German FKK Clubs - Lounge and chat area

[Mr Ho]

It depends if the pandemic comes to an end soon because no one will invest in a club if the club stays closed during two thirds of the year.

That is one way to look at it, but it is good to buy not now, but soon as it is expected to open at least in 2022, so those surviving cost can be deducted from the investment amount, why 2022, well that is the are one has to gamble as investment has some gambling nature to it unfortunately!

2021, we will partly live with pandemic I think. But nobody knows! Vaccines thing is very promising news!

[McAdonis]

If there is a belief that international business traffic will not return to a significant level, I think it will be difficult for investors to back new budget airlines. I think this is going to be made worse by the loans that governments have made to the large flagship carriers. Why would governments subsidize new low-cost carriers when they stand the best chance of being repaid with existing large carriers being able to charge significant fares?

I believe there is a real possibility that "business travel" will not return to a significant level, but I imagine that the demand for leisure will return to normal levels. I would assume that over 95 percent of people on a budget airline are leisure travellers. Ryanair is a budget airline that is the most profitable in Europe. But to your point, long-haul budget airlines haven't been able to replicate the success of Ryanair using no-frills, ancillary services business model.

And there will be a large number of American travelers who saved up vacation funds during the pandemic without actually vacationing. I think they will pay $1,500 - $2,000 each for tickets to Europe, the major carriers will fill that sweet spot of 75-85 percent capacity, but the overall demand will not be significant enough to allow a resurgence of low-cost carriers to enter the market for a few years, and we won't see the bargain fares and the nice availability of business class seats at low mileage award levels like we did the last few years. But I could be very much wrong. I didn't think the stock markets would soar like they have during the pandemic, and I tend to be a pessimist.

So hopefully your forecast analysis will be more accurate than mine.

TBH, I am not that confident in my forecast. Mostly just optimism.

Some interesting statistics on USA outbound travel. Broken down by reason for travel, age range, state of residence, destination, ethnicity, and much more. Perhaps someone can find insights in there.

https://www.beyondsummits.com/sites/...8%EF%BC%89.pdf

https://travel.trade.gov/outreachpag...-Overseas.xlsx

https://travel.trade.gov/outreachpag...nd_Profile.pdf

https://travel.trade.gov/outreachpag...nd-Europe.xlsx

[Sirioja]

Are FKK Clubs open? If not, do anyone know when they will open?

4 in Switzerland, until 7 pm. 1 is only direkt zimmer.

[The Cane]

I have already made my estimation. I won't think about travelling this year. I will probably start to think about travelling in summer, 2022. I will probably actually travel some time in 2023.

I hope to do some domestic travel this year. Then hopefully international in 2022.

[Gfefan]

Are FKK Clubs open? If not, do anyone know when they will open?

[Turgid]

You are probably right, the question when will it be post covid, it looks like that more and more there are doubts about the vaccine efficiency specially against the Brazil or south African variants, Manaus had also reached a herd immunity of 70% and now is again hardly hit with the new variant, not really encouraging, even Pfister is speaking today about a new shot which will be needed to better protect the people. In Europe the situation is getting worse and worse and probably France will go for the 3rd lockdown Thursday. I am afraid that we will have to live many years with that covid and the different variants and that there will not be a unique remedy like for the normal flue which we were able to put under control.

I have already made my estimation. I won't think about travelling this year. I will probably start to think about travelling in summer, 2022. I will probably actually travel some time in 2023.

[BigBuddy69]

I think it will be more like change of the ownership of some FKK clubs than closing for good because I imagine the license to operate FKK clubs are hard to obtain, so lucrative thing to sell!?

It depends if the pandemic comes to an end soon because no one will invest in a club if the club stays closed during two thirds of the year.

[Mr Ho]

It's difficult to tell, it also depends of the number of clubs closing for good.

But more important, it also depends of the attitude of the guys.

For example, I related before the story of the German girl Olivia in GT who first asked for 100 euros / hour but took 75 euros without problems when I reminded her it was the club price.

But you can see that this dude was upsold by the same girl despite being a regular, only because he didn't dare to remind her the rules.

So when the clubs will reopen, if all the customers are so desperate to have sex that they'll accept every conditions, yes the prices will increase. You just need to have some balls and to be ready to say 'no'.

I think it will be more like change of the ownership of some FKK clubs than closing for good because I imagine the license to operate FKK clubs are hard to obtain, so lucrative thing to sell!?

[Mongerer88]

In #18605 I mentioned role of discount carriers (Ryanair, Wizzair, WOW Air, Norwegian Air). The consensus seems to be that the prices for international airfares will go up. We were just looking for glimmers of hope, and trying to imagine scenarios where these price hikes won't be too steep or permanent.

With discounters going out of business, shouldn't there be excess aircraft and unemployed pilots? If government is able to remove bureaucratic red tape and find ways to encourage investors, why couldn't new discount airlines enter the picture?

Not only should USA encourage Americans to travel to the Grand Canyon, they should also encourage Chinese, Europeans, Russians, Japanese tourists to visit the Grand Canyon.

Italian businesses have been courting Chinese shoppers for years. Probably a third of all Prada, Gucci, and LV bags are purchased by Chinese tourists. The 19-24 percent VAT (sales tax) is already waived for tourists outside of the EU, but I believe you are required to fill out paperwork at the airport. What if they waived that? Governments could also waive tourist visa fees.

Hopefully it works out that way.

My concern is that we enter a period of classic Those With Capital Have No Ambition and Those With Ambition Have No Capital.

Perhaps that is a bit misdirected, though. Most budget carriers rely on filling their planes to the max. If there is a belief that international business traffic will not return to a significant level, I think it will be difficult for investors to back new budget airlines. I think this is going to be made worse by the loans that governments have made to the large flagship carriers. Why would governments subsidize new low-cost carriers when they stand the best chance of being repaid with existing large carriers being able to charge significant fares? And there will be a large number of American travelers who saved up vacation funds during the pandemic without actually vacationing. I think they will pay $1,500 - $2,000 each for tickets to Europe, the major carriers will fill that sweet spot of 75-85 percent capacity, but the overall demand will not be significant enough to allow a resurgence of low-cost carriers to enter the market for a few years, and we won't see the bargain fares and the nice availability of business class seats at low mileage award levels like we did the last few years. But I could be very much wrong. I didn't think the stock markets would soar like they have during the pandemic, and I tend to be a pessimist.

So hopefully your forecast analysis will be more accurate than mine.

[Sirioja]

I remember seeing weekly at Bruggen be choices for 75/60 but often sitting on stool, when stars who worked for 100/60 and not less, were always full busy. Easy, just have to be able to understand all girls don't worth same rate. Beauties for 100/60 is good deal for me, when I won't even pay 50 for 90% of FKK WGs, because not pretty enough, or not attractive behavior, too prostitute, not enough charm. Each one own tastes of course, when many guys don't feel good with beauties, but I look only for.

[McAdonis]

I don't think you folks are focusing enough on the role of discount airlines in creating price havoc the last few years.

Their existence created overcapacity on many international routes and the big carriers price matched to an extent.

In #18605 I mentioned role of discount carriers (Ryanair, Wizzair, WOW Air, Norwegian Air). The consensus seems to be that the prices for international airfares will go up. We were just looking for glimmers of hope, and trying to imagine scenarios where these price hikes won't be too steep or permanent.

Many discounters have gone out of business during Covid and won't come back. With a lack of pricing competition from low-cost carriers, the major airlines may not offer competitive international fares for years to come.

With discounters going out of business, shouldn't there be excess aircraft and unemployed pilots? If government is able to remove bureaucratic red tape and find ways to encourage investors, why couldn't new discount airlines enter the picture?

Why would the USA Subsidize international air travel for Americans? They would rather Americans travel to the Grand Canyon instead of Europe.

Not only should USA encourage Americans to travel to the Grand Canyon, they should also encourage Chinese, Europeans, Russians, Japanese tourists to visit the Grand Canyon.

Italian businesses have been courting Chinese shoppers for years. Probably a third of all Prada, Gucci, and LV bags are purchased by Chinese tourists. The 19-24 percent VAT (sales tax) is already waived for tourists outside of the EU, but I believe you are required to fill out paperwork at the airport. What if they waived that? Governments could also waive tourist visa fees.

Whether it is a consortium of local businesses or local governments, isn't it common to subsidize costs to encourage tourists to visit? Las Vegas already does this, but do they only do that for domestic tourists? "An Italian island will pay for your flights and hotel in new scheme to encourage tourists to return": https://www.thesun.co.uk/travel/1147...hotel-flights/.

[McAdonis]

The airline industry has taken a massive hit and post covid will continue to suffer. Businesses have shifted away from person to person meetings to online meetings via Zoom, etc. In such an environment airlines cannot increase their prices, they may have to maintain their fares or even reduce. Competition will see to that. Same for hotels. The leisure and entertainment industries (except Pornhub, Netflix and the like) will suffer the most post covid. Major changes are coming.

Many airlines had dirt cheap airfares in summer prior to the second peak. It seems they are experimenting with pricing at the opposite end. In #18605, the link I provided is from December 30th. It states that for March 2021 departures, business class is currently 70 percent higher, and economy class is 18 percent higher. Even the author seems baffled by their current pricing, noting that in the fall, there was a 20 percent decrease in demand for business class:

"So for now, the airlines have raised their 2021 prices to make up for the lack of demand. But if demand stays low, expect them to fall."

https://edition.cnn.com/travel/article/winter-aviation-covid-airlines/index.html..

Like WGs, airlines can be extremely irrational with their pricing and at other times extremely calculated. If you read sites like thepointsguy, the airlines base everything on algorithms and categorize each seat accordingly. Even if they have five empty business class seats six hours before take off, the airline may only offer upgrades to three people. And each of those will be charged for that upgrade differently based on their status. The airline deliberately leaves one or two business class seats empty on the off chance that some last minute bookings come in. Algorithms probably tell them that their is a 10 percent chance that they could make $7000 profit on a last minute booking and a 90 percent chance that seat goes empty and they make $0. The airlines are fine rolling the dice.

A Sharks WG might run those same calculations in her head at 03:00 during a busy Messe weekend. There may be a recognizable face, and she knows that he usually does 50 EUR rooms. She may refuse that cheap charlie, and just smoke with her friends, absolutely fine with making zero EUR those last two hours of her shift. Because she knows there is a 10 percent that some fresh-meat, clueless business traveller arrives last minute, who she can more easily overcharge. Isn't that what airlines do? Take advantage of the desperate? If you were on day five of an eight day trip and had to take the first flight back home due to a family emergency, you think the airline would give you a discount? (assuming you had no status).

That said, some WGs, who are currently working out of hotels, are adopting other "airline strategies". These WGs are overbooking themselves with the knowledge that a small percentage will no show. If both clients actually show up resulting in an overlap, she will make one of them wait in his car. Again she's doing mental calculations. If she knows the monger drove one hour to the booking and he is not a married guy who has to rush back home to the wife, then she can probably get away with making him wait 30-60 minutes.

[Mongerer88]

I don't think you folks are focusing enough on the role of discount airlines in creating price havoc the last few years.

Their existence created overcapacity on many international routes and the big carriers price matched to an extent.

The lower prices also gave incentive for the big airlines to make a lot of seats available for award mileage redemption, including coveted business class seats, on USA To Europe routes. And incidentally the gap in comfort / service between business class has widened over the years. The experience of a lie-flat business class seat is phenomenal versus the recliner type business seat of years ago. Similarly, airlines once had international seat configurations in coach class decades ago that gave more legroom than domestic seat configurations, but that is no longer the case.

Many discounters have gone out of business during Covid and won't come back. With a lack of pricing competition from low-cost carriers, the major airlines may not offer competitive international fares for years to come. And they also won't offer many business class seats at the lowest award redemption levels. And many Americans have been accumulating frequent flier miles the past year via credit card sign-ups and spending, but have not been redeeming those miles. So their will be natural inflation that occurs when the miles build up, but seat availability does not.

And while governments may offer subsidies to encourage travel, I think it will be geared toward hotels and restaurants. Why would the USA Subsidize international air travel for Americans? They would rather Americans travel to the Grand Canyon instead of Europe. If my hypothesis is correct, local Europeans will be glad that Americans who primarily purchase commercial sex overseas will not arrive en masse with the money they have been saving, and drive up European prices. But I am skeptical that we will see easy availability in terms of affordable travel, especially in business class, from the USA To Europe in the near future.

The wild card is if the USA Is able to vaccinate its population sooner than most of Europe, and travel is opened to the vaccinated, prior to most everyone being vaccinated. Their will be a sweet spot where there are more airline seats available than travelers eligible to travel. That could create favorable short-term pricing consequences.

[ExpatLover]

The airline industry has taken a massive hit and post covid will continue to suffer. Businesses have shifted away from person to person meetings to online meetings via Zoom, etc. In such an environment airlines cannot increase their prices, they may have to maintain their fares or even reduce. Competition will see to that. Same for hotels. The leisure and entertainment industries (except Pornhub, Netflix and the like) will suffer the most post covid. Major changes are coming.

You are probably right, the question when will it be post covid, it looks like that more and more there are doubts about the vaccine efficiency specially against the Brazil or south African variants, Manaus had also reached a herd immunity of 70% and now is again hardly hit with the new variant, not really encouraging, even Pfister is speaking today about a new shot which will be needed to better protect the people. In Europe the situation is getting worse and worse and probably France will go for the 3rd lockdown Thursday. I am afraid that we will have to live many years with that covid and the different variants and that there will not be a unique remedy like for the normal flue which we were able to put under control.

[AznHotBoy]

Secondly, for the Devil's threesome, I think it would be beneficial to ensure somewhat similar member "size". The relationship with your friend may never be the same after simultaneously banging a girl but the friend is either super small or ridiculously big, LOL.

I don't know about you but I didn't have the luxury to pick my friends based on penis size. If it turned out my best friend had a 12 inch dick, I would high-five him and tell him at least god blessed the right man LOL!

The friend I brought was a very different man than me, in every way possible. Sure his penis was a bit bigger but he was also a lot taller and older than me. He's about 6'2 and I'm 5'9, and at the time I was still in my 20's and he was already half way through his 40's. He has 2 kids, recently divorced, only had sex with 2 girls his entire life (by the end of our trip it was a round 20), and extremely depressed at the time.

When we first landed in Germany he was a bit nervous to go to the club, typical middle aged American man scared of pussy. Then when we got inside he was too nervous to talk to any girls and followed me very closely. I was jokingly telling him it looked like he was going to go to room with me if I find a girl I liked. He was surprisingly very open to that idea. Then I found my reliable "super star" and talked her into taking the both of us. Once we got into the room, I told her to work on my friend first. She started sucking him and about a minute or 2 he busted a nut in her mouth, without even asking or telling her. LOL! I was laughing my ass off and it also got me really excited. Watching her take a fat load in the mouth from an old man that probably didn't cum for months if not years was something to be experienced. Her facial expressions, the noises she makes, and her continued effort to suck out the last drop. These are sights that I usually miss because I'm too busy cumming a fat load myself. But having someone else doing the cumming allows me to savor these facial and body expressions from a 3rd person perspective that was impossible before.

It was at that moment, I realized I've reached a different level on my FKK journey LOL!