Legal Discussion

[MidniteRider]

Hope he can dance.

[Stroker Ace88]

this reads more like an ngo scripted plant but here goes, it's a real story:

"66-year-old american arrested in talisay; cebuana who met him online cries [CodeWord123] on first meeting"

you only see the surface. there is alot of shit going on in the cebu expat circles that newbies don't know about. this guy has made his own bed and now must deal with what comes.

no ngo, just a dumb guy who lies and is abusive, he did the wrong thing and now is staying in jail, some other forum a guy went to help him and he was abusive to the guy helping.

there has been a huge increase in the number of a-holes that have come to the philippines within the last couple of years. the 66yr old is a real scumbag and deserves everything he gets (and more). the guy likes to lure filipinas to meet him with promises of a job and / or marriage. chances are good he talked down and shit on everyone he met in the few months he had been living in cebu, but this time he tried to shit on the talisay hotel manager without a clue the guy was also the local barangay captain. lmfao! this turd with legs punched out a taxi driver awhile back too and now will get the crap beat out of him on a daily basis all while wearing a nice orange jumpsuit over in cprdc. good riddance!

this story reminds me of a young guy (20something) i saw on tvpatrol about a month ago. he went into a resto on fuente and ordered a cheeseburger meal. something happened womanbetween him and the young woman who was serving him, so the guy just took the cheeseburger meal without paying for it. the guard came and held the idiot until the pnp carted him away to the fuente tourist police station. so now the donkey has a record and can be thrown in jail and left to rot for awhile for any second offense. all for a 112p burger meal.

[D Cups]

Smart move, G. I usually stick to twenty-something's, too, with an occassional 30-something. In America I couldn't get women this age to tell me the time of day!

Thanks for that one Frenzy3,

In my opinion, so many guys are treading a fine line when they are picking up 18 year olds. It is so easy for her to claim 18, even to have I'd which gives her age as 18, when in fact she is younger. And when the cops want to bust you, it is so easy for them to do so if the girl is borderline.

A case in point. I met up with a pinay (Miss Z) , who I had briefly chatted on the previous trip. She promised to be a bit of fun. She turned up with another girl, who looked pretty young to me. Fortunately, I had spoken with the guards on the door, and told them that if I came back with young looking girls, they were to pull the girls over, check them in, check their IDs. If either of them was, or looked, too young, they were to refuse the girl entry.

So I took the girls to the hotel. The doormen pulled them over, had them fill in the book, asked for IDs. Miss Z produced 2, neither with age on them, the other had no I'd. So the guards refused entry.

That way, the girls had the impression that I was being positive, and helpful. It was those pesky guards who caused the trouble.

When it was all over, I tipped the doormen well, smiles all round.

So, I start again with Miss Z next trip.

G.

[Frenzy3]

this reads more like an ngo scripted plant but here goes, it's a real story:

"66-year-old american arrested in talisay; cebuana who met him online cries [CodeWord123] on first meeting"

http://cdn.ph/news_details.php?id=15183

no ngo, just a dumb guy who lies and is abusive, he did the wrong thing and now is staying in jail, some other forum a guy went to help him and he was abusive to the guy helping.

[MidniteRider]

this reads more like an ngo scripted plant but here goes, it's a real story:

"66-year-old american arrested in talisay; cebuana who met him online cries [CodeWord123] on first meeting"

http://cdn.ph/news_details.php?id=15183

[Sammon]

this entire passport discussion may have value for someone who lives in the philippines or will be staying and / or traveling with a lt gf. however for the other 95% of guys on this forum it is about as useful as ff's idea of going back and forth to lapu lapu to fake out the girls. the urban legend of visitors getting set up in **** girl scams in cebu engenders these posts. but at least riverman's comments could be useful for someone, unlike ff's famous "report of distinction".

cebu seems to be more laid back. none of the cebu hotels checked i. d of my girls. this is not to say people should try their luck. i. d or passport cannot be believed in some cases. i heard from ac that after the raid and arrest of girls policce get dentists and other professionals to verify the age.

i believe it is not easy anymore to take young phi girls on vacation to other countries. all immigration officials are advised to thoroughly check. it is better to enjoy phi girls where they are. nothing is going to be gained by taking girls on exotic holidays outside philippines.

[FurryFriend]

Key words here for me are "To recruit. A person by any means. For the purpose of prostitution. Sexual exploitation."

Let me know if I am interpreting "4a" wrongly, don't think I am.

Your interpretation is perfect. But respectfully, it's irrelevant.

If you EWRd a girl from a bar, you've also "recruited" a bar or mamasan to help you transport a girl for sex. That law is broad and vague (probably intentionally) and can apply to most P4P in the Philippines.

It's ultimately at the discretion of the Philippines whether to use anti-trafficking law to nail you, whether you've recruited a girl, a mamasan or even your best friend. If you want to use anti-trafficking laws to warn against recruiting a girl to meet others, you should also be fair and state that your warning also applies to meeting girls in bars.

My grandparents in China met through a matchmaker, as is common in China in the 1920s. This is also "[CodeWord908]" according to that piece of Philippine law.

[Sxxxx]

I am not trying to scaremonger, just trying to make sure all the guys who recruit girls for sex through another girl or whoever, that the law as per 4a (courtesy of Frenzy3) says :

"Section 4. Acts of Trafficking in Persons. It shall be unlawful for any person, natural or juridical, to commit any of the following acts:

(a) To recruit, transport, transfer; harbor, provide, or receive a person by any means, including those done under the pretext of domestic or overseas employment or training or apprenticeship, for the purpose of prostitution, pornography, sexual exploitation, forced labor, slavery, involuntary servitude or debt bondage";

Key words here for me are "To recruit. A person by any means. For the purpose of prostitution. Sexual exploitation."

So you get a 45 year old hag, not a teenager, to bring another 45yr old hag, not a teenager, to your room for paid sex. Bingo, seems its illegal, don't it? Telling the Police the 45yr old, or 18/19 yr old teen you screwed, was for free will not wash with the authorities, I'd say. Depends on circumstances at time I suppose, for example, why would an 18yr old screw girl with a 58yr old, for free etc? No need to put yourself in those situations anyway.

Getting girls via pimps of any kind seems now, with 4a, to be illegal. Apparently they do not encforce that one with regular pimps, cause lots of pimps supplying girls to lots of guys. But one day bad luck might strike and a corrupt policeman is asking you for big money to avoid detention? Possibility.

Purpose of my post is for guys recruiting girls for sex via other girls, should know the inherrent dangers as per 4a, kindly supplied by Frenzy3, in the public interest.

Let me know if I am interpreting "4a" wrongly, don't think I am.

[FurryFriend]

i am one of those guys who likes the 18 and 19 year olds. i am also very careful to weed out the **** ones, and if i have any doubt i avoid them. there are plenty of actual 18 or 19 year old out there available to fill anyones dance card.

i used to do alot of hiring, so i became pretty adept at getting need info from prosopects without their realizing i was getting it.

i'm not into 18 and 19 year olds because their performances usually suck. but let's face it. in southeast asia 17 year old girls can appear 21 (and vice versa). so it's worth finding ways to avoid an **** girl.

a few weeks ago, i posted recommended countermeasures to avoid being victim of **** and [CodeWord123] scams. some of those countermeasures involve finding ways to weed out the ****. since you brought up this topic, methinks it's worth repeating some of those measures here (as well as a few new ones i thought up) :

- ask for her birth year and don't let her think or hesitate. this will expose liars one-third of the time.

- even if her said birth year puts her at 18 or over, pretend to do a mental calculation and say "hey, that means you're 22, not 19!" if she considers your answer for even a moment, she's lying.

- ask her to name her siblings and their ages from oldest to youngest. then talk about something else. then, ask her to name it again. except this time, ask her to name them from youngest to oldest. see if her story changes.

- tell her that in america (or wherever you're from) , people can tell someone's age definitively by some body part (eyes, hands, lips, nose, etc). then, do an examination and accuse her of being ****. many girls likely aren't particularly worldly and will believe you actually have such abilities.

- you can even go perv by saying "hey, i prefer someone around 16, do you know anyone like that" and see if she admits to be younger than she said.

- asian zodiacs (year of the dog, dragon, snake, etc) aren't as big in the philippines as they are in the rest of the pacific rim. but many of them should know their asian zodiacs. you can ask for hers and see if it matches her said birth year.

there are other good ones i've used but i won't say it publicly. folks can pm me and i'll share them.

[Stroker Ace88]

[SNIP]If they are gf or regular potential, offer to pay to get them their passport. This will set you back about PHP 2, 000. Any of age filipina will jump at this opportunity, because they hope you will take them on trips outside the phils, and it also gives them to option to become overseas workers. I also like this option because it helps me weed out the piso pumpers. If you know the cost of thing in the phils in advance, and you offer to pay, and she gives you an inflated price, thats a really bad sign. If she gives you the correct price, its nice to know you have an honest one. Anyway, to get the passport the NBI (phils FBI) will do a very thorough backround check and she has to present a birth cert and good I'd. No way around it for her. If she doesn't want the passport BIG RED FLAG. If she already has one (not likely, but possible) then its simplicity itself to ask to see it.

Your thesis is not new, infact it's standard operating procedure for most of the guys who visit the Philippines on a regular basis. Conducting an interview online within the first 10mins chatting with a girl or in person over a 70p meal at Jollibee or McDo to see if any red flags come up is just common sense.

What's new is your ludacris suggestion that guys should fork over 2000p for a passport or 115p for the NBI clearance fee? Geesh, if you have doubts just walk and find someone else, no need to pay anything to figure out her age. Either you believe her or you don't, simple. If you like the woman and you pay to get her NBI clearance that will entail you making up some story or filling her head with promises to convince her to apply. What if during the NBI clearance waiting period you change your mind, lose interest in her or find someone else? She will be very upset with you to say the least that you made a fool out of her and played games with her heart. Everyone it seems has atleast one family member, friend or neighbor who is PNP and you open yourself up to be made an example of.

Also FYI you are a regular member and your posts have to be reviewed by a moderator and approved before other members can see it, hence you double-posted the same post when it didn't appear instantly. When or if you become a senior member with unmoderated status your posts will show up on the forum within a few seconds of posting.

[FurryFriend]

Thanks Frenzy, your educating the lunatic fringe, with eg 4a, who reckon they can do whatever they like when in the Philippines. Not so.

But as I said before, Police or Judge, would invent a law, if they didn't have one, LOL.

There's nothing lunatic about paying to meet women. Professional matchmakers have been around since dating and marriage was invented. Not to mention, when a guy pays to join CherryBlossoms. Com, he's also paying to meet girls.

This matter is a dead horse. There is nothing illegal or unethical about what he's doing. You're free to have a personal or moral objection. But they're just that. A personal or moral objection.

If Philippine police or judges really wants to crack down on foreigners meeting 18 and 19 year olds, they'd do a rousing business in Angeles City.

If you want to get technical about the law. 99% of us are in violation of Philippine immigration laws by being a sex tourist.

[Riverman]

i am one of those guys who likes the 18 and 19 year olds. i am also very careful to weed out the **** ones, and if i have any doubt i avoid them. there are plenty of actual 18 or 19 year old out there available to fill anyones dance card.

i used to do alot of hiring, so i became pretty adept at getting need info from prosopects without their realizing i was getting it.

there are alot of proper reasons for an employer to know the exact age of a prospective employee, yet the usa makes this practice illegal. but you still need to know. many **** girls need a meal ticket, so they may be motivated to lie to you. this you definately need to know.

anyway, before meeting a girl, ask a bit about her life in an interested fashion, not as an obvious cross examination. ask how many siblings, she where is she in the birth order. is she working or a student. buried in there should be a question when she graduated high school. for many westerners, this can be a point of confusion becuase graduating from high school usually happnens about 18. however, in the philipines its 16. so, if she proudly says she graduated high school 1 year ago, bingo, she is probably 16 or 17.

i usually will attack this point from several different angles. if she says her oldest sibling is 20, and she theirs 2 sibs inbetween her and the oldest, red flag. if she says she's a college student, ask what year / level she is. they generally start college at 16, so you can extrapolate from there. if she has a job, ask how long she's had it, etc, etc. the point is to develop a timeline and check it from a few different angels. most people, even smart sophisticated ones (and most of these girls are neither) are incapable of developing a false profile that covers every party of their lives.

this technique can and does uncover any red flags and discrepancies, and has the added benefit of making the girl feel your interested in them, which can help their performance in the sack.

if they are gf or regular potential, offer to pay to get them their passport. this will set you back about php 2, 000. any of age filipina will jump at this opportunity, because they hope you will take them on trips outside the phils, and it also gives them to option to become overseas workers. i also like this option because it helps me weed out the piso pumpers. if you know the cost of thing in the phils in advance, and you offer to pay, and she gives you an inflated price, thats a really bad sign. if she gives you the correct price, its nice to know you have an honest one. anyway, to get the passport the nbi (phils fbi) will do a very thorough backround check and she has to present a birth cert and good i'd. no way around it for her. if she doesn't want the passport big red flag. if she already has one (not likely, but possible) then its simplicity itself to ask to see it.

anyway, hope this helps someone.

happy hunting

[Sxxxx]

That as I said was posted in another forum as the guy asked if a 17 yo girl could join him on a trip.

This one you should read.

http://www.lawphil.net/statutes/repa...9208_2003.html

Section 4 e And

Recruiting teenage girls to find you girls by way of payment Falls under 4 a

Thanks Frenzy, your educating the lunatic fringe, with eg 4a, who reckon they can do whatever they like when in the Philippines. Not so.

But as I said before, Police or Judge, would invent a law, if they didn't have one, LOL.

[Frenzy3]

That as I said was posted in another forum as the guy asked if a 17 yo girl could join him on a trip.

This one you should read

http://www.lawphil.net/statutes/repa...9208_2003.html

Section 4 e And

Recruiting teenage girls to find you girls by way of payment Falls under 4 a

[Gaijin Gigolo]

since i can not pm you just a update (i found this link and posted the same in another forum)

http://www.lawphil.net/statutes/repa...7610_1992.html

section 8. attempt to commit ****. – there is an attempt to commit **** under section 7 of this act.

(e) when a person engages in the act of finding children among low-income families, hospitals, clinics, nurseries, day-care centers, or other child-during institutions who can be offered for the purpose of ****.

and.

section 6. attempt to commit child prostitution. – there is an attempt to commit child prostitution under section 5, paragraph (a) hereof when any person who, not being a relative of a child, is found alone with the said child inside the room or cubicle of a house, an inn, hotel, motel, pension house, apartelle or other similar establishments, vessel, vehicle or any other hidden or secluded area under circumstances which would lead a reasonable person to believe that the child is about to be exploited in prostitution and other sexual abuse.

so targeting 18-19 yo as you said you do is not a good idea.

oh and there is no free wifi in the condos or jail

once again. 18-19yos are not children! what the fuck. why is this so hard for you to understand?

section 3. definition of terms. –

(a) "children" refers to person below eighteen (18) years of age or those over but are unable to fully take care of themselves or protect themselves from abuse, neglect, cruelty, exploitation or discrimination because of a physical or mental disability or condition;