Stupid Shit in Kyiv

[Stykler]

I wonder if Thailand will restrict the United States travelers, so they don't piss off the Chinese and now Hong Kong.

Rather than being political, I think this will be more of a practical move. Why would countries who have done the hard (and expensive) yards by locking down early and strictly, thereby slowing the spread of the virus, allow residents of countries with let's say a more "laissez faire" approach to the virus' spreading similiar access to their country. It doesn't make much sense to them and I have to agree.

That's partly what this bloody virus is all about IMHO. Take me seriously governments or I will destroy you!

[MonkeyPaw]

I agree it is just too soon to project that things are just going to open particularly with International travel. I would love to be wrong when it comes to the freedom to travel. There are many announcements read between the lines, words like " hint " when it does open expect a ton of strings attached especially with foreigners.

Brits may be banned from Thailand. Not sure if this is gossip or what? But I promise you, China / Hong issues and relations has lots to do with who and when gets to travel to Thailand. Just the same as Japan not opening up to China in July because it doesn't want to piss off the USA. But Thailand has drawn its alliance with China on this one. I mentioned this earlier. I wonder if the USA will also be banned as well, since they removed the 1. 3 billion import tax exemption on Thai goods. I guess there always the Philippines for those living in the USA to monger. I wonder what would ever happen if China over took the USA as #1 economy with regards to bilateral agreements?

https://pattayaone.news/thailand-to-...may-be-banned/

[TinyHippo]

Most of that interest by ladies towards older guys is checking for a possible big score.

What reason do they have to fuck an old guy when there is plenty of money in the younger crowd? If you flash money to attract some fish. You are going to find a few sharks. It is up to you to be the smart one.

[Riina]

Tons more guys like this. Really mind-boggling how men can be so stupid around women, especially Anglo world men around Ukrainian women.

Most of that interest by ladies towards older guys is checking for a possible big score.

[PhotoSlider]

...A form of gambling addiction...

The more I think about it, the more similarities found.

5 weeks spent in the Great City of Kiev in September-October 2018, having a total of 50 girls in a pure burst of mongering insanity. First few days it was at least 3 girls one after another every 24 hours, while a semi-permanent rental GF was out of my bed at work in her office.

In a hindsight ordering those hourly girls did look like playing poker or blackjack.

- Give me another card please!

- Lilya, 2000 UAH + taxi, 168 cm, 52 kg, 2, 21 yo. Sending you pictures.

- Not bad. How soon at my door?

- 25 minutes.

- Deal.

Half an hour later I am assessing Lilya's assets and curves. Then later she takes a shower, not quite leaving my apartment yet, while I request via Viber:

- Give me another card please!

- Sonya, 1600 UAH + taxi, 172, 53, 2, 19 yo.

- Pass. I had her already last Friday. Give me a different one!

- Sure Paulina, 1800 UAH + taxi, 175,56, 3, 21 yo. 30 minutes at your entrance?

- Do you have her pictures?

- Here you go.

- Deal! Send her out.

- OK. Then Lilya can take the same car from your location.

At that moment Lilya appears out of the shower in all her shining glory, I pour her more champagne, we still have 20 minutes for a good BJ and sweet chat, when friend of mine calls. He wants to join the game at our table, and maybe strategic for upcoming weekend. And kaleidoscope keeps rotating, generating unimaginable pictures.

Girls like cards of different denomination, hand after hand after hand from the dealer, layout and alignment are constantly changing, wins and busts, ups and downs, the thrill of new face, new character, new interaction.

What a great addiction!

[PhotoSlider]

...introductions to overweight middle-aged single mothers, then finally met a few younger girls who he took on expenses paid vacations to Venice and other pricey destinations before they dumped him...

What a great writing style! IMHO ability to deliver thoughts clearly, in excellent literary language, certainly with proper grammar and spelling, strongly correlates with person's IQ. And vice versa, constant typos and simple laziness point to primitive thoughts or even lack of any.

Anyway, why do Anglo world men fall in such a predicament with huge expenses and not much if anything gained? There are certain patterns observed:

1. A form of masochism:

- She abused me, and I was so deceived! I spent so much money, and got nothing! And all the Ukrainian girls are ugly scammers!

And those complaints go on and on, because they deliver masochistic pleasure to the whining loser.

2. A form of gambling addiction. Similar risks, dangers, and loss patterns. Perception of getting the value:

- I am a wealthy man. Not everybody can afford this exclusive life style!

Let me explain this one in a little more detail.

When I order an hourly girl from agency, I know that at a minimum I'll get a BJ and vaginal intercourse. Simple very transactional business foundation. There is a chance of getting low quality resource, and most of the time I reject those in the delivery vehicle before paying anything. There is also a chance of getting a poor performer, who acts better during initial casting and then shuts down. In my experience that chance is under 30% when sourcing from established contacts, and I don't mind that loss within 1500-2000 UAH price segment. I consider this as an opportunity to convert better performers to my regulars. But this post is not about my successes.

Things get significantly more complicated with travel, marriage agencies and especially with paid online communication. The Fantasy is sold, the Promise, ever so elusive Happiness. Obviously girls and their management do not want to do much for free.

On one side, those Anglo world men do not dare to destroy that fancy temple, elaborately built in their imagination, with a request for a concise services list directly explaining aforementioned intimacy. Anglo world men assume that imminent paradise will unfold on its own, as it does in their heads (both upper and lower).

On the opposite side, girls (and managing them boys or whoever) have well established business processes with catch phrases and perfectly positioned marketing statements, actually saying nothing about mating or even kissing. That's where the disconnect happens. Anglo world men have false assumptions based on wrong expectations without due diligence, pre-qualification and validation.

Does it mean providers are scammers?

Only if they do not deliver on their promise in the contract.

If contract states "To have great time together with exceptional select females", then there's no breach in not providing sex to dissatisfied horny monger. And doesn't matter if he is ugly or tall, fit, sharply dressed and has great personality. Girls actually enjoy having a type of sadistic pleasure in dominating without delivering while being chased after.

If contract states "sex", but doesn't say how often, and doesn't mention GFE, then this is again the case of wrong expectations and assumptions.

Hookers in Amsterdam RLD do not promise GFE. Pay, fuck and move on! Are they scammers?

When inexperienced black jack player looses more than he can afford, is Casino at fault? Are card dealers and pit bosses merely shameless scammers?

Mongering in Kiev is like gambling. Even experienced card counter may have tactical setbacks, but with solid strategy and properly set expectations long term mongering chances in Kiev are way better than in black jack. And by saying long term, I mean many girls over at least multiple weeks if not months and years.

I am not talking about virtues of management and employees of marriage agencies around the world. And I agree with Kozerog, it is mind-boggling how men can be so stupid around women, doesn't matter Ukrainian or not.

I actually think it is not stupidity, but rather mental disorder one way or the other.

[DramaFree11]

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=91697-tr62k

I had a number of online arguments with this Stryker guy, including on his Ukraine Fusion forum, where he banned me for negativity. .

This is the main reason I stopped going to Ukraine, there are scams everywhere now. Most are small, but very easy to get sucked in. Use to be a great place, but now, not good.

[Kozerog]

Anthony, the escorts in Dubai and the dreams in Ukraine are different things. The simplest of chat on social media can quickly lead to opening a Western Union account.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=91697-tr62k

I had a number of online arguments with this Stryker guy, including on his Ukraine Fusion forum, where he banned me for negativity. If I recall correctly, Stryker himself spent $5000 on a Dream Connections tour, have $8000 to another agency to get introductions to overweight middle-aged single mothers, then finally met a few younger girls who he took them on expenses paid vacations to Venice and other pricey destinations before they dumped him. At least he got sime "intimacy" during these trips. Not sure how much intimacy, but surely price per act of intimacy at least $1000.

Another guy on Stryker's forum spent like $30 K on a girl and never got more than a kiss. When he took her to Paris after she accepted his marriage proposal, she insisted on separate bedrooms. At least the marriage fell through and he didn't get divorce raped. I spent a lot of time chatting with this guy. Clearly a sharp businessman (something to do with gas and oil drilling) and worth at least $10 million, but absolutely no sense where women are concerned. Turns to putty in the hands of these Ukrainian scammers.

Tons more guys like this. Really mind-boggling how men can be so stupid around women, especially Anglo world men around Ukrainian women.

[DramaFree11]

Yes 2-3 k is more like it. I know because I run a software company in Kyiv.

Thank you for your input. Many of the veterans on the Kiev page are in complete denial about Kiev and nothing will change there mind. There is a lot more money in Kiev then most would ever understand.

[Riina]

When would Mohammads send money to Kiev just for the attention of the girls when they can get high end Ukrainian and Russian escorts in Dubai?

Anthony, the escorts in Dubai and the dreams in Ukraine are different things. The simplest of chat on social media can quickly lead to opening a Western Union account.

[AntonySun1996]

When I was there the girls I knew were getting Mohammads sending them money each day. These dudes were so needy. And the girls would pay attention to them for a couple minutes and get funded.

When would Mohammads send money to Kiev just for the attention of the girls when they can get high end Ukrainian and Russian escorts in Dubai?

[Riina]

You guys ever notice that these you tube guys traveling Eastern Europe discreetly incorporate pussy into their videos. If we were back ten years, these same dudes would be on this forum describing their sexual conquests. I enjoy the content, but they're misleading viewers to believe sweet cuties can be found in the East. I can only imagine how many excited young men jump on a plane to only find reality.

I'm not discouraging travel. If you want success, you better have the cash and time. Most importantly, you better keep your Western values back home.

[MS Clive]

My doubts were about boys under 25 making 6 K USD a month. 3-4 K USD monthly before taxes or paid cash for a person under 30 in his prime is believable. Happy to be mistaken. Seriously. Thanks for sharing your knowledge in a civilized manner).

Kiev is an interesting city. One can spend almost more than in New York, or stay within very modest limits.

Yes 2-3 k is more like it. I know because I run a software company in Kyiv.

[PhotoSlider]

I think you would be very surprised at the IT salaries in Kyiv. $3000 is very common for a python or java programmer under 30. In the US or London they would be making at least $8000 a month. So, $3000-4000 is a bargain and office girls (SMM, Adsense, data science, etc.) are making 1200+ a month. Epam alone has over 5000 tech employees in UA. Odessa and the east is a very different story, but the young tech crowd in Kyiv has money.

My doubts were about boys under 25 making 6 K USD a month. 3-4 K USD monthly before taxes or paid cash for a person under 30 in his prime is believable. Happy to be mistaken. Seriously. Thanks for sharing your knowledge in a civilized manner).

Kiev is an interesting city. One can spend almost more than in New York, or stay within very modest limits.

[PhotoSlider]

...In other words, even if a few girls successfully scammed Mohammad in the past, the secret is out now and competition has surely ruined the market. That is, add up all the money of all the gullible Mohammads in the entire world, then divide by the number of scammers, and result is that most scammers aren't making much...

The key word here is "most". Some girls do, but resources are limited, and competition is fierce. I have wealthy local friends, they get a lot for free, and have no desire to sponsor long-term.

I also communicated a few times with scammers. They get easily frustrated when their attempts do not work. Desperation is obvious.

So, there's a lot of make-belief, wishful thinking and misconception around mongering activities in Kiev, as well as lots of variety, as it is a big and continually growing city with vibrant young population. Many girls do fish for easy money, doesn't mean they get it left and right, leaving the visiting boys empty-handed.