Seoul

[Mofaka]

since we're still on the "guidebook to humping good kgirls part googleplex", the sheer truth is, it's way the fuck cheaper to go straight p4p than to be a shiny white playa. if one tries to play the prada obsessed hyolee lookalike, you better be pulling in 6 figures at minimum! you need to be banking shitloads while having every korean in your social group aware of it without being crass (if possible at all in korea).

nice boyfriend and nice girlfriend senarios are just as rare for the korean korean couple. foreigner korean couples that don't look like ass? fuggitaboutit. urban fucking legend created by some fob uni grad turned esl guru.

ffs! there's a freaking korean tv show that spoofs this sheer fact! here's the setup. average-hot kgirl brings her new foreign beau to meet with the unsuspecting parents. parents are in silent and utter shock. foreigner throws in some korean skills, anyunghaaaaaaseyoooooo. actually ends up looking like a ******* (and not johnny knoxville sheik neither) to foreigners as well! foreigner takes a [CodeWord134] break. parents shit bricks at their newly dubbed ho daughter. dude comes back and the jig is up! all around laughs, family fun! roflmaowpm! whatever...

quick tangent: all male foreign extras whom volunteer to "act" in dramatizations or any korean tv shows need to be publically bitchslapped, flayed, and basted with iodine. wtf are they thinking?! i wanna be on ktv and be the dumbest representative to my home country! cool dude!

my point from this whole diatribe? if you wanna do the hump n dump with hot legit kgirls in seoul, be invisible. midnight hookups with rich inebriated kgirls speaking gibberish on their "handuhphones" to you will be your microscopic window of opportunity. daytime or public dates hand in hand? go to krungthep or guangzhou, unless you'll take the amazingly mediocre korean female stock. you want the good shit and you're a foreigner 10 degrees short of being ck models? be insanely wealthy. if you're somehow the outlier, you won at life. seriously. of course, you probably wouldn't be reading an mb about p4p worldwide.

=m=

[BikeRider]

Let me add one final thing. I'll let you guys in on a little "secret". There are TONS of hot 25+ professional women out there. Attorneys, doctors, marketing directors, the list goes on. I've heard countless times that there aren't enough Korean men for them. Here's the thing though... many are waiting for the "big one", the Samsung or multinational execs, etc... Some do hookup with a foreign exec, but their natural preference is Korean, regardless of their English proficiency. In their world, perception IS status in the social heirarchy. Therefore, alot get a bit long in the tooth (29-30) and settle for a Korean 5' nothing prematurely balding minor exec... Its a motherfucking travesty! Korean women? They're as hardcore as they come, whether they be a full blown RLD ho or some hiso Boondang baby.

I have to agree with Mofaka here. I'm late 30's and speak basic Korean, and most of my GF's in Seoul have been late 20's early 30's (some married but most single) and professional: TV reporter, IT consultant, business manager. I usually don't have a problem finding them. Although, I have noticed as I approach the big 40 it is becoming more difficult to hook-up. But, that's being offset slightly by being able to speak Korean better. :-)

My impression has been in some cases that they're hooking up with me as a last resort in an attempt to find a husband. In other cases, the girls have been fairly straight up with things "I just want to have fun and a nice time with you". In an example of the former, the girl I picked up on a flight from Osan (she was in business class) this summer became mad at me when I dumped her (she was getting way too sticky as most k-girls do). She said "I went out with you and let my friends see me with you." Her point was not that I look like a hunchback (or perhaps it was), but that she lost face with her friends because she was dating a foreigner.

Don't let it bother you, but know the situation. Just use it as an excuse when you dump them!

[Shadoe]

I visited the hill Last night. The Fantasy bar, she pulled me in, she was a 7. small and sweet.

120,000won for BJ and Normal aktion. Was not the best I've had, but it was good.

Is there somewhere closer to me? Gangnam-gu.

Is there something cheaper in the area.

Let me know please. I'll be here a while. Laugh.

Tim

[Cute Guy 9000]

People don't learn too speak languages only from private schools, that's just utter garbage, there are other ways, chat rooms, internet groups, many organizations offering free English classes are some of the many ways, there's so many insane comments in your story, but saying that only middle and upper class Koreans can learn English

Of course there are people that have a talent for language and learn English outside of the expensive private school system. And the public school system, despite itself, can produce some fluent english speakers. But we're talking averages here. There are probably 23 year old english fluent Korean women out there happy to hop into bed with a 50 year old she meets in a bar or Starbucks. But, I wouldn't lay money on it.

All what I'm saying is don't assume there's an abundance of young English speaking Korean women who are waiting for their middle aged white man to swoop into Korea, take them to TGI Fridays and then bang them in their hotel. There's nothing quite sadder than seeing a middle aged man strutting around Seoul thinking he's a sex god because of his white skin. The fluent ones generally come from good families and have very high expectations and Korean society offers her a lot more in terms of career and status than a woman in China or Thailand.

Best of luck in your hunt. And choose what you want to believe. But the white guys who live here generally aren't running around screaming what a paradise of easy, white loving women this land is.

[Shadoe]

I visited the hill last night. Not really all that. For 120,000 BJ and normal from a good looking girl in the Fantsy Bar. she pulled me in as I walked by. Not bad, it it was not really that great.

Is there anything else out there for the same price or cheaper?

I am in Seoul, Gangnam-gu. Anyone know that area?

I would also be looking for a long term thing, i'll be here 6 months.

Please let me know.

Tim

[Nick Belane]

I was just wondering if anyone had any experience with the girls at On y Va, Black Penny, or Justin bar in Itaewon...

I dated a girl for nearly a year who later went on to work at Onyva. She was nice during the time we dated but turned into the biggest feckin' mercenary once she turned hostess. And the same is true for all those girls. They are merciless.

They are hot and they know it and they will make you pay and pay and pay. You'd better have pretty deep pockets and be willing to stick around until the bar closes in reasonably sober condition if you want to pick up. Be prepared to spend at least W500,000 before any of those girls will even consider leaving with you. And even then there is no guarantee. And no matter what they won't leave until the bar closes -- anywhere from 2am to 5am depending on how busy it is.

You could always go the direct route and ask, "What time do you finish and how much to f*ck you?" but I don't think you will be quoted anything less than the aforementioned W500,000. Probably more. A lot more.

[Mofaka]

*****s are in abundance in Korea, no doubt. Most are from the provinces and less educated. Many leave the country due to the shame of being identified or the idea that they may make more money(lies, especially with the current exchange rate). Their ability to speak english? Well, being ladies of the night is as low as one can get in the Korean heirarchy. Just right below to a standard bar girl (non p4p). I'm just gonna take a guess that their shyness of practicing "brothel" english is nonexistent in comparison to their situation.

Most Koreans are educated in English in the school system early on. Yes, they can read and sometimes write proficiently. But their ability to converse in English is minimal to shutdown mode when approached. I think what CG9k is talking about the Apgu Kgirls whom can converse in somewhat competent English, instead of the "you no have money" vernacular of p4p girls.

If you're a middle aged foreigner with minimal Korean skills "ul ma yo" and aren't able to pickup decent uni poon back home, fuck it. The ones you do "score", most definitely pros or moonlighting. Remember, this is still a country where 90% of the population consider the Korean female with a foreigner a prostitute straight up. Ask the Kgirls, they'll agree with that as well! If you could give a fuck, more power to you, but don't delude yourself.

CG9k is right. Korea is one of the most viscious and aesthetically obsessed nations in the world. It's all about the wad, in your wallet, that shows one's desirablity. Listen, it ain't all shits and giggles on the K front as well. You don't know how many times I've seen absolute troll adjushi's with hyperinflated K pr0n stars to innocent country girls chowing down at the Hyundai food court... Yet that adjushi with a sweaty balding head has got a gaudy ass $10k Rolex and Armani suit while engulfing jajangmyun.

The hot girls that are actually worth some human merit... well line up boys. Matchmaking adjummas are all on their ass with countless suitors whom own a BMW fleet in their garage. Booking clubs are just a laymen's glimpse on the feeding frenzy for the "hope" of legitimate hookups. Of course those too have become bastardized and the ho's have come storming in. No that's not a good thing for p4p. It equates to overinflated won for shit service...

Let me add one final thing. I'll let you guys in on a little "secret". There are TONS of hot 25+ professional women out there. Attorneys, doctors, marketing directors, the list goes on. I've heard countless times that there aren't enough Korean men for them. Here's the thing though... many are waiting for the "big one", the Samsung or multinational execs, etc... Some do hookup with a foreign exec, but their natural preference is Korean, regardless of their English proficiency. In their world, perception IS status in the social heirarchy. Therefore, alot get a bit long in the tooth (29-30) and settle for a Korean 5' nothing prematurely balding minor exec... Its a motherfucking travesty! Korean women? They're as hardcore as they come, whether they be a full blown RLD ho or some hiso Boondang baby.

Don't assume to know the game here. It's no holds barred mma style with barbed wire rings. If you try the western sensitive guy route, expect a rude awakening... If somehow you are able to... fuck'em n dump'em. That's priceless words of wisdom here.

[Jake III]

I was just wondering if anyone had any experience with the girls at On y Va, Black Penny, or Justin bar in Itaewon, you know the more upscale places in Itaewon. The girls I've seen there are hot. Is it possible to take them out? How much?

I must add I've been a regular up the hill for a while now. Miya at the Fantasy bar is always around for an afternoon romp and is well experienced at giving a nice sloppy blow job followed by a good fucking. She's worth visiting a few times because she puts out even more. I had one of the best experiences the other nite at paradise club with this girl about 7 face, 8 body. It was late so i think she was pretty loaded up on booze and right away she grabbed me and led me inside, locking the door as she closed it. i was following my little head so as soon as she showed me some tits and grabbed my cock i could hardly think about shopping around. A hundred g's quickly slipped from my pocket and I was nailing her doggy style next to the bar within a minute. All in all a good time.

[Run Mann]

Now all you poor fat guys know that this is just someone running off his mouth about his experience, people don't learn too speak languages only from private schools, that's just utter garbage, there are other ways, chat rooms, internet groups, many organizations offering free English classes are some of the many ways, there's so many insane comments in your story, but saying that only middle and upper class Koreans can learn English, I suppose that all those Koreans working on the many military bases in Korea and speak English are all middle and upper class people working for low to medium wages, yeah right! The many Korean translators that are employed by the U.S Military are all middle classes making the kinda of money they're making. Be for real! The occasional hooker one might meet with better english skills than some native speakers must be upper and middle class too. There are thousands of Korean soldiers know as "KATUSAS" that speak english, granted some better than others and never attended a day of private school (ever spent time with them), they learn it in public school and from being around GIs. I know this from my many years of interacting with them, research and write offer facts to back up your claims if you want to make these types of statements, this will give your piece the creditbility it's lacking. Learning to speak a language is depended on an individual's dedication and commitment to it. Unless you've dated a representative sample of Korean girls and you've obviously not, you shouldn't make blanket statements. You don't and can't speak for a whole race of people, no one can.

I know you don't know the majority of the civilian contractors, if you classified them as lonely and they're not the only ones, these people are living large, check out the Hyatt Hotel on a Friday night, but now I know you're making unfactual statements just to make your point. Because you don't see it doesn't mean it doesn't happen, even if you don't see these girls out there scooping out men doesn't mean that given the opportunity even from the poor fat slob they won't be receptive. We never know what people will when presented with the opportunity.

You obviously have some slant to this subject and have skewed it to the most extreme, maybe you just don't want the fat guy to succeed, I don't know, but don't believe you've convinced any reasonable thinking person with what you presented here, other than to show some bias on your part. Arguably the most complicated being are females especially in an austere environment as Korea can be, ergo their reaction cannot be predetermined by someone who professes to know what they will do because he dated some of them. If any of you have money to burn, can act the role of a "shinsa", regardless of how you look and you want to take a chance, my advise is to go for it, no one knows how far you will go. This we know more than ever after reading this exchange.

Of course it's opinion. I live here. I've dated Korean women. I talk to them. I'm just offering my observations and what these women have told me. If you're 50 and looking for a 23 year old Korean woman who is fluent in English, you can't think of them as being like a 23 year old thai woman or flipina. My educated opinion is your best chance is pay for play if you're not young, in shape, or stylish. Your ability to pick up a young lovely for a freebie is slim to none.

Koreans learn English in school but the English educaiton is generally a pitful joke. The only people who can really learn to speak it are those who come from middle classed families who can afford to send them to private night schools.

Koreans have a 97% Korean literacy. Sure. But I'm not sure how this is evidence they're fluent in English. Again, we come back to the unavoidable fact that women who speak English in Korea (beyond some basic words) are middle and upper classed. As a culture, these young women are consumed with the idea they have to pay their parents back and the way they do it is marrying a Korean man. They're really, really not out scoping the scene for a middle aged white man.

I see lots of them. And they're not exactly being mobbed by young lovelies in the bars. Given the lack of women on their arms, they're a pretty lonely looking bunch.

Hey, don't believe me. Come to Korea. Spend your time and money in the university districts trolling for a freebie from some young lovely or plunking yourself down in Starbucks in Edae waiting for the line to form at your table.

[OldAsiaHand]

Gentlemen,

I have read conflicting reports on acceptance of foreigners in these areas. I have not visited an RLD in a few years, but I remember one area where the chances for white guys was higher. Maybe it was Miara, but I am not certain. The alleyways were a bit darker if I remember. I think I paid 60k for BBBJ + FS. The girl was only about a 6-7, but the service was pretty good. I visited another two brighter areas where nearly all the girls refused.

What is the current situation? I do not want to pay more than 60-70k ST, but I am looking for better quality than one can find on the "hill". Any suggestions?

Thanks.

OAH

[Cute Guy 9000]

You certainly didn't say that in your original report, really this just appears to be your opinion, you presented no facts or data to back up what you're saying, it's an opinion and that's how your piece should have been presented.

Of course it's opinion. I live here. I've dated Korean women. I talk to them. I'm just offering my observations and what these women have told me. If you're 50 and looking for a 23 year old Korean woman who is fluent in English, you can't think of them as being like a 23 year old thai woman or flipina. My educated opinion is your best chance is pay for play if you're not young, in shape, or stylish. Your ability to pick up a young lovely for a freebie is slim to none.

And what does speaking English have to do with being middle class, from my experience, it appears that most Koreans have some concept of the English language and they learn it in school too.

Koreans learn English in school but the English educaiton is generally a pitful joke. The only people who can really learn to speak it are those who come from middle classed families who can afford to send them to private night schools.

The literacy rate in Korea is 93 to 97 percent depending on whose statistics you use, so even the lower class citizen have the learning ability, it has nothing to do with being middle class.

Koreans have a 97% Korean literacy. Sure. But I'm not sure how this is evidence they're fluent in English. Again, we come back to the unavoidable fact that women who speak English in Korea (beyond some basic words) are middle and upper classed. As a culture, these young women are consumed with the idea they have to pay their parents back and the way they do it is marrying a Korean man. They're really, really not out scoping the scene for a middle aged white man.

If you think that its so hard for the overweight ball guy from the USA to get connected, I invite you to go to Yongsan Army Garrison and conduct a survey with the many civilian contractors working over here. Ask them how, where and with whom they go to bed with at night. You may be surprise, at the end of the day unless you see it, you’ll never know what people are doing in private, no matter how they may present themselves to you in public

I see lots of them. And they're not exactly being mobbed by young lovelies in the bars. Given the lack of women on their arms, they're a pretty lonely looking bunch.

Hey, don't believe me. Come to Korea. Spend your time and money in the university districts trolling for a freebie from some young lovely or plunking yourself down in Starbucks in Edae waiting for the line to form at your table.

[Run Mann]

You certainly didn't say that in your original report, really this just appears to be your opinion, you presented no facts or data to back up what you're saying, it's an opinion and that's how your piece should have been presented. There's lots of assumption in your story, how do you know the women in the news story don't speak English? And what does speaking English have to do with being middle class, from my experience, it appears that most Koreans have some concept of the English language and they learn it in school too. The literacy rate in Korea is 93 to 97 percent depending on whose statistics you use, so even the lower class citizen have the learning ability, it has nothing to do with being middle class.

Using logic from your story, women in the USA are well off because its a wealthy country, but we all know too well that there are millions of Americans living in poverty so what make you think that because Korea is a top economic country that the citizens are doing well. And if they are doing so well, why is my masseuse a 22-yr. university student working out call? I never asked but maybe I will ask her next time what motivates her to do what she does if she has such good career opportunities. If you saw her on the street you would never believe what she does on the side.

Travel to NYC and visit some of the Massage Palors in Manhattan and ask your self why are there so many young Koreans (including other Asian races) working there.

Unless you go out and conduct a scientific survey and have data and FACTS to back up your claim, your story has little or no value because it’s not base on any quantifiable data, its your opinion, and that's ok if you say so. Presenting a story the way you did would make one believe you made your claim base on something other than your opinion or experience. There are no absolutes in the world, anything is possible. People are not adjuncts of each other; they can't be classified as a lockstep group because they all have different motivations. Some women like old men, some like fat men, some like skinny, they’re all different, different things motivates different people, I don’t know what the fat guy’s chances are with a Korean chick but the
percentage may not as be as low you seem to think.

If you think that its so hard for the overweight ball guy from the USA to get connected, I invite you to go to Yongsan Army Garrison and conduct a survey with the many civilian contractors working over here. Ask them how, where and with whom they go to bed with at night. You may be surprise, at the end of the day unless you see it, you’ll never know what people are doing in private, no matter how they may present themselves to you in public.

I'm not talking about all Korean women. Any society will have poor women who will turn to prostitution. And there are certainly women who ran up huge credit card debts and have had to turn to the sex industry to pay them off.

I'm talking about Korean women who speak English and the fantasy that they're willing to jump on anything white. I'm assuming if you're looking for a freebie in a bar with a 20something woman, your Korean skills are slim to none. Hence, you're hitting on the subset of Korean women who speak English. And that subset comes from a middle/upper class family and her expectations are quite different. She's not looking for an older foreign meal ticket like a Filipina might be. If she's in her 20s and she's looking for a foreigner, she'll probably go after a 20something Marine or a ESL teacher type.

If you're an older business man here, you're up against a lot of competition, including young Korean men who have no inhibitions about the most over the top displays of romantic attention and are willing to drop huge amounts of money on the object of their affection. If she's looking for a guy to show her a good time (measured by the amount of won spent on a date), it's not too hard for her to find local, moneyed Korean talent.

[Cute Guy 9000]

This story may turn out to be a smack in the face of Cute Guy's post about Korean women being well off and aren't looking for a meal ticket out of here.

US Club owner arrested in Korean trafficking, prostitution case.

I'm not talking about all Korean women. Any society will have poor women who will turn to prostitution. And there are certainly women who ran up huge credit card debts and have had to turn to the sex industry to pay them off.

I'm talking about Korean women who speak English and the fantasy that they're willing to jump on anything white. I'm assuming if you're looking for a freebie in a bar with a 20something woman, your Korean skills are slim to none. Hence, you're hitting on the subset of Korean women who speak English. And that subset comes from a middle/upper class family and her expectations are quite different. She's not looking for an older foreign meal ticket like a Filipina might be. If she's in her 20s and she's looking for a foreigner, she'll probably go after a 20something Marine or a ESL teacher type.

If you're an older business man here, you're up against a lot of competition, including young Korean men who have no inhibitions about the most over the top displays of romantic attention and are willing to drop huge amounts of money on the object of their affection. If she's looking for a guy to show her a good time (measured by the amount of won spent on a date), it's not too hard for her to find local, moneyed Korean talent.

[Darren 33]

What's the deal with Friends (Soongsil) these days? I'm not sure, but am under the impression that they do not want foreigners there anymore. Are you still getting regular service there without any hassles?

[Run Mann]

This story may turn out to be a smack in the face of Cute Guy's post about Korean women being well off and aren't looking for a meal ticket out of here.

Let me kill some fantasies for middle agers+ coming to Seoul looking to pick up some 20 year old in a miniskirt and kneesocks:

Seoul isn't the sticks of China. Seoul is the capital of one of the world's top economies. In short, women aren't looking for a meal ticket out of here, especially the ones who speak english. They're middle classed and have good career opportunities.

US Club owner arrested in Korean trafficking, prostitution case

By Bill Miller and agencies
May 3, 2005

Dallas - A Texas businessman faces federal charges of harboring seven Korean women who, according to federal agents, were illegally brought to the United States to work as party hostesses in his Dallas karaoke club.

(Name Removed), 39, of Coppell, was released on his own recognizance during a preliminary hearing Wednesday before U.S. Magistrate Irma C. Ramirez in Dallas. He was arrested early Tuesday at his home during a raid by 20 federal agents, including a heavily armed tactical team.

Special Agent David Popp of U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement testified that agents believe (name removed) worked with an "international alien smuggling ring" to recruit Korean hostesses for his business, the WA Club.

(name removed), a Korean-American, declined to answer questions from reporters as he rushed from the courthouse. A federal grand jury will decide whether there is enough evidence to bring the case to trial.

"I think the truth will come out," said his lawyer, William Bratton of Dallas. "I think it's a complicated case for the government to prove."

Bratton said (name removed) came to the United States in 1986 and became a naturalized citizen last year. He described his client as a legitimate businessman with a wife and child, whose livelihood is rattled by media attention on the case.

Especially harmful, he said, are inferences that He was running a sex slave ring.

But Sarah Saldana, a federal prosecutor, noted that (name removed) doesn't face any charges relating to prostitution.

"This case concerns the concealing and harboring of illegal aliens," she said. "It has nothing to do with the purpose that these women were brought here."

Concerns about prostitution, however, were what started the investigation.

According to Popp, his neighbors complained to police last year that women were constantly coming and going at night from (name removed)'s home in Coppell, northwest of Dallas.

Popp said vice detectives notified his office, which investigates human smuggling cases. Meanwhile, he said, one of the women escaped from name removed's home by jumping out of a second-story window.

He said she fled to a Korean minister who referred her to law enforcement officers. Popp said she later told him that the women worked at (name removed)'s club to pay the fees charged by the smugglers, about $12,000.

Popp said the woman reported that she was never forced to have sex with any of the Korean businessmen who came to the club, but some of the other women "chose to do so to pay off their debts quicker."