Any Updates on the new law and the clubs Venus, F39

[Breadman]

Anyone knows the law regarding flat rate / Pauschal Brothels, Could they still charge flat rate or it will need to be different??

Prepare for the worst, hope for the best. Nobody on this board knows exactly what will happen, laws get passed and then not enforced (at least in the US) when the cops say they don't have the manpower to enforce the new law. Do you want to be in any club right after July 1st and be fined a grand? I remember reading here when it was first introduced that the law only prosecuted the johns and the clubs saying "its a law to help protect the women" but in the article below it clearly says the girls will be fined. How likely is it that the girls are going to risk a thousand dollar fine?

"Any violations of the law – by pimps, buyers or prostitutes - can be punished with fines between €1,000 (£860) and €50,000 (£43,000)"

[Maxime]

A broader discussion about the effects of the new law here: http://www.internationalsexguide.inf...Info&p=1941887#post1941887.

[Wild Man]

Anyone knows the law regarding flat rate / Pauschal Brothels, Could they still charge flat rate or it will need to be different??

And how will it affect gang bang clubs such as Erlebeniswohnung?

[Adindas]

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/wo...-a7326056.html

I don't know if clubs will have any way to work around the law and offer AO, maybe just by word of mouth? Some clubs still offer AO But don't mention it on their websites.

Anyone knows the law regarding flat rate / Pauschal Brothels, Could they still charge flat rate or it will need to be different??

[Patbutter]

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/wo...-a7326056.html

I don't know if clubs will have any way to work around the law and offer AO, maybe just by word of mouth? Some clubs still offer AO But don't mention it on their websites.

[Varenne]

Here's a sagacious essay by Dona Carmen e. V. :

http://www.donacarmen.de/die-artemis...d-ihre-folgen/

English google translate:

https://translate.google.com/transla...n%2F&sandbox=1

[Maxime]

Any ideas on when (if passed) the mandatory condom and mandatory prostitute registration would be effective?

All RTCs and other AO clubs and parties still practice the same (AO) policy as before, only not publicly advertised anymore.

[MaxSquatter]

Any ideas on when (if passed) the mandatory condom and mandatory prostitute registration would be effective?

[SwingerLover]

SvenFKK wrote an excellent and very balanced report on the matter of the projected "law" that German feminists would like to implement in order to terrorize sex workers and their clients: http://www.internationalsexguide.inf...=1#post1764193.

There is also a number of reports on this matter in the 'German FKK Clubs Lounge and Chat area' thread of the Germany FKK Clubs Forum already: http://www.internationalsexguide.inf...-and-chat-area.

It seems to have started with this post here and has already spawned a number of replies: http://www.internationalsexguide.inf...=1#post1761380.

And here's the text to the cunsultant's proposal (I hope that's a better term to describe "Referentenentwurf.) for a draft law for a 'prostitutes protection law', which IMO is rather a proposal for a law for the annihilation of the prostitution business and the terrorization of people being active in the field of prostitution: http://www.internet-law.de/wp-conten...29.07.2015.pdf.

[Optimist]

That might very well become the first time of my life that I will join a demonstration.

Excellent. Any significant demonstration would be a biit of a surprise for the Coalition I think.

[SwingerLover]

But it's possible that it falls in the category of a civil infraction, like a speeding ticket,

That's it! Good comparison! It's exactly treated like that in Bavaria and the Saarland already, provided that it's treated at all in the Saarland.

And old joke for the rubber-fans: What is speeding? Speeding is if it smells of burned rubber in the bedroom!

[PacificRim]

I don't know about German law and what the category of violating the no bareback rule would be. But it's possible that it falls in the category of a civil infraction, like a speeding ticket, which in most US states would not be either a felony or a misdemeanor. Not every violation of law is criminal.

[SwingerLover]

A misdemeanor is a crime,

Once again: No it's NOT! At least not in Germany.

Maybe there's a kind of language barrier here. I don't know how to otherwise translate "Ordnungswidrigkeit", maybe there's a difference here between German "Ordnungswidrigkeit" and American/English "misdemeanor". By comparison: A "crime" would be a "Straftat". In Germany, there are two seperate and quite different laws regarding sentencing, fines and penalties.

Anyway, further discussion is pointless unless a "bill" or "draft law" is available where one can read what is actually planned to be put in effect.

And resistance finally starts: http://www.bw7.com/forum/showthread....ns%21?p=620101 http://www.rotlicht-weblog.de/es-ist...ir-wehren-uns/ http://plattform-frankfurt.de/ http://www.donacarmen.de/.

That might very well become the first time of my life that I will join a demonstration. So everybody that's free and willing on June 13 t is hereby invited to join the demonstration or protest March in Frankfurt.

[Member #4359]

I disagree. Because:

You are comparing crimes to misdemeanors.

File sharing is as far as I know a copyright violating and considered "stealing", therefore a crime. AO can NEVER be a crime, because then you'd have to prohibit it EVERYWHERE and not just in the paysex business. Since you can't prohibit people from having sex the natural way, (as you can't prohibit smoking in general) AO can NEVER be a crime, just as smoking cigarettes cannot.

Never say never. Don't forget the USA did prohibit making, selling, or consuming alcoholic beverages for several years in the early 20th century. It didn't stop people from doing it, just drove it pseudo-underground. And made criminals of millions of otherwise law abiding people. A misdemeanor is a crime, just one with a lesser punishment than a felony. I don't put it past nanny governments to legislate anything in people's personal lives, including criminalizing AO across the board, paid or not. In New York City merchants cannot legally sell a fountain drink larger than 16 ounces! Nothing is off limits.

[SwingerLover]

This is simply not true.

I disagree. Because:

to track down a crime.

You are comparing crimes to misdemeanors.

It is routinely done for file sharers, which in most cases is probably a misdimeanor. In the case of AO, one could be charged with a high crime as well, such as supporting trafficking. Whether or not that is correct is beside the point. Or, the law could be changed to make AO worse than a misdemeanor.

File sharing is as far as I know a copyright violating and considered "stealing", therefore a crime. AO can NEVER be a crime, because then you'd have to prohibit it EVERYWHERE and not just in the paysex business. Since you can't prohibit people from having sex the natural way, (as you can't prohibit smoking in general) AO can NEVER be a crime, just as smoking cigarettes cannot.