Hey Mojo,
The only result that would come from paying Colombian women $150 per hour is your Colombian friends would no longer be able to afford Colombian women.
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Hey Mojo,
The only result that would come from paying Colombian women $150 per hour is your Colombian friends would no longer be able to afford Colombian women.
Fast Eddy and China Monger,
I can answer both your questions. It's really best that you dress like Colombians do since otherwise you will be a much more noticeable target for street crime. Other forms of crime that the US government warns against (kidnapping, terrorism, etc) are blown way out of proportion (if you stay in or near the city limits of Cali).
Some rules for dress in Colombia:
- Never leave the hotel wearing shorts, sneakers or t-shirts unless it's to do some sport (tennis, mountain climbing, etc)
- Nice shoes are especially important in this culture (I have no idea why) and a belt that matches the shoes is something the women all insist on.
- Jeans are fine
- Button-down shirts are best
- I know it sounds gay, but if you really want to blend in, a Colombian necklace would help. You can buy for $2-$3 when you're down here.
-Kdog
When did I say pay Colombian working girls 150, read the post well.
Antifreezer, it would be amazing if you didn't treat these girls well after paying them less than 10 bucks. I don't doubt your decency unlike mine but I certainly don't doubt your cheap ways. And yes I know the states well and I don't think you are in no position to tell me that I should be the one to pack my bags and go there when I was born in this land which I love deeply and that's way it wires me with indignation that people whose economy is three times or more better than ours complaint about paying a woman 20 bucks for an hour. you probably had problems with getting women in your country which it's cool, not everyone is successful with that and now that you might here you think everything is overpriced.
All in all you have to learn a lot about this country, before giving an opinion about it, before calling it a 19th hundred country take the time just between having dirt cheap sex and the next trashy 10 dollar woman to study a bit about Colombia and all South America as a matter of fact.
No matter what you wear, you will likely be marked as a foriegner and a tourist. Your conduct will have a lot more to do with whether you are a target for street crime than your wardrobe.
I have travelled to both Cali and Medellin and wore shorts, t-shirts and tennis shoes almost the entire time. I had no problem getting into any club, resturaunt or other establishment and had no problems meeting women, both pro and non-pro. The key is wear what makes you comfortable and treat people nicely and with respect. Remaining alert and not putting yourself into dangerous situations is how to avoid street crime.
As far as looking like a foriegner that is exactly what makes you attractive to the Colombian women as they are anxious to get out of Colombia as there is not much of a potential for progress for women in Colombia. They love Americans and wearing something with an American flag or a well known designer like Tommy Hilfinger certainly helps. IMHO
MOJO: I sympathize with your feelings, but I would also point out this: Almost all of the nice Colombian girls I have met who are in the "business" are single mommies who were forced to sell their bodies because a Colombian man got them pregnant and then abandoned them. Thus, it would appear that it is COLOMBIAN men, not American men, who show no respect for Colombian women.
Mojo: I know antifreeze quite well and he is NOT an ugly American (they mostly go to Cartagena). He LOVES your country more than any other, as do I. He also treats the chicas pretty well, despite not wanting to pay gringo price. And I do not think YOU really want all the casas upping their rates to 50,000, do you? I doubt you pay the ridiculous prices at Flores Frescas or Kaliente either, right? Most of the chicas in the casas love foreigners because they are more likely to give propinas than Colombianos, don't you agree?
I TOTALLY agree with you that Cali does NOT need the ugly Americans mistreating the chicas; if you look in this thread back in November, Antifreeze and I exposed an ugly American "Studplayer" who wanted to molest young girls and do other nasty things and we pretty much drove him out of Cali and off this board. We want to PROTECT Cali and its chicas. So while I SUPPORT you completely in trying to protect the chicas from BAD foreigners, your attacks on Antifreeze are misdirected as he is one of the good foreigners. Paz ******.
I TOTALLY agree with Chupolongas comment as well; many Colombianas have been mistreated by Colombianos (machistas) and they DO appreciate extranjero caballeros.
Regarding the dress issue, yes most gringos look like gringos regardless how they dress, and so wearing shorts probably will not make you much more of a target for crime. It WILL, however, result in nice chicas not giving you a second look and will cause other people to look down on you like a campesino. Beach areas are the ONLY PLACE in Colombia where wearing shorts is culturally acceptable, and the WISE traveler KNOWS that by conforming to local customs one is MUCH better received. Bars & stores will not refuse you admission but be sure they WILL look down on you as a low class visitor.
That said, while I NEVER wear shorts I do wear my flipflops as they are just TOO comfortable, and sometimes the sun is just TOO BRIGHT to go without shades. I TRY and hide my feet by standing behind something when meeting chicas, however. I also think these are MUCH less offensive than wearing shorts around town.
I am not here to moralize on wether a woman should become or not a prostitute or defend Colombian men for their bad behavior. You say you disagree with women becoming prostitutes mr antifreezer, yet you love to go to them and take advantage of their situation, how easy and comfortable is for you to say "they should not become prostitutes" like if you were all informed about their lives also. I don't think that even god would put himself in that same arrogant position. However like I said I do not care to moralize on that. Secondable, americans who come here for sex or for whatever, are going to compare prices inevitably and they are going to realize that it's cheap, way cheap, so why cry. Of course you are a selfish man, mr antifreezer, you have not grown out of the anal phase that we go through as children and that some like yourself stay in their whole life. If colombia is cheap and you whine about it then you are way above the scale of being cheap, we all should come up here with a new word to define you because I really don't think there's one in the dictionary that would suit you properly. This is my whole criticism to you and to the rest with such mentality and nothing more.
I completely agree with Surfer's assessment on the dress code. The first time I was in Colombia I walked around in shorts and t-shirt and the usually sweet Colombian women actually made comments to me that I dressed poorly. Trust me, Colombian women DO NOT like the way Americans dress. This has been pointed out to me many many times in the US by Colombians there.
More recently I've found that by dressing nice by American standards isn't even enough. These women want everything matching, not a single wrinkle in your clothes, and expect your shoes to be shined every few days (this is especially important). In fact, you'll be hounded by shoe shiners up and down Avenue Sexta because it's so common (it costs less than a $1 and they do a good job).
Mojo,
Here's a direct quote from you "How much in the states do you have to pay for an hour? Minimum 150 dollars if I am not wrong. How cheaper do you want it."
Your last sentence implies $150 is cheap and that it shouldn't be lower than that.
Now if you want to post more to Antifreeze or Kdog, post to private messaging so we can stop wasting everyone else's time.
Look surfer,
There are already fixed prices in these brothels and I am not trying to suggest that they rise up the prices, I know which houses you are talking about, but some girls who might be better looking have a higher cost, I am not even talking about fresh flowers or kaliente. But even there the girls are so much better looking and some people like quality and don't care to pay more for that, they are glad to pay that, you get what you pay for. what pisses me off is the idea of cheap Americans complainting about cheap prices. If you don't have enough money to spend don't come to Colombia in the first place or much less move here. I've seen Americans complainting and making a fuss out of 1 dollar tip for two, these are the people I am not very happy to see here. I even tip though I don't have to and I don't live in the states and make dollars or anything, so you can understand why this pisses me off. I have very good American friends who can't stand these sort of people either. If an American decides to pay more than ten dollars or pay more for a better accommodation why do you have to tell him that he shouldn't just because you would prefer to be economical if not cheap rather than take quality into consideration. Some people like good stuff and they don't refrain from paying its cost and I am not talking about the gringo price that they might pull on you. If you are a loser in America, at least don't act like that here, women spot that right away and you lose points, they certainly don't like cheap foreigners.
Kdog,
I meant cheaper than 50.000 pesos, cheaper than 20 bucks.
If it's such a time wasting for you why do you reply?
Interesting to read about the dress code.
I'll be in Cartagena for Easter. You mention pants. Are polo shirts regarded as acceptable attire to the women especially at the nightclubs or bars?.
Strange how you describe clothing. I had the same encounter while in Casablanca. The tourists in shorts were American or Canadian. I'm American and I did my homework. Read a guide book for preparation. Just ordered one for Colombia. I'm also starting spanish lessons in 3 weeks.
Have a good one. Have many.
I'm packing up for a trip to Cali in a couple days to see my girl friend, but caught up by the conversation going on here. I can understand Rojo's patriotism, and his sympathy for the working Calenas, but have to agree with Chuponalgas. My girl friend has a 3 year-old daughter from her ex-boyfriend, a Caleno who has no interest to see his own baby girl, not even talking about supporting her even he knows where he can find them. I know for a fact that most of the Americans who came to Cali do treat the women here better the the local guys. Many of the girls I know here simply refuse to have a Colombian boy friend because of their irresponsibility. All these times I came to Cali, I'm deeply involved emotionally with people I met here. All I can suggest is the Colombianos should love their women more, and less on soccer.
Return to the pricing issue for working girl, A few years back, when travelling to China on business, they had a two prices policy, which make the foreigners pay way more than the local people, and this really pissed me off. I believe when in another country, nobody likes to pay more for the same merchant just because of his foreign status. Antifreeze has provided very useful and updated info on this board, though never met, just like me, Colombia holds a very special place in out hearts. Rojo, you may not believe, but I very possibly love Colombia as much as you do.
Let's discuss this topic openly here in the forum instead of having the conversation privatly. It is very helpful to understand what an educated and very likely well off Colombiano think about the Americans who come to Colombia to appreciate the Colombianas.
Expat: Cartagena is the one place where you can get away with beachwear as it is BY FAR the most casual city. Polo shirts are fine.
For a guidebook, the Footprint guide is head and shoulders about the rest. Lonely Planet's Colombia edition (the NEW one) is SO truncated that it is a disgrace to a book series that is usually pretty good (except for the feminist slant that is SO anti-Sex). If you ordered LP send it back unopened and get the Footprint Guide.
Easter is HIGH season, and HOT season, in CTG. So try and stay cool and book EARLY.
kdog is absolutely right regarding clothing in Cali (and most of SOuth-America). The reason why clothing is so important down here is that most people don't have much, and they show the little they have through clothing. So, in their womens mind, if you can't afford a good pair of shoes, then you can't afford me. So she won't give you a second look. They like to show off through their clothing. On my side, when I used to live in the US, wearing a Polo shirt seemed overkill (I didn't like to show off there), but here in Colombia, wearing an expansive piece of clothing will really increase your odds when you'll break the ice with that Colombian. In the US, everyone wears shorts since it is more appealing for women to find a man that can afford a vacation once in a while. In Colombia, they are attracted to people that are well dressed since it is more appealing to be courted by a man that has a job. It's as easy as that (and latinas are extremely conformist - the majority pretty much react the same way to bad clothing by looking the other way).
One last thing, Cali is a great spot to go cloth shopping. If you don't have good shoes, there are plenty in here for sale for a fraction of the price of the Borring States of America. So, don't feel like you need to shop at home, but reserve your first day to do that in Cali.