Rants and WTF are you talking about and Coronavirus!

[Pessimist]

I know, we may have second wave even next year like Spanish flu, it killed more people with second wave. This won't be over till vaccines are invented, and even then virus can come back with different form like influenza is, that is why we get shot with updated vaccines every year.

Well, then why did so many nations around globe had destruction of medical system to the extent they did not even have masks or gloves or life supporting equipment were so short of needs that doctors had to choose who will get the life supporting system etc.

Look, I hope world especially human are wonderful as we like to believe, west love idealism. Japan like to believe in idealism too, we like it, but we stick to reality and are more practical. Meaning Japan think like this, if we say we are testing people so easily then mass public will rush to hospital to test themselves especially with japans good insurance policy where most things are covered and where people love going to hospital as we are health hygiene conscious race, so this will create many problems including cluster infections at hospital while waiting and even we test and tests results are positive, we do not want to treat mild symptom patients with medicine like avigan because we rather to keep them to fix it with their immune system first, either way there will be panic plus the cluster infections, so what we focused on is to make people to stay home not to gather and for those who need to go out side go out side if it is related to work or buying food.

It is different way of approaching it and japans way of not being idealistic and not trusting what mass public could do is different. We know what will happen if we begin testing people as they request based on mild symptom. And hey, it is Japanese mass public we are talking here, based on truth, we have reputation of being very polite, organized and disciplined than other nations, but even then we were careful to how mass public may react if people began going to hospitals. As a result, we do not have collapse of hospital here and we still have masks and gloves at hospital, in pharmacy, we stopped selling it as one request, but one can only buy certain amount per day and is hard to find now. But fed did give us 2 recyclable masks per person in Japan, which apparently cost 467 million USD to distribute this 2 masks, which could have made apparently 5 million pills of Avigan, which we want to make just in case there is over shooting of allowed infection rates testing. There is easy testing kits available, but it is not that accurate apparently, either way we do not test everyone at hospital..

To your question why did some countries have such poor medical systems and why were they shown in such poor light by Corona?

The answer is a combination. Some countries are poor and didn't have sufficient funds to build up a good medical system. This was probably true in China and will be true in India and Africa as Pistons said a few times.

Some countries do have money but didn't spend sufficiently on healthcare. Also, what they had spent on matters too. US spends 20% of GDP on healthcare but there are large gaps. We have a public / private payer system as compared to mostly public payer in other countries. So, for example we pay a higher amount for the same drug than in most other countries. We have some extremely sophisticated things in US but some hospitals may not have sufficient PPE.

More importantly, when a sudden spike happens in number of cases, any local hospital can be overwhelmed. This can be a local issue. US a whole may have sufficient number of ventilators etc but if you have too many cases in NYC and too few cases in Florida, You can not match supply with demand efficiently because these are sick patients and cannot flows to other areas of the country.

I agree with someone who said this before. Poly perhaps. The rich countries will be fine. We will beat this. Yes, a lot of people are dead and many will lose jobs and loss of networth due to stock market but we will generally be fine. I am not so sure about poor countries. Many millions may die in those countries.

[Saturn11]

My information is of course second hand but from reliable contacts, as I am not currently in Germany although I was there after some clubs had already closed. Some girls are still in Germany and are entertaining regulars, there are a few groups of girls operating like an FKK, but access is by invite only, and Chinese, and American visitors are specifically excluded.

If you believe their statistics Chinese should be one of the least likely nationalities to have it at the moment. Since yesterday doubt any Chinese or Americans are flying into Germany given the 2 weeks quarantine. I asked some girls at Sharks if they ever saw customers outside of the club some said yes, some said never. I imagine the girls that said never are relaxing that policy at the moment.

A mini private FKK sounds intriguing, wish I was in lockdown in Germany, not just for that reason. Sounds like they are streets ahead of other countries with their testing and availability of hospital beds.

[Mursenary]

Lower population densities certainly help, it is no wonder that New York is the worst afflicted area of the US. However the only way to assess a health care system is the mortality rate per those who are seriously afflicted with the d
isease, we don't really have such general statistics, but we can assess mortality rates per known infection.

And in that respect certain countries are doing quite poorly despite the futile assertions to the contrary here and from the numbers I have just seen on CNN, the US is not doing particularly badly but it is in an earlier phase of the pandemic, given the lag between infection time and death, the mortality rate will increase in the US.

There aren't really any effective treatments for this as far as I know, so it is really up to your immune system. The reason people are touting arguments like our health care system is much better, we will therefore handle it better or we are just better people is that they are deadly scared and nervous and hoping this is the case against a careful reading of the evidence.

Yet New York City mortality rates are still lower than these "hard hit" nations. NYC is one of the most densely populated cities, if not the most in the western world, and the death rate of those infected is still lower than entire countries even accounting for the countryside population in those nations. As of today, 5800 deaths in New York county with 92,000 cases. That's 6.7%. Several European countries are sitting at a 10% case fatality rate. At this point, the US is far enough along the timeline to have peaked. Intubation rates and hospitalization rates have gone down in the past 3 days in New York. Other areas will see a surge but it will not be as bad as New York. The US is already on the plateau phase and while deaths will continue, death rates will decrease even more.

Regarding treatment, I transitioned to the ICU last week and effective protocols have already been established. Medicine is more complex than the public who thinks that a magic medication will come "cure" this. As with all advanced viral respiratory illnesses, symptom management is the treatment. Maintaining adequate ventilation whether it is via ventilator or a simple nasal cannula, sepsis control through blood pressure management and intravenous hydration, and some antibiotics to address secondary infections. That's all there is to do. Some antiviral therapies may help but that is hardly concretely established in the literature.

[Pessimist]

My information is of course second hand but from reliable contacts, as I am not currently in Germany although I was there after some clubs had already closed. Some girls are still in Germany and are entertaining regulars, there are a few groups of girls operating like an FKK, but access is by invite only, and Chinese, and American visitors are specifically excluded.

Of course, Apollyon may have other thoughts

It seems to me that many mongers believe they are immune to Corona. It seems as if they would go back to their mongering ways today if they could if the governments allowed it. Social distancing and quarantine are mere nuisance forced on them in this narrative.

I disagree. I am not in the risky age groups and I do not have any Existing conditions that predispose me to the virus. I still am observing the distancing rules strictly and Staying home. I'm lucky that I can wfh w / o loss of any income, and the biggest misfortune that has befallen on me is the loss of a huge amount in stock markets but I can weather it.

Sugar babes are quite desperate now. I see many pretty new girls on the site, and most are out of jobs and have no income. If my intention was to just fuck a girl, it is easier to do so locally, and prices are even cheaper than FKKs. I'm not meeting them out of caution and for my own safety. I am surprised that mongers are desperate to fuck ex FKK girls in Germany whichever way they can. If you are willing to do so, you might as well eschew all distancing rules and try to build your own personal dose of herd immunity.

[Sirioja]

My information is of course second hand but from reliable contacts, as I am not currently in Germany although I was there after some clubs had already closed. Some girls are still in Germany and are entertaining regulars, there are a few groups of girls operating like an FKK, but access is by invite only, and Chinese, and American visitors are specifically excluded.

Of course, Apollyon may have other thoughts

Business in cars? In hotel? If still open in Germany, closed in France. My contact at GT is off now. My contact at Globe is at home. Both made big money since years, so they can take a rest for months.

[Sirioja]

First, you should read an article about why it is dangerous and stupid to infect yourself. You are either selfish or expect the girl to be stupid. Second, just because a girl has some immunity does not make her safe in any way. If she goes with a asymptomatic punter before you, her contamination will easily infect you. This virus is highly transmissible. Also, if she is immune, she has no incentive to adequately disinfect herself before you. In most clubs, the girls don't even fully shower between clients. Don't dream. Follow the science. If you want to partake, pay up and go with an escort that is not seeing 10+ people a day in a highly contaminated environment. Don't this that towel that is put on the bed will protect you from that infected punter before you. To be safe, everyone entering the club must pass a test. Do you think that is likely?

Sharks took temperature on 13/14 March just before closed, Oase didn't control, I think also no control in NRW. Pretty sure virus was already in FKK land, with so many guys and girls, still few Asians seen, but in brothels, we share some of our diseases, even using condom, better to be aware, risky playfield and can also be for relatives, I think about chlamydia for wife, or HIV from AO, a reason for the new law in Germany to protect families. About future and risks in these places, I think better to have gotten and recovered from, then no more risk about it, when quite impossible with so many guys and girls from all over the world, virus don t play in FKK land. Better to know for risky health people, but it could already be risky before virus, not only this virus in FKK land.

[Optimist]

Please Einstein tell us how your mongering is going.

My information is of course second hand but from reliable contacts, as I am not currently in Germany although I was there after some clubs had already closed. Some girls are still in Germany and are entertaining regulars, there are a few groups of girls operating like an FKK, but access is by invite only, and Chinese, and American visitors are specifically excluded.

Of course, Apollyon may have other thoughts

[Optimist]

How about renaming this thread as the Corona Covid-19 Lounge?

That would save a lot of time for anyone looking for information about P6 in Germany.

[Turgid]

How about renaming this thread as the Corona Covid-19 Lounge?

Please Einstein tell us how your mongering is going.

[McAdonis]

New York City is doing terrible but New York City only represents less that 0.3 percent of the entire United States. As much as the media and Europeans talk terribly about our healthcare system, the fact remains, we are doing a much better job treating the sick during this pandemic than most European nations. That's a statistical fact.

I do not get the impression that news outlets are using infection / death rates as a means to evaluate any one nation's level of medical care. If anything doctors and nurses in Wuhan, Lombardy, and NYC are seen as heroes. Nobody doubts their competency or blames them for high number of lives lost. All the blame usually goes to politicians who downplayed the threat and failed to prepare.

Milan politicians encouraging citizens to go out even after first 11 towns locked down: https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...navirus-crisis.

Germany politicians have been lauded. Their first chain of infections came a month before Italy's. They effectively contained that first cluster which bought them crucial time to ramp up capacity (urgent care beds, testing kit, medical / emergency personnel capacity). https://www.reuters.com/article/us-h...-idUSKCN21R1DB.

However, media from around the world is decrying the lack of universal health care in the USA, and questioning why poor Black and Hispanic communities are dying at disproportionate rates.

[Delta Indigo]

I doubt that differences in death rates amongst developed nations can be explained to any great degree by differences in the quality of care. Infection rates and their control are arguably the greatest source of differences.

Higher population density in Western European cities facilitated a faster spread of the virus that frequently overwhelmed health infrastructure. The US has comparative advantages because of geography / population density, but where it doesn't you have similar problems to what we've witnessed in Italy, Spain etc. New York city is the textbook example, where around one third of the national death toll is generated by 2. 5% of the population.

Some of the developed nations that have to date fared best, such as Australian and New Zealand, have greatly benefitted from low population densities and their lack of neighbours. Certain Southeast Asian countries have been much better at controlling the spread of the virus from an early stage because their testing, tracking and isolating programs have been superior.

I agree, there are many quotes here saying that this or that is proof of the quality of certain health care systems. The prime determinants of a countries mortality rate per population, not per infection, is its underlying population density and the stage of the pandemic it is in.

Lower population densities certainly help, it is no wonder that New York is the worst afflicted area of the US. However the only way to assess a health care system is the mortality rate per those who are seriously afflicted with the disease, we don't really have such general statistics, but we can assess mortality rates per known infection.

And in that respect certain countries are doing quite poorly despite the futile assertions to the contrary here and from the numbers I have just seen on CNN, the US is not doing particularly badly but it is in an earlier phase of the pandemic, given the lag between infection time and death, the mortality rate will increase in the US.

There aren't really any effective treatments for this as far as I know, so it is really up to your immune system. The reason people are touting arguments like our health care system is much better, we will therefore handle it better or we are just better people is that they are deadly scared and nervous and hoping this is the case against a careful reading of the evidence.

Lower population densities coupled with a sensible lockdown are a definitive advantage, certainly Australia is far less vulnerable than India would be given its far lower density, but in this respect the US outside of its relatively dense urban areas, of which there are relatively few, would have a slower rate of progression than many European regions. Unless there is an effective treatment, no countries health care system will make much of a difference.

[Mursenary]

Without a doubt population density majorly determines infection rates which in turn plays a heavy hand in determining mortality rates (deaths within a total population). What the density angle doesn't really explain is the case fatality rate, CFR (deaths once you have the disease). In the case of the US, ours is sitting at 3. 7%. Even in densely populated NYC as you explain, that rate is at 6.3%. Compare those numbers to the entire countries of France, Spain, Belgium, UK, and the Netherlands whose CFR are all over 10%. The city of NYC alone, despite its density, is keeping people alive at a greater rate than entire western European countries even when you dilute their infection rates with the countryside. So despite overloading the healthcare system in our most densely populated city, we are still producing better results than entire developed countries.

As for quality of care, while the science of medicine is somewhat universal, the logistics of delivering that care is not. The US has the most number of critical care beds and ventilators per capita than any nation in the world. In addition to doctors, we utilize a system of mid-level providers such as Nurse practitioners (NPs) and Physicians Assistants (PAs). In addition, our nurses are more likely to be university educated than those in Europe. Despite our problems with poor general health and a population suffering from chronic illnesses, the numbers do show that we are superior in responding to an acute medical crisis than most of our developed nation peers.

At any rate, my point was to correct several statements that portrayed a picture of American carnage responding to Covid-19 and other criticisms of American healthcare when the data show that we are doing a better job than most of these western European nations. And I'll reiterate the need to pay attention to the data rather than the sensational images on your screens. That's what smart men do, use the data.

I doubt that differences in death rates amongst developed nations can be explained to any great degree by differences in the quality of care. Infection rates and their control are arguably the greatest source of differences.

Higher population density in Western European cities facilitated a faster spread of the virus that frequently overwhelmed health infrastructure. The US has comparative advantages because of geography / population density, but where it doesn't you have similar problems to what we've witnessed in Italy, Spain etc. New York city is the textbook example, where around one third of the national death toll is generated by 2. 5% of the population.

Some of the developed nations that have to date fared best, such as Australian and New Zealand, have greatly benefitted from low population densities and their lack of neighbours. Certain Southeast Asian countries have been much better at controlling the spread of the virus from an early stage because their testing, tracking and isolating programs have been superior.

[DasBooty]

More testing means more of the infected people will be confirmed to have the virus.

Yes, which means that the death rate will be more accurate compared to when less testing takes place e. G. Sweden. Unfortunately some people here fail to understand that and basically draw conclusions from data which they do not understand.

[Sirioja]

You are right. Let get back to sex topic after today then LOL.

I much prefer to talk about mongering than virus, which I can do with my private life, where as mongering, I cannot discuss in my private life.

You don't tell to your relatives, or neighbors, or at work, where you spend your holidays? When I tell about my holidays, ski free riding or bicycle climbing, people say: You are so passionate, when You tell You have stars in eyes, like when I see a beauty, but they are rare.

[Admin]

Thread Starter.