China Women - Opinions and Advice

[Mind Maggot]

I agree with this. So how do you deal with these complaints from WGs? Is it simply a case of them trying to take advantage, and do you have to "show them who is boss" so to speak, tell them you paid for the service, and keep doing what you want, ignoring the (fake) complaints?

Depends on the situation of course. Sometimes Maggot just smiles and ignores, sometimes mildly threats of leaving and talking to the papasan or mamasan or manager, sometimes assures the girl that there is nothing to be afraid of. After all its fake, just how you manage to get the job done.

[Just Seven]

Yo, bros

I need some feedback. I went into a seedy KTV in an upscale neighborhood alone and with no Chinese language. I got a room for 100 w/ an OK girl @200. She spoke a little English. A short time later I arranged for her to go back to my hotel @500. But I was not yet fully agreed with the KTV about the room, and some disagreeable things happened. The end result was that they asked me to leave without taking any money. I had already drunk some beer; the girl a drink too.

Here's the scoop. After the basic KTV arrangement was in place, girl sitting next to me, my order for two beers made, a waiter came in with a tray of 12 bottles of beer. He was expecting that I take them. I strongly balked; the girl told him to take all back except two bottles. Next he came in with two big trays of snacks; I balked except for one small bowl of a snack the girl wanted. He took back one tray but left the other tray.

She wanted me to pay 100 but I asked why so suddenly and why in advance. Then due to a mistake of mine about time, I mistakenly thought I was only to get 30 min. in the room but actually 1 hour, (until it closed). She walked out. I then went to the front spoke with some staff (one knew a few words in English.) A bill was soon given to me with a number of charges, some should not be for me.

She came back, we went into the room to check over the bill. I balked about several items---including a small tissue box, a couple of food items I don’t think I even saw. Ok, ok, they said. They erased them. But now they wanted 200 in advance. Before me stood the boss and his assistant, a pretty girl with a scowl. She did much of the pushing me for money. I then asked them through my girl to step out of the room for a moment. I wanted to talk with my girl. If I could be convinced that she would come back to the hotel, then I could accept the KTV offer/demand.

I am unsure exactly why, but my girl left the room with the rest of us in it. The three of us took it to the front. I wanted the girl back. They wanted their money. Eventually they told me just to leave. I never got out of line and was cool headed.

But I felt that if I accepted those things –the snack trays, etc., I might be put in a position of getting an outlandish bill at the end. Additionally, the girl might have just been stringing me along. So I would be left with no girl and a huge bill to pay.

Overall I don’t think that these people were really bad—like dirtbags or thieves—but bringing 12 bottles of beer when I ordered just 2 through the girl? (There was no mistake in order.) Am I just paranoid or is this how Chinese run KTV’s? (Originally all the charges they told me were as I listed at the top of this post.)

Most of the KTVs in the smaller areas that I have been to do not sell single bottles of beer. Or if they do the pricing structure is like this: One bottle of Beer 40 rmb, or 12 + however many "free" Bottles of beer 100 RMB. As for the snack trays and tissues, some places nickel and dime you. Thats all part of the fee for the room. It is a combination of healthy paranoia and a small learning curve. If you live in the area, I would attempt to call them and speak with someone that knows a little bit of english and explain the situation, I am sure after a bit of clarification they would enjoy your company again.

As for paying the girl, you always do that at the end. If theres some sort of barfine or she tells you she has to pay the mamasan. She's just trying to milk you. Again, in the smaller areas that I have been to, she can pay the barfine or her mama when she gets back. And usually mamasan fee is included in the 2/5/8 or whatever she is charging you (the #/#/# system explains sitting/short time/long time fees)

[Just Seven]

If she is pulling that crap, tell her you will talk to the mamasan. However this is already after the fact. I have started getting into the habit of mentioning my very big little brother to girls before we go anywhere. If they still agree to go and then cause trouble, I just go back to the mama/papa and tell them and get a different girl.

It can't be a veiled threat. The mamasan does not care which girl you take or pay just that you pay A girl. The girl cares which girl you take. I feel this is your only avenue of recourse.

[Henhao888]

Yo, bros

I need some feedback. I went into a seedy KTV in an upscale neighborhood alone and with no Chinese language. I got a room for 100 w/ an OK girl @200. She spoke a little English. A short time later I arranged for her to go back to my hotel @500. But I was not yet fully agreed with the KTV about the room, and some disagreeable things happened. The end result was that they asked me to leave without taking any money. I had already drunk some beer; the girl a drink too.

Here's the scoop. After the basic KTV arrangement was in place, girl sitting next to me, my order for two beers made, a waiter came in with a tray of 12 bottles of beer. He was expecting that I take them. I strongly balked; the girl told him to take all back except two bottles. Next he came in with two big trays of snacks; I balked except for one small bowl of a snack the girl wanted. He took back one tray but left the other tray.

She wanted me to pay 100 but I asked why so suddenly and why in advance. Then due to a mistake of mine about time, I mistakenly thought I was only to get 30 min. in the room but actually 1 hour, (until it closed). She walked out. I then went to the front spoke with some staff (one knew a few words in English.) A bill was soon given to me with a number of charges, some should not be for me.

She came back, we went into the room to check over the bill. I balked about several items---including a small tissue box, a couple of food items I don’t think I even saw. Ok, ok, they said. They erased them. But now they wanted 200 in advance. Before me stood the boss and his assistant, a pretty girl with a scowl. She did much of the pushing me for money. I then asked them through my girl to step out of the room for a moment. I wanted to talk with my girl. If I could be convinced that she would come back to the hotel, then I could accept the KTV offer/demand.

I am unsure exactly why, but my girl left the room with the rest of us in it. The three of us took it to the front. I wanted the girl back. They wanted their money. Eventually they told me just to leave. I never got out of line and was cool headed.

But I felt that if I accepted those things –the snack trays, etc., I might be put in a position of getting an outlandish bill at the end. Additionally, the girl might have just been stringing me along. So I would be left with no girl and a huge bill to pay.

Overall I don’t think that these people were really bad—like dirtbags or thieves—but bringing 12 bottles of beer when I ordered just 2 through the girl? (There was no mistake in order.) Am I just paranoid or is this how Chinese run KTV’s? (Originally all the charges they told me were as I listed at the top of this post.)

I've heard many worse stories than yours. Beware of the Chinese coffee shops and KTV. They will bring you things you did not order, and then hand you outrageous bills.

If the place feels suspicious, always demand to know how much up front. If they try to pull something like bringing 12 bottles, just walk out. You can easily find a better girl someplace else. The girl is always in on it.

If there is a problem, call the police at 119 immediately. Tell them you are at KTV being charged for things you did not order. The police are very concerned about foreigners being ripped off like this. Bad image for the city. Many worse horror stories in the newspapers.

[Chill Out]

Maggot firmly agrees, freebies dont complain, WGs do. Mainly cause very few WGs in China enjoy doing it. They presume they can finish the deal quickly or get away with below par performance by such a complain. Many a times Maggot was told "please cum quickly".

I agree with this. So how do you deal with these complaints from WGs? Is it simply a case of them trying to take advantage, and do you have to "show them who is boss" so to speak, tell them you paid for the service, and keep doing what you want, ignoring the (fake) complaints?

[Middleway]

Yo, bros

I need some feedback. I went into a seedy KTV in an upscale neighborhood alone and with no Chinese language. I got a room for 100 w/ an OK girl @200. She spoke a little English. A short time later I arranged for her to go back to my hotel @500. But I was not yet fully agreed with the KTV about the room, and some disagreeable things happened. The end result was that they asked me to leave without taking any money. I had already drunk some beer; the girl a drink too.

Here's the scoop. After the basic KTV arrangement was in place, girl sitting next to me, my order for two beers made, a waiter came in with a tray of 12 bottles of beer. He was expecting that I take them. I strongly balked; the girl told him to take all back except two bottles. Next he came in with two big trays of snacks; I balked except for one small bowl of a snack the girl wanted. He took back one tray but left the other tray.

She wanted me to pay 100 but I asked why so suddenly and why in advance. Then due to a mistake of mine about time, I mistakenly thought I was only to get 30 min. in the room but actually 1 hour, (until it closed). She walked out. I then went to the front spoke with some staff (one knew a few words in English.) A bill was soon given to me with a number of charges, some should not be for me.

She came back, we went into the room to check over the bill. I balked about several items---including a small tissue box, a couple of food items I don’t think I even saw. Ok, ok, they said. They erased them. But now they wanted 200 in advance. Before me stood the boss and his assistant, a pretty girl with a scowl. She did much of the pushing me for money. I then asked them through my girl to step out of the room for a moment. I wanted to talk with my girl. If I could be convinced that she would come back to the hotel, then I could accept the KTV offer/demand.

I am unsure exactly why, but my girl left the room with the rest of us in it. The three of us took it to the front. I wanted the girl back. They wanted their money. Eventually they told me just to leave. I never got out of line and was cool headed.

But I felt that if I accepted those things –the snack trays, etc., I might be put in a position of getting an outlandish bill at the end. Additionally, the girl might have just been stringing me along. So I would be left with no girl and a huge bill to pay.

Overall I don’t think that these people were really bad—like dirtbags or thieves—but bringing 12 bottles of beer when I ordered just 2 through the girl? (There was no mistake in order.) Am I just paranoid or is this how Chinese run KTV’s? (Originally all the charges they told me were as I listed at the top of this post.)

[Mock A Bee]

Maybe I am overanalyzing. I had no previous experience with a girl from Shanghai China. So, my big head today has learned. Besides, the little head is smarter actually. Pussy=good, other baloney interfering with the pussy=bad. If my relationship is beyond the understanding of the little head, maybe it's not worth the trouble.

The Blackwidow spider is so named because after it copulates with a male spider, it kills the male by biting its head off... ergo, Shanghainese women = Blackwidow spiders.

Yes, this is a rather dramatic analogy, however, there are enough evil Shanghainese women out there who are Blackwidow spiders, enough to spoil the soup for everyone, giving Shanghainese women a bad name.

Buyer beware!

MAB

[Dash]

Couldn't you find an American girl that would say yes?

You used your little head to do the thinking at the beginning and now you use your big head to overanalyze what happens afterwards. Now only if you used your big head to do the thinking at the beginning!

Maybe I am overanalyzing. I had no previous experience with a girl from Shanghai China. So, my big head today has learned. Besides, the little head is smarter actually. Pussy=good, other baloney interfering with the pussy=bad. If my relationship is beyond the understanding of the little head, maybe it's not worth the trouble.

[Bob Builder]

Who said that American women walk all over me? American women are simply not as demure and sweet as the Chinese I have met, and so if they behave agressively it does not come as a surprise.
As far as the Chinese girl goes, I am guessing that her Confucian upbringing influences her interaction, which is pleasant, but deep down she was sneaky and venal. Typical or not, western or American men should be cautious.
I was lied to but do not consider myself gullible.
American girls are straight up: "I met a guy, I will not be your girlfriend. Good luck."
re: American values means I am not obligated to fully adopt her customs in my own country. It also means direct, straight talk and honesty. In fact, Lil herself knew this.

Couldn't you find an American girl that would say yes?

You used your little head to do the thinking at the beginning and now you use your big head to overanalyze what happens afterwards. Now only if you used your big head to do the thinking at the beginning!

[Dash]

Not exactly.

Being a pussy-dependent chump is a no-no. Anywhere.

You'll only get as much bullshit as you put up with and encourage.


And the only constant there being ... you. Ever considered that American women walk all over you because you let them? Chinese ones play you because you are easy to play?

American values ... pft. Your 'values' at best and since when has gullibility been a value please?

Who said that American women walk all over me? American women are simply not as demure and sweet as the Chinese I have met, and so if they behave agressively it does not come as a surprise.
As far as the Chinese girl goes, I am guessing that her Confucian upbringing influences her interaction, which is pleasant, but deep down she was sneaky and venal. Typical or not, western or American men should be cautious.
I was lied to but do not consider myself gullible.
American girls are straight up: "I met a guy, I will not be your girlfriend. Good luck."
re: American values means I am not obligated to fully adopt her customs in my own country. It also means direct, straight talk and honesty. In fact, Lil herself knew this.

[Dyson]

First, for the record, I have many western friends who have married Chinese women, and they have not had any problem at all. The main commonality is that they have all lived in China for 5+ years, and been involved in several relationships with Chinese women. I guess you could say they knew what they were getting into before they got married. In addition, they did not meet their wives on the internet or in a bar - they met them via normal interaction, and the wives tend to be much younger (less than 30 years old). I think the older a Chinese woman gets, regardless of occupation, the more jaded they become.

As all things in China there are the laws, and reality. Under the law if you are married then she cannot simply take the children. See the following article describing the legal situation: http://www.international-divorce.com/d-china.htm

That being said, if she wants to run off to her home town with the kids you are going to be at a detriment. Do you speak Chinese? Know where her home town is located? Have you met her family? Were you married in China, or the UK? I saw one post that said that if you were married in the UK, than a divorce in China would not be recognized. I assume the reverse it also true - if you were married in China then a divorce in the UK would not be recognized.

Even though you would have the law on your side, the individuals who enforce the law will be on the side of your Chinese wife. I would accept the position, but also begin discussions with a Chinese law firm to ensure that if she pulls any shanagans you will be ready to handle it.

If you guys are truly unhappy the maybe you just need to address the issue, without involving the kids. Tell her you understand she is not happy, and if she wants to leave that is OK, but that you would like to share in custody of the children. As I am sure you can imagine, the less drama injected into the situation the better, and it will of course be better for the children as well. If you are on an expat package where your company will pay for your kids to attend an international school then you certainly have the upper hand. I cannot imagine you wife would argue that your kids would be better off in a local Chinese school in some small village rather than attending an international school. You could probably work it out where they spend the school year with you, and holidays / summer vacation with her. This way everyone is a winner. Of course, I have not met the Chinese yet who understands the concept of a win-win relationship, so don't expect too much!

Good Luck!

Sammy

Many thanks Sammy T for your informative reply. What's done is done and there's no point in whinging about it. The important thing is that I have children to consider and I am trying to get all my ducks in a row before I decide whether or not to jump into the fire and return to China. I was married in China and I do speak some Mandarin and I do have some friends in China that I can call upon if the shit hits the fan. I have met my wife's family and I do know where her parents and close relatives all live.

[Mind Maggot]

Anyone considering taking a Chinese wife should think again. They are hard work and throw in the demands of Dad and the rest of the family who believe that western man is the answer to their retirement and housing plans don't even think about it. It is a constant battle fending of regular scams to rip-off the husband.

Its very much unlikely that she will run away since her family sees you as a bank. No matter how many times you fended off scams, they kept coming back. There is a possibility that your wife doesnt like it, but for Chinese girls, parents are always more important than husband.

Maggot firmly agrees with every word Sammy T said.

[Mind Maggot]

no offense gentlemen but the only activity more stupid than looking for marital advice on an international sex guide forum is looking for a husband here.

I'm sure all your wives are lucky gals.

With due respect Sir, Maggot doesnt agree. Most gentlemen here dealt with tens and hundreds of women in their lives, they should know well how to deal with women.

[Meiguoguizi]

no offense gentlemen but the only activity more stupid than looking for marital advice on an international sex guide forum is looking for a husband here.
I'm sure all your wives are lucky gals.

[Jamie5063]

I totally believe you.
The difference is I am living in the states, not China.
The fact there are chicks in abundance keeps your wife more attentive to you possibly. It's impossible that she does not know you have others talking to you, and this may keep her honest.
Thanks for your comment. Have a good time in the middle kingdom. I'm hitting the beach now.

Thanks Dash
Its quite true, if I'm on QQ she never looks at the computer screen same on Skype she uses it and I have some female "friends only" on there but never any questions. If she uses Skype when I'm on the computer she turns her Chair away. Of course she also can say what she likes to her friends and I have not a clue.I just hear Lawei pop up now and then. Like all China exports its never as good as the sample