Bangkok Reports

[Wimble]

Good for you. Vote with your feet I say. Don't support a place that doesn't want your business or money.

I immediately stood up and said, "Oh, no problem. I'll go to another bar where they will serve me what I want," and began to walk out. That server clutched at my arm and practically begged me to please stop and come back. I didn't.

[Smoothy]

As I read Amnesia's post (and the reason I agreed with it), he was merely describing what I have seen and experienced in the Bangkok/Pattaya go-go bar scene for years. And those bars stay open, occasionally upgrade and expand so it must be a viable business model.

It's a successful business model due to the OTHER customers in the place who actually spend some money, not because of the guy milking one drink all night. I will use Long Gun as the example. That place has about 70 seats. If it was completely full of 70 guys who each ordered one drink then sat there all night milking that drink, the cash intake for the night would be 150 per drink times 70 = 10,500 baht. If the place was completely full of those 70 guys all month long, that would be 30 times 10500 = 315,000 baht money intake for the month.

The place has about 30 dancers working there. They get a salary of about 8000 baht each per month. 8000 x 30 = 240,000 baht.

The place has about 10 waitresses, bartenders and other staff. To be very very modest, let's say another 60,000 baht for the month.

Then they have to pay rent. Let's say about 200,000 baht per month.

I am sure that security and police bribes come into play as well.

I'm not even going to include the price of the drinks, electricity, etc because it's already obviously absurd to think that guys coming in and buying one drink is a good business model.

Not to mention that every dancer in the place would quit very soon since they were getting no drinks and no bar fines.

There's nothing wrong with sitting there and drinking one night all night on occasion, but to do it every time is not beneficial to the maintenance of the establishments in question.

[Wimble]

Hey Einsteins,

Oh I mean Smoothy. Forget about it.

I am just going to complain to management whenever I see someone man-handling a water bottle. Puts me off my game and barfining a girl. Especially if the culprits are south Asians.

Yes, for sure his model would be very successful. I am also looking forward to it.

Amny, please let us know the day it opens, because it's not likely to make it to the 2nd day, we wouldn't want to miss it.

[Nounce]

Water is not a good analogy. I suspect that bar makes more money selling water. It is not just about fixed cost as the other poster has mentioned it is high fixed cost. It is not that bar don't want one drink customer. The bar already make money on the drink you bought, they would prefer you to buy the next drink so they could make more money. There is a bar in Nana with post-ops that is known to kick out customer for not ordering more drinks.

[EihTooms]

Yes, for sure his model would be very successful. I am also looking forward to it.

Amny, please let us know the day it opens, because it's not likely to make it to the 2nd day, we wouldn't want to miss it.

As I read Amnesia's post (and the reason I agreed with it), he was merely describing what I have seen and experienced in the Bangkok/Pattaya go-go bar scene for years. And those bars stay open, occasionally upgrade and expand so it must be a viable business model. I honestly have never seen a go-go bar or a beer bar kick someone out because they ordered a water, soda water or coke instead of a beer or a cocktail or because they sat nursing one drink for at least an hour or so. I see plenty of customers sitting in those bars for a long time on one drink purchase and waving off pesky servers. I have never been asked to leave because I don't order a new drink every 20 minutes. I am not saying it has never happened to anyone. Just that it does not appear to be any bar's enforced policy.

I realize there are anecdotes about pesky servers who appear ready to lodge a complaint with the Board of Appropriate Customer Purchasing Habits any second if you don't finish that drink post haste and order another one in less than 20-30 minutes. Ignore them. I do. They are Thai people working in a bar. They aren't exactly brilliant to begin with and possibly they are half drunk to boot.

Mind you, I am not talking about a customer who sits for hours with one drink in front of him and never purchases anything else like food. And neither did Amnesia say such a thing in that post. As I have stated elsewhere, I think there is a built-in timeframe involving assessing two 20 minute dance sets and another 20-30 minutes for possible return arrivals from earlier barfines that can justify holding off with one drink purchase for as long as just over an hour until you know there is actually a good reason provided by that bar and its very own business environment to start buying multiple drinks and Lady Drinks for potential take-out girls.

Once I had a server laugh and say something like, "This is a bar where men drink alcohol, are you a lady?" when I ordered a water instead of booze as I sat down in their nearly empty go-go bar (I think it was Shark Go-Go Bar on Soi Cowboy). I immediately stood up and said, "Oh, no problem. I'll go to another bar where they will serve me what I want," and began to walk out. That server clutched at my arm and practically begged me to please stop and come back. I didn't.

I have indeed seen a couple of customers goaded by servers after noticing those guys have been sitting there for well over 2 hours on one drink. I was sitting and chatting with one such guy at Big Dog's Bar, an outdoor beer bar at the entrance to Nana Plaza. He had one beer bottle sitting in front of him when I arrived and that same beer bottle was there about 90 minutes later. Maybe he had been nursing that one drink for well over 2 hours. Yep, the server did say something to him about it and he reacted like he was insulted. Then he paid his bill, got up and left. I don't know what would have happened if he hadn't left and hadn't ordered another drink. Maybe some bouncers would have come over and tossed him out. But I have never personally seen such a thing happen.

Why do you think companies like Agoda, eatigo, or Groupon exist? Why do all those hotels and restaurants accept customers paying a fraction of the actual price? Why accept those Cheap Charlies rather than the big spenders?

So no, it's not bullshit. In fact you yourself are providing arguments that are supporting my statement: fixed costs.

1) User Smoothy says the bar is not making any money with a customer who's only drinking a water. That's wrong, and everyone who has basic math skills knows that. A water costs the bar maybe 5 Baht. They sell it for 120 Baht. Other than the cost of purchase, there are no variable cost I cause the bar. Maybe I use the restroom, so deduct 20 Baht for water and soap. That still leaves you a gross profit of 95 Baht, and a nice gross margin of almost 80%. The bar IS making money from me.

2) It's better to have an additional 95 Baht than an additional 0 Baht. It's not like there is a long line of high-spending customers waiting and I am taking their seat. All those bars always have excess capacity, even during peak hours and peak season. Leaving a seat empty rather than earning 95 THB with it would be nonsense. In fact, it's not only the 95 Baht additional profit you make. The more customers are inside, the more fun does the bar look like, so the more likely it will attract additional customers.

3) If the bar is not profitable, then it has to find ways to reduce its (fixed) costs and / or increase its revenues. Getting rid of small-ticket customers would be nonsense; you would not get more profitable but less. One way could be to turn low-spenders into more-spenders. You won't achieve that by trying to push them out of the bar. But if the girls are hot and nice, I am not constantly being pestered to buy every Tom, Dick and Harry a ladydrink, and the barfines and girl rates are reasonable, I am glad to stay and have many beers. Otherwise I will leave after having one water.

4) If all that does not work, maybe the whole market needs to consolidate (E. G. , taking out excess capacity from the market by merging bars), or the whole business model is not feasible.

[Amnesia]

Amny, please let us know the day it opens, because it's not likely to make it to the 2nd day, we wouldn't want to miss it.

It always amazes me how grown men start acting childish on discussion boards when they can't win an argument. Look, you don't have to feel bad for not having business acumen and basic math skills. I am sure there are some farm girls who will willingly nod to your barstool economics while you can work on your reputation to become the biggest spender in a Thai hooker bar. I would actually have a second water to watch you Einsteins talk shop.

[Smoothy]

Amnesia,

Best of luck on your crusade for a new business model. Follow your ideas. Sent me an invite to show off your successful establishment.

Yes, for sure his model would be very successful. I am also looking forward to it.

Amny, please let us know the day it opens, because it's not likely to make it to the 2nd day, we wouldn't want to miss it.

[TimTimGuy]

I still catch taxis from Arrival level at Suwanaphum.... so I watch for this very carefully these days. Once got stuck on freeway to Pattaya, which had no exit for a long distance, because taxi failed to take On Nut exit.

He's posting about catching a taxi from DMK to connect on a flight at BKK. You pulled the trigger (pounded the keys?) without reading the post.

(I normally wouldn't post a comment like this, but the ISG connection is giving me trouble and I'm sorting out what I can / cannot do with this internet). TTG.

[Syzygies]

4 - Quickly go take a coupon for public taxi, while waiting your number to be called you can buy food / drinks. Ask the taxi driver to take the express way.

I still catch taxis from Arrival level at Suwanaphum. No wait. No coupon fee. I select a taxi where the guy is sitting politely waiting in his taxi and only gets out at last minute to help with your luggage. Mostly these polite types will use the meter as a matter of course. No hassle type of guys.

Any guy that runs up to you too eagerly is to be avoided, IMHO. They will wait till have started to exit the airport and then ask for exhorbitant fee. I have had to exit taxis outside Don Meuang on occasion when selected the wrong one.

It is also important to tell the driver that we are not Thai. Getting to the destination at the cheapest possible price avoiding tolls, is not the objective at all. The objective is to get there as fast as possible. Paying tolls is no problem. Wise to check the best route with google Maps as well. It can detect unusual traffic jams, although it does sometimes underestimate the time needed to get there. Taxi drivers can sometimes choose an unfortunate route. Of course I am lucky to be able to speak Thai, and communicate details of desired route, or remind driver where the correct freeway exit is. Some drivers make bad mistakes, whether accidental or intentional. If driver goes wrong way, must have him stop the car until can calc new best route with Google Maps, to avoid getting into progressively worse traffic jams. I had one such incident on way to Suwanaphum, when driver exited freeway at Rama IX by wrong exit, into traffic jam at Ekkamai. I had to quickly calculate a back streets route to get back on motorway. Fortunately still made it to airport on time. Hard to understand driver making bad mistakes when signs show route to airport so clearly on expressways, even if he is not familiar.

I have now had quite a number of incidents where taxis failed to take my desired exit from freeways, so I watch for this very carefully these days. Once got stuck on freeway to Pattaya, which had no exit for a long distance, because taxi failed to take On Nut exit.

[Syzygies]

Speaking of bed restraints as well as spreader bars, ball gags and vibs. Where to buy?

Lingerie also. Helps to keep tired old John Thomas upright.

This stuff is probably illegal in Thailand. Buy in Germany or Scandinavia most likely. Even basic vibrators are not totally legal in Thailand I believe and you can't buy any quality ones here. They might sell cheap chinese crap stuff on the street.

[Nyezhov]

Speaking of bed restraints as well as spreader bars, ball gags and vibs. Where to buy?

Lingerie also. Helps to keep tired old John Thomas upright.

[MonkeyPaw]

Very well said. I am going to Vietnam but considering making a stopover in Bk after reading your post. The adventure around the mongering can be more exciting than the sex acts themselves! Would you be up for a drink around next Friday or Saturday?

I'll be back in BKK on the 2nd. Vietnam is very fun if you are able to hunt in the underground scene where the locals play. Not sure how brave you are, but it used to be my old stomping ground as well.

[MonkeyPaw]

I wonder what housekeeping says. They do gossip and keep logs (not the wooden types)

I tend to stay in condos off AirBnb, so there is no issue or extra charge for bringing back multiple girls back to the room. I've had many many threesomes, foursomes, and fivesomes this way. The only other way is to also stay in a 5 star like Radisson Blue, Westin, or Sheraton Grande where the don't really ask for ID who care about how many girls go up to the room. In the condos, I clean my own room everyday. When I do stay in hotels, I of course, hide all my play toys including restraints, before housekeeping comes in to clean my room.

[Amnesia]

4 - Quickly go take a coupon for public taxi, while waiting your number to be called you can buy food / drinks. Ask the taxi driver to take the express way.

5 - Most taxi drivers give you 2 options, I. Go with meter and pay the toll charges for the express way or II. Settle a fixed amount (around 700 baht) and everything is taken care by the driver. Choose the later option since with earlier option taxi drivers tend to go slow / wait so that meter adds wait time !

700 THB including tollway sounds way too expensive. The actual meter should be around 300-350 maybe, tollway must be 70 or so. Maximum 500 all-in, but I don't see how a fixed fee is saving you much time. The driver still has to stop at the toll booth to pay the toll.

In general, 3 hours for DMK-BKK is quite risky. Traffic in Bangkok is unpredictable. I advise people to take the Airport Link and BTS when they have that little time. Understand it might be inconvenient when you have a lot of luggage and / or just arrived after a long flight. But it's usually the safest option. (For the way from DMK to the next BTS Station take a cab or the airport shuttle that stops at the BTS stations).

For the taxi stand in DMK, keep in mind that the line can get quite long when many flights arrived.

As for Grab, I never really understood why anyone would need it in Bangkok. Most of the time it's easier and faster to flag a taxi on the street. During the times when you actually could need such service (I. E. Rush hour), they don't have a cab available. Quite often the driver can't find your place, takes hours to arrive, or decided he should grab some food first. The only two use cases are (1) girls taking a cab during the night, and (2) foreigners who cannot speak Thai.

[Wimble]

Correct. I am wasting my breath.

Err, what exactly are you talking about?.