Kyiv

[Riina]

Love your post and get your point. I agree about US guys. Where in Ukraine if not Kiev?

I just meant what most of us here see in Kiev's night clubs is not a reflection of Ukrainian life for young people.

[Sean EZ]

I don't think Jonathan is referring to drunk sluts and prostitutes. He's right, Ua girls have had more cock then girls in the West at 21. Forget about Kiev, it's not Ukraine. Go on VK and look at the photos of social pacts of young people doing other things together like camping and trips. Just because they don't have access to venues does not mean they do not come together to have fun. I've had my share of teens and all have had multiple threesomes with friends when most young Americans would have been lucky just to rub a clit. Find a sexual Ua girl to open up to you. She will tell you that she fucked her teacher, that her boyfriend arranged paid sex with someone she wanted to fuck, that she and her girlfriends have licked each others pussies. I'm really jealous sometimes when I see these groups of young and pretty Ukrainians all in love with one another in my home city. The girls are not making judgements on their guys as to their financial worth at that point in life and their is little cultural restriction from having fun together. I feel sad when I look at young American guys with low pay work. Where's the pussy for them?

Love your post and get your point. I agree about US guys. Where in Ukraine if not Kiev?

[Riina]

Based on what? I've met the horniest and sluttiest girls in UK. When I went to Burgas. Bars or clubs full of wasted 14 year old sluts. Kiev with its population and having what 10 clubs in total is a far cry. Girls in the west are way open minded when it comes to sex and party and there are many more venues and opportunities for that compared to other poor developing countries like Ukraine.

I don't think Jonathan is referring to drunk sluts and prostitutes. He's right, Ua girls have had more cock then girls in the West at 21. Forget about Kiev, it's not Ukraine. Go on VK and look at the photos of social pacts of young people doing other things together like camping and trips. Just because they don't have access to venues does not mean they do not come together to have fun. I've had my share of teens and all have had multiple threesomes with friends when most young Americans would have been lucky just to rub a clit. Find a sexual Ua girl to open up to you. She will tell you that she fucked her teacher, that her boyfriend arranged paid sex with someone she wanted to fuck, that she and her girlfriends have licked each others pussies. I'm really jealous sometimes when I see these groups of young and pretty Ukrainians all in love with one another in my home city. The girls are not making judgements on their guys as to their financial worth at that point in life and their is little cultural restriction from having fun together. I feel sad when I look at young American guys with low pay work. Where's the pussy for them?

[YummyPL]

When you start believing all girls will share their pussy with an older foreigner, you have crossed into delusional. When your ego tells you that a girl will like you if you can just corner her attention, you have again crossed the line into delusional.

I don't think anyone would argue against that. But there are literally tens of thousands of exquisite girls in Kiev. If you can find a few of the 1% that will, then you have a good thing going.

I said I will never have a strong short game. I actually think the most important aspect of a good short game, other than the requisite confidence, is a good smile. I am fairly confident but I don't have a nice smile. I don't look approachable or friendly. My teeth are not nice and when I smile, unless it is super genuine, it looks more like an evil grin than a smile. It is not good for picking up girls.

But something as simple as taking a girl's coat is HUGE. Some of these girls have never had that kind of treatment in their lives.

So my progress. Yesterday I was sitting on the couch in my apartment with the 18 year old. We were sitting sideways facing each other with our backs against each end of the couch. We were like this off-and-on for a couple of hours when she extended her legs and basically put her feet against my legs that were crossed under me. It was innocent enough, but not something I would expect to be done without thought. I basically ignored them for quite some time. Eventually I took one of them in my hands and started giving it a massage. This was the very first blatantly flirtations thing I have done. I'm not saying I have not flirted. I just have kept it on the very mild side of flirting. She sorta pulled her foot away a bit and said something along the lines "eewww, feet are gross" but I told her I like her feet. She let me continue to massage them. I did nothing more than that.

Today she arrived at my apartment at 10 AM. I took her coat, and she took off her boots. As she did this, she said to me "I have a surprise for you. I bought these last night because I thought you might like them" She was wearing obviously newly bought and brightly colored toe-socks (the kind of socks with individual toes). Is that something a girl who is not at all interested in me would do?

This girl is 18-fucking-years-old and is very attractive. I could not have dreamed of getting this girl in the USA even when I was 30, much less now. When she left today I gave her a kiss for the first time. It was light, short, and not at all sexual, but it was a real kiss and she kissed back.

She and I have not touched a drop of alcohol together. In the 7 times I have met with her I have spent a little over $100 on meals of which more than half was eaten by me, and about $80 on Russian language tutoring which has truly been productive. Maybe we will never have sex, but personally, I think it is money very well spent. I am building exactly the kind of relationship I want with this girl. I know, I know, she is probably just using me. But, I can easily pay for sex any time I want. This particular hunt is starting to be very fun.

By the way, I dropped another girl that wasn't going anywhere interesting. I am down to two for this trip after 1 week, but I am not unhappy. Next week I am in Germany, and if I want to have sex, I have dozens of FKKs to choose from.

And for those asking which specific website I used. I really have no desire to spread that all over this board. However, this isn't fucking rocket science. First, what kind of websites do people use to look for work? WTF, it isn't that fucking hard to figure it out. Second, you are not going to get an "Innocent flower" to meet with you for Russian lessons unless you can disarm them and give them a reason to believe you. I dropped a girl this morning because she told me her mother freaked out when the girl told her about me and she promised her mother she wouldn't go to my apartment. I won't be meeting this girl again.

And attached photo is me. Not super great, but not bad for a 48 year old guy. I'm 191cm tall and am in good shape. Maybe charm isn't the only thing going for me.

[Sean EZ]

And don't be fooled by these 18 year old girls. They've had more cocks already than most girls in the West at 21.
Regardless, I wish you good luck.

Based on what? I've met the horniest and sluttiest girls in UK. When I went to Burgas. Bars or clubs full of wasted 14 year old sluts. Kiev with its population and having what 10 clubs in total is a far cry. Girls in the west are way open minded when it comes to sex and party and there are many more venues and opportunities for that compared to other poor developing countries like Ukraine. I also find Russian / Ukr prostititues a lot colder than the girls in the west (condoms for everything, etc).

[Riina]

When you start believing all girls will share their pussy with an older foreigner, you have crossed into delusional. When your ego tells you that a girl will like you if you can just corner her attention, you have again crossed the line into delusional.

[Rammstein2]

This girl is permanently offering her service in mamba since I am a mamba follower. I don't look for such girls who are full time prostitutes. But we wrote a lot of times while we both were online. You can see her face also in mamba so its no problem to public her face here. I am chatting with here in whattsapp. +3809XXXXX489. She wants to have 200 for a night and 500 for the week. Her name is Alenka and she also used some other names. On my list she is number 224 in file E = trash girls.

Have fun with her.

[CallSign Papa]

And don't be fooled by these 18 year old girls. They've had more cocks already than most girls in the West at 21.

Judging by your posts so far, you're all opinion and no actual reports. Do feel free to actually report your boots on the ground experience because clearly you know more than the rest of us.

[YummyPL]

And don't be fooled by these 18 year old girls. They've had more cocks already than most girls in the West at 21.

I don't disagree but I have had interesting experiences with much less experienced girls. The fact is I prefer a girl that has had a few cocks in her. In Moscow, I actually had a 21 year old virgin who thought I was going to ask her to marry me. She didn't tell me she was a virgin until after I started entering her and she started almost yelling "It hurts, it hurts. " It was really clear she was a virgin with the blood. I dumped her the next day. If she had told me she was a virgin, I would never had tried to fuck her. I know, I know, it sounds impossible, but it is true. This girl had even already traveled to the USA for a summer and China for a year. I didn't even know what to do.

As one of the mongers here wrote a long time ago, "money is no substitute for charm" and it is still possible to woo a girl if you make the right moves. I will never be effective at the short game. I am too old and not good looking enough. But, I am very skilled at the long game. I am VERY skilled at building trust and some girls still go for that.

[Reiner Otto]

1) My long game in Moscow lasted 3 years and those were the best sexual years of my life.

2)And, I am not sure about Ukraine, but in Moscow language skills opened up much greater opportunities.

1) Same for me, 5 yrs in Peter.

2) Me, too. Also had an excellent Russian language teacher in UA.

Her photo (although few years old) was on the title page of Anastasiaweb. Needed quite a few lessons before getting some result.

But, as you wrote, this approach is for a long term visitor only.

[Bald69]

I think its not possible for me because I have no rights to sent mails. Are you able to sent a mail?

You need to pay for a membership for me to send you a private message. If you have info to share and you are in Kiev, pay for the membership and we can exchange contact info then. I will pay you back for the expense if you have info to share.

[Tomek123]

This girl. For those who love hard anal sex (inexpensive.) 24-25 years of age. Not a model, like a little Vietnamese girl from film about Wietnam War.

https://www.facebook.com/marinka.marinoczka

Sucks dick passionately. She does not speak any languages other than Slavonic. I fucked her three times a year ago. I can not call it beauty but its advantages is the pretty face and big beautiful eyes. Elastic body, her ass is not bad, but the waist is not visible. Perhaps the most good and sexy it is a big firm Ukrainian breasts)) yes) Unfortunately her shoulders as wide as her waist.

Great hot and heavy breasts. We speak Russian. I gave her then 400 hryvnia. Now she is asking 500-600 hryvnia from local men (She has two children).

(600 with anal sex) .

Simple girl from some village or small poor city 100 km. Near Kiev.

[Jonathan Pine]

I get what you're playing at, I've been there myself. So my advice to you is 3 lessons maximum for each tutor, than it's cards on the table time. If you sense she's unlikely go to further with you very soon, you'll have to cut your losses quickly.

And don't be fooled by these 18 year old girls. They've had more cocks already than most girls in the West at 21. So you need to firm, be in total control. If you show a bit of weakness (you might think it's kindness), they'll eat you alive. This is for young college girls that think they're hot shit. For the 30 year old divorced single mothers, the strategy is to be kind too them. After all they're in the shitty situation that they're at now was exactly because they went with the bad boys when they were younger. Now they appreciate guys that are kinder and softer.

In general I'd advice against meeting girls through language lessons. Too time consuming. Even if you live locally.

Regardless, I wish you good luck.

[Jonathan Pine]

I have done it personally. And I would have to say that it's very ineffective and time wasting. For me anyways. Why? Because the only reason they agree to meet you might very well be for the money. If you don't believe it. Try tell the girls that you'll no longer have paid lessons with them, but instead want to date them or fuck them. See how many will go for it? Very few. Most likely no one. By then you've already invested so much time and effort. It's more effective just chatting with girls in McDonalds or on the streets. Because you can weed out the ones that are not interested in you right away.

But this depends on the punters' age and appearance and charm. For older punters, paying them for "lessons" might be the only way to lure girls to meet them.

Bottom line, if one can date college aged girls in one's home country, one will be able to date college girls in Ukraine or Russia. If one can't get college girls in your country, it's very unlikely one will get college pussies in EE. So the only option is via money, but even that is extremely difficult.

The olden days are long gone. Stop day dreaming.

And my Russian language level is better than intermediate for those that are wondering.

[Volpone]

Studying Russian is great but I would do that at home. Committing your time to a classroom or one girl with no interest in sharing her pussy is a waste of time. Go to McD, buy a milk shake, and try to chat with college girls. Most are not desensitized to foreigners and are often times excited by the interaction. It's honest and nobody will make judgements. Language skills are over rated.

Well it was much more an experience than a real interest in taking some lessons. I just wanted to see if these girls, that were looking for someone till 25,28 or 30 years old, would agree to meet a guy older for some grivnias. Many girls weren't interested in it and some others said that wasn't enough money. The few times I went to the McD I didn't notice that some girls might be interested in talking with me. However I do that in the streets and in parks and it sometimes leads to a conversation, but usually nothing more.