View Full Version : Odessa
Doctor_Skank
09-01-06, 07:04
" wonder why you (mongers travelling to UA) never talk about Moldova which is very close to Odessa. "
Because Moldova is discussed in the Moldova section?
Spiderman1
09-01-06, 14:07
I thought singles is a part of mail.ru, but it is not truth, surely most girls are the same, but for example the Ella of Irish Lad it doesn't exist in mail.ru where I am registered and where i searched her right now...or may be she is registered with another age.It's the same database... try http://love.mail.ru/elliana200644?1=1&photos_a=1
Dr Slank,
Yes but I noticed that people here are not the same as in Moldova section ! (aren't they ? Has it changed ?) that's why I asked this question.
Moldova section has also a lower posting rate.
(A frogg !)
Explorer69
09-02-06, 14:43
It's the same database... try http://love.mail.ru/elliana200644?1=1&photos_a=1Elliana has some very good reports, I want to contact her for my upcoming trip to Odessa, but the phone number given previously doesn't work. Any recent information about how to contact her on phone? I am not a member of that particular website and thus unable to send e-mail to her.
JR49,
IMHO, there is a good corelation between the number of posts and how good of mongering destination the place is. Countries like Germany, Thailand, Argentina, Brazil get a lot of posts.
I am sure it's possible to have a wonderful experience wherever you go if you are resourceful (e.g. connection, language skill, your look, finance, etc). Or you could be very lucky to hook up with a gem by chance. But if not, I think my chance of having a good time would be better if I went to a good destination (i.e. well developed pro scene, or easyly accessible amatuers).
So maybe Moldova is not as good of a mongering destination as Ukraine?
Just a thought;-).
Hi all, I am in Odessa, if somebody else is here and wants to meet for a beer or to hunt together, just write me PM.
Can anybody give me a good address or a phone number for girls in Nikolaev?
Thank you!
Wednesday September 6, my first night at Odessa, took a taxi to the port. No street girls. Went to the freelance bars, no freelance girls.
Thursday September 7, around midnight: Walked out of my OES apartment and was immediately caught by the Odessa Passport Police.
"No passport, big problem. Police Station."
They had already caught many foreigners without passports, but were all let go after their friends brought their passports. I didn't have any friends so they escorted me to my apartment to get my passport for 100 Grivnas.
Thursday September 7, around midnight: Walked out of my OES apartment and was immediately caught by the Odessa Passport Police.
"No passport, big problem. Police Station."
They had already caught many foreigners without passports, but were all let go after their friends brought their passports. I didn't have any friends so they escorted me to my apartment to get my passport for 100 Grivnas.
I do not know your nationality, but if you are legally there and have a proper ID card, like happens in Russia, there should be no problem.
If you are in the category needing Visa, like in Russia, it has to be registered, so you can go around with a proper ID card and the Hotel card (while they are registering it).
If police ask you money just refuse, when you are already at the Police Station, for 100 HRV it's not worth to refuse, but just ask them to call the Hotel for your passport or the Embassy.
Might that in these countries, like in Russia, it's much better to be fined (even if not completely legally) than to be without the passport because stolen... The problem is not the passport. It's the Visa you have on it!
I always leave my passport at hotel or home. Sometimes I carry a photocopy with visa pages.
IT
On Sunday night around midnight, Lukasek and I were extremely bored drinking in the Irish Pub along with lots of other foreign single men with nothing to do. We decided to walk to the port again to see if there was any action there. It is a little dangerous, but we decided to walk there anyway.
We saw around 15 - 20 girls at the port. Most were low quality but there were one or two good ones. We asked and the answer given by their spokespersons was $50.
We walked around and found 2 nice 20 year old girls sitting by themselves away from the crowd. They didn't speak English and we didn't speak much Russian. They wanted $100 each. We offered $50 each but they were not interested. Too bad it was my last night in Odessa.
What I noticed was that some of the port street girls were walking to the church and then to the Deribasovskaya Street. All this time the street girls could have been parading in front of us and we didn't know it.
Working or not, the girls in Odessa never give eye contact.
"Working or not, the girls in Odessa never give eye contact"
And really never means NEVER,and I do not dress as ukranian man...
Once at home, I will write long report, so far, the biggest problem is to kill the time here...not exactly what I expected when I went here..
"Working or not, the girls in Odessa never give eye contact"
And really never means NEVER,and I do not dress as ukranian man...
Once at home, I will write long report, so far, the biggest problem is to kill the time here...not exactly what I expected when I went here..
It seems everybody is easy writing when it is time to plan a travel and to ask many questions, but once at home forget to find couple of minutes to write at least a short report.
Odessa is a good example, in winter and spring time, many members asked many questions, some also wrote reports, but most of them after the season disappear writing anything.Here my very, very short report on Odessa.
In Odessa you can see the most incredible, goodlooking women walking on the street. But that is just it.
For the rest Odessa is a complete waste of money, time and effort. Boring place.
The report of Loso69 tells it all. See: "Loso in Odessa"
Only two good things in Odessa were:
* Sacha (short name for Alexandra): telephonenumber: +3 80 97 27 00 106 (phone number put on this forum on request of Sacha herself)
$70 for an hour, $100 for two hours, $200 for all night (until early morning), $300 for 24 hours See here another recommendation for her
* My appartment: Odessa Executive Suites (http://www.odessaexecutivesuites.com/)
Do not think the girls must jump on you because you an american, french, egiptian etc. They do not need to.
If you dont know what to do, I can tell you. Where, how, how much, where to stay and where to go!!! Looking on your boring messages, other people think thats its only one hooker here and one apartment to stay. :) Stop crying! I like it here!
Bez Bezarra
09-15-06, 02:47
Here my report on Odessa.
In Odessa you see the most incredible women.
But thats it.
Odessa is a complete waste of money,
time and effort. Boring place.
Only good thing in Odessa was Alexandra (Sacha)
$70 for an hour
Maybe luck has something to do with it.
Or imagination and creativity.
Making something out of nothing.
Some other good things found in ODC.
(not new, from adventures gone by)
Please make me stop crying and make me smile Hottravel.
Please give me names, pictures and telephonenumbers of girls, url's of good escort bureaus, places to pick up girls (and I don't mean the drug addicted women near the harbour).
Please convince me. I want to be convinced. I you can I am happily willing to come to Odessa to meet you so you can show me around.
Most reports her on this forum about Odessa are not that special.
What to think about Lukasek who writes: "Working or not, the girls in Odessa never give eye contact".
In South America I have seen quite different.
I can understand you have doubts about me. But I can't understand you have doubts about Loso. Loso is a very professional mongerer who has written quality reports on Rio, Cartagena (Colombia), Thailand and about Odessa. And his report on Odessa is not that good. See: "Loso in Odessa"
Do not think the girls must jump on you because you an american, french, egiptian etc. They do not need to.
If you dont know what to do, I can tell you. Where, how, how much, where to stay and where to go!!! Looking on your boring messages, other people think thats its only one hooker here and one apartment to stay. :) Stop crying! I like it here!
Please enjoy the picture. Unfortunately not from Odessa, but well . . .
I agree with you..
Hottravel? How can you trust a member with so little report who speaks only in generally?
ALL the good report in Odessa section are written from member with only a couple of reports, it sounds pretty strange or I am wrong?
Yes the hooker are more than one,may be about 10, but in a city of 1 milion of inhabitants... but he is right about one thing, there are many flats to choose...but who is coming here just to live?
Fido your picture is amazing beautiful, ( the kind of beauty that in Odessa you see daily walking in the street,but that you will never get...trust me..), where is she from?
Fido Dido said,
Please enjoy the picture. Unfortunately not from Odessa, but well . . .
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No this pic is not from Odessa, it appear to be from Brazil. Correct me if I am wrong, as the skin color, hair extensions, and tan lines are NOT what one finds in the Ukraine.
About my bad experiences in Odessa "Bez Besarra" wrote:
Maybe luck has something to do with it.
Or imagination and creativity.
Making something out of nothing.In Odessa I approached about 20 "normal" girls in the street. Trying to get telephonenumbers/dates.
This was not in Arcadia, not in disco's and it was far from Deribasovskaya.
Although most of the time the girls were friendly, smiling and sometimes even charmed by my approach I did get only once a telephone number.
From a very beautifull Armenian girl (very little diamond in one of her teeth). After I called her a day later a guy called back. He told me she was his girlfriend and that I should never bother her again. Sounded a bit intimidating. For me this was the limit!
Everybody planning to go to Odessa should read this report: "Loso in Odessa". Saves you a lot of money, time and frustration.
Still do want to recommend:
* Sacha (short name for Alexandra): telephonenumber: +3 80 97 27 00 106 (phonenumber put here on this forum on request of Sacha herself)
$70 for an hour, $100 for two hours, $200 for all night (until early morning), $300 for 24 hours See here another recommendation for her
* My appartment: Odessa Executive Suites (http://www.odessaexecutivesuites.com/)
Lukasek: thanks for your support. Too bad you didn't enjoy yourself neither in Odessa. Might be correct that there are some people here on this forum who have a commercial interest in Odessa.
By the way the girl from the picture is from Brazil (correct Blastoff). Reminds me of the place were I should have gone to instead of Odessa.
Fido Dido,
Seems like we've had similar experiences. Neither of us was impressed with Odessa. Both of us have great memories of Angelica from Karla Models in Rio.
Curta a vida.
Loso
Fido Dido said, By the way the girl from the picture is from Brazil (correct Blastoff). Reminds me of the place were I should have gone to instead of Odessa.
Attached Images
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Thanks for your honesty. When you have mongered around the world as long as I have it is difficult to sneak much past me hahaha.
Regards.
Finally at home, after some short reports, I will try to write something longer to clean all the doubts everybody still has about Ods. ( the same doubts I had before to go there ).
I had to go in july and meeting with my friend, but he was not able to come, so I went at the beginning of september for 16 days.
I like to plan in advance every my travel very well, so from may I started to do my homeworks and it means using skype and icq and above all contacting about 700 girls from mail.ru. Yes about 700, no joke!
In mail.ru there were about 6 thousands profiles of girls from Odessa with foto from 18 till 36 yo, every week I checked girls between a couple of years and I wrote to those I liked the same first letter. ( if you are quickly and using mouse past-copy it is really easy to write to many girls in little time. Every page of mail.ru shows 10 profiles, you do not need to open all of them, open only the foto you like and that's all).
I wrote not only to nice girls, but to every girl I liked. I counted were, really, I have no reason to lie, about 700 contacts.
I also prepared 5 others letters where I wrote about my life, the city where I live, what I am thinking about Ucranian women, why I go to Ods. And I used to copy these letters when the corrispondence started with somebody.
YES! I was a male westerner scammer, I did what many Boris, Igor and so on did many times to all Us.
Remember I had to go in July and I went in september, so I had much time to work.
Most of girls I wrote,they did not answered, others answered in russian, with others we stopped to write after few letters, however I went to Ods with about 30 telephone numbers of girls regular, freebie, that were supposed to be SURELY meeting and enough surely fucking too. With these 30 girls, I wrote daily mail, it took me so much time that I had to stop definetely to write with my normal girlfriends from czech and slovak republic, I did not login in the cz and sk chat for more than 3 months... I am sure that after 8 years I was used to go daily in these chats, they thought I decided to...marry...I am not enough brave to do it :)
As I wrote before, my travel was not as I thought, and to help you to understand why it was a disappointment, to avoid you to think that the fault was only from me, I tell something about me.
I am 32yo, 174kg-65kg in good shape. I am not naive, it was not the "first time" I went in holiday, besides 54 times in czech and in slovak republic in 8 years, where I feel as home, I was and I had very succesfull holidays in Moscow,Piter,Krakow,Recife,Budapest,Arad,Riga. I speak basic,but I speak russian enough well to start and to have conversation. ( specially in Ukraina where everytime I did not know some words, it was enough to speak slovak and they understood me very well. My cz and sk knowledge is much better than my english...).
I am not Brad Pitt, but surely not ugly too and in my holiday I usually had regular women and used pro just to have more fun, trying something different and obviously to get the top notch models type.
As dress, just to give you an example, I took as shoes my favourite gucci and prada, so I did not look as ucranian man even if I had ucranian passport...
So I think I wrote everything....let's start!
p.s. most of you are from english speaking country, so I apologize in advance for my mistakes in english...
I had to arrive on friday afternoon, but a problem of plane, delayed me and others 2 guys one day in Venice, pretty boring day,but however I had still 15 days to stay in ods.
I arrived in flat about at 17:00 and the biggest problem of delay one day was that I planned to make come from Kiev my best contact, Sveta 22yo student. She arrived on saturday morning and she was so kind she waited me 9 hours. We met in front of mac donald on Deribasoskaya on 19:00 and I immediately told her, I need some food, so we went to supermarket in Afina. Then with excuse to put the food in the flat, I took her to my apartment and after open a bottle of italian wine, it was really easy to had sex with her. Why? She was my best contact, we called many times in skype with webcam...we started to speak about sex and thinking about it together in middle of june....
When I was in bed with her, somebody knocked the door.... I went downstair and It was my buddy. We had to meet in friday evening and I still did not had his phone number so he directly came to my flat.
The problem was that to have a girlfriend on saturday night when you want only to go with your favourite friend out hunting it sucks....so I had to find a solution. I told him, give me only couple of hours and we will hunt as it was planned we had to do it yesterday.
I finished, slowly..., with her and after the first shot, even if still horny, I told her I felt very tired. We dressed on and went out to have a dinner, when she told me she had still her baggage in railway station. When we found a taxi at the end of Deribasoskaya, I told her, that I prefer to sleep alone, cause I am use to sleep with nobody in my bedroom, she looked at me bad, but I had no choice...
I knew also that in railway station there are flat, however she told me it when we spoke some month ago about our meeting. So I asked her what about the price to sleep there. She told me about 50 grivna. I gave her 300 grivna and I said, I will call you tomorrow morning so we can meet.
OK...I know I was bad man, but the only thing I really wanted to do, was to hunt in Arkadia with my buddy and the only way was to sent her sleep alone. She looked at me very bad when I left her, but I thought that no one woman think twice before to fuck a man...so for one time I acted as woman. She wrote me after few hour that she decided to go back to Kiev... I did not answer. It was my first mistake, to burn my best contact after couple of hours I arrived in Ods.
Once I left her go with taxi, I run for all the Deribasoskaya so fast that almost everybody looked at me and I had so big smile and I felt so well, just to go to flat, do a shower and meet my buddy and finally...let's holiday starting...finally!
When we met we opened another bottle of wine and after one hour of talking we took a taxi to Arkadia. I spoke with him and the price was 25 grivna,not bad as beginning.
We went directly to Western, cause it is the most friendly disko in Arkadia.
I have to say that we had really great fun, cause we joked and drunk and spoke a lot about pussy, travels and everything even if.... we got immediately the feeling, the very bad feeling, after trying few times to approach girls close to bar, that the girls in Odessa are... a mission impossible.
ZERO contact eye, even if the only westerns we saw were turkish men, ZERO hope that they were interesting in foreigners and worst of all, SHITTY ATTITUDE, that was a common factor for all my stay in Ods.
About 4:00 am, we left Arkadia, I was still horny so I proposed to my buddy to go to fuck in sauna. After asking to some taxis I found one that seemed to know where take us. I have to say that I was enough tired and little drunk :) , that I care not so much about the price, so the taxi car fucked us very well. Only my fault...sorry buddy!!! :) Something about 70 grivnas and the sauna was very close to Arkadia.
Once in sauna if I remember well we payed about 150 grivnas for sauna, but I am not sure. However we ordered few beers and said immediately to the woman who worked in sauna that we need females :)
After some 10-15 minutes arrived 3 women, we choose 2 for 100$ each one.
My girl was nice, but she was arrogant and cold, she told me, no possible bbbj and no anal. I was pissed off...for what I payed??? I wanted handjob in toilet of sauna and back sleep... I am joking,ok, but...
She also did not want to do sauna or to enjoy the swimming pool too.
Ok my buddy went to the other room and I tried to do all my best.
We took shower where she put me condom and she start to blowjowed me, nothing special, then we ended to the sofa and I fucked her in doggy style for about 15 minutes. I was not in mood to enjoyed the sex with her, I was tired and most of all zero feeling with her,so I tried to cum as soon as possible.
After sex we smoked one cigarette and I tried to touch again her pussy, the orgasm me made me again horny and less tired, but she said no,no. I was surprised and she told me:" sto ".
She wanted another 100$ buck!!!!! What a *****!!!!!
You agree for one hour, you pay one hour, but in Odessa you get one shot...too bad.
I told her, ok, you can go, she was reluctant, I told her twice, go, you can go,please go. She left and I felt better. I waited my buddy and we went to sleep...about...50 grivnas....I spoke with taxi too...sorry again bro! :)
Sunday we got lunch at Pizza Pazza and then we decided to give a try to Sasha and Suzi, cause... I remembered from here, only very GOOD report about them!
Another disappointment! Why? It is easy to say:
-they are very average in beauty in comparison to the girls you see walking in the street. I rate them as a 6,5'.
-they are, it is true, easy speaking and it is true they stayed more than one hour,but...
-once upstairs still dressed, she, I got Sasha, said immediately:" money-money". Ok I payed 70$,but when after dfk she took the condom before bj, I asked if not possible bbbj, she said immediately no problem, but +20$. Ok I agreed too.
But she was enough mechanical and she was in hurry to start sex, instead me, I like to enjoy bbbj without hurry. Sex was not bad, but nothing special too for 90$. ( she does not do anal... )
-after some chit chat and some beck's, she asked me, if I wanted again to go upstairs to the bed. I was immediately happy. Hey, I though, she is not too bad, but once upstairs she asked again money. I was enough surprised, cause I am use to call pro to have sex and not just to talking, so for me it is useless she stays more than one hour if she wants money for every shot...am I wrong? I do not think so... I said her, forget it, she immediately told me, ok for 50$ sex+bbbj, but I was not in mood even if she gave me discount till 10 grivnas. I told her she can go, she drunk another beck's and the she left.
-I think,but it is just my opinion, Sasha can be good only if you saw pussy for last time many months ago. It is true, before to go to bed, you have nice talking and joking, I enjoyed it but sex is nothing special, she is 19yo... her body she is however my favourite kind of body, 45kg-thin-blond, but her attitude is... the typical Odessa girls attitude...
-I know she was use to charge 100$ for 2 hours, I know VERY WELL...but ACTUALLY she charges much more, I mean she charges for every shot....I normally do it twice in one hour,sometimes 3 times, if girls does not look to time and in hour and something more minutes.. so it means...180-270$ with her? Am I crazy??? Sorry I am not... How is far the memory of privat brothels in Moscow and Piter...ok that it was the year 2004, but 100$ for 60 minutes not for every condom you are gonna use...
-when "was asked her", few days later, why she charges more, she asnwered that everybody says she is good, so why not charges more???
Just in august my friend got her for the usual 100$ couple of hours without count of shots...
-SURELY I will reccomend her to nobody!
-my friend got the same with Suzi...
-we met them the second day in Deribasoskaya going to another customer,they said and they asked us, why we do not call them anymore, my buddy, you was great bro!! :) , answered them immediately that they are not friendly, they smiled and left us... but he was right, if you ever had at least one time one friendly pro, you cannot say they are friendly...at least in september they are already spoiled!
So after about 24 hours I arrived in Ods, I got 3 girls, one freebie and 2 pro, good? No man!
During the dinner with my bro, after walking in the streets with ZERO EYE CONTACT, we looked each other to the eyes and we already understood that we were going to do the our BIGGEST mistake we could do....to remain in Odessa!
YES!
We had to left Odessa for another city, better if out of Ucraina, on monday morning, cause in the first 24 hours we seen and we got all that Odessa can offers to monger, zero contact eye with girls, average sex with pro and very cold weather.
However I had still my 30 contacts and still 14 days in Ukraina..and in 14 days in East Europe everything can happens....yes but not in Odessa...
I will back soon for continue the report.
P.S. here the foto I was able to take from the girl of sauna. ( she did not want to show her face-breast-pussy but surely with money she changed idea, but I was not so tired-drunk gonna to pay for foto of her...)
During the first week I got much fun with my buddy, but even if I contacted most of my contacts, I was able to take to bed only one freebie, Elena.
I called most of them and had nice conversation too, many sms, I lived with mobile phone in my hand, but to write with them and to meet them is totally different thing.
My buddy too, that had to meet with girl that was supposed had to come to Ods with a friend for me, did not come.
They simply like just to play, one asked me if we can meet next week,cause she had to study, another one told me, she had to go to cinema and then to fitness center the second day.
Unbelievable! They do not give a shit, no contact eye in street, zero results in disko and the others couple of westerners we met, had the same results.
Pretty impossible to get laid in Ods, if you do not live there and if you come only for short time and... 16 days are very short time!
Elena the second one freebie I fucked, I had to met her 4th times to convince her to come for a dinner to my flat. Here you see her during the day and after sex. She is a 6', the kind I can also get at home with little chit chat, but ok, I got my second freebie.
Interesting what she told me, that when she put in skype her on line status free for friends she soon got about 10 messages from new people and he had to shut off the computer or to close skype. When I met her, she had about 120 contacts in skype... and she is average...try to guess a nice woman in Odessa how many different men she has to handle every day..... will you be the lucky one who will get her to the bed if you have short time?
Another thing to say about Elena,that she always asked me questions about love and so on, after sex, she disappeared for 4 days and then she called me and asked me, if I am still in Ods and if I want to meet her again....I prefer much more to go out with my buddy instead to meet her again.
Arkadia as the Turkish disko were very slowly during the week, so sad.... you are in holiday and you have to kill the time,not exactly what you are thinking about when you plan a travel to Ukraina...
I got also a couple of pro from port. I will post their foto in few days.
Big thanx, great and very informative report, honest and detailed as well! I am surprised the internet contacts didnt work well, as opposite to DocSkank claims.
Thanks once again for your time
i’m not a novice, i’m pretty far to be ugly, i’m a globe trotter and mongers for over 20 years now, i can honestly write a book about it…..before going to odessa i was prepared to face the worst events as you can expected from any former ussr city but apparently my “training” wasn’t enough to face odessa trap…..
day 1
after 12 hrs of traveling and 8 hrs transit in istanbul (btw nice city istanbul and met quite interesting girl there), i was a dead man walking. nicely surprised on the flight istanbul-odessa a lot of babes…my vacations start well….odessa the weather is cloudy, rainy and cold…shit i forgot sweaters….i pass commenting on odessa airport as they’re still at the ice age (they still unload baggages by hand).
out of the custom my eyes are looking for my name as i’m expected….no name but only oes sign….maybe paper sheet in odessa is more expensive than somewhere else…. i have 2 luggages with me, no help offer from anybody, anyway i don’t ask for help (especially from a girl) but at least when you are in accommodation industry you should propose your help! this is a basic rule in this business.
then comes a rotten van, here again the driver don’t even bother to open the door or help you to load the luggages.
in the van the girl gave me an odessa map with their ad bragging their services, i was interiorly laughing, after all i’m not here for the quality of their services. as we’re crossing the city babes are everywhere, as in all former ussr the city is horrible and falling apart.
arrived in the area of my apartment, rishelievskaya and bunina street, there are 2 entrances, of course the girl took me to the worst one, i was shocked the whole building is a ruin.
as usual no help from anybody to unload your luggages, the entrance smell [CodeWord109] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord109) and shit, we cross a courtyard with garbages everywhere, there’s a metallic door with a code but the girl told me i won’t need it as the door is mostly open. in the hall same shitty smell and a complete darkness, i can’t see a damn thing, no lift, there are 4 floors to climb (as the stairs are very longs and wide i should say 6 floors), so i’m trying to find a switch somewhere but the girl just stop me to do that by saying “please don’t touch anything, we have some strange neighbors here they break everything” and she keeps climbing the stairs with the help of the light of her mobile phone, so after an exhausting travel, now carrying alone 2 heavy luggages and climbing 4 floor wide stairs in a complete darkness…just imagine my mood and anger…even the apartment is quite nice and spacious but what a point to have a castle in a shithole…i immediately asked to change the apartment but the girl told me they’re fully booked, i told her i can’t stay here ‘cause it’s totally unsafe, after trying to convince me with her bullshits she shows me the bill…i suppose to have a discount but no discount on the bill so i told her the manager promised me twice a discount, she told me impossible ‘cause at this price is already discounted, the normal price is us$95,..are you kidding me who’s gonna pay this shithole us$95, ud$75 is already overcharged, it doesn’t worth it at all, anyway no point to argue with a pawn and i’m too tired for that, i will see with the manager directly. after she left i realized i don’t have local currency, so i call the office…8pm..of course nobody …i forgot “business hours”…anyway no big deal i should be able to find a hidden atm in the area…now let’s explore the apartment and see what i need to buy…there’s a huge empty fridge (even not a welcome small bottle of water), tv set, cable tv (receiving only in black and white color), hi-fi, no new pc with fast internet access, washing machine in russian (very useful when you don’t read russian), a very used soap (no way i’m gonna touch it), no toilet paper, so imagine after an exhausting travel you have to go down in the darkness once again to find an atm and a supermarket at 9pm in an unknown city in order to spend a decent night….thanks oes great services….
fortunately atm and supermarket are easy to find and pretty close….the staffs in the supermarket (mostly girls) are quite unpleasant and rude…oups that’s a sign… on my way back with my hands full of shopping …shit the metallic door is closed and no number silk-screened on the buttons so you have to count the buttons in order to press the right button number…so you have to press 3 numbers in the same time...humm not easy in the dark with shopping bags and lighter in one hand and the other one trying to press 3 numbers in the same time…miracle i did it…but something or somebody is holding back the door the other side and i hear people whispering and running in the stairs and then they let go the door, i was shitting in my pant…at this moment i was ready to go straight to any hotels but realizing that i just paid us$600 so fuck it….i can get killed, stabbed, robbed, everything bad can happen in this darkness as i can’t see a damn thing…with the small light of my mobile i can see at least more than 10 people on the second floor staring at me…i never felt as vulnerable as i am now, i’m a tough guy but what can you do with 10 guys surrounding you…as i’m approaching them what a surprise there are mostly girls, a few guys and all of them are quite young…anyway i won’t ask them what games they are playing, i just double locked my door and enough adventure for my first day in odessa.
day 2
due to the jetlagged and an useless blinds my eyes are wide opened at 7am, did you ever try to sleep with a huge window in front of your bed with the daylight striking your face...for me impossible…anyway i was ready to forget my misadventures as i have a date with a girl from nikolev, it was a shitty day, heavy rain and cold. i turn on the light…and no light, yet there’s electricity as i can see the dvd player is on…..shit i can’t call anybody…too early…again business hours…9pm i call (no manager too early) and explain my problem, the girl promises to send over somebody…10:30 still nobody and i have to leave at 11 to pick up the girl at bus station, anyway the switch box is outside of the apartment.
taxi in undeveloped country is always a rip-off as usual, however i’m nicely surprised at the bus station, she’s prettier than in her picture, blond, green eyes, slim with a huge tits, speaking perfect english and french….i start to love ukraine…as it was raining like hell and i was too gentleman and shy to ask her to go directly to my place so we went to the restaurant, it was a very nice chatting and touching game. time is running as she has to go back at 7pm and it’s already over 4pm, it’s a good excuse to go back and check if they fix my light...at my surprise she was quite happy to go to my place…shit i should bring her directly to my place and not wasting time and money in the restaurant…she was a bit scared due to the darkness in the hall but nicely surprised when she’s in the apartment, she told me “what’s the difference between the inside and the outside?”…anyway the light wasn’t fix so i call the office (4:30pm no manager again maybe it’s too late), it was another girl and she wasn’t aware of my problem so she try to explain her bullshits again…anyway i don’t give a shit about her explanations and honestly the light is the last of my worry as i only want to fuck my beautiful girl ….after a fair game of no-yes play i put my tongue into her mouth and 2 fingers in her wet pussy…i was in heaven…suddenly she told me somebody’s knocking the door…i didn’t care i want her pussy…she stops kissing me and tell me again somebody’s knocking the fucking door…fuck, fuck…the girl from the office comes to check the switch box….but she hasn’t the key of the switchbox….what the fuck? what a dumb *****? in the meantime the mother of my girl call her…i really don’t care about her bullshits and try to make her understand that she has to get the fuck out of the apartment so i can get laid…then my nice neighbor comes and proposes me some candles….fuccccccccck leave me alone, i want to get my shot…too late it’s almost 8pm and my girl has to go (hurry by her mother)…fuck, fuck and fuck…trying to use all my tricks to keep her sleeping at my place…she can’t stay …so send her back to the bus station.
at this stage i was quite positive about odessa even i didn’t fuck yet, a girl comes from nikolev to see me (160 km away from odessa), she’s easy going and beautiful so if all the odessan girls are like her i will pass good times here and i still have a lot of freebie’s contacts.
back to the apartment still no light…so no light in the hall and the apartment …that’s great…shit i forgot business hours …nobody is in the office…not even a single lamp in the apartment so i can plug…yesssss i found the manager mobile’s number on the invoice…i call and then bla, bla,bla…ok he’ll come in 30mn (it was 8:30)…9:30 nobody yet, i have to turn on the tv in order to get some lights…10pm he shows up and just engage the switch in the switchbox…so i was waiting the whole fucking day for a simple gesture…anyway i told him my yesterday misadventures…his answer is “oh! don’t worry it’s a youth dormitory here, so a lot of in and out”…my question is; how can it be safe and secure (as oes brag everywhere on their ads) if there is a lot of in and out…anyway i wasn’t interested to argue as i spent a very good day and he promised me to give me back some money (discount promised) and change to another apartment if there’s any availability…as i have a friend just arrived and living at deribasovskaya street so the manager shows me where is his apartment…it isn’t far but not close either…3 blocks away…but the area is much nicer than my place…main street, nice shops, supermarket, restaurants, everything at your feet…the building is under renovation but still much nicer than where i am…there’s lightly marble hall, the apartment is a kind of loft, view on main street (mine view on crap ruined houses), pc with internet access,…, here is definitely nicer and cheaper…anyway i don’t care about prices…a deal is a deal…i only want a place i feel comfortable…after seeing his place how can i get back to my shithole...
12pm met-up with my buddy and straight to arkadia, only crowded place was western and as usual tons of babes …but ukrainian chicks are cold and distant, they seem not interested in foreigners at all or at least you have to speak russian and act like local guys, i noticed how local guys approach chicks; they just say a few words and then try directly to touch, hug, or kiss the girl…and most of the times it works…i read a lot of reports about dressing code for guys in ukraine such as dressing nice, trendy shoes (coz ukrainian chicks supposed to pay attention to shoes)…sorry to say that but local girls don’t care at all how you are dressed….most of the local guys are ugly and dress like shit but it doesn’t prevent them to shag beautiful chicks so dressing code is really not an issue…if you are waiting for an eyes-contact …well you can wait for years coz there is no eyes-contact or nothing really convincing to motivate you to go forward…they are beautiful but bad attitudes towards foreigners….so realizing no chance to get any chicks in disco we went to sauna…..i had a good session with a pro but my friend not….anyway nothing extraordinary…
back to my place, by climbing the stairs in the dark i stepped on drunken bum sleeping there ….that scared a shit out of me…this time enough is enough, i decided to change to deribasovskaya or book an earlier flight to go back coz this apartment depress me as hell.
day 3
i realized that i forgot all my contact numbers at home…shit…
i called the manager and tell him that i might have to go back earlier for business matter but i’m waiting a confirmation in the afternoon, in case that i have to leave earlier is there any refund for the unused days, yes but it will be a minimum…anyway i don’t give a damn about the refund as i want to get out from odessa asap…went to several travel agencies to book an early flight for bucharest ( i have some sure shots there)…spending 100 bucks but no suitable flights to catch the flight to my warm hometown…then no choice to call the manager and tell him i’d stay but he has to move me to deribasovskaya area…late afternoon i went to oes office to talk to the manager but he wasn’t in the office, his assistant told me there will be at least 2 available rooms tomorrow here, i called the manager … but he just hanged up on me…tried again 1 hour later…unbelievable he hanged up again … and then he shut down his mobile… i was so pissed…anyway i tried again a couple of hours later…after a couple of ringing, he answered with an unfriendly voice but when i told him i’ll stay ‘till the end… the tone of his voice was much more friendly…i told him i stay only if i can change to deribasovskaya area…he told me he’ll check and will call me back later on. 10mn later he called me with enthusiasm and confirmed that i can move tomorrow afternoon to the room next to my friend, i was so happy that my friend and i celebrated by drinking a bottle of wine…that day we didn’t feel to go out as we enjoyed so much only by talking and joking.
day 4
i was awake at 8am as i was so hasten to get out from my shithole (anyway impossible to sleep with the daylight on your face), at noon pulling 2 heavy luggage on the street (thanks again to oes great services) might look funny to local people as they look at me bizarrely, anyway i don’t give a damn as i was happy to move out …i put my luggages at my friend’s place and we went to have lunch…3pm i went to oes office to get the key of my room…i asked for the manager and an unfriendly voice shouted “who is it?” it seemed to me more like “who the fuck is it”…at the tone of his voice i was sure something’s wrong…anyway i told him i came for the key of the new apartment…he looked at me like surprised and said “ i never told you to move in today” i was so shocked and pissed as he kept lying and bullshitting me…i told him “what is your fucking problem as you have at least 2 available rooms here” … his answer was; he needs at least 24 hours to clean up the room (what an efficiency the need 24 hours to clean up 50sqm) …besides he will put me on upper floor in a tiny room…as the apartment next to my friend is booked month ahead…at this stage no point to argue further as he doesn’t have any scruples to lie to me…that was a complete customer disrespect and an insult to my intelligence… from that moment no need to tell you that my vacations are completely screwed up…no motivation to anything anymore…
day 5
10pm he called me and said that i can move in the afternoon…i said “why yesterday you told me i can move in before afternoon?” as usual same lying bullshits…anyway 10mn later he called me back and said i can move in now and i will have the apartment next to my friend…no comments….
when i went down the stairs there is a jewish community moving in the 3rd floor…and i saw them changing bulbs in the hall and turn on the light….thanks again to oes great services…i almost broke my neck twice because of a fucking simple cheap bulb….
conclusion:
oes has screwed me and my vacations.
- they are liars and unprofessional
- they don’t know shit about accommodation business
- they advertise “western standards” but they surely mean “western africa standards” (in western countries the law forbids to let people live in a ruin where the roof can collapse at any moment, see pictures below)
- they should stop bragging about the quality of their apartments and their services coz it’s false advertisement (in bucharest i rented a similar apartment for 200 euros a month, not 75us$ a day)
- no 24 hours security as the guy disappears in the night time
- no continental breakfast as advertised in the brochure
- no imported egyptian linen (unless egyptians write in cyrillic letters)
- no services (if you need something you have to beg for it)
- unfriendly and incompetent staffs and management
adding to this;
- odessa chicks have bad attitudes, not friendly and cold
- they like playing games such as driving you nuts with contradictory moves
- the living cost is very expensive comparing to the standard salary
- services are inexistent
- very unfriendly staffs in restaurant or else
- you are invisible if you don’t speak decent russian
- pro scene is very poor and girls are not really clean (took 4 pros, 2 good fucks but not really clean, 1 bad fuck and not really clean and 1 very good fuck (really the best, everything is allowed) and clean.
- even pro doesn’t want to talk to you if you don’t speak russian
- taxi always try to rip you off
my advices:
if all my troubles don’t convince you not to go odessa here are my advices:
- take only apartment on deribasovskaya street
- learn russian
- do an intensively home work before going there (even that no guarantee you will get a free shot)
- don’t be so nice (as suggested by a lot of guys in isg), anyway it shows that you’re weak, act like local guys, they’re rude… and they fuck beautiful chicks
- be ready to…hit and miss
- stay at least 3 weeks if you want to get any positive results
- be zen otherwise you will get angry and nut
- in case you are lucky and get a freebie, be patient and ready to play games coz local chicks will play surely nasty with you…you know the very famous game “ fuck or get fucked”
- or go somewhere else than odessa…it can’t be worst …
eros75
Doctor_Skank
09-22-06, 16:00
Rocko1:
"I am surprised the internet contacts didnt work well, as opposite to DocSkank claims."
Obviously you never read my reports on Odessa, I have been saying for two years that Odessa isn't Pussy Mecca.
Stravinsky
09-22-06, 16:18
Eros,
Sounds like they really rolled out the red carpet for you! Odessa sounds like just my kind of place. :)
Too bad you don't speak Russian. I wouldn't mind being locked up in a youth dormitory full of young dyevs!! A bottle of champanskovo, a tin of ikra, kysochik xleba, and you will have more pussy than you've seen in your life. :) And there's always more new ones coming in! :) Geez, you were in paradise, and didn't even know it!!!
But, then, as a seasoned EE traveller, I never go anywhere without my roll of TP and a flashlight! :)
счастливо,
Stravinsky
Stravinsky
09-23-06, 02:17
. . . coz me I can't distinguish male or female in the dark...
Personally, I've never had any trouble telling the difference. (HA!)
Mazel Tov!
Eros75,
Sounds like you never traveled to Russia or Ukraine before. Most buildings in the former Soviet Union look like shit, especially the exteriors, common areas: hallways, stairs (just think cat [CodeWord140] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord140)) reception areas,etc. This is due to the fact that the local governments usually own them and NOT the tenants.
On the other hand, you can be in a crappy building and the apartments can be palaces on the inside. This is just a fact of travel there that won't change until the mode of ownership does....and the income levels increase.
Also, debris in the courtyard doesn't surprise me either. Everywhere you look, there is construction and renovation.
Hi Guys,
Just booked a return flight from London to Odessa via Prague, flying out on 22 Dec and coming back on the 26th. This coincides with the four day (w/e + Xmas day + Boxing Day) Christmas break we get in the UK. Of course, this period is not Christmas time in the Slavic world.
However, my focus this time is going to be Nikolaev - roughly 1 1/2 hrs by taxi from Odessa - rather than Odessa itself. Although NIK is smaller with less to do than ODS, the simple fact - so I've gathered - is that Nikolaev's girls are about 10 times nicer and keener to meet us (i.e. foreign men) than the screwed up bitches in ODS. There's essentially no oligarch syndrome in NIK. In ODS, hot girls have no problem finding a local rich guy to pick up their bills and shower them with gifts, so they can treat Westerners trying their luck with contempt.
In NIK, you've got the same hotties, same flash clubs, posh restaurants and female aspirations, but NO local Uke mafiosos to pay their bills. So, that's where WE come in :D
I'm sure you've got the same kind of (favourable) situation in Donetsk, Lugansk and Mariupol, it's just that NIK is easier (for me) to get to for a short break.
I think a combination of going off season and going to a non destination town will prove to be a goldmine. Does anyone have a different opinion, or think that ODS will be better than NIK in Winter?
So, who's on for some winter freebie chasing in NIK? Alphamale? Skank? Let me know.
Vinnie,
All of your reports are useless since your credibility is zero with most forum readers.
To confirm with Anton or Masha at OES about your experiences versus Eros75's is just another example of a useless post. These are the very people who Eros75 accuses of poor service and constantly lieing.
It really would be more appropriate for our long lost poster CAT who owns OES to resurface and to explain what happened to Eros75 to the forum. His pictures and text paint a very unfortunate picture of OES.
Doctor_Skank
09-23-06, 18:57
We'd all be interested in hearing what OES has to say about the dismal service reported by Eros75 during his stay, even though much of Eros75's complaints are about Odessa itself and Odessan women, neither of which are OES's responsibility.
Odessa has dark shitty entryways and badly needs a remont... just like the rest of Ukraine once you've ventured more than 500 meters from Kreshatik. Actually you don't even have to go that far. I lived 100 meters from Maidan in Kiev and had a whole bomzhi colony living next door... that's FSU-life love it or leave it.
Cashiers don't smile? They don't smile in Kiev or Moscow either but their eyes roll back in their head when you fuck them real hard. Slavic passion is under the surface. Their superficially mean demeanor is a defense mechanism.
I know the area of Odessa that Eros75 is talking about and probably even stayed in the apartment he mentioned at one time or another. I am quite certain that had Odessan women been more "forthcoming" in giving up their pussies, the lack of Egyptian cotton sheets or all-night security would have taken a secondary importance.
Nonetheless advertising is advertising and perhaps the OES website should be adjusted to reflect a more realistic view of the facilities. I had my own minor difficulty with the same issue a few months ago, even though as I stressed then I was generally satisfied with their service.
I may be wrong, but I think the main source of frustration for foreigners visiting Odessa is the fact that the pros don't even come close to measuring up to the kind of beauty you see every day on the street and those ISG mongers looking for free and easy sex with the locals sooner or later discover that the Odessan women patrolling Deribasovskaya or the clubs at Arkadia are quite adept at removing foreigners from their money and their nerves. Since 90% of foreigners visiting Odessa never leave the Deribasovskaya or Arkadia areas, these are the only women they'll meet... and it really can be like running up against a brick wall, particularly in the summer.
More "normal" Odessan women... like the ones that actually have a REAL JOB (besides shopping, sitting in cafes or hanging out at the beach) are much more approachable and honest... but you probably need at least intermediate Russian to communicate with them.
Eros,
I've never been to or plan on going to Odessa but based on what I have seen others report in this forum did you really expect anything other then what happened to you? With the exception of your dismal OES experience (I wouldn't stay in that pictured crap hole if it was for free) everything else seems par for the course - you really expected a FSU cashier to smile at you?
Well, it looks like someone has a different opinion already!
So..
- I am sure that most of the men, if not all..., went to Ods, when they realized in Ods is mission impossible to pick up with regular, immediately they contacted girls from Nik, it means that in Nik the women are ruined as well as in Ods.
- the mine 2 girls, showed me that also in Nik the girls are fucked up as in Ods and they have the same bitchy attitude.
-the city is ugly, sad and if I saw all the center in half hour in september and got boring in one hour,even if every street had many persons walking, I cannot imagine what you can do in winter there...
I suppose to stay in Nik in winter had to be so funny as to live inside to graveyard...
-Ash1001 I am pretty sure you do not know what you are talking about, when you plan to go to Nik.
However I will be very happy if you go there and if you showed me with proof that I am wrong...
-last but not the least, If Odessa with tons of turist, have almost zero pro scene, Nik sad, ugly city with zero turism have even less pro scene.Well actually I did have an alternative plan - stay in ODS and check out the winter clubs: palladium, YoYo etc. There should be lots of students around too as it will be their term time.
I might do Nik in early Summer when it's a little less depressing
Bez Bezarra
09-24-06, 14:05
my thought a simple fact -
Nikolaev girls are 10 times nicer to meet foreign men than bitches in ODS.
There's no oligarchs in NIK.
In NIK you've got NO mafioso.
I'm sure the same situation in Donetsk, Lugansk and Mariupol.
I think going will prove to be a goldmine in Winter
:) Probably you should "think" again? Unless....
Does your extensive experience at FSB state security service
or years working Interpol OCD on Donets'k Lugans'k Nikolaev
and Mariupol that leads your conclusions those cities don't
have oligarchs and mafia?
Is same 'thinking' lead you to believe mongering in snow and
ice is goldmine?
Or maybe is it ostolop dumat zhopa?
Does your extensive experience at FSB state security service or years working Interpol OCD on Donets'k Lugans'k Nikolaev
and Mariupol that leads your conclusions those cities don't
have oligarchs and mafia?
Is same 'thinking' lead you to believe mongering in snow and
ice is goldmine?Bez,
No doubt those cities I listed have their share of Mafia - the industrial towns of the Donbass is where the oligarchs actually make their money. In fact Rinat Akhmetov, Ukraine's richest man (and biggest gangster :) ) still lives in Donetsk.
But these places are definitely NOT tourist destinations for Ukrainians who have money, whereas Odessa is. I'm sure you can't argue with that. We all have first hand experience of ODS girls with no obvious source of income dressed head to toe in Gucci and treating Westerners with contempt
I just cannot believe you'll see the same thing in Nikolaev - not from what I've heard anyway. Demographically there are simply not enough men with money to go round. If I'm wrong, please explain.
And I doubt that a little snow and ice would stop a girl going to a nightclub, buying a small beer and sipping it all night - in the hope that some guy with a few $ will come and sit next to her and buy her champagne.
I agree that 4 days in a run down industrial city in Winter could be a bit much to take - and the streets could be a little empty. But the clubs should still be happening, right? Or not? Who's actually checked out UKR provincial town nightlife in the winter?
Hi guys,
I am usually a lurker because I don't look for sex, I am married 5 yrs to a Odessen women. I finally think I should come clea nabout opionions I noticed over the yrs. I was an expat in kiev where I met my wife. I was one of the biggest playboys Kiev ever saw. I was in my late 20s, German guy and I worked I and Kiev during the day and chased girls at night, or they chased me. Then I fell in love got married, etc. Visit often because of my wife. Now I am going to give you inside details about Odessa. Even from articles in magazines etc.
Odessans always was cosmoppolitan city full of snobs. They accepted foreigners because they always had them. In fact the genes often are part Greek, Italian, etc. In Soviet Union Odessa was number 1 city for free expresion and had foreigners coming all the time (sailors). The first sexpats went to Oodesa and marriage agency chasers as well. Basically they saw moe foreigners then any other city and got sick of them. Also economy wise Odessa doing good. They don't need a foreign men. They can meet Russian guy or even make money them selves. Odessans also very worldly and most beautiful women left, even pros went to other countries.
So my question is why does anyone go to Odessa. The residents are descendants from criminals (read book titled Odessa Mama)and all they see foreigners as prey to scam also because they know foreigners in Odessa just tourists etc, they have no long tern reason to be nice to you. In Kiev at least it can hel there career because they live there.
Everything is also overpriced. From what I here Moscow, St. Petersburg best for pro scens and freebies. Litle cities in Ukraine good for long term relationships but no pro scene. But why waste time on bus, just go to big cities with established pro scenes.
As for Nikoliev, of course bette then Odessa but to close to Odessa to be much different. Usually they copy Odessan mentality (Kherson) also and actually ar jealous of Odessans.
As for cat I saw him advertising in beginning and challenged him he wrote me back some excuse. Truth is I wouldnt be surprised if I evn know the owners, I pretty much met most Odesan expats and probably met them as well. Be honest most expats in odessa seem to be low class as well. Usually they know odessa expensive and odessan women hard to buy so need lots of money to impress them just like local russian guys. They open agencies to rip off foeigners. I disaagree with cat interpretation of Odessa and he obviously promoting Odessa to make money. I might have met Doctor Skank years ago, maybe we even ex-wingmates. I wouldn't know because no one uses real names. But hes right k
I've great compared to Odessa.
Also now with so mank suckers going to Odessa it even getting worst because girls will be more unimpreessed, etc. But these agency owners doing it for money. Even the long term sexpats keep away from Odessa in sumertime. There's some chubby canadian guy who hunts in Odessa year long and he doesn't do very good (of course much better then he would in Canada).
Now excuse my english please, but I thought I had to say something.
Don't get me wrong, Odessa much better than home and can be rewarding, but bad place for mongering and not much of a beach resort. Sea and beaches dirty. If you like to work go to Odessa, if you want room service go to capitals.
If anyone has questions ask.
Bez Bezarra
09-24-06, 17:55
But these places are NOT destinations
for Ukrainians, whereas Odessa is.
I just cannot believe the same in Nikolaev -
not from what I've heard anyway.
Demographically there are not enough men with money.
If I'm wrong, please explain.
Somewhat opposite again.
1. Now there are probably as many or more non-Ukrainians
going to holiday in Odeca, than Ukrainians. (Krim is most
popular summer holiday for Ukrainians)
2. Most visitors to Ukraine cities ARE Ukrainian businessmen.
3. Every city has its own elitny and BMW leather wise guys.
Making assumptions and generalizations that some places
are "different" based on hearsay is mere fiction.
PLEASE don't believe me, go and see it for yourself.
Guys,
As I said on my reports I was prepared to the worst things in Ods, I'm not a novice about FSU scene, I didn't expect that chicks jump on me at the first sight (usually yes :-)), I had tons of russian girlfriends (no pros), I was living for more than a year in Bucharest and the diagram is not much different than Ods and for whom read carefully I said I'm not in Ods for the quality of OES services...even they bragged they are the best...but what I had paid I expected at least a minimum of services such as having light in the hall so I can access without any danger to my apartment...and it wasn't a deficient "community services" coz OES has just to change the bulbs...
I'm a quiet and easy going guy, I wouldn't write a such report against OES if the manager just explain diplomatically to me whatever the reasons (as any common sense manager would explain to a customer)but as he kept bullshitting me without giving any valid reasons so my anger is quite understandable.
Before going to Ods me and my friend we were ready to face the bad attitude of local chick, we even said in case we don't score any freebie we can simply enjoy by talking, drinking and joking ourselves but we didn't expect (I should say I coz my friend's place is a good one) that the problem will be OES.
Most of guys surely have good experiences with OES but unfortunately not me and I was complaining only about the apartment I stayed, it doesn’t concern the others as OES has very good apartment at Deribasovskaya Street.
Even freebies in Ods are not that easy but I would surely manage a way to get some as I did everywhere I have been in the world but my hunger and motivation have been completely spoiled by OES attitude’s staffs..
Doc you are surely a Slavic pussy’s expert but in my opinion any pussy (no matter where they’re from) would roll back their eyes in their head if you know how to fuck them real hard.
Special Ciao to my friend with me in Ods…without him in Ods would be worst.
Eros75
Doctor_Skank
09-24-06, 20:45
Eros75:
Well we really all agree that OES should provide comment on what happened to you. Some posters have had great experiences with OES, others average and some poor.
I'll also 100% agree with you that seemingly minor setbacks when compounded over the course of a couple of days soon become major mojo killers and put you in the wrong mood for mongering. But we mongers must persevere and much of FSU's bureaucracy, lack of service, poor city conditions, greedy taxi drivers etc. are all there to try to stop us, but we must fight through it.
As for girls rolling their eyes back into their head, I was just making a point that just because a Slavic girl seems cold on the outside, it doesn't mean she isn't a firey demoness inside.
And as for anybody being an expert, every time I think I've truly figured Slavic women out they throw me for a loop... and I realize I never want to totally figure them out, I enjoy the ride too much and like it to stay unpredictable.
Sorry about your bummer vacation man, I am sure you will find solice in the arms of a Slavic babe soon enough to make you forget why you ever doubted that they are the greatest thing on Earth... :)
No doubts Doc they are the best of the best, I confirm again...and again...
Eros75
Hmm, I have perhaps been a little hasty in booking my flight down to Odessa for the Xmas period. But I had four days to kill and did NOT want to be in London. Maybe I should have chosen Istanbul or Dubai? But hey, that's a whole new thread :)
I'm a frequent visitor to Kiev and am usually impressed by the openness and friendliness of the women I meet - it's almost as if the big city attitude is working in our favour. I just thought I'd do S Ukraine in the Winter as it will be warmer, and I'm curious about what ODS will be like off-season.
I've only been to ODS twice, the first time being in October 2004 when the tourist season had just finished. There were a lot of students around and no obvious tourist contingent. BUT speaking Russian, I discovered, was the make or break factor - you would be blanked if you started your chat up in English.
I'm taking Russian lessons and should be able to hold a meaningful conversation now ;)
So, do you think Fri 22nd to Tue 26th Dec in Odessa will be the safer bet? Or should I take a deep breath and try Nikolaev? Advice please.
Bez Bezarra
09-25-06, 03:27
Guys,
I was the worst thing that chicks jump on
I had tons of girlfriends in Bucharest and read carefully I dont brag
I paid to have danger and bulbs.
I ease it in but he kept shitting me so my anger is quite understandable.
me and my friend when we don't score we enjoy talking coz my friend's a guy
but I was complaining as I did everywhere I have been in the world
and have been completely spoiled by my special friend with me in Ods…
without him in Ods would be worst.
Eros75
Time for some new friends?
Bez Bezarra
09-25-06, 03:45
Eros75
Well we really all are Sorry about your bum man,
I am sure you will find lice in your thing :)
Can you hear Akroyd and Steve Martin joking with the accents
in those "two wild and crazy guys"!
Sevastopol1
09-25-06, 07:16
Are you aware that Xmas is celebrated in January and the days you mention are just normal days?
Hmm, I have perhaps been a little hasty in booking my flight down to Odessa for the Xmas period. But I had four days to kill and did NOT want to be in London. Maybe I should have chosen Istanbul or Dubai? But hey, that's a whole new thread :)
I'm a frequent visitor to Kiev and am usually impressed by the openness and friendliness of the women I meet - it's almost as if the big city attitude is working in our favour. I just thought I'd do S Ukraine in the Winter as it will be warmer, and I'm curious about what ODS will be like off-season.
I've only been to ODS twice, the first time being in October 2004 when the tourist season had just finished. There were a lot of students around and no obvious tourist contingent. BUT speaking Russian, I discovered, was the make or break factor - you would be blanked if you started your chat up in English.
I'm taking Russian lessons and should be able to hold a meaningful conversation now ;)
So, do you think Fri 22nd to Tue 26th Dec in Odessa will be the safer bet? Or should I take a deep breath and try Nikolaev? Advice please.
Bez
Don't change my words to your own, don't be a dumb coward by copying and change the meaning of my words, if you have something to say...say it with your own words, don't be a pussy coz there is already a lot on this site...I value much more friendship than pussies coz pussies you can get anywhere...but I'm talking something you surely don't know....by your reaction I won't be surprised if you are involved in some ways to OES business
Eros75
Doctor_Skank
09-25-06, 14:42
Tom73:
I don't think we met, which is too bad because I am sure we would have had fun having a couple of drinks and chasing skirts...
Thanks for your "insider" comments on Odessa.
Ash1001:
Just like Tom73, I doubt that Nikolaev is simply "Odessa without the attitude", but can't speak from first hand experience. Have been to plenty of other provincial towns though and have been saying all along that I don't think they are really better than the big cities for mongering. Some guys say the provinces are heaven, my experience has been inconsequential ... moments of spectacular glory mixed with a lot of moments of mind-numbing boredom.
Sure there are some advantages in mongering in smaller towns:
* generally lower prices on everything, including p4p sex
* much less competition from other foreigners, some girls are attracted to foreigners
* women who may be looking to "escape" the boredom and hopelessness of their shitty towns
* almost all strip clubs are pickup joints for pros, as are saunas
* student towns have lots of 18-22 year old women
* one GOOD pro contact can keep you supplied with pros for your entire stay
That is about it... but for some mongers, that's exactly the right mix.
The disadvantages are, among others:
* lack of p4p infrastructure, much of "the game" is unadvertised
* generally dismal, depressing life during the week... only club action in on weekends
* clubs very limited and generally dominated by local wanna-be mafioso
* Russian language skill (or good contacts) a must to really crack the surface of "the game"
* you may attract negative attention from the locals, especially if non-white
* lack of accessible apartment services (they do exist in every city, but Russian is often required)
* hotels not girl-friendly and either expensive-n-shitty or cheap-n-super shitty
* due to student girls busy schedules, in-week dating often difficult and many girls leave on weekends
For the more comfort-oriented monger, the provincial towns are really not a good bet.
An adventurous freebie-chaser may find heaven in the provinces, I have usually found a wash-downed version of the capitals. Interesting, but no real advantage compared to Kiev for example... at least in the short term. Being in the provinces usually starts to pay off after about 7-10 days... before that there is a lot of "run around" getting settled, finding and milking contacts, making dates and getting girls to come to your apartment. You have this in Kiev as well, but in Kiev you also have easy access "crap-shoot" p4p options to fall back on and there is freebie club action 7 days a week. Going "provinicial" can pay off big-time if things go well, but it can be mentally and physically draining, especially if you are alone.
We've met and I know you are a fit and confident guy, so I don't doubt your ability to handle Nikolaev, but do wonder if it's going to be much better than Odessa or even Kiev in terms of freebie action in the winter. I'm kind of hoping you give it a try and give us all a good report on how it goes for you... am curious like the rest of ISG on how well you do... :)
My experience about EE is limited to Chisinau and Romania, but despite all the real disadvantages listed by D.S, and without being controversial, those 'mid-sized' provincial cities are IMO still VERY interesting hunting grounds.
What seems to me evident is that those cities are HUGE. Kharkov has 1 500 000 inhabitants, compared to, let's say, the 600 000 inhabitants of Chisinau urban area. Almost three times more girls to chase (in Chisinau the girls are already PLENTIFUL and it has been for me a very, very, very good freebies hunting ground). Also how many mongers go to Kharkov (or Dnipro, Donest, ect, all cities of 1 000 000 inhabitants or more) compared with the HORDES of sex-tourists invading Chisinau ?
Just my two leis
http://www.citypopulation.de/Ukraine-Cities.html
Doctor_Skank
09-25-06, 20:18
Prosal:
If you have the urge to check out the provinces, then go for it... maybe it is your paradise... :)
I do suggest you plan in a couple of days longer than you would for Moscow or Kiev... it takes a bit longer to "get the ball rolling" in the provinces and there are the various disadvantages I listed before (among others) but if you can get good mojo going, it can pay off big time.
Just don't expect it to be a simple case of:
"Kharkov: Kiev without the foreigners"
"Nikolaev: Odessa without the attitude"
or
"Donetsk: Moscow without the traffic"
The differences are less superficial... then again, if you've been to Chisinau, you know what to expect...
D.S
You're spot on. In Chisinau, as in Bucarest, one of the most important rule is to have ENOUGH time (three to four weeks are ideal). I guess it's the same thing EVERYWHERE in EE.
Cheers
I went to kharkov for hunting.It was not so great maby because I staid only 2 nights.
I saw some sw but I rate them as 5-6.couldnt find clubs like the RP in kiev or even close to it.
In my opinion its a waste of time going there for hunting.
Good Luck
I just remmembered: On the train from Kharkov I saw a girl from kiev-x.com.
It seems that the nice girls are going to Kiev for open and close.
CA Traveler
09-25-06, 21:15
at his request, i'm posting this response to eros75 from anton since he is not able to post it directly...
i am sure ca traveler will respond also, but i wanted to reply…under my real name: anton olff… as eros75 - i will not disclose his name. he gets the benefit of anonymous posting and can therefore say anything, make false statements and accusations about me and my staff.
from the standpoint of a business owner, it is always disheartening to hear that a customer or client has had a bad experience…whether they have contributed to this in some way or not. when you are in the accommodations business, you try all possible ways to make a client happy, regardless of his personal needs and quirks. most of the time, we have succeeded. in this case, we clearly did not.
there are times however, when everything you do is not enough. moreover, there are always people whom are never satisfied, whether due to unrealistic expectations, an individual personality, lack of experience in russia or ukraine, attitude, etc. eros75 fits that bill.
in any case, i would like to address comments made by eros75, so that the readers on this website can have the facts to make their own judgment. moreover, i would love to hear from others who have stayed with us. my email is: anton@theodessagroup.net
what strikes me most about reading this posting are some of the general statements of eros75. at the very least, they tend to be contradictions to much of his diatribe:
“in the van the girl gave me an odessa map with their ad bragging their services, i was interiorly laughing, afterall i’m not here for the quality of their services”
“even the apartment is quite nice and spacious, but what a point to have a castle in a shithole”
our apartments may indeed be “castles in a shithole,” to paraphrase eros75. one could argue that much of the fsu is a shithole. what we have been trying to do…and we are not completely there yet…is renovate and rebuild the so that it is not in the case. this country and this region, have a ways to go before that is the reality. most buildings (quoting eros75, “ as in all the former ussr city is horrible and falling apart”), the entrances, the courtyards, the exteriors, the staircases… all need major work, including the building where eros75 stayed upon his arrival.
as for personal safe, odessa is safer than most cities in the world. eros75 seems to be a little disturbed by the fact that other people live in the building, and somewhat frightened by the prospect of living next to apartments housing young jewish female students.
as for accusations made by eros75 about my conduct and that of my staff, i am shocked by his statements. i would like to respond every point…but it would quickly become a flame war which is inappropriate for this forum. however, i would like to make several points…
some facts:
1) both my staff and i went out of our way to accommodate eros75 at all times. no one bullshitted him or lied as he states. i am personally insulted not only by his comments, but by his omissions: for instance, the best girls whom he had with were women i had referred to him.
2) in spite of 100% occupancy, i suggested and arranged for him to move closer to his friend and at the inconvenience of a personal friend who i had to accommodate elsewhere. i did this out of pity for someone i considered lost and confused and perhaps in need of a little hand holding.
he is also confused about the prices he states (i guess our office manager masha, the “pawn” that eros75 calls her from the beginning of his post, lied to him too.) if he likes, i can post his confirmation and invoice on the internet for all to see. he was never quoted orally or in writing: $95 per night for any apartment he stayed in.
moreover, as courtesy to his friend, he received a discount when he booked and received an even more generous discount when he transferred to a larger more expensive apartment at our main location on deribsovskaya…. plus, a partial refund as another gesture of goodwill.
in addition, he complains about internet service not being in the apartment, but he never booked it or asked for it. on top of that, i gave him our optional high speed internet service…free of charge!!!
some other minor points:
our van is not rotten, nor dirty. in addition, our driver is one of those rare finds in this part of the world: a non-drinker and a clean freak.
on several occasions, eros75 rejected the help of our staff who tried to help him after he called the office requesting it. he also rejected my assistance, and interestingly the help of a fellow monger and neighbor who offered him candles when the power went out temporarily. if your cock is your brain and guide, then please don’t insult those who have tried to help you.
some advice for travelers to odessa, and indeed the fsu in general:
1) arrive with an open mind. if you are the type who cannot accept the challenge of being in a developing country or city, go to a more developed destination. also, there are some people for whom apartments are not a good choice. hotels are a better option for these types of travelers. however, it most cases, plan to pay more for everything.
2) learn some russian. the days of bagging “regular girls” cause you are an english speaking foreigner are over. as for pros…better to go to moscow, bangkok or rio. however, if you are prepared to do a little work to bag some of the most beautiful women on the planet, then this…and the rest of ukraine…are your place.
3) some asian men do very well here. if you are asian however, as eros75 is…don’t expect the girls here to fall at your knees. there is still prejudice and if you don’t have the personality to overcome this obstacle, then you will be disappointed (could this have something to do with the perspective of eros75???)
we have had african-americans, japanese and chinese men stay with us who have very done well here. again: if you are a loser in your own country…or you have a fragile ego, then don’t expect the results to be different here. go to bangkok instead. the girls here are easy. however, they have a modicum of self-respect and aren’t as hungry as girls from southeast asian villages or the slums of the third world.
4) plan your dates with “regulars” before your arrival…and overbook.
5) the girls here can be very cold and distant on the outside, but they warm up if your approach is correct. eros75 is half-right when he says you have to treat them badly to score: “nice guys don’t get laid.” on the other hand, you have to know how to treat women. 98% of the mongers who arrive in odessa are really good and their success rate reflects it (it is always a learning experience for me!!!) unfortunately, the remaining 2% are clueless and seem to screw it up for others.
6) dress nice!! sorry eros75, you are very wrong about that one. i am a very poor dresser myself and i know that i have lost a few hot prospects every now and then because of it. people here are very status conscious and clothes are one way to express it.
lastly, keep your expectations in line with the reality of traveling to the fsu.
Doc Skank and Prosal - thanks vm for your perspective on the provincial town issue.
Although I'm definitely curious about Nikolaev, I think that in the depth of Winter staying in Odessa will just be more pleasant - it's a sophisticated town with good restaurants and bars and a generally upmarket feel. You could enjoy yourself even with no sex materialising (just kidding - it's not THAT great :))
I think I'll check out NIK in early summer, say May. Perhaps run-down, post-industrial grimness won't feel so bad when the sun is shining!
Nikolaev, by the way, is the #1 town for marriage agency "socials" (once again this is something I've only heard). I wonder how this would affect the general attitude of the girls and their approach to foreign men? It'd make them savvier & more jaded, no doubt?
CA Traveler
09-25-06, 23:17
It probably has not been noticed, but I have purposely not posted over the past couple of months. I don’t plan to bore people with a long explanation, but rather share a few final thoughts with anyone who might care to listen.
While I operated my apartment rental business in Moscow, one of my greatest pleasures, besides being sandwiched between two blondes, was meeting and getting to know fellow mongers from all over the world. Many of those clients have become repeat clients, good friends and, in Anton’s case, a business partner. During that period, it was obvious whenever a client came to the FSU for the first time, but for the most part everyone seemed to be flexible enough to understand the environment and that even in the “capital” of the Soviet Union, where billions of rubles are spent to make it the “showplace”, it was still in a transition phase of development and, in fact, that was part of the charm.
When I first visited Spb, it was a city totally under construction in preparation for its upcoming 850th anniversary. Now, of course, it is a “show place” but even Spb has its decaying areas.
When I first visited Odessa directly from Moscow, I was amazed at the underlying beauty of the city, which I shared in earlier posts. Granted it is still in the middle of a long transition to its former self, BUT the city is magnificent in that it shows the three stages of the long crawl out of the dregs of the Soviet Union; 1) Decay, 2) Work-in-progress, 3) Full restoration.
Of course, one of the downsides of this crawl up the mountain of restoration is that you may have a decaying building right next to a beautifully restored 19th century building, BUT perhaps you have to be flexible and knowledgeable enough about the history and culture to appreciate the city’s progress.
At the same time, Odessa is not Kiev, Spb, or Moscow, it is not the primary destination of Ukrainian grivna for development projects. By all standards, Kiev is far along in the progress of development, as is Moscow and Spb.
Specifically to address the several negative comments posted recently, there have been hundreds of posts that discuss the terrible common areas in apartment buildings throughout the FSU. Eros75 makes it sound like he has frequently traveled throughout the FSU, i.e. Russia, yet he has no posts that I can find about RU. It seems that bedding a Russian does not make you culturally literate about the country and its quirks.
I began by praising my clients in Moscow because they were the highlight of my time there… Similarly, in Odessa the vast majority of our clients have been great guys with an understanding that Odessa is not Thailand and it does not offer the P4P opportunities of Moscow, Bangkok or other oft mentioned destinations. Nor is Odessa a western destination where most people speak English!
(That said, the vast majority of our clients have a great time and many have already returned for their second, third and fourth visits. Some have even purchased or are looking for an apartment in Odessa.)
In fact, I think all of this has been well documented, but in spite of the many posts stating exactly this, people continue to arrive with false expectations that… 1) every girl is available as a P4P partner, 2) average pay is so low that a girl will swoon over every westerner who waves a $50 bill at them, 3) A ho is a ho and once you pay them you own them, 4) there’s no need to do any homework, but still to expect to sweep an ODS girl off her feet because they live outside the FSU, 5) There is no need to learn even a few Russian words, etc.
To repeat again, Odessa is not a first line of the monger kingdom, but rather a reasonably priced place you can visit and, at the same time, be surrounded with beautiful women at clubs, cafes and on the street. IF you have the moxie to make it happen, it is really up to you. As a rule of thumb, if you can walk into a bar/club in most cities and have the personality to get close to a woman and either leave with her or with her phone number, AT LEAST 30% of the time, you will do OK in Odessa and will have a ball. Why? Because you obviously enjoy the hunt and understand that you can’t bag a keeper if you don’t make it happen yourself!
If you can’t answer that honestly, then you should not plan to visit Odessa and have a FREE bed partner…
The other unusual thing about Odessa is that the working girls let you know if they don’t like a client. In fact, I have never seen it happen as often as it did in the past two months from mongers who made unreasonable demands and in fact had a difficult time finding P4P AT ANY PRICE! Why? Simply because they were jerks and behaved in ways that forced these normally flexible girls to draw the line! In other words, a loser in their home country is probably going to be a loser in Odessa!
Ironically, when VinceV made plans to visit, I held my breath because I knew he had a rep of ripping off other’s information, including mine, and I fully expected him to be very high maintenance! HOWEVER, he had a great time and didn't require a lot of hand holding because he was personable and made friends, even if he didn’t speak Russian. I admit I was surprised, but some of the recent posts by less successful mongers have highlighted that you can’t judge a person and his personality from their posts!
As doc stated, one's perspective would have probably been different if they had been able to keep their bed occupied without help. In fact, that makes the FSU crummy hallways seem petty! :)
At the same time, it is a bit of a stretch for another member to pu-pu VV’s report when that member has recently posted a report where he has bent the truth to such an extent!
As it stands, we can pretty much peg the guys who will do well when they visit Odessa. Surprisingly enough, it is not the “Brad Pitts”, but rather the personable guys who enjoy life and are flexible enough to absorb the character of Odessa and Ukraine as a new experience and not a place where you can bag a dozen birds a day for $100.
That said, it doesn’t matter if the guy is white, brown, black or yellow, it is his personality that will win out in the end.
Specifically, I find it hilarious that any one who has traveled very much in Asia would dare to call Odessa a shit hole! A walk through almost any city in China, most cities in Thailand or Cambodia, and, yes, even Hong Kong, specifically Kowloon, will deliver negative sensory stimulation that will not be approached in Odessa unless you happen to be crawling around in the gutter by a dumpster.
In fact, we have had numerous emails and PMs asking if Eros75, Losos and others had visited the same city as they had visited!
OTOH, I apologize if I led anyone to believe that Odessa was a monger’s paradise… I don’t believe I did, but there's my mea culpa. Perhaps the key is being a local, but I can tell you that last winter, I had 2-3 girls ringing my door bell every night, and it wasn’t because I am such a handsome devil!
At the same time, it was stated that “there didn’t seem to be many younger girls with older guys”! In fact, I spent 5 weeks last summer with a Ukrainian girl 37 years younger than I am… Perhaps that wasn’t enough of an age difference for some!
First point, don’t plan to visit Odessa if “taking photos is more important than sex” with the working girls or if you think every girl is a ho or if you think you can bed as many as you can for $50 or less each.
Secondly, just because you don’t embarrass yourself, don’t think you’re not embarrassing your friends and companions.
Lastly, if you stay with us and if you have a problem, you must tell someone. If no one knows there is a problem, it is difficult to fix it. This is Ukraine and local Ukrainians do not normally do more than they have to. In fact, the OES staff is the best there is and for Eros75 to embellish his story with distortions does no one any good.
Specifically, Eros75, I know for a fact that the OES staff bent over backwards to make your stay pleasant. On top of that, even when you were upgraded to another apartment, you were given both free services and a further reduction in your rate with little appreciation on your part.
I guess the good thing is that the bad apples will soon dry up and return to Thailand so that all of the returning visitors and others will not have to endure their sour attitude!
To all of my past clients and our many great OES clients, we want you to know that we appreciate your business and will continue to work to improve our service in the future. I think they will all agree that we may not be perfect but we do respond to a problem to the best of our ability... if it is known.
5) The girls here can be very cold and distant on the outside, but they warm up if your approach is correct . . . . . 98% of the mongers who arrive in Odessa are really good and their success rate reflects it (it is always a learning experience for me!!!) Unfortunately, the remaining 2% are clueless and seem to screw it up for others. CA Traveler, I don't want to interfere in your dispute with Eros75 about the appartment.
But I definitly want to give a reaction to what you are saying about Odessa being a good place for mongering.
Yes, in Odessa it is possible to have "freebies". But you have to stay a longer time and you have to spend quite some dates, time, money and effort. It is hard, hard work. Maybe if you live in Odessa it is good. But not for short time visiting (1-2 weeks).
Yes, I did see foreigners/tourists with beautifull women but those women were their "fiancees". They did meet through marriage agencies. And I don't think most members of this forum are interested in getting marriaged.
You talk about 98% of all mongerers in Odessa being succesfull.
But only seldom we see travel-reports with good, detailed information of proof of succes.
If we see posts bragging on succes then these posts have only general information and often they are from members who have posted only 2 or 3 times. Maybe, just maybe there are some posts among these who come from people who have a commercial interest in Odessa. Just maybe. I might be wrong.
In fact, we have had numerous emails and PMs asking if Eros75, Losos and others had visited the same city as they had visited!If there are numerous people who have succes, how come they don't posts on this forum?
Only thing they do is write PM's to you? Are they too modest? Is being modest the key succes factor in approaching Odessa girls?
Oh yeah, I wouldn't count Loso among the "2% that are clueless and seem to screw it up for others".
Loso is a very experienced and determined mongerer. His information is always of the highest quality.
I would rather say that only 2% of the mongers who arrive in Odessa is succesfull instead of 98%.
The conclusion can only be that Odessa is definitly over-hyped.
Please do see these posts:
Lukasek: report 1 on Odessa: Lukasek in Odessa (intro)
Lukasek: report 2 on Odessa: The first day from Lukasek
Lukasek: report 3 on Odessa: The first week
Loso69: Loso in Odessa
Doctor_Skank
09-26-06, 08:23
First of all I am happy to hear from Ca_T again and hear OES's version of the Eros75 story.
Ca_T's version, in which OES staff did all they could to satisfy Eros75's needs and help him as much as possible, does correspond with my experience with the level of service offered by OES. They did do all they can to help during my stays with them. You might remember that I also had a technical problem with an OES apartment during my last stay, however they fixed it the next day and in the mean time offered me an alternative shower to use. Having a technical problem (in my case no hot water) wasn't an ideal start from a holiday standpoint, but OES did do all they could to help... and technical problems occur regularly in Odessa. In hotels too, by the way. Having ANYBODY to contact in case of problems is a big plus in EE, having an English-speaking contact is a double plus.
Am sincerely sorry that fellow monger Eros75 didn't enjoy Odessa, but as I said before, it sounds like much of his "bad luck" was simply an aversion to Odessa itself and the women there and not directly related to OES.
Mongering in EE is an imperfect science and Odessa really isn't for everyone. Compared to other "provincial" EE cities though, at least in the summer Odessa does offer good entertainment value, at least I have always enjoyed myself.
When looking for an EE summer holiday destination, it should also be considered that in the summers, many of the larger EE cities, whether Moscow, Kiev or Kharkov for that matter, do "empty out" and many of the girls (especially students) go on extended holidays to the sea or to visit parents and relatives. Club action in bigger cities is actually better in the winter than in the summer... summer is off season in most places, whereas in Odessa it is high season. The same is true of Crimea.
As many mongers including myself have reported, Odessa is over-hyped in terms of freebie action... it's definitely there, but there is nothing "automatic" about it... and the game is played differently there than in most other EE places. Moreover, there are definitely a lot of Odessan girls who "play" with foreigners all summer long, it really is a summer hobby for many of them. It is actually quite easy to recognize their game once you've clued into a few signals. One of the signals is if they are overly friendly, dress stylishly, speak English well and give you their telephone number instantly... that's usually a sign that you are John #23, Marco #16 or Johann #34... also MANY if not ALL of the Odessan girls on love.mail.ru, flirt.com.ua have met foreign guys and are quite adept at playing... or simply bored with foreigners and prefer local men. You'd be insane to think that a really hot girl on one of those sites is only communicating with you and ís sincere in everything she says. Odessa is a fishbowl, it's like a village despite its million inhabitants.
For those who are serious about mongering in EE, I really do suggest that you learn some Russian as well. Most of us mongers are people who are fascinated (even obsessed) with Slavic women, particularly Russians and Ukrainians. It only makes sense that learning their language is going to be of great value in our mongering "careers"... and in my experience, at least 50% of my freebie scores only happened because I was able to speak Russian to them... and my Russian isn't perfect by any means, it's just good enough to communicate and that's all that matters.
As for success rates with local freebies, there are 1000 variables that are going to determine who is successful and who isn't, one significant factor being luck and another being resilience. It's not a contest (even though it sometimes feels like one) and for those who didn't do well in Odessa, you are in good company... it can happen to anyone. I've also had my share of unsuccessful missions. Just as easily however, you can suddenly find yourself in bed with a local cutie and quickly forget why you ever lost faith.... :)
My summer wouldn't be complete without an excursion to Odessa, so I'll be back.... but will also know what to expect and what not to expect.
Eros75,
Although I have not been to Odessa and used CA-travelers's apartment, but I would say I could totally feel your frustration and anger from your report. I too had a bit taste of similar experience when I was in Praque earlier this years and got cheated a few times. EE people are not open and worldly people you might see from other parts of the world. I am sure that they are nice people inside but because of the social system and sad history, they tend to have an attitude. Also, as economy is bubbling there and they feel good about themselves.
Lastly I just want say from looking at photos posted by Eros, I will too be very pissed off about the ripoff situation. 95dollars per night for that place is just ridiculous
let us all be aware of the some the false advertising here.
Rodney Munch
09-27-06, 01:07
just came back from another week in odessa and will give the following report. not as negative as some of the preceding posts but i can say with confidence that if you are looking for an easy lay, this may not be the place. there are most certainly girls ready to party out there but they are becoming increasingly difficult to get. we visited kiev, odessa and kherson in july, with mixed results, mainly due to the enormous number of tourists, particularly in odessa. the contrast between seasons there is incredible, we were there in february, when there were no tourists whatsoever it seemed and found it much easier to get phone numbers, take girls home, etc etc. so my friend suggested coming down again in september, since it is a stark difference from july, while the weather is still comparable to summers. while we did not achieve the level of success as during the winter trip, it was still much easier to score freebies than in july. first a few observations. the clubs in arkadia close around 10th of september, and many of them have season ending parties for weeks straight. every night is a season ending party but the places are flooded with girls. gone are most of the tourists compared to july, but a good portion still remains. heard lots of german, italian and french, not so much english this time (lots of americans though during the summer).
we rented an apartment again through www.odessaapts.com , one that is probably going to be my home if i ever go to odessa again. this place will spread legs faster than a speeding bullet; the key will be getting them up there. five rooms in this place, each one with either a bed or a couch, which makes things convenient. spent a total of 5 nights in odessa and 2 nights in kherson, which by the way is also a very nice little city. very small compared to odessa, but has a nice center, with a river running through it and an immense number of beauties walking around. best club costs $5 enter and we were perceived as some sort of high rollers. we had limited success in kherson, just because of a lack of time, and fact i was recovering from a slight food poisoning but one could do major damage here, since westerners are in much higher demand there compared to odessa. i had a chance to take 2 girls back to odessa with me, they were willing to drop all their work plans to go spend a couple of days in odessa, but did not want to be attached to someone while there so i declined, but have the phone #s just in case.
while at buffalo café in odessa, we overheard some english and it was two guys from london. they were staying at oes and overall said they were satisfied. not sure which location they stayed at but after seeing our apartment during some pre game action i think they were ready to switch. of course we were paying $190 per night for this place, which is not exactly cheap by this region’s standards but split 2 ways it’s your standard midwest holiday inn. the common entrance area was not undergoing construction but if it were, certainly no surprised there. my strategies in ee are to always rent an entirely private flat which is impressive enough on its own to pull the panties down. the other major advantage to renting such an apartment is that you can claim to the girl you are with that you own it. it is a cheap technique but highly effective, as everyone knows in odessa you have to present the illusion that you are there to stay, or at least visit frequently. if you are just another tourist in town for 10 days, few girls will want to go home with you.
echoing others, the common areas in fsu are far from perfect. the problem is that there are no common area assessments of any sort so the area is typically neglected. in some of the most expensive apartments i ever stayed the entry way is usually decent and at times even renovated. also, seeing people hanging out in the stair well in places like odessa is a fairly standard thing. at night you will see bunched up teenagers and even kids drinking beers and smoking at all hours. does this make the place unsafe? perhaps, but only if you are close minded. from having traveled to prague, budapest in the early days and more recently to moscow and kiev it is a given that city service problems may arise. personally, the common area to me is not too important. it is very important to keep in mind that your typical russian dyev, or i should rather say any odessa girl will not give a flying fuck about the condition of your common area. what mattes is what is behind the door to your private apartment. by the way, were the jewish dormitory girls hot?
i have seen the oes site, but without having stayed at their properties i am unable to comment but based on the pictures posted by eros, it may be wise for them to rethink some of the claims made. in any case, i have rented from the same agency every time i have been in odessa and they have always delivered me straight to the apartment reserved, airport car was regular sedan and nothing special. i do not expect the driver to help me with luggage since it’s really his own tip that he is sacrificing. my rule is that if the driver helps with luggage, they get a tip and most of the drivers know this. some drivers are more motivated then others and some learn to read clients, not helping those they think are unlikely to tip. one thing that is a constant in fsu in terms of common areas is that they are always craps shoot, i knew that going in. during my 3 trips to odessa, we have been without power twice for a few hours each time. one of the times was during a nice session with a 22 year old and the only reason i knew is because the music system went dead. the girl later told me that blackouts are common in odessa and are the result of city services being under funded / corrupted and looted by politicians. the times i had lost power, we contacted the manager of apartment firm which told us they would call the city services and find out if it is a problem isolated to the apartment or the city. each time the problem was claimed to be caused by the city and the power returned a few hours later. no repair men ever showed plus the common areas lights were out too, so you could tell it was the entire building that was out.
odessa is not bangkok and it is not dominican republic. i have mentioned it in previous posts that if you don’t have any game, this may not be the place. most girls on the streets have university education and are able to get decent paying jobs. decent paying in relation to the lifestyle they live. the very flashy girls that get most everyone’s attention are usually trophies of local newly rich or in some cases of revolving foreigners. to say that there are few girls in odessa with older men is like saying bangkok is so touristy because of their museums. this is the land of old men with young girls and any night out in ibiza or itaka is fresh evidence of that.
overall, we had decent rate of success while in odessa on the freebie scene. we got very lucky at a club called 23, which is on bunyan street (i think it may be new) it was recommended to us by a 21 year old waitress from american steakhouse restaurant. i asked her to join us and bring a friend. by the way, picking up waitresses is becoming my specialty in ukraine - she said she had no friends who would be able to go so i asked her to come alone and we would find someone for my friend inside. the waitress spoke decent english, plus i am becoming better at russian so it working out fine. my friend was striking out at first, one girl even told him the only way he has a chance with her is if he paid 1000 gravies. she was a regular girl (not a pro) and i think this was her way of telling him to f off, but there was definitely some truth to it. i told him he could take her home for the night for $100 (which is half of what she jokingly asked). he was going to keep this option in the back of his pocket, but was determined to get laid for free. unfortunately, it didn't happen for either one of us this time. the girl i was with claimed she had to wake up early and wouldn't drink the required quantities of alcohol which all but guarantee a score. my friend was striking out too, but managed to get 2 phone numbers which was enough to get us some beach dates for the next day.
it seems most guys expect the girls to produce the same reaction to guys they like in arkdia clubs, same as it was some local pub in us or canada. it's been said before, and i will say it again. girls in ukraine/russia will not smile or even make contact 99% of the time, even with men they like! it is in their blood, and genes to make the guy come up to them so they are assured that they are the ones you want. even if they smile at you, it is often to reinforce their own self confidence, not because they actually like someone. it's kind of like a mean game of revenge, these girls have maybe only 5 - 7 years in the ‘drivers’ seat, when they look great, and they will take out their frustration with their life on foreign men very often i have noticed, and also heard. it is not easy to see, but actually the best targets are the girls which have come to odessa to relax with their friends from out of town. also, it seems to me guys on this board expect to come to ukraine, come to a nightclub and have a lay within minutes. what people don't get, is while the country is poor, a place like odessa is not so poor. yes, there are poor areas outside of the center, but the money concentration is at nightclubs and in the center, so these girls, especially if they are good looking are not fazed by westerners anymore. getting them is hard work, no different than working in the office, except that the pay is much better!
the main problem is that odessa does not have a central place for the pro scene. the irish pub seemed to have skanks inside it and visa vi, which is a new casino in the center had some expensive looking girls inside who did not seem interested in as much as a drink. in kiev, the river palace fulfills the 3am urge every time but odessa, aside from the port option offers nothing. there are saunas but as the experience recently shows, unless you know exactly what you’re getting it is probably going to be crappy quality.
after 3 days of striking out, even after dates at the beach we finally hit the jackpot with 3 girls who were visiting from nizhni novgorod. these were relatively poor girls, but all 3 amazingly hot and were clearly just looking for someone to pay for the clubs and drinks in exchange for some play at night. even though they were young, claming to be 22 (i think may be younger in reality) they had little illusions about any fling in odessa progressing into something serious although i did give away my # at home and email since one of the girls may be coming to north america to work at a camp possibly. my buddy and the 3 girls shared our jacuzzi (not all at the same time) on our night before last in odessa with a serious amount of liquor involved. i ended up fucking one of the girls while the other watched in the jacuzzi. these girls were impressed, and this whole trip was their version of cancun spring break. the girls friend was naked watching but did not let me fuck her. shyness can be a *****. also a friendly advice to stay away from odessa’s absinthe, 2 shots of this (with others) had me in a major hangover the whole day after. my buddy screwed the friend in one of the other bedrooms. overall an amazing night that makes it all worth it. i still say for freebie scene, despite increasingly difficulties odessa and most of ukraine still offers better odds for freebies than horrible places like prague and budapest in which you should not even try to score for free, you will fail miserably.
in terms of p4p scene. we took a walk around the port, and saw girls congregating nightly around midnight. some are good from far, but far from good up close. if you look hard enough you can find some 6s and 7s but most are beaten up and generally i do not get a good feeling about getting someone from there. we picked up 2 girls after a drunken night at visa vis, which has amazing quality of women on wednesday nights, but most are with someone or there just to be seen. the overall experience was good, true gfe, anal for $150 a night. i ended up letting her go after 2 hours or so. in kiev we were quoted $150 per hour, but of course you can have anyone for $200 for night there, maximum. also tried out 2 girls whose #s i got from http://my.love.topping.com.ua/ this is the same database which has many fronts. i know it's been mentioned on this board before. both of the girls were solid 8s looks, but one was truly incredible while the other just average in bed. one of the girls (alena) doesn't do outcall, so be ready to navigate your way through the soviet building blocks in the cheremishki area of odessa (about 15 minutes from the center), the other one does outcall. the one which only does incall charged $60 per session, i ended up staying 2 hours so i gave her $100 for being a good sport. the other is a stunning 24 year old, very classy and nicely dressed and charges $60 per hour, but i think it is only because i spoke russian with her. this girl could easily dictate $100, since she is amazing all around (service and looks a solid 8) - tall, with a model like body. i will give the phone # only to a few people; i do not want these girls to get flooded with calls.
overall, the trip was a success even though the freebie scene is difficult. we are talking about doing new years in kiev and odessa, with possible nikalaev on the way. the smaller places like kherson and nikalaev produce much higher returns but of course the nightlife and overall things to do are lacking. there is no question it is easier to get laid in nikalaev than odessa, the girls are more desperate at the end of the day. same with kherson and other small towns. the ease at which you get girls in smaller places is incredible, probably what odessa and other similar places were like 5 or 6 years ago. based on our winter travel in february, odessa is much easier to navigate in the off months. i barely saw any tourists in the winter, tons of girls most of which are looking to party with someone who can show them a good time. if you care about every dollar spent, odessa is not for you. the main thing is impressing the girl, either with your looks, personality or best of all: money. it is not so hard to create an illusion of being a ‘whale’ in odessa. rent a nice flat, buy a bottle of champagne, wear nice trendy clothes and a bit of charm will go a long way to getting anyone laid. if you want very very easy pussy, head to the small towns or moldova from what i hear. if you want easy pussy, with potential challenges plus charming center, wide variety of nightlife and dining optionis then odessa is better.
unfortunately we had to endure eros's depressing pictures so to even things out and bring this forum back on its feet i have a few shots from one of the nightclubs we visited. i have a few pics of the nizni nov girls i will post soon.
editor's note: i certainly hope that the author or somebody else will post a link to this report in the reports of distinction thread. please click here (http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?) for more information.
I wonder Anton of OES is the same Anton in Kiev section who operates an escort agency. Same compliant from members about his services.
I would like to add my experience of OES. As Dr mentioned, the staff at OES did absolutely their best to make my stay pleasurable. As I mentioned in the previous post, OES was (and perhaps still is) going through the renovation process. There were less than perfect conditions such as dark staircase, and messy courtyard. But they put some temporary lights in the staircase, cleaned up the courtyard as much as they can -- they were constantly making improvement. So I thought it will be a great place to stay once all the renovation is done. As an added factor, I got along really well with Anton. So that made my stay even more pleasant.
I feel sorry that Eros75 had such a bad time in Odessa. And I cannot judge one way or another if he was unresonable. I wasn't there. But his experience at OES is certainly different from mine for sure.
As for Odessa girls, I must admit they are tough bunch. But because of the lack of Russian language skills, my encounters were limited to those girls in downtown and Arkadia. Perhaps they are more used to going out with foreigners and getting free meal, etc. I am sure Eros75's experience in ODS was more positive if the girls had been "easier". Just MHO.
Explorer69
09-27-06, 18:21
reading the recent comments about odessa as well as the service and accomodation of oes makes me wonder quite a lot: have some people been on another planet??? i have been in fus countries about 40 times during the last 5 years, and about 35 times i have lived in apartments. today i come home after staying 3 nights at the same address as eros stayed in, at rishelievskaya in odessa, all organized by oes. if this is a “shithole”, then i really wonder were the persons who make such a statement have stayed in fus countries. yes, there is renovation work in the yard and in the stairs, so it may be dusty. but when thinking of all the hallways and stairs with year-old dirt and smelling [CodeWord140] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord140) i have entered in fus countries, this place was very clean:)). compared to western standard it does not look very good, but it is a part of life in fus countries. the main compound of oes also have ongoing construction work, but the finished apartments are great (i have stayed there), and it takes a minimum of imagination to see that the everything will be outstanding when finished!
then complaints about loss of electricity. well, this is a part of life in fus countries – and what i understand possibly more frequent in odessa than in kiev, st petersburg, etc. the same is with water, etc.
if you cannot take these problems – and i admit they are uncomfortable – in kiev a year ago i packed and prepared to go to the airport early one morning by the help of a cigarette lighter that happened to be in the apartment – if you cannot accept these problems, please go somewhere else.
regarding oes service. i have now been twice in odessa with oes and i am soon back. the only thing i can say is that the staff are going out of their way 24/7 to advice and assist you in any question or problem you may have. the comments made here earlier about the nice and friendly masha i feel almost as a personal insult:)). anton and ct provides a highly competent and always very friendly service that is unsurpassed, and they are an encyclopedia concerning practical information about odessa – and that includes girls and p4p.
their apartments are made during the last year (= very fresh), have the necessary fascilities, satellite tv, nice bathrooms, high-speed internet, big beds, made with taste…
maybe i can give a little piece of advice to those that complain most: smile to the world and the world will smile to you!!
it seems that the biggest complainers are those that got less pussy than what they wanted. is there a connection? :)))). the fundamental error is to believe that odessa has a bangkok – like system with the kind of offers where you do 2-3-4-5 girls for 1 hour each during the day. if that is your style, go somewhere else – because you will be terribly disappointed! i had a great time in odessa, during my recent 3 days my biggest problem was to coordinate the girls to avoid overlap:)). i will be back with a report on that part.
big boss, the anton in odessa is not the anton running escort service in kharkov:)).
CA Traveler
09-27-06, 19:36
Just a couple of quick points to clarify a couple of things...
YB... Eros75 paid nowhere close to $95 per night. Notice that his fotos were of the common areas in a building that we do not control. Inspite of that, we recently added a big florescent light which will not be blown out by power surges or have the bulbs stolen by other residents. With regard to his beautiful "sea view" photo, there is a sea view, but you must get your head out of your ass and look out instead of down. In addition, the seaview is even listed on our website as "in the distance" it no way implies that it is on the beach. You may also notice also that E75 didn't bother to show photos of his apartment... only the common areas. In fact, one of the reasons that we differentiate between OES facilities and our other apartments... WE CONTROL ALL ASPECTS OF THE OES FACILITY, but not the common areas in other locations.
YB... No, Anton does not run an escort agency anywhere, so it isn't the same person. Secondly, I resent the implication that E75 was swindled or ripped off in any way. Even in our peak season, he received not only a significant discount, but also rec'd free services AND a partial refund. If he failed to have a good time, he only has himself to blame because he was like a lost puppy if he wasn't next door to Luca... who actually gave up a freebie so he could spend time with him.
FD... Although I did not make the claim of 98:2% breakdown, it was Anton's analysis, I will remind you that not all of our clients are ISG members and even then only a small percentage actually post. But, I will guarantee you that we have far more repeat clients than dissatisfied ones.
Again, as others have said in the recent posts, if you go back to earlier posts, it is quite obvious that I made a point to say that ODS is not nor will ever be Thailand, Rio, or even Moscow. However, no one can deny that Ukraine has the most beautiful white girls in the world and the summer is even better because beauties show up from all over the FSU.
Hello mongers, nice guys, slim, not so, righ, cheap, white , black (so fkg tired to count):)!
This Saturday, September 30th we where invited to join social dating party with good ladies. Party incl introductions,funny contests, prizes, dancing etc. Location at the finest place in the center. I cant wait to be there ;) Cannot post here owners mail or ph.
All interested for time, place and how to get laid there can ask me for contact info.
Rod, what's up with the web pics? Do they mean anything?
It's hard to get a perspective of the quality of girls you are refering to when you post someone else's picture. Based on the prices you mentioned and my own Ukrainian experiences I am guess sub 7 in a 1-10 scale.
Rodney Munch
09-28-06, 00:10
The pictures are from that club's website. They do not mean anything other than that. Stereo is a great place if you think you can bag a 21 year old or younger.
...........It's been said before, and I will say it again. Girls in Ukraine/Russia will not smile or even make contact 99% of the time, even with men they like! It is in their blood, and genes to make the guy come up to them so they are assured that they are the ones you want. Even if they smile at you, it is often to reinforce their own self confidence, not because they actually like someone.
Thanks Rodney, nice report and interesting insights.
So how can you tell when a Slavic girl likes you? What do they do when they like someone? If a girl likes you but doesn't look at you or smile at you, how can she expect you to appraoch her?
I'd like to think girls, or people in general act similarly regardless their cultural background. We're all human beings after all. But I've heard Slavic girls respond more postively than their Western counterparts to "manly behavior". And I have noticed that Slavic guys do seem to be more forward. But I'm not an expert in Slavic culture and I still have a lot to learn.
Any insights to Slavic dating rituals would be appreciated.
Bez Bezarra
09-28-06, 06:59
Bez
Don't my words to you be dumb by copying mean words you say.
say your a pussy coz this red pie pussies gay here.
I kno you know you're involved in OES business
I am not the OES MBA. (Monger of Business Administration)
But once an editor, always an editor.
Ca_T!
Does this mean you will hire me to consult
on blondinky sendviches?
I have a lot of research compiled on this
she-devil, Novosibirsk nympho Nadia.
Doctor_Skank
09-28-06, 07:51
Rodney M.:
Personally Stereo is my least favorite of the main clubs in Arkadia, but it is the favorite hangout for local teens. And I'd say the only 21 year old girls there are chaperones watching their little sisters. Normally I don't even think about age, but Stereo is the only Arcadia club where I felt seriously old... at least before the first three "Vodka/Burns"... after which I felt like the Mack... :)
Speaking of burning, with it's all wood construction and single entrance, Stereo is a fire disaster waiting to happen... especially when the start tipping over their flaming Sambuca cocktails at 3am...
IMHO, Stereo is one of the toughest places to score out of for the 30+ crowd, as almost all the girls are locals out with their horde... and Stereo also has one of the worst girl/boy ratios of all the clubs. In fact it got so bad, that during a summer trip to the club my mongering mate and I actually had to SHARE a girl, we sandwiched her at the bar and both made out with her, alternating every few minutes or so... was fun, but not something I want to make a habit out of...
Bez:
Your private harem never ceases to impress... please tell me you keep them locked up in your basement and one day you'll be releasing a 10 DVD ISG collector's edition "Dyevs Gone Dikayie" fun pack...
And as for me, I am now wearing a "Went all the way to Odessa looking for blondinkas and all I found was Nellie Furtado" T-shirt... :(
LifeSavour
09-28-06, 08:49
..... But I've heard Slavic girls respond more postively than their Western counterparts to "manly behavior". And I have noticed that Slavic guys do seem to be more forward. But I'm not an expert in Slavic culture and I still have a lot to learn.
Any insights to Slavic dating rituals would be appreciated.Of course am no EXPERT! But I see many that I think are way 'FUgly' and do well with the ladies - BECAUSE - they just expect it! They TELL the girl what to do, when to do it, and how to do it!
Its not "Will you go home with me?" Its take her by the hand and "WE ARE going home!"
Even some 'monger reports' talk of just taking the gal by the hand and start for the door.
The jest of this is not to be rude or rough, but firm and MANLY!
LS Guy
Bez Bezarra
09-29-06, 03:33
Bez:
You never impress me
keep locked up in your basement
one day you'll be released
Go fuck
:(
Actually, a dyev locked me in HER basement
with no TP for my bung hole.
Of course am no EXPERT! But I see many that I think are way 'FUgly' and do well with the ladies - BECAUSE - they just expect it! They TELL the girl what to do, when to do it, and how to do it!
Its not "Will you go home with me?" Its take her by the hand and "WE ARE going home!"
Even some 'monger reports' talk of just taking the gal by the hand and start for the door.
The jest of this is not to be rude or rough, but firm and MANLY!
LS Guy
I very much agree. Being travelling around in the Baltic States and CIS since 1993/4:
You have to be a gentleman, e.g. holding doors, pulling the chair out for her, helping her with her coat and simply always thinks what she wants and needs next and try to show that you treat her with respect.
This is of course very generally speaking, but the same does also apply when making decissions. Don't ask her what restaurant she wants to go to, but tell her e.g. that you saw that she likes that and that fish, and you know exactly a restaurant where this fish is prepared excellent etc.
When it comes to sex - again of course generally speaking - your girl will also appriciate that you play the gentleman and understands her needs and the timming. This is means that if you ask her 'Please, Do you want to come with me?', this could in many cases be understood that you do not care and did not pick-up what she wants, and you will get a 'Net' even if the lady wants you (if you think so then try a little bit later again), but if you have the feeling that there is a common understanding of how to spend the following hours, then it is better to say 'I want you!'. Even if the lady do not want you the damage of asking her in a more directly way is less than the more vague 'Please...', as she in many cases will take the direct one as a compliment.
Again very general speaking, however, I have some experience :-)
Stravinsky
09-30-06, 21:47
So, I'm watching the pycckii televisor this morning and all of a sudden, I'm getting these images of classrooms, filled with beautiful young dyeffki, diligently studying away (bless their hearts), and every single one of them is eminently ball-able. So, I naturally want to know what this is about. Turns out they are students at the Jewish University in Kiev, and I'm thinking to myself... students, Jewish, Ukraine, why is this familiar? And then it dawns on me.
CAT, that apartment you have in the Jewish student dormitory in Odessa, is it still available? Odessa is at the top of my list of places to visit and if I ever get there, I want first dibs on that apartment!
I'll bring the TP and the candles, but, I must confess, I am a little spoiled. I do at least expect some goriyachi vodah. :)
Stravinsky
Felix Nordic
09-30-06, 23:11
Bez;
Thats a krassiva blondinka! Cool russian beauty that gets so warm;)
Cheers and happy hunting!
/Felix
I'll be in Odessa on 6 October for a week or so. If anyone else will be there, please let me know.
Painkiller
10-02-06, 10:29
Hi all,
I plan to go to Ods with 2 friends; is there other reliable agencies than OES? We wouldn't want to get the crap that Eros75 had. I would also be very pissed and mad if I have to stay 3 weeks in that kind of crap building.
Thanks in advance.
Painkiller
Explorer69
10-02-06, 15:13
Painkiller,
Look at what I have written before. I am in Odessa now, OES have the best fascilities in FUS countries that I have used. I now stay with them for the 3rd time. Also very service-minded in every way! Don't believe all complaints you see. But be aware, Odessa is not Bangkok or Moscow in offers, that is the mistake a lot of guys do!
Doctor_Skank
10-02-06, 15:30
Painkiller:
Really, OES is as good or better than the other agencies. What Eros75 complained about was Odessa. All private apartments are in crap buildings. It's how the apartment looks inside that counts. OES apartments are mostly quite modern and OES is honest in describing them to you in terms of their condition and location.
But if you are worried about OES nonetheless, why not just google "Odessa apartment" and see what comes up. There are several agencies in ODS... it's a tourist town after all. You can also try the marriage agencies, most of them also can rent apartments... although you'll often find they rent the same exact apartments that are offered by apartment agencies... just with a 10-15% commission for themselves.
Here's a pic from the OES Bunina flat, the bed was sufficiently stable and this freebie chick enjoyed the pounding, although after her second orgasm she did stop to complain that the sheets weren't made of cum-absorbing Egyptian cotton. :)
The kitchen area is large and comfortable... if you are going with a group, it's a nice place to hang.
Check your options on the net, there are plenty... many even mentioned on this forum. Especially off-season you won't have many occupancy worries, so you'll have a large selection to choose from.
LifeSavour
10-02-06, 22:00
Painkiller:
Really, OES is as good or better than the other agencies. on't have many occupancy worries, so you'll have a large selection to choose from.Irish Guy is my 1st.
Meet me for a brewski when in Kiev?
Ls guy
Hi all,
I plan to go to Ods with 2 friends; is there other reliable agencies than OES? We wouldn't want to get the crap that Eros75 had. I would also be very pissed and mad if I have to stay 3 weeks in that kind of crap building.
Thanks in advance.
PainkillerIf you are really concerned with the entry, just ask them about it for a specific apartment. I have done this in the past and gotten a fairly honest answer. Here are some options. The first company I've used for Kiev and the second for Odessa and third for Sevastopol. I got what was advertised and no problems to speak of other than minor things.
www.uaapartments.com
www.odessaapts.com
www.travel2sevastopol.com/
Hi,
That flat on Bunina cost 60$?/ Friend of mine stayed there last year.
My dear friends
Is it easy to get freebies in ODESSA?
If yes how can I get contacts, any bars? or coffe places?
I am a newbee in ucrain and have few businesss meetings on november.
Any help will be apriciate.
ESSI
Despite some negative opinions lately, here is an account from the side of success. It seems to be a russian women blog, I found it by accident searching for some Odessa info for my trip in November. Some interesting pictures and I and anyone who's been to Odessa can affirm to them. It is amazing to see what regular girls (non pros) wear on regular daily basis.
http://lacecurtain.blogdrive.com/archive/4.html
Doctor_Skank
10-05-06, 19:39
Rocco55:
So what's postive about his report (the linked one)? He collected phone numbers, lusted after girls right and left for a week and from what I can tell from the report, never got laid once. :)
If I wanted to get 100 telephone numbers a day in Odessa I could. When has an Odessan girl ever said no to "dai mne tvoi nomer mobilnika!"?
Right, they never say no!
But as we know, a telephone number means nothing until your taking off her panties on your couch... :)
Essi:
Based on the Moldova reports I've read, Odessa is similar in terms of freebie action. Win some, lose some. In a way it's like Dante's Purgatario... everyday and everynight you are either sent to heaven or hell....
You've got a lot of Moldova experience, so put your magic to work in Odessa and you should do just fine... anxious to hear your perspective. :)
It's unclear if the writer of that report ever got laid, but I think he did at least once, the part where he mentions a hazy night which involved alcohol. In any case, he also says he stayed in Odessa for only 3 nights and is on the trail for Mrs. Right so it appears he wasn't really gunning for first date/night sex as much as we would.
I am going to Odessa with similar intent. It will be a combination of wife searching, with having some fun in the evenings. My previous trip was purely about fun so this will be different. Still, seeing those pictures in the post made me long for Odessa, easy lays or not.
Doctor_Skank
10-06-06, 13:23
Rocco55:
I agree that Odessa is special, but think that the American writer on the report you listed had his "newbie glasses" on... assuming all those smiles and phone numbers he was getting meant he was close to fucking all those girls and that Ukrainian girls automatically preferred foreigners to their own men. Reality is a bit different. I doubt he noticed the Ukrainian guys sitting around the dance floor drinking vodka and eating fruit. Many of the "hot babes" flirting on the dance floor actually "belong" to the goons sitting around.
As for wife searching in Odessa, do be careful and use good judgement. The "bride business" is huge in Odessa and there are a lot of "players". Don't get burned...
...and play back.. score one for the home team mate! :)
http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showpost.php?p=358659&postcount=99
Good luck man, wish I was going with you... despite its faults, Odessa is still a great place to play.
CA Traveler
10-08-06, 17:24
in paris, for a long weekend at the sex clubs, on the way back to ods via paris for three weeks ...
couple of points of clarification...
doc... the bunina flat e75 stayed in was actually one of our very few managed flats zhich is on the top floor, 4th, of the rishieleveskaya building. the flat doc stayed in is much more than $60 per night.
strav... we will make sure that the jewish girl students remain in place for your visit. ;)
bez... you may certainly consult for us, provided the fee is the first half of a piva round!
rocco... be aware that docs comments about the incestial nature of the ods apartment biz is correct. virtually all apartments in ods are marketed by other agencies. of the people that i know, other than our company, only arik at odessaapts.com has proven himself to be honorable and trustworthy. use anyone else at your own risk!
hi ca traveller,
hi how are you doping long time no c last time whem\n i sent u message u were in us. nice to learn that you are back in odessa
i understand thtat you are in odessa and run odessa paretments ...i am sending you email please reply to it.
the email is sent to you email on web site
i ned some inf on odessa.
bye
spark78
in paris, for a long weekend at the sex clubs, on the way back to ods via paris for three weeks ...
couple of points of clarification...
doc... the bunina flat e75 stayed in was actually one of our very few managed flats zhich is on the top floor, 4th, of the rishieleveskaya building. the flat doc stayed in is much more than $60 per night.
strav... we will make sure that the jewish girl students remain in place for your visit. ;)
bez... you may certainly consult for us, provided the fee is the first half of a piva round!
rocco... be aware that docs comments about the incestial nature of the ods apartment biz is correct. virtually all apartments in ods are marketed by other agencies. of the people that i know, other than our company, only arik at odessaapts.com has proven himself to be honorable and trustworthy. use anyone else at your own risk!
Coding Wizard
10-09-06, 16:57
Despite some negative opinions lately, here is an account from the side of success. It seems to be a russian women blog, I found it by accident searching for some Odessa info for my trip in November. Some interesting pictures and I and anyone who's been to Odessa can affirm to them. It is amazing to see what regular girls (non pros) wear on regular daily basis.
http://lacecurtain.blogdrive.com/archive/4.htmlI think I met him when I was at the Itaka in Odessa. He was from New York and quite pleasant.
LifeSavour
10-10-06, 07:23
Bill Me,
But it don't hurt wih those knockers!Gigantic odessa tits.jpg
Hey Bez, was just looking back at some old pics on here and found this one of yours... yes nice - but your pic file is saved as:
Gigantic!
This is what I call huge.
LS Guy
PS: Us 'big guys' sometimes need a big gal!
Explorer69
10-12-06, 15:57
I have been reading the messages with views about Odessa, in a few things I agree, in other things I disagree – mostly I disagree. During the last 3 months I have been 3 times to Odessa, and I really like the place.
1. Odessa is as far from SEA style as possible. CT wrote very early in his reports from Odessa that the p4p was very hidden, you needed time to get into it and to see it. It is completely true. You need to get started somewhere, and the suggestions and numbers that Anton or CT at OES can help you with are invaluable. Without a secured starting point one can easily be in Odessa for a week without getting laid.
2. There has been a lot of comments that the girls in Odessa are only trying to scam you to buy them drinks etc. To a certain extent that is correct, because they see you/us for what you/we are: middle-aged guys with some extra kilos and thinning hair hoping to get laid by some marvellous 20 year old babe. When the girl look at you and she see that “pussy” is sparkling in your eyes, she is laughing inside and of course she tries to make a fool out of everybody and get some free drinks! They are not stupid!! Having a legitimate reason for being in Odessa is one key to paradise, but you need more keys…
3. Girls in FSU are general more conservative than in Northwest Europe and also in parts of North America. I have in my younger days extensive experience from this and it is far easier to get a girl into your bed the first night in these countries than in FSU countries. Now I am not talking about girls going to the Boar house etc., and some other exceptions. I am talking about the standard, nice, friendly, unspoilt babe. They are genuinely searching for a nice man to take care of them and with some commitment. You find more of “the easy one night stand girls” in Western Europe! You really find a lot of serious, fun-loving girls in Odessa. However, some of them may do a trick on the side in order to add to their monthly salary:)). But they are great GF material.
4. Look at it, when the girls have to choose between some of us being there for a few days, twice their age, panting for pussy – as compared to their locals in their 30ies – after all these guys are not usually a dream either, but there is still more possibilities for some long-term commitment – and that is what these girls are interested in.
5. Take your time, be relaxed, enjoy the company of girls outside of bed as well, be a good and interesting company, be a gentleman, dress nicely, wine and dine them – and you will be richly rewarded. Then you can have secured some P4P later in the evening as back up, send the “dined girl” for later – have the P4P, but on the 3. night you have your “dined girl” in bed. It will cost just as much in total, maybe even more, but the rewards are far greater.
6. If you look for girlie bars and to fuck several girls ST per day, do not go to Odessa, you will be terribly frustrated!
7. If you only look for a lot of ST fucks and don’t enjoy the company of girls and the GF aspect that the Odessa girls can give, then you really are a looser….
I have been twice in Odessa in less than 3 weeks, 3 and 4 nights respectively. My first stay was like this:
First day
I had the now “famous Sasha” for 4 hours in the afternoon, that was prearranged by SMS, because I had her number from this website. Nice girl, beautiful face, a bit too skinny, getting a bit professional…
Then I wined and dined a girl I met on the internet, nice girl, good progress.
When she left for home at around 11 pm, I decided to look at the notorius Seaman’s bar. Usually this lower end is not interesting for me, but since it has been mentioned many times, I was curious. Got a cab, went there, was surrounded by a lot of girls and a mamasan. Took a girl who looked rather sweet. result: bad and mechanical performance, not to be repeated.
2. day.
Chatted with a beautiful waitress at lunch. Another dinner with the girl from yesterday. Once more she went home and I had Sasha again. We had a nice night, she was far warmer this second meeting.
3. day
I again went and had lunch at the place where my waitress worked. Beautiful student girl, speaks good English. After some talking got her phone number. The girl I wined and dined came to my apartment. I ran out in the evening to buy juice. On my way back up the stairs to the apartment in Richelieskaya Sasha called and wondered if I wanted her over. When talking to Sasha on my way up, all of a sudden I met this extremely HOT girl coming down the stairs. Elegantly dressed, throwing to me flirting smiles and really moving her hips when walking. I looked after her and she also turned and looked at me. Outside the door I stopped, put down the juice, and started to think: this must be a hooker, waving her tail in that way. And she looks like dynamite! I must get her number!
So I ran down, out on the street, I see her on the other side waiting for a taxi. I ran over the street and said. “You are wonderful, I must get your phone number” . I don’t know who was most surprised, but I got it!! The I went up in the apartment with my juice and I was “handsomely rewarded” for my wining and dining this girl.
Last day
On my way to the airport I sent SMS to the girl in the stairs from the night, let’s call her Kamilla, saying “this is your new boyfriend to whom you gave the phone number last night, I meet you in 10 days when I am back”
Next visit 10 days later
1. day
Immediately after arriving in a beautiful apartment by OES, I called a number I had aquired from local contacts in Odessa to a girl that now and then did P4, she is Sveta (sorry, she does not want her name or number on the internet). She turned out to be a very sweet 21 year old girl, next door girl type, good looking, but nor a stunner (USD150 for 4 hours). I feel she was rather inexperienced as a P4P, but gave very good service and after some extended DATY with a couple of orgasms she turned into a Duracell personality:)).
One hour after Sveta left I had an appointment with Kamilla for dinner. I was very uncertain about her, but I felt convinced that she was some kind of P4P. To my big surprise this was not the case, money was never brought up, but she came with me to the apartment. She is a 23 year old beauty, 174, very slim, but D cups. Brunette with long curly hair. I will say a 9, in my eyes a stunner! Wonderful service and when she got going, there was no off button! She is somewhere on the top of my all time list when you combine her beauty and her magnificent service. She left at 3 am.
I repeat: all my meetings with Kamilla was without any talk of money. In the beginning I was very curious I was certain she was for P4P, but she just had this very flirting attitude. I even asked if she wanted some “sponsorship” because I could not believe my luck, but she said she did not need any. However, the last day I bought her some jewelry for USD 200. in the beginning i was convinced that she had been with somebody in one of the appartments rented by OES in Richelieskaya, but it turned out she had just viisted a girlfriend one floor below!
Day 2
Kamilla told me on the phone that she had to be home in the evening, some family thing, but she would stop by in the afternoon. A few hours with wonderful sex, then dinner with my waitress, and at 11 pm came Sveta, who developed into a true girlfriend with high quality service combined with Duracell energy. To good to be true!
Day 3
Kamilla again came in the afternoon and superb time together. She left at 7 pm and should be back at 10 pm. In the meantime I had dinner with my waitress who now looked ripe for the picking. However, I only wanted Kamilla, that girl was personalized Viagra! At home no signs of Kamilla. After repeated SMS and calls no response. At 11 pm I called Sveta, who came. Although she became even better with each meeting, I still missed Kamilla.
Day 4
I woke up at 8 am due to a bombardment of SMS from Kamilla who apologized intensively, she had gone to rest because she had a cold (yes, she had!), and had received some pill from her mother so she had just passed out until morning.
Now Kamilla was free from work at 12 am, we met at 1 pm. After lunch we had more hours of great fucking and sucking. When we decided to go to dinner I realized that I would really need some chemical assistance in order to get through the night with honours! And what a night! We fell asleep at 4 am.
Last day
After a too quick breakfast session with Kamilla I had to go to the airport to leave. I will soon be back and then I will stay as much as possible with Kamilla, she is unbelieveable.
Epilogue
As you can see, I did not try to fuck as many as possible. If a girl gets good and we click, then it is my experience that everything only gets better. However, it depends on whether you also can have a little fun outside of bed. If not, then there is no fun after the first 24 hours.
Maybe I should not speak too loud about it because of the limited number of girls I met. However, I also spoke to other girls regularly in different situations: in supermarkets, on the street, in cafes, and also got a few more numbers which I never tried. The girls are generally rather reserved, but I think the key is not to seem as if you want to fuck them right there, be relaxed, have a good reason for being there, dress and behave nicely.. If girls feel that you are a middle-aged “sextourist” – as most of us are:)) - then there is no chance. And these girls are smart, they see through a lot of things, and they are rather suspicious against single, middle-aged men coming to Odessa, they know what we are after. And they have seen this type.
If some of you miss pictures, then I never take pictures. I also think that unless the girsl want their picture on the website or they already advertise on internet with pictures, then it is no good to post pictures. Most of the FUS girls do some P4P to add to their meagre salaries or to help them through studies. A picture in the wrong place can destroy their lives. In particularly when photos of freebies are posted on this site.
And finally: as I have repeated before on this site: OES gives the best service and have the best flats I have tried in FUS countries. Another view will in my opinion say more about the person complainging than about OES. Maybe he did not get laid as much as he hoped for.
EDITOR'S NOTE: I certainly hope that the author or somebody else will post a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please Click Here (http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?) for more information.
Explorer69: In your review you mention the rental agency OES three times. And you are very, very positive about them. I personally don't think that OES is better or worse then any other agency. I wouldn't mind renting an appartment from them. Nor from another agency.
But why do you mention their name three times in your post? Doesn't happen often. Is there any relation between you and OES? Did they ask you to post a positive review because of the bad reviews there were in the last few weeks?
By the way: no offense mend. Just a question.
PS E69: I do agree with the bad reviews on the mongering situation in Odessa that were on this forum in the last few weeks. Good to hear you had a good time. Maybe you do something better then I do. Don't know. Would like to find out.
Explorer69
10-14-06, 00:57
Explorer69: In your review you mention the rental agency OES three times. And you are very, very positive about them. I personally don't think that OES is better or worse then any other agency. I wouldn't mind renting an appartment from them. Nor from another agency.
But why do you mention their name three times in your post? Doesn't happen often. Is there any relation between you and OES? Did they ask you to post a positive review because of the bad reviews there were in the last few weeks?
By the way: no offense mend. Just a question.
PS E69: I do agree with the bad reviews on the mongering situation in Odessa that were on this forum in the last few weeks. Good to hear you had a good time. Maybe you do something better then I do. Don't know. Would like to find out.The answer is very easy: there is NO connection between me and OES except that I mention where I stayed, and the 3 times I have been in Odessa I have stayed with OES. However, I will strongly stand for the view that after about 40 visits in FUS countries, most of which I have stayed in appartments, OES gives me the best value and quality that I have experienced. I repeat: I have NO personal connection with OES, and they NEVER asked me to write anything about them..., I am just very happy with their quality and personal service - in addition to superb appartments.
Coding Wizard
10-14-06, 15:51
I agree with Explorer69 - I have NO connection with OES, but it does offer value for the money, though I did have some complaints about the lack of curtains and the long climb up five flights of stairs. Mind you, Sasha commented about my paunch, so maybe the five flights was good for me, but that's beside the point.
The apartments were good and spacious even by North American standards. That said, I have never been to the rest of the FSU outside of Odessa and Kiev, and even in Kiev I never got to look at how people live, so I don't really know.
CA Traveler
10-15-06, 13:30
Let me put to rest any concern that E69 is a paid or otherwise schill for OES...
He is well traveled European who was a client, as many clients/ISG members were, when I rented apartments in Moscow and, like many others, THANK YOU, have chosen to visit Odessa since we began to roll out OES and The Odessa Group, TOG.
Unfortunately, when we first began to market OES and TOG, we anticipated being fully open and operational by the beginning of the summer season. Those plans however did not anticipate the many challenges associated with completion of the OES project... in both time and money.
For that I apologize to our many ISG guests for the lingering construction and we look forward to having our final nine OES apartments open in the very near future. Once construction is complete and the courtyard paved and the new cafe open, we continue to believe that we will have something that is totally unique in the FSU since we will control all, or all possible in the FSU, aspects of the operation.
That said, many of the concerns expressed by clients, who happen to have been new visitors to the FSU/Odessa, were based on TOG flats which we MANAGE exclusively for the owners but are in outside buildings for which we have no control. Granted the stairways are not pristine, but they are better than normal in the FSU and we have taken on ourselves to install stairway lighting that we control as opposed to the local building management.
Fortunately we do control the new OES building and we believe that once you see the OES entrance and well lit stairs with the wainscot throughout with chandeliers and the nighttime attendant combined with a large separate jacuzzi on the second floor, we think guests will agree with our claim of a unique operation in the FSU.
Specifically to the stairs issue, like you cw, many of us dread climbing the stairs... when I first visited Odessa, I too missed elevators, but then when I looked at the buildings in Moscow with elevators hung on the front and back facades of most of the buildings, I decided that the exercise was not a bad thing when combined with the fact that the buildings are not going to be bastardized by the parasitic elevators hanging on buildings throughout the city. Even now when I return after an absence, I breath heavily when climbing to the top floors, but like you I know, at my age, it is not a bad thing. BUT, cw if it makes you feel any better it is only four flights and not five! :)
Again, you may wonder why some reports praise Odessa and others diss it... Odessa is not Thailand or even Moscow when it comes to P4P, but it is a beautiful old city undergoing a renaissance and... it happens to have some of the most white girls in the world. Trust me when I tell you that there is far more P4P here than is reported, but it does take a starting point for one to begin to network between the girls. In addition, the stable of "semi-pros" here and visiting are probably unequaled, BUT it does require some work and will result in varying degrees of success. However, the other option of importing a girl or three from the smaller cities is very viable and it would be a lot more fun hosting her in Odessa than some small Ukrainian town/village where almost no one speaks English, but even this takes work. At least the trains are cheap!
Bottom line is if you are shy and don't feel comfortable approaching beautiful women or if you expect the women to beckon to you from bar stools... it ain't gonna happen in Odessa!
Coding Wizard
10-20-06, 07:52
Nice to hear from you again, CA. I may be coming back in December, so please make sure you have something for me - and make sure there are curtains, so Sasha and Suzi and I can have some privacy while we're ... uh, playing chess and discussing philosophy.
regarding this:
http://lacecurtain.blogdrive.com/archive/4.html
Nice page and great photos, but my buddy (early 40s, american, tall, dresses well and not a bad looking guy) had a real hard time even being able to approach the girls. When he approached them most either pretended he wasn't talking to them, and others would say 'no english'. Appearently the hottest girls are on the payroll of the local mafia or well off dudes and they won't get caught talking to a foreigner. To make matters worse, the town is full of italians/dutch/europeans in the summer looking for hot pussy and throwing cash around. It was noted in this board that these are the ones who were leaving night clubs alone that that's true.
You can consider this a first hand experience because he is a very good friend of mine. We always go to Colombia together and I always see him do very well with regulars in Colombia. He does speak very good spanish. I don't know if this is the case in Odessa if you speak very good russian.
It might be true that you must stay for extended periods of time or be a frequent visitor; I am convinced from what he and my other friends told me the trip is not worth it. I am glad I didn't go. They went in July of 2006.
I just wanted to clarify that by saying that the trip was not worth it I meant to say that if the sole purpose of your trip is scoring a freebie then it's probably not. Other than that eye candy is everywhery and the beaches and the parties are good, and the city is beautiful from the arcitectural and cultural perspective.
Explorer69
11-06-06, 13:17
Some more stories and views about Odessa:
Last week I spent 3 nights and 4 days (includings days of arrival and departure) in Odessa. Since there are different views upon Odessa, I will again add my views and some more experiences and information. You can call this a follow up from my report and visit in Odessa a month ago.
Day 1
Arrival, painless and efficient check-in with OES. After an initial trip to the local supermarket, my girlfriend “Kamilla” (see my previous report from a month ago, she is an unbelievably passionate stunner) arrived, we spend the afternoon, evening and night together, it was for a dirty old man like the “Fountain of youth”.
Day 2
I had business to attend to, but Kamilla came back for some hours in the late afternoon. At 8 pm she left me to attend some family anniversary. After my lone dinner I was thinking what to do, I was sexually VERY satisfied, but maybe a little exploring around?
Around 10 pm (this was a Wednesday) I went to Captain Morgan’s which has a reputation for sometimes having working girls? Absolutely nothing. Irish Pub? Nothing! Then I decided it could be fun to see if there were some stunners working the bar at hotel Odessa. I arrived at 11:30 pm. There was one sweet, little blond girl sitting by herself in the bar. Obvious what she was after so I went straight and sat down beside her.
Her name was Anna. She was 22, really sweet, small blonde, seemed to have the curves in the right place. Her price was USD 200 per hour!! And the same price for each hour thereafter! Her “boss” she showed me was sitting in a corner of the bar, looking like a pimp in a black T-shirt and in the company of a sexy/vulgar looking fake blond with big breasts (“his girlfriend” Anna told me!). With them was a 3rd guy who looked like a wrestler (bodyguard?). Something told me not to fuck with these guys…!
Anyway Anna was under complete control of these guy(s) who took 100 of the 200 for each hour. I asked out of curiousity that if we decided to go for an hour, then we could continue at a lower price without her boss knowing. This was impossible she said, he checked her, called her, etc. The only possibility was to phone her in advance so that she did not go to work at all or meet in the afternoon.
Maybe this is nothing to play with, but for those interested, her phone number is +380-979-409-871. She was an 8, sweet girl. However, with this mafia style around working girls there, I wonder if there is space for independent girls in the bar of hotel Odessa, I imagine that they very quickly would be offered some kind of “protection”.
After this exploration I ordered a taxi to go home around half past midnight. Once in the taxi I decide: why not check the local strip club? There are 2 in Odessa: X- club with is a 15 minutes taxi ride in the outskirts of town. I was there in summer and it did not make a great impression. Then I knew there was another one, “Manhattan”. CT told me last summer he had been there once and was not impressed. Manhattan is right in the centre, so it was no detour, in fact 5 minutes to walk from the main street Deribasovskaya. Why not end the night with looking at some nude girls? And who knows what may happen?
Manhattan was a small place, and they had probably 7-8 girls dancing (I didn’t count, X-club is a much larger place with a lot of girls). I was not too impressed. A lapdance at your table was 20 grivna. After about an hour I was more or less ready to go, when this little, dark-hared girl caught my attention. She was beautiful, but more a good-looking girl next-door than a stunner, but absolutely good-looking, the best in the club in my eyes (I have to tell that there was a “monster girl”, maybe 35, very big, looking as if she had 3 children and large breasts hanging to her hips). Anyway, I asked the girl to sit with me, I will call her StripGirl.
After talking for an hour it became clear that StripGirl was available for take out, it was USD 300 for all night, and the club got 50% of that. She told me that in principle all girls were available, but it was rather uncommon to go out. The girls only went with a guy whom they had talked to, liked, and trusted. It also depended on their financial situation (what a surprise!). If she was financially OK, a girl would not go with anybody, even if she was offered USD 500, but if she wanted an expensive new winter coat, it was far easier…!
I was not interested in paying 300 for a night that now was becoming rather short (around 3 am). But I got her phone number, the girls sold their phone number for 100 grivna! We made an appointment to meet the next day, I should call her at 1 pm. I went home alone.
Day 3
Strip girl and I met for lunch at 1:30 pm. She was a very nice and sweet girl, who with rather little school background was smart and spoke surprisingly good English. She was from a village 200 km to the east, and she had been working in a shop in the centre of Odessa for a couple of years for a monthly salary of USD 100 to 150. When dancing (only for the last 5 months) she made between 50 and 100 dollars a night! She had a boyfriend whom she didn’t love, but “he was a nice and decent boy who treated her well”. And the next morning she would visit her mother who was in jail in Odessa for murdering another woman!!! According to StripGirl, her mother was innocent!
At around 3.30 pm we were in my apartment at the OES Deribasovskaya compound, and soon in bed. It became quickly clear that StripGirl was a passionate gem in bed, multiorgasmic to both oral and penetration. She was unbelieveably passionate and affectionate, giving fantastic oral as well. By the way, it was for me a new experience to get oral from somebody with a piercing in tongue.
Everything became so good and so wild that at 5 pm I sent SMS to Kamilla, saying that I would “not be free” for our original appointment at 7 pm, we had to postpone until 8! Stripgirl left at 7:30, and she had made me absolutely crazy. Cost for a great meeting: USD 150 pluss lunch.
The I added some chemistry in order to get through the night with Kamilla and still “maintain my honour”.
Day 4 – departure
I had a passionate morning “good bye” with Kamilla, this girl is a gem on every level, one of my all time highest ranked. I am happy to cross Europe to be with her. Kamilla left me an hour before I should go to the airport and I was to pack my things. One minute after Kamilla left, it knocked on the door. Thinking it was Kamilla who had forgotten something, I opened and there was StripGirl standing with a big smile!! She came in, kissing passionately and gave me a keyring from Odessa “so I should not forget her” (I had already told her I would be back in maybe a month)! Although I was tempted for a quickie, I felt that the sexual abilities of middle-aged man were stretched beyond their limit already, so we just kissed …..
But Kamilla and StripGirl must have passed each other in the stairways!! Sometimes luck is on my side!!
I then went to Kiev for 2 night to follow up my profession/work there, spent one night with a girlfriend from Sumy who came in with the train for one night, the next with an old girlfriend from Kiev. Very nice.
Some conclusions:
1. It looks as if the girls in hotel Odessa are run by some mafia-like pimps?!
2. The invisible network for girls who may be willing for P4P is present in Odessa!! StripGirl offered me to bring a girlfriend of hers next time! She told me she had several girlfriends – and knew about even more girls – who might be willing to meet what she called “a nice man”.
3. It is very discreet, Stripgirl didn’t want either her name or her phone to be published on the internet. She also told me that most of her girlfriends who were willing for a meeting for money, either would first see the man or have a direct recommendation from another girl.
4. All girls she knew about for P4P were either in regular work or were students. Most of them only did this when they needed something special, weeks or maybe months in between. However, most of them or maybe all would be interested in meeting some “nice man” for a longer relationship with “financial support”.
5. These girls are not *****s, they are just in a culture where it is expected that a man provides financially for the girl.
6. Odessa is unsuitable for those who wants to have a lot of short-term girls. There are few such opportunities.
7. The numbers given to me by Anton and CT the first time I was there in summer were invaluable. After that I have more or less been on my own. And CT and Anton are not pimps (according to the expectations presented on the boards from some visitors to Odessa, it may seem as if some people almost think they are!), and it would be unrealistic to believe that they can provide anybody with an endless stream of willing girls…
8. The stripclub “Manhattan” may give some possibilities, but it is best to get numbers and meet the girls the day after, unless you are willing to pay 300. This price may vary from girl to girl.
9. One should pay attention to that almost all girls for P4P in Odessa are what we would calls “normal girls” and they need to be respected and treated like that.
10. CT has already mentioned that those living there or staying for longer times have a tremendous advantage. My feeling is that the average sex tourist may have a difficult time in Odessa. The fact that I already in connection with my work have been 20 times in Kiev and since summer 4 times in Odessa, largely increases my credability and attraction. After all, I am in an age group that normally I would not expect to be attractive for girls 20-24 years old, and I don’t look like Brad Pitt!
11. I feel I am in the borderline between the absolute normal girls and those that moonlight with P4P. However, in both situations I have experienced some of the best ever relationships with Odessa girls. They have been exceptionally tender, passionate, sweet, and affectionate. In addition I have for years wondered if there is in the the countries of the former Soviet Union an Academy for Oral Sex (AOS). If there is an AOS, then I think a lot of Odessa girls are qualified as instructors there!
12. The availability of the girls seem to be changing or fluctuating. Most of the numbers I had from 4 months ago don’t respond any more when I send SMS and ask for a meeting
13. Odessa as a city is far less interesting in November!
14. Finally, although I have been suspected of being a paid public relation agent for OES (and I again I can tell I only rent apartments from them!), I will again claim that they do the best apartment service I have experienced in FUS countries. The contrast when I got to Kiev now and there used the service of another agency was striking – both regarding the quality of apartment and the service.
EDITOR'S NOTE: I certainly hope that the author or somebody else will post a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please Click Here (http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?) for more information.
An Academy of Oral Sex! What a great idea! I donate the first $ 100. Who follows? I am even willing to manage the funds and take the exams :-)
Alessiocomneno
11-24-06, 20:18
Im Searching A Friend For Find Girls In Ods I Will Be There From 26 Dec To 6 Jan Im Alone And For Find Girls Is Better And More Safe To Be In 2 Or 3 Guys.
Hi,
I sincerely appreciate your reports, but...
Would you please STOP capitalizing the first letter of EVERY word in your reports!
It's difficult to read, it's time consuming to fix, and it takes you more work to write like that.
On behalf of myself and your fellow Forum Members: Thank You!
Jackson
Now that the Odessa section seems to be in silence, I keep on writing something more.
In Odessa I got bored soon, cause bad weather during the first 16 days of september, so no point to go to the beach, the regular girls and their shity attitude were only losing time, so I thought what to do.
And even if, I recognize alone that it is enough pity to go till Odessa to see "fishes", I did a try to delfinarium.
I have to say that for few bucks, you can see a nice and pleasent show that impressed me and my girl I went with.
Not the reason to go to Odessa, but once there, one good way to kill the time during one afternoon of bad weather.
The classic option to kill the time in the east europe is banya, so I tried it.
I went there with the same girl, regular I went to delfinarium, and I simply asked to one official taxi the best banya-sauna in town, he told me the name and said the price, I said, too much, poka and I stopped a privat car, for the half price with the good info. :)
I forgot the name of the sauna, but it was in a fitness center far about 40 minutes from center. It was pretty expensive, in comparison by ukranian salary, may be they charged me as gringo, however was the best quality sauna I was in my life with 2 swimming pool, one cold water and one hot water jacuzzi with nice lights, one big monitor LCD with porno DVD :), two sauna, one normal and second one that smells of flowers and a nice biliard and most of all two bedrooms:).
Very big at least 90-100 metrs square.
3 hours of this privat banya + some coke and beers for about 900 grivnas, more or less it was 130 euro.
Going to Afina shopping center, very close to mac donald and, specially now, much better than to walk outside in the cold.
Usually in the lunch-time and late evening you can find normal girls eating cheap, and not so good, lunch or simply drinking something.
I went there alone and I saw 4 girls sitting at one table, I simply asked them in english a good disko where to go.
After the usual question, hey where are you from?, I self-invited to sit down with them :) and start to talk.
As you can see from the pic, very normal girl, surely I did not travel across half europe till Odessa for such quality, but better than to drink alone.
Then we went out and I proposed to go to my flat drinking good italian wine "amarone", they said they do not know me very well and bla bla, but I wanted to drink it, so I went to take the bottle and,look the foto, we ended to drink it in the Debarisoskaya :)
After they wanted to go to turkish disko, where they were used to go and I saw immediately they knew inside there many turkish who sit down with us.
They started to get soon drunk, I mean not only afina girls but also the turkish with us, so I was enough sure, nothing possible.
I went to toilet and once back I payed my bill and left to the port :)
p.s. in the pic the red one pig-girl drinking my favourite "amarone" :(
Latin Crusher
12-18-06, 03:00
I bet you would off score with the girl in the Red If you had back up with you! all three of them look fine as fuck ! crush that ass hell ya !
I bet you would off score with the girl in the Red If you had back up with you! all three of them look fine as fuck ! crush that ass hell ya !
Fuck as fuck I do not need to go so far till Ukraina for such pussy as these three...I went there for much better quality, the same quality you see daily walking in the street...as Doc right said, the frustracting factor in Odessa is a problem and no one of these three pussies is enough nice to be frustracting..at least for me.
Doctor_Skank
12-20-06, 00:36
Fuck as fuck I do not need to go so far till Ukraina for such pussy as these three...I went there for much better quality, the same quality you see daily walking in the street...as Doc right said, the frustracting factor in Odessa is a problem and no one of these three pussies is enough nice to be frustracting..at least for me.
The two on the left look good enough for me... :) But Lukasek is righth, these girls are pretty average looking. After seeing 8s and 9s all day you dont wanna fuck a 6 in Odessa... at least not until 4am and after 6 mojitos...
Felix Nordic
12-20-06, 01:00
You shouldnt have wasted such a lovely wine on the girl in the red! ;)
The girl in the middle looks ok for a hot night though:)
You better watch out for these "free entrance and free drinking girls"!
With your aquired knowledge I wish you better luck next time!!
Happy hunting!
//Felix
Doc: you are kindly, but I saw all the pics you posted and surely you will not going to fuck girl as the two on the left....If drunk I can fuck a 6" too, but these were not a 6"....I am only a good photographer:)..
Felix Nordic: the red pig was able to drunk my amarone only once and only cause in that moment alone in Odessa.....I just though to all of you: I had in my hands the cam to make this foto to show you them ;)
Yes man, you are right, they were EXACTLY "free entrance and free drinking girls, as the 80% of girls in Ods and that's the reason why I left them sooner as I though at the beginning.
To explain: the girl in yellow, first from left, was the sister of red pig, she was the worst, every few minutes she asked my cell phone to call her Turkish friends, she was already drunk in Afina when I met them and listen fellows...she is 17yo!!! The youngest- the worst! Funny cause she lead non-stop the older sister red pig.
The girl in the middle, she came back from London, where surely she bought her shirt, see the flag, and she was enough depressed, she spoke non stop about how is great to live there and so on....and my Mr. Happy was not more interested to listen info about disco and night life in London ;)
So I went to my flat alone and hungry as mad-dog, I cooked spaghetti+2nd bottle of wine :) and then to the harbour looking for clean, friendly, nice, with(out) three holes shaved (life)-boat ;) .....
To be continued soon..
Bez Bezarra
12-20-06, 03:37
So I went to the harbour for cleanout three holes shaved
:) Well, is that one tramp with 3 holes?
;) Or shaved holes on 3 tramps?
:( If its one, I hope she doesn't have to shave too much her mustache,
:D Unless its rectal mustache
Doctor_Skank
12-20-06, 13:08
Doc: you are kindly, but I saw all the pics you posted and surely you will not going to fuck girl as the two on the left....If drunk I can fuck a 6" too, but these were not a 6"....I am only a good photographer:)..
To be continued soon..
Lukasek,
Sorry to hear about your horrible Odessan trio of girls. I've been to the Turkish disco on Deribasovskaya before too... a despicable and dirty place. Maybe if you are in the right crowd there it can be good, but it seems to me it is very local and tourists will not enjoy it. I felt totally out of place there and people literally stared at me with a "what the fuck you doing here?" look in their eyes. The girls flat out ignored me and seemed even worried that their jealous boyfriends might see them talking to me. I left as quickly as I came.
I've had my own experience with local groups of girls and know how they can be. It is too bad you didnt have a wingman... some fire support would've helped. I think the main problem was the 2 sisters. The fat one will never be happy about anything in her life except chocolate and alcohol and the small one seemed to be really insistent on spending your money one way or another. The middle one could have worked out if you got her alone, but her bodyguards weren't going to allow it.
That's sometimes the dynamics of things. It's best to be really aggressive with these kind of girls and if they don't want to go to your apartment, just dump them. If they insist on going somewhere of their choice for drinks as a group, you will usually be unhappy. It pays to be macho with this kind of girl... either you'll get what you want or find out soon enough that they only want to play before you spend too much money and waste too much time.
I have always felt that key to success in anything is keeping the initiative on your side... like in war attack is the best defense. If they start determining your evening plans, you have already lost. Don't feel too bad about it though, just look at it as a lesson learned. I think most if us have been in similar situations and you were smart enough to call it off before you wasted too much on them.
Bez...just to ask....here for you, ass mustache ;) ... not an Afina girl, but believe me, her face worth to invest much time with her and I got her for free and even if her pussy was hairy, it smells... as a fresh red rose in spring... uhhhmmmm...
Doc...at least the trio of girls "took" me only couple of hours of time in 16 days in Odessa...not so bad.
I took the chance to see turkish disko with them and I agree with you, not a nice place, everybody there seems to do not like so much the turists and the girls you find there are mostly looking for only turkish men...
"If they start determining your evening plans, you have already lost." In these words there is one of the best gold rule to score pussy in every state:never and never be kind man and agree to their plans or they will think they can lead you and then...forget their pussy!
Felix Nordic
12-21-06, 00:32
Girls like that are to be tought a lesson. They will never learn if they dont take the consequences of their own behaviour!
Happened to me in Lithuania and Moldova. If you can, always try meet girls of this kind inside the disco, and make them pay for their own entrance. If they insist on going right now with you, there is usually something fishy. If its not possible to meet them inside, and you think you got a chance with one of the birds, hang a long and see what happens. As soon as they start to show more interest for "close male friends or maybe even girlfreinds" than for you, you know youre taken for a ride. Order another round to the table and let girls smile at you as the stupid foreigner they think you are. Go around and be free, come back to the table - to make them feel sure you'll pay, and leave again. This time you go for your jacket and disappear from the place pretty fast! And dont go to this place again or atleast stay away for a week.....
Girls will be sitting with the bar bill and will soon realise that this fellow hit us back with our own medicine! :) They will have some probs with the bill....
How tasty wasnt that Cognac thats been payed for by scammer girls?? - Yummiieee!;)
Hopefully they will think twice next time when they have the possibility to scam a man!;)
Bottom line; Gentleman behaviour should be prevailing as long as there are ladies around. Bitches should pay for themselves!
Merry Christmas and Happy New hunting Year!!
/Felix
P.s Ten red flags;
Girl that must have her friends along to go to the disco
Girl wanting to meet outside the disco, or with her friends, and go together inside to disco
Girl giving you much less attention once after entering the disco - holding hands is no no.
Girl seem to know the waitors
Girl have the ability to ask for the most pricy drinks - and will not be happy with less! A normal unspoiled girl is happy with getting stoned on not pricy drinks or even vodka! Can be good though to impress with fancy drinks sometimes if you feel that works;) getting her a bit drunk makes it easier to bed her!
Girl orders fresh juice instead of ordinary juice
Girl have many friends in the place
Girl recieving many sms and calls
Girl that orders things without you knowing it
Girl wanting champagne (local champanski is ok)
Cruiser rules....
You meet girls at discos/club...you don't bring girls to discos.
Doctor_Skank
12-21-06, 09:05
Girls like that are to be tought a lesson. They will never learn if they dont take the consequences of their own behaviour!
Bottom line; Gentleman behaviour should be prevailing as long as there are ladies around. Bitches should pay for themselves!
Merry Christmas and Happy New hunting Year!!
/Felix
P.s Ten red flags;
Girl that must have her friends along to go to the disco
Girl wanting to meet outside the disco, or with her friends, and go together inside to disco
Girl giving you much less attention once after entering the disco - holding hands is no no.
Girl seem to know the waitors
Girl have the ability to ask for the most pricy drinks - and will not be happy with less! A normal unspoiled girl is happy with getting stoned on not pricy drinks or even vodka! Can be good though to impress with fancy drinks sometimes if you feel that works;) getting her a bit drunk makes it easier to bed her!
Girl orders fresh juice instead of ordinary juice
Girl have many friends in the place
Girl recieving many sms and calls
Girl that orders things without you knowing it
Girl wanting champagne (local champanski is ok)
Absolutely! Just reading your ten red flags reminds me of Odessa... :)
Doctor_Skank
12-21-06, 09:17
Cruiser rules....
You meet girls at discos/club...you don't bring girls to discos.
Normally I agree with you Cruiser, but obviously if you are with a regular girlfriend or a new girl you want to impress and are really sure you can score with her it is OK. Sometimes taking a provincial or studenty dyev to a disco is an excellent way to get her home to your pad, especially if she is one of those that is "scared" to go to your apartment outright. I think a good measure for success on this is to be the one that determines the evening plans.
If she says "I want to go to disco 'so-and-so'..." it's usually a sign she just needs someone to take her there and who that someone is, is irrelevant. A no go.
If you take a girl to a disco on your initiative, you can loosen her inhibitions with cocktails and since you brought her there, also determine when it is time to leave... as a couple.
Even in Odessa, actually taking a girl to the Arkadia discos was a good method... provided certain rules were followed and Felix Nordic's red flag list was observed.
http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showpost.php?p=543535&postcount=646
When I am with a particularly hot girlfriend, sometimes I like to take her out and show her off a bit. One of my favorite things to do is go to a particularly snobby "business" or "elitny" restaurant with a wild and young girl and enjoy the looks I get from the patrons and waiting staff. Especially enjoyable is when you go to the same restaurant 3 days in a row with 3 different girls... the looks from the staff are golden... :)
Of course for every rule there is an exception.
I prefer to keep my super hot girls locked in a cage in my apartment. Or at least chained to the bed. Of course then I feel bad for them and have to go find another hot girl for them to play with.
It is interesting to see how waitstaff reacts when you meet a bunch of girls at the same place. My two favorite meeting places in Kiev are TGIF - always greeted with a wave and a smile and Jacob's cafe.
Always meet a girl for a pre game size up at a cafe. Who really wants to meet at a noisy club to get to know someone - someone looking for a free ride or wanting to control the agenda. If you like what you see then take her to a club - of your choosing. Or better yet use one of my favorite lines and tell her there is a disco in your apartment. ;)
I visited Ods in September and Jully, with a friend of mine now living there running his own business. He had the sweet pleasure to judge the Miss Bikini contest in Odessa in July at the riviera beach. I had the pleasure of seeing one round of this but unfrotuantely did not get a chance to hook up with any of the contestants.
http://www.missbikini.odessa.ua
I will post my full report soon when I have some time meanwhile, check out these beautiful beach pictures. I still say you have to be dickless not to get laid in Odessa.
http://www.missbikini.odessa.ua/photovotes/photos/report/002.jpg
http://www.missbikini.odessa.ua/photovotes/photos/report/009.jpg
http://www.missbikini.odessa.ua/fotokonkurs/big/val_20.jpg
http://www.missbikini.odessa.ua/fotokonkurs/big/Postroenije.jpg
http://www.missbikini.odessa.ua/fotokonkurs/big/ka_16.jpg
http://www.missbikini.odessa.ua/fotokonkurs/big/7304569.jpg
http://www.missbikini.odessa.ua/fotokonkurs/big/35.jpg
What I really miss in every city I am and I go is the typical way of Moscow, between milion others different ways..., to get a pro by tochka way. :)
Why? Doc wrote a gorgeous report about tochka, read it, it worth!
So I tried in Odessa too and I decided to start asking to the taxidriver I was used to call to go to arkadia.
I have to say that more or less, as written before, tochka in Moscow sense, doesn't exists in Odessa.
However besides the harbour there are at least 3 places where to get streetwalkers. Do not ask me where, I forgot it, I remember only that one place is close to harbour, second one is towards arkadia and that the third is in district Luzanovka.
Negotiate in advance or the taxidriver will fuck you as only 10 pro together can do it. :)
The SW in Odessa are surely not nice, but surely less % of drug addict than at harbour, just my opinion, most of them you risk to find them drunk, so check the smell of their breathe before to take her. LOL
I took 2 sw and the first was good, very friendly even if only a 6", (but the friendly-factor is why I love tochka-SW...) and the second one was so drunk that nearly fall asleep in the taxicar....once in the flat we drunk water and juice and looking at her, I decided that was better to send her home, instead to see her vomit on my bed during a doggye style :))
So if I had to be honest, even if it is possible to find something good, and however I enjoyed so much stay in taxi driving in the streets of Philad...ehm of Odessa early morning with cigarette and bottle of beer, searching tochka-sw in Odessa doesn't worth it so much...so it is up to you.
In the pic my taxidriver, in black and red clothes, askind where to find sw to another one sw, the blond one, sorry for bad quality, but I did the foto inside the car with cell phone...better than nothing:)
p.s. Rocco Barocco...thanks for your many many many reports...thanks to be one of the biggest contributor to this forum as all the others members speaking of Odessa as a heaven...and all of them with about 10 (ten) reports....yes,go there and you will see that 99% of mongers in Odessa have big problems to get laid as very well and very long and from many members reported here or that 99% of turists in Odessa are dickless....and in 16 days in Odessa, 10 days alone, I met really many foreigners and the usual question between us was,why we are here? Where regular girls do not give a shit, where no pro scene...I never seen neither in Prague so many mongers complain and be disappointed that they went to Odessa....believe me or not that is true!
Nice pics, but nobody said Odessan Girls are not nice...so your pics demonstrate NOTHING..and usually the difference between photograph girl or to have sex with her is ENOUGH BIG difference,but as I see...for the "dreamers" there is no differences...
My lucky? I already was in Odessa and I know the truth and how is hard to score regulars..so sorry,but with me your report number NINE doesn't work...
Or am I the only one to find Rocco's bikini girls mostly average?
But thanks for the pics...
Most of them are average. There are 2-3 who are above average. Not one of them was drop dead and whip out the money clip kind of girl though. Then again, I haven't posted a single pic on here, so who am I to make comments :).
Thanks for posting them.
Bez Bezarra
12-24-06, 01:43
Of course I keep my girl locked in a cage and chained to my bed.
I tell her there is a disco in apartment. ;)
Uh dude, there might be some people lookin' for ya.
DJ FourMoney
12-24-06, 10:27
Or am I the only one to find Rocco's bikini girls mostly average?
But thanks for the pics...
You see better at your average NOPI Show or Drag Race. In fact, I'll even go as far to say you see better at your average American car show, which again proves their nothing wrong with American women from the outside, its the inside that makes them almost impossible to deal with even under ideal conditions.
For somebody 300 reports are nothing, for somebody else a great number.. I do not know if I was a good contributor or not, I let to the others to judge me, but one thing is sure, I always wrote the truth!
After almost 3 years of reading and writing in this fabolous forum I met many members and with some of them I get a good friend too.
My first thank, a very big thank is to Jackson, thank to him We all saved money and time to get the girls We all desire.
Second and not less big thank to Guido88, a great guy with so big heart.., that in Moscow in january 04 in the internet cafe under krasnaja ploschad showed me this forum and the third thank to the last member I met and that become as a bro, Eros75 that made my stay in Odessa much much less boring and much more funny!
So to celebrate Xmas, the end of 2006 what a better way to give to all the members here my little present?
I thought a lot about it and I understood that I will not go one more time to Odessa so why not to share with all You all my contacts I got after couple of months of intense chat in www.mail.ru?
So for every senior member with 50 posts or more who will write me a PM, I will answer with the list of the cell phone to the girls I contacted.
In the foto you see the papir I got always with me in my 16 days in Odessa, ( they are 18 regulars and 4 pro, all from mail.ru) surely some of them changed their phone number, surely others will not answer cause they do not know you, but I am sure it worth to try to contact all of them once you get in Odessa or in Kiev,inviting them to tour in the capital.., and simply to say: " hello xxxx do you remember me? We chatted in mail.ru, now I am in Ukraine, why we do not meet for a drink?".
It costs you nothing and maybe...who knows...
With the hope that my contacts can help many of You to have unforgettable beautiful nights of delicious sex with Ukranian girls I wish You all my best wishes to a nice, merry Xmas!
Lukasek
Guys, would love your opinion, especially those who have been to odessa recently.
I keep reading odessa isn't the haven for girls as it used to be.
Therefore over the past couple of months, I've been making an effort to meet girls at a free ukrainian date/meeting site.
I have 4 girls I talk frequently with from odessa. About 4 meaningful emails a week (7 or 8 line emails).
MY QUESTION: (I'm 31 and not a bad looking bloke:)
What do you think my strike rate will be?
Meaning, I will be there for 2 weeks, I don't want to be disappointed with the frustration of how hard it is to meet lots of nice girls in odessa.
Do you think this 6 months of lead work (arrive in June), will help me?
If I had 6 girls interested in me, do you think lets say half on average may be for real and can't wait to see me LOL and then it means I will have 3 guaranteed meetings with nice girls and with a bit of luck and I won't look so frustrated and desperate LOL I will be calm and relaxed and I may meet a few others when I'm there. Know what I mean?
What are your thoughts? Am I really wasting my time with these online girls?
Alistair01
12-28-06, 18:13
I am not the OES MBA. (Monger of Business Administration)
But once an editor, always an editor.
Ca_T!
Does this mean you will hire me to consult
on blondinky sendviches?
I have a lot of research compiled on this
she-devil, Novosibirsk nympho Nadia.She is hot. Have you got her number or where she lives let me know please.
Doctor_Skank
12-29-06, 00:25
Guys, would love your opinion, especially those who have been to odessa recently.
I keep reading odessa isn't the haven for girls as it used to be.
Therefore over the past couple of months, I've been making an effort to meet girls at a free ukrainian date/meeting site.
I have 4 girls I talk frequently with from odessa. About 4 meaningful emails a week (7 or 8 line emails).
MY QUESTION: (I'm 31 and not a bad looking bloke:)
What do you think my strike rate will be?
Meaning, I will be there for 2 weeks, I don't want to be disappointed with the frustration of how hard it is to meet lots of nice girls in odessa.
Do you think this 6 months of lead work (arrive in June), will help me?
If I had 6 girls interested in me, do you think lets say half on average may be for real and can't wait to see me LOL and then it means I will have 3 guaranteed meetings with nice girls and with a bit of luck and I won't look so frustrated and desperate LOL I will be calm and relaxed and I may meet a few others when I'm there. Know what I mean?
What are your thoughts? Am I really wasting my time with these online girls?
If you've been maintaining contact for so long, you will most likely be able to bed them all. I don't know what your correspondence has been like or what kind of girls you are talking to so I can't say with 100% that it isnt a scam or attempt to get some perks.
When we have been talking about Odessa being overhyped, we basically are talking about the assumption that some seemed to have that you could go out to the clubs and score new hot babes of the freebie type every night. In actuality scoring at the clubs is full of pitfalls and Odessa in the summer does seem to really be a market primarily for sponsorship in one way or another, not to mention the fact that much of what you see is spoken for.
Really, you CAN and most likely will get laid in Odessa. We don't mean to totally down-hype the place... it isn't Xanadu but it isn't a giant ATM honey pot either.
If you have 4 good contacts you have primed, try for them all... you should get AT LEAST 2 without trying hard. Go for at least a kiss on the first date and sex on the second. If that doesnt work out, she'll just waste your time for the rest of the trip. Move on or at least make her chase you. And when you make your move and she resists, just continue to push a bit. They almost always say no at first but many yield quite quickly afterwards. If they don't, oh well. Move on and never second guess yourself.
Two things I would warn you about though:
+ Sometimes too much communication can lead to too much expectation on her side. Likely all 4 will try to hog your time and some may be expecting something more serious than you are willing to offer.
+ If she looks too good and especially too well-dressed or photographed in front of exotic locations or in front of expensive cars, she is most likely quite experienced in milking men for perks. That's no crime and you can maybe even use it to your advantage.. but be forewarned. She expects something tangible.
And another thing, read this excellent post from Felix Nordic:
http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showpost.php?p=543535&postcount=646
And the most important thing, when you get there just go for it.
Thanks Dr Skank. Your a legend. I was thinking exactly what you said and you have confirmed everything for me.
The girls I'm talking to seem like decent girls. I have filtered out the ones that seem like too much trouble. But these girls all seem sweet & are heading the convos towards the serious side, talking about there need to find a good serious boy, lack of these boys in ukraine etc. So I gotta steer away from that kind of talk. I can see now I'm going to find it hard to juggle them all LOL thats why they will all think I arrive on a different date; ) a day or 2 apart.
I really can't wait. I will report my trip on here for all. I will do about 10 days odessa, 10 days crimea, 7 days kiev & 3 days either nikolaev or dnipetrosk.
1 month in heaven with these gorgeous girls:)
Do you live in Ukraine Dr Skank?
Will any1 be in Ukraine this June?
Sevastopol1
01-02-07, 12:40
Probably the best advise I can offer is go and get yourself a good Russian language learning programme and study every day, you will need need it once you get to Krimea (I repeat zero Enlish spoke in Sevastopol/Simferopol/Balaclava and rural Krimea. Yalta possibly a little)! Get studying.
Regards and good luck
Sevastopol1
Thanks Dr Skank. Your a legend. I was thinking exactly what you said and you have confirmed everything for me.
The girls I'm talking to seem like decent girls. I have filtered out the ones that seem like too much trouble. But these girls all seem sweet & are heading the convos towards the serious side, talking about there need to find a good serious boy, lack of these boys in ukraine etc. So I gotta steer away from that kind of talk. I can see now I'm going to find it hard to juggle them all LOL thats why they will all think I arrive on a different date; ) a day or 2 apart.
I really can't wait. I will report my trip on here for all. I will do about 10 days odessa, 10 days crimea, 7 days kiev & 3 days either nikolaev or dnipetrosk.
1 month in heaven with these gorgeous girls:)
Do you live in Ukraine Dr Skank?
Will any1 be in Ukraine this June?
Probably the best advise I can offer is go and get yourself a good Russian language learning programme and study every day
Sevastopol1
Rosettastone and pimsleur are very good programme for me to learn russian, the best ones, just use them in daily basis.....
....Thinking to russian and ukranian pussy works it much better ;)
Bez Bezarra
01-03-07, 03:54
She is hot. Have you got her number or where she lives let me know please.
Yes Nadia is one of the very hottest fleshpots ever. What a shame only
985 views after 100 days. Just spoke with her last week, to tell her I'll
be heading her way soon to re-ignite that little volcano betwixt her thighs.
No longer in Odessa, she's 36 hours away, a hell of a trek, but worth
every endless fucking hour.
I'm afraid she's not available yet to the public, though somewhere else on
ISG someone actually posted a link to an old foto of her from a
dating site, which floored me when I saw it. So she might have been
looking before, and I'm just glad I found her.
I never WOULD have even met her, except that I kept bugging one
dyev I knew to introduce me to any girlfriends she had, and what's
even more crazy is that on the night that I met her, she came by
with another dyev I actually chose over her. Nadia looked totally
trashed and tired, and so I passed on her. It didn't turn out bad at
all because the other one was such a 200% GFE sweetie that I
completely forgot to snap some fotos. 2 days later Nadia returned,
and well, you can see she was a real devil.
This is definitely one case where if I [CodeWord140] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord140) anyone off for with-holding
info, I certainly wouldn't blame you for bashing me. ;)
Sex-bomb-goddess Nadia:
You are right Lukasek. My 'dickless' comment is uncalled for and I wrote it when I was drunk, thinking about my lays in Odessa. Came home alone and horny after a long night out in Toronto; frustrated and started reminising about Odessa and deciding to post that short report.
I agree with you that most guys have a lot of difficulty scoring freebies in ODS and the pro scene is not well developed but on the other hand, if you get yourself with the right 'russian' crowd it is still easier to score there with a freebie than most other places in the world. What ODS really needs is a river palace type of place for those who struck out late at night and need a backup plan.
I also think that sex on the 1st night is becoming more difficult to come by. Even friends of mine who live in Moscow are now saying that girls rarely put out on first date, but the 2nd date success if almost 100%.
Slavicgourmet
01-04-07, 03:36
Rosettastone and pimsleur are very good programme for me to learn russian, the best ones, just use them in daily basis.....
....Thinking to russian and ukranian pussy works it much better ;)Lukasek and all. I have various programms to learn Russian, Rosettastone included.
One of the best one, if not the best is GOLOSA.
Available for free,
downloadable on the net with :
3 hours of videos
30 hours of audio trainings
and tons of written exercizes
Check at : http://www.gwu.edu/~slavic/golosa/
Doctor_Skank
01-04-07, 08:48
I wrote it when I was drunk, thinking about my lays in Odessa.
Posting on ISG when you are drunk is like going to a tochka when you are drunk... the next morning may very well have you thinking "what in the hell did I do that for?" :)
Thanks Dr Skank. I was thinking exactly what you said and you have confirmed everything for me.
I really can't wait. I will report my trip on here for all. I will do about 10 days odessa, 10 days crimea, 7 days kiev & 3 days either nikolaev or dnipetrosk.
1 month in heaven with these gorgeous girls:)
Do you live in Ukraine Dr Skank?
Will any1 be in Ukraine this June?
I don't live in Ukraine, but manage to visit a couple times a year. I agree with Sev1 that learning a bit of Russian will help you out a lot... so don't be lazy. You can get by with English, but will greatly limit your possibilities with freebies and pros alike.
As for Odessa in June... maybe... :)
Explorer69
01-04-07, 09:05
Guys, would love your opinion, especially those who have been to odessa recently.
I keep reading odessa isn't the haven for girls as it used to be.
Therefore over the past couple of months, I've been making an effort to meet girls at a free ukrainian date/meeting site.
I have 4 girls I talk frequently with from odessa. About 4 meaningful emails a week (7 or 8 line emails).
MY QUESTION: (I'm 31 and not a bad looking bloke:)
What do you think my strike rate will be?
Meaning, I will be there for 2 weeks, I don't want to be disappointed with the frustration of how hard it is to meet lots of nice girls in odessa.
Do you think this 6 months of lead work (arrive in June), will help me?
If I had 6 girls interested in me, do you think lets say half on average may be for real and can't wait to see me LOL and then it means I will have 3 guaranteed meetings with nice girls and with a bit of luck and I won't look so frustrated and desperate LOL I will be calm and relaxed and I may meet a few others when I'm there. Know what I mean?
What are your thoughts? Am I really wasting my time with these online girls?I am convinced that you have a 50% possibility to "score", that is you are able to bed half of them. However, the chances that you take them to bed the first evening are almost zero. I have myself a lot of expereince during the last 6 months (5 visits)and I will summarize: the odessa girls are wonderful once you get them in bed, however, they are not easy freebies. Your chances of making it the first night is much higher in Western Europe and in USA (personal experience). My guess is that you will get them in bed the 2. or 3. night. It all depends on you! My suggestion would be to make an arrangement with a hooker as a backup for the first and second night. The first night just go for the WG after you had dinner with your girlfriend. For later meetings have the WG as a possible backup.
In the end it all depends on you, you may be more lucky, or you may not get anything.
CA Traveler
01-10-07, 22:11
I have been getting a lot of email lately wondering where I am and where I’ve been, so I’m going to share some info with all of my ISG friends and clients from the past decade!
As many of you know, after a long stint commuting from California to Moscow, I sold Moscow Star Properties and after returning to California went through a divorce which ultimately allowed me to return to Moscow. Shortly thereafter I moved to Odessa to live and eventually open up another apartment rental business with a fellow hobbyist, Anton. To make a long story a little shorter, a few months ago, my ex- and I reconciled and I returned to California. During that time, Anton continued to operate OES.
Over the past few weeks, we made the decision to sell the operation, The Odessa Group and Odessa Executive Suites to the property owner in Odessa. Anton will continue to live in Odessa with several other successful biz ventures in the works. As usual, I am going to continue to enjoy life.
Both Anton and I would like all here to understand that we are no longer associated with The Odessa Group or Odessa Executive Suites.
More importantly, with this change in my life, I’ve decided to try to keep a little lower profile with my hobby activity than in the past.
With that in mind, although I will still be in the hunt, I will probably not be posting on my adventures in the future. However, I would like to thank the hundreds of fellow hobbyists who over the past thirteen years have shared a beer and have become clients, wingmen, and good friends.
Through the years, it’s been a great run and WSG/ISG has been a terrific guide and has saved me tons of money and time when I planned to visit a new venue.
I wish all of my friends the best… Stay safe!
Kinda long post, but this is pretty much my slavic experience for the past few months.
I thought I'd do what it takes to find the Holy Grail for slavic women. By Holy Grail,I mean a place where I just show up, go to a club or a bar, and get surrounded by women wanting to get introduced to me. And I get to choose with whom to connect and whom to take home.
The search brought me to Odessa for the first time in July, 2006. I was in Odessa for slightly more than 2 weeks and ended up with 5 non-pro hotties during the course of my stay. And they were HOT. (I have been told that I have REALLY high standards for women- When I was in Night Flight in Moscow couple years ago, I could not think of going home with more than two girls from the entire buffet of girls out there). But was Odessa the Holy Grail that I was looking for? No, absolutely not.
I am in my late twenties, can speak passable russian, am from Southern California and like to think that have reasonably good game out there in the states. But I just don't find the quality that I find in the slavic countries. I was kind of hoping that I could come to Ukraine, switch my "Game" button off and still get laid like a rock star, but I found that I needed to use all aspects of my Game and more to get the girls that I really desired.
I realised that girls here ( I am saying here, because I am in Odessa right now) do prefer their russian boyfriends to tourists who are coming over there for a week or two. They always seem to ask "What are you doing in Odessa" and soon, I realised that the true answer, "I am travelling" is just not gonna cut it. Since I knew that I wanted to come back here, I decided to start a business here and ended up buying a clothing store out here in partnership with some other people.
I returned to Odessa in October and have been in Ukraine since then. The attitude of the girls is totally different when you tell them that you do have a business out here. I actually like to take my girls to the store on the first or the second date, just to make them more comfortable with me.
The major realisation I can share with folks is that the only thing that stands between us and absolute hotties out here, are our beliefs about women that we carry along with us and our screwed up cultural programming coming from the western countries.
My wing and I here, just go up to women on Deribasovskaya street and start talking with them. Important thing- don't subconsciously apologize for approaching them. Be a MAN, CONFIDENT, with a BIG SMILE, slightly commanding and ask them simply if they speak english. They say nyet, just keep on talking..laugh out loud and say, c'mon, you do speak english, everybody took english in school. And then, if they are still not relenting, I break into russian. But the reality is, 30% of them WILL speak english- and WOULD talk. Just have a nice relaxed fun attitude- don't act creepy or you'd project that onto the girls and they'd run. You could collect maybe 5-10 numbers within 2 hours..
What about rejection here?
Hell, yeah, we get rejected, but so what? The worst thing that could happen is that she is not going to go home with you, but guess what, if you never approached her, she is not going to go home with you anyways, so the worst is already over.
Get the number, invite them for coffee right away, if they go, nice, or make plans for the next day- don't leave without making concrete plans. "I'll call you sometime" leads to nowhere.
Spend time over coffee or dinner, with a nice, relaxed, fun attitude again. Invite them over to your place- pretexts? The ones I have used are:
1. Get money from the ATM. Tell her, you need to go home because you don't want to walk around with such a lot of money. This is good, 'coz if she's a semi-pro, her thinking gets catalysed.
2. I'll show you a home video from California on my laptop.
3. I'll show you some great photos of hollywood hills, etc.
4. I left my windows open because my friend John smoked too much in my apartment and I need to go close the windows now.
And don't project too much lust...that's the hard part- just genuinely have the intention of knowing her better, but don't ask too many questions- tell stories about your life, family, travels, etc. My favorite is to talk about my niece and my nephew- this gives them the idea that you have other significant people in your life and they feel more comfortable.
Ideally, have lots of photos of your friends, family, travels, etc and show them to them. (I have the pics on the internet and invite them over to show them the same)
At home, don't just pounce on them- have a good selection of alcohol available and just make them comfortable...I like to smell their neck and tell them..damn..you smell good, what is that? smell it again in two minutes, gently kiss the neck...and then go for a kiss..if she rejects..don't get angry, just start another story, laugh and 5 mins later try again...usually by this time, the vodka and nature, both start taking their own natural course.
As I am sitting here typing, I am enjoying the leftovers from the wonderful dinner that a girl cooked a few hours ago before she rocked my world. She is so hot that my friend back in CA couldn't rate her on a scale of 10. She doesn't even let me pay for her taxi (she's an exception in this regard though)
The MOST important thing out here is to make sure that you act desireless- I even randomly tell some girls that I just met in the course of the conversation that I am having problems with my current girlfriend. (I make up some random problem) This lets them know that you DO have somebody currently and that you are not expressly hitting on them. I usually don't compliment girls on their physical traits unless I know they are already attracted to me. Don't try to use compliments as a way to get to her heart. But when I DO compliment, let's say, "u tibya ochin krasivayi glaza" (you have beautiful eyes), I do it midway between a sentence, (as if it were a passing thought) and keep on going with what I was saying.
The reality of the situation though is that, even though Odessa has immense
pulchritude, and the non ending parade of beauties is mind boggling, its hard to scrore with non pros unless you are here for atleast 3 weeks or so. And of course, if they know that you are going to come back here, a few times a year or whatever for business, they feel much, much more comfortable.
The kind of problems that you start running into, if you are here for a reasonable (>3 weeks) period of time are: 1. You start running into your other girlfriends when you are out with someone else. 2. How to schedule multiple sessions in a day so that there is no crossover possibility, etc
Just keep your eyes open, take that chance and you WILL get hotties out here- no questions asked. You just have to expose yourself to as many girls as possible and have that belief that if they get to know you better, they'll want to be with you. And then, let the magic take over.
The search for the Holy Grail is still on.
If anybody wants to wing, just pm me and we can meet up for a beer.
EDITOR'S NOTE: I certainly hope that the author or somebody else will post a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please Click Here (http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?) for more information.
Amistaad I could only totally agree with you, as I saw Odessa is the city with the best looking girls I was, but the problem is that most of mongers go to Odessa once or one time at year and for about 7-10 days, too short time to get laid with more than 3 regulars girls.
I am sure that if you live there you will not be able to decide with whom have a date, but also in Moscow, Piter and in every city in the east europe if you live there, you are very sucessfull with women.
If was in Odessa for 16 days and even if I got few regulars, I worked too much and for me it doesn't worth it. In 16 days I can get much more girls in Prague or Bratislava, even more in Minsk or in Kishinev surely.
Odessa is a paradise if you live there, not as monger destination.
I envy you, in friendly way obviously, but for the 99% of mongers here, as me, Odessa is most of time a losing time + frustracting factor ( as Doc said)!
Have a surely great time and think about us at home in our sex prison. ;)
Hello all,
Success in Odessa is only for Premiership players. The women there are the most mercenary in the country. However, it's the perfect place to improve your skills. After a week there you will be equipped to succeed in any other city.
Doctor_Skank
01-18-07, 09:09
Hello all,
Success in Odessa is only for Premiership players. The women there are the most mercenary in the country. However, it's the perfect place to improve your skills. After a week there you will be equipped to succeed in any other city.
:) Great analogy!
As mercenary as Odessan women can be and as challenging a pitch Odessa is, my summer wouldn't be complete without a short exodus to Odessa... maybe see you there next summer!
According to Anton 98% of mongers score in Odessa.....that's why his partner CA Traveler went back to his ex-wife..that makes sense lol
"OES is this, OES is that" said the ads...in one word OES is a paradise on earth.....they shut it down...again that makes sense lol
This happens only to a bunch of amateurs who don't know shit about accomodation business..
You see CA Traveler I don't need Lukasek's hand to predict your business won't last...
Eros
Amistaad, I say it again, great report. Odessa is definitely on my list. Was it difficult for an American to buy a business? Do you have a report on the P4P scene?
Rodney Munch
01-23-07, 05:01
Great report Amistaad. Very precise and on the point about Odessa. I have returned to north america after a 5 month stay and agree on almost everything he says. The fact taht I speak fairly fluent Russian of course makes things a bit easier for me and I grew up in the West but had eastern european culture at home.
The reality is that if you come to odessa and leave your bullshit inhibitions behind, act like a man and not a western whipped pussy your odds of scoring will be incredibly high. Don’t know about 98% but they will be up there. However, let's not forget who you are going after. Odessa is all about quality not quantity and that seems to be a point that some members on this board and elsewhere just do not get across. Unfortunately, this city aside from a small port scene, does not have a well developed p4p scene so if you come here be prepared to navigate non pros, semi pros and the inbetween which is the majority of girls in Odessa. If you are looking to score twice a day with different chics, better stick with Phillipines. This aint the place.
In the past 8 months, I have had the pleasure to visit St. Pete, Moscow, Kishinev, Kiev, Lugansk, Sevastopol, Yalta the list goes on and on but without a doubt the most amazing white women in all of former USSR are concentrated in Odessa. If you don’t belieive me just come here during the warm months and see for yourself. Moscow has more of very fashionable model types but even those appear in force in odessa during the summer months.
I visited Odessa for the first time almost a year ago. The city is unexplainably chill and filled with contrast beyond belief. What I like best about being there is not even the endless parades of babes literally wearing thongs with seethroughs on top during summer days. No, that's a nice feature but the best part is just being able to walk outside, sit in a shady cafe sipping an amerano with your friends, chatting up the cutie watress about her evening plans WHILE having the endless parade walk by. The problem is that it can only be done about 5 months out of the year in this city and since my job requires just an internet connection I can remedy that pretty easily.
The biggest problem that I've observed hanging out with the limited expat scene out there is that many guys, coming for a week or less expect the girls to fall to their knees at the sight of the American, Canadian, German, etc. You get my point. I have had this conversation with a number of my fellow expats friends in Odessa. Many of you are probably reading this right now and may even know who I am. Everyone agreed with the point made above. Evidence is there if you need it. Any night at the Irish pub is filled with sour mongers bitching about ‘the one that got away’ after they got into the nightclub. So, for everyone one of these stories I can tell you there is a considerable number of success stories. I have lived that scene and plan on being there again from June through October once again this upcoming summer.
I have to say that whihle you can meet women here (I am not physically in Odessa right now but mentally I am) ANYWHERE, the best source of meetings for me would be the http://www.love. Topping.com. Ua/ this is a large databse and there are other domains for it out there. This is the one I use. From here, if you live here you are able to line up 2 or 3 dates a day if you so desired. If you are visiting, my suggestion is to not even bother using the system prior to 2 weeks – 10 days prior to your arrival. The girls will lose interest if you do not meet them quickly.
The question is, how much money do you want to spend and how much energy do you have. The money is not a big issue since if you meet during the day you can just stop have coffee or a drinks somewhere, at night, if it is someone you already like you can go with dinner but always better to skip that and just go to a nightclub instead. I would tell everyone, if they have any extra time and can vaguely understand Cyrillic to try and get in touch with some of the girls on that website. There are both pros and of course mostly non pros.
For me living here on a fairly decent budget it is VERY easy to score. The reason I emphasise very is because money is the main thing in Odessa to get laid, not looks. If the girls are under impression you are a wealthy it will go further than your looks. That does not mean if you are a troll you will impress them with a bottle a bottle of champagne, but if you are a troll hitting more of a 2nd tier type of club, getting the front table with a bottle, being one of the very few people there able to do that chances are in your favor by the end of the night you will have some easily imperessionable 19 year old provincial ***** with newly found visions of dating odessa’s new Donald trump.
Odessa can be categorized in the following fashion, the ‘Tourist’ clubs and ‘Non Tourist’ clubs. You can score in both, but what works in one may not work in the other. Sex on a first night is overall difficult. At this point, you will have easier time scoring the first night in a college bar in the States. The problem is that in Odessa, the girls get fucked so much by so many dudes that at the very least they want to be assured they get a meal out of a fuck, a night out, etc.
If you are lucky to score a first nighter, it will usually be with a visiting student from one of the surrounding shitholes or 22 year old designer from Moscow visitng her cousin. The point is, that with the locals who are out there daily, weekly and monthly it is unlikely you will get laid THAT particular night for a variety of reasons. So, if you know this information, you can use it to imiprovie your odds. When meeting girls, if in regular life in a nightclubt, lounge whatever one of the first questions will be where are they from. Now in most cities the answer would obviously be that they are from that city, but one that that will surprise anyone that lives here is how many out of towners are here constantly god knows why.
Some very quick tips and if I have more time I will add to it. When approaching a girl in Odessa, whatever your opener is, assess the situation soberly right away. Say to yourself is this girl at all genuinely interested or is this a waste of time. Also, know exactly that you may have to simply settle for a phone number at any point, so anytime in the conversation say that them you gotta run but would like to chat some more. Like Lukasek said you will never be refused a ‘mobilka’ here.
All in all, after you are seeing girls on the 2nd date, and they are under impression that you are constantly in Odessa for some business reasons your odds of getting laid that night are about 90%. They can be higher for some and lower for others but I am just talking about personal perspective with the benefit of connections and speaking the language. There are alwys going to be cases of girls still going to their own homes but but that’s just unavoidable. Also, when I say 2nd date that does not count their friends going out with yours.
In total, I personally know about 7 expats living in Odessa full time at this time. Of course there are hundreds more but I am talking about people I have gotten to know and would call more of friends than aquintances. I have been visited by friends from US, London and Moscow. I can say unequivocally that if you are into the best white women this planet Odessa is one of the top contenders. First thing I told all my friends is to recalibrate their standards as soon as they land in Odessa. Whatever you considered an 8 in your country will be a weak 6 in Odessa. When I read amistads point about his friend not being able to rate his girl this is what came to mind. This fact though is not so evident in the cold months. The city is still very nice in the cold months, much fewer tourists but in the summer the clothing girls are wearing is a sight men must see before they die. I know this sounds like I may be sugarcoating it but if you ever visit in July or August you will know for yourself.
EDITOR'S NOTE: I certainly hope that the author or somebody else will post a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please Click Here (http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?) for more information.
Rodney Munch
01-23-07, 05:06
There are also a number of downsides of living there. The packages take forever to get to you or sometimes not at all. You can be faced with extreme poverty at any particular time, even when completely unexpected. You must be street savy and be aware of your surroundings when walking at night. Some of the issues are the roaming gypsies in some parts who will try to get you get a reading or simply donate, do not do this for any reason as it will expose where yyou keep your wallet and it will make you a target from that point on. There are also packs of roaming dogs everywhere in the city. I believe they passed a law that the dogs will no longer be killed and are rather caught, stereilized and released. Otheriwse, there are also the ongoing ‘document checks’ by the local police in order to extract a small bribe. If you truly do not have the documents required, which are a photocopy of your passport and the customs colorful card you used to enter you should NEVER pay more than $20 as absolute max to get out of it. When speaking to the police, say very confidently that you are a tourist visiting Odessa with a cruise ship and your group will search for you if you are missing. The main thing is that the police will not take any foreigners to jail for not h avinng documents. They try to indimidate you into paying to get out, so act cool, pay of a fee you feel is fair, which is no more than $20 and you will not see them again. This is an unfortunate fact about this city and places like Moscow where cops make a living on this alone. To avoid it, just make two photocopies of both items and carry them with you at all times. Odds of being stopped are still fairly low, always walk with confidence, like you know where you are going and don’t be afraid to stare the police right into their eyes.
If you do choose to come here, rent an apartment. There are decent hotels in the center but their price does not match what you are getting. All my friends who have visited all stayed at apartments without any glitches. There may be occasional power outages whever you are here but typically the power goes off for 30 mins to 2 hours. I'm not sure if the hotels have electrical generators but that’s about the only thing I would say they may be better for. Second item is that if you are staying at a hotel, it makes it very difficult to bullshit the girls into thinking you are in Odessa ‘on business’ with many future visits or even staying indefinitely. Thhe cost will vary but if you come for a short stay you can get something nice and central for around $60 a night. If you can splurge, you can get something very special for $100 a night. If you live here, you can consider buying but the prices right now are sky high. For long term rent you can find a nice place for about $700 and up which will easily impess a vast majority of girls who will have had the pleasure to see it. If anyone wants a name of the company whose owner I am a personal friend of please pm me. Most of the people who came to visit me used his firm for apartments and I have not heard any real complaints unlike some other firms.
Parents of my high school friend (immigrant from the 70s who actually spoke so highly of Odessa that it made me curious to visit) came to visit Odessa in the late summer and used the Odess executive suits firm. Granted they were elderly people who probably complain for a living these days but they were bitching about the cost and how unhappy they were with a number of blantant lies that company made. My friend had to buy them a cell phone to use while there since their room did not even have a phone. Now I consider myself a reasonable person but I would say if you are in the hotel business one of the first things you should make sure of is that each one of your rooms has a phone installed. This may not be so important but when my friend was booking the room for his parents he did so because it allowed them to call US for a small extra fee unlimited per day. So not only they couldn’t call US, they did not even have the equipment that’s required to do that. I met them at the airport, so when we found this out and went to talk to a manager, a woman told us that yes that room did not have a phone but in return we were getting free internet. I explained that these people do not use the internet and don’t care about it and just want some price discount for which they just said that the internet and the fact it was summer and no other rooms were available there was nothing that could be done. Either way, in contrast to what you can get for the same money in the way of private flats and their benefit with the dyevs of Odessa will go a long way.
In terms of p4p scene there are few options. Through the website mentioned before, you can build a contact list with very fresh and not so fresh pros who will gladly visit you for about $50 per visit. Alternatively you can also ‘date’ some student and after spending a few nights with her simply offer a compensation for her visits whenever you desire. This way you do not feel guilty sending a horny sms at 2am on a Thursday evening. Another option is places like the port, Hotel Odessa, irish pub, etc. If you look hard enough, you will see pros lurking in these places. They can also hang at places like Ibiza and Itaka during the summer, although it is not as easy to see who they are. These girls prey on westerners and will quoet high rates. From what I have seen, there are few above 7 or 8s in this category. Additional option is the numerous banya’s in this city. There are a few major ones around the center, that have inhouse girls with varying costs. This option is great early in the week with a few friends since you can rent out an entire spa for about 20 usd per hour and the girls will usually be 80 on top of that. So 100 for the entire place with a girl. Final option is to use a few published ‘escort’ services out there. There is 2 websites that I am aware of, both have been posted on this forum. There is also a section in www.makler. Md website which is called like ‘personal entertainment’ in Odessa section, must read in Russian which has private listings from escorts, although it is not that many.
The p4p scene needs to be further developed here but I am not sure it will ever live up to the standards Kiev and Moscow have to offer. The problem is what Amistaad mentioned, while the city is fairly large in size and population you do run into the same people constantly. This is the main reasons girls don’t want to sometimes seen with foreigners, or be walking into hotels or things of that nature because they are afraid their friends/mothers/cousins/grandmas will see them and they will remain the *****s they are in their minds for the rest of their lives. I have been in many situations being out with a hottie running into a girl that I had in my bed just a few nigihts prior but never encountered any incident at all. In fact, I would say girls in Odessa in my experience at far and away the most experienced and most seasoned when it comes to being screwed and cheated by men. This is probably the primary explanation of why they try to play the game for all its got, trying to get dinners, entrances to clubs, etc. In my experience the girls, when they see you with another cutie, will pretend not to know who you are and walk pass you. Of course, it is unlikely they will want to see you again, although with a little damage control I have gotten pass that item a number of times saying I was simply out with my friends’s girlfriend or some other ridiculous bullshit which the girls have no choice but to believe.
It may not appear so on the surface, but getting laid in Odessa (and most of Ukraine) is really a basic function of math. Without a doubt, Odessa simply has MORE women than men. Right now, CIA guidebook pegs that there is https: //www.cia. Gov/cia/publications/factbook/geos/up.html
A 15-64 years: 0. 92 male (s)/female ratio in Ukraine. So this is saying that rougly for every 9 men there are 10 women. This number is actually more like 8 to 10 in Odessa because of the number of guys which died due to drug / alcohol abuse a few years ago when there was an epidemic here. Then from the 8 guys, you can be assure about half of them are into getting loaded every night and the remaining 4 guys, the ones that actually have some money, etc have very little interest in settling down usually choosing to burn through women like most of us go through socks. So, even if you will argue I am wrong about my break down (and I'm not) the fact there are 9 men to 10 women is of huge significant. It simply means that there are not enough guys for all the girls out there even if all the men are perfect, have money, don’t have substance absuse problems and are interested in providing the lifestyle most of these girls seek. Anyway, you get my point. This is a longer post than I would have liked and in the future hopefully I’ll have some time to post Do’s an Don’t on talking to the Russian dyevs which may help some of the first time visitors. Meanwhile, enjoy this picture taken at one of odessa’s nightclubs.
P. S I am back in Odessa this summer, if anyone wants to hook up for some arcadia action please pm me.
EDITOR'S NOTE: I certainly hope that the author or somebody else will post a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please Click Here (http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?) for more information.
Felix Nordic
01-23-07, 20:49
Very good and informative threads! This is what many veterans of the East Europan campaign claims; To be there short term is going to be disappointing a lot of times. With russian language and longer stays, along with skills, you can score!
Amistaad! Very well written dummy guide for Odessan girls and EE girls in general! :)
Thanks for taking your time with these reports,
Felix
Doctor_Skank
01-23-07, 22:57
Wow, great reports Rodney M!
By now there are some really fantastic reports on Odessa from a lot of guys in the R-o-D section (no pun intended)... love it or hate it, Odessa really is something special.
One point Rod-M touched on that I feel shouldn't be underemphasized... even though I know most of us non-ODS residents go there to chase women and get laid... but when you are in Odessa, this shouldn't be the only thing on your mind. I know that might sound stupid (or impossible) considering all the eye candy around, but I have always felt really at ease and happy in Odessa just lounging around during the day and not running from one date to the next.
Odessa has a summer lounge factor of 10. Drinking breakfast cappucino at 1 in the afternoon, nursing a hangover in the late afternoon sipping cheap and tasty local "champagne" on the beach, drinking an early evening beer before taking a cat nap and heading out to the Arkadia clubs around midnight on a gorgeous summer night...
...can't wait to get back!
Hey man,
Something wrong with your pm? I tried to pm you, but it didn't go through. From your post, it seems that you are pm-able but doesn't work
EROS75,
You are dead wrong. Judging by your past posts regarding Odessa...and mongering in general, it doesn't surprise me.
First of all, OES is still operational. Indeed, they are adding more apartments, as well as a cafe where the office had been. The new cafe will be run by the same folks who manage Zara's.
As for being a bunch of amateurs: I know Anton and CA Traveler quite well. Both set up a professional operation before selling their shares in the business to another partner. In the case of CA Traveler, he went back home to focus on other business ventures and to be with his wife. If you ever met his wife, you would know why.
As for Anton, he is in Odessa directing an import-export business.
According to Anton 98% of mongers score in Odessa.....that's why his partner CA Traveler went back to his ex-wife..that makes sense lol
"OES is this, OES is that" said the ads...in one word OES is a paradise on earth.....they shut it down...again that makes sense lol
This happens only to a bunch of amateurs who don't know shit about accomodation business..
You see CA Traveler I don't need Lukasek's hand to predict your business won't last...
Eros
I was asked by a couple of people as to what the attitude of girls here towards non caucasians is.
As a rule, I feel that girls here are most comfortable with caucasians.
A few things need to be noted. Close to Odessa (about a 5 dollar taxi ride from the center), there is the 7 kilometer market. From what I hear, this is the biggest open market in all of CIS. I visited the place, and the place is truly monstrous with containers and containers of everything that you can ever dream of. (containers=the shipping containers that you see on cargo ships. They sell merchandise straight out of these containers in the 7km market). Now, people of all conceivable nationalities work here. There are Turks and Chinese and Pakistanis and Indians and Syrians - you name it.
Now, when a girl in Odessa comes across any non-white foreigner, she ends up thinking that it might be one of these people working at the market, basically someone who is out here in Odessa from one of the countries that she might not view as a favorable destination to end up in. Especially, I get the feeling that a lot of girls are particularly xenophonic against Turks and middle easterns from Saudi Arabia. They seem to think that they are going to take them back and sell them there or some such stupid notion.
A few turkish friends of mine, who have been here in Ukraine for 4-5 years now tell me that they find Odessa really really hard to score in because of this attitude of girls. (They are doing great in Kiev though)
Having said that, I am not caucasian, and I still do pretty well with girls out here. There is a subtle thing which has to be seen to be believed. When you cold approach a girl out here and she gives off the vibe that she's not interested in talking and keeps on walking, DO NOT QUIT talking to her. Keep on talking as if nothing has happened, even if you have to walk faster to pace her. This is completely counter intuitive coming from the US or any other western country, where we usually give up as soon as the girl brushes us aside. Girls out here will NEVER raise their voice or say something like "I told you not to talk to me" so keep on going for it. Even when your entire organism is telling you that you should walk away from her, just try to keep on talking for two extra minutes- ask her where the opera house is, or what's her favorite opera, or what club is the best on a wednesday night or whatever, but just keep on going. There is NO way, you can get the import of what I am saying out here unless you see it in action.
Basically, when your western-calibrated-self tells you to quit, tell it to go to hell and keep on talking to the girl for a few more minutes. You'll be surprised how the girls open up and start talking within a few minutes. And once they do that, you can do what I suggested in my previous post and go from there. Again, whether you are African American or Turkish or Pakistani or whatever, just project yourself strongly and congruently and go from there. There is not much you can do about your skin color- but how you project yourself is completely in your control. If you honestly believe that you are the ultimate prize for the girl in front of you, that vibe will rub off on her too, and nothing else will matter.
EDITOR'S NOTE: I certainly hope that the author or somebody else will post a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please Click Here (http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?) for more information.
DO NOT QUIT talking to her. Keep on talking as if nothing has happened, even if you have to walk faster
Hey great...but between mongers who go to Russia or Ukraine who plan to have to run close a woman to start a conversation with them?
What you said explain very well the attitude of odessan girls, cause even in my sex prison at home, I can start a conversation with a girl without the need to walk close her for half center of the city.
But if for you is a normal way to know a regular girl in east europe, so please... in your next travel...do not forget your sporting shoes...or you will not able to date anybody... LOL!
ERO75...blah, blah, blah
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
EROS75,
You are dead right. Judging by my past and future posts regarding Odessa...and mongering in general, I'm still jerking off at home.
First of all, OES is still operational. Indeed, they are adding more rotten apartments, as well as a cafe machine second hand in each apartment. The new cafe will be run by the same folks who manage Zara's circus.
As for being a bunch of amateurs: I know Anton and CA Traveler quite well as I'm an amateur myself. Both set up a professional operation called "Delta Force" in Vietnam before selling their shares in the business to another partner. In the case of CA Traveler, he went back home to focus on other business ventures and to be with his wife. If you ever met his wife, you would run away.
As for Anton, he is in Odessa directing an import-export monkey business.
Western, Eastern or Middle - sounds a tad bit desperate to me. Girls in Odessa find that umm, display of manliness attractive? Or are girls in such limited supply in Odessa you have to run after them? Geez, I'm glad I am in Kiev.
Non white guys running after girls in Odessa for a date in public sounds like a good way for really bad things to start happening.
I was asked by a couple of people as to what the attitude of girls here towards non caucasians is.
As a rule, I feel that girls here are most comfortable with caucasians.
EDITOR'S NOTE: I certainly hope that the author or somebody else will post a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please Click Here (http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?) for more information.
In a related question, since the Ukraine is the land of the giants with most women averaging at least 5 feet 7", what can a dwarf (I'm 5 Foot 4") like me expect ??
Doctor_Skank
01-25-07, 21:02
Non white guys running after girls in Odessa for a date in public sounds like a good way for really bad things to start happening.
Sounds more like reinforcing every negative stereotype girls have about non-white foreigners in the first place. I guess if it works more power to those who do it, but you won't catch Doc Skank making an ass out of himself acting like a bazaar tout trying to sell himself on Deribasovskaya. (I have many other ways of making an ass out of myself) :)
Hot Daddy43
01-29-07, 19:08
Hi,,
Here is my report about Odessa. I was in O for Xmas hollidays and actually I loved Ods, much. Thats a really treasure of the world, a lot of real pretty and funny girl. Well, I was in Ods not really for bussiness, but for rest. I wanted to reach a poor soul relaxing. And I was looked for good community, honest smiles and for sure safe sex:) first of all I gone to Deribasovskaya str to find smbd, who can satisfy my request. But actually all girls I loved were busy (with bfs) or with many other girls just walking. I met mamasan Dina. Ohhhh that was really terrible! I could believe my eyes! Shes a crazy! Really crazy. She almost fucked all my brains out! But she had a few girls. Sympatic girls with average fugure (two blonde and 1 red hair). When Dina shutted up only for a monet, I had a chance to pick up a girls. Well I tookk 2 girls (one blond and one red hair) for 50 $ each, but I had to pay 100 more for Dina mamasan (like 50 and 50 for each girl). Girls could speak english (just like 5 words: Hello,,, give me money, no BJ, no anal, don't touch! ) heh. Well sex was bad. Really bad. They very in hurry, alaways speaked between each other. Mamasan Dina called him 5 times per a hour!
No BJ! No good kisses! No passion! Like a robots! Better I gone to sex shop and bought a sex-doll for fuck! I was really dissapointed! I wanted to complain to Dina, but she just Fuck me off!
I thought: oh yessss. Very good servise ion Odessaa. I was very very very upset. And gone sleep in that mood.
Next day I gone to Irish Pab on Deribasovskaya str. And I have met there American guy. Very friendly! We had a very good time together! He told me about Ods and girls, a lot of stories like mine. And he gave me a few numbers of girls with really good servise and pretty looking. This way I have met Suzy. A 22yo slim very pretty girl with brown hair and very beautifull green-blue eyes. She have an awesome body, very tight and nice tits and very passionate sex! I was in heaven! She rocked my world! And all this only for 100$ per hour, but for suure she cost much much more! Also she have a good friend Alexandra, which she adviced to try to me. Alexandra is 19yo slim longhaired blonde girl with winderfull blue eye. I have never seen such a deep and beautifull eyes before. She looked at me with a tenderness. I almost fall in love with her! He he In sex shes also very passionated and very soft at one time. She gave me a great BJ and a great pleasure in bed! I was really satisfied!
So guys, if you are looking for good servise and kind girls, don't play with your fortune, choose the best! Don't be as fool, as I was when gone to deribasovskaya and met Dina!
Here is numbers of Suzy and Alexandra: +380677098365, +380972700106
I tried them for 3 and 4 times each and I was not looked for something other.
So, guys, enjoy!
Rodney Munch
01-30-07, 03:49
Hey man,
Something wrong with your pm? I tried to pm you, but it didn't go through. From your post, it seems that you are pm-able but doesn't workAmistaad,
I am actually not PM able on this forum but I am PM able on another 'similar' forum. I have posted the same exact post there as well so pls get in touch.
And now ladies and gentelman some pictures of ODS girls from a new nightclub. Ranging from provincial sluts to borderline models.
Explorer69
01-30-07, 11:58
And now ladies and gentelman some pictures of ODS girls from a new nightclub. Ranging from provincial sluts to borderline models.New nightclub? Topless? Is it a strip club?
Rodney Munch
02-01-07, 04:30
The pictures are mostly of dancers at a new 'mega club' in odessa. It is not a strip club, just a regular nightclub but really really huge. As far as I saw, there are 2 topless girls there on most evening. The club is called Euro Party Club and is just off deribasovskaya street not from from the garden there in the middle. Lots of hot women in this place, pretty easy to score if you know what you are doing.
Odessa Man
02-03-07, 14:35
Odessa has throughout its history been a melting pot of a great many different Nationalities and at times the town has even been a safe refuge for those fleeing persecution in their homelands, making the region the most racially tolerant in Ukraine. Amongst the towns churches are the Synagogue and Mosque on Rishelyevskaya St. With the integration of immigrants from particularily Italy, Bulgaria, Romania, Georgia, Israel and to a significant extent Greece many of the towns people have a slightly darker look with black hair and brown eyes. In the three years that I have lived here I have become aware of an increased influx of Turks and Arabs, attracted by the business opportuniities this Port Town offers and perhaps even by the long legged, blue eyed, Slavic Beauties.
As a white guy I don’t wish to suggest that I completely understand racism, but what I can say is that the handfull of non white clients who have stayed with Odessarentaflat have reported mixed success with the opposite sex (no different from the white guys) and the few Turkish guys that I am acquainted with who live here are quite content and report good success with the ladies.
Street Sleuth
02-03-07, 19:02
i've got to note some dissapointment:
let's leave the race issues for some other forum. posters are off-base attacking amistad - he's not what you may be thinking. i know him well - very well behaved, and amazingly succesful with the women, much more so than myself (for this reason, and for this reason only, he's a total bastard).
as for 'american guy', and his friends/aliases - the problem with this guy is not whatever origins he may or may not be from, but with the fact that he poses as a 'friend' in order to squeeze money out of otherwise generous foreign mongers.
before you start going off on me - i am about 6th or 7th generation white american - so, unless you can prove your ancestors sailed the mayflower, back-off. i left the states half because of the women, half because i got tired of grossly overweight, selfish, ignorant people who think eating fried chicken is a profession.
oh - and what's up with the talk of 'cute boys for the evening'?!?! - (i think on the kiev board). now there's something to get in a huff about! could we please keep this board non-****philic at the least - and heterosexual, if it isn't too much to ask.
Spent 5 nights in Odessa at New Year. Used Odessarentaflat.com which i found on this site. The service was great - other companies wanted to charge me ridiculous mark ups on these dates but straight away Matt quoted me a normal rate and answered all my mails and queries efficiently. His driver was great too and to give an example of that necessary personal touch - i used another company in the summer who took 3 days to provide us with a second key - with Odessarenataflat - my then girlfriend got one on arrival day. All the girls that visited me commented on what a nice place i had.
New Yeas Day my girl walked out so in need of company i resorted to Flirt.ru and ISG - my first visitor was 26 so she said but looked more like 46 - after 30 minutes and $70 i sent her home and was going to giving up on mongering.
But then read about Sasha on this site and next afternoon she came round - it was $100/hour but she stayed for over 2 hours - extremely nice girl, laid back beauty - who told me she had a very strong pussy from cycling 3 hours a day around town for fitness - she was right.
In the evening i rang Sveta - a flirt.ru babe - she again quoted 100$/hour and turned up quite merry after a Xmas drinks outing with her stripper friends. She was a 5ft Marilyn Monroe lookalike - body to die for, great tits, great ass, great smile. Had 3 and half hours of fun and laughter.
My 2nd visit to Odessa showed me that its a challenge to pull a freebie and get laid unless you are out there for a lenth of time. Paid sex is the easiest option. The women are streetwise and know how to tease.
EDITOR'S NOTE: I certainly hope that the author or somebody else will post a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please Click Here (http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?) for more information.
Street Sleuth
02-04-07, 13:59
Since it appears there are some administrators of the daily rental apartments on this board, I have a question/observation:
I've stayed in 3 daily rental apartments in Eastern Europe lately - the first, no problems. The second - I got robbed of laptop computer/camera - no signs of break-in. The third - just last night - got a phone call at 5 am (landline), followed by doorbell ringing shortly later (I was too hard asleep to answer the phone or the door), followed by someone with keys trying to open the door (they couldn't, as I had my key in the lock from the inside, which blocks keys from the other side....).
The long and short is - it seems like a real problem that there are thieves who get keys to these apartments (not too tough to do - rent them for a day, make copies....), then stake the places out. $50 - $80 rent for the keys, followed by $1,000+ in electronics - a worthwhile 'investment'.
How do you deal with this?
I'll keep staying in these apartments, as they are still the best deal, and I have nothing of value left to steal anyway :(, but would like to know how to be more secure in the future - other than just hiding valuables (which I failed to do....).
Street Sleuth
02-04-07, 21:00
I jumped the gun on suspecting a thief on last nights incident - turns out it was just a grumpy old neighbor, who came to gripe about how I came stumbling home at 4 am, and cooked Pelmeni (apparently, the fumes from the cooking woke her up).
Doesn't change the reality of the computer/camera having been stolen, though.
Explorer69
02-05-07, 21:41
I tried to PM you but it did not work.
Do you have any contact information for Sveta? I will be in Odessa in 10 days.
Infinity99
02-06-07, 05:33
Doesn't change the reality of the computer/camera having been stolen, though.Hello,
Its my first post on this board since I usually just entertain myself reading but since this has now ventured right into my area of expertise I think I will make some comments.
First, I am an American, born and raised in Odessa who owns and operates apartment accommodation businesses in both Kiev and Odessa. I have done so for the last 3 years, quiet sucessfully. Our clients include mainly westerners and to some extent new russians. If anyone has a strong interest on what my sites are I would be happy to post them in the classifieds section but they have been mentioned on pretty much every discussion site by numerous satisfied clients ranging from sex boards to russian women discussions to regular tourist boards. My belief in business is to let others advertise it for you, I just concern myself with providing a quality product and service, while the rest gets taken care of on its own.
Just to answer the question above, "how to prevent your stuff from being stolen" the answer is simple - use a reputable rental agency! These types of thefts can happen in 1 of 2 ways. Either by the rental agency themselves, which is rare since the reputational loss to them could be much greater than the small financial gain from the items. Or in more frequent cases by the actual owner/landlord of the apartment. I can tell you that with our business, we only deal with self owned apartments or landlords that own multiple units and have rented out their apartments to foreigners for many years. They have no need to steal as they average about $200 - $500 in pure rental income per day.
In terms of your comment about keys - I can tell you that in Ukraine, it is very rare we will actually rent an apartment for only 1 day. Further, the keys if you ever saw them in this part of the world are actually designed in such a way that it is impossible to duplicate them. Not all, but vast majority. Thus, even if one has pocession of it, in 90% of cases they wont be able to duplicate it. All in all, apartments vs. hotel in regards to theft pale. I can tell you personally about 10 different cases of various Hotels in Odessa who routinely steal from their tenants. This includes maid service going all the way up to managerial workers. This problem isn't as bad as it used to be but still the odds of hotel room theft are much greater as more people are able to access the room. In contrast, in all the years we have been operating we have never had any of our clients items stolen, except for one case where one of them had the stupidity to fall asleep with a port hooker in his apartment and woke up only to find her and his laptop gone. Those things we can't prevent :-)
while we are on this topic, here is a funny article about that from a moscow english paper: http://www.exile.ru/2006-November-17/the_ho_with_the_heart_of_gold.html
EDITOR'S NOTE: I certainly hope that the author or somebody else will post a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please Click Here (http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?) for more information.
First before I load up on the napalm let me tell you a little bit about myself and my activities in the Ukraine; Kiev in particular. I am a single male in my late 30’s never been married. Grew up in a white bread neighborhood in the US. I am moderately successful in my business activities, which allows me to travel freely to anywhere in the world for 1/3 of the year. I lived in Europe for 3 years and SE Asia for 1.5 years during my 20’s, all for work. I currently travel to Kiev often, mostly for serial dating and the occasional pro or semi pro – which is basically what I do in the US too. ;)
First off there is nothing wrong with America or American women. It is very easy to have a relationship (or sex) with an American woman who is as good looking as anything that anyone has fucked in any Eastern European country. The advantage that American women have is that they can still be extremely hot into their 40’s. Or as I like to explain it, a lot of America man (insert another nationality here) come here saying, ‘oh, American women are so horrible, blah, blah, blah’. When the truth is it are American women that find them somewhat lacking. The two advantages that I see in the FSU are that girls are generally slender and they dress to impress. Sure there are a lot of obese people in the US (#1 in the world), if you don’t like that move to a somewhat more cosmopolitan area. I can only assume from your critique Street, that you are a cut and buff twenty something Adonis. Not the over 50, overweight, dumpy, cheap American sexpat you generally hear this argument from.
As far as the whole race thing goes. Momma told me to never stereotype, but hey there is a reason why there are stereotypes. And when people start reinforcing that behavior by their actions well…
Which brings me to the section where people are really going to start throwing the bricks at me. What is up with you guys and all these insipid games you play to get laid? Don’t you have any self respect at all? Made up excuses to get girls back to your apartments? Lies of a better life? All that just to get a little pussy? Tell you what guys – why don’t you just get a job, go to River Palace and pay for it – well, that’s if you want to fork over the big $8 fee to get into the disco, it is a little more self respecting.
Street as far as you getting robbed, if you aren’t a naïve fellow from the sticks then there is this thing called Karma, learn it, love it. Deal with reputable people and be a reputable person and you will find these things are less likely to happen to you. $80/night is more then enough to get you a western remodel apartment in Kiev center with a well known agency – which I am sure will be the most expensive place you have gone during your little adventure.
And The Connection lay off of Felix a little bit. He sounds like a guy who got fucked over hard by some scammers and is still feeling it.
Infinity, of course reputable agencies in Kiev and Odessa don't have to steal - they are already raking their clients over the coals with obscene rates and a lack of service. I don't know about your apartment agency but 99.9% of them don't use lock/keys that are hard to duplicate due to the nature of the business (client often lose keys). If you'd like we can meet at one of your apartments in Kiev, give me the keys and let me know how many copies you'd like by the end of the day. However I do agree with you, this is a very unlikely scam. Most get robbed due to the unsavory characters they invite into their apartment - see my comments above.
Street Sleuth
02-06-07, 14:24
Infinity,
Thanks for your response.
In 2 out of 3 cases (and these are just recent cases), I had no problem at all. The one case was actually with a 'chasni dom' - a single house, not an apartment. And the key was a very simple one (although in the other two apartments they were indeed complex keys - but, in my experience, almost any key can be copied....). It was stupid of me to stay there - it was too easy for a theft to occur, and I knew it.
As for apartments being safer than hotels - I definitely agree with that. I wouldn't leave anything of value in a hotel room in Eastern Europe.
Like I said, I'll keep using the apartments, just looking for experienced advice...
Street Sleuth
02-06-07, 14:33
Cruiser,
You go from advocating an $80/night apartment in Kiev, to bashing the guy from Odessa that the Kiev/Odessa apartments are a ripoff?
Karma? Give me a break. So, if you're a decent person, and you stumble around Baghdad, only talking to 'reputable' people, karma will save you? For having travelled so far and wide, your mentality is still rather naive. Whoever stole the computer could have cared less how reputable the owner was - most thieves really don't think in those terms.
Explorer69
02-06-07, 15:30
Hello,
Its my first post on this board since I usually just entertain myself reading but since this has now ventured right into my area of expertise I think I will make some comments.I would like contact with you, but it seems that a PM is not possible? How can we do it? I am in Odessa in a week and would like to meet for possible business.
Street Sleuth
02-06-07, 15:35
Cruiser,
I can tell you were a bit erked at my earlier post, so I just need to chime in again, as it always annoys me when someone claims to disagree with me, even when they effectively agree:
1) Fried Chicken - my comment regarding fried chicken wasn't referring to overweight American women - it was referring to another group of people, perhaps better expressed by saying, "folks who think collecting welfare checks is a profession". Before you start blasting me for being a hypocrit, as one might very well construe some racism in that remark, I never said I didn't have a racist bone in my body - I was only stating that Amistad didn't fit the profile.
2) American Women - I have no particular gripe about American women - again, I wasn't clear enough, and could have been misconstrued - I came to Eastern Europe because of the Eastern European women - with some thought, however, the main benefit of Eastern Europe isn't so much the women - there are plenty of hot women in the U.S, and plenty of over-weight ugly women in EE. But for every hot girl in the US, there are 5 'reputable', hard-working, succesful, decent guys chasing her. In EE, for every hot girl, there are 5 alcoholics that would gladly beat her at random. Simply put - the benefit in EE isn't so much the women, but the lack of competition for them.
The 'supply' of hot women is about equal (US vs EE), the 'demand' from decent guys is much lower in EE - it all comes down to simple economics.
As for American women staying hot into their 40's, I recently made the same case on another board (a guy was asking about how Slavic women age - my response being that American/Northern European women generally age better than Slavic women).
If I had to rate women world-wide, I'd say the most ideal women are the Scandinavians - hot (into their 50's, in many cases), slim, educated, interesting - the problem being, Scandinavian men aren't exactly shlumps themselves....
I'm not fat (though I've chubbed up a bit as I've been bumping around, and got out of routine of going to a gym), not 50, and, like you, travel around a good bit partly for entrepreneurial reasons, mostly for adventures.
Too bad you had to get in a huff with me, we could have met up for a drink.
Street Sleuth
02-06-07, 15:59
Just another thought Cruiser,
The problem I had with your original post is that you were jumping to conclusions about someone who you really don't know.
It occurs to me you did the same again with me - I'm not on a little 'sexpat' tour. I've been living in and out of Western and Eastern Europe for roughly 10 years. I speak fluent French, Spanish, and decent Russian (the grammar is much trickier, so it takes more time to master).
Odessa Man
02-06-07, 17:05
In addition to the advise already offered about renting an apartment in Odessa, or anywhere in the FSU for that matter, it is worth noting that a few companies (a tiny minority it has to be said)offer apartments with safes, where valuables may be stored.Many of odessarentaflats own units have these.A new occupant can simply set his own personal combination and store his valuables in the knowledge that they are completely secure.
It is important to keep a sense of perspective about this.If you deal with a reputable company and really just use your common sense, it is highly unlikely that you will encounter a problem.I normally advise my clients to take a minimum of cash with them and to use the many user friendly ATM machines dotted throughout the town.
Infinity99
02-07-07, 02:56
Just a few comments about keys – some apartments have simple keys, but most have complex keys which, while not impossible to duplicate are fairly complex to duplicate. Clients do not lose keys as much as you would think and when they do, they are almost always asked to pay for a new lock which is about $50 - $75. The locks get replaced, and the owner receives 5 fresh new keys. I would be happy to settle you into one of our flats in Kiev/Odessa, give you a key and see how many duplicates you’ll produce. Unless you have some serious connections, you will produce zero by the end of the day.
Explorer
If my memory serves me right, my site has been mentioned on this board in a positive regard by at least 10 different people, a number of which I know personally. If you want to find me simply type in ‘Odessa apts’ in google and the first company that will come up will be mine. Via email in contacts page you can get in touch with me. In fact, in addition to board members here it has also been mentioned in UK guardian, fashion TV, some German driving magazine, lonely planet, MTV Europe, and probably some others which I am not even aware of. However, I must warn everyone, I do not have any contacts for pros in Odessa at all. Never had to pay for it there. I am always happy to share a beer with anyone visiting Ukraine, granted if I am around and have free time. During the summer time, some very privileged clients/friends even get tours of Arkadia by me but that is reserved for the select few (I don’t mean privileged from the $ standpoint).
The 'supply' of hot women is about equal (US vs EE)What have you been smoking and where can I get some? You must be joking with that comment. I have spent a number of years in NYC, as well as Miami and LA to some extent, which are about the only 3 cities in US that come somewhat close to EE when it comes to quality of women. Let’s first also define what EE includes. Are you talking about places like Slovenia, Slovakia, Albania, Hungary? If so, then once you add those beasts to the Russian mix then yes, the ratio is somewhat similar, but still off. If you are comparing EE in the sense that you are talking about Russia / Ukraine / Belarus then the number of hot girls there vs. US is probably roughly 10 to 1. Have you walked on the streets of pretty much any Northern American city and ever seen more than 1 truly attractive woman in the span of 10 minutes? I haven’t. Even in the cosmopolitan bowels of NYC, most of the hot women come associated with about 10 ugly friends. For every 1 hot one, you get about 9 fat, busted up girls. You go to a place like Kentucky and that ratio is 1 to 90. You get the point and I am sorry in advance if anyone is from Kentucky. In Ukraine/Russia, it is difficult to walk 10 meters without bumping into a beauty. Dress styles aside, which are also a factor in appearance, women are simply more beautiful and slender in this part of the world, there is no way to deny it. Of course, what you say about lack of men is also true, but that doesn’t take away from the pure fact that there is a higher density of attractive white women in Russia/Ukraine than any other country I can think of.
Street, you handle that well, Bravo.
Infinity, I have been in Kiev for the last 6 weeks. I'm not interested in renting an apartment from you unless you can provide me a US apartment at US rates (NYC for example) - nevermind a class A apartment at suburban US rates. But if you want I'd be more then happy to meet you at one of your apartments in Kiev. You can lock/unlock the door give me the key and tell me how many keys you would like by the end of the day.
EE women - As I stated before the major difference between EE and US woman is that they are generally slender and dress to impress. Unlike in the US where it is 'ok' to be over weight in the FSU if you are a young girl and over weight most people think there is something seriously wrong with you. And to be honest, the longer I keep coming to FSU the less and less I get impressed with the girls. For example, I got dragged to McDonalds the other day and the scene was typical for any fast food place I've been to in the US - with the exception of no minorities and all the people speaking Russian. ;) This isn't meant for anyone in particular but men who come to the FSU for the express purpose of girls have generally lost their mojo at home - that is if they ever had any.
Bacon Butty
02-07-07, 15:14
I've just read all 48 pages of this thread after hearing about this site on another forum. I've been looking at going to Odessa for quite a while now but just haven't been able to find this level of information anywhere before. I am looking for a wingman or even any other traveller planning to go there this year in early July. I'm 22 and wear Armani, Prada etc like the local *****s want to con you into buying and target wearers of. Am fairly good looking and use the gym a few days a week. Would be happy to hang out with anyone who knows the area well and wants some good nights out in clubs. I speak no Russian but am intelligent and can learn the basics quickly. Am after either paid or free girls. I really dislike Western women but love EEs. Am experianced in the Prague scene but haven't ventured anywhere too exciting yet. If anyone wants to meet up in early you can contact me at rock_of_gibraltarathotmail. Co. Uk. I'd like to prebook an apartment from CA_T but sadly don't have a VISA or Mastercard right now to do that. Odessa sounds like my kind of town though kind of like Ibiza which I know well but with hot EE chicks rather than fat Western girls. I'll follow this thread closely and am definately going in the summer during my 3 weeks off. Sadly I cannot go before due to having a career and holiday being hard to organise. Am pretty excited about the games the local girls play and trying to outdo them and find a way to conquer them through their, aterialistic nature. Look forward to hearing from anyone.
Ed
Street Sleuth
02-07-07, 16:56
Cruiser....glad you handled my response well also...
Infinity: I stand by my comments. Yes, in the centers of Odessa/Kiev/St. Petersburg/Moscow you will see a very high ratio of hot girls - but go outside these areas, and the ratio slides fast. If you go to rural areas, you will have a real rough time finding hot girls at all (I've travelled quite a bit in Russia, Ukraine, as well as rest of EE...and no, I didn't mean to include Central Europe, which is another story altogether). The reason is, most hot girls gravitate to the major urban centers - this is true worldwide, but exponentially true in these parts, I've found.
Girls definitely dress to impress in EE, but this is of little value, as far as I am concerned - most men ultimately are concerned with what is underneath...and that quality isn't necessarily better here than in the US - its just easier to obtain. If you go out to bars/clubs in New York, Miami, Chicago, Washington DC, LA, Houston, etc, etc, you will find a lot of hot girls - every bit as hot as the girls in EE - they just are more difficult, as there is much more competition (tip-top shape, single, sober, educated guys with steady, high paying careers).
The US is a country of extremes - so, yes, there are lots of fat girls. But there are also lots of girls that go out of their way to diet/excercise - all the while, gyms are relatively new (and overpriced, much like the apartments) in EE, and McDonalds becomes ever more popular here, while it declines in the US. Kind of like smoking...
I do agree the DUFF factor is worse in the US than EE - but it does exist here as well :(
Explorer69
02-07-07, 18:59
In this discussion about American / West European / East European / Slavic girls one can go on for ever. But I always felt that the average EE girl was better doing oral sex than their Western cousins. I have often wondered: is there an Academy of Oral Sex that EE / Slavic girls attend during their teens?
You belong in the Ukraine - I'll have the fried fat with a side of fat sprinkled with salt...oh yeah, and can you cover that all in grease sauce?
Seriously...
Odessa during the summer is the only recommended time to go. However if you aren't packing your 'A' game you Will crash and burn with the 7+'s. It doesn't matter if you are Brad Pitt's younger poor twin. If the girls want that they will hook up with the locals.
If you are a EU citizen you no longer need a visa to travel to the Ukraine. And CAT is no longer in Odessa, however if you want to visit him in S Cali I am sure he will be more then happy to put you up in a Super 8 Motel.
And...to expand on the FSU - American dyevuska thing...
I don't know the last time (if ever) any of you have been to the top clubs in the US (any major city) but I would more then happily put those girls up against any girls in any club in the FSU (or any place else) - lets get real. You hit the 'A' list clubs in LA, NYC, Miami or Vegas and it's going to be Odessa what? Moscow huh? Kiev nyet. Actually Odessa is so provinical I feel odd even mentioning it in that list - Kiev barely makes that list. If anyone wants to put their money where their mouth is I'll be in South Beach in three weeks and LA the week after that. You'll be with me, so you won't get faced at the door. ;)
I agree with Street, the further you get away from major metro area's in the FSU the less appealing girls get.
Hot Daddy43
02-08-07, 01:16
I tried to PM you but it did not work.
Do you have any contact information for Sveta? I will be in Odessa in 10 days.Sveta +[Telephone Number deleted by Admin]
EDITOR's NOTE: This report was edited to remove personal telephone numbers in the text. Please do not post personal telephone numbers in the Forum. Instead, please invite other Forum Members to contact you for this information directly via the Forum's Private Messaging system. Thanks!
Bez Bezarra
02-08-07, 03:24
Wandering all over the oblasts, I meet more cuties in little shops and parks
and on trains and cafe's, just about anywhere. These dyevs are not models,
but they are still super hot, to me. So maybe you big city studs
wouldn't think so, but I don't care. Why the fuck should I? :D
Because its my OWN personal taste. I can talk to them and find a way
to start something up from nothing. So it works, for me. I've had no
shortage of US pussy and latin pussy and oriental pussy and even
black pussy, I just crave slavic pussy more because we get off
together more intensely than any other kind.
This debate over which kind of females are better is a big steaming load
of shit. Here's the proof. A study released today surveyed 10,000
american women and asked them if they'd be willing to give up sex for
3 years in exchange for a new wardobe of clothing, and 91% chose the clothes. :o
Infinity99
02-09-07, 14:02
don't have a VISA or Mastercard right now to do that
Dude, wtf? I hope you have an ATM card you can use when visiting ukraine.
As far as the conversation about which country has better looking girls, of course we will all have our own opinion but I can comment on Odessa where I've lived 16 years, Kiev 2 years total time combined, Moscow 6months, NYC 17 years, I have also of course visited Miami, LA and virtually every other major city in Western Europe. In NYC, I routinely visit places like home, marquee, cain, pacha and in case you guys don't know, these are the top clubs in NYC. Unless you show up with at least same number of girls at the door, who have to be 6+ (american standard which differs from russian) you can forget about getting in unless you are willing to drop $500 + for bottles with table service.
Are the women in Odessa better than NYC? It's tough to say. Places like NYC, Miami and even moscow to some extent offer a nicer diversity. In NYC, I have taken home or dated asian, black, puerto rican, russian, israeli, nationalities girls. However, if you are a fan of eastern european beauties, which is a certain type of look which anyone who's ever been to FSU knows all too well, then places like Odessa, Kiev, Moscow are unbeatable. Sure Miami has a massive number of incredible looking girls, of all sorts but they are more difficult to get (unless you have coke), plus all in all I would say that ratio is the same as any major ukraine city. It's common sense that urban areas have better looking women, that's a fact around the world. But if someone tells me that Omaha Nebraska (pop 344, 000) has the same number or denisty of hot women as say Nikolaev (pop 530, 000) They deserve to get slapped across the face.
So we get back to the question of is Odessa in the same rank as Moscow or Kiev, if we are talking about FSU girls. My take on it is that Moscow has all in all better looking women than Ods and Kiev. That's simply a function of massive wealth that is concentrated there. It is also the center of Russians' culture, entertainment, press, fashion industries. Of course, the size of the city just carries an insane number of gorgeous women. Are girls in a place like NYC as beautiful, in my opinion it is not even close. I'll take moscow hottest nightclub view over nyc hottest nightclub view any day. I guess all of this comes down to preference and this is mine. Kiev and Odessa are around the same level although Ods of course is much better in the summer, I think most people would agree with me. A considerable number of people from kiev, middle and uppper class visit Odessa during the summer. Although lately places like turkey and egypt are becoming more popular destinations.
Is Odessa provincial? Of course! In fact that is the appeal and the residents often call it a "big village". Most people have about 4 to 5 degrees of seperation between each other through friends, relatives, etc. Odessa's population is about 1/10th of moscow so how can you ever really compare the two in terms of sheer number of women that reside in that city. Yet, it is that 'provincial' feel that makes Odessa in my opinion so much more pleasant than monsters like Moscow and even Kiev to some extent.
In Moscow, if you go say to fabrique, which is one of the nicest places there at the moment and you are not enjoying yourself for whatever reason, it is likely you'll have to endure about a 45 taxi ride to get to the next hot party. In odessa, you are usually either a 5 minute walk away from the next place or 5 minute taxi ride. Kiev has a nice number of beautiful women, but is becoming somewhat superficial like moscow with some clubs enforcing strict face control and sometimes not even allowing legitime girls inside. I showed up at the doors of Decadence house in KIev with 2 beauties (from odessa of all places) on my arms and they were denied entrance. The girls were regular girls, 23 years or so whom I knew from odessa, both visiting kiev staying with their relatives. They were also a solid 8 but in US they would qualify for a strong 9. Long story short, the doorman allowed me inside but the girls were denied. Reason? Too many women were already inside and not enough men. Now I ask you, when in NYC, Miami, LA etc have you ever been in a club where the ratio of girls to guys was better? In all my years of going out, I have maybe witnessed this phenomenam a couple of times. Meanwhile, in Kiev and Ods I have seen it probably 50% of the time. In Odessa, if you are going out during the winter months, you are usually faced with a 7 female to 3 male ratio. It's simple math folks, if you have any game, not afraid to drop a few bucks and can be aggressive you should not have any trouble scoring freebies. Speaking russian is preferable but not a necessity. Also, in Odessa thahnk god they are not yet enforcing any type of face control in the clubs, as is happening in moscow to such horrible extent and beginning in kiev.
Whoever mentioned previously that there is a lack of men in this city, is absolutely right. Most guys in this city, who work regular jobs like taxi, chefs, etc stay home with their friends on weekends nights, drinking vodka in their podyezd and smoking trava. These guys can't go out and even drop the type of money that most clubs in the city require to have a good time. Anyway, anyone who has spent any considerable time in most russian cities knows what I am talking about. The girls on the other hand, for the most part all have goals such as to go out, have fun, meet a guy, meet a boyfriend, meet a sugar daddy (most popular one), get laid, or out having fun with their friends but are almost always open to maybe meeting a new guy.
Who is a better quality women, american or russian is the next question. Also a matter of preference, although I am sure limitless discussioins on this can be found on russian marriage discussion sites, after all this is a sex board but let me just say one thing. I have a number of personal friends, who after visiting ukraine/russia after the first time said they could no longer envision themselves getting married to an american woman. The people I speak about are pure americans, born and raised. Two of them are now married to girls from ukraine and the others are still single. Cruiser D, you have either spent too much time in Ukraine lately (forgetting how truly terrible american women are), or you have spent too much time in US and forgotten how nice those blond slavic blued eyed broads really are.
EDITOR'S NOTE: I certainly hope that the author or somebody else will post a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please Click Here (http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?) for more information.
Hey Infinity99
I just read your third post and wanted to thank you. It was a really comprehensive and insightful post. Much appreciated.
I have a few questions if it's not too much trouble:
1) Are you currently still living in Odessa? Why have you chosen to live in this town year round over Kiev, to run your business?
2) So you would consider Kiev slowly turning into a mini version of Moscow that has gone down the road of superficiality? This would make it pretty hard to score with your personality then, unless you are inclined to be both charming and show some bling? Many might differ to this view because I'm sure there's a lot of soilders out there still punting along with the superficial Moscovite freebies.
3) You said "Odessa and Kiev are around the same level in terms of good looking women". Since Odessa is a 'town', wouldn't most young ladies from around Ukraine head towards the capital for their university studies, job opportunities, culture, entertainment, fashion etc... throughout the year, then head back home during school holidays or down to the coast (Odessa) during summer vacation? At least that was my experience with Latvia and Lithuania.
4) You said "in Odessa, if you are going out during the winter months, you are usually faced with a 7 female to 3 male ratio". Honestly, how dead is Odessa in winter? I mean, it's a coastal town/resort so it won't be particularly pretty in the winter cold, especially with the clubs that are right by the beach. Are these ratios based on girls who are still in high school or can't get out to the capital for better opportunities? At least in Kiev, girls from all over Ukraine still have to attend university and work.
5) You mentioned that there was a lack of men in Odessa at the social haunts. I suppose you are referring to the winter months right? I'd imagine there would be a shitload of Ukrainian and foreign hunters in summer. Is there also a lack of testosterone in Kiev at the clubs/bars? :p
6) I posted up some questions in the General Info section and it seems you would be more than experienced to answer them. My post is #272 and you have already answered half of that in your post. So I was hoping to hear the other (Kiev vs. Odessa) half :)
7) I'm organising for a move to Europe maybe in August. But first I have to go to France. I might be there for a few months, then I'll move to the Baltics and settle down. This will then allow me to regularly visit the rest of FSU (in order of preference: Ukraine/Russia/Romania/Moldova/rest of Siberia) for some fun and games. If the things I have to do in France ends up spreading over to a full year, then I'll just move to the Baltics and go back to Paris maybe once a month and spread the work over two or more years.
So, I hope we'll get a chance to meet one day, enjoy some social outings, debate about politics/economics/life, and create some good memories :D
Many thanks!!
Ps. I tried sending you a PM but you can't receive them so I posted it here.
EDITOR'S NOTE: I certainly hope that the author or somebody else will post a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please Click Here (http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?) for more information.
Interesting post Infinity. I think we have different club and culture experiences and expectations. I for one would never think of Moscow as a beacon of culture - Russia's history and current situation while interesting and intriguing is not something most would consider sophisticated or avant-garde. Like some states in the Middle East I find Russian new money's attempt to buy culture amusing and comical.
Having lived and travel the world I generally operate under the premise that people are basically the same no matter where you go. To say for example that FSU women are better then American women tells you quite a bit about the person who makes that statement. As I had made mention before I don't think it is the man who is rejecting the whole of American women but American women who as a whole has rejected him. Let's face it boys, it easier for a schlub to find a 7-8 in the FSU then it is in America or Western Europe but things are changing fast, aren't they...
Infinity99
02-17-07, 02:28
Cruser D,
What’s the matter? Some Natasha break your heart? No need to get upset, just get right back in there and find a new one.
I do not consider Moscow as Universe’s culture center. I simply said that Moscow was the center of ‘Russian" culture. Yes, money these days are a factor and are being flaunted everywhere you go (in Kiev / Odessa also to some extent), but that doesn’t take away that Moscow is the center of Russia’s culture. Is the culture superior to that in US? Absolutely in my opinion. Does US even have a culture? Aside from the coastal areas, most of US’s culture revolves around Wal-Mart, rounds of golf and Monday night football. So yes, give me Moscow’s flamboyant, new money in your face culture any day of the week over US.
Also, having lived and traveled around the world I would COMPLETELY disagree with you and say that people are not the same at all, all of which depends on their upbringing, local culture and general perspectives on life. For instance, are the Chinese the same as Americans? Especially now that some are getting quiet wealthy? The answer is no. They could not be more different. Are Japanese same as Chinese? Not even close. They are intrinsically different than other cultures. Same applies to Russian vs. American (or insert other country here). As said before, I can only speak on behalf of my opinions and yet I find that Russian women on the whole, could not be more different than American women. I mean if you are the type of guy who likes to be with a woman who will completely give up on her looks after her first child, enjoy getting whipped weekly about (insert issue of the week here), and requires hours of explanation to justify going out with your friends then perhaps an American woman is for you. Again, please do not take this the wrong way. There are exceptions to everything, including fat and ugly Russian chics just as there are amazingly beautiful American girls who have great personalities. But as someone who has spent about the same number of years living in both Russia and Ukraine as US, I think I can at the very least express my opinion which is shared by absolutely every single red blooded American man who has ever visited me in Ukraine.
Saunter,
1. I currently spend most of my time in Odessa, although I spend a lot of time in New York along with Kiev as well.
2. Despite Moscow or Kiev being superficial, there are simply too many women out there and plenty of places that will allow anyone with decent game and not overly cheap to get laid. Firstly, a lot of the flashy places are that only on surface. Meaning that the girl or even a guy for that matter, may splash $20 on the cover, wear very expensive clothes but go back every night to their shitty left bank soviet apartment and not have a pot to [CodeWord140] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord140) in. So do not judge books by their covers in Ukraine, still a small % of very flashy girls have very comfortable lives.
3. Lots of women do head to Kiev from Odessa, but even more women head from Kiev or Moscow to Odessa. I personally know a dozen or so Moscow residents who all have taken their entire wealth accumulations and moved to Odessa. There are also lots of universities (including medical schools, music schools, etc) so there is definitively more ingoing ‘student’ and alike traffic than outgoing. Last by not least, most Kievlians are still envious of Odessits as the city always has and still does have the ‘coolest’ reputation to be from.
4. Odessa during the winter is not dead at all. Give me the winter nightlife there any day since my batting average then is around 75% vs. Maybe 40% in the summer. I’m talking about first night taking home, normal girls. Odessa is more happening during the week than Kiev. For example in Kiev every single nightclub on Monday/Tuesday night is closed. There is NOBODY out on nights like those. In Odessa, you can hit visa vis, euro, vechernaya Odessa, morgan and be sure you’ll find a few wounded sheeps up for grabs.
5. There is a massive lack of men in Odessa. I am talking about locals of course. During the summer, the ratio in nightclubs crawls up to 50/50 with about 90% of males being foreigners. I would say about half of those have very little game so again, if you can work in your native country and are not shy, can be confident you should have no problems. The summers are tougher for one night lays though. If you need to get in touch with me, you can do so via the other board.
EDITOR'S NOTE: I certainly hope that the author or somebody else will post a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please Click Here (http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?) for more information.
Infinity, let me put this another way. I think we travel in different social and club circles. You somehow found yourself in the 3rd rate resort town of Odessa making a living off of desperate sex tourists. Life in the US and good looking American women too hard for you to obtain?
As far as the whole American culture thing goes. There is no culture in the US except for the coastal areas? Oh you mean where 80% of the population lives? Not to get too nationalistic but if American culture is so poor or non-existent why exactly does every 1st and 2nd world country try to copy American life and the American lifestyle? Why is American fashion everywhere? American food? American movies? American TV? American books? Why is 80% of the Internet American content? There is what 6 or so billion people in the world. But only 300 million Americans, how is this possible? Why is landing a green card to the US still view as winning the golden ticket in the lottery?
People are the same the world over. They all have the same wants and needs, food, shelter, family, companionship from the jungles of Burma to the concrete jungle of NYC people act and react in the same way. Human nature is basic. Culture differences may distort this a bit but underneath it all it is always the same. If possible you need to be less superficial in your observations.
Let me know the next time you are in NYC. Maybe we can meet at the same clubs. Or if you are there during the summer we can hit some Hampton parties. I'm sure you get the same invites, did you get your membership to Cipriani Up yet? BTW - I prefer Bungalow 8 to Cain, I like a club that will face a B list starlet.
This conversation is getting far too pretentious for this board, if you feel the need we can continue it in private.
Bez Bezarra
02-17-07, 16:41
The US are nothing else than war mongers.
And please don't try to say the people elected them, they didn't.
The people elected Gore and Kerry. The opposition rigged their win.
Follow the money.
Infinity99
02-17-07, 17:31
I agree this conversation is pretentious, plus not pertinent to this board but I'll just make a few comment:
80% of US's population is coastal? What are you smoking man, and please share some with me. I'm not going to go into stats here..... Also, im being quiet generous with my comment, coastal elite US really consists of NY, SF, Boston, LA and Miami. Even so, majority of people's definition in these cities is a weekend spent at a baseball game and a blockbuster night on a rainy night. Please do not try to explain to me, how your tiny circle of elite club goers represents the masses.
Let's not even get into the fact that 90% of Americans do not pocess a passport. If you want to see american's culture, look no further than George W. The former cokehead got elected twice, inherited an empire and has been slowly flushing it down the toilet. His hick constituency are too dumb and too ignorant to even see it.
US is FAR from what it used to be. People still desire to live there on the whole, but many immigrants have also gone back to their countries of origins. I personally know chinese, russians, ukrainians who have all packed up and gone back home. I also know plenty of kids who graduated school and have gone off to workin moscow, making about double what their salary would be in the states. Don't kid yourself about the US culture either. Fact of the matter is, that in say place like Russia, people are influenced by culture from say Italy and France much more so than from US. This includes music, arts, food, theater and pretty much everything you can think of.
American food? Are you talking about McDonald's? My point has been made.
Im in NYC at the moment. Bungalow 8? well I'll believe you get in there when I see it. Somehow, I'm willing to bet pretty much everything in my procession that you will not get in within 5 ft of that door. If you do actually get in, that prompts another question of why you are on this board? Perhaps you can also tell us about your night out with Justin Timbelake a couple of nights ago. Or the wild time you had with Puffy at this white party in the hamptons? Either way, im sure it was a blast!
Give me so called '3rd rate' ukrainian resort city, with duties to sex tourists over hamptons and 'bungalow' parties any day. I prefer people to be slightly more real in this part of the world, even if I have to sacrifice some of the elitness and lack of material to brag about at the next cocktail party in Southampton.
As to American women? Even when in the states, I rarely date them. Every now and then, I'll hit an upper east side bar and shoot for a one night stand. That's as far as my dating relationships go with american girls. Give me a russian, israeli or western european girl any day and thank god there are plenty of them in new york and miami.
Cruiser i really don't understand why you're SO controversial with Infinity.
His posts are informative, well-balanced, and an interesting read.
When was the last time you heard someone from Canada or Mexico called an American?
Iran should have been biotch slapped in 79. Cuba hasn't been bother since the 50's nor has it progressed. Haiti should have been allowed to fall to pieces. Iraq was a big mistake and we should have allowed Saddam to kill and torture his own people because that would have been in the US best interest. Personally I think the US should go into a mode of political and trade isolationism not seen since post WW1. Don't worry the EU will pick up the slack or maybe the country you come from will take over the role of world police man. Putin seemed pretty upset about America a few weeks ago. Maybe he's going to step up to the plate.
Bez, I never bought the 'it's Bush not the American people' arguement. Heck Clinton almost got shown the door over making 300k at Whitewater. Anyone think this is slightly more important? Yeah sure Al got the shaft in Florida but Kerry lost the election all on his own...
Prosal, informative, how so? Like I said, anyone who spouts the line 'American women are so horrible' is generally quite lacking themselves. My only mistake has been in address this at all. There is no anger here, I am all about the love.
I don't agree with the statement that there are no differences between US-women and women elsewere. There is a hughe difference between Gringas and Latinas. Everyone who has once been with a Latina can confirm that.
No differences in culture between the US and other countries?
Please explain me why a US president as Bil Clinton gets almost kicked out of office because he gets sucked a few times by an ugly girl as Monica Lewinsky.
The current French president Chirac is also known as Mister 10 minutes. It is because of his habbit for quick fucks in between his busy schedule. And he is not fucking on these occasions with Mrs. Chirac! Nobody in France cares about that. Even French women don't care. They understand he is an alpha-male and therefore entiteled to much sex.
In the US it was the same 45 years ago. JFK fucked a different woman every day. Nowadays that would be unthinkable for a US president. Can you imagine George W fucking a different woman every day? If he did so he would have more trouble with that then he currently has with Iraq!
"Cruiser D" I do believe the US is a great nation and that we in the free world have much to thank to the US. But sometimes you guys are so naive (no offence mend). By Jove look at what you wrote yourself:
Iran should have been biotch slapped in 79.Did you forget about USSR still being in existance in those days. Might have mend WWIII.
Cuba hasn't been bother since the 50's nor has it progressed.I am very glad Cuba hasn't bothered that long and that it hasn't progressed. Thanks to the embargo that forbids US-investments and practically forbids US-citizens from going there the country is still pretty genuine and prices are affordable! You can have real great time there with the women. If you play it good even for nothing! Try that in the Ukrain. By the way: I am not a Fidel-fan. For me he is a complete moron.
Personally I think the US should go into a mode of political and trade isolationism not seen since post WW1Please don't think nowadays world can't keep turning without the US. China, Russia and India are coming up. It is going to happen either with or without the US. You might not like it (neither do I) but you got to face reality. Don't put your head in the sand!
Cheers!
Chill Bill
02-17-07, 19:28
Hey there,
Anyone ever use any of the "marriage" agencies to meet girls? These three all seem to be related, and there are some real young hotties with profiles posted! Just curious if anyone's every heard of them, if they're legit, and if anyone's had any personal experiences meeting girls from them. Thanks!
http://www.ukrainebride.net/
http://www.odessa-models.com/
http://www.russianthongs.com/
- Chill
Bez Bezarra
02-17-07, 20:12
Can you imagine George W fucking every day?
In Cuba you can have real great time with women.
Try that in the Ukrain.He's doing it to the whole world.
Some of us DO have a great time in Ukrain.
Some of us DO have a great time in Ukrain.BB,
Please quote me properly.
I wrote: "You can have real great time there (in Cuba) with the women. If you play it good even for nothing! Try that in the Ukrain."
Of course you can have a great time with women in the Ukrain. But you will feel it in your wallet. See this recent report on Kiev opportunities by Hecker
Bez Bezarra
02-17-07, 20:26
OK great women in Ukrain that's not for free.
You pay big bucks!
Don't worry about your quote, I'm not changing your point.
If you know what you're doing, you don't pay a lot or anything. There are many dyevochkas that are NOT greedy, when you wander around the country away from the capital city.
As for Cuba, I don't care for cafe con leche or cafe non leche. And the blancas ARE greedy little putas.
Don't worry about your quote, I'm not changing your point.
If you know what you're doing, you don't pay a lot or anything. There are many dyevochkas that are NOT greedy, when you wander around the country away from the capital city.
As for Cuba, I don't care for cafe con leche or cafe non leche. And the blancas ARE greedy little putas.You are talking about "cafe non leche"? I am talking more about a little taste of Habana Club Rum. And prices? Very, very moderate. Not greedy at all.
Please do see the pictures
Girl in blue. Habana Club Rum of 18 años. Country girl. Very relaxed, willing and natural. Damage: $25 whole night.
Girl in orange. Habana Club Rum of 21 años. What a technique. Incredible. Damage $30 whole night.
Bez Bezarra
02-17-07, 23:13
Move this to the foto gallery.
Rodney Munch
02-18-07, 00:57
Cruiser, sounds like you are bitter at something. The statement “all women are the same” is absolute idiocy. Sure everyone desires the same things, no matter what the location is. Things such as air, sex, food, water are of particular importance to all humans. Further one also needs shelter, love, comfort, acceptance of others, etc etc. However, all humans or women having these ‘cravings’ in common does not make them all the same at all. Quite the contrary, what makes us all different is our parents, our upbringing and our societies.
\What defines them is how they treat their man in the life on daily basis, their treatment towards their kids and their overall idea of a family. Also, having traveled around the globe enough times I also agree with infinity that American women are some of the most demanding women in the world, ball busters if you will. You may not agree that they are horrible, but there are a lot of men that will, while I think very few will say that about Russian girls.
Look no further than the marriage industry which has been growing and growing, even in the past few years of so called ‘prosperity’ period in Ukraine. American and western European men keep going there looking for wives. Are some of them losers that could not score if their life depended on it? Sure, but there are also normal, good looking 30 year old guys, who already established they are not interested in creating a family with an American girl. While living in Odessa, one of my very good Canadian friends who runs a marriage agency there exposed me to this business. I routinely saw guys walking in and out of his office, even got to know a few with which I still keep in touch.
If you need further proof that ‘american women are horrible’ notion is shared by more people than you think, here is an interesting forum: http://www.americanwomensuck.com********index.php
Within this forum, interestingly enough there is a subsection called “Eastern European Women – Tall and Lovely”.
I personally do not advocate american or any other nationality having horrible women. But i can certainly see how some cultures differ from others and as they say "to each their own".
Rodney Munch
02-18-07, 03:23
In addition to what i wrote, I went through my albums from Odessa and found a lovely picture with one of my favorite Odessa girls of all time. This is what the city is all about, even if you can't get laid, at least take advantage of the shady cafes on Deribasovskaya with a company of a nice blondie.
Here is sharing a breakfast on a sunny weekday.
Street Sleuth
02-18-07, 13:37
Most are quasi-legit. The girls are real, the info they sell real - at worst, the info can be out of date. The problem with them, as follows, in my anecdote:
I flirted with a girl on a Ukrainian inter-city street - she was standing around, in the bitter cold, and I chatted her up, suggesting we went inside for warm coffee. She said she was waiting for another guy, but gave me her number.
I called her the next day. She said we could meet, but the cost would be $40 (I was only quasi surprised - I didn't think she was a hoe, but you never know)...she was young and cute, so I agreed.
Later that day, lying in bed next to her, after having had P4P, she asks me to translate an SMS she had just recieved (her English was rotten). Its from a guy saying, "I'm boarding the plane back to US, miss you, will call you when I arrive in US" - naturally, I'm curious as to who the guy is that is so hell bent on keeping in contact with a P4P.
She tells all - she met the guy on a marraige agency, he came for a week to see her, and spent most of his time with her (except for the late evenings)...according to her, she never slept with him! She could have been lying, but why lie to me, at that point? I said I found it odd she didn't sleep with him - her response, "I'm not going to sleep with a guy that wants to marry me!". She went on to explain that she wouldn't mind touring the US, but had absolutely no intention of getting married (she was only 18), and didn't want to move to the US anyway.
I just can't help feel bad for the guy.
They can be OK ways of finding girls, but just don't make too much of them.
Hey there,
Anyone ever use any of the "marriage" agencies to meet girls? These three all seem to be related, and there are some real young hotties with profiles posted! Just curious if anyone's every heard of them, if they're legit, and if anyone's had any personal experiences meeting girls from them. Thanks!
http://www.ukrainebride.net/
http://www.odessa-models.com/
http://www.russianthongs.com/
- Chill
Street Sleuth
02-18-07, 13:49
My words of wisdom on EE Women, and the whole idea of going there to meet them, for dating, P4P, marriage, or whatever....
Imagine you are in a town, and you want to go out for the evening, to try and score (wife, girlfriend, one night stand, P4P, whatever) and there are only 2 bars. The first bar has a ratio of 1 young hot girl to 5 young, horny, single, educated, rich, decent guys. The second bar has a ratio of 1 hot girl to 0.5 young, horny, single, educated, rich, decent guys. Which bar do you go to?
Now, imagine the 'town' is 'planet earth', and you have the financial means to travel.....
I tend to agree with Cruiser on the 'people are basically the same everywhere' - the differences of female behavior to males is mainly influenced by supply/demand.
Doctor_Skank
02-18-07, 15:29
Later that day, lying in bed next to her, after having had P4P, she asks me to translate an SMS she had just recieved (her English was rotten). Its from a guy saying, "I'm boarding the plane back to US, miss you, will call you when I arrive in US" - naturally, I'm curious as to who the guy is that is so hell bent on keeping in contact with a P4P.
She tells all - she met the guy on a marraige agency, he came for a week to see her, and spent most of his time with her (except for the late evenings)...according to her, she never slept with him! She could have been lying, but why lie to me, at that point? I said I found it odd she didn't sleep with him - her response, "I'm not going to sleep with a guy that wants to marry me!". She went on to explain that she wouldn't mind touring the US, but had absolutely no intention of getting married (she was only 18), and didn't want to move to the US anyway.
I just can't help feel bad for the guy.
They can be OK ways of finding girls, but just don't make too much of them.
That's the reality of the agency game. I wouldnt trust any of those girls. I don't blame them for doing it, but condemn the naivety of the poor guys thinking "their" girl is going to be faithful to them in any way. Why should they? At the end of the day, it's just business.
A $40 (semi) pro - good score.
I'm going to disagree with you slightly. I think 1/3 of the girls in marriage agencies is like the girl you met, not serious and just looking for a good time. Some times it includes a good time for you, sometimes you just get to pay for it. ;) Also there are a lot of 'fake' profiles out there. Sure the girl is real - she probably got free modeling photos out of the deal but the agency is just using her to lure money paying males to the site. The first and last time she probably checked her profile/email is when she made it. Then again some agencies (a very few) are completely legit, most are half and half and a few complete scammers. But I completely agree with you when you say they can be an OK way to meet girls, just don't put too much into them.
I also run into the good/bad girl problem. A lot of girls who I know are pro's or semi pro's pretend to be good girls because I am prime grade A marriage material. On the flip side I've had more then a few good girls say at the end of a date, 'let's go back to your place and you can have me' because they want to nail me down.
Rod, when are you going to post a picture of a girl that makes me want to actually come to Odessa? Come on this is supposed to be the poon capital of the FSU (during the summer), post a picture of a girl that is going to make me say fuck Kiev, heck post a pic that is going to make me say fuck Omaha.
In, I'd like to join you at 8, but I'm at South Beach right now - with JT, Diddy couldn't make it. I have to go now, Will Smith needs to use my laptop to check his MySpace page.
Most are quasi-legit. The girls are real, the info they sell real - at worst, the info can be out of date. The problem with them, as follows, in my anecdote:
She tells all - she met the guy on a marraige agency, he came for a week to see her, and spent most of his time with her (except for the late evenings)...according to her, she never slept with him! She could have been lying, but why lie to me, at that point? I said I found it odd she didn't sleep with him - her response, "I'm not going to sleep with a guy that wants to marry me!". She went on to explain that she wouldn't mind touring the US, but had absolutely no intention of getting married (she was only 18), and didn't want to move to the US anyway.
Just want to say thanks to everyone (especially Dr. Sknk) for the healthy debate, discussions, differences in opinions and views. It really is a pity I have to wait another year before joining some of you on a regular basis. Keep up the good work and continue to blast the fools who are stupid enough to pay rip-off western prices that will undoubtedly screw up the scene for us all.
Cruiser - You have a wealth of experience that obviously works for you and many other like-minded mongers. I might fall into the group with Infinity99 where our games with girls in clubs/bars/streets/general places... are somewhat different or even views on life in general. All I can say is that new gamers like myself still have to pay respect where it is due for the many informative posts, even if I have to disagree with you on some things. Hope you're still around when I get the chance to visit Kiev, would be the best way to be convinced, that maybe some of my views could be opened up to other tried-and-tested versions.
If you need to get in touch with me, you can do so via the other board.I've really enjoyed your posts and you seem to be more into the 'types of games' I might be and also the kind of associate to share views on other things in life. I would really like to keep scoring freebies cuz IMHO, don't have a need to pay to get 6+ girls. Of course I have been rejected by 5's too but that's part of the fun! I am not everyone's type, not even a 1/10 rated girl. ISG guidelines disallow me in giving out emails so let me know what's the best way to swap contacts.
Thanks.
I'm not an experienced ukrainian monger like many of you, but I would like to add my 2 cents to the ongoing debates and discussions, sharing my personal experience of having had for a few months a girlfriend from Odessa.
I had to come quite often in Ukraine in the past months due to a project my firm is doing in the Odessa area and honestly I had big benefits from advices from this forum. I agree with many of you that it's tough to score in Odessa with regular girls, but the women here are so unbelievably hot that it's worth to try. I'm 40 y. O. In a quite good shape, so I can play my cards. Like everybody else there are good and bad times, but honestly I enjoy pretty much the hunting activities. And when I cannot score there is always the P4P backup:.) made easier by all of your posts.
Knowing I have to come quite regularly in Odessa and in Kiev and following the advice of some of the fellow mongers, I've made several contacts in a couple of dating websitee and scheduled dates for the days I've been in Ukraine. Most of the contacts that showed up resulted in a great fuck within the 2nd-3rd date with a relatively low level of cash out (I have the advantage of being on expenses and getting cash back for any restaurant bill, as well for hotels or apartments). One of the dates was a 26 y. O. , 1. 75, black long hair really stunning looking. Almost a 10 in my scale. She was quite tough at the beginning and took me 6-7 dates before having sex, but she is really able to make me crazy, as she has no limits and unbelievable passion and skills. Making long story short, she became sort of girlfriend since last September and at a certain point of time I had also tough times to avoid evil discussions about marriage.
Hereafter some observation from this relationship:
1. The day after our first sex session, she stopped in front of a shop saying that she needs new boots and made me spend $400 on this. Fine with me as I had no relevant expenses for her so far and thought it was worth. The day after she asked for a coat fur of about $2. 000. I said no no no and we quarreled for a while, but in the night we had again wonderful sex and she never made again this kind of requests. I suppose this was sort of setting the boundaries.
2. She has been working as a clerk for about $250 per month. Without any discussion with me (making me very disappointed) she left her firm after few weeks of our relationship, as she expected I was going to take care of her. Her point was that $300 are not a problem for me and that this is a big improvement of her social status in front of her friends. In the groups of Odessa girls the coolest are the ones that don't need to work having one or more sponsorships
3. One day her phone felt on the ground from my hands and broke in several pieces. I offered to buy a new one of course. We went together in a shop and she wanted immediately the most expensive and fashionable model (about $1000 D&G model). "no no no darling forget about this. I won't waste money in something with the same characteristics of any other $200 mobile, but the brand. "
"If you love me you have to take the best for me"
"I'm happy to buy a very good mobile, but not this one"
"Ok, if you don't want to buy me THIS, I will stay without mobile"
We moved out of the shop. She was in a very bad mood all the day until we had one of our total-fuck-wild-nights. Talking after sex she apologized for pretending that kind of mobile explaining how much important was for her to show all her girlfriend how good things I can give her. I understood that girls there consider foreigners just for fun and one off cash dispensing. Nevertheless their social recognition increases a lot if they hit a very reliable and supporting foreigner boyfriend. Fancy mobile is first of all a proof of how much they are cool. I took in Italy a quite cool (and cheaper) mobile checking that this specific model is not distributed in Ukraina. She was fine with having nobody else can easily have there.
4. We have spent together christmas holidays in Mauritius. We were alone without any contact with her girlfriends. She has been always very modest and never asked for anything but being with me.
5. In Odessa she was used to spend immediately all the money I gave her in hairdressing and underwears (and some sex toys:.)). Asking after for help to pay bills and food. I was pretty much disturbed because when sending her money for travelling to Kiev or for renting an apartment in ODessa, she used it for dresses and cosmetics, so I had to avoid this approach and send her prepaid tickets. Also once she lost her flight to Kiev and hired a driver to reach me at Borispol (instead of taking the flight after and arrive just a couple of hours later). I had to pay $300 for the driver (more than twice the cost of the flight). I sent back her Odessa by pullman and didn't make any present in that days. I was expecting quarrels or bad mood, but she had no reactions and again we had great time together. I suppose this is also sort of education and setting the boundaries.
6. We met several times in bars or at the disco some of her grilfriend and always asked for paying them entrance, cafe', wine. Whatever. I obleyed many times, but one day I refused. She was very happy with this (? ) and even prouder of me. I understood I have just thrown money before.
7. I left her couple of weeks ago, because I discovered she has dated another Westerner while I wasn't there. And also because I was getting a little bit tired of her. She is still bombing me with calls and sms (of course. She has lost a good deal). The surprise is that most of her girlfriends started to call me and try to date, as I got the reputation of "good boy" (even the girls with local boyfriends! ). I've fucked few of them in the past days without spending one additional cent out of cafe' and restaurants and they are all open for a relationship. I imagine they consider this a sort of investment for the future. Quite a different situation with respect my first times in Odessa where I was not able to do anything.
8. In general all of this girls (my ex-girlfriend on top) are incredibly hot and top class fucker. They also have unbelievable self-confidence and self-care. They believe to be better than any other woman in the world. And in bed they seem to be; )
All the best!
EDITOR'S NOTE: I certainly hope that the author or somebody else will post a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please Click Here (http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?) for more information.
Tonit66,
Thank's for writing and ordering all these experiences. I conffirm very similar experiences. These people had a big problem with their wasting priorities. The problem for me it's only I haven't had time to come back to Odessa to pick up all my "ex" padrugui, which were very difficult to be introduced to...
Good luck for everyone.
Infinity99
02-21-07, 04:12
Great post ToniT. It emphases a few very important points, that some westerners at times completely miss. While Ukraine is a very poor country, Odessa (particularly the center of Odessa) has a fairly decent concentration of wealth. Thus, spending western amounts of money on restaraunts, clothes, etc is not atypical.
The other item of importance is how you were able to 'control' your woman. This is a critical item of importance, since girls in Odessa, if you give them an inch they'll take a mile as the saying goes. Girls in ukraine love a man who is a provider, but yet draws limits on what she can and can not have. There are very wealthy guys out there (multi millionaires) but they still have a very strict amount they will give their girlfirends when they are going shopping/out with friends, etc. Girls are smart, they know a man is most vulnerable at times after a great fuck session. So they will time their requests to be right after such passionate moments. Some suckers will panic, and think to themselves that if they don't buy the girl that 'Gucci' bag she so badly wants he'll never taste that hooch again. The reality is that, if a very attractive woman has already slept with you after a few dates, chances are she already likes you for you, and partially for the $ (but not for the $ alone) and that is the difference between viewing you as someone they want to hang out with, have some fun with vs. Viewing you as a big fat wallet for whom they occasionally must spread their legs.
Not to sound like the board curmudgeon, but that report can be summed up with. She used me, I used her; everyone had a great time. She went on to boyfriend #2 (or back to #1) and I got to bang her friends because they thought they could squeeze me for a fur coat. Go Team!
I'm sure by now you are all saying Cruiser, just go away. But my point is if this is the game to be played in 3rd rate Odessa why not just play it in a more sophisticated and comfortable setting? Sure our pal Infinity who happens to own or be involved in an apartment rental business is saying, ‘Hey Odessa is great! And it’s normal to pay western prices here – everyone does it!’ so typical FSU. If you are going to waste time and money on pay for play action go to Vegas, LA, Marbella, Paris, London or NYC. There are a lot of very attractive girls out there looking for a guy to make their life easier, you don’t need to go to Odessa to get ripped off when you can get ripped off at home. ;)
Odessa and Kiev were great when there were limited numbers of people going there - pre Orange - pre Eurovision (EU visa). Is it over? Not quite yet but it is certainly well down the road of diminishing returns.
Not to sound like the board curmudgeon, but that report can be summed up with. She used me, I used her; everyone had a great time. She went on to boyfriend #2 (or back to #1) and I got to bang her friends because they thought they could squeeze me for a fur coat. Go Team!
I'm sure by now you are all saying Cruiser, just go away. But my point is if this is the game to be played in 3rd rate Odessa why not just play it in a more sophisticated and comfortable setting? Sure our pal Infinity who happens to own or be involved in an apartment rental business is saying, ‘Hey Odessa is great! And it’s normal to pay western prices here – everyone does it!’ so typical FSU. If you are going to waste time and money on pay for play action go to Vegas, LA, Marbella, Paris, London or NYC. There are a lot of very attractive girls out there looking for a guy to make their life easier, you don’t need to go to Odessa to get ripped off when you can get ripped off at home. ;)
Odessa and Kiev were great when there were limited numbers of people going there - pre Orange - pre Eurovision (EU visa). Is it over? Not quite yet but it is certainly well down the road of diminishing returns.Cruise,
I really think everybody has the right to tell waht he thinks, and I think your resume fits! So pls, don't go away! :-)
Unfortunately I had no occasions to visit Ukraine before and I've spent time there just because I had to and not just for women. I would never come here just for mongering. Believe me that I'm able to bang almost everywhere and I agree with you that London and NYC freebie arena is great (I like to think that italian charme still helps sometime, but I'm aware that wealthy lifestyle helps even more, and you are right! that's true eveywhere). I agree that Ukrainian stunning looking ar not cheap at all. I also think that on the average they are unbelievable good fuckers, while sex talent in other countries is always a bet.
I posted the report just to share my impressions about behaviours and mentality. Having an ukrainian girlfriend has been a brand new learning experience from this point of view. That's it.
All the best
It is doubtful if people like Tonit66 do harm or good to other mongers.While they may raise girls' demands in a certain way they also give a reliable example of provider behaviour and maybe next mongers will find it easier to lay them since they may consider it to be a good future investment.
If providers are many in proportion to girls population,things for casual mongers become difficult but if there are few,things may become better.
Sure is that people who look for a bride and marry ukrainain girls help mongers making them seem more reliable and trustworthy and make girls trust them hoping for marriage.Of course girls may have their own criteria distinguishing a monger from a groom.
Regardless of anything 66 it sounds like you had a great time and that is really what matters. Being able to mix business and pleasure is always a big plus. I like to look at it this way, if I have to pay NYC prices (girls, food, lodging) then guess what, I want to be in NYC (or London, Paris, Rome, Vegas). Getting FSU service and lodging at NYC+ rates is more then just a little bit annoying.
I have yet to have anything but fantastic sex in the Ukraine. I think socially a lot of girls associate it with their self worth if they are anything less then stunning in bed. And I've never been in a country yet with such a high percentage of girls who are bi and up for a threesome. My current Kiev gf is extremely hot, bi and loves threesomes and actively finds other girls for us. I'm sure I'll find some way to fuck it up. ;)
Infinity99
02-22-07, 13:28
While Odessa is not cheap by 'Ukrainian' standards, let's just sum up the situation that the type of girl Toni is desribing will cost you about 3x more in NYC to get into bed (if at all) and at least 2x more to bed in a place like Marbella. Also, I spend 2 weeks in Marbella (puerto banos) just last July, one would not belileve the shortage of good looking women there. Aside from some occasional high scale escort service russian, the ratio of German/British male tourists to attractive young women is about 8 to 2.
Also, my personal business interests do not come into play when I post my opinions. I have 4 other businesses, and my rental operation in Kiev is significantly more profitable than in Odessa, yet you do not see me praising it (I wouldn't say I praise Odessa either, but rather try to provide balanced viewpoints). I personally like Odessa very much, I spent many years there and to be perfectly honest I find it the nicest city in the world. Let it be 3rd rate in your mind, sure the infostructure can be improved, life can be sometimes difficult in this part of the world, but if western conviniences is what interests you, I suggest you stay in NYC or take it a step further and move to Phoenix or Tampa.
Cruise,
I'm 100% with you. Nothing but fantastic sex in Ukraina, especially with regular girls. Don't know how it was in the past, but for sure Odessa and Kiev aren't cheaper than other western cities. In NYC lounge bars at St. Regis or W Times Square are full of 20s-30s hotties looking for fun, especially on thursday and fridays... and I scored there more than 50% of times almost for free (just spending something in fancy dinners and pubs, nothing I wouldn't have done anyway). In Premier Palace you have chances only adding at least $500 upfront and for me this is a no no no, just as matter of principle. and RP starts form $300 (I hate to negotiate). So I would never travel here just for mongering. But if you catch regular girls you can get a sex paradise. And start to think you would never come back.
Maybe I've been lucky, but really a great time here! (now!)
Street Sleuth
02-23-07, 00:29
The type of girl that Toni is describing hardly exists anywhere in the U.S., in the direct sense. Not that there aren't American women that look towards men for financial sponsorship in some form or another, but rarely do they insist on immediate 'gifts'.
Rather, American women tend to go for the big kahoona items - a house, a car, vacations to the Bahamas.
In that sense, such a woman would cost a lot more than 3x the Odessa price...
Just the same, there are enough decent girls in Odessa that one really needn't bother with such superficial types.
Then again, I am basing this on my own circumstances. I guess it would make more sense for a guy that is, say 45+ years old, trying to score with a 25 year old beauty, to shell out cash/gifts. The more good-hearted girls, looking for a decent guy, will rarely agree to date a guy more than 10 years (+/-) older than her.
On the same note - when I'm 50, I'm sure I'll have no issue at all buying a cellphone or some such gifts for a 25 year old smoking hot girl, in exchange for some compassion, even if it is a bit half-hearted.
Even more to the point - such relationships (25 year old hot girl with wealthy 50 year old) - are downright rare in the U.S./Western Europe. It just isn't socially accepted. This is certainly one of the upsides to Eastern Europe - though it does have its limits. Like I said, a true relationship between a young girl and an old guy based on nothing more than liking the guy isn't going to happen anywhere in the world.
Infinity, all I can do is base my outlook on my own experiences which are markedly different then yours. Odessa is nice, well so was Atlantic City in the 70's. I think you will find anyone hard pressed to describe Odessa anything other then a 3rd rate resort town, sorry for calling your home crap, but it is and having lived overseas you already know that. Phoenix or Tampa two very provincial American cities that you decry outstrip Odessa in every category EXCEPT for the amount of hot Russian/Ukrainian girls It would be foolish for anyone to even attempt to argue otherwise. And, as a side note, if you know how to play the game you can find many hot Ukrainian or Russian girls in either Tampa or Phoenix. The exception (generally) being if you are over 45. Then as Street pointed out you need to take a trip to the FSU if you are hunting the 18-25 old dyevuska.
66, I've notice there are generally three types of girls interested in money (or what it buys) for sex, due to the social/economic nature of the FSU this tends to be hyper-exaggerated.
One, the xxx/hr pro, she trades sex for money on a timed basis, that's it, you might get some traction with her the more time (money) you spend with her but don't count on it.
Two, the semi pro, very popular in the FSU due to the economy; She's going to rock your world and might even be a gf but it's going to cost you something - allowance, coat, apartment, car, whatever. It's always best if you get the particulars and ground rules out of the way first. But due to the dynamic nature of the relationship this can be hard and will always cause problems either way. Relationships like this generally have an expiration date (so read the packaging carefully) but are good for a couple or few months fun.
Third, the passenger, she figures you are an upscale dude and wants access to the places you go, along with a free ride of course. You spend on items of the moment for you and her and that is it. Something like this might actually turn into a real relationship. Of course you always have the 'does she like me for me' problem or is it all about the lifestyle. This is personally my favorite but I like to mix it up a little. I might be rocking the house with her and two of her gf's at Arena one night, but the next night she's cooking borstch for me at my place. The caveat being that this girl wants to have a good time with you. If you can't show her a good time then she is either going to get bored and leave or (rarely) want money to make up for your short comings (cough...cough).
A subset of number 3 is the foreign god syndrome in the FSU. It doesn't get much play in St Pete, Moscow, Kiev or Odessa anymore but in other areas you might get some traction out of it.
Street, not to get involved in you say white, I say black discussion. But...sponsorship especially in college cities like Boston is very much alive - trust me on this one. ;) Also I disagree on the 25f-50m thing too, although rare I like to call this the Daddy syndrome, sometimes it's $ related, sometimes it isn't.
Street Sleuth
02-23-07, 18:16
The 'daddy' syndrome - I had to laugh at that one. Yeah, ok, it does exist - but it is rare, and the guy has to have a lot going for him - he needs to still be good looking, in good shape, not bald, as well as wealthy, and in touch with the younger generations (he has to be comfortable chatting with her friends)....so its not going to happen for your average 50 year old guy (who may be wealthy, but isn't likely to still be so attractive to younger girls, and is even less likely to be able to effectively communicate with them).
The communication problem goes both ways - I personally grow tired real fast hanging out with any girl under 25 (not physically - I could fuck them all day long...but at some point, you end up wanting to get out of bed to get something to eat together...that's where the problems start). And I'm a long way from 50.
As for the ranking of Odessa - I've had this discussion many times (offline) - if you took the girls out of Odessa, what would you have? A very weak city. The beach area is only nice for a few months, and it is far from a top-notch beach - in line with something you'd find, say, in Virginia or Maryland - nothing like Fort Lauderdale, Rio, Antibes. Then you have the center of town - a bar/restaurant area of about 6 square blocks....and none of them particularly good.
The vast majority of the city is still just old soviet block apartments with random depressing eateries.
As far as I am concerned, the only city in EE that is worthwhile, outside of the female contingency, is St. Petersburg - which ranks with major Western European cities. Moscow and Kiev are decent, but not up to par with Western European cities as far as interesting things to do, see, architecture, culture, etc.
Street, one of the great things about being male in a male dominated society is that some where some hard bodied 18 year old girl wants to sit on your lap and call you daddy. Regardless of how old, out of shape, bald or poor you are. Being rich and buff helps but I doubt she wants anyone who can relate to her friends, that’s not what the attraction is about.
As far as the under 25 communication thing goes, girls grow up fast. Girls in the FSU grow up even faster. But I do know what you mean. About four years ago I was on a date in Kiev with a girl who was 18 or 19. The date started out okay but by the time it was over (thank god) I felt like I was babysitting. Since then I’ve dated maybe 20 or so 18-19 year olds and luckily it was the only time something like that happened.
Gentleman Travel
02-23-07, 22:09
Then again, I am basing this on my own circumstances. I guess it would make more sense for a guy that is, say 45+ years old, trying to score with a 25 year old beauty, to shell out cash/gifts. The more good-hearted girls, looking for a decent guy, will rarely agree to date a guy more than 10 years (+/-) older than her.
On the same note - when I'm 50, I'm sure I'll have no issue at all buying a cellphone or some such gifts for a 25 year old smoking hot girl, in exchange for some compassion, even if it is a bit half-hearted.
Even more to the point - such relationships (25 year old hot girl with wealthy 50 year old) - are downright rare in the U.S./Western Europe. It just isn't socially accepted. This is certainly one of the upsides to Eastern Europe - though it does have its limits. Like I said, a true relationship between a young girl and an old guy based on nothing more than liking the guy isn't going to happen anywhere in the world.
This is exactly my situation.
As a late-40's average guy on a moderate expense account, I have to take the heady wine of Dr. Skank (and other stars) reports with some water, or a grain of salt, or whatever. So I feel I will have to be a little more generous and more focused to make it with really desirable dyevs, or even stay down-market where I get more traction with what I have to offer. For example, it doesn't seem realistic to think that I can score with hot 20-somethings without providing some kind of material/lifestyle incentive. I'm still going to try sometimes, but for the most part I will rely on strategic incentives.
All the same, I think I have learned a lot from here and the little bit of experience I have had in EE so far. I am setting up a layered strategy for my next trip, covering a variety of quality, age and cost scenarios, to see what works best and what feels best for me. I think I will succeed in all categories (blonde bombshells, sexy 7s, over 30s) but it will be thinner pickings than some of the success stories we see here.
So it always useful to do a reality check of what's realistic for us, given our own limitations. However, the best advice, repeated often by the experts here, is that attitude and confidence can carry you a long way, relative to your other limitations.
While we are talking about scoring in NYC or LA or London or Paris, I have to say that I am really disappointed with the forums (okay, I know it's fora) for Western European and American/Canadian cities. It is all escort services and massage parlours. Isn't anyone trying to score freebies or divorceés (or even semi-pros) in these cities? Sure, we will have to adjust our sites and expectations a bit (or a lot) but surely there is some action out there and some intelligence on strategies and locales to be shared.
We should set up a separate thread within Ukraine or Russia to tap into all the expertise the serious mongers here have when they are operating out of the FSU!
I had a quick trip to Paris lined up a couple of weeks ago, and when I read the Paris forum it was pretty damned discouraging! Same for Geneva and Zurich, unless you like buying vastly overpriced drinks for strippers.
My little scheme to import EE talent did not pan out in the timeframe available, but I planted some seeds and think I will be able to feast next time. I got some useful advice from a couple of guys in this forum, but the Paris group is a bust!
... So it always useful to do a reality check of what's realistic for us, given our own limitations. However, the best advice, repeated often by the experts here, is that attitude and confidence can carry you a long way, relative to your other limitations.
GT - I just replied to your "Paris question" in the Russia General thread, but I see you bring up more issues to discuss here. Like you, I'm mid-40s. But I don't use the word "limitations" when it comes to fun with girls. We've corresponded a few times before, so I know you're being modest here.
Like you, I prefer the non-pro/semi-pro "companion" experience when travelling overseas. The answer is to find a girl who will be excited about travelling in a new country or city, and you're half-way there. The "friendship" sites are good for this.
Talking about "strategy", mine is all about supply and demand, the numbers game, not looking like Quasimodo, not being desperate, and luck.
When I get to Russia in a few weeks from now, I'll avoid the city areas if possible. When I use English-speaking sites such as myspace.com, I find most Moscow and SPB city girls are just as demanding and fussy as girls in any western city - obviously because the girls who use English-speaking sites are usually educated and financially comfortable.
For guys in their 40s, the reality check is that we have something to offer girls in their 20s something they want, but cannot get from guys in their 20s. It's usually money and material goods, combined with some worldly adventure.
Doctor_Skank
02-24-07, 00:42
Like you, I prefer the non-pro/semi-pro "companion" experience when travelling overseas. The answer is to find a girl who will be excited about travelling in a new country or city, and you're half-way there. The "friendship" sites are good for this.
I find most Moscow and SPB city girls are just as demanding and fussy as girls in any western city - obviously because the girls who use English-speaking sites are usually educated and financially comfortable.
For guys in their 40s, the reality check is that we have something to offer girls in their 20s something they want, but cannot get from guys in their 20s. It's usually money and material goods, combined with some worldly adventure.
Well-written... and doesn't just apply to the post-40 crowd.
One of the reasons I like young student types is that they are so curious about life, carefree, happy to do anything together and quite frankly, easily-impressed by a cosmopolitan well-travelled and well-hung foreigner. :)
They are low-maintenance as well, although I am happier to drop money in the form of gifts to them. Even cheap but thoughful gifts mean something to them. A stuffed toy, a Swatch, a book or a pair of Adidas. Last summer I got a phone call from a gorgeous teen I hadn't seen in more than a year telling me she was wearing a t-shirt I had bought her more than 2 years ago and thinking of all the great things we did together. That's gold.
I find telling them interesting stories, but prodding and letting them talk to, taking interest in what they say in an appreciative but occasionally strict or critical tone turns them on.
As for the the good-looking English-speaking girls being bitchier, I haven't necessarily noticed it being only the English-speaking ones, the Russians can be ice cold if they aren't interested. The hotties don't let their guard down easily... and don't respond at all to being chased.
Still, I am contuinely reminded that Russian girls can lust after man much older than them, especially if the men are perceived as strong, successful and clever. It turns them on.
About Odessa, it has an ugly beauty in the center, but all in all it's a colossal shithole. Way worse than any place I've seen in terms of trashy streets, plague-like wild cats and dogs and tons of untrustworthy people.
It's still got the women though, although speaking to one of the gfs she told me that Odessan women were getting uglier every year. Quite honestly, I wouldn't go that far, but did notice a downturn in overall quality last year. I think the top circles are going to more exotic and classier places to get a tan.
Doctor_Skank
02-24-07, 01:05
Infinity, all I can do is base my outlook on my own experiences which are markedly different then yours. Odessa is nice, well so was Atlantic City in the 70's. I think you will find anyone hard pressed to describe Odessa anything other then a 3rd rate resort town, sorry for calling your home crap, but it is and having lived overseas you already know that. Phoenix or Tampa two very provincial American cities that you decry outstrip Odessa in every category EXCEPT for the amount of hot Russian/Ukrainian girls It would be foolish for anyone to even attempt to argue otherwise. And, as a side note, if you know how to play the game you can find many hot Ukrainian or Russian girls in either Tampa or Phoenix. The exception (generally) being if you are over 45. Then as Street pointed out you need to take a trip to the FSU if you are hunting the 18-25 old dyevuska.
66, I've notice there are generally three types of girls interested in money (or what it buys) for sex, due to the social/economic nature of the FSU this tends to be hyper-exaggerated.
One, the xxx/hr pro, she trades sex for money on a timed basis, that's it, you might get some traction with her the more time (money) you spend with her but don't count on it.
Two, the semi pro, very popular in the FSU due to the economy; She's going to rock your world and might even be a gf but it's going to cost you something - allowance, coat, apartment, car, whatever. It's always best if you get the particulars and ground rules out of the way first. But due to the dynamic nature of the relationship this can be hard and will always cause problems either way. Relationships like this generally have an expiration date (so read the packaging carefully) but are good for a couple or few months fun.
Third, the passenger, she figures you are an upscale dude and wants access to the places you go, along with a free ride of course. You spend on items of the moment for you and her and that is it. Something like this might actually turn into a real relationship. Of course you always have the 'does she like me for me' problem or is it all about the lifestyle. This is personally my favorite but I like to mix it up a little. I might be rocking the house with her and two of her gf's at Arena one night, but the next night she's cooking borstch for me at my place. The caveat being that this girl wants to have a good time with you. If you can't show her a good time then she is either going to get bored and leave or (rarely) want money to make up for your short comings (cough...cough).
A subset of number 3 is the foreign god syndrome in the FSU. It doesn't get much play in St Pete, Moscow, Kiev or Odessa anymore but in other areas you might get some traction out of it.
Street, not to get involved in you say white, I say black discussion. But...sponsorship especially in college cities like Boston is very much alive - trust me on this one. ;) Also I disagree on the 25f-50m thing too, although rare I like to call this the Daddy syndrome, sometimes it's $ related, sometimes it isn't.
Great post. My favorite is also "the passenger", who I like to think of the aspiring kind. I like to help them as much as possible.. but without spending money on gifts, trips etc. Really if someone wants to spoil a girl it's his business. I don't spoil them too much at all though... makes me feel like a stooge. Only my very favorites get gifts at all.
Doctor_Skank
02-24-07, 01:11
Infinity, all I can do is base my outlook on my own experiences which are markedly different then yours. Odessa is nice, well so was Atlantic City in the 70's. I think you will find anyone hard pressed to describe Odessa anything other then a 3rd rate resort town, sorry for calling your home crap, but it is and having lived overseas you already know that. Phoenix or Tampa two very provincial American cities that you decry outstrip Odessa in every category EXCEPT for the amount of hot Russian/Ukrainian girls It would be foolish for anyone to even attempt to argue otherwise. And, as a side note, if you know how to play the game you can find many hot Ukrainian or Russian girls in either Tampa or Phoenix. The exception (generally) being if you are over 45. Then as Street pointed out you need to take a trip to the FSU if you are hunting the 18-25 old dyevuska.
66, I've notice there are generally three types of girls interested in money (or what it buys) for sex, due to the social/economic nature of the FSU this tends to be hyper-exaggerated.
One, the xxx/hr pro, she trades sex for money on a timed basis, that's it, you might get some traction with her the more time (money) you spend with her but don't count on it.
Two, the semi pro, very popular in the FSU due to the economy; She's going to rock your world and might even be a gf but it's going to cost you something - allowance, coat, apartment, car, whatever. It's always best if you get the particulars and ground rules out of the way first. But due to the dynamic nature of the relationship this can be hard and will always cause problems either way. Relationships like this generally have an expiration date (so read the packaging carefully) but are good for a couple or few months fun.
Third, the passenger, she figures you are an upscale dude and wants access to the places you go, along with a free ride of course. You spend on items of the moment for you and her and that is it. Something like this might actually turn into a real relationship. Of course you always have the 'does she like me for me' problem or is it all about the lifestyle. This is personally my favorite but I like to mix it up a little. I might be rocking the house with her and two of her gf's at Arena one night, but the next night she's cooking borstch for me at my place. The caveat being that this girl wants to have a good time with you. If you can't show her a good time then she is either going to get bored and leave or (rarely) want money to make up for your short comings (cough...cough).
A subset of number 3 is the foreign god syndrome in the FSU. It doesn't get much play in St Pete, Moscow, Kiev or Odessa anymore but in other areas you might get some traction out of it.
Street, not to get involved in you say white, I say black discussion. But...sponsorship especially in college cities like Boston is very much alive - trust me on this one. ;) Also I disagree on the 25f-50m thing too, although rare I like to call this the Daddy syndrome, sometimes it's $ related, sometimes it isn't.
Great post. My favorite is also "the passenger", who I like to think of the aspiring kind. I like to help them as much as possible.. but without spending much money on gifts, no trips etc. I suppose it depends on the definition of "much" money. Is $100 "much"? Maybe in Odessa, but certainly not in Moscow. Taking them to a theater or ballet performance can be great too, it's fun to see what they come up with when you say "wear something nice". Some show up and you think "o God, this girl needs to read less "Teen" and more "Elle".... but the vast majority manage to conjure up something really nice. It's great being out with a hot chick.
Only my very favorites get more than just token gifts at all though.
Really if someone wants to spoil a girl it's his business. I don't spoil them too much at all though... makes me feel like a stooge. I prefer to give them a glimpse of the glam lifestyle of nice clubs, restaurants etc. The only thing preventing a non-local occasional visitor from really being able to have lifestyle is a car and nice pad.
Kiev has nice rental pads, at least by Kiev standards. Moscow doesn't have any rental apartments that are going to impress anybody. The only thing that sometimes impresses is location. There are many, many downtown locations... just lacking quality of style and equipment.
And cars... that is a headache. Riding around in Volgas and Zhigulis was nostalgically hip and cool in the '90s up until about 2003, but it's getting to be quite embarassing now... especially when a well-dressed foreigner gets out. Kind of comical in the we're laughing at you not with you sort of way, at least in the capitals Moscow and Kiev.
I am intrigued by the idea of taking a girl on a short holiday just to have a fun and a sexy companion. I've done it in the past with "serious" girlfriends and really enjoyed it. It was so much more fun sharing the experience and then banging away all night. Russian and Ukrainian girls love to fuck.
Street Sleuth
02-24-07, 02:04
Dr. Skank,
You bring up an issue of interest to me...cars in FSU. There are lots of ways to impress local women, but a car is downright incomparable, and it opens up lots of other adventures.
The problem being, many of the adventures, I suspect, wouldn't be of the fun kind. I see traffic cops stopping cars all over the place. One American guy in new in Odessa, over there for some time, with a company car, says he gets stopped minimum once per week (but he has foreign plates....).
Anyone have experience here with a car in FSU?
If/when I'm back, and know I'll be back for a year or more, I'd really like to have a car, but want to explore all the issues....problems with registration for a foriegner? Insurance problems/costs? Taxes? Theft?
As for type of car - I really think the main issue is to just have a car, which in itself is scarce (compared to the U.S. where everyone has a car, and the issue becomes, 'what kind of car do you drive?').
Street Sleuth
02-24-07, 02:14
Cruiser,
I have definitely noticed that the 18-22 year old girls in FSU are more excited about dating a foreign guy than the older girls (by older I mean 24-28). The 29+ girls start to be easier again, due to desperation as a result of being single at 30 (a big no-no for FSU girls).
My take is their excitement and ease is due to their inexperience with men in general, the desire to brag to their friends that they have a foreign boyfriend, and their naivety about what may come out of a relationship with a foreign guy, though there are certainly many factors at play.
he older girls have likely been burned many times already (during their younger years), and are skeptical of us expats, and they have become more serious (looking for marraige, versus a night out to a good restaurant and nightclub). Foreigners have become viewed as only interested in a good-time (short to very-short relationships)....which is largely true :)
This is all of interest to me, as I generally prefer the 24-28 year old girls, but actually have more luck with the young ones :(. Well, ok, its nothing to get all depressed about :).
Bez Bezarra
02-24-07, 14:08
cars in FSU.
The problem being I see traffic cops stopping cars.
American guy in Odessa with a company car gets stopped
once per week he has foreign plates.
Anyone have experience with a car in FSU?
In USA, cop pulls you over, gives you ticket, you mail your payment
to the courthouse.
In every other country in the world, you pay the cop and he keeps it.
FSU cops make 85% of their salary pulling people over, its called
extortion/bribery. Its the system. What's the mystery?
Foreign plates are bonus, they don't argue as much over a bigger fine,
because they are on business and don't have time to haggle, and
definitely don't want to get hauled down to HQ for trouble.
Anyone who has foreign plates on his car in the FSU also has an invisible sign that says, please pull me over. First thing you should do is get local plates ASAP. This will eliminate 80% of the problems.
Also if you have a very expensive car cops are extremly less likey to pull you over in the FSU, even if you are doing something wrong. They don't want to fuck with anyone who might be able to fuck with them.
Doctor_Skank
02-24-07, 14:56
Anyone who has foreign plates on his car in the FSU also has an invisible sign that says, please pull me over. First thing you should do is get local plates ASAP. This will eliminate 80% of the problems.
Also if you have a very expensive car cops are extremly less likey to pull you over in the FSU, even if you are doing something wrong. They don't want to fuck with anyone who might be able to fuck with them.
Good advice on the foreign plates, but I see expensive cars pulled over all the time in Moscow.. the cops know those guys have the money to pay decent bribes. I Ukraine or in the provinces, the cops don't fuck with expensive cars as much. Too dangerous for them. Big city Moscow cops aren't as easily intimidated.
A big factor is race. Dark-skinned guys, especially those looking Georgian or Armenian, get pulled over all the time, expensive car or not.
It's about leverage. If the cops think they have it, especially with foreigners and Caucasians, they try to exploit it.
Street Sleuth
02-24-07, 16:02
I definitely agree, and understand, the whole issue with paying bribes here and there to the traffic cops - annoying, but unavoidable (even if limited by having local plates). I mentioned the same thing to the guy (with the foreign plates) - it was a company car, not registered by him, nothing he could do about it.
I also saw uppety model cars getting pulled over often in Odessa. I guess its a real existential dillema for the cops, "they've got cash, but, then again, do they have influence?".
I'm not really worried about the random 'fines' though - this is to be expected. But what about other issues - how bad is car theft? Insurance?
Then again, I am basing this on my own circumstances. I guess it would make more sense for a guy that is, say 45+ years old, trying to score with a 25 year old beauty, to shell out cash/gifts. The more good-hearted girls, looking for a decent guy, will rarely agree to date a guy more than 10 years (+/-) older than her.From my personal experience with Latvian and Lithuanian girls, and as a recently post mid 20's male, I totally agree with you. On MOST occassions, the only reason a girl is willing to be with you with such an age difference, comes down to financial support ie. sponsorship, gifts, free nights out etc... But this shouldn't affect most of you guys anyway because you aren't really here for marraige materials anyway right? Just to fuck as many hot girls half your age and legal to pop.
Some have been known to even get married (look at Donal Trump) but of course, in general, this is the time where "they learned to love after..." sort of like arranged marriages in places like India because it's beneficial economically or professionally. The amazing thing is that arranged marriages have a 80% chance of success. Though I still don't advocate this practice because I'm not a struggler in a third world country that needs to do this in order to move up the economic ladder.
Even more to the point - such relationships (25 year old hot girl with wealthy 50 year old) - are downright rare in the U.S./Western Europe. It just isn't socially accepted. This is certainly one of the upsides to Eastern Europe - though it does have its limits. Like I said, a true relationship between a young girl and an old guy based on nothing more than liking the guy isn't going to happen anywhere in the world.Man, Anna Nicole Smith would beg to differ with that comment. She really wanted to convince the world it had nothing to do with all that oil money. It was all about love, honest!
Infinity, all I can do is base my outlook on my own experiences which are markedly different then yours. Odessa is nice, well so was Atlantic City in the 70's. I think you will find anyone hard pressed to describe Odessa anything other then a 3rd rate resort town, sorry for calling your home crap, but it is and having lived overseas you already know that. Phoenix or Tampa two very provincial American cities that you decry outstrip Odessa in every category EXCEPT for the amount of hot Russian/Ukrainian girls It would be foolish for anyone to even attempt to argue otherwise. And, as a side note, if you know how to play the game you can find many hot Ukrainian or Russian girls in either Tampa or Phoenix. The exception (generally) being if you are over 45. Then as Street pointed out you need to take a trip to the FSU if you are hunting the 18-25 old dyevuska.
Cruiser ... you said you've never been to Odessa before, so how can you personally speak from experience? The stance by Dr. Skank and yourself on this issue has even gotten me to reconsider my hit list from 'Odessa, Kiev, Moscow' to 'Moscow, Kiev, Odessa'. Ah well, I'll find out myself when I move over there! I just hope when you speak with those views, you have also taken into consideration that not everyone is on the same level of playing field as the All Star mongers/freebies players eg. money, time, game.
You know where I'm from so this is just my curiosity... why is there a large population of Russian/Ukrainian in Tampa and Phoenix? I thought Arizona's immigrants are mostly from the south ie. Mexico.
Quite honestly, I wouldn't go that far, but did notice a downturn in overall quality last year. I think the top circles are going to more exotic and classier places to get a tan.To places like Marbella perphaps? Man, you people suck, Odessa is turning all muddy before I've even set my foot in for the first time. At the rate this seems to be going, I'm just gonna have to bring my 'A' game up a few notches and hit up Moscow and Kiev.
Doctor_Skank
02-24-07, 23:06
To places like Marbella perphaps? Man, you people suck, Odessa is turning all muddy before I've even set my foot in for the first time. At the rate this seems to be going, I'm just gonna have to bring my 'A' game up a few notches and hit up Moscow and Kiev.
No sweat Saunter, it's still a fun place in the summer. My point is that Ukrainians and Russians with the means (the cash) definitely look to more exclusive "elitny" places, whether it's Marbella, Goa, Thailand, Brazil or whereever. Most of the Russians I know from more elite circles don't think much of Odessa at all. Ukrainians are generally more positive about it.
Odessa will still offer you plenty to look at and lots of partying in the summer... but do bring good game, it's not inherently easier than Moscow or Kiev. In my opinion Kiev and Moscow are actually easier places to score (probably just a businessman's perspective), but both Moscow and Kiev are slow in the summer... much of the talent takes holidays somewhere.
Bring an open mind to Odessa and don't read too much into what's posted here... there is such a mix of perspectives and experiences that it's tough to get a grasp on the city that way. Your experience will be individual anyway.
whether it's Thailand whereever.
Two russians tourists killed in Pattaya.
http://www.pattayadailynews.com/shownews.php?IDNEWS=0000002484
Fuck
What kind of freak can kill two babies like those ?
:(
The answer to your question: they were obviously killed by members of the Russian mob as a payback for something they or their friends were involved in. Thais could be perfectly capable of doing this, but I don't think they were involved.
Doctor_Skank
02-25-07, 01:13
The answer to your question: they were obviously killed by members of the Russian mob as a payback for something they or their friends were involved in. Thais could be perfectly capable of doing this, but I don't think they were involved.
Exactly. Cute or not, they had the wrong "friends".
What this has to do with Odessa is beyond me.
this is exactly my situation.
as a late-40's average guy on a moderate expense account, i have to take the heady wine of dr. skank (and other stars) reports with some water, or a grain of salt, or whatever. so i feel i will have to be a little more generous and more focused to make it with really desirable dyevs, or even stay down-market where i get more traction with what i have to offer. for example, it doesn't seem realistic to think that i can score with hot 20-somethings without providing some kind of material/lifestyle incentive. i'm still going to try sometimes, but for the most part i will rely on strategic incentives.
all the same, i think i have learned a lot from here and the little bit of experience i have had in ee so far. i am setting up a layered strategy for my next trip, covering a variety of quality, age and cost scenarios, to see what works best and what feels best for me. i think i will succeed in all categories (blonde bombshells, sexy 7s, over 30s) but it will be thinner pickings than some of the success stories we see here.
so it always useful to do a reality check of what's realistic for us, given our own limitations. however, the best advice, repeated often by the experts here, is that attitude and confidence can carry you a long way, relative to your other limitations.
while we are talking about scoring in nyc or la or london or paris, i have to say that i am really disappointed with the forums (okay, i know it's fora) for western european and american/canadian cities. it is all escort services and massage parlours. isn't anyone trying to score freebies or divorceés (or even semi-pros) in these cities? sure, we will have to adjust our sites and expectations a bit (or a lot) but surely there is some action out there and some intelligence on strategies and locales to be shared.
we should set up a separate thread within ukraine or russia to tap into all the expertise the serious mongers here have when they are operating out of the fsu!
i had a quick trip to paris lined up a couple of weeks ago, and when i read the paris forum it was pretty damned discouraging! same for geneva and zurich, unless you like buying vastly overpriced drinks for strippers.
my little scheme to import ee talent did not pan out in the timeframe available, but i planted some seeds and think i will be able to feast next time. i got some useful advice from a couple of guys in this forum, but the paris group is a bust!gent,
the best hint i can give you is to look for the lounges of the hotels with agreements with the major airlines, and latinaoamerican and fsu airlines desreve special look. nothing better than a crowd of hostesses to play the game. good times and bad times of course, but on the long term the likelihood to bang in the same night is at least 30%. additionally i got a lot of phone numbers with some successful follow up:) typical the hotels are of the hilton, inn, sheraton chain. i figured out many times just while chatting with the hostesses (the old ones, the youngest will never tell you) or the stewards during the flights. of course you have to look for reasonable targets. hard to score gals more than 10-15 years younger than you or with the ones sitting with pilots. nevertheless there is a significant chance to acquaint with a cute in the 8-9 range if you really can live without [CodeWord900] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord900):) as you say self confidence and expertise are a must to play "our game".
last summer i had for free a very cute stewardess of ukr. airlines in paris. well, to be honest i had to pay some bar bills, but i consider this a rule of the game. i met her in the lounge of the hilton close to the eiffel tower.
in zurich a good option are both the renaissance in glattburg, and downtown, but for some reason i've not found there the hostess crowd all the times. in this case a good spot is a nightbar called "adagio" where you can find a lot of divorecees and 30s 40s women looking for a bang (and some professional hooker). found using the magic words in the city guide you typically find in the hotels desks: "crowd over 30s". never been on geneva
my personal best practice is the inn at ballpark in houston, that seems to be the meeting point of all the hostess of the world. i am not able to explain why, but i scored any time i was there with cuties from all over the world. unfortunately houston is not on my route so often as i would like.
all the best
Moscow and Kiev are slow in the summer... much of the talent takes holidays somewhere.Suits me fine as I can take a break holidaying somewhere else with my girl and circle of close friends ;)
Bring an open mind to Odessa and don't read too much into what's posted here... there is such a mix of perspectives and experiences that it's tough to get a grasp on the city that way. Your experience will be individual anyway.Yeh, I am hoping my results won't be too shabby. I can easily go for college types as their same hip-age range or bring my game up a bit and hit the town like a businessman. But of course, I'm sure there's much I can learn from real 'AAA' business gamers like yourself :)
My point is that Russians with the means (the cash) definitely look to more exclusive "elitny" places, whether it's Marbella, Goa, Thailand, Brazil or whereever.
.What this has to do with Odessa is beyond me.Didn't you write about Russians vacationers going to Thailand ?
My post was just a - very sad - parenthesis on the topic.
The answer to your question: they were obviously killed by members of the Russian mob as a payback for something they or their friends were involved in. Thais could be perfectly capable of doing this, but I don't think they were involved.One girl takes one bullet in the arm and three in the stomach, and the other gets one in the back ?
Doesn't appear to be a russian mafia hit, but a very amateur style. Probably they upseted some Thai thug, or maybe simply they bruised someones homicidal ego.
Doctor_Skank
02-25-07, 13:37
One girl takes one bullet in the arm and three in the stomach, and the other gets one in the back ?
Doesn't appear to be a russian mafia hit, but a very amateur style. Probably they upseted some Thai thug, or maybe simply they bruised someones homicidal ego.News is saying it was a Thai that murdered them, a guy who rented beach chairs and had argued with the two girls earlier that evening. Thais are generally very calm and seek to avoid any open conflict... however when they do "lose face" and argue publically, they can go absolutely berserk. In any case, RIP.
Explorer69
02-26-07, 01:16
Maybe I am stupid, but I don't understand what these last postings have to do with Odessa?
Bring an open mind to Odessa and don't read too much into what's posted here... there is such a mix of perspectives and experiences that it's tough to get a grasp on the city that way. Your experience will be individual anyway.I think wherever you go, people will always be left with varying impressions. I have had the priveledge to visit most major FSU cities, even including Minsk and to be perfectly honest would say that I like Odessa the best. My second favorite is St. Petersburg, but the two can't be compared. St. Pet is basically one large museum and overall you feel like you've stepped into a city with incredible history, odessa is more like the tijuana of Ukraine with lots of clubs, nice cafes and restaraunts especially in the summer. There are lots of beaches, although the best ones are not in the city limit but about 30 minutes away. The center of odessa is nice, very compact and can be navigated by foot, it actuallys reminds me a bit of a really run down mini paris. There are roaming packs of dogs and cats all over the place, but they are harmless. I am the type of person that actually likes the rugged aspect of things and don't care much for the ritz and shininess, but I am strange in that way. I don't care what anyone says, the number of amazing looking women there is absurd, at least the times I had been there, maybe I got lucky. How easy it is to score with them is a different question but based on personal experience, if you can score in your native country you should score a freebie in odessa consistently.
Some people really like Moscow, but I would need to be clinically insane to ever want to spend prolonged periods of time there. The city is massive, stressful and people are incredibly rude to each other, even by FSU standards. BUT it appeals to some, I'll never get it.
The major issue is that most people will form opinions about a city based on just a few experiences they encounter. My buddies went to Rio a few months ago and got their luggage stolen by a cab driver right after they got out of the airport. After that their trip went well I guess but they came back cursing Rio to pieces, saying what a hole it is and how horrible everything is and it is purely based on this one sour experience. Is Rio truly horrible, probably not but they will probably go through their whole life saying how horrible that city is.
Doctor_Skank
02-26-07, 10:52
would say that I like Odessa the best. ..odessa is more like the tijuana of Ukraine with lots of clubs, nice cafes and restaraunts especially in the summer. ... I am the type of person that actually likes the rugged aspect of things and don't care much for the ritz and shininess, but I am strange in that way.Strange or not, that is exactly the right attitude for success in FSU.
Moscow is glam, Kiev a little bit so as well, Pitr is "improving" rapidly, but the rest of FSU is pretty much a shithole in terms of structure, maintenance and service, but that still doesn't stop us from enjoying it.
BTW, when FSU finally (if ever) gets up to 2nd world or 1st world levels, it will have lost a lot of it's charm for me. Enjoy the decrepit FSU while it lasts.
Street Sleuth
02-26-07, 17:22
Strange or not, that is exactly the right attitude for success in FSU. Enjoy the decrepit FSU while it lasts... :)I wholeheartedly agree with both of those (connected) comments.
The situation is already changing rapidly - aka, all the new Western style high-rises being built all over (including Kiev). I even saw new high rise apartments/condos being built in Izmail!
The biggest charm of all, naturally, is the woman-factor. As the economies of the FSU improve, the local women become progressively more difficult (or local competition increases, whichever way you want to look at it).
I am personally already annoyed by the level of development in the bigger cities - what does it do for us? It makes everything more expensive, the women more difficult, and, in the end, relative to the U.S., its still basically a pit - there is just no benefit for us (I would never want to live in one of the new high rise developments in the outskirts, for example).
LifeSavour
03-02-07, 16:04
What western style? These apartments ARE not and will never be Western Style as long as the local 'government' owns / controls the common ground and areas (like the hallways)!
IF, someone would come here and offer true quality. Workmanship. WEST Style. They would rock!
I can't & don't want to work that HARD!
Even $500, 000 flats don't hold a candle to good ol' Iowa standards.
LS Guy
I wholeheartedly agree with both of those (connected) comments.
The situation is already changing rapidly - aka, all the new Western style high-rises being built all over (including Kiev). I even saw new high rise apartments/condos being built in Izmail!
The biggest charm of all, naturally, is the woman-factor. As the economies of the FSU improve, the local women become progressively more difficult (or local competition increases, whichever way you want to look at it).
I am personally already annoyed by the level of development in the bigger cities - what does it do for us? It makes everything more expensive, the women more difficult, and, in the end, relative to the U.S., its still basically a pit - there is just no benefit for us (I would never want to live in one of the new high rise developments in the outskirts, for example).
Sevastopol1
03-03-07, 11:22
If you look a bit deeper and inspect the new builds (check the electrics, heating system, walls (interior and exterior) etc) you will see how good the quality is! Russian engineering at it's best, not a surprise they didn't get to the moon!
I have just gutted a new build (all services) and started again, I am not even going to try and explain the communial areas (big yuk).
I wholeheartedly agree with both of those (connected) comments.
The situation is already changing rapidly - aka, all the new Western style high-rises being built all over (including Kiev). I even saw new high rise apartments/condos being built in Izmail!
The biggest charm of all, naturally, is the woman-factor. As the economies of the FSU improve, the local women become progressively more difficult (or local competition increases, whichever way you want to look at it).
I am personally already annoyed by the level of development in the bigger cities - what does it do for us? It makes everything more expensive, the women more difficult, and, in the end, relative to the U.S., its still basically a pit - there is just no benefit for us (I would never want to live in one of the new high rise developments in the outskirts, for example).
The government generally doesn't own the common area of new developments - it's more of a US condo association thing. Of course the problem being in the Ukraine is you pay the fee and some one steals it.
The work done on new construction is generally very bad. It depends on who the construction manager is. Look at Mandarin Plaza - the place is falling apart. Globus 1+3 however seem to be well constructed - the owners are looking to sell for around 200mil if anyone is interested. One of my buddies lives in a new hi rise and it’s amazing how the place is deteriorating so quickly. Buying a new construct in Kiev is like buying a new suit in Metrograd – you are going to pay a lot of money for something of very questionable value.
Older construction seems to hold up well to natural gas explosions and it's amazing how many load bearing walls you can remove from your apartment before the floors above you collapse.
I am sure there are antiquated building codes that no one follows anyway.
Street Sleuth
03-03-07, 17:15
I've never done any inspections of the FSU new builds - well, actually once, at a townhouse development (first of its kind in the city) in St. Petersburg. The biggest guffaw I saw there - the developer built one master heating system for the whole complex - it looked like a smallish factory, with a smokestack shooting out of it - they still haven't gotten away from 'central heating'...it was a real shocker. You'd think, for a hundred-million dollar project, of the kind that no Russians had ever done before (with American developers/engineers/architects having done thousands of townhouse developments), they would have brought in some outside expertise - alas, Russian arrogance wins out over practicality and reason, yet again....
I would indeed be very leary of new-build construction in FSU - I've done a good bit of construction in the US, so know the business, and the nuances - the biggest being 'city inspections'. The way things work in the FSU, following procedures, and installing electric/plumbing/hvac to code would be of little help in getting past city inspectors - the focus would be more on, well, bribes.
The result being - you can't really trust the quality of construction. As much as I hate the permitting and inspection process in the US, it is the only way to keep builders straight.
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