General Info

[OldKool]

On my last trip I wifed up with a pretty little thing from San Juan. At first she was a little shy and reserved. Once she got comfortable the sex was awesome. The sad thing for me is even with all this I still wanted to sport fuck. Wifing up in Sosua is never easy. Everywhere you go girls are trying to get your attention. I have stayed in contact with the little sweetie and I am planning another trip next month.

Last trip I ram into a 70 year old guy who has moved to the Sosua area. He was giving me advise on which girls gave best BJs and other inside info. When I first met him he was a rookie to the seen. While in the states 70 year old guys going to nursing home while this guy is banging 24 year old hotties. He was an obvious sugar daddy but he had the sugar and the girls wanted it.

[Camaro1257]

I have followed the different points in this discussion and believe everyone is making valid points. One of my favorite analogies is "is it a floor or a ceiling?" Of course the answer depends on your perspective. If a person only deals with women who as a matter of practice exchanges money for sex in the Dominican Republic that person might possibly assume all women here exchange money for sex and their opinions are based on that fact. In my experience all Dominican women do not exchange sex for money. In fact if every woman I encounter is exchanging sex for money that speaks to my choices as well as the women who make themselves available for that purpose.

Sometimes people are different in different geographical locations. For example I have travelled extensively outside tourist areas such as Sosua and the North Coast; I have discovered that I am treated differently therefore I need to respond differently. Some of my anecdotal experiences are different because I have exposed myself to different people and situations dealing with a cross section of people.

I think this discussion has been insightful seeing different people points of view.

[Frannie]

In years past, in Sosua or the DR generally, guys used to make tentative plans with chicas? For instance, a guy is walking about in Sosua, bumps into a fine chica. A brief chat ends up with him telling her he might get with her a certain time. Or for her to come by his place later. He tells her where he's staying. And like clockwork, that chica shows up at his hotel at the designated time, and might be standing around waiting for him.

Or a guy communicates with a chica before his trip. He tells her the day he's coming. Chica shows up at the airport waiting for him to come out. How many vets remember chicas showing up to a guys hotel like that? But the guy either forgot about it, or didn't think the chica would take him seriously. I'm talking about back then when these girls didn't have cell phones. And if they did it was a cheap Alcatel phone, and if high on the hog it was a BlackBerry.

Wasnt it a common thing that a guy would have to watch what he said to a chica, because that chica will show up at his place at the time he said he could see her? The chica assumed she had an appointment.

Same thing with a local taxi driver. The local taxi driver might ask the day the guy is leaving, and show up at the guys hotel hoping to get a return fare.

My point here, if my memory serves me correctly, is that enough foreigners dealing with locals experienced folks here that did care about time on a social level and a business level. A short while ago I used to sit and chill at Rockys. I called the front area The Office. Chicas would pass by all the time. I might check one out and agree to hook up with them at a certain time. But I'd tell them that right now, I'm chilling with my friends.

When I decide to get up to leave, that chica shows up on time ready to leave with me. In fact, sometimes during the course of guys sitting there, some chicas will make several passes just to make sure a guy is still there.

I think we can gather from this, that we can't conclude that locals don't generally care about time. There are always examples out there that people forget about. More than we give credit for. Why? Because enough folks don't pay much attention when people are on time or being conscientious. There's more attention given when people are late or no shows.

Another thing we might can gather, is that the use of today's technology, especially the use of the internet may have corrupted us further to a certain extent. In addition a new breed of folks with less home training than the previous generation are now on the scene. Now the moment a guy nutts and heads to take a shower, the chica has already whipped out her phone and is checking on her other clients. Trying to juggle them all.

The family, the chulos, The WU novios, the next potential client she eyeballed at New Garden restaurant, the guys she communicates with on Facebook, Whatsapp, Tagged, DC, her bi-sexual GF, her amigas that help her to score some new clients staying in a villa etc. No wonder some muggs can't be on time. Work potential overload. Too much shit going on, right at ones fingertips.

So there was a season when locals valued time a lot more, socially and in business. I just think that things have evolved for the worse, and the lack of putting people in check and making them accountable is really why lateness and not giving a fuck about time comes from. In business where deadlines are very important, folks have less of a choice, like the Caribe Tours example. But on a social level, muggs can get to do whatever the fuck they want to do, because they don't have anybody stepping up to give a fuck. It sure aint coming from their HOME TRAINING.

Collectively were cultures filled with softies. Enough men have a hard time accepting their role as men, that lead, take control , offer guidance and solutions to problems with others. Now it's. "you have to accept it" because that is the way it is, or the way they are. Fuck that!. Women today are screaming for men (by their out of control and assbackwards behavior) to take responsibility and take charge, and all we ( collectively ) find ourselves being is accommodating.

You are spending too much time in the company of hookers. Suggest you move to a different part of the DR to complete your Ph. D. thesis on Dominicans and the times of their lives.

[Mr Gogo]

I don't think people in Sosua are complaining about girls being late, you just step into the street and pick the next one. Get outside of Sosua and that dynamic changes. Also it's a difference between a girl coming for an hour fuck and a girl coming for a date and maybe spending the night. The conversation started because mostly girls in SD were always late.

You speak on how Sosua used to be and I agree but the hustle was respected back then with a code. Now we are seeing stinking pussies, girls doing CBJ, and girls rushing out. It's all about the fast dollar.

It's one of the disadvantages about living in a tourist trap, it sugarcoats the DR experience. Step outside the tourist areas where you have thousands of options, can dictate terms, and spend time in other areas. Then you will notice patience and understanding are the only way of survival for a gringo.

Understanding in the DR is a guy you don't know delivering your lost keys, saving you from changing the locks or making new keys, and eliminating you of the worry of a future attempted burglary, and offering a worthy reward. Not a two dollar reward which it would have cost you to replace just one key. Not trying to understand would be you trying to impose your American values and say you would have returned them for free.

You have to make the adjustment bro, because you are playing a losing game and the outcome will be you getting frustrated and blaming the Dominicans (we see that always in your posts). Life in the DR will never change to meet your standards.

P.S. You are stuck in your comfort zone you have created, and analysing everything based on Sosua but I really think you need to relocate to another real DR city to get a new perspective. Peace.

[Frannie]

The DR novios that Old Kool says screwed them over and left them unwed mothers have already eaten the icing. Now you are groveling over paying for stale cake. LOL.

If you have money you are just as good as any other option.

Not really, the icing is not their virginity, but being able to satisfy curiosity about how they look naked, how it feels to touch their skin, how they act when having sex, and so on without making any long term commitment of time or money.

I thought your shtick had always been that women are not interested in you for money or any kind of financial or lifestyle advantage--they are just lonely and want your company for its own sake.

In any case, having a guy come to the DR every so often to have sex in your basic apartment in the barrio is hardly as alluring as having the opportunity to go and live in Italy or Canada, or Switzerland, or the Netherlands and start a new life and family, especially if you have a passport and financial situation that makes it impossible for you to ever travel away from the island where you were born by other means.

[SubCmdr]

No, it is not true and I don't remember that. At least not in Santo Domingo. And I thought we had this "Glory Days" discussion before. But hey. Someone wants to have it again. Why not?

Here is what I remember. Making a date with a girl and giving her 15 minutes after the time to show up. When she no shows, I head out to find a another date. I remember the front desk clerk knocking on my door and telling me I had a visitor while I still had a visitor in the room. I told the clerk to let the girl know to cool her heels and I'll be down soon to get her. Walking out with my previous date. Sending her off and taking the new girl up to the room with me.

I remember the same thing happening when I went out to get another date and when I returned my original date was in the lobby waiting for me. Quick check with both girls and off we go up to the room. I learned very quickly not to double book as many have suggested. But I did wind up double booked or with girls back to back due to lateness. Something that I experienced from day one of my visits here. And yes we are talking about Santo Domingo.

I have written about this before. There is a body of academic work about how different countries and cultures view time and work. Those differences are real. If you want talk personal accountability well honestly that is a completely different subject in and of itself. If you want to talk business then business is about making money. Getting paid. If you are spending money then you are just another consumer. And all talk about game or business is erroneous. Trying to attribute the ills of society to how people spend money is erroneous. I don't know the background of all the critics that write here. And quite honestly I don't care too. Critics talk and are irrelevant. Men in the arena do!

It is the men in the arena that matter.

[OldKool]

Sosua may be the one exception in the DR. The competition is thick for our dollars. When you tell a chica to meet you at your hotel she shpws up unless she found something better. The same is true for the airport pickups. You are the meal ticket in Sosua and they are hungry. Sometimes literally. I went to the room where one of my hook up was staying. there were 3 or 4 girls in a small room. No TV or kitchen cloths piled everywhere. It was depressing. When a chica comes to your room it is a huge step up in most cases.

[Wrx2005]

In years past, in Sosua or the DR generally, guys used to make tentative plans with chicas? For instance, a guy is walking about in Sosua, bumps into a fine chica. A brief chat ends up with him telling her he might get with her a certain time. Or for her to come by his place later. He tells her where he's staying. And like clockwork, that chica shows up at his hotel at the designated time, and might be standing around waiting for him.

Or a guy communicates with a chica before his trip. He tells her the day he's coming. Chica shows up at the airport waiting for him to come out. How many vets remember chicas showing up to a guys hotel like that? But the guy either forgot about it, or didn't think the chica would take him seriously. I'm talking about back then when these girls didn't have cell phones. And if they did it was a cheap Alcatel phone, and if high on the hog it was a BlackBerry.

Wasnt it a common thing that a guy would have to watch what he said to a chica, because that chica will show up at his place at the time he said he could see her? The chica assumed she had an appointment.

Same thing with a local taxi driver. The local taxi driver might ask the day the guy is leaving, and show up at the guys hotel hoping to get a return fare.

My point here, if my memory serves me correctly, is that enough foreigners dealing with locals experienced folks here that did care about time on a social level and a business level. A short while ago I used to sit and chill at Rockys. I called the front area The Office. Chicas would pass by all the time. I might check one out and agree to hook up with them at a certain time. But I'd tell them that right now, I'm chilling with my friends.

When I decide to get up to leave, that chica shows up on time ready to leave with me. In fact, sometimes during the course of guys sitting there, some chicas will make several passes just to make sure a guy is still there.

I think we can gather from this, that we can't conclude that locals don't generally care about time. There are always examples out there that people forget about. More than we give credit for. Why? Because enough folks don't pay much attention when people are on time or being conscientious. There's more attention given when people are late or no shows.

Another thing we might can gather, is that the use of today's technology, especially the use of the internet may have corrupted us further to a certain extent. In addition a new breed of folks with less home training than the previous generation are now on the scene. Now the moment a guy nutts and heads to take a shower, the chica has already whipped out her phone and is checking on her other clients. Trying to juggle them all.

The family, the chulos, The WU novios, the next potential client she eyeballed at New Garden restaurant, the guys she communicates with on Facebook, Whatsapp, Tagged, DC, her bi-sexual GF, her amigas that help her to score some new clients staying in a villa etc. No wonder some muggs can't be on time. Work potential overload. Too much shit going on, right at ones fingertips.

So there was a season when locals valued time a lot more, socially and in business. I just think that things have evolved for the worse, and the lack of putting people in check and making them accountable is really why lateness and not giving a fuck about time comes from. In business where deadlines are very important, folks have less of a choice, like the Caribe Tours example. But on a social level, muggs can get to do whatever the fuck they want to do, because they don't have anybody stepping up to give a fuck. It sure aint coming from their HOME TRAINING.

Collectively were cultures filled with softies. Enough men have a hard time accepting their role as men, that lead, take control , offer guidance and solutions to problems with others. Now it's. "you have to accept it" because that is the way it is, or the way they are. Fuck that!. Women today are screaming for men (by their out of control and assbackwards behavior) to take responsibility and take charge, and all we ( collectively ) find ourselves being is accommodating.

[SubCmdr]

Camaro and WRX will see a broad spectrum of women. Guys on this forum are focused on P4 P girls by enlarge and occassional non pro who needs some help living.

I use the concept of Cost per Orgasam (CPO) to provide a quantitative measure the economic cost across types of girls. That way you don't have to get into typing each and every one of them. Simply take the total you spend on a girl and device by the number of orgasms she give you.

Total money spent / Orgasm=Cost Per Orgasm.

It's a universal concept.

[SubCmdr]

Attitudes towards time differ between cultures. There is entire body of work that has looked at how different countries and cultures deal with time. These attitudes are completely different from time management. Every single one us of has specific responsibilities on how we manage our time based on the expectations of other individuals or institutions in our lives.

Wrx2005 has an absolute expectation for prompt arrival. As long as he makes the other party aware of what his personal expectations are then it's all good. If the person does not meet them then he serves up his bevy of consequences.

I on the other hand have a sliding scale on which I judge how another person uses their time. If I'm in my house chilling and don't have any time sensitive plans, I could care less if she arrives late. But if we have plans that have a specific start time, then yeah, those plans have been cancelled due to lateness on her part. I'm time rich and I can spend it how I like. And I'm not letting pussy pursuits upset me.

It's up to each individual to determine how they view lateness. How I choose to view time and how other person chooses to view time is actually irrelevant and unimportant. It says absolutely nothing about the person. Time is an arbitrary concept that only came to importance historically with the industrial revolution.

[Mr Enternational]

Just eat the icing and leave the cake.

The DR novios that Old Kool says screwed them over and left them unwed mothers have already eaten the icing. Now you are groveling over paying for stale cake. LOL.

Yes, of course you can find attractive childless women too, but they have more options that may not include you.

If you have money you are just as good as any other option.

[Frannie]

If you insist on fulfuilling economic needs, why settle for these sloppy seconds? If you have to pay for the ride why not call a shiny new Uber instead of a busted up taxi publico? I do not see the logic in rejoicing at the privilege to pay for damaged goods.

Hiring individual transportation is clearly more expensive that just buying a seat in a shared taxi or guagua. I think what Old Kool is saying is that renting someone else's time share for a week requires a lot less capital than buying into a time share, but may still give you all you want without the worry. Just eat the icing and leave the cake.

The fact that the women are unwed mothers is precisely the circumstance that makes them available on a rental basis. Yes, of course you can find attractive childless women too, but they have more options that may not include you. For example they are much easier to export to Europe.

[Mr Enternational]

Pros or not all women in all countries want men who satisfy their economic needs. The number of gorgeous unwed mothers in the DR is huge. Most of these ladies have had attractive DR Novios who have screwed them over.

If you insist on fulfuilling economic needs, why settle for these sloppy seconds? If you have to pay for the ride why not call a shiny new Uber instead of a busted up taxi publico? I do not see the logic in rejoicing at the privilege to pay for damaged goods.

[OldKool]

If I lived in the DR I would tell all my girls I had a novia and could not devote myself to them. It has always surprised me how girls will be your side chick if they know you have a main girl. The DR is the perfect place to implement this strategy. Pros or not all women in all countries want men who satisfy their economic needs. The number of gorgeous unwed mothers in the DR is huge. Most of these ladies have had attractive DR Novios who have screwed them over. Gringos are viewed as prince charmings. We want to fuck like porn stars, flatter them and have money. Bingo this is the dream of every DR chivca. You do not have to pay them all but believe me they all are all in it for the dollars. The truth is this is women all over the world.

[Wrx2005]

This is something I have been saying for years, but to other board members I am bragging or cheating women out of something or lying to them about something. I have no problem paying a hooker for work, but every woman is not a hooker. Why should I pay a woman that is not a hooker? Some say because she has less than me. What the fuck does that have to do with anything? And nobody has ever answered what if it is a woman that has more than me? Do I still need to give her money? Does she need to give me money? I do not understand why some people do not believe that sometimes people are just two adults doing what adults do and neither party is looking for financial gain

I don't think its about guys not believing all women are not hookers.

I think the reason some guys may have concerns over this issue, is because many women in the DR misrepresent themselves.

Outside of Sosua and general P4 P environments, you can't readily tell by looking at women who expects to be paid / compensated for their time from those that don't. The general consensus is, men run into women who expect to be compensated much more than women who expect nothing. Moreover, a man has to distinguish from those women that are playing the long game. The ones who may put on an act, but down the road expect compensation from a man.

Here's an example from a taxi guy I used to befriend. I used to use his taxi services. He would act offended when I tried to get him to give me a price for his services. He'd rather wait until it's time to square up, and then you find yourself paying him more because he expects you to use your heart as your guide, rather than pay exactly for each thing he did a la carte. His way he gets more out of you.

Someone not aware might think that he's just being a friend. But there is an underlying motivation behind his actions. He hopes to get more out of you in the long run. I've seen male and females look at money handed to them as if to say WTF is this for? But the underlying reason for that is, they think what you gave them is peanuts in comparison to what they think they deserve. That is why I am not concerned about women being offended if offered money or it's discussed. The point is, we have established that your time can be bought, now were just trying to figure out how much you think your time is worth. And that IMO is why enough women are offended. Give an offended chica a 1000 US and see if she gives it back. If she does, triple it.

I lost a set of keys at the playa in Sosua. The guy that found them gave them to somebody else on the beach because he had to leave. The guy who brought me my keys, looked at the 100 pesos I gave him with the same WTF is this attitude as we see with chicas. So I asked him how much does he want. The mugg kept babbling about the guy who found the keys would want more money. Basically talking in circles. It was all bullshit, but that's how he kept avoiding being honest about what HE wanted for bringing me my keys. I asked him at least 3 times to tell me how much he wanted.

I'm trying to get across here, that enough dominicans have a hard time when it comes to accepting responsibility and being honest. Finally I stopped asking, and gave him another 100 pesos. He still looked at it funny. The parking lot attendant kept telling me to just walk away. Because the guy was being ridiculous about it. I even asked the guy suppose he lost his keys, what would he pay me for their return? Crickets. I told him that if I found his keys I would gladly return them and not expect anything in return. You cant shame or reason with some of these folks. Once they think they got a gringo in their debt, they go fucking nuts.

When it comes to women, a guy has to access the situation and discern who he is dealing with. True, not every woman is a hooker. But every non hooker is not offended by being offered money / compensation. Sometimes non hookers welcome being offered money / compensation. They know all too well how to rationalize that they are not being paid for sex.

My saying. BE CAREFUL WHAT YOU GET FOR FREE, BECAUSE YOU don't KNOW HOW MUCH IT MIGHT COST YOU IN THE LONG RUN.