Istanbul

[Big Bro AJ]

Awesome baby.

Local Expert,

Such an experience and observation from a foreigner. I agree most of it. Showing who is the boss is the right approach, act like you know what you are doing and why you are there are the key elements in those places. Always be nice. Taksim area bars/pubs are famous with rip offs. As I wrote Serenda has a hotel for its customers. It’s secure enough. Police raid is part of the business; they will be running next week with same guys.

From my view SW (most of them drug addicts) is too risky, even you have some risks with club girls. Definitely stays away from chicks with dicks in Turkey.Most of them have serious psychological problems and AIDS risk higher than real girls.

150-200 is the normal price for all night in Istanbul. As long as you have some contacts you may get good rates for better girls.

AJ

[Local Expert]

Catalyst:

I read your posts with a smiling and a crying eye, as I felt transferred back about seven years, when I had my first encounters in the bars of Ankara and my knowledge of Turkish was close to zero.

As a foreigner you are always seen as fair game by Turks, especially in the bars and clubs we from the WSG attend. But not only us, also Turks who come to such a location for the first time are being fucked heavily by waiters, pros, bar-managers, etc. The folks who work in these locations have a very elaborated sense whom of their customers is a first-timer and who is not. I received several PM's even by Turkish mongers in Ankara who wanted me to accompany them on their first "mission", as they know what happens to "virgins".

Who are these waiters / managers? These guys usually do not earn a salary, but live on the tips left by the customers, bribes by the girls and even by cheating the club owner heavily. In Ankara some chicks told me that they have to go to bed with the waiters in order to get seated next to customers with priority when the latters ask the waiters for "a" chick. Have you ever received a receipt in any of those bars for your payment ? Of course not, you just get a piece of paper with, let us say 50 million written onto it and that was all. That's how the barmen cheat even their bosses. Now, what is the psychology behind that ?

None of the folks in these bars has seen school for more than 5 years; they all come from the very poor AND CONSERVATIVE areas of each town. They are happy to have at least A job, and dare, don't think their parents know where they work exactly. (By the way, that also counts for the girls. Many of them live still at home and tell their parents they work in the tourism industry, that's why it is difficult to get an all-nighter with them).

Now these waiters see you as easy prey right in the middle of "Sodom and Gomorra". You are a non-muslim, you carry loads of cash with you and, on top of that, even drink alcohol. This is faaaaar too much for their conservative view of the world, so when they see that you are already smiling after your fourth beer, you have to pay for your sins and they gonna fuck you big time..... if you let them.

To avoid that, I am always very careful when it comes to Istanbul, regarding alcohol. In Ankara, the barmen all know me, so I can pump it here, but I would never do that out of town. What I suggest to all "Turkish-Illiterates" is to reflect the above before you enter one of the clubs. Then, make the waiter know that you are the boss in a friendly way. Order your coke, push his arm with the plates of nuts, salads, fruits, etc. VERY gently away before they even touch your table and be firm on that. Make him understand that you don't wanna eat anything there and combine this with maybe a joke. If you have a belly, point on it and say that you are on a diet e.g.... make the guy smile, then you are on the safe side. When these cigarette or teddy-bear sellers come, tell them to fuck off. They are on the lowest social level of the bar. Make them know that you know this! The best way to do that is to look into their eyes and use the Turkish mimic for "no". That is raising your eyebrows and your head (a bit) at the same time. Additionally, wave them away with your right hand. That shows them that you know they work in "Sodom and Gomorra" and what their status in there is.

Only invite a chick to your table who you definitely wanna screw that night. Make sure that you agree on the price and conditions within the first 3 minutes, then let her finish her drink and LEAVE ! Don't spend more time in the place than you have to.

Bunny Hopper, No Commit and me met for a mongering weekend in Istanbul last summer. I won't go mongering in Istanbul again in summer, as all the good chicks are down in Antalya, but if some of you come back to Istanbul after October, we could all meet in that beautiful city and go mongering for a weekend together. It is definitely worth it, if you know where to go and how to behave.

To your questions:

1) Usually YES
2) Never had one from Bacardi, as 200 USD is too much
3) Definitely, they might be closed for a week due to a police raid

Finally: Istanbul is not a destination you go to for sex-tourism. It can never compete with Rio, Phuket or Nairobi, but you can have fun there if you are in Turkey for other main reasons !

[Priamos]

Catalyst,

Actually it was I who used the term classic American/North European tourist. I'm glad you approve... ;-)

In response to your direct questions:

a) The best way to pay an Aksaray working girl is: (1) agree on the price before going to a hotel room with her. The agreement should include the services and, crucially, the amount of time spent ("two hours" easily shrink to 50 minutes if you don't insist); (2) do NOT pay before you are inside the hotel room; (3) prior to undressing, put the agreed sum (plus perhaps a small topping if you want to enhance the probability of GFE) on a table in the room. Ex-Soviet girls abhor having cash thrust into their palm. Also, this creates an exit option if you feel the girl reneges on her promise: just stand up, get dressed and withdraw a portion of the cash (you should leave a little, though, to avoid trouble).

b) I have no experience with Bacardi girls. I have been to Bacardi a couple of times, but I feel strangely out of place: most of the other punters are apparently wealthy Turkish businessmen on a night out, and even by dressing up I have never been able to dispel the impression of being an outsider.

c) Serenda is up and running. I don't know what to make of this place: on the one hand, the girls are very pretty and not overly expensive. On the other hand, the service you usually get is far from GFE. Most of the time I prefer to trawl for the chatty and un-rushed services of a less dazzling "neighbour's daughter" from one of the smaller bars in the neighbourhood. Finally, on the issue of Serenda, if you go in autumn be aware that they are closed during Ramadan.

[Catalyst]

Aslan,

Thanks for all the great info. Maybe I'll give Istanbul another try sometime.

Not much I can do about my language skills without a big investment, and I'm not sure I'm up for calling my connections a couple of times a week, so I'll be at a disadvantage. I'll skip the streetwalkers and try to form some relationships with girls after testing them out for an hour or two.

Can anyone comment on a couple of points:

1 - Do you always or usually pay in advance?

2 - Have people had good experiences with the really gorgeous girls in Bacardi, or do they have a bad attitude because they think too highly of themselves?

3 - Is Serenda still operating?

I really like Germany. The girls are beautiful, the sex is great (depending on the club), and everything is straightforward. I hate the way I always seem to be pulling off leeches in Aksaray. Whoever suggested that I must be a classic north European/American tourist who is uncomfortable with this stuff nailed it.

[Aslan Kral]

Catalyst,

When I hired the girls for 2 hours we always went to my hotel. I was staying at Holiday Inn Atakoy then, and none of the girls objected. Of course, you will have to ask the girl, but I don't think there would be any objection, at least in Irmak. I mentioned about it in other posts, most restaurants close to Irmak have a condition on the customer that the lady should be brought to a hotel that has an agreement with the restaurant. Those hotels are crap and charge more than usual because they share the payment with the restaurant.

In Topkapi, I spent some time close to Holiday Inn Istanbul. I noticed young girls with heavy make-ups, waiting in front of apartments on minor streets, during evening, but I didn't ask any of them. I saw guys speaking to them briefly and taking off. I also spotted SWs both sides of the street where Holiday Inn and Topkapi Eresin are located. Some of them were she-males. Anyway, at least those SWs would sure require some language skills and it is critical not to ask the wrong lady.

A taxi driver told me that this activity is not stable. Sometimes, police shows up during late evenings to push them otuside of that area.

The activity increases during evenings, but I saw one she-male around the hotel at 5PM. It was clear that he/she was a PRO, heavy make-up, a 'funny' bag and looks. Not for regular girls.

My understanding is SW activity is happening in most places and most women involved are married. One lady friend mentioned about a married women in her building bringing customers to her apartment. In this case, husband knows, and I could get this lady quite cheap, less than 50M, but I can't spend with her more than half-hour and have to visit her apartment. One time deal, probably no BJ, but she is attractive, again according to my lady friend.

Turkish Connections mentioned about a lot of things; beatiful married women where the husband doesn't know, younger girls doing anal sex to keep their virginity, veiled women whoring(possibly in traditional sense, can't imagine otherwise), etc. And the numbers are exploding. I have the impression that anal sex is more common among Turkish pros. Most foreigners pros don't do it.

I was thinking that they were exaggerating, but last Saturday I went into a bed with a very nice Amateur, married, 25 years old. Another lady had to bring her to my hotel room. I paid 100USD for 2 hours, which I had to spend 45 minutes just talking/drinking to prepare her for bed. It was awesome. In my opinion, I am not going to have this experience in another country. And how would I find her without connections?

BTW, you need to keep your connections under leash. I don't spend much time in Turkey, and when I'm outside I give a call to each connection 1-2 times a week. This way, you also push them to look for girls for your next visit.

Now, I plan to be back in Istanbul late May and would like to have sex with 5-6 different Turkish gals during a weekend. I am not going to touch any pro foreigners for some time. US or Europe, it is not worth it. In Germany I visited FKKs a few times, Pay 100-150 euro, have sex with 2-3 women for 30-40 minutes. No real action, just mechanic sex with a lady who had fucked so many men during that week. Why bother to fuck them? I don't want to even cover the pathetic situation in east coast. You can have exotic choices, but rule of thumb is, pro or not pro, American women are dumb.

I can't really comment about Rio, Thailand or Moscow. But most places in Western world, forget it, I am not going to spend a single cent.

A side note is that every person has a different taste, perspective, and sexual situation. My feelings are not probably applicable in your case. But, if you had just spoken the language, you would get a much better deal.

Aslan Kral

[Vegamars]

Apart from the funny prices in the US the quality is so poor that you cannot even compare it with another place or Istanbul.That's why any American guy falls in love with the first Russian girl he encounters.
The trick with Bacardi and similar places is to be experienced enough to look for the new girls in town and to negotiate for 2-3 hrs for first meeting.Later on you can easily arrange a meeting for yourself by avoiding the clubs and the system.
Considering all and the comparison of quality vs prices, the best place in the world is definitely Northern Cyprus.

[Catalyst]

Thanks, guys, for the info. I’ve been to some of the better places in the world, including Moscow, but also Rio, Germany, Thailand, and Amsterdam (before the prices went crazy), so maybe I’m spoiled.

I am definitely looking for the best looking ones, and they are scarce here, so there is a problem. Some of the Bacardi girls might have been worth it, but not if there is a likelihood that they will take your $200 and then leave early. Does everyone pay in advance? Can you count on most of them to spend the whole night? I certainly got bad vibes from at least the first one I spoke with.

If you go for 2 hours can you go to your hotel, or do you have to shell out for a local mafia hotel? If I’m ever back I think a better strategy than immediately bargaining for all night would be to go for 2 hours and then extend to all night if it goes well. And I’ll try to make connections. I’ll certainly do everything I can to avoid those leeches who run the restaurants and discos.

Where should I look for streetwalkers around Topkapi; in front of the hotels? Things didn’t look very developed out there. Also I tried Serenda, but it was closed and seemed like it might be for a while.

“When you compare the prices with US, having sex is really cheap in Istanbul.” – And when you compare MacDonald’s with gruel eaten by starving Ethiopians it tastes like the best restaurant in Paris.

[Big Bro AJ]

Catalyst,

Sorry about your bad experience in Istanbul. As “Aslan Kral” mentioned as long as you can speak Turkish a little bit you may pass the barriers more easily. If you are looking for hot beauties, Moscow is the best place, but the quality of the girls at Thockas going down and the prices are going up at the clubs, because of the summer. You may find all the details from MOSCOW section.

Not only in Istanbul, mafia controls the sex industry everywhere. You may see it clearly at the former communist countries.

Seranda, Irmak and Bacardi are the best places for mongers.

Seranda has a hotel; if you deal with the girl you can take it over there. It’s safe for sex.

Generally prices for all night is around $200 or equivalent Euro. It’s summer time.

When you compare the prices with US, having sex is really cheap in Istanbul, but none of them is a GFE.

Don’t forget “what you see what you get”

[Aslan Kral]

Catalyst,

I never bargained with the girls. I asked what would be the price for 2 hours and was directly quoted 50 Euros twice and slightly higher another time. With one of them, we only spoke in English.

There is a reasonable chance that you are looking for someone quite high on the scale. I am interested with the girls aged between 25-35 and hot, passionate, long sex is number one priority.

As a result, I don't usually look for girls higher than 8 and those type of girls provide only mechanical sex. This is the case in other countries as well. They want to finish quick and return back to pick up another customer, so they would do anything just to get rid off you. There is a nickname for these type of girls; 'Animal'.

I had never been to Bacardi, but price seems right. 150-200$ for the night in those type of places.

I don't mean escort services. I asked one of my ladies about a Turkish girl and convinced her that having sex with a Turkish girl would be fantastic. She was reluctant at the beginning, but later arranged one such girl. I then asked that girl to arrange me other Turkish girls, and eventually had sex with several Turkish gals.

I have the impression that SW activity is everywhere. I have seen girls waiting for customers in Topkapi area, some of them are really gorgeous, young and possibly cheap.

Aslan Kral

[Priamos]

Catalyst,

I privately agree that Irmak is a tad overrated. Some of the other bars/restaurants on the same short street even have a better selection of girls, but the waiters there are more pushing and more trickery so expats tend to prefer the relative honesty of Irmak.

On the basis of your posting I'd say you're a classic north European or American tourist, who does not want to play Vanderbilt (this rules out Bacardi and a couple of similar places) and who does much like the aggressive bargainings and mutual deceit of the eastern Mediterranean (that rules out much of Aksaray). If so, I strongly recommend you take a look at the map I posted a couple of weeks ago and go to a place like Gold Can in the afternoon or Sultan Club in the evening. Both of them (and especially GC) are a bit dark and smoke-filled, but they are more honest than most and with a good selection of girls.

[Catalyst]

Aslan,

Sounds like one should stick to Irmak, but the selection was not good when I was there. 20 million sounds like what I would have paid at Irmak (or maybe 25 if the girl had ordered a more expensive drink).

How hard do you bargain with the girls? Do they start out at 100-110 Euros? Bargaining didn’t get me very far in Bacardi or in one other club (the other $200 girl).

Regarding connections, do you mean that you ask the girl you are with to hook you up with her friends? You’re not referring to escort services, are you?

There was a gorgeous young girl I passed on the street out by the wall. She was sitting on a chair on the sidewalk and offered to take my picture. I wondered if there was something up with that, but I hardly speak any Turkish, so I didn’t think I had any way to find out.

[Aslan Kral]

Catalyst,

I agree with many points you mentioned in your message. Turkish 'enterpreneurs' usually try to rip off foreigners as much as possible, even in small cities far from touristic places. I witnessed many similar events when I was in Turkey. This seems like a tradition. At the moment that you are realized as a foreigner, the price for the commodity will go up. The key point is not the looks, but the language barrier.

I guess, being Turkish or at least speaking some level of Turkish would be quite helpful. My Turkish is not very good, and I visited Aksaray several times, including once during night time, I never run into any problem. I simply ignored those people who try really hard to convince.

Anyway, in Irmak you shouldn't pay more than 20M including both drinks(one for the girl, one for yourself) and a small tip. I think, it is just about luck. When I visited Irmak last time, there were 15-20 girls downstairs waiting for the disco to open and I was able to choose a nice girl for 110 euro per night. All the girls I got from Irmak stayed over night without any problem, but only one of them spoke passable English. That's another potential problem with foreigners, most girls don't speak English.

BTW, I visited Irmak only three times, all over the same weekend, and always worked with connections afterwards. Connections arrange new connections and if you don't like what is arranged, you can usually reject the lady and just pay the taxi fare. During last few weeks, I just focused on Turkish connections and last Saturday, eventually I had great sex with a stunning Turkish amateur. She wouldn't even touch my dick, but I ravaged her for one full hour. She was trying to hide, but I think she was married. I felt guilty afterwards having sex with a married woman, but I will definitely arrange her when I visit next time. She was hot.

Once you get the right connections, you can't imagine what is being offered with a little incentive. Istanbul is an incredible place if you speak the language. The key point is to build relationships and go from one connection to another and let them work for you. Because, when you have sex with a semi-pro for a few times and have a good relationship, she would know enough about your sexual preferences and will arrange what is best for you.

Of course, again, these are valid statements if you speak the language and yes Istanbul might not be a good destination for foreigners.

I guess, Turkish mongers will be much better off in the coming years. Prostitution has not been an acceptable discipline for previous generations, but that's changing fast. I believe, we will go through an explosion in numbers as younger generation is not restricted enough and economic situation is not improving. Do I like this situation, no, I would prefer Turkey to stay as a closed country as much as possible, which is somewhat contrary to my darker side.

Aslan Kral

[Catalyst]

aksaray. so this, this is what all the chatter is about?! this is a catastrophe! turkey would make a great comedy skit about everything that spoils the hobby.

everything in aksaray is controlled and ruined by an obnoxious mafia. they stand between you and the girls and do everything in their power to extract the maximum toll form you in exchange for access. they breed a culture of lying and leeching such that no matter what you are willing to pay you may not get what you are after.

the hassle starts even before you get to one of the streets where the action is. men who see where you are going call out to you, say “excuse me, where are you from?” and start to follow you. if you refuse to engage them in conversation they get angry. perhaps their job is to guide you to a particular club, perhaps it is just to hustle you; i never let them waste enough of my time for me to find out.

every club has hawkers at the entrance. if you walk towards a club or even simply look at it they will come out to greet you and block your path. they will take you by the shoulder, address you as their “friend”, and guide you inside where you will be handed off to various men of increasing seniority whose job it is to guide you to a seat and make you feel committed.

there are two general venues - discos and restaurants – which are more or less the same. restaurants are on the first floor and have an associated disco either upstairs or downstairs. restaurants are open during the day and at night the discos open and the restaurant girls go to the discos.

in both places the girls sit at tables in small groups rep001tered about a room. when you enter you are expected to take a seat and order a drink, although you can first make a loop around the room to take a look at the girls if you ask. even during the day it is hard to get a good look at the girls with one pass and once you sit down some of them will be out of view. at night it can be impossible to see many of them, and some clubs have u-shaped rooms or even have two levels with the girls divided between more than one space. i suppose you could take more walks around the room, but you will be conspicuous if you do and i wouldn’t want to leave my drink unattended.

want to get a better look at a girl? want to know how much it will cost you to spend some time with her? just wave to her or let a waiter know you are interested in her and she will come to your table. she will be followed by a waiter who will take your drink order.

drinks you order for yourself will usually cost you about 10 million lire ($1 = 1,300,000 lire). when you enter the club you will be told that they cost 1 million or maybe 3 or 4 million. but this, like everything else you are told in most clubs, is a huge lie. in many places your drink really does cost 4 million or so, but it will come with some amenity such as a plate of peanuts which costs maybe an extra 5 million. if you ask how much the peanuts cost you may be told that this is “normal disco service” or that there is “just one price for everything”. every effort is made to deny you information about anything. naturally the full potential of the language barrier is exploited.

drinks you order for the girl will cost much more. in some places it is impossible to find out what the pricing structure is. bacardi and irmak were somewhat straightforward. in bacardi her drinks cost 25 million. in irmak it depends what she orders; there is a menu with prices ranging roughly from 10 million to 15 million and perhaps you could try to veto a more expensive drink order. some other discos told me that there is one fixed price of $50 for food and drinks for the both of you. probably this would not include the drinks you had already ordered before inviting a girl to your table, but i never threw away such a large sum to find out. learning prices always required asking several times and then waiting for the request to be passed up the chain of command until it reached a manager who had the authority to divulge such sensitive information. i was told that food and drink prices are lower in the restaurants than in the discos, so going during the day might be more economical than going at night, but i never verified this.

buying a girl a drink guarantees you nothing. if she quotes you a high price, doesn’t look so good close up, has a bad attitude, etc... you have blown $20-50. when she quotes you a price she is of course well aware that you have already spent money just to talk to her and probably don’t want to throw it away and start over, so this tilts the pricing game heavily against you.

finally the girls. if you like fat 30-ish russian chicks with huge perms then istanbul is the place for you. everyone else should run away. to be fair there are some good looking ones, mostly in bacardi, and there are even a couple of real stunners. but most clubs had at most 1 or 2 who were possibilities, many did not have a single girl who looked interesting, and the few stunners i spoke to all wanted $200. pretty much everything i was told here was a huge lie, so when a girl says she will spend all night with you make sure you have a good book with you just in case.


the first place i visited was bacardi. i got there at 8:30 on a friday and it was a little dead, so they told me i should come back in a couple of hours which i did. there are two unique things about bacardi. first there is a large dance floor, and the girls all took turns dancing so this was the only club i saw where you could get a good look at all the girls. secondly, the selection was far better than anywhere else. this was the only club that had several girls that i was definitely interested in.

the floor manager was straightforward about drinks costing 10 million for me (or 25 million if i sat at a table closer to the dance floor) and 25 million for her. after ordering a drink and watching for a few minutes i picked out a conspicuous stunner which he brought to my table. she looked like the porn star keisha from the early 1990s. she told me she was from kazakhstan and made some nice chitchat about where i was from, etc ...

as soon as her drink arrived the vendors swooped down, selling flowers, cigarettes, and candy. they were waiting in line to get at me. i told them all to go away (multiple times of course, since the first several requests were ignored). she told me to buy her a pack of cigarettes, and when i said no her answer was “my price is $200.” how could anyone turn down such a skillful and understated sales pitch? i did. when she walked off i had the feeling that she felt quite smug about having cost me an expensive drink.

the floor manager asked me if i wanted to see another girl and was actually decent about my dilemma, allowing me to talk briefly to two more girls without having to buy them drinks. one girl didn’t speak any english. the other wanted $200 and while she wasn’t a buy-me-cigarettes b---- she had a bit of a professional air and wasn’t really hot enough to be asking that price anyway. so i asked for the bill. 10 million for my drink plus 25 million for the girl-drink plus a 5 million tip tacked on came to 40 million. $30 to talk for 2 minutes to a couple of stuck-up princesses. and this is the best place in town!

next i decided to try irmak. it is on a narrow walking street and to get to it (from the north end of the street, as i did) you have to pass a gauntlet of hawkers who block your path, tug at your arm, and get upset when you don’t stop. irmak’s restaurant was closed so i went upstairs to the bar (i later learned that there is a disco on another floor above the bar which is better). there was only one girl who looked interesting and i wasn’t eager to buy more lady drinks, so i left.

i looked in several discos on that street and finally agreed to sit in the melody disco next to irmak since i saw a couple of possibilities there. inside i was careful about asking the price for everything. i was told that a beer was 4 million, so i ordered one. but the beer arrived along with 3 plates of food, which i argued furiously against accepting. in the end they took away everything but a plate of peanuts which i agreed to pay another 4 million for. i asked how much a lady drink was and was told 10 million. that seemed reasonable, so i asked a girl to sit with me.

she was a pretty rumanian who spoke a little english. she asked for $150 for all night. i asked if she would have breakfast with me the next morning and she said yes. a couple of things she said made me think she was somewhat uncorrupted. she had only been in istanbul for 3 months. when i asked to pay in lire instead of dollars she had to ask her friends what the lire equivalent of $150 was. i told her i was staying at the eresin and she hadn’t heard of it. so we closed the deal.

the bill came and my drink (4 million) plus peanuts (4 million) plus her drink (10 million) plus a plate of chocolates (4 million) that came with her drink (in addition to many other dishes that i refused to accept) came to a total of ... 45 million?! the price for lady drinks had suddenly increased to 15 million and there was more than one of them plus other charges. i refused to pay. after a long argument i gave them 25 million and they threw me out and wouldn’t let me take the girl. i had paid over $50 at two lousy places and i was on my way home to whack off.

the next night i made a tour of the entire area, looking briefly inside every club i could find. serenda was closed and it wasn’t clear whether they would open again soon. a taxi driver told me “serenda kapali ... problema”. most of these places looked roughly identical. i didn’t see what the fuss over irmak was. they seemed a little more honest and open about their prices, but they had a worse than average selection. this night i didn’t see a single girl who looked interesting in irmak. i did sit in the disco and have a beer to see if i had missed something or if more girls would show up. it was frustrating not being able to see the girls in the darkness. there is a dance floor, but it was monopolized by two men. one looked like kenneth starr and the other looked like a fat steve buschemi. they appeared to be under the impression that they were “getting down”. they were eventually joined by a bony 20-ish youth who looked like a dancer from sprockets on snl. the girls seemed to prefer to avoid them. similar bizarre spectacles occurred in several clubs that i looked in.

i tried an approach to simplify the selection process and met with mixed success. if i saw something i liked in a bar i would tell the floor manager who was holding onto my arm that i didn’t want to sit and have a drink, but could i just pick a girl, talk to her, and pay the bar something if i decided to take her. in most places the answer was no, that they have a system that needs to be followed. in one bar the owner said ok and allowed me to talk to a stunning russian girl without ordering a drink, establish that her price was $200 (which was too expensive for me), and turn her down politely. she asked me several times about why i wasn’t following the system and she seemed uncomfortable with or at least puzzled by what i was doing.

before i could leave, however, the owner cornered me in a booth and explained to me that he wanted $100 for “arranging things with the girl” (paraphrased from broken english). i wasn’t sure if he meant that if i decided to take a girl he wanted a $100 commission or if he was saying that i already owed him $100 because i had talked to a girl. i got out of the situation where i was cornered (clearly to intimidate me) by saying that i wanted to leave with the girl and that she could resolve everything if we could just talk to her. we walked over to her and i said to him “but she won’t go with me for $100, she wants $200” (deliberately confusing his commission with her asking price). i said “it’s too much for me” and quickly walked out without looking back as he started to speak to the girl.

in another club the floor manager said he would allow me to pick a girl, arrange everything with her, and the total for the girl and the bar would be $150. but oddly he also said that he would come with us to my hotel to “talk to her and make sure everything went smoothly”. this unwelcome suggestion was made more unsettling by the fact that he was much bigger than me. i wondered if the idea wasn’t go to the hotel in his car and somehow not quite make it there. a couple of other clubs said that they were happy to go along with my system, but that the charge for food and drink with a girl was $50 and that i would pay this even if we left without eating or drinking. there seemed to be an advantage to be gained here since it sounded like i could talk to the girl without paying anything if i decided not to go with her, but i could never be sure that it wasn’t another huge lie, that i wouldn’t be made to pay even if i didn’t go with a girl. most of these clubs didn’t have anyone who looked interesting anyway, and $50 was more than i wanted to pay even if i found someone i liked.

when i passed by the melody bar i was surprised when the hawkers came after me. i told them that i would take the rumanian girl i sat with the previous might and pay a fee to the bar, but that i wouldn’t go back for more drinks. they told me she wasn’t there. so my second night turned out more successful than the first one because as i whacked off i could reflect on having spent only some 30 million lire on a few drinks for myself instead of the 65 million i spent the night before.

the next day i set out more determined to get a girl and more willing to pay for it. i started early, at around 5. in the worst case scenario i would go to bacardi late and pay $200 for a beautiful girl, but first i would try to find something less expensive at irmak. well, again there was nothing interesting there, but as i came out and passed by melody bar their hawker came up to me and said that the rumanian girl was there.

i went inside and there she was. she said she would come with me for the whole night (which i was suspicious of since it was still early) for $150. a waiter came to take our drink orders and i said that i wanted no food and no drinks, i only wanted the bill. this caused some confusion but eventually resulted in a slip of paper with “35” written on it being produced. i didn’t see how i was going to do any better than this. when i put 35 million lire on the table there was anger and indications that it wasn’t enough, in spite of it being written down, but a little arguing and refusal to pay more prevailed. (remaining calm and friendly though firm when arguing, even when faced with ridiculous requests, seemed to be the most successful strategy in these places.)

now, finally i get to try out one of these girls and see if all night really means all night. well, it doesn’t. after having sex the first time she asked me how many more times i wanted to have sex and told me that when i was done she would go. i didn’t much care by now since her english wasn’t great, so being with her for a long time might be dull, and after two rounds i thought i had gotten some value for my money. she offered a third round but i didn’t know if i would be able to so i said it wasn’t necessary. overall she was neither bad nor great. she seemed a little nervous. she wanted to be paid in advance. when she undressed i was a little disappointed. the first bj was covered and the second uncovered but it only went about ½ inch into her mouth. there was some blood as her period was just ending (so maybe it was a good thing that i didn’t take her out 2 nights earlier). kissing was no problem. both times after a few minutes of sex she started asking about when i was going to come. certainly it was not worth the $250 and 2 nights of searching that i had spent. when she left she asked for cab fare and i said i didn’t have it. she said she didn’t believe me (she was right), so i told her that well she said she would stay all night, and she let it drop.

there was a language barrier, but if i understood her correctly she had spent a night at the police station. after i left her two night earlier the management of the bar got mad at her because i wouldn’t pay (as if it were her fault). then later that night the police raided the club. she made the unfortunate mistake of alerting the police to the fact that the restaurant was run by the mafia, and for this she got slapped around and spend a night in jail. she said she hated the people at the bar and told me not to go there again but to call her directly if i wanted to see her again and she gave me her number. the whole story was gloomy, and one particular detail that was a depressing commentary on the state of the hobby was that she would hustle me about spending the whole night and then expect me to want to see her again. i told her that i would be in isanbul for a few more days. i don’t know if things would have gone as well if she had known that i was leaving the next day. she told me that she is thinking of going to another country because there is nothing in turkey, but she doesn’t know where. i asked her if she knew about the clubs in germany, but she said that she doesn’t speak german, doesn’t know anyone there, and anyway f---ing people is a lousy job.

in the heart of the marketplace by the yeni camii there is an area where you can buy generic viagra very cheaply. there are also some porn vcds which i don’t recommend. i picked up 4 of the vcds for 1 million each. three of them weren’t awful, but the movies on them had nothing to do with the covers, and the fourth was a regular cd with turkish lessons instead of a vcd. i asked the viagra sellers for cialis and got suckered into buying kamagra (generic viagra). i checked the chemical name – sildenofil citrate – and knew that i had heard the name before, and i only bought one packet and tried it out before buying more, so i wasn’t a complete bonehead who just believed what they said. when i realized my mistake i was only a little annoyed since even for viagra it was a good price. i paid 15 million (about $12) for a packet of 4 once i got the price down. maybe it can be had for less. in thailand viagra costs about $10 per pill.

if you are stuck in istanbul or if you are there for the tourist attractions, do what you have to do. but if you are looking for adventure and can choose your destination don’t come here and support the crummy gangsters who treat both you and the girls like crap. oh, and if my post hasn’t convinced you to avoid istanbul check out the posts on diseases. this is not a good place to go to hobby.

[Cohiba Guy]

Hi All!

I will be visiting Gocek/Fethiye area soon and I know that this is not the appropriate forum for this but the other areas forum has so little traffic that I am afraid I won't have anyone read this. I will be there early May, before the real tourist season begins.

Where can I go for some action? Any CIS girls around there?

Thanks in advance!

[Priamos]

BunnyHopper,

I see what you mean, but in my experience being at the centre of attention in Yenikapi exposes you to little more than obtrusive touting. (Plus, a couple of ****heads once tried the fake-fight routine in order to pick my pockets. They failed...) I have never felt physically threatened.

But there are threats and there are threats. I don't want to be a spoilsport, but I have to agree with AslanKral on one point: these days there's a veritable Chlamydia pandemic in the neighbourhood. My hotel receptionist and a local waiter, both of whom having fathomed that I like to go to this part of town at night, voiced stern warnings about this. The waiter, with whom I struck up a reserved friendship, was aware of the data Aslan quoted (apparently they've been widely quoted in Istanbul) and contended that if anything they are an understatement. The girls in that study who got themselves deported have generally worked in "private establishments", where certain house rules apply. The privateers of Yenikapi do whatever they feel like. The latter are an exclusive club with a few hundred members, and most of them are incredibly irresponsible (I sampled five girls in one week; one of them insisted on protection; one flatly refused; three said it was for me to decide.) so you can just imagine.

Responding to your question about concrete places, a few words about Gold Can. As indicated earlier I am an "early bird" who doesn't like to be awake after midnight, so I do most of my mongering in the late afternoon or early evening. This makes GC ideal: it begins to fill up with hostesses and patrons around 3 p.m. It's a classic smoke-filled Muzikhol with live music most of the evenings. The bar tap for a drink and a few salted nuts (the de facto cover charge) sets you back 10 mill. TRL (7 bucks) and a lady drink costs an additional 10-20 mill. TRL according to the waiter's moods. On a normal afternoon/early evening the room is at least half full, with about 1/3 working girls and 2/3 patrons. Since many of the latter are on the voyeuring rather than the punting side the girls/guys ratio is quite satisfactory.

The girls reserve the right of refuse: there are sometimes a few stunners who only give second looks to local tycoons known to pay top prices for a 12 hour-service, and maybe some of the others just don't like the way you look. The way to choose is this: within the first 5-10 minutes of sitting down look at each single girl individually. If she's available she'll gaze back with a positive interest. Same thing applies when a new girl enters the room (they walk in and out all the time) - just ogle her and see if she responds. Naturally, you're not expected to pick one during the first 10 minutes. Turks like to take their time and you should do likewise. After the initial starting contest the girls will pretend to lose interest, but now that you know who is looking for your custom its easy: once you've decided, just catch the eyes of your chosen one and gesticulate through the room that you'd like her to sit next to you. Warning: less than half of the girls speak English.

The action usually takes place in a hotel less than two blocks away from the club, which specialises in these things (there are quite a few of those). Unlike what one might expect, the hotels are clean and modern and you'll need your passport to check in. The bellboy will sometimes to extract a small bakshish by offering to sell you a drink or provide preservatives. In some of the places the girls are expected to back his effort as part of their arrangement with hotel. This is an annoying little hassle, but not very expensive. Count 50 euros for the girl (two hours), 30 euros for the hotel plus 10 euros for unforeseen expenses.

Finally, many bona fide tourist hotels in Istanbul are guest friendly, but not all girls will be willing to go to your hotel. - It helps if its so late in the evening that you're likely to be her last, or only, client.