Seeking Arrangements

[Elvis 2008]

I hope your point gets taken in the right way. It's been discussed many times here and other country forums. I think everyone here is realistic.
First and foremost in all cases, money and a green card appear to be the glue of the relationship.

I know of one instance where a friend's business abruptly went south and the young foreign wife immediately left green card in tow. He was devastated. No money, no big house, no love.

Yeah, I should point out that the women I was talking about are not typical. Most women I saw were the hos types. I just weeded them out and moved on.

[AmericanPi]

And they kind of get lost in the fantasy that much younger women are immediately more attracted to them..

This is my point. Realistically, having citizenship from a western country and having western compensation is like a woman having large breasts and beautiful hair. They don't replace a personality and other traits, but they sure as hell tip the scales. But what happens when the breasts sag and the hair goes gray? A romantic would say it depends on the girl inside but I'm not a romantic. The girl becomes invisible. What happens to a penniless western man in a developing country? How much google translate will a girl be willing to tolerate if there's no pot of gold at the end of the rainbow? My guess is not much.

I take Elvis's point tho. Many of the men in these Latin counties are macho idiots. That plays into this also. Just not being an asshole is an asset. Unfortunately I'm an asshole. Fortunately I hide it well with my babies. They don't know till I tell them it's time to call a cab because I need some sleep.

[Ggekko2009]

We had quite a few discussions on this over the years in these threads. Bottomline is that there is no consensus. I personally paid 300 or less in tier 2 and 350 to 400 in tier 1. Tier 1 being Boston, never San Fran nor NYC. But then again, mongers even recently said they are paying 500 to 1000 in Florida etc. Which in my view are not expensive places. (Miami is but not Tampa etc.)

What I gathered is that 400 is the new 300. Even in smaller places, for pretty white girls, 400 is a min. That can be significantly higher in tier 1 cities.

Prices can be lower for older girls, not in great shape or for other ethnicities but sometimes those girls overvalue themselves and quote high prices too.

Net net, there is no pricing standard. This is not an FKK with a specified price dictated by the theke.

Greatly appreciate this information. It allows me to establish a range on what a right price ought to be based on the different parameters. Kind of like google flight telling me if the price is within a typical range.

[Pessimist]

For the long term sanity of participant like us "I had no true emotional connection" this is the only way to go. I had a SB, maybe my first, 25 years younger than me. It was an intense time and she would drop around to my corporate office. OMG the things that happened after hours. But as soon as her BF came back to town she cuts all contact. I was just a fling for her. It hurt at the time. But when I realized what she was investing emotionally (nothing) I learned to do the same.

Interestingly we are still FB friends and chat. Go figure.

Yes, friendship is fine. Yes, we do have emotional connection with male friends as well. But as you know, the emotional connection that may develop with someone you fuck regularly is of a different kind than the bond with a drinking buddy or with a normal friend. I Have fond feelings for even the girls I fucked in FKKs once or twice. We may have shared a tender moment or some other connection briefly. But the emotional connection with a spouse or a long time GF is of a completely different type, at a much higher level of intensity. You feel much happier when they are happy, even the fights hurt so much more with a spouse than a fight with a sugar babe or some random girl you fucked once or twice.

That sort of intense feeling is something I will never develop with any working girl or sugar babe. Not just because I am carefully guarding myself from developing such feelings although subconsciously that may be a reason. But when you go into these sugar dates knowing you want only sex and nothing much more, and especially where I am in my life at the moment with a career, family, a million other things, these sugar babies are on mind only briefly. Whatever they say or do typically means almost nothing to me at a deep personal level.

I don't know if what I said makes any sense to anyone but my guess is, married guys who still love their spouse but cheating at the same time probably understand it. I doubt that I am the only one of such stripes but perhaps others are not writing here.

[WyattEarp]

Your attractiveness is based in that context, in large part, on the strength of your passport and the denomination of the currency you get paid in.............. It's possible you're not just a great guy and a great lay, but in addition you're someone who represents the possibility of an alternate future and reality and that's baked into your attractiveness.

I hope your point gets taken in the right way. It's been discussed many times here and other country forums. I think everyone here is realistic.

I have had friends travel to Brazil, Colombia, Eastern Europe, etc. And they kind of get lost in the fantasy that much younger women are immediately more attracted to them. Some have even gone the marriage route. Like any marriage, sometimes it works out. Sometimes it doesn't. First and foremost in all cases, money and a green card appear to be the glue of the relationship.

I know of one instance where a friend's business abruptly went south and the young foreign wife immediately left green card in tow. He was devastated. No money, no big house, no love.

[AsianPursuits]

but I only have 5 days in CDMX so I try to get that out the way

I think from a negotiation POV this mind set could be an issue for you. You are the only person that knows you only have 5 days which sounds awesome BTW.

You will find girls! So that is not an issue.

Even if a girl agrees to drop her asking prices in pre-arrival chat, she will easily dump you for a higher price on the day. You don't want these girls in your schedule which will cause you more pain than what you are negotiating down.

I would be spending my pre-arrival time displaying the caring, respectful, reliable guy that you are. Then on the day your higher priced girl is more likely to dump the other 'price critical guy' for you.

[Elvis 2008]

I'm not calling BS here. I believe what you're saying. But please be open to a counterpoint. There is a context to your travails. Your lawyer baby who fell so hard for you she wanted to give you your money back exists in a social context. Your attractiveness is based in that context, in large part, on the strength of your passport and the denomination of the currency you get paid in. Let's say you're graded on a curve and the curve benefits you greatly. It's possible you're not just a great guy and a great lay, but in addition you're someone who represents the possibility of an alternate future and reality and that's baked into your attractiveness.

If you are married, I would forget about making these women your GF. Keep variety and do not get attached.

I totally get where you are coming from, and I would have said the same thing 10 years ago. Don Carlos told me something that was funny. You could have the smartest man in the world giving another guy advice about women but a man will listen only to another woman no matter what the woman's intelligence. The point is I doubt I can convince you of anything. The women will have to.

With the lawyer, she offered the $300 back to me because she wanted to date me. I insisted she take it because I did not want to date her. I flew her to Bogota from a smaller town and I felt like the reason she was interested in me was because the prospects in her smaller town were terrible. I never thought it was because I was a stud. I guess I looked around and saw what these women have to date and was not impressed.

But I still have to present myself with the ultimate litmus test: if I were not an American with deep pockets, is there any chance in hell this young thing would look twice at me? I'm humble enough to know myself. I'm a good catch but no, they would not. They'd be banging hot guys their own age and enjoying it.

But you are asking yourself that and not the women. Ask the women. When I asked my Venezuelan ex-fiance why she was with me, she said she dated the Latin guys and they were macho bullshit artists.

Another had been beaten by her EX who abused drugs and like what happens so often in Latin countries, nothing was done to him, and it is common: https://euroculturer.eu/2020/11/03/p...-rape-culture/.

Furthermore, child support is not as strenuously enforced and the last three women I dated had half-siblings because of their fathers fucking around. There is not the stigma like here, and it was not hidden. The women saw their mothers go through hell, and they have said they do not want that.

My current gal is not interested in American citizenship for years because of her kid. And my ex proudly showed me all the American men interested in dating and marrying her on her IG page.

Ask the women why they are not out with handsome men their own age and open yourself up to the fact that they may not be lying to you. I should warn you that it may change your life.

Seeing sugar babies led to my divorce. It was not because I was seeing other women but I was dumping SBs for bullshit that I was letting my wife get away with.

I considered why I was seeing and paying for SBs, and my answer was simple, "I want them to make me feel good. ", and the ex was constantly shaming me and making me try to feel badly.

My marriage license was like a license of abuse, and one of the things that opened up my eyes was my asking a 23 year old American sugar baby of mine if she would date me if I got a divorce. Her answer shocked me. She said yes if I gave up all the other women. I was mid 40's at the time, and her friends called her Angie Everhart because she looked so much like that supermodel.

I did not take her up on the offer though because at the time I did not want one woman, even one who looked like her.

[DramaFree11]

I know there's 50% here that say to negotiate before the meet and other 50 that says during the meet, but I only have 5 days in CDMX so I try to get that out the way but If a girl quotes you a price that's above what your wiling to pay PPM, do you just say " That's a little above my budget, maybe another time" or try and negotiate down?

I'm not a big fan of negotiating as I suck at it, but some of these girls in CDMX are throwing out higher numbers (6 k) then Twitter LOL. How would you guys go about asking for a lower PPM?

Nope, if you are there only there a short time, if there prices are reasonable then stick with there offer. They get offended easily. $200-300 is the normal rate there, but you can negotiate for over night or several sessions.

[Ggekko2009]

I give you some quid, you give me some quo.

What? No I respect you. Of course you ain't a WG.

You're like my GF, and I'm your beaux.

Except at the end, I give you some dough.

But that don't mean I think you're a pro.

Huh? No. I don't have time to take it slow.

No, I don't think you understand this though.

I pay you, and you participate in my fantasy so.

If you can't get with the program yo.

Sorry ho. I got to go.

AmericanPi. 2022.

Because ISG should be a place for high culture. Obviously.

LOL, very poetic, almost like a Haiku.

[Pessimist]

Looking for some guidance here.

What is the on-going rate that you would offer for PPM and weekly / monthly allowance for the different tier cities (Tier-1, Tier-2 or maybe Tier-3?

I would see Tier-1 like NYC, San Francisco and equivalent, Tier-2 would be anywhere below the first tier where cost of living is lower, and of course Tier-3 will be in a much smaller cities or towns.

Hoping to get some info from those who have played this game in the US.

We had quite a few discussions on this over the years in these threads. Bottomline is that there is no consensus. I personally paid 300 or less in tier 2 and 350 to 400 in tier 1. Tier 1 being Boston, never San Fran nor NYC. But then again, mongers even recently said they are paying 500 to 1000 in Florida etc. Which in my view are not expensive places. (Miami is but not Tampa etc.)

What I gathered is that 400 is the new 300. Even in smaller places, for pretty white girls, 400 is a min. That can be significantly higher in tier 1 cities.

Prices can be lower for older girls, not in great shape or for other ethnicities but sometimes those girls overvalue themselves and quote high prices too.

Net net, there is no pricing standard. This is not an FKK with a specified price dictated by the theke.

[WyattEarp]

I give you some quid, you give me some quo.

What? No I respect you. Of course you ain't a WG.

You're like my GF, and I'm your beaux.

Except at the end, I give you some dough.

But that don't mean I think you're a pro.

Huh? No. I don't have time to take it slow.

No, I don't think you understand this though.

I pay you, and you participate in my fantasy so.

If you can't get with the program yo.

Sorry ho. I got to go..

If you lay down a beat to those words, I think you might have something there.

[NahkMD]

I know there's 50% here that say to negotiate before the meet and other 50 that says during the meet, but I only have 5 days in CDMX so I try to get that out the way but If a girl quotes you a price that's above what your wiling to pay PPM, do you just say " That's a little above my budget, maybe another time" or try and negotiate down?

I'm not a big fan of negotiating as I suck at it, but some of these girls in CDMX are throwing out higher numbers (6 k) then Twitter LOL. How would you guys go about asking for a lower PPM?

[Alex7J]

Married guys should keep it as P4P; I have no respect for the guys who are not honest in this regard.

Again with the under confidence? There are so many guys who cannot get it up, go limp, or cum in seconds. The average sex act is 9 minutes long, and 30% are done in less than 3 minutes. Anything longer than 9 minutes and you are top 50%.

If you can show a woman a fun time, that is often much better than money.

Try the Magic Potion for 30-60 days with the discipline as guided and I bet you or anyone will be top 50% such are the effects of natural herbs.

Cheers.

Peace.

[AmericanPi]

I banged a lawyer, agreed to pay her $300 for 2 or 3 days, and she fell so hard for me, she wanted to give the money back and date me.

But I agree: pay them nothing and see what happens. I bet you will be surprised how many do not want to leave. If you can show a woman a fun time, that is often much better than money.

I'm not calling BS here. I believe what you're saying. But please be open to a counterpoint. There is a context to your travails. Your lawyer baby who fell so hard for you she wanted to give you your money back exists in a social context. Your attractiveness is based in that context, in large part, on the strength of your passport and the denomination of the currency you get paid in. Let's say you're graded on a curve and the curve benefits you greatly. There's a reason this sort of thing happens at all in developing countries but my guess is female lawyers in the United States (or wherever you're from) are not prone to unpaid sugar arrangements at quite the same rate. It's possible you're not just a great guy and a great lay, but in addition you're someone who represents the possibility of an alternate future and reality and that's baked into your attractiveness.

I don't know you so I'm not trying to be presumptuous. You might actually be that rock solid Casanova who travels the world gathering free sugar babies. More power to you. Wish I were you.

But I also see myself. I'm actually a quite good looking guy. And quite well off and generous with it. And I speak 3 languages. Apart from the fact I'm married, which I lie about to babies, I appear to be quite a good catch. But I still have to present myself with the ultimate litmus test: if I were not an American with deep pockets, is there any chance in hell this young thing would look twice at me? I'm humble enough to know myself. I'm a good catch but no, they would not. They'd be banging hot guys their own age and enjoying it.

[SonicBoom1]

But I stop. I pull myself out of it sharply. Why? I know what I am. I'd never be in front of them without my passport, bank account, and desire for 20 year old chicks. This is a brief fantasy we play out but it has no foundation. It's a brief charade. It's an escape. It's like going on vacation and thinking you should buy a time share, which you definitely should not. It's like going to a great restaurant and buying the cookbook you'll never use. There's wisdom in knowing that a great meal is just that. A great meal, and not a pivotal moment in your life.

How true. I often have the same thoughts myself, but then I snap back to reality, no matter how great a time I had with a SB.