Morelia

[El Mojado]

Hello Everyone! (Especially Miller2k & Proko!)

Hey, this is my first post but I've been watching for over a year now on here. I've been scratching at the keys waiting for the discussion forums to come back online (Many thanks Jackson!).

Well, I feel I have a lot in common with Miller2K and Proko -- I love Morelia very much. I have traveled to Mexico at least 2 to 3 times a year for the last five years and I was fortunate enough to spend upwards of 2 to 3 months each trip. I actually had a single, steady girlfriend for over 2 years in the city of Uruapan which is very close to Morelia (85 peso bus ride, $8.50USD)

I agree with Miller2k in terms of Mexicanas as girlfriends, they will wait for you to return, but be careful. They do want to marry and tend to look at living in the US as their best chance to have a good life. I don't agree with that -- the U.S. is where the money's at as Proko advised to another user in the Guad forum, but as Miller2k said, it's not a place for true freedom -- you're a slave to the corporate world unless you make a heck of a lot of money and are not divorced with alimony and support payments and limited visitation with your children. The best thing I've seen is to make your money and get out.

My girlfriend got her own ideas and we broke up... after that I discovered all the fun I was missing!!! Uruapan is a happening city all its own and I'll post soon about my adventures there! Out of three women I met at the strip / sex clubs, all three were very nice, two spent the whole night with me on several occasions and these two gave me exquisite GFE! ($300 to $700 pesos prices as recent as December 2001) None spoke english - I'm fluent in Spanish.

So my question for Miller2k and Proko -- I've zero experience in Morelia. I tried to go to one of the stripper clubs there once that was listed in the old forums and I actually got there too late, it was closed and too late to even get a last minute girl. I like the idea of the SW's behind where the old bus station was, but I'd like to know if there is anything like the massage parlors of Guadalajara that sound REALLY good (I might almost want to live in Guad just for that Is there anything in that same price range that is decent in Morelia ($350 to max of $500 Mexican Pesos)

However, I love Morelia and I have a few friends there and I like the student atmosphere and the restaurants and food. And it's close to my old watering hole of Uruapan in case there is no middle ground between the $200 peso, 15 minute quickie SW and the $1,500 peso 2 hour dancer.

Now I'm looking to live in Morelia unless I get convinced to go to Guad. I'm planning on moving in September of 2003, I've already got some money saved up but want to sock away another year of U.S. wages before I head into Mexico and try out my "Mexicano" approach to living life.

Anyway... I'd like to talk more about that with you Miller2k if we could. I'm curious how you can afford to live in Mexico with what you earn AND still be able to go a "mongering". I plan on cooking my own food and cleaning my own place, so no maid and no chef. Though if I could work out something with one of the chicas and pay her to do my laundry and a little more on the side for some extra $ then that's cool too

Miller, since you are down in the Michoacan area, can you let me know what the going price is for a house in Morelia (2 bedroom or so) or an apartment with a cochera, (parking area) for a truck? If the truck turns into a problem, I'll get rid of it, but I'll be moving with it and legalizing it in Mexico (it's a datsun/nissan 1980 P/U, the kind that are all over that area of Mexico - easy to fix and easy to get parts).

I'm budgeting about $8,000 pesos per month with no more than $2,500 pesos per month going to pay the rent. You can get anything from a small house to a 2 bedroom apartment in Guadalajara for that price. That would leave me with plenty to buy food, go out once in a while to eat at the Colibri restaurant, go catch a movie, etc. Plus, I think I'd have enough for checking out the chicas at least 2X per month, not the $200 peso ones, more like the $500 to $750 peso ones. Call me old fashioned, but I'd like to just have a few regular chicas to choose from, maybe 2 or 3 or 4 with the option of sampling a new tasty chica every once in a while

I was originally trying to budget just $8000 USD per year for 6,500 pesos a month, but it'll probably be more like $10,000 USD per year. Either way, working in the U.S. for some months out of the year would probably be what I end up doing like my Mexicano brother counterparts, only at least I'll be spared of having to risk my life crossing over the border since I have valid U.S. and Mexican passports.

O.K. I'll post more later in the weekend. I had some trouble getting this post up. But Miller, you need to visit Uruapan and check it out... It's quite a place and the ladies are very nice at the strip clubs. There are no Gringos hardly there, but there are locals who are returning from working in the U.S. and when they're around, forget it... the ladies are all taken.

-- El Mojado....

[Prokofiev]

Was back in Morelia several weeks ago, just when the server went down! The weather was good but it rained every day.
.
Finally found the hotel "behind the old bus station". Several young girls on the street, somewhat aggressive in looking for tricks. Definitely not shy and several were rather good looking but with that druggie look. Going price still 200 pesos but to my surprise NONE of them would consider a BJ! A 15 min lay is the only thing on the menu. I tried to reason with them, a BJ is cleaner and less work, but they all said no. I couldn't believe it.
.
Decided to pass and look at the area by the conservatorio. Several older women there but still no BJ! Maybe I'm paranoid, but I wasn't in the mood for a STD. Finally found a cute morena, late 30's who took me to her hotel for a total of 150 pesos which included the room. Cheap, but no oral. Is this a new rule? Had no problem last time. I ended up getting a HJ (!) while she sat on my face giving me a spectacular view of her goods - which seemed in tip-top working order. Actually was kind of exciting and only $15. More later . . P

[Cupido Morboso]

Prokoliev:
I know this is not the right forum but I must tell you...I love Spain, I like Barcelona (a lot) but I prefer smaller cities, my favorite cities in Spain are (in order):

1.- the Marbella/ Torremolinos/ Fungirola/Malaga/Gibraltar area (Costa del Sol),
2.- Oviedo (Principado de Asturias),
3.- San Sebastian,
4.- Santander/El Sardinero beach,
5.- La Coruña (suburb) and Santiago de Compostela (Galicia),
6.- Sevilla
7.-Zaragoza
8.- Barcelona
9.- Madrid


I like to visit Spain in Feb/March (I like the weather),
If you want my advice on Spain post your questions on the Spain forum, will be a pleasure to help,

if you return to Morelia and want a GFE/amateur, call Mrs. NORA (tel. 3133486), read my postings about her (old forum), she will set you up with an amateur, don't forget to tell her that a "friend" sent you... it's important or she will hung up,


Regards

CM

Miller: try Nora once or twice, you will not regret it,

[Mill Just]

Cupido...Welcome Back!!! We thought that we'd lost you to the Pink Team!!! (just kidding).

Proko...I didn't mean to imply that you were looking for luxury. It just seemed that Gpiper was concerned about the big lifestyle change involved in moving to Mexico. Having money aside for emergencies is good and strongly recommended. I came here with a relatively small amount saved and I was lucky enough to not need extra cash for an emergency. I've always lived a gypsy lifestyle (except for the horrible, horrible stint in corporate America) and I've been lucky enough to have an angel on my shoulder the whole time- this is not the case with most people. I wanted to drop out completely because I felt that even the slightest amoung of "security" would hold me down and prevent me from making my lifestyle change. Almost like learning to swim, but never letting go of the boat. To each his own. That's the beauty of life, but I feel that my current hapiness is entirely due to the fact that I made the committment to change with all my heart.

[Prokofiev]

Cupido,

Glad to see you're still "here", at least in spirit. Two of my favorite places are Morelia (all of central Mexico) and Barcelona. You seem to have strong connections and good info on both places. Will be in Barcelona again for a month in November. Welcome back.

Miller. The reason I strongly recommend earning and saving some cash$$$ is NOT so one can live in luxury. I've always lived beneath my means as a matter of choice - and you can live simply in the US as well as Mexico. For me, it's a matter of freedom and security. If living in Morelia is a little too expensive for you, how could you ever live in Guadalajara or Mex City, much less NY, London, Paris etc.? Maybe none of this interests you, but the freedom to live or travel where you want, how you want, is very important to me. Security doesn't mean living in a castle with guards to watch over your possessions. But it does mean that you can pay your medical expenses for an operation or long hospital stay. That you don't have to worry about missing work and not eating. I believe you could live a very similar life in the US and still make some money for your future. At a later date, you can then drop out and return to Mexico or where ever with more of a security blanket. I worked in a high paying job for over 20 years yet never bought a car. I took the bus to work - and enjoyed it, while others drove sportscars and bought boats. It all depends on the individual and what they want. I value experiences, not possessions yet I need to have options available. The wealthy man can live where and how he chooses. The poor man has few options. A few sacrifices early in life can assure your future. Peace - P

[Cupido Morboso]

Miller and Prokoliev:
I'm still interested in Chicas...



I'm out of the country (Japan/Korea/Russia), I have limited Internet access, I'll be back Oct/Nov,
Leave some Morelianas for me...

Regards,

Cupido Morboso,

P.S.

I have girlfriend now so....no hobby... for some time...

[Mill Just]

hiya piper...I live in a town called Cd. Hidalgo. I originally moved there because a friend of a friend had a house I could use there for free. That has changed, though. So why am I still here if Morelia is so great? Well, in the two years that I've been here I've grown to like the people and I've developed quite a few close relations. There's also an economic advantage to living in a smaller town: No competition. In Morelia, there are many English Institutes and quite a few Americans. But here, I am the only Gringo in town and I have no competition. It's either study with me or get on a bus for a couple of hours. Having said all that, though, I am planning at least a partial move to Morelia in the near future.

just to touch on a point you made. I left the USA because I wanted to get away from all the materialism. My life is very simple now and that's the way I wanted it. I get the feeling that you want to leave the USA and still want to live like you did in the States. That's fine. To each his own, but I will warn you that you might be very disillusioned. The first few months here are blissful: You have a pocket full of cash and everything's rosy. Then, somewhere around the end of your first year, reality starts to hit hard. Even with your savings and the money you make from working, you will find yourself slowly sliding downhill economically. The problem here is that they nickel and dime you to death. 20 pesos here, 30 there and pretty soon you are living barely from payment to payment. That's how the people live here, they borrow from one to pay another. Of course, all of this can be overcome. I did. But I did so by simplifying my lifestyle even moreso than I had intended. So, Prokofiev is right. If you want to live in luxury and never have to worry about money, save up a dozen or so years and move down south.

When/If you decide to come down I will be more than happy to give you a few names and act as a guide...

[Prokofiev]

Okay Piper,
This is just my opinion but ...
.
It sounds to me like you are in your late 20's, have student loans and a negative net worth. You are thinking of moving to Mexico and trying to get a job there for a few years while you say you have US job offers around 50K to start. Crazy idea. Why go further in debt by struggling to work in the Mexican economy? It is clear from your posts that you are not remotely like Miller2k in your outlook on life. Believe me from experience, you will be far happier saving a few bucks and starting a career before its too late. If you like women, you will find that money and status count no matter where you live. Even more so in Mexico. In your 20's and early 30's you can get laid anywhere - broke or not. But if you want to remain a player at 35, 40 and beyond you have to have something to show you are a man of means. Women want the security and peace of mind that comes from a man who can take care of himself and her. This is the one invariant I have found in a lifetime of chasing tail around the world. Class, culture, education, manners, status and money will see you through for the rest of your life. You don't have to flaunt wealth (and shouldn't-especially in Mexico) but having it makes everything easier. Make some money, visit Mexico on trips and 20 years from now you can write your own ticket. - P

[Gpiper]

cherubino, miller:
thanks for all the info. Didn't quite understand everything you were trying to tell me cherubino. I have lived in mexico before, albeit for only 4 months in '99 in Aguas. I have a cAR, BUT know i WON'T BE NEEDING IT DOWN THERE. i ALSO HAVE a NICE TV, DVD, ETC., DON'T KNOW IF IT'S PRACTICAL TO BRING DOWN THERE (shipping expense). I won't be coming down empty handed with only $70 in my pocket and no job or place lined up like my friend did 3 yrs. ago.. When you were talking about the girl with 2 cars, who made $,2500 pr. month, was she working in mexico or the states? ..I'll also have to consider my financial situation. Even though i've saved a bit of money, I have more debt due to student loans i've accrued for these darn degrees. I may have the opportunity of picking from a few jobs here in the states that would pay me $45-50g to start, I could make a major dent in these loans over the next 2 yrs. and i could vacation worry free in Mexico twice a year for 10 days, or go down to Mexico in sept., work and be content making no more than 8,000 pesos a month and having my debt accrue over 1G per yr. in interest alone! It's obviously something you guys can't decide for me. But this guy on GDL site named Montes seems to have a good idea of staying in the states working and saving until he has 100G and is debt free and can make his move down to Mexico and live comfortably and work part-time for a long time. That's something I'll consider as i'm, open to suggestions...Miller..1 more question..Why do you live in a little town(name?) 1.5 hrs. away from morelia if you like Morelia as much as you do (especially with all the girls and decent nite life there)?...And as far as the strip clubs and escort services, If i do head to Morelia, i'll contact you before i leave to get some names of places and possibly chicas you may have run into over there, and hopefully i'll be able to give you guys my own report in the 'action' scene down there, so you can get a break from all my questions!...Piper out.

[Mill Just]

gpiper...I'll try to answer as many question as I can (I wish I had someone to ask when I first came to live in Mexico. It would've saved a lot of time and money):

I make about 7,000 pesos a month (9 in the summer). This is more than suffiecient to cover room and board, and at least one or two weekends of partying a month ( I also charge people to translate documents). The students are plentiful and if I wanted to work 18 hour days, I'd have enough students....I live about a 1 and a half hour drive from Morelia...I don't have a car and I don't need one because my town is small and Morelia is full of cheap taxis (20-25 pesos to anywhere in the city)...It's always about the same temperature (maybe a tiny bit warmer in March and April)...Religion is a big part of the Mexican existence, but you'll find most of the girls are religious at home, religious at church, but more liberal-minded in a relationship...I don't know about being treated like royalty, but the people tend to be out-going and they have bent over backwards to help me out...There are a few strip clubs (not too sure about the estheticas) that I would highly recommend. They are not tourist traps and everything is reasonably priced. There are quite a few escort services with a good selection of girls. I would rate the escorts and strippers as better than anyother place I've been to in Mexico with regards to price and quality of service...But, if you prefer to go "traditional", you certainly, as a Gringo, have a leg up in the whole dating scene....Where I live, I can rent a big house with all services for about 800-1,000 pesos a month. Of course, my cost of living is less since I don't live in a big city. In Morelia, I've heard of apartments going anywhere from 1,000 to 3,000 pesos (sometimes mores for larger places). Look in the "Voz de Michoacan" newspaper. Most places don't have air conditioning because the building materials they use are naturally insulated. It could be very hot outside and you'd feel chilly inside...Don't have too much info on schools, but I know that there are many institutes in Morelia and the surrounding area...

...What Cherubino is refering to is that, as Americans, we are accustomed to a standard of living that just doesn't exist very often in Mexico. We are used to living in a disposable culture of new cars every two years, electrical appliances everywhere, eating out at will, etc. If you live like this and make a Mexican salary, you will go broke. 6,000 pesos a month is plenty to live a very comfortable life if you live a simple life. Eat out only every so often, make do with your old TV, hang on to your VCR for another year before buying the DVD. When I first got here, I was living like a tourist and I faced the cold, hard realities fast. Money is not as replenishable in Mexico as it is in the USA. In Mexico, you need to worry about the necessities, while Americans take those things for granted. "Living like an American" means spending money on things that aren't necessary, treating luxuries like necessities. I'm happy here and I don't have to worry about money now, but I'm still aware that this might change. I always think long and hard now abouth whether I REALLY need something before I buy it...

Hope I helped...If you need anything else, let me know...

[Cherubino]

gpiper

I feel the need to jump into this conversation if for no other reason than to give you some other perspectives.

I can tell you need to spend some more time in Mexico so you will better understand the dichotomy which exists between the American and Mexican lifestyles; and the contrast between rich and poor in Mexico. Read what Miller2k has written about "living like an American" for a better idea of what I mean.

I have friends both Americans and Mexicans. Every visit I get an earful of bellyaching about abysmal economic conditions from both sides.

One Mexican friend has a decent job, adequate little house, maid once a week, laundry girl to wash and iron his clothes, part-time cook to do his grocery shopping and prepare his meals, telephone, internet service, cable TV, and satellite dish. He lives in an inexpensive area. He makes US$60 a week and thinks his economic outlook sucks.

One American friend always complains to me about her $250 electric bill, $2.50 per gallon gas, high cost of maintaining two vehicles, high cost of imported American brands, and the trouble finding good help (1 chauffeur, 2 maids, 1 cook, 1 gardener) who will not steal her blind. She lives in an expensive tourist area with the other gringos. She says she is having trouble making ends meet with US$2,500 per month and thinks her economic outlook sucks.

Somewhere in between lies the truth of what it costs to live in Mexico. I listen to both sides because I have the same interests as you.

[Gpiper]

Miller,
Thanks for the info! i am now seriously considering trekking down to Morelia from Miami, FL(where i live now) in September, for at least a few months. .a few more questions: So you're an english tutor? i did that in Aguas 3 years ago. What kind of money do you make and do you have enough clients to cover room, board, and a little partying? ? I'm not too crazy about working at a school, because of the 1 yr. contract commitment thing, and if i don't like the city for whatever reason, i don't want to get tied down there. I still don't know if i want to work and stay in 1 Mexican town for close to a year, or just pick up some part-time tutor gig in a few different cities, and sample the cities for a few months each. Last time i was in aguas i was staying with an american buddy of mine. He's now back in the states with his mexican fiancee, so i will be traveling solo, which isn't as fun...Morelia sounds like it's a lot more happening then Aguas. Are the girls real religious in Morelia? You make it sound like americans are almost treated like royalty in morelia. It sound like they're even friendlier then in Aguas. In aguas, there was 1 college where the girls were actually quite stuckup. How far do you live from Morelia? Is it easy to get around without one's car? You mentioned the weather is real warm. Is that year round? when i was in Aguas, it would go down to 35 degrees early in the am november -january. I wasn't prepared for that.. As far as the strip clubs and esteticas are concerned.. are there many there, or do you rely on the friendliness and numbers of the college girls in town to hook up gratis? Maybe you can supply me with some more specific info on schools also..And what about accomodations? What does it usually run to have a decent 1 bedroom apt. with electric, and air if possible? Thanks again!!

[Mill Just]

gpiper...

If you like women, aged 18-25, then Morelia is your town. Morelia is the capital of the state of Michoacan and it's also a college city. So, the place is loaded with young, attractive people. Also, because of so many young people, there are many clubs and discos to meet all needs. Morelia is in Central Mexico, about a 5 and 1/2 hour drive West of Mexico City. The temp. is almost always about 80-85 degrees Farenheit. Morelia has its own International airport, but you'll have to check which US cities it serves. (I know for a fact that it serves Chicago and San Francisco, but I'm not too sure about other cities). The beach is a distance, but with the good weather, beautiful mountain ranges, and gorgeous ladies, you won't care.

The population is aprox 1.5 million, but the population acts much like a small city. They are warm and open and open-minded. Americans are very welcome and almost always become the most popular persons at the club or party. Don't worry about tourist traps too much because almost everything is on the up and up. I've never been cheated or taken advantage of because I was a Gringo. On the contrary, I've received special treatment most of the time.

I teach English in a nearby town and I don't have any sort of certificate. I just came down here, printed up some flyers, and started. What you'll realize down here when you live in Mexico for some time is that everything is better done under the table. I was worried about certificates and visas when I first came here, but almost the entire population prefers to do business away from the authorities. So, I work for myself, charge whatever I like, and take time off whenever I want. The gov't doesn't ever bother me because they honestly don't care. That's fine by me. If you must go through the "proper channels", there are always Institutes that are looking for teachers. English is very important in Morelia because the University system in the state of Michoacan demands a score of 80% or higher in English in order to graduate (at least that's what I've been told)

If you want some more specific info, let me know...hope I helped

[Gpiper]

Hey Miller,
Have never neen to Morelia. where in mexico is it and how is the climate? Am thinking of returning to Mexico for a while in september. I was last there in AGUAS in '99. i like em young too (18-25). How is the ratio there, and are they friendly like in Ags.? Is it a fun town, or is it boring like Ags. was?..I'm interested in teaching english in the fall. do you know any schools hiring? My spanish is descent, and by sept. i'll have my masters degree and a tefl cert. Also, how far is Morelia from the ocean, and where is the nearest airport? Thanks for any info!!

[Prokofiev]

Miller,
Thanks for the reply. I KNOW that the english lessons would be killer, but I am never in one place more than a week. Maybe in the future I will rent a house for a month or two. I usually study spanish in one of the local schools and I make it a point to attend the english-spanish exchange hour, usually in the late afternoon or night. A GREAT way to meet the locals! Although the vast majority of students are very young, there are usually several older students and the teachers as well. I taught several english classes here in the US last month at a local school, to help out my spanish teacher who runs the operation. First day of classes I hook-up with a 35 yo woman from China! I wasn't really looking for it , but it definitely came to me. What a woman! I now give her private lessons in my home and she has become my girlfriend. I really was looking for a latina - and there were many- but this is just too good to turn down. I may start posting on the China board! - but what a tough language! I thought spanish was hard. . .
.
Also don't forget the Karina cell phone number. I will remind you in 5-6 weeks, right before I leave. I will of course post all my experiences. Keep the Faith ... - P