Mombasa

[Willyboy]

Thanks for the explanation you give about your opinion on prostitution payment in kenya. I can not explain better in my cramped english. But this is what I've always wanted to write.

[Bareback Jack]

But I think a multiple of 5 or 10 times the average per capita income is not too shabby, no?

I saw your other post where you quoted statistics from sources like IMF, CIA Factbook etc. You seem to like those statistics a lot. I'm sure you are aware that a simple arithmetic average isn't a very representative measure. We could take a deeper dive into stochastic calculus but that would surely be beyond the scope of this topic. However, even in the US it's a pretty irrelevant number as it doesn't even account for regional differences.

Also, if I'm not mistaken, CIA for instances quotes GDP per capita at $48, 500 which should not be mistaken for income. If you were to arrive at average income numbers in Kenya, or anywhere in Africa for that matter, it would be mostly guess work. Many workers are in unofficial employment, without registration and tax payments and small businesses are allowed to pay a 2% turn over tax on what they file as turnover. KRA has not yet developed the capabilities of the IRS or HMRC for that matter.

If you have asked around, you will of course hear what people tell you they earn, but have you really ever seen a payslip here in Kenya? Most waiters will tell you they work for 6k, room maids for 7k, etc. If you speak or know senior management in hotels, they will tell you another, quite different story. The truth might be somewhere in between. Earnings for police officers have been published officially. Police and army are usually among the lowest earners in almost every country. If you take that for instance you get a much better idea of what the earnings at the lower bracket of unskilled workers are. The official figure of the government for a minimum wage employment for a house girl for instance is 7, 000.

We all know that these wages are too low to make a living. Police spice up their wages by open bribery and most employees have some kind of money generating mini business on the side. If you really care to take a look around you will get to understand real prices as well. The cheapest 1-bed home with electricity for example somewhere deep inside the non-tourist side of Mtwapa goes for about 4k per month, on the other side you will pay a minimum of 10k, hardly something someone could afford from a 5k / month income.

So, let's add together: 10k for a bedsit. 1k for electricity, another 6k to bring food on the table, clothes and hair salon (for women) add another 3k, so even the most cost conscious babe will need at least 20k a month to barely break even.

A while ago I spoke to one of those mzungu "Marondo". He lived here in Kenya off a 800€/month pension. He had a small flat for about 12k in Mtwapa. He said he found it hard to get around with the money. According to his own account he had to cut down on girls and would afford himself only 2-3 girls per week for short time (1k) , as otherwise he wouldn't be able to maintain himself, given the real cost of living.

If you believe that 5, 000 is the average income in Mombasa or Nairobi, you will also believe in Santa Claus. Do you really think the dramatic expansion of brands like Nakumatt, Tukys etc has been fuelled by tourists only? Far away from the truth.

Anyway, we can go on about this forever and end up with no conclusion at all

[Wenzman]

So, where exactly Mr. Wenzman has anyone said anything about "do-good"? No one here claims to have noble intentions as far as I can see. It is only that a few individuals like myself have voiced the opinion that prevailing market rate is nothing more but an orientation guideline. Treating everyone the same doesn't seem to be logical to me. A standard rate awards the same to a less attractive or overweight woman as to a very attractive woman in perfect shape. Proof that not all women fall into the second category can be seen plenty in the photo gallery.

For arguments sake, you might say that your gold member doesn't know the difference when it's inside the punany. Then, of course it would be money wasted. However, if the packaging is important, which after all is again a matter of personal preference, then it seems to be logical to award a better rate to an individual that offers the overall better package in the eyes of the client.

Welcome to kindergarten.

Incidentally, yesterday I have paid in a German FKK Club for 30 min full sex with a beautifull lady by your standards 50 €. Hopefully that was enough for you. Get a life and go *ucking

[Pete Benetar]

True, but why the comparison to average income? Where in this world would a prostitute work for average income and why should she?

First, I'm not referring to professionals. Second, the 5, 000 shilling number was based on ONE week and I did not seriously propose that as a sole source of income for an able bodied woman looking to support herself. If you include 4-5 weeks that would come out to over 20, 000 shilling per month so I am guessing that would still be much more than the AVERAGE kenyan earns.

Moreover if you go by what most, myself included, would consider fair based on present exchange rates and national income numbers providing 1000-2000 a day then you can multiply 1500 shilling by 6 day work weeks. If she "worked" full time at that rate, you are closer to 40, 000 shilling per month.

I doubt anyone in this thread who spent a week with a lovely and genuinely liked her would gift her with a scant 5000 shilling. So I am not in any way recommending 5000 shilling per month for a lovely woman working for average pay. But I think a multiple of 5 or 10 times the average per capita income is not too shabby, no?

[Woef Woef]

True, but why the comparison to average income? Where in this world would a prostitute work for average income and why should she?

A comparison towards the average income is a good comparison in my humble opinion. Imagine the average income of the average prostitute in a specific country to be much higher than the average income of a worker?

Normally this will lead to a dysfunctional society. Cause why should you work in a hotel for a month, if you can earn the same money by hanging around at bars and spreading your legs LT twice a month?

So one would assume that this would lead to a high (er) amount of prostitutes (be it pro, non-pro or however you categorize them). It's all supply-demand in the end in fact.

I don't know if demand is increasing in Kenya so for the hypothesis I will assume it stays equal. In that case if supply goes up, then normally prices should drop. However there is an alternative scenario in fact. It's also possible that the supply side will decide to work less per average worker but for the same price.

Let's compare the situation to brothels in red-light districts in Europe. I think in most West-European countries the rate a girl has to pay per shift of 12 hours is about 200 euro rent for the window. Let's say the average cost for a fuck is about 50 euro. This means that she will have to finish 4 customers a day to break-even.

The average working girl behind windows will make about 1500-2000 euro a month after rent of her working place and taxes. This is is higher than the average income but not much, so comparable.

As most of these girls are foreigners, why would they suffer this much only to make some more than the average income? Because they often send euro money home where the value of it in the destination country is much higher than at the source. And mostly the first years they have all-most nothing left in fact, as they need to pay of their pimps who brought them to Europe (cost about 25-50K euro) which equals about 1-2 years of work. After that they are break-even. That's also often the time when you see them stop working behind windows in fact, or working less, and start to live full-time on European social security benefits which is about 1000-1200 euro a month.

Now we are not talking about high-class prostitutes here. The same is the case in MBA, Mtwapa, etc. And we are talking in general. An individual can off course always be an exception, but that we can consider as statistical noise.

So the average windows prostitute in Europe makes max. 25% more than the average income for a lot of hard work. While the Mtwapa street prostitute can make much more than the average income while her working conditions are easier and she will have to do less fucks for more money in relative numbers.

The only conclusion from a socio-economical perspective is that prices are too high there which creates a high probability that the average kenyan young woman will prostitute herself.

I don't know where you live. But I assume it's a rich country towards Kenya. Now imagine from next month social security becomes less, unemployment increases and on top of that thousands of foreigners enter your country for sex holidays throwing a multitude of the average income to pussy. What do you think would be the probability that your young daughters are going to end up doing? Working in a hotel? Or spreading legs?

BTW this scenario was basically what happened in world war II at the top of the german power. It created thousands of white young prostitutes to german soldiers.

Customers who are consistently overpaying are a very important factor why prostitution keeps growing in Kenya. It's not the only factor off course, but it's a very important one. And it is one which we ourselves create.

That's why I agree with Willyboy, etc. In these conditions there is a lot of room for getting what you want at lower prices also. And mostly that will occur later in the night or with fixed contacts, when the heavy spenders are already sleeping like a bear after they spread their seeds.

[Bareback Jack]

And overall. 5,000 shilling is still not much less than a full months average Kenyan income

True, but why the comparison to average income? Where in this world would a prostitute work for average income and why should she?

[Cheupe]

Perhaps I make 300, 000 / month or 30, 000 or 3, 000, 000 shilling per month. If the women you associate with perceive westerners as uber wealthy and that they, the women, should be entitled to share the man's wealth, then you have a point. That's a self entitled philosophy I don't agree with, but if some guys want to pay 10, 000 shilling per night or whatever, good for them. I'm sure that will make your girls happy.

By the way. 5,000 shilling for a 7 day week is little more than 700 shilling per day. Significantly below what I have heard most anyone on the board suggest for a woman befriended. And overall. 5,000 shilling is still not much less than a full months average Kenyan income.

If you spot any guys paying out that rate, you can tell them I suggest a few more shilling, ok?

atPete;

When I brought up the Marondo thing, I was just trying to give the guys an "inside scoop" on the attitude that some of the Msa girls have towards a section of the "market"

"Self entitled philosophy" describes so well how most women I have met feel towards the men they associate with. I couldn't think of a better word to describe it. If we left it to the women, they would take the whole pay cheque even! I would not have put it any better.

It is because of this attitude that some of the women have assumed derogatory attitude towards those of us who they feel have more to share but opt to share less. But still,"the women I associate with" call us marondos because we are poor and can't afford for them what westerners can, ie good hotel accomodation, and a fat wad of cash. But when they refer to a mzungu as a marondo, it almost feels to me as if the mzungu / westerner allure is dying. I don't know how to put it, but it just doesn't feel right. It is almost as if they are saying they expect "bedbug bed" treatment from the mzungu. Westerners are on average much more prosperous than Kenyans. Kenyan girls expect more from them. It is only natural. I can't put a figure to it, because the women are so variable.

[Woef Woef]

Hello all,

It's already many months ago, nevertheless I would like to share my experiences from my second trip to Mtwapa.

On my first trip I tried to follow the advice of many frequent posters on this board, and I succeeded well and had a nice holiday. However I still felt being 'played' to a certain extent as I realized that these girls often made the same 'salary' in 1-2 nights than the average wage of a hard working kenyan in the hotel I was staying it. I could only come to one conclusion which was in fact already often suggested on this board: the majority of white men in Kenya are over-paying. Second, I feel the majority of white men think they are in control cause they have the money, which is mostly an illusion. For the most part, the african woman is largely in control on different levels. The only conclusion I could come to next, was that in fact the majority of these girls can afford to lose some time on you.

So before my second trip I gave myself a challenge. To get laid about once a day, without spending a single shilling directly on sex. Shillings were only allowed to be spend on drinks or meal for the girl and definitely not on presents or sex.

Next I thought about a strategy to apply, to maximum the girlfriend / sex experience on one hand, and to minimize the financial spending on the other hand. I approached it as a game to be played, an adventure in which my goal was to become the master deceiver. To play the game like the girls play it. To "fight" them with their own weapons: lies, deception and psychological warfare.

I created the following rules:

- Before you take a girl to your room or you go to her place, etc. Always ask her first if she is a malaya. And state that you dislike malaya's very much. Only go with her, if she says no. If you can get this in written form via sms it's even better. Remember it's all about psychology.

- Dream / Story-telling, pretend that you are searching for everlasting love but that you are very careful because you heard so many bad stories about african women. This will make her feel doubt and gamble: either invest her body / time in you without getting financial value, or a potential ticket to USA / Europe in long term, etc.

- Never never ask a girl for sex or start sex first. Even when laying in the same bed naked, make her start to approach you.

- Lie lie lie, excuses excuses excuses, create a story about yourself, what you do, your life etc. Which is not true, tell this story to every single girl. First, this will make it easier for you not to make mistakes and second the story will be consistent once the girls start talking to each-other.

- Create a network of girls. This can be done beforehand via the internet. The goal is not necessary to date them, but to use them as a buffer in case things go wrong. In other words, when a girl start to make trouble or do not want to leave. You can call another one to show up.

- If a girl makes trouble, use the strategy of passive resistance. Refuse to argue, hence even refuse to speak any longer with her, leave the place immediately of place of argue, etc. The only thing you will say once is 'I never pay for sex, and by the way prostitution is illegal according to Kenyan law'.

I've spend one week there:

- Girl 1: was a girl I spend several days with at her home on my first trip. She was a good lay so I thought it would be a good start. She picked me up in downtown Mtwapa and she wanted to spend the full week with me. As she gained too much pounds according to my preference, I banged her once, took a shower, watched some tv, etc. Then I told her that "the feelings I had to her" were apparently not the same anymore as last time, and I felt I had to leave. She was very surprised. Next she said she can't pay her electricity bill etc. So I left 500 shilling on the table, which should cover for the foods and drinks I took from her place. Case closed.

- Girl 2: Big Tree. She was young. 19 I think. Good Looking. Her friend asked if she could come to have a drink with me. I said I was not interested. Was reading a book. One hour later she came to me herself and ordered the bartender a drink for me which she paid. I accepted and started chatting with her. Next bought her a drink also (to stay even) , and 2 hours later I stood up and said I will go back to my hotel to eat dinner. Next she asked if she could come with me. I played my lines with her. We went to the hotel, bought her dinner. We banged. In the morning we banged again. Next she asked 3000 shilling. I reacted surprised and said I could not give her money as it's against my principles. She begged. I refused. Next she left, never gave me another call or ring. She told me I had a heart of stone that nobody could break. Case closed.

- Girl 3: Went out one evening in Caserina. Played the game according to the rules above. I said in daytime that I had to study for university so she had to leave my room and come back in the evenings or go out together. Banged her the first night. Banged her the second night. The third night I said I had a headache (I think not only women have a right to have headaches right?.). Case closed.

- Girl 4: On the night that I had "a headache", I decided just to sit in the bar drinking. At around 23 o'clock a girl came to order some drinks for herself and her african male companion. I chatted with her, puled some jokes etc. She went back to her table. After 15 minutes she asked me to come to sit with them and drink. We talked chit-chat. Apparently the guy could not speak English. 30 minutes later she offered me to go to watch a movie at her place. So we splitted and I followed her. At her place she took a shower, undressed her clothes. Banged her in her big bed. I remember that evening there was no electricity, it was humid and hot, the room was pitch dark and the sex we got was steaming hot, one of the best in my life. Apparently she was living with a girlfriend who was out. Next sleeping. After 30 minutes (long enough to justify my excuse) I told her I was restless and had problems sleeping in a place which was not my own. She called me a motorcycle who brought me back to my hotel and we agreed to meet the next day as she wanted me to go with her to Nairobi. The next day I cancelled the appointment and told her the timeframe was too short to me to travel back and forth to Nairobi. Next I turned my phone off. When I turned it on again 12 hours later I saw she called twice. Case closed.

- Girl 5: internet girl, cousin of a group of 2 cousins and a friend I was playing online for a while. She had to travel from a another city to meet me. We met on Sunday, the day before I would fly back. She was expected to come at about 4 pm.

When I was sitting in the bar outside the hotel. What do I suddenly see. Girl 3 moving in the hotel on her way to my room together with her auntie (in who's place I had eaten spaghetti and drink beers some eve's before we went out together). They approached me in the bar, and were obviously mad that I did not returned the calls etc. So I sad I was ill, and that I could not meet her anymore as I had an appointed in 2 hours with a longtime friend. Next they asked money. So I stayed silent, asked why you need money for? She said, you should show respect for my auntie and the nights I spend with you? I immediately called security and demanded them to remove them from the hotel immediately as I felt threatened (which I overstated to the security). Then in front of all of them (security + girl + auntie) I only said the following: apparently this girl is a malaya as she requests money from me as we spend the night together. However I never promised anything and I never pay for sex, not abroad and not in Kenya and I stated that prostitution is illegal under Kenyan Law. I gave it an extra push by stating that I'm a good christian and would never go with a prostitute. Next I walked to my hotel room and waited till they were gone. Security cleaned the mess and came to inform me about 1 hour later that they were gone.

30 minutes later Girl 4 arrived. I was sitting, drinking and laughing with her in the bar. Lot of eyes on me off course from the personnel. I told her the above story and expressed her my disbelief and stress. She took me out to Tembo and some other clubs, where she kissed me etc. We ended up in bed, again I did not started anything. After one hour she came on top of me and she gave me a great ride. I gave her some money for the trip back to home and a meal. Next online she said she was broke, , wanted to make baby with me, etc. It ended up with her blocking me on facebook. Case closed.

I think I can say I succeeded my mission. On 7 nights I got laid 6 nights and sometimes more than once with minimal financial investment.

I share this story with you, to give a different perspective. I played a game within the game, a game of lies and deception. However I would not advise others to practice it without extreme caution as it could lead to dangerous or unpleasant situations. After all you are on holidays, so the preferred way I think is still the middle way, a mix of the strategies that I applied + the holiday lifestyle of the regular visitor. Which is the same underlying reason as why the vast majority of whites don't mind overspending, cause they want no trouble on their holidays and more importantly don't risk their lives. In which to a large extend I can only applaud them.

It must be said, that the strategies I applied were good but not bulletproof. I think it would have been better if I spend the night everyday at a different hotel. And I'm sure some of you could even highlight other mistakes or suggestions for improvement.

From a psychological perspective it's extremely interesting to experience how you yourself and the girls react in that environment within these conditions. It's the game of poker at it best. I guess it's clear that all-most none of the girls tried to contact me back, they all realized their losses, folded their hands and withdrew from my gaming table. To see and experience this single thing should be a must pass for every mongerer, the realisation that when there is no money on the table you stop meaning anything to them. You are of no value to them anymore, worth nothing. A reality which stands in sharp contrast to the illusion that a lot of whites in Kenya like to believe.

Interesting, very interesting time I had there.

Cheers!

Woef Woef.

"Hells are empty and all the devils are here". Sir William Shakespeare.

[Woef Woef]

Hello all,

It's already many months ago, nevertheless I would like to share my experiences from my second trip to Mtwapa.

On my first trip I tried to follow the advice of many frequent posters on this board, and I succeeded well and had a nice holiday. However I still felt being 'played' to a certain extent as I realized that these girls often made the same 'salary' in 1-2 nights than the average wage of a hard working kenyan in the hotel I was staying it. I could only come to one conclusion which was in fact already often suggested on this board: the majority of white men in Kenya are over-paying. Second, I feel the majority of white men think they are in control cause they have the money, which is mostly an illusion. For the most part, the african woman is largely in control on different levels. The only conclusion I could come to next, was that in fact the majority of these girls can afford to lose some time on you.

So before my second trip I gave myself a challenge. To get laid about once a day, without spending a single shilling directly on sex. Shillings were only allowed to be spend on drinks or meal for the girl and definitely not on presents or sex.

Next I thought about a strategy to apply, to maximum the girlfriend / sex experience on one hand, and to minimize the financial spending on the other hand. I approached it as a game to be played, an adventure in which my goal was to become the master deceiver. To play the game like the girls play it. To "fight" them with their own weapons: lies, deception and psychological warfare.

I created the following rules:

- Before you take a girl to your room or you go to her place, etc. Always ask her first if she is a malaya. And state that you dislike malaya's very much. Only go with her, if she says no. If you can get this in written form via sms it's even better. Remember it's all about psychology.

- Dream / Story-telling, pretend that you are searching for everlasting love but that you are very careful because you heard so many bad stories about african women. This will make her feel doubt and gamble: either invest her body / time in you without getting financial value, or a potential ticket to USA / Europe in long term, etc.

- Never never ask a girl for sex or start sex first. Even when laying in the same bed naked, make her start to approach you.

- Lie lie lie, excuses excuses excuses, create a story about yourself, what you do, your life etc. Which is not true, tell this story to every single girl. First, this will make it easier for you not to make mistakes and second the story will be consistent once the girls start talking to each-other.

- Create a network of girls. This can be done beforehand via the internet. The goal is not necessary to date them, but to use them as a buffer in case things go wrong. In other words, when a girl start to make trouble or do not want to leave. You can call another one to show up.

- If a girl makes trouble, use the strategy of passive resistance. Refuse to argue, hence even refuse to speak any longer with her, leave the place immediately of place of argue, etc. The only thing you will say once is 'I never pay for sex, and by the way prostitution is illegal according to Kenyan law'.

I've spend one week there:

- Girl 1: was a girl I spend several days with at her home on my first trip. She was a good lay so I thought it would be a good start. She picked me up in downtown Mtwapa and she wanted to spend the full week with me. As she gained too much pounds according to my preference, I banged her once, took a shower, watched some tv, etc. Then I told her that "the feelings I had to her" were apparently not the same anymore as last time, and I felt I had to leave. She was very surprised. Next she said she can't pay her electricity bill etc. So I left 500 shilling on the table, which should cover for the foods and drinks I took from her place. Case closed.

- Girl 2: Big Tree. She was young. 19 I think. Good Looking. Her friend asked if she could come to have a drink with me. I said I was not interested. Was reading a book. One hour later she came to me herself and ordered the bartender a drink for me which she paid. I accepted and started chatting with her. Next bought her a drink also (to stay even) , and 2 hours later I stood up and said I will go back to my hotel to eat dinner. Next she asked if she could come with me. I played my lines with her. We went to the hotel, bought her dinner. We banged. In the morning we banged again. Next she asked 3000 shilling. I reacted surprised and said I could not give her money as it's against my principles. She begged. I refused. Next she left, never gave me another call or ring. She told me I had a heart of stone that nobody could break. Case closed.

- Girl 3: Went out one evening in Caserina. Played the game according to the rules above. I said in daytime that I had to study for university so she had to leave my room and come back in the evenings or go out together. Banged her the first night. Banged her the second night. The third night I said I had a headache (I think not only women have a right to have headaches right?.). Case closed.

- Girl 4: On the night that I had "a headache", I decided just to sit in the bar drinking. At around 23 o'clock a girl came to order some drinks for herself and her african male companion. I chatted with her, puled some jokes etc. She went back to her table. After 15 minutes she asked me to come to sit with them and drink. We talked chit-chat. Apparently the guy could not speak English. 30 minutes later she offered me to go to watch a movie at her place. So we splitted and I followed her. At her place she took a shower, undressed her clothes. Banged her in her big bed. I remember that evening there was no electricity, it was humid and hot, the room was pitch dark and the sex we got was steaming hot, one of the best in my life. Apparently she was living with a girlfriend who was out. Next sleeping. After 30 minutes (long enough to justify my excuse) I told her I was restless and had problems sleeping in a place which was not my own. She called me a motorcycle who brought me back to my hotel and we agreed to meet the next day as she wanted me to go with her to Nairobi. The next day I cancelled the appointment and told her the timeframe was too short to me to travel back and forth to Nairobi. Next I turned my phone off. When I turned it on again 12 hours later I saw she called twice. Case closed.

- Girl 5: internet girl, cousin of a group of 2 cousins and a friend I was playing online for a while. She had to travel from a another city to meet me. We met on Sunday, the day before I would fly back. She was expected to come at about 4 pm.

When I was sitting in the bar outside the hotel. What do I suddenly see. Girl 3 moving in the hotel on her way to my room together with her auntie (in who's place I had eaten spaghetti and drink beers some eve's before we went out together). They approached me in the bar, and were obviously mad that I did not returned the calls etc. So I sad I was ill, and that I could not meet her anymore as I had an appointed in 2 hours with a longtime friend. Next they asked money. So I stayed silent, asked why you need money for? She said, you should show respect for my auntie and the nights I spend with you? I immediately called security and demanded them to remove them from the hotel immediately as I felt threatened (which I overstated to the security). Then in front of all of them (security + girl + auntie) I only said the following: apparently this girl is a malaya as she requests money from me as we spend the night together. However I never promised anything and I never pay for sex, not abroad and not in Kenya and I stated that prostitution is illegal under Kenyan Law. I gave it an extra push by stating that I'm a good christian and would never go with a prostitute. Next I walked to my hotel room and waited till they were gone. Security cleaned the mess and came to inform me about 1 hour later that they were gone.

30 minutes later Girl 4 arrived. I was sitting, drinking and laughing with her in the bar. Lot of eyes on me off course from the personnel. I told her the above story and expressed her my disbelief and stress. She took me out to Tembo and some other clubs, where she kissed me etc. We ended up in bed, again I did not started anything. After one hour she came on top of me and she gave me a great ride. I gave her some money for the trip back to home and a meal. Next online she said she was broke, , wanted to make baby with me, etc. It ended up with her blocking me on facebook. Case closed.

I think I can say I succeeded my mission. On 7 nights I got laid 6 nights and sometimes more than once with minimal financial investment.

I share this story with you, to give a different perspective. I played a game within the game, a game of lies and deception. However I would not advise others to practice it without extreme caution as it could lead to dangerous or unpleasant situations. After all you are on holidays, so the preferred way I think is still the middle way, a mix of the strategies that I applied + the holiday lifestyle of the regular visitor. Which is the same underlying reason as why the vast majority of whites don't mind overspending, cause they want no trouble on their holidays and more importantly don't risk their lives. In which to a large extend I can only applaud them.

It must be said, that the strategies I applied were good but not bulletproof. I think it would have been better if I spend the night everyday at a different hotel. And I'm sure some of you could even highlight other mistakes or suggestions for improvement.

From a psychological perspective it's extremely interesting to experience how you yourself and the girls react in that environment within these conditions. It's the game of poker at it best. I guess it's clear that all-most none of the girls tried to contact me back, they all realized their losses, folded their hands and withdrew from my gaming table. To see and experience this single thing should be a must pass for every mongerer, the realisation that when there is no money on the table you stop meaning anything to them. You are of no value to them anymore, worth nothing. A reality which stands in sharp contrast to the illusion that a lot of whites in Kenya like to believe.

Interesting, very interesting time I had there.

Cheers!

Woef Woef.

"Hells are empty and all the devils are here". Sir William Shakespeare.

[Pete Benetar]

Knowing how women think, I can understand the shock for a Kenyan girl who knows someone comes from a background where the average income is Kshs 300, 000 per month giving her Kshs 5K at the end of the week. It is no even funny any more.

Cheupe

Perhaps I make 300, 000 / month or 30, 000 or 3, 000, 000 shilling per month. If the women you associate with perceive westerners as uber wealthy and that they, the women, should be entitled to share the man's wealth, then you have a point. That's a self entitled philosophy I don't agree with, but if some guys want to pay 10, 000 shilling per night or whatever, good for them. I'm sure that will make your girls happy.

By the way. 5,000 shilling for a 7 day week is little more than 700 shilling per day. Significantly below what I have heard most anyone on the board suggest for a woman befriended. And overall. 5,000 shilling is still not much less than a full months average Kenyan income.

If you spot any guys paying out that rate, you can tell them I suggest a few more shilling, ok?

[Bareback Jack]

To all the suckers who have too much money left. Give it to them, but spare us with your "do-gooders" arguments

So, where exactly Mr. Wenzman has anyone said anything about "do-good"? No one here claims to have noble intentions as far as I can see. It is only that a few individuals like myself have voiced the opinion that prevailing market rate is nothing more but an orientation guideline. Treating everyone the same doesn't seem to be logical to me. A standard rate awards the same to a less attractive or overweight woman as to a very attractive woman in perfect shape. Proof that not all women fall into the second category can be seen plenty in the photo gallery.

For arguments sake, you might say that your gold member doesn't know the difference when it's inside the punany. Then, of course it would be money wasted. However, if the packaging is important, which after all is again a matter of personal preference, then it seems to be logical to award a better rate to an individual that offers the overall better package in the eyes of the client.

[Cheupe]

Kenya girls can always going for 200ksh / schot in sabasaba.

Enjoy Kenya brothers

atwiilyboy, you know Kenya too much what you doing in sabasaba? Msufi mkavu? Some of Kenyan boys fear those girls!

[Jiggydus]

Good for you! I used to be Exec Platinum with AA and had exalted Elite status at Marriott as well (forget what they called it) and earned freebies all the time. But in those days you paid NOTHING when you redeemed any award, not even taxes (which I guess is the $10 / day for ).

Yes, the $10 bucks is tax on air award ticket, and unfortunately, I was 4, 000 Marriott Rewards points short, so that is where the $50 bucks come from. Not bad when I would have ended up paying over $500 if I were a cash / credit card paying customer.

[Willyboy]

Knowing how women think, I can understand the shock for a Kenyan girl who knows someone comes from a background where the average income is Kshs 300, 000 per month giving her Kshs 5K at the end of the week. I understand when these girls have low expectations of us Kenyan boy friends; and when they call us Marondo, well, it is only natural. But when they call a Mzungu Marondo? It is no even funny any more.

Cheupe

Kenya girls can always going for 200ksh / schot in sabasaba.

Enjoy Kenya brothers

[Cheupe]

This chick looks like a malaya or like many of those ladies wearing the veils. I don't mess with them and the Kenyans I do mess with don't get mad or upset over me giving them 1, 000 or 2, 000 ksh. But I mostly focus on non-pros vice pros, but every now and then, I like to spice it up. I am a cheap bastard, yes. I have a Kenyan gf here in the US and I am flying her up to be with me for about a week. She is a 3 holer (thanks to me). Guess how much it has cost me so far for her airfare and hotel! If you guessed $60 USD, you would be correct, and no I am not lying. I paid $10 for her airfare (award ticket for those of you still wondering what the hell I am smoking) and $50 for her 5 day hotel stay in a Marriott Chain hotel. Oh my situation is complicated so that is why she will be staying in a hotel. So if I spend so little in the US for a good time, why would I want to travel anywhere and spend $100 plus per night for a hotel and give a chick $50 to $100 USD for a good time? More power to those ladies who can coax that kind of cash out of willing suckers, but I am not one.

I can't follow half of what you are saying Jiggydus, but if you are talking about a Kenyan woman living in the US who has no "visa complications", she does not know what Marondo is. Judging from what little light Lustyhombre has shed on the flight and hotel rates, I seriously doubt any girl in Kenya would refer to either of you as "marondo".