Seeking Arrangements

[Turgid]

That's exactly how I felt about it too. Did it for 90 days and experienced from the absolute high to the lows. Just be forewarned that if you try it in the States then you're going to find yourself slogging through knee-deep bullshit, and will probably end up having many, many less than stellar experiences overall. The site is full of fakes, flakes, scammers, and con games making it not worth my time. You might find otherwise, but I doubt it, especially if you're using it to meet women in the States. If you do go there good luck (and report back)!

Some time ago you were posting about a hot blonde you met on Seeking in the States and the great times you had with her. That is one of the incentives for trying it here. I have been warned. Nevertheless, I do plan to try it in whatever destination is my next.

[HumbleHal]

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[Foolish]

Regarding Meu Patricinio only works if you are in Brazil (or fake it via vpn). Otherwise the buy button never enables. I verified this with customer support. Those who have used it say it's good.

Thanks, glad to know there's reports of some success on MP. I just checked out the upgrades for fun, looks like they've added a "card issued abroad" option. I have a CPF, so not sure if it will work as is (reminds me of buying flight tickets, Azul=easy, Latam=tricky). Will definitely try the VPN options if it doesn't work as is. Worst case, focus on seeking earlier and MP while I'm down there.

but I wanted to do something small and nice for her while we keep chatting until then

Hey IC. I definitely understand the excitement, but this is the first rule of this hobby (in whatever style): never pay before meeting. In some brothel or streetwalker situs, they demand $ upfront and it's normal for a given locale; Or an established escort who is known to take small deposits electronically (even this goes south eventually w / some providers, so beware). But in this sugar / seeking space, I would agree w / Steve: terrible idea. Let's say you have video chat / verified with whatever method. This means the girl is probably real, but could be a scammer or working w / a guy, etc. Even if you decided to bring gifts / etc (some guys like buying little sample perfumes or generic things), I would reserve that for after you have consummated in the bedroom. But remember, this always sets precedence (as below) and don't be surprised if later on the girl gets disappointed with no gifts, it's just human nature. These considerations tell me that the "gift" side of these relationships can be pretty random and I'm sure there are folks who it works for, but probably not for early on. This is the same as buying a gift from the seeking "gift wishlist". Don't do it.

F.

[Steve 9696]

Folks,

I have been chatting with a girl from Spain for an upcoming trip there. We really hit it off and I've got a lot of joy pay few weeks just chatting with her. Lot of good connection, good chemistry etc. I'll meet her when I get there, but I wanted to do something small and nice for her while we keep chatting until then. Any suggestions for a food delivery gift card (or something like that) that I can buy from US which she can use in Spain? Also, I don't want my real name associated with the gift in any way, so something preferably that cannot be tied back to me.

Sorry I know is it's not what you asked but this is a super BAD idea in two ways. First it sets a precedent that you are an easy mark. Once you set a bar that your going to send her gifts for basically doing nothing, she will expect this in the future and when you stop she will be disappointed. Second it is a DISincentive to meeting up. If she can get free money from you for doing nothing why in the world would she get all dressed up and fuck you?

Super super bad idea. Sorry.

[AmericanPi]

The more I read about Seeking the more I am liking it. I may not wait until my Mexico City trip to try it for the first time. I have been to every type of pro establishment there is under the sun and I have done escorts; I have also met genuine non-pros on dating sites. The only approach left for me now is Seeking.

Cdmx was my first too.

It's hard to replicate how good it is. It's such a large city, and the dollar is so strong relative to the peso, that you simply have options.

Enjoy.

[Intelligencium]

Folks,

I have been chatting with a girl from Spain for an upcoming trip there. We really hit it off and I've got a lot of joy pay few weeks just chatting with her. Lot of good connection, good chemistry etc. I'll meet her when I get there, but I wanted to do something small and nice for her while we keep chatting until then. Any suggestions for a food delivery gift card (or something like that) that I can buy from US which she can use in Spain? Also, I don't want my real name associated with the gift in any way, so something preferably that cannot be tied back to me.

[Steve 9696]

Great report Foolish and glad I could help. Regarding Meu Patricinio — only works if you are in Brazil (or fake it via vpn). Otherwise the buy button never enables. I verified this with customer support. Those who have used it say it's good.

[Foolish]

Took me forever to actually sit down write this out, just too many thoughts. You can skip the preamble, but this is more me documenting the journey.

I share a similar experience with many of you, IE western relationship, then starting out at massage, then "safe" GFE, then escorts / fkks, etc. My appreciation for GFE (the experience, not the acronyms) was developed not only with civvie girls, but also after spending many sessions with escorts and having the rollercoaster of good & bad experiences (and some jading on my part). In our local scene, privacy and safety are tilted to the max: IE talking about unsafe practices (BBFS), or trying to ask escorts out (or find out about their personal lives) is a big nono. People get banned / blacklisted / blasted by forums / agencies / girls / white knights on forums, etc.

When Twitter took off in this space, things changed a bit. You could start chatting directly (although many stated not to waste time in DMs, etc) and I started to get to know a few well known / regarded ladies. Agencies and Indy escorts started having these private (you had to use your alias at the door / guestlist only) meet and greet events during the holidays, boat cruises around the harbor or even parties in other cities.

There was one lady that I started talking to that we hit it off in chat and she was super nice and a shy type from overseas. Even though I had grown up admiring the supermodels (Karen Mulder, Cindy see, Naomi see etc), I had met very few women remotely of that body type or had been in the bedroom with them. She definitely fit in that camp bodywise, 5'10", 110 lb, 34-22-34. Some people don't believe in chemistry (Colombia forums ha), but we hit it off (I tried to extend our first session, but she had another appt). I was slightly disappointed, but she told me to visit her off the books when she wasn't seeing other clients. Too good to be true? It definitely wasn't something kosher in our scene (using agency hotels during "off times", etc), but went with the flow. Shyly asked her out to dinners / etc not knowing that she was into me. Even though she definitely needed the money, she would never let me pay for anything, ever. Went on short trips to other city industry events and dinners and lots of bedroom time. She was so new to everything, she clung to me at these meet and greets. Long story short, I pre-empted any relationship journey by telling her I wasn't looking for anything. At that point, I was also hanging out with another popular lady off the books. I guess I wanted the dream to go on forever ha.

Long story short, times with her set the standard of what GFE is to me. Long, passionate sessions that just kept going and going organically and just felt right without too much discussion. After about 6-7 months, she sort of disappeared and I found out later, that she found a BF. I didn't expect her to just drop off the scene, but I definitely understand the whole thing a bit more now. I definitely have some regrets, but not sure I would have done things differently (not ready to blow up the home situ or string her along). It wasn't a perfect relationship by any means, she was definitely stubborn about me helping her out financially (9 months later, she still needed money, showed up back in the escort scene and wouldn't even let her BF help) and then changed her # after they broke up. Ever since then, haven't really done the P4 P thing in years.

Seeking.

With my first trip to Brazil a while back, decided to also check out Seeking. I had joined many years before, but never coughed up the fee (got one of those 30% offers for about $88 usd). I had started favoriting girls in Brazil about a month out. Two weeks before landing in SP, I used the JokerCard (actually MC not VISA that I previously reported) and started messaging about 20 SP & a bunch of Rio profiles. Thanks Steve for posting your guide again, followed a lot of your suggestions (along with everyone else). Here for any new readers:

http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/...=1#post2782507

For context, I wanted to try a few of the different venues / styles of the hobby in SP, so didn't spend crazy amounts of time focusing on SK. Wanted to check out clinicas, boates, etc.

As part of my SP review, wrote a section up on the one Seeking experience I had in SP:

http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/...=1#post2809404

I don't really speak Porto at all, but it was a fairly seamless experience messaging girls for a bit and eventually transitioning offsite. Hard to say whether they had basic English or were seamlessly translating. My "gathering profile" experience was delayed as I waited until I arrived before getting another SIM for Whatsapp. I focussed on about 5 ladies, 1 which ended up being a dominatrix (which isn't really my thing, but she was a model type and very fashionable). 1 pretty MILF with fake T&A wanted 2 k BRL, which I ghosted. A couple of young spinners seemed up for drinks & action, but didn't really speak English (they were asking 900 BRL), so let those sort of die off (one offered another friend spinner / school girl style which I declined). I was left with a branca gamer / anime girl and a ruiva MILF. The MILF was busy during the weekend (we also had a slight misunderstanding about her posting "sugaring only" If I was only doing Seeking or in a place with less clubs / venues, would have definitely gathered a bigger funnel. I was hanging out with another BM / wingman and the gamer girl ended up responding pretty quickly asking if I prefer chatting in Porto or in English. So I went along with the process. She was looking also for 900 BRL, but was looking for an additional gift (ridiculous ask, but she does this naturally ha). Was mulling it over, but it was a Sunday and not too many night time options as I had already gone to Casarao and wasn't looking for a club atmosphere that night. Parted ways with wingman, headed back to the hotel for a quick nap. She has expensive tastes, so asked her to find an alternative gift. Almost didn't work out, wasn't too pressured either way.

Interlude: I know this doesn't seem to happen too often on Seeking, but I realized that another BM had been with her previously and had a good experience (later would find yet another BM who posts a lot got her referral and saw her as well). I tried to reach out to the first BM, but didn't get a response in time get a better idea of the deal that was made. All I read was that she was out of the city and would take a long time but the experience was good.

So in the meantime (with Steve's guidance in my head), we discussed the date: grabbing dinner / drinks and then back to my place for a few hours, which she was cool with. Also any likes / dislikes in the bedroom (I don't have any crazy fetishes. Yet ha). So we basically agreed for allowance to be what I mentioned previously and a gift (approx 3-400 brl, but had to figure out the "how" a bit). She definitely has a bit of the shell game about her being broke / needing stuff. Her phone was having issues (trying to move the target / deal), more on this later.

We Whatsapp video chat to verify and while she didn't have her glam look on, she could definitely communicate in English, was pretty and had good vibes, so all good there. Now for the timing shenanigans as I would come to expect. It took her 2 hours to get ready and then almost 2 hours to get to me. So we're messaging to keep track of timing, etc and she can't get off the phone repair thing (she does some sort of camming or live chat stuff so needs it). I'm sure most of you are saying, WTF is this fixing phone stuff, get to dinner & bedroom damn it!? She eventually arrived at the hotel, I jumped in the Uber and we tried to go to a phone store at the mall (at 9:45 pm) to get a quote. I knew this would sort of happen, but the mall was quiet and most stores were closed. Seeing as we missed dinner, etc, I change gears (part of my moving parts plan), check guiademoteis (can see discount offers with map feature) and see if she wanted to explore a love hotel with me (and basically get an overnight out of it). She quickly agreed. WIN, get to check off a few boxes, seeking, overnight & love hotel.

More on the anime girl: approx 5'6", 90 lbs, dark brunette / black hair (she changes her style a lot and had white-ish tails). Asked her to dress conservatively and she came in a school-girl-esque long shirt, skirt, stockings and loafers w / makeup to match and straight bangs. Funny that I'm sensitive to smokers, but couldn't detect it at all while kissing. Almost perfect natural body to me except for maybe that "divot" I encounter sometimes with spinners above their coochie that is missing a bit of cushioning. No worries though, no problems hitting from behind, ha.

So we settled into our room with "hidro", etc and were getting comfy. So in general, she was pretty demure and low key, cutesy and calm. But once we got undressed, she had a quiet intensity about her. Had some make out in the hot tub, but generally just chatting and getting to know each other more. Really good kissing (not surprising that all the ladies I met in Brazil can kiss). Beautiful soft BJ, but had to get her pseudo death grip hands off. Really nice "be" cups and going down on her was nice. Did various positions over the long love making session, but the highlight definitely was her riding ability. Once she got on top of me, she rode for a long time. I didn't time it LOL. But definitely had the most stamina I've encountered, probably 30 min+ in cowgirl alone. I know there was some discussion on the Rio forum about some guys having problems lasting too long or shooting too fast (can't have it all), but if I'm having a good time, definitely want it to last a lot longer than if the experience isn't great. Seeing her ride with different rhythms alongside w / soft moans will be cemented as one of my favorite bedroom memories. I asked if I could finish in her mouth, she said "no problem, are you close?" Ended up having a gentle facesmashing action and she swallowed every drop. It was probably 3 am at that point and getting sleepy tired, we finished and called it a night.

In the morning, while getting ready to head out, she asked if I had the cash on me as she has been scammed before. So for those keeping track, I still owe her a gift (but already been with her for 12 hours, so no issues there. Ended up grabbing breakfast at a cafe, went to the mall again to check phone repair cost. Was pretty pricy, wasn't going to commit to so much extra. Decided on trying to figure out the other gift portion, so we did some local shopping. So found a suitable gift but was more expensive than her estimate (she wanted me to order something on her account earlier w / my own payment method, definite no). Anyway, I realize at that point, I can either just top up some cash and call it a day. I decided to counter with fixing her phone and this gift for basically another day (maybe could have gotten her to stay night too, but was pretty tired from the previous night).

Long story short, we hung out all day, running around checking out some places I wanted to eat & drink. Finished with another great session at the hotel.

After this experience, I realized why so many guys don't the shopping or actual "gift" girls. Too many moving targets, definitely would not try to replicate this experience with someone else.

That being said, I had a really good time. Her "struggle to survive" vs "I want pricy stuff" game gave me some good chuckles but I made sure that I clearly defined what I'm committing to or not. We enjoy the same music, have great chemistry in bed and feels like a low key GF (as opposed to too flamboyant in public) while we're together. Would probably take her on a trip to a beach or other destination where there is little action to be had. But have to firm up the deal way beforehand. I saw how imports are pretty heavily taxed first hand in Brazil from other places.

Turgid, if you have the $ and the patience / time for sorting through girls online, Seeking is worth a shot, especially since I believe you like slim, pretty types and GFE experiences (clear your PMs ha). I definitely am a believer. Way less time constraints / paying for time, hopefully good chemistry (need to filter like Steve) and potentially high level of illusion (while turfing the immediate pros).

Midwestern, I have only broken the no photo rule with one girl, but I usually avoid any media (photos or vids) with the ladies.

Everyone else, good points on dinner being a slog if you don't get along w / in 5 minutes. I really enjoy good company at dinner, whether civvie or pro, but that usually comes later. I like DF's suggestion of good hotel bar where you can pivot pretty easily to room or dinner depending on the situ.

Anyone have experience with Meu Patrocinio? There seems to be tons of pretty / tall model types on there for Sao Paulo. Been favoriting like SK but can't message without the monthly fee.

Will probably stick to arrangements while travelling for now. Random #s: I filtered in SP for slim 20-27 year olds. About 700. I favorited about 5% to my taste. In my local home area, there are 2400!! Results with these specs of every color of the spectrum. Definitely lots of options, but not ready for that at the moment. Will have to live vicariously through you all. Thanks all for sharing your thoughts and experiences.

Cheers,

F.

[The Cane]

The more I read about Seeking the more I am liking it. I may not wait until my Mexico City trip to try it for the first time. I have been to every type of pro establishment there is under the sun and I have done escorts; I have also met genuine non-pros on dating sites. The only approach left for me now is Seeking.

That's exactly how I felt about it too. Did it for 90 days and experienced from the absolute high to the lows. Just be forewarned that if you try it in the States then you're going to find yourself slogging through knee-deep bullshit, and will probably end up having many, many less than stellar experiences overall. The site is full of fakes, flakes, scammers, and con games making it not worth my time. You might find otherwise, but I doubt it, especially if you're using it to meet women in the States. If you do go there good luck (and report back)!

[Turgid]

The more I read about Seeking the more I am liking it. I may not wait until my Mexico City trip to try it for the first time. I have been to every type of pro establishment there is under the sun and I have done escorts; I have also met genuine non-pros on dating sites. The only approach left for me now is Seeking.

[Midwestern]

MW, how many photos do you think there are of the two of you together otherwise? Hotel cameras? Traffic cams? You can ping locations on your cell phone and see she is with you. So the only issue is the SB has the photo.

GFE Fan shares similar concerns that I did, but I have been through this. First off, I think every wife knows if a guy is messing around. They just shut it out of their mind. Really, the wife should only get concerned if you catch feelings. Women know how men are. The main thing is you just do not throw your infidelity in her face IMO.

I do not know why men are worried about blackmail but not worried about the woman stealing. They are both illegal, and a woman who tried to extort money from basketball coach Rick Pitino was put away in federal lockup for 7 years: https://bleacherreport.com/articles/...oach-after-sex.

The way a woman could legally extort money out of you IMO is via pregnancy but a pic makes no difference there. Even with that though, there are so many guys throwing money at the hotties in the USA that if things did not work out, the woman could find another guy easily especially if the woman was hot.

So what happens if somehow the wife gets the pic? You lie about it. When I was caught by my ex, I could have lied again and nothing would have happened, but I was tired of lying, and I did not deny it. Furthermore, I said I have more than one SB and the SBs make me happy and you do not. I think I too would have said at some point during this time when I was cheating, I was happily married too. Now that I am out of my marriage, and it is just my opinion, but any guy who says they are "happily married" while seeing other women really isn't.

So add it all up. Blackmail is very unlikely. The wife probably already knows, but the supposed worst, your wife finding out and wanting to leave you in my case was not the worst that happened. Yeah, divorce sucked, and you do not want to go there, but when it ends, then you really get to see how your marriage was, and in my case, ending the marriage was a huge relief. The stress of hiding, the unhappiness, the lack of freedom were weighing me down where more than I though. Guys are constantly saying they can handle the stress, but it wears on you.

And you know what they say about women's quality of life going way downhill after divorce? Yeah, that was way true with my ex.

So really outside of any hurt feelings, I do not see much downside to being in a pic with your SB then. Just make sure she does not put it up on social media.

All good points. At the end of the day, there's no way we can cover our asses. I have told every SD, every monger, and every cheater that I know, that we should only do this if we are ready to face the consequences, both the forseen and unforseen, and be okay with having to deal with them. Sure enogh, my friends that I tell this too just scoff or brush it off, but two cheaters that I know eventually got caught, and because their cheating was borderline of the illegal variety and excessive, they both lost their jobs, not just their families.

[Midwestern]

I have mentioned this a few times over the past few years on this forum. I just do not like dinner dates as a first date with an SB. Two reasons. First, like Elvis says, I can usually tell right away if I am going to have chemistry with a gal, and if I sense that I will not, then I hate being stuck with her for dinner. Second, usually after dinner, with our bellies full, neither she nor I am totally in the mood for play time. But I agree that Steve does a great job at screening, and so this is probably why dinner dates work for him. I am horrible at screening. Many times we had chemistry on text or on calls, but in person the chemistry was not there.

Yeah, I have encountered pros on SA. Pretty easy to pick out. If they don't not do some back and forth on text before the first meet, they are likely to be a pro from my experience.

Yeah, I have encountered mega losers (like the one LshRoomer described) on SA. Not only the kind that he described, but there are a lot of drug addicts and other kinds of losers on SA. This is to be expected. Before I joined SA, I always thought my secretary was a loser for being just a secretary. But after meeting many, many, many gals on SA, I realized that my secretary was a total winner and that she had her shit totally together. She works hard, she owns a home, she raised a kid, she takes vacations every year. So yeah, maybe avoiding the older gals on the site is a good idea. But that said, I am not into the ones that are in college or just graduated. I met a lot of them. We just had nothing in common. And so my favorite age range was from 24 to 26. She has some exposure to the real world, but she is still young enough that she may not be a loser.

[Midwestern]

I'm in the middle of a business trip, and of course it includes play time with gals. A FR is coming soon, but I thought I'd share some quick tidbits.

1. I invited one of my former SBs to meet me. But becasue Steve pointed out that I may be overpaying them on trips, I realized he was right and so I told her that I couldn't afford givng her the usual shopping money amount, and she said that it was fine. However, during our time together, I could tell she was a little unhappy about the lower shopping money.

What did I realize from this? Precedent is everything. Once you establish a precedent, then deviating from it, especially in a negative way for the gal, is going to be a downer for the relationshp and the time together. That is, once I give X amount, I am setting a precendent and it will be hard to give less than X in the future. So I have to think carefully if I ever want to be excessively generous. And as an aside, I now do realize that I have been too generous in the past.

2. I also inivted my new SB to meet me. She didn't want to come at first, but I talked her into it. She was going to arrive after the my former SB was leaving. But before my new SB was to arrive, she was asking me about picking her up at the train station, about what we were going to do on this trip, etc. This is all okay, but I was getting exhausted from my trip, and so I told her not to come. Luckily, she was able to get refunds for her booked train and booked hotel.

What did realize from this? If an SB is not excited about going on a trip, then do not oversell it. She needs to contribute to the fun, and I also feel that she has to be low maintenance, for me to enjoy being on a trip with an SB.

3. With my new found free time, since my new SB was not coming, I hit up an old GF who is often DTF whenever I am in town on business. Well, luckily, she agreed to come to my room. It had been a couple of years since the last time I saw her. She does not drink. In the room, it is a little awkward. Usually, alcohol kills any awkwardness, as you guys (including Steve) are all aware, and so at first it was just so awkward, trying to go from chit chat to the bed. Then suddenly I remembered one of my modes of operating when I was a young womanizer. I always had music on. And so I quickly turned on some music (old school rap). This eliminated the awkward silence, and everything flowed smoothly thereafter.

What did I realize from this? Having music on in the room helps a lot with setting the mood. No akward silence.

[Midwestern]

If things go south with SB, and you have exposure, yes.

Don't want to scare you but, for example, I am married and happily so. Don't want an SB, if and when she is miffed with me, ruin my personal life with evidence. Some smart SB's might sfill find some but why leave something known on the table?!

P. S: I am super happy in my mariage and don't want to lose it. Sex shucks though. I am struggling to answer whether I got in to SA because of poor sex at home or SA got me to realize sex is poor at home. Shucks.

I am especially worried about two things. She may post the picture on social media, to either find my identity by asking if anyone knows me by my picture, or she does it innocently and someone I know sees it. Or, she uses the pic to do a reverse image search on Google. Since we can all afford to be SDs, most of us probably have a LinkedIn profile. Several of my SBs have found my identity with a little bit of sleuthing which led to my LinkedIn profile.

[DramaFree11]

Steve, the issue with dinner for me was getting stuck with a woman whose pics and attitude I did not like. I can tell within 5 minutes if I am interested or not. If I am not, I want to bail. Maybe you screened better than I did, but I thought a quick coffee was the way to go. In the USA, it was always sex on the second meet save for once or twice. Abroad, it was usually same day.

There were many times I met the woman and was just not interested in her at all.

I always meet them in the Bar of a decent restaurant, for drinks and appetizers. This gives you options, you can stay at the bar, go have dinner if she is hotter in person, or end the date quickly, if there is no chemistry or fake pictures.