2002 Moscow Reports

[Kalifornia]

Timmy, welcome aboard -- unfortunately I have never been to Siberia, but I have meet a few girls from Novosibirsk. Firstly, if you are a sober, well-smelling American dude, all you have to do is not beat the girls up and you have a great chance just meeting them on the street -- Siberian girls are not known for being particularly picky, as the men they have to deal with are of a ... ehhh ... substandard quality. September is a particularly good time to go, as the fall semester at various schools in Novosibirsk and Omsk will be commencing and all the beauties will be back. I must warn you -- Siberian girls are known for their endurance, as the food that they eat and the environment they live in is particularly healthy -- so, you better eat your Weaties.
Unfortunately, I cannot point you to a particular place, but I hope that your Russian friends from Novosibirsk and Omsk will treat you royally and ship you over to some "banya" (bath house) or just roll with you into some salon.
The only place in Novosibirsk that I know of is
< http://www.sibgirls.ru/girls.html> -- you can go and look at the girls just by clicking on their names (in Russian).
As to Omsk -- I juts know where it's located ... approximately. But I will keep you in mind and if I run across something useful, I will let you know. Good luck, as if you will need it, being an American in Siberia.

[Timmy21]

Kalifornia, I am sorry to butt in to the discussion, I was wondering if you could provide some advise, this Sept. I'm traveling to Siberia, two days in Novosibrisk and 8 days in Omsk, I've heard many stories about the lengendary beautiful Siberia girls, and I need to see this area for myself, have you been to Omsk previously, from what I hear the saunas is the best best to meet the working girls in that city.

[Kalifornia]

Chicago, in my experience, Night Flight will have more beautiful girls per square foot than any other place in Russia -- we are talking tons and tons of 8s and 9s -- and quite a few 10s. If you are gonna be in Moscow for only a few days -- Night Flight is the best bet for a short time, but in all honesty, Moscow Expat's recommended Rusakli salon is probably a better bet -- cheaper, and in-house, but if you wanna see some of the most upscale Russsian hookers -- Night Flight is the place to be. Either way, I know you are gonna have a blast -- have a good one!

[ChicagoBoy23]

Thanks for advice on cabs- I will definitely follow.

I am jealous. I am only in Moscow for 2 nights. You sound like you have a rowdy week and a half planned in Russia!

In your opinion is the Safari club worth a visit if I am only there for 2 nights or should I stay with Night Flight and more upscale?

Chicagoboy

[CA Traveler]

Expat, thanks for the info... turns out that now my return visit will be StP for 5 nights and then 8 nights in Moscow. So, I plan to explore both cities extensively. I've already scheduled two more trips to Russia the next 8 months, so I should have time to become more comfortable with the Moscow. However, I'm really looking forward to getting out into some of the smaller cities. I spent 5 nights in Prague with a beautiful girl from Samara several years ago and if she's any indication of the talent that waits out in the hinterland, it'll be worth the trouble of travelling outside Moscow.

chicagoboy, most taxis outside the major hotels will know NF, but it's better to ask the hotel to write down the club name and address in Russian... Then you can get a taxi or almost any car to take you there. Don't forget to get them to write down the hotel name and address in Russian as a safety factor in case you wind up someplace without a clue where you are and no way to communicate where you want to go. Also, figure out a backup club in case you don't like your first option and get that name and address in Russian as well. You don't have to spend much time alone in mainland China before you figure this out... If you think Russian is foreign, you should try communicating with a Chinese cab driver!

[ChicagoBoy23]

Thanks for information girls in Moscow.

I am really looking forward to my visit.

As an American who does not speak any Russian - can I just hop in a cab from my hotel (Sheraton) and tell the cabbie take me to Night Flight ?

[Kalifornia]

Moscow Expat -- not only had I never had sex with his wife, I have never even seen her. Is she a fox ... ah, doesn't matter, any American, who had sex with DS' wife, without his knowledge and/or concent, in a car (bonus points, chi-chiiiiing) is a demigod and is worthy of admiration, emulation and something else ending on -tion, but I can't think what exactly, as I am about to roll over to this Russian girl's house in West Los Angeles and my brain is in neutral, whilst my @ss is in gear.
I'm gonna write you an email and just generally kiss your ass and say how cool you are and how shocked I am that there are Americans like you in Moscow -- the ones I have seen are either locked up in Fortress America (Ameerican Embassy) or go to NF and claim, ad noseum, how they have partaken in the real Russian nightlife.
Out here, in the land of the free land the home of the brave we sure are proud of you.

[Moscow Expat]

Kalifornia:

Aha! So you know Dima also I see. But did you ever have sex with his wife... in a car... without him knowing about it? Hehehe.... Life is funny sometimes.

Sure, you and anyone else are welcome to send me email. Enough people already do. That is why I provide the email address.


Fotoguy1:

Of course you can subsist on less. I guess a substantial number of people (Russians) live in Moscow on $300 or less a month, (although they don't need to pay for their housing). However, unless you've experienced living on welfare, and not even then, would I recommend that you try this! It's just too brutal!

Moscow Expat
moskvaexpat@yahoo.com

[Fotoguy1]

Moscow Expat-- thanks for the additional info. My interest presently would be a year or two sabbatical with the thought of possibly working as an English teacher to offset my expenses and possibly take some Russian language courses.

I'm amazed that the cost is so high. I don't have that kind of outlay here in the states on a monthly basis and I don't live like a pauper! If that is what it takes then I guess it will be worth the experience I am sure. From all that you and Kalifornia tell of the mother country it sounds like a gold mine for the adventourous ones to explore.

Any additional info would always be appreciated.

[Kalifornia]

Moscow Expat, I bow down before you and would like to express my sincere admiration for your breadth of knowledge -- anything from Sumerki to L.N. Tolstoy -- get out of town.
The salon I was talking about is in-calls only, but I have taken a girl from there (Natasha) on a date (I $hit you not) -- we went dancing and I took her to my place afterwards. I did NOT have to directly pay her (drinks and food expences notwithstanding) and this is my claim to fame -- free sex with a prostitute ... sounds sorta oxymoronic.
Well, Dmitrii Sergeevich could have made it big -- I have noticed some powerful folks frequenting his lavish establishment -- this was Anna Pavlovna Scherer on crack -- I like going to the defunct site just to see the pic of girls I had sex with ... in DS' office once or twice. Damn, when I recall rolling around Moskovia with my dawgs in in a beat-up 'Burban with 004 dimplomatic plates, Dr. Dre blasting on those nuclear-powered spakers ... ah, youth.
Well, the salon you've mentioned sounds cool -- I would shell out $100/night for some Russky pussky with a smile on my face and a "bolshoye spasibo". But I also enjoy the thrill of the chase in Propaganda, etc. You are probably right that Propaganda is no soiree, but you will notice some Moscow "golden youth" ("zolotaya molodezh") in 13, Muzei, Zeppelin, in particualr. Naturally, there will be zero to none of the oligarchs or movie stars out there, but still ... scoring with a dimplomat's daughter in her posh Kutuzovski Prospekt apartment makes for a nice diversion from the provincial babes of Samara, although this is just as good.
Have you been to the <http://love.mail.ru/category/1500.html> and <http://lovers.ru/category/8111.html> sites? They have a huge selection of delic ladies (with pic, of course) for very reasonable prices -- mostly salons, but a lot of out-calls too.
Oh, paying $200/night for sex in Moscow is criminal -- you can get into a stunning girl in a salon for $100/night, as you well know. As this is what I also do -- after I develop some rapport with the girl, I snag her mobile and, thus, eliminate the middle-man (or, more frequently, middle-madame, hehehe).
Bro, you are so cool, when I hit Moscow like a ton of sushi (Allah willing come August), you are very welcome to join my friends and me in a night on the town.
Finally, there is this city called Ivanovo, about 4 hours away from Moscow -- it is famous for its beautiful girls ... oh, and did I mention that for every one sober guy in Ivanovo, there are, at a minimum, 8 available women. But that's the story of Mother Russia ... ok, bro, keep it real! Oh, would it be cool if I wrote you directly to yuor email?

[Moscow Expat]

Well, I'm back from another long weekend, lazily lounging about the dacha (vacation cottage) doing basically, next to nothing. This my variation of a popular Russian summer pastime. The authentic version has the dacha-owner working hard all weekend from Friday night arrival to Sunday departure, building this, fixing that, gardening like mad, and generally working twice as hard as he does during the week. I assume it is some perverse form of entertainment because a few years ago, a potential employee turned down a rather lucrative assignment from me because he had to "build his banya (sauna)" at his dacha, when for 10% of what I was prepared to pay him, he could have hired an Ukrainian migrant laborer to do it... Myself, I'll stick with sex.


hargow20:

It's been a long time since I've had a $50/night girl in Moscow. It's par for the course in the regions, but Moscow is just pricier, unless you want to try your hand slumming it at the railway stations. You can find free-lancers in that price range outside of the city however. A few weeks ago, I was in a small nightclub in the Moscow Region near my dacha and I was propositioned by a 4-5/10 girl for 2000 roubles for the night ($1 ~ 31.33 roubles), so I know it's probably possible to find or to negotiate to $50/night once you're outside the city limits.

Of course many Russian girls will do facials. Really it's no big deal. It's the really kinky stuff which will require some searching here.


CA traveler:

off-topic: The best prices in Europe for authentic labels has got to be Milan however, especially if you visit the factory outlets just outside of the city. Fantastic prices. My wife visits once or twice a year just to shop for clothes.

In a ten day visit, you should be able to really make some mischief. Since everyone is different, I will give you my itinerary for a few day visit if I were in your shoes. On day #1, I would definitely start with Spearmint Rhino (I provided the address earlier -- see my message from Thursday, April 18, 2002 - 06:46 pm in the WSG archives). Fantastic women to give you a real taste of Russian beauties. On day #2, I would stop by Marika (that is if it's a Friday or Saturday). This was Moscow's (and perhaps Russia's!) very first nightclub, closed for a few years but now reopened. Terrific selection of pros and freelancers. (I also provided the address of Marika earlier -- see my message from Sunday, April 21, 2002 - 05:06 pm in the WSG archives). After having some guaranteed paid sex, day #3 would be spent visiting some of the places for picking up free-sex girls. I've also provided the short-list in the archives -- see my message from Wednesday, April 10, 2002 - 01:36 pm. Then by day #4, I'd already have some personal favorites that I can revisit.

In general, the most attractive free-lancers will be working the top nightclubs, such as Marika and the ones Kalifornia has already mentioned. Expect to pay $125-150/night around 1-2AM in the morning. Professional models however are $200+/night. (Three years ago, I picked up a Red Stars model at the old Marika for $200 and ended up keeping her for a week! Wheee.... I was even considering converting her to become a GF, but she was a real airhead. C'est la vie.)


Kalifornia:

Welcome! I can use the help in advising these Russia visitors here! Thanks for the pointer on your 723-66-90 place. I will have to try it. Is it incall only, or do they also do outcall? I've mentioned the bargains to be had in St. Petersburg in this WSG forum before. But I do think that if you're not picky, you can also find some bargains outside of the MKAD (the outer ring highway) for about what you can find in St. Petersburg. Of course, the selection is worse, since so close to Moscow, the best looking girls go downtown for work.

As for Rusalki, don't knock it until you've tried it. I've had sex with so many girls here I've long ago lost track, but I would still recommend Rusalki, because for me, it gave me the best experience in years. Again, for the short-timers, go someplace else. $100/hr is indeed high. But Rusalki does charge $100-150 per 12-hrs and I do think this is quite reasonable. I've referred a number of friends there, and no one has given the thumbs-down yet!

So what was your problem negotiating at NF? That she immediately went from $300/hr to $200/2hrs should have been a good indication about the fluidity of the pricing. Actually, NF is the first place I take any out-of-town (male) visitor! I've never had a visit leave for more than $200/night. One friend (back last August 2001) even took out two for $400.

I wouldn't call those clubs (Propaganda, etc.) the russian "high-society". I would call them tusovka (hang-out) places for the Russian young elite. The russian "high-society" is altogether different, and I've attended many soirees in Moscow which made me think of an Anna Pavlovna Scherer's vecherinka (lil' soiree). (slightly off-topic: speaking of vecherinkas, I do have a first-hand story about a certain famous cellist and a certain vice-minister that I could share... it's even related to sex... but only in private email!)

Of course I've been to Sumerki Bogov! Man, I loved that place. I even knew the owner. The first time they closed/moved, it was because of local community action. Very sad. I was shocked when I read your repart that Tsvet Nochi (The Color of the Night) was closed, but I too just visited their bulletin board and it does seem as if you are right and they closed a month ago. I will try to look up the owner, Dima, again and get the story from him. Stay tuned.


Hedonist:

I've provide a list of "quick-get-lucky" GF clubs in an earlier message. See my message from Wednesday, April 10, 2002 - 01:36 pm in the WSG archives. You can pretty easily pick up a girl, although no guarantees about niceness for such a "lightning" operation.

As for how to behave: Well, just don't behave like a dork. Russian girls (at least the tusovka ones) tend to be pretty sophisticated, while wealthy Russian men abound, so any foreigner who struts about trying to look cool sticks out like an ole sore thumb. All the girls will be snickering. Instead just be yourself. Be self-assured as Kalifornia advises. And girls will either approach you, or you can approach them.

Katenka or any salon: Kalifornia pretty much told the story. You will have trouble even finding the salons if you speak no Russian at all. The salons never advertise their exact addresses (for obvious reasons) and so you are expected to show up at an appointed street corner in the direct line-of-sight of the salon, and then call up. Then they check you out before coming to get you. In theory, it's completely possible to do without speaking a word of Russian. And I've had visitors even do it (to my amazement). Practically, you might find the experience frustrating.

I did find Wellcum to be an excellent salon. I even noticed they speak a little English (although I speak Russian, I have a very American accent and often people test their English skills on me).

I would downplay however the risk of visiting salons by yourself, unless it's late at night, in which case newcomers to the city should be careful anyways. I find that the places for crime in Moscow tend to be where the tourists gather actually. A few days ago, at high noon, I witnessed a con go down on Red Square that I first saw in the movie "The Sting", although in another version! So just hang onto your wallet, and you should be alright.


fotoguy1:

Kalifornia has already laid out the basic expenses. However, I would think though that for $1500/month, you will pretty much live like a student though. I myself would just not do it. It's been too long since college. To really have fun, I would peg the proper amount at a minimum of $3K/month -- pretty much what you would spend in Paris or London. Now would this be a two year sabbatical for you, or are you considering temporary relocation and work?


chicagoboy23:

See my comments to Kalifornia about NF. I really really really hate the idea of people passing up one of the greatest sights of Moscow (NF) because they think it's too expensive. You can (repeat after me: "Yes I can!") party all night with a girl from NF for $200! Night Flight is not for every night just as the Tour d'Argent should not become your daily lunch spot. But even so, I just don't know what everyone's problem is. Do they go and hit up one girl (like one fish in the sea), get disappoint and then split?!?! I've just never ever ever had such a problem at NF. (I feel as if we are somehow talking about a different "Night Flight" or something... Is there also a club called "Night Flight" in Moscow, Idaho?)

Girls always prefer dollars, and no one has change, so be sure you are well stocked with $5's and $20's since one of the idiosyncrasies of Moscow is that there are more $100's here than smaller bills.


Have fun everyone.

Moscow Expat
moskvaexpat@yahoo.com

[Kalifornia]

Moscow Expat, have you ever been to the old Sumerki Bogov on Old Arbat, right next to the MEXX store? I have spend many a nights there and I am convinced that it was the absolute ultimate in adult entertainment. Tsvetok Nochi is shut down, judging from the posts on the Sumerki website ... damn, if Sumerki would reopen I would fly over to Moscow from LA just for that -- and I'm serous too. There was this girl Masha there ... ah, enough about that ... damn, none of the hot California chicks that I'm exposed to could match good old Masha in just plain good looks or in her outstanding attitude towards sex ... how lucky you are to be in Moscow, bro. Stay healthy.

[Kalifornia]

Fotoguy, well, let's concider that you come to Moscow for a month. An apartment should run you about $400/month; food and just getting around should run you about another $300/month. Miscellaneous expences should add up another $300/month. Now, the girls should average about $100/night or $50/2 hrs, so compute accordingly. I think you probably need a minimum of $1,500/month to have a good old time, plus airfare. Moscow is not particularly cheap, especially if you don't speak Russian. I hear that the Kiev, Ukraine is significantly cheaper and the girls there at AT LEAST as goodlooking as those in Moscow. Or you could just go to St. Petersburg, if you wanna save some money it's about 30% cheaper than Moscow. You could also go into provinces, such as the city of Samara, which, in my opinion, has the highest per capita amount of stunnding girls -- living outside of Moscow is MUCH less expencive, but you have to have Russian language skills or at least some Russian friends to get around, as very few people even speak English out there.

[Fotoguy1]

Kalifornia--I will ask you the same question that I posted for Mosco Expat. What would be the monthly living costs for a non-patriot to have a comfortable living situation and to enjoy oneself especially all of the local lovely beauties around.
Thanks

[Kalifornia]

Hey, Hedonist. I am glad I could be of some help. Here is how the salons operate: for the most part you call them in advance (I recommend about 4-6 hours), ask about the availability of girls, services and prices, schedule an appointment (yes, not unlike going to your dentist, but much more fun, hehehe), get their address and directions and show up at the appointed time. It is VERY helful to have somebody who speaks Russian call for you -- maybe he will negotiate a better price or more time, but most importantly, many of the madames speak little English, as they are mostly imported from the provinces and have little education. There are two types of salons: larger ones, with as many as 10 or more girls working there and what we call "boutiques", many of which are self-run and have maybe 5 or less girls. The larger salons are geared towards foreigners
Salons are particularly convenient because you don't have to go throught the hassle of getting the girl through hotel's security, particularly after 8pm, as the hotel often has its own WGs and wish to maintain a monopoly on their own turf. I provided the phone number for the salon I frequented in September -- it is really fantastic: decent price ($40/2 hrs with one girl or $70/2 hrs with two), close to the center of Moscow, safe, cozy and friendly. Oh, and the girls were really sexy and not used up, like it happends, as I suspect, in larger salons. But this was back in September of 2001 and I have no idea if they are still in business. Alternatively, you may go to the link I gave you earlier and see if you like any of the girls there -- have somebody who speaks Russian call them and arrange for you to show up to meet the Russian fox of your choice.
I would also recommend that you NOT go to a salon you have never been to alone -- although the danger to you in minimal, really, but Moscow is a big city and you just never know. Even there is one chance out of a hundred that you will be robbed, if it happends to you, it's often enough. Bring a friend or go to a larger, well-established salon, although you will pay about 30% more and the atmosphere will be less "cozy".
One final point -- you will probably be offered a shower and a massage; you do NOT have to agree to it, as it will lessen the time you will be actually getting freaky. Conversely, you may WANT to take a shower, if the girl agrees to accompany you (and almost invariably they will).
In conclusion, I miss Russia a lot and one of the reasons why I'm here is to sorta live vicariously throught you guys, as I still rememer my summer months in Moscow, when I would go through 10 GORGEOUS girls in a week (some paid some free). As always, best of luck.