Stupid Shit in Kyiv

[John Clayton]

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/12/23/w...e=articleShare

I pray this goes somewhere. Theres got to be a way to stop the killing and insure the security of Ukraine.

How would a ceasefire ensure the security of Ukraine?

[Tiny 12]

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/12/23/w...e=articleShare

I pray this goes somewhere. There’s got to be a way to stop the killing and insure the security of Ukraine.

[Riina]

You forgot to mention they are sending Females to the front now, that is how bad it is for Ukraine, yet some continue to want the war to continue.

I see lots of young Ukrainian men in my home city and they are quality dudes certain to be successful. It's hard to believe governments want to destroy them.

[DramaFree11]

"The average Ukrainian soldier is 43-years-old, according to Time Magazine.

When the war began in February 2022, the average Ukrainian soldier was between 30 and 35 years old.

Ukraine is battling mounting manpower problems more than 20 months into the war. ".

https://www.businessinsider.com/aver...0 years%20 old.

You forgot to mention they are sending Females to the front now, that is how bad it is for Ukraine, yet some continue to want the war to continue.

[DramaFree11]

Here is the latest piece from Taibbi:

In a bold piece of agitprop, "USA Officials" blame Ukraine's bleak battlefield situation on. Pentagon leaker Jack Teixeira?

If Teixeira hadn't let slip that officials were freaking out in private about Ukraine's prospects, members of Congress might not have been emboldened to filibuster Biden's spending bill as they did last week. Therefore, learning the truth was bad, and we can blame the leaks, not the factory-produced river of hogwash dumped on the world for the last 22 months, for the dilemma now facing Biden and Ukraine. How's that for Beltway bull-slinging?.

Great post! I Hope Pres. Z days are numbered, you want to talk about war crimes, he should be on the top of the list. Hopefully they charge him with War Crimes. What joke. There will be nothing left. Biden, Pres. Z. And some Euros have no clue and have ruined Ukraine. It is time to wave the White Flag and save what they can, but I am afraid they are going keep going and Russia will have to take Pres. Z and his government out.

[Elvis 2008]

Here is the latest piece from Taibbi:

In a bold piece of agitprop, "USA Officials" blame Ukraine's bleak battlefield situation on. Pentagon leaker Jack Teixeira?

If Teixeira hadn't let slip that officials were freaking out in private about Ukraine's prospects, members of Congress might not have been emboldened to filibuster Biden's spending bill as they did last week. Therefore, learning the truth was bad, and we can blame the leaks, not the factory-produced river of hogwash dumped on the world for the last 22 months, for the dilemma now facing Biden and Ukraine. How's that for Beltway bull-slinging?

Now that the contracting orgy has stopped, however, pucker season is on. Volodymyr Zelensky was in DC Tuesday night and looked like he was doing a take for John Wick 9 when he walked out of Congress empty-handed. If that face is any indication, phones will start ringing all over soon, as unnamed "officials" give seething insider takes on how things got so FUBAR.

If the White House is already sending up trial balloons like this Post story, that means the real blame game is about to start. Zelensky came here for $61 billion, got sent home with a handshake and $175 million from Biden's Presidential Drawdown Authority, and left with gritted teeth and the look of a man planning an as told to Kitty Kelley memoir. Unless this thing gets turned around, and it still could, we're about to learn some things. Was there ever a plan? What promises were made? From our side, how much of this was a pork party, really? If a little leak was intolerable, imagine how the whole truth would go over.

End of that link.

Then you have this story, https://www.racket.news/p/lying-was-...m_medium=email.

What gets me is how many people, especially Democrats, fall for this bullshit like this below.

These "savior weapons" pieces were cranked out like clockwork, usually just ahead of Ukraine-related appropriations decisions so "the legislator's already hearing about it, the narrative's already created," as one PR exec put it to me. Not dozens, but hundreds of sunny predictions were rolled out about how Ukraine would be steaming toward Moscow if they could just get more Patriot or Javelin or Stinger missiles or Leopard tanks (They "instill great fear," said Radio Free Europe!) or 155 mm artillery shells or Fortem F700 drones or whatever else.

Advertorials of this type came mostly in two formats: in-field soldier endorsements ("The more of them we get the better!" an unnamed Ukrainian gushed to CBS, about cluster munitions).

In the mean time, Texiera was attacked because he let the truth slip about what the experts were saying in private that went against the official narrative. We saw the EXACT same thing with Covid. The experts had one set narrative in public where they were all knowing and in private were up in arms, scared shitless, and really knew nothing.

I joked that we should all be thankful for Putin as he cured the world of Covid and apparently I was not the only one. We are in the repeat phase of wash, rinse, repeat. And for that, we go back to Taibbi talking to a colleague.

Walter Kirn: Right. I mean, because to use the current thing term, what tends to happen at the end of some big initiative that isn't working is that a new frightening foe presents itself and we all shift our attention. I mean, the joke was Ukraine ended Covid and it did. So what's going to-.

Matt Taibbi: Yeah, Hamas ended Ukraine.

Walter Kirn: Yeah, Hamas ended Ukraine. Exactly. And so that seems to be the new strategy, or just let's not call it a conscious strategy, the new reality. Our attention is turned intensely toward new challenges when old disappointments evolve. And rather than let us sit around and be disappointed and have blame and be in this big muddle of bad feeling, I have a feeling, at least at the media level, if not the real one, we're going to be pointed towards something else. The coming dictatorship of Donald Trump.

You would think the smugness of Democrats and always being wrong when listening to the "experts" who are just paid hacks with degrees or experience would end now but is has not. The smugness on Covid and Ukraine will now be replaced with smugness with regards to Trump and Hamas. To be a Democrat these days requires you to have a memory the length of your average gnat.

[Tiny 12]

Sooner rather than later, Ukraine will run out of men to put on the front line. Then what? They are already sending teenagers and old men. What's next? Women? Horrific.

"The average Ukrainian soldier is 43-years-old, according to Time Magazine.

When the war began in February 2022, the average Ukrainian soldier was between 30 and 35 years old.

Ukraine is battling mounting manpower problems more than 20 months into the war. ".

https://www.businessinsider.com/aver...0 years%20 old.

[Reiner Otto]

Russia has over 3 x the population of Ukraine, probably more. Ukraine will run out of men and ammo much quicker than the Russians. That's reason enough to say the Russians will win.

Unfortunately, you are wright. Look, what's actually going on in the USA right now. Will the USA still "help"next year? And look at all the help from Germany. Allthough a German citizen, I have to

be ashamed regarding the amount of "help"the German government provided. Already last year I outed my opinion, that Germany (and the West?)

want to bleed out the Ukraine, being so fast in providing "support'. Germany started with a few thousand helmets. Wow! At least, not from the Wehrmacht. And then the old, half (or completely?) rotten

?) rotten old anti-tank weapons from the former East German Army, thus antique Russian stuff. The USA, although, kept face. Until now.

The West had a lot of sweet talks, mainly. And a few weapons. Until now. How could the West expect a successful offensive of the UA, without air superiotity? Without modern fighter aircrafts?

And now, even in case F16 will be sent, finally. Still good UA-pilots available? Or did they shed their blood already flying old MIG-29 and SU-27 ?

This writes somebody, who lived, worked and hunted 5 years in the RF. And 5 years in Nikolaev, Odessa and Cherson. And was partying multiple times in Kazantip, Crimea.
Only chance for the UA to win: 5 Billion Dollar bounty for Putler.

[Blood Red]

No NATO just wants Putin to stop prosecuting a genocidal war on Ukraine, murdering civilians with precision weapons, deporting their children to re-indoctrination camps, that kind of stuff. As to the Ukrainians, they want to fight to preserve their identity.

NATO already threw Ukraine under the bus. Ukraine will never join NATO. The goal of NATO is to make Russia weak and to bleed. Lyold Austin said this over a year ago. He didn't say anything about Ukraine winning because he and the rest of NATO know that is not possible. May those NATO monsters rot in eternal hell for taking Ukraine down the primrose path.

Sooner rather than later Putin will run out of ethnic canon fodder from the poorer regions while having fewer and fewer from other regions willing to fight. Then what? We've already seen one exodus of 200,000 young Russian men as they fled for the border, and there's a rebellion among Russian mothers and wives.

https://www.chathamhouse.org/2023/12...lized-soldiers

This is a war of attrition. Don't you know how that works? Russia has over 3 x the population of Ukraine, probably more. Ukraine will run out of men and ammo much quicker than the Russians. That's reason enough to say the Russians will win.

This is propaganda and easy to say in a monger forum. Prove it with a reliable source, and go ahead include Russian state media. You are either in the camp directly or a far right isolationist. There's actually not much difference between the two though. Teenage adults yes, "old men" no outside of volunteers. Ukraine currently has 688,000 active troops, 650,000 in reserve and a larger pool to tap into. But yea, it's easy to talk. Link us to your sources.

https://www.businessinsider.com/ukra...-of-war-2023-4

Alright man, believe what you want.

Your opinion and two dollars will buy you a cup of coffee. Putin has been very clear that he believes the Ukraine belongs to Russia, while he doesn't have any "new" territories. The occupations are illegal, while he ran from both Kyiv and Kharkiv with his tail between his legs and is on his heels in Kherson.

What "started this whole thing" is Putin's imperialistic designs and decades long belly aching over the loss of the USSR, along with Ukraine's commitment to democracy which of course he sees as a threat. Also, before you go there, no promise against NATO expansion was ever made. That's another point here that has been covered at least a dozen times.

https://hls.harvard.edu/today/there-...-enlarge-nato/

When did Putin say he beleives Ukraine belongs to Russia? If he wanted to take over Ukraine, 2014 would've been a much better time, when Ukraine military was weak. Instead he tried 2 Minsk accords. There's no evidence to support what you just said. You live in a fantasy world if you're not willing to accept that this is all about NATO expansion (root cause). Even the PM of Georgia said the same thing a while back.

Hogwash, while this has been refuted at least a dozen times on this thread over the last 18 months. The democratically elected national legislature removed a corrupt Russian puppet leader, and all within the provisions of the Ukrainian constitution. NEXT.

You know what they say about opinions, while that's all your prediction is. But the two situations are different on many grounds, primarily because we are talking about Russia, a country that habitually breaks agreements while they have expansionist ambitions. Ukraine is fighting against genocide and to preserve their identity, and as long as they are willing to do so the west should support them.

Yeah, support them until the last Ukrainian. Or you could call for a ceasefire. You want the former. What a horrific tragedy that could've easily been avoided. God bless the Ukrainian people.

[Questner]

Arm wrestling matches do not end in a draw or tie. Same here: all the goals of the SMO are going to be accomplished. Crimea is a wonderful region, highly recommended to visit June to September.

[Paulie97]

The polls actually weren't conducted by the occupiers, but did occur in occupied territory. Some were conducted by respected organizations like Gallup and Pew Research.

Please say you are kidding us. LOL Who cares who the "respected organizations" are, as the polls were still conducted under occupation and under a cloud of intimidation.

See here for info about polls in Crimea.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014_C...tus_referendum

The pre-2014 polls are a mixed bag, but post referendum polls indicate a preference for being a part of Russia.

Wikipedia isn't a source but a bathroom wall. Anyone can post content there, and though moderated, this can be sketchy and slow to come. The Tartar question is often ignored. These favor Ukraine, and have often been intimidated since Stalin purged them from Crimea in the early 1940's. But regardless, anyone in Crimea or the Donbass that wants to be part of Russia doesn't have far to travel. Irrespective of specious polls and votes at gunpoint, the annexations remain illegal.

https://www.eeas.europa.eu/node/112989_fr

[Tiny 12]

Polling data from the occupiers can be discarded.

The polls actually weren't conducted by the occupiers, but did occur in occupied territory. Some were conducted by respected organizations like Gallup and Pew Research.

We've discussed Donbas before:

Please see this article from 2019.

https://www.kyivpost.com/post/7557

"Only 5.1 percent of people living in the Russia-controlled parts of Donetsk and Luhansk regions want Ukraine to regain control over the territories. Half (50.9 percent) want a union with Russia and another 13.4 percent said the region should accede to Russia with a "special status." For the whole of Donbas, including its Ukraine-controlled areas, 49.6 percent want it to become part of Russia, with another 13.3 percent choosing such a scenario with a "special status" for Donbas. A fifth (19.2 percent) see Donbas as part of Ukraine."

So apparently 50.9% wanted to live in a Russian oblast, and another 13.4% in something like a Russian territory (e.g. like Puerto Rico in the USA). Only 5.1% wanted to live in a Ukrainian controlled oblast.

See here for info about polls in Crimea.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014_C...tus_referendum

The pre-2014 polls are a mixed bag, but post referendum polls indicate a preference for being a part of Russia.

Russian as it is now, will never stop meddling in UA politics, they can't even stop meddling in US and EU politics.

Good point. I believe you're probably right.

[Paulie97]

Great job liberals.

And how many times have you been presented with the fact that the majority of American conservative Republicans support aid to Ukraine? A dozen? That applies to both voters and lawmakers. But yea, turn it into a conservative versus liberal thing when you don't get your way. That's easy enough I suppose, though that false dichotomy has gotten pretty dated.

[Paulie97]

Until the last Ukrainian? I know that's sick, but it sounds like that's what the neocons, the NATO warmongers and Zelensky wants.

No NATO just wants Putin to stop prosecuting a genocidal war on Ukraine, murdering civilians with precision weapons, deporting their children to re-indoctrination camps, that kind of stuff. As to the Ukrainians, they want to fight to preserve their identity.

Sooner rather than later, Ukraine will run out of men to put on the front line. Then what?

Sooner rather than later Putin will run out of ethnic canon fodder from the poorer regions while having fewer and fewer from other regions willing to fight. Then what? We've already seen one exodus of 200,000 young Russian men as they fled for the border, and there's a rebellion among Russian mothers and wives.

https://www.chathamhouse.org/2023/12...lized-soldiers

They are already sending teenagers and old men. What's next? Women? Horrific.

This is propaganda and easy to say in a monger forum. Prove it with a reliable source, and go ahead include Russian state media. You are either in the camp directly or a far right isolationist. There's actually not much difference between the two though. Teenage adults yes, "old men" no outside of volunteers. Ukraine currently has 688,000 active troops, 650,000 in reserve and a larger pool to tap into. But yea, it's easy to talk. Link us to your sources.

https://www.businessinsider.com/ukra...-of-war-2023-4

I don't think Putin wants anything more than the 4 new territories + Crimea as part of Russia.

Your opinion and two dollars will buy you a cup of coffee. Putin has been very clear that he believes the Ukraine belongs to Russia, while he doesn't have any "new" territories. The occupations are illegal, while he ran from both Kyiv and Kharkiv with his tail between his legs and is on his heels in Kherson.

But Ukraine must be neutral also, that's what started this whole thing.

What "started this whole thing" is Putin's imperialistic designs and decades long belly aching over the loss of the USSR, along with Ukraine's commitment to democracy which of course he sees as a threat. Also, before you go there, no promise against NATO expansion was ever made. That's another point here that has been covered at least a dozen times.

https://hls.harvard.edu/today/there-...-enlarge-nato/

And for the you. S to stop meddling in Ukrainian politics as well. I mean that's how this whole thing started in 2014 when the you. S removed the democratically elected leader.

Hogwash, while this has been refuted at least a dozen times on this thread over the last 18 months. The democratically elected national legislature removed a corrupt Russian puppet leader, and all within the provisions of the Ukrainian constitution. NEXT.

That's how this will end, a ceasefire without a peace agreement, a frozen conflict, much like the Koreas.

You know what they say about opinions, while that's all your prediction is. But the two situations are different on many grounds, primarily because we are talking about Russia, a country that habitually breaks agreements while they have expansionist ambitions. Ukraine is fighting against genocide and to preserve their identity, and as long as they are willing to do so the west should support them.

[Elvis 2008]

Given the size, strength and budget of the Orc army vs Ukraine, the orcs are by no means kicking ass, in terms of lives lost, economic destruction and equipment losses, Russia is the one getting pummeled.

And the most convincing part of that if anyone in government shares document showing that line is bullshit not only will they be put in jail but their boss will be put in jail.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...-jack-teixeira

He is accused of sharing classified military documents on Discord about Russia's invasion of Ukraine and other national security topics.

Authorities allege he began sharing classified documents in a Discord chat group, including typing out documents and sharing photographs, and continued to do so even after being warned by superiors about his activities in accessing intelligence information.

Teixeira allegedly bragged about the scope of information to which he had access, writing that what he had presented was "less than half of what's available".

"All of the shit I've told you guys I'm not supposed to," federal prosecutors have alleged he said.

https://www.zerohedge.com/military/a...r-removed-post

One of the documents released by Teixeira was an intelligence assessment that predicted that Ukraine would fall "well short" of its goals in the counteroffensive. American officials attempted to downplay those findings in May before Kiev launched a counteroffensive the following month.

End of link.

It is amazing how much government shit is classified and why it is. In this case, it is pretty obvious documents were classified to keep the American people in the dark about how throwing money into the pit that is Ukraine is a complete waste.

Russia is the one getting pummeled? Yeah, sure.