Stupid shit in Medellin

[Elvis 2008]

Here we go again with the Houdiniesque contortions, and just plain false information. Chile is seeing a decline in cases and death numbers over the past two months
Yes, after having the highest number per capita in the whole America's hemisphere.

https://www.worldometers.info/corona...country/chile/

They are also the most developed country in South America.

Absolutely right. Paulie, the numbers have been going down, but they are also the highest per capita in the entire American hemisphere. That data does not support the notion that viral spread is due to noncompliance.

Much of the non-compliance is poverty related, which involves living in crowded households, plus an absence of refrigerators and means to stock up food. Shopping is often done in crowded markets. There is plenty of poverty in Argentina, with a rate over double that of Chile.

If the poverty is worse in Argentina, why is the per capita rate of infection 4 X higher than in Chile? Again, you have listed nothing showing compliance or poverty have anything to do with the spread of the virus. I agree that crowded living conditions facilitate the spread of the virus, but the data you provided is not supporting that opinion.

Argentina also has a substantially higher poverty rate then their neighbor Brazil. It thus should come as no surprise that their graphs follow a similar trajectory. It all can be reviewed here.

But your assertion falls apart again when you look at the total number of cases. Why does Brazil have three times as many cases per capita as Argentina?

Not to mention that we know how the disease is spread. The non-compliance in the US, lack of social distancing, masks, etc. Relate more to arrogance and fake news than poverty.

What does fake news have to do with viral spread?

So the reason the infection rates are dropping in New York and not in Arizona is due to compliance?

The general patterns in the Americas are not following those of Asia and Europe. Hell, policies varied in the USA from state to state as did the infection rates.

Colombia and Peru implemented stricter rules than anywhere in Europe and their rates have not gone down, and the reason for this is non-compliance? Based on what data? They also didn't allow international air travel. Show me the data that proves noncompliance in Peru and Colombia overwhelmed the international air travel ban they enacted and Europe did not.

The successes in Western Europe relate to implementing the simple and correct strategies. All the smoke and mirrors in the world won't make these truths go away.

That assertion is pure smoke and mirrors. Which strategy do you mean? Spain's? Sweden's? Poland's? If all of Europe implemented the correct strategies and all of Latin America did not, then why is Spain's rate per capita twice as high as Mexico and 8 X higher than Poland?

None of this fits. All you are doing is more Trump bashing. If only Trump would have done what the geniuses in Europe did, all in the Americas would be well. That is ridiculous. Something else is going on in the Americas.

You Demorats have been spouting Trump as being the cause of everything bad with the virus since February: https://www.nytimes.com/2020/02/26/o...rus-trump.html.

And nothing has changed.

You guys keep pushing the notion that scientists know all there is to know about the virus, and Trump stupidly has ignored them when scientists and the data have been all over the place. You guys cannot even have an intelligent conversation without bashing Trump and bashing me, and all I really want to talk about is when is Colombia going to open up.

[Elvis 2008]

Pay attention you idiotic, cock swallowing, anal polyp.

Do you have to try to be so fucking clueless, or does it just come naturally? Since you seem to have missed out on learning history, I'll fill in one of the gaps. International travel has been around for a long fucking time. Viruses don't get seasick. They weren't just sitting around waiting for a plane. There's these things called "ships. " They carry passengers. Often ships, loaded with passengers, travel between countries. Often, if there are infected people on the ships diseases are carried from country to country.

I did pay attention, ass wipe! You, being the Democrat dipshit that you are, said that if air travel were banned the virus would not have spread, a swipe at Trump. Now viruses can travel by ships. SO.

Earlier today a squirrel ran across the road in front of me. I yelled "stupid squirrel" and the cheeky little bastard yelled back "at least I'm smarter than Elvis." Had to give him that one.

Again, you're true to form. You fail completely to understand the simplest direct statement. If I wrote "Red is a primary color" you'd reply that people in Laos don't eat bacon for breakfast, therefore I'm wrong.

I wrote: "Viruses are apolitical. They behave exactly the same regardless of geography, politics or religion."

I didn't say viruses spread the same. I said they behave the same. I understand, to you, "behave" and "spread" always mean the same because, whenever your current daddy tells you to behave you spread your ass cheeks for him, but viruses aren't like that.

Any virus looks for a host. That's it. It doesn't look for a host that drives a BMW. It doesn't look for a host that lives at the beach. It looks for a host. Period. When it finds a host it attempts to replicate its RNA code. It does this in the jungle, in the desert, in the mountains and at the beach. It does this in the cities, towns and rural areas.

How many hosts are available in an area affects the rate at which the virus spreads, but it has no effect on the behavior of the virus.

You haven't been on point since your last new butt plug. Don't try to claim you're getting on point now, unless daddy just sent you a care package.

Cases are surging. That's all you need to know. Which is extremely fortunate because your capacity for knowledge is about the same as my capacity for the abject stupidity of every one of your posts. We know how to stop the cases from surging. We've already done it. Many places are still doing it. The US is not doing it. As for Peru, Chile and Argentina, I give zero fucks about them. I'm not in Peru, Chile or Argentina. I have no plans to go to Peru, Chile or Argentina. I have not once mentioned them except to tell you that I'm not writing about them.

There are 3 countries I'm paying attention to, the US, Canada and Colombia. The first 2 because my time is split 80-20 between the two and Colombia so I know when to start planning a trip.

But let's talk about "severe lockdowns. " There's a section of I-75 between Findlay and Beaverdam, Ohio with signs saying Speeding and distracted driving violations are strictly enforced with zero tolerance. Guess how effective that strict enforcement is. Just about as effective as the "severe lockdowns" in Colombia. Sure the Parque Lleras clubs are closed, but every single night, all the people who would normally be partying at a club are partying at someone's apartment, or out in the streets. Ask the guys in El Centro how many days Plaza Botero was completely empty.

DATA? You dare to use the word "Data" you fucking testicle rest of a hypocrite? You've been claiming all the data is wrong for months. You repeatedly ignore all data presented to you and now you want to tell me what the data supports? You wouldn't recognize Data if Brent Spiner was face fucking you.

Italy and Spain learned their lesson. They understand what they need to do. South America is learning the same lesson right now. They'll figure it out.

Your opinion is worth slightly less than a piece of toilet paper stuck to a fat lady's shoe.

Have you been to Canada recently? Say at any time in the past 3 months? You want to know why Canada has seen a decline? For 2 months Canadians stayed the fuck at home. At least I assume they were at home, because they sure as shit weren't in their cars driving to and from work. They weren't at the malls, movie theaters, schools or churches. They sat at home and waited it out. When they began opening back up, they paid attention to the numbers. In short they did all the things that were so heavily criticized in the US states that were effective at flattening the curve.

You see, the big problem in the Americas can he summed up with one word: "You." It's the fucking shitskulls like you who haven't a fucking clue about anything beyond your own nose, who want to drive the ship. You pissed and moaned like a fucking infant when someone in Texas told you to wear a mask. You've jumped on every single conspiracy theory like a god-damned jackrabbit on Viagra. You change your fucking opinion more often than they change the toilet paper roll at the Diarrhea Institute. You babble incoherently about science, without knowing what the fuck science is and then you whine about the economy. If stupidity was a crime, you'd have been executed 47 times and would still be locked in a cell for the next 30 billion years.

There's no point in debating with me because your knowledge of debate is roughly equal to a pile of kangaroo shit's knowledge of string theory, although that's doing a disservice to the kangaroo shit.

The CDC did not say masks don't work. At the beginning, the CDC recommended people not hoard masks because the US did not have enough masks for the people who desperately needed them. Once the mask shortage was dealt with they recommended and continue to recommend the use of masks.

Part of your problem, aside from the oxygen deprivation you're experiencing from having your head so far up your ass, is that you haven't a fucking clue what science is. You look at science as if it's some stock pick from a bunch of Bulgarian goat fuckers. Science isn't a matter of right and wrong. It's a set of tools for the accumulation of knowledge. The most important tool is "I don't know. " From there you begin to add knowledge. Sometimes you go the wrong way and have to backtrack, but you've still gained knowledge from your mistakes.

Science can't give a definitive answer on how many will die. Science can only make projections based upon what actions are being taken.

Let's try an analogy. Not for you, because I'm fairly certain you think an analogy is a large, wooden toy for your ass, but for the people who are smarter than mildew.

If someone is driving from point A to Point be at 50 mph and the distance is 300 miles, science says the trip will take 6 hours (get someone to do the math for you). Science doesn't take into account how many times the driver stops to piss. It doesn't consider that the guy might drive 30 minutes and decide to go home. It only considers the available data.

When the experts made predictions, those predictions were based upon following a certain path. Any change in the path invalidates the predictions. Every single time the US has changed the path. Asia and Europe followed the path.

It's as if your brain can't retain anything more than 2 seconds. If it turned out to be a disaster, the decision wasn't a good one. "Even though the explosion killed the guy and destroyed 3 apartments, I think his decision to take a bath in gasoline while smoking was a good one. ".

Are you competing with yourself to come up with ever more idiotic statements?

The southern states decisions had nothing to do with data from anywhere. Trump said "open back up" and they said "okay. ".

What? How in the fuck did you go from southern states opening back up being a disaster to "So the decision to open up Colombia is a political one?" What fucking planet did you leave your brain cells on? "Yesterday I ate 2 hot dogs. So my decision to shove my head up my ass was based on ergonomics. ".

The decision to open back up Colombia is a Colombian decision. Whether they decide to make it a political decision or decide to base it upon controlling the spread of disease is up to them. They aren't consulting with fucking morons over how to make the decision. If they decide to, I'm sure someone will come looking for you.

The tip of My. Everest rises 29,029 feet above sea level. Challenger Deep in the Marianas Trench is 36,200 feet below sea level. Combine the two and it's still nowhere near the depths of your ignorance.

Not one time have the scientists been wrong. But it does no good when festering ass boils like yourself refuse to listen. If I tell you, "take a right turn at the next light and you'll avoid all the traffic", but you take a left turn, it's not my fault you're stuck in a jam for the next hour.

At the beginning, the scientists said "we need to start testing, we need to isolate, we need contact tracing. " Instead, we did nothing. They said we need to start shutting down now. Instead we waited almost a month. They said "more testing. " Instead we said "more testing makes us look bad. " They said "keep it shutdown until we have it under control. " Instead we said "we have to protect the economy. ".

Every step of the way the US has ignored what the experts have recommended and bilious enema extracts like you have been screaming for the US to ignore the experts. Then, you festering twat blisters have the gall to claim the experts don't know what they are talking about.

What good would that do? If I told you cheese is a dairy product you'd reply that the moon landing was a hoax propagated to install tracking devices in disposable diapers in order to bring about a new world order based upon a birthday card Karl Marx gave to his mother.

There is no scientific consensus on opening Colombia back up. You expect them to come out and say "Wednesday, November 18,2020 at 3:47 pm should be good?

The scientific consensus is that Colombia first needs to get the number of new cases to start falling. The scientific consensus is they do that by strict social distancing, the use of masks, avoiding unnecessary travel. Once the number of new cases drops below the level where Colombia can begin contact tracing, the scientific consensus is that Colombia can slowly begin opening things back up. The scientific consensus is increased testing will be necessary. Assuming the numbers continue to fall, Colombia can continue to restore things, until they are confident in their ability to detect and control any outbreaks. At some point, whenever Colombia decides they have the situation controlled and they are ready to allow international travel, Colombia will allow international travel. They will decide what restrictions there will be.

However, it's up to Colombia to decide whether they'll follow the scientific consensus, or if they'll listen to Chlamydia infested cunts like you.

[Paulie97]

Now I do understand that you want to try and one-up JjBee62 and challenge anything he says whether the facts support you or not. You could just grow up, ignore his posts and concentrate on the true purpose of this forum which is about Medellin Colombia and the entertainment options.

In all fairness you can't lay it all on Elvis. If you are going to tell him to "grow up" then you need to say the same to JJBee62 and several others. That assumes that the discussion needs to end, but I'm not convinced that it does. On the ground info on Medellin is scant at the moment. Plus there's the "Stupid Shit" thread for any overflow that the Admin can use at his discretion.

[JjBee62]

Pay attention you idiotic, cock swallowing, anal polyp.

Sigh. I know what the rationale is for them. The question going forward is are they worth having now? I think given the data the answer is no, but the decision to open or not in Colombia will be based on politics. If the president opens the country and case numbers go up, and the trends in Colombia look terrible, the president will be hammered by his main opposition, the mayor of Bogota. They have already clashed on air travel before.

I already covered that. Once again, because you're only useful as a sperm sponge, you missed the fucking point. Each country, which last time I checked includes Colombia, is dealing with controlling the spread of the virus. That's where they are allocating resources. Opening up international travel leaves them with 2 options. They can either say "Fuck it" and let whoever come in without any preventative measures, or they can move resources to the airports, testing, isolating, quarantining and enforcing, to keep any visitors from adding to the problem. Which means they have to take away from their efforts to stop the spread they are trying to deal with.

It has the same to do with politics as your effective IQ, A Huge Fucking Zero.

Was air travel significant in the 1918 pandemic? You make statements like this that have no basis in reality.

Do you have to try to be so fucking clueless, or does it just come naturally? Since you seem to have missed out on learning history, I'll fill in one of the gaps. International travel has been around for a long fucking time. Viruses don't get seasick. They weren't just sitting around waiting for a plane. There's these things called "ships. " They carry passengers. Often ships, loaded with passengers, travel between countries. Often, if there are infected people on the ships diseases are carried from country to country.

Earlier today a squirrel ran across the road in front of me. I yelled "stupid squirrel" and the cheeky little bastard yelled back "at least I'm smarter than Elvis. " Had to give him that one.

Viruses spread the same regardless of geography? This is another statement that is so ridiculous that NO ONE in the scientific community agrees with. Geography also has to do with population density and the very animals that often harbor the viruses that spread to humans.

Again, you're true to form. You fail completely to understand the simplest direct statement. If I wrote "Red is a primary color" you'd reply that people in Laos don't eat bacon for breakfast, therefore I'm wrong.

I wrote: "Viruses are apolitical. They behave exactly the same regardless of geography, politics or religion. ".

I didn't say viruses spread the same. I said they behave the same. I understand, to you, "behave" and "spread" always mean the same because, whenever your current daddy tells you to behave you spread your ass cheeks for him, but viruses aren't like that.

Any virus looks for a host. That's it. It doesn't look for a host that drives a BMW. It doesn't look for a host that lives at the beach. It looks for a host. Period. When it finds a host it attempts to replicate its RNA code. It does this in the jungle, in the desert, in the mountains and at the beach. It does this in the cities, towns and rural areas.

How many hosts are available in an area affects the rate at which the virus spreads, but it has no effect on the behavior of the virus.

Getting on point though, I said that others besides you have made the comment that the reason the virus is surging in the Americas and not Europe and Asia is due to noncompliance. The idea being that countries like Peru and Colombia with severe lockdowns have had surging cases of the virus due to non-compliance.

You haven't been on point since your last new butt plug. Don't try to claim you're getting on point now, unless daddy just sent you a care package.

Cases are surging. That's all you need to know. Which is extremely fortunate because your capacity for knowledge is about the same as my capacity for the abject stupidity of every one of your posts. We know how to stop the cases from surging. We've already done it. Many places are still doing it. The US is not doing it. As for Peru, Chile and Argentina, I give zero fucks about them. I'm not in Peru, Chile or Argentina. I have no plans to go to Peru, Chile or Argentina. I have not once mentioned them except to tell you that I'm not writing about them.

There are 3 countries I'm paying attention to, the US, Canada and Colombia. The first 2 because my time is split 80-20 between the two and Colombia so I know when to start planning a trip.

But let's talk about "severe lockdowns. " There's a section of I-75 between Findlay and Beaverdam, Ohio with signs saying Speeding and distracted driving violations are strictly enforced with zero tolerance. Guess how effective that strict enforcement is. Just about as effective as the "severe lockdowns" in Colombia. Sure the Parque Lleras clubs are closed, but every single night, all the people who would normally be partying at a club are partying at someone's apartment, or out in the streets. Ask the guys in El Centro how many days Plaza Botero was completely empty.

The data does not support that though. Chile is a very law abiding country and the virus is spreading there like crazy. Argentina has the same genetic makeup as Italy and Spain and the same attitudes towards governments those nations do and a younger population to boot but the cases of virus are surging in Argentina and not in Italy and Spain.

DATA? You dare to use the word "Data" you fucking testicle rest of a hypocrite? You've been claiming all the data is wrong for months. You repeatedly ignore all data presented to you and now you want to tell me what the data supports? You wouldn't recognize Data if Brent Spiner was face fucking you.

Italy and Spain learned their lesson. They understand what they need to do. South America is learning the same lesson right now. They'll figure it out.

In my opinion, something is happening in the Americas that cannot be explained totally by noncompliance: environmental factors maybe, a mutation in the virus. Yes, Canada has seen a decline in the cases of the virus as has the USA Northeast, but those are the only regions in the Americas that have really cooled off. All the other most populous countries in the Americas are still seeing a surge in cases.

Your opinion is worth slightly less than a piece of toilet paper stuck to a fat lady's shoe.

Have you been to Canada recently? Say at any time in the past 3 months? You want to know why Canada has seen a decline? For 2 months Canadians stayed the fuck at home. At least I assume they were at home, because they sure as shit weren't in their cars driving to and from work. They weren't at the malls, movie theaters, schools or churches. They sat at home and waited it out. When they began opening back up, they paid attention to the numbers. In short they did all the things that were so heavily criticized in the US states that were effective at flattening the curve.

You see, the big problem in the Americas can he summed up with one word: "You. " It's the fucking shitskulls like you who haven't a fucking clue about anything beyond your own nose, who want to drive the ship. You pissed and moaned like a fucking infant when someone in Texas told you to wear a mask. You've jumped on every single conspiracy theory like a god-damned jackrabbit on Viagra. You change your fucking opinion more often than they change the toilet paper roll at the Diarrhea Institute. You babble incoherently about science, without knowing what the fuck science is and then you whine about the economy. If stupidity was a crime, you'd have been executed 47 times and would still be locked in a cell for the next 30 billion years.

As I said before, there is no point in debating you JJBee. You keep claiming the scientists and experts know what they are doing when they have been all over the map. The CDC said masks did not work and now you can get arrested for not wearing one.

There's no point in debating with me because your knowledge of debate is roughly equal to a pile of kangaroo shit's knowledge of string theory, although that's doing a disservice to the kangaroo shit.

The CDC did not say masks don't work. At the beginning, the CDC recommended people not hoard masks because the US did not have enough masks for the people who desperately needed them. Once the mask shortage was dealt with they recommended and continue to recommend the use of masks.

Part of your problem, aside from the oxygen deprivation you're experiencing from having your head so far up your ass, is that you haven't a fucking clue what science is. You look at science as if it's some stock pick from a bunch of Bulgarian goat fuckers. Science isn't a matter of right and wrong. It's a set of tools for the accumulation of knowledge. The most important tool is "I don't know. " From there you begin to add knowledge. Sometimes you go the wrong way and have to backtrack, but you've still gained knowledge from your mistakes.

Science can't give a definitive answer on how many will die. Science can only make projections based upon what actions are being taken.

Let's try an analogy. Not for you, because I'm fairly certain you think an analogy is a large, wooden toy for your ass, but for the people who are smarter than mildew.

If someone is driving from point A to Point be at 50 mph and the distance is 300 miles, science says the trip will take 6 hours (get someone to do the math for you). Science doesn't take into account how many times the driver stops to piss. It doesn't consider that the guy might drive 30 minutes and decide to go home. It only considers the available data.

When the experts made predictions, those predictions were based upon following a certain path. Any change in the path invalidates the predictions. Every single time the US has changed the path. Asia and Europe followed the path.

I think the decisions made by Southern US governors to open up their economies based on the data from Europe and Asia were correct, but that decision turned out to be a disaster.

It's as if your brain can't retain anything more than 2 seconds. If it turned out to be a disaster, the decision wasn't a good one. "Even though the explosion killed the guy and destroyed 3 apartments, I think his decision to take a bath in gasoline while smoking was a good one. ".

Are you competing with yourself to come up with ever more idiotic statements?

The southern states decisions had nothing to do with data from anywhere. Trump said "open back up" and they said "okay. ".

So the decision to open up Colombia is a political one. The patterns seen in Europe and Asia are different from those in the Americas, and the data on International travel is all over the place. And politically speaking, I think the president is more likely to keep the borders closed than open them up, but that is just my opinion based on politics and perception not hard facts.

What? How in the fuck did you go from southern states opening back up being a disaster to "So the decision to open up Colombia is a political one?" What fucking planet did you leave your brain cells on? "Yesterday I ate 2 hot dogs. So my decision to shove my head up my ass was based on ergonomics. ".

The decision to open back up Colombia is a Colombian decision. Whether they decide to make it a political decision or decide to base it upon controlling the spread of disease is up to them. They aren't consulting with fucking morons over how to make the decision. If they decide to, I'm sure someone will come looking for you.

I just do not get the concept if we just listened to the scientists everything would be okay. Some parts of the media has been kissing Dr. Fauci's ass the whole time. Those media channels have failed to point out how often he and other scientists were dead wrong so often.

The tip of My. Everest rises 29,029 feet above sea level. Challenger Deep in the Marianas Trench is 36,200 feet below sea level. Combine the two and it's still nowhere near the depths of your ignorance.

Not one time have the scientists been wrong. But it does no good when festering ass boils like yourself refuse to listen. If I tell you, "take a right turn at the next light and you'll avoid all the traffic", but you take a left turn, it's not my fault you're stuck in a jam for the next hour.

At the beginning, the scientists said "we need to start testing, we need to isolate, we need contact tracing. " Instead, we did nothing. They said we need to start shutting down now. Instead we waited almost a month. They said "more testing. " Instead we said "more testing makes us look bad. " They said "keep it shutdown until we have it under control. " Instead we said "we have to protect the economy. ".

Every step of the way the US has ignored what the experts have recommended and bilious enema extracts like you have been screaming for the US to ignore the experts. Then, you festering twat blisters have the gall to claim the experts don't know what they are talking about.

Can you tell me what the scientific consensus is on opening up Colombia is then? Because I do not see a scientific consensus on international travel at all.

What good would that do? If I told you cheese is a dairy product you'd reply that the moon landing was a hoax propagated to install tracking devices in disposable diapers in order to bring about a new world order based upon a birthday card Karl Marx gave to his mother.

There is no scientific consensus on opening Colombia back up. You expect them to come out and say "Wednesday, November 18,2020 at 3:47 pm should be good?

The scientific consensus is that Colombia first needs to get the number of new cases to start falling. The scientific consensus is they do that by strict social distancing, the use of masks, avoiding unnecessary travel. Once the number of new cases drops below the level where Colombia can begin contact tracing, the scientific consensus is that Colombia can slowly begin opening things back up. The scientific consensus is increased testing will be necessary. Assuming the numbers continue to fall, Colombia can continue to restore things, until they are confident in their ability to detect and control any outbreaks. At some point, whenever Colombia decides they have the situation controlled and they are ready to allow international travel, Colombia will allow international travel. They will decide what restrictions there will be.

However, it's up to Colombia to decide whether they'll follow the scientific consensus, or if they'll listen to Chlamydia infested cunts like you.

[Paulie97]

Getting on point though, I said that others besides you have made the comment that the reason the virus is surging in the Americas and not Europe and Asia is due to noncompliance. The idea being that countries like Peru and Colombia with severe lockdowns have had surging cases of the virus due to non-compliance.The data does not support that though. Chile is a very law abiding country and the virus is spreading there like crazy. Argentina has the same genetic makeup as Italy and Spain and the same attitudes towards governments those nations do and a younger population to boot but the cases of virus are surging in Argentina and not in Italy and Spain.

Here we go again with the Houdiniesque contortions, and just plain false information. Chile is seeing a decline in cases and death numbers over the past two months.

https://www.worldometers.info/corona...country/chile/

They are also the most developed country in South America.

https://idesa.org/article_english/ch...latin-america/

Another affluent South American country, Uruguay, is also doing well with only 35 total deaths. But these are the exception in their region, not the rule.

Much of the non-compliance is poverty related, which involves living in crowded households, plus an absence of refrigerators and means to stock up food. Shopping is often done in crowded markets. There is plenty of poverty in Argentina, with a rate over double that of Chile.

https://www.batimes.com.ar/news/arge...ts-INDEC.phtml

Argentina also has a substantially higher poverty rate then their neighbor Brazil. It thus should come as no surprise that their graphs follow a similar trajectory. It all can be reviewed here.

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/#countries.

Not to mention that we know how the disease is spread. The non-compliance in the US, lack of social distancing, masks, etc. Relate more to arrogance and fake news than poverty. The successes in Western Europe relate to implementing the simple and correct strategies. All the smoke and mirrors in the world won't make these truths go away. Though I'm confident you'll keep trying.

[Zeos1]

Sigh. I know what the rationale is for them. The question going forward is are they worth having now? I think given the data the answer is no, but the decision to open or not in Colombia will be based on politics. If the president opens the country and case numbers go up, and the trends in Colombia look terrible, the president will be hammered by his main opposition, the mayor of Bogota. They have already clashed on air travel before.

Was air travel significant in the 1918 pandemic? You make statements like this that have no basis in reality.

Viruses spread the same regardless of geography? This is another statement that is so ridiculous that NO ONE in the scientific community agrees with. Geography also has to do with population density and the very animals that often harbor the viruses that spread to humans.

Getting on point though, I said that others besides you have made the comment that the reason the virus is surging in the Americas and not Europe and Asia is due to noncompliance. The idea being that countries like Peru and Colombia with severe lockdowns have had surging cases of the virus due to non-compliance.


The data does not support that though. Chile is a very law abiding country and the virus is spreading there like crazy. Argentina has the same genetic makeup as Italy and Spain and the same attitudes towards governments those nations do and a younger population to boot but the cases of virus are surging in Argentina and not in Italy and Spain.

In my opinion, something is happening in the Americas that cannot be explained totally by noncompliance: environmental factors maybe, a mutation in the virus. Yes, Canada has seen a decline in the cases of the virus as has the USA Northeast, but those are the only regions in the Americas that have really cooled off. All the other most populous countries in the Americas are still seeing a surge in cases.

As I said before, there is no point in debating you JJBee. You keep claiming the scientists and experts know what they are doing when they have been all over the map. The CDC said masks did not work and now you can get arrested for not wearing one.

I think the decisions made by Southern US governors to open up their economies based on the data from Europe and Asia were correct, but that decision turned out to be a disaster.

So the decision to open up Colombia is a political one. The patterns seen in Europe and Asia are different from those in the Americas, and the data on International travel is all over the place. And politically speaking, I think the president is more likely to keep the borders closed than open them up, but that is just my opinion based on politics and perception not hard facts.

I just do not get the concept if we just listened to the scientists everything would be okay. Some parts of the media has been kissing Dr. Fauci's ass the whole time. Those media channels have failed to point out how often he and other scientists were dead wrong so often.

Can you tell me what the scientific consensus is on opening up Colombia is then? Because I do not see a scientific consensus on international travel at all.

All kinds of ways of denying the simple and obvious. And there's nothing significant that has changed since late January when the WHO was warning how serious this could be. This virus spreads when people are close enough together that the receiver gets close enough to the infected person to get infected. Number one and by far the most significant way it spreads. Second, by touching something with active virus and then touching your face (eyes, nose especially).

Everything else is just refinement of that knowledge. The big discussion over aerosol transmission versus droplet, droplet size, etc. Is minute differences in how it might spread. The vast majority spreads exactly in the way that many viruses spread. This one is reasonably contagious, but not as much so as some (fortunately).

Countries and places that have got the majority of the people to follow distancing and basic hygiene protocols have seen the virus "are" factor below 1 - in other words declining cases, and after a few months to almost 0 cases. Irrespective of how the "rules" they have sound, it is how people behave. Parts of the US have had similar rules to others, with different results. But when analysis of how many people have actually followed the guidelines or rules is done the answer is the same. It is easy to predict the infection rates by knowing how many different people are in contact with each other and in close proximity.

No need for stories about why this is being allowed, who is behind it, etc.

Travel bans have certainly helped Canada. As with almost everywhere initially all the cases were "imported". But we didn't act soon enough on that. But when we put a general requirement that everyone coming back (citizens, residents) and everyone entering (tourists, immigrants, whatever) had to quarantine the new cases peaked, and since around mid May have been going down. Due to all kinds of reasons, mostly that people stopped mixing and being in proximity (lots of different ways that was done. All well known). Cases in the country can now almost all be considered "mopping up" as there are situations where large families had cases generating more as time went on, for example, or right now a series of religious communes where there have been three or four rounds of infection. And of course testing, contact tracing, all of those things. Which work a lot better when the case load is low enough they can be done in a thorough way.

As an example, the last day of reporting (Friday I think) there were over 30,000 tests in my province. There were less than 200 new cases I believe. There are very few left in intensive care, etc. And believe me, when someone tests positive there are a swarm of health people following up on all contacts, etc. That wasn't so when things were at the peak, but again, once numbers get to a manageable level it allows a lot better followup, and allows us to get back to some version of normal. And to keep it that way people are ok with masks in indoor public spaces, distancing while shopping, etc. Etc.

Anyway. I only post this to give people a sense of hope. I think this virus can be beat. But until it is a worldwide effort we won't be able to travel normally and do a lot of things we would like to do.

[Villainy]

A thorough lockdown on International travel, combined with aggressive testing and contact tracing, could have prevented the pandemic, if it had been done in early January.

Was air travel significant in the 1918 pandemic? You make statements like this that have no basis in reality.

There wasn't any air travel in 1918. But there was extensive troop movements from the United States to Great Britain and France which was largely credited with the spread the disease over to most of Europe.

You could research your facts by reading the Wikipedia page on the Spanish Flu and reading about how the troop movements spread the disease.

Now I do understand that you want to try and one-up JjBee62 and challenge anything he says whether the facts support you or not. You could just grow up, ignore his posts and concentrate on the true purpose of this forum which is about Medellin Colombia and the entertainment options. We don't really need to analyze epidemiological events from 100 years ago. If you can't help yourself, let's talk about whether the strict quarantine for.

3 day weekends where (like today) there aren't any people out and very little traffic on La 70 (normally one of the busiest streets in Laureles) is doing any good or not. Will the mayor's new policies abate the recent rapid growth curve and how long will it continue. That might be somewhat interesting to someone instead of your "I have to win an argument just once against jibee62".

[Elvis 2008]

International travel bans now are to reduce the strain on local resources while countries attempt to get their infection rate under control.

Sigh. I know what the rationale is for them. The question going forward is are they worth having now? I think given the data the answer is no, but the decision to open or not in Colombia will be based on politics. If the president opens the country and case numbers go up, and the trends in Colombia look terrible, the president will be hammered by his main opposition, the mayor of Bogota. They have already clashed on air travel before.

A thorough lockdown on International travel, combined with aggressive testing and contact tracing, could have prevented the pandemic, if it had been done in early January.

Was air travel significant in the 1918 pandemic? You make statements like this that have no basis in reality.

Everyone wants to make it political. Viruses are apolitical. They behave exactly the same regardless of geography, politics or religion. Until we start treating it like a disease instead of a way to score points, nothing is going to change.

Viruses spread the same regardless of geography? This is another statement that is so ridiculous that NO ONE in the scientific community agrees with. Geography also has to do with population density and the very animals that often harbor the viruses that spread to humans.

Getting on point though, I said that others besides you have made the comment that the reason the virus is surging in the Americas and not Europe and Asia is due to noncompliance. The idea being that countries like Peru and Colombia with severe lockdowns have had surging cases of the virus due to non-compliance.

The data does not support that though. Chile is a very law abiding country and the virus is spreading there like crazy. Argentina has the same genetic makeup as Italy and Spain and the same attitudes towards governments those nations do and a younger population to boot but the cases of virus are surging in Argentina and not in Italy and Spain.

In my opinion, something is happening in the Americas that cannot be explained totally by noncompliance: environmental factors maybe, a mutation in the virus. Yes, Canada has seen a decline in the cases of the virus as has the USA Northeast, but those are the only regions in the Americas that have really cooled off. All the other most populous countries in the Americas are still seeing a surge in cases.

As I said before, there is no point in debating you JJBee. You keep claiming the scientists and experts know what they are doing when they have been all over the map. The CDC said masks did not work and now you can get arrested for not wearing one.

I think the decisions made by Southern US governors to open up their economies based on the data from Europe and Asia were correct, but that decision turned out to be a disaster.

So the decision to open up Colombia is a political one. The patterns seen in Europe and Asia are different from those in the Americas, and the data on International travel is all over the place. And politically speaking, I think the president is more likely to keep the borders closed than open them up, but that is just my opinion based on politics and perception not hard facts.

I just do not get the concept if we just listened to the scientists everything would be okay. Some parts of the media has been kissing Dr. Fauci's ass the whole time. Those media channels have failed to point out how often he and other scientists were dead wrong so often.

Can you tell me what the scientific consensus is on opening up Colombia is then? Because I do not see a scientific consensus on international travel at all.

[JjBee62]

Quarantines don't work if people don't follow them and quarantine. Same as distancing, same as lock downs, etc. They work when people follow them, and they don't work when even a significant minority do not follow them. That's the main difference between countries where it has worked and continues to work, and countries where it doesn't work.

We've experienced the same thing in recent years with vaccinations. It only took a relatively small group of anti-vaxxers to bring back outbreaks of the measles. I expect we'll start seeing polio again within a few years.

[Zeos1]

Well said, I have been saying the exact same thing. This is so bad and in my opinion quarantines are just not working that well, besides killing the economies and ruining people's lives.

Quarantines don't work if people don't follow them and quarantine. Same as distancing, same as lock downs, etc. They work when people follow them, and they don't work when even a significant minority do not follow them. That's the main difference between countries where it has worked and continues to work, and countries where it doesn't work.

[JjBee62]

The third screenshot. Wow. Thanks for sharing.

You're welcome. That one is an enigma. According to me she's a non-pro, according to people who have no knowledge of her, she's definitely a pro. Next thing they'll be telling me she's a man who's not even Colombian.

Anyway, she's, according to her, a Psychology student and a submissive. She's gone full blown submissive with me. Sends me about 15 minutes of video every day and always trying to come up with new stuff to please me.

About 2 weeks ago I suggested something to her for a video. I told her to get one of her friends to watch her masturbate in a video. So she asked her best friend (who I've been talking to, but wasn't getting anywhere with). The friend went straight to doing a lesbian video for me (for a price). That happened in a motel in San Antonio de Prado (which explains another post of mine) Thursday.

It was obvious that they've never done this before, at least not together, which makes it better.

[JjBee62]

GT,

I have been pounding JJBee and the fake numbers for the longest time. He goes off on anecdotal evidence that someone else supplies than goes off on and tells how everyone he knows has been affected by Corona. He did the same thing with AIDS. He knew 1000's of people who died with AIDS.

You are right. The numbers are bullshit. The mortality rate was way overstated. I never thought Corona was a hoax but an exaggeration. I know dozens of people who have it. What I have seen in my life is that when you give people in authority a way to politically cover themselves and a chance to take on more power, they will jump in with both feet. The designation of what businesses were essential and not was the chance for bureaucrats to play king maker, and they loved it. In addition, they had press conferences where they got precious air time, and business leaders had to stand and give these bureaucrats what they all crave: complete submission. Also, all the mistakes with Covid have been swept under the rug.

It wasn't hard for me to believe that this was more bullshit after seeing what I did with AIDS and the opioid crisis. The heterosexual AIDS crisis was pure bullshit, and the opioid crisis was not one until the DEA got involved. Every year, there are more and more overdose deaths, and it is the fault of everyone but the federal government who is responsible for it. These were complete full blown conspiracies. The truth is the DEA went after prescription opioids because it was losing money from all its pot seizures once pot was legalized. 90% of the world's heroin is grown right under the eyes of the USA Military in Afghanistan. The Taliban could cut heroin production but our military is powerless to stop it? Bullshit!

So the federal government has cried wolf so many times that it was easy for me to believe it was doing so again. Thing is I was discussing Covid with someone and he reminded me that unlike the Hong Kong flu in 1968, the hospitals were not full, and I had to admit he was right. It does not take much to expand hospital capacity as we saw in New York, but in Italy, there was an issue with too few ventilators. You remember the we are running out of ventilators and the flatten the curve bullshit everyone has forgot about?

It is that kind of stuff along with the CDC doing a 180 on masks, and the social distancing crap that grinds my gears. Social distancing was put in place to track people via their cell phones. You need six feet for the GPS to be accurate with contact tracing. The notion you can catch Covid from someone if you stand 4 feet from them and not 6 from them in a line at Walmart is more bullshit.

One of the other issues, and you will not hear this anywhere else, is that doctors were probably too quick to put patients on ventilators. Once patients were on ventilators, their prognosis went way down. Covid is more a problem with oxygention than ventilation.

The other big thing are blood clots. A lot of Covid patients have renal issues from blood clots. In fact, the low oxygen associated with Covid is probably more often due to blood clots than the Covid pneumonia. The mortality rate is lower mostly from the use of immunosuppresants like HCQ, dexamethasone, and the frequent use of heparin. I have not seen the Covid mortality rate decreasing discussed nearly as often as it should be.

Again, I would have emphasized hospitalizations and the lack of beds, which is easily verified, available over death data which is easily manipulated, and the government frequently manipulates death data to enrich itself power wise. What causes death is a misnomer. Usually, it is a combination of things but the government likes to list one cause of death, and it gave financial incentive health care providers to list Covid as cause of death.

The mathematical projections were wrong as they always are because humans learn how to handle things better. The 3. 5% mortality rate as estimated by the WHO was patently absurd, and all other death projections were way off.

Still, I cannot argue with the hospital rates. That is true, and no other flu virus save for the 1918 pandemic has put so many people in the hospital. Frequent testing and isolation does work to slow the virus as does keeping people from gathering in large groups especially for prolonged periods of time..

You've been pounding me? You back to fantasizing about me again? I believe you have the direction of the pounding backwards Elvirus.

Over the numbers, no less? You've never addressed the numbers. Not once. I keep asking you to address the numbers and you start talking about Sweden.

Then you resort to complete fabrications. I stated I knew and saw dozens die from AIDS, while I was a volunteer with the AIDS, Art, Alive project in San Diego (from 1988-92), and you say I claim to have witnessed 1,000's. That non-profit has since closed down. However, you have the sheer fucking audacity (I. E. Stupidity) to claim I went back 30 years to locate the name of a non-profit, dig up the name of the founder, a respected, but reasonably unknown artist and author just so I could claim to have seen the effects of AIDS. That's not just stupidity, it's lunacy.

Again, address the fucking numbers you spineless dipshit.

2017-18 Lab verified flu deaths in Indiana - 187. That's the same year the CDC Estimated both 61,000 and 80,000 flu deaths nationwide. I can assure you, the people of Indiana are not all superhumans impervious to disease. Quite the opposite. At a minimum, if the CDC estimate is correct, that number should be at least 1,500.

Address this from the CDC:

"Fourth, our estimate of influenza-associated deaths relies on information about location of death from death certificates. However, death certificate data during the 2018–2019 season were not available at the time of estimation. We have used death certification data from all influenza seasons between 2010-2011 and 2016–2017 where these data were available from the National Center for Health Statistics. Furthermore, our model uses the frequency of influenza-related deaths that have cause of death related to pneumonia or influenza (P&I), other respiratory or cardiovascular (other are&C), or other non-respiratory, non-cardiovascular (non-are&C) to account for deaths occurring outside of a hospital by cause of death. These frequencies were not available from the 2018–2019 season at the time of estimation, so we used the average frequencies of each cause from previous seasons, 2010–2011 to 2016–2017."

And this:

"We first look at how many in-hospital deaths were observed in FluSurv-NET. The in-hospital deaths are adjusted for under-detection of influenza using methods similar to those described above for hospitalizations using data on the frequency and sensitivity of influenza testing. Second, because not all deaths related to influenza occur in the hospital, we use death certificate data to estimate how likely deaths are to occur outside the hospital. We look at death certificates that have pneumonia or influenza causes (P&I), other respiratory and circulatory causes (R&C), or other non-respiratory, non-circulatory causes of death, because deaths related to influenza may not have influenza listed as a cause of death. We use information on the causes of death from FluSurv-NET to determine the mixture of P&I, are&see, and other coded deaths to include in our investigation of death certificate data. Finally, once we estimate the proportion of influenza-associated deaths that occurred outside of the hospital, we can estimate the deaths-to-hospitalization ratio. ".

The flu numbers you keep touting are clearly stated by the CDC as not being accurate. Yet they're apparently the only numbers you pay any attention to.

Or would you rather address your constant changing story? Take your pick. Or go back to your rock and hide again until someone else comes along and expresses an OPINION which agrees with your delusion. Then you can come back out of hiding again and pretend you've been "pounding" me, when we both know you keep running away every time your cognitive dissonance rears its ugly head.

If you want to debate me on it, show me the numbers. Don't tell me supposition. Don't go running off to Bulgaria to get information from a group which contains no doctors, no persons with any background in medicine and no knowledge of what they're babbling about (which is obviously why you're so enamored of them). Don't make up more lies. First you don't know anyone who has had COVID-19, yet now you know dozens.

Frankly, you should change your handle to Septic tank because you're completely full of shit.

[DramaFree11]

I agree with TTM's statement.

In Florida, I believe the #'s are inflated. People check in at a free testing drive thru, and decide waiting for 4 hours in line to get the test isn't worth it. So, they leave without getting a test, yet a few days later they get a call that they tested positive.

I had the Rona, and thankfully it was more mild than the flu for me, I just pounded DayQuil because I had an infrequent dry cough.

Yes, the Rona is real, however the mortality rate is something like. 2/. 3%.

I think the leaders in South America have so much misinformation, on top of people from South America believing everything they see on the news, and then leaders in places like MDE make people stay at home for days.

It is just going to crush South American economies, but what can ya do. See'est la vie.

Well said, I have been saying the exact same thing. This is so bad and in my opinion quarantines are just not working that well, besides killing the economies and ruining people's lives.

[Elvis 2008]

I agree with TTM's statement.

In Florida, I believe the #'s are inflated. People check in at a free testing drive thru, and decide waiting for 4 hours in line to get the test isn't worth it. So, they leave without getting a test, yet a few days later they get a call that they tested positive.

I had the Rona, and thankfully it was more mild than the flu for me, I just pounded DayQuil because I had an infrequent dry cough.

Yes, the Rona is real, however the mortality rate is something like. 2/. 3%.

I think the leaders in South America have so much misinformation, on top of people from South America believing everything they see on the news, and then leaders in places like MDE make people stay at home for days.

It is just going to crush South American economies, but what can ya do. See'est la vie.

GT,

I have been pounding JJBee and the fake numbers for the longest time. He goes off on anecdotal evidence that someone else supplies than goes off on and tells how everyone he knows has been affected by Corona. He did the same thing with AIDS. He knew 1000's of people who died with AIDS.

You are right. The numbers are bullshit. The mortality rate was way overstated. I never thought Corona was a hoax but an exaggeration. I know dozens of people who have it. What I have seen in my life is that when you give people in authority a way to politically cover themselves and a chance to take on more power, they will jump in with both feet. The designation of what businesses were essential and not was the chance for bureaucrats to play king maker, and they loved it. In addition, they had press conferences where they got precious air time, and business leaders had to stand and give these bureaucrats what they all crave: complete submission. Also, all the mistakes with Covid have been swept under the rug.

It wasn't hard for me to believe that this was more bullshit after seeing what I did with AIDS and the opioid crisis. The heterosexual AIDS crisis was pure bullshit, and the opioid crisis was not one until the DEA got involved. Every year, there are more and more overdose deaths, and it is the fault of everyone but the federal government who is responsible for it. These were complete full blown conspiracies. The truth is the DEA went after prescription opioids because it was losing money from all its pot seizures once pot was legalized. 90% of the world's heroin is grown right under the eyes of the USA Military in Afghanistan. The Taliban could cut heroin production but our military is powerless to stop it? Bullshit!

So the federal government has cried wolf so many times that it was easy for me to believe it was doing so again. Thing is I was discussing Covid with someone and he reminded me that unlike the Hong Kong flu in 1968, the hospitals were not full, and I had to admit he was right. It does not take much to expand hospital capacity as we saw in New York, but in Italy, there was an issue with too few ventilators. You remember the we are running out of ventilators and the flatten the curve bullshit everyone has forgot about?

It is that kind of stuff along with the CDC doing a 180 on masks, and the social distancing crap that grinds my gears. Social distancing was put in place to track people via their cell phones. You need six feet for the GPS to be accurate with contact tracing. The notion you can catch Covid from someone if you stand 4 feet from them and not 6 from them in a line at Walmart is more bullshit.

One of the other issues, and you will not hear this anywhere else, is that doctors were probably too quick to put patients on ventilators. Once patients were on ventilators, their prognosis went way down. Covid is more a problem with oxygention than ventilation.

The other big thing are blood clots. A lot of Covid patients have renal issues from blood clots. In fact, the low oxygen associated with Covid is probably more often due to blood clots than the Covid pneumonia. The mortality rate is lower mostly from the use of immunosuppresants like HCQ, dexamethasone, and the frequent use of heparin. I have not seen the Covid mortality rate decreasing discussed nearly as often as it should be.

Again, I would have emphasized hospitalizations and the lack of beds, which is easily verified, available over death data which is easily manipulated, and the government frequently manipulates death data to enrich itself power wise. What causes death is a misnomer. Usually, it is a combination of things but the government likes to list one cause of death, and it gave financial incentive health care providers to list Covid as cause of death.

The mathematical projections were wrong as they always are because humans learn how to handle things better. The 3. 5% mortality rate as estimated by the WHO was patently absurd, and all other death projections were way off.

Still, I cannot argue with the hospital rates. That is true, and no other flu virus save for the 1918 pandemic has put so many people in the hospital. Frequent testing and isolation does work to slow the virus as does keeping people from gathering in large groups especially for prolonged periods of time.

Could the economies have been saved? I think now that there was going to be a hit no matter what, but it didn't have to be as bad as it did. South America is proof that huge lockdowns did more damage to the economy than they did in halting the spread of the virus.

Given how badly the leaders in this crisis have fucked up, I think anyone who is not cynical should be. I cannot stand the notion that questioning leadership is somehow unpatriotic. The shame of it all is that like all other times I have seen the federal government bureaucracy screw up, no one is going to be held accountable and responsible for all the mistakes that were made.

[Paulie97]

Bigfoot, alien abductions, the Moon Landing Hoax, etc. All have fans proving that many Americans aren't the brightest bulbs in the box.

In Florida, I believe the #'s are inflated. People check in at a free testing drive thru, and decide waiting for 4 hours in line to get the test isn't worth it. So, they leave without getting a test, yet a few days later they get a call that they tested positive.

Please cite your source for this information, and no some guy at a bar or on a monger board doesn't count. If this is true then you are accusing testing entities like eNorth of committing mass fraud. And they don't make "calls" but send an email, then one logs into their account and views the lab report.

https://etruenorth.com/

Also many locales in the US have been pushed to capacity for morgue space and have had to use refrigerated trucks for storage, just like in Italy, Brazil and others. This is the present situation in Houston. Many overwhelmed ER docs have been on the news begging people to take precautions. Are they frauds also? Amazing that they would violate their Hippocratic oaths and risk the careers they worked so hard for perpetuating such frauds. And for what reason? Hospitalization rates are spiking in several areas of the US, as are Covid related deaths.

https://covidtracking.com/data/state/arizona

https://covidtracking.com/data/state/florida

https://covidtracking.com/data/state/texas

In Florida, 56 hospital ICUs are currently at capacity.

https://www.beckershospitalreview.co...-capacity.html

This is up from the 40 on July 10.

https://www.foxnews.com/us/florida-h...cu-coronavirus

There's nothing like real evidence to put to bed idle talk.

This and more has already been covered on this thread, and the arguments about economies, suicide risks, etc. All have been addressed as well and found wanting. It's all here. I'm not doing it all over for every monger that comes along that can't be bothered with reading the whole discussion. They are all yours JJBee62. Ya can't fix stupid, but thankfully you can do a lot to work around it.