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Chorfa1
I don't know if I totally agree with that, since I occasionally read the SA boards and guys seem to making out like bandits there. South America is mostly Roman Catholic and we all know how much of a stranglehold religion has on everyday life with the middle class and the poor at the very least. I think market forces (a chica's everyday needs to live and a mongerer's carnal needs) will win out over religion most of the time. Faith doesn't fill a grumbling stomach nor does it often provide immediate rewards after providing for a mongerer. Any young chick in SA who sees the bright lights and other enticements of the big city is gonna choose THAT over faith when you get down to it.
OTOH American Women are given everything, expect the world, and give almost NOTHING back. I'll be GOD-DAMNED if I ever take any shit off some American barracuda whose attitude is: "What can you do for ME? YOUR needs (ANY type of reciprocation) are irrelevant".
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Shit I live in South America (Argentina) and NO ONE here takes religion seriously, as opposed to in México and Central America. Here they say you go to church to get "married and buried." Yes, the church has political influence but among the rank and file it does not affect sexual behavior very much. Trust me.
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Well there you have it guys... I stand corrected
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I can't really add that much as far as religion & the attitude of american women is concerned, but from my experiences in Central America I'd say that Chrofa's point has it's merits. For example, in Guatemala and it's neighbouring countries you find a quite strong divide between catholics and protestants, the latter being a growing movement mainly influenced by various NA sects. And while the Catholics there are generally thought to be the more easy-going, modern, don't-take-the-church-too-serious people, many of the protestants are firm believers with a more religious lifestyle. I guess that's due to the fact that they are just new to their faith after converting from the traditional catholic church.
So, Chorfa if the behaviour of SA / CA protestants translates to that of NA mainstream-protestants it would seem like you're getting it exactly right; Shianju, you just overestimated the influence of catholicism in modern SA / CA societies, and Dickhead, what you say about CA is definitely true for the protestants there, but not (any more) for Catholics.
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I'd have to agree somewhat with Chorfa1. To borrow a quote from the movie "EuroTrip" (stupid movie, but there are a couple of shots of cute topless girls).
"America was founded by prudes who left Europe because there was too much weird sex going on there."
Or something like that.
I'm no expert on comparative religion, but one thing that the Catholics have going for them is confession - basically do whatever you want, go to confession and do your penance and you start over with a clean slate. Protestants (especially southern baptists) are stuck with a permanent tabulation of sins and good deeds that get tallied up on judgemnent day - if the sin side out-weighs the good deed side, your piggies are gonna get hot. No forgiveness where protestants are concerned.
My experiences in Brasil, which is primarily Catholic are essentially like Dickhead says "you go to church to get "married and buried." ". However, the garotas were all very respectful of the church & especially the pope - they just don't see why they need to go to mass every week. If they ever feel guilty about the way they've been living their life (very rare), they just go to confession, say a few "hail mary's" and they are transformed into a guilt-free garota de programma and are back in the game before you missed them.
CW
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Hey guys,
I've been noticing something and wonder if anyone out there will agree with me.
Most of us stand united on the fact that American women, as a whole, aren't that great. Many posters say the same thing about Canadian women, English women and western women in general. I think I see a trend here. I call it local guys and local girls.
Think about it. As a local guy in your own town, the girls are kind of boring and unattractive. What's worse, they look at you the same way. The only way to get one interested is to be really handsome, have lot's of cash or some kind of super magnetic personality. The funny part is that if you were that great, you wouldn't be interested in them anyways.
So, you take a trip. and all of a sudden beautiful women are everywhere! As is that wasn't good enough, many of these girls are giving you the eye. You're the star of the show, chatting with the hottest babes wherever you go. All the while thinking about how much better these women are than the ones back home.
In some respects this is completely correct. But think about it. How would the local guys think about these girls? What a bunch of b**ches! There they go again, chasing after every guy with some cash who will take them out and spend money on them. Starting to sound familiar?
Women are women no matter where you go. They all want the same thing. That is to get the best deal they can, for themselves. The reason that foreign women seem somehow to be "better" is because we look better to them. We come from somewhere else so that makes us more ecxiting and different. We also tend to have a lot more money than the local guys (depending on which country).
If any American (or western) women perceives you to be different/special and that you have way more money, she'll be interested. Just look at rich and famous guys like Donald Trump or Jack Nicholson. They still score with the hottest young babes and the women don't seem to mind the 30 year age gap. Just like all those great gals in Thailand, Brazil, Phillipines etc. That's the reason why we do so well with women in foreign countries. When we go there, in some respects we have the same movie star qualities of being wealthy and interesting.
I'm not trying to defend American/western women. I'm just saying that women pretty much are the same wherever you go if you are looking at things from the perspective of a local guy.
One last point. Since the girls in these other countries DO look at us that way, we'd be crazy not to go there and take full advantage!!
Rock
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Rock, if you read one of my older posts, I have mentioned that it is a lot easier to get laid in many countries outside of the US that are "First World" nations. For your information, German and Scandinavian women are the some of the easiest to get into bed, you should see the bums these babes screw during their summer vacations.
And most local guys don't look at their women the same way Americans guys look at the women we have to put up with, at least I don't anymore.
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CBGB, thanks for the acknowledgement!
It feels nice to know that someone took the time to read what I wrote.
I've never been to Germany, Norway, Sweden etc. so I can really disagree with you. The only point I was really trying to make is that it seems to me like local girls are a lot tougher on the local guys than they are with men who come from somewhere else. It's probably because we seem more interesting and more exciting to them. Therefore it doesn't take as much for us to persuade them to have sex with us.
The statement that you made saying that those women are easy to get into bed would seem to go along with this idea. I was wondering though about the bums you mentioned. Are these supposed to be local guys or were they Americans? If they are local guys, then those countries just might truly be exceptions to the rule.
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Rock, I have to disagree with your thesis. Of all the western nations, American women tend to be the fattest, the least discriminating in dress and fashion, and the most aggresive.
Just compare the flight attendants on US airlines (specially on international routes) vs. European Airlines.
Peace
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Chorfa,
I welcome your opinion regarding the idea that I put forth in my previous posting. I also think that you're right about American women being porkers and poor dressers.
Recently I went to a mall and took a look at every woman that I saw. I rated them by physical looks and by style. Of course this was all 100% subjective and based on my personal opinion but it still serves a purpose.
I found that, on average, you can dismiss at least half of all women as being too old or too young. Of the half that are left, roughly half of them are overweight (in my opinion) or just plain out of shape. This leaves about 25%. Of these, I found that less than one out of 5 had decent looks. I personally define a decent looking woman as one that simultaneously posseses a decent ass, nice tits, good physical condition and acceptable face.
Therefore, if my math is right, there should be about 5% attractive women available here. I'm willing to bet that if you went to just about any country and performed the same survey, you'd find about the same result. Even if there's twice as many good looking women there, it would still only be about 1 in 10 attractive girls.
According to the principle of supply and demand, if 50% of the guys are chasing 5 or even 10% of the women, those women are going to get really picky. Think of them as the OPEC of pussy. We want it, and they have it. They control the supply and the only way we can get any is to persuade them that they should give some to us instead of somebody else.
Things may be better in other countries in asia, latin america and europe. However, I personally feel that the same principles are in effect no matter where you go. Women want to get the best deal for themselves that they can. That's why the grass seems greener on the other side of the fence. It's not because those girls are different, or better. They just seem better because they know that (compared to the local guys) we have what they want.
Just as you stated, the women here are generally ugly and more aggressive. I agree with you and I think that the reason for that is supply and demand. Because there's proportionally fewer attractive women, even the homelies think they're entitled to some kind of "dream man".
I open to any comments or ideas as always,
Rock
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Actually most of the guys are local guys, and they're not rich, most of them are waiters, janitors, bus drivers, mechanics, etc. and a lot of them aren't that good looking either. Even in their native countries, I have seen a lot of losers date these hot women.
Even in North America, if anyone has visited Montreal, you will see a lot of joe nobodies with some hot women.
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Comments about the "fat American woman":
It seems to me that a more politically-correct American society promotes sexiness at any size. Combined with shows like Oprah and a growing rate of US obesity, "thicker" women are getting the message that men will like them no matter how fat they are becoming. Maybe there are guys out there that like that (personally, I can handle a woman w/ a few extra lbs, as long as is isn't grossly overweight), but most men want women that are in better shape than the average woman.
Chorfa1: I agree with you in that there are too many women I see that are not discriminating enough in their dress style. Seeing a lot of fat sticking out of clothes that are too small, too tight, too low is not "sexy".
As far as a "decent or better" body among women, let's face facts, it is much harder to keep the looks and an in-shape body as they get older. Laziness is not just in the unwillingness to exercise, it also factors in when there are more "sexy" clothes made to accomodate the fat woman.
I think what is gonna happen is the men who are the most successful are going to go after the young women (from legal age to mid 20s). Those women typically fit the traditonal standards of beauty in America.
MP
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Rock,
I agree with some of what you said. The local guys not piquing the interest of the local girl and all. I experienced an example of that when I was in Atlantic City once and A Polish guy said to me: "Polish women are bitches". I thought to myself: "Huh"? The Polish women I'd met here in the States seemed kind, well-mannered and quite pleasant to talk to. Hearing him say that made me consider the other side of the coin. I thinK it may be the perceived "exotic factor" where "foreign guy" immediately is perceived as interesting because he is from outside of the "everyday universe" of the local chick. DON'T get me wrong; I am in NO FUCKING WAY letting American Women off the hook.
The comments about American Women accepting the way they look (wearing revealing clothing and displaying tons of exposed rolls of fat and the attitude that they think of themelves as beautiful! GET REAL!) are just too hilarious. Except for a guy whose sexual tastes are WAAAAAAAAAAAAY off the beaten path, what sane male is gonna think of some broad who looks like a walrus as sexually appetizing?
On another subject touched upon here, I've seen some older women who obviously were well aware of the ravages of time upon the human body and they DID something about it! They work out religiously and look almost like female Olympians carved in stone. Now the sight of THAT makes me wanna lick strawberry syrup off them!
To tie in these aforementioned points of view, American Women feel they don't have to do much of anything to attract a male because they subscribe to the viewpoint that: "We're all you've got, guys! Either accept my obesity, my unrealistic demands, and my unbalanced psychological state or accept two five-fingered dates"! Political Correctness is just another phrase for: "You men should lower your standards and just settle". Should I feel ashamed for taking UNBRIDLED advantage of the "exotic factor" and my economic status relative to my target countries? FUCK NO! I'm gonna KEEP doing it, because like American Women taking advantage of the average American GUY who lacks the knowledge that there are more beautiful, compliant alternatives out there, I CAN! American Women take advantage of suckers (Americanus Wimpus) ALL THE FUCKING TIME!
I'm not saying that foreign women don't expect to be wined and dined, but in my experience, it ties in to a short-term romantic encounter, NOT some mercenary financial exchange (as when it involves American Women) where the only emotion is cold-professionalism.
Sorry for the rant, bit hearing about a nation of psychos makes me turn green, burst outta my shirt and growl!
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To Sinanju Master,
You got it 100%. Those were exactly the points I was trying to make! I've read so many reports from guys blabbing away about how great these women are in some country they went to. But how many of them stopped to ask the local guys THEIR opinion of how great these women are?
It just so happens that I have a couple of friends that were born in eastern europe. One of them is from the Ukraine and the other guy came here from Poland. A couple of years back, I was looking at some of those matchmaker sites on the internet. One day I asked my Ukrainian buddy for his opinion regarding some Russian girls that I was looking at. He surprised me with his criticisms, saying things like "those girls from St. Petersburg and Moscow are spoiled" and also "they'll like you, as long as you can pay!"
My polish friend, a well-educated professional like myself, said some of the same things regarding polish women. He told me that they're very materialistic. Wow, this was kind of disappointing and yet somehow familiar.
Last year there was a party at another friend's house. He happens to be from the former Yugoslavia and there were some girls there that he knew from back home. These girls were knockouts! Slim, pretty and dressed for maximum effect! When I asked him about them, he gave pretty much the same reaction as the other guys. "They look OK but they're nothing special" is what he told me. What's more, he was totally crazy for this local girl that we both knew. I'd always thought of her as being kind of a cold fish, and slightly above average looks. For the life of me, I could not understand how he could possibly prefer her to those other women.
That's when I started to believe in what Sinanju has called "The Exotic Factor". What it all boils down to is that everybody thinks the grass is greener on the other side of the fence. It's possible that this could be partly true with regards to cultural differences. It's also true that obesity/blubberitis is way more common here than in most other countries. My own personal experiences however, from the 3 examples above, tell me that this is mostly an illusion.
What does all this mean to us? It means that for american men, american women pretty much suck. It also means that women from other countries give us a way better deal because they think we're more interesting and exciting because of the exotic factor. Having said that, it means you could get a way better woman for yourself by looking for one in some other country. But don't kid yourselves guys, women are still women no matter where you go.
My 2 cents worth,
Rock
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Chorfa,
Have you flown British Airways recently? It's been a couple years since I was last on one of their flights, but I don't really see much difference between their flight attendants and those of American carriers (the exception was on the concorde - it was a fairly small plane, so the fat cows just didn't fit).
Fat people in America. Well, that is a subject that I've been mulling over for a number of years and I've come to a few conclusions, based on my own family history, which, I believe is fairly similar to most Americans. My family is decended of European Peasants who migrated here in the mid 1800's as endentured servants (essentially contracted themselves to be (near) slaves for a period of time to pay for their passage). People from this demographic (poor) didn't always have access to food so they would eat a lot of food when food was available to build up the fat reserves to take them through the lean times when food was scarce. Feast or Famine. This worked well for most of human history, however, for most of the last 70 years in the USA, there has been no famine, but we keep feasting because we were brought up to be proud of how much we could eat (I still remember stories of how much my grandfather could eat - people were in awe of that mans appetite) and to feel guilty if we don't clean our plates ("just think of all those starving children in china" I suppose it should be changed to Sudan or Somolia, but when I was a child, it was china). Another factor is the change in lifestyle - my parents generation grew up on farms where they had lots of physical labor. My generation grew up in the city/suburbs and we all work in sedentary office type jobs, but we still have that feast or famine mentality - I've tried to explain this to my sister (who, like the rest of us, is over weight) when she berates her kids for not eating enough, to no avail - she continues to worry that her children have eating disorders. I believe that most Americans are aware of the fact that we, as a nation, are fat, but I think it will take a couple of generations to finally get to the point were we get out of the feast or famine mentality that I believe is making us fat.
Male/Female relationships in the USA - that's what this thread is all about after all. I think that here in the USA, we're in a time of "flux". Women are getting more rights but they're still wanting to hold onto the preferential treatment they got before they were granted these rights. This is another thing that will get sorted out in time. Unfortunately, this too will probably take a couple of generations and it may very well be due to a large number of "mail order brides" or American men leaving the country in disgust in order to get laid abroad by real women. At some point, I hope, American women are going to find a balance between their newfound equality and their femininity - stop trying to be men and go back to being women. If that happens, maybe they won't be so psychotic.
In short, this is not the best time to be living in America. I think it would be interesting to see if things have sorted themselves out 100 years from now.
My 2 cent hangover babble.
CW