quality of posting here and my interested seemed to go down at the same time.
I am guessing Skank decided to go Legit and / or found a long term gf / wife. You also have to remember Skank has been living this since 2000 or the late 90's. Even unlimited hot slavic girls gets old after a while. Like anything it will get repetitive and boring. Or he just got bored of ISG. I do miss the Superbowl Ho Downs with him, we did it four or five years.
I think Bez left after Jackson gave him a hard time about something.
Great to have you back. Where have you been the past year or two?
Likewise, whatever happened to Dr Skank and some of the other old school?
Colon still turns up once in a while though with the same old same old LOL
Liljoey, what makes you detect a bit of skepticism in my reply to Acolonizer, re (the Reason) for the lack of 10&9 girls on the night of his so called visit to Rio? .
I am a fan of Rio Club, and I usually go there every night when I am in town.
I agree with you about the line up & the convenience of take out, now River Palace is gone..
But if I were to agree 100% with you on Rio Club, We'd both be Wrong.
Great to have you back. Where have you been the past year or two?
Likewise, whatever happened to Dr Skank or Bez Bezarra and some of the other old school?
Colon still turns up once in a while though with the same old same old LOLSay what you like about Aclonizer's posts, but at least he is still posting under the same username.
But I suspect some members of the old school, have been Reincarnated under New Names. 4 whatever Reason.
BTW, where is Borat 69, AsianChaos.
With all of the above things that you want to do to the Nice girls in Kiev, has any of them, turned round and told you, 'You are a Pain in the Ass?.
But of course, if you can Stand Her Shit. You won't be a Pain in her Ass.
Actually it's Cafe Touch, the old Decedance, not Arena.
Don't want you going to the wrong place. .
Now I am toying with the idea of catching a plane to Kiev, if for anything to catch Marcia at Arena Club on Monday night party, in aid of World Water Day. Would love 2 get her wet on the night.
I doubt they are going to have wet tea shirt competitions on the night. Kiev is not Fort Lauderdale of the old days during Spring Break.
http://es-es.facebook.com/pages/MARCIA/7769760772?sk=wall&filter=12
Marcia on her facebook, Eurofashion2012 in Kiev.
RomanyStar
03-17-12, 15:07
Romany, I got your PM. I'm generally not interested in meeting people from ISG but if you run into problems let me know, maybe I can help.Thanks for all your posts, and the offer. Never would have picked up on the last minute use of Mambo for those online without one from you from a couple years back. I'm a 99% solo mongerer, I've found it hard to match styles. So far all is going about as I had suspected it would, not as easy a destination as some, but amazing women. If I haven't scored that perfect Euro Babe by Monday I'll just head back to Budha and drop the rest of my wallet in her lap.
AColonizer
03-17-12, 15:46
My best prostitutes were a Romanian, an Ukrainian and a Moldavian. This statistics can be apply to any other prostitutes and piggish girls. All of them drank thousands cumshots and had hundrends of creampies by unknown strangers of any age and any ethnics and any hygiene in their 8-years carrier. They had care of themselves enough. Now they are living in good health much more than a lot of regular girls. That was not just luck because millions of prostitutes work (and live) at the same way and there are no epidemics of STD in the world.
The official science is politically correct, in fact also the official science is a disguised mean of mass persuasion (at the same way of religions, politics, economies, schools, televisions, mafias, parties, etc.)
The spread of HIV is for 90% because of infected syringes, and because of American pharmaceutical companies want to sell their anti-HIV medecins to prohibitive prices to African countries (that have even no water supplies).
Moreover if you think criminals mind something about their customers, then also you believe parliamentary lobbies mind something about their voters.
At the last, I never fucked so much as the last week at reasonable prices and I didn't pick any girls from mentioned places here.
N. B. For your information, a true monger can get a real deepthroat swallow blowjob for 20/30 euros in Italy. I am sure it is the same in all Western countries. Why should men pay more?
As long as you are having a good time that's all that matters.
$100 for BBBJ and generally whatever else I want (I don't do anything BB). They usually stay until I boot them to make room for the next one. Or I just outright tell them another girl is coming over and they are welcome to stay and join.
Working girls in Kiev used to do BBBJ as part of the standard service up until 2005. I can only assume too many of them started getting STD's. So the whole WG mafia throttled back on that. It's still rather common with semi pros, of course YMMV.
The clubs in Kiev are loaded up with working girls. Of course there aren't anymore 99% environments like River Palace but you shouldn't have a problem finding them. The highest concentration is probably at D'Lux.
I avoid Buddha Bar like the plague.
The bar and the girls (even the freebies (?) are waaaaaay too pretentious for my tastes. The decor is somewhat amusing (in that trying too hard way but not quite getting it) and I find the food average and very overpriced. I find it amusing that girls and some guys view this as some kind of ultra swanky place. It's just a flash place for people who think they have something to flash.
OK Bar is where the local juice used to like to go, haven't been there is a year so I don't know if it's still trendy.
Anyone been to Beef? Or is it called Meat? That place across from Decedance? It looks interesting but I don't know if it's all flash.
Thanks for all your posts, and the offer. Never would have picked up on the last minute use of Mambo for those online without one from you from a couple years back. I'm a 99% solo mongerer, I've found it hard to match styles. So far all is going about as I had suspected it would, not as easy a destination as some, but amazing women. If I haven't scored that perfect Euro Babe by Monday I'll just head back to Budha and drop the rest of my wallet in her lap.
The quality of posting here and my interested seemed to go down at the same time.I couldn't agree with you more CD. This constant blather about Rio and other strip clubs is almost as boring and repetitive as Colon's constant diarrhea.
All of that combined to make me lose interest in this forum plus I have been spending a lot of time in the Middle East.
The good news is that in a short time I come back to open a new business in Kiev with travel to Moscow, SP, plus other CIS places in addition to Warsaw, Prague, Budapest and all the other EE cities. This will be definitely be a dream job.
And I do miss Bez and his unique approach to mongering and posting.
Me too and probably for the same reason, with the world economy in the toilet the USG was (unfortunately) throwing a lot of money around in the Middle East (down the toilet). Probably more money than most country's GDP.
I miss Bez too.
It is kind of funny reading about RIO and GIA. It's like reading a review of the McD on Khreshatic. Rio was awesome before 2006, it's way overplayed now. GIA was over in what. 2002?
I'm in Kiev until 3 April if you want to grab lunch? I won't make you go to Friday's this time.
I'm waiting for my 18:00 to show up. My apartment is right across the street from the Lva Tolstoy metro. I told her to call me when she gets there, then I'll go out and met her.
All of that combined to make me lose interest in this forum plus I have been spending a lot of time in the Middle East.
And I do miss Bez and his unique approach to mongering and posting.
Me too and probably for the same reason, with the world economy in the toilet the USG was (unfortunately) throwing a lot of money around in the Middle East (down the toilet). Probably more money than most country's GDP.
I miss Bez too.
It is kind of funny reading about RIO and GIA. It's like reading a review of the McD on Khreshatic. Rio was awesome before 2006, it's way overplayed now. GIA was over in what. 2002?
I'm in Kiev until 3 April if you want to grab lunch? I won't make you go to Friday's this time.
I'm waiting for my 18:00 to show up. My apartment is right across the street from the Lva Tolstoy metro. I told her to call me when she gets there, then I'll go out and met her.Sorry, CD, right now I am away from Kiev until, and unfortunately, just before that Euro-2012 starts. I'll take a raincheck on that lunch when you get back the next time, my treat.
I recently took a look at Gia prices and was astounded by their typical Ukrainian greed. Way way overpriced for what seems to be très ordinaire quality if you can call it "quality." There is so much better out there and these guys come in for lap dances and astronomically priced village girls.
Hey, enjoy your time there. I can't wait to be back, just counting the days. PM me if you want.
Actually it's Cafe Touch, the old Decedance, not Arena.
Don't want you going to the wrong place.Going by their site www.arena-kiiev/ukraine-.
I got the following EuroFashion. 2012.
March 19 at Arena Dance Club will be the official after-party EuroFashion. 2012 in support of World Water Day! .
A lot of wannabe models& Fashion students going to be around, so I hear.
Actually it's Cafe Touch, the old Decedance, not Arena.
Don't want you going to the wrong place. .Going by their site www.arena-kiiev/ukraine-.
I got the following EuroFashion. 2012.
March 19 at Arena Dance Club will be the official after-party EuroFashion. 2012 in support of World Water Day! .
A lot of wannabe models& Fashion students going to be around, so I hear.
Here you go, going by this.
http://www.arena-kiev.com/
plus I have been spending a lot of time in the Middle East.
The good news is that in a short time I come back to open a new business in Kiev with travel to Moscow, SP, plus other CIS places in addition to Warsaw, Prague, Budapest and all the other EE cities. This will be definitely be a dream job.
And I do miss Bez and his unique approach to mongering and posting..
Good to hear from you again OLD BOY. .
Hope you haven't been laying the ground for another Cockup in the Middle East, like the way the US&Uk handed on a plate Iraq to the Fucking Mullahs of Iran &their cronies.
I owe my initial success in Kiev 2 you, Old Chap. Remember.
(Read Borat 69 reports&do exactly as he says.). Being a Rebel with many causes, I did it my way &saved a lot of money. DIY excercises in KIEV mongering is best, if you have the time, that's what I say. .
I agree with you &CD about Buddha Bar, overpriced& overrated.
US$500 for a girl there is daylight robbery.
Another Thank You goes out to (Irish Lad) for explaining 2 me at the time, what Sponsoring was all about. I thought it was all a code for straight forward Prostitution.
I thought at the time, that my Mamba girl from Donetsk was another WG, But Irish Lad thought otherwise. And he was right.
Now I have relegated her to the Status of my Private Friend with Benefits. Best for Refferrals 2 other girls in Kiev, FOR MY OWN USE ONLY.
I have 2 state this, because I Don't want another JOE POSTER from a far away corner getting ideas &, start 2 pm me for short cut to Pussies In Kiev
Member #4274
03-17-12, 18:42
And I could not agree with you more! Kiev is one of my favorite cities in Europe and the mongering there is still quite good. However, the ridiculous amount of posts about Rio, which is 1 percent of what Kiev has to offer, is depressing and boorish. I rarely even look at the Kiev posts anymore due to the lack of interesting and useful content.
The poster you linked to on Facebook had Touch Cafe. Maybe it changed to a bigger venue like Arena when they sold more tickets.
Going by their site.
www.arena-kiiev/ukraine-.
I got the following EuroFashion. 2012.
March 19 at Arena Dance Club will be the official after-party EuroFashion. 2012 in support of World Water Day! .
A lot of wannabe models& Fashion students going to be around, so I hear.
liljoey, what makes you detect a bit of skepticism in my reply to acolonizer, re (the reason) for the lack of 10&9 girls on the night of his so called visit to rio. .
i am a fan of rio club, and i usually go there every night when i am in town.
i agree with you about the line up & the convenience of take out, now river palace is gone.
i tried to talk some of the girls to meet me 4 happy hour during the day, but no joy so far.
unlike some of the girls at river palace in the old days.
its just us$ 300 in one go, is above my budget for kiev or anywhere for that matter. i have to budget for a lot of temptations in london during the week as well.
one of them was a 30 stone 220kg young black girl in london, by the name of zen fierce, which cost me 120 an hour or nearly us$175 for one hour. call me a wierdo
its your money& its your choice. no need to explain why you think its a good deal 4 u at rio.
just make sure that you don't pay for sex more than. ten times the price of a hair cut at the top hair dressing salon in kiev. see my earlier posts in reply to asian chaos re his question how much to pay for sex in kiev.
now i am toying with the idea of catching a plane to kiev, if for anything to catch marcia at arena club on monday night party, in aid of world water day. would love 2 get her wet on the night.
i doubt they are going to have wet tea shirt competitions on the night. kiev is not fort lauderdale of the old days during spring break.
http://es-es.facebook.com/pages/marcia/7769760772?sk=wall&filter=12
marcia on her facebook, eurofashion2012 in kiev.the way i read your post, i thought you were trying to imply that the existence of girls on the beauty level of 9's or 10's at rio was only in my head.
normally i simply don't react to ad hominem comments by guys anxious to get into it with me, because truly my only interest insofar as this thread is concerned, is to file reports aout my own experiences during mongering trips in a way that i hope is entertaining and at the same time informative, and in between my own trips to also preserve a source of accurate information so that newbies have something reliable to refer to. so you appeared to be agreeing with acolonizer's sour grapes report on rio's offerings, and accuracy required a response. i felt that newbies were capable enough of understanding acolonizer's special viewpoint by reading his posts, so i didn't feel the need to respond. however, you have more mainstream credibility, and thus my reply.
looks at rio:
for the record, i have always stated there were also many girls at rio of average looks, and i simply filter them out of my observations and ignore them. i have furthermore stated that there are a fair number of 7's and 8's, and since i am picky, even factoring in the differences in tastes between guys, i am including in this category only girls who i thought would be considered doable by the vast majority of men.
i have also stated that most times i have visited rio, there were a not insignificant number of girls there whom most men would consider 9's, and even a few 10's. i realize that not all men can agree on what should be considered a 10. therefore, i considered it more useful to comment on the availability at rio of girls who were 8's and 9's. and i feel that without exaggeration in the least, there are definitely girls at rio, that most guys would agree were in the 8 to 9 range.
so when a guy reports he only saw average looking girls at rio, he is either far more picky than the majority of men, or more likely he is exaggerating because he has an agenda to do so.
it really doesn't matter in the end, because all any newbie needs to do is walk into the club when they finally visit kiev and circulate to the different bars there in order to see the truth about the line up at rio.
i almost always find girls at rio to bring home who are far more beautiful than the hottest fkk girls i have fucked in my jaunts through fkk-land. that should tell any monger who is an fkk man something.
costs at rio:
rio's $300 for three hours equals $100 per hour rate.
rio's $400 for the whole night, if the "night" consists of, let's say 6 usable "sex time" hours, assuming you can leave the rio club by 10pm and have until 5am, the club's closing time, and subtracting an hour from the "sex time" for getting the girl home and chatting a bit and taking showers, would be a rate of $66 / hr ($400/6hours) , a very low rate, hard to beat in most places in the world with a girl of equivalent beauty.
websites:
i have stated numerous times for the record that i advocate using websites like mamba. ru and top-modals. com and other websites either (1) during daytime hours when clubs are closed, or (2) when for budgetary reasons a monger wants to cap the total p4p cost at $100 / hour or less and only wants one hour and doesn't need multiple hour dates. for example, most of my mamba. ru contacts for my upcoming trip to kiev are asking 500 uah or 600 uah. 600 uah is only $75 usd per hour.
now, i don't know what these internet girls look like and i won't know until they show up at my doorstep, because the website pics are usually fakes. so if they don't look good enough i will have to send them away and start again, with lots of time wasted, and in the end there is no guarantee that i can get a girl this way on a level of an 8 or a 9. but there is a possibility. however, most probably guys working this method will take the first "doable" girl who shows up, who may be a 6 or a 7, because why not? look at the freakin' low price for this good pussy!
and sometimes guys doing this website method are lucky and an 8 or maybe even rarer occurence, a 9 shows up, and then these guys are deliriously happy and write stuff on the thread like "this is my personal working girl, so don't pm me for the number". who can blame them. do you think they want to call up their personal working girl next time, only to find that because of her popularity with the rest of the isg membership, she is now overbooked and no longer available to him.
also, it is possible to get multiple hour or all night sessions from these internet website girls for very low rates as well.
but the caveat with using the fake picture websites, is that the significant possibility exists that if you only go this route, you may not get any 8's or 9's at all on your kiev trip. if you can be happy with that outcome, good. but if that would be an unacceptable outcome for your kiev trip, then you must do something else to try to guarantee you nail at least some 8's or 9's while you visit kiev.
nightclubs:
the advantage of the nightclubs (places like shooters, arena, d'lux, avalon) which are legitimate discoteque dance clubs where mostly regular normal people go, but to which some girls interested in p4p also go, is that if you manage to figure out which girls are wg's or semi pros interested in p4p, you will probably be asked for very high rates, much higher than the rates asked at rio strip club. although sometimes the rate can be negotiated downward the later it gets and the smaller the potential client base. the environment is fun and normal and many guys prefer chasing girls in a nightclub atmosphere where they can also try for freebies. now in a place like kiev you are guaranteed to see girls in the nightclubs who are 9's and even 10's. but what you are not guaranteed is that any of them will end up in your bed as a freebie or for p4p at $100 / hr or less. if you are looking for a guarantee that you will get an 8 or 9 beauty in your bed during your kiev visit, then this is not the basket to put all your eggs in. although you should do it at least some nights purely for the fun factor on an extended kiev visit, and for the chance tha you may get lucky.
streets / shopping malls:
this is another fruitful way to meet girls during daytime who you can see in advance are very pretty and try for freebies or possibly semi pro p4p. but no guarantees. and the outcomes depend entirely on your mongering skills and charm.
After 14 hours of deep sleep I woke anxious for today's action. I had a 60+ message contact from Mamba due at 2PM. No call. No Mamba response. Why did she bother with all those messages?
By 2:30 I decided to roll the dice. Went back to Mamba and searched for currently online talent. Sent a half dozen messages and got a couple quick responses. Mostly stating $100 / hr. Called one and smelled a pimp. Then got a response that said $150/2-3 hours from a 27yo MILF that swore her pics were real. She showed up in 30 minutes and I bet the pics were shot last month. Talked for awhile, and moved off to the bedroom. Very nice round one, all covered, but DFK and real decent skills. We showered talked awhile and I thought she would move on. Wrong there. After a glass of fruit juice and some more conversation she led me back to the bedroom. I tried to explain that my recovery time was a little more than the 45 minutes that we had talked, but she wasn't having any of that. After a LONG session, and a thoroughly explosive finish it was back to the shower. She still wasn't making any moves to get dressed! We talked some more. We grazed on the goodies in the fridge. Listened to music and acted like teen lovers. Total GFE except for the condoms. She finally left at 9:30. With the hefty tip I ended up paying $200 for nearly six hours with this great lady. Can't get rates like that on the streets in Tijuana. If it weren't for my absolute NEVER repeat policy I know what the next three days would be spent doing. Total jackpot experience.The foregoing is a perfect example of what is possible to end up with using the websites such as Mamba. Ru or others. You may waste a lot of time. But you may hit the jackpot. It is definitely worth pursuing this mongering route in Kiev during the daytime when nightclubs are closed, or when one seeks lower cost p4p options due to budget idsues.
LJ.
Since my body is 10 time zones off from Kiev, I'm real wide awake at 10PM, so I figured despite being thoroughly wrung out it was time to explore the club scene. First stop Rio. Now it may have been an off night, or maybe I was on the wrong floor, but I sat there through the entire lineup, a couple times. Two and a half hours and I had two on my list as dooable. I like slender, and most of these girls have tummies. I counted a couple real 3's, plenty of four-sixes, a couple sevens, and one eight. Maybe my standards are high, maybe an off night. My regular stomping ground is Hong Kong Club in Tijuana and I have to say this place is lame by comparison. What's with a strip club without nudity? Might as well have been in California. I sat with one of the real cuties through a couple drinks, we'd had nice eye contact while she danced through the couple sets I watched. We had great conversation, she wants to be a model. Took her off for a private dance, which was hot. Finally the bottoms came off, but in a pretty dark booth. Thought I might as well see if I could set something up for tomorrow. Not happening. She "never" leaves the club. Now I'm not bad looking, well dressed, well spoken, and I don't stink, so I was a bit miffed but figured I had picked the wrong girl. Sat back down, and my number two candidate was just getting on stage. Didn't invest in the drinks this time, but went for two REAL hot dances. Popped the question, and got the same damn line. OK a long time ago I learned that strippers get a kick out of teasing, and a good WG likes to see her customer satisfied. This is not the place for me.Your Rio experience was sub-standard, chiefly because you failed to follow specific advice on methodology I had written about in detail in prior posts. I have more than once been stymied by a rather lame line up in one of the four seating areas / bars located within the Rio club. But knowing that two other completely different line ups are dancing in the club simply means you have to move and go to another bar area and room when you don't see what you like in the area you are first seated. For example, if you are first seated in the upstairs outer room as generally happens to a newcomer on a crowded night, and you know from my reports that this is the same line up that is dancing in the upstairs inner room, if you don't see anything good enough in a reasonable enough time (maybe one sit thru of the line up) , then you must ask to change location and be seated either in the downstairs room or the VIP room (each with different line ups). In order for this to happen, and happen soon, you should have already tipped the manager properly. 100 UAH seems to do the trick. The 2nd thing that could have increased your chances of a score, is to ask the manager you tipped about any girl of interest and whether she is dancer only or does she go out with customers. He can usually tell you, if she's been there a while, and you can save yourself from private dances with girls who don't go out with customers, and the manager could have pointed you toward girls who do go out for you to consider. I usually ask managers just three questions about interesting looking girls I see on stage, the name (which I put into a memo along w some descriptive comments about her, so I can ask for her to be brought to me later if I want) , and whether the girl speaks English and whether she goes out. But since I don't always have the attention of the manager or don't want to incessantly bother him, I also get up from the table and approach girls while they are dancing and ask them their names and give them a complement or maybe a tip (50 UAH) if I'm really interested in her. I also can invite her to my table directly and don't need to ask the manager to do the inviting. We don't want to be wasting time. Time is pussy in Kiev.
I moved on to Shooters. Some times a situation just makes me feel like an old pervert, and this was one of them. If there was anyone in that room within 15 years of my age I sure didn't see them. Did a quick exit and moved on to Buddha. I felt more at home, my slacks and sports jacket weren't glaringly out of place. There were some amazing looking women, so I decided to suck up another sparkling water and see what would turn up. Didn't take long and I was asked if I would like to buy a drink. She was a solid 8. 5, natural blond, blue eyed EU classic. Conversation quickly came to the $500 / hr point. Best laugh I've had in weeks. Sure glad I was still feeling far from needy though, damn she was hot looking.Did you try to negotiate her $500 down to $300 or lower? Its sometimes possible, as has been reported
Horny Monger
03-18-12, 02:11
.
In 1996 the Hryvnia was introduced, and it was 1. 83UAH to the US$.
In April 2005 it was pegged at 5. 05 UAH to the US$. .
I did Prague, Warsaw, Budapest, Sofia, Zagreb, Belgrade in the late 1980s, before the Berlin Wall came down. It was as cheap as Chips, didn't need to pay a Dime in Prague, Warsaw or Budapest. But then again I was in my 20s, I had youth on my side and with a Western Regesiterd car, I was a bit of Novelty then in those places.
But even then I used to see German mongers who were in their 40s being approached only by WGS in Tourist Clubs in Prague, civvy girls were just not interested in them.
Kiev became a viable cheap mongering destination for me in late 2008, 2009 (8+Uah to the US$) , with the depreciation of the UAH and the Cheap flights on Wizzair from London.
Without those 2 Factors, I wouldn't have considered Kiev as a Mongering Place, because it wasn't cost effective for me. And honsetly with what I got In Kiev & Minsk later on, I don't think I missed out on earlier years.
The only time a girl cost me more than US$ 100 in Kiev, was a girl that I exchanged more 40 messages with her, before she agreed to come from Donetsk to see me In Kiev. And she wasn't a Pro.When it was 36 CZK to a $, I went to Prague and was able to get BBBJ, CIM, DFK, etc and sometimes overnight stay with a tall beautiful 20 year old Slovakian blond for 1000 CZK = $30. It was a steal, I thought. And later she went to work with the nick name Karen (maybe some of you knew her) in K5 Relax Club, which charged 3900 CZK an hour without extras and an entry fee of 500 CZK. The same year, I ate prime filet Mignon at a French restaurant for $10.
Horny Monger
03-18-12, 02:44
When there was a less important event in Kiev like the Eurovision song contest in 2005 it was an earth quake : prices rised up and it took months and months to go back to normal situation. So I guess this time it might be just worse, as Euro 2012 will last for 1 month and not only for a few days and many more people are expected to visit Ukraine.From what I can see, prices for accommodation have already sky-rocketed three to five fold depending on the establishment, and even then lots of places, especially the budget types, are fully-booked during the EURO 2012 with these elevated prices.
Horny Monger
03-18-12, 02:51
Yes Liljoey, brazil indeed is great destination, and from what I have heard, pros there are really stunners. In comparison to eastern europe, where 10/10 pros are big rarity, in brazil it is quite common, and chicks there are less money oriented, if they really like you, compared to europe girls. But its all about rumors, you need to go and see. But be carefull buddy, don't go alone, brazil can be dangerouse place.
As for chzechs, there are a lot of beauties in prague, but the persentage of beautifull faces is more common in Kiev, but maybe I need one more visit to clarify this. But anyway, Czech chicks are hot. Liljoey, you say that there is possibility for hot privat girls in internet escort agencies. Is it as relible as mamba or something else?
Its pity I didn't visit Rio kind places in moscow, but privat houses (with very nice girls) Nile Copenhages says there are a lot of hot chicks over there (and moscow is huge huge city) in places similar to Rio, and you can bang them in the place. Would like to know how it is in comparison to Rio in Kiev. All in all there is huge number of beautiful chicks in moscow and especially in st. Peter, although girls in Kiev have little bit prettier faces on my mind. But Russian matrioshkas are very nice either, especially in peter, very kind hearted girls. Big Russian heart.Yeah, there are lots of beauties in Prague. Percentage of beautiful faces maybe more common in Kiev, but higher percentage of Prague girls have killer bodies.
Horny Monger
03-18-12, 03:00
So far most of the attention here was paid to girls prices. But the accommodation capacity in Ukraine is not as large as such an important event might require, so I heard rumours of families that are planning to move out to rent the flat where they live for 3-4 times the average monthly rent to rental agencies that will accommodate there the Eurocup fans for outrageous daily rates.It's not a rumor, it's a fact that accommodation prices have already went up several times during Euro 2012.
Even airfare prices are high during this period.
Horny Monger
03-18-12, 03:05
Just read a few posts here. I think Liljoes posts are very good. I like the way you think in many aspects.
However I do have a bit of a hard time to accept $ 400. 500 for a night. Something is too high about the prices in Kiev. Perhaps some people are ready to pay that.
With the risk of sounding like a bitter looser without cash I am pretty sure you can find hot girls on internet sites for a better deal. Perhaps I am wrong? I am not so used to the Kiev scene though. Been in Ukraine 3 times only and planning to come in early April to Donetsk.
I am hunting on mamba and there are plenty girls. Some ok, and some are not. However prices are much less. If this indeed is the market I am very surprised hunters go to Kiev for P4P. I understand though, if hunters go for amatuers after having invested some time to find girls.
I agree that to see the "meat" dance and talk to them helps, however it is still too much money.
As have been written, with these "market" prices I would perfer to go to a FKK club in Germany. Probably, or most likely would be more sex for the dollars.
Cheers and thanks.
/FelixAgree, Felix. FKK is the best bang for your buck!
Cheers.
I think they usually reply.
'Fuck off, Acolonizer'To which I can only say:
Fair play to them...
HunterDave
03-18-12, 04:22
So it is nice relaxing place with cute girls and some action but no sex. Thank you Sponsor74. I may consider for relaxation and experience because their prices look reasonable.Red,
No sex just erotic happy ending, but good massage.
Hunter
STREETS / SHOPPING MALLS:
This is another fruitful way to meet girls during daytime who you can see in advance are very pretty and try for freebies or possibly semi pro p4p. But no guarantees. And the outcomes depend entirely on your mongering skills and charm.Joey, listen, before you send guys in the wrong direction, you should at least ensure that they know what the absolute minimum requirements are for such an expedition, day, night or otherwise.
Unless the hunting is done on Khreshchatik or in the immediate vicinity, success in this endeavor will be close to zero unless you can converse in at least intermediate Russian. Ordinary girls or store clerks have almost zero knowledge of any other foreign language. Only if there is some unexpected chemistry, despite the language issue, will anyone reading this forum have any real chance of success and that will be very rare.
If your Russian language skills are above average and you have the charm and the balls to cruise the malls and fast foods for possible conquests, then I say go for it. Some of my best times have been with ladies I have gotten to know from "over the counter" but only because I speak the lingo very well.
HunterDave
03-18-12, 04:44
Me too and probably for the same reason, with the world economy in the toilet the USG was (unfortunately) throwing a lot of money around in the Middle East (down the toilet). Probably more money than most country's GDP.
I miss Bez too.
It is kind of funny reading about RIO and GIA. It's like reading a review of the McD on Khreshatic. Rio was awesome before 2006, it's way overplayed now. GIA was over in what. 2002?
I'm in Kiev until 3 April if you want to grab lunch? I won't make you go to Friday's this time.
I'm waiting for my 18:00 to show up. My apartment is right across the street from the Lva Tolstoy metro. I told her to call me when she gets there, then I'll go out and met her.CD,
Glad to hear from you on ISG. I will be back in Kiev last week of March and hope we can meet for a drink. I think I owe you from our last time.
HD
LOOKS at Rio:Joey, for you a 10 in Rio could be a 3 for me or a 6 for someone else. Unless you are shilling for Rio, it would be best to lay off the 1-10 system. You found a girl you liked, great. Tell us about it but don't start telling us that she was a raving beauty that others would not necessarily agree with your assessment.
I must confess, like Cruiser, I have not been there in ages and so I do not know the current level of talent. However, again, like Cruiser, I agree that it was far better 10 years ago than they are now.
That said, when I return I will definitely come by one night and just see for myself how it now compares to the "great old days."
I think they usually reply.
'Fuck yourself with your own fist Acolonizer'VG, I think you were just off a tad.
.
Good to hear from you again OLD BOY. .
Hope you haven't been laying the ground for another Cockup in the Middle East, like the way the US&Uk handed on a plate Iraq to the Fucking Mullahs of Iran &their cronies.
I owe my initial success in Kiev 2 you, Old Chap. Remember.
(Read Borat 69 reports&do exactly as he says.). Being a Rebel with many causes, I did it my way &saved a lot of money. DIY excercises in KIEV mongering is best, if you have the time, that's what I say. .
I agree with you &CD about Buddha Bar, overpriced& overrated.
US$500 for a girl there is daylight robbery.
Another Thank You goes out to (Irish Lad) for explaining 2 me at the time, what Sponsoring was all about. I thought it was all a code for straight forward Prostitution.
I thought at the time, that my Mamba girl from Donetsk was another WG, But Irish Lad thought otherwise. And he was right.
Now I have relegated her to the Status of my Private Friend with Benefits. Best for Refferrals 2 other girls in Kiev, FOR MY OWN USE ONLY.
I have 2 state this, because I Don't want another JOE POSTER from a far away corner getting ideas &, start 2 pm me for short cut to Pussies In KievHow are you Jo? I see you are keeping busy.
You have learned the right way that the real scene is neither Rio nor Gia or even Buddha or Shooters. That is for those who do not want to practice real monger skills or who do not have them and then must utilize the very easy and the most expensive route to paid bliss. Nothing wrong with this, it is just a matter of choice and / or convenience. In Kiev and generally in Ukraine, this easy route covers only about 1 percent of available ladies. I and others prefer and enjoy the other 99 percent. More opportunity, higher quality, lower price.
VG, I think you were just off a tad.UB, my apologies and thank you for the clarification.
Your humble servant, VG. :)
RomanyStar
03-18-12, 07:40
Started the beautiful sunny day walking up and down Khreshchatyk admiring the fine city and it's occupants. The only thing that at all resembled a pick up opportunity was a nicely put together 40 something that struck up a conversation in English. Not the demographic I'm looking for for short term.
Thanks to Sevenup for a lead to Dolly Massage. Hard to find, I've added it to the map, but I'd still call for directions. The manager had to walk out into the street to help me. They give a lineup, so you get to pick from the available girls. The model level body Euro chic that I came to Kiev in hopes of finding, was standing in front of me! Unfortunately, like their site says, no touching down below, and the menu is limited to hand release.
All the Mambo messaging paid off with a fine freebie last night. The search I was using was for those looking for sponsorship, but not sex for money. Not group sex and not one night stand. This gal advertised with one photo (real) , said she was 25 (I'd add 3-4) , and wanted correspondence. We wrote on and off Mambo for six weeks. All she ever asked for was a nice dinner and red wine. Worked out well. So far. Nice dinner, decent wine, nicer night, and a rock your world morning. She just left, with the 200Gr I insisted she take for the cab. Now my only concern is if I'm going to be able to avoid investing any more time while here.
Hope I'm not boring the regulars with this drivel. I'm trying to show those coming to Kiev for the first time what my results were from what I learned on the board and elsewhere.
LJ, I DID read the board. I did tip the manager. I did duck my head in downstairs for one last OJ before leaving. I don't carry a notebook. I have been going to strip clubs all around the world for over 30 years, with varying levels of success. Rio didn't work for me, different strokes for different folks, right? As I said in my post, I was pretty used up, mostly out window shopping, so I didn't try to negotiate the Buddha Babe down a dime.
Joey, for you a 10 in Rio could be a 3 for me or a 6 for someone else. Unless you are shilling for Rio, it would be best to lay off the 1-10 system. You found a girl you liked, great. Tell us about it but don't start telling us that she was a raving beauty that others would not necessarily agree with your assessment.
I must confess, like Cruiser, I have not been there in ages and so I do not know the current level of talent. However, again, like Cruiser, I agree that it was far better 10 years ago than they are now.
That said, when I return I will definitely come by one night and just see for myself how it now compares to the "great old days."Uke Boy, I do not suffer from a nostalgia for "great old days" or "good old boys" that some of the most recent posts on this thread by some veterans like CD reflect, because I am a relative newcomer to this board and began mongering in Kiev only since 2009. So I don't have the frame of reference for how good things might have been back then. But then was then, and now is now, and now is what's relevant.
I am amused at your suggestion that I am shilling for anyone. It's apparent you aren't that familiar with my standpoint or my reports, for if you were I don't think you could legitimately have thought that. But even if you do think that, it is of no import, because as you wrote, you intend to check things out for yourself. So you will find out the facts. My responses here to you are more for the sake of the newbies reading this thread looking for tidbits of accurate information, because you are a big boy and know your way around, and my efforts have always been, and always will be, to write reports and / or provide responses here that provide balance and accuracy to the extent possible in a forum where exaggeration sometimes confuses things for newbies.
Joey, for you a 10 in Rio could be a 3 for me or a 6 for someone else. Unless you are shilling for Rio, it would be best to lay off the 1-10 system. You found a girl you liked, great. Tell us about it but don't start telling us that she was a raving beauty that others would not necessarily agree with your assessment. QUOTE]
Uke Boy, in deference to your veteran standing, I will not deflect your question / comment, but rather respond to you in detail, as you merit. I reassure you that I am well aware that there is a range of opinion that exists between different men in their evaluation of beauty, and that the old adage "beauty is in the eye of the beholder" is as true today, as on the day that line was first written. Therefore, in a given group of men, what one man thinks is "the most beautiful" may not be another man's top choice. Does this mean that there is no way for a writer to communicate anything about beauty to another man? No, I do not believe it is hopeless to try to communicate opinions about beauty, because in the midst of all the profusion of opinion, certain statistical patterns will emerge from the mens' various opinions, (if, for example, each man in a group were to be polled as to his opinion on ranking the beauty of the women in a given line up, such as the top ten of a beauty pageant) , from which a generalized consensus can be described. Statistically, one can expect to find more agreement amongst a larger majority of the men, and only a much smaller group of men would hold opinions that diverged sharply from the mean. It's a statistical concept being applied to variations amongst men as to opinion on female beauty. But it holds true. What it means in more plain English is that while it is quite possible for individual men to quibble on whether a particular woman was an 8 or a 9 or a 7, and there would be a fair number of proponents for either view, nevertheless, there would exist an overall majority opinion that she was between a 7 and a 9. However, an opinion that the same woman was only a "3" would only be held by a very small minority of the men on the extreme fringes of deviation from the mean, and would be a fringe view compared to the majority consensus.
The conclusion I have reached is that although it is very difficult to have broad agreement on a position that a particular girl is specifically a "9" or a "10", it is quite possible to have a broader consensus that the girl is in the 7 to 9 range. Some guys will think she's a 9, some will feel she's an 8, and some will think she's only a 7. But that's ok. Because we just want to know if she is not ugly or average. A girl that a majority of men would put in a range of 7 to 9, is a good looking girl worth checking out for ourselves.
So I think that it is possible, when writing about evaluation of beauty, to be accurate to within 2 points of the majority opinion of men. And I am trying to write with the majority opinion of men in mind. When I write that a girl is in the 8 to 9 range, I am saying that most men would find this girl's body and face to be very Good looking.
I fully recognize that there will be a small minority of guys who are extremely demanding and picky in women's beauty matters, who will have much higher standards than the majority of other men, and rate things differently. However, I am not writing for these guys, nor could I. These fellows know themselves and know that they differ from most other guys in this area, and they can factor that into what they are reading.
I was thinking of a way to illustrate this for you, and aside from referring you to my first post where I tried to illustrate what I considered to be a "10" girl, so there could be a frame of reference to my reports (so I provided links to pictures of hotties I thought should make the grade) , I also thought of the following post I wrote a while back and the opinion of a fellow monger whom I happened to meet up with that night at Rio. Perhaps you will enjoy reading it, and maybe will have more confidence in my evaluations and reports.
http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showthread.php?816-Kiev&p=1150887&viewfull=1#post1150887
[QUOTE=Jet Setr; 1150994]Joe is, indeed, not exaggerating about the hotness of the girls. The brunette was attractive and a sweetheart, but the blonde may have truly been one of the prettiest girls I have ever seen. She had the face of an angel. I thought I knew what a ten was, and then this girl completely reset my scale. Her face would rate an 11-12 on my 'old' scale.
In general, I have never seen such a pretty ensemble as one sees just walking down the streets of Kiev. It is truly amazing. Most of the girls have these bright blue or green eyes and they are all usually in good shape and dress to the nines. Fully 1/4 of them look like they are sisters or cousins of Megan Fox or Mila Kunis.
LJ, I DID read the board. I did tip the manager. I did duck my head in downstairs for one last OJ before leaving. I don't carry a notebook. I have been going to strip clubs all around the world for over 30 years, with varying levels of success. Rio didn't work for me, different strokes for different folks, right? As I said in my post, I was pretty used up, mostly out window shopping, so I didn't try to negotiate the Buddha Babe down a dime.RS, my pointers were given with a view toward making your next visit live up to the potential I have witnessed there. If you're more into mamba or other options and don't intend a return, it's cool, and maybe someone else can learn something of value from our exchange. I take notes in my Blackberry mobile phone which has place for memos. I'm not sure how long you gave the downstairs line up to appear, but should you venture there again, it's worth circulating thru the different rooms including the VIP room, the downstairs room and one of the upstairs rooms (inner or outer) , before giving up and going to Buddha Bar and the like where the prices are even higher than Rio.
Your reports are well written, not drivel. Keep it up.
Joey, listen, before you send guys in the wrong direction, you should at least ensure that they know what the absolute minimum requirements are for such an expedition, day, night or otherwise.
Unless the hunting is done on Khreshchatik or in the immediate vicinity, success in this endeavor will be close to zero unless you can converse in at least intermediate Russian. Ordinary girls or store clerks have almost zero knowledge of any other foreign language. Only if there is some unexpected chemistry, despite the language issue, will anyone reading this forum have any real chance of success and that will be very rare.
If your Russian language skills are above average and you have the charm and the balls to cruise the malls and fast foods for possible conquests, then I say go for it. Some of my best times have been with ladies I have gotten to know from "over the counter" but only because I speak the lingo very well.I agree with what you've stated. I'm merely presenting options for things to try in Kiev. Obviously, mongering skills, appearance, charm, and as you point out, language skills, will all play a role in the outcome. It's the same issue hunting for freebies in nightclubs. Those with no Russian language skills are seriously hampered. Even in p4p a language barrier can prevent getting laid by some WG's not willing to subject themseves to the problems it presents.
Yet, with that being said, I have written in previous posts on the topic, that there is a little hope for those who only speak English, if they can use some of the language tools available nowadays on many smartphones or via the internet. I have used Google Translate on my laptop back at the apartment as well as in more limited fashion on my cell phone, to allow sufficient communcation to take place for things to remain fun. But there's no question that searching for freebies in nightclubs or shopping malls and being restricted to only those girls that can speak a little English is very limiting to one's chances for success.
You forgot to mention in Kiev it's warm in the summer and cold in the winter.
(lots and lots of stuff deleted)
The way I read your post, I thought you were trying to imply that the existence of girls on the beauty level of 9's or 10's at Rio was only in my head.
People's opinions do vary.
I've seen people post what they consider 9's and 10's in the photo section of this forum. I can only assume they are using a scale of 1-20.
A 5 is average! Average! In the Ukraine that means a girl isn't fat, chubby or curvy (a western word to make girls feel better about being overweight) and that they dress sexy. That my optically challenged friends is AVERAGE for Ukraine.
A 7 means guys start turning their heads to look at her.
An 8 means she starts attracting a lot of male attention.
A 9 is OMG WTF.
10's don't exist except on the photo shopped pages of magazines.
Just because a 5 pays attention to / fucks you and you are a 4 it doesn't make her a 9.
Jeesh.
Joey, for you a 10 in Rio could be a 3 for me or a 6 for someone else. Unless you are shilling for Rio, it would be best to lay off the 1-10 system. You found a girl you liked, great. Tell us about it but don't start telling us that she was a raving beauty that others would not necessarily agree with your assessment.
I must confess, like Cruiser, I have not been there in ages and so I do not know the current level of talent. However, again, like Cruiser, I agree that it was far better 10 years ago than they are now.
That said, when I return I will definitely come by one night and just see for myself how it now compares to the "great old days."
I always like reading about the experiences that new guys have.
Thanks for posting.
Hope I'm not boring the regulars with this drivel. I'm trying to show those coming to Kiev for the first time what my results were from what I learned on the board and elsewhere.
I think you are missing the point Uke is trying to make.
Things are still freakin awesome if you have a clue.
Hitting RIO, GIA or Buddha Bar every night is like going to Disney World for vacation for the last 20 years in a row. Sure you may love it but don't bore us with your 500th review of how awesome it is to ride Magic Mountain (pun intended).
Uke Boy, I do not suffer from a nostalgia for "great old days" or "good old boys" that some of the most recent posts on this thread by some veterans like CD reflect, because I am a relative newcomer to this board and began mongering in Kiev only since 2009. So I don't have the frame of reference for how good things might have been back then. But then was then, and now is now, and now is what's relevant.
I think you are missing the point Uke is trying to make.
Things are still freakin awesome if you have a clue.
Hitting RIO, GIA or Buddha Bar every night is like going to Disney World for vacation for the last 20 years in a row. Sure you may love it but don't bore us with your 500th review of how awesome it is to ride Magic Mountain (pun intended).So Uke Boy has a defender. He doesn't need one. He made a cogent point about language skills being a barrier for most guys visiting Kiev that would prevent likely success in chasing freebies or semi pros in shopping malls or in clubs. A necessary consequence of this language barrier that most new visitors to Kiev that don't speak Russian will face, is that since they cannot make much headway in the places that are off the beaten path, they must concentrate their efforts on the tried and proven p4p options in Kiev that may be boring for a true adventurer. So what if it's boring for you personally. When I respond to questions of newbies on this thread, or respond to misinformation that was posted in order to clear up the facts so that newbies can have a reliable resource, or I present an overview of options or strategy from time to time because newbies typically don't invest the time to read back in the thread sufficiently, it does not constitute me writing something to "bore us with your 500th review of how awesome it is to ride Magic Mountain (pun intended)". I am uninterested in whether a guy like you is bored or not bored. There are many people who are considering a trip to Kiev and need basic information. That's it.
CD, if what you wrote in your above post reflects what you think I've been doing here on the Kiev thread, methinks you got stuck somewhere on Magic Mountain and never came back from Never Never Land. You have my permission to skip my posts whenever you encounter them. I am not writing with you in mind. I am only writing for newbies and other people who don't know it ALL already.
People's opinions do vary.
I've seen people post what they consider 9's and 10's in the photo section of this forum. I can only assume they are using a scale of 1-20.
A 5 is average! Average! In the Ukraine that means a girl isn't fat, chubby or curvy (a western word to make girls feel better about being overweight) and that they dress sexy. That my optically challenged friends is AVERAGE for Ukraine.
A 7 means guys start turning their heads to look at her.
An 8 means she starts attracting a lot of male attention.
A 9 is OMG WTF.
10's don't exist except on the photo shopped pages of magazines.
Just because a 5 pays attention to / fucks you and you are a 4 it doesn't make her a 9.
Jeesh.
If you are relaying on RIO for your P4P and you have been to Kiev more than once, you have no mongering abilities.Do you really think that you are the only man who knows what an 8, 9 or 10 girl is? Do you really think that others' opinions are those of guys who are 4's who are so overthrilled they got laid by a 5 girl that they think she is a 9? C'mon down off your high horse.
Ronaldinjo
03-18-12, 14:29
As lilojey said, there are a lot of avarage girls there, but if you are lucky so its possible to bang some 8 or in rare occasion 8. 5 there. I saw there even 3-4 s (some really fat strippers that nearly fall donw from stick by gravitationl force of there weights, but come on. There are some cutties there, not everything is so bad. What is the weather like in the beginning and middle of April in Kiev? Can somebody answer me.
It's not a rumor, it's a fact that accommodation prices have already went up several times during Euro 2012.
Even airfare prices are high during this period.Airfare prices:
I just bought ticket round trip from Expedia, I will come and leave before Euro 2012 from California to Kiev.
The interesting thing is on my ticket it says:
Total ticket cost: $415. 00.
Taxes & Fees: $633. 10.
Booking Fee: $7. 00.
Airfare total: $1, 055. 10.
The tax and fees is more than the ticket cost. more than 60% of the total are taxes and fees
If you expect any action, you have to go where girls are concentrated looking for men. This means either the strip or night clubs. The nightclubs are fantastic here, mid aged men with the right look and charisma can pull from clubs. Forget trolling the streets unless your twenty five years old. You will look like a predator if you are an older guy. But if someone stares at you, definitely follow up that lead.
A bit off subject, but I would like to mention some observations from my first night at D'lux. The girls all have really bad teeth. I don't think there are any dentists in this town. Oh, wait a minute I forgot, they have no money to afford dental care. The other observation was the cheap clothing. All the clothes they can not sell in Western Europe are shipped off to the Ukraine. Luckily for these girls with there smoking bodies, they can make Kmart clothes look super sexy. Between the bad teeth and cheap clothes, I was completely turned on by the stunners at D'Lux.
I much prefer this environment of poverty in Kiev as opposed to the wealth and isolation of Moscow.
Uke Boy, in deference to your veteran standing, BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH etc. YAWN.
http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showthread.php?816-Kiev&p=1150887&viewfull=1#post1150887I don't need any defender, thank you.
Joey, can you re-write this dense, turgid and incomprehensible explanation into clear and concise 1-2 sentences? Attempting to read through your bloat is a very tedious experience and you do it all too often. You should at least think about non-native English readers (and there are many) who would have even greater difficulty in understanding you.
The best service you can provide to newbies, as you claim you are trying to do, would be to KISS – Keep It Simple Stupid.
Here's a suggestion of what you could have written: "My evaluations, like everyone else's, are highly subjective. A 9 for me may not be that for you, and that's fine."
As for your argument that Jet Setr backed you up, this is a guy who has all of 14 useless posts and the one you quote was his last from a year ago. For me, that is no confirmation at all. Other posters such as Colon, of all people, and Romany, who is in town right now, have disputed your assertions. If Cruiser had backed you up, then that would be another story.
Started the beautiful sunny day walking up and down Khreshchatyk admiring the fine city and it's occupants. The only thing that at all resembled a pick up opportunity was a nicely put together 40 something that struck up a conversation in English. Not the demographic I'm looking for for short term.
Thanks to Sevenup for a lead to Dolly Massage.
All the Mambo messaging paid off with a fine freebie last night. The search I was using was for those looking for sponsorship, but not sex for money. Not group sex and not one night stand. This gal advertised with one photo (real) , said she was 25 (I'd add 3-4) , and wanted correspondence.
Hope I'm not boring the regulars with this drivel. I'm trying to show those coming to Kiev for the first time what my results were from what I learned on the board and elsewhere.
LJ, I DID read the board. I did tip the manager. I did duck my head in downstairs for one last OJ before leaving. I don't carry a notebook. I have been going to strip clubs all around the world for over 30 years, with varying levels of success. Rio didn't work for me, different strokes for different folks, right? As I said in my post, I was pretty used up, mostly out window shopping, so I didn't try to negotiate the Buddha Babe down a dime.Romany, you passed on a "nicely put together 40 something?" You probably made a big mistake. You went out for a hand job and a platonic dinner before heading to Buddha and suffering from sticker shock.
There are more than a few nicely put together MILFs in Kiev. Those that take care of themselves that I have enjoyed are wild women in bed.
There would have been nothing wrong with you talking to her, asking for her phone number and meeting up for coffee or a drink later that day or the next day. Take advantage of all opportunities that come your way. This could have been dynamite. We all want hard-body 18 year-olds but it may not always happen. Keep posting and letting us know what's up.
A bit off subject, but I would like to mention some observations from my first night at D'lux. The girls all have really bad teeth. The other observation was the cheap clothing. I much prefer this environment of poverty in Kiev as opposed to the wealth and isolation of Moscow.The bad teeth are indicative of village and provincial girls, the same for the clothes. Standard health services, even dentistry, are still lacking. These girls many times have to buy second hand European cast-offs due to their limited incomes.
When you see that, you should be able to negotiate less than top dollar prices.
That is another reason they are in the clubs, to make a little on the side and maybe even latch on to someone for a longer term, if lucky.
I don't need any defender, thank you.
Joey, can you re-write this dense, turgid and incomprehensible explanation into clear and concise 1-2 sentences? Attempting to read through your bloat is a very tedious experience and you do it all too often. You should at least think about non-native English readers (and there are many) who would have even greater difficulty in understanding you.
The best service you can provide to newbies, as you claim you are trying to do, would be to KISS – Keep It Simple Stupid.
Here's a suggestion of what you could have written: "My evaluations, like everyone else's, are highly subjective. A 9 for me may not be that for you, and that's fine."
As for your argument that Jet Setr backed you up, this is a guy who has all of 14 useless posts and the one you quote was his last from a year ago. For me, that is no confirmation at all. Other posters such as Colon, of all people, and Romany, who is in town right now, have disputed your assertions. If Cruiser had backed you up, then that would be another story.I guess you didn't get my point, and maybe the fault is mine for assuming you could relate to the statistical concept I was trying to convey. I recognize what I wrote was a little complicated, but I thought you would benefit from understanding my concept. I guess not. It's obvious you think my opinions on female beauty are not reliable, like Cruiser Dave thinks. And you both openly admit that you came to your opinion based on no personal knowledge, not having been at the Rio club yourselves, which to me means you talk before you know.
My point was not at all that I recognize your opinion may be different than mine. Thanks for trying to rephrase my post just the same.
My point was the opposite. That my evaluations of the line up at Rio are being written with the viewpoint of the majority of men in mind to the best of my ability, and so I try to speak in terms of there being girls in "an 8 to 9 range" to encompass a broader range of opinion. A girl who I label as being in an 8 to 9 range is a girl who I am quite confident would be considered very hot by a majority of men, some maybe labelling her an 8, others thinking she's a 7, and some thinking she's a 9, But a majority would find her worth checking out. In that way I believe my evaluations of such things, when I have offered them (which hasn't been for some time, so I'm wondering what you and Cruiser Dave are in a blither about) are useful and helpful to the readers here.
My purpose was to decidedly reject the notion that you and Cruiser Dave were suggesting that what I thought might be a 9, would be in reality only a 3 level girl. That's sheer nonsense. If you both have an agenda against people going for p4p to Rio strip club, in preference for some other place or method which you call the 99 percent of Kiev (but have left undescribed or unwritten about) , let's just let everyone here recognize where you are coming from, so your objectivity can be evaluated.
My own opinions of what I think the majority of men would find attractive stand on their own. I am quite confident they are correct. I do not need backup. I merely happened to recall the post of Jet Setr and referenced it. Your dismissal without pause of Jet Setr's statement shows you are not objective and have some sort of agenda. I don't know what it is yet, but if you continue to post, I will maybe figure it out. You will see the facts when you go to Rio and you can make up your own mind. So let's just leave it that you don't rely on my opinion, and you only rely on Cruiser Dave's, and I am truly ok with that.
As to your comment that you like shorter posts, and I tend to be more detailed and lengthier, I am guilty as charged. KISS method was never my strong point. But my reason is that I don't have the extra time necessary to edit down what I've written to pithy pearls of wisdom, and also that for newbies more details are more helpful. So at the expense of yawns from guys like you who know the basics already, I leave details in the report or survey the p4p options from time to time for the benefit of newbies. And despite this, I get frequent questions over and over about the same details. So I know there is a value in this for newbie readers of this thread. To guys like you all I would say is just have a little more tolerance and suffer through, or better skip over my posts, as you obviously know all these basics already.
My only purpose in reporting about the various options for p4p in Kiev is so that newbies will not miss out. Therefore I try to present the options available together with the considerations one should take into account in deciding what to do with one's time and money in Kiev. It is my opinion that very hot girls that would thrill most men are available at Rio for take out. If you or Cruiser Dave becloud that option by something you wrote that causes newbies to mistakenly believe it's not worth going there because all they have in the line up is fat, chubby girls on a 3 level (a false premise), then in my view all you have accomplished is to cause newbies to miss out. It's like the advice you recently offered Romany Star that he should not have passed on the 40 something MILF. It's because you know from experience that such hook ups can be very pleasurable and that he missed out. Likewise, do I think that in light of the current options of p4p in Kiev, anyone who misguidedly stays away from Rio on the incorrect notion they don't have good looking enough girls is missing out -- BIG TIME.
What is the address for buddah bar?
I found their site but they don't have their address there
how far is it from Rio?
AColonizer
03-18-12, 18:09
It is important you plan your day-by-day hunt when you go to Kiev.
You see those clubs for your eyecandy, but they are not better than a lot of places in california, also about prices, maybe california is cheaper.
I visited san francisco in 2002, and quality of beauties and actions inside strip-clubs was much better than in Kiev.
Be very selective with girls, nobody deserves crazy prices.
Know yourself: you want to pay money for pure feticism, such as touching a beauty and listen her moaning, or you want to pay money for real sex such as feeling her tongue strolling from your dickhead to your asshole?
What is the address for buddah bar?
I found their site but they don't have their address there.
How far is it from Rio?
Joey, the amount of time you spend on writing your dreck and drivel is amazing. Editing really would help. I bet you also love listening to yourself speak for hours on end. To each his own.
I do not need to nor do I care to understand your ratings system. It's garbage and a form of self-adoration that you wish to tell us all in great boring detail how you judge who is atractive to you. The bottom line. All such judgements are purely subjective, have been, always will be. No need to explain ad nauseum and then try to impose or justify your standards on the rest of us.
95% or more of the girls who work in strip clubs ARE attractive. That is why the clubs hire them, duh! The quality gets ito be more problematic when using online escort services. However, it is still worth trying even this option.
If the sadly departed Bez Bezarra was still posting, I am sure he would have joined in and written "Where are the photos, show us the photos to back up what you say and then let us judge!"
It's too bad, though, since you do have something to contribute.
What is the address for buddah bar?
I found their site but they don't have their address there.
How far is it from Rio?Next door to. Kreschatick Hotel, Kreschatick Street.
Walking distance to Rio, or easy ride on Bus 11, LOL.
Joey, the amount of time you spend on writing your dreck and drivel is amazing. Editing really would help. I bet you also love listening to yourself speak for hours on end. To each his own.
I do not need to nor do I care to understand your ratings system. It's garbage and a form of self-adoration that you wish to tell us all in great boring detail how you judge who is atractive to you. The bottom line. All such judgements are purely subjective, have been, always will be. No need to explain ad nauseum and then try to impose or justify your standards on the rest of us.
The bottom line is that 95% or more of the girls who work in strip clubs ARE attractive. That is why the clubs hire them, duh! The quality gets ito be more problematic when using online escort services. However, it is still worth trying even this option.
If the sadly departed Bez Bezarra was still posting, I am sure he would have joined in and written "Where are the photos, show us the photos to back up what you say and then let us judge!"
It's too bad, though, since you do have something to contribute.You don't speak for the "rest of us" except in your own arrogant self inflated head. What's worse is you speak in ignorance, and unfortunately there are possibly those who may be swayed by your words, to their detriment. I guess you figure that attacking me will somehow further your agenda against people going to the Rio club. What you have against that p4p option I cannot fathom.
It is unimportant, truly, what your opinion is of what you call my "drek and drivel" and that you think my efforts to report about the level of beauty of girls in various p4p venues is "garbage". In retrospect, seeing how closed your mind is, I regret trying to explain my thinking to you. It was obviously wasted effort. What marks your opinion as valueless is that you have admitted you lack personal knowledge and have not been to Rio in years, and yet you still berate my opinion even though you must know that it is quite probably correct. Your ad hominem attacks are simply base name calling and do not substitute for facts.
I know that my accurate postings have helped many of the rest of the readers on this thread. I have received sufficient feedback from the some of the membership to feel I haven't wasted my time. So, it matters not that someone as unimportant as you attacks my reporting without valid basis. Knock yourself out, Uke Boy. Rail against my reports or me all you want. It doesn't affect me. But it can affect other readers. Doing it only exposes further the fact that you have some sort of agenda that has nothing to do with informing the membership of helpful details.
I would encourage any readers who doubt the veracity of my factual reports because of some arrogant and ignorant postings by these two members, Uke Boy and Cruiser Dave, to investigate matters personally so they don't miss out on something fun that exists in Kiev.
LJ
LJ & UB, I don't think your personal attacks on one another are helping me find girls.
Joey, you are nothing but a completely thin-skinned dolt who when his self-proclaimed "authority" is questioned goes into an incomprehensible and personal rant.
Of course, you did not read what I wrote. Maybe it is because you cannot bear to read what others write but want to have everyone praise and faun and kiss your ass over what you write.
I wrote that I could not stomach your ridiculous ratings system, not about anything else. I even said that most of the girls in clubs are attractive. You really don't like people to disagree with you at all. You seem to want to be the arbiter of all things Kiev and especially that of Rio.
Now it becomes more and more of a likelihood that you use your posts to receive payments in kind from the management of Rio. Maybe that is why you seem to succeed more than others. Your steer the innocents to Rio so that they can pay the entrance fee, pay for lots of drinks and private dances, all hopefully without any subsequent take-out. Clubs can make a lot more money that way than losing a top girl for 4 or 5 hours.
When these guys then write that they cannot take anyone home, you tell them that they did not follow Liljoey's Rio Commandments exactly as set down to the peasants by his highness. In your world, everyone else is wrong and only you are right.
Let the monger beware.
Me and You
03-18-12, 20:58
Climaxnow,
Your argue will never end as bothos you has his point of view. And Both of you are right. Why you do not write your own experiences in Kiev in Rio or CLubs or freebies with posting some photos. And I think ISG readers are smart enought to read, to understand and to select. Every mongerer has his own taste and plans and time (limited or not) and budget and skills and languages. Many factors so no rules. More we read more we learn. And more we monger more we learn also.
Apparently.
Do you really think that you are the only man who knows what an 8, 9 or 10 girl is? Do you really think that others' opinions are those of guys who are 4's who are so overthrilled they got laid by a 5 girl that they think she is a 9? C'mon down off your high horse.
It was 22 today and sunny. The weather is only going to get better
www.weather.com. Type in Kiev and hit return.
There are cuties all over the place. Khreshatic was full of cute village girls today, you don't need to go to Rio ad nauseum to find them.
As lilojey said, there are a lot of avarage girls there, but if you are lucky so its possible to bang some 8 or in rare occasion 8. 5 there. I saw there even 3-4 s (some really fat strippers that nearly fall donw from stick by gravitationl force of there weights, but come on. There are some cutties there, not everything is so bad. What is the weather like in the beginning and middle of April in Kiev? Can somebody answer me.
But it would be good reading if LJ wasn't so repetitive.
LJ & UB, I don't think your personal attacks on one another are helping me find girls.
If you speak Russian and you live in Kiev or spend alot of time there you have time to meet / chase girls and develop a relationship.
Strip clubs like Rio are great for older guys, who don't speak Russian, who travel to Kiev for a short time and don't have time and don't really care about having a relationship so for those guys like me Joeys posts help alot
this forum is called international sex guide, so if you want to meet girls the normal way then its not for you, stop fighting with posters
CityHunter77
03-18-12, 21:58
This is a fairly new hotel that opened last week in Kiev.
http://www.fairmont.com/kyiv/?cmpid=.OVKEY=fairmont
Has anyone managed to stay here for mongering purposes?
I know it's expensive, just wanted to have a change from the usual apartment experience
LJ & UB, I don't think your personal attacks on one another are helping me find girls..
Its back 2 the times, when it was HunterDave V UB& Bez Bezarra, remember.
It might not find you girls, but makes you read between the lines, some of it makes you really wonder?
In fact, I can see here both sides of the Input, Rant, whatever.
I said I usually go to Rio every night when in town&enjoy the dances, atmosphere, but I never took out any girl from there, not at US$300, when I only go for short sessions anyway.
And paying US$3oo in one go, defeats the whole object of me going to Kiev (Mongering) in the first place.
Off topic here, Hydro park in the Summer is a great place, if you have a Russian speaking wingman, or better still go with a nice looking BI girl & let her do the hunting 4 both of you.
Stay home.
You can buy top quality girls for $300 any where in the world.
Even when I used to hang out at Rio to the point where the managers and doormen used to greet me by name, it was part of a well balanced diet of pro's, night club semi pro's and dating. Hadn't started using mamba at that point (RP was still afloat).
If you speak Russian and you live in Kiev
All the western hotels don't mind you taking WG's back to test out their beds.
However I don't know of one that (knowingly) allows them to troll on the premise.
This is a fairly new hotel that opened last week in Kiev.
http://www.fairmont.com/kyiv/?cmpid=.OVKEY=fairmont
Has anyone managed to stay here for mongering purposes?
I know it's expensive, just wanted to have a change from the usual apartment experience
LJ & UB, I don't think your personal attacks on one another are helping me find girls..
Its back 2 the times, when it was HunterDave V UB& Bez Bezarra, remember.
It might not find you girls, but makes you read between the lines, some of it makes you really wonder?
In fact, I can see here both sides of the Input, Rant, whatever.
I said I usually go to Rio every night when in town&enjoy the dances, atmosphere, but I never took out any girl from there, not at US$300, when I only go for short sessions anyway.
And paying US$3oo in one go, defeats the whole object of me going to Kiev (Mongering) in the first place.
Off topic here, Hydro park in the Summer is a great place, if you have a Russian speaking wingman, or better still go with a nice looking BI girl & let her do the hunting 4 both of you.
Looking 4 girls in shopping malls, etc, I usually head to Perfumery&Cosmetics sections, there you find the best looking girls with more chance of girls speaking English, if they sell International brands. Again taking a girls with benefits 4 you, helps in this case as well.
Assuming here, one is staying in Kiev for at least a week.
Stay home.
You can buy top quality girls for $300 any where in the world.
Even when I used to hang out at Rio to the point where the managers and doormen used to greet me by name, it was part of a well balanced diet of pro's, night club semi pro's and dating. Hadn't started using mamba at that point (RP was still afloat).US$300 gets me 3 girls on Half hour sessions or one hour with one girl&1/2hour with another, and still get back some US$$ in change.
Here is Tilly & Sally.
http://www.annabellasescorts.com/escort-girl.php?girlid=257
So much better here, than time spent in Watertown, MASS.
Member #4491
03-18-12, 22:32
Wow, so many letters and word in this thread every day. Since I am one of those adventurers who could easily see myself avoiding Rio simply because it gets so much attention here, I have a question that maybe some old timer can answer? Once I was in Kiev and took a taxi out in an area of high rises to go to some sort of techno party. Floor one was packed with teens with their heads in a speaker. Floor two was covered with pool tables and there was also a bar. Up a rather narrow staircase to a small third floor there was a strip club with several females pointing their nipples at me. A couple where hot and would have looked great on Barba's t-rex. I did not have any ambition or possibility to barfine (or whatever it is called in this part of the world) any of the girls, but would not mind going back when I visit in April if I have a wing man and know the name. I like adventures more than the hard core scene, at least if I have more than a couple of evenings, so any advice is much appreciated.
Barba
Joey, you are nothing but a completely thin-skinned dolt who when his self-proclaimed "authority" is questioned goes into an incomprehensible and personal rant.
Of course, you did not read what I wrote. Maybe it is because you cannot bear to read what others write but want to have everyone praise and faun and kiss your ass over what you write.
I wrote that I could not stomach your ridiculous ratings system, not about anything else. I even said that most of the girls in clubs are attractive. You really don't like people to disagree with you at all. You seem to want to be the arbiter of all things Kiev and especially that of Rio.
Now it becomes more and more of a likelihood that you use your posts to receive payments in kind from the management of Rio. Maybe that is why you seem to succeed more than others. Your steer the innocents to Rio so that they can pay the entrance fee, pay for lots of drinks and private dances, all hopefully without any subsequent take-out. Clubs can make a lot more money that way than losing a top girl for 4 or 5 hours.
When these guys then write that they cannot take anyone home, you tell them that they did not follow Liljoey's Rio Commandments exactly as set down to the peasants by his highness. In your world, everyone else is wrong and only you are right.
Let the monger beware.Now you're being just plain silly. Do you really hold by the ridiculous conspiracy theory you just wrote in your last post? Your shrill tone does not bespeak any objectivity.
My reason for trying to expose the baselessness of your opinion about my reports is because I regard the info I have written to be a valuable resource to the members of the forum and I have taken pains to make it the most accurate information I could obtain by personal observation and experience. I have also always incorporated into my ongoing reports the opinions and insights of others who made good points, and served as a basis to correct something I had written previously. This is because I wanted there to be a reliable resource with accurate information available here. I am ready and have always been ready to defer to a fact or correct insight.
But you had no facts, just your arbitrary feeling that Cruiser Dave knows better than me what a pretty girl looks like. And that's ridiculous. You don't know me and you have not been to the club to be in a position to judge my opinions.
Therefore I felt you must be rebutted when you cast doubt on facts that I know to be true, not because I am thin skinned, which I am not, or a dolt, which I don't think I am, but because I want to preserve the truth for the benefit of the newbies and those readers trying to learn the ins and outs of mongering in Kiev. There are no commandments, just stuff I have discovered that worked for me, so I passed it on to others. There are mistakes one can make that I have learned the hard way can decrease one's success at a place like Rio, so I pass it on.
You want to invent another approach to snag hotties at Rio, be my guest, test it out and if you report it in good faith, I will try your recommendations too. It's the pussy that we can get that should be the goal of these reports, not tearing each other down. I'm sure you agree with at least that.
Stay home.
You can buy top quality girls for $300 any where in the world.LOL.
Okay.
I get the feeling you are in love with one of the dancers at Rio buddy and don't want us to go there.
Has anyone been to Paradise club on Schevchenko lately?
Can you still take dancers home?
Given the fact that from my POV your posts about Rio lead me to wonder just why the extremely heavy emphasis on the club. If, as you claim, you are not shilling for Rio, then I throw down to you this challenge.
Since you are not in Kiev right now and you have no supposed firsthand knowledge of the club, its managers, its policies and its girls and line-ups, then it makes as much sense for you to write about it today as it does for me to criticize it since I have not been there in ages. Things change, and in such clubs, they can change overnight and in several nights in sucession.
Given your distance from actual real-time experience, boots on the ground experience, there really is no reason for you to write about Rio in any specific terms.
The challenge is this. For me and for many who read the forum, for you to show that you are not a shill for Rio, that you now abstain in the whole to write about Rio. Write as much as you want about everything else, no problem with that to show you know more about Kiev than exclusively Rio. Show us that you know mongering outside of the most expensive strip club in Kiev.
Once you return to Kiev and head for Rio, go ahead and write as much as you want. And if it so happens to be when I am back, I will come by and check it out and also write about it.
Are you man enough to accept the challenge or shall we always doubt your posts about Rio?
LOL.
Okay.
I get the feeling you are in love with one of the dancers at Rio buddy and don't want us to go there.I know Cruiser and he has about as much need of the strippers at Rio or any other club as I do. Going there and trying to score by paying an entrance fee, drinks, private dances and whatever else such as rip-off taxis is a total waste of money.
Honestly, I would be thrilled if all of you kowtowed and then prayed at the altar of the great all-knowing and all-seeing sex god Liljoey and his Rio fixation.
Just that much more for the rest of us in a very very big city. Go and play in your little pond, I will revel in the ocean.
You want to invent another approach to snag hotties at Rio, be my guest, test it out and if you report it in good faith, I will try your recommendations too. It's the pussy that we can get that should be the goal of these reports, not tearing each other down. I'm sure you agree with at least that.I had posted before I read your response but I still think the challenge is worthwhile. OK, no problem with this finish to your post. I agree it is what we can all do to succeed in the very many OTHER opportunities Kiev presents than just one specific venue.
When I get back I will post on everything but strip clubs. They are all, including one now unnamed club mentioned too many times like issues surrounding Gia earlier, they are nothing just rip-off joints where all you will earn is the sound of one hand action when you get back to your apartment or hotel.
RomanyStar
03-19-12, 08:54
we interrupt this cat fight for a post on the mongering situation in kiev. .
after a four-hour nap i was wide-awake. my body still believes it is ten time zones away from kiev.
since yesterday's massage went so well i figured i ought to try the much-lauded rakuena. finding this was made even more confusing since the english version of their website lists their old address. it also lists a much more involved menu than dolly. walked through the door of a much nicer facility and was offered a lineup of a half dozen stunning women. the 5'8' blond inna outshone all the rest. she was so fine that i opted for the 700gr 90 minute erotic encounter. glad i did. after the shower i got back to the room to see the finest pair of c+ natural fun bags i've ever had the pleasure to feel up. the rest of her has to be in the teens on body fat ratio. obviously works to keep that fine body in top shape. still no idea what the erotic encounter is, but we are in a jacuzzi room so i had high hopes. she had me lay down face up, and stripped. oiled us up and went right into a most erotic body slide. again no touching the pussy, but close was ok, and oh those beautiful breasts. after about 15 minutes of this she sat on top showing a gaping pussy, and amazing sexy eye contact, reached behind and worked me to a finish that i could not help but fantasize has in her fine ass. while my heart rate came down, she toweled me off she explained that the rest of the session would include regular massage, erotic massage and a shower together. yippee! we talked a bit while she did the regular massage, when she got to the erotic massage i was to busy enjoying the touch and view to say anything. this time she turned around in 69 position. worked those lips open and closed inches in front of my face. the vitamin c had me looking ready to go but after letting her work pretty hard at it for about five minutes i gave in and said it wasn't going to happen. damn this getting old is crap. shower was nice. i had been scheming, since about the third second after i laid eyes on her, and did my best to get a dinner date, but it just wasn't happening despite her expressing that she really liked me. it was some of the best-spent money in many years of this hobby. i'the give a couple hundred bucks for a nice video of that session. note these massages were on saturday and sunday, which is when knowledge from previous posts said there would be the best selection. inna works another kind of job m-f.
ok skip the next if you're just after the x-rated part.
today was nearly shirtsleeves warm. did a couple laps up and down khreshchatyk admiring a lot of leg. made some eye contact, but nothing serious enough to get me to risk using my lousy russian. around 5:00 i dropped back in to oliva for an early dinner. the mixed grill was tasty, can't imagine why i'm craving protein. just after i sat down, two girls that could have easily passed for vegas hookers sat at a large table next to me and went to work on their phones like it was all business. had i just discovered some secret spot where they had a decent meal before heading off to work? in a couple minutes another sort of trashy looking gal joined them. slowly the table filled up with couples, including mom & dad. i add this to make note that this would be an easy place to get a sound slap on the face if one were too forward with some fashionista after first glance. one more lap at dusk, but still nothing worth the risk of looking like a fool.
napped for an hour, the plan (always written in sand) was to find something supper hot in one of the clubs tonight. found my fantasy babe twice but couldn't get more than a hand job, damn fine hand jobs mind you, but i came here to see one of those perfect asses in front of me driving me mad. woke up groggy, showered, snacked, still not up to more than a couple cylinders firing. the time zone thing has kept me from a decent sleep schedule since i got here. decided to be lazy and see what i could summon up to the door. tried the mamba 'who is online and offering sex for money' strategy, since it was now 9pm, as many posts will tell you, it was too late in the day for that to work. stupidly wasted an hour and a half on it. going back to all my website research, i had a number of sites where tineye had not detected stolen images. called one, made it clear i would only be satisfied with the girl in the picture, they must have realized that i wasn't a good scam candidate and honestly said that girl was not available. got that same crappy pimp line through a handful of calls. finally one was up front honest, and said they would send out four girls to choose from. with that kind of offer at $700gr for regular girls, or $900gr for model level: i had to give it a try, asked for model level. forty fucking five minutes later, the three candidates arrived. must have lost one of the herd along the way, because if any of these girls were modeling it was for bovine quarterly. by the way these heffers came from top modals. some of the other sites i tried and was absolutely sure i was dealing with slime balls included minuet, intimgirls and vipescort. i put those on the avoid list. many times there are great disappointments chasing that perfect instant of pleasure, this was one of them. decided to have a glass of wine and get some sleep.
[QUOTE=Jojosuntook.
, Hydro park in the Summer is a great place, if you have a Russian speaking wingman, or better still go with a nice looking BI girl & let her do the hunting 4 both of you.
Looking 4 girls in shopping malls, etc, I usually head to Perfumery&Cosmetics sections, there you find the best looking girls with more chance of girls speaking English, if they sell International brands. Again taking a girls with benefits 4 you, helps in this case as well.
Assuming here, one is staying in Kiev for at least a week.[/QUOTE]Some of the best girls that I met in Kiev were working in Saunas which I make sure to visit in the afternoon. Sessions there, set you up for the evening&increases the will power to resist temptation at high prices.
Saunas in Kiev are VFM& a great place to meet girls, if the chemisrty is right.
A lot of students work there during holidays &weekends.
Discretion is reuquired here, when posting Names of girls.
Three years ago, I made the mistake of posting the name of one student, and the next minute I got a Bollocking via pm (And rightly so) from a senior member at the time (Diceman, where is he now?).
Another place worth visiting during the day as well for a must visit (Culture Vulturing) as well as meeting girls from out of town, are the CAVES.
Buy candels there, stand in line next to some pretty girl &pray by her side, or behined her LOL.
[QUOTE=Jojosuntook.
, Hydro park in the Summer is a great place, if you have a Russian speaking wingman, or better still go with a nice looking BI girl & let her do the hunting 4 both of you.
Looking 4 girls in shopping malls, Department Stores etc, I usually head to Perfumery&Cosmetics sections, there you find the best looking girls with more chance of girls speaking English, if they sell International brands. Again taking a girl with benefits 4 you, helps in this case as well.
Assuming here, one is staying in Kiev for at least a week.[/QUOTE].
Some of the best girls that I met in Kiev were working in Saunas which I make sure to visit in the afternoon. Sessions there, set you up for the evening&increases the will power to resist temptation at high prices.
Saunas in Kiev are VFM& a great place to meet girls, if the chemisrty is right.
A lot of students work there during holidays &weekends.
Discretion is reuquired here, when posting Names of girls.
Three years ago, I made the mistake of posting the name of one such student, and the next minute I got a Bollocking via pm (And rightly so) from a senior member at the time (Diceman, where is he now?).
Another place worth visiting during the day as well for a must visit (Culture Vulturing) as well as meeting girls from out of town, are the CAVES.
Buy candels there, stand in line next to some pretty girl &pray by her side, or behined her LOL.
Been there a few times myself. Maxim?
The strip club is one of the Rhino clubs.
Wow, so many letters and word in this thread every day. Since I am one of those adventurers who could easily see myself avoiding Rio simply because it gets so much attention here, I have a question that maybe some old timer can answer? Once I was in Kiev and took a taxi out in an area of high rises to go to some sort of techno party. Floor one was packed with teens with their heads in a speaker. Floor two was covered with pool tables and there was also a bar. Up a rather narrow staircase to a small third floor there was a strip club with several females pointing their nipples at me. A couple where hot and would have looked great on Barba's t-rex. I did not have any ambition or possibility to barfine (or whatever it is called in this part of the world) any of the girls, but would not mind going back when I visit in April if I have a wing man and know the name. I like adventures more than the hard core scene, at least if I have more than a couple of evenings, so any advice is much appreciated.
Barba
I can't remember the last time I went to Rio. 2007? Maybe 2008?
Feel free to go there and Buddha Bar all the time.
LOL.
Okay.
I get the feeling you are in love with one of the dancers at Rio buddy and don't want us to go there.
An 8 means she starts attracting a lot of male attention.
A 9 is OMG WTF.
10's don't exist except on the photo shopped pages of magazines.Seconded. I personally have no 10s. A James Bond girl as Olga Kurylenko is a 8. 5 in my book. Maybe Aphrodite, if she goes down from Olympus Mount, could be rated a 10. We'll see.
Just that much more for the rest of us in a very very big city.+1. The reason why people focus that much on a nasty strip joint, in a city of 2. 7 millions full of possibilities, is beyond me.
Anyway since there is talks about it, why not post pics of the alleged 9s strippers?
Stripper from St Peterburg (freebie) :
I can't remember the last time I went to Rio. 2007? Maybe 2008?.
CD, Can't you have a good looky in RIO on a good night this week, and let us know?
Proof of the Pudding. In this case. Doesn't have to be in the Eating, but merely to check out the looks of the girls.
It is important you plan your day-by-day hunt when you go to Kiev.
You see those clubs for your eyecandy, but they are not better than a lot of places in california, also about prices, maybe california is cheaper.
I visited san francisco in 2002, and quality of beauties and actions inside strip-clubs was much better than in Kiev.
Be very selective with girls, nobody deserves crazy prices.
Know yourself: you want to pay money for pure feticism, such as touching a beauty and listen her moaning, or you want to pay money for real sex such as feeling her tongue strolling from your dickhead to your asshole?The only difference between RIO and the clubs you describe above including great ones in London as well, is that in RIO there are girls you can take out for US$300 for 3 hours.
This is a fact, not some kind of Fantasy in Candy Land, where its 4 your eyes only.
What is disputed by some members here, are the looks of the girls, and the Scale used in tthe evalution of such looks.
US$300 over 3 hours, is US$100 per hour, and if you can pop more than 3 times during this time, then it can work out at less than US$70 per pop.
Unfortunately for me, even with Levitra, I wouldn't be able to manage that, being in the wrong half of my 40s.
This thread is becoming addictive.
Next door to. Kreschatick Hotel, Kreschatick Street.
Walking distance to Rio, or easy ride on Bus 11, LOL.Hi Jojosun,
That hotel escort friendly?
Thanks,
Naykan
I have been reading this board for some time and have benefitted from the advice given by those hearty explorers who have blazed a trail before me in the various countries I have visited so far in pursuit of 'the hobby'.
This is my However, after reading the posts of the last half year or so, I feel that this Kiev era.
I still consider myself a novice at this, although point that they feel their money is well spent. One of the chief concerns of the writers...For the benefit of the ongoing thing about the Looks of the girls & the scale in relation to price.
I have copied& pasted parts of LJ's first post here. OF relevance here are the looks of the Polish Girls in London that he posted on.
Amelia& Gloria.
US$300 gets you one hour with them according to the Agency's site, compared to say something similar in Kiev for 3 hours.
Using Amelia&Gloria as the benchmark or if you like yard stick for comarison purposes with Rio girls, can anyone here point out the Rio Girls who are on the same scale as Amelia& Gloria in LONDON.
Then, we are talking about a Known quality.
For the benefit of the ongoing thing about the Looks of the girls & the scale in relation to price.
I have copied& pasted parts of LJ's first post here. OF relevance here are the looks of the Polish Girls in London that he posted on.
Amelia& Gloria.
US$300 gets you one hour with them according to the Agency's site, compared to say something similar in Kiev for 3 hours.
Using Amelia&Gloria as the benchmark or if you like yard stick for comarison purposes with Rio girls, can anyone here point out the Rio Girls who are on the same scale as Amelia& Gloria in LONDON.
Then, we are talking about a Known quality.The links for Amelia&Gloria. As per LJ's first post.
Or Gloria – 200 GBP (around $325 USD) per hour.
http://www.supreme69.co.uk/london-escorts/gloria.html
http://prime-escort.co.uk/gloria.php
http://www.supreme69.co.uk/london-escorts/amelia.html
http://www.admiralescorts.com/escort/edgware-road-w2-blonde-amelia
Or Gloria – 200 GBP (around $325 USD) per hour.
http://www.supreme69.co.uk/london-escorts/gloria.html
http://prime-escort.co.uk/gloria.php
I will only go if I can talk Irish Lad into going too. .
.
CD, Can't you have a good looky in RIO on a good night this week, and let us know?
Proof of the Pudding. In this case. Doesn't have to be in the Eating, but merely to check out the looks of the girls.
Hi Jojosun,
That hotel escort friendly?
Thanks,
NaykanNow you are asking a leading question.
Call me a Weirdo but I like my own space& 8 hours sleep so much, that I book another room if I am with another girl.
Not just in Kiev. I like it this way & girls find it a bit weird at first, but they end up liking the arrangement.
A bed for Bonking& a bed for Sleeping in 4 me. +Room Service 24/7.
That's why I am such a cheap skate when it comes to Flying to Kiev. Saving$$$on flight costs.
Thank you Wizzair.
Here I am talking, if the girl is staying overnight.
For short sessions up to 11pm, I don't think you should have a problem.
After 11pm you would need to grease the palms of the security guy with say a 100UAH or 150 UAH.
I only briefly looked at the link but the photos appeared professionally posed and photo shopped.
So what known quality are we taking about?
Then, we are talking about a Known quality.
I will only go if I can talk Irish Lad into going too. .A pint of good Guiness there, should talk him into it.
Come on guys lets bring this thing into some kind of an agreed conclusion, by getting a panel of seasoned wise mongers to inspect the goodies at Rio.
I would have done it myself this week, and especially for Arena tonight, but couldn't get away from prior arrangements.
Member #4274
03-19-12, 17:40
Seconded. I personally have no 10s. A James Bond girl as Olga Kurylenko is a 8. 5 in my book. Maybe Aphrodite, if she goes down from Olympus Mount, could be rated a 10. We'll see.
+1. The reason why people focus that much on a nasty strip joint, in a city of 2. 7 millions full of possibilities, is beyond me.
Anyway since there is talks about it, why not post pics of the alleged 9s strippers?
Stripper from St Peterburg (freebie) :Prosal, I couldn't agree more. Why someone with regular access to Ukraine would concentrate on a strip joint in a city / country of so many beautiful women is baffling to me, too.
I only briefly looked at the link but the photos appeared professionally posed and photo shopped.
So what known quality are we taking about?I read Liljoey's first report on them, and he says pictures are real and the girls were 10s.
So in this case we would be comparing the top girls of Rio, with what LJ says are the 10s, being the Polish girls on his Scale.
Actually I am hoping that LJ comes back on this point, since I haven't met the Polish girls in London, and I don't know the girls in Rio that LJ was posting on.
I only briefly looked at the link but the photos appeared professionally posed and photo shopped.
So what known quality are we taking about?QUOTE (Although the rates of these two girls in London approximate the base rate for a hot girl in New York, it is not similar. Because these two girls, Amelia or Gloria, are truly exceptional. They are, in my opinion, clearly 10's, and so beautiful in terms of their facial appearance, the perfect shape and tone of their bodies, that girls such as these 'supermodels' would command a far higher rate in New York than the basic $400 / hr rate)[/QUOTE]Now we are not talking Pies in the Sky or a Mermaid called Wanda, but the above girls looks in LJ's first post.
Tried the mamba 'who is online and offering sex for money' strategy, since it was now 9PM, as many posts will tell you, it was too late in the day for that to work. Stupidly wasted an hour and a half on it. Going back to all my website research, I had a number of sites where TinEye had not detected stolen images. Called one, made it clear I would only be satisfied with the girl in the picture, they must have realized that I wasn't a good scam candidate and honestly said that girl was not available. Got that same crappy pimp line through a handful of calls. Finally one was up front honest, and said they would send out four girls to choose from.Be careful with this, you don't want fake cops start banging on your door, beat you up and take your money.
I read this happened to someone one time
Seconded. I personally have no 10s. A James Bond girl as Olga Kurylenko is a 8. 5 in my book. Maybe Aphrodite, if she goes down from Olympus Mount, could be rated a 10. We'll see.
+1. The reason why people focus that much on a nasty strip joint, in a city of 2. 7 millions full of possibilities, is beyond me.
Anyway since there is talks about it, why not post pics of the alleged 9s strippers?
Stripper from St Peterburg (freebie) :Hey, Pro.
It keeps being discussed because some guys, based on their posts, prefer the "certainty" of a known venue. There is a lot of energy put into "quantifying" the experience in terms of cost per hour, cost per orgasm, cost per unit of beauty, etc. Which is a bit excessive. And at some point, a decision was made (and then repeatedly rationalized) that Rio represented the lowest risk, highest value option for a newbie. Exploring other alternatives would involve a different set of skills, attitudes, and beliefs.
As it relates to non-pros (and that's my PRIMARY focus since it represents the largest pool of available women in ANY city) , many on this board believe that wining and dining a woman for several dates or offering her money are required for her to have sex with you. You and I both know that's simply untrue. Completely, absolutely untrue, provided a guy knows what he's doing. We both know it's possible to walk into a bar or night club, chat up some women, and leave with companionship for the evening (or meetings scheduled later) no money required. Now, when you START with that understanding, there is an entire city at your disposal. Humans are creatures of habit and the same women tend to go to the same places on a regular basis. By constantly exploring new venues you gain access to a fresh crop because each bar / night club / restaurant is a new pool of applicants.
Now, this assumes a guy TRUSTS himself to know what to do in that new environment and is comfortable with uncertainty. The HUGE paradox about uncertainty is things that are random in the short term are pretty f*cking predictable in the long term. To clarify, from the time I walk into the building until I'm kissing her goodbye, I know exactly what I'm doing (and why). And like a good musician, even if I get lost, I trust myself to "find my way back" because of years of experience. I completely accept the uncertainty, yet my results are consistent. Hence, the paradox. You and many of the experienced guys would probably say the same thing.
The 'business managers' are generally taking 50% if not more.Not easy to understand for me, I got one nice girl and she told me she pays 50% to the "agency" I offered her next time direct and she gave me her mobile, but at the end she did not appears (?)
Can these girls work independed? 50% is in my opinion too much, or what are the risks for these girls to meet us on a private basis without agencies?
Not easy to understand for me, I got one nice girl and she told me she pays 50% to the "agency" I offered her next time direct and she gave me her mobile, but at the end she did not appears (?)
Can these girls work independed? 50% is in my opinion too much, or what are the risks for these girls to meet us on a private basis without agencies?The girls would starve without the boys. Most do not have the business acumen to work solo and it is very important to them to be part of a system with rewards and penalties. One third is more realistic with a true agency unless its a pimp relationship.
We interrupt this cat fight for a post on the mongering situation in Kiev. .
Today was nearly shirtsleeves warm. Did a couple laps up and down Khreshchatyk admiring a lot of leg. Made some eye contact, but nothing serious enough to get me to risk using my lousy Russian. Around 5:00 I dropped back in to Oliva for an early dinner. The mixed grill was tasty, can't imagine why I'm craving protein. Just after I sat down, two girls that could have easily passed for Vegas hookers sat at a large table next to me and went to work on their phones like it was all business. Had I just discovered some secret spot where they had a decent meal before heading off to work? In a couple minutes another sort of trashy looking gal joined them. Slowly the table filled up with couples, including Mom & Dad. I add this to make note that this would be an easy place to get a sound slap on the face if one were too forward with some fashionista after first glance. One more lap at dusk, but still nothing worth the risk of looking like a fool.Something to keep in mind is if you are not willing to "look like a fool" with the one's that don't matter, you will be unable to really "perform" when it does matter. Make your mistakes on the one's you don't want, so you are on autopilot by the time you get to the hot one's. Part of being good "on the street" is being willing to fail and indifferent to the outcome. That's also why it would have been a GOOD THING for you to hang onto the MILF. She's your insurance so there is no reason to go to bed alone, assuming she's attractive enough to make that "better than nothing" decision. Then, when you're out meeting women there's no pressure because you have an insurance policy that's a phone call away. When there is no pressure, you're able to be funnier, smoother, more charming, and indifferent to the outcome, which increases attraction. For MILF's, f*ck the living daylights out of them once and show them a nice evening (focus on blowing her fuses). Then, she will always come when called, pun intended. (Yes, you can anchor a woman to orgasm from the sound of your voice.) Women are extremely predictable when it comes to their own pleasure. Next, as you meet a better candidate for that role, repeat the process and gently release the first one.
About a week ago, I posted a report on my first visit to Rio. It basically stated the talent was mostly 7's and some 8's and that I would not spend too much time there. Well, with all the chatter about the club, it got me thinking. Senior members came here recently and placed a new light on Rio very opposite of LJ's reports. I don't like to ignore anybodies viewpoints and now reflecting back I would like to share more detail of my first night.
I did not want to say anything too negative about the club because I was dead tired from the flight and never had any lady interaction. Here were the problems. After I walked in, I was escorted by a hostess to the top floor and I requested to be seated by the bar. When the manager approached, I was immediately placed on guard. He was polite and simply told me that it was 100 hry entrance fee, cash only, and that he was going to call some girls to dance on the stage. I was the only customer up there and it had me worried that I was about to be clipped. I am no export on stripclubs but I have been to most of the good ones in Moscow and never feared myself to be a target. Everything made sense in the Moscow clubs but this Rio club was just confusing and not clear in its schematic. So I got tired of being the only one up on the third floor and asked one of the bouncers if I could walk around. I ended up at the first floor where they have a closed off dance area with more girls dancing. The girls were hotter but another problem put me on guard. The tables were basically closed off booths where the girls would have to sit down and could not dance around you. I have never seen this type of table arrangement in strip clubs so another red flag arose. After watching the girls, a bouncer came up to me asking if I wanted some action (I don't know if he was referring to a dance or bring home) with any of the girls. I declined, I was tired and nothing attracted me. This was another red flag that no girls ever came up to me in the club and the only people approaching me were managers / bouncers. So with all the red flags and the lack of clearity, I got out of there.
Seconded. I personally have no 10s. A James Bond girl as Olga Kurylenko is a 8. 5 in my book. Maybe Aphrodite, if she goes down from Olympus Mount, could be rated a 10. We'll see.
+1. The reason why people focus that much on a nasty strip joint, in a city of 2. 7 millions full of possibilities, is beyond me.
Anyway since there is talks about it, why not post pics of the alleged 9s strippers?
Stripper from St Peterburg (freebie) :Prosal, can you assign your view of a number rating to the stripper in the photo you attached. Can't see the face, but her body looks nice. Same invitation to the rest of you gents, including Cruiser Dave who is regarded by long time members as somewhat of an expert on such matters. This photo does not appear photoshopped. So here's your benchmark guys. Have at it. Perhaps a few more sample photos would make this exercise more productive though.
You ask why would someone focus on a nasty strip joint than the whole 2. 7 million population?
The answer is that those who are interested in the strip club are those mongers desiring p4p, for which the entire 2. 7 million of population would be irrelevant.
Your own preference for chasing freebies is well known to me from your prior posts, Prosal, but we must differentiate p4p, from pursuit of freebies amongst a population pool of 2. 7 million. As you know, p4p can only be pursued within a very restricted pool of women who are open to it. These WG women need to be found by the mongers who would take them. Where to find them in any significant degree of concentration to make a search worthwhile? In Kiev nowadays it's. On the internet, in some Kiev nightclubs, and in some strip clubs, and girl apartments, as there is no large SW scene in Kiev. The determining factors on one's choice of venue to seek p4p are well known, and include prices, looks level, efficiency etc.
Why are these mongers desiring p4p instead of pursuing freebies?
That is a separate question. Chiefly the reason is a strict limitation in the particular monger's available time in Kiev, coupled with a desire to nail a hottie while in Kiev, as well as possibly a lack of sufficient abilities to guarantee success with freebies. Many of us are not young, do not look like a Prince, and may not necessarily have winning "game", or more basically the necessary language skills in speaking Russian. Also freebies take longer to cultivate and are not guaranteed, whereas p4p is a guaranteed short and sweet way into hot pussy.
Why the strip club versus the other p4p possibilities?
I have posted the answer to this in detail numerous times previously, so anyone interested can look up prior posts for the details of the analysis.
Anyone who has actually read my prior reports will know that I have investigated and reported on all the p4p options in Kiev, and am quite familiar with them all. They would also have read the analysis of the pros and cons of each of the p4p options in Kiev, insofar as they relate to various different types of mongers with different levels of time on their hands in Kiev, and the logical reasons for preferring one option over another. These things are in the realm of facts. For example, if I report to you that there is a lot of time wasted using the internet websites such as mamba. Ru because they use fake pics and send ugly girls and it takes multiple tries and persistence to get a good looking girl this way, this is not an opinion. It is an observed fact. It has been reported by many. If I analyze the ease with which one can get to a hot girl for "take out" in a venue like a strip club where you can see the girls in advance, in comparison to using the websites like mamba. Ru, and report that there is much time waste using websites and greater efficiency seeking p4p at nightclubs, and even far more efficiency seeking p4p at a strip club, this too is an empirical and measurable fact, not just an opinion. The prices too are facts, not opinions, and are reported by numerous members. Lastly, at the strip club there are additional tools useful in finding a GFE, such as private dances, unavailable for the other p4p options. All in all, none of the analysis I have written, or the conclusions, depends on subjective opinion, with the exception of the level of beauty of the girls in each venue.
Therefore, discussion of the level of beauty available in each p4p option is the only area where it is useful to inquire further. But it is difficult to know what to do with the conflicting assessments made by different mongers of the same venue.
Yet we all know that there is a certain level of ugly that 80% of men would probably agree is ugly. At the other extreme, there is a certain level of beauty that 80% of men would probably agree is beautiful. No man is an island who holds a completely different view from every other man in all aspects. There are areas of convergence. There is consensus by a majority about at least the generality of beauty, versus a girl being average or plain. The industry of modeling is built on this truth.
So despite all the problems that subjectivity introduces into communicating about beauty, I feel it is still useful to talk about beauty if we can simply aim at not being so exact or precise and saying that there are girls available who are very worthwhile checking out, such as girls above an 8 level, I think. Then it makes no difference if different guys evaluate that above 8 girl as a 9 or a 10 or a 7. We will get the idea that she's very attractive and worth looking at in order to make our own minds up.
RomanyStar
03-19-12, 23:11
Something to keep in mind is if you are not willing to "look like a fool" with the one's that don't matter, you will be unable to really "perform" when it does matter. Make your mistakes on the one's you don't want, so you are on autopilot by the time you get to the hot one's. Part of being good "on the street" is being willing to fail and indifferent to the outcome. That's also why it would have been a GOOD THING for you to hang onto the MILF. She's your insurance so there is no reason to go to bed alone, assuming she's attractive enough to make that "better than nothing" decision. Then, when you're out meeting women there's no pressure because you have an insurance policy that's a phone call away. When there is no pressure, you're able to be funnier, smoother, more charming, and indifferent to the outcome, which increases attraction. For MILF's, f*ck the living daylights out of them once and show them a nice evening (focus on blowing her fuses). Then, she will always come when called, pun intended. (Yes, you can anchor a woman to orgasm from the sound of your voice.) Women are extremely predictable when it comes to their own pleasure. Next, as you meet a better candidate for that role, repeat the process and gently release the first one.I know well how to build and nurture this kind of situation, but I was here for a one time experience, and was focused on non-age appropriate entertainment. Wanted to save my juices for the under 25 crowd that would be most likely never be available to me in a pick-up situation.
RomanyStar
03-19-12, 23:13
Ten hours of glorious sleep later it was time to make the most of my last day in Kiev. While laying there I felt a strong urge for someone fun, and NOW. Call it lazy, call it wasting money, call me a shill if you want. I called Gia again. It worked so well last time that with just 24 hours left in Kiev I wanted one more absolutely guaranteed hotty.
Polina showed up within 45 minutes. Dressed in very classic business attire, this tall, sort of innocent looking girl with a gorgeous smile looked WAY to good to be true. The coolest part is she was giving me an amazing passionate kiss seconds after walking through the door. She proved to be a total Energizer Bunny. Site says she is 29, I didn't believe it, but she insists. On the pencil thin side, but I finally got to cum watching that amazing ass slap up against me. We got along like a couple long lost friends. Love it when you run across a pro that enjoys what she's doing, and makes you crazy in the process. Those that say Gia is overpriced, may be right, but based on a worldwide market I say they offer damn good value for the money. Prices are well below top quality US agencies, and exactly the same as in Montreal. When an agency goes two for two at the quality of who they sent me I call it top notch.
If you old timers say Gia is over, then who is a currently stepping up to offer real pics, and services that happen as defined today in Kiev? If there is another source that provides this quality in Kiev I sure wish I had known about it, and I'm sure those that follow in my tracks will too.
I'm interested in quality p4p rather than freebies. Already have a couple of emails from the Mamba girl that spent the night. The expectations that come along with messing with someone's head like that amount to karmic debt I'd the rather not mess with. Remember this was intended, and probably is my only visit to Kiev.
I had another potential freebie scheduled for tonight, but decided to flake on her. I had already purchased tickets for a dance performance I wanted to see, and being without a date decided to call my guide girl and see if she would join me, on the clock of course. She was free, so I booked the day. Turned out we spent the afternoon doing the tourist tour of all the normal sites in Kiev. Beautiful city and seemingly pretty nice people. If I were looking at working for another ten years I would have to consider moving here. Fact is I see the other side of the SSI too soon to consider any new opportunities.
Decided to take the gorgeous guide girl to a nice dinner. It was a treat sharing a bottle of Pouilly-Montrachet with this articulate, stunning woman. Nice to know that there will be a woman remembering me fondly in Kiev, for our conversation and nothing more. She won't be hoping for a passport, or an outfit, this lady and her kind will be running things one day. She left in her taxi and I went back to the room for some, well earned shuteye.
On the plane to Amsterdam in the morning.
Cememr2000
03-19-12, 23:55
Hi guys,
I simply cannot decide which one should I choose.
I have been in Kiev 2 years ago but never been in Chisinau.
Which one do you recommend?
A detailed analysis would be very much appreciated.
BR.
About a week ago, I posted a report on my first visit to Rio. It basically stated the talent was mostly 7's and some 8's and that I would not spend too much time there. Well, with all the chatter about the club, it got me thinking. Senior members came here recently and placed a new light on Rio very opposite of LJ's reports. I don't like to ignore anybodies viewpoints and now reflecting back I would like to share more detail of my first night.
I did not want to say anything too negative about the club because I was dead tired from the flight and never had any lady interaction. Here were the problems. After I walked in, I was escorted by a hostess to the top floor and I requested to be seated by the bar. When the manager approached, I was immediately placed on guard. He was polite and simply told me that it was 100 hry entrance fee, cash only, and that he was going to call some girls to dance on the stage. I was the only customer up there and it had me worried that I was about to be clipped. I am no export on stripclubs but I have been to most of the good ones in Moscow and never feared myself to be a target. Everything made sense in the Moscow clubs but this Rio club was just confusing and not clear in its schematic. So I got tired of being the only one up on the third floor and asked one of the bouncers if I could walk around. I ended up at the first floor where they have a closed off dance area with more girls dancing. The girls were hotter but another problem put me on guard. The tables were basically closed off booths where the girls would have to sit down and could not dance around you. I have never seen this type of table arrangement in strip clubs so another red flag arose. After watching the girls, a bouncer came up to me asking if I wanted some action (I don't know if he was referring to a dance or bring home) with any of the girls. I declined, I was tired and nothing attracted me. This was another red flag that no girls ever came up to me in the club and the only people approaching me were managers / bouncers. So with all the red flags and the lack of clearity, I got out of there.You could glean this from reports in the thread, but here are some pointers in case you make a return visit when you are not tired and are thinking you want to try a take out. The girls are not permitted to approach you. They can only entice you with smiles, eye contact and their dance. You're right. It's very opposite the kind of thing that exists in many strip clubs or brothels all over the world where the moment you enter, girls are throwing themselves at you and trying to latch on to you. I guess it's this strip club's idea of class. There are not usually table dances on the floor, so to speak, also for the same reason, and private dances are in a private room. (although I have seen a girl sitting on a guy's lap facing him at one of the tables and essentially dancing on him as would be possible in a strip club in the US, so I guess it's just not the norm at Rio). Your fears of being clipped were in your head. There aren't any reports I am aware of on this forum of the kind of things that go on in moscow clubs where they rip off customers with phony bills and bouncers enforce the rip off. So your fears were misplaced. Your fear of the managers was also misplaced. The managers at Rio are there to service your needs, especially with regard to girl interaction. They were trying to do their jobs to help you. You just didn't let them because of stuff you had going on in your head causing you to be overly suspicious. However, on the other hand, you did the right thing in asking to be moved to a different bar when you didn't see what you liked in the upstairs bar, so you could see a different one of the three line ups. There was also the VIP room in addition to the downstairs room. It's unfortunate that your red flags got in your way and prevented you from having a nice time. Perhaps had you read more of the available descriptions of what goes on at the club on this thread you would have known better what to expect and would not have been distracted by red flags.
Hey, Pro.
It keeps being discussed because some guys, based on their posts, prefer the "certainty" of a known venue. There is a lot of energy put into "quantifying" the experience in terms of cost per hour, cost per orgasm, cost per unit of beauty, etc. Which is a bit excessive. And at some point, a decision was made (and then repeatedly rationalized) that Rio represented the lowest risk, highest value option for a newbie. Exploring other alternatives would involve a different set of skills, attitudes, and beliefs.
As it relates to non-pros (and that's my PRIMARY focus since it represents the largest pool of available women in ANY city) , many on this board believe that wining and dining a woman for several dates or offering her money are required for her to have sex with you. You and I both know that's simply untrue. Completely, absolutely untrue, provided a guy knows what he's doing. We both know it's possible to walk into a bar or night club, chat up some women, and leave with companionship for the evening (or meetings scheduled later) no money required. Now, when you START with that understanding, there is an entire city at your disposal. Humans are creatures of habit and the same women tend to go to the same places on a regular basis. By constantly exploring new venues you gain access to a fresh crop because each bar / night club / restaurant is a new pool of applicants.
Now, this assumes a guy TRUSTS himself to know what to do in that new environment and is comfortable with uncertainty. The HUGE paradox about uncertainty is things that are random in the short term are pretty f*cking predictable in the long term. To clarify, from the time I walk into the building until I'm kissing her goodbye, I know exactly what I'm doing (and why). And like a good musician, even if I get lost, I trust myself to "find my way back" because of years of experience. I completely accept the uncertainty, yet my results are consistent. Hence, the paradox. You and many of the experienced guys would probably say the same thing.Disregarding the first part about the Rio Club, with all due respect to your opinions about how to score, the rest of your post is of no use to anyone going to Kiev for p4p purposes only, including yours truly.
I go on mongering trips to Kiev& other places. I don't need to go on ego trips.
Prosal, can you assign your view of a number rating to the stripper in the photo you attached. Can't see the face, but her body looks nice.Her face is typically Slavic, with eyes to get lost in. Anyway I'd rate her 7. 5. I guess she'd be a solid 9 for most of the guys in Western Europe or in the US, but by FSU standarts she his IMO just "not that skanky".
Ten hours of glorious sleep later it was time to make the most of my last day in Kiev. While laying there I felt a strong urge for someone fun, and NOW. Call it lazy, call it wasting money, call me a shill if you want. I called Gia again. It worked so well last time that with just 24 hours left in Kiev I wanted one more absolutely guaranteed hotty.
Polina showed up within 45 minutes. Dressed in very classic business attire, this tall, sort of innocent looking girl with a gorgeous smile looked WAY to good to be true. The coolest part is she was giving me an amazing passionate kiss seconds after walking through the door. She proved to be a total Energizer Bunny. Site says she is 29, I didn't believe it, but she insists. On the pencil thin side, but I finally got to cum watching that amazing ass slap up against me. We got along like a couple long lost friends. Love it when you run across a pro that enjoys what she's doing, and makes you crazy in the process. Those that say Gia is overpriced, may be right, but based on a worldwide market I say they offer damn good value for the money. Prices are well below top quality US agencies, and exactly the same as in Montreal. When an agency goes two for two at the quality of who they sent me I call it top notch.
If you old timers say Gia is over, then who is a currently stepping up to offer real pics, and services that happen as defined today in Kiev? If there is another source that provides this quality in Kiev I sure wish I had known about it, and I'm sure those that follow in my tracks will too.
I'm interested in quality p4p rather than freebies. Already have a couple of emails from the Mamba girl that spent the night. The expectations that come along with messing with someone's head like that amount to karmic debt I'd the rather not mess with. Remember this was intended, and probably is my only visit to Kiev.
I had another potential freebie scheduled for tonight, but decided to flake on her. I had already purchased tickets for a dance performance I wanted to see, and being without a date decided to call my guide girl and see if she would join me, on the clock of course. She was free, so I booked the day. Turned out we spent the afternoon doing the tourist tour of all the normal sites in Kiev. Beautiful city and seemingly pretty nice people. If I were looking at working for another ten years I would have to consider moving here. Fact is I see the other side of the SSI too soon to consider any new opportunities.
Decided to take the gorgeous guide girl to a nice dinner. It was a treat sharing a bottle of Pouilly-Montrachet with this articulate, stunning woman. Nice to know that there will be a woman remembering me fondly in Kiev, for our conversation and nothing more. She won't be hoping for a passport, or an outfit, this lady and her kind will be running things one day. She left in her taxi and I went back to the room for some, well earned shuteye.
On the plane to Amsterdam in the morning.Romany. Really enjoyed reading your reports, very well written, down to earth & honest reporting on the ground.
This is the Real Kiev to Mongers of a certain age, who want to have a good time in Kiev on a short trip. .
Wish you a Safe Journey & a Happy Landing.
BTW, I liked the part about the Pouilly Montrachett, which shows a lot of class attached to your mongering. How much did you pay for it.
You could glean this from reports in the thread, but here are some pointers in case you make a return visit when you are not tired and are thinking you want to try a take out. The girls are not permitted to approach you. They can only entice you with smiles, eye contact and their dance. You're right. It's very opposite the kind of thing that exists in many strip clubs or brothels all over the world where the moment you enter, girls are throwing themselves at you and trying to latch on to you. I guess it's this strip club's idea of class. There are not usually table dances on the floor, so to speak, also for the same reason, and private dances are in a private room. (although I have seen a girl sitting on a guy's lap facing him at one of the tables and essentially dancing on him as would be possible in a strip club in the US, so I guess it's just not the norm at Rio). Your fears of being clipped were in your head. There aren't any reports I am aware of on this forum of the kind of things that go on in moscow clubs where they rip off customers with phony bills and bouncers enforce the rip off. So your fears were misplaced. Your fear of the managers was also misplaced. The managers at Rio are there to service your needs, especially with regard to girl interaction. They were trying to do their jobs to help you. You just didn't let them because of stuff you had going on in your head causing you to be overly suspicious. However, on the other hand, you did the right thing in asking to be moved to a different bar when you didn't see what you liked in the upstairs bar, so you could see a different one of the three line ups. There was also the VIP room in addition to the downstairs room. It's unfortunate that your red flags got in your way and prevented you from having a nice time. Perhaps had you read more of the available descriptions of what goes on at the club on this thread you would have known better what to expect and would not have been distracted by red flags.Well thank you LJ for the supportive response. I am now as sharp as a razor and will be back to Rio in a few days for myself and the team.
Well thank you LJ for the supportive response. I am now as sharp as a razor and will be back to Rio in a few days for myself and the team.Please do ASAP & take one 4 the team.
My experiences at Rio when I visited, differs from yours.
I had 2 call the manager & more than once to get me the girl of my choice 4 a private dance.
BTW I had to pay the entrance fee at the door, before I went upstairs& as soon as I walked in.
But times could be changing?
Member #4491
03-20-12, 01:49
I have been chatting with an*Ukrainian*girl for some time. Not super pretty but good looking and smart. She is studying psychology. Her yearly*tuition*fee is*6000 Ukrainian grivnas, so about 750 USD. Her yearly rent for her dorm room is 2000 grivnas so 250 USD. This is less than what many of my girlfriends in the Philippines pay for their [CodeWord140] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord140) smelling shoe boxes. Seems Acolonizer was right all the time. People are overpaying enormously.
Been there a few times myself. Maxim?
The strip club is one of the Rhino clubs.That sounds familiar. Thank you. No idea about what Rhino clubs are though. Is it worth a repeat visit in your opinion?
Hey, Pro.
It keeps being discussed because some guys, based on their posts, prefer the "certainty" of a known venue.Even though I can not pronounce your name I salute your wisdom and experience. A refreshing and initiated post among all the repetitive turf pissing. Keep posting. You have at least one reader.
Cheers / Barba
Horny Monger
03-20-12, 02:04
For the benefit of the ongoing thing about the Looks of the girls & the scale in relation to price.
I have copied& pasted parts of LJ's first post here. OF relevance here are the looks of the Polish Girls in London that he posted on.
Amelia& Gloria.
US$300 gets you one hour with them according to the Agency's site, compared to say something similar in Kiev for 3 hours.
Using Amelia&Gloria as the benchmark or if you like yard stick for comarison purposes with Rio girls, can anyone here point out the Rio Girls who are on the same scale as Amelia& Gloria in LONDON.
Then, we are talking about a Known quality.Amelia&Gloria is a good-looking girl with a hot body, but there's no need to spend $300 an hour with a girl like Amelia&Gloria.
I did a girl last autumn, Paulina, whose face and body looked in real person so much like Amelia&Gloria in the photos. Even their eye colors are the same.
She offered unlimited number of cums, deep throat BBBJ, CIM with swallow and long time DFK, etc except anal for miserly $70 an hour.
She has one of the two pairs of perfect breasts I've ever seen.
She's always busy.
I wasn't surprised because at this price with that kind of beauty and GFE quality, lots of guys'd be waiting.
She's great GFE, but I also turned her into hard-core, doing hard-core fuck and face-fuck.
Horny Monger
03-20-12, 02:15
It keeps being discussed because some guys, based on their posts, prefer the "certainty" of a known venue. There is a lot of energy put into "quantifying" the experience in terms of cost per hour, cost per orgasm, cost per unit of beauty, etc. Which is a bit excessive. And at some point, a decision was made (and then repeatedly rationalized) that Rio represented the lowest risk, highest value option for a newbie. Exploring other alternatives would involve a different set of skills, attitudes, and beliefs.
As it relates to non-pros (and that's my PRIMARY focus since it represents the largest pool of available women in ANY city) , many on this board believe that wining and dining a woman for several dates or offering her money are required for her to have sex with you. You and I both know that's simply untrue. Completely, absolutely untrue, provided a guy knows what he's doing. We both know it's possible to walk into a bar or night club, chat up some women, and leave with companionship for the evening (or meetings scheduled later) no money required. Now, when you START with that understanding, there is an entire city at your disposal. Humans are creatures of habit and the same women tend to go to the same places on a regular basis. By constantly exploring new venues you gain access to a fresh crop because each bar / night club / restaurant is a new pool of applicants.Right. Some of LJ's posts do fit with your well-said description, quote: 'There is a lot of energy put into "quantifying" the experience in terms of cost per hour, cost per orgasm, cost per unit of beauty, etc. Which is a bit excessive. And at some point, a decision was made (and then repeatedly rationalized) that Rio represented the lowest risk, highest value option for a newbie. '
Perhaps LJ is not interested in going after older chicks or MILFs; it seems he's going after the hot 18 to 22 year old group. With limited time but wanting a sure thing from hot chicks much younger than himself, LJ has found his place.
Unless a man is or looks under 40, it'the be quite a feat to chat up a hot 18 to 22 year old young girl and to frequently have his wicked ways with her for 'free'.
How often is it really free when a man 35 to over 40 is dating a 18 to 20 year old hot chick?
Horny Monger
03-20-12, 02:25
The only difference between RIO and the clubs you describe above including great ones in London as well, is that in RIO there are girls you can take out for US$300 for 3 hours.
This is a fact, not some kind of Fantasy in Candy Land, where its 4 your eyes only.
What is disputed by some members here, are the looks of the girls, and the Scale used in tthe evalution of such looks.
US$300 over 3 hours, is US$100 per hour, and if you can pop more than 3 times during this time, then it can work out at less than US$70 per pop.
Unfortunately for me, even with Levitra, I wouldn't be able to manage that, being in the wrong half of my 40s.
This thread is becoming addictive.Eye candy is not real fun.
I want to play.
I avoid Buddha Bar like the plague.
The bar and the girls (even the freebies (?) are waaaaaay too pretentious for my tastes. The decor is somewhat amusing (in that trying too hard way but not quite getting it) and I find the food average and very overpriced. I find it amusing that girls and some guys view this as some kind of ultra swanky place. It's just a flash place for people who think they have something to flash.
OK Bar is where the local juice used to like to go, haven't been there is a year so I don't know if it's still trendy.
Anyone been to Beef? Or is it called Meat? That place across from Decedance? It looks interesting but I don't know if it's all flash.The most sensible post I've seen in a long time.
Horrible place, way overpriced, and way past-it old pros. Never heard anyone I trust say they got a good service even for the minimum $200 I know some old-timers managed to get (3 hours).
Agree with every word about the clientele and decor C. D.
And there are 8 pages of reports to wade through!
Arrived back in Kyiv yesterday evening. For those interested and asking about what the weather will be like when I visit etc. It's impossible to tell, check the 3-day forecast, anything more than 3 days is usually wrong and drastically revised during your stay! Just remember I was here last month and subject to. 28c. Yesterday and today were +20c. Tomorrow will be around +10c. In April could be anywhere between +3c and +27c, most likely about +17 I guess.
Mainly meeting friends this trip, cultivating potential freebies. Did have a free evening tonight though and instead of visiting a club, went on the websites and invited two girls over from Mamba, one masseur at $50 for 90 minutes. Sex would cost $100. She was 18yo but not too hot (maybe a 6) but she gave very firm professional massage and I couldn't resist fucking her. The landing strip on the pussy just drew me in (nice to see not everyone is totally shaven).
Then just made myself a coffee having shoved the 18yo out the door when I got a ping from Mamba, and this time struck lucky with a great GFE, studentka, occasional pro.
Very girl next door, cute, fit body.
Tomorrow likely I'll be out of action. Damn annoyed I missed the Fashion party. Reminds me of the old days of Moda Bar and other great pre-Eurovision times.
Once again agree with Cruiser D and another of the veterans I respected from day I found this board: Uke Boy, while Dr Skank is a great loss.
It is kind of funny reading about RIO and GIA. It's like reading a review of the McD on Khreshatic. Rio was awesome before 2006, it's way overplayed now. GIA was over in what. 2002?I do remember thinking how much I missed on first trips to Kyiv, trying to discover everything on my own. Mind you even Kyiv Post had $50 girls advertising to help newbies, and with vintage R. P. (and Mandarin, Moda. 112) it was hard to go wrong!
However I've always been partial to strip joints, as an hors the'ouerves before the main event, although I usually try to pull the strippers too (having a business card is too hard for girls to hide. I write my number on a few small pieces of paper, then fold them up, before I head out. Much easier to push one of those into girls' palm even with the omnipresent cameras.
And it does annoy the hell out of me how poor the Rio stage shows are now compared to when I first visited (pre-fire, with casino upstairs). In those days though it was so expensive to take a girl out she had to be a 9 or above to even contemplate, but the atmosphere was good.
This is a fairly new hotel that opened last week in Kiev.
http://www.fairmont.com/kyiv/?cmpid=.OVKEY=fairmont
Has anyone managed to stay here for mongering purposes?
I know it's expensive, just wanted to have a change from the usual apartment experienceHey Immy. It would have been very handy for R. P. Bit far out for me.
I imagine there's a fair chance security will sense a chance to line their pockets.
.
Its back 2 the times, when it was HunterDave V UB& Bez Bezarra, remember.
It might not find you girls, but makes you read between the lines, some of it makes you really wonder?
In fact, I can see here both sides of the Input, Rant, whatever.
I said I usually go to Rio every night when in town&enjoy the dances, atmosphere, but I never took out any girl from there, not at US$300, when I only go for short sessions anyway.
And paying US$3oo in one go, defeats the whole object of me going to Kiev (Mongering) in the first place.
Off topic here, Hydro park in the Summer is a great place, if you have a Russian speaking wingman, or better still go with a nice looking BI girl & let her do the hunting 4 both of you.Getting the Bi-girl in the first place is not easy though! I just ended with a bi GF. Maybe I'll regret in a few months!
Idropark is a good place to go look / mingle. Lots of great, scantily clad bodies in various states of inebriation as the day turns into evening!
And with its own metro stop. Even newbies can't get lost.
Has anyone been to Paradise club on Schevchenko lately?
Can you still take dancers home?Still? Considering they were trying to charge about 3 times what a very good RP girl would go for, and not until you'd bought extortionate champagne, and had the attitude of a Militsiya General who just found out you made his hitherto virgin 17yo daughter pregnant. I decided to steer clear for many, many years. Oh, actually I did accompany someone who was insistent on going once. He was convinced the stage show would be quality. He soon bowed to my knowledge and pledged never to doubt me again!
YMMV
Guys should get flamed for posting BS and lies.
I know plenty of guys who love Rio and plenty who don't.
What is important is LJ posts the truth AS HE SEES IT, including his own ratings.
I've met Joey, he's a straight up guy and I'd stake a lot on him never having so much as a free cup of chai in Rio.
I go to Rio when I need to, or sometimes just to meet other mongers.
The problem with the line-up at the moment is probably "cramming". Students are having to fit in their year's work into a month shorter in 2012 because of Euro, so they don't want to commit to the 5 days a week minimum they want you to work. All I can say is I would be surprised if any club had more good-looking girls working. ADmittedly some won't sleep with you "dancers only", but LJ makes some valid points (albeit in a verbose way!) and tips such as simply asking Pasha or Dima if either X or Y leaves the club. Or sometime I have just said "Pasha" you know I want to take home a very slim, blonde, under 22, with decent attitude. And he will send someone over! We talk without onbligation, and if I like her I buy a drink and negotiate time / services.
I also used to go to R. P. Quite a bit, again because of convenience. You knew you could go there and pick up a girl of reasonable quality.
In those days there were many "old timers" as I used to think of them then, who used to flame guys for just going to RP and missing out on so much.
It's undoubtedly true the best sex is very very seldom with girls in the club. Rio overworks its girls and their service has gone down.
If you are fortunate enough to be able to hook a date and get her into bed you'll be very happy. But it's much the same as anywhere in the world. If you can't score at home you may struggle in Kyiv. Confidence is a massive factor, and age is only a minor handicap. So if you're around 50 and confident (ask Hunter Dave) you'll be fine. If you're 42 and lacking in confidence and "gift of the gab" you will struggle. Language problems are a bigger handicap than age.
I'm sure you could work out a mathematical formula, but maybe knock 10 years off your age and think the kind of success and types of girls you pulled back home then. That's what you should get in Kyiv now.
Right I risk being panned for boring the shit out of everyone. Enough said. LJ speaks sense and truth, though not to everyone's taste. Wise old hands Uke Boy, C. D. Et al know the whole scene from experience.
Must go sleep, got another Mamba girl due in 3. 5 hours, let's see if she wakes me up with her call!
RomanyStar
03-20-12, 06:28
Thanks to all here. I'd call my Kiev trip an overall success. Damns the luck being here while the college girls are all busy cramming. Being sleep deprived from the ten time zone trip probably hasn't helped a bunch either. Wish I'd had the originally planned ten days instead of trying to power through my priorities in five.
Before I get on the plane I want to suggest that this board needs a FAQ in the worst way. There are some great examples around on ISG, and some pretty articulate writers here. Be awesome if those currently posting made a cooperative effort to generate and maintain a single document where us first timers could go. You would be doing a great service to Jackson's poor server full of repeated entreaties from the board to newbies to read through many pages of what can often be useless. Not saying there isn't a ton of good info here, but getting past the style and personality clashes is a time wasting chore.
Not sure if anyone is interested, but the map I prepared for my trip has over 300 hits from distinct IP's. Someone out there is wading back to the links and following them. Since I doubt I'll be back I won't be putting any more work into it, but am willing to help pass it off to anyone interested in maintaining it. If not I'll leave it up as long as I see it is getting used. A link in a FAQ document would sure make it easier for those that need it to find it too.
I'll bring it to the top one last time:
http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?ie=UTF&msa=0&msid=202083364326811814553.0004b69c9d40f14d29d51
Still? Considering they were trying to charge about 3 times what a very good RP girl would go for, and not until you'd bought extortionate champagne, and had the attitude of a Militsiya General who just found out you made his hitherto virgin 17yo daughter pregnant. I decided to steer clear for many, many years. Oh, actually I did accompany someone who was insistent on going once. He was convinced the stage show would be quality. He soon bowed to my knowledge and pledged never to doubt me again!
YMMVThanks thats all I needed to know.
I thought I read its a sister club of Rio and thought its all the same
Thanks thats all I needed to know.
I thought I read its a sister club of Rio and thought its all the sameAh, you're getting mixed up. Paradise on Shevchenko is "Paradise Cabaret" part of the Premier Palace hotel.
Personally I've not been to Rio's sister club. It's out of town, don't even know where. LJ got a complimentary taxi once I believe.
If I go out of town it's for a date or Club MaXimum (or previously Rest Town!)
Amelia&Gloria is a good-looking girl with a hot body, but there's no need to spend $300 an hour with a girl like Amelia&Gloria.
I did a girl last autumn, Paulina, whose face and body looked in real person so much like Amelia&Gloria in the photos. Even their eye colors are the same.
She offered unlimited number of cums, deep throat BBBJ, CIM with swallow and long time DFK, etc except anal for miserly $70 an hour.
She has one of the two pairs of perfect breasts I've ever seen.
She's always busy.
I wasn't surprised because at this price with that kind of beauty and GFE quality, lots of guys'd be waiting.
She's great GFE, but I also turned her into hard-core, doing hard-core fuck and face-fuck.Wow! Out of curiosity, which city / country was this Paulina offering herself for $70 / hour?
You say Paulina is as pretty a girl as Amelia who is in London at 180 GBP? That's pretty low priced for a girl looking that good in London. How did you find Paulina? Amelia remains as one of my ATF's, so I guess that's why I'm curious. (unfortunately the link to Gloria is obsolete but there are plenty of other high level EE hotties on the same agency websites)?
I have been a passive user of this forum for many years. I haven't added any reports mainly because somehow I have been afraid that it will leave some tracks of my trips. But now that I see what are people writing to LilJoey I had to write something. With his advices I had many great experiences in Rio (ok I would figured that out myself as well, but it saved me some time). Ok, I am Slavic guy so I have maybe little advantage comparing to other ethnic groups. My Russian sucks, but it never was a problem. Some of you are saying that he is paid by the club for writing lies and that girls won't go with you. I will tell you for sure LilJoey is not lying. Maybe one girl from 10 has told me so far that she won't go out with me. Its all about how you act, if you are gentleman. It is great that girls there have their right to choose who they go with. Maybe if you go there, drink one tea for 2 hours and and just starring at the girls, nobody will go with you. Or maybe you are just plain ugly.
I am glad that people share info, but I don't want to convince you to go there. I am always happy when not too many people is there. For me and my friends, Rio is the heaven, and I don't think that I can find a better place in the world for beautiful model like ladies (considering my taste).
Hopefully this club will last forever.
Just yesterday in Paradise I saw a girl. Her name was Leja. Anybody knows here? She was the most beautifull (naked) women I have seen for years. I had made my choice already, so I couldn't change.
Ok thats for my first post. I will try to add some experiences if I will somehow dig out the names that are buried somewhere inside my brain.
Thank you guys for all the advices, this forum is golden.
Ah, you're getting mixed up. Paradise on Shevchenko is "Paradise Cabaret" part of the Premier Palace hotel.
Personally I've not been to Rio's sister club. It's out of town, don't even know where. LJ got a complimentary taxi once I believe.
If I go out of town it's for a date or Club MaXimum (or previously Rest Town!) TheKnight's memory is good. There was one night at Rio when there was no "take out" being permitted at all, and the girls were strictly doing dances. Either it was because they were understaffed, or it could have been there was LE present in the club. They offered to drive me over to their sister club at no charge since they knew I was looking for a take out and would strike if I found a good girl. It was about a 30 to 40 minute drive from downtewn Kiev. It was the same staff as you could see at Rio, as the girls rotate to do shifts at the sister club. Personally I can't think of a reason to make the trip, unless you are looking for a specific girl and the manager at Rio tells you she's at the other club. In that event, if you've already been out with her and definitely want to take her now, I would inquire if she could be brought to you at Rio while you have a drink, or "reserved" for you at the other club if you're willing to go pick her up.
Hi guys,
I simply cannot decide which one should I choose.
I have been in Kiev 2 years ago but never been in Chisinau.
Which one do you recommend?
A detailed analysis would be very much appreciated.
BR.Assuming you've read the thread on this forum for Chisinau and Kiev, and you are therefore aware that p4p is highly developed and available in Kiev, whereas in Chisinau the p4p scene is more limited, it's a no brainer that if you're looking for p4p action that you should go to Kiev.
However, if you are able to speak Russian and are looking for freebie action and adventure, then different criteria apply and since I've never been to Chisinau, I will defer trying to answer that question to someone who does have the experience to give you a meaningful response.
Her face is typically Slavic, with eyes to get lost in. Anyway I'd rate her 7. 5. I guess she'd be a solid 9 for most of the guys in Western Europe or in the US, but by FSU standarts she his IMO just "not that skanky".You're right, I would have given her body a slightly higher rating than 7. 5. The good news for those interested in scoring with a stripper on her level of good looks, is that there are a significant number of young girls with bodies on her level or better available in the Kiev strip clubs too, if you're willing to pay the price.
If one is not willing to pay the high prices of the strip clubs for take out, then it's more hit or miss trying to find a girl like this using websites at lower prices, but not impossible.
Getting girls like this into your bed for free? Ahh well this is the area in which you operate Prosal, so please tell us the story of how you got this hot stripper.
Every now and then, this forum gets into weird debate of how to scale girls. For the sake of common ground, I use the oThER major sex forum as the template of what constitutes a 7 or 8 and so on. Eighty percent of the many thousands of mongers of that forum concur as to what is what in appearance. Sure some members skew it with overly personalized ratings but a common denominator is generally reached among the mass.
For the members that state 10's don't exist or Victoria Secret models are 8's, well I have no idea what to say to that.
Getting the Bi-girl in the first place is not easy though! I just ended with a bi GF. Maybe I'll regret in a few months!
Idropark is a good place to go look / mingle. Lots of great, scantily clad bodies in various states of inebriation as the day turns into evening!
And with its own metro stop. Even newbies can't get lost.Yes, unless the girl is a Pro, it would be difficult 4 a civvy girl to out herself to you that she is Bi.
In my misspent youth on both sides of the Atlantic, most of my girlfriends were working in cosmetics&perfumery and were so much fun as well as with good looks.
The majority of them were Bi. How did I find this out? .
I figured rather than spending money going to the gym, why not turn a huge spare room in my place into a mini gym, complete with a big jacuzzi, sunbed, shower &treadmill. And with some indoor plants& the right lighting and music system, it was a truly sexy place.
Going out with my girlfriend at the time on a lot of after work social drinks with other girls (No Guys at all) , the girls at the end of very boozy sessions, were dying by then to come back to my health club for more drinks& a dip in the Jacuzzi.
Once in the jacuzzi with 2 or 3 girls you would be surpsied at how Bi they were, when you thought at first they were straight? . It was the quickest & cheapest way to get them undressed in a natural way & 4 me to get into their pussies. Over time ex girfriends were becoming more like Buddies & Ladettes, and I kept in touch with some. .
It was like penetrating a closed social club. .
In Kiev, I don't know if its a culture or languages issues, but I found it difficult to get a non pro girl to admit that she is BI.
I don't like to go to a normal club on my own, looking like a lone lost Dick in my late 40s chasing young pussies.
This is when a good looking BI wing girl comes handy, as a magnet to atttract another girl.
And this what I am working on & doing with my Darina from Donetsk, whom she felt hurt at first, when I told her that being just with her is not very exciting 4 me.
Hence she is my friend now with benefits. IF she didn't agree, I was seriously thinking of bringing one of my good looking BI Ladette from London on a monering & pulling trip 2 Kiev. On a longer stay in Kiev, I am going to stay in an Apartment with a Jacuzzi to go down memory lane.
Sorry to bore you with all the above BS, but you got me nostalgic. Will dig up some old photos to complete the picture.
BTW, I am glad to see that you posted in time about your honest opinion of Liljoey, who was getting at times the same reception as Hunter Dave got, when he first posted.
At those times even some posters were doubting that a monger by such name existed.
Well I didn't get to meet Hunter, but I met a great looking girl Inna, whom Hunter met & had the pleasure with. And her description of Hunter's looks match photos that he posted here.
Now watch this space for more Action, when Hunter lands in Kiev at the end of the Month.
In the meantime have Fun & keep us updated.
Cheers
Ronaldinjo
03-20-12, 14:07
And there are 8 pages of reports to wade through!
Arrived back in Kyiv yesterday evening. For those interested and asking about what the weather will be like when I visit etc. It's impossible to tell, check the 3-day forecast, anything more than 3 days is usually wrong and drastically revised during your stay! Just remember I was here last month and subject to. 28c. Yesterday and today were +20c. Tomorrow will be around +10c. In April could be anywhere between +3c and +27c, most likely about +17 I guess.
Mainly meeting friends this trip, cultivating potential freebies. Did have a free evening tonight though and instead of visiting a club, went on the websites and invited two girls over from Mamba, one masseur at $50 for 90 minutes. Sex would cost $100. She was 18yo but not too hot (maybe a 6) but she gave very firm professional massage and I couldn't resist fucking her. The landing strip on the pussy just drew me in (nice to see not everyone is totally shaven).
Then just made myself a coffee having shoved the 18yo out the door when I got a ping from Mamba, and this time struck lucky with a great GFE, studentka, occasional pro.
Very girl next door, cute, fit body.
Tomorrow likely I'll be out of action. Damn annoyed I missed the Fashion party. Reminds me of the old days of Moda Bar and other great pre-Eurovision times.
Once again agree with Cruiser D and another of the veterans I respected from day I found this board: Uke Boy, while Dr Skank is a great loss.
I do remember thinking how much I missed on first trips to Kyiv, trying to discover everything on my own. Mind you even Kyiv Post had $50 girls advertising to help newbies, and with vintage R. P. (and Mandarin, Moda. 112) it was hard to go wrong!
However I've always been partial to strip joints, as an hors the'ouerves before the main event, although I usually try to pull the strippers too (having a business card is too hard for girls to hide. I write my number on a few small pieces of paper, then fold them up, before I head out. Much easier to push one of those into girls' palm even with the omnipresent cameras.
And it does annoy the hell out of me how poor the Rio stage shows are now compared to when I first visited (pre-fire, with casino upstairs). In those days though it was so expensive to take a girl out she had to be a 9 or above to even contemplate, but the atmosphere was good.Hello, knight. Were the girls much more better looking then or what compared to novadays? What was the difference? Can you explain?
Ronaldinjo
03-20-12, 14:19
[QUOTE=TheKnight; 1259654]Guys should get flamed for posting BS and lies.
The problem with the line-up at the moment is probably "cramming". Students are having to fit in their year's work into a month shorter in 2012 because of Euro, so they don't want to commit to the 5 days a week minimum they want you to work.
Theknight, do you meen that this is the reason why there are not a lo of good looking girls there now? The egzams untill the end of may? You think the quality will improve during and after euro or stay the same?
Guys should get flamed for posting BS and lies.
I know plenty of guys who love Rio and plenty who don't.
What is important is LJ posts the truth AS HE SEES IT, including his own ratings.
I've met Joey, he's a straight up guy and I'd stake a lot on him never having so much as a free cup of chai in Rio.
I go to Rio when I need to, or sometimes just to meet other mongers.
The problem with the line-up at the moment is probably "cramming". Students are having to fit in their year's work into a month shorter in 2012 because of Euro, so they don't want to commit to the 5 days a week minimum they want you to work. All I can say is I would be surprised if any club had more good-looking girls working. ADmittedly some won't sleep with you "dancers only", but LJ makes some valid points (albeit in a verbose way!) and tips such as simply asking Pasha or Dima if either X or Y leaves the club. Or sometime I have just said "Pasha" you know I want to take home a very slim, blonde, under 22, with decent attitude. And he will send someone over! We talk without onbligation, and if I like her I buy a drink and negotiate time / services.
I also used to go to R. P. Quite a bit, again because of convenience. You knew you could go there and pick up a girl of reasonable quality.
In those days there were many "old timers" as I used to think of them then, who used to flame guys for just going to RP and missing out on so much.
It's undoubtedly true the best sex is very very seldom with girls in the club. Rio overworks its girls and their service has gone down.
If you are fortunate enough to be able to hook a date and get her into bed you'll be very happy. But it's much the same as anywhere in the world. If you can't score at home you may struggle in Kyiv. Confidence is a massive factor, and age is only a minor handicap. So if you're around 50 and confident (ask Hunter Dave) you'll be fine. If you're 42 and lacking in confidence and "gift of the gab" you will struggle. Language problems are a bigger handicap than age.
I'm sure you could work out a mathematical formula, but maybe knock 10 years off your age and think the kind of success and types of girls you pulled back home then. That's what you should get in Kyiv now.
Right I risk being panned for boring the shit out of everyone. Enough said. LJ speaks sense and truth, though not to everyone's taste. Wise old hands Uke Boy, C. D. Et al know the whole scene from experience.
Must go sleep, got another Mamba girl due in 3. 5 hours, let's see if she wakes me up with her call!And when you met Liljoey at Rio club, you showed him the Translation Application on Your I Phone, Remember.
How do I know that, when I haven; t met either one of you.
Now I am waiting for someone to say, that I had a look on the CCTV for that night, because I am member of the Male Non Dancing Non Stripping staff of Rio Club.
Ahh, I also remember the times, when Good Old Bez Bezarra used to flame anyone who went to River Palace looking for hotties.
His recommendations were to head deep into Provincial Ukraine & the villages.
Call me a Pansy being now at my age, and especally when it comes to going deep inside Ukraine &
Russia, but had I listened to Bez's advice at the time, perhaps I would have ended with F All, to show 4 my trip. .
I am trying to locate here a very good & realistic report on who can score the most with Freebies in Kiev, it was posted by Waryman, but can't find it.
Anyone here, please post the link for it, if you can find it.
Guys should get flamed for posting BS and lies.
I know plenty of guys who love Rio and plenty who don't.
What is important is LJ posts the truth AS HE SEES IT, including his own ratings.
I've met Joey, he's a straight up guy and I'd stake a lot on him never having so much as a free cup of chai in Rio.
I go to Rio when I need to, or sometimes just to meet other mongers.
The problem with the line-up at the moment is probably "cramming". Students are having to fit in their year's work into a month shorter in 2012 because of Euro, so they don't want to commit to the 5 days a week minimum they want you to work. All I can say is I would be surprised if any club had more good-looking girls working. ADmittedly some won't sleep with you "dancers only", but LJ makes some valid points (albeit in a verbose way!) and tips such as simply asking Pasha or Dima if either X or Y leaves the club. Or sometime I have just said "Pasha" you know I want to take home a very slim, blonde, under 22, with decent attitude. And he will send someone over! We talk without onbligation, and if I like her I buy a drink and negotiate time / services.
I also used to go to R. P. Quite a bit, again because of convenience. You knew you could go there and pick up a girl of reasonable quality.
In those days there were many "old timers" as I used to think of them then, who used to flame guys for just going to RP and missing out on so much.
It's undoubtedly true the best sex is very very seldom with girls in the club. Rio overworks its girls and their service has gone down.
If you are fortunate enough to be able to hook a date and get her into bed you'll be very happy. But it's much the same as anywhere in the world. If you can't score at home you may struggle in Kyiv. Confidence is a massive factor, and age is only a minor handicap. So if you're around 50 and confident (ask Hunter Dave) you'll be fine. If you're 42 and lacking in confidence and "gift of the gab" you will struggle. Language problems are a bigger handicap than age.
I'm sure you could work out a mathematical formula, but maybe knock 10 years off your age and think the kind of success and types of girls you pulled back home then. That's what you should get in Kyiv now.
Right I risk being panned for boring the shit out of everyone. Enough said. LJ speaks sense and truth, though not to everyone's taste. Wise old hands Uke Boy, C. D. Et al know the whole scene from experience.
Must go sleep, got another Mamba girl due in 3. 5 hours, let's see if she wakes me up with her call!And when you met Liljoey at Rio club, you showed him the Translation Application on Your I Phone, Remember.
How do I know that, when I haven; t met either one of you.
Now I am waiting for someone to say, that I had a look on the CCTV for that night, because I am member of the Male Non Dancing Non Stripping staff of Rio Club.
Ahh, I also remember the times, when Good Old Bez Bezarra used to flame anyone who went to River Palace looking for hotties.
His recommendations were to head deep into Provincial Ukraine & the villages.
Call me a Pansy being now at my age, and especally when it comes to going deep inside Ukraine &
Russia, but had I listened to Bez's advice at the time, perhaps I would have ended with F All, to show 4 my trip.
I am trying to locate here a very good & realistic report on who can score the most with Freebies in Kiev, it was posted by Waryman, but can't find it.
Anyone here, please post the link for it, if you can find it.
Right. Some of LJ's posts do fit with your well-said description, quote: 'There is a lot of energy put into "quantifying" the experience in terms of cost per hour, cost per orgasm, cost per unit of beauty, etc. Which is a bit excessive. And at some point, a decision was made (and then repeatedly rationalized) that Rio represented the lowest risk, highest value option for a newbie. '
Perhaps LJ is not interested in going after older chicks or MILFs; it seems he's going after the hot 18 to 22 year old group. With limited time but wanting a sure thing from hot chicks much younger than himself, LJ has found his place.
Unless a man is or looks under 40, it'the be quite a feat to chat up a hot 18 to 22 year old young girl and to frequently have his wicked ways with her for 'free'.
How often is it really free when a man 35 to over 40 is dating a 18 to 20 year old hot chick?You know, you are right: 18. 22 year olds are not my target market anymore for several reasons. First, I have a 17 year old niece whom I adore and the creepy / pervy factor goes up when I even consider someone close to her age. Second, I spent several years in "stripper world" which means I was a stripper boyfriend, hung out with strip club owners, went to stripper weddings, stripper birthday parties, hung out with strippers for Thanksgiving, New Years, Christmas, and vacations, etc. Are you getting my point? I'm strippered-OUT. (BTW, my professional career is 180 degrees from that aspect of my social life.) And, third, I prefer a woman with a little more life experience. I'd rather have the 25 year old yoga instructor or the 30 year old ER nurse who runs 5 days a week instead of the 20 year old stripper or student. I'm in my late 30's, so perhaps I'll come back around someday.
Now, to answer your question about the 35-40 year old man with a 18-20 year old chick, it comes down to roles. In the past, I have gone with the mentor / mentee frame which is driven by the belief that women in that age group crave interesting, new, fun, exciting experiences like junkies. Here, I'm inviting her in and sharing my world in a way guys her own age cannot, specifically, along on things I ALREADY plan on doing. If a close male friend forgot his wallet at home, would I buy him a drink if I was ALREADY ordering one for myself? Of course. Several years ago, a little redhead turned to me at dinner and said she realized we weren't going to nice places because I was trying to impress her. Rather, I'd be there ANYWAY even if she weren't with me. BINGO! With the mentor / mentee role, you expand her model of the world by placing a VALUE on your 30+ years of experience and communicating that in a way she can understand. The 18-20 year old wants to be seen as a "real woman" (gross generalization) , not a little girl. The joke is each one has some unconscious metric as to how much "experience" is required for her to be a "real woman", hence the craving. That's your target. Your job is to push that emotional button, while being the cool, confident MAN she can look up to. As it relates to pick up, HER ability to snag a cool, confident, worthy man is a direct reflection on her value as a WOMAN. Complete reframe. Granted, if she's a total party girl with ADD, then she's going to go chasing after the next "shiny thing" anyway. However, ADD party girls are a subset of 18-20 year old hot chicks, just like strippers are only a subset of hot women, in general. This is just an approach I have used. I'm sure others have their own process / framework / structure.
For the members that state 10's don't exist or Victoria Secret models are 8's, well I have no idea what to say to that.Any talent scout can tell you that 10's don't exist. It is not only a question of mensurations, height, bust measurement, marked camber, impish nose, mellow lips, or perfect geometry between eyes interval and neck nobility. Beauty is a mathematic equation: as an exemple, the distance between the base of the nose and the chin must be the same than between the crest of the forehead and the eyebrows. There is rules to respect, as the "Golden Number" (1. 61803399) , which is the height of Keops pyramid divided by its half-base. If you divide the girl's height by the distance between the ground and the navel, you must obtain this number, which also must be equal to the distance between the ground and the navel divided by the distance between the navel and the top of the skull. True connoiseurs will tell you that a girl which doesn't suit those criterions is literally unfuckable.
As for the "eighty percent of the many thousands of mongers of that forum concur as to what is what in appearance", I see in some forums many many photos of girls described as "drop dead gorgeous" but that I wouldn't rate above 2's and that I wouldn't touch with a 10" pole.
Scaling girlsThe "Golden Number" was of course a joke, but it's a pure fact that beauty is a mathematic equation, and by no means something subjective. Anyone working in the model business will confirm that.
Dave Carrera
03-20-12, 19:14
http://escort-models.com/en/models/sort:price:asc/
Seems too good to be. Anybody ever use this?
Dave
Goodbye Lenin
03-20-12, 19:32
http://escort-models.com/en/models/sort:price:asc/
Seems too good to be. Anybody ever use this?
DaveFull of fakes.
http://escort-models.com/en/models/sort:price:asc/
Seems too good to be. Anybody ever use this?
DaveHi Dave,
I recall our PM correspondence where you were seeking advice regarding having a batchelor party in Kiev, and I reference my post on this thread of February 23, 2012, concerning my ideas for your batchelor party, see: http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showthread.php?816-Kiev&p=1251303&viewfull=1#post1251303
So, how have your plans progressed for the batchelor party?
I have reported previously on the website you asked about www.escort-models.com. I have also seen reports by other members about this agency.
Unfortunately, Goobye Lenin is correct. The photos look and are too good to be true. So don't rely on the photos of this agency to order girls to staff your batchelor party.
However, this does not mean you can't get good looking girls from this agency. It merely means the pictures are fake, and you will have to do some work to reveal what this agency is capable of delivering. I reported my own experience with such websites, where a really extremely skinny spindley blond girl with an ok face showed up in response to my invitation to send one of the website hotties, and I complained to the girl who came and told her that I wanted a girl like the one on the website that I showed her on my laptop. She said she will arrange things with her agency and a pretty girl will come. I did wait a longer time than they said, and the agency was not that reassuring on the phone when I called, so instead I made other arrangements and a girl I had been with before was soon on her way. But then lo and behold a very pretty girl did show up from the agency. So I got it cleared with both girls and had an impromptu 3some. What it means is that you must do the investigative work I wrote to you about and go throught the websites and make dates and send away the girls who don't make the cut, and try out the girls who look good and come up with some girls who make the grade to be invited to the batchelor party, so it will be a good one.
At the time Gentleman Travel wrote some good advice which I will cite to you again.
I would just like to add that you don't necessarily have to find dozens of quality girls for your bachelor party. First you have to find 2 or 3 really good girls (in terms of price and quality) whether they be pros or semi-pros. Then they can find other girls for you. Like any business, referrals are invaluable. All girls are plugged into vast networks of friends and colleagues, and if you find one that suits your needs then chances are she has friends who will meet your friends' needs. A hot 8. 0 blonde who is doing everything you want for $300 is not going to set you up with frigid faker who wants $500. So work the dyev network to expand your network.This is the way to get enough good looking girls for your batchelor party at a reasonably low cost.
I wrote to you about the higher cost option at the strip club which would not involve a lot of preliminary investigative work to find good looking girls, since it reliably has a lot of good looking girls present at the club on any given night, but there the risk is in performance of the girls once you get them home, and therefore even at the strip club it would be best to try out a few of the girls in advance, until you know you have winners to invite to the batchelors party.
Lastly, I wrote to you that an FKK trip would be a blast for a batchelor's party, especially if you haven't been to FKK's before. It will literally knock your socks off, and you may become addicted, as so many on this forum have.
I will be hitting the FKK's later in April. I will be in Berlin's Artemis on the night of April 19, and I will be in Frankfurt for weekend of April 20 to 22 and plan to hit FKK Oase and FKK Palace, two of the best FKK's. If you want to do a preliminary expedition then, I would be glad to show you the ropes.
So where are you along the process of planning your party? Never heard back from you.
And when you met Liljoey at Rio club, you showed him the Translation Application on Your I Phone, Remember.
How do I know that, when I haven; t met either one of you.
Now I am waiting for someone to say, that I had a look on the CCTV for that night, because I am member of the Male Non Dancing Non Stripping staff of Rio Club.Before you freak out TheKnight with your last one, Jojosun, I should remind that I believe I posted this information somewhere previously and told about the application TheKnight showed me, in trying to explain to mongers that not speaking Russian doesn't mean they have to entirely give up on getting girls who don't speak English. I have been using Google Translate on my laptop, and on my Blackberry to do enough translation so that I can get by enough to get into the pussy in question. And a touch and talk application like the one TheKnight showed me would work even better.
Guys should get flamed for posting BS and lies.
The problem with the line-up at the moment is probably "cramming". Students are having to fit in their year's work into a month shorter in 2012 because of Euro, so they don't want to commit to the 5 days a week minimum they want you to work.Theknight, do you meen that this is the reason why there are not a lo of good looking girls there now? The egzams untill the end of may? You think the quality will improve during and after euro or stay the same?Ronaldinjo, don't get into a tizzy over this. When is your trip to Kiev? I was just in Kiev for weekend of February 17 to 19 and everything at Rio was as usual, plenty of pretty girls. I will be in Kiev for March 30 to April 4 again, and will likely go to Rio during that period, although this time I have a number of evenings set up with dates with girls I met on prior trips. I will definitely report if I see anything remarkable amiss at the club in terms of line up. There was a bit of a wane in the line up at the end of last summer in August / September 2011, for whatever reason. So it sometimes happens. But generally speaking the line up has a fair number of hotties.
Ronaldinjo
03-21-12, 00:20
Hi Dave,
I recall our PM correspondence where you were seeking advice regarding having a batchelor party in Kiev, and I reference my post on this thread of February 23, 2012, concerning my ideas for your batchelor party, see:
http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showthread.php?816-Kiev&p=1251303&viewfull=1#post1251303
So, how have your plans progressed for the batchelor party?
I have reported previously on the website you asked about.
www.escort-models.com
I have also seen reports by other members about this agency.
Unfortunately, Goobye Lenin is correct. The photos look and are too good to be true. So don't rely on the photos of this agency to order girls to staff your batchelor party.
However, this does not mean you can't get good looking girls from this agency. It merely means the pictures are fake, and you will have to do some work to reveal what this agency is capable of delivering. I reported my own experience with such websites, where a really extremely skinny spindley blond girl with an ok face showed up in response to my invitation to send one of the website hotties, and I complained to the girl who came and told her that I wanted a girl like the one on the website that I showed her on my laptop. She said she will arrange things with her agency and a pretty girl will come. I did wait a longer time than they said, and the agency was not that reassuring on the phone when I called, so instead I made other arrangements and a girl I had been with before was soon on her way. But then lo and behold a very pretty girl did show up from the agency. So I got it cleared with both girls and had an impromptu 3some. What it means is that you must do the investigative work I wrote to you about and go throught the websites and make dates and send away the girls who don't make the cut, and try out the girls who look good and come up with some girls who make the grade to be invited to the batchelor party, so it will be a good one.
At the time Gentleman Travel wrote some good advice which I will cite to you again.
This is the way to get enough good looking girls for your batchelor party at a reasonably low cost.
I wrote to you about the higher cost option at the strip club which would not involve a lot of preliminary investigative work to find good looking girls, since it reliably has a lot of good looking girls present at the club on any given night, but there the risk is in performance of the girls once you get them home, and therefore even at the strip club it would be best to try out a few of the girls in advance, until you know you have winners to invite to the batchelors party.
Lastly, I wrote to you that an FKK trip would be a blast for a batchelor's party, especially if you haven't been to FKK's before. It will literally knock your socks off, and you may become addicted, as so many on this forum have.
I will be hitting the FKK's later in April. I will be in Berlin's Artemis on the night of April 19, and I will be in Frankfurt for weekend of April 20 to 22 and plan to hit FKK Oase and FKK Palace, two of the best FKK's. If you want to do a preliminary expedition then, I would be glad to show you the ropes.
So where are you along the process of planning your party? Never heard back from you.
Before you freak out TheKnight with your last one, Jojosun, I should remind that I believe I posted this information somewhere previously and told about the application TheKnight showed me, in trying to explain to mongers that not speaking Russian doesn't mean they have to entirely give up on getting girls who don't speak English. I have been using Google Translate on my laptop, and on my Blackberry to do enough translation so that I can get by enough to get into the pussy in question. And a touch and talk application like the one TheKnight showed me would work even better.
Ronaldinjo, don't get into a tizzy over this. When is your trip to Kiev? I was just in Kiev for weekend of February 17 to 19 and everything at Rio was as usual, plenty of pretty girls. I will be in Kiev for March 30 to April 4 again, and will likely go to Rio during that period, although this time I have a number of evenings set up with dates with girls I met on prior trips. I will definitely report if I see anything remarkable amiss at the club in terms of line up. There was a bit of a wane in the line up at the end of last summer in August / September 2011, for whatever reason. So it sometimes happens. But generally speaking the line up has a fair number of hotties.Planning to fly to Kiev in the beggining of may for 2-3 days. I know the summer is not the best time for Kiev as a lot of hotties travel to the seas, but what about April-may? If there are a lot of students there as you mentioned so they are going to be in study vaccations. Does somebody know when the studies end in Kiev this year? Suppose earlier then last year because of euro 2012. Joey, you have been there last April, did you mention some abcence of hotties in that period of time?
Felix Nordic
03-21-12, 00:31
Good discussion here during the last 20 pages or so and contributions from many good members. Much welcome and it benefits us all. There is a huge need for a reality check regarding Kiev. Much needed IMHO.
What do you get compared to what you can get for that hard earned dough in other places? I feel some people just think that lets go to Kiev because it seems like a hot place for girls. Is it? For the first timer without experience I would say no way! Better chose another destination, like Germanys FKK, which pays of better for what you get. Nice to have some of the old guard posting here, and I think they contribute a lot, though I feel some are off as well. We all like to live in what it used to be like. However for the insider it might still be heaven, but that does not reflect the general situation now IMHO. Anyway, I go to other places than Kiev and thats for a reason. Easily!
I want to comment about Bez as well. IMHO he was a strange guy and a huge pain in the ass to many members including myself. In the end we got along better, but still I feel it is not fair to give him divine status just because he posted some pics and posted amusing replies. He even gave me a PM in the end but that does not excuse his ways. He herassed my arse in the early years, and many others, without a reason at all. All I tried to do here is to post what I like to think as usefull information and contribute and pay back as I have learned a lot here. I think I do so, at least I hope so in general, though Kiev is not my place in this particular reply, but I wish to start a reality check and a wake up for some members. If you think my posts are bad I challence you, to come up with any bad posts or faulty information posts I have made and compare with Bez replies. Please do it. Bez totally lacked social skills and a way to behave in a decent way. No loss for his leaving of this forum as I did not think he contributed in a good general way and he liked to pick on certain members. Thats not the way to do it on our forum and I understand if he was kicked. I have not actually read any good informative posts by him. I have only been a member here for 7 to 8 years, but please forgive me if my memory serves me wrong, but yet again no real value information by him in the open forum. With that said he also often posted quite nice pics I have o say, Kudos to him, but I wish he could have bought a better camara and been more socially skilled. The drop of Bez is good to this forum IMHO. I do not give a rats arse if other respected old guard members feel differently. Feel free to do so, and please correct me if my posts are bad. I welcome that, but please put Bez comments to mine in to the context. I will be glad to reply to that. Please be ready with good arguments.
Dr Skank is another matter and he was a huge asset to the forum. He was also a humble man with a lot of experience and a super hunter. I do miss him as well. I heard he has got tired of posting here as few qualified posts were given back. I do undertand him. Dr Skank, all the best wishes to you!)
Well, well. I have not seen a single photo of a girl posted in this Ukraine thread that was close to rival a girl I shagged in Frankfurts FKK Palace around 5 years ago. (As a side note that goes for some other girls I have shagged as well) Not even close, and I regard this girl named Danielle from Romania as a pure 9. When she entered the FKK club it was just perfect and what I needed as I had already done 3 nice girls. However I got her attention instantly as she entered and told her to go to a room. It was dinner time at 18. 00 and most were headed to the buffe that was served. It has been reported that she was snobbish and gave poor service to some guys but good service to others (her service including real tongue kissing and BBBJ as standard) and to me it was a real strike, to use bowling terms. No wonder why she was a bit snobbish, as she was aware of her market value. A bit of a shark but as I know a bit of Romanian I think I charmed her, or at least I like to think so, at least I made personal contact. My burst of semen hit her in her face and eyes and she became upset, but I calmed her with a few words in Romanian and excuses and sweet talking that I could not help it because she was so beautiful. I could be wrong, or just plain lucky, but I know what I got. However I can compare with other services I have gotten with P4P and she was great, very good. And a top beauty. I have never been with a true 10 as a side note. In my meter personality and performance weighs in as well. Age does not matter but rather beauty and performance matters even if she is that hot 18 or that hot 30. Beauty and performance counts. On my meter a rather popular porn actress should be a good comparison, not that it means I do worship her, or all men, but as a general standard meter. Those managing the porn industry knows which girls are hot because they are into it in a professional way. Thats why they use "male worship icons". Some of these girls you can get at $ 600, or above but be selective and smart, for 3 hours compared to a no name "no recognised beauty, or a no beauty" in a Kiev strip club at $ 300 for 3 hours. Lets compare. Does it make sense? Not to me. It really should be cheaper in in Kiev unless desperate rich guys plays it, loss or no loss, or really does not care. Instant gratification to feel like a real man is far more important to most. Would you buy a bottle of Veuve Clicquot for E 35 or a E 100? Your choice and your call, but be prepared to be named as crazy.
Prices are climbing and for those who try to manage their economy, and with a brain, for hunting good quality it is all changing. On todays market it is different. The sucker takes the bait, and the smart fish will get the good deal. It becomes more and more important to be smart and selective.
I post a photo of a girl that I consider to be a 9, not as sharp as Danielle girl in FKK palace, or other top girls IMHO that I have shagged, but on the other hand this girl in the photos did not cost me anything money wise. Ok, I did buy her roses and fancy lingerie and cooked her nice tasty food, but that does not count IMHO. I rate her as close to a model body and a nice model face. A real 9, but small tits though, but thats what you usually get with a really slim girl.
Cheers and happy hunting.
Felix
Global Surfer
03-21-12, 02:15
http://escort-models.com/en/models/sort:price:asc/
Seems too good to be. Anybody ever use this?
DavePhotos are usually fake, however sometime you may get a good deal. Remeber, for foreigners, this is one of the cheapest option. Please note if you send the girl back with just the taxi fare, they would not serve you again even though it is their fault to post a fake photo in the first place.
Personally I would prefer Mamba. Most photos even on mamba are fake or heavily photoshopped and it does require hard work but worth a try.
I generally prefer to meet them in afternoon. If all goes well then enjoy your evenning otherwise switch to Plan B I. E. Bars.
I think there is very interesting debate going on in favour of and against Rio and Budha bar and etc.
I have used these places and no doubt you can get quality but the point is if you add up all the cost of travel and hotel and the girl, probably west is much cheaper than that
Thank you RomanyStar. Always good to hear about the negatives as well as the positives. I always thought Top Modals looked a bit too good to be true.
We interrupt this cat fight for a post on the mongering situation in Kiev.
Going back to all my website research, I had a number of sites where TinEye had not detected stolen images. Called one, made it clear I would only be satisfied with the girl in the picture, they must have realized that I wasn't a good scam candidate and honestly said that girl was not available. Got that same crappy pimp line through a handful of calls. Finally one was up front honest, and said they would send out four girls to choose from. With that kind of offer at $700Gr for regular girls, or $900Gr for model level: I had to give it a try, asked for model level. Forty fucking five minutes later, the three candidates arrived. Must have lost one of the herd along the way, because if any of these girls were modeling it was for bovine quarterly. By the way these heffers came from Top Modals. Some of the other sites I tried and was absolutely sure I was dealing with slime balls included Minuet, Intimgirls and VipEscort. I put those on the avoid list. Many times there are great disappointments chasing that perfect instant of pleasure, this was one of them. Decided to have a glass of wine and get some sleep.
Yes, unless the girl is a Pro, it would be difficult 4 a civvy girl to out herself to you that she is Bi.
In Kiev, I don't know if its a culture or languages issues, but I found it difficult to get a non pro girl to admit that she is BI.Well my now ex-GF just volunteered the information herself about her bi-sexual fantasies. I did not suspect at all until we talked about fantasies. She knew I wanted 3-some, and explained she'd be more than willing as she was what we'd describe as "bi-curious", but not prepared to do anything on her own. Bingo! And without trying!
Oh, and I met Hunter Dave a couple of times too. Come to think of it HD met that ex too!
Maybe everyone I meet from this board is in line to be flamed!. IMMY007 watch out!
I can offer very little new information from this trip I am afraid. Reasons to follow.
But one nugget for you. A branch of "Dolls" is opening to increase nightclub competition.
I saw a banner across a street near where I was walking with GF#2, I caught a glimpse out of the corner of my eye, verified it was Dolls nightclub, and I think opening day was last night or night before. When free of female company I retraced my steps trying to confirm what I saw, but it's now been removed.
I have found out online that the club is based somewhere near the new stadium, according to some online adverts for "hostess" paying 3500UAH a month incidentally (I did not apply!)
But the club itself has no online presence yet, which is strange.
I imagine management were desperate to get open and have a presence before Euro2012, get more dancers in, get rid of the poor ones so by 1st June they have a decent line-up. The club is billed as striptease, but from other Dolls around the world I imagine it's identical to Rio & Solid Gold, with Takeout available.
The bad news though is they may have a prime spot ahead of Euro, and therefore prices are likely to be very high. Ridiculously, competition may increase prices in this crazy country.
So, apologies for not being able to check it out, but I will try to firm up location tomorrow when I have a wander. Hope some other guys on the ground here will make the inaugural ISG visit and report back. Really a club like Dolls should invite us senior guys along for a free evening in the name of marketing, don't you think?
Personally I have no chance of a visit to the club this visit unless I get blown out by the girl I'm meeting from her work. This evening was spent with the mamba girl from last night, who's swiftly turned into a freebie, with a lot of work and convincing.
Photos are usually fake, however sometime you may get a good deal. Remeber, for foreigners, this is one of the cheapest option. Please note if you send the girl back with just the taxi fare, they would not serve you again even though it is their fault to post a fake photo in the first place.
Personally I would prefer Mamba. Most photos even on mamba are fake or heavily photoshopped and it does require hard work but worth a try.
I generally prefer to meet them in afternoon. If all goes well then enjoy your evenning otherwise switch to Plan B I. E. Bars.
Thecost of travel and hotel and the girl, probably west is much cheaper than that.
I used escorts-models& top modals, and I agree a lot of the photos are fakes, but I met quite few gems as well.
Yes, best time is to meet them in the afternoon or early evening. The ones that I didn't like, I sent them back with only 50UAH Taxi Fare. Phoned the agency or their minder, or whoever on the phone, and told them that I am staying in Kiev for a while, and if they wanted my continous custom / they bettter send me good looking girls, or girls close in looks to photos posted on their site.
Their subsequent supply improved a lot in the looks& service dept of the girls.
But to send them back with more than 50UAH taxi fare, is only a reward for their fake photos.
Bamba is more reliable & a lot of semi pros as well, as financially Embarrassed Students.
Photos are usually fake, however sometime you may get a good deal. Remeber, for foreigners, this is one of the cheapest option. Please note if you send the girl back with just the taxi fare, they would not serve you again even though it is their fault to post a fake photo in the first place.
Personally I would prefer Mamba. Most photos even on mamba are fake or heavily photoshopped and it does require hard work but worth a try.
I generally prefer to meet them in afternoon. If all goes well then enjoy your evenning otherwise switch to Plan B I. E. Bars.
Thecost of travel and hotel and the girl, probably west is much cheaper than that.
I used escorts-models& top modals, and I agree a lot of the photos are fakes, but I met quite few gems as well.
Yes, best time is to meet them in the afternoon or early evening. The ones that I didn't like, I sent them back with only 50UAH Taxi Fare. Phoned the agency or their minder, or whoever on the phone, and told them that I am staying in Kiev for a while, and if they wanted my continous custom / they bettter send me good looking girls, or girls close in looks to photos posted on their site.
Their subsequent supply improved a lot in the looks& service dept of the girls.
But to send them back with more than 50UAH taxi fare, is only a reward for their fake photos.
Bamba is more reliable & a lot of semi pros as well, as financially Embarrassed Students.
And if you compare prices with what's on offfer say in London on www.adultwork.com, you will find that even in London you can find a lot of gems at prices comparable to the above. In Kiev.
I don't know who posted this. The quoting is a little messed up.
Girls like that are a dime a dozen in most major cities. You guys need to get out more.
If you are paying more than $300 for a girl like that in NYC you are either too lazy to look or there are other issues. Which of course explains the Rio-GIA-Buddha Bar triangle.
QUOTE (Although the rates of these two girls in London approximate the base rate for a hot girl in New York, it is not similar. Because these two girls, Amelia or Gloria, are truly exceptional. They are, in my opinion, clearly 10's, and so beautiful in terms of their facial appearance, the perfect shape and tone of their bodies, that girls such as these 'supermodels' would command a far higher rate in New York than the basic $400 / hr rate)Now we are not talking Pies in the Sky or a Mermaid called Wanda, but the above girls looks in LJ's first post.[/QUOTE]
Pro, just because there are more fat chicks in the US and Western Europe doesn't change the scale. .
Her face is typically Slavic, with eyes to get lost in. Anyway I'd rate her 7. 5. I guess she'd be a solid 9 for most of the guys in Western Europe or in the US, but by FSU standarts she his IMO just "not that skanky".
The strip club? No? The rest of the complex, yes. It's a good place to meet unspoiled Ukrainian girls.
That sounds familiar. Thank you. No idea about what Rhino clubs are though. Is it worth a repeat visit in your opinion?
Cheers / Barba
Actually 21-25 is the worst age. The girls have just enough experience and vain enough to be extremely annoying.
Unless a man is or looks under 40, it'the be quite a feat to chat up a hot 18 to 22 year old young girl and to frequently have his wicked ways with her for 'free'.
How often is it really free when a man 35 to over 40 is dating a 18 to 20 year old hot chick?
Only the FSU hotel security guys are looking for a hand out. If they try that at a Western hotel just laugh at them and continue on without breaking stride.
Hey Immy. It would have been very handy for R. P. Bit far out for me.
I imagine there's a fair chance security will sense a chance to line their pockets.
The report of distinction area is the FAQ.
The map is a definitive newbies guide to Kiev. Too Funny. .
needs a FAQ.
http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?ie=UTF&msa=0&msid=202083364326811814553.0004b69c9d40f14d29d51
Why even bother replying when you haven't been there? You are neither experienced in Chisinau or apparently Kiev. What is the sound of one hand clapping? Little Joey as he types a post on ISG.
You talking about Rio endlessly is about as interesting as you doing a cost comparison about the value menu at the McDonalds on Khreshatic, which I'm sure is probably next.
Just so there is no confusion about why the experienced members of the board react the way we do to you posts. Everything about your posts screams, I don't have a clue and apparently you are willing to write very long disjointed essays to that effect.
Please stop, it's extremely tedious. You can take girls out of Rio for sex, some are okay looking. We get it. Stop.
The board didn't jump back to life because you posted your 100th dissertation on Rio. It came roaring back to life because I started posting and some other senior members joined me. People that actually have something to say other than I went to Rio (Buddha Bar, GIA), my apartment, Arena to eat and then back to the airport.
Assuming you've read the thread on this forum for Chisinau and Kiev, and you are therefore aware that p4p is highly developed and available in Kiev, whereas in Chisinau the p4p scene is more limited, it's a no brainer that if you're looking for p4p action that you should go to Kiev.
However, if you are able to speak Russian and are looking for freebie action and adventure, then different criteria apply and since I've never been to Chisinau, I will defer trying to answer that question to someone who does have the experience to give you a meaningful response.
My issues is guys with limited experience rating trolls over a 5. Which on sites like this is generally par for the course.
I mean come on! Maybe everyone here hasn't fucked a 7, 8.9 but we've all seen them unless you are a shut in.
Every now and then, this forum gets into weird debate of how to scale girls. For the sake of common ground, I use the oThER major sex forum as the template of what constitutes a 7 or 8 and so on. Eighty percent of the many thousands of mongers of that forum concur as to what is what in appearance. Sure some members skew it with overly personalized ratings but a common denominator is generally reached among the mass.
For the members that state 10's don't exist or Victoria Secret models are 8's, well I have no idea what to say to that.
Actually little Joey and Hunter Dave got hammered for different but somewhat similar reasons.
Little Joey goes on and on and on about one place in Kiev. The most noobiest of noob places now after the loss of RP.
Hunter Dave went on and on and on about the 7, 8.9s that were dropping all over him from mamba and I think River Palace. He was just painting too rosy of a picture and needed to adjust his scale by two notches. Kind of reminds me of what a first timer to RP who didn't know the place was p4p said, 'wow the girls here are really friendly. ' Really? Really.
BTW, I am glad to see that you posted in time about your honest opinion of Liljoey, who was getting at times the same reception as Hunter Dave got, when he first posted.
At those times even some posters were doubting that a monger by such name existed.
Cheers
Worst advice I ever saw on this forum, which is saying a lot.
If you are clear with the agency that you want the girl in the photo (which has about a 20% chance of happening) or super hot girl and they send a troll. Send her packing, if you want to be a nice guy and give her taxi money (60uah) that is on you. If you give her some of the fee to stay in the good graces of the agency, you are an idiot.
I generally meet agency girls on the street (not in front of my building. d-oh!) so I can just walk away if need be.
Please note if you send the girl back with just the taxi fare, they would not serve you again even though it is their fault to post a fake photo in the first place.
I went to Kiev some weeks ago, just for the weekend, and it was my first time in Kiev, and I do not speak any Russian at all. I did not have time to read all 634 pages in here, but saw the reports from Rio.
I planned to start out with a massage from Rakuena, but never managed to find the place.
Then I went for Roksolana, which was also very hard to find. I ended up in a womens haridresser salon, with a sign outside, saying "THIS IS NOT ROKSOLANA". Then I tried the alley next to the hairdresser, and ended up in a quit scary entrance hall, and up the stairs. Turned out to be the right place. Had a 90 mins erotic session, including shower, massage (not the best I have had) and 2 handjobs. Not to be repeated, but ok for 700 UAH.
Had dinner on the top of Hyatt hotel, with a great wiew of the churches nearby.
Went to Rio around 10 pm, as it was the most mentioned place in this board. Paid the 100 UAH entrance, and was placed in a chair, where 2 strippers were dancing in front of me.
Had a walk around the club, and saw the other strippers. I never figured out how many girls were actually working there, as girls kept on coming and leaving.
Finally saw a great looking girl, which was a 10 for me, maybe for others as well, but maybe just 1 for some. It is up to you guys.
Had a private dance and finally took her to my hotel for 2400 UAH for 3 hours.
It is the best ever WG experience I have ever had. She did everything exept BBBJ, and we had great sex for nearly 3 hours. Only drawback was her loud screaming, as I was afraid that the neighbours would come and complain.
Unfortunately her English was limited, and I never got her name. Something ending with ana. She was blond with huge natural tits, and a big ass.
I would go back to Kiev, just to see her again.
Finally I would suggest to start a thread just for Kiev strip clubs, then the more experienced mongers can stay in the Kiev thread.
Thanks to everybody for reporting on Rio.
Pro, just because there are more fat chicks in the US and Western Europe doesn't change the scale. .Totally agree. Problem is that most guys are just SO happy to get laid (by something with a hole, even if have to pay for it) that they fool themselves to the point to rank as a 9 a girl who is actually a 6 or a 7.
Dave Carrera
03-21-12, 17:10
(I recall our PM correspondence where you were seeking advice regarding having a batchelor party in Kiev, and I reference my post on this thread of February 23, 2012, concerning my ideas for your batchelor party, see:
http://www.internationalsexguide.inf.=1#post1251303
So, how have your plans progressed for the batchelor party?
I have reported previously on the website you asked about.
www.escort-models.com
I have also seen reports by other members about this agency.
Unfortunately, Goobye Lenin is correct. The photos look and are too good to be true. So don't rely on the photos of this agency to order girls to staff your batchelor party.
However, this does not mean you can't get good looking girls from this agency. It merely means the pictures are fake, and you will have to do some work to reveal what this agency is capable of delivering. I reported my own experience with such websites, where a really extremely skinny spindley blond girl with an ok face showed up in response to my invitation to send one of the website hotties, and I complained to the girl who came and told her that I wanted a girl like the one on the website that I showed her on my laptop. She said she will arrange things with her agency and a pretty girl will come. I did wait a longer time than they said, and the agency was not that reassuring on the phone when I called, so instead I made other arrangements and a girl I had been with before was soon on her way. But then lo and behold a very pretty girl did show up from the agency. So I got it cleared with both girls and had an impromptu 3some. What it means is that you must do the investigative work I wrote to you about and go throught the websites and make dates and send away the girls who don't make the cut, and try out the girls who look good and come up with some girls who make the grade to be invited to the batchelor party, so it will be a good one.
At the time Gentleman Travel wrote some good advice which I will cite to you again.
This is the way to get enough good looking girls for your batchelor party at a reasonably low cost.
I wrote to you about the higher cost option at the strip club which would not involve a lot of preliminary investigative work to find good looking girls, since it reliably has a lot of good looking girls present at the club on any given night, but there the risk is in performance of the girls once you get them home, and therefore even at the strip club it would be best to try out a few of the girls in advance, until you know you have winners to invite to the batchelors party.
Lastly, I wrote to you that an FKK trip would be a blast for a batchelor's party, especially if you haven't been to FKK's before. It will literally knock your socks off, and you may become addicted, as so many on this forum have.
I will be hitting the FKK's later in April. I will be in Berlin's Artemis on the night of April 19, and I will be in Frankfurt for weekend of April 20 to 22 and plan to hit FKK Oase and FKK Palace, two of the best FKK's. If you want to do a preliminary expedition then, I would be glad to show you the ropes.
So where are you along the process of planning your party? Never heard back from you.)
[QUOTE=Ronaldinjo;1259979
Our flights and hotel are now set. We are coming to Kiev for 4 nights mid April, and staying in a suite and 2 regular rooms at the Hyatt. We will do as you have suggested; wish there were a site with verifiable photos as so much to choose from and we are trying to maximize fun and ease.
There's a great business opportunity for someone who could be a "Mr. Wolf" who can make all the arrangements for a wild party with minimal angst. If anyone knows of a person who does this, please let me know!
Actually little Joey and Hunter Dave got hammered for different but somewhat similar reasons.
Little Joey goes on and on and on about one place in Kiev. The most noobiest of noob places now after the loss of RP.
Hunter Dave went on and on and on about the 7, 8.9s that were dropping all over him from mamba and I think River Palace. He was just painting too rosy of a picture and needed to adjust his scale by two notches. Kind of reminds me of what a first timer to RP who didn't know the place was p4p said, 'wow the girls here are really friendly. ' Really? Really.Yes you brought back some life into the Kiev thread when you re- appeared again.
And to tell you the truth, I was beginning to think & wonder if liljoey had some kind of a vested interest in Rio Club. I did post that reading between the lines. Made me wonder, especially when I went back to read his First Detailed report (Where have all the River Palace girls Gone?).
Then (The Knight) posted in time with his honest opinion as he saw it, after meeting LJ in the club. Although I never met The Knight, or LJ, I think I can trust The Knight's judgment on LJ/
But with Hunter Dave versus Ukeboy&Bez bezarra, it was more of a banter, than anything else.
And what about posters walking into a Strip Club or a Bar I. And nailing a stunner in record time & For Free.
Ronaldinjo
03-21-12, 19:01
Hi Joey. Planning to fly to Kiev in the beggining of may for 2-3 days. I know the summer is not the best time for Kiev as a lot of hotties travel to the seas, but what about April-may? If there are a lot of students there as you mentioned so they are going to be in study vaccations. Does somebody know when the studies end in Kiev this year? Suppose earlier then last year because of euro 2012. Joey, you have been there last April, did you mention some abcence of hotties in that period of time?
Why even bother replying when you haven't been there? You are neither experienced in Chisinau or apparently Kiev. What is the sound of one hand clapping? Little Joey as he types a post on ISG.
You talking about Rio endlessly is about as interesting as you doing a cost comparison about the value menu at the McDonalds on Khreshatic, which I'm sure is probably next.
Just so there is no confusion about why the experienced members of the board react the way we do to you posts. Everything about your posts screams, I don't have a clue and apparently you are willing to write very long disjointed essays to that effect.
Please stop, it's extremely tedious. You can take girls out of Rio for sex, some are okay looking. We get it. Stop.
The board didn't jump back to life because you posted your 100th dissertation on Rio. It came roaring back to life because I started posting and some other senior members joined me. People that actually have something to say other than I went to Rio (Buddha Bar, GIA) , my apartment, Arena to eat and then back to the airport.It stuck in my mind the first time I asked Old UkeBoy about the Meaning of Salons in Kiev, never heard it before. His swift reply (Read Borat 69 reports & do exactly as he says, or do you want us to change your Nappies for you?).
To this I replied (No need to be so Huffy mate, I have my own Baby sitter.).
I mean can't you & Ukeboy adopt the Style of a very good diplomat, when he tells you to Go to Hell, and actually makes you look Forward to It.
Its not what you say sometimes, its the way it is said.
BTW, wasn't lecturing anyone here. Just my thought for the day.
Keep them coming, your Posts.
I don't know who posted this. The quoting is a little messed up.
Girls like that are a dime a dozen in most major cities. You guys need to get out more.
If you are paying more than $300 for a girl like that in NYC you are either too lazy to look or there are other issues. Which of course explains the Rio-GIA-Buddha Bar triangle.
Now we are not talking Pies in the Sky or a Mermaid called Wanda, but the above girls looks in LJ's first post.[/QUOTE]The quoting about the NYC prices in relation to London's Amelia & Gloria, was made by Liljoey in his first report.
As for NYC, I had a blast at the infamous Plato's Retreat swingers Club, just before it closed.
It only cost me the few dollars entrance fee. That's what I call a freebie.
Another freebie in NYC that I truly remember pulling, was in Tavern on The Green.
Sadly closed as well. But I am still going strong and more than 20+ years older, with a strong preference for P4P with 18/24 Tanned Blondes, don't mind them being Bimbos either.
Call me a Pervert.
Maybe, if there was I'd probably do it. .
There's a great business opportunity for someone who could be a "Mr. Wolf" who can make all the arrangements for a wild party with minimal angst. If anyone knows of a person who does this, please let me know!
Gentleman Travel
03-21-12, 21:52
Ten hours of glorious sleep later it was time to make the most of my last day in Kiev. While laying there I felt a strong urge for someone fun, and NOW. Call it lazy, call it wasting money, call me a shill if you want. I called Gia again. It worked so well last time that with just 24 hours left in Kiev I wanted one more absolutely guaranteed hotty.
Polina showed up within 45 minutes. Dressed in very classic business attire, this tall, sort of innocent looking girl with a gorgeous smile looked WAY to good to be true. The coolest part is she was giving me an amazing passionate kiss seconds after walking through the door. She proved to be a total Energizer Bunny. Site says she is 29, I didn't believe it, but she insists. On the pencil thin side, but I finally got to cum watching that amazing ass slap up against me. We got along like a couple long lost friends. Love it when you run across a pro that enjoys what she's doing, and makes you crazy in the process. Those that say Gia is overpriced, may be right, but based on a worldwide market I say they offer damn good value for the money. Prices are well below top quality US agencies, and exactly the same as in Montreal. When an agency goes two for two at the quality of who they sent me I call it top notch.
I'm interested in quality p4p rather than freebies. Already have a couple of emails from the Mamba girl that spent the night. The expectations that come along with messing with someone's head like that amount to karmic debt I'd the rather not mess with. Remember this was intended, and probably is my only visit to Kiev.Hey Romany, thanks for the detailed reports, not everyone does this after mining the forum for advice.
Glad you had a great time, although I think you made things difficult for yourself with your "no repeats" policy. The ROI goes up dramatically when you don't incur the work and risks of finding a new pussy every time. But to each his own!
How much was the GIA girl? If you say "same as Montreal" I assume that is $200-$250 per hour? But it sounds like you got a real GFE from her and probably more than one hours time?
And what about posters walking into a Strip Club or a Bar I. And nailing a stunner in record time & For Free.Nothing extraordinary with that. There's many opportunities with strippers in FSU, as long as you treat them nicely and have some "game". Jake993 and Passepartout said it better in the Russia forum, these girls are treated like piece of meat night after nignt and are often not looking for money as much as they are looking for a little personal attention, empathy and respect. As a side note, many of them are completely normal people outside of work.
By the way having a stripper as a regular "fuck-buddy" is a very good position in that even if you go to a non-pro disco or have a date with a non-pro and say don't get any that night, you always have your stripper to fall back on at 5am. My first freebie stripper experience was in Chisinau, with a nice and rather hot girl 21 yo working in Bacardi Club. She would get off of work at 5am, SMSed to see if I was available or still awake, and if I was, would go to my apartment, down one beer or two, talk a bit, have sex, sleep till noon, sex again, and then leave. No questions asked and no materialistic expectations, save a few cocktails sometimes at 7 pm before her work. Talk about a nice situation. I then had the same kind of experience in Tashkent and other places in FSU.
Talking about Tashkent, in case of someone here is interested by comparisons (it seems that many guys here SHOULD expand their horizons), there is strip bar there named FM bar, a drinking hole and a strip club under the same roof. Usually, there are 25 - 30 girls and not very many guys. Most of the girls are rather hot (by my standarts), and all ethnicities are represented - it's Uzbekistan, the most ethnically various country in FSU. It's as close to a striptease club that you can get in Tashkent, which means: the girls don't get totally naked, but stay in lingerie (with a few dancing exceptions). Usually, they'll come to your table and ask you whether you want a lapdance or a massage. The lapdance is a normal lapdance, and after it's done you're expected to hand a tip to the girl. Usually 3000 Soum (1€) will do, but if you really enjoyed the dance 4000 soums is better. The massage is a neck and shoulder massage. Some of the girls are also really good at that. The price is the same as for the lapdance and usually, lapdance and massage last for the duration of one song.
The drinks are humanly priced with the ladies drinks going for the rate same as the customer’s: a long neck beer is 1€ and a vodka shot even cheaper. Girls don't drink expensive silly champagne cocktails but are perfectly happy with beer, and occasionally by a hookah or some chocolate bonbons if they want to stay longer at your table (no fee), which often happen if you're nice with them. At those prices, I am rather generous and usually ordered anything they asked for so I had permanently two or three girls at my table. And as every other strip club of the region, if you hit it off with one of the girls, you can quite easily date her for a lunch or a drink the next day and strike up a freebie relationship.
Why even bother replying when you haven't been there? You are neither experienced in Chisinau or apparently Kiev. What is the sound of one hand clapping? Little Joey as he types a post on ISG.
You talking about Rio endlessly is about as interesting as you doing a cost comparison about the value menu at the McDonalds on Khreshatic, which I'm sure is probably next.
Just so there is no confusion about why the experienced members of the board react the way we do to you posts. Everything about your posts screams, I don't have a clue and apparently you are willing to write very long disjointed essays to that effect.
Please stop, it's extremely tedious. You can take girls out of Rio for sex, some are okay looking. We get it. Stop.
The board didn't jump back to life because you posted your 100th dissertation on Rio. It came roaring back to life because I started posting and some other senior members joined me. People that actually have something to say other than I went to Rio (Buddha Bar, GIA) , my apartment, Arena to eat and then back to the airport.Cruiser Dave, I have read the small snippets of comments you have posted since you recently began posting and detect nothing of value to anyone contributed by you. You have posted no action reports or current intel. The Kiev thread has not "come roaring back to life" because you started posting except in your own mind, but such a line does clearly expose how self important you feel. And this in turn explains why you persist in trying to mischaracterize my posts as being only about Rio, which is false. I have written about all of Kiev's p4p options. Anyone who has read my prior posts knows that I have reported on all aspects of Kiev's p4p, and I have experimented with all of it, and that I know what I am writing about. Further I supply valid factual reasons for any recommendation I make which are sufficient explanation for my conclusions, without going into delusional conspiracy theories. If you wish to dispute a recommendation or conclusion I have made, do so on a factual basis. Otherwise, your ad hominem attacks on me are useless rubbish.
You have posted no action reports and have not recently contributed anything of value. Why don't you stop trying to fight with others and be more constructive. Sorry if I'm not bowing before your highnesses, but the emperor hath no clothes.
LJ
RomanyStar
03-21-12, 22:30
hey romany, thanks for the detailed reports, not everyone does this after mining the forum for advice.
glad you had a great time, although i think you made things difficult for yourself with your "no repeats" policy. the roi goes up dramatically when you don't incur the work and risks of finding a new pussy every time. but to each his own!
how much was the gia girl? if you say "same as montreal" i assume that is $200-$250 per hour? but it sounds like you got a real gfe from her and probably more than one hours time?glad you enjoyed the travelogue. i've used isg for years, but for the first time felt like i had a number of questions i could not dig out of the forum (in a reasonable amount of time). my small payback may be appreciated by a few, and i hope that one of you is willing to do the faq.
actually, since the gia girls were each $300/2hrs it makes them a little cheaper than montreal. i usually pay $180-200 / hr in montreal with no discount until three hours. i always do at least two hours to build a rapport, for the experience i'm looking for it works better to have a half hour of talk, then to slowly move into the touch, kiss phase rather than meeting them at the door nude and peeling them down on the spot. this is the closest two people ever get, treating them like a friend, an equal, and a lover makes it a lot more pleasurable for me in the long run.
no repeat policy stems from a bad mistake 30 years ago. i did a rescue on a high end la call girl that led to a ten year relationship. the divorce and subsequent therapy makes that the most expensive pussy i've ever dreamed about. even though sorely tempted in kiev i will never see a p4p again within the year, and also why i shy away from "freebies". i'm not buying anybody another house, or splitting what remains of my retirement. hourly works best for me.
one more flight to get home. kiev is fortunately too far from home for me to even consider returning. beautiful women all over the place. a couple out of my small sample were absolutely awesome in bed. beautiful city, great food. totally understand why those that stay or return are there, but not again for me.
Hi Joey. Planning to fly to Kiev in the beggining of may for 2-3 days. I know the summer is not the best time for Kiev as a lot of hotties travel to the seas, but what about April-may? If there are a lot of students there as you mentioned so they are going to be in study vaccations. Does somebody know when the studies end in Kiev this year? Suppose earlier then last year because of euro 2012. Joey, you have been there last April, did you mention some abcence of hotties in that period of time?Last year I don't think I detected any noticeable lack of p4p girls after the Easter holiday, so the "holiday" effect should not persist after the holiday ends this year too. However, you have alluded to the effect changes in the university schedules this year because of Euro 2012. This is an unknown, although there was some posting on it earlier in the thread. I suppose you could try to ask or find out about the university schedule more in detail and make inferences based on what you find out. We will just have to wait and see. If you already have booked the trip, I'm sure you will still be able to have a nice time even if some girls have left town.
Our flights and hotel are now set. We are coming to Kiev for 4 nights mid April, and staying in a suite and 2 regular rooms at the Hyatt. We will do as you have suggested; wish there were a site with verifiable photos as so much to choose from and we are trying to maximize fun and ease.I responded to you via PM regarding using a website to choose girls. I assume you mean to try out the girls in advance of your batchelor party, when you wrote you'll do as I suggested. Now you've given the time for your trip as mid-April. I hope you were mindful of the prior posts to avoid the Easter holiday period. What are your exact dates of travel?
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