American Women

Paddy,

You said: [i]"he's about to get 33% of his wages garnished before taxes (he has two kids) so she can sit home and go shopping for the rest of her life."[/i]

Are you saying that 33% of his wages amounts to enough for her to support herself and two children?

If so, then the 77% that he is left with must be a HUGE amount of money. And if not, she most certainly won't be sitting on her arse watching TV all day...she'll have to work one job to pay the balance of the expenses and that means paying for childcare, which practically needs a second job to cover the cost of it!

It got me angry a few months back, and it's got me angry again. How DARE these men whine and cry about having to pay child support? How DARE they consider liquidating their assets...or even creating a new identity!!...solely so that they can deprive their children of money??? I don't give a shit whether it was the husband or the wife who did the screwing around...the kids DIDN'T DO IT! Why punish THEM???

Now I'm sure you all know my position on alimony....I don't understand the concept (because we don't really have it here) and I don't see any reason for it in most cases. But I DO see the reason for child support...and that's because the kids are YOUR responsibility as well. If this guy has to pay 33% of his wage to his children...stiff shit, I say! I have to pay, at the very least, 80% of my wages to my children. Accommodation, school, clothes, food, travel, utilities...it all costs me three times more than it costs my ex-husband, because he's alone and I am a family of three. 33% (and it's only 18% here) is bugger all compared to what I spend. I don't feel sorry for your mate at all.

And you can flame me all you like, guys...I won't budge on this topic. You get a woman pregnant...you bear the consequences. It's called taking responsibility for your own actions.

Well, RN, I agree wholeheartedly with your views about men supporting their children, as I have stated before (me, I had an operation to prevent that crap), but I would like to point out that 33% + 77% = 110%. Maybe this is why you have money problems from time to time? :)

A lot of divorce money goes to alimony which is money that the wife sues the ex husband for for herself. If she doesn't accept what the ex husband gives her for support of the child and she wants to be greedy and sues for a third or more of his salary and assets then she deserves to be stiffed. Some ex-wives won't even let the ex husband even 500 yard away from their kids. These are the women that MUST be taught a lesson. If she is however a good woman and accepts only child support (NO ALIMONY!) AND she lets the ex-husband see the kids at least for the weekends then I support the idea that the ex-husband must stay here and pay 18-20% of his wages to support the kids. I think greedy bitches should be screwed over for being that way.

UNDENIABLE FACT: kids should be provided for through a mutual and equitable agreement made by the parents if said parents are going to separate. I have NO argument with that. If a man helped bring kids into the world, he should step up to the plate and face the "Nolan Ryan special" that's bound to head his way. What I DO have problems with is the type of woman who would act as a Hoover on her ex's wallet while at the same time, attempting to deprive a father of deserved time with his children and filling their heads with half-truths or outright lies in order to tarnish his image in their eyes while painting herself as the innocent victim. Too many times, men have to walk on eggshells and grind their teeth to get visitation and to prevent threats from a woman that she will seek to enforce through the man-hating court system.

RN: I've read only a few of your posts and I bang my head against the wall when I hear of women hooking up with slime that are analagous to Dr. Henry Jekyll: he's brilliant, dashing, exciting (choose your own superlative to fill in the blank) in the beginning, but Mr. Hyde takes over and BAM! These women are then in a situation that they should have instinctively known FROM THE BEGINNING wouldn't work. I'm sorry you've met up with quite a few cads, and red-cape-and-red-boot wearing guy-defender that I am, I do NOT defend the stool samples I've read about that turned your life upside down.

Darkseid, I like the way you think, regarding the adherence to cash-only. However, I DO believe that if you employ a little guile, you can still live through accounts and credit cards if you watch your P's and Q's.

LOL Dickhead! You're right...it seems I'M the dickhead this time. :) I was a bit pissed off when I was writing that, so I must have got confused (that's my excuse, and I'm sticking to it!)

sinanjumaster,
I didn't mean to sound like I was looking for pity. I only relate my experiences as examples, and I do it because so many men in here seem to have warped ideas about what it's like to be a single Mum. I just get so tired of these guys who are so hung up about "paying the ex-wife". That is NOT what child support is, and I get the impression that a lot of these guys honestly don't see that! Alimony...yes, that's a different story (although I do believe it could be fair in some cases). But child support is not something that should be dodged.

I do agree with you that some women are just out to screw their ex husbands over financially, and I do think that practice is revolting. I also absolutely ABHOR people using children as tools for bartering...give me heaps of cash or you'll never see the kids again. However, if men run off to avoid the alimony claims, etc...their kids miss out. It's not fair to punish the children for the sins of their parents.

And I must say, even though I think it is disgusting that women would not let the men see their children...I don't believe that means they shouldn't have to pay child support. Whether or not you are actually involved in your children's life, you are still their father. If someone took my kids away from me and I was never going to see them again, I would still want to know in my heart that they had everything they needed. I would pay money for them even if I wasn't seeing them.

Hi RN & Guys,

I seem to have triggered quite a firestorm here. All I was looking for was some information for a desperate friend.

In reference to my friend that will be having 33% of his wages garnished, his soon to be ex. is already living with another guy and neither of the two kids live with her. My friend has one child living at home with him and another away at school. He pays for everything for the kids. Always has and always will. His ex is overweight, unskilled and profoundly lazy. Despite this he will still be getting 33% of his wages garnished due to the draconian divorce laws in Wisconsin. Lawyers say it's the worst state in America.

I agree 100% that men are responsible for their children and their overall welfare. Absolutely! I not only believe this but practice what I preach and am still totally supporting my last child who is a graduate student at an elite private university. This school costs $9,800 per semester not to mention her room and board, books, the lease on her car, etc. etc. It's the best money I've ever spent and am happy to do it. However, does the mother have no responsibilites? Is it her responsibility to stay out at night boozing and having encounters with strange men? Is it her responsibility to stay at home, not work and contribute nothing? This is an atypical case I suppose but this guy has really been screwed.

So, again, any more advice on getting out of the USA? Where to go and how to go about it?

Even if my good friend does leave the country, he will still support his children but wants the money to somehow go DIRECTLY to them and not through his ex. If the money goes to her first, the kids will never see it. If you knew the circumstances, this is not an irrational fear by any means.

So, I guess that I should have thrown out more details to begin with. This guy is a decent and professional person who married the wrong girl. We tried to tell him this before he married her but he was "in love" and wasn't listening. Sound familiar?

Regards,

Paddy

Paddy,
Now I DO feel decidedly sorry for your mate! Sorry I jumped the gun, but I figured the '(he has two kids)' in your original post meant that was who the money was for. Alimony is something else. How does that work? How does a woman manage to get alimony when she's already living with someone else and doesn't even have custody of the kids? Your divorce laws suck!

But seriously though, you said the kids already live with your mate. Is he intending on dumping them in order to run away from the ex? What is he going to do with them? Isn't there any way he can fight this, without losing his kids, and win??? If he leaves the country and disappears he may never see his kids again. Could he really live like that? It's just that it's so rare to see a man who was granted custody, and it usually only seems to happen if the woman is an unfit mother or if she didn't WANT them. If that's the case, is he considering leaving the kids with that sort of woman? This all seems terribly unfair...how can these b*tches live with themselves??!!

As for not listening to your friends when they tell you your partner sucks...my best friend told me not to marry my ex, and I ignored her. Then two years later I told her I hated HER new partner, and she ignored me. We are now both divorced! LOL We have promised to listen to each other from now on. :)

Hi RN,

No problem with jumping the gun as you put it.

My friend's ex. is living with her "lover" in another city now. My friend's daughter is living with him at his home because she didn't want to leave her high school, friends, etc., and move to another city to be with her mom. She's only 17. The oldest is away at school in Arizona and is quite independent.

Despite this, his ex. is going to get 33% of his monthly salary or else she can get half his pension account, half the house, half his investments, etc. The laws in my state are really irrational and very much favor the woman.

Yes, we've discussed the loss of contact with his kids to the point of exhaustion. It's really painful stuff and there are no viable solutions. He's really disillusioned and it's a no win situation. He vascillates back and forth. One possibility is to cut his losses, leave the states and start over if and only if he can channel money to his kids for the next few years without his ex. or the courts intercepting it. He's working on a process to do this right now.

You know, RN, this guy is 49 years old and he honestly wonders why his life and his future should be decimated by his ex. and the courts. He's worked very hard in life and has done all of the right things. His only mistake was to marry this woman.

By the way, He's checking into Oz and New Zealand as possible places to emigrate amongst others. Are these viable options in your opinion or is he better off in Bora Bora or something?

Thanks,

Paddy

Paddy,

I don't know a hell of a lot about it, but I believe Australia's immigration policies are extremely tight. I'm not sure that a man his age could get residency very quickly here... if at all. Don't take my word for it, but I'm pretty sure he'd find it difficult. (I think Dickhead looked into this too?) Australia and New Zealand have special agreements between each other, but I know nothing about NZ's policies regarding people from other countries.

Re: paying the kids directly...has he looked into Internet banking? He could put money into an internet account from anywhere in the world, and they could just transfer from the net it into their personal accounts. I just can't believe this alimony thing. How long are these 33% payments to the ex supposed to last? And doesn't the fact that she's living with someone else come into account? Sheesh...it's so ridiculous!

[i]"this guy is 49 years old and he honestly wonders why his life and his future should be decimated by his ex. and the courts. His only mistake was to marry this woman."[/i]

I know exactly how he feels on this one. It's so sad that people can do this sort of thing to each other...and their children. And people wonder why I am determined to stay single these days!

"Hell hath no fury like a woman scorned"

Should be more like "Have a child with a girl in the US and you're screwed"

Here is my suggestion for your friend Paddy: Agree to the 33% wage deal as divorce terms. As I read your last point this means he gets to keep the house, investments, etc... Once this is finalized he should immediately sell everything he owns and transfer it to an offshore company that he has created for himself. Now that all his assets are out of the country (and safe) he can declare bankruptcy in the US. Depending on the type of work he does, he can then operate his business out of the other country... thus denying the wife her alimony... and she didn't get half he owns either.

He cannot just cash in everything now and run to another country. The wife's lawyers will slap a hold on all assets and he'll lose them. If he does manage to escape with the goodies a judge will declare him a felon and he will be arrested if he ever returns to the US (to see his daughter).

By doing this he can continue to see his daughter, give her money without the wife garnishing it, and live in the US legally.

From what I've read/discussed with others it will require approximately 10 to 15 000 dollars to hire a consultant to arrange the offshore accounts. He will also have to pay the taxes for cashing in his pension fund, investments etc... an accountant can figure out how to defer some of this too.

Good luck

On a personal note: I too have recently been stung by the AW.

My GF has a job where she works 10 to 12 hours per day, plus 4 more on saturday (for a 40 hour week salary, and the company does not give her time off in lieu of overtime - why do people in the US put up with this??? - in Japan they would call this working oneself to death) and is therfor constantly tired. She has little to talk about other than work (because that's her entire life), and can't keep her eyes open past 11:00. For the past 2 months we have been doing nothing but going out for dinner, fucking, and sleeping away saturday and sunday. I'm bored out of my tree and have not been putting any effort into the relationship for the past 6 weeks. The sex is boring... I do all the work and she's given up her blowjob training courses. I know she won't back down on work, she's a habitual over-achiever, and sacrificed an ideal family life to move to Florida and pursue her career/school. She has proven many times that nothing will come between her and her (in my opinion) pointless careerism. On top of this she has become clingy and seems to think I should move in with her when she buys a house in the new year.

To get to the point...

I told her that I was not happy with her over working, her moving the relationship at too fast a pace, and think it's time to end things. She goes ballistic and tells me that I've been neglecting her (which I have... for the above reasons) and that I'm a total bastard. Now when we talk she always has a snide remark about me in some part of our dating (I told her I could stay with her if some things changed). So far, nothing has changed.

So this is what I get for being honest and mature with a girl: Misery. Had I just called up one day and said "have a good life" I would be free. But nooooo... I decide to be a decent guy and tell her the truth.

I'm sooooo... Fedup

And that's exactly why I don't want a partner!

My advice to you Fedup, would be....

If you love something, set it free.
If it comes back, it's yours.
If it doesn't...it never was.

An oldie but a goodie. If you stay with her and wait "until things change" there is a good chance that it will just go nowhere. Won't get better and it won't get worse...it'll just drag on like it is now. You have no motivation to leave because you are waiting for her to change, and she has no motivation to change because she knows you're not leaving. I say end it. If she truly loves you, she will make the necessary changes to win you back. If she doesn't bother, then at least you know sooner rather than later.

Yeah I know...I'm a callous b*tch. Women suck.

Oh, by the way...I have ten cigarettes left. When they're gone, I'm not buying any more.
Well, I'm gonna try not to...

Wish me luck. :)

C'mon RN! LOL You know yer gonna have a Jones fer the nicotine soon after that tenth ciggie has burned its last ember...

1] The check's in the mail
2] You're the best I've ever had
3] Size doesn't matter

Seriously though, cold turkey IS possible... my old man smoked heavily until 1975 and went cold turkey EVER SINCE. I don't like him as a person, but that is one accomplishment I have to begrudgingly admire him for.

Hi RN and Fed Up,

Thanks for your thoughts in reference to my friend and his attempts to extricate himself from a bad, bad situation.

He's working with a trusted accountant who has advised some of the things that you suggested. Lawyers here will not help him because they would be assisting potentially felony behavior on his part.

The idea of internet banking to get money to his kids is an excellent one. Also, his accountant suggested that he take the 33% hit, liquidate his assets and then escape. Still, the only way he'll see his kids is if they come to visit him - wherever that might be.

Yes, Fed Up, having a kid with an American woman is a real dangerous undertaking given the laws here. When it comes to divorce law in America, guys are at a real disadvantage.

Good luck quitting smoking RN. It's not easy but you're a rather strong willed and tenacious person. In other words, if anyone can quit you're the kind of person that can. One last thing. Every medical study that comes out in the states about smoking indicates that it is sooo dangerous that it almost defies description. I'm sure that they're saying the same thing is Oz too. Again, best of luck.

PS My friend has confirmed your views on immigration to Oz. I think that he's focusing on New Zealand instead.

Paddy