2003 Moscow Reports

[Doctor_Skank]

SM,

Thanks, noted your dates, I think I'll be in Moscow the following week, but will know more mid-November.

Age:
I'd prefer to think that the girls think older guys have more to offer.. money and experience. One thing that Russian girls seem obsessed with is that you are able to tell them exciting stories and have experienced a lot. An ex-GF used to say that Russian girls love with their ears. I don't know how true that is, but I don't think money is the only factor, although obviously money and position are more likely to be found with a guy 30+ than with a 22 year old. Unless he is a 22-year old Georgian junior mafia cronie...

Pic strategy:

Like I said before, I usually leave the camera around and first ask them to take a pic of me, they usually cannot resist having their own pic taken. I think you should just ask and see what happens, but ask confidently otherwise you'll likely get shot down. Or you could just take out the camera and tell them that you are going to take a picture, giving them little time to object. Or just take it. She isn't going to kill you.

One thing's for sure, unless you try, you'll never get any pics.

Since I have starting asking for pics or just taking them, I've had less rejections than I thought I would. Especially tochka girls seem not to mind. NF and CF girls are less likely to be picture friendly IMHO. They are probably just smarter than tochka girls and know where the pics may end up. A lot of NF and CF girls also lead "normal" lives as students etc. and aren't too keen on their pics floating around.

[Swissman]

Doctor Skank,

Someting about the age, Where I was in the CF I saw severl Mens in the age of 50 where was kissing whit young girls (about 18) in CF! I guess the age is not matter. I'm 31 years old but i see no advantage of me age. It seems to me that a working girl thinks that a older western guy have mor money to spend on her as a younger werstern Men. Can it be? One girl in the NF told me she will come whit me for 150$ because i'm young and nice, it was about 1:30 in the night, so this will be the reason of the drop of price and not my age *lol

Questin about taking a pic of the girls, How you ask them? Just; hey your so nice let me make a pic of you? How is the reaction of the girls?

Swissman

[Doctor_Skank]

Ca_T:

Double pics: I took it the right way and wasn't upset at your remark, just a little miffed that Patrick suggested I was making up stories or switching stories. Maybe I overreacted, if so, sorry to all. No harm no foul.

Your point on the 25-31 year olds is dead on. If a girl is hitting on you in a bar, chances are she's in that category, has a decent job but is unsatisfied with going home to an empty apartment and watching videos. Easy pickings and grateful. These girls are also especially keen on Western guys, having experienced communism first hand and gone through the Glasnost/perestroika years when everything from the West was better. Younger girls have a more balanced view of things. And the 25-31 category are relatively low maintenance. You're right, there is almost no competition for this, as the already limited competition is concentrating on the fresher 18-24 year olds.

In my experience however a pro over 25 is already way past her prime and generally doesn't have a good attitude. Nearly every bad experience (and there are surprisingly few) I've had was with a pro approaching or just on the other side of 30 where gigantic warning lights were blinking "no! no! no!" and my alcohol clouded brain said "yes yes yes!". Too much booze + aging ho = no fun.

Dyevs and age: on the dating sites most girls list their preferred man as 25+ or 30+... good for us...

A special category for new girls at the tochkas? WOuld be interesting for sure, although I hope the quality is better than the $70 girls... all the girls I have seen in that category were atrocious.

[Oetziboy]

Hi to all, I'm in Moscow for the weekend, I wonder if you could tell me where the line up near the Marriott Grand is, I hope to be free on saturday evening......so I'll may have to report (hopefully)

[CA Traveler]

rm... very good points but, unfortunately, besides being a hassle to travel several hours outside of the city to be transformed into a/THE "white god", the amenities, other than young devushkas, are scarce and you'd better be mentally and physically prepared for travel in a "third-world" area. Also, if you are not at least competent with the language, it will be difficult to communicate.

So, at the risk of being a broken record, the closest thing you can find to being with a girl from 3-10 hours away from Moscow is a "novi" girl from outside Moscow at a tochka.

Now regarding the availability of freebies in Moscow... there is no question that the opportunities are rampant. Here is a cut/paste from a recent letter from a married 27 y.o. that I've been communicating with.

Hello,
It's good. I'm tired from russian man. Russian man is a mistake of nature.
Travel outside of Russia is a problem, becous I am a student and I need go to Institute evry day. And I'll have problem to explain my hasband this voyage.
Alena

In fact, I think the biggest untapped market in Russia is the 25-31 y.o. market. Be cautious though, the Russian woman ages in "dog years", so you have to be careful as the age creeps up, but there is virtually NO competition in this age group.

There must be millions of 25-31 y.o. girls that are unmarried with one child. Every single one of these women are no longer dreaming of a young, handsome millionaire sweeping them off their feet and living happily ever after. At this point, they are just realistically looking for satisfaction and if it developes into something else... OK!

While they may have been swept off their feet when they were 18 or 19 by a 35 y.o. millionaire, by the time they get to be 24, this Russki stud is looking to upgrade with another 18/19 y.o.
which leaves a prime opportunity for the horndogs among us.

doc... Very good advice... except that I would add that it's not just the 30-40 y.o. men, since it is not unusual at all to see a 18-22 y.o. girl with a 40-50+ man. Thank goodness!

nc... get thee to Russia! You won't regret it.

[No_Commit]

I am not a Moscow regular but this thread is one of my favorites.

Doc is absolutely right by saying "Russian women are also extremely skilled at manipulating men and some will definitely be in it for the "big score", so if you are not careful, getting out of the relationship will be a lot more difficult than getting in was..."

I was with this Russian chick years ago and before I knew it we were married (we still are). I still don't know what possessed me.

NC

[Doctor_Skank]

KiwiG,

Besides the p4p market which is well-documented here thanks to all the guys who post, there is of course the so-called "freebie" market which is equally rewarding and interesting. I love this about Moscow...and love the p4p option when I either don't have time or am not willing to make the effort in pursuing a girl in the "traditional" way...

If you've got time and the inclination there are a number of approaches to getting freebie girls, ranging from the dating sites and forums to the normal methods you'd use in any other place.

I've tried all sorts of approaches and find Moscow to be easier than other places in Europe or America, although I definitely agree with RM that it isn't automatic and Moscow in particular is getting more difficult, especially the top quality dyevs have really high expectations from a guy.... the days where just being a westerner in Moscow ensured you of model quality babes are long over... at least they haven't been falling into my lap. Like RM, I think for this you'll have to go to other cities, or other Eastern Block countries. Model level girls in Moscow will go to the top clubs and one look at the parking lot will tell you what kind of guys are in there. I've been in those places and it is impressive, but for me it wasn't worth the effort involved. Or maybe I am too lazy.

Nonetheless, the overall quality of women in Moscow is really high and the city itself is huge, with the vast quantities of girls in the 6-8 category (on the Russian scale) being quite accessible and worth the effort. Scoring on the first or second date is quite common. Actually my experiences in Russia have "trained" me to be a little bit more forward. Often I'll not have more than one evening to finish the job and so I'll make my approach fairly quickly. Most girls will give in and if you did it right, they'll be flat on their back wondering what happened before they have a chance to object. Once into it, they'll go all out to please you. Still, some girls have an insane "2nd date rule", but by the 2nd date you will most likely score... and if you don't score by the second date you might be in for a long campaign, which I suggest you call off unless you really think she is worth the effort. Why waste evenings on a girl who you'll likely dump at some point after screwing her a couple of times anyway when you can find another more willing candidate on every streetcorner?

Competition is "stiff" (no pun intended) for the 9-10 quality girls so you'll have to bring some good game to score there (if you've got that kind of game, more power to you) but in the 6-8 category you'll have remarkably little competition. There just aren't enough decent Russian guys to fill the demand, any Russian girl will tell you this. Nothing against Russian guys... the good-looking ones with a little money must be spoiled rotten.

For me at 33 years old one of the biggest advantages of Moscow and the Eastern Block in general is that girls in the 18-22 range really have no problem with dating guys on the other side of 30.

Another plus is that Russian women, contrary to what some guys have said, are very passionate, emotional and sexually skilled. Moreover, you can do pretty much whatever you want with them, they are very open to experimentation.

RM bings up a good point about trust and emotions. If you are just in it for the fun, be careful not to get too emotionally involved. This isn't always easy, as like girls all around the world, Russian girls fall in love too. And this can be dangerous, as Russian women are also extremely skilled at manipulating men and some will definitely be in it for the "big score", so if you are not careful, getting out of the relationship will be a lot more difficult than getting in was... beware their wrath if you [CodeWord140] them off, they are as emotional as Italian women. One ex-girlfriend even threw away her bed after we broke up. Another one threatened to use her dad's supposed FSB connections to put me in a world of hurt. I now try to keep the level of emotional involvement low... live and learn.

As for trust, there are of course all kinds of girls. The P4P girls all have their own agenda, so trusting them is a risk. Some freebie girls will also have alterior motives in being with you, but if you know this and play the game in the end you'll get laid, they'll have a good time and it is always your choice whether you want to see them again or not. I know some guys who use an alias, and if you are really just in it for the score, not letting them know too much about you might be the way to go. More often than not though, if you are picking up freebie girls in the end it'll be you breaking their trust and not the other way around. That's just the way it goes.

KiwiG:
If you are serious about going to Moscow on a freebie dyev hunt, if you'd like drop me a line at doctor_skank@hotmail.com and maybe I can help you out with some tips or point you in the right direction.

Cheers all and happy hunting!

[Roger Mellie]

KiwiG,

Moscow is a bit easier than Chicago or London, but not that much easier. There is a lot more money in Moscow than most westerners seem to understand. So being a westerner doesnt give them anything that a cute girl cant get easily in Moscow anyway. In fact, not only are plenty of young Russian guys loaded with cash, but unlike westerners, they dont hold back splashing it around.

Anywhere else other than Moscow or St Pete is a lot easier. Get 3 hours out of Moscow and you suddenly begin turning into a white god. If you are 10 hours or more train ride out of Moscow, you are THE white god in town and your foreign-ness is a total chick magnet.

Like the Doc, I spend a lot of my time in Moscow with girls I have previously bent over after meeting in bars. Despite the fact that they have boyfriends and sometimes husbands, they do like to get a good shafting and happily come and visit when you are around. Its not that difficult to end up in a position where you are juggling too many evening "commitments" each time you are in town.

Just make sure you:

(1) Never trust them, never believe them, never love them.
(2) Never buy the "I am a good girl, I don't do that on the first night" routine.

[CA Traveler]

T99... It seems to me that there have been postings about the marriage agency socials, which allow you to mingle with 200-300 single girls with only 25-30 men. You might try searching under "socials".

I've only been to one of the socials and it was in Spb, but it was interesting even though it was expensive. I did get laid, but it wasn't until I'd made some serious efforts at it.

At the same time, I've communicated with many girls on several different website looking for love and/or marriage. I've even gotten laid a few times, but it is very time consuming and you've got to be careful when you're writing several different Olgas, Natashas, or Irinas because it is very embarassing to get them confused.

One thing about Russia... there is no limit to the possibilities and options when it comes to women in all forms.

Good luck.

[Lose it Here]

Traveler0099,

I posted a report in Kiev this week about my experience with some of the dating services. I had a lot of success with them. I took me 2 days to get two of the girls in the sack. It took three days for another girl, and for another two girls I got action the same night. Obviously it was a little more difficult than selecting a girl from a tocha or from an escort service, but it was well worth the effort.

[Worldtrav0099]

Just an idle thought ...

Has anyone here ever joined one of the mail order bride sites, set up some dates, and then gotten any serious poontang upon arrival in Russia?

Seems like those sites have lots of babes and they all can't be just looking for a husband. Gotta be a few amateurs or semi-pros looking for a hook-up.

Comments?

[Doctor_Skank]

Ca_T:

Good to hear from you.

Will do, I got your number. I will be in Moscow the last week of October and again in mid-November. I am usually tied up during the week with GFs and work, but I always keep one evening free for carousing and mongering... Moscow wouldn't be the same for me without the lure of "the strange"...

Swiss Guy:

Glad to hear you're considering a Moscow winter adventure. Between all the mongering, don't forget to check out the city. Careful though, you could very well become addicted to Moscow...

Will be in Moscow in December as well, not sure on dates yet. Before you leave be sure to post your contact info, maybe we'll be able to hook up for that beer...

[CA Traveler]

doc... This trip, I arrive on Oct 24th and leave on November 8. At this point, in December, I arrive on the 2nd and depart on the 15th, but that could change slightly.

Let me know if you'll be around.

[Swissman]

CA and DS,

Thang you for your information. I guess i will do this adventure :-)
If somebody are also so crazy to go in Dezember to Moscow, please tell me. I like to hook up for a beer. I will proerly staying in one of the Marriott Hotels.

Take care
Swissman

[Eddie123]

Hello everyone,

I will be leaving to Moscow on Thursday the 23rd of October (one week). Unfortunately, I will only be able to be there for 4 days. I changed my hotel to the Marriott Grand. I have heard you all mention that there is line-ups close to this hotel. Could you all please fill me up on this? Also, what are the locations of the best line-ups to find the best girls.

I would sincerely appreciate anyone's reply to this since I am leaving soon and need all the information that I can get.

Eddie123