LilJoey vs Climaxnow, Uke Boy, Muddy7, Barba, et al.

[LilJoey]

Lj, Ronald, Poeker Player, Limarian, Kirch, I suspect are all one poster. The reports of these members all break down to the common denominator of Rio. Five members with absolutely zero depth to there mongering personality. Never an opinion about Slavic girls that goes beyond how pretty they are.

Let's be clear on something, I have no problem with Rio. If I visit Kiev, I will probably visit this place. However, I do have a problem with non authentic members posting on the forum. Is it really worth it LJ to misguide newbies.

What's wrong Uke Boy? Have you forgotten what you posted under Climaxnow's name in his / your recent post? Climaxnow wrote explicitly he was in Rio once each week for three weeks in a row. Now you have Climaxnow writing that he will probably go to Rio when he visits Kiev, as if he hasn't been there before. You are contradicting yourself. I know it's hard to keep track of what you're writing under each of your profiles, Uke Boy. But it's obvious you goofed on this Climaxnow report you just posted.

Also anyone reading my posts, and especially my recent posts attempting to correct your false posts and shilling accusations, will have read the information and facts I reported and explanation of my conclusions and the reasons for my conclusions, which are logical. So they will know that I'm not misguiding anyone. Rather they will realize that it is you (Uke Boy, Climaxnow, and Muddy7) which are writing false things and are being destructive to the truth and this forum, and are attempting to misguide newbies.

[Muddy7]

Lj, Ronald, Poeker Player, Limarian, Kirch, I suspect are all one poster. The reports of these members all break down to the common denominator of Rio. Five members with absolutely zero depth to there mongering personality. Never an opinion about Slavic girls that goes beyond how pretty they are.

Let's be clear on something, I have no problem with Rio. If I visit Kiev, I will probably visit this place. However, I do have a problem with non authentic members posting on the forum. Is it really worth it LJ to misguide newbies.

Liljoey is a loser with different usernames, go find something better to do pal, only 4-5 posters read your garbage.

Any poster who keeps posting all these long posts about a joint is a loser or maybe just dumb.

Hey Joey, I'm thinking about sending a letter to Slava(admin) at RIO and let him what a poor job your are doing, maybe he can hire a smarter shill

[LilJoey]

Lj, Ronald, Poeker Player, Limarian, Kirch, I suspect are all one poster. The reports of these members all break down to the common denominator of Rio. Five members with absolutely zero depth to there mongering personality. Never an opinion about Slavic girls that goes beyond how pretty they are.

Let's be clear on something, I have no problem with Rio. If I visit Kiev, I will probably visit this place. However, I do have a problem with non authentic members posting on the forum. Is it really worth it LJ to misguide newbies.

Uke Boy you have now betrayed your hand and exposed yourself. It is now clear that what you have done is open multiple profiles on this forum, and that you have been posting your ludicrous smear attacks on my posts using Uke Boy, Climaxnow, and Muddy7, forum usernames, which explains the attacks in tandem orchestrated by you, with each post supporting the other. It also explains why no amount of patient response with facts and logic could get through to Climaxnow or Muddy7, since both are simply you, Uke Boy, writing under those names.

Truly Machiavellian. Not a bad scheme as schemes go. But you have exposed yourself with the hand that points the finger, which has three other fingers pointing back at yourself. You are a malicious and destructive son of a gun. You really should be banned from this forum.

I hope Jackson has a way of figuring out that you posted multiple profiles. I hope you are banned from this forum for being destructive.

LJ

[LilJoey]

LJ.

While Samuel Johnson said that "the last refuge of a scoundrel was patriotism," in your case, your only last refuge is to lash out in hatred, anger and insults. We now know you to actually be a complete nut case, who, when someone disagrees with you, and that has been the case as well in many of your other posts, you descend even farther below from where you come from, the sewers, the abattoirs and the garbage dumps of the city.

It is also interesting that you not only denigrate me but also other readers and contributors. You really are someone filled with unbounded hatred. Anyone who disagrees with you must then be the recipient of your bitter vile and, worse yet, your painfully bad writing.

You have not reasoned your case that you are not a shill with this ridiculous out of control rant that actual had me laughing. In fact, with this cascade of antagonism, it shows me more than ever that you are a shill for Rio trying everything possible, especially with no-class personal attacks, to try and keep his job. Are your Rio bosses unhappy about this turn of events?

I now leave it to the readers of this forum to decide about the truth of the matter as they see it. So should you.

Uke Boy, I really don't hate you or anyone. I am very affronted by your false accusations and I value truth. I have invested considerable effort in trying to provide newbies with a sound analysis of the p4p scene in Kiev. Your malicious attempts to undermine my opinion with reckless accusations of shilling have damaged this forum and board. You have falsified and conducted a smear campaign for no valid reason. You have never discussed or debated a fact. Just smear and false accusation. It has done its damage as you have mislead a few of the unsuspecting to doubt my reports, which they have never read, and because of you, they will not derive the benefit I had tried to provide for them.

I now realize that what you have done is to open multiple profiles on this forum, and you are writing your silly but destructive posts under your Uke Boy handle, as well as your Climaxnow profile name, as well as your Muddy7 profile name. I wondered about why it was that Muddy seemed to be limited to be trying out mostly girls I had written about, out of all the other girls in the club, and ascribing to them lower values than I had ascribed. It now makes some sense that it was you trying to substantiate the idea you then wrote under your Uke Boy name that I "consistently overrate the girls". It is remarkable, now realizing what you have done in opening multiple profiles, how your attacks on me come in tandem, like a carefully orchestrated barrage, from Uke Boy, Climaxnow, and Muddy7, and who knows how many other false profiles you are writing under. It also explains why logic and facts have absolutely no effect on the almost robotic responses coming from Climaxnow and Muddy7.

What is behind your Machiavellian attacks on my posts is irrelevant. Your capacity for destructiveness warrants that you be banned from this thread.

Why don't you contribute something to the forum in terms of usable information for newbies, instead of the drek that you spew with malice and no constructive end.

[LilJoey]

The intelligent readers can see right through you.

I didn't say those readers who think they are intelligent, but nevertheless make up their minds without actually reading my posts, showing disdain for the actual facts. Not a sign of intelligence, by the way.

I said,"The more intelligent readers who have read my posts know that I have only written with the intent of being helpful to the newbies contemplating a trip to Kiev. The sheer breadth of information I have discussed, completely unrelated to Rio, should show a normal reader that Uke Boy is peddling bullshit."

Anyone who has actually read all my posts would know that the reason for my conclusion in 2011 that in the absence of an option like River Palace, Rio was the next best option for those visitors to Kiev on a short trip who want to get high level p4p pussy on a more or less reliable basis, was based on the facts that it was cheaper, and more efficient there. Yes, it's the lazy man's option, and doesn't involve the "thrill of the chase". So what? These visitors to Kiev, in town for only a few days don't care about that as they don't have time to run around "thrilling in the chase" and maybe not getting what they had hoped. They are not coming to Kiev to gamble with whether they will have a beautiful woman in their bed each of their few nights in town. They want to know what is the best, easiest and most reliable way to get a hottie for p4p. Therefore, since using websites in Kiev like mamba. Ru and top-modals. Com and others meant dealing with fake pictures and a lot of ugly girls showing up, and although sometimes a better looking girl was reported to have been gotten this way at a cheap price, the key point was there was no guarantee that a hottie would show up, just a chance. Therefore, only the venues where you could see the girl in advance and know she was hot enough for one's tastes were better to look at. And that meant the regular nightclubs which were frequented by WG's or the strip clubs offering "take out", where you could see what you were getting in advance.

My recommendations about going to Rio were not addressed to the guys seeking freebies and the thrill of the chase, or to guys who are in Kiev for longer periods of time, and could afford to miss a night here or there without having a hottie in bed. My comments were directed specifically to guide only those who were in Kiev for a few short days, where every night was precious, and their goal was to bed a real Kiev hottie each night. That's a specialized group of mongers on this board, but a group that needs the most guidance, since they cannot afford the time to waste on trial and error.

In recommending Rio to the short term visitor to Kiev looking for high quality p4p, in preference to the nightclub scene, my reasons were clearly stated: (1) lower cost, and (2) less time waste and more efficiency. These reasons are factual, logical and completely sufficient in and of themselves to explain my stated opinion. Your attempts and Uke Boys attempt to distort and corrupt this forum and substitute some ulterior motive to me in making my recommendations on the p4p scene, fly in the face of these above facts, and are not logical or sensible. It is very clear that Uke Boy has his own ulterior motive and agenda in posting false accusations of "shilling". Facts or truth or logic have nothing to do with it. He seems to have a vendetta against the Rio club. I don't know why. But his false accusations are not based on fact or truth.

I don't think anyone who assesses the factual information that existed in 2011, could reach a different conclusion than I reached.

(1) CHEAPER: Rio prices were $300/3hr take out (a $100 / hr net rate) and $400 / all night (which could be up to 7 or 8 hours, depending on what time you took the girl out and began the date, until the 5:00 AM club closing time (a net rate of as low as $400/8hrs or $50 / hr). The other strip clubs had $400 take out prices. The Working Girls (WG's) in the nightclubs were demanding outrageous prices of $400/2hrs or $500/2hrs, and only some could be negotiated down to around $300/2hrs. (a $150 / hr net rate). Therefore, Rio was demonstrably cheaper than the prices being demanded by the really hot girls in the nightclubs.

(2) MORE EFFICIENT: Furthermore, since the nightclubs were filled with regular girls also, and it was not always so easy to find those who were Working Girls, and the process took time to even locate which girl was "working", and then to have an "interview" with her to judge her potential for GFE, and then negotiate for a lower price, which she generally refused at first, and then play the waiting game in the negotiation, as we used to do at River Palace, where she gets to see that she couldn't get any takers at the higher price she demanded, and then maybe at the end of the evening she might come down in price, and you get the price you wanted maybe 3 hours later. All this time waste, is avoided in a strip club environment like at Rio, because the girls are paraded before you, and prices are fixed by the club.

[Rio had its own type of issues that could interfere with one getting a GFE experience with a hottie from there. Having decided that it was cheaper and more efficient to monger at Rio than at the nightclubs on a short trip, I chose to spend time there and in confronting the problems that exist, I tried to figure out ways to overcome them. And I offered reports about what I experienced and warnings about pitfalls and recommendations on the best way to succeed. ]

Many members are convinced about the truth of what I wrote and have come to the same conclusion about the greater efficiency of mongering at Rio versus the nightclubs. You need only pay attention to the most recent response to your post by another monger, Kirsch.

Hi Climaxnow, you are totally right and I can just agree. BUT for Kiev and not having so much time RIO is the best place. Everywhere else you will spend too much time. For a tourist coming to Kiev and not speaking Russian it's hard to get around and in addition very expensive. So instead of checking Kreshatik during the daytime and night time at McDonalds, Vodka Bar, Buddha Bar, Deluxe, Baby Face Bar, Arena City and and and, you could just go to Rio and spend EUR 10 for entrance and about EUR 5 for Bacardi Cola (cheaper than Germany) and check out all the girls coming straight to your table. I totally agree that recently the girls are not all 10s but still a lot of nice girls. AND as I always write, it's a matter of your attitude what you get later in your apartment! Of course sometime you are wrong and pay a lot of money for a cheap blowjob and f* with condom and she's leaving after 2-3 hours. But I have there many times and the managers know me and give me advice what girl to take. Furthermore with some experience all of the girls were 7-9s and stayed at my apartment until noon. But my conclusion is that I spend my money way better in Germany going to the FKK clubs. How can I say, it`s the all-in package you get, being in a foreign nice country. Hope you understand :-9

Having said all the foregoing, in order not to mislead newbies, by failing to present the entire picture, I add that since Cruiser D, a veteran poster, has reported recently that very hot Working Girls or semi pros can be taken out of regular nightclubs, although he says stay away from Buddha Bar, for prices of $200/2hrs or less, like it used to be in RP days, that this requires a re-evaluation and adjustment to the recommendations for the best place to monger on a short trip to Kiev. No one is happy with the high prices of $300/3hrs plus $50 to $100 in club costs like drinks, and private dances at Rio strip club. So in light of the potentially lower prices for hotties at the regular clubs, it seems adviseable to start at the regular nightclubs that are recommended on this thread, especially if you are in Kiev on a weekend, and see what you can come up with. If you succeed in finding a very hot WG at a nightclub for $200, you will have done significantly better than you could have done at Rio. So why not try? A regular nightclub is a much more fun environment to monger in anyway. Now it could be that even if prices are lower now in the regular nightclubs than at Rio, that the efficiency factors are still better at the strip club. But one can't know this without trying. At the old River Palace, it was not so easy to get a low price, and one had to negotiate hard, and show the girl you were prepared to pass on her unless she came down on price, and this dance often went on for hours until she caved, or maybe she got some other guy to pay her price. But since it was more or less a sure thing that you could get some girl to come home with you from River Palace at a decent price if you were willing to stick it out until the wee hours, we put up with that inefficiency, because the process of the chase was somewhat fun. Yes, even the chase of the very hot WG, not a freebie, was fun. So it's worth it to try at the nightclubs, and keep the strip clubs (Rio or Mandarin or Dolls) in mind as a back up plan. Also, during the daytime, one should definitely try to meet as many mamba girls as one can stomach, because many members have reported sending away many ugly girls, but eventually having a real hottie show up, and for very low prices of $100 or $75, and this is where Kiev shines.

LJ

[Climaxnow]

In my personal opinion Ljs posts are very helpfull and I like to read them a lot. It is maybe true that he overpays girls, but this is his money and his life and he is free to do with them whatever he wishes. Even if he is shill for Rio (which I honestly don't believe) his information is mostly true and relible (eventhough maybe I don't agree about girls beautie, but as it was so much said previously, beauty is on the eyes of beholder). So dear Lj, don't take other mongers attack personally and continue to post your interesting statment as you used to. There are a lot of peaople ready to read them with interest. Those who are not interested can skipp Ljs posts. By the way Lj, I have found Kiev to be much more than only Rio, there is neeed for some effort only and a little bit of luck.

Lj, Ronald, Poeker Player, Limarian, Kirch, I suspect are all one poster. The reports of these members all break down to the common denominator of Rio. Five members with absolutely zero depth to there mongering personality. Never an opinion about Slavic girls that goes beyond how pretty they are.

Let's be clear on something, I have no problem with Rio. If I visit Kiev, I will probably visit this place. However, I do have a problem with non authentic members posting on the forum. Is it really worth it LJ to misguide newbies.

[Uke Boy]

LJ.

While Samuel Johnson said that "the last refuge of a scoundrel was patriotism," in your case, your only last refuge is to lash out in hatred, anger and insults. We now know you to actually be a complete nut case, who, when someone disagrees with you, and that has been the case as well in many of your other posts, you descend even farther below from where you come from, the sewers, the abattoirs and the garbage dumps of the city.

It is also interesting that you not only denigrate me but also other readers and contributors. You really are someone filled with unbounded hatred. Anyone who disagrees with you must then be the recipient of your bitter vile and, worse yet, your painfully bad writing.

You have not reasoned your case that you are not a shill with this ridiculous out of control rant that actual had me laughing. In fact, with this cascade of antagonism, it shows me more than ever that you are a shill for Rio trying everything possible, especially with no-class personal attacks, to try and keep his job. Are your Rio bosses unhappy about this turn of events?

I now leave it to the readers of this forum to decide about the truth of the matter as they see it. So should you.

[Climaxnow]

As for me, I really don't care if a few mindless numbskulls aRe manipulated by guys like Uke Boy and miss out on reading good information and guidance. The more intelligent readers who have read my posts know that I have only written with the intent of being helpful to the newbies contemplating a trip to Kiev. The sheer breadth of information I have discussed, completely unrelated to Rio, should show a normal reader that Uke Boy is peddling bullshit.

The intelligent readers can see right through you.

[LilJoey]

No need for ignore lists Prosal, once shills get called out on the forum they usually dissappear. They can't afford the negative publicity.

Just because Uke Boy falsely lies and writes I'm a shill for Rio, doesn't mean it's so. That's all it takes for guys like you, is his say so? Why should your head be stuck up his ass so far, that facts don't matter to you? I am not and never have been a shill for anything. My recommendations were and are based solely on the facts of where the LEAST expensive top level p4p experience could be had. Do you deny the facts? Do you even know the facts?

After the demise of River Palace toward end of 2010, it's a fact that the Working Girls in the nightclubs like Avalon, Arena, Buddha Bar and when D'lux opened, in D'lux too, were reported to be asking very high prices of $400 and $500, and that was for 2 hours, and they wouldn't negotiate down to lower than $300/2 hours. No need to argue about it. Go look at the reports on this thread from the beginning of 2011 and onward. That's what was being reported. And that's also what I experienced being quoted by the seriously hot girls, the best looking WG's in the regular nightclubs in that period. And it's also a fact that Rio's price was lower at $300 for Three hours. Those are facts. You think someone is a shill for preferring a lower price? That's nonsense.

So once I decided where very hot 8+ girls could be easily found at the lowest rate, I tried to confront the problems you yourself just pointed out in your last post, and find the girls who were good enough looking, and did take out, as quickly as I could, and tried out strategies for interviewing girls all with a goal of getting the GFE experience we're all looking for (which includes BBBJ and DATY). I reported on my successes as well as my failures. Anyone who actually read my posts from the trips I took in 2011, would see the balance and obvious honesty of the presentation.

If in 2012 the prices in the nightclubs have Now come down from where they used to be reported as, as Cruiser D has stated, then I am the first to say that the nightclubs are a better starting point Price-wise than Rio. And guess what? I have said that. In writing. Right here on this thread. But I know that you have not read that, because you were too busy making up your closed mind to accept the mere accusations by Uke Boy, without looking at the facts, and so you decided to leave your head up his ass rather than read what I actually wrote.

If you are interested in the true facts and insight about which I have written in depth and detail, and for which I have received the appreciation of many, you may do so, or you may choose to deny yourself these resources, and follow the recommendations of Uke Boy on this thread. But oh, I forgot. There is not one shred of usable guidance for newbies posted on this thread by Uke Boy in the last year. His presence here has been largely obsessed with malicious confrontation with my posts in his vendetta against Rio. So I guess you will need to discover things on your own.

My recommendations have always been based on the facts of where one could most easily, with the least time waste, locate the hottest level WG's for the least money in Kiev. If it was at River Palace, that's where I went, and would have recommended to go. I wasn't posting in those days in 2010. When things changed, and Rio became the lower priced venue compared to the nightclubs, I started focussing on that venue. If things have changed again and very hot girls are available in the nightclubs at prices lower than Rio, then I am recommending trying the nightclubs first. I go with the facts.

Uke Boy, on the other hand, has a vendetta against Rio. I don't know why. Maybe they tossed him out once, or maybe one of the girls mistreated him. Who knows? Who cares? But for him, just mentioning the fact that the prices were lower in Rio than the nightclubs in 2011, which is a historical fact as reported on this thread on this forum, (you can go and read the reports as no one can fabricate and the record is there) is enough to set him off on his vendetta again. He has resorted to simply lying. He claims that I reported knowing in advance which girls would dance and when, which he then said was insider information. However you can search in vain for any such statement by me in the record. It doesn't exist. Only a record of truthful reporting by me exists in the record of this forum. But Uke Boy makes such statements which are simply false, because he knows it is too much for anyone to care about researching. He relies on the fact that some who didn't read the record will simply accept his words. But he is a LIAR. Let him produce a quote for his claim that I reported on which girl will dance and when in advance based on insider information, that couldn't be obtained by any customer. He can't produce such a quote from me because he is lying about it, and because he is attempting to mislead the readers of this forum by a campaign of slander and libel. It's harsh to say it, but Uke Boy has stepped over a line and should really be banned from this thread. His actions have truly damaged the corpus of valuable information in this thread. If Jackson cares about the quality of information here, let him do something.

As for me, I really don't care if a few mindless numbskulls aRe manipulated by guys like Uke Boy and miss out on reading good information and guidance. The more intelligent readers who have read my posts know that I have only written with the intent of being helpful to the newbies contemplating a trip to Kiev. The sheer breadth of information I have discussed, completely unrelated to Rio, should show a normal reader that Uke Boy is peddling bullshit.

Most of the newbies don't bother to read too far back anyways, so what I posted in 2011, won't be read by them anyways. And this year things are up in the air and changing from month to month. It could be, that after Euro 2012 effects settle down, we will enter an era in which the prices in the nightclubs frequented by WG's will be lower than the prices at strip clubs, as Cruiser D asserts currently, and like it was in the days of the River Palace. In such case, I will be trying the lower priced venues of the nightclubs first, just as I was going to River Palace in its day, and this whole argument over Rio will become moot. The facts are that I have never wrote anything that wasn't based on my own observations visiting the club as a customer.

My preference to only consider very pretty girls and not consider the more average type girls available for less money on mamba is simply because I wanted the best quality experience in Kiev even if it cost a little more, and I didn't have the time to waste anything many mamba girls that need to be invited and sent home because of the fake picture problems. So for situations where you can see the girl in advance, it was between the nightclubs, or the strip clubs. TheKnight had reported on the higher prices at other strip clubs, leaving Rio as the lower priced venue for such high level girls.

So to you, and others who would follow Uke Boy mindlessly in this silly idea that I have shilled for Rio, if you feel compelled to ignore my actual reason for going there, which was the lower prices and higher efficiency than the nightclub scene, then stay away from the strip clubs.

Lastly, Uke Boy postures himself that he likes chasing freebies for the thrill, and therefore has disdain for anyone who is looking for easy p4p with gorgeous girls. There are others who feel that way. They feel they are more of a man if they get a freebie, than if they pay for it in a p4p transaction. And it's ok to feel that way. Many men do. We all enjoy the more truthful and real responses of a woman who is with us as a freebie.

But it's not ok to be so intolerant of other members of this forum who are past that kind of limiting mentality on a mongering trip, and who are looking for good p4p, and want to get to the best pussy they can even if they must pay for it. That's what this forum is for. Mongering. P4p. Or didn't you know that.

Prosal said it best in his most recent post. Anyone who is a reader of this forum would know that Prosal is one of those members who much prefers the freebies chase. Yet he engages on this forum with others with respect. Different strokes for different folks.

Climaxnow, you said in your post that you attended Rio three times in three weeks and had the money to take out a girl, but you decided not to. It shows that while you may like the chase and freebies, that you would also consider p4p. That's like most of us. The fact that you didn't take out from Rio means that you don't speak about the girls' services with any Personal knowledge. It is false to state that you cannot get DATY or BBBJ from Rio girls. I know you are writing falsehoods because I have gotten DATY and I have gotten BBBJ. You misstate the problem. The problem is that there is no guarantee you will get such services from Every girl. But everyone knows that there is no guarantee to get these services from any girl in any of the Other nightclubs either. So what to do? That is why the selection process and the discussion about it in my posts and others posts is important and helpful. This issue will confront the monger no matter what venue he is pursuing, be it mamba girls, WG's in nightclubs or strip clubs, or even freebies to some extent.

LJ