Dating Russian Women

[Jack2004]

Agreed, compensated says a lot, but in the long run, it may get a bit. Dull. May question to yah all (seems to fit in this thread.). How would slavic women feel about going together with a friend to (a compensated) date in a strip bar? I don't go there much myself, seem to remember seeing men with girlfriends there (might have been dancers having a break). Think this might be interesting with my (young) girlfriend (s) , as a compensation or alteration for watching porn with her. Has anyone s-g to report?

In my experience visiting a strip-bar with a FSU woman is not a taboo, is almost "normal", generally speaking. They are quite used to it, and sometimes can be rewarding. Some friends have had very interesting experiences, mine have benn only "spicy". Lesbian sex there is neither a taboo. Remember most women want to enjoy life, and love surprises. And if your life is a difficult one, you'll be hungrier for nice and new experiences. Of course these are general rules, and for sure there are many exceptions.

[Guntherus]

Agreed, compensated says a lot, but in the long run, it may get a bit. Dull. May question to yah all (seems to fit in this thread.). How would slavic women feel about going together with a friend to (a compensated) date in a strip bar? I don't go there much myself, seem to remember seeing men with girlfriends there (might have been dancers having a break). Think this might be interesting with my (young) girlfriend (s) , as a compensation or alteration for watching porn with her. Has anyone s-g to report?

[Prosal]

Compensated dating. It's a perfect description. Good catch.

Right, good catch. I didn't know that the concept came from Japan. What never ceases to amaze me is that the high-end clubs in "poor" FSU (Moldova, Uzbekistan, Ukraine, ect) are literally crawling with girls wearing designers clothes, expensive bags, fancy watches, Louboutin heels, with the latest Iphone 4S, ect. How girls can afford this? Certainly not from their wages, when you know that a girl working in a shop, in Kharkov or Chisinau, earns at best 200 €/month.

That said, there is IMO a whole stratum of female population in Russia who wouldn't even consider the idea of "compensated dating" (successfull young office professionals, intellectual or arty girls, ect). This is the best target for us (or those of us) who can't compete with Moscow money!

[Jake993]

dr. chris swader of moscow's national research institute has a scientific take on a topic often discussed here: "the commodification of intimacy? the practice of compensated dating in moscow". he seems to be touring europe with his lecture (abstract here:

http://regconf.hse.ru/uploads/2e60d3...b445507a27.pdf

) , next stop uppsala university in sweden on september 11.

»evidence from online sources, realworld 'speed dating' investigations, and from qualitative interviews describes compensated dating as a hybrid practice with connections to both commercial sex and romantic love, yet distinct from both, « the scholar states. a fair verdict imho.

thank you so much for this link. it's priceless. i love it. compensated dating. it's a perfect description. and in russia (especially moscow) it works perfectly because you have a relatively high concentration of men with relatively (disproportionately) high incomes who have the looks and social skills of neanderthals and a lot of hot women who can't afford to maintain the lifestyle to which they want to be accustomed to. without compensated dating, these guys would never get laid and these girls would never be able to afford the shoes, clothes and vacation they want. talk about quid pro quo. we have discussed this on this board to the point of boredom, but it bears repeating that this so called "compensated dating" is in large part responsible for pulling some of the best hotties off the p4p market in moscow and jacking the prices up. were it not for compensated dating (aka sponsorship) you would probably see a lot more competition for p4p dollars.

he suggests that this practice lies somewhere between prostitution and dating. and imho, he is 100% bang on. these girls in no way consider themselves pros, but in fact it's exactly what they are doing. and on the other side of the equation, i bet that a lot of these guys absolutely hate the idea of visiting a prostitute because of psychological or social issues. they are happy to shell out regular cash to keep a girl (or several girls) "on call" because they can afford it. and let's not forget the married guy whose wife drives him bananas and wants to keep a few girls on the side.

you have to hand it to this guy for writing a paper on the topic. i's love to hear the lecture just for it's comedic value alone.

good catch.

[Banaanovich]

dr. chris swader of moscow's national research institute has a scientific take on a topic often discussed here: "the commodification of intimacy? the practice of compensated dating in moscow". he seems to be touring europe with his lecture (abstract here:

http://regconf.hse.ru/uploads/2e60d3...b445507a27.pdf

) , next stop uppsala university in sweden on september 11.

»evidence from online sources, realworld 'speed dating' investigations, and from qualitative interviews describes compensated dating as a hybrid practice with connections to both commercial sex and romantic love, yet distinct from both, « the scholar states. a fair verdict imho.

[Prosal]

When EE girls come to visit you in Paris, how much does it cost you in terms of taking them out, clubbing, restaurants, drinks, taxis, metro.

I posted this answer to JJ in the Minsk thread, but maybe it has better its place here. Just to point out once more that the Russian women's mentality on vacation is very positive. They don't mind riding the bus, are totally happy with dinners in mid-level romantic restaurants, boozing in nice but unpretentious bars, ect. No posh places, no glam clubs. No need. Most important is to actually take care of their well-being, fulfill their touristic expectations (long romantic strolls, visits of picturesque areas, monuments, ect) , and at the same time satisfy them emotionally, intellectually and sexually.

Had a 23 yo Belarus student at home this weekend, with who I was "relationship building" on internet since almost two year. She is on a Germany, France and Italy bus tour (her first trip in western Europe) and quitted the group to stay two days with me.

Saturday: meeting at 8 pm. Stroll to my favorite bar where we had 4 cocktail each on the terrace (was happy hour) , bill 40 €. Nocturnal romantic stroll to Notre Dame that lasted some two hours. Stop at a nice mexican place where we had three Coronas each + chip, salsa and guacamole, bill 45 €. Long romantic stroll to my home (I live near the Opera). Cost of the night in town: 85 €.

Sunday: wake up at 11am, tea at home, she wasn't hungry. Bus to her hotel (2 € each) so that she can change clothes. From her hotel, long stroll through picturesque areas, at 4 pm stop in a nice typical french brasserie near my home, she wasn't hungry, I had to force her to share with me one plate of frogs and one creme brulée, this with thow bottles of Chardonnais, bill 60 €. Back home for a wild fuck and more wine. At 11 pm, walk to a modest brasilian place with live music and great atmosphere, three beers each and some "casquinho de caranquejo" (crabmeat covered with manioc) , bill 42 €. Walk back home. Cost of the day: 110 €.

Monday (was vacation day here) : wake up at 11 am, cafe plus croissant at a cafe terrace, bill 12 €. Stroll and suntanning at the Louvre Gardens during two hours. Shopping to La Maison du Chocolat (high-end stuff) where I buy her as a gift some chocolate truffes, cost 28 €. Then stop in a cafe, one omelette for two and a bottle of rosé at the terrace, bill 34 €. Taxi to her hotel 10 €. Her bus leaves at 3 pm to Nice and then Italy. Long kiss goodbye. Cost of the day: 85 € (gift included)

Cost of the weekend: around 280 €. She sent an sms from the bus to say that she will be grateful forever for this weekend that was the most wonderful of her life.

As a side note: what great women Russian women are. Beside being honest, emotional, smart, cultured, witty, selfless, fun and great conversationalists, again and again I'm amazed by their liking for no-holds barred sex and their skills at oral. They are definitely the best and most enthousiastic blowers on the planet. It's literally amazing. There must be some special schools in Russia where they learn to suck dicks. She was with my cock like a starving dog in front of a roast chicken. No way to move her away from it, even by force (not that I tried too harshly though).

What a great weekend.

[Stravinsky]

One of those lovely nuances of the Russian language that English lost a long time ago.

[Jonners]

Yep using the formal 'vashe' after you've had sex with her is sure to annoy her.

This is very true. If a Russian man is married, he might talk about it with his wife. But some dyevchonka he picked up somewhere? Never. It's really none of her business.

The girls will press you if you are a foreigner, because foreigners have a way of, well, disappearing. The Russian guys will always be around, somewhere.

Most important is that you have money, or at least look Like you have money. And if she presses you too much about what you do, just say,"&1101; &1090; &1086; &1085; &1077; &1074; &1072; &1096; &1077; &1076; &1077; &1083; &1086;" (it's none of your business). This will either [CodeWord140] her off or increase her curiousity. Either way, it could be fun.

[Stravinsky]

Russian men do not discuss their business dealings with women, and the intrigue will work in your favor.

This is very true. If a Russian man is married, he might talk about it with his wife. But some dyevchonka he picked up somewhere? Never. It's really none of her business.

The girls will press you if you are a foreigner, because foreigners have a way of, well, disappearing. The Russian guys will always be around, somewhere.

Most important is that you have money, or at least look Like you have money. And if she presses you too much about what you do, just say,"это не ваше дело" (it's none of your business). This will either [CodeWord140] her off or increase her curiousity. Either way, it could be fun.

[Latexian2]

+1. And it is true even for first dates. If you take a girl to a too flashy place, she can think that you're the kind of man who wants to impress at all cost, lacks of self-confidence and needs a decorum all around him to hide his lack of personality, charm and witt.

Well that's only true if it's an atypical place for you. I mean if you're rich or like fancy restaurants, more power to you. But I had a friend once who always wanted me and him to say we were bankers when out in Moscow. It might work for a one-night stand, but even then you have to drop money in the club / bar. You can't say you're a banker, with a fancy watch, and then count your bills to see if you can pay for her long island iced tea. And after that first night it was a horrible strategy as now their expectations would be very high.

As with most things with women, the more information you give to them the generally worse off you will be. Better to keep her guessing what your salary and general status are. I mean you should be giving the hints an EE woman looks for, like nice clothes, a watch, decent cell phone, knowledge of travel (or even names of cocktails) , things of that nature. But beyond that don't say anything.

In fact in my experience, one of the best answers to "what are you doing in Moscow/Kiev/Minsk?" is neither honesty (we all know that) or lying (saying you have a long-term job there) but rather dodging the question entirely by just saying "dela." She will push you on that but just say you have your own business matters to take care of and that's why you're here. Keep her guessing. Russian men do not discuss their business dealings with women, and the intrigue will work in your favor. Maybe she has a fantasy of being roughed up by an arms dealer. Maybe she wants to find an i-banker type in the jet set. Maybe she wants a man with a stable job who leaves his work at the workplace and just wants to have fun. If you're ambiguous she can pick whichever fantasy she wants.


This is completely different than in the states where in singles bars the first several minutes is usually about your profession/job.

[Stevie69]

Well, you do not have to have a real facebook account. I have one with a fake name, like here, strictly for dating. I am single so I have no wife to worry about, but still, I do not want my family and co-workers knowing about my sex life. I do not post anything (one any of my facebook accounts) but I do keep track of other people and the girls get to size up their competition.

I have had several "girlfriends" ask me to join facebook for keeping contact! My blood froze immediately! I will never, ever join facebook or any other of the social websites. It will be the start of the road to social disaster.

[Stevie69]

A while back I used to date my boss, who made 1. 3 to 1. 5 times as much as I did. Sometimes we went out for drinks and / or food with co-workers and being the boss, she often volunteered to pick up the bill. No, it was not deductible; it was out of her pocket, anywhere from 100 to 500 USD, and at least once per week. However, when she went out with me, only me, she expected me to pay for her.

On another case I lived with a woman who had 2 houses on her property. Actually, one 3 bedroom house, and a one bedroom apartment with a large garage. She rented the larger house to a family and we moved in for a few months into the smaller house. She actually wanted me to pay rent to her, and she wanted to charge me more than she was charging the family of strangers for the entire large house.

Third example: I was ready to make it permanent with a woman. Staying with her meant I had to work as a trader, which meant I could potentially make far more money than she did, but it would be more variable, and not guaranteed, at least at first. However, she just could not get used to the idea that she would be the one with the regular paycheque, or our steady source of income. Eventually, I had to get a regular job, which meant leaving her.

That was in the good US of A, with women who were well-educated, financially secure and supposedly feminists.

I currently live in eastern Europe now and usually make far more than the women I date. I do not mind paying but I do appreciate it when they at least makes me feel like we are working together. I really appreciate it when a woman quickly digs into her purse for loose change to avoid making me break another large bill. Or when she buys a few small items without asking for money. To me those are the keepers.

A lot has been written about dating Russian women. They are a lot different from Western women in a lot ways so what I add in this post is not so much a new perspective on anything so much as a recap of an interesting conversation I had recently with a Russian woman. She's lived in Moscow for about 10 years but was born and raised in Siberia. So I guess that does not really make a Moskvitchka in the true sense but for the purpose of this discussion I think she can qualify. She's in her early 30's. A professional with a very good salary. Probably makes more money than 95% of Moscow women.

No, I'm not fucking her (yet) so it was a pretty candid conversation in her apartment over tea. We had gone out with a group of people (mostly colleagues) to this concert and several of us ended up at her apartment (let's call her Oksana) for tea. Everyone was gone except me and we chatted over one last pot of tea. It was an interesting conversation reflecting on her last boyfriend (Let's call him Boris). He wasn't Russian but British. Well, he was born and raised in Britain to Russian parents who emigrated. He's fluent in Russian so she decided she might get the best of both worlds.

She told me they went on vacation together to the tropics and that she left him after a few days and went to another island. I asked her why and she said because he treated her badly. After a lot of probing I found out that the source of the problem was that Boris insisted that she pay her fair share of the holiday. Just to be clear, they are both professionals earning about the same amount of money (truth be told I think she earns more).

I pressed her a bit on her logic and she said that the man HAS to pay. It's just the way it is. After all, he's just using her. Using her body, using her time, using her emotion and it's only 50:50 at best that he will even stick around so why SHOULDN'T he pay?

I think that comment speaks volumes about the mindset of your average Moscow girl these days.

Anyone care to chime in?

[Prosal]

So the man must pay, but you don't need to go to expensive places.

+1. And it is true even for first dates. If you take a girl to a too flashy place, she can think that you're the kind of man who wants to impress at all cost, lacks of self-confidence and needs a "stage setting" to hide his lack of personality, charm and witt.

[Prosal]

So the man must pay, but you don't need to go to expensive places.

+1. And it is true even for first dates. If you take a girl to a too flashy place, she can think that you're the kind of man who wants to impress at all cost, lacks of self-confidence and needs a decorum all around him to hide his lack of personality, charm and witt.

[Bimbo Boy]

Every (true) Russian woman expects the man to pay. This is the way they have been raised. Makes no difference where they are; Tahiti, L. A, Manhattan or Odessa (Texas). This is a fundamental understanding all Russian women have about men.

I have met many Russian women here in the States. Most of them came here as the bride of an American man and then split up. At some point they find themselves dating again and eventually they all come to me (well, the ones who know me) for advice: about American men. Russian women find American men almost as difficult to understand as Russian women are for us. One of the problems Russian women have is that American men expect the woman to pay for everything and this is simply incomprehensible to a Russian woman. Of course, they don't understand that American men have been trained to act this way by American women. So, I have to explain to them the history of male / female relationships in America over the past 40 years. American women have basically lost any vestigial remains of femininity and no longer bear any resemblance to an actual woman. But I digress. Jackson has a whole thread devoted to American women and we could discuss that subject ad nauseum.

I remember something I read by Nietzsche once, long time ago, and it has always stuck in my head,"there are no men here, therefore their women make themselves as men. For only a man can truly redeem the woman in woman." Yes, Friedrich could be a little corny at times, but it has a certain ring of truth to it.

So, what's all this got to do with your dyev? Lukasek is absolutely right: the poor thing is conflicted. She has reached a point in her life where she has enough disposable income to call the shots. But, way deep down inside her Russkaya dooshah, she yearns for a real man who will dominate her. Slap her around a little when she's bad, keep her in line and give her direction and purpose in her life.

Because, ultimately, that's the only way she can be sure he really loves her.

In that regard, us Western guys can all take a lesson from our Russian brethren. Never spoil the female, it leads to nothing but disaster. Keep her on the straight and narrow, never ask her to make important decisions: it just makes her nervous and irritable. Take charge, make the decisions, call the shots and be sure to pay for everything and she will be happy. And when a Russian woman is truly happy, well. We should all be so lucky.

Stravinsky. These are words of wisdom.

In my experience, the Russian expects and wants you to pay, not because she thinks about money, but only because she expects you to act as a man.

So the man must pay, but you don't need to go to expensive places.