Same solution to many issues
The ongoing GT debate as with similar ones in the past points out yet again as noted by Captain Dan that there is a one size fits all solution to many mongering issues.
We are fortunate to have ISG and other forums that focus on our hobby to alert us to issues such as GT. There is always the unfortunate monger that receives such treatment and if not self inflicted should receive our sympathy along with a mental tickmark on our next travels. We could be the next one.
But to add,
poor service from a provider at any locale ?
unpleasant attitudes by providers, clubs or service providers in general no matter in what business ?
The answer to all of the above is simply be informed and exercise your discretion by hitting them where it most hurts - in the pocket book.
Nothing gets attention if it is possible to get attention by a conscious decision spoken or unspoken and in the case of providers attached with a civil, No Thank You. If it doesn`t get attention, too bad, but then again you have not ecouraged or subsidised bad behaviour with your time and hard earned cash and probably will spend your time and Euros with a provider or club that does. In any event, their loss and not yours.
There are so many delightful venues and providers waiting and eager for your patronage why waste your time and money on those that don`t.
One mistake: shame on them and let other fellow travellers know about it. Repeat the same mistake: shame on me.
E.
[QUOTE=Captain Dan]I empathise with your position regarding [b]GT[/b], but I would not be too confident about the practicality of your suggestion. :confused:
There are plenty of other good clubs in the area with a less restrictive door policy.
Best to just go to another club and spend your money in a place where you are welcome.
[b]CD[/b][/QUOTE]
A brief history of the GT door policy discussion
Hi there,
Please provide a reference for the VV shill you uncovered. As I remember, you and your crew were trying to organize a boycott of VV back then over an incident that may or may not have occurred as written. There are conflicting accounts of what transpired.
[url]http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showpost.php?p=757190&postcount=71[/url]
[url]http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showpost.php?p=759117&postcount=84[/url]
[url]http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showpost.php?p=759940&postcount=94[/url]
For the record, I have not patronized VV since 2008, not because I am boycotting the place, but rather I did not care for the line up back then. It would be hard for anyone to accuse me of being a VV shill. I might give them another try this summer.
[QUOTE=Fkk Lover]All I'm saying is that THIS TIME, all you guys slinging invectives at each other MAY HAVE wasted alot of energy on a bogus event, and should perhaps be directing your venoms at another party for making you do so...[/QUOTE]
Anything is possible, although his post seem consistent with previous posts on this subject. I also have direct personal experience with this occurring, so I find his post credible as a couple of key details are consistent with my experience. See second paragraph in the following report.
[url]http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showthread.php?p=749627&highlight=drugs#post749627[/url]
While Brad Knot does not have a posting history, I found his post more credible than some senior members with a history of lying on the forum. But this all misses the point. The invectives that were slung, for the most part had little to do with whether Brad Knot was excluded or not. I got a good belly laugh out of your insinuation the post could have been the work of a shill for VV. I found the insinuation a little “tin foil hat”. If one were a shill for VV, a more effective strategy would be to, oh I don't know, maybe, post positive reviews of VV on ISG? If one decides not to go to GT, there are many other options in the area other than VV. If the Brad Knot post was fabrication, I would think the most likely explanation would be that he was trying to re-ignite a old flame war. This topic seems to be the easiest way to do so.
The issue that got out of hand was the back and forth from a member of your crew who previously threatened to out another board member. It only came about because he decided to use this incident to resume posting. He would have likely resumed posting anyway, irrespective of whether Brad Knot posted his post. So whether Brad Knot’s post was credible or not is not relevant to the fracas that ensued.
Anyway, I thought I would it would be good to take a stroll down memory lane on reaction to reports of being denied entry to GT by your crew. There seems to have been an evolution of theories regarding the GT door policy:
1) GT does not exclude based on race
2) GT excludes to keep the out the “riff raff”
3) GT excludes to keep out the pimps. Albanians and Turks are usually mentioned even though more often than not the gentleman having been excluded was of African or Indian descent.
You seemed to have arrived at a new, novel theory:
4) Posters complaining about being excluded from GT may be shills for VV and are not to be trusted.
Some references are in order:
1) GT does not exclude based on race
[QUOTE=Dedalus] …Of course they know me at those places, but it is kind of an honor thing, and say what you want to about GT's occasional door policy (which by the way, has less to do with skin color or country of origin than it does with guessing who will conduct themselves in a respectful manner) but they do generally maintain a clientele who know what is right and what is wrong, and are discreet without needing to have a rule book shoved in their faces… [/QUOTE][url]http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showpost.php?p=762321&postcount=3160[/url]
2) GT excludes to keep the out the “riff raff”
[QUOTE=Dedalus]I do believe that they are trying to keep out the riff-raff and IMHO they do a pretty decent job of it.[/QUOTE][url]http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showthread.php?p=762855&highlight=riff-raff#post762855[/url]
3) GT excludes minorities to keep out the pimps. Albanians and Turks are usually mentioned even though more often than not the gentleman having been excluded was of African or Indian descent.
[QUOTE=Dedalus]Thirdly, Henio makes a very good and important point when he says that the GT door policy has a lot to do with the girls wishes and notions about men of certain ethnic and religious backgrounds. It is a common stereotype here in German that the majority of pimps are either Albanian or Turkish. While clearly not all pimps in German are Turkish or Albanian, quite a few are. Also quite a few Turkish and Albanian pimps, or pimp wannabes like to troll bars, discos AND FKK and Sauna clubs looking for meal tickets.[/QUOTE][url]http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showpost.php?p=790098&postcount=734[/url]
Other than the shill factor, I’m curious why your crew seem so insistent in denying what has been reported by multiple posters on the forum. Is it as simple as the shill factor at work? I know the one of the posters I have quoted above has met one of the ISG members who was turned away at the GT door. I would be curious as to whether he believed he was turned away because he was thought to be “riff-raff” or mistaken for a Turkish or Albanian pimp?
Only two (or three) more posts to go until I return to self imposed lurker status.
Regards,
EL
A small clarification about the "boycott"
[QUOTE=Ekliges Lauern][/LURKER MODE]Hi there,
I have to break my self-imposed exile to comment on this post as it was one of the funniest posts I had read in quite a while.
Aren’t you forgetting another “esteemed member” you “roll” with. Begins with Irish and ends with Pussyman. Feel free to correct me if I’m wrong...
...As I remember, you and your crew were trying to organize a boycott of VV back then over an incident that may or may not have occurred as written. There are conflicting accounts of what transpired.
EL[/QUOTE]Hey, he's back! Nice to have your imput, EL, once again, even if for a brief cameo appearance. And it is nice to see both from you, and FKK Lover, a high-road tone, devoid of any profane language or put-downs. Both of you are clearly gentlemen, something we can all learn from and model our posting behaviour with your examples in mind...Bravo to both of you!
About the comments of "rolling" with various "esteemed" members: Hey, not too long ago, when I was lucky to be in the same club at the same time as Dedalus, Henio, Beffen, etc. I used to "roll" with those great guys. Does that mean I can be "esteemed" too? or at least a "used-to-be-esteemed." Anyway, all of those guys are great to "roll" with and I hope maybe we'll be lucky in a couple of weeks to overlap...???
Actually, if my memory serves, it was I (often very stoned Ortos) who initially called for a boycott of this place, not Dedalus or Henio, who simply reported that when they tried to make a (imho very legitimate) complaint and objection about there being a photographer snapping pictures right and left at the VV party a couple of years back, the manager was missing the whole point and abruptly suggested they leave the club if they didn't like it! So reading this --and I personally believe every word that they posted, knowing the honour and integrity of the individuals involved-- I kind of shouted out on the board "Boycott the fucking club!" So I don't think that even the people involved who were badly treated by the club and somewhat victimised by this event, themselves ever called for a boycott. It was me, and I was not altogether serious...just pissed off that my "rolling mates" were so arrogantly dealt with when they were (again, imho) clearly in the right.
I would only add that now that I am older and wiser, I probably would not call for said boycott, esp as (to be honest) I've never even visited VV...yet!
O