Victoria

[Un_Circumcised]

Thanks for the compliment, Dave. Yes, I remember the old days on ASP, and must admit that your site and pro-hobby advocacy was part of the inspiration for my site--which I created in April, 2001. I really started it as kind of a lark--and it was yanked by the original host (Angelfire) a few weeks later--but it has remained on Yahoo! Geocities since May '01, and has evolved into something I'm quite proud of. Indeed, the Seattle Weekly even did a positive review of it a year ago.

As for the current political situation, as you know it's pretty bleak in most of the U.S. (including here in Washington state), and there seems to be little movement toward greater acceptance of prostitution (the Seattle City Council approved a new $500 fine last year--primarily to screw men who patronize escorts, the thinking being that they can afford it whereas many street johns are rather poor). However, the mood in Canada seems quite different--especially in Vancouver now with a new progressive mayor and city council. Of course there are many up there who adamantly oppose any liberalization (The Canadian Alliance and various bluenose politicos primarily out in the suburbs and Fraser Valley), and the fear I have is that any positive changes (not charging streetwalkers who remain in designated strolls, for example) will be "balanced" by a greater crackdown on johns--possibly including the draconian vehicle forfeiture tactic. Even now, though, there are already 3 or 4 strolls in Vancouver where the trade is largely tolerated--save for some occasional token
harassment and stings. And street hooker advocate Jamie Hamilton seems to be again pushing the envelope on the "bawdy house" law with a new safe house / trick pad on Franklin St, and may be calculating that the new Vancouver administration will not interfere. If Ottawa does eventually give the go-ahead for legal strolls with appropriate restrictions, it will surely have a subversive effect on the U.S. in my opinion, and can only hasten the day when these repressive, puritantical laws are confined to the rubbish bin of American history.

[DavePhx]

Hi Un_circumcised
You have quite a site for street work! I know you have been around the scene for as long as I have or more - remember the old days on other boards and lists.

I certainly agree with the progressive idea of allowing street hookers in designated areas like in parts of Europe. That is the only kind of street work I do support - not in the face of the public in front of homes and businesses.

A few years ago there was another proposal to eliminate the seldom enforced bawdy house incall laws, which makes providers far safer than on the street but it died.

When the Canadian Supreme Court upheld the no street solicitation law it was a divided court. The Canadian Rights and??? Charter (forget the exact name like our Bill of RIghts) is taken much more seriously for individual rights. The court only by a small majority upheld the anti solicitation law because it was so offensive to the community. Before the law test a provider almost had to pin a provider to the wall and yell at him to pay her for sex before she broke the solicitation law. Now its more strict, but it was a divided issue over rights of the individual vs. neighborhood nuisances.

The "red light walk" as in parts of Europe would seem to satisfy both sides if appropriative area can be agreed upon.

The only ones strongly against it would be the religious right and at least the Christian ALliance party?.. which most were in was soundly defeated a few years ago.

On the other side of the issue in 1998 there were serious proposals to make solicitation an indictable offense instead of just a summary offense now. In some cities the hookers were becoming unbearable (pardon pun) to neighborhoods and they wanted more teeth in the solicitation law instead of just small fine and no record as with a summary offense. Again the zones of tolerance idea would solve that problem.

Dave in Phoenix
http://www.sexwork.com
http://www.sexworktoronto.com
http://www.touchangels.com
http://www.libchrist.com

[Un_Circumcised]

Hey Dave, did you see the Vancouver Sun article I recently posted on my news page -- "Canada debates changes to prostitution law"? (The Sun's links only work for 2 weeks, and it just expired tonight)

It sounds like there is a move by some of the more progressive members of parliament to legalize street soliciting--perhaps in designated areas like Amsterdam has done. This is apparently being spurred by the appalling "Pig Farm" case of Robert William Pickton--who is awaiting trial on charges of murdering a dozen or so Vancouver low-track streetwalkers. This is what I've been arguing for years: Legalize street prostitution in discreet areas of every city that affect the least number of residents and businesses; provide on-site security, waste bins, health and drug outreach workers; and you would eliminate or greatly minimize most of the non-moralistic objections to the street trade.

[DavePhx]

Originally posted by fatsoNOT
Even more strange, this guy lives in southern Cal and would fly all the way into Canada. Since there is no direct flight from so. Cal to Victoria, he would fly into Vancouver, wait for the transit and fly into Victoria. This is an all day trip, why not just drive down to Mexico which takes much less time and the dollar is almight?

I have been both to Mexico and Canada and I will take Canada any day. If all you want is a cheap date for a few minutes of dirty sex in a dirty tiny cubical at a strip club with a girl that speaks almost no English than I agree.

However if you want a intelligent attractive, GFE with an English speaking often college student in a nice place for an hour that costs about the same as an hour in Mexico or less, than go to Victoria.

Instead of flying from Vancouver to Victoria, I take the airport-Victoria bus that goes on the Ferry. Beautiful Ferry ride across the bay and bus gets in the long line first bypassing all the cars in line. The bus will then take you to downtown Victoria, drop you off at some areas or to bus station with rental car companies a block or so a way. Cost as I recall is only about $US25 for the bus and Ferry leaving from the Vancouver airport.

I have more info and links on my Victoria report on sexwork.com although its been a while since I now prefer Toronto for its other great options other than just escorts.

I also much prefer Victoria over Vancouver which is too much like U.S. providers, although at least there isn't the legal issues in Canada like there is in the U.S.

Of course all of this relates to private providers, not the street hooker scene which I have zero interest in and in my view is a disgrace to sexwork and should be illegal as it is in Canada and most of the rest of the world. Far different than legal private sexwork in Canada and most of the world except the U.S., about the only place private sexwork is a legal issue.

Dave in Phoenix
http://www.sexwork.com
http://www.sexworktoronto.com
http://www.touchangels.com
http://www.libchrist.com

[Michael1967]

Hi,

I occasionally check out this area of the board and I wanted to make a quick comment.

I recently did another posting for someone in Honduras. I was in Honduras and was writing about how badly it was sucking. A guy that I knew came over and saw what I was writing (this was in the middle of a large mall) and asked me to post some stuff for him too. I did my regular posting and then posted for the other guy...I noted in my post that it wasn't my opinion. This person had never spent time around computers and didn't know how to do anything besides send e-mail (yes, there are people like that in the world....and they should be ashamed of themselves).

I would think he was showing a friend the WSG and his friend probably said he was in Victoria and it sucked and to post that it sucked (exactly what happened to me), but probably couldn't get his facts straight. Just my opinion....now get back to whoring!

[RX-7]

I read the report too and the only thing I could think of, is that the guy isn't really in South Cal. but for the sake of paranoia, he said he was.

As for the exchange rqates in Canada, ALWAYS goto a bank to get your US green backs exchanged! with the Canadain $ hovering around 55-65 cents tot he buck, you Americans are much better off to do so. In canada, any bank will exchange your money, you don't need an account there ( as far as I know) If you rely on a store to exchange your cash you will likely only get about 30 cents to the dollar, and then you usually have to buy something as well.

You guys gotta remember, the laws in canada are a little different. Our money is know as fiat money (basically, that means there is no canadian fort knox gold bank backing our bucks) and as such we (being stores/restaurants/etc) DO NOT have to give an exchange rate for US dollars! but must places do as B.C. likes to have you "Amuricans" come up here and spend you hard earned cash

[Un_Circumcised]

Yeah, I was scratching my head at some of it too. He originally asked me to repost it--but since it's rather obvious that I'm strictly a street john, he shouldn't have been surprised that I only
posted the street-related stuff and edited out the call girl encounters and travel tips--most of which are irrelevant to BC and WA locals. Still, it was a credible report, and it fits with what others have been saying over the years as to where the street action is in this city. As for why he would travel from southern California to BC instead of Mexico--maybe it's because he doesn't fancy Mexican women or the socioeconomic culture down there. Actually he flew into Seattle--not Vancouver--then flew to Victoria International--which is quite a distance from the city. I guess the biggest disagreement I have is with the notion that U.S. money isn't widely accepted in Canada. It is, of course, but not all businesses give a fair exchange rate, so it's wise to convert it anyway.

[FatsoNOT]

This is weird. Why is this guy posting for someone else? Why the original writer couldn't post the report himself? Even more strange, this guy lives in southern Cal and would fly all the way into Canada. Since there is no direct flight from so. Cal to Victoria, he would fly into Vancouver, wait for the transit and fly into Victoria. This is an all day trip, why not just drive down to Mexico which takes much less time and the dollar is almight? Lastly, this guy is running around in Canada trying to exchange U.S. dollar to Can$ but any joe blow knows that you can use your ATM card to withdraw cash in Canada. This guy(s) utterly makes no sense and weird.

[SoCalguy]

posting this for someone else. this is his full report and i don't know why he want all the way to canada when he could have gone to tijuana in mexico.

victoria bc trip report from "victor victoria"

this covers getting there, where to stay, street action,
and outcall.

getting there:

i live in burbank, ca., so i left from los angeles lax airport
on alaska air to seattle, then took an alaska air turboprop to
victoria. this was in december, not the summer tourist season.
the seattle-victoria flight took 30 minutes. you will go through
customs, so don't even think about bringing guns, drugs, etc.
over an international border.

the victoria airport is very small, but there are rental cars
available from hertz, avis, budget, etc. the drive to victoria
will take you 30 to 40 minutes. just follow the signs to

victoria.
be sure to change your money to canadian at the airport; this

isn't
like mexico where us dollars are accepted everywhere.

considering the time spent changing planes in the seattle airport,
i would still advise taking the plane if you aren't interested in
seattle, but you may wish to rent a car in seattle and take the
ferry if you want to visit seattle on your trip. i haven't tried
this, so do some research on the internet before deciding.

where to stay:

there are a bunch of traveller's inn motels one block from the
action. they are at:

1850 douglas street victoria, bc
phone : (250) 381-1000 (1-888-254-6476)
http://www.travellersinn.com/inn_downtown.htm

1961 douglas street, victoria bc
phone : (250) 953-1000 (1-888-877-9444)
http://www.travellersinn.com/inn_city_center.htm

710 queens street, victoria, bc (on douglas)
phone : (250) 380-1000 (1-888-753-3774)
http://www.travellersinn.com/inn_on_douglas.htm

winter rates: from $39.95 ($25.60 us) (oct 16 - mar 15)
spring rates: from $49.95 ($33.30 us) (mar 16 - may 31)
summer rates: from $89.95 ($53.30 us) (jun 1 - oct 15)

outcall/incall:

outcall prostitution is 100% legal in canada. see
http://www.geocities.com/un_csd/legal.html for
details. if you want to be totally legal, get out
the yellow pages in your hotel room and look up
"escort services." i called seductions unlimited.
they described the girls who were available, i picked
one, and 35 minutes later she was at my door. price
was $180 canadian ($115 us) and no tips or extra charges
were requested (i did tip $20 but didn't feel like i
had to. looks=7 service=8. they also offer incall.
while there is an old "bawdy house" law on the books,
i have heard that it is only used to shut down incalls
where the neighbors complain, and that the victoria
escort industry is smart enough to pick out-of-the way
locations.


street action:

all of the streetwalkers were on government street between
johnson and hillside, and they were all on the right as
i drove north. there is a one-way section of government
street that never has any action, then chinatown, then a
bunch of auto repair places, etc. where the streetwalkers
are. i picked up two during my trip, and was quite happy
with the experience. one of them was better than the incall
escort! they both report that law enforcement drives right
by as they are working and never bother them unless a girl
starts yelling at cars, moves to a residential area, or
otherwise becomes a nuisance. there were at least 6 girls
from 7pm to midnight, and one still there a 2am. to stay
safe i opened the door, she got in, and i asked if she would
like to go to my room and talk further. in one case this
resulted in a lively discussion about canadian law and whether
talking in a car is "in a public place." i also found out that
pimps are illegal, and that the streetwalkers will call the
cops if they see someone obviously **** working the street.

i did some research, and found that the "street prostitution"
section (section 213) of the canadian criminal code reads as
follows:

section 213 of the criminal code states

213."every person who in a public place or in any place
open to public view

(a) stops or attempts to stop any motor vehicle,

(b) impedes the free flow of pedestrian or vehicular traffic or
ingress to or egress from premises adjacent to that place, or

c) stops or attempts to stop any person or in any manner
communicates or attempts to communicate with any person for
the purpose of engaging in prostitution or of obtaining the
sexual services of a prostitute is guilty of an offence
punishable on summary conviction."

i also found that the criminal code of canada defines a "public

place" as any place to which the public has access either by right
or by express or implied obligation. still, it seems to me that
a car is "open to public view" even if it isn't a "public place",
so i stuck with the old us standby of never talking to someone
who won't get in my car, combined with asking her to come to my
room and refusing to talk about sex or money until then.

i will leave it to the lawyers to debate this, but the facts are
that the victoria streetwalkers are getting into people's cars
while the police drive by in their police cars, and neither the
stretwalkers or the customers seem worried about le. i personally
will still not talk about money or sex until i am in my room.

getting back to the action, in both cases i was quoted $100
canadian ($65 us) for full service and $80 canadian ($50 us)
for oral. i told each of them that there was $50 tip if i
had a really good time, and both responded with a real "eager
to please" attitude. i rate them as looks=7 /service=9 and
looks=6 service=7.

i think that what impressed my the most was that all three
victoria prostitutes i encountered were articulate, educated,
and even affectionate. it wasn't the cold, businesslike
transaction i am used to in the us. i also appreciate the
low prices and the lack of added charges. the extremely low
canadian crime rate is also a factor if you are deciding
between canada and mexico for legal action.

***** end *****

[WellHungGuy]

un_circ, I used to live in Victoria. The SW's were always along Government Street (usually only at night) but am surprised to hear that they've moved as far North as Hillside Ave. But that was years ago that I lived there...

For US visitors, you'll get a GREAT exchange rate by using your ATM card in Canada. Current exchange is approx US $1 = Cdn $1.57, so if you withdraw $100.00 Cdn at the ATM it equates to about $65.00 US when you get home. Just keep it as an option before you go to one of those Currency Exchanges...

[Un_Circumcised]

finally! a recent, detailed report of the victoria street scene. the following was sent to me on dec. 25 by a california resident who
calls himself "victor victoria", and says he can't post to this board because he hides behind an anonymous remailer. he also hired an escort and had more thoughts on laws and travel tips, but i'm only reposting the stuff relevant to street prostitution because that is my interest. thanks, guy, and i just want to say "don't be so paranoid!" i've never been hassled by the authorities for anything i've said online, and i'm about as oustspoken as a john can be. now on to his report:

"all of the streetwalkers were on government st between johnson st and hillside ave, and they were all on the right side as i drove north. there is a one-way section of government that never has any action, then chinatown, then a bunch of auto repair places, etc where the streetwalkers are. i picked up two during my trip, and was quite happy with the experience. one of them was better than an incall escort i used! they both report that le drives right by as they are working, and never bothers them unless a girl starts yelling at cars, moves to a residential area, or otherwise becomes a nuisance. there were at least 6 girls from 7 pm to midnight, and one still there at 2 am. to stay safe i opened the car door, she got in, and i asked if she would like to go to my room and talk further. in one case this resulted in a lively discussion about canadian law and whether talking in a car is "in a public place". still, i stuck with the old us standby of never talking to someone who won't get in my car, combined with asking her to come to my room and refusing to talk about sex or money until then. i will leave it to the lawyers to debate this, but the facts are that victoria streetwalkers are getting into peoples' cars while the police drive by, and neither the sws or customers seem worried about le. i also found out that pimps are illegal, and that the streetwalkers will call the cops if they see someone obviously **** working the street. in both cases i was quoted $100 canadian ($65 us) for full service, and $80 can. ($50 us) for oral. i told each of them that there was a $50 tip if i had a really good time, and both responded with a real "eager to please" attitude. i rate them as: 7-looks & 9-service, and 6-looks & 7-service. i think what impressed me the most is that both were articulate, educated, and even affectionate. it wasn't the cold, businesslike transaction i am used to in the us."

[Un_Circumcised]

I finally got around to adding Victoria to my street prostitution guide. If anyone knows of strolls other than Government St--or can more precisely define the boundaries of the Government St stroll--post it here or e-mail me. I'm intending to come over and check out the scene in the near future (I'll be my first visit since the '70s!), but I might wait until warmer weather returns in the spring.

Seattle-Vancouver-Victoria street guide: http://www.geocities.com/un_csd/streetguide.html

[Eeyore]

Visited Victoria in August. All prices quoted are in Canadian dollars (C$). At the time of the visit, the exchange rate was about 66¢C/US$1. My thanks to Dave of Phoenix for his advice and continued public service in sex work.

His URL:

http://www.sexwork.com/victoria/content.html

Monday Magazine is a good place to look for new talent.

However, I have long wanted to visit Victoria for one reason, and was delighted to finally have the chance.

Jude was my first stop in Victoria, and my first session there was by far my best. Jude is exquisite. She is more beautiful than the photos on her website. Tastefully elegant, she greeted me in a light patterned dress. After the preliminaries, including a shower, we proceeded to have the time of our lives. Definitely a GFE with a very strong, intimate connection. She is intelligent, open-minded, experienced, refined, charming, witty, and very lovely. What more can I say? Oh yeah, the session cost C$200.

Visited Classy Ladies in their incall location, a small house in the James Bay neighborhood. My time was spent with Abby, who is new to the profession. She was an attractive blonde from the prairies who was born in Manchester, UK. She greeted me in jeans and a Union Jack t-shirt, and affected a British attitude. The session was somewhat disappointing, perhaps given that she is not very experienced. While FS, she did not kiss or even look at me during the session, which cost C$160.

Scheduled an incall appointment with Nikita at Escape and Relax. When I called to confirm just prior to going there, I found that she had been double-booked, and that nobody else was available at that time.

Called Elegance and made an outcall appointment with Kristi. She did not match the description given over the phone, was wearing too much perfume, and appeared somewhat haggard in her appearance. It wasn’t going to work. I gave her C$20 for carfare and cancelled.

Gave Escape & Relax one more try. Hanna performed outcall massage in my hotel for C$210 for the hour. She is a tall, voluptuous and dressed like a hippy in a denim dress, peasant blouse, and flower pattern headband. In platform heels, she stood taller than 6’. While very open-minded and responsive, she was not what I would call GFE. No kissing, and some distancing, but on the whole fulfilling.

No question that Victoria is as good a place to visit for the hobby as anywhere in North America. It's been said before, but is worth repeating on this forum: Beautiful, intelligent, honest women; reasonable rates; and a relaxed atmosphere.

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