FKK Oase - Burgholzhausen

[Henio]

Hi Tony,

The followinf is a bit off topic, but what the fuck, most of the discussion nowdays is off topic anyways so here goes:

Only those from countries outside the EU (actually outside the EEA) need work permit (physicians also need work permit EU residents or not). Poland (along with Lithuania, Latvia, Hungary, Estonia) became part of EU last year.
So called "transitional regulations" apply for those countries. I am not sure what that exactly means, but during the transition time, you need to apply directly to the foreigners authority in your future place of residence for a residence permit (which also grants access to the labour market).

The reason you will find many girls from non EU countries taking vacation every 3 months is because they do not need a residence visa is for stays less than 90 days (they are not allowed to work during those 90 days though, but still do).

Bulgaria and Romania have completed EU negotiations and are set for membership in 2007. Romanians can enter Germany without visa as of 1.1.2002. Bulgarians can also enter without visa. People from both of these countries have to apply for work permit in Germany.

I am not sure what the lenth of work permit for non-EU residents is in Germany. The maximum time for issue of work permit in UK is 5 years, but can be extended. I would guess there are similar rules in Germany (but I have no idea though).

Chivaz

[Tony70]

Routard
Many thanks for clearing up this point about security, you are right there is security and they are invisible! As so much for us guests not to notice them.


Beffen1
What you have said about pimping has been very interesting. I guess many girls won't admit they are paying back their debt to their pimp/loverboy.

How long is an official German work permit valid for if someone from say Poland wants to work in Germany as a waitress etc and pays taxes. I know that some of the working girls don't have credit cards so there is no records of their earnings or spending.

[Routard]

FKK are extremely customer minded, of course you will never see bouncer, and you will have nothing to fear, as long as you don't start to be a dick head yourself. But don't be misleaded by this welcoming environment and friendly staff, there IS a though security behind the scene, and everything is video monitored (not in the rooms however). I have seen these guys in Oase, they are REALLY though. Don't know what has happened, but they solved the problem in a very discrete way, without any violence. Later, the police entered also, but most customers didn't even notice it. German efficiency.

But these guys are there for the security of the customers and the girls, they are not to be mixed up with pimps. Most girls in FKK have individual pimps, and those pimps don't even enter in the FKK. Sometimes you will see them at closing time when they come to pick up their girl, that's it.

In most cases, there is no direct relationship between the pimps and the management of the clubs.

Also, don't mix up the managers of the club who are friendly professional people working for their monthly salary and the real shareholders who probably never enter the Club. That's why even if some kind of maffia owns the club, you will not necessary see them.

I raised the question of pimps inside FKK, because I found one of my favorite girl I've learned to know in a Frankfurt Club back in a NRW Club. She told me she had left the Frankfurt Clubs because of the deteriorating environment. There where pimps entering FKK as normal customers, trying to catch the girls who hadn't yet a pimp.

[Tony70]

Just to reassure new readers to the forum(even though I don't post often!) or those wanting to visit an FKK club, the German FKK clubs are warm, friendly welcoming environments, with the staff and girls being very service orientated! I have been to PHG fifteen times in the last 12 months and have never ever felt threatened or uneasy. The staff welcome and greet me with smiles as well as the ladies.

You certainly do not see hard nuts, bouncers, security at PHG. And I haven't noticed any "Russian looking guys" hanging around the bar or the cafe downstairs; what is a Russian looking guy? The only time you see male staff is when they clean the room; you can identify them as they all wear white sock with sandals! In fact I have never seen a hard nut at any of the FKK clubs I have visited included Goldentime, Oase or Bluenote.

Yes I did open up issues about pimps because I was curious and Peter seemed to be knowledgable about "behind the scenes" at the clubs.

Tony70

[Beffen1]

That is a question? Many girls from eastern europe make the choice to work in this profession, but they cannot since they lack the papers. A large number of the girls therefore have "friends", men who facilitate and arranged for them papers, and/or sham marriages to EU males for sums of up to 25,000 euro. The girls must make regular payments on this fee to their "friends" and or sham husbands and get to keep the rest. The " friends" are prone to protect their "investments". It's kind of like a mortgage payment where the girls "mortgage" their futures for the chance to earn in one night what at home they would take a month or more to earn. I do not think there are many if any girls in the German clubs who were tricked into this work, or forced, other than being forced by economic circumstances.

Many others have romantic attachments to boyfriends who use their girls as cash cows.

I have met pimps in World, guys from Southern Europe who bragged about "having" five girls here tonight. They look and act as regular guests but watch the number of girls who fawn over them as they relax in the club. As far as I am concerned, the HA run a class outfit at World and I am grateful. The management of PHG runs a tight ship, ie no pimps around, and I believe the boss is Hungarian.

beffen

[JustGotBack]

All this mob talk makes me remember a time I went to a club in Prague. This was back about 10 years ago. It was away from the city center. I went into this place and there were all these big bouncer types in tuxes. I sit for a while and decide that nothing meets my fancy so I get up to leave. The head bouncer type intercepts me at the door and says in broken English something to the effect of "why are you leaving? sit down and have a good time." I respond that there's nothing I like here. He responds "you're crazy, the girls here a great, sit down". This went on for a while. I had the serious feeling that I was being strong armed to stay although he never touched me.

I remember I saw a Russian looking guy at PHG, I know its definitely mob controlled.

[CBGBConnisur]

I remember I saw a Russian looking guy at PHG, I know its definitely mob controlled.

[Matteo 77]

lets talk about girl !!!!

I'm a usual customer of world, this time i tried Oase....

at midnight of last sun 14 aug, i was there , happy to see a lot of others italians old friend , you know is holidays period in italy now !!!

I had 3 session first with Mona romanian , black hair, slim , green eyes, def my tipe , i would give her a 7++, we starded in the KINO, everything seems to start in the kino @ oase !!!! , good BBBJ , 69, DATY, and we finished doggy.


Then i had 2 sessions with the same girl I really cant remember her name, but she is romanian too,she was blond not really slim so not my tipe i would give her a 6-, but guys when she sucks... you'll lose your mind.... and when she puts her tongue in your asshole, you buy her the apartment next to yours.....

i shoul go back to FRank next monday... so maybe i will go back again

[Tony70]

I guess its a case of "What you don't know doesn't hurt you". If you don't know or put a thought on organised crime playing a part in these clubs, then its not a problem. Do the HA run Planet Happy Garden? I have never scenes a group of biker looking guys there ever. Or even ther faint suggestion of pimps inside PHG. I guess we all look the same as polar bears in bathrobes.....

[CBGBConnisur]

PHG is run by organized crime, I am certain about that. World is run by the Hell's Angels. I know the owner of Atlantis was involved in [CodeWord908], tax evasion, and in possession of cocaine. That's how his entire club went down permanently. I met the owner of Babylon, kind of reminded me of a cross between Einstein and Gandhi.

[Tony70]

Thank you Euro 100,

Are the HA involved in running Planet Happy Garden or Goldentime?

[Euro100]

HA = Hell's Angels
Formerly a rough motorcycle gang.
Probably running FKKW, but definitely not Oase.

[Tony70]

For Peter

"The reason I do not like the number of Romanians is that it reeks of a trafficking operation by HA. Many german girls won't work there because of the HA, and the tendency of many members to seek to pimp girls (not in this club, but in general) and they want nothing to do with any HA whatsoever"


Hello Peter,
What is HA? Have you found that there are guys actively trying to recruit and pimp girls in the clubs like Goldentime and Planet Happy Garden? On Dutch website recently, there was a claim that a girl at Goldentime was pimped and a huge debate blew up about sex trafficking and pimping. Discussing these issues opens up a can of worms and and on occassion brings up moral issues, i.e what would you do if you knew a girl was being forced to work in an FKK club....

On a different note, many thanks for sharing your German experiences and thoughts with us. You seem to have the "inside track" and get on well with the ladies and club owners!

All the best Tony70

[CBGBConnisur]

I beat the living crap out of a German pimp a few days ago around Koln, I have discovered that German guys are largely very feminine, especially compared to Russian and Australian dudes who who I am more accustomed to dealing with in New York and Sydney. The Arnold Schwarzenegger stereotype of German men is bullshit, girlie men is the more appropriate term.

[Routard]

I agree in a way with Peter. I'm also sensitive about what's happening "behind the scene". I feel unconfortable hobbying when it becomes obvious that girls are exploited and forced to do it, or if they have no other economical choice like in Third World countries. At first view, the FKK scene seems to be one of the "cleanest" scene in the world, as it is fully legal, secured and in a wealthy country. FKK girls seem not to be drug addicted, have mostly very interesting personality and seem to enjoy their work.

Well, this may be true sometimes, but not always when you get to know better the girls. The Eastern European girls seem to be more likely to have pimps than the German. The bigger clubs in Frankfurt seem to be more controlled by pimps than the smaller ones or the ones in the NRW area. A FKK girl told me that they are even inside the club, as regular customers. They are either German or from Eastern Europe, wearing golden chains, and try to catch the girls who have not yet a pimp. It happened to me several times that a girl in an FKK asked to me if she could stay with me only for company till closing time. Friendship, tired of working or need for protection?

No idea also if there is a direct link with the managers of the clubs. Probably not, but they must know each other and have some kind of agreement.

I know all this is a sensitive issue. I tried to know some more about it when a girl asked me advice if it was safe enough to go to work in an FKK. Do some of you have a clearer idea about how things are going on?