Kyiv

[Kraled]

Ah Skank, you are the best at posts.

I have been to ukraine 5-6 times, and agree with almost everything you say, exceptint the last-hence my post.

I have almost never seen evidence of coercion in a provider, and certainly not in ukraine, although I have met more than a few who would have gladly departed to another country with a halfway decent man. Jbut the same might be said of a male plumber: it just makes sense to better oneself. Because I am merely a one quarter decent man, the topic is moot.

In fact, I believe, we are all, each of us, coerced by some circumstance. The human condition.

I have found the girls of Kev and Karkov to be very sweet, accomadating, and genuine. In odessa I got a freebie, except I felt bad and gave her money anyhow, taht might have been a little delusional on my part, the freebie portion but, if I fooled myself inot thinking taht, so what, I mean she called the next day and I did not answer rhe call. I am not entirely sure what tha tmeans, but I am sure the same would not have happened where I live.

Anyhow, thanks for your insight

[Hedonist]

I recently accepted a job offer in Kiev and will move there soon. Can anybody recommend me good real estate agencies for long-term rentals? What districts of Kiev are best to live for somebody actively engaged in our hobby? I would appreciate any advices regarding relocation, apartments, etc.

[It Travel]

IT,

Yes, the Arena complex is at the Bessarabaya Square end of Kreshatik. 112 and the Arena bar, disco and Restaurant are there. Just to clarify, I met her in 112 and took her to the Arena restaurant because I was hungry and I wanted to make sure her energy levels were up.

Jack.

I just usally rent flats on ul. Baseina, so it's two-three minutes walt I wanted to be sure it was the same!

IT

[Excess]

Originally Posted by Cruiser D
Ever seen a prostitute crying because she doesn't want to be one? Yet her abusive drunk boyfriend keeps sending her out because he is too lazy to get a job?

If true then why the hell she doesn't kick him out the door?

Fido,

A reasonable question coming from one of us - male, monger etc.

However, you also need to look at it from the girl's point of view and the pysche of many of them for an answer to the question.

In many or most cases such as the one above and in a lot of abusive relationships what keeps the women there is a psychological dependency on the drunk boyfriend, insecurity, and often just plain certainty that as bad as it is, it is probably better than not being there or doing that.

There is often at one point and remaining aspects of love that the woman feels for the, in our eyes, rat. That's the way many woman are wired mentally and emotionally. For them this is on the surface rational behaviour, for us hard to comprehend.

Men are not so prone to this and so it is very difficult for us to understand why they remain. But they do. As we know well, women are mysterious creatures that take a long time to even partially figure out. One of life's joys is exploring them in all their forms and aspects.

[Cruiser D]

Who was looking to moralize this? I was simply stating some truths. The way you reacted is quite interesting Fido. You don't think you are fucking drug addicted diseased prostitutes? Really? Where do you find your working girls? Fantasyland? Oh wait, you find your girls in the high class $25 bordello's in South America, I am sure none of those girls or the last 1,000 guys they fucked were carrying any diseases. Those girls who you have been banging at GIA who have been on there website for the last 2-3 years, do you think they are sex crazed nympo's enjoying the occasional degradation and abuse from clients - think they might be heavily medicating themselves to make it through the day? I am always interested in the length’s people will go to moralize their activities. Been feeling exploited by the mean prostitutes lately Fido?

In the pimp-john-ho equation it is always the ho who is the loser. Gritty and harsh yes but that is the truth at the end of the day. I could go on and on about this but I'm guessing at least 70% of the people reading this forum want to ignore the ugly truth.

[Doctor_Skank]

Dear Doctor, don't think I live in a fantasy world.
And, how for shure do you know that what you write is the simple thruth and nothing but the simple thruth?

I don't claim to know everything nor do I believe that all pros lead shitty lives or are forced to do what they do. I've known happy pros as well. I doubt they'll keep that happy demeanor forever if they stay in the business too long however.

However, if you've fucked more than just a few pros in Kiev Fido, than you've very likely also fucked ones coerced into working that job one way or another... just as Cruiser said... whether it's physical force, financial duress or the need to raise a child on a wage higher than she'd get working the local produkti. By no means are all pros doing their job because they really enjoy it. I'm amazed by how many actually do enjoy it, but am also aware of those that don't.

[Fido Dido]

Jeez Fido, don't live in a fantasy world . . . . It's just stating a simple truth . . .

Dear Doctor, don't think I live in a fantasy world.
And, how for shure do you know that what you write is the simple thruth and nothing but the simple thruth?

I wouldn't find any joy in exploiting women who are forced for wathever reason. Specially not desperate drug adicted prostitutes. Apart from the risks of diseases.

The only time a girl told me she was forced to be a prostitute was in a brothel in South America. The girl told me this after I had prepayed for her. Something like $US 25. $US 25 is not much for a GIA-girl but it is a lot of money in certain parts of South America.
After she told me she was forced I didn't want to have sex with her anymore. Although I didn't believe her story. To me it was just a trick to get money for doing nothing.

Also once spoke to a girl who claimed to be a prostitue because she had to buy medicine for her grandmother. Sorry, but I don't believe these stories.

. . . but you have to respect the capacity of endurance they have.

I didn't write of disrespect for prostitutes. Why should I disrespect the women whose services I am glad to use?

Working girls I have met knew very well what they were doing, were no victims and liked to earn good and quick money.
I hope the girls spend the money on something usefull like a study or an investment. But lots of them spend it on worthless things like make up, clothes, cellphones, jewelery and boyfriends.
Most complaints I heard were from girls who made good money in the thermas in Rio. Biggest problem for them was the boredom of being 5 or 6 days a week 7 to 8 hours a day in therma (=disco/brothel/bar).
With good money the therma girls make I mean 10 times the official minimun wage in their country. If they invest well they can make a good living on that money after they are retired.

Only working girls I met in the Ukrain were Suzi and Sacha in Odessa and Yana from GIA in Kiev. To me they were independend women, who didn't mind what they were doing. They also were glad to accept my money.
Remark about these Ukrain working girls: it was nice being with them, althoug I think they were too expensive. Will not repeat on them. I certainly am dazzled with the prices at RP I read about on this forum.

[Doctor_Skank]

If true then why the hell she doesn't kick him out the door?

Correct: very American political correct feminist bullshit argument of Cruiser. The girl is a hooker and who is to blame? A guy! A guy who forces her!

Jeez FD, that's not feminist or politically correct, that's just pointing out that no matter what their "game face" says to you, many of them live really shitty lives.

If I really cared I suppose I'd stop banging pros, but it still is a thought that occasionally crosses my mind. I hope I never one day become totally callous to the plight of some of the women I fuck.

[ChrisForSex]

Met Polina at http://www.gia.com.ua and liked her from the first time. Then I called the manager and arranged for a meeting with her. She came on time, so well-dressed that my first thought was to undress her. We talked a bit and then she started teasing me by telling me all the naughty things and making me some kind of erotic massage. She was really gorgeous in bed! she has very beautiful breasts. First I thought they were not natural but when i touched, I was amazed - so
fresh and tight but natural. We changed some positions. She does bareback absolutely perfect! Very good blowjob, coming in mouth. I really forgot everything with her... and when the time ended (it has flown by as a minute) I wanted to keep her longer, she said she had to go. So pity, but really good impressions on her!!! Just look at these boobs!

[Fido Dido]

Ever seen a prostitute crying because she doesn't want to be one? Yet her abusive drunk boyfriend keeps sending her out because he is too lazy to get a job?

If true then why the hell she doesn't kick him out the door?

. . . Cruiser, you are the last person I expected this type of rubbish from. So political and so American.

Correct: very American political correct feminist bullshit argument of Cruiser. The girl is a hooker and who is to blame? A guy! A guy who forces her!

[Observeration]

Ever seen a prostitute crying because she doesn't want to be one? Yet her abusive drunk boyfriend keeps sending her out because he is too lazy to get a job? Or how about seeing her cry because she lives in some crap hole like Kiev where the only way to make a decent wage is to steal or sell her body? Or the prostitute who cries because she sells her body to make a better life for her child? Dude, you need to get out more often or start hanging around with The Connection....

She's selling the slit mate these tears are simply requests for more money what's gotten into the lot on this site?

Cruiser, you are the last person I expected this type of rubbish from. So political and so American.

[Srilm]

Ever seen a prostitute crying because she doesn't want to be one? Yet her abusive drunk boyfriend keeps sending her out because he is too lazy to get a job? Or how about seeing her cry because she lives in some crap hole like Kiev where the only way to make a decent wage is to steal or sell her body? Or the prostitute who cries because she sells her body to make a better life for her child? Dude, you need to get out more often or start hanging around with The Connection.

You can get sex for free but feel like shit afterwards? Ummm, ok - that's a new one...

GIA sucks. The price keeps going up because foreign tools keep using them. Pick up a free copy of What's On or the Kyiv Post...

Actually, I was just trying to point out that we all have a different point of view and a different morality. I don't like lying, pretending, or talking "game" to pick up girls. Although I'm probably above average at it, I just got tired of it. It's not really that new.- how many ads, personals, or statements have you heard from people that are tired of "playing games". I hear it all the time and that's what I'm talking about. When GIA prices themselves out of my range, I'll just go elsewhere without so much as a whimper. As for the rest, maybe some here like threesomes, or transvestites, or even more "unusual" scenarios. I say.- as long as no one is being hurt.- go for what you like. Neither I nor you, nor anyone else is correct in judging their activities.

Maybe I'm lucky, but I've never been with a prostitute who showed outwardly that she was unhappy in my presence. But even if she did, OUR relationship is completely honest. That's how it works in my mind.- if it works differently in someone else's, that's perfectly OK. The pros know full well what they're getting into, but my local bar can be a regular sobfest at times. Sometimes I have to leave just because I can't stand the bullshit the guys in there are slinging anymore. We actually had a guy here who claimed to be from Russia.- it was his "gimmick". He couldn't speak a lick of the language, but I didn't have the heart to mess with his "catch. " If she's that dumb, she deserves what she got, I just couldn't be the one to do it.

Live and let live. There's plenty of both freebies and p4p in Kyiv.

[Jackmiov]

IT,

Yes, the Arena complex is at the Bessarabaya Square end of Kreshatik. 112 and the Arena bar, disco and Restaurant are there. Just to clarify, I met her in 112 and took her to the Arena restaurant because I was hungry and I wanted to make sure her energy levels were up.

Jack.

[Cruiser D]

Ever seen a prostitute crying because she doesn't want to be one? Yet her abusive drunk boyfriend keeps sending her out because he is too lazy to get a job? Or how about seeing her cry because she lives in some crap hole like Kiev where the only way to make a decent wage is to steal or sell her body? Or the prostitute who cries because she sells her body to make a better life for her child? Dude, you need to get out more often or start hanging around with The Connection.

You can get sex for free but feel like shit afterwards? Ummm, ok - that's a new one.

GIA sucks. The price keeps going up because foreign tools keep using them. Heck, I know guy who speaks fluent Russian and was using them. Don't worry Cruiser D fixed his shit, K Street style! Take small steps pick up a free copy of What's On or the Kyiv Post.

Just for illustrative purposes, my personal view is that paying for sex is usually the most moral way to get it. It's a basic human need, and 100% honest. The girl knows up front that we're going to have sex and that she's going to get money for it. I've never seen a prostitute crying because of the emotional abuse from some lying boyfriend or because someone sold her a line to get in her pants.

I can get sex for free, but I feel like shit after I do it, because to give a girl what she really wants in a seduction, most men (including me) have to resort to subterfuge.

------

Back in Kyiv in April for 2 weeks. I've been keeping an eye on Gia, which has always been the safest best for a good time there, but the prices keep going up.

SR

[LifeSavour]

Does that include lube?

Are you sick?

LS Guy