General Info

[Lefeu]

I was in Frankfurt the week of July 4th and visited Oase, Sharks, and Mainhattan. I was disappointed by the LU in all of them, compared to prior once-a-year visits. Sharks was relatively the best, followed by Oase, then Mainhattan. I visited Sharks the most (3 times) and also did quite a few 3-somes there.

Thinking about it, I was wondering whether the World Cup had something to do with it. Someone made the comment that many of the top girls probably went to work in Russia during the sport event. Unfortunately, I like eye candy and that was sorely missing on this trip.

[Maxime]

Looking for my new Eve, free bird goes everywhere, as say Mady ex History. Ch now at Oase: This guy goes everywhere. I discovered on this Friday, I didn't find any dreamed girl, even they were smiling, so I moved to discover Freudenhaus. Despite Ines and Anni, no room on this Friday, I preferred to watch great matches in Wimbledon, cheap 90 day. But 2 beautiful and relaxing clubs with friendly staff.

5 clubs on 3 days, for only 2 rooms, but a good discovery to repeat, even she doesn't have potential to become my new Eve. I really regret my Sharks Eve was not made for this business, she had the perfect behavior out of room for me, and her beauty worth I worked on her. Have to find a new one.

You must travel a lot of kilometers. Hope you will find your new Eve (before New Year's Eve).

[Der Auslander]

Attendance is down at just about every NRW club. GT might be the lone exception. Chongmal, BB69, Siri have been vocal about LR's attendance issues. Acapulco attendance drop-off was dramatic the second-half of 2017, there has been a rebound, but still not at pre-2017 levels. Recently, RN remarked that Stuttgart Paradise dropped its price from 79 EUR to 69 EUR, and suggested "business must be slow". As far as I know, there hasn't been a new FKK venue opening in Stuttgart area in over a decade, so can't see why they'd be losing business, unless customers just lost interest in paid sex or chose paid sex alternatives.

Agree with just about everything which you have written but I would add emphasis on the reality that FKK Clubs in or around the Frankfurt area (particularly the Frankfurt Mega Clubs) are simply not as much fun as they used to be. The casting at most clubs in Frankfurt and throughout Germany is now heavily reliant on almost exclusively Romanian ladies with perhaps a sprinkling of other nationalities. In fairness to these Romanian girls, they have provided sufficient casting to keep these clubs open and for a long time they have come to Germany in such numbers that they have helped keep the cost of pussy at an even keel. This has been the case for many years but has begun to gradually change as the girls (and possibly their managers) seek more financial return from each session. Up-selling is much more prevalent now (particularly in the Frankfurt Mega Club) than it ever was. There was a time when Euro 50 per half hour was sufficient payment. Requests for CIM and other optional extras were once infrequent, now they have become more or less the norm and consequently tend to ruin the mood in the room when conversation moves away from imaginary romance or fun and games back to financial matters yet again. You can still just about get reasonable service for Euro 100 per hour but the Euro 50 thirty minute session can very often leave the male club visitor less than satisfied.

The majority of mongers reading this Board, particularly those residing outside Deutschland, will visit FKK clubs only within the Frankfurt area and consequently clubs like Sharks and Oase will have a higher portion of non-national visitors. Irregular visitors or tourists, coming from East Asia or North America or even from other EU Countries, visit the clubs less often and as a consequence tend to spend more on their club visit. This tourist phenomenon so prevalent in FKK Sharks and FKK Oase (but also in some NRW clubs) has made these clubs much less attractive venues for lower spending locals. The girls are more accustomed to these higher spending non German nationals. You now even have the phenomenon of some girls specializing in the extraction of cash from East Asian wallets. Of course if you are an experienced monger or if you are prepared to hand over bundles of cash to a preferred favorite girl, you can still have a great time but for the less experienced or average monger it can be a more difficult task (particularly in Frankfurt) than it once was.

You do notice the more sharky nature of the Frankfurt clubs when you move away from the Hessen area (and to some extent when you also move away from Dusseldorf NRW) and visit second tier FKK and Sauna Clubs where you won't necessarily have the same quality level of casting but where your euros will probably go further and where demands for optional extras are less frequent. There can be more fun to be had and more bang for your buck or euro away from Frankfurt but overall throughout FKK Land the price of pussy has increased whilst at the same time the amount of fun to be had is less. I think this is a reason why the numbers visiting FKK and Sauna clubs are generally down.

But that said, I am also in agreement with what you have written.

[Ortos]

I will admit though, that of the three, Sharks' attendance levels would be the hardest to gauge. Simply because Sharks added rooms, lockers, and parking spaces in the last two years. So is it a case of male attendance decreasing at Sharks or did their infrastructure improvements just make it feel less congested?

Too bad they didn't add air conditioning in the many new rooms they introduced.

But you make many interesting points. Unfortunately more often than not discussions on comparing the two largest / most successful Hessen clubs Sharks vs Oase degenerate into emotional arguments similar to kids backing their favourite football club. But your comments are objective and seem devoid of any emotional bias towards one club or the other, so thanks for that. I agree that in general FKK attendance is on the decline, probably from a multitude of reasons, but I have to say that between Sharks and Oase, I believe (from my own observations over the past couple of years visiting both clubs) that Sharks definitely has (or at least used to have until quite recently) the stronger momentum between the two clubs; and at Sharks on "Cheap Charlie Weds 50 e Entry Tag" I've often seen lines of guys waiting to pay their discounted fee to get into the club, snaking out from reception desk right into the parking area, which is something one sees on a less frequent basis these days at Oase.

[McAdonis]

As are the German wages. And notice, the link shows real wages.

And these are countrynwide numbers, not some cherry picked sectors.

Just because average worker sees increase in real wages, does that mean that everyone in all sectors, should automatically get an increase?

As for the argument that girls better like the 50 E or else they can take a hike and go work in the red light district well, they are not doing that. They stayed in the clubs, and have increased their effective wages and still getting enough business. I am not advocating for a price increase for the FKK girls, I am merely pointing out that they do have enough pricing power and have been able to increase their true effective prices already (by cutting back on services, time, etc and still paid 50 E).

Going to RLD would mean lower rates. I suggested they try their luck with a paid sex option that earns them 200+ EUR per hour.

Some are getting enough business. Some aren't. Isn't pole dance crew among the most popular? I see them approaching men all the time, men who were actively engaged in conversation with each other, men that did not even initiate eye contact with them. They are considered top optics. And 50 is such a "bargain". On these days when there is a 3-to-1 male-female ratio, should they not be in demand the entire time? Yet they are hunting.

I suspect most WGs exaggerate how much their whales spend on them. Why exaggerate? A salesman is always going to give the appearance of being financially secure and not desperate for the sale. It doesn't matter if it's the end of the month, and the salesman is far from his quota. They don't let the prospect smell fear, and gain an upper hand in negotiations. Also there is an element of "social proof". Imagine a fly-in tourist who has just completed his trip. He is riding in his taxi to the airport, when he realizes he just dropped 2000 EUR on his favorite WG, which is way over his budget. He initially feels some remorse, but is then comforted when he recalls that she has all these whales that spend significantly more than he does. That validates to him that he didn't overpay. If all these rich men see value in her, than she must be a prize and worth every penny that he spent. What he doesn't suspect is that he is one of her top whales.

[McAdonis]

A month or two ago, we had extensive discussions and I thought we generally agreed that effective prices in FKK clubs have appreciated for the years. Do you no longer think that is true? Or are you saying effective prices went up only in FKK clubs but have stayed stable at a lower level outside the clubs (in RLD, street corner,.)?

The paid sex scene outside of FKK clubs is too big, so the range of services, optics, and prices is too wide. One person can only sample so much, but yes I do believe it has remained stable outside the clubs. Also at FKKs, I am meeting many regulars who share information, so I feel it is easier to obtain a more complete snapshot that encompasses more than just my own experiences.

I am not a big spender, but when I perceive value, I tend to go on more of a shopping spree. So while effective prices increased (price demands increased, attitudes worsened), my per visit spending Sharks is about half what it used to be. Same thing happened my last ten visits at Oase, before I just stopped attending completely. Not sure how many others fit my profile.

If prices are lower outside the FKK clubs and high inside, then FKKs would be losing market share and customers. If that is not happening, then it means FKK prices even after they have gone up effectively are not that high because they offer a superior product which their customers value.

I do believe FKKs are losing customers. Certainly none of the clubs are consistently as busy as they once were. Oase was the busiest Hessen club in 2013. Multiple mongers have told me that attendance has decreased or stayed flat the last few years, even with Oase introducing entry discount promotions and improved food offerings. World is reportedly a ghost town compared to years past. The emergence of Sharks in 2014-2016, we all know caused both Hessen incumbents to lose customers. But in my opinion Sharks in 2018 is not as busy as 2014-2016 either. I will admit though, that of the three, Sharks' attendance levels would be the hardest to gauge. Simply because Sharks added rooms, lockers, and parking spaces in the last two years. So is it a case of male attendance decreasing at Sharks or did their infrastructure improvements just make it feel less congested?

Attendance is down at just about every NRW club. GT might be the lone exception. Chongmal, BB69, Siri have been vocal about LR's attendance issues. Acapulco attendance drop-off was dramatic the second-half of 2017, there has been a rebound, but still not at pre-2017 levels. Recently, RN remarked that Stuttgart Paradise dropped its price from 79 EUR to 69 EUR, and suggested "business must be slow". As far as I know, there hasn't been a new FKK venue opening in Stuttgart area in over a decade, so can't see why they'd be losing business, unless customers just lost interest in paid sex or chose paid sex alternatives.

[Pistons]

Had a bad visit at PHG a few months ago, but at Oceans this weekend I met a great girl who is returning to PHG after a few days at Oceans. Guess she is more known by locals at PHG. Perhaps PHG is not too bad. But the indoor area was a bit dull, so make sure it is sunny and warm if you decide to try it out. The same can be said about DV. The outside area is nice. DV's problem is upselling and lack of girls. 20 feels a bit low, but if you get in for 35 (non messe day before 20.00), it can be fine I guess. Met 2-3 doable girls there. VV (Villa Vertigo) falls into the same group of clubs. Outside area can be nice, and some of the same type of girls can be found there. YY since it is in NL is 100% safe when it comes to BBBJ though. A big selling point for some.

[Takedown]

Ok so I have my itinerary planned, what do you guys think? I have a car so no problems getting around.

Thursday: Babylon.

Friday: Acapulco (or dolce vita?

Saturday: World (or Sharks?

Sunday: Goldentime and maybe Living Room.

Monday: Samya.

I did Sharks before and loved it, I'm thinking of giving world a try! Or is it really bad?

Is there anywhere better in that area on a Friday?

Thanks for all the advice! What is YY and PHG? Will samya be good enough on a Monday?

FYI I had the midnight pizza at LR before, it's just cold hard crisp pizza they leave lying around. But when there is a cook it's very good food.

YY is Ying Yang.

PHG Planet Happy Garden.

Haven't heard many good reports out of World. GT on a Sunday would be a busy mess.

Samya will be pretty dead on a Monday if no convention is in town, especially during the day time. Most clubs will be slow but Sharks, Oase, or GT on Mondays would be the only places that I would consider. Oase had about 3-4 nice looking girl during the day and 2-3 more showed up after 6 pm. Sharks would probably have similar numbers. GT's management will make sure to have something decent on Mondays and the club will been less busy.

[Sirioja]

Ok so I have my itinerary planned, what do you guys think? I have a car so no problems getting around.

Thursday: Babylon.

Friday: Acapulco (or dolce vita?

Saturday: World (or Sharks?

Sunday: Goldentime and maybe Living Room.

Monday: Samya.

On Monday, I would only advice Sharks.

Samya where pretty girls, on Friday or Saturday.

Sharks on Friday, Saturday or Sunday for 50 before 2 pm. I don't go anymore at World, even entry 47 before 1 pm.

GT on Friday or Sunday.

PHG is Planet Happy Garden, dead in the afternoon, but discotheque at night. Some black girls.

YY is Yng Yang Roermond NL, on Friday or Saturday.

[Ggeorge6]

Ok so I have my itinerary planned, what do you guys think? I have a car so no problems getting around.

Thursday: Babylon.

Friday: Acapulco (or dolce vita?

Saturday: World (or Sharks?

Sunday: Goldentime and maybe Living Room.

Monday: Samya.

I did Sharks before and loved it, I'm thinking of giving world a try! Or is it really bad?

Is there anywhere better in that area on a Friday?

On Sunday, I would advice GT or Sharks. After GT, you can move to LR for only 35 more, for midnight pizza, asking on GT desk a discount ticket for LR, when you leave.

For outdoor swimming pool, YY NL, or PHG with black girls, or Bab Elsdorf, or Dolce Vita, or Sharks, or Oase, or World, or Finca, or Mainhattan.

For woman types, GT or YY. Same for highest average level in bed.

For fresh beauties, Samya or Aca.

Thanks for all the advice! What is YY and PHG? Will samya be good enough on a Monday?

FYI I had the midnight pizza at LR before, it's just cold hard crisp pizza they leave lying around. But when there is a cook it's very good food.

[Sirioja]

Few days ago you never heard of Venus, and now you know all about it?

Looking for my new Eve, free bird goes everywhere, as say Mady ex History. Ch now at Oase: This guy goes everywhere. I discovered on this Friday, I didn't find any dreamed girl, even they were smiling, so I moved to discover Freudenhaus. Despite Ines and Anni, no room on this Friday, I preferred to watch great matches in Wimbledon, cheap 90 € day. But 2 beautiful and relaxing clubs with friendly staff.

5 clubs on 3 days, for only 2 rooms, but a good discovery to repeat, even she doesn't have potential to become my new Eve. I really regret my Sharks Eve was not made for this business, she had the perfect behavior out of room for me, and her beauty worth I worked on her. Have to find a new one.

[Maxime]

Also legendary Bernds, and very beautiful, small, saunaclub Venus where You can also have public sex in lounge upstairs or in kino downstairs, but couldn't find any girl to make me dream. You can see girls dancing at Venus.

Few days ago you never heard of Venus, and now you know all about it?

[Sirioja]

Thanks! It looks like only few options. And Babylon maybe the largest in that area. Others LU is very limited.

Freudenhaus does have a good interior. LU just doesn't match it.

Yes, Bab Elsdorf is the only big real FKK in NRW, can have public sex there. Outside swimming pool. Only few quite pretty girls. Kity started at Bab, her friend Barbi worked at Bab on end of 2014, before GT.

[JennyKk]

Also legendary Bernds, and very beautiful, small, saunaclub Venus where You can also have public sex in lounge upstairs or in kino downstairs, but couldn't find any girl to make me dream. You can see girls dancing at Venus.

Same at Freudenhaus Dortmund, not a FKK, but a very beautiful club. Girls and even staff couldn't understand I didn't go to room, but I enjoyed a good diner with excellent beans, like in UK or Duba for breakfast, then hot chocolate watching Wimbledon. No girl to make me dream, no beauty like Alina found at Bahama Maintal, when difficult for me to find at big Sharks or Samya, so when I find one, I m so happy and repeat with her as long it works, I marry for the best and leave for the worst. FKK life.

Thanks! It looks like only few options. And Babylon maybe the largest in that area. Others LU is very limited.

Freudenhaus does have a good interior. LU just doesn't match it.

[Sirioja]

Besides Babylon, any other decent clubs has the FKK rule for the ladies?

Also legendary Bernds, and very beautiful, small, saunaclub Venus where You can also have public sex in lounge upstairs or in kino downstairs, but couldn't find any girl to make me dream. You can see girls dancing at Venus.

Same at Freudenhaus Dortmund, not a FKK, but a very beautiful club. Girls and even staff couldn't understand I didn't go to room, but I enjoyed a good diner with excellent beans, like in UK or Dubaï for breakfast, then hot chocolate watching Wimbledon. No girl to make me dream, no beauty like Alina found at Bahama Maintal, when difficult for me to find at big Sharks or Samya, so when I find one, I m so happy and repeat with her as long it works, I marry for the best and leave for the worst. FKK life.