2005 Moscow Reports

[One O Nine]

As a semi-follow-up to Dealdo's post, what are the options generally for the top grade girls in Moscow? I know you can occasionally come across a real knock-out at NF, and there are plenty at some strip clubs. But I was hoping for some place where you could get them more consistently than NF, and for a more meaningful encounter than what you can usually get with a stripper.

I remember seeing some site some time ago which claimed to be an agency offering actual models and had a bunch of photos including some professional and runway shots, with the girls priced at a grand and more. Anybody know what it was, and if there are any other options? I'm going to Moscow again soon, and the thought of spending a slow weekday night at CF / NF is becoming a little depressing.

[NY Monger]

I wanted to throw in a word of caution here as well. Because Russia had, or has, a multitude of agencies/dep'ts that provide some sort of law enforcement/security/intel apparatus, it is difficult to truly understand to a foreigner how deep you may be in trouble.

Also, and this was several years ago, a guy who used to work for one of these semi-police type groups called, I think, Petrovka, told me they would go into foreigners places and leave some coke/heroin or some white powder and then when you're there enter and arresst you. No matter how caring your embassy is, once they're told illegal drugs are involved they dont jump in with 2 feet to free you. Be very careful about who is in your place or if things dont look right when you return.

I'm wondering as well, is the police activity/violence y'all are seeing mostly against westerners or can you say more prevalent versus Americans than say germans?

[Dealdo]

I don't know if people knows, I was curious, most of us start looking for dyevs in the internet right?

Well, I had some girls selected in my "must to see" list unfortunately nobody help me to confirm the authenticity of these sites.. So I got to Moscow blind as a bat..
I found that many of the agencies that post in this site http://ww30.prastitutki.ru/index2_en.htm are fake pictures.. you guys can find a LOT of pornostars almost all the girls advertising services for 150 Dlls per hour are not real.. I visited a couple privs in downtown and the reality was completely opposite. or anybody can tell me what of these "playmates" are really working in Moscow?? what about this one? http://ww30.prastitutki.ru/show_anke..._gr_id-645.htm

It is really a place you can pick this kind of girls for those prices?

Thanks to all

And please don't spoil this kind of scammers.. if the supermodel doesn't work there, don't pay those prices, because they keep tricking us out, it's so frustrating go so horny expecting to score whit Britney Sky and find out Rosy O'Donell instead. =(

Good happy hunting

DeAldo

[Peter The Great I]

Doc,

Thanks for the nice words. I agree with you hat you might run somewhat easier into trouble in Russia than in most other cities. And my phone was almost stolen, that’s true. Being prepared usually decreases the potential damage. On the other hand, the longer you stay in Russia, the higher the probability that you will run into something. Compared to that it underlines your veteran status because so little happened to you for this extended period while other people can run into trouble already from the very first day they arrive.

I only want to say: Russia is a different country. I had the feeling when I was walking through the streets that my senses were sharper, prepared for anything that might pop up unexpectedly. I guess you know the feeling. You seem to live more intense in Russia. The next time I will be in Russia for an extended period. A few things are sure: 1) I will fuck dyevs, 2) something will happen, whatever it will be.

PtG.

[Stravinsky]

Doc,

I didn't mean to say that the girls downtown are less honest, just that the convenience of the central clubs will cost you. Just like the convenience of picking up girls in McDonalds will cost you.

I would think it a little odd to be approached by a beautiful young Russki dyev while eating at McDonalds, particularly a complete stranger who is hot to get into my pants and my apartment. But then, again, I think it's a little strange to be eating at McDonalds in the first place. Who knows, maybe this guy looks like Alain Delon and gets hit on all the time by young women. It would definately set off an alarm bell for me! The scary part is... I'm not sure it would be loud enough to save me. After all, there's no fool like a middle-aged fool.

I think we all understand the kinds of dangers that any traveler might encounter in a large city, particularly when you're running around until all hours of the morning. What is particularly disturbing about the story of the Italian guy is that this was not a crime of opportunity. The Italian was specifically targeted. They knew who he was, where he lived and enough of his habits to know that he could be approached at McDonalds. The girl was sent in specifically for the purpose of enticing him back to his apartment, where her friends were waiting for him. In fact, it's clear that he was targeted because he was staying in an apartment. As many of us do.

So now we have to raise the bar a little higher when it comes to vigilence. Not only do we have to be concerned about our immediate surroundings, but we have to think about the unknown stranger may have been following us around since we arrived in town. And that sweet young thing tickling our ego may not necessarily believe that we are the suave, intelligent, witty, bon-vivant that we like to think we are.

Bummer.

But don't let this stop you, Born Loser. Beauty is dangerous, that's what makes it so exciting. To be forewarned is to be forearmed.

Lukasek, what happened to you is not all that unusual. In the old Soviet era apartment buildings, where the same families have been living next to each other for decades, it's not unusual for the neighbors to have keys to each other's apartments.

One would hope, however, that when an apartment rental agency takes on the responsiblity of letting out an apartment on a regular basis that one of the first things they would do is change the locks!

счастливо,

Stravinsky

[Starchild2012]

How I Wish the Power of Just being good prevails, Why can't it just be ABCD, Why just so much complexities in just being good and doing good.

I'm not a white guy, I'm asian and I have saved my penny's to make sure that i would go to russia, The land of endless beauty and get my share of dreams.

I'm following the events closely from last three months and my preparations for going to moscow are well over 1 year now.

I observed that in past couple of months, the violance has gone up considerably, one asian guy was whacked near the airport for no reason, just for few dollars the poor guy got axed. The authorities are still investigating, they blame the skin-heads are to be blamed.

And now after reading recent post's, shall I put up my dreams of going to russia, i'm not white, I wouldn't be able to gel in quite easily, I would be an easy target to the skin - heads, militia, every crook in moscow street and top of it, i may be charged a bit more than usual for the services.

In Short if you think, its dangerous for you to go in, then just multiply 10 times to think about non-whites state of mind of going into moscow in these times.

Ha, like ally mc'beal's john would say, let me say that again ""HA""....Who cares !!

Lets just go in Tons to moscow now. This is the right time for us to show in the power of just being good. Do not give in to the power of evil and bad.

Let BE the truth and good times prevail...practically

Just becasue evil happens to be strong this time, I'm not going to stay behind and wait for the good times to come.

I think if violence against tourist continues, the authorities will be pressurised to make some law to protect the tourist, the western media will take notice and inturn the respective givernments will issue travel warning not to travel to russia, which putin won't allow as it would be a major embarassment to the government in line they would be like Iraq, Afganistan et all..

So folks, Tour in to moscow, www.znakomstva.nu , How can I stop myself if I visited this site.

[Roger Mellie]

Re: your apartment agent "friend"

Funny thing is, she sent me basically the same email, with one difference ... she didnt include this line:

"Promice me that you 'll behave yourself here, in Moscow"

I can only assume she had specific reasons she wanted YOU to promise to behave yourself. What might they be? ;-)

[Doctor_Skank]

PtGI:

First of all thanks for your St.Pete reports, they're really great.

Safety in Moscow:

I agree with you in principal that Moscow isnt really more dangerous than other large cities, however the stories of what has happened and can happen are relevant and interesting.

* I WAS drugged at CF, one of the most popular expat hangouts in Moscow.

* Lukasek's apartment WAS broken into while he was out on the town.

* The Italian guy I mentioned WAS beaten and robbed for doing something we all like to do... meet Russian girls and take them back to the apartment for a cup of tea and a poke.

* The militia in Moscow DOES specifically target mongers.

I am sure there are other WSG memebers who have had similar things happen to them, stolen cameras etc... like almost happened to you in St.Pete.

These stories arent intended to scare anyone away or make anyone paranoid. As you know I have always encouraged people to go out in the "wild" away from the normal expat hangouts and explore.

These stories are intended to keep people vigilant and know what dangers are out there so that they can do their best to avoid falling into the same traps. And these stories are to help we mongers prepare for our Alaskan Grizzly hunting trip. Furthermore, neither I, nor Lukasek, nor the Italian guy were behaving in a particularly reckless manner. What happened to us could very easily happen to anyone else. So lets learn from this.

[Eros74]

Hi fellow members, I want to put my one euro here and tell you my experience in Piter last september; Doc I don't remember if I told you about this or not.

I had an apartment and I usually every day left it about early in the afternoon and come back about evening, one day I come back after few hours cause I was tired and I wanted to sleep more, so I comeback, I put the key inside the door and I found the door is not blocked, it was open, I opened the door and I found inside my flat one old woman about 60-70 years and one very young girls about 20 y.o..

You can easily imagine how I was suprised to find two foreign persons inside my flat! Immediately the young girl started to speak italian to me, she knows I am..., and told me that she stayed in my flat with her italian boyfriend and forget her cell phone and immediately she and old woman that she told me was the owner of the flat, left the flat. They didn't find the cell phone and they apologize that use the key of old woman, owner, to get into my flat.

I was so surprised that I was without words!

The "strange" thing was that it was my 5th or 6th day, so I am sure that they were inside my flat not to search cell phone..

I only can imagine what happened if I didn't come back early that day...

And the city was Piter and not Moscow..

I guess how can be the situation in Siberia where surely much less foreign turist and many women looking for foreign person-husband..
I think that may be in Siberia not so dangerous as in the two biggest cities but it is only my idea, what about your idea about Siberia?

Doc I miss, and surely not only me.., your foto.

Dear members I wish You all happy hunting in gold land Russia.

[Doctor_Skank]

strav,

i wouldnt really agree that girls in the expensive central clubs are inherently less honest than those outside the ring, they are just more spoiled and better at playing with men. cant really blame them. the good looking ones get a lot of attention. that $400 cell phone your sexy unemployed 20-year old girlfriend has? she didn’t get it from her grandmother. besides that, most girls in central clubs dont actually live in the center, but just as far outside of it as anyone else.

still i think central club girls are the best targets simply because they are so often great looking and if you can get past 1st base it isn’t far to home plate. incidentally i also find that if i am not getting anywhere with a particular girl it is better to give up and move on than keep whipping a dead horse. this goes for club action as well as date action. if it isnt going well it is probably not going to spontaneously heat up. the great thing about moscow is that there are always plenty more fish in the sea.

those girls in clubs outside the ring can be equally hot and are usually more impressed by your foreigner status and your presents, however their friends can be suspicious of foreigners. this is usually easily defused if you are a decent guy though. russians can be remarkably normal people.

i honestly havent been able to determine any increased frequency of scoring at the clubs outside the ring vs. those in town. like many i would logically conclude that going out beyond the garden ring and into “russia” (as opposed to central moscow which is an anamoly of its own fantastic kind) would yield some sort of latent wgf… however this hasn’t really been the case. i’ve scored often enough there… and also struck out rather unceremoniously… basically the same as i do in the center. sometimes i meet with “wow! you are an american.” and just as often with “you are an american, who gives a fuck.” even more often your foreigner status is just a curiousity and the real challenge lies in utilizing your communication skills/charm. in the end it is the same story. if you can get into a conversation that lasts more than 5 minutes and tweak her interest your chances are good.

one problem i often have is that my excursions outside the ring are usually solo endeavours... and a lone 30+ foreigner outside the ring hitting on 18 yr old dyevs may yield good results occasionally, but it can also viewed be viewed as predatory by the locals, so one has to be a bit careful. and striking out once or twice when alone can defuse your mojo. striking out when with mates is usually laughed off quite easily and considered part of the sport. adding a wingmen completely changes the situation and you go from desperate predator to jovial international playboy on holiday.

as far as meeting strange girls, meeting a girl at mcdonalds is also absolutely legitimate in my book... there is no sop on where to meet a girl and i think our unfortunate italian friend (cant blame the poor guy for wanting to get laid) had rather bad luck and probably did a poor job of judging his target. i'd be suspicious of any perfect stranger ultra anxious to meet me despite a lack of common language etc. honestly speaking though, i doubt that would keep me from trying to get in her pants. same thing could have happened to any of us. these recent events have certainly increased my wariness, even if they wont affect my libido.

militia:
militia dont specifically target people leaving nf (night flight) as the clientele there is likely registered in hotels and the girls almost always have their docs. besides that, stopping people on tverskaya is impractical for them. the majority of their stops when targeting mongerers are on the ring roads or on the main thoroughfares such as leninsky and leningradsky prospekt. and yes, they do specifically target us, mongers holding foreign passports.

which brings us to cf (chesterfields/boarhouse), which is conveniently on the ring road. lately the militia has been staking out that place and stopping people a kilometer or two down the road after they leave it. i experienced this twice in two trips to cf during my last weekend in moscow at the beginning of april. shos reported the same to me during his recent trips there.

always popular for stops are the tochka areas on leninsky, leningradsky and near the triple train station. i like to call bringing your tochka girl home unrep001hed "running the gauntlet".

if you are registered in a hotel you generally have no problems, however the militia will try to discover a problem. to avoid this i recommend bringing your hotel room pass with you. they often ask for it, hoping you dont have it. same goes for your boarding pass stub for those cases where your arrival to moscow was from another city such as st.pete. you have to prove when you arrived in moscow, not when you arrived in russia. i keep this stub with me, or train ticket or whatever. i havent personally experienced the departure ticket scam, but certainly a photocopy would suffice here. i wouldnt want to risk losing my return flight ticket.

none of their probing is legit, its all a scam. it is a good feeling to have all this documentation shit with you. you will likely defeat them. if in a hotel with registration stick to your guns, speak only english. they really have nothing.

if in a apartment, make sure you write the apartment address in the "host organization" block of your entry card. this gives you three days registration time instead of the one day limit for hotel guests. if stopped within those three days, stick to your guns and keep repeating “three days” etc. and they’ll likely give up. remain cordial, confident and calm. and speak english. i only resort to russian when the situation really looks bleak.

i haven't paid in any of my last 5 militia stops.

that said, i know people that have paid despite all their best efforts. if they really want to push the issue they will find a way to fuck you. sure if you call your embassy, lawyer etc. you will win. but who wants to go through that hassle, especially at 4am? if it is a payment situation i suggest solving it with a quick 300 rubles or a 500 ruble note. don’t show them much cash, they’ll get greedy. and don’t get in the car and let them drive you some place where they can put the heat on you. that will cost you $100. never happened to me, but i know plenty of guys that have had to pay in that situation.

usually of the group that stops you, there will be 1 guy in charge. this is not necessarily the one checking your docs initially. after the initial guy finds a problem, the boss will come over. i usually turn my back to the others and slip him some cash. that usually ends the situation immediately.

another method i use when the girl is taken to their police car is to have the taxi driver do the talking/bargaining. give him 700 rubles or so and he can usually bargain her free for this price and she will be let go. again, ymmv.

long story short, bring the following with you:

passport
arrival/departure card (with either hotel or apartment address entered as host org)
hotel pass (if staying in hotel)
boarding pass stub if arriving from another russian city
photocopy of departure flight (never experienced this personally)

hotel guests will get registered at the hotel and this will appear on your arrival/departure card, keep this with you.

apartment guests will have to get registered by the person who arranged their visa or by any of the other methods mentioned.

[Peter The Great I]

Pardon me for jumping into the discussion guys, but I think we are losing the focal point. Every now and then a story pops up about some guy being beaten up by locals. Let’s make the following comparison: I live in a big city, have never been into the wilderness and don’t even think about survival in nature. So when I would go hunting for grizzlies in Alaska on my own I would get into deep shit. I know that, and therefore I don’t. Some rangers told me that they deliberately wait for helping such blokes when they got into trouble just to teach them a lesson.

If someone wants to go hunting for dyevs in the wild, completely unprepared for the problems that he might run into, he deserves a lesson too. Guys like him should stay in the safety of a $$$ hotel, driven around on guided tours by Intourist, pay $$$ for hotel girls and only be allowed to walk on the Nevsky or Arbat between 11AM and 1PM. Everyone who read at least the threads of the last two years should be able of staying away of most kinds of trouble.

PtG.

[Stravinsky]

Doc,

You're right, he should have been very suspicious about meeting a dyev in McDonald's. Generally speaking, the more comfortable you feel, the more it will cost you. Watch out for the big nightclub downtown, where the girls have names like Barbi and Valerie, serves American whiskey amd everyone speaks some English. Give me the little club outside the Ring, where they only serve vodka and Baltika and I can while away the night with Ksiusha, Tanyshka and Svetochka.

I'm sure the Militsia targets Night Flight specifically because they know it has a high percentage of foreign tourists.

Which prompts me to ask... can you or CAT, or anyone-else-who-might-know, give us a definitive statement on just exactly what kind of credentials we need to take with us when we go out, particularly if we're headed out for a long night/morning on the town. Obviously you need your passport and registration. But I seem to recall there has been some mention that the Militsia also want to see your plane ticket? To show that you will be leaving the country. Is that true?. Is there anything else we need? Is it acceptable to carry photocopies of these documents?

Just exactly how do you know when to "stick to your guns" and when to pay up.

Stravinsky

[Doctor_Skank]

Strav and Dealdo:

Thanks for your comments.

It is hard to say if Moscow is getting more dangerous... actually I doubt that it is. The 90's were exceedingly violent in Moscow. However it does seem that tourists and businessmen are being more overtly targeted for scams and crimes.

Perhaps as more tourists and businessmen come to Moscow and as the gap between super rich and poor in Moscow shows no signs of closing, the temptation to target well-fed foreigners has increased.

Moscow is not only expensive for Westerners who frequent luxury restaurants, clubs and hotels, but also daily life in Moscow is expensive for average Moscuvites as well. The jealousy and desperation of those trying to get ahead in society who dont have a legitimate means of doing so is high.

I have been lucky I suppose, dozens of girls have stayed in my apartments and only rarely have I taken all the proper safety measures, such as locking the door from the inside and hiding the key. With pros I am more cautious of course, but with non-pros I treat them with a great degree of trust. I've never been stolen from and the girls have had plenty of opportunities. My naivety has served me well so far.

Curiously enough, I trust St.Pete girls far less than Moscow ones. Especially St.Pete pros seem a bit shady.

The militia problem also seems to be worsening. On two separate recent nightly excursions together with Shos we were stopped after leaving CF. Both times we didnt have girls with us, but we still had to go through the annoying registration routine. Both times we got off without bribing them, we stuck to our guns and refrained from speaking Russian...which we are both capable of. On both occassions they left disappointed and a little disgusted with us... we were happy to send the bastards home without their lunch money. Had we had girls with us I am sure that we would have had to pay something or at least have had a more intense "discussion".

In any case, be vigilant.

P.S. The "kidnapped" guy was a 40-yr old Italian and met the chick near the Pushkinskaya McDonalds (an Italian should have known better than to trust a girl that goes to McDonalds!)... really quite a miracle that he survived. He was bound and gagged and left in the apartment, which was locked from the outside. The thugs had taken all his money and phones and taken the phone cord for the apartment phone. So after he somehow freed himself from his binds, he then had to contact someone. Russian walls in old buildings are very thick, as are the doors. No chance of breaking this. By some miracle he found a second telephone cord and remembered the number of the agent. Movie-quality stuff. What a nightmare. I hope that the chick was at least cute and that he got her phone number to arrange a second date. The first one went kind of sour.

[Dealdo]

Dr Skank, Stravinsky,

You are right. Moscow is getting more dangerous now. And we all are target from people looking for your wallet.

If you go to the metro you will see suspicious guys stalking on you especially if you bring out your metro map to find your destination.

Militia asked me 500 rbls because my registration wasn't correct, (supposedly), (but the taxi cab was full of drunk dyevushkas and making too much noise) Another time militia asked me for 1000 rbls because I pick a toshka girl in Leningransky (I know what is a toshka now! is correct toshka? ) and the girl didn't have her ID.

Also in one of my friends apartment somebody stole my camera and my MP3 player. (But that night I left my stuff there and I didn't come back because I met a girl in a dance club and she took me to her apartment). so anything can happen to anyone if you're gonna look for fun.

But I can't say that Moscow is the most dangerous cities of the world. Mexico City and Caracas Venezuela are way more "peligrosas".

I know if I where just a "day time Tourist" the possibilities of being robed would decrease more than 70%. That's the price of the fun, too bad =(.

Ca-T,

What a bad luck in Buenos Aires for you, but well, the "asados" made of pork and beef are a big temptation in Argentina you just can't control the appetite. I will be very careful and will pass on pork meat, but most of the meat I'll eat will be "gatita" meat; ) as a buffet. =) I hope.

[Stravinsky]

Something to always remember when you are travelling anywhere in eastern Europe, not just Russia or Moscow, is that any Westerner will stick out like a sore thumb.

There is a common understanding among people in eastern Europe that foreign tourists carry lots of valuables, particularly cash. This may not actually be the case so much any more, what with banks, credit cards and ATM's much more accessable nowadays; nonetheless, the thinking among the locals remains the same.

So basically, you are a target.

If you're staying in one of the big international hotels, then you will be protected by their security, at least while you are in the hotel. That has it's good points and bad.

Apartment dwellers in particular should be aware that if you are staying in an apartment that is rented on a regular basis, then by definition, everyone in the building will know that you are a foreign tourist, and all that implies. This is not to say that you shouldn't stay in an apartment, simply to remind that if you do, then the burden of security falls completely on you.

Remember, even in an immense city like Moscow, it is impossible for a Westerner to be inconspicuous. Someone will always have their eye on you, and their intentions cannot be known.

So let your big head do the thinking.

счастливо,

Stravinsky