Bangkok Reports

[Lefeu]

The comments here about the lateness of Brazilian or Colombian women seem acutely out of touch with and ignorant of Latino / Mexican / Central American / South American / Hispanic Caribbean culture...

Sorry, I don't feel I am out of touch and / or ignorant of the Latin culture. I have taken 20+ trips to Latin America (mostly Colombia, Brazil, and Mexico), some of those trips for work. I also speak decent Spanish and semi-decent Portuguese.

There is no excuse for being late. That is simply inconsiderate, because we often don't have much free time and we would rather be doing something else, than waiting for someone to show up. They don't consider their time important, but we do.

[EihTooms]

If more guys were prepared to cancel dates where girls are late by 30 minutes or more (without a genuine excuse or having informed you of a delay) they would very quickly learn that expat guys (foreigners) will not accept such BS. Allowing them to get away with being late just reinforces the behavior. You might miss out on some "hotties" but there are always back-ups available.

Ah, but you see how brilliant they are about it? They DO have a genuine excuse and ARE informing us they are "on the way". LOL. And I suspect they actually believe it in their heart, too. When I have called them on it and just walked, they behave like my reaction is the meanest, most heartless they have ever known. LOL. Poor babies.

Actually, there is a fun way to play the Late bit with the dating site girls. And since it almost always happens that they are late, I apply it almost every time. Her message - "Sorry, I am late". My reply message - "No problem. Your punishment for being late is I make you do terrible things to my body." Big laugh from her. Helps her to relax. Also, it reconfirms the purpose of this date in the first place. And I really do mean what I said as well. So when it begins to happen later in the evening, she is fully prepared and would not have come to "see my apartment" without having been forewarned.

[Red Kilt]

I also have a friend in the north who does professional training. People are typically 15-30 minutes late for training sessions. She is constantly frustrated by it, but says it is part of Thai culture and she can't change it.

You CAN change it if you're persistent and your training sessions extend over a few days, You can also build in sanctions for those who are late.

As a professional trainer myself, I start on the scheduled time and it's too bad if people are late. They don't get hand-outs etc until after the session is over and I don't recap anything that they missed.

I now have a "reputation" for starting on time, and when participants know I am presenting it is amazing how punctual they can be. It works in both Thailand and Philippines, two places where time is traditionally treated in an off-hand way.

If more guys were prepared to cancel dates where girls are late by 30 minutes or more (without a genuine excuse or having informed you of a delay) they would very quickly learn that expat guys (foreigners) will not accept such BS. Allowing them to get away with being late just reinforces the behavior. You might miss out on some "hotties" but there are always back-ups available.

[EihTooms]

In some established KTVs in other countries, "Pay Upfront" comes with service level guarantee. The girl won't denied services agreed upon, won't leave early without the customer's permission, some just absolutely won't leave before time is up. The girl will be panelized by suspension if the customer complains or some times the customer will get partial refund.

Hard to imagine such a venue existing in Thailand. Some guys liken a "Pay Upfront" P4P deal as similar in some way to paying upfront for your McDonald's Big Mac Combo Set; you pay the money up front and they hand you the tray of food as stated, no wild downside variations, no unpleasant surprises in virtually any McDs at any time of day or night. lol.

When a bar or shop in Thailand guarantees or money will be fully refunded that their girls will deliver as promised in the bar with no unpleasant surprises and there is a long term pattern of success to back it up, no dead rat under that bun instead of grilled beef so to speak, then and only then will I be ok with "Pay Upfront" in Thailand. Or in the Philippines for that matter. Which means I will never be ok with it really.

[DonkeyLeg]

Thailand or the Philippines to get away from dreary English winters? The land of smiles win outs. Got myself a great crib in Lang Suan close enough to the action and with great food choices.

On Lang Suan itself my favorites are Smoking Pug a great Yankee style smokehouse with Cajun style rib racks to die for and Ninth Café for my Tom Yum and Somtam. The best of all though is the open kitchen eating emporium attached to Tops supermarket at Central Chitlom. It's amazing, sitting at the same table you can have a bowl of noodles costing 70 baht or 200 grams of caviar costing 38000 baht. You can order from an extensive menu or shop at the supermarkets butchers department for your prime cut then have them prepare it as you desire for an extra 160 baht which includes a side dish, the mashed potatoes are good. Buy a bottle of wine (the white is perfectly chilled) from their excellent selection in the wine department and have it served without a corkage charge. Great sushi and oysters from everywhere on earth. Also on Lang Suan Muse hotel has a good Italian and staying with the same cuisine a little further along there's limoncello on 11 great Parma ham pizza and Rossano's on 21, Friday or Saturday is best there, you get the tenors and soprano's doing their thing.

I am not great at remembering names or even places but for what it's worth here's a rundown on what else I've come across. Closest to me is LE glamour massage beside Chit Lom BTS. Not a great selection but facilities are brand new and the girls try really hard to give you a good time. Candy was my choice there. Heading towards Sukhumvit there are a number of very basic massage shops on the left side of soi 1. I wander by every so often, the girls sit outside and I have found some good choices here but they come and they go so it's very hit and miss.

I like Hillary 2 and 4 on Nana and have made friends with some expats who are regulars. Its interesting hearing their perspective on living here. Hillary 4 has some rocking music in the evenings. These and the beer garden on 7 provide opportunities to meet girls / women all day all night long. Mostly older but I sometimes like some MILF action. For no hanky panky massage its Tarntip on 7/1. On to 19 to Mai Chan. I have found this to be where I end up most often. It's a Japanese (but all are welcome) themed massage joint with lots of nice service touches, cold towel while choosing from the lineup, choice of drinks, helping you undress, showering you before and after and then helping you dress. The staff are mostly young and cute, Hana and Mo are my favorites.

My head spins when I wander around Phrom Phong, so many choices how does a fellow decide which door to go in, which girl to choose. There is also a small soi on 22, second on left past the Marriott with lots of choices. I must have been to at least a dozen places so far on soi's 22, 24, 26 and 33 but still a hundred yet to explore. In their own way they are all different yet somehow they are all the same. I've learned Its not the place its the girl.

And now for something completely different. On On Nut soi 32 (I know sounds funny) there are two shops side by side on the left hand side which offer what is known as Jabkasai massage. Only one girl works in each. It's a cross between a therapeutic treatment and a good old fashioned hand job. It's not for everybody as massaging the prostrate is a big part of what happens and while it's an asexual experience there is no touching at least for me the slow build orgasm is really intense. Not something I would do everyday just once in a while.

I appreciate my writing style lacks flair so I think this may be enough for my second contribution to the forum.

P.S. Absolutely love it here.

[WindAngel]

In terms of "rip off" possibilities, I will further submit there are many more well-intentioned and otherwise generous customers who get ripped off by lousy providers than wonderful or even merely decent providers who get ripped off by customers who mysteriously decide this is the kind of girl they want to deny the 2000-3000 payment for good service that was indeed provided. And, imo, it is the former situation pattern that causes a girl or the venue to realize they'd better institute a "Pay Upfront" system rather than rely on getting paid the agreed upon rate afterwards, not the latter situation pattern of encountering customers who were well treated by the girl but chose to rip her off on the payment.

In some established KTVs in other countries, "Pay Upfront" comes with service level guarantee. The girl won't denied services agreed upon, won't leave early without the customer's permission, some just absolutely won't leave before time is up. The girl will be panelized by suspension if the customer complains or some times the customer will get partial refund.

[EihTooms]

Payment up front for the girl is to protect them from being ripped off by their customer.

I would submit that it is not just that some girls are worried that they will be unlucky enough to hook up with a customer who will "rip them off" by not paying afterwards or by paying much less than expected. Of course, I am sure that must happen sometimes. But it is also the case that some girls are so often so god-awful at their job they experience a high percentage of customers who balk at paying them the fully agreed upon rate afterwards. Therefore, it is best FOR THEM to collect the money upfront, even better if a third party like the mamasan collects it and keeps it in hand for them at the bar or wherever.

In terms of "rip off" possibilities, I will further submit there are many more well-intentioned and otherwise generous customers who get ripped off by lousy providers than wonderful or even merely decent providers who get ripped off by customers who mysteriously decide this is the kind of girl they want to deny the 2000-3000 payment for good service that was indeed provided. And, imo, it is the former situation pattern that causes a girl or the venue to realize they'd better institute a "Pay Upfront" system rather than rely on getting paid the agreed upon rate afterwards, not the latter situation pattern of encountering customers who were well treated by the girl but chose to rip her off on the payment.

[EihTooms]

One good approach is to meet close to where you're staying and ask them to send you a message when they're almost there...

That is usually the best way, imo. Actually, it is common for the girl to start Line messaging you as they (presumably) are getting closer to the destination anyway, typically asking ME "Where are you now?" 2-3 times as their bts/mrt train or taxi is getting closer (preumably) to the meeting destination. God forbid they arrive an hour late and then have to wait so much as 10 minutes for the man.

After they arrive at the destination, if you happen to be in the toilet or on the other side of the mall strolling around, their "Where are you now?" messages will become more urgent by the minute. Again, this will be after they are already at least an hour later than the agreed upon time. BTW, in the case of dating site girls, count on the latest ones being the ones who insisted on their profile they don't want to meet anyone who "plays games" and impresses you with how much they "hate liars". LOL.

A critical point for anyone meeting a Thai girl away from their hotel or apartment; never, never, never choose or agree to a meeting place outdoors. You will either be sweating like a pig from the heat, drenched in rain or both by the time the girl arrives, if ever. Always set a destination inside an air-conditioned building with plenty of seating available, beverages, a decent toilet and good wifi. And the closer to a bts or mrt station, the better.

[HorseTrader]

I guess there have been girls only 20 to 30 mins late. Others usually over 1 hour late.

It's not just social events where Thai people are late, it extends into the professional world. My first trip to Thailand was a 48 hour whirlwind business trip with 4 separate meetings scheduled. If I remember correctly, each meeting started 30 to 60 minutes late. Thai lateness was a contributing factor to continuing business elsewhere.

I also have a friend in the north who does professional training. People are typically 15-30 minutes late for training sessions. She is constantly frustrated by it, but says it is part of Thai culture and she can't change it.

[Blanquiceleste]

I was at RB5 late last night and noticed a two different customers sitting next to me seem to pay the girl's fee up front at the bar. I am wondering what will happen if I refuse to do the same and insist on paying after.

These are exactly the kind of practices that mongers must unite against, instead of bickering about the prices we pay.

That said, I agree with BB, in some bars, if you are not a known customer or you look like a guy who will stiff the girl over her fee then you are out of luck. Pure perception and judgement at play here. Nothing you can do. One of the other reasons why you should not behave like a cheap charlie in the bar. Sure, you don't have to go overboard but it helps if you don't come across as a tightwad.

[TigressWanted]

Back in Bangkok this week, my second visit, was here 2 years ago. I'm staying near Soi Cowboy and checked out Baccara for the first time, I'm from the US. Clean place, good music, went upstairs, I am just average looking, late 50's, but got lots of attention from ladies, including 2 sisters, one is 20 and wanted me to take her for ST but I was too tired from my flight. The hottest females, one was just totally smoking hot, were hanging with younger Asian guys. Got to say though, watching the action on the dance floor, half the boob jobs are just gawd awful. Poorly designed and executed, LOL. Then last night, Monday, I walked into Shark after checking out Thermae (holy shit I was surprised how many ladies were there, completely packed at 8:30). Being completely objective, the quality at Shark was quite good. I saw 3 ladies there I would die for vs only 2 at Baccara, granted, I got to Baccara a bit later, so many of their best lookers had probably been booked. Interesting though, Shark was virtually empty. Is October generally slow? Maybe it's just Monday. I went home with a hostess that I had fucked my previous visit, a total sweetheart, older, natural tits, who is fun because she is extremely responsive to oral, and a massage expert to boot. When she initially saw me come in last night she ran up to me and gave me a big hug, that's a good feeling. I wonder how she would feel if I tried to bar-fine one of the hot dancers later this week though.

[Smoothy]

I was at RB5 late last night and noticed a two different customers sitting next to me seem to pay the girl's fee up front at the bar. I am wondering what will happen if I refuse to do the same and insist on paying after.

I often have the bars ask for this (especially when the girl speaks no English), and I always refuse and tell them I will give the girl the money in my hotel room after we are done. The mamasan always asks the girl if it's ok for me to pay her directly after we finish in my hotel, and every time the girl has said that it was ok. Not once have they not allowed the girl to go with me. I do normally buy a lot of drinks in the bar though, so I think the girls feel safer that they will receive their money considering I was willing to spend a lot on drinks already. If there ever comes a time when the girl refuses to go with me unless I pay up front to the mamasan first, I would refuse and go find a different girl in a different bar.

[Banana Boi]

I was at RB5 late last night and noticed a two different customers sitting next to me seem to pay the girl's fee up front at the bar. I am wondering what will happen if I refuse to do the same and insist on paying after.

If this is one of the rules of the gogo bar then you will be out of luck unless you are a known trusted customer. Payment up front for the girl is to protect them from being ripped off by their customer. No proof but I suspect some gogo bars also take a portion of the girl's ST or LT fee. You're always free to make arrangements with a girl to meet you on their days off. That's what I do so I save on the barfine.

[Catire]

The comments here about the lateness of Brazilian or Colombian women seem acutely out of touch with and ignorant of Latino / Mexican / Central American / South American / Hispanic Caribbean culture.

Times for social events / gatherings / meetings, etc in said cultures are merely very general approximations of the actual time anyone will physically appear.

For e. G. If a party is announced / starting t to begin at 8 pm, there will not be a single person there until 9 pm at the earliest.

Same things with a date unless you are attending something that requires being there at a specific timeframe (like a play, sold out movie, etc).

[Syzygies]

As for the vague "on the way" updates, I think if you call them, they're more likely to provide a bullshit answer (avoiding direct confrontation). If you send a "where are you?" Line message, they will either tell you, or delay replying. If they reply 10 min later, you should take a hint and leave.

One good approach is to meet close to where you're staying and ask them to send you a message when they're almost there...

In my experience, "where are you"? Is answered by "in taxi on the way? Where have you got to, can't be answered because actually still not in taxi. Can I talk to the taxi driver to see how far you have got to go, since you seem to have no clue where you are? Absolutely not!

I almost always ask them to send a message when very nearly there, but percentage that do it is low. Get message long before and maybe another when have already arrived.

I guess there have been girls only 20 to 30 mins late. Others usually over 1 hour late. Others, who knows if they ever would have arrived? One of them claimed to be sick while in taxi and went home, but I got no message at the time. Her migraine was too severe to notify me of non arrival. LOL Probably complete and total bullshit, but you never know for sure.

Fortunately not too many no shows. If an important girl is very late, better than nothing since best girls can disappear completely very easily.

I agree with Smoothy that older girls are a bit more reliable, but still can be extremely late. Like she was stuck on a phone call to her boyfriend. LOL