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Hi Intransit,
I also have had some good, bad and ugly expereinces with Chinese GFs. I have to agree with you in that the Chinese girl is looking for something much different in her husband than a western girl, that is basically financial support. In the case of non-Chinese passport holders, your passport is also a valuable asset. No matter how much love there is, the money issue is always hanging in their minds.
Chinese girls are not money hungry, they are just living in a society that doesn't give them the same oppotunities as men. Therefore they need a man to make sure they and their familes will be OK.
Maybe this is changing in the big cities, but I would warn all foreign guys in China that when fkng around with Chinese girls, especially an unmarried girl under 28 that you need to have an escape from relationship "ejector seat" ready to go.
On the other hand, divorced women in their late 20s are often really just looking for fun (and sex), and these are in my opinion much more rewarding targets.
Also now that there are Chechen girls working at Maggies I try to remain better behaved there.
My Two Cents....
My feeling now is that some girls fall into the following categories:
1. "appreciative" of a guy who has his sh*t together.
2. Appreciative of how a Westerner treats them (or so they seem to believe that 99% of chinese men wont treat them well)
3. Some are in it for status and money that they imagine us expats have. (i don't know about you all, but I am not loaded, however I guess I have more than the average chinese gal. I have seen where they often live.
4. I have met some who are fresh out of a long relationship and they want me to be their alcohol. They drown themselves and forget their sorrows in the sack with me! -you know.. I just want to help!! ;-)
The reality is you all need to use some real serious gut instinct. If you can't walk into a street market, buy some things at the same price as a local, you probably have not refined your senses enough to weed out the wrong kind of girl. - Or if you dont care, you are ahppy to play with some snobby, money grubbbing shanghainese chick. That is fine, as long as you don't live in some dilusion that it is real love.
blanknamecruiser
Changshu and Blanky and other brothers,
I apologize that I deleted my original post from this board. I had it in the Beijing section, and it seemed a bit untoward when I re-read it. However, I should have left it in the Living in China section. I recreate it below at least in spirit if not in actual text.
Gents, the other night I had a deep discussion with a friend of mine at Maggie's. As we watched the pool balls roll to and fro, he told me that he intended to move back in with his longtime girlfriend, from whom he has lived apart for over a year now. His move is motivated not by thinking this woman is the greatest thing since sliced bread, but because he feels guilty that she is so depressed all the time that they're not together, that she's having a tough time at her job, etc, in other words numerous reasons that do not primarily relate to "I love this woman more than life itself and can't bear to imagine a future without her."
This woman has never given up her intentions to be with him, despite his moving out and his "active" life during their time apart. He even told me that he would marry her as long as he could still have some fun on the side or one or two weeks per year where he could travel alone.
I respect my friend and I respect his decision. I know what it's like to have history with someone and to care about them, even to love them, without wanting to be with them full-time.
What I want to emphasize here is that women in China play to win. Through a combination of guilt, history, occasional sex, and other tools, this woman undermined my friend's ability to enjoy his freedom, and has now gotten him to the point where he is willing to essentially give up his life to her in exchange for some occasional furtive fun. These women are focused on securing their future. That doesn't mean they don't love you, but it means they are after something specific and they fully intend to get it. They play hardball. Their eyes remain on the prize.
I have too many friends whose balls are resting in jars that their wives are holding onto, who have to ask permission to play on sports teams and to spend money that THEY, the men, earned. Fuck that. I'm all for equality, but I'm not for abuse.
Be careful, gentlemen. Chinese women are great girlfriends, but my experience and research shows they are shit wives. As soon as that wedding banquet ends, you are expected to be a leader, a provider, and a father. Your role as lover and friend is over. Don't forget that.
Intransit and others....
Wow... that is a little heavy but.... I think you are generally right.
The Chinese are extremely smart. If we lao wei's think we have them figured out, or we can out manuever, out smart, out anything.... we are right where they can get us.
Don't be so proud to deny that your girl is likely more shrewd than you.
There is a reason they survived endless bad abusive murderous governments.
There is a reason they are getting richer a hell of a lot faster than the rest of us.
Be smart. Marry if that is where your heart is, just make a few things clear.
1. You will NOT take them back to the states.
2. You do NOT have any money.
3. You do NOT want ANY kids.
(even if you do want these things, just test them)
Pretend you just lost your job. Stop spending money. Pretend every day you are out looking for a job. Change to a cheap ass apartment. See if she sticks it out. If you are too lazy to go through this trouble, you are going to pay dearly later. I sure as hell wouldnt be too lazy if the REST of my life was going to be spent with this woman.
just my 3rd cent.
blanknamecruiser
Blanky,
Interesting perspective, but I must ask one question--if we can assume they are at least as shrewd as we are, then would they fall for the "I don't have a job/don't have money/not taking you to my home country" ploy? And if we really do marry them because we love them, why would we want to do that?
Anyway Blanks, let me know next time you're in town, have met Tapioca and would like to meet the board's most senior poster.
Intransit,
I think you should stack the odds in your favor. Maybe they will not believe you at first, but keep it up. Tell me.. what is the worst that can happen?
She leaves you... Then you know it is not for real. If she doesn't care, only loves you and wants to stay with you, at least you have a little more assurance.
of course life has no guarantee. Just try.
Thanks for the invite. I hang with Tapioca all the time. He also tells me you are the King of Beijing. I would love to get together some time.
I'll PM you on my next trip to BJ.
blanknamecruiser
Blanky, good points again. You're right--if she takes a hike, then the interview process just became a lot easier, did it not?
Well, I'll settle for a Prince of Maggie's title for now...
I have been nailing a lot of freebies lately.
I have noticed clear difference. Not all girls are looking for a passport or money. As I know you know... I am ust reiterating since I am recently dating these girls.... and a lot of them at once I should add..
I seem to find that if I meet a sweet girl at a restaurant or something, you can bed them quickly if you are sincere with them, but they also will fall in love with you.
Some of these girls I am meeting by running an ad in a western magazine classisfieds. For the most part, one of the girls I met frmo this simply told me that she is out of an 8 year relationship. She wants to simply feel better.
We chat a little bit online, then I went to her home one night at 2am since we could not handle chatting and not seeing each other. Within 20 minutes we were in bed. I got a shot at night and a shot in the morning. She keeps in touch but is very mellow about everything.
there are really a lot of different kind of girls out there.
blanknamecruiser
By the way.. I am running an ad for married woman who want something on the side.
It may surprise you but I am getting alot of reply.
blanknamecruiser
I have a job offer to work in Shenzhen at a high-tech company for 5000 RMB/month for 20 hours a week, which would be about 1/10 of my USA electrical engineer salary. I can speak enough chinese to get by ok on. How crazy would it be for me to move there, and does anyone know what would be my chances to score a higher paying job somewhere else in Shenzhen or elsewhere in China? Also how much does a decent apartment in Shenzhen cost? Thanks for any info. If I move there I think I will have many experiences to contribute to this website.
Damn dude.... my rent is more than that. I think if you can fill the rest of the time teaching english or something, then you probably have a good chance to survive.
I have seen some teaching jobs pay 1,500 per month full time plus free apartment.
blanknamecruiser
Hello,
I'm going to Guangzhou region to teach english. Can anyone tell me about the action in the surrounding areas. Also, would it be easy to get freebis, like from students etc.
China 69,
I don't know what decent means to you, but you can figure RMB2k+ for anything even close to livable. Nicer places can go as much as 6k for 2-3 bedrooms. Detached villas in Shekou can be as much as 40k. So, take your pick.
5,000RMB is a local salary. In my last expat job, I paid a local guy with 3 years experience that much. Native English teachers in Shenzhen make around 7-8k with housing per month for about the same hours.
Real expat jobs are hard to come by these days as most companies would like to localize as many positions as possible. Most expats have been sent over with the company from the West rather than hired in China.
If you are looking to broaden your horizon by living in China, it may be worthwhile. If you are looking to advance your career or make a lot of money, forget about it.
Just my POV.
OAH
China 69:
I don't know if the job you're referring to does, but a lot of jobs throw in an apartment (OAH probably knows more about this than I do). I remember seeing a lot of ads for English teaching jobs that provide housing, although it may be beneath a "decent" standard as far as you're concerned.
I've heard it's harder and harder for expats to get jobs here for the reasons OAH cites. On the other hand, I see a lot of graduates from the American university I teach at landing lucrative "consulting" jobs with virtually no experience (perhaps a summer internship in the states before), so it seems like it's easier to work into a job from outside China than look for one here.