German FKK Clubs - Lounge and chat area

[Mursenary]

Despite there being fewer flights and those flights being emptier, both business class and economy are currently pricing higher than 2020: https://edition.cnn.com/travel/artic...nes/index.html.
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Returning to subject of long-haul travel. Back in 2018, low cost carriers like WOW Air, LEVEL and Norwegian Air were offering dirt cheap flights to Americans wishing to cross the Atlantic. This forced traditional carriers like United and Delta to lower their pricing to remain competitive. So a lot may depend on if these budget airlines can stay financially afloat. And if Norwegian Air collapses like WOW Air did in 2019, will other low cost carriers emerge to replace them? From a regulatory standpoint, I am not sure what the barrier to entry is like. Governments could choose to lower the taxes and bureaucratic red tape. Governments still own and operate some of the world's major airports, so in theory NYC could lower the fees they charge to airlines that land in JFK.

I've taken 8 legs of domestic flights during this past year and have paid the lowest prices I've ever paid (except in college with the $49 one-way standby transcontinental tickets offered by AirTran).

The 6 times I flew with Delta, I was upgraded every time. One flight carried a total of 12 people. Took 2 legs of a 1 hour flight with Spirit Airlines (The cheapest carrier in the USA). The round trip ticket to Tampa, FL and back was $36.

Not at all expecting this to remain the case 6 months from now.

[Mursenary]

I don't know how much experience of business and first class you have but I have a lot and find that economy just doesn't do it anymore. I don't think anyone ever likes these intercon-trips (especially the east bound) but having sampled the goods up at the front it's even harder. The same goes for the hotels too. These 2-star hotels near the Hauptbahnhof are impossible to stay at these days and don't get me started on older 2-3 star hotels in the US. I don't need 5 star but the level of what's acceptable is obviously higher these days.

That means that even when I'm travelling for pleasure I try to find a way to move myself up one class.

I mean, I'm not against the luxuries in life, not at all. Everyone must judge for themselves how to get the most joy for your money. I'm sure my pre-pandemic $30 thousand plus holiday budget is sinful even for the average upper middle class person.

For me, it's just that the airline first class price points are absurd to me. I have never ever ever ever ever paid for a full priced first class ticket, or business class for the matter. My status with Delta does allow for routine upgrades to business class on domestic flights and to economy comfort+ on international travel (over 50% occurrence, probably 75%.

While I do enjoy the perks, if I was forced to actually shell out the cash at the going rates, would I? Nope (except for the few times when I was offered a heavily discounted upgrade offer.) Take a look at prices for transcontinental business class prices in the United States. An economy ticket from east coast to west coast is somewhere around $400. A business class ticket costs around $2000. That's an extra $1600 for a four to five hour flight, $400 per hour for extra leg space, comfy seats, and not having to deal with loud children and passengers with poor airplane etiquette. That's just too rich of a luxury expense for me to reason, as frankly, I judge the value of service purchases based on my personal working rate, and I am well shy of being a $400/ HR earner.

For transatlantic travel (for me to get to an FKK), the economy prices are $800 compared to $4000 business and over $7000 for first class.

This is another way I look at it, for the price difference of a business class ticket, I can have 64 Cheap Charlie half-hour FKK rooms, or 32 half hour CIM rooms, or 32 hours of a continuous blowjob. Or for the same flight time, 8 hours with 4 hookers continuously sucking, fucking, and licking from head to toe.

If I only made one or two mongering trip per year, perhaps. But for someone who makes 5 to 6 trips per year, $20-40 K per year just on luxury class tickets would easily double my annual holiday budget.

Anyway, if the price point was closer to 2 x compared to economy tickets, that would be my personal point of fair value.

As for hotels, it just depends on why I'm traveling and with whom. I'm still not above staying in hostels if backpacking through whatever region that I am exploring. In fact, it's sometimes preferred as many hostels are naturally social environments. On the other hand, if I am traveling with a lady or to a tropical leisure locale, will I shell out extra money versus a budget roach motel? Of course. Have I stayed at a $15 per night hotel when driving across the country? Also yes.

[AznHotBoy]

I was never into watching others fuck or getting watched while I fuck, but maybe one day, I might began to be further hentai LOL!

Very much the same for me at the beginning of my FKK journey. Wasn't shy or curious for any public action, even thought it was a bit weird.

That all changed in 2018, when I brought a good friend with me to FKK land and we double teamed a FKK "superstar" LOL!

It was quite the life changing experience I would say. First thing and most important thing, it totally broke the illusion I had with the girl. Seeing her being used like a piece of fuck meat in person is definitely a refreshing perspective I greatly needed LOL! Seeing her sucked my friend the exact way she sucked me made me realize she just was really good at her job and it was just a job at the end of the day. Secondly, it made my friendship with my friend a lot better. We had a unique friend experience that many men don't share and it was definitely worth it just to have a deep friendship! Lastly, it brought me pleasure to be to public with my actions, not something I actively seek but there is a level of satisfaction I have now knowing others are watching us fuck.

In fact, my last FKK action of 2020 was public during GT's Chinese New Years party where all the rooms were full. The girl I was with really got into it when she realized I was really into it. We did it in the cinema room and it was packed, but people gave us room for what we needed to do.

[The Cane]

I don't know how much experience of business and first class you have but I have a lot and find that economy just doesn't do it anymore. I don't think anyone ever likes these intercon-trips (especially the east bound) but having sampled the goods up at the front it's even harder. The same goes for the hotels too. These 2-star hotels near the Hauptbahnhof are impossible to stay at these days and don't get me started on older 2-3 star hotels in the US. I don't need 5 star but the level of what's acceptable is obviously higher these days.

That means that even when I'm travelling for pleasure I try to find a way to move myself up one class. And even when I'm staying a little longer in Frankfurt or Zrich for FKK I won't move hotels to some dump. Instead I will move to a Hyatt or Intercontinental. After the pandemic I will be watching prices closely because as it is I have a real need for personal travel. My employer on the other hand found their convenient excuse to cut the travel budget almost entirely. Let's see about 2022.

I don't see myself travelling to FKK cities much unless I can hide it behind a 'legitimate' reason so I'll absolutely be one of those travellers that won't bring additional income to those cities.

I'm with you on the flights. Once you've experienced first and business class travel it's really, really hard to go back to economy / coach. At this point in my life, when it comes to leisure travel by air, I will be sticking with at least premium class seats. Economy / coach or "cattle cabin" class is simply too uncomfortable. No more landing with a sore neck! As for hotel rooms, I tend to stick with 3-star to 4-star hotels. You can find some of those near the hauptbanhofs in the big cities, which is where I prefer to stay in Germany since I take the train a lot, and it's easy to find a taxi too if you need one. Although, I have Uber and Lyft, and will be seeking to utilize those services more often.

[The Cane]

That's a good point, well then, I will be that hentai mofo between the curtain of down stairs room by cinema in Artemis voyeur-ing some mongers session through that crack of the curtain LOL!

I am planning to go to Globe public sex day at one point though!

I fucked Marketa in the ass in one of those little rooms with the crack in the curtains LOL!

[Ararat]

As a value travel shopper, I fear that your assessment may be correct. Without airlines benefiting from high-profit margin tickets, the cost might just be transferred to economy class ticket purchasers.

I do hold out hope due to one phenomenon. The median income of my peer group is somewhere in the low 6 figure range. That's a fairly high number although hardly wealthy. That being said, for personal travel, most of them rarely purchase first class or business class tickets for long haul flights. Even my $200 K+ earner friends rarely purchase those tickets. The ones who do fly business and first class are usually a special group. They are the weekly business travelers in consulting and perhaps sales. Due to their frequency of travel on company dime, they manage to achieve platinum / diamond airline status meanwhile accumulating up to millions of frequent flyer / reward miles / points. Because of this, their seats are frequently upgraded while traveling for business and when "purchasing" a ticket for personal use, they just use their rewards points / miles to be upgraded to business and first class.

I suspect that a large chunk of business and first class travelers are upgrades and rewards users. If this is true, then perhaps the loss of business class revenue may not be as great as it may appear on the surface.

I don't know how much experience of business and first class you have but I have a lot and find that economy just doesn't do it anymore. I don't think anyone ever likes these intercon-trips (especially the east bound) but having sampled the goods up at the front it's even harder. The same goes for the hotels too. These 2-star hotels near the Hauptbahnhof are impossible to stay at these days and don't get me started on older 2-3 star hotels in the US. I don't need 5 star but the level of what's acceptable is obviously higher these days.

That means that even when I'm travelling for pleasure I try to find a way to move myself up one class. And even when I'm staying a little longer in Frankfurt or Zürich for FKK I won't move hotels to some dump. Instead I will move to a Hyatt or Intercontinental. After the pandemic I will be watching prices closely because as it is I have a real need for personal travel. My employer on the other hand found their convenient excuse to cut the travel budget almost entirely. Let's see about 2022.

I don't see myself travelling to FKK cities much unless I can hide it behind a 'legitimate' reason so I'll absolutely be one of those travellers that won't bring additional income to those cities.

[McAdonis]

My other optimistic hold out. I've always felt that business class tickets are extremely artificially bloated due to careless company spending. With smaller amounts of business travelers filling up the first class seats, perhaps the market will dictate that business class tickets come down to a reasonable price practical to the upper middle class. At current prices, there is no way I'm willing to spend a few months of home mortgage on one intercontinental plane ticket.

Despite there being fewer flights and those flights being emptier, both business class and economy are currently pricing higher than 2020: https://edition.cnn.com/travel/artic...nes/index.html.

On SecretFlying, you can still find USA to mainland Europe flights for $275-400 in the April-December 2021 timeframe. A lot can happen in 3-12 months. Airlines could go bankrupt. International borders could close or you could contract CV19 a week before your flight and be unable to fly. Would change fees be waived? What would the refund process look like?

Regional airfares should be stable in Europe as long Ryanair and Wizzair are still operating. Ryanair I would assume has very little dependence on business travellers. Each booked seat costs Ryanair on average 47 EUR while they on average charge each passenger 37 EUR. Ryanair is willing to take that 10 EUR loss on each seat because: (1) they know they can fill each plane, and (2) their predictive analytics show that each passenger spends on average 17 EUR on ancillary services (extra luggage, priority boarding, beverages, lottery tickets). This business model allowed Ryanair to be the most profitable airline in Europe: https://simpleflying.com/how-low-cos...rs-make-money/.

Returning to subject of long-haul travel. Back in 2018, low cost carriers like WOW Air, LEVEL and Norwegian Air were offering dirt cheap flights to Americans wishing to cross the Atlantic. This forced traditional carriers like United and Delta to lower their pricing to remain competitive. So a lot may depend on if these budget airlines can stay financially afloat. And if Norwegian Air collapses like WOW Air did in 2019, will other low cost carriers emerge to replace them? From a regulatory standpoint, I am not sure what the barrier to entry is like. Governments could choose to lower the taxes and bureaucratic red tape. Governments still own and operate some of the world's major airports, so in theory NYC could lower the fees they charge to airlines that land in JFK.

Governments also hold on to airports because they see them as economic-development tools that provide indirect boosts to their bottom line assets that attract businesses and tourists, for instance. Thats certainly an argument in favor of building an airport. Once an airport is built, however, those indirect benefits will continue no matter whos in charge of daily operations.

Globally, airport privatization has been going on since 1987, when Margaret Thatcher put Londons Heathrow on the block. Today, more than 100 major airports around the world are privately run. In 2018, three-quarters of all passenger traffic in Europe and 66 percent of all passenger traffic in Latin America and the Caribbean passed through privately run airports, according to Airports Council International.

https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2020/08/sell-airports/615331/

[Sirioja]

I wish for it but unfortunately it is not the case, I am not a good fucker contrary to many guys on this forum who are able to make the prostitutes coming so often and many times, I am also a very bad driver contrary to so many guys who are even better than Hamilton.

Difference between brothels and real life is easier to make cum on DATY than fucking WGs because their pussy is less fresh from many fuckings and of course they have less desire in brain than should have your girlfriend. But not so difficult on DATY, with some girls helping, rubbing clit on your tongue, or leading You to their spots if they trust You, and some returning to repeat. When some women, like some WGs, tell me, I often heard women about boring sex just for fast emptying balls. When I ask about foreplay, many women in real life look at me with round eyes, who is this alien? Maybe why many have headache to avoid sex. My 2 last girlfriends, divorced little mum, refused sex with their husband, I had to be patient, starting with only kissing but they kissed me so much like with their child, looking for tenderness, then after few weeks, only foreplay to open them and succeed to lead them to orgasm, then they trusted me enough only after 2/3 months, but then never told me about headache, even under period, but telling with smile: I go to bed, I wait for you, when I was sometimes watching football, or still working. Both were 12 years of my life and great school to learn about women, rebuilding them to make them feel woman, not only being mother with no sexuality, when we learned about sexuality together, adapting to each other, and I adapted on first months for them, for their sweetness, tenderness, kindness, beauty, but also for what they did' t know yet they would become, but I already felt from their passionate sweet kissing. I remember when I told them: I would like You sleep full naked with me, you don't have to be afraid of me, I saw fear in their eyes, I didn't insist, but later telling me: put it off. If I met last one when I was 18 , I would have liked to have only her for woman of my life, kissing with no more teeth when we would be old, as we often laughed about. Sexuality in normal life is so far higher level than with prostitutes who don t know much.

About cars, when you drove H3 E21 and RS500 Cosworth daily for more than 20 years, my rodeo girl as I told my girlfriends who were jealous and asked me to sell: I don't want You die in this car, I need You for my new life, nothing about money they never asked me, but now, Audi are so easy and I find even easier with no quattro which make me problems to feel rear reactions, and if You really drove many kilometers, especially at night, sometimes after skiing or climbing whole day, You should know speed and adrenaline help not to feel asleep when You are used to drive many kilometers. Facts are no girl never took me to any desk of staff, and I never crashed injured anybody in more than 35 years, often pushing to grip limit and maximum engine power, and not even when skiing, injuring only me. Not so bad for a bad guy, but still improving like good old French wine, even I don't drink.

[Sirioja]

After the pandemic, whenever this finish, how do you imagine the FKK scene will be?

Will its change from before corona or it stay the same?

If it change what do you think will change? More or less girls? Better services? Change prices?

I know its hard to tell for sure. But just wondering.

I think not much will change. Maybe more girls (hopefully) which will lead to more competition between girls and better services overall.

When some clubs reopened after first confine, I didn't see difference, girls don't care about virus, they just want money. I'm pretty sure to mistake, but wish for less long time girls, maybe retired, and more fresh blood needing money from crisis, and even only one elegant beauty would be great for me, but pretty sure granny Sylvana will be back, question being where? Other question being when reopening when Germany is now in big trouble. I think Switzerland should reopen on March or April, when they still have few clubs remaining open until 7 pm.

[ExpatLover]

After the pandemic, whenever this finish, how do you imagine the FKK scene will be?

Will its change from before corona or it stay the same?

If it change what do you think will change? More or less girls? Better services? Change prices?

I know its hard to tell for sure. But just wondering.

I think not much will change. Maybe more girls (hopefully) which will lead to more competition between girls and better services overall.

I think like in the recent years a another decrease of the fresh natural beauties, there will be always the same veteran and overfucked girls around. Where should the young fresh girls from? So many companies are switching from China to Hungary, Romania therefor it is easier for the girls to find a job. The same happened to Poland from 2010 to 2015 were we faced a strong decrease from the Polish girls in the FKK.

[Rambambinoz]

After the pandemic, whenever this finish, how do you imagine the FKK scene will be?

Will its change from before corona or it stay the same?

If it change what do you think will change? More or less girls? Better services? Change prices?

I know its hard to tell for sure. But just wondering.

I think not much will change. Maybe more girls (hopefully) which will lead to more competition between girls and better services overall.

I don't think they will be back to normal straight away. I think they will initially reopen in the same way Artemis did, masks, temp checks, sanitisers everywhere. They will most likely ease these measures over time. I thought the attitude of the girls was really good when I visited Artemis in September under the measures.

[Mr Ho]

You never know until you try LOL.

That's a good point, well then, I will be that hentai mofo between the curtain of down stairs room by cinema in Artemis voyeur-ing some mongers session through that crack of the curtain LOL!

I am planning to go to Globe public sex day at one point though!

[Tuber19]

After the pandemic, whenever this finish, how do you imagine the FKK scene will be?

Will its change from before corona or it stay the same?

If it change what do you think will change? More or less girls? Better services? Change prices?

I know its hard to tell for sure. But just wondering.

I think not much will change. Maybe more girls (hopefully) which will lead to more competition between girls and better services overall.

[Mursenary]

Any kind of reward points doled out are the result of high spending. Airlines are not going to reward 50 cents on every dollar spent. RE: travellers who use rewards earned from business travel towards personal travel, from the airline's standpoint, that is still probably quite lucrative business model. To even qualify for that upgrade in the first place, somebody (usually the company) must have spent significant sums of money. In that sense, we could consider that upgrade as being "prepaid".

Many companies allow employees to keep the points they earn from business travel as a perk. If that same corporate travel policy also allows the employee to pick their own flights, then the employee is NOT incentivized to find the best deal and save their company money.

if you have fewer of these scenarios where "someone else" is footing the bill, then you have more cost-conscious customers, which means airlines could see lower profit margins even on their economy tickets.

Here is a place where we could possibly hold out hope: perhaps governments will step in and subsidize airlines..

For sure, business travel is a (the) backbone of airline travel for all of the reasons that you stated and airlines will take a hit no matter what. No doubt that without government intervention, the retraction of business travel culture will lead to leisure travelers eating some of the loss of profit in the form of higher ticket higher prices.

I'm just offering some hope of optimism in that the mere loss in business class sales by actual business travelers may not be what actually leads to the direct loss in airline profit margins. The bulk of business travelers are still flying economy but are superficially making it appear as if all of the business class seats were actually purchased in hard cash, as in direct profits. Point is, a bigger loss might actually come from the lack of daily economy class business travelers, and perhaps like you said, last minute economy class business travelers paying bloated economy ticket prices.

One would think that senior management travel currently travel less than the young consultant and middle level company lieutenants, leaving the latter to handle the weekly logistics and stress of company operations. The former are probably the ones that always travel business class or higher while the young, weekly travelers are relegated to those economy class tickets. Perhaps the former's travel habits will be less affected in the post pandemic world and actual business class sales do not suffer as much of a direct loss as it would suggest on the surface.

My other optimistic hold out. I've always felt that business class tickets are extremely artificially bloated due to careless company spending. With smaller amounts of business travelers filling up the first class seats, perhaps the market will dictate that business class tickets come down to a reasonable price practical to the upper middle class. At current prices, there is no way I'm willing to spend a few months of home mortgage on one intercontinental plane ticket.

[Carpaccio18]

I was never into watching others fuck or getting watched while I fuck, but maybe one day, I might began to be further hentai LOL!

You never know until you try LOL.