Angeles City

[PedroEscobar]

The next afternoon, my plan is to enjoy the Perimeter bars. My plan is always the same: Perimeter in the afternoon and Fields in the evening. As I leave Score Birds and approach close to where I picked up the girls last night, a voice shouts at me "Hey! You! I saw you last night!

I look over and it's a couple of girls / ladyboys in the spa. I think it's best to ignore them but my curiosity is piqued and decide to walk over and play coy. They are eating some delicious mangos and offer me a piece. What did you see? What are you talking about? And they proceeded to recount their view point of what happened when I picked up Sarah and Christine and my negotiating. I didn't realize I had asked for so many things from the two girls. Then they wanted to know what happened afterwards, what we did and how long they stayed. None of your business is what happened. These two hairstylists were a lot of fun to talk to. No customers in the spa so they were bored..

Really enjoyed reading your posts, your exchange with the ladyboys in the above quote made me smile, one of the reasons along with your reports on ladies that I am now considering AC / Manila over Thailand / Pattaya! Pattaya I have done quite a few time a good few years ago, and visiting in December (along with other places around Thailand)!

I know this is a hard question to answer, but leaving mongering out of the equation, what sort of costs are involved in eating and general costs while there. For instance for a week in AC? I might fit a trip in say in September this year prior to Thailand.

[Pute Nut]

The puss going for 3 K in AC goes for 300 pesos in the provinces.

Thanks for the wake up call, CM. Paid 500 for last province romp. No wonder she was so happy. And now messages me to come back soon.

[GoodEnough]

You may be in denial. Logic does matter.

Examine your feelings. Your motivation is not eleemosynary but rather to distinguish yourself so that news of your largesse will aggrandize your reputation thus facilitating your future forays.

So whereas you deny that your tipping will have an overall influence on the market in general, you do hope that it will enhance your standing in the marketplace.

Hold the market steady and don't tip. But GE, you will probably have to continue tipping since you have already created an expectation which you can not disappoint. That is the other down side to tipping.

Don't really need psychotherapy for that part of my life thanks, since it's neither a source of turmoil nor conflict for me. I'm not in denial; I'm doing what feels good and appropriate. Since it makes me feel good, is of direct benefit to the girl, and causes no one else any harm, there's no issue. This requires neither further analysis nor further discussion.

I've created no "expectation" since I rarely repeat with anyone, and I doubt that the word has been spread among the huge population of ladies in Angeles. Creating expectations implies foreknowledge, for which there would be no basis.

My take is that everyone here will do what he wants to do without having to justify his actions to anyone else.

Peace,

GE.

[Chocha Monger]

Actually, Westerners have brought in more than just tourist dollars in the past. Many of those who brought in real money to invest in businesses and build things ended up dead or imprisoned. The lucky ones ended up penniless and deported. The Philippine laws on foreign investment and ownership are very unfavorable towards foreigners and provides an incentive for corrupt Filipinos to defraud them. The Philippine government itself is not exactly a good example in its dealings with foreign investors. Westerners have good reason to be wary of investing in anything in the Philippines without legal reforms to provide strong protection for their investment and efficient judicial processes free of corruption.

The puss going for 3 K in AC goes for 300 pesos in the provinces. There is really no reason to cling to AC. If the Koreans want to put the money into businesses and real estate with all of the risks involved, then let them. Maybe they can succeed where many others failed. The Filipino police has already targeted Korean businessmen for extortion and murder in AC, and they have also been victims of other criminal elements. They are going to have a hard time turning a profit with all of the bribes that must be paid to the authorities.

The entire Philippines might end up under martial law with ISIS making a strong showing in Mindanao allowing the NPA and other insurgent groups to become resurgent in other parts of the country. If that happens, it could put a real damper on nightlife.

[GoodEnough]

They are building things here. Whole sections of towns reconstructed into little Korea towns. While the westerners are only bring in tourist dollars and not much else. Koreans will take over in 5-10 yrs everything will be to there way of doing things and we westerners need to adjust our mongering techniques, Bring in real money and start investing to counter what the Koreans are doing or go home. Thats my take on it.

This is the most sensible post I've read on the "Korean" subject. The fact is that the Philippines attracts far fewer Western tourists than many other ASEAN countries, and ranks dead last among major ASEAN countries, aside from Brunei, for direct foreign investment, due both to corruption and onerous investment rules that protect the oligarchs. Koreans have not only begun to invest heavily, but the Korean Government has begun to provide massive foreign assistance for infrastructure thus filling an enormous void in the country's development plans. Western countries had opportunities to do the same and declined to do so. So it's not surprising, given the financial commitment of individual Korean investors and the Government of Korea that the country would begin to accommodate them. That's the reality, and whether or not we like it, or can find the means to adapt to it is largely irrelevant. It's a trend that will continue, together with an increased number of Chinese tourists who will come for much the same reason. I would guess–though with no substantiation–that with the massive aid beginning to pour into the Philippines from both the Chinese and Korean Governments–individual companies and investors have found ways to bend the rules, much the same way American food companies did during the 19th and early 20th centuries.

As with others on this board, I too have watched as groups of Koreans have "made it rain" in various bars in Angeles. I assume they do this because it's fun for them; because it doesn't cost them much to indulge in the fun, and because it generally makes them feel good. It seems inane to me, but it's their money, their idea of a good time, and has no real impact on me, so I don't really care.

I think I posted about the fact that the last time I was at the ABC, 4 Korean guys rented a cabana and had approximately 27 girls inside and out, drinking, swimming, shrieking with laughter, and generally having a good time. Their Korean hosts primarily drank heavily and took lots of pictures. Fun for them, lucrative for the girls, and harmed no one. Again, it wouldn't be my idea of the ideal way to spend several hundred dollars on an afternoon, but it had zero impact on me, so I didn't care.

The bottom line for me is that I know very little about Korean culture but I assume it differs drastically in some respects from my own. So long as those differences don't affect me negatively I don't much care.

GE.

[Bone Yard]

Yeah. This act of going into a bar and just tossing money in the air is totally asinine.

So prevalent in strip clubs in the US. Don't get it!

[Streetlooker]

Whether its AC or any other dozen mongering cities in the Philippines, Koreans are ruining it for me. And its not the tipping. Tipping for service is one thing. Walking into a bar and throwing cash in the air is not tipping IMHO, its what's ruining the scene. Lots of Koreans in Phnom Penh now too.

Yeah. This act of going into a bar and just tossing money in the air is totally asinine.

[Streetlooker]

Streetlooker is right. Koreans have already integrated themselves in Filipino society from Baguio all the way to Davao. I spend a lot of time in Cebu as well and even though culturally they are standoffish, their investment (time and money) has made them more vested and Invested in las pinas more than we think. Korean foreign investment in the Philippines is at an all time high. They may seem standoffish but they are buying the Philippines at record rates.

They are building things here. Whole sections of towns reconstructed into little Korea towns. While the westerners are only bring in tourist dollars and not much else. Koreans will take over in 5-10 yrs everything will be to there way of doing things and we westerners need to adjust our mongering techniques, Bring in real money and start investing to counter what the Koreans are doing or go home. Thats my take on it.

[MrWoolyBooly]

If you really felt charitable, just pay her barfine, give her the tip, and tell her to take the night off.

I've done this in Burgos, Makati. It doesn't make me any more charitable than if I bonked her coworker or her beforehand. Interestingly, she eventually became mistress / employee of an Egyptian guy with a freight forwarding business in Metro Manila. When I visited Makati several months later, she simply insisted on meeting me and providing unrequested enthusiastic but surprisingly low skilled freebie at the Isabella Royale. I should check up on her, see how she's doing.

[MrWoolyBooly]

That is what I say. If it was all about helping then you would give them money without fucking them. But when you give it makes YOU feel warm and fuzzy inside. It has nothing to do with genuinely wanting to help someone.

If a guy gets warm and fuzzy pleasure from giving money unnecessarily, is that somehow wrong if he also gets warm and fuzzy pleasure from sex with the same person? I think very, very few people think "who is the one person in the world most in need of this dollar / euro / ruble / rupee / yen that I can give?" Almost all who give chose their recipients with subjectivity and the arbitrariness of proximity or familiarity. Assuming he didn't steal the money, how he spends it is his business whether it makes any sense to anybody or not.

[Mr Enternational]

You may be in denial. Logic does matter. Wanting to help the girls? If you really felt charitable, just pay her barfine, give her the tip, and tell her to take the night off.

That is what I say. If it was all about helping then you would give them money without fucking them. But when you give it makes YOU feel warm and fuzzy inside. It has nothing to do with genuinely wanting to help someone.

[Member #4566]

I know guys who tip thousands of pesos because they can and they want to help the girls. Does this mean that the next time these girls or their friends are barfined they expect a similar tip? I think not. I always tip because I think it's the right thing to do. I don't give a damn what others may do. Logic on this subject doesn't seem to matter. GE.

You may be in denial. Logic does matter. Wanting to help the girls? If you really felt charitable, just pay her barfine, give her the tip, and tell her to take the night off.

Examine your feelings. Your motivation is not eleemosynary but rather to distinguish yourself so that news of your largesse will aggrandize your reputation thus facilitating your future forays.

So whereas you deny that your tipping will have an overall influence on the market in general, you do hope that it will enhance your standing in the marketplace. But that is the point that some of us are trying to make. Your tipping moves the fulcrum, even if ever so slightly, in favor of the seller. You are contributing to inflationary pricing. Multiply that by many others who are excessive and you have a shift in the market.

Hold the market steady and don't tip. But GE, you will probably have to continue tipping since you have already created an expectation which you can not disappoint. That is the other down side to tipping.

[SockBoy50]

Of course you're correct; it makes no difference what a single person, or 200 single people do. The market in Angeles is comprised of thousands of guys a year barfining thousands of women. I know guys who tip thousands of pesos because they can and they want to help the girls. Does this mean that the next time these girls or their friends are barfined they expect a similar tip? I think not. I always tip because I think it's the right thing to do. I don't give a damn what others may do. Logic on this subject doesn't seem to matter much as there will always be a nucleus of guys screaming that those who tip more than a few hundred pesos will "ruin" the market for the rest of the guys.

GE.

Whether its AC or any other dozen mongering cities in the Philippines, Koreans are ruining it for me. And its not the tipping. Tipping for service is one thing. Walking into a bar and throwing cash in the air is not tipping IMHO, its what's ruining the scene. Lots of Koreans in Phnom Penh now too.

[SockBoy50]

Its already quite difficult in several areas of town to pull girls if you are not Korean. I agree they don't like others around and do not integrate well. I have had a whole stage of girls pulled off by the Korean manager after all the Koreans had left the bar. This Happened at Roadies. I was left there alone. I have also had Many girls say they can no go out with me cause they are already taken on reserve. I am afraid the old way of doing things in this town is rapidly changing and not for the better. Sure there will still be a few Bars here and there that will hold out for the old timers but they will be less and less over time.

Streetlooker is right. Koreans have already integrated themselves in Filipino society from Baguio all the way to Davao. I spend a lot of time in Cebu as well and even though culturally they are standoffish, their investment (time and money) has made them more vested and Invested in las pinas more than we think. Korean foreign investment in the Philippines is at an all time high. They may seem standoffish but they are buying the Philippines at record rates.

[Streetlooker]

Adjusting will mean being treated like 2nd class customers. After living in Korea for a time I came to understand that Koreans have two standards of service: one for Koreans and a lower one for everyone else. I never patronize a Korean business unless I absolutely have to.

I disagree with your conclusion that we will be forced into a different format for procuring girls. Koreans are a standoffish bunch and do not integrate well with other people. That will always limit their ability to penetrate and influence Filipino society.

Its already quite difficult in several areas of town to pull girls if you are not Korean. I agree they don't like others around and do not integrate well. I have had a whole stage of girls pulled off by the Korean manager after all the Koreans had left the bar. This Happened at Roadies. I was left there alone. I have also had Many girls say they can no go out with me cause they are already taken on reserve. I am afraid the old way of doing things in this town is rapidly changing and not for the better. Sure there will still be a few Bars here and there that will hold out for the old timers but they will be less and less over time.