Living in Thailand

[PinkPearl]

The sex industry in Thailand has always been far better than Cambodia, and though it has waned, it has waned less than in that NGO-controlled country. In practice $5 sex is difficult to find now in Cambodia. $10 is more the normal minimum, so about 350 baht. The normal short time in Pattaya is 500 baht, so not much more, and obviously Pattaya is enormously more pleasant to live in than any part of Cambodia or Bangkok. Thais tend to provide much better service than Kmer Cambodians, and even somewhat better than the now somewhat less available Vietnamese girls.

I wonder what your source is. Although I haven't followed the Cambodia threads at ISG for about 6 months, prior to that it seemed that 5 dollar sex was easy to get in PP. Maybe things have changed of late.

I recall a comment in the PP section that Khmer ladies were of a kinder disposition than TGs. Even should that be so, it is concievable that TGs have the overall better service, as you claim.

As for Pattaya, I wonder what one can get for only 500 baht. If it is the type of TG we see in the photos here at ISG, I can only say that prior to seeing them I did not believe in extra terrestrials.

What is it that makes you feel Pattaya is more pleasant than Bangkok. Isn't it the former that has a reputation for criminal elements?

[Seeko]

And having already tried to deposit said amount into a Thai Bank, but to no avail - cannot open account on Tourist Visa and have no Work permit etc etc How exactly does one achieve this?

Kasikorn Bank (Green plant over water). Make sure it's a full-service branch. Try the one at the corner of Sukhumvit and Soi 33.

I have obtained Savings Deposit Account with ATM card and Time Deposit Account with 3/6/12-month periods (CD's in USA), using only my tourist passport. [For local address, make one up or use your hotel's; but, tell them _not_ to send anything, i.e. no monthly statements or newsletters.]

And, set up Online/Internet Banking, so you can check your account(s) from abroad. You'll need a valid Thai mobile number and email address.

Good luck,
Seeko

[PinkPearl]

I have a savings account with Bangkok Bank, the largest bank in the country, and regularly earn interest, just as any Thai citizen would.

Are you here working? Or retired?

[PinkPearl]

In my earlier aquisiition of r.visa, I had to show the "long list" to immigration, not to the embassy. Your comments, encouragement, solutions encouraged.
I was also surprised that I could get 2 back to back 60 day tourist visas when I thought the law says 90 days in country on a tourist visa then you must stay out for 90 days.

C4T

I can't say whether that applies to Tourist Visas, but I understand it
does with those who are making border runs every 30 days. So they would be limited to 3 of those in a 6 month period.

[PinkPearl]

And having already tried to deposit said amount into a Thai Bank, but to no avail. Cannot open account on Tourist Visa and have no Work permit etc etc How exactly does one achieve this?

This may be of no help to you personally, but in BKK I was able to open an account with 2 banks so far, Kasikorn and Krung Thai. The Tourist Visa I showed them was I triple, but I cannot say whether or not they would have accepted me with a single or even a regular 30 day visit.

Some other banks rejected my application in the absence of a work permit, or required I go to my embassy to obtain a letter of some sort. But the two above are sufficient for my needs. No interest BTW.

[Sanook D]

As I said, I think this is a great place to live, if you are not dependent on the Thais for a living. Fortunately, I'm not encumbered by any financial ties here. But, I have personal entanglements, which I plan to maintain.

I'll just likely become a tourist for awhile and then move back when the time is right.

In my case, new arrivals or people I talk to back home tend to get the impression that my feelings about Thailand are unrelentingly negative, but I agree with OTH that Thailand is good place to which to retire, especially if you know your way around a bit, and still a good place to be tourist. I just don't think it is wise to depend on or get involved with Thais any more than one absolutely must.

I may have written this here before, but I don't think this is really so much a "Thais hate farangs" issue. I have no doubt that many Thais really do hate farangs, in the sense that because one of the prime motivating forces in this society is envy, Thais deeply resent people whom they perceive as having something they don't. To get a sense of how the Thais operate you have to observe how they treat each other, and frankly I don't think the way they treat each other is much better than how they treat farangs- in many cases it is worse, depending on what they think they might get from the farang or their perception of the farang's wealth or connections. Thai society is deeply hierarchichal; in a sense one is either a bully or a victim here. A person has almost nothing in terms of human rights other than his or her ability to wield power. Justice really is the will of the stronger in Thailand, and you generally don't want to find yourself at the mercy of a Thai, whether or not you are a farang. I've known some Thais in positions of power in companies or law firms, for example, who do have an enlightened sense of fairness, but I tend to see them as exceptions who prove the rule.

[Old Thai Hand]

All good points of view, gentlemen.

Perhaps when it's all over, I'll elaborate on what has transpired in my case. What I will say is that, my contract was not renewed after 3 years of working in my current job, with no reason given. It's not that I resent not having my contract renewed. It's happened before and it simply goes with the territory here. It has everything to do with envy and greed. The Thais are jealous and feel threatened, because I'm simply better than they are at the job. There are also issues of loss of face for them etc. etc. The way they do things is unethical, unprofessional, devious and callous. And, I'm certainly not one to roll over and take it quietly.

But, all I really care about is that, there has been fraud committed against me and there's been a violation of my rights under Thai labor law, which I will now have to fight. This will be the 3rd time in 12 years that I've had to do this. I will win again, just as I did the other 2 times. But, it's tiresome and draining having to go through it.

Of course this happens in the US and Canada. The difference, though is that at least one is protected by some measure of the law, not to mention unemployment insurance, etc. Employers are less inclined to violate employee rights because of the penalties. In contrast, Thai employers violate labor law all the time largely because Thais rarely fight back, and they assume that Farang are not protected. Fortunately, we are.

Of course there is no perfect place in the world. While I have mentioned that I considered returning home, that is probably not going to happen because of a lot of the reasons mentioned here. The thought of returning to Canada really bores me. There's nothing really there for me. I've lived lots of places. So, l'll probably end up somewhere else in the world, where at least I'll make a lot more money. Personally, I'm not prepared to just get by, like Opebo on $1,100/month. I do have a good job offer here, with a Farang-run educational institution and might consider staying, if they meet my price.

As I said, I think this is a great place to live, if you are not dependent on the Thais for a living. Fortunately, I'm not encumbered by any financial ties here. But, I have personal entanglements, which I plan to maintain.

I'll just likely become a tourist for awhile and then move back when the time is right.

[Opebo]

...Thais ... I've come to the conclusion that as a culture and as a people, they are collectively about the most morally reprehensible lot I've ever had the misfortune to know.

So, as far as I'm concerned, any knob who goes ga-ga about Thailand, doesn't have any real clue about the place.

Well, OTH, we all know why we go ga-ga about Thailand - prostitution. (and to a lesser extent easily available semi-prostitutes, giks, etc.)

But I can say that as a 'morally reprehensible' person who can in some ways out-Thai the Thais, I feel very comfortable here. The key is to be lazier than them. Sure, you'll end up getting screwed over, kicked out, whatever, but if you never invested any real effort into your position, its no great loss. Usually they'll simply not renew your contract at the end of the year, as outright firing you requires a bit of a reason ('he's incompetent, no good, lazy, doesn't teach, etc.') and can be a loss of face for the dude that hired you.

And speaking of high salaries, making $1,100/month in a country where apartments are $100/month, meals are a dollar or two, and sex is $15-30, is a pretty good deal in the meantime. (I couldn't make any more than that back home). So it all depends on your point of view. I think you have, perhaps, come to expect too much from your adopted homeland. I for one, have found my much more limited and sex-focused expectations have been filled to sufficiency.

[Slylock]

Gentleman,

Firstly, there are only a few countries in the world that will make a foreigner tourist or expat feel truly welcomed! Mostly America and Canada. That is due to our respective countries being built and maintained by people from all around the world, that is one thing about our countries that make us unique. Most countries in the world are ethnic to themselves, those that are not have civil wars, redraw the borders towards ethnic lines! for a list see major wars over the last 20 years! This is even true in Europe. Yes it is much easier if you look the same as the ethnic people of said countries, but it is NOT the same and you will always be foreign. As I have said in other posts here I love Thailand for the simple reason that I know for a fact where I sand! there is no confusion, I am the white devil with a fat wallet.( I am speaking as a society in whole, not person to person. as all people are different and have different views towards different things, if not how would a Thai person ever marry a western person.)

I for one live and work in Malaysia, and I feel for OTH point of view on how expats are treated in the work place and how upper class people treat the 'drones'. But allow me to expand a bit. Myself being American I am not used to the socialists belief of full time permanent employment. The most we can hope for in the USA is a contract for 2 to 5 years with some sort of severance package if there is a lose of job. But mostly it is a 'at will' service, only requiring 24 hour notice by the company or staff to terminate employment. Of course this is mute point concerning SOME unions. I myself have been droped as the VP of operations for North America by a Fortune 500 company, only because they found someone who would do it cheaper. Needles to say I had been at this company from nearly its beginning, and was the driving force to it's 500 status. they let me cash in my stocks and held the door so it wouldn't hit me on the ass! So in Malaysia I am always looking for a different job, always! So OTH, are you telling me that the Elite in Canada or other western countries do not walk on the middle class and below? I believe that is what is going on in Canada and the US as we speak. In Canada you are a indentured servant for your whole life owing to the socialist programs in place for the 'welfare' of the people. In the USofA the rich republicans only want to spend money on their friends, god forbid we should give money back to the people who originally 'gave' it to the government, 'give' is a lose term for taxes. I am not trying to knock ANY country as each has it's own faults. I am just trying to put a different spin on what you are saying. Maybe you are burnt out and need a break, like a lot of the guys heading to Thailand want. It's just that your break after all of these years happens to be going back home?

I wish you all the best!

Slylock

PS see news article about the 93 year old man who died from being frozen to death in his own home because the electric company turned of his power! there is a human rights violation for you, but since the media is controlled by the west this incident is a 'outrage' or 'unfortunate incident' that needs to be investigated. If this happened in the so called third world, what would it have been? Hell if Bush was still president he might have wanted to invade, lol.

[Waste Mgmt]

I have to admit that because I am currently in the middle of quite an awful mess, am incredibly disheartened and feel betrayed beyond belief, that I have a particularly strong "hate-on" for Thais and all things Thais. But, it is worthwhile to talk about it, as an object-lesson for those who have blinders on about the place, because sadly, my situation is not especially unique.

As someone who is considering living 3-5 months/year in Thailand, the negative side is very useful for me: so I very much appreciate your insight. It's a big decision as to where to go (Thailand, Philippines, Brazil.)- big investment in time and resources (esp. To learn enough of the language to make it manageable).

I had the blinders on my first visit (despite reading this forum before going). Now, I have a better idea of where I really stand in the eyes of the average Thai- certainly not where we'd like to believe from the abundant smiles we see on holiday. In many countries, the natives don't do much to conceal their, let's say, lack of admiration of westerners. Thai's, as part of their culture, just put on the happy face regardless of what they think (well, unless you do something they find particularly objectionable, then watch out! ).

My dilemma (and statement) though is that, with blinders off, I'm pretty hard pressed to find ANY non-western country where I'll be on any measure of equal footing. If it's a country where my dollars allow me to live a nice life and have plentiful low cost pussy, and warm weather (my criteria). I'm going to encounter jealousy, disdain, disingenuous "friends", 2 tier pricing, etc etc- kinda par for the course. I'll never really fit in, regardless of my efforts. Is Thailand really that much worse than other choices? I know friends in China where I'll feelings towards westerners (esp. Now with things turning down) are encountered often (anti-western get-togethers with a few hundred people chanting "China for Chinese" isn't exactly the welcome wagon). Brazil seems to be a better alternative for attitude, though the crime and truly watching your back is more of an issue.

I can go to Canada or Western Europe and feel like I fit in- but the whole cost of living/cheap pussy thing is not to be. So, given my criteria (shared by many of us here), Thailand is high on the list. If South Americans had the same body type as Thai's, it would be no contest. But, alas, I prefer Asian women.

I am planning to give it a go for a few months. Posts like yours have helped keep me realistic and deter me from doing anything so stupid as to consider starting a business, buying property or anything that makes it difficult to move on. Even if I found the seemingly "right girl", I'm leaving a clear exit strategy.

BTW, this site has got much better non-sex related information than sites like TV. I just never post because I don't have much to add (as evidenced by this post!).

[Old Thai Hand]

You seem to have crowned yourself King of the Sex Crawl. All knowing, eminently far superior in your understanding and appreciation of all things Thai. Bull crap! You, by your own admission, come off sounding soured by your life's failures and thereby finding solice in self-image admiration. Mirror, mirror on the wall, who is the most knowledgeable of us all? Of course, it is Old Thai Hand, who sees his own life's accomplishments only in terms of how many Thai holes he fills. Come down from your lofty heights OTH and smell the roses and stop with the pompous B.S. You have no idea what my knowledge level of, or time in country I have. So bugger off.

Hardly King of the Sex Crawl. I'd give that crown to the likes of people such as Mick Licker, NicFrenchy etc. They're the true champions and knowledgeable experts on sex in LOS. Comparatively speaking, I'm a novice especially when it comes to P4P.

I was speaking more of Thailand, in general. I don't care if you've been here a thousand times, do business here, have spent time in an Isaan village, eaten somtam with the natives on the floor of some village shack, and toiled for fun, for an hour or two in some rice paddy, just so you could say you understand these people's plight. You don't know the true nature and measure of a place until you've lived there for an appreciable length of time, have become a part of its social fabric and its ongoing, day to day activities and especially worked with and particularly for the locals. If you ever had to work with or for Thais, and suffer their continual abuse, and disregard for basic human rights and principles, your gooey opinion, filled as it is with love and affection for the place would go down the drain pretty damn fast.

I haven't had any life failings here. I have been and continue to be successful in my own activities. What has failed me are the people here. While I have been and continue to be ethical, professional and moral in my behavior, I have come face to face with some of the worst lapses of proper human behavior I've ever experienced. I'm not saying that all Thais are bad. I actually think that a lot of them - the average Joes, slaving away for meagre earnings - are quite nice people. But, through extensive and intimate experience of living and working among them, especially the upper echelons of Thai society, I've come to the conclusion that as a culture and as a people, they are collectively about the most morally reprehensible lot I've ever had the misfortune to know.

So, as far as I'm concerned, any knob who goes ga-ga about Thailand, doesn't have any real clue about the place.



addendum...having unleashed my vitriole in the above, I'll still admit that I will likely retire here, at some point. But, I think retirement is the only logical circumstance under which any Farang should live in Thailand. People like LBM and Daddy07 have it sorted. But, working here under any circumstance (including owning a business) is a fools game destined to leave you completely undone and your soul destroyed.

Rather than this merely being a bit of personal navel-gazing and therefore of little interest to readers on this board, I think it's important to make comments on what happens, if one makes the mistake of wanting to come here to work, in order to stay in the country. I certainly have had a fair number of PMs from guys wanting to know how they can accomplish this. I've been fortunate in the sense that I've been able to earn an atypically high salary here. But, that has come at an extremely high price. The bottom line here is that there is no security. You're always walking the tight-rope without a net. Ultimately, the Thais don't want you here, will only put up with as long as they have to and will screw you in the end, with no regard for personal, let alone legal rights.

I have to admit that because I am currently in the middle of quite an awful mess, am incredibly disheartened and feel betrayed beyond belief, that I have a particularly strong "hate-on" for Thais and all things Thais. But, it is worthwhile to talk about it, as an object-lesson for those who have blinders on about the place, because sadly, my situation is not especially unique.

[Ham Yai]

All good advice Fifty Fifty but its up to you.

If you are serious apply for the Police document at your local. It takes up to 2 months to get the document or it did in my case.

Go to the Thai Consulate in the UK and ask for a multiple entry one year O non immigrant visa.( 90 pounds?)After one year renew it. After two years apply for a Retirement visa in Thailand. ( Assuming you ARE retired)

Go to Thailand and get accommodation ONLY with a landlords rental form (obtainable from any stationers). He completes it and must give signed copies of the house/flat ownership and his ID.

Then go to Tisco Bank or UOB and open a bank account

Armed with these you can apply for a Thai driving licence. ( Passport with visa,Residence Cert you get from Immigration here,2 x 1"photos, Valid UK licence or International Licence requst form and fee.

You can get this with a Thai girlfriend's help. You get a one year Licence then a five year one, then a ten year one.

The trick here is that this Driving Licence becomes your ID card. Its friendly with everyone including the Police.

There two other VERY important points.

1. Keep your powder dry ( don't get a bun in the oven with one)

2 Keep your money in YOUR pocket

There is one other VITAL area

Don't marry a Thai. There are so many fish in the sea you really won't need to.
If you must get hitched try a Phili for size. Doesn't stop you living in LOS either.Shes abroad and away from her family which she will prefer and you have the added security of being able to stay in "control".

One other small suggestion. Live away from Bangkok or Pattaya. They are always there for a fling but can get on top of you if you stay too long.

Thats why I suggested Korat. You try the Sima THani or Dusit Princess Hotels for 2000bht+ but you would be showing off and wasting your money on a honey.

Plenty of students to try at the Virginity Colleges in most big cities and they all have massage (with take away) and boom boom parlours.

Hope that helps but you can always send a private message

[El Greco]

Really? I wish you folks good luck if you take that approach. Part of my work is dealing with the Thai Govt in BKK on a regular basis and I deal with two of their consulate offices / personal as well even more often (Philippines and in Canberra). Every time I talk to them on the same subjects I get different answers.

And just because they have a law that says one thing does not really mean the local authorities where you are at follow those rules or reg's.

With all due respect I don't know what your business problems might be.

IMO such generic aphorisms are of no help to this forum.

With a simple google search I found out that either for a 90 day Non immigrant “O” Visa (that can be later converted in a Thai retirement visa inside Thailand) and/or a Thai retirement visa ( Thai “A-O” Visa) the individual has to start from the Thai embassy (consulate) in his country.

"If you plan to retire in Thailand, you may use your Thai “O” Visa to apply for a one year extension inside of Thailand for the purposes of retirement. This visa would then be classed as a Thai “A-O” Visa or Thai retirement visa. The other option available to you is to apply to the Thai embassy for a Thai “A-O” visa. There are certain requirements which need to be met when doing this application."

http://www.thailand-visa.org/visa/th...uirements.html

http://www.thailand-visa.org/visa/th...ment-visa.html

http://www.thaiembassy.com/retire/retire.php

My two baht

[Member #3428]

Why don't you visit/call your nearest Thai consulate to investigate your options?

IMHO the easiest and safest way to find out about the correct procedure.

Really? I wish you folks good luck if you take that approach. Part of my work is dealing with the Thai Govt in BKK on a regular basis and I deal with two of their consulate offices / personal as well even more often (Philippines and in Canberra). Every time I talk to them on the same subjects I get different answers.

And just because they have a law that says one thing does not really mean the local authorities where you are at follow those rules or reg's.

[El Greco]

Why don't you visit/call your nearest Thai consulate to investigate your options?

IMHO the easiest and safest way to find out about the correct procedure.