Stupid Shit in Kyiv

[Nyezhov]

LOL. Ukraine is being ruthlessly used by rogue elements in the USA who think a,weakened Russia somehow helps the USA. On the contrary, USA would benefit from a strong Russia led bloc as an ally against China. USA certainly wasn't threatened by Russia after 1990,-but some people didn't get the message. Or maybe they did get a different message: no Russian enemy means budget cuts. Too shortsighted to see that China would justify plenty of budget for defense, so no need fur Russia as enemy.

Ukrainians are even stupider than USA to have allowed themselves to be used by these USA rogue elements. I say rogue, because according to reports in NYTimes and elsewhere, CIA has been warning for years that Ukraine is a red line for Russia and was advising against arming Ukraine. Even former President Bush the first (previously head of CIA) warned Ukrainians about nationalism in 1990. His son, of course, was the idiot (along with arch warmongers Rumsfeld and Cheney) who insisted on opening NATO for Ukraine,-which is how this mess started. Rogue elements are State and Defense Department. Defense because they never met a war they didn't like, as long as no real risk to USA. State because populated by nsive idealists. In other words, contrary to the natural assumption of a devious CIA plot, CIA are the responsible grownups in this case, and State Department is who has been running amok..

You need to include the power hungry Dems that used the Ukraine to gin up fake scandals in your history of this sad event.

As a child of the Kingdom of Galicia and Lodomeria, I know how complex the history of that area is.

[DramaFree11]

LOL. Ukraine is being ruthlessly used by rogue elements in the USA who think a,weakened Russia somehow helps the USA. On the contrary, USA would benefit from a strong Russia led bloc as an ally against China. USA certainly wasn't threatened by Russia after 1990,-but some people didn't get the message. Or maybe they did get a different message: no Russian enemy means budget cuts. Too shortsighted to see that China would justify plenty of budget for defense, so no need fur Russia as enemy.

Ukrainians are even stupider than USA to have allowed themselves to be used by these USA rogue elements. I say rogue, because according to reports in NYTimes and elsewhere, CIA has been warning for years that Ukraine is a red line for Russia and was advising against arming Ukraine. Even former President Bush the first (previously head of CIA) warned Ukrainians about nationalism in 1990. His son, of course, was the idiot (along with arch warmongers Rumsfeld and Cheney) who insisted on opening NATO for Ukraine,-which is how this mess started. Rogue elements are State and Defense Department. Defense because they never met a war they didn't like, as long as no real risk to USA. State because populated by nsive idealists. In other words, contrary to the natural assumption of a devious CIA plot, CIA are the responsible grownups in this case, and State Department is who has been running amok.

Ukraine is not going to win as long as Putin is alive, because Russia can just escalate to nukes. Furthermore, even without Putin, there is a deep bench of military types behind Putin who are just as hawkish about Ukraine being a red line, so nukes still possible without Putin. Though I don't expect nukes, with or without Putin. Rather, I expect total devastation of southern and eastern Ukraine..

By far your best post ever. We disagree about a lot of thing, about Ukraine, but I completely agree with you on your assessment. Ukraine loses either way. A tie is not a win, if there is nothing left.

[Kozerog]

On May 8 1945, many countries in Europe laid destroyed, and yet, it was a win. What does corruption or NATO have to do with the fact that Ukraine became a victim of an unprovoked aggression? Did Ukraine wake up one morning and decided: what a great day for getting destroyed? Or did Russia do it to them?

I'm not sure what you're trying to say? Should Ukraine capitulate in your opinion now that they're winning?

LOL. Ukraine is being ruthlessly used by rogue elements in the USA who think a,weakened Russia somehow helps the USA. On the contrary, USA would benefit from a strong Russia led bloc as an ally against China. USA certainly wasn't threatened by Russia after 1990,-but some people didn't get the message. Or maybe they did get a different message: no Russian enemy means budget cuts. Too shortsighted to see that China would justify plenty of budget for defense, so no need fur Russia as enemy.

Ukrainians are even stupider than USA to have allowed themselves to be used by these USA rogue elements. I say rogue, because according to reports in NYTimes and elsewhere, CIA has been warning for years that Ukraine is a red line for Russia and was advising against arming Ukraine. Even former President Bush the first (previously head of CIA) warned Ukrainians about nationalism in 1990. His son, of course, was the idiot (along with arch warmongers Rumsfeld and Cheney) who insisted on opening NATO for Ukraine,-which is how this mess started. Rogue elements are State and Defense Department. Defense because they never met a war they didn't like, as long as no real risk to USA. State because populated by nsive idealists. In other words, contrary to the natural assumption of a devious CIA plot, CIA are the responsible grownups in this case, and State Department is who has been running amok.

Ukraine is not going to win as long as Putin is alive, because Russia can just escalate to nukes. Furthermore, even without Putin, there is a deep bench of military types behind Putin who are just as hawkish about Ukraine being a red line, so nukes still possible without Putin. Though I don't expect nukes, with or without Putin. Rather, I expect total devastation of southern and eastern Ukraine.

So yes, capitulation is and always has been the best option. If they want, split off west Ukraine and call it Galicia and send all the nationalists there.

[PedroMorales]

You are American and so do not belong in Europe about which you should not comment because you know nothing about it.

World War Two in Europe was a win for the USA who gave the least and took the most.

NATO is an American controlled mafia gang that is fueling the Ukrainian war, just as Sweden and Finland fueled Hitler. If Sweden and Finland carry through and join NATO and thereby allow Russia's Northern fleet to be blocked and Russia's early warning nuclear defences to be countered, nuclear war heads will rain down on New York and Washington.

Corruption has losers, in this case the ordinary Ukrainians. Zelensky, a guy who plays the piano in the nude, is the world's richest comedian.

Ukraine should surrender. Eastern Ukraine is being liberated and the last twelve years of Kiev war crimes are being ended. Western Ukraine will be another Kosovo, another US controlled Kosovo. Victoria NuLand said Fuck the EU. Fuck America as well. And fuck off as well.

On May 8 1945, many countries in Europe laid destroyed, and yet, it was a win. What does corruption or NATO have to do with the fact that Ukraine became a victim of an unprovoked aggression? Did Ukraine wake up one morning and decided: what a great day for getting destroyed? Or did Russia do it to them?

I'm not sure what you're trying to say? Should Ukraine capitulate in your opinion now that they're winning?

[Xpartan]

When your country is destroyed, sorry that is not a win. They will never get into NATO because of the corruption. Yes, both Russia and Ukraine are screwed. Especially they every day people.

On May 8 1945, many countries in Europe laid destroyed, and yet, it was a win. What does corruption or NATO have to do with the fact that Ukraine became a victim of an unprovoked aggression? Did Ukraine wake up one morning and decided: what a great day for getting destroyed? Or did Russia do it to them?

I'm not sure what you're trying to say? Should Ukraine capitulate in your opinion now that they're winning?

[GDreams]

Russia gets million from selling oil and gas, they can use another third country (like Iran or so) to buy Chinese equipment and skip sanctions, will see what happens.

What broke the USSR was military spending trying to match the US. With more sanctions, reduced international access to markets and through the roof military spending the people in Russia are not going to be be happy if the only outcome of this war is to get independence for a couple of breakaway republics that had already broken away.

[Jmsuttr]

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...KGB-chief.html

As I noted in the post title, this is as yet unconfirmed. But it's certainly something to watch for over the next few days or weeks.

[Jmsuttr]

Jmsuttr, I was reading how a country like India buys a lot of military hardware from both Russia and the West. If countries see Russian military hardware underperforming in battle they might adjust their purchases. This war can't be good for future Russia's military exports.

India has always played a decent game of neutrality. However, Indian elites are definitely Western-oriented. Too many affluent Indian ex-pats in the United States, United Kingdom, Canada, etc. The Indians are also watching this dance between China and Russia. Needless to say, China is India's rival economically and militarily in the region.

One foundational fact is that India hates China, with a capital H. One reason they've cultivated a relationship with Russia is because that was seen as way to blunt China's regional influence.

Right now I think many countries, India included, are reevaluating their relationship with Russia. I'm sure India is happy, in the short term, to buy oil at a substantial discount. But I'm sure they're taking a look at long term scenarios.

And I absolutely agree that Indian generals and admirals must be positively horrified at the underperformance of Russian military eqp.

[Jmsuttr]

Russia gets million from selling oil and gas, they can use another third country (like Iran or so) to buy Chinese equipment and skip sanctions, will see what happens.

Sanctions evasion is absolutely happening, of that I have no doubt. But the question is what items are slipping through the cracks and whether it's happening on a large enough scale to make a material difference. It's also important to consider how far a country is willing to stick its neck out for Russia.

Take China, for example, while they talk about "partnership" with Russia, there's no evidence they're helping Russia militarily. And that's probably because that would risk their relationship with Europe and the West. And China needs the West much more than it needs Russia. Also, the kinds of items that would be important are pretty well tracked. And it's unlikely that advanced technology of value would be sold to either China or Iran. And, when it comes to military tech, Russia has generally been considered to be at a higher level, or at least on par, with China's. Not sure exactly what China has to offer, even if they were inclined to do so.

Since sanctions evasion happens away from the public eye, maybe the best indicator is what's happening inside Russia itself. From every report I'm seeing, Russia is running short of precision munitions and has had to shut down tank and missile factories. I agree that time will tell, although I don't think time is on Russia's side.

[Jmsuttr]

For all you flyover country cowboys and Gotham shtetl crawlers, we hear ya.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=AVf7m_YZ2zY

Nuthin', zero, zip, nada.

Not sure what kind of delusional world you inhabit in which you think that a random YouTube video link, posted by you, would be of general interest.

Pray tell, is it a home video of Hitler celebrating his birthday in a bunker?

[Jmsuttr]

Great post. I post about MDE because it is shit-hole, but you probably like the place. The difference between Kiev and MDE. 10-15 years ago Kiev was an amazing place, full of energy, great food, fun, amazing night-life, , great theater, good weather and many other wonderful things. Then corruption took over and unfortunately the country fell apart. I really doubt MDE was ever good, unless you have terribly low standards, you like bad service and even worse food. I can go on. If you like cheap sex was average girls and very curvy, then go. I am sure Bogota is much better, but both are very dangerous and full of drugs.

In my response to Pedro M, the only reason I mentioned Medellin was because he (Pedro M) was complaining about "Stupid Shit" threads while actively posting in SS threads in both the Kiev and Medellin forums.

So my only reason for posting about MDE at all was for the purpose of pointing out Pedro M's blatant hypocrisy, nothing more.

[Jmsuttr]

When your country is destroyed, sorry that is not a win. They will never get into NATO because of the corruption. Yes, both Russia and Ukraine are screwed. Especially they every day people.

Much of Europe was destroyed in WW-II. It took years of investment and reconstruction, but it was rebuilt. Ukraine already has many commitments for such reconstruction efforts.

Besides, Ukraine has no choice in the matter. Russia is the one who chose the path of destruction, not Ukraine. All Ukrainians are doing is defending themselves as best they can. And, hopefully with Western weapons and support, they can kick the Russians out of most or all of their territory.

So, while I understand your general sentiment, unless you have another solution, the Ukrainians are doing the best they can with the shitty cards they've been dealt.

As far as NATO is concerned, I'm guessing Ukraine will be allowed to enter the EU and that some set of security guarantees will be crafted that don't necessarily depend on NATO membership. Besides, the primary reason for NATO's existence is to counterbalance threats from Russia. If the end result of this war is that Russia is severely weakened and can no longer pose a credible threat to Ukraine, then that problem will be substantially solved.

There are no good answers, obviously, because the best answer would be for the war to have never started. Since that's passed out of the realm of possibility, the only options left are those that deal squarely with the reality of the situation, such as it is.

[WyattEarp]

When you're being attacked by a bigger, more powerful opponent, not losing is the equivalent of a win. Hanging in there while the bully exhausts himself gives you a chance to strike back when the opportunity presents itself.

Ukraine didn't choose this war, Russia did. And Ukraine doesn't have the luxury of dictating terms and conditions. The best they can do is roll with the punch. And, with the support they're receiving from NATO and the West, they now have a fighting chance. Every piece of eqp lost by Russia will be difficult or impossible to replace. Every Ukraine loss is being replaced by weapons that are even newer and better.

Jmsuttr, I was reading how a country like India buys a lot of military hardware from both Russia and the West. If countries see Russian military hardware underperforming in battle they might adjust their purchases. This war can't be good for future Russia's military exports.

India has always played a decent game of neutrality. However, Indian elites are definitely Western-oriented. Too many affluent Indian ex-pats in the United States, United Kingdom, Canada, etc. The Indians are also watching this dance between China and Russia. Needless to say, China is India's rival economically and militarily in the region.

[Ringudor]

Every piece of eqp lost by Russia will be difficult or impossible to replace. Every Ukraine loss is being replaced by weapons that are even newer and better.

Russia gets million from selling oil and gas, they can use another third country (like Iran or so) to buy Chinese equipment and skip sanctions, will see what happens.

[Golfinho]

For all you flyover country cowboys and Gotham shtetl crawlers, we hear ya.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=AVf7m_YZ2zY