Seoul

Well if you are coming from Seoul the best and cheapest way would be subway,train then taxi in that particular order. You would get on the subway and navigate to the green line which is line 2. Take that line and get off at the Ehwa Womens University stop. Stop #241. Then come above ground and look for signs that will lead you to the train station. Or politely ask someone. It's called Sinchon Station. Take the train north until you get to the town of paju. It's the stop after Wollong. If you miss the stop you can still get off at the next stop which is Munsan. I know for a fact that it's only 10,000 won for a taxi to Yong Joo Gol from there. But Paju is closer if your coming from seoul. Then just find a taxi and tell the driver Yong Joo Gol.

Train costs 1200 won
Subway costs 600 won
Taxi cost is negotiable

Once there you will see the windows where the women sit and wait for customers. Have fun, enjoy yourself and be careful out there. I was going this weekend but due to the recent events in Yongsan I have to stay home.

stabbing??!!?? woah... i like to get laid just like the next red-blooded male, but it's definitely not worth getting a knife in my back...

i've been following stories about the rising anti-american sentiment in Korea in the press, particularly disturbing are the "No Americans Welcome" signs in some of the stores / restaurants near the military bases...

is anyone actually in seoul now? what is the mood like? i guess its better to lay low for awhile?

[quote]originally posted by agoodfella
[i]stabbing??!!?? woah... i like to get laid just like the next red-blooded male, but it's definitely not worth getting a knife in my back...

i've been following stories about the rising anti-american sentiment in korea in the press, particularly disturbing are the "no americans welcome" signs in some of the stores / restaurants near the military bases...

is anyone actually in seoul now? what is the mood like? i guess its better to lay low for awhile? [/i][/quote]

its not as bad as the media makes it out to be. i'm here and haven't noticed any hostility. i haven't seen any of those signs either. i was shopping in dongdaemun on the weekend and the koreans were their usual selves. i only got asked once, in a friendly fashion, by a shopkeeper "american?" to which i replied "no." (i'm not).
you have to understand koreans are famous for this kind of sensationalism (remember anton ono and speedskating?). they even have a word for it.. which translates roughly to "a tin pot boiling rapidly and just as rapidly cooling off". fact is, these girls died several months ago and there were no 100,000 person plus vigils in the city.. only now that the racist ilbo's have jumped on he story after the aquittals and turned sofa reform into a presidential candidate platform issue. give it a month and they'll have found something else to be pissed about.

i would avoid going to places where large numbers of drunk korean men are about (shinchon, gangnam) to drink. in itaewon on the weekends at night you see more foreigners walking about than koreans anyway.

don't sweat the details.

Threre definitely is an increase is some crime against Americans, or at least GIs. If you are young, have short hair, and dressed like the typical GI, I would be cautious. I travel the subway to work everyday, and no one ever says boo to me. However, I'm not young, and I'm not a GI. I look more European than American.

There was a beating in Tongduchon this past few days, and one GI was shot with a pellet gun in the chest. If you have good manners, and are polite, don't worry. Koreans are just looking for an excuse to turn on you.

GI Curfew Hits Itaewon Nightspots

Continuing anti-American protests and the curfew on US military personnel has resulted in a severe blow to the profit margin of most Itaewon night spots.
The night club district off Itaewon was quiet last night, as were areas around other bases nationwide. The 9 a.m. to 5 p.m. curfew bans 37,500 soldiers from leaving their bases, following a knife attack on an American officer by three unidentified Korean men in an underpass outside Yongsan base Monday.
``The curfew is disastrous for my business,’’ said Hong Yoon-jin, owner of Club Dolce Vita. ``We are barely making 20 percent of what we usually took in before the anti-American protests began. Revenue will drop further as the curfew continues.’’
The protests and the curfew are having a very bad economic impact in Itaewon… ``You can say there is almost no business not affected by this situation,” said Chung In-cheol, owner of Seoul Pub.
``I will call it a night and go home early,’’ said Park Sung-bok, 48, a manager of club Indian Joes. ``Before the protests, about 12 soldiers visited my club each night, and Gis are usually big spenders. Now there are only two or three customers. I’m thinking of changing to another business.’’
American military police officers were on patrol in Itaewon last night, looking for curfew violaters.
In one bar, a sharp-eyed waitress was sitting in front of a closed-circuit TV monitor looking out for the MPs. She said the monitor was “installed to alert American soldiers who would then hide in the bathroom or elsewhere.”
jj@koreatimes.co.kr
12-18-2002 17:29

lighter9000: I think you are mistaken on your conception of this whole issue. There has always been anti-americanism in Korea for quite some time now. It has been known that there were at least 100,000 North Korean spies working in South Korea spreading anti-american rhetorics since the 70s. You can take note of this in the form of student protests during that time. During those days it was only the extreme leftest liberals that acted on these rhetorics. I believe that such elements still exists today, but the thing that worries me is that now, people who have stood on middle grounds are increasingly becoming more anti-america. This is the impression that I have gotten from my Korean friends. It is trully sad. But I have to stress that such sentiments are not of fickle in nature and took years to develop into full blossom. I just hope that it gets better soon. When it is all said and done, Korea has something to gain from America and America has something to gain from Korea. I hope this point can enlighten some people. Oh yeah, the stabbing incident is some bullshit. Don't worry about that. It's bunch of high school punks trying to think they are some mobs. I assure everybody that you have better change of getting stabbed in NYC than in Seoul even with this crisis going on.

Few Questions,

How do Room Salons and Business Rooms work?

Is it real expensive? Are these places you go by yourself?

SHould i go with a Korean?


Also, when you go to the Red Light areas, the girls there obviously expect a fuck. What if I just want a blow job or something.

ANyone know the going rate for that stuff? And how do you ask for a blow job in Korean? (i can read korean if you can type)

Jiggaman

can someone explain what Room Salons and Business Rooms are like? should you go with other ppl? do you basically shell out a lot of dough?

when you go to Red Light areas, do girls expect sex only? Can you ask for BJs only? If so, how much do those run? Or normally when you ask for price they give you price for sex?

How do you say BJ in Korean?

jiggaman,

'Room Salons' and 'Business Rooms' have in legal sense, no differences. They are classified as '1st kind entertainment facilities' in Korean law.

But in practice, they have some differences. Although all the 'business rooms' insist on their being and having no differences from room salons, we could hardly find genuine 'Room Salon' outside of Kangnam area in Seoul.

Among room salons in Kangnam area in Seoul, we categirize them into 5. They are '10%' '15%' '20%' 'Club' and 'Club with time limit'. The meaning of this classification is so complicated and hard to explain before you actually experience them.

Anyway, 'Room Salons' are more expensive than 'Business Clubs'.

For instance,

Room Salons Business Rooms
Premium Whisky KRW 250,000 KRW 150,000
Basic Sidedish KRW 150,000 KRW 100,000
Room Fee KRW 50,000 KRW 30,000 or under
Girl (1) KRW 100,000 KRW 80,000
Karaoke(man) KRW 100,000 KRW 80,000
After KRW 300,000 KRW 200,000

But in usual, in Room Salons girl will not stay beside of you all the time being, while in business rooms they will serve only you while you were there. Furthermore, 'After' price KRW 300,000 in Room Salons are minimum prices.

Why, then, usual men go to Room Salons instead of Business Rooms? Well, before your actual experince to Room Salons (esp. for 10% ones) you could not understand. For me, it's worth while.

It is real expensive? Yes, it's crazy expensive.

Go with a Korean or not? I strongly recommend you to go with Korean, and he must know and get accoustomed to the culture, behavior and everything in Room Salons. Otherwise, you would spend your money for nothing.

You could send me an email to :

daniel_you@yahoo.com

Thanks

Daniel

[QUOTE]Originally posted by jiggaman
[i]Few Questions,

How do Room Salons and Business Rooms work?

Is it real expensive? Are these places you go by yourself?

SHould i go with a Korean?


Also, when you go to the Red Light areas, the girls there obviously expect a fuck. What if I just want a blow job or something.

ANyone know the going rate for that stuff? And how do you ask for a blow job in Korean? (i can read korean if you can type)

Jiggaman [/i][/QUOTE]

jiggaman: The first time I went to room salon with bunch of Korean friends, it cost me 700 dollars. Yeah they are expensive but worth the price. girls are better looking and they seem more accomodating.

yaoming,

$700?! worth the price?! $700?! that's 35 bar fines in angeles. that's 70 trips to blow row. and you don't have to hang with korean guys while they act like teenagers. was is really worth it?

all,

with the military curfew in force now you should be able to negotiate some good service rates on the hill. after sept 11, the last force-protection lock down, the prices on the hill were 30,000 for bbbj & happy ending in the mouth. but that was a long lock down. this lock down ends soon, though. happy hunting this weekend.

mindy was a guy. if a post-op is your thing, enjoy. if it isn't, she should be paying you.

has anyone been to the clubs on the lane that is perpendicular to the hill? walk up to the yogwan, turn right, and there are 5-6 places. reports?

nice that indian joes got a mention in the paper. she's been sucking dick there for decades. same white head band too. i try to stop by every 3 months or so as every once in a while she has a new girl working. there have been a few special ones. there's a special room hidden behind the curtain at the entrance. the place is always worth a look, and she's quite friendly. wonder what she plans to do as an alternative? perhaps suck the skins off grapes for the bong bong grape drink.

don't worry about the stabbing? when should we start to worry? after a few are killed? the tank crushing the two girls was a tragic accident. key word: accident. the korean behavior is all deliberate. that's why there's a boycott korean goods movement that's started on the bases. families back in the states are participating too. if you're tired of these goose-stepping over achievers you can help out by looking at the made in label before buying.

enough of the rep001ter shot.

happy christmas to all. i'll prowl the hill this weekend and i'm off to the philippines for a few weeks.

hutsori (and to the wsg community),

***warning long post***

re: the tank accident and anti-american sentiment in korea

let me begin by saying that my comments are meant neither to antagonize nor be unneccessarily argumentative, i just want to share some of the insight that i have accumulated over numerous conversations over many years from a very broad spectrum of people (from korean citizens ranging from students and taxi drivers to executives and professors and also from academia outside korea and also an ambassador in seoul who will remain anonymous but represents a "western" country...)

so if you don't want to get a bit of insight on this situation other than "there go those crazy koreans again" please feel free to stop reading...(and please bear in mind that i am an american and my sole purpose is to try and bring some perspective which may in some way help bridge the misunderstanding and miscommunication between two traditionally strong allies)

the tragic accident (and i fully agree that the fact that this was an accident is an important fact to bear in mind) is not the major issue from a "hard-core" korean's perspective. what is? there are several issues at different level, but in sum:

1) changes to the sofa agreement
2) a perception of american "hypocrisy" in its foreign policy
3) a general wish for more parity in the bi-lateral us-korea partnership

first off, the so-called "rising" anti-american sentiment is not all that a recent of a phenomenon. just because cnn is starting to report this issue now does not make it "news". for those who have been living or have been frequent travelers to korea (as i have) over the years and who have had a chance to speak with nationals, will realize that anti-american sentiment has been building for many years, this accident (and the subsequent acquittal of those two servicemen sparked the flashpoint which brought these underlying sentiments to a head - a crude analogy would be the rodney king riots which brought the racial tensions and the many years of police exploitation of blacks in south central l.a. to a boil)

1) the sofa (status of forces agreeement) has been a point of contention for many years (and not just in korea - those who have followed the numerous [url=http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123][CodeWord123][/url] cases by us servicemen based in okinawa, japan know that the japanese have pushed for similar changes to their sofa). yes, at the end of the day us force are there for korean security - of course i bring this issue up all the time when discussing this with nationals, but they are quick to bring up the fact that just because one wears a us military uniform does not automatically absolve one of criminal activity - they don't have some kind of diplomatic immunity just b/c they serve in the military. if they commit a crime, they should be judged by that jurisdiction which the crime is committed. that actually makes a lot of sense to me. the overwhelming majority of us servicemen are stand-up guys making unknown sacrifices to serve the us and korean interests -- its the very few bad apples that give them a bad name. why have them create this kind of negative feeling within the community that they serve? of course there will be a few "bad" guys in any community -- but why protect them? and to what extent does that "protection" begin to become detrimental to the rest of the larger team -- when does this "special treatment" begin to undermine the original mandate of the us military presence? well, its happening - president-elect roh made a huge campaign platform out of this very issue and his victory underscores these very questions. imho, people who commit crimes anywhere should be accountable for those actions. (again this doesn't mean that those two servicemen should have been sent to prison, it is the principle that they were judged by a us military court that is at issue here).

before i go on to points 2 and 3, i want to make sure that i'm not taking up too much space here and perhaps get some feedback as well...

here is hoping to some constructive dialogue instead of hurling insults at one another - we are all adults here right?

agoodfella-I've never understood why we still have armed forces in both S Korea, and more signifigantly in Japan some 50+ years after WW II, and almost 50 years since the end of the Korean conflict. There is no doubt that both countries can afford to defend themselves at this point. In essence, the US is substantilly subsidizing both countries economies, by providing this defense, for little current benefit. Lord knows, the US economy could use the stimulis that returning these billions of $ to the US would provide every year. Perhaps they would be more comfortable getting a "better" deal from the Chinese. I think not.

What is the racial situation there in Korea? I was stationed there in 1972 to 1973. During that period of time, the racial problems were intense. What does a short time cost in American dollars?

thor,

your question is a good one and although i don't have all of the answers, there are a few reasons why a US military presence in North Asia is still considered paramount to US security interests. To sum:

1) peace on the Korean peninsula (and peace in North Asia) has been kept in very large part due to the very visible US military presence both in Japan and Korea...
2) why is that peace important to US interests? well, if the North had ever attacked the South or Japan, the US would be there (that was one of the compromises that Japan made for not creating another military post-WWII and is also the reason that Japan and South Korea are NOT nuclear powers - it was a quid pro quo - the US would provide security and Japan and Korea wouldn't seek to become nuclear powers (of course it is not as simple as just that but this post is getting long already) - in sum, if war broke out US boys would be in there and many many lives would be lost - having troops in Japan and Korea has averted and continues to deter war - that kind of strategic deterrence has paid huge dividends
3) the US has a significant geo-political, strategic, and economic interests in maintaining a presence in North Asia - particularly with the rising might of China. the downing of the US spy plane earlier this year is an ominous prelude to China's future intentions. make no mistake - China does not perceive the US as a "friend" they are making clear benchmarks to the US military and want to be able to match our forces (including the Naval 7th fleet) over the coming years, and they are already bulking up their fighter forces, destroyers, subs and heavy artillery... my guess is that once they complete this build out, they are going to head south and "settle" the renegade Taiwain province issue once and for all

You are right in that Japan and Korea have the finances to defend themselves (in fact, the cost of military occupation in both Japan and Korea is actually in large part subsidized by Korea and Japan at this point) of course the personal sacrifices that US soldiers make notwithstanding, the actual "cost" of keeping forces there are largely borne by the host countries now. The money again is not the issue. The US military presence has provided stability for the region which is a long-term "insurance" policy which benefits all parties in the long run, and as Asia takes a larger table in the world economy, it is in America's best interests to have a say in helping to shape and influence policy (from foreign relations to economic issues) - in other words, packing up and leaving the US is always an option - but now more than ever, the it serves the US to be out in front and soldifying partnerships that have been forged over the decades - why leave now when for the first time the US can start to leverage and "cash in" some of the goodwill that has developed over the years?