Seeking Arrangements

[Midwestern]

You meet an attractive girl. You try to interest her. She determines if you are offering enough to keep her interested in you. Even after you think you hit it off and you get her phone number, she might not respond. Then there's the date or dates. If you are lucky enough to wind up at your place or her place, the girl might play hard to get and you have to go through a long seduction.

For me, there was absolutely no long seduction.

For me, the challenge was finding a girl that I liked that was willing to meet me for a drink. When I was active on SA, I would look at pages and pages of profiles, send out maybe a half dozen messages and see if I can get a nibble from any of them. Once I got a nibble, I would say "let's meet for a drink. " There were occasions where they might want to chat me up a little, and I did chat a bit, but I would eventually return to "let's talk about all this over a drink. " If they were game, then we would then set a time and day, but many times the date does not materialize.

But when I finally did get someone to meet for a drink, then we could see if there was genuine chemistry. If there wasn't, then I just cut bait. But if there was great chemistry, then we either had a great time and fucked that night, or we just had a great time and we fucked the next date. Agreeing to an arrangement with girls that I had chemistry with was always easy and quick. We both know what we want in an arrangement. I know what I am wiling to pay and she knows what she is willing to accept. So, convergence occurs quickly.

So, no long seduction. The long part is just finding someone you like to agree to meet you for a drink. But I'm a sample size of 1, so you should take my take with a grain of salt, of course.

[Member #4703]

Guys have dicks so they pay to message.

Girls have pussys so they message for free.

So yeah they don't need premium but you do.

Unfortunately. Thanks for the confirmation!

[Member #4703]

I looked up Lisbon just now and the selection seems OK. That's a good omen as it is not always true in my experience that SA has a large enough selection of girls in all the European cities.

How long will you be in Lisbon? If it is for 2 to 3 weeks at least, paying up a month worth of subscription is worth it. If you are only there for a week or less, I would be hesitant to spend 80 bucks to purchase a subscription. When I used SA in Europe, it was because I already purchased subscription in USA and didn't cost me anything more to use in Europe.

I am only going to be there for 5 days but I coughed up for a subscription today. Put into a few hours work and fortunately have got two dates lined up with two early 20's girl who said they are ready to go intimate if the chemistry is there over drinks. Pursuing a couple more, lets see how it goes. Normal price which girls ask is 150-200 for a couple of hours or the whole night depending on the girl (targeting only top 20% of the girls, no 25+ or fat girls). It is already a better deal than doing escorts (which are 150 an hour for the doable / nice ones), so I guess the 100 euros spent on SA membership are not money down the drain.

Lisbon is a bit cheaper in this regard compared to The Netherlands, where I have had most of my SA experience. Netherlands is mostly 200 for a couple of hours, and 300 for a whole night. Depends on the girl also of course, I have had freebies once the girl and me liked each other, but normal prices are what I wrote.

Somebody was asking where to find girls for 200 per meet on SA. I think you have your best chance in the south in the big cities, Madrid, Barcelona, Lisbon. North will for sure be a bit expensive. You can pm me and I will help you for sure if I can.

[LshRoomer]

Steve9696,

Awesome report man. Keep it coming. Personally, the situations that I find myself in with SA girls are part of the thrill that keeps me coming back. Each one is different and will make the night interesting in different ways.

Game is definitely part of the interaction. As you mentioned, they are not hookers that will fuck you the moment you meet because you are paying them. They do have the ASD (love that term!) and you have to break down those defenses. I start on this the moment we meet in person, with the "freedom talk" over drinks. Basically pointing out that you should be free with your thoughts, free with you emotions, don't be subjected, be free with your path in life, free with your sexuality, as it is right to explore, but only if the guy respects you and your freedom. LOL.

I know it sounds crazy, but most girls eat this up, because it comes across as a challenge. Who wants to think of themselves (or be thought of) as a prude or closed minded person, that enjoys restrictions, and spurns experimentation? I want them to be free with me, and I usually explicitly (with subtlety) let them know that there is no judgement from me for embracing your freedom. One girl even asked, "Do you think I'm a prostitute?" I gave her the freedom speech with a shot of good cognac and I was getting a BBBJ 30 minutes later. LOL. It works.

02.

[Steve 9696]

We would like to know your experience with SA girls in various cities and what they are asking for allowances or ppm. There is very little information what the market rates for SBs in various cities.

Asked and answered I think but here it is again:

Most large US cities 300-400 with 400 more common.

San Fran and NYC 500.

Second tier cities 300, with possible score at 200.

Girls will often throw out 800 or 1000 PPM. They are smoking crack. Just move on.

[LshRoomer]

Were you living in Denver and Orlando when you used SA? Or you visiting those cities on a short term basis? I can see Orlando is perhaps not too productive. I have not used SA in Orlando but have had some success in Miami / Ft Laud area and also a couple of times in Tampa; the Tampa / St Pete area was truly good with the amount of response I received when I sent out requests ahead of my visit and the quality of girls was awesome and FL prices were reasonably cheap. Orlando however is a touristy city with mostly Disney and Universal crowds and not a fun place otherwise so I can imagine it is a waste of time. I had been in Denver a bunch of times but not recently; I have been on SA for 4-5 years now but in this time frame I was in Denver only once and I did not get a chance to use SA on that visit.

Your 300/400 Euro price is a bit high for my taste. I have gotten super great service in Europe for 200. Pretty girls too. Europe is in economic distress. There are tons of girls now who are desperate. In Spain, one girl I met through SA told me that her work had dried up and she was more or less desperate. She was grateful to take 200 from me for each session, spent nearly 3 hrs each time and pretty much nothing was off limits. That would have cost a pretty penny in FKKs. On the plus side, she was a true Catalan woman and not a Romanian faking to be Catalan (FKK inside joke, for those who get it), BTW, this was prior to Covid. I would think things are truly dire in Europe now and I would not be shocked if you can truly exceptional deals for 200 to 300 (multiple hours, super hot girls, BBFS, etc).

I think in US it is possible to get decent service for fly by travelers but much better to be a local. American girls don't put out that easily and not necessarily on the first date. Some might but many won't. If you are in a city for 4 days, you can try your luck but don't be too disappointed if nothing happens. It is not you, it is them.

Of course, it all depends on who you seek. I always stick to 25, White, slim body types and generally pleasant pretty faces. Occasionally I take fair skinned Latinas. Colombian / Argentine types rather than Mexican / Brazilian types. That is my optical spec. I suspect if you compromise on specs or expand the range of specs, success rate might go up. However, I would not know because I did not try.

When I tried Denver and Orlando, I was there for 4 days a piece. Denver girls were very receptive. Of the 2 that I went out with, I banged one ($200) and just made out with the other. On the day I was leaving 2 more girls that I had spoken to contacted me to hang out. One was a thin redhead that I wanted to bang so bad. She couldn't find a babysitter during my whole stay I would definitely do SA in Denver again. It was harder (than EU) to negotiate in Denver, but I was able to line up about 4 girls. Unfortunately, I just didn't have the time to see them all. Orlando, as you mentioned was a desert.

In Europe, my experiences with SBs have been in Berlin, Prague, London, and warsaw. All of these cost me about 300-350 eu. I almost got baited and switched in Berlin for 500, but I shut it down before I pulled out the cash. I've had free in London, as she only wanted stuff (shoes, bags, hang out with me at nice restaurants). I find it difficult to use SA in Prague. I get plenty of initial replies, but they don't continue the correspondence. One SA girl I banged in Prague wasn't even Czech, she was Aussie. I'm still relatively new to the Sugar scene (about 2 years less this year due to being fucked by COVID). I usually use Seeking 2 weeks before I travel and this has been working pretty well.

You have to share where you are finding these 200 eu SBs!! I've never been able to agree on 200/ meet. I usually look for thin non smokers. Ethnicity and age don't matter to me as much, though I do favor euro white girls, then asians, then latinas. However, recently I have been searching for 20 and up. I banged two 18 year olds and I remember wanting a bit more life experience for the chatting, non-bedroom portion.

I'm with you that things in EU sound pretty bad right now and using Seeking would probably yield great results at this point. There are probably awesome sessions to be had for 200-300 eu with the current conditions. More places to conquer once this is all over.

02.

[Steve 9696]

I myself have not jumped into the SA pool. However after following this thread and other forums on the topic, it seems to me the process is one long negotiation. That's fine. It closely parallels the experiences of actual dating.

You meet an attractive girl. You try to interest her. She determines if you are offering enough to keep her interested in you. Even after you think you hit it off and you get her phone number, she might not respond. Then there's the date or dates. If you are lucky enough to wind up at your place or her place, the girl might play hard to get and you have to go through a long seduction. Much like what Steve is referring to as Japanese Nanpa.

In the MeToo world this all might now seem odd. A girl just wants to kiss and you really want to fuck. Seriously, you're going to seduce her into having sex?? Yes, exactly. She never says no. She moves your hand away from her body while still locking lips. Or she says it's late and that she really needs to go home, but she never actually moves to get up.

Remember those dates. Some girls would simply let you touch them and undress them. They were the ready and willing. Other girls wanted to play good girl and make you work for it. How bad do you want it? Haha. Sometimes you had to get the girl physically worked up to the point where she could no longer resist.

When a date finally culminated in sex, it was very satisfying beyond just the actual act. I think from what I read here this is what many men enjoy about SA. The hunt is part of the enjoyment.

Exactly. I would say with proper warm up drinks and the right conversation by text ahead of time most girls are Down to Fuck (DTF) but it can vary widely. On my Vegas trip my three girls ran the gamut from:

1. DTF. Had a teddy in her purse she put on when taking a pee.

2. Sorta DTF. Needed some drinks and kissing to get warmed up.

3. NOT DTF. Literally said "I can't have sex with a guy I just met".

Of these girls, number 1 was the most fun and I repeated with - total wildcat. Number 2 was a lot of fun and I repeated with. And number 3 was a straight up adventure and enjoyable because of the conquest. Here's how that one went down:

Remember, SA girls are not hookers -- at least the ones I want to be with. There is a certain amount of game required -- both text game and in-person game. And, since I've had a couple civvy (unpaid) dates that were sex-fails, using my 30 year old pickup game (LOL), I've been reading up on Nampa -- Japanese Street Pickup Game. And I've learned some good stuff which I ended up using particularly with Jesse. Here are some terms you need to know:

Escalating / Kino. Light touching and kissing during the date to establish how receptive she is. I do this naturally anyhow.

Bounce. Take the girl from one location to another, particularly one where you can be close together. And when you bounce to the hotel don't make a big deal about it. Don't discuss. Don't ask. Just go there.

Push and Pull -- When you go for a kiss or a feel and she resists. Just brush it off. Change the subject. Try again in a bit. It will go farther. Eventually you can get her worked up and do the deed.

Persistence -- Don't be deterred if you get shot down. Just take a detour and try again. This concept was so foreign to me. You'd be amazed at the guys that go for a kiss, get shot down three times and end up fucking a half hour later after repeated push pull! WTF? Really. Yep.

LMR. Last minute resistance. Despite a girl going to your room she may get cold feet at the last minute. Push and pull and persistence are key to dealing with this.

Anti-Sl*t Defense (ASD) - No girl wants to feel like a sl*t. They need to rationalize in their heads that you are special and fucking you on the first date is Ok. You have to help them see this. That is also why in street pickup, you have to isolate her from her friends on an initial open and bounce somewhere else (so she can later go to the hotel privately and not look slutty).

Some guys push it all too far, IMO, but most of the principles are sound. This will be important later particularly with Jesse.

OK. So day 2 is Jesse day. Jesse is my 20 year old Viet Korean Mexican hottie. From the pics, she was kinda my fave. In person she is pretty, but via lots of make up and eyelashes and hair extensions (she confessed). Alexa is more naturally pretty. But Jesse is still a very pretty girl.

I changed reservations to go to Lago instead of Carbone, which sounded too much like Il Mulino. Lago is spectacular. The view of the Bellagio fountains is amazing and the food is wonderful. It's Italian tapas so we had five plates we shared.

We had a really nice dinner and she is a much more engaging conversationalist than Alexa. And she really appreciates the setting and the food. She gets carded by the waiter, but she can't produce it and they deny her a glass of wine. Kind of a bummer; but I guess an occupational hazard of dating a twenty year old! Hahaha.

So with Jesse more so than the others, I start to sense her youngness and perhaps she's not as sophisticated and sexy as she tries to imply. I decide to walk straight to the hotel without really saying where we are going, but surely she knows. I escalate with an arm around from time to time and it's not a cold response but not warm either.

As we enter the hotel I tell her I have a couple wines to choose from in my room and she says OK, so we just rock on up there. It's pretty comfortable but you can tell she is shy -- which is in complete contrast to how she dresses, as she is the sluttiest dresser of the three.

In the room, we admire the view and I can just feel the flow is not right. We start drinking and that probably helps. At one point she sits on the bed, which I take as a good sign and join her. But we really just chat a bit awkwardly. At some point I think fuck it and just go in for a kiss. She responds nicely and is a pretty good kisser. So we do that for a minute or two then stop.

The push and pull (remember Nanpa?) is now ringing in the back of my mind so I initiate again and pull her down to a lying position. And we make out a bit more but it's just not feeling there to move beyond that. But again, in retrospect, this was one more pull in a push pull sequence I was unconsciously executing.

I think we have some more wine but you can feel this awkward feeling that she is not DTF (down to fuck) and so I just meet it head on and say it seems she doesn't have chemistry towards me and it's cool. Sometimes it happens. She is all shy about it and says "I can't have sex with a guy I just met!" (LMR! ASD! I say I understand.

At some point I tell her all girls are different and I met a girl in Buenos Aires who took me to a sex club on our second date -- just to let her know that girls her age can be highly sexual. Plus, I am thinking it's not happening, so whatever.

She says "pour me another drink". I think she's getting up her courage. And I say I have a great idea. Let's just make out like high schoolers and we'll do what high schoolers do -- up to but no sex. And she says OK. In retrospect I see I was subconsciously using push pull and a lot of persistence.

So I pull her up fully on the bed and we are both fully clothed and I start letting her feel my masculine dominance. I am on top and kissing her hard and passionately and grinding my pelvis into hers. I do go really slow like a first timer. I start pulling her shirt up and her bra down and sucking her tits. She LOVES that. She's starting to grind back. Good sign.

At some point I put her hand on my hard dick thru my jeans (also learned this move from the Nampa dudes! And I feel her pussy thru her jeans and start thinking about getting them off. I am distracted with some more tit work and when I look down again, her jeans are unbuttoned and the zipper down. Looks like an invitation to me!

At some point we turned out one of the other lights and she is down to bra and panties and I am still working her pussy from the outside when she suddenly says "OK we can fuck now. Just turn out the lights. ".

WTF? Thank you baby Jesus!

I promise this was not all part of an evil plan. But I realize I subconsciously executed some rocking Nampa moves without knowing it! I always read in disbelief as some guy escalates from a blocked kiss to an SNL (single night lay) and how the girl's defenses crumble as she gets horny. And goddamn if I didn't just do it!

She is TRULY inexperienced. No BJ. No DATY. Modest attempt to get me hard by hand. But nice sex in all positions. Marked by her checking her phone from time to time as her mother texts. Bwahahaha. She lets me know she only has a half hour. So I am a little concerned especially with no BBBJ warmup. But her pussy feels great (using Trojan Bareskin Magnums which I like) and I pound out a nice shot in Mish shortly after she says "cum for me baby". Woohoo!

Definitely not the best sex ever and not a repeat. But the whole experience was totally fascinating and I am glad I had it. Seeking just remains soooo interesting.

I walk her to her Uber and off she goes. I know she is feeling a little slutty and so I help her ASD a bit by texting her how I appreciate that she can see I am different from other guys and such. Just helps her feel like she made an exception. Seems to work, as I get some thanks and heart emojis back. And she texts me the next day. Just nice touch base stuff. I am sure she'd go again, but there are too many better options.

[WyattEarp]

I myself have not jumped into the SA pool. However after following this thread and other forums on the topic, it seems to me the process is one long negotiation. That's fine. It closely parallels the experiences of actual dating.

You meet an attractive girl. You try to interest her. She determines if you are offering enough to keep her interested in you. Even after you think you hit it off and you get her phone number, she might not respond. Then there's the date or dates. If you are lucky enough to wind up at your place or her place, the girl might play hard to get and you have to go through a long seduction. Much like what Steve is referring to as Japanese Nanpa.

In the MeToo world this all might now seem odd. A girl just wants to kiss and you really want to fuck. Seriously, you're going to seduce her into having sex?? Yes, exactly. She never says no. She moves your hand away from her body while still locking lips. Or she says it's late and that she really needs to go home, but she never actually moves to get up.

Remember those dates. Some girls would simply let you touch them and undress them. They were the ready and willing. Other girls wanted to play good girl and make you work for it. How bad do you want it? Haha. Sometimes you had to get the girl physically worked up to the point where she could no longer resist.

When a date finally culminated in sex, it was very satisfying beyond just the actual act. I think from what I read here this is what many men enjoy about SA. The hunt is part of the enjoyment.

[Akibono]

Akibono,

We are all here to help each other and share our experiences sir. I don't understand what you mean in your last comment? Are you asking for city details instead of naming the general country?

We would like to know your experience with SA girls in various cities and what they are asking for allowances or ppm. There is very little information what the market rates for SBs in various cities.

[Midwestern]

In the US, I have only tried it in Denver and Orlando. I was able to find plenty of girls in Denver but they wanted too much in my opinion. Orlando was a waste of time.

Orlando surprisingly has a lot of FS AMPS, so that's a good alternative if you find yourself in Orlando.

[Midwestern]

Question: what cities in your experience have the best "hit rates?" Where SA has a developed scene and you can reliably expect to send out a few messages, offer up a nice package, and get some takers? Or is that totally unrealistic?

I had to travel to Portland OR a lot for work. My hit rate in Portland was very good. Maybe it's because hippy chicks are more chill, I don't know.

I tried SA in about a dozen USA Cities, and other than Portland, OR, I would say that Las Vegas was second best, which seems counter intuitive, but I think any city where tourism is the main industry is a city where the many locals are hard up for money. After all, you cannot get rich being a waitress or a blackjack dealer. For example, another place where I had good success was Niagara Falls on the Canadian side. My main city for SA was SF, and man oh man, that was a LOT of work, but it was pretty worth it.

[Midwestern]

And had another date for tomorrow and I get the "car broke down need Cash App" text. Wtf is wrong with these girls. They could be making $400/ pop but they'the rather scam guys for $50 each and do volume. Sooooo annoying.

Very frustrated right now.

I think these gals know what they're doing, based on their experience. We just don't know what their experiences are. Have you tried looking for SBs in a nearby city? I was stuck in a 2nd tier US city and had no success with SA, so then I expended my search to include two nearby cities and had some success. Of course, the downside was the 2-3 hour drives. So, I usually just spent the weekends in those nearby cities and made the most of my time there, even when the dates were occasional no-shows.

[Pessimist]

Hey Guys,

Probably a noob question from a first time poster in this thread. I love in NL and have had quite some fun with the local sugar dating site, suikerarrengements. NL. Now planning a trip to Lisbon soon and couldn't find a local Portuguese sugardating website, so going to sign up for the premium membership of SA soon.

Question, if I become a premium member and message a girl, would the girl be able to read the message only if she is a premium member too? Asking because I am getting some messages from girls but can't read them as I am not a premium member.

I looked up Lisbon just now and the selection seems OK. That's a good omen as it is not always true in my experience that SA has a large enough selection of girls in all the European cities.

How long will you be in Lisbon? If it is for 2 to 3 weeks at least, paying up a month worth of subscription is worth it. If you are only there for a week or less, I would be hesitant to spend 80 bucks to purchase a subscription. When I used SA in Europe, it was because I already purchased subscription in USA and didn't cost me anything more to use in Europe.

[Steve 9696]

I am of course the guy singing the praises of SA because I had so many good experiences last year. But man I am struggling in my second tier city. You may recall I started out with two scam girls — arrive at the meet only to be told by text they can't meet till the get CashApp. Pick your favorite excuse.

Then I happened upon Layla and was saved. But Layla has some flaws and so when she's out of town I've been trying tingindo alternatives. And ouch!

I chased this one girl hard. Finally got her to go out. But then a postpone. Then on for today. But she didn't show. Apologized and had an excuse. But damn.

And had another date for tomorrow and I get the "car broke down need Cash App" text. Wtf is wrong with these girls. They could be making $400/ pop but they'the rather scam guys for $50 each and do volume. Sooooo annoying.

Very frustrated right now.

[Steve 9696]

Hey Guys,

Probably a noob question from a first time poster in this thread. I love in NL and have had quite some fun with the local sugar dating site, suikerarrengements. NL. Now planning a trip to Lisbon soon and couldn't find a local Portuguese sugardating website, so going to sign up for the premium membership of SA soon.

Question, if I become a premium member and message a girl, would the girl be able to read the message only if she is a premium member too? Asking because I am getting some messages from girls but can't read them as I am not a premium member.

Guys have dicks so they pay to message.

Girls have pussys so they message for free.

So yeah they don't need premium but you do.