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08-07-10 21:10 #3812
Posts: 1Directly from LA Cafe Management
I emailed the LA Cafe and they said they would definitely be opening soon but did not elaborate.
They also sent this letter in reply.
OPEN LETTER TO
Honorable Harry K. Thomas, Jr
Ambassador to the Philippines
United States Embassy
Roxas Boulevard
City of Manila
THE CHAIRMAN
COMMISSION OF HUMAN RIGHTS PHILIPPINES
SAAC BUILDING,
Commonwealth Avenue,
Quezon City
Ms. Elzadia Washington
USAID Philippines
Acting Mission Director
United Nations Avenue,
Ermita, City of Manila
infoph@usaid.gov
Mr Roger Carlson
USAID Philippines
Acting Deputy Mission Director
United Nations Avenue,
Ermita, City of Manila
infoph@usaid.gov
Dear Sirs / Madame,
The employees of LA Cafe would like to address the fabricated press releases and totally untrue allegations coming from an AMERICAN FUNDED group called International Justice Mission (IJM) under the leadership of a certainAtty Carmela Andal-Castro, IJM Field officer
IJM Philippines an American Funded group claim they donate large sums of money to Philippine Government organizations. Their money comes from donations from American tax payers via USAID and various American Agency's.
LA Cafe has been operating as a restaurant, live band , billiards bar similar to an American Theme Restaurant/Bar in Makati called Hard Rock Cafe since 1999 without any problem's ror issues affecting public morality or health. LA Cafe enjoys Worldwide renown and is a significant contributor to local Philippine employment and welfare.
LA Cafe is a member of the Manila Entertainment Music Lounge Association and has been accredited by the Department of Tourism Philippines (DOT) since 1999
In early 2007 the general manager of L A Cafe was attacked by an inebriatedAmerican National and as a direct consequence suffered a life threatening heart attack, resulting in a full heart by pass operation at the Philippine General Hospital
The General Manager of LA Cafe once released from hosiptal filed a case against the American National Mr. MARC EDWARD MC CABE / IS # 06-H-16862/ Address: 139 Blk 7 Sitio 3 Zone 7 Sto.Nino A. Bonifacio, Western Bicutan Taguig – who claims he works for USAID Philippines
McCabe, a US citizen claimed he was ”un-touchable” in the Philippines as he worked for USAID Philippines and would use his infuence, connections and position of authority to cause problems for LA Cafe if a case was taken against him.
This criminal case IS# 06-H-16862 can be verified by the Regional Trial Court of Manila – the criminal case is still being processed and continued.
Why did an American USAID supported group (IJM) start to harrass a legalFilipino business that EMPLOYS more than 190 FILIPINOS as waitresses , bar tenders, utility, chefs, live bands ,dj's, security guards, and administrative and purchasing staff? Workers who support their families and now have NO EMPLOYMENT!! thanks to the unfounded and untrue accusations and cases issued by IJM an American funded group, just a week after the case involving the USA National McCabe was elevated to court?
To compound matters and to highlight the level of vindictive behavior thrust upon this FILIPINO company by the AMERICAN funded group, IJM, several honest and hard working L.A Café waitresses have been accused by IJM of beingPROSTITUTES! These accusations were made nationally in our FILIPINOnewspapers giving no thought to the humiliation felt by hard working FILIPINASas the baseless lies are paraded in front of their families! These poor FILIPINA waitresses were even paraded like animals on Philippine national television (TV PATROL), accused and condemned as PROSTITUTES and CRIMINALS while wearing their work uniforms!!
The American sponsored group INTERNATIONAL JUSTICE MISSION are the entity that filed a complaint against LA Cafe with the Manila City Hall, as verified by the newspapers
The Manila Standard Newspaper even wrote in their article that Mayor Lim had previously closed LA Cafe which is un true and baseless.
How would AMERICANS react if we FILIPINOS marched into a Hard Rock Café in New York, or TGI Fridays in Los Angeles, a HOOTERS BAR in Las Vegasor any AMERICAN owned restaurant and accused AMERICAN waitresses of being sex workers, PIMPS and PROSTITUTES writing un founded allegations to your beloved Mayor!!
Would this ever happen to the American Franchise Chain's in the Philippines such as HOOTERS MANILA, HARD ROCK CAFE, TGI FRIDAYS, OUTBACK, CAFE HAVANA, CALIFORNIA PIZZA OVEN, MCDONALDS or the American Hotel Chains such as the MARRIOT PARANAQUE, HOLIDAY INN CLARK or the RENAISSANCE MAKATI where they have restaurants, bars and discos
These Filipina waitresses, supervisors and management all come from respectable Philippine famalies and are now branded as PROSTITUTES, PIMPS and CRIMINALS in their own Country the Philippines by thisAMERICAN funded organization IJM
There are many similar Filipino establishments within walking distance from LA Cafe such as HOOTERS Manila Bay, Hard Rock Cafe, Hobbit House, Cafe Havana, TGI Friday's, Cowboy Grill, which have never been a target of the American funded IJM and their vindictive operations against Filipino's
How can this American supported mission IJM ask for donation's from the American taxpayer for EVANGELICAL work here in our beloved Philippines whilst fabricating evidence and issuing affidavits against hard working Filipinos in our own Country, the Philippines?! All because the AMERICAN, McCABE got drunk and was sued correctly within OUR LEGAL SYSTEM???
Which legal Filipino establishment will this American Funded Group (IJM) target next and fabricate evidence against the management and have inocent Filipinos forced into jail while using American Tax Payers Money in our Country the Philippines
There are now four (4) FILIPINA'S who work for L. A. Cafe Restaurant/Bar as managers/supervisors facing LIFE IMPRISONMENT due to the total and baseless fabrication of evidence and sworn affidavits that they were pimpingPROSTITUTES and are themselves PROSTITUTES
Their names have been published in all the National Newspapers by the American funded IJM using American Tax Payers money
Amazingly there are two (2) Filipina customers of LA Cafe who the American funded IJM
claim worked in L. A. Cafe, the management of LA Cafe has no record of there persons nor knowledge who they are.
The final detainee does not work for LA Cafe but is the manager of LA Cafe Annex in the adjacent building which is a small billiard hall employing 14 Filipino waitresses, utility and security. This small billiard hall is also closed due to fabricated allegations depriving its Filipino employees their constitutional right to work and support their families thanks to IJM.
All the employees of LA Cafe have valid work/health permits issued by Manila City Hall
Does the RAID on LA Cafe during a 2010 World Cup Soccer game and live performing Live Bands at 10.30pm at night have anything to do with the vendeta of the American National who claims to be a USAID employee who was aREGULAR CUSTOMER of LA Cafe until his drunken fit of rage with his Filipina girlfriend against the General Manager of LA Cafe??
L. A. Cafe has a very clear Policy with our 12 security guards managed by anhonorable decorated retiried Filipino Colonel that NO MINORS are to enter the premises as ordered by Manila City Hall even though we are just a public restaurant and bar. The NO MINORS policy is clearly shown at the entrance and throughout the premises with prominent signs. Any minor who is out after 10 pm is a violation of Manila City Ordinance 8046 and responsibility of the parents, barangay officials and police.
No Philippine National is forced to work at L. A. Cafe as claimed by the American IJM Group. This idea is RIDICULOUS, BASELESS and is a TOTAL FABRICATION!! The AMERICANS have their own history of SLAVERY, we proud FILIPINOS DO NOT !!!
How interesting is that many United States of America DIPLOMATSfrequent LA Cafe (since its opening) and know personally the employees now held in jail, due to the fabricated affidavits of an agency that they support, The IJM!
How ironic that the United States of America Philippines Embassy held a going away party for an American DIPLOMAT at LA Cafe recently, the Embassy department even more ironically was NCIS (Strategic Investigations) of the United States of America in the Philippines
This is NOT A FABRICATION unlike the baseless claims of IJM the LA Cafe has 16 CCTV Cameras constantly monitoring the premises for the protection of us the staff and its customers. CCTV footage can SUPPORT ANY counter claims made by LA Café against IJM and their hypocritical American supporters.
Many foreign and Filipino executives are customers of LA Cafe both female and male personalities including famous actors, actresses and sportsmen. The LA Café is a tourist attraction and brings foreign money to our country and to our community, helping to support our local families.
LA Cafe proudly sponsors, as being the largest billiard venue in Manila (On and off) the following famous athletes and done since opening in 1999 with pride
Manny Pacquiao Pound for Pound greatest boxer in the World
Bobby Pacquiao Former Asia Pacific Boxing Champion
Efren ”Bata” Reyes Hall of Fame Billiard Player and many times over Wold Champion
Francisco Bustmante Former World Number 1 Billiard Player
Marlon Manalo World number 6 Billiard Player
Jeff De Luna Professional Pool Player
Alex Pagulayan World 2004 Billiard Champion
Roberto Gomes World 9 ball Runner up
Darren Appelton World number 1 English Pool player British
Karl Boyles UK World 8 Ball Champion
Rudolfo Luat Former world number 1 9 ball billiard player
Ronny Alcano World 9 and 10 ball champion
Steve Davis Number 1 paid UK athlete in 1988 and World Snooker Champion
Dennis Orcollo Current World Number 1 Billiard Player
LA Cafe is the proud Sponsor of MP Warriors General Santos Basketball Team.
LA Cafe arrange regular live exhibitions by these athletes, two weeks ago there was an exhibition billiard game featuring Efren ”Bata” Reyes a Filipino icon
Two live band's perform daily on the second floor where the American funded IJM claim is located a sex den
The second floor has live bands, 4 billiard tables, eating area and an extensive wine cellar
There are NO PRIVATE VIP rooms anywhere in LA Cafe
LA Cafe bands are auditioned by both International and American Hotel chains from Guam, Dubai, Singapore, Hong Kong, China and Malaysia.
The bands from LA Cafe then receive legal contracts to work throughout the world as a performing artists.Something we FILIPINO's can be proud of. Does this constitute [CodeWord908] as alleged by American funded IJM
The World famous Filipino Artists that have and until last week did perform in the LA Cafes second floor, claimed to be a SEX DEN by the AMERICAN IJM, include
Ramon ”RJ” Jacinto Rock and Roll Legend of the Philippines
Freddie ”Anak” Aguilar (For over 10 years) KA Freddie
Side A
Freestyle
Aegis
(Francis Magalona)
Andrew E
Southborder
Cushe
Highway 69
Christoper De Leon
Air Supply International Band
And two (2) local bands daily who vary from day to day.
Manila Dogs Golf Club (500 Members) which was founded by LA Cafe and has been the home of the club since 2001, have their weekly prize giving at LA Cafe.
Players include both male and female diplomats from many Embassies including the United States of America
Palugaw Soup Kitchen for the Ermita Street Children
Every weekend LA Cafe sponsors Palugaw Soup Kitchen with the Barangay 668 to feed the street children of Ermita, this will now be cancelled due to the closure of LA Cafe thereby depriving Filipino Street Children the opportunity of a full meal once a week due to the American Funded IJM
Should IJM not use their American funded resources to feed and help these innocent street children in Ermita which LA Cafe has done for years instead of closing legitimate business for their own personal gain for more funding from America
We the employees of LA Cafe request that this American funded IJM be stopped from continuing to use American Tax payers money to make victims of innocent Filipinos! We are perfectly able in our own country to control our own affairs and do not need to be bullied by some HYPOCRITICAL American funded mission
The American funded IJM are wasting the time of the Philippine courts while making Millions of Peso's for themselves from the donations given to them by American Agencies and the American “man in the street”. Most importantly we cannot work and support our loved ones and we don’t have their resources to repudiate these FALSE and BASELESS accusations against us
FINALLY WE THE EMPLOYEES OF LA CAFE HAVE LEGAL DOCUMENTS AND SIGNED AFFIDAVITS PROVING THAT IJM AN AMERICAN FUNDED MISSION ARE USING AMERICAN DOLLARS TO OBTAIN FALSE AFFIDAVITS FROM THIRD PARTIES TO CRIMINALLY PROSECUTE INNOCENT FILIPINOS SO THEY CAN JUSTIFY THEMSELVES TO THEIR AMERICAN HEAD QUARTERS TO RECEIVE MORE FUNDING FOR THEIR PERSONAL GAIN AT THE EXPENSE OF FILIPINOS
Mabuhay!
Employees Crisis Commitee of L A Cafe
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08-07-10 18:35 #3811
Posts: 6836lighting for your camcorder
Originally Posted by GregLondon
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08-07-10 18:19 #3810
Posts: 234New Harry the Horse
the aug harry the horse issue is out. http://www.harrythehorse.com/2010/august.htm
there is an open letter posted to honorable harry k. thomas, jr, american ambassador to the philippines, the chairman, commission of human rights, philippines, ms. elzadia, usaid philippines and mr. roger carlson, usaid philippines regarding the lac closing and addressing accusations that lac staff were pimping, whoring, and soliciting. its a decent read. it goes to great lengths showing the accusations are false, and address possible motives for the accusations.
a few highlights:
the employees of la cafe would like to address the fabricated press releases and totally untrue allegations coming from an american funded group called international justice mission (ijm) under the leadership of a certain atty carmela andal-castro, ijm field officer. ijm philippines an american funded group claim they donate large sums of money to philippine government organizations.
the general manager of la cafe once released from hospital filed a case against the american national mr. marc edward mc cabe / is # 06-h-16862/ address: 139 blk 7 sitio 3 zone 7 sto.nino a. bonifacio, western bicutan taguig – who claims he works for usaid philippines. mccabe, a us citizen claimed he was "un-touchable" in the philippines as he worked for usasid philippines and would use his infuence, connections and position of authority to cause problems for la cafe if a case was taken against him. this criminal case is# 06-h-16862 can be verified by the regional trial court of manila – the criminal case is still being processed and continued.
why did an american usaid supported group (ijm) start to harrass a legal filipino business that employs more than 190 filipinos as waitresses , bar tenders, utility, chefs, live bands ,dj's, security guards, and administrative and purchasing staff? workers who support their families and now have no employment!! thanks to the unfounded and untrue accusations and cases issued by ijm an american funded group, just a week after the case involving the usa national mccabe was elevated to court?
the american sponsored group international justice mission are the entity that filed a complaint against la cafe with the manila city hall, as verified by the newspapers. the manila standard newspaper even wrote in their article that mayor lim had previously closed la cafe which is un true and baseless. how would americans react if we filipinos marched into a hard rock café in new york, or tgi fridays in los angeles, a hooters bar in las vegas or any american owned restaurant and accused american waitresses of being sex workers, pimps and prostitutes writing un founded allegations to your beloved mayor!!
l. a. cafe has a very clear policy with our 12 security guards managed by an honorable decorated retiried filipino colonel that no minors are to enter the premises as ordered by manila city hall even though we are just a public restaurant and bar. the no minors policy is clearly shown at the entrance and throughout the premises with prominent signs. any minor who is out after 10 pm is a violation of manila city ordinance 8046 and responsibility of the parents, barangay officials and police. no philippine national is forced to work at l. a. cafe as claimed by the american ijm group. this idea is ridiculous, baseless and is a total fabrication!! the americans have their own history of slavery, we proud filipinos do not !!! (ok, ouch lol...comment mine)
harry, to give the truth, la cafe was just to give lim some promotion. i worked there for many years, all workers are over 18, they don't hire **** females. the boarding house out back is for girls who don't have a home and they can stay there, they have a security guard to keep out males. there were no **** girls there. this is usually a police setup as many times in the past, same here. la will reopen this month. that's a fact, mike (i know that the la cafe was a popular hang-out and that many, many lady customers were part of its popularity, but they were not employees. it will be interesting to see if your prediction comes true)
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07-27-10 09:14 #3809
Posts: 26Originally Posted by Denom
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07-27-10 04:58 #3808
Posts: 634HD CamCorders
I recently decided to invest in a HD Camcorder to record some of my recent exploits for posterity. I already had a reasonably decent video capability on my digital cam so hitherto I had thought it not worth getting a specialist camcorder.
I bought the cheapest Japanese branded one I could find with HD capability. The Chinese ones were about 30% cheaper but I prefer to go with a brand I'm familiar with. As I'm in the Phils I had to settle for a slightly out of date and over priced model cf that available in West. The Sanyo Xacti VPC HD700 for 11,000P here in the Phils.
Actually I'm very pleased with the results. Its a really compact easy to use machine. In good lighting the pics are excellent, in low lighting the pics are much more grainy so if you wish to spend more money this is a feature you should focus on.
I found its really better to have a spare person to take the recordings whilst you are fucking, another reason for getting 2 or more very open minded girls. LOL
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07-26-10 13:01 #3807
Posts: 3003Originally Posted by Radoboy
Except that he had probably heard the same tired joke a million times.
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07-26-10 07:15 #3806
Posts: 188Originally Posted by Red Kilt
If you are of a certain age and not married, Filipinas and Filipinos will think that there is something wrong with you (which in fact is true, since being a sex tourists is "wrong"). They will call you "butterfly" and "babaero".
If, on the other hand, you are married but also support several other women for sex, they will find this perfectly acceptable - even though it is in fact less commendable from a moral point of view.
There are, after all, not that many differences between Christians and Muslims. At the end, it amounts to the same. Muslims can have many wives, but often can't afford it. Rich Christians do have many wives, just like rich Muslims do. At the end, it just amounts to a matter of wealth. The difference is that Christians are hypocrite about it.
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07-26-10 06:54 #3805
Posts: 3230Originally Posted by Red Kilt
My major point was that many of the guys who call filipinas all manner of names for being chronic liars also tell the most blatant lies to the girls too. I am bemused by this anomaly and even more amused by the way that it is rationalised away by the same guys when they are challenged about it.
Econotech knew what I was saying when he mentioned the tolerance levels.
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07-26-10 05:56 #3804
Posts: 1685Originally Posted by Carmex
This is getting hilarious. I wonder if the whiners are just out of college or have never had any experience with women. OR. Just assumed that since back home women are screwed up, Asian women will be as they are promoted "obedient, subservient, and never saying no, and always willing to oblige". Forgetting that people are people where-ever they are.
It is just. In Asia, when an Asian screws up, it is bad, but when a westerner screws up, just the tolerance is a bit higher, but that also has a break point.
The classic example I hear from my friends. When an Europeans talks about positions with Asian girls, the girls go "wow, you europeans are so open minded about sex. " and when an Asian guys pips in. With similar comments, the girls go "damn pervert. "
So. The grass is always greener. Doesn't mean anything else.
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07-25-10 21:44 #3803
Posts: 33Lies = mental survival for some
Women are deceivers. In every culture. What do you think make up is? Nothing but deception. Since Eve if you want to get philosophical.
I once challenged a missionary to ask his good wife if women deceive men. Her answer? "well if the men allow themselves to be deceived" Se how they twist their didhonesty to mak it our fault? Which meets my second point. Women are far better verbal creatures. They manipulate and manage and hurt men with words.
When a man sometimes finally retaliates physically. He wasn't the aggressor or the initiator. He is still WRONG, but often not the initiator.
I guarantee – they will see past your bald faced lies. And choose to ignore it, for their own benefit.
The fun part is when you call their bs: New shoes dear? Her" no I've had them for ages " Him " lucky that they are the new seasons colors" haha
Its a game A sport. Find one who is 100% straight and no natter how ugly marry her Or send her to me and I will
From a movie I like: Man us the head of the house- but the woman is the neck: and she can turn the head anyway she likes.
Pinays lie as a way of surviving. They live in large families and in close housing there is no privacy. Plus they are free Islander like people oppressed by old Spanish Catholic moralities. SO the ONLY way to survive, to stay sane, is to lie, lie alone. Lie in teams. I have seen it done as a way of life in 3 Filipino families and am convinced it's the norm.
Pretending to ignore the lie. Also seems to be part of how the game is played. I hate it.
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07-25-10 17:43 #3802
Posts: 243Words for thought
Well as long as we are on the subject, I thought I would add. My live in GF here in Asia was a blonde from Texas with gigantic titties. When she would ask me questions like, "do you love me?", "how does this dress look?", "What do you think about ...", I would always reply with a truthful answer.
Finally she said to me one day, "We are going to have to work on your responses". She then went on to tell me, when a woman says this, you say this. Thus, I surmised it really did not matter at all what my opinion was, she was looking for a conditioned response, i.e. you are beautiful, not fat, I love you dearly, and you are the only one for me ever!
I wonder if this is what transcends all women, meaning, if you are talking to a bar girl then she has conditioned responses to questions that she thinks you want to hear that will make you happy. It only goes to reason. And the inverse might also be true, meaning if she is asking you questions then you are providing answers that you think she will want to hear. Is this lying outright? I am not sure. My guess is we should quantify what is exactly lying or not.
We are on vacation correct? So do you really want to hear, "I have three kids at home and support my Filipino husbands' drinking, cockfighting, and yaba addiction by fucking various foreign men throughout the month. Oh yea, and your number 35 this month so just short of fucking my ear I hope you don't get VD, warts, or Chlamydia because I was 'sick' the day I was supposed to go to hygiene".
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07-25-10 10:49 #3801
Posts: 33A culture of lies
Women are deceivers. In every culture. What do you think make up is? Nothing but deception Since Eve if you want to get philosophical.
I once challenged a missionary to ask his good wife is women deceive men. Her answer? "well if the men allow themselves to be deceived" Which meets my second point. Women are far better verbal creatures. They manipulate and manage and hurt men with words.
When a man sometimes finally retaliates physically. He wasn't the aggressor or the initiator. He is still WRONG, but often not the initiator.
I guarantee – they will see past your bald faced lies. And choose to ignore it, for their own benefit.
The fun part is when you call they bs: New shoes dear? Her" no I've had them for ages " Him " good that they are the new seasons colors" haha
Its a game A sport. Find one who is 100% straight and no natter how ugly marry her Or send her to me and I will
From a movie I like: Man u\is the head of the house- but the woman is the neck: and she can turn the head anyway she likes.
Pinays lie as a way of surviving. They live in large families and in close housing there is no privacy. Plus they are free Islander like people oppressed by old Spanish Catholic moralities. SO the ONLY way to survive, to stay sane, is to lie, lie alone. Lie in teams. I have seen it done as a way of life in 3 Filipino families and am convinced it's the norm.
Pretending to ignore the lie. Also seems to be part of how the game is played. I hate it.
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07-25-10 08:13 #3800
Posts: 1685Originally Posted by Red Kilt
I was wondering why the thread degenerated into a load of name calling about filipinas. And the culture and what not. Till you enlightened the masses.
Damn, I wonder why people over analyse such stuff.
If you are looking for a wife. Look for a wife in nicer places. Darker places such as bars only have people who have dark intentions. Either knowingly or unknowingly (in the knowingly category. They plan to make money. In the unknowingly category. They are made to make money by their circumstances / family /bf etc.)
If you are looking for a screw. Just do it and get over it.
If you are looking for a long term relationship. Don't look for it in the bars. Now can you guys also reveal how many women in the west marry guys for the money and then call it quits? You could add in the load of sham marriages almost everywhere.
For some, it is filipinas ripping them, for Singaporeans, it is China girls ripping them, for Malaysians, it is Indonesian girls ripping them. So. It is everywhere.
Just pay the girl to leave, and move on.
If you are psycho analysing stuff, let me quote this little joke, that applies for all women.
A man was walking along the beach in california, and saw a bottle. Rubbed it and as expected a genie popped up. The genie said he could ask for 3 wishes. The guy says "I want a million dollar in my bank account" and the genie says "done"
Then the guy says "and a beachfront property in florida, with a mini golf course and private marina". And the genie says "done
Then the guy says "I want to go to hawaii, but I am scared of flying. Can you build a highway from west coast to hawaii? " the genie says "no can do, it is thousands of miles away over the sea. Ask something else"
Then the guy says "ok, then can you tell me how to read the mind of a woman? "
The genie says "errr. The highway, you want it four lane or six lane? "
Get the drift?
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07-25-10 07:43 #3799
Posts: 3230Doesn't everyone tell lies?
I am amused by the number of guys who visit either AC or other monger destinations who continually criticize filipinas as being liars and cheats and thieves etc.
How many of these same guys tell the girls that they are not married (when they are); divorced (when they are not) don't have kids (when they do), looking for a possible pinay wife (when they are not), plan to settle here (when they aren't and cannot anyway) and so on?
I know 2 guys whose whole life here is described to women as the complete opposite of the truth. When I go out with one of these guys he relies on me to go along with his charade and not "blow his bullshit stories". Yet he is one of the same people who uses the old corny "if her lips are moving then she is lying" line.
He doesn't see the hypocrisy when I challenge him about this. He says it is "different".
I am not suggesting that we have to divulge everything about ourselves to the girls but I do wonder about telling them absolute bullshit lies. I tend to fall into the category of not telling them anything rather than telling them straight out lies. I don't subscribe to the theory that says "they tell me lies so I will lie in return".
Just wondering if any readers are the same as my mate. That is, you think pinays are liars but it's OK to tell them a heap of lies about yourself too.
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07-25-10 05:51 #3798
Posts: 3359Originally Posted by Vaughnyb1