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08-14-21 05:01 #3178
Posts: 1283Originally Posted by Travv [View Original Post]
Here again, I think we (as a people) feel like we have to do something. In reality, what did the shutdowns do? At the onset, I don't think it was a terrible idea. There were real shortage issues with ventilators and PPE. We quickly overcame that. That is about the only thing I'll give the government credit for in this whole mess. (And no, I'm not a big Trump fan.) But slowing the spread made sense early on. But that is all the lockdown did. Slowed the spread. It slowed the inevitable. And frankly, it robbed all of us of months and now years of, well, we all know. This is why I say we have have to learn to live with it. That's not a rosy picture. But I think it's more realistic than believing a shutdown or a mask will actually stop this.
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08-14-21 04:41 #3177
Posts: 1283Originally Posted by SeaBeeJoe [View Original Post]
But I do think we were misled. Our politicians and our leaders all said this would end the pandemic. Reality is that it might slow the spread for a time but it is crystal clear that it will not stop it. I suspect we're heading to an annual flu shot type approach. And I'm fine with that. What I'm not ok with is forever altering our lives to masks and shutdowns. I will not be held responsible for deaths of those that don't want to help themselves, particularly when there is no real end in sight.
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08-14-21 04:27 #3176
Posts: 64499.5 percent of Covid deaths among the unvaccinated
Originally Posted by Dcrist0527 [View Original Post]
https://www.pbs.org/newshour/health/...inated-at-risk
When scientists developed vaccines to slow the spread of the coronavirus pandemic, their vaccine candidates were judged effective based on whether or not people were hospitalized or died after getting immunized.
Even with delta, almost everyone who dies from COVID-19 99.5 percent of known cases are unvaccinated people, along with 97 percent of people hospitalized for the illness. That suggests that the vaccines are still highly effective, said USA Surgeon General and Dr. Vivek Murthy during a recent press briefing.
The CDC is counting vaccinated people who have been hospitalized or died from the coronavirus. Based on data available so far, that very rarely happens.
Seems the numbers have fallen some on vaccine protection against the delta variant, but at least they do protect against hospitalization.
https://www.reuters.com/business/healthcare-pharmaceuticals/moderna-may-be-superior-pfizer-against-delta-breakthrough-odds-rise-with-time-2021-08-09/
The mRNA vaccine from Pfizer (PFE.N) and BioNTech (22UAy.DE) may be less effective than Moderna's against the Delta variant of the coronavirus, according to two reports posted on medRxiv on Sunday ahead of peer review. In a study of more than 50,000 patients in the Mayo Clinic Health System, researchers found the effectiveness of Moderna's vaccine against infection had dropped to 76% in July - when the Delta variant was predominant - from 86% in early 2021. Over the same period, the effectiveness of the Pfizer/BioNTech vaccine had fallen to 42% from 76%, researchers said. While both vaccines remain effective at preventing COVID hospitalization, a Moderna booster shot may be necessary soon for anyone who got the Pfizer or Moderna vaccines earlier this year, said Dr. Venky Soundararajan of Massachusetts data analytics company nference, who led the Mayo study.
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08-14-21 02:07 #3175
Posts: 2420Originally Posted by Travv [View Original Post]
On 5 November, Mogilev became the first city in Belarus to introduce compulsory use of facial masks in public places.
On 9 November, compulsory use of facial masks was introduced in Gomel Region.
According to the 11 November Ministry of Health decree, PCR-based tests were no longer conducted for first-level contacts with an asymptomatic infection course.
On 12 November, compulsory use of facial masks was introduced in Minsk. As of date, besides Minsk, Gomel Region and Mogilev, such measure was reported to had been employed in Babruisk, Asipovichy, Klichev, Krichev, Chavusy District, Cherykaw District, Polotsk District and Novopolotsk.
On 16 November, compulsory use of facial masks was introduced in Vitebsk Region.
On 18 November, compulsory use of facial masks was introduced in Brest Region.
On 7 December, an epidemiologically motivated partial closure of Belarusian borders was announced in the governmental decree No. 705, according to which, since 21 December, Belarusian citizens and residents of Belarus were to be temporarily prohibited from leaving Belarus via land, except for a limited number of cases. Duration of the prohibition was not specified in the document.
Suspected statistics falsification.
According to the Gomel Region media resource "Flaghshtok" citing a relative of a deceased COVID-19 patient, as of July, 2021, around 60 intensive care unit COVID-19 patients were buried in Gomel daily by a single burial services company. It was also reported that the death certificate of the mentioned patient indicated "heart failure" as the main cause of death and had no mention of COVID-19 despite the patients' medical history.
According to the data obtained by the Belarusian "Cyberpartisans" hacker group via the Belarusian Ministry of Internal Affairs' passport database, excess mortality in Belarus in the March, 2020, to March, 2021, period comprised more than 32,000 deaths (14 times the official statistics for the same period), with approximately 25,000 deaths having had happened during 2020.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/COVID-...mic_in_Belarus
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08-13-21 20:53 #3174
Posts: 657No Lockdown. Belarus Reports COVID Mortality Rates Similar to Countries W Lockdowns
Quote The outcome is basically the same as similar places where restrictions are imposed. ".
The country of Belarus, which imposed no legal lockdown at all throughout the entire pandemic, has released COVID mortality figures which are broadly in line with other nearby countries which imposed draconian lockdowns.
After authorities in Belarus refused to put their citizens under lockdown, the global media had a collective hissy fit, with one headline declaring, "One leader looks hell-bent on turning COVID-19 into a catastrophe for his country."
However, while managing to avoid all the negative impacts of lockdown, the outcome of Belarus' no lockdown policy is far from a "catastrophe."
Newly released overall death statistics from the start of the pandemic up to March 2021 show that the death rate is similar to neighboring countries such as Latvia, Russia and Ukraine which imposed full lockdowns. Indeed, when compared to Poland, which imposed a particularly harsh lockdown, Belarus' mortality rate in March 2021 was significantly lower. . . Belarus is similar to Sweden, which has suffered fewer than 15,000 COVID deaths despite refusing to impose a lockdown. Figures show that cases and deaths tend to fall in waves whether a lockdown is imposed or not, proving that lockdowns are totally pointless. Quote.
John Paul Watson.
Definitely. Need more vaccinations and more lockdowns! Believe Fauci! Yeah! LOL.
Originally Posted by Dcrist0527 [View Original Post]
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08-13-21 18:20 #3173
Posts: 1283Originally Posted by SeaBeeJoe [View Original Post]
The 99% figure represents the number of vaccinated that have not tested positive. That number, however, is very misleading. Most breakthrough cases are asymptomatic. So we have no way of knowing the real number because the vast majority of asymptomatic, vaccinated people are not getting tested. And why would they.
As for new infections: that metric is not readily available. The CDC is not providing a lot of hard data, which is curious. But a few weeks ago, they estimated about 35,000 breakthrough positive tests every week. If we take that as fact, over 10% of new infections were breakthrough cases. Two very important considerations:
1-That 35,000 figure does not represent any asymptomatic cases. Again, when vaxxed and exhibiting no symptoms, they just aren't testing.
2-This is a game changer when you look at it from transmission standpoint.
To your larger point, I agree. People should get vaccinated. It greatly improves their situation should they contract Covid. But I just don't want people to misinterpret the misleading math being pushed. (Pushed by our so called experts, not you, SeaBee).
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08-13-21 03:43 #3172
Posts: 644Originally Posted by KoolBeans [View Original Post]
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08-12-21 00:01 #3171
Posts: 558Originally Posted by CaptainSolo [View Original Post]
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08-11-21 22:17 #3170
Posts: 1283Originally Posted by WombatEd2 [View Original Post]
I'm not trying to convince anyone of anything. I have no medical expertise. My biggest claim to fame in that field may be passing high school Biology. If anyone takes any medical advice from me, God help them!
I get the err on the side of caution. As I've said, I got to believe masks help to some degree.
My purpose for opening my pie hole was not to claim any virology expertise. My hope is that people really start to think and challenge what the group think is. You are absolutely right. Virtually all doctors, scientists, etc agree. But what have those experts accomplished? We've done it their way and we are literally no better off right now.
I'll tell you why I do not believe pretty much anything they say. My quote from Fauci is accurate. Everyone will say 'circumstances change' and of course they do. But Fauci has directly contradicted himself more times than I can count.
What's coming? Not exactly a bold prediction here. But this will be so telling. For the last few weeks, Fauci is telling us how the booster shot is unnecessary. But we follow the science, right? The data, Pfizer, Moderna. The science tells us that Fauci is wrong. Soon, Fauci will change his mind yet again and tell us we will all die without that booster shot. I would bet a year's salary on this. It's predictable. So he's either lying to us now, or he's an idiot and not following the science. Or both. But this is the leader of that group of all doctors, scientists. This is the guy that so many follow blindly. I don't care if it's a scientist, a car salesman or a plumber. I run from someone with a track record like his.
I'm done talking about this topic. Sadly, we're all entrenched in our beliefs. But I do hope we all start to think for ourselves and evaluate our so called experts on their results. It's a scary proposition because, honestly, I don't think we have answers.
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08-11-21 19:12 #3169
Posts: 2420Originally Posted by Dcrist0527 [View Original Post]
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08-11-21 18:30 #3168
Posts: 6519Not A Difficult COVID Choice
For over 200 years, doctors, nurses, hospital workers all over the world have been scrubbing their hands and arms, wearing masks, gloves, sterilized garments ect to minimize catching or spreading infection.
Why are we now doubting these basic hygiene measures?
The ease of transmission and high risks of CoVid infection, with lots of unknown long-term effects, pain, death, high costs of hospitalization to everyone in the world, dictates that everyone must do everything using all means they can at individual level to contain its spread.
Wombat is right. It's not a difficult choice. When in doubt err on the safe side. Mask up, glove on, scrub your hands after picking on bar girls' anus and kittles, pucker up and hope the virus won't' kill you, your bar GFs, friends, family, children.
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08-11-21 17:21 #3167
Posts: 536A Difficult COVID Choice
Whether to believe what pretty much all the doctors, scientists, and health officials are telling me, or to believe what some self-appointed pundit on a monger website is telling me. (No, I'm not talking about you; I'm talking about that OTHER self-appointed pundit!) (grin).
Given that my life, and the lives of those I care about, are on the line, I'm going to err on the side of caution.
Wearing a mask may not exactly be the "silver bullet". But I have every reason to believe that it's a good bit safer than NOT wearing one.
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08-11-21 04:36 #3166
Posts: 1283Originally Posted by Jackie888 [View Original Post]
Or because I look at facts. Sweden deaths have outperformed most nations, without implementing mask mandates. That's just a fact.
As a nation, case counts were the highest when mask compliance was at its peak.
But don't take my word for it. Let's see what God's gift to science has to say about it:
"wearing a mask might make people feel a little bit better and it might even block a droplet, but it's not providing the perfect protection that people think that it is."
Perhaps science isn't for Lord Fauci either?
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08-11-21 01:03 #3165
Posts: 2420Originally Posted by Sol12 [View Original Post]
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08-11-21 00:54 #3164
Posts: 2420Originally Posted by Dcrist0527 [View Original Post]