Blastoff,
If you quote, please don’t quote the all message and write one sentence. It takes too much space.
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Blastoff,
If you quote, please don’t quote the all message and write one sentence. It takes too much space.
[QUOTE=Blastoff] ...I invite any input and comments from all members especially those with some experience in this.[/QUOTE]
Since you asked, here's how I did it last time. (Not in Moscow, but you've got me thinking about doing it for Moscow also). Very effective and efficient method. No time-wasting chat-rooms, no hours of "seduction" emailing back and forth. I simply put an ad on expatriates.com (Dubai section) which said something like this:
___________________
Free Trip to Amsterdam.
Married guy, late 30s [okay, I lied about my age!], travelling to Amsterdam for one week next month. I'm looking for a discrete and adventurous woman to join me for fun, adventure and intimate times. I'm professional, okay looking, fit and healthy, adventurous, and fun. Will be staying in a 5-star hotel, enjoying the sights and nightlife. Come and join me! email me at xxxxx
__________________
My plan was to bring a gal from Dubai (if I could find a suitable one), but I ended up with about 20 replies from all over the world. I settled on a Paris-born-and-bred student with an Arabic background. We only exhanged about 6 emails each over a few weeks. She politely backed out a few days before we were supposed to meet, which was fine by me. But when I arrived, I sent her an email telling her I'd arrived, and if she changed her mind, to let me know. She emailed me her phone number, we chatted about 10 minutes, and she hopped on the first train to Amsterdam. Try placing an ad.
PS - here she is.
[QUOTE=Blastoff]They all talk like they want a long term relationship but that doesn’t mean much to a monger does it? :)
..... It also guarantees that they have to leave when I say because they don’t have the money to return home if I don’t pay for it.[/QUOTE]
I suppose this means you won't tell them you're not after long term relationship, while they are. If you feel like cheating naive girls looking for a way to bail out of their misery and kicking them out hitch hiking home once you've shagged them, why not. We all take advantage of the fact that some of these girls are poor and desperate, to which extend is up to each one.
[QUOTE=Piper1]Blastoff - good plan.
I will be in Moscow for a week, from about June 25. (I cancelled the St Pete part of my trip, as the pal I was going to stay with had to suddenly leave St Pete a few days ago. He came back to Dubai with a black eye. I don't believe his "skating accident" and "visa problem" story. ;))
I also dabble in the dating sites - but it takes up a hell of a lot of time (I'm doing some Dubai dating internet work currently -narrowed it down to a nice Russian and a keen Filipino, from many possible dates). Yes, the responses are usually good, but as you know, it can be hit and miss. But if they are offering to stay at your hotel (especially in their underwear ;), well that's surely a good sign. Of course they won't mention money, but they will expect something (at least gifts, and probably some "spending money").
I had success last year in Amsterdam with a gal who travelled from Paris to stay with me for the adventure and some gifts and the train fare. Good fun memories with a 20 y.o non-pro student. Now she wants to come to Dubai. Beware the baggage![/QUOTE]
This is what i am talking about. Thanks for your input. Your mention about it taking a lot of time can be valid but I have got it down to 3 emails then I ask them to stay with me and they agree. Od corse I will buy them food and some small gifts if they are nice to me but these girls come from poor areas and it does not take much to make them happy compared toa Moscow stripper LOL.
[QUOTE=Big Bro AJ]Blastoff,
Arranging girls via chat rooms is what most of us (including me) did. It’s hit and miss…As long as she lives in Moscow, it’s an adventurous way to find freebies. Arrange 2-3 girls, have a drink or late lunch (luckily most of them only eat salads or fruits), if you like each others, take her out at night and probably get laid at the second date (worst case scenario).
When you find a girl from a club/bar/tochka/internet; and don’t like her or don’t really find what you expect on sex than you only send her back. BUT, what are you gone do if you don’t like the girl you sponsor.
Besides how can you believe her that she really lives in another city. She speaks English and has access to Internet. If she is clever enough, she can easily arrange couples of guys for free summer holiday in Moscow. All she has to do is play the innocent country girl trick. I know it because it happened to me.
She will expect you to take her to fancy and popular clubs and shopping; breakfast-lunch-dinner is gone be pricey. Why do you bother yourself for sponsoring? Of course it’s your money, and none of my business; BUT as I understand this will be your first time in Moscow.
I humble think that sponsoring girls will definitely limits you and will cost you more.[/QUOTE]
Thanks for your comments. Sponsoring is not a word I am familiar with. I do NOT intend to send them money if that s what you are suggesting. The way to get rid of them if I don't like them in bed is this as I have done this in other countries. Firstly I buy her the ticket so she can come from where she is in the country to Moscow and mail it to her at her country address. This removes the possibility that if I send her cash for the ticket, she will not come and proves that she does live out of town. Secondly if I don't like her I either tell her so and send her back right away as the bus ticket is cheap or if she won't go for any reason, I move hotels and she won't find me. This is what I have done in SA before with success. Just my view.
[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]Although Big Bro's concerns are valid, I'm not quite as suspicious as he is of the girl's intentions, but you should be careful.
As internet is one of my primary sources of new talent and most girls are fairly honest, I'm not quite as suspicious as I dont think they necessarily are coming to haul in the mother lode, but I am sure they would be very disappointed if they got "nothing but cuddles" out of it.
I also think that it would only be decent to reward them somehow, as it is quite an effort for a girl to ride a shitty bus across Russia (provided they even accept this as a legit mode of transport to meet their prince), take holiday from work or school, explain to her family and friends why and how she is going to Moscow, not to mention the latent anxiety of meeting a complete stranger and having to stay with him. I also assume that the girls, at least if they are smart, have a plan B in case you turn out to be a psycho. :)
Especially if they are really innocent girls as you suggest, a fair but not overdone "reward" would be very decent.
If she looks "polished" in her internet profile... nice hair, nice clothes etc. or shows pictures of herself on holiday in Turkey or whereever, you can almost be guaranteed that she has a sponsor and probably expects a bit more than the more plain student types would. Its still not a bad idea, but there really is the question of what do you do with her if she arrives and you dont like her? Just kicking her out on the street might sound great in theory, but you may then be surprised to find out how many "brothers" and "friends" in Moscow she suddenly has.
I'd still give it a go, for sure, but really dont overschedule. I dont know how long you are planning to stay, but bussing in new girls every second day is a bit much. Remember that Moscow nightlife is an energy vampire and although you may want to spend all your nights and days in the comfort of your hotel bed with your internet maiden, I am sure the girls are going to want to go out and see the town... and its restaurants and bars. They may not necessarily want "to paint the town red" (after all it is already red) but I am sure they expect some fun. If you arent careful, you could find yourself utterly drained and desperately wanting a break, even as you drive to the bus station to pick up Olga #3... :)[/QUOTE]
Good point. I plan to stay around one month so I will have time to experience all the different modes of mongering in that time frame. This is an idea that I feel will work and if the girl I don't like suddenly has brothers in Moscow then I will do a Harry Houdini and disappear to the Ukraine or Latvia for the rest of my stay. I don't intend to be a cheap Charlie and not buy her anything but what I do intend is to buy her things proportionate to how she treats me and her income back home. If she earns $100 a month and I spend $100 on her in 3 or 4 days, she should be happy with that especially if she has not been previously spoilt with foreigners.
[QUOTE=GandJim]I suppose this means you won't tell them you're not after long term relationship, while they are. If you feel like cheating naive girls looking for a way to bail out of their misery and kicking them out hitch hiking home once you've shagged them, why not. We all take advantage of the fact that some of these girls are poor and desperate, to which extend is up to each one.[/QUOTE]
Sorry, but what you just said is complete nonsence. If a girl says she is after long-term relationships, in most cases she really believes in such a possibility and treats you another way. She may tell her parents about a nice guy she met and with who she hopes for a happy future. In most cases these girls are young and don't expect to be used and be thoughned away as dirty piece of toilet paper. And afterwards she may cry for half a year or more and not understand what wrong she had done for her lover to quit with her. That's not fare exchange for kind attitude. You may say something like: "Oh, Helena, again you, shut your mouth, life is unjust..." But guys, we all human beings. Just imagine yourself in this place, or your daughter, or sister. Would you like someone to do this to them? What would your feelings be? Ok, you want to fuck as much girls as possible. There's nothing wrong about this. Fucking is fun. And there are enough girls ready to fuck with no obligations. Both for money and free. There is no importance to cheat those who want to marry and behave like pigs. It's same as robbery, but worse, because you steal from young girls (young, because you'll hardly be able to cheat mature woman this way) believe and trust to others. It's much more worthy then several hundred dollars you plan to save.
[QUOTE=Piper1]Since you asked, here's how I did it last time. (Not in Moscow, but you've got me thinking about doing it for Moscow also). Very effective and efficient method. No time-wasting chat-rooms, no hours of "seduction" emailing back and forth. I simply put an ad on expatriates.com (Dubai section) which said something like this:
___________________
Free Trip to Amsterdam.
Married guy, late 30s [okay, I lied about my age!], travelling to Amsterdam for one week next month. I'm looking for a discrete and adventurous woman to join me for fun, adventure and intimate times. I'm professional, okay looking, fit and healthy, adventurous, and fun. Will be staying in a 5-star hotel, enjoying the sights and nightlife. Come and join me! email me at xxxxx
__________________
My plan was to bring a gal from Dubai (if I could find a suitable one), but I ended up with about 20 replies from all over the world. I settled on a Paris-born-and-bred student with an Arabic background. We only exhanged about 6 emails each over a few weeks. She politely backed out a few days before we were supposed to meet, which was fine by me. But when I arrived, I sent her an email telling her I'd arrived, and if she changed her mind, to let me know. She emailed me her phone number, we chatted about 10 minutes, and she hopped on the first train to Amsterdam. Try placing an ad.
PS - here she is.[/QUOTE]
I think a news paper add is an excellent option and an addition to the method I suggested. I will definitely do that as well to see the reaction, in fact I may arrange an add in the Moscow Ex-pat English papers soon advising the girls I will be in Moscow June and July and see what kind of reaction I get. Can some one tell me the name of the main ex-pat paper in Moscow please. I will keep you posted o the results.
[QUOTE=GandJim]I suppose this means you won't tell them you're not after long term relationship, while they are. If you feel like cheating naive girls looking for a way to bail out of their misery and kicking them out hitch hiking home once you've shagged them, why not. We all take advantage of the fact that some of these girls are poor and desperate, to which extend is up to each one.[/QUOTE]
You have misunderstood me. I would NEVER leave them on the street. Even if I hated them from the first meeting I would still pay for there trip home and give them some money. Hope that clears this up.
[QUOTE=Helena Moscow]Sorry, but what you just said is complete nonsence. If a girl says she is after long-term relationships, in most cases she really believes in such a possibility and treats you another way. She may tell her parents about a nice guy she met and with who she hopes for a happy future. In most cases these girls are young and don't expect to be used and be thoughned away as dirty piece of toilet paper. And afterwards she may cry for half a year or more and not understand what wrong she had done for her lover to quit with her. That's not fare exchange for kind attitude. You may say something like: "Oh, Helena, again you, shut your mouth, life is unjust..." But guys, we all human beings. Just imagine yourself in this place, or your daughter, or sister. Would you like someone to do this to them? What would your feelings be? Ok, you want to fuck as much girls as possible. There's nothing wrong about this. Fucking is fun. And there are enough girls ready to fuck with no obligations. Both for money and free. There is no importance to cheat those who want to marry and behave like pigs. It's same as robbery, but worse, because you steal from young girls (young, because you'll hardly be able to cheat mature woman this way) believe and trust to others. It's much more worthy then several hundred dollars you plan to save.[/QUOTE]
I hear what you are saying but there are always more than two sides to an argument. You are suggesting that all these girls are young and innocent with good morals. I am suggesting that just as many of these girls are scammers and will lie and cheat me if they can as there are good ones amongst them.
Most of them are lying to me from the start when I ask them about there past relationships etc. I have an excellent bull shit metre built into me and can ell liars easily.
Who knows that if I or other mongers meet a genuine girl who is who she says she is and can fall in love for the right reasons and not only for money as many girls look at us like we are only walking automatic teller machines which they can withdraw money out of all the time thus treating us like dumb ass idiots, we may just fall in love with the right girl. Time will tell but in my 20 year experience around the world, most girls I have met lied to me about themselves and their life history. I hope I do meet a genuine and serious girl as you are suggesting in my endeavours in Russia.
[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]Blastoff:
"They all talk like they want a long term relationship..."
Of course they talk like that, but that doesnt mean they really think it'll happen. I assume most understand that it is a sex holiday with an option for more. As often with Russian girls, you just have to package your desires in a romantic or acceptable way. Flat out asking for sex or a fling may also work sometimes, but it will also get a lot of "doors slammed in your face."
In most cases if they say so, they still hope. And I think the best way is to find balance: be romantic enough (simple pleasant behavior will suit) and at the same time not make any hooks for future (no hints on marrige, children and so on... you are just having fun today, it's great, but who knows what will happen later... life is hard to predict, let's enjoy the moment). Problems start when you promise too much of what you can't do =))))
[QUOTE=Helena Moscow][QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]Blastoff:
"They all talk like they want a long term relationship..."
Of course they talk like that, but that doesnt mean they really think it'll happen. I assume most understand that it is a sex holiday with an option for more. As often with Russian girls, you just have to package your desires in a romantic or acceptable way. Flat out asking for sex or a fling may also work sometimes, but it will also get a lot of "doors slammed in your face."
In most cases if they say so, they still hope. And I think the best way is to find balance: be romantic enough (simple pleasant behavior will suit) and at the same time not make any hooks for future (no hints on marrige, children and so on... you are just having fun today, it's great, but who knows what will happen later... life is hard to predict, let's enjoy the moment). Problems start when you promise too much of what you can't do =))))[/QUOTE]
Yes I agree fully. The problem lays with the fact that so far all my internet chat girls say they are looking for marriage and children in the first or second email. It is hard for me to say NO as it would defeat the purpose but I do use your methods of romance and say things like, "Time will tell and It's up to God what will come out of this " etc. All of this is true in fact as I was once married for 10 years so the possibility is still there. It is just unlikely that's all
[QUOTE=Helena Moscow]Sorry, but what you just said is complete nonsence. If a girl says she is after long-term relationships, in most cases she really believes in such a possibility and treats you another way. She may tell her parents about a nice guy she met and with who she hopes for a happy future. In most cases these girls are young and don't expect to be used and be thoughned away as dirty piece of toilet paper. And afterwards she may cry for half a year or more and not understand what wrong she had done for her lover to quit with her. That's not fare exchange for kind attitude. You may say something like: "Oh, Helena, again you, shut your mouth, life is unjust..." But guys, we all human beings. Just imagine yourself in this place, or your daughter, or sister. Would you like someone to do this to them? What would your feelings be? Ok, you want to fuck as much girls as possible. There's nothing wrong about this. Fucking is fun. And there are enough girls ready to fuck with no obligations. Both for money and free. There is no importance to cheat those who want to marry and behave like pigs. It's same as robbery, but worse, because you steal from young girls (young, because you'll hardly be able to cheat mature woman this way) believe and trust to others. It's much more worthy then several hundred dollars you plan to save.[/QUOTE]I'm in agreement with Helena.
On my first trip to Russia, I met a girl that I "met" on a marriage site. I slept with her a couple times then I quickly got tired of her because there were so many stunningly beautiful girls around and I didn't have enough time to chase them. Keep in mind that it was my first ever trip to Russia so my resistence level was low, I was like a kid in a candy store. Anyhow I do think that she was a nice enough girl. I didn't know her situation very well but I knew (in hindsight only, I wasn't thinking at all at the time) she wanted to get out of her situation and I was probably her only way out. Long story short I saw her again in a hospital a few days later after I had stopped seeing her. It was obvious even to a dumb ass like me that she had been crying and she was heartbroken. I felt guilty. I lied to her in our emails that I was looking for marriage, I continued to lead her to believe that when I was in Russia, I slep with her than dumped her for other girls. I broke her heart and I shattered the last hope she had. She was so happy when we first met in person. I guess at first she didn't believe that I'd show up and I guess she liked what she saw and I treated her fairly well. I could see in her eyes that she was so happy to meet me and she liked me so much. Both her and her friend thought she hit the jackpot. I then dumped her shortly after. I guess they were both sadly mistaken about me. I was an asshole and a liar. In normal dating, you win some and you lose some. Sometimes people get hurt. But in this case I lied to her, I took advantage of her situation. Although I never promised her anything either in the mails or in person, I did lead her to believe that I was looking for love. I don't know how she's doing now. But I always feel bad about what I did. I would like to ask people monger with care and responsibility in Russia. Some of the girls live in dire situation and are sincerely looking for a knight in shining armor to save them, they're not out to cheat or use us for money. They just want to meet a decent guy that can make their lives a little better, at least it was the case of my girl. Since then I stopped using marriage sites and stopped telling girls that I was looking for a relationship or love. I simply tell them I like to travel and I'm simply a vistor (either in peron or on dating sites). That probably hurts my chance a great deal but I still had a lot of fun especially that I could live with myself. I was honest and I still had a ton of fun. It's so easy to get laid in Russia, there's no need to lie. Some of the girls really have high hopes and are putting their future on the foreigners they meet online. Just remember there's karma.
bbaj... If Marty returns this will not be his first venture to try to steal the CF/boarhouse mystic... He opened another club a couple of years ago, as I recall, but it never did too much. However, if CF closes it may have an opening.
bo... I appreciate your enthusiasm about the internet and bringing girls to Moscow, but you would do well to listen to doc and others. A new girl every other day or so is a killer. Moscow is a whole new world for both you and, maybe, your 'girl'. If she has not been to Moscow you will have to do the tourist thing, which is not bad the first couple of times you do it, but gets very old after awhile. Besides the dead guy is only open in the morning on some days and closed other days. :)
More importantly, my experience with bringing girls in for longer periods is a real mixed bag... it is a gamble whether you will get along and have the chemistry to make it happen for you and at the same time that she will be what you expected or you what she expects. On top of that, I don't think you realize what you are asking for a girl to spend as long as two days on a stinking bus to come visit you for a couple of days. Something doesn't compute with that on the girl's part...
Besides, I doubt that you would want to be with her after she has spent two nights on a bus bouncing her way to Moscow. Even a train is a long trip, but I suggest that you consider limiting your radius of searches to a reasonable distance from Moscow.
Quite frankly, I think you are falling in the seductive trap of over planning your trip. If you schedule every minute of your time with internet friends, what happens if you really like one of them and another Elena is on the bus headed your way? What happens if you get sick of her and just want to have a beer and soak up Moscow? I can tell you from personal experience that it is a real downer to tell a girl that you don't like her after an hour and then try to put her back on a plane/train/bus/automobile!
Not only that, but you must allow yourself time and energy to find the bus/train station, each RU city's trains/buses may arrive at a different station, then fighting traffic to get there and back to your flat, then doing the same thing to take her back and then to pick up a new girl. Believe me it is much easier to plan than to accomplish... especially if you don't speak Russian and know Moscow! As a start, I suggest you find out how many train stations there are and where they are located in the city... I promise you they are spread out all over the city... the bus stations are probably worse!
Chances are that some of these girls will be scammers and some will be VERY nice girls who are just looking for a better life with a good man. The scammers can easily be discarded but the nice girls are difficult, at least for me, to deal with because they are playing by what they think the rules are and then the door is slammed in their face because a new Elena is arriving.
At the same time, just because you've invited them for two days doesn't mean that they think that they will have to leave in two days... Their expectations may be totally different than yours.
On top of all of that, I suggest to you that an overplanned trip will quickly fall apart because you'll soon find that there is so much in Moscow to be absorbed that you'll regret not being able to experience it all while you are there! I've done exactly the same thing, and it is fun while you plan your trip, but when your feet hit the ground everything changes and you will be pulled in many directions, quite willingly I imagine. Take this for what it is worth... Don't be disappointed if your plans go to shit shortly after you arrive... That is what Moscow is all about and go with the flow and enjoy the ride!
One last comment, and I don't want to burst your bubble of enthusiasm, when you wire money to any girl... write it off! Don't fret if she doesn't show up... count it as a gift as soon as you give Western Union the cash. Also, don't count on having to just pay the girl for the bus/train ticket... on a long trip she must buy her food along the way or before she leaves. If you send her exact change, don't count on a happy camper when she arrives... IF she arrives. Besides, unless she is totally new to the internet game, don't expect that you being the first.. at anything! Always remember... She may be getting HUNDREDS of new emails every day! And then, unless you are a Brad Pitt look-alike, ask yourself exactly what are you offering to make her drop everything and ride a bus/train for hours/days to meet you?
Apparently, the club Coconuts burned down over Christmas. According to my source, one person died, but the cause has not been determined. I've been told that Doug consulted but didn't have any money in the place although you never really know who's into what in Moscow. Things are never what they seem...
As it was once written about Moscow for non-Moscovites, "The only 'experts' on Moscow are those who have been here for two weeks or twenty years!"