Morocco - Photo Survey

[ShortFoot]

I personally think Belguel is getting what he deserves. What was he smoking or drinking posting full pics of Muslim women or any woman for that matter without their permission. I can't even begin to imagine the trouble these women are in, especially in a Muslim country. I agree with another poster that he was probably fully aware of the ramifications of his actions (as he had intimate knowledge of Morroco) but still went through with them. Stupid, stupid stupid. He is probably safer in a Belgian jail that being out on the streets.

[Local Expert]

avenging muslims seek to kill belgian journalist
from the desk of paul belien on wed, 2005-07-13 19:03

for decades tintin has been the world’s most famous belgian reporter. but now it looks like he may have a competitor. philippe servaty is the 42-year old chief economics correspondent of le soir, brussels’ most influential newspaper. this modern tintin’s adventures took him to morocco several times over the past years. there dozens of women ended up in his bed and naked in front of his camera lens.

one of them is 42-year old samira, a teacher in agadir. servaty told her that he loved her and asked her to pose nude for a souvenir picture. he had her stand on all fours with a leash around her neck while he took her doggy-style. “these sluts are so naive. if you promise to marry them and take them along with you to brussels they do whatever you ask,” servaty wrote on a website where he posted samira’s picture. another woman, 23-year old amina, was photographed while servaty urinated on her. he had promised her that he was going to help her flee the husband of her arranged marriage and use his media connections to make her a movie star.

once servaty had gone home, however, the women never again heard of their brussels “manneken pis.” neither did they know that he made them stars on the internet. samira eventually abandoned her dreams of a new life in the heart of europe as the wife of one of its major journalists and got engaged to a local agadir man whom she was to marry later this year. on 22 april, however, her fiancé recognised her on a cd-rom that had been made of the modern tintin’s moroccan adventures and was for sale in the souks of agadir. he beat her up and threw her out. servaty’s photo collection contained over 80 moroccan women aged between 17 and 45, some tall, some fat, some beautiful, some ugly, some single, some married, and all but one depicted in the most degrading poses.

samira went to the police to lodge a complaint against servaty. this was only the beginning of her ordeal. to pose for pornographic pictures is a crime in morocco and she was immediately arrested. a judge sentenced her to a heavy fine and a prison sentence of one year. her school fired her, her family cast her out, all her friends abandoned her, while the police began a search for servaty’s other models. so far, 13 have been convicted to prison sentences, the husband of one of them went insane, two attempted to commit suicide in gaol and some, whom the police cannot find, are thought to have killed themselves or to have been murdered by their disgraced family. even 30-year old hafida, the only woman in the pictures who had not taken her clothes off, has become a social outcast. the neighbours call her a ***** and the local shops refuse to let her enter.

when the moroccan police authorities asked their belgian colleagues to arrest the new tintin, they were told by thomson and thompson in brussels that this was impossible. i would say even more, according to belgian law servaty had done nothing wrong: the women had freely consented to having him take the pictures.

le soir, however, forced servaty to resign in early june when it became known that servaty had added “anti-islamic remarks” to some of the pictures, like “there is no better drug than to ejaculate on the veiled face of a woman” or “i met her walking down the street in her djellaba. a few minutes later the f***ing ***** did everything i wanted. miracles do happen, even in a muslim country!” abusing the credulity of women to get them to engage in obscenities is one thing, “insulting” islam is another. last year le soir, the voice of the brussels francophone establishment and a pillar of the belgian regime, had loudly applauded the suppression of belgium’s biggest party, the flemish-separatist vlaams blok, as a criminal organisation because some individual vb members, including a turkish-born woman who criticised the treatment of women in fundamentalist muslim societies, had made remarks which according to the belgian judiciary “contributed to a campaign of racial hatred.” since one of its senior writers has been proved a “racist,” le soir even claims to be “one of servaty’s victims” along with the poor moroccan women.

the racist remarks might possibly get the new tintin into a belgian gaol after all. since the affair has deeply shocked morocco the belgian authorities are under pressure from the moroccan judicial, political and diplomatic authorities to prosecute servaty. the latter himself realises that he might currently be better off in gaol than out of it. moroccan families desiring to avenge their daughters have put a price on the journalist’s head. the reason why they want him dead and why their daughters are committing suicide has nothing to do with servaty’s mockery of the naivety of muslim women dreaming of a better life in europe, but everything with his sexual abuse of them – the very thing for which he cannot be prosecuted in brussels. the servaty affair is basically a sex scandal, not a racist crime. however, in contemporary europe making rude remarks about a group of people is a crime while willfully and malignantly wrecking the lives of individuals is not if these individuals have been so stupid as to trust sweet words and empty promises.

a second observation needs to be made. morality has gone berserk all over europe, but nowhere to the same degree as in belgium. there are, of course, sexual perverts everywhere, but philippe servaty was not an ordinary sex tourist. he worked for the most influential newspaper in his country. he was a member of the brussels incrowd, an acquaintance of politicians, academics and businessmen, whom he regularly met and interviewed. though he posted his photos under a pseudonym – “belguel” – the new tintin did not hide his identity as every sensible non-belgian involved in similar “adventures” would do. he gave the moroccan girls his real name and address and he told them he worked for le soir.

in the summer of 2004, servaty had been arrested by the moroccan police. they discovered pornographic pictures in his possession and told him that he risked imprisonment for this. he related his story on the internet: “the police kept me in for 18 hours, but they released me because morocco has good relations with belgium where i am a well known person.” one of his internet fans, however, suspected that his nationality was exactly the reason why the moroccans had searched servaty for pornography in the first place: “they probably detained him because he is a belgian.”

like servaty, i am a belgian journalist. since i started my career in journalism in 1982 i have wondered why belgium is being plagued by so many scandals – corruption, sex scandals, political murders, abductions, extortions, gangs extending into the police, the judiciary and the political parties. i have come to the conclusion that it has to do with the nature of belgium, which is an artificial state combining dutch-speaking flanders and french-speaking wallonia. belgium is not a genuine nation; it is nothing but a political construction. political power corrupts. to keep the country together the regime has to buy the adherence of a significant part of the population. corrupt voters do not care about corrupt politicians and corrupt politicians do not care about organised crime. brussels is marked by an absence of morality. there is a lesson here for everyone. if europe ever “belgianises,” i. e. becomes a state without a real nation, it will end up as the same moral cesspit that belgium is today.

the history of belgium reads like a long list of scandals. in the 1970s, belgium’s present king albert ii, then still the crown prince, was implicated in a sex affair involving the bribery of saudi officials. in 1990, police officers revealed the existence of photos and videotapes of sex parties to members of a belgian parliamentary inquiry committee investigating the malfunctioning of the police and the judiciary. the mafia is said to have used the tapes to blackmail high ranking officials. in 1997, officers declared to a second parliamentary inquiry committee that the tapes had “mysteriously disappeared” from the police files. ordinary belgians have come to suspect that there are people belonging to the establishment who can do whatever they please. philippe servaty undoubtedly thought he was one of these. it is only because moroccan hit squads are now hunting for him, that he has discovered there is a price to be paid for immorality.

[Leparticular]

I'm glad Jackson removed those photos and I think Belguel got and is getting what he deserved specially in the light of the damage he caused the women involved, their families and to a lesser extent a monger's destination. I remember looking at those photos way back in the day and thinking to my self, this guy is sick!

I also personally think he was fully aware of the ramifications of his actions (as he had intimate knowledge of Morroco) but still went through with them.

Anyways, I personally don't even enjoy the hardcore shots that I find here once in a while. I appreciate the the nude shots of women though, where they're not in the act but just standing there, posing, etc. I don't know about anyone else but what I like seeing is the different looks and body types that a particular nation produces. I shared a few shots in the Cuba thread, non were Hardcore although I had few HC shots that I kept to myself. I don't see the urge of showing my dick entering some pussy CLOSE UP!? I'd rather show you what the woman looked like.

[Routard]

Mr Jackson.

Once again, you have shown your leadership skills by taking the right decision against the poll results.

I hope to meet you once, as BA is on the top of my next destinations list, and the WSG mansion on the top of my best dreams list.

The question was about what to do with the Belguel pics, and we have now the answer. Yet, I don't want to appear pushy, but as soon a major problem has been solved, the next question to face is how to prevent the problem to occur again.

This question has been anticipated by most of the previous posts. I agree it is not the right thread for it, as it is not concerning only Morocco.

Even if my personal opinion is to remove all the pics from the WSG for the reasons I've previously explained, I understand most of the members would not agree about this. At least, some necessary Site rules have to be added, easy understandable by all.

These are my suggestions:

1- Photos and reports degrading women, other cultures, other religions are strictly forbidden.

2-Photos my not show persons in sexual or degrading positions:
- We can not control if they are not minors
- We can not control if it is exposed with their consent
- We are not a porn site (at least on a porn site it is published with the consent of the involved people).

3-For the safety and privacy of the girls AND the members, Emails, real names, identifiable faces or any other clues that my lead to identify persons are forbidden in the reports and the photos.

Hope this will help

[Surfer]

This whole brouhaha has resurrected my previous fascination with Morocco (started by a 1982 issue of Surfer magazine that ran a foto spead of Agadir's Anchor Point) and I hope to visit next winter. So, from a personal point of view, I hope the Belguel incident will not have a chilling effect on people posting here.

Further discussion of the incident is NOT what the board needs now. Rather, the focus should be redirected towards where and how to meet women in Morocco without offending local sensibilities. Don't be a "wolf", the predators that Belguel described as the target of local authorities.

While special care and tact is required due to local sensitivites, let's not shut down the flow of information entirely. OBVIOUSLY, any picture posted should obscure faces and not be degrading to Islam nor feature any clothing or objects associated with Islam.

Finally, I urge Jackson to impose a firm rule against fotos or text degrading to women, other cultures, religions etc.. This will cause an outcry, I am sure, but I personally think it a matter of survival that WSG ban all X rated fotos and limit it to Playboy genre (rather than the Hustler genre exemplified by Belguel's fotos). In this politivcal climate, you are going to take LOTS of heat in any event and there are tons of porn sites for the guys who want to see hardcore pictures. IMHO having those pictures really attracts an undesireable element (scary how much I sound like one of the moral majority types I SO despise).

Not all mongers are ant****ial misfits unable to attract "regular" girls, despite that perception among the general public. I hope Jackson, and WSGers, will assiduously avoid reinforcing that perception.

[Neyzen Tevfik]

Thanks to Jackson, for not disappointing me.

I drew the image of Jackson in my mind, for all the years I've been reading this forum.

He's though, he has his own ideas and measure that are hard to bend or break, he's an old hard d*ck !

However, he's a GENTLEMAN ! He's a servant of the public, and he's a fellow.

Let's all get back to basics and go on enrichening our sections of the forums, abiding the rules better from now on (while it is still FREE)...

Carpe Diem

[Teegee]

Dear Jackson,
great to see that the photos have been removed regardless of the outcome of the vote. Surely the vote was an interesting experiment to see what a substantial amount of viewers want.

Better so it was also clear what the contributers of this forum want, which was clearly shown in the overwhelming support to have the photos removed.

The forum lives from quality contributions where the photos of that particular degrading nature only create the attraction of the nonqualified member.

many thanks again

[Catire]

You've made your point ages ago and got your wishes, it's time to back off now, there is no marketplace here, to a large extend we are free loaders being taken care of by the Government (Jackson), after all we are not taxpayers to this company/country. The services being offered here are for free. It's acceptable to offer constructive criticism, disrespect crosses the line conflicts with the original point of your post.

Jackson's tolerance level for taking crap is way off the charts, just find any other place on or offline where you can slam the owner/CEO and get away with it. On many other sites or institution, censorship by management would have ruled the land.

last time I checked Jackson wasn't "taking care of me" and I've provided my share of "content" which basically means "I'm taking care of Jackson".

As to what Jackson "gets", it kind of comes with the territory.

that said, yes I think you're right that I've made my point and it's time to shut up.

though I still want to know if Raoul is Achmed's brother.... or what?

[Run Mann]

You've made your point ages ago and got your wishes, it's time to back off now, there is no marketplace here, to a large extend we are free loaders being taken care of by the Government (Jackson), after all we are not taxpayers to this company/country. The services being offered here are for free. It's acceptable to offer constructive criticism, disrespect crosses the line conflicts with the original point of your post.

Jackson's tolerance level for taking crap is way off the charts, just find any other place on or offline where you can slam the owner/CEO and get away with it. On many other sites or institution, censorship by management would have ruled the land.

to help right a sinking ship by the virtue of how one's stock is valued in the marketplace. It awakens boards which then put their CEO's on notice or simply replace them.

Just think of me as that 'helpful' hedge fund.

sincerely
Catire

[Catire]

but as dictatorial as Jackson's role can be, he, alongside with any other person who runs any kind of website, where content is provided by someone else, is essentially beholden to his content provider(s).

the power always belongs to the "rain-makers", which in the case of this forum/business would be your Senior Members.

no content= no forum= no "Jackson"

What I now want to know is who is "Raoul"?

is he the Brother of "Achmed"?

[Domino]

Catire: Metaphors, your one of the market place included, should be kept short for maximum impact. Your metaphor is out of place here as there is only one shareholder, it is a privately owned company and the shareholder/CEO is not responsible to anyone, LE perhaps excepted.
Jackson is easily the most interesting guy on this entire site. He breaks his balls, for his own reasons, making this the best site of its kind in the world. He wastes thousands of dolllas (in his own words but I reckon it must be tens of thousands) allowing photos etc to be put up at his expense from places he will never visit because of time constrictions. Anytime his site runs into logistical problems, he gets deluged by "hey asshole wtf, I can't see the fucking pictures, you lazy prick" pms ordering him to jump to.
In this thread, he probably got an unprecedented amount of criticism and he took a brave decision by stepping back after issuing a short statement. As it is his ball, he can do whatever he likes and, as he said in response to the Thai choir boys when he upgrsded me to Senior status, he does not have to explain his every minor move to the wankers of the world.

There are bigger issues besides Belguel and his many faces. These revolve around the profile and direction JACKSON wants the forum to take and the role the photos should take in that. Give Jackson room to breathe.

[Catire]

Of course, after a long night doing all this work, I get the pleasure of reading Catire's report making a mockery of my efforts,

Jackson

to help right a sinking ship by the virtue of how one's stock is valued in the marketplace. It awakens boards which then put their CEO's on notice or simply replace them.

Just think of me as that 'helpful' hedge fund.

sincerely
Catire

[Domino]

Jackson
24 hours adds to a lot of flight time. However, you must know by now that bitching against you will always far outnumber both pats on your back and actual help.
As regards removing Belguel's photos: might I just suggest zapping all his posts as that is the easiest for you? So, what will you lose? The thread will not be quite continuous or coherent but so what? You have done similar actions in the past. References have been posted to the French stories and I am sure English ones will follow. Just zap all his posts and be done with it.
I think your rationale in all this should be: what suits Jackson both in terms of time and objectives? One poster mentoned about paying taxes - contributing photos, words and general bs. The only guy who really contributes is you. So do what is easiest for you. And make sure your butt is always legally covered.
The Belguel controversy is not all wasted effort. It raises a number of logistical questions as to how you intend to manage the sheer volume of work associated with running this site.
Again, I suggest you get your BA dudes to help you. Start your Tuesday fuck fests a little earlier, then give Dickhead, Cpt Dave etc jobs to do in cleaning up various threads: just deleting all the crap, to improve the information to noise ratio. As it is your ball you don't have to give explanations, ever, about anything. Maybe start a general moan in page so you guys an have a laugh on Tuesdays too.
If the board continues to run as it is, with a large number of voyeurs, a few hundred active posters and a tiny team running the show, more bottlenecks will have to arise.
This site is almost unique in the www world. But there is always room for improvement. Just make sure the improvement suits you, the big taxpayer.

[Ferolga777]

Yes. Kudos!!!


Jackson

You got a crappy job: Administrator of a site that caters to horny men.LOL

You do a great job, most of the time.


Sometimes your best judgment fails you. Your life experiences are not wide and deep enough to understand that not every country is the same and that repressive regimes are called that for a very good reason.

NOW, you hopefully realize that you made a mistake when you refused to delete the photos when that Belgian dude asked you to. But, today you are learning that there were then real risks to the man that begged you to remove those photos and to the women that would have begged you to do so if they had access to this site.

But, you are learning, we all are learning. Hopefully, you will never have to learn the hard way the power and wide discretion that law enforcement has to pick and choose its fights.

Kudos again and best of luck.

Ferolga

[Tropi]

I can only applaud - wise decision.

Now I would like to invite anyone who wants to post photos of girls to think about the following.

1) Could the photos cause you problems?
2) Could the photos cause the girls problems?
3) Could the photos cause Jackson problems?
4) Could the photos cause the destination problems?

Agadir, as you may or may not know, is dead because of the scandal. Without photos that wouldn't have happened.

Think about it.